22/11/2016 Victoria Derbyshire


Download Subtitles

SRT

ASS


22/11/2016

Daily news and current affairs. The BBC's John Simpson talks about life as a foreign correspondent and his 10 near-death experiences.


Similar Content

Browse content similar to 22/11/2016. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!

Transcript


LineFromTo

I'm Victoria Derbyshire, welcome to the programme.

:00:08.:00:11.

This morning, we reveal that thousands of people with incurable

:00:12.:00:14.

and degenerative conditions like Parkinson's, MS and dementia

:00:15.:00:19.

are being told that some of their personal-independence

:00:20.:00:22.

payments are being stopped, because they're deemed

:00:23.:00:25.

It just makes you feel so demoralised.

:00:26.:00:31.

I instantly knew the system is simply broken, because how can

:00:32.:00:38.

they tell me I'm better than I was, when I've deteriorated?

:00:39.:00:45.

We'll bring you the full exclusive story throughout the programme.

:00:46.:00:49.

And if you've been affected, do get in touch.

:00:50.:00:52.

Should patients have to show their passports to get

:00:53.:00:55.

non-emergency treatment on the NHS in order to crack down

:00:56.:00:58.

We'll hear the arguments for and against.

:00:59.:01:02.

And, last week we spoke to former professional

:01:03.:01:04.

footballer Andy Woodward in his first broadcast interview.

:01:05.:01:08.

He told us about the abuse he suffered for years at the hand

:01:09.:01:11.

The impact it's had on my life is just catastrophic,

:01:12.:01:19.

and you live with that all your life, and you can't put it

:01:20.:01:24.

Since that interview, he's been contacted by other footballers

:01:25.:01:33.

Throughout the morning we'll bring you the latest breaking news

:01:34.:01:54.

In around half an hour we're expecting to find out how much more

:01:55.:01:58.

And in around 15 minutes, this man, legendary BBC

:01:59.:02:03.

journalist John Simpson, who's here to answer your questions

:02:04.:02:06.

Plus, he'll tell us about his near-death experiences.

:02:07.:02:11.

Do get in touch on all the stories we're talking about this morning.

:02:12.:02:15.

If you text, you will be charged at the standard network rate.

:02:16.:02:19.

Our top story today is that the NHS is looking at whether patients

:02:20.:02:22.

across England should have to produce two forms of ID before

:02:23.:02:26.

Its most-senior official says it is considering identity checks

:02:27.:02:32.

in an effort to tackle the rise in so-called health tourism,

:02:33.:02:35.

when foreigners come to the UK to receive free medical treatment.

:02:36.:02:43.

The NHS is aiming to claim back ?500 million a year

:02:44.:02:47.

The money recovered has risen in the past few

:02:48.:02:51.

years but is still more than ?200 million short.

:02:52.:02:55.

Yesterday, MPs on the Public Accounts Committee challenged health

:02:56.:02:58.

bosses about what they were doing to improve the situation.

:02:59.:03:02.

The Department of Health's most senior civil servant,

:03:03.:03:05.

Chris Wormald, told them there were lots of possible ideas,

:03:06.:03:08.

including requiring patients to produce ID.

:03:09.:03:12.

Are we looking at whether trusts should proactively ask

:03:13.:03:17.

There are individual trusts, like Peterborough, who are doing

:03:18.:03:23.

that and are reporting it makes a big difference,

:03:24.:03:25.

and there you are saying, "Please come with two

:03:26.:03:28.

forms of identity - passport, address," and they use

:03:29.:03:30.

that to check whether people are eligible or not.

:03:31.:03:37.

Mr Wormald acknowledged it was controversial,

:03:38.:03:39.

but said it appeared to be making a big difference,

:03:40.:03:42.

and was the kind of thing the Government wanted to look at.

:03:43.:03:45.

He said it was unlikely that all trusts would introduce measures

:03:46.:03:48.

like this, it would depend on their populations.

:03:49.:03:51.

A consultation on the issue is under way.

:03:52.:03:57.

Our political guru Norman Smith is here.

:03:58.:04:01.

Would the Government really press ahead with getting NHS patients

:04:02.:04:03.

to produce passports and utility bills before they can get treated?

:04:04.:04:09.

It is already happening, if you go to Tooting and what to do maternity

:04:10.:04:13.

services, you will have to produce your passport, and you will also

:04:14.:04:18.

have to have some other proof of address, maybe a utility bill or

:04:19.:04:22.

something like that, before you can take advantage of the services,

:04:23.:04:27.

because of concern about so-called maternity tourism. It is part of the

:04:28.:04:30.

broader concern about people from outside the UK coming here to take

:04:31.:04:35.

advantage of the NHS, because if you come from elsewhere in the EU, you

:04:36.:04:39.

are supposed to say so the Department of Health can build the

:04:40.:04:42.

other EU country, and if you come from outside the EU, you are

:04:43.:04:46.

supposed to pay yourself. It is estimated that the price of

:04:47.:04:51.

so-called health tourism could be up to ?2 billion a year. At the moment,

:04:52.:04:59.

the NHS is apparently only clawing back 300 million. There is a huge

:05:00.:05:02.

amount of money which the Government thinks they could claw back. But

:05:03.:05:05.

that said there is a considerable amount of disquiet amongst doctors

:05:06.:05:12.

in particular, who say, we are not immigration officials or

:05:13.:05:15.

accountants, we are here to treat people. There is also a view that

:05:16.:05:19.

many British citizens might struggle to get the necessary ID, because

:05:20.:05:24.

only 70% of people have a passport, so it could be a huge hassle for

:05:25.:05:28.

people who do live here. Then there are questions about the culture of

:05:29.:05:32.

the NHS, do we really want to impose these conditions before people

:05:33.:05:33.

receive treatment? Another story this morning,

:05:34.:05:35.

Donald Trump's said Nigel Farage would make a good ambassador

:05:36.:05:37.

to the US. The Downing Street point of view is

:05:38.:05:47.

absolutely not. They reacted with a stunned horror this morning at the

:05:48.:05:51.

very thought that Nigel Farage could become the ambassador to Washington.

:05:52.:05:58.

They have said in diplomatic speak that there is no vacancy, but

:05:59.:06:03.

talking to number ten people privately, they say categorically

:06:04.:06:06.

there will be no role for Nigel Farage, because if you think about

:06:07.:06:10.

it, it would be an incendiary move, it would cause a political outcry in

:06:11.:06:16.

the Tory party. Downing Street say, he is an opposition politician, he

:06:17.:06:21.

spends his time attacking the Conservatives, why would we want him

:06:22.:06:26.

in Washington? Theresa May the sort of politician who likes to good

:06:27.:06:29.

troll events, Nigel Farage is a complete lose Callan, they would not

:06:30.:06:37.

want him roaming around Washington. I spoke to him this morning, he

:06:38.:06:42.

says, if Donald Trump things I can do a job, I am very happy to do it,

:06:43.:06:47.

I would do anything I could to bolster ties between Britain and

:06:48.:06:48.

America. The BBC Newsroom with a summary

:06:49.:06:51.

of the rest of the day's news. More than 50 flood warnings

:06:52.:06:54.

are in place across England and Wales, with more heavy rain

:06:55.:06:56.

forecast today in the South-west and north-west England

:06:57.:06:59.

and south Wales have been Network Rail is warning

:07:00.:07:03.

of disruption to train services. It says the main line to south-west

:07:04.:07:07.

England has been "severed". The heavy rain spread

:07:08.:07:14.

from the south-west Here in Stalybridge,

:07:15.:07:16.

to the east of Manchester, torrents gushed past cars as people

:07:17.:07:22.

tried to make their way home. Greater Manchester Fire

:07:23.:07:28.

and Rescue Service received 120 Elsewhere, the heavy rains

:07:29.:07:34.

caused localised flooding. Train services between London

:07:35.:07:41.

and Cardiff and the south-west were badly affected yesterday,

:07:42.:07:50.

and there could be further It's the same story across the north

:07:51.:07:53.

of England, where there were delays and cancellations

:07:54.:07:57.

between Manchester and Leeds. Train operators say some routes

:07:58.:08:01.

will remain closed until it's safe The weather is also

:08:02.:08:04.

hitting ferry services. 146 passengers and crew have been

:08:05.:08:10.

stuck overnight on this ferry It is expected to make a third

:08:11.:08:14.

attempt to dock at The Environment Agency is warning

:08:15.:08:18.

of more rain and further flooding before the rain

:08:19.:08:24.

eventually eases off tonight. The site of the Fukushima nuclear

:08:25.:08:31.

plant in Japan has been hit by a one-metre tsunami wave

:08:32.:08:34.

after a powerful earthquake off Officials say there is no sign

:08:35.:08:37.

of damage and the government has The facility was destroyed

:08:38.:08:41.

by an earthquake and The Turkish prime minister has said

:08:42.:08:46.

the government is withdrawing a controversial bill

:08:47.:08:51.

which would have allowed men who'd had sex with underage girls

:08:52.:08:53.

to have their convictions quashed The bill had sparked

:08:54.:08:57.

protests and had been met The parliament in Ankara had been

:08:58.:09:01.

due to vote on the bill later today, but critics said it would legitimise

:09:02.:09:06.

statutory rape and encourage Thousands of people with incurable

:09:07.:09:09.

conditions like Parkinson's, MS and dementia are being told

:09:10.:09:16.

by the Government that some of their benefits are being stopped

:09:17.:09:19.

because they're getting better. This programme has discovered

:09:20.:09:23.

that many applying for the mobility element

:09:24.:09:25.

of Personal Independence Payment are having their awards

:09:26.:09:28.

reduced, sometimes to zero. The Government says that more

:09:29.:09:31.

people overall are getting American researchers say

:09:32.:09:34.

the proportion of people in the US The number of plastic

:09:35.:09:39.

carrier bags found on UK beaches has dropped by 40%,

:09:40.:09:42.

according to conservationists. The Marine Conservation Society

:09:43.:09:44.

says its volunteers cleaned up an average of seven plastic bags

:09:45.:09:47.

for every 100 metres of coastline this year,

:09:48.:09:49.

down from 11 in 2015. It's attributed the fall

:09:50.:09:53.

to the introduction of the five-pence levy

:09:54.:09:55.

on plastic bags. According to reports in the US

:09:56.:09:59.

media, the rapper Kanye West has been hospitalised,

:10:00.:10:01.

suffering from exhaustion. The news comes after the musician

:10:02.:10:04.

abruptly cancelled the remainder of his live tour following a week

:10:05.:10:07.

of no-shows, curtailed concerts Well, a zoo in America is asking

:10:08.:10:12.

the public just that. They were born in September,

:10:13.:10:34.

and a name has to be decided by December 12th, in accordance

:10:35.:10:37.

with Chinese tradition. People can choose from seven

:10:38.:10:41.

pairs of proposed names That's a summary of the latest BBC

:10:42.:10:42.

News, more at 9:30am. Do get in touch with us

:10:43.:10:57.

throughout the morning. This is to do with our exclusive

:10:58.:11:09.

story just after 9:30am, about some element of personal independence

:11:10.:11:14.

payment being taken away from people with degenerative and in curable

:11:15.:11:19.

conditions of. One person says, I don't understand what this

:11:20.:11:22.

Government is doing. It ain't says, the system has been ripped apart by

:11:23.:11:27.

a Government's attempts to privatise. Terry says, it is a

:11:28.:11:31.

disgusting situation, especially when decisions are being overturned

:11:32.:11:37.

on appeal all the time. 65% of original decisions are overturned on

:11:38.:11:41.

appeal. Kathy says, I see it everyday, I helped to run a benefit

:11:42.:11:46.

support group, we have members struggling, fighting to get what

:11:47.:11:49.

they are due. It is appalling discrimination.

:11:50.:11:52.

Let's get some sport, and we can join Hugh Woozencroft this morning.

:11:53.:11:55.

We'll start with the England managerial vacancy, are we any

:11:56.:11:57.

After a job interview there will be an anxious wait for Gareth Southgate

:11:58.:12:06.

to see if he does become the new England manager. He is in pole

:12:07.:12:11.

position, he had an interview lasted more than three hours with the FA

:12:12.:12:15.

yesterday, but there is not an announcement expected until next

:12:16.:12:19.

Wednesday. He was unbeaten during his four matches as interim manager,

:12:20.:12:23.

but the interview has prompted Chris Sutton to call it a slap in the face

:12:24.:12:28.

for Gareth Southgate. Adrian Bevington used to be an FA

:12:29.:12:32.

executive, he has said it made perfect sense to make the meeting

:12:33.:12:36.

public, and that it did not overcome locate the process. There is one

:12:37.:12:41.

thing that could compensate it, the sacking of Jurgen Klinnsmann as the

:12:42.:12:45.

USA head coach. It was reported in July that he was one of those who

:12:46.:12:49.

was interviewed as a potential successor to Roy Hodgson. He is

:12:50.:12:53.

likely to be in the running this time around as well. On petition for

:12:54.:12:57.

Gareth Southgate could be hotting up. There is no rush for the FA to

:12:58.:13:01.

name the next manager, England's next match is not until March.

:13:02.:13:04.

Staying with football, and it was good night for West Brom?

:13:05.:13:09.

One game in the Premier League last night, West Brom beat Burnley 4-0 at

:13:10.:13:17.

the hawthorns, thanks largely to a first half scoring blitz. Matt

:13:18.:13:23.

Phillips, James Morrison and Darren Fletcher put them 3-0 up at

:13:24.:13:27.

half-time, and Salomon Rondon rounded off the scoring in the

:13:28.:13:30.

second half. They move into the top of the table, with back-to-back

:13:31.:13:34.

victories. Good news for baggies fans. Take a look at this. Talk

:13:35.:13:41.

about wrong place, wrong time, one of the sound men at the Minnesota

:13:42.:13:47.

Vikings tried to get into the right place as the teams ran out,

:13:48.:13:50.

completely wiped out by their defensive lineman. Fortunately, he

:13:51.:13:56.

was OK afterwards. He could see the funny side. It almost was not a

:13:57.:14:04.

laughing matter. He is six foot four, 329 lbs. I am sure he had a

:14:05.:14:09.

headache the next day, he did well to get back from that smiling. That

:14:10.:14:15.

would hurt. More from you through the morning.

:14:16.:14:17.

Lots to come throughout the programme, but first,

:14:18.:14:19.

John Simpson is the BBC World Affairs Editor,

:14:20.:14:20.

His job has taken him to some of the most-dangerous

:14:21.:14:24.

He became the first journalist to interview the Taliban

:14:25.:14:27.

after dressing in a burqa to sneak into Afghanistan.

:14:28.:14:30.

He's been hunted by Robert Mugabe's forces in Zimbabwe and witnessed 46

:14:31.:14:34.

But despite having been blown up, bombed and injured, the 72-year-old

:14:35.:14:41.

says his most hair-raising experience was nearly dying

:14:42.:14:43.

Fortunately, he made a full recovery, and has released

:14:44.:14:47.

a new book all about the life of a foreign correspondent.

:14:48.:14:50.

He joins us, and if you've got a question for John

:14:51.:14:52.

It was the smoked haddock that nearly did for you. It was, and the

:14:53.:15:03.

next day I played a game of cricket, all day long, it was quite hot, hard

:15:04.:15:08.

to believe, the beginning of September, so I got a bit

:15:09.:15:14.

dehydrated, and apparently this interacted with pills I had been

:15:15.:15:19.

taking for years to cut down the sugar in my blood. I nearly died of

:15:20.:15:28.

kidney failure. I did not have to show my passport at the John

:15:29.:15:31.

Radcliffe Hospital. It is only for nonemergency. I think

:15:32.:15:44.

you were an emergency. When I got a little bit better I tried to say to

:15:45.:15:48.

them, I'm leaving all the money to a cat's home! They didn't think it was

:15:49.:15:53.

really very funny. I thought it was great! Two of the doctors said to me

:15:54.:16:02.

afterwards, they went home that night thinking he is a gonner and

:16:03.:16:08.

said that to their wives and families. I am a tough old character

:16:09.:16:14.

and I kind of, I just got over it. How many near death experiences have

:16:15.:16:18.

you had? Well, when I was in hospital I thought I better work it

:16:19.:16:22.

out in case anybody asked me that question. Nobody has, actually,

:16:23.:16:25.

you're the first, but I got the answer! Nine plus this. Nine of

:16:26.:16:36.

bombing, shooting, knives, once a knife. That kind of thing. This is

:16:37.:16:42.

death. This is not just kind of injury. But I think this was number

:16:43.:16:51.

two, if not the number one incident. Probably the number one incident was

:16:52.:16:57.

being bombed by the Americans in 2003 in Iraq. When your translator

:16:58.:17:02.

was killed? Yes. I was just back there last week actually and I went

:17:03.:17:07.

to see his family again. And that was painful, Victoria. I went, I had

:17:08.:17:13.

to break the news back in 2003 to her that her son had died. I had

:17:14.:17:19.

blood on my clothes. And going back there was quite hard too and not

:17:20.:17:25.

many dry eyes in the house when we were talking, but I have always felt

:17:26.:17:30.

a bit guilty. He only joined us because he had seen me on television

:17:31.:17:37.

and he thought that we would have adventures together and he was just

:17:38.:17:43.

24. He was just a kid. So I had to say to his mother could she find it

:17:44.:17:48.

in her heart to forgive me for taking him and getting him killed?

:17:49.:17:52.

It wasn't very easy, but she said yes. Did she? Yes. Goodness. When

:17:53.:17:59.

that incident happened, you carried on reporting, why? Well, it is what

:18:00.:18:05.

I exist to do. I mean, you know, it seems to me that that was of

:18:06.:18:12.

interest and in a way, quite important. I mean it showed

:18:13.:18:16.

something about the way the American forces operate which I thought

:18:17.:18:20.

people should really, really know about. Well, that actually, that

:18:21.:18:24.

phrase that people should know about that, that gets to the heart of what

:18:25.:18:28.

a foreign correspondent is which is what your book is about. How would

:18:29.:18:34.

you define the role of a foreign correspondent then? It's simply

:18:35.:18:40.

that. It's nothing more than opening things up to people in foreign

:18:41.:18:44.

countries and saying, "We think you might be interested in this. Or

:18:45.:18:50.

perhaps this is important for you to know about." Nothing more than that.

:18:51.:18:58.

It is a weird profession. It doesn't do very much for the home lives of

:18:59.:19:07.

the people that do it. But there are some fantastic characters who are

:19:08.:19:10.

and have been foreign correspondents. I just wanted this

:19:11.:19:15.

book to be a celebration of them, of some of them, you can't get

:19:16.:19:20.

everybody in. God knows I had to leave an awful lot of people out,

:19:21.:19:26.

but... Who would you draw out for our audience watching this morning?

:19:27.:19:33.

Murray Colvin the correspondent for the Sunday Times who died a couple

:19:34.:19:39.

of years ago. Deliberately bombed by the Syrian Army. And a wonderful

:19:40.:19:46.

girl, I suspect I was half in love with her for years and years and

:19:47.:19:51.

years and I saw her just a few, a couple of months, a few weeks before

:19:52.:19:58.

she was killed and she had already suffered an eye injury in Sri Lanka.

:19:59.:20:06.

She used to wear... There she is. Oh dear, Marie. She was a lovely girl.

:20:07.:20:12.

I was going on perhaps a little bit too seriously. Something we do we

:20:13.:20:19.

were talking at, both of us at the Chelsea Arts Club and she and I was

:20:20.:20:24.

getting a bit pompous probably, well it is not difficult for me, of

:20:25.:20:29.

course, about the way that you know the importance of foreign news and

:20:30.:20:34.

she just interrupted me and got this lovely New York accent and she said

:20:35.:20:40.

to me, "Ya, but we do have an awful lot of fun, John." I just was,

:20:41.:20:46.

perfect. That, of course, goes into the book. 50 years at the BBC this

:20:47.:20:52.

year, is that correct? It is. I've just passed the moment, yes. I'm

:20:53.:20:57.

just doing, in fact I went to see the mother of my translator for a

:20:58.:21:03.

Panorama that we're doing in early December about my weird 50th

:21:04.:21:07.

anniversary. It doesn't seem like it. I didn't look like David

:21:08.:21:14.

Attenborough. I looked different, but somehow we've grown together.

:21:15.:21:18.

Yes, but in that time, I'm sorry it is such an obvious question, but I

:21:19.:21:22.

want to know the answer, you've interviewed world leaders and

:21:23.:21:27.

reported on all major conflicts over the last few decades. You know, you

:21:28.:21:32.

were there when the wall came down in Berlin. What has had the most

:21:33.:21:37.

impact on you? Funnily enough, not a bad thing, but a really, wonderful

:21:38.:21:43.

thing and I still, I still get a bit of warmth from just thinking about

:21:44.:21:49.

it. I went to South Africa. I was the BBC correspondent in South

:21:50.:21:55.

Africa during the absolute heart of, the height of apartheid and you

:21:56.:22:02.

know, I knew how awful it was. And everybody assumed that the end of

:22:03.:22:10.

apartheid would bring civil war and bloodshed on a massive scale and I

:22:11.:22:15.

was there in 1994 when people were thinking that there was going to be

:22:16.:22:22.

bloodshed and there wasn't and there wasn't because each of a number of

:22:23.:22:26.

people, but five or six people decided to do the right thing

:22:27.:22:34.

instead of the selfish thing for their part of the community. They

:22:35.:22:41.

reached an agreement and we had an election where there wasn't a single

:22:42.:22:46.

crime committed in the entire country of South Africa which is not

:22:47.:22:53.

exactly crime-free on that day. I was quite close to Nelson Mandela at

:22:54.:22:56.

that time. I will never, I mean, watching the

:22:57.:23:24.

wall come down was wonderful. If your book you say the greatest

:23:25.:23:30.

exclusive story of the past 50 years came from first class reportage and

:23:31.:23:38.

it was Michael Burke's reporting of the famine in eth thopia, let's

:23:39.:23:40.

look: And as the sun breaks

:23:41.:23:44.

through the piercing chill of night on the plain outside Korem,

:23:45.:23:46.

it lights up a biblical famine - This place, say workers

:23:47.:23:49.

here, is the closest Thousands of wasted people

:23:50.:23:54.

are coming here for help. They flood in every day

:23:55.:24:00.

from villages hundreds of miles away, dulled by hunger,

:24:01.:24:07.

driven beyond the point 15,000 children here now,

:24:08.:24:09.

suffering, confused, lost. A child or an adult

:24:10.:24:15.

dies every 20 minutes. Korem, an insignificant town,

:24:16.:24:23.

has become a place of grief. Explain why you think that had such

:24:24.:24:46.

an impact. Partly the pictures shot by a friend of mine who was later

:24:47.:24:50.

killed. Partly, but mostly, I think, the words, the way that Michael

:24:51.:24:57.

allowed the pictures to just come through and not kind of dictate to

:24:58.:25:01.

you what you should think about this. No emotion there. None of that

:25:02.:25:08.

quite intrusive business about how you feel. I mean, I always think who

:25:09.:25:16.

cares how I feel, you know? And Michael clearly thought the same,

:25:17.:25:19.

who cares about my reactions, it is all about what is happening in front

:25:20.:25:25.

of our eyes. He just was, I say was in the past tense because he doesn't

:25:26.:25:32.

do, he is not a foreign correspondent, he was an absolute

:25:33.:25:35.

master of words and they're words that stick in the mind and lesser

:25:36.:25:43.

people of whom I'm no doubt one, would copy some of the techniques

:25:44.:25:49.

that he used and all to the good, you know. All to the good. There are

:25:50.:25:55.

people watching who are perhaps too young to remember that reporting led

:25:56.:25:59.

to people raising hundreds of millions of pounds for the victims

:26:00.:26:07.

of the famine. Do you see parallels with Yemen, with what is happening

:26:08.:26:13.

in Yemen and if not, why? Well, there are parallels with Yemen, yes,

:26:14.:26:18.

but you know, Yemen is not the only place where people are hungry. It is

:26:19.:26:24.

that ability that Michael had to shine a light on something. It is

:26:25.:26:29.

very difficult to get to Yemen. Believe me, I've tried. And I

:26:30.:26:35.

haven't yet succeeded. I hope I do, but there is not only a civil war

:26:36.:26:39.

going on there, but Isis in a different form is there. It's

:26:40.:26:45.

extraordinarily dangerous to cover it. And so far, although it has some

:26:46.:26:53.

brave people have managed to get there and show us, we haven't had

:26:54.:26:57.

that sort of, that kind of Michael Burke moment somehow. Yes. Some of

:26:58.:27:03.

these images from Yemen are unbelievably distressing, but I

:27:04.:27:07.

wonder if you think we get used to seeing these images because we can

:27:08.:27:10.

get them anywhere on the internet now, can't we? That's always a

:27:11.:27:15.

danger. It was a danger back in the 80s when Michael went to, Ethiopia.

:27:16.:27:26.

That was when the phrase, "Compassion fatigue" Was invented

:27:27.:27:30.

because afterwards people got kind of tired of being faced with sick

:27:31.:27:39.

and starving people. I'm not a great sympathiser with compassion fatigue

:27:40.:27:43.

actually, but nevertheless it is a fact and people sort of moved, you

:27:44.:27:47.

know, wanted to move on and do other things. I do think it says something

:27:48.:27:55.

about our society and about the way that ordinary people behave, but on

:27:56.:28:01.

the other hand, so did that extraordinary outflowing of sympathy

:28:02.:28:06.

and generosity. You mentioned that you were in Mosul, you have been in

:28:07.:28:10.

Mosul recently... Well, I was outside Mosul. You were outside? The

:28:11.:28:18.

BBC fore bade me to go within 20 kilometres of the centre of Mosul.

:28:19.:28:23.

Why? Because I had been ill and they didn't want me to. I would have been

:28:24.:28:28.

fine, but I probably might not have survived the experience if I had

:28:29.:28:29.

driven in there anyway. Fair I want to ask you about

:28:30.:28:33.

what you think Fair the future Before I do, let's a play a clip

:28:34.:28:36.

from the BBC's foreign correspondent Quentin Somerville in Mosul in Iraq,

:28:37.:28:40.

which was broadcast on Sunday. Islamic State are 200

:28:41.:28:42.

metres in that direction. You can see children

:28:43.:28:46.

running, children playing. People are living 20 metres

:28:47.:28:49.

away from here. No military were injured,

:28:50.:28:51.

just civilians. This was happening

:28:52.:28:55.

on peoples doorsteps. enough. Do you believe that Islamic

:28:56.:29:07.

State can be defeated? Oh yes. You said that really casually. They are

:29:08.:29:14.

on their way out. Really? It was an enthusiasm which built up, you know,

:29:15.:29:21.

in the last five years and it's, I mean, it only had strength from

:29:22.:29:26.

being, from seeming to be unstoppable. The Iraqi Army has

:29:27.:29:37.

stopped it in various places. The Iraqi Army isn't fantastic, but they

:29:38.:29:40.

are better than Isis. The problem is not all the enthusiasts and the

:29:41.:29:44.

people that go there from all over the world. The problem is the

:29:45.:29:53.

absolutely unforgiving people who used to work for Saddam Hussein,

:29:54.:29:59.

where in his army and his armed forces and who were thrust out when

:30:00.:30:03.

the Americans invaded, the Americans and the British invaded in 2003.

:30:04.:30:11.

Those are the people with battle experience, with real experience, of

:30:12.:30:14.

how to make bombs and where to put them and so on. Isis, without them,

:30:15.:30:20.

would just be a bunch of amateurs and yes, I mean, I'm not saying that

:30:21.:30:28.

the problem of Islamist feeling is going to go away, it certainly

:30:29.:30:33.

won't, but Isis is a phenomenon, controlling large parts of Syria and

:30:34.:30:36.

Iraq is on its way out. Can you see yourself ever retiring,

:30:37.:30:45.

or will you do a David Attenborough and go on? The thing about David

:30:46.:30:52.

Attenborough, he has got all his faculties still. I have got them at

:30:53.:30:58.

72, whether I shall have them at the age of 90, has David Attenborough

:30:59.:31:05.

does, who can say? You can't tell. If you had asked me on the morning

:31:06.:31:11.

that I got ill, would I be fine, I would say, yes, I have another 20

:31:12.:31:16.

years, and I could have been buried in an unmarked grave that night.

:31:17.:31:23.

None of us know what is ahead, but yes, I shall carry on working. If

:31:24.:31:27.

the BBC won't have me, I will find somebody who will. Defiant! Jonathan

:31:28.:31:33.

says, who'd -- how do you keep a refreshing sense of humour? I have

:31:34.:31:40.

got a very happy home life, I have a ten-year-old son who is absolutely

:31:41.:31:46.

wonderful. And a lovely wife who looks after me. We have great fun

:31:47.:31:56.

together. I always have that to look forward to at the end of every trip.

:31:57.:32:03.

I am a bit irritated with my kid, because he tweeted yesterday... I

:32:04.:32:10.

was on one of the great Radio 2 programmes and he said, are you

:32:11.:32:16.

ready to accept the great Simpson? Not exactly the kind of thing I

:32:17.:32:19.

would tweet in my own name. He is only ten! If he wants to be 11, he

:32:20.:32:25.

will have to watch that! Why did you let him on Twitter? He is too clever

:32:26.:32:32.

to stop! That is a lame excuse! Pauline says, you are a true

:32:33.:32:37.

gentleman. Dennis says, when the honours lists appear each year,

:32:38.:32:42.

where our legends like John Simpson? Would you accept an honour? I took a

:32:43.:32:54.

CBE a long time ago. It took me a long time to think about it and

:32:55.:32:59.

working it out. 1991, it was just after the first Gulf War. I rang up

:33:00.:33:07.

Downing Street. I don't like the idea that these are political

:33:08.:33:11.

things, but anyway, now it is less political. I rang them up and said,

:33:12.:33:18.

I don't think it is really right, and the lady I spoke to said, you

:33:19.:33:27.

are in the category of civilians with the equivalent of a military

:33:28.:33:32.

medal. So I thought, OK. I don't use it. But I am very proud of it. It is

:33:33.:33:38.

not true to say I don't use it, when I go to flash dinners where

:33:39.:33:43.

everybody wears loads of medals, I have my CBE around my neck, just to

:33:44.:33:48.

try to keep up with the Joneses. Thank you very much for talking to

:33:49.:33:49.

us. John's book, We Chose To Speak

:33:50.:33:54.

Of War And Strife, is out now. This programme has found that many

:33:55.:34:00.

people with incurable conditions such as Parkinson's,

:34:01.:34:03.

MS and dementia are being told by the Department of Work

:34:04.:34:05.

and Pensions that some of their personal independence

:34:06.:34:07.

payments are being stopped - And, what's up with the American

:34:08.:34:10.

rapper Kanye West? According to media reports he's been

:34:11.:34:14.

rushed to hospital suffering from exhaustion after abruptly

:34:15.:34:17.

cancelling his US tour. Here's the BBC Newsroom

:34:18.:34:23.

with a summary of today's news. The NHS is considering requiring

:34:24.:34:26.

patients in England to produce two forms of identification,

:34:27.:34:29.

including a passport, before they receive some types

:34:30.:34:32.

of non-emergency treatment. It's an attempt to reduce the cost

:34:33.:34:35.

to the service of treating patients from abroad,

:34:36.:34:38.

which currently stands Nigel Farage says he is flattered at

:34:39.:34:54.

Donald Trump's call for him to be appointed as the British ambassador

:34:55.:34:55.

to the US. Donald Trump has backed calls

:34:56.:34:57.

for Nigel Farage to be appointed Britain's ambassador to the US,

:34:58.:34:59.

saying he would do a "great job". The President-elect said that "many

:35:00.:35:02.

people" wanted to see the interim Ukip leader as the UK's senior

:35:03.:35:05.

diplomat in Washington. Downing Street says there is not a

:35:06.:35:12.

vacancy. Flood warnings are in place, with

:35:13.:35:21.

more rain forecast today. South-west England, north-west England and

:35:22.:35:23.

South Wales have been badly affected. Network Rail says the main

:35:24.:35:27.

line to south-west England has been severed. Scotland has five flood

:35:28.:35:32.

warnings in the border region. The Turkish Prime Minister has said

:35:33.:35:36.

the Government is withdrawing a controversial bill which would have

:35:37.:35:39.

allowed men who had sex with underage girls to have their

:35:40.:35:42.

convictions quashed if it went on to marry them. It had sparked protests

:35:43.:35:46.

and had been met with international condemnation. The parliament had

:35:47.:35:50.

been due to vote on the bill today, but critics said it would legitimise

:35:51.:35:54.

statute rape and encourage the practice of taking child brides.

:35:55.:35:59.

New research suggests teenagers drink the equivalent of almost a

:36:00.:36:02.

bath full of sugary drinks each year. The study found that children

:36:03.:36:07.

of all ages were consuming too much sugar in drinks, although there had

:36:08.:36:12.

been an improvement on 2014 figures. Drinks are their main source of

:36:13.:36:15.

added sugar, and too much can lead to obesity and health problems. In

:36:16.:36:19.

March the Government promised a tax on sugary drinks in England.

:36:20.:36:22.

That's a summary of the latest BBC News, more at 10am.

:36:23.:36:26.

The latest figures for Government borrowing show a smaller than

:36:27.:36:34.

expected deficit. What do we mean when we say deficit? If you have an

:36:35.:36:41.

income of ?1000 and you spend ?1100, you have a deficit, you are out

:36:42.:36:46.

spending by ?100. It is similar for the Government, almost all the time

:36:47.:36:49.

they outspend their income on and the public sector as a whole local

:36:50.:36:56.

Government, the NHS, etc. But these numbers show something relatively

:36:57.:36:59.

positive, we were expecting them to have to borrow ?6 billion to close

:37:00.:37:04.

the gap tween its income and spending in October, but it only had

:37:05.:37:08.

to borrow 4.8 billion. It is better than most were expecting. If you

:37:09.:37:12.

look at the total amount we have borrowed over time, all of those

:37:13.:37:18.

deficit added up, it comes to 1.6 trillion, which is a lot of money,

:37:19.:37:22.

about 84% of the value of the whole economy, on the other hand it is not

:37:23.:37:28.

quite as much as a proportion of the economy as it was. That has been the

:37:29.:37:31.

Government goal, to get it coming down as a proportion of the economy.

:37:32.:37:36.

It is not that they are slashing the debt, it is that the economy is

:37:37.:37:42.

growing better of people forward. Almost every economic indicator

:37:43.:37:46.

since the referendum has been far better than the Bank of England or

:37:47.:37:49.

the Treasury predicted. The Treasury addicted immediate harm to the

:37:50.:37:53.

economy following the referendum. Although there was a shock in July,

:37:54.:37:58.

a bit of a pause and people did not buy, it almost immediately caught

:37:59.:38:07.

up, and now, what disaster? What emergency we looking at? So far it

:38:08.:38:12.

looks like normality. That may change as the negotiations pan out,

:38:13.:38:16.

but in the short term we can say that public sector finances, like

:38:17.:38:19.

most other indicators, are looking relatively healthy. Google talk more

:38:20.:38:25.

in the next ten minutes or so. Tomorrow it is the Autumn Statement,

:38:26.:38:28.

the mini budget, full coverage here on BBC News.

:38:29.:38:30.

Here's Hugh now with the morning sports headlines.

:38:31.:38:34.

Gareth Southgate will have to wait until next Wednesday to see if he

:38:35.:38:39.

becomes the new England manager. The decision to make his interview

:38:40.:38:42.

public has drawn witticism, but Adrian Bevington says it made

:38:43.:38:49.

perfect sense. This Gareth Southgate makes sense, especially now Jurgen

:38:50.:38:52.

Klinnsmann has become available? He was interviewed in the summer before

:38:53.:38:56.

Sam Allardyce was given the job. He is now free to be spoken to, he was

:38:57.:39:00.

sacked by the United States yesterday.

:39:01.:39:02.

West Brom are up to ninth in the Premier League, beating Burnley 4-0

:39:03.:39:08.

last night. The ICC Council has fined the South

:39:09.:39:12.

African captain Faf du Plessis 100% of his match fee after he was found

:39:13.:39:17.

guilty of ball tampering during their second Test match against in

:39:18.:39:20.

Hobart. Australia He is free to play in the third Test match.

:39:21.:39:24.

That's all for now, back just after 10am.

:39:25.:39:27.

How is it that thousands of people with incurable

:39:28.:39:31.

conditions like Parkinson's, MS and dementia are being told

:39:32.:39:33.

by the Department of Work and Pensions that some

:39:34.:39:36.

of their personal-independence payments are being stopped

:39:37.:39:37.

Let me tell you about these conditions.

:39:38.:39:41.

It develops when cells in a part of the brain stop working properly.

:39:42.:39:46.

It's "progressive", which means the symptons,

:39:47.:39:49.

tremors and slowness of movement, will gradually get worse.

:39:50.:39:53.

Dementia describes a set of symptoms that may include memory loss

:39:54.:39:57.

and difficulties with thinking, problem-solving or language.

:39:58.:40:01.

MS, multiple sclerosis, is a neurological condition that

:40:02.:40:07.

affects the nerves in the brain and spinal cord.

:40:08.:40:10.

Symptons include fatigue, stumbling, slowed thinking.

:40:11.:40:15.

This programme has discovered that many of those with these conditions

:40:16.:40:21.

applying for the mobility element of Personal Independence Payment

:40:22.:40:25.

are having their awards reduced, sometimes to zero, something that

:40:26.:40:30.

charities and patient groups have told us should never happen.

:40:31.:40:35.

The Government says that assessments are carried out by qualified health

:40:36.:40:38.

professionals, and overall, more people are getting the highest

:40:39.:40:40.

It took my independence away totally.

:40:41.:40:49.

I instantly knew that the system is simply broken.

:40:50.:41:00.

How can they tell me that I'm better than I was?

:41:01.:41:08.

Hundreds of thousands live with an incurable disease,

:41:09.:41:11.

Many rely on the state to pay for the extra costs

:41:12.:41:16.

But this programme has learned that, for many, that support

:41:17.:41:20.

It's like having a really bad dose of the flu and you can't move

:41:21.:41:27.

Diane Barrett has lived in South London all her life.

:41:28.:41:37.

Eight years ago she was diagnosed with Parkinson's disease.

:41:38.:41:41.

Diane has difficulty walking, but when she's

:41:42.:41:43.

on the right medication, she can drive short distances.

:41:44.:41:47.

I did mention to my family that I was a bit worried,

:41:48.:41:50.

because I'd learned of people losing the mobility part of their

:41:51.:41:53.

All my family said, "That won't happen to you, because you've

:41:54.:41:58.

got a debilitating disease that is not going to get any better.

:41:59.:42:01.

And I was absolutely gobsmacked when the letter came.

:42:02.:42:06.

There's a lot of paperwork in those!

:42:07.:42:08.

For seven years, Diane received Disability Living Allowance,

:42:09.:42:12.

but DLA is slowly being phased out, replaced by the Personal

:42:13.:42:15.

The idea is to base the amount you get not

:42:16.:42:21.

just on the disability, but how it affects

:42:22.:42:23.

The switch means everyone has to be reassessed.

:42:24.:42:30.

Diane was told her needs had changed and the amount she received

:42:31.:42:33.

for getting around fell from ?57 a week to zero.

:42:34.:42:39.

Without the disability allowance, I couldn't have a car,

:42:40.:42:41.

because I haven't got any extra money.

:42:42.:42:43.

It took my independence away, totally.

:42:44.:42:49.

Without a car, there's a little hop-a-bus round here,

:42:50.:42:53.

but I find it really difficult getting on and off.

:42:54.:42:56.

And they don't wait for you to sit down,

:42:57.:42:58.

It made me realise how bad my Parkinson's was.

:42:59.:43:06.

It's also quite depressing, because with Parkinson's you can get

:43:07.:43:09.

So, Diane had to give up her old car.

:43:10.:43:13.

She asked for the decision to be reconsidered, and lost

:43:14.:43:16.

Six months later, she took it to a full appeal

:43:17.:43:21.

The tribunal took just ten minutes to decide the Government was wrong.

:43:22.:43:29.

Because I think we were just so relieved.

:43:30.:43:32.

He was relieved for me because he knew how it

:43:33.:43:35.

And I think I was just relieved it was over, really.

:43:36.:43:39.

And I felt like somebody was listening to me.

:43:40.:43:42.

The Government will say we are spending much more

:43:43.:43:50.

as a nation on things like disability benefits.

:43:51.:43:53.

It has to run these checks to make sure that the right people

:43:54.:43:56.

But I think, straightaway, when I look at a paper,

:43:57.:44:04.

they can see if somebody's got Parkinson's, dementia,

:44:05.:44:06.

To qualify for a car under the Government's mobility scheme,

:44:07.:44:17.

you have to receive the highest rate of PIP.

:44:18.:44:19.

It also gives you other rights, a disabled badge and free road tax.

:44:20.:44:25.

But faced with that growing bill for disability payments,

:44:26.:44:28.

the Government has been tightening the rules.

:44:29.:44:30.

Critics say the assessment process is also more demanding.

:44:31.:44:35.

Freedom-of-information requests for this programme show the effect

:44:36.:44:37.

this is having on people with incurable conditions.

:44:38.:44:41.

Under the old DLA scheme, 82% of people with Parkinson's

:44:42.:44:45.

disease were receiving the full payment.

:44:46.:44:47.

It's the same basic pattern with other diseases like multiple

:44:48.:44:54.

The Government says that, overall, more people receive the highest rate

:44:55.:45:02.

of support under PIP, and more people with MS,

:45:03.:45:05.

osteoarthritis and Parkinson's are receiving the highest-possible

:45:06.:45:09.

That wouldn't include the mobility allowance.

:45:10.:45:15.

People who lose a car can get extra help to buy their old vehicle

:45:16.:45:18.

outright, though that is paid for by charity rather

:45:19.:45:20.

At Parkinson's UK, they have now set up a dedicated team to deal

:45:21.:45:29.

The charity says people with a degenerative disease already

:45:30.:45:32.

on the highest level of support should not

:45:33.:45:34.

have their needs constantly reassessed.

:45:35.:45:38.

The experience of going to an assessment is extremely stressful.

:45:39.:45:42.

People with Parkinson's go to so much trouble to appear well,

:45:43.:45:45.

and take their medication and get up so early in the morning to get

:45:46.:45:48.

And then because they appear well on that day, the assessor often

:45:49.:45:53.

says, "Well, you don't look ill, you don't need that

:45:54.:45:55.

The latest figures show the numbers appealing a decision are ballooning.

:45:56.:46:02.

There are now more than 6,000 full tribunals every month.

:46:03.:46:04.

A large proportion, 65%, have their decision overturned

:46:05.:46:06.

It's shocking, frankly, that two in every three PIP decisions that

:46:07.:46:14.

It's great that those decisions are then overturned and people

:46:15.:46:19.

are getting the levels of support they need, but we shouldn't be

:46:20.:46:22.

in a position where people have to rely on the appeals process

:46:23.:46:25.

to get that support in the first place.

:46:26.:46:27.

People should be able to expect that the first decision that they

:46:28.:46:30.

The Government says PIP assessments are carried out by qualified

:46:31.:46:35.

Decisions are made following consideration of all the information

:46:36.:46:38.

provided by the claimant, including supporting

:46:39.:46:40.

We first met Wendy Mitchell last year when she appeared in a film

:46:41.:46:53.

And that was when something hit me that it wasn't quite right.

:46:54.:47:07.

My life has changed, simply from the fact

:47:08.:47:14.

I probably was able simply to talk about anything and everything,

:47:15.:47:29.

She was one of the first to be moved straight onto PIP

:47:30.:47:40.

Under the current system, she still has to be

:47:41.:47:44.

When her latest decision came through, she was told her needs had

:47:45.:47:51.

changed, and her entire benefits would be cut from ?77

:47:52.:47:54.

It enables you to continue to live independently.

:47:55.:48:07.

That's the whole purpose of the benefit itself.

:48:08.:48:11.

It enables you to continue to live in your own home.

:48:12.:48:19.

Official statistics show that, overall, under PIP, more people

:48:20.:48:29.

with dementia do now appear to be receiving

:48:30.:48:31.

But critics say that's not the full story.

:48:32.:48:34.

The Alzheimer's Society says it's received at least 250 calls

:48:35.:48:36.

from people having problems with the benefit over

:48:37.:48:38.

I don't remember the content of the interview, but I remember

:48:39.:48:46.

feeling that I wasn't there very long, and the person didn't ask me

:48:47.:48:51.

many questions to help me remember what I was supposed to be saying.

:48:52.:48:57.

So, did you feel that they had an understanding

:48:58.:48:59.

of your condition at the end of it?

:49:00.:49:01.

I felt that they totally lacked any knowledge of dementia whatsoever.

:49:02.:49:05.

And then I got the shocking letter that told me that I was no longer

:49:06.:49:10.

And a list of all the things that I was apparently better

:49:11.:49:22.

I wish I was better, who wouldn't when they've got dementia?

:49:23.:49:35.

When you received that letter, what went through your head,

:49:36.:49:37.

Oh, well, it just makes you feel so demoralised.

:49:38.:49:42.

I instantly knew that the system is simply broken, because how can

:49:43.:49:48.

they tell me that I'm better than I was, when I've deteriorated?

:49:49.:49:58.

Since we filmed, Wendy has lost her first review of her PIP

:49:59.:50:01.

decision, and has decided a full appeal at tribunal

:50:02.:50:05.

A group of charities is now calling for ministers to scrap unnecessary

:50:06.:50:10.

repeated reassessments for people living with diseases

:50:11.:50:12.

The Government says the PIP system is better than the one it replaced,

:50:13.:50:20.

and overall is spending more on disability benefits every year.

:50:21.:50:27.

We asked the Department for Work and Pensions

:50:28.:50:29.

for an interview and, you guessed it, they said no.

:50:30.:50:36.

But in a statement told us, "PIP assessments are carried out

:50:37.:50:39.

by qualified health professionals who combine their clinical knowledge

:50:40.:50:41.

with an understanding of the fact that not everyone with the same

:50:42.:50:44.

disability is impacted in the same way.

:50:45.:50:46.

Decisions are made following consideration of all the information

:50:47.:50:48.

provided by the claimant, including supporting evidence

:50:49.:50:49.

from their GP or medical specialist."

:50:50.:50:56.

If you've been affected, do get in touch.

:50:57.:51:00.

We are going to talk to a Conservative MP at 10.45pm. The

:51:01.:51:07.

Electoral Commission say they are opening an investigation into Ukip's

:51:08.:51:12.

finances amid allegations the party misspent European Union money. So an

:51:13.:51:15.

investigation is going to be opened into Ukip's finances by the

:51:16.:51:19.

Electoral Commission. The allegation is that Ukip misspent European Union

:51:20.:51:24.

money. Donald Trump has said that he thinks that the current Ukip leader,

:51:25.:51:28.

Nigel Farage, should become Britain's next ambassador to the

:51:29.:51:30.

United States. Well, in the last minute, Nigel Farage tweeted this,

:51:31.:51:34.

"I have known several of the Trump team for years and I'm in a good

:51:35.:51:40.

position with the president-elect's support team to help."

:51:41.:51:55.

The Philip Hammond will set out more details about the public finance ins

:51:56.:52:00.

his Autumn Statement tomorrow. So what do the latest figures mean for

:52:01.:52:05.

us? Mean for you? What do they tell us about the state of the nation's

:52:06.:52:08.

finances in a post Brexit world? Here to talk in plain, simple

:52:09.:52:14.

language are Professor Anand Menon, who is Director of the UK

:52:15.:52:17.

in a Changing Europe initiative - Hello, both of you. Good morning.

:52:18.:52:24.

OK, what is the state of the British economy? Bearing in mind the latest

:52:25.:52:30.

figures? Well, latest figures are better than the economists

:52:31.:52:32.

predicted. What we can say about Brexit is less certain. It hasn't

:52:33.:52:35.

happened yet. There is a massive amount of uncertainty around. We

:52:36.:52:39.

haven't left the single market and trade hasn't dipped. It is too early

:52:40.:52:43.

to draw any conclusions, but so far, so good. Would agree with that? I

:52:44.:52:48.

would. It is due to the fact that the Bank of England has lowered

:52:49.:52:52.

interest rates further and that, of course, it gave a lot of liquidity

:52:53.:52:57.

back into the market to help the banks and to help business to

:52:58.:52:59.

continue to operate and borrow and therefore, invest. The con somer has

:53:00.:53:05.

taken huge benefit from that, very low interest rates and low mortgage

:53:06.:53:12.

rates having encouraged the take-up of borrowing and consumer spending

:53:13.:53:15.

has been high and that's what kept the economy going. So it wouldn't be

:53:16.:53:20.

fair then to say the Treasury warned of imminent danger if there was to

:53:21.:53:26.

be a leave vote and they were wrong because you say they've, the Bank of

:53:27.:53:30.

England and others have tried to ameliorate the situation? What would

:53:31.:53:33.

have happened if there was no intervention at all? What is going

:53:34.:53:36.

to happen tomorrow with Philip Hammond is he is going to make sure

:53:37.:53:40.

that he does enough to reassure businesses that in fact he would be

:53:41.:53:44.

behind them if you like to encourage investment which is very, very

:53:45.:53:48.

important for the economy. He can't do a lot because his fins even

:53:49.:53:53.

though better in the last month are actually still worse over the year

:53:54.:53:57.

or will be worse over the year than he was anticipating and will

:53:58.:53:59.

continue to be worse because the economy won't grow as fast as it did

:54:00.:54:04.

before and he will give those forecasts backing what he is going

:54:05.:54:08.

to be do from the office of budget responsibility which will show that

:54:09.:54:11.

slowdown will impact on his finances. So he will be careful in

:54:12.:54:14.

what he does. He will give a little bit there and a little bit there.

:54:15.:54:17.

More infrastructure and may help businesses a bit, but he will wait

:54:18.:54:20.

and see what happens to the economy over the next few months and maybe

:54:21.:54:25.

he will do something more fundamental. Should people expect

:54:26.:54:30.

after Christmas, I've interviewed various businesses, who say after

:54:31.:54:32.

Christmas they will have to put their prices up because of the level

:54:33.:54:36.

of sterling and importing bits and bobs have made their businesses more

:54:37.:54:41.

expensive? They are going to have to put their prices up because they're

:54:42.:54:44.

paying 20% more. Prices will go up. The flip side is that businesses

:54:45.:54:47.

that export might do better because their goods are cheaper. Of course,

:54:48.:54:51.

next year, at sometime we expect the Prime Minister to trigger Article 50

:54:52.:54:54.

and then the real show starts because then we get some idea about

:54:55.:54:59.

the impact on trade is going to be. At the moment we don't know. My

:55:00.:55:03.

sense is a lot of businesses are holding fire to wait and see which

:55:04.:55:07.

is why things are continuing as normal. We don't know what will

:55:08.:55:10.

happen because we don't know what Brexit will mean. OK. Thank you

:55:11.:55:12.

both. Thank you very much. Kanye West has been admitted

:55:13.:55:16.

to hospital for exhaustion, a day after cancelling his tour

:55:17.:55:18.

and this outburst over the weekend. Because I heard that you said

:55:19.:55:21.

you wouldn't perform unless you won Video of the Year over me,

:55:22.:55:32.

and over Hotline Bling. Now don't go trying

:55:33.:55:35.

to diss me, I said. But sometimes we be playing

:55:36.:55:42.

the politics too much Right now, press, get ready

:55:43.:55:48.

to write your passive aggressive, Get ready to have a

:55:49.:56:02.

field day for this. Get ready, get ready -

:56:03.:56:09.

because the show's over. Radio 1 Newsbeat's reporter

:56:10.:56:16.

Sinead Garvan can tell us more. What's going on? A man has been

:56:17.:56:26.

hospitalised. That's what LA PD Police told the BBC and it is widely

:56:27.:56:30.

assumed to be Kanye West. Varying reports around the States about what

:56:31.:56:34.

it is. I think the overall opinion it is to do with exhaustion. His

:56:35.:56:40.

morm spoke last night saying that he is very tired from the tour and if

:56:41.:56:44.

you look at everything that happened with the family, with Kim

:56:45.:56:49.

Kardashian's robbery and he is having problems with Jay Z and

:56:50.:56:52.

Beyonce. He talked about debt problems in the past. A lot of his

:56:53.:56:56.

friends say he is a man who doesn't sleep very much. He will stay up for

:56:57.:57:00.

48 hours at a time. So it seems that's probably the most likely

:57:01.:57:03.

thing that he has got to a point where everything has got on top of

:57:04.:57:07.

him and that's why he has been taken into hospital. A bit of burn-out

:57:08.:57:13.

perhaps. Yes. We will bring you the news and sport

:57:14.:57:17.

shortly, but here is the weather with Carol. What a lot of weather

:57:18.:57:22.

there has been, my goodness. There has. You can see how much rain we've

:57:23.:57:29.

in the last 12 hours or so. A lot pushing up across the north of

:57:30.:57:32.

England and into southern and Eastern Scotland and a lot of

:57:33.:57:34.

showers following on behind. All of this came on top of Storm Angus

:57:35.:57:39.

which went through on Sunday. Another area of low pressure formed

:57:40.:57:42.

and that brought in the wet and the windy conditions we had. But today,

:57:43.:57:48.

it is a little bit quieter. We have got weather pictures. This is Devon.

:57:49.:57:52.

A beautiful start to the day. It doesn't mean it will stay dry all

:57:53.:57:56.

day. There are showers around. And this is another one. Look at this.

:57:57.:58:00.

Somerset. There was a lot of rain and some flooding in Somerset. This

:58:01.:58:03.

is actually a field as you can tell with the grass sticking out of it.

:58:04.:58:07.

So a lot of rain and another one I want to show you is further east.

:58:08.:58:18.

This is in Surrey. Again, in Cobham. It has been so wet. After today,

:58:19.:58:22.

things tend to settle down. That's good news. So you weren't affected

:58:23.:58:27.

by t were you? No. No, thank goodness. There is a lot of surface

:58:28.:58:31.

water and spray on the roads. Yesterday when I was driving home it

:58:32.:58:34.

was scary, because I passed a lorry and there was water everywhere.

:58:35.:58:38.

Today, still showers to come. So I will just get on with the forecast.

:58:39.:58:41.

Showers around today. It will be wet and it will be windy for a time. And

:58:42.:58:46.

again, today, it is showers that we're looking at. Some of them

:58:47.:58:49.

merging to give longer spells of rain. As they travel behind this

:58:50.:58:53.

area of low pressure some will merge. So the south of the country

:58:54.:58:58.

seeing some breaks in the cloud. Will see maybe sunshine coming

:58:59.:59:01.

through across East Anglia, Kent, Essex and Kent and possibly the

:59:02.:59:05.

London area, but we're not immune to showers. It is further north and

:59:06.:59:09.

west where we will see the lion's share of the sunshine across Western

:59:10.:59:11.

Scotland and also into Northern Ireland. Temperatures here, seven or

:59:12.:59:16.

eight Celsius. Further south, milder at 11 or 12 Celsius. Windy around

:59:17.:59:21.

the coasts and as we head on through the evening and overnight, there

:59:22.:59:24.

goes the low pressure heading off to Scandinavia. Behind it, high

:59:25.:59:28.

pressure starts to build in. So things quieten down. There will be a

:59:29.:59:31.

lot of cloud across England and Wales. One or two breaks will allow

:59:32.:59:34.

fog patches to form in Southern England and maybe the Midlands and

:59:35.:59:38.

parts of Wales and we've got clearer skies across Scotland and Northern

:59:39.:59:41.

Ireland. So not only will it be a cold night, temperatures in Braemar,

:59:42.:59:45.

that area in the Highlands dropping to minus ten Celsius. We will have

:59:46.:59:49.

freezing fog. The freezing fog will be slow to lift tomorrow morning and

:59:50.:59:53.

it will really hold the temperature down, if it lingers for much of the

:59:54.:59:57.

day, but for Scotland and Northern Ireland and then later Northern

:59:58.:00:00.

England we will see a fair bit of sunshine. For the rest of England

:00:01.:00:03.

and Wales, variable amounts of cloud, some holes being punched in

:00:04.:00:07.

that through the day so some of us will see some sunshine, but still a

:00:08.:00:12.

few showers. The winds will strengthen again, across the English

:00:13.:00:15.

Channel, affecting the Channel Islands and later we will have

:00:16.:00:19.

coastal gales off the coastlines of Devon and Cornwall. Temperatures

:00:20.:00:22.

tomorrow, well nothing to write home about. If you are stuck under the

:00:23.:00:26.

fog, that's what this two represents, but as we come further

:00:27.:00:30.

south, we are looking at nines, tens and 11s. A look at overnight and

:00:31.:00:36.

into Wednesday morning. It will be wet and windy. High pressure

:00:37.:00:40.

establishes itself over the UK so we see more settled conditions. Mostly

:00:41.:00:44.

dry and cold by night and cold by day.

:00:45.:00:48.

Hello, I'm Victoria Derbyshire, welcome to the programme.

:00:49.:00:53.

Thousands of people with the generative diseases are getting

:00:54.:00:59.

their benefits cut because they are told they are getting better.

:01:00.:01:04.

Straightaway, when they look at their paper, they can see if

:01:05.:01:07.

somebody has Parkinson's disease, dementia, MS. You are not going to

:01:08.:01:12.

get over it, it is going to get worse.

:01:13.:01:14.

We will hear from more people affected. If it has happened to you,

:01:15.:01:21.

get in touch. Last week we spoke exclusively to

:01:22.:01:24.

the former professional footballer Andy Woodward, who revealed how his

:01:25.:01:27.

formative coach accused him for years.

:01:28.:01:29.

The impact it's had on my life is just catastrophic,

:01:30.:01:31.

and you live with that all your life, and you can't put it

:01:32.:01:36.

Since that interview, six people have come forward to say they also

:01:37.:01:49.

have been abused. We will talk to him again shortly.

:01:50.:01:53.

And, competitive gaming is growing massively in popularity, so why at

:01:54.:01:58.

the biggest gaming awards last night did not a single woman win one?

:01:59.:02:02.

There is a perception that men are biologically crime -- primed for it,

:02:03.:02:12.

that men are better at competitive games, therefore they are more

:02:13.:02:13.

visible in the industry. Here's Joanna in the BBC Newsroom

:02:14.:02:16.

with a summary of today's news. The NHS is looking at

:02:17.:02:20.

whether patients across England should have to produce two forms

:02:21.:02:22.

of ID before receiving Its most-senior official says

:02:23.:02:25.

it is considering identity checks in an effort to tackle the rise

:02:26.:02:31.

in so-called health tourism, when foreigners come to the UK

:02:32.:02:36.

to receive free medical treatment. Nigel Farage has said he's "very

:02:37.:02:38.

flattered" by Donald Trump's call for him to be appointed Britain's

:02:39.:02:42.

ambassador to the US. The President-elect said he would do

:02:43.:02:45.

a "great job" and that "many people" wanted to see the interim Ukip

:02:46.:02:48.

leader as the UK's senior The suggestion was quickly rebuffed

:02:49.:02:51.

by Downing Street, which says The UK's election watchdog has

:02:52.:03:05.

announced it has opened an investigation into Ukip's finances,

:03:06.:03:09.

following allegations that the party misspent money it received from the

:03:10.:03:13.

EU by the European Parliament to regroup it is affiliated to. It is

:03:14.:03:18.

claimed they use the funds on its campaigns in the general election

:03:19.:03:21.

and the Brexit referendum. The electoral commission is looking at

:03:22.:03:25.

whether there was a breach of UK election law.

:03:26.:03:27.

The amount the Government has to borrow to plug the gap between its

:03:28.:03:33.

income and its spending shrank in October, 24 8p, down by a quarter

:03:34.:03:36.

compared with the same month a year ago the figures were better than

:03:37.:03:45.

most economists had expected. What these numbers show is something

:03:46.:03:50.

relatively positive, we were expecting the Government to have to

:03:51.:03:54.

borrow ?6 billion to close the gap between its income and spending in

:03:55.:04:00.

October, in the end it only had to borrow 4.8 billion, so it is better

:04:01.:04:04.

than most were expecting. If you look at the total amount we have

:04:05.:04:08.

borrowed over time, all of those deficit added up, it comes to 1.6

:04:09.:04:13.

trillion, urges a lot of money, that is about 84% of the whole economy,

:04:14.:04:19.

or on the other hand, it is not quite as much as a proportion of the

:04:20.:04:23.

economy as it was. That has been the Government goal, to have the debt

:04:24.:04:27.

coming down as a proportion of the economy. It is not that they are

:04:28.:04:30.

slashing the debt, it is more that the economy is growing better than

:04:31.:04:33.

people thought. Thousands with in curable conditions

:04:34.:04:38.

are being told by the Government that some of their benefits have

:04:39.:04:42.

been stopped because they are getting better. We have discovered

:04:43.:04:51.

that many are applying for the mobility element of PIP and having

:04:52.:04:52.

their awards refused, sometimes to zero. The Government says more

:04:53.:04:53.

people are getting the highest level of support.

:04:54.:04:55.

That's a summary of the latest BBC News, more at 10:30am.

:04:56.:05:00.

Gareth Southgate is going to have to wait until next Wednesday to see

:05:01.:05:06.

Former England striker Chris Sutton called the interview a "slap

:05:07.:05:13.

Adrian Bevington, who used to be an FA executive,

:05:14.:05:19.

told the BBC it made "perfect sense" to make the meeting

:05:20.:05:21.

public and that it didn't overcomplicate the process.

:05:22.:05:25.

One thing that could complicate the process is the sacking

:05:26.:05:28.

of Jurgen Klinsmann as USA head coach.

:05:29.:05:31.

It was reported back in July that the former Spurs and Germany

:05:32.:05:34.

star was one of those interviewed as a potential successor

:05:35.:05:36.

There was one game in the Premier League,

:05:37.:05:41.

and a bit of a surprising result, as West Brom beat Burnley

:05:42.:05:44.

4-0 at the Hawthorns, thanks largely to a first-half

:05:45.:05:48.

scoring blitz, with Matty Philips, this from James Morrison

:05:49.:05:52.

and a Darren Fletcher tap-in putting Albion three up at half-time.

:05:53.:05:55.

Striker Salomon Rondon rounded off the scoring in the second half

:05:56.:05:59.

as Tony Pulis' side move into the top half of the table.

:06:00.:06:03.

That's back-to-back wins for them as well, so good news

:06:04.:06:05.

You know, to score four goals, it's been a dreadful day today,

:06:06.:06:10.

and to get the supporters out, I thank the supporters for coming

:06:11.:06:14.

tonight, because they could have easily sat in and watched it on TV.

:06:15.:06:17.

So they deserve a lot of credit, and I'm just so pleased that we've

:06:18.:06:21.

put a performance in and scored four goals for them, really.

:06:22.:06:25.

The International Cricket Council has fined South Africa captain Faf

:06:26.:06:28.

du Plessis 100% of his match fee after been found guilty of ball

:06:29.:06:32.

tampering during the second Test against Australia in Hobart,

:06:33.:06:37.

but is free to play in the third Test.

:06:38.:06:44.

It is not often not members of Barcelona's team are starstruck, but

:06:45.:06:50.

they may just have happened yesterday when they were paid a

:06:51.:06:53.

visit by one of pop's the guest stars, I am talking about Justin

:06:54.:06:58.

Bieber, with Neymar, at their training ground. The Canadian is due

:06:59.:07:04.

to perform in Barcelona today, he took time out and showed off some of

:07:05.:07:08.

his skills on the pitch. The Brazilian star posted afterwards, it

:07:09.:07:13.

was impossible to dribble past this defender, with a picture of him.

:07:14.:07:18.

That is all the sport for now, we are back with more just after

:07:19.:07:21.

10:30am. Nigel Farage has written an article

:07:22.:07:28.

for a right-wing news website, the editor in chief of which has just

:07:29.:07:32.

been appointed chief strategist by Donald Trump. This is what he says.

:07:33.:07:37.

He is responding to the fact that Donald Trump has tweeted that Nigel

:07:38.:07:42.

Farage will be a great ambassador to the United States. Nigel Farage

:07:43.:07:46.

says, nothing could have paid me for what came next, like adult from the

:07:47.:07:51.

blue, Donald Trump tweeted I would do a great job of the UK's

:07:52.:07:55.

ambassador to Washington. I can scarcely believe he did that, though

:07:56.:07:59.

speaking to a couple of his friends, perhaps I am less surprised, they

:08:00.:08:03.

all say that he is loyal and supports those that stand by him. It

:08:04.:08:07.

is called trust, it is how the world of business operates. The cesspit of

:08:08.:08:12.

his career politics understands nothing of this. The concept of

:08:13.:08:18.

trust is transitory. He goes on to say, at every stage I am greeted by

:08:19.:08:21.

negative comments from Downing Street, the dislike of me, Ukip and

:08:22.:08:25.

the referendum result is more important to them than what could be

:08:26.:08:29.

good for our country. I have known several of his team for years, I am

:08:30.:08:33.

in a good position with his support to help. The world has changed, and

:08:34.:08:38.

it is time that Downing Street did as well. The words of Nigel Farage

:08:39.:08:40.

on the right wing news website. Last week, we exclusively spoke

:08:41.:08:43.

to ex-Crewe Alexandra player Andy Woodward,

:08:44.:08:45.

who told us in his first broadcast interview he'd been raped hundreds

:08:46.:08:48.

of times by a former youth coach. Any person that has suffered abuse

:08:49.:09:06.

and rape, etc, will hopefully understand where I come from when I

:09:07.:09:10.

say this. The impact it has had on my life is just catastrophic. You

:09:11.:09:18.

live with that all your life. I cannot put it into words what that

:09:19.:09:24.

has done to me. But other people out there will understand what it does

:09:25.:09:28.

to you. Everybody always says, how do you cope with it? We survive, and

:09:29.:09:32.

that is it. Andy Woodward told us he'd

:09:33.:09:34.

waived his right to anonymity and was speaking out to try and urge

:09:35.:09:37.

others to come forward. Since that interview,

:09:38.:09:40.

six other people have come forward. You have spoken to them all, what

:09:41.:09:56.

have they said? I have been inundated with not only the six

:09:57.:10:00.

people that I have spoken to directly, but also messages from

:10:01.:10:07.

other players who have told me that... So many stories,

:10:08.:10:10.

heartbreaking, I have been so emotional. They are harrowing

:10:11.:10:17.

stories. They have reached out to me and thanked me so much for coming

:10:18.:10:23.

out originally. It has given faith. You have spoken to six, but other

:10:24.:10:30.

contact via Twitter. In total, how many people have got in touch with

:10:31.:10:34.

you since to interview? There has been several people that have

:10:35.:10:49.

contacted me. I cannot put a number on it. They vary in what they have

:10:50.:11:10.

said. They all footballers? Yes, ex-footballers. Did they say that

:11:11.:11:10.

they found the courage to speak out because you had? Absolutely, that is

:11:11.:11:15.

what they have said. The colours of what I have said, it has given them

:11:16.:11:16.

coverage -- courage and belief. Cheshire police are investigating.

:11:17.:11:17.

Is this the tip of the iceberg's I have said it all along, it is. But

:11:18.:11:18.

it will take them a long time. People to come out and speak, there

:11:19.:11:24.

is no rush, the police have started their investigation, and I don't

:11:25.:11:27.

want to put pressure on anybody. I came out with a long view, for other

:11:28.:11:32.

people to survive from this, and I cannot thank the public enough for

:11:33.:11:37.

what they have done. It is brilliant, I can't thank them for

:11:38.:11:42.

their support they have given me. Have you had any contact with Crewe

:11:43.:11:46.

Alexandra since the revelations? No contact from them whatsoever. I was

:11:47.:11:51.

very disappointed with the replies that have come out. That is an

:11:52.:11:57.

understatement, disappointed. It may be really sad. Why did you think

:11:58.:12:03.

they are saying nothing? I don't know, somebody would have to ask

:12:04.:12:07.

them that I have no idea. Why has it upset you so much? I came out with

:12:08.:12:16.

such a story, it has taken me so much coverage, and it has taken so

:12:17.:12:19.

much longer for them to come back with any reply. I did not expect any

:12:20.:12:26.

sort of long things, but just an appreciation for what I went through

:12:27.:12:32.

there. I have a statement from Cheshire police, they say, we are in

:12:33.:12:35.

the process of making contact with six people and no one else is under

:12:36.:12:41.

investigation at this stage. We take all reports of sexual offences to be

:12:42.:12:45.

seriously and have specialist trained officers to provide advice

:12:46.:12:50.

support. We urge anybody who has been a victim, no matter how long

:12:51.:12:54.

ago, to contact the police on 101. If there are other players, former

:12:55.:13:00.

players, young football players, who could be experiencing this, what

:13:01.:13:06.

would you say to them? All I would say is I am an example, I just one

:13:07.:13:15.

of many, I with you all the way. I just hope that one day you feel the

:13:16.:13:19.

courage and the bravery that I have been told I have had, I don't see it

:13:20.:13:25.

like that, I Jesse White can help people, but one day you will pluck

:13:26.:13:28.

up the courage to come forward, because I know there are several

:13:29.:13:32.

more. There are loads of people out there, and it is not just Crewe

:13:33.:13:46.

Alexandra. That man was at other football clubs, including Manchester

:13:47.:13:49.

City. I am aware of people going back in history that have suffered

:13:50.:13:50.

all their lives because of this. This is not just because of Crewe

:13:51.:13:53.

Alexandra, these other clubs that were involved, with that man, who

:13:54.:13:54.

went round thinking that he could take people's lives and strip them.

:13:55.:13:59.

You are speaking of the man who was jailed in the late 90s after

:14:00.:14:01.

pleading guilty to offences against boys. That is correct. I am aware, I

:14:02.:14:08.

have spoken to people at Manchester city who have made comments about

:14:09.:14:13.

that man and what he did and lucky escape that people have had. It is

:14:14.:14:19.

devastating. I will not stop now. I want this to good to knew. That is

:14:20.:14:25.

why I am trying to generate as much support from people, because people

:14:26.:14:29.

are suffering out there. You have done a remarkable thing, thank you

:14:30.:14:32.

for talking to as again. Just one thing. I just want to send a message

:14:33.:14:38.

to my family, who have all been absolutely fantastic. And my dad,

:14:39.:14:44.

who has motor neurone disease, and will be watching this, so thanks,

:14:45.:14:45.

dad. A right-wing journalist has been

:14:46.:15:02.

barred from speaking at his old school after the Government's

:15:03.:15:07.

counter extremism unit intervened. We will talk to some of the students

:15:08.:15:08.

at the school. NHS patients in England could be

:15:09.:15:12.

required to show two types of identification,

:15:13.:15:15.

including their passports, before getting some types

:15:16.:15:16.

of non-emergency treatment, It's part of an attempt to crack

:15:17.:15:18.

down on so-called health tourism. Labour said it will oppose the move

:15:19.:15:26.

being rolled across England and Wales saying that NHS staff are not

:15:27.:15:29.

border guards. A senior civil servant

:15:30.:15:32.

at the Department of Health called Chris Wormald told MPs

:15:33.:15:36.

that it was a controversial move but already happened

:15:37.:15:38.

in some NHS trusts. We have some trusts which are asking

:15:39.:15:48.

for two forms of ID before treatment. That's obviously a

:15:49.:15:55.

controversial thing to do, but in terms of how do you get those

:15:56.:15:59.

numbers up? Those are the kinds of things we will look at. The general

:16:00.:16:06.

question of are we looking at whether trusts should proactively

:16:07.:16:09.

ask people to prove identity, yes, we are looking at that. As I say we

:16:10.:16:13.

know individual trusts like Peterborough who are doing that and

:16:14.:16:18.

who are reporting it makes a big difference and they are saying

:16:19.:16:21.

please come with two forms of identity and they use that to check

:16:22.:16:28.

whether people are eligible or not. It is obviously a controversial

:16:29.:16:32.

thing to do to say to the entire population that you have to prove

:16:33.:16:33.

identity. So, how much does health tourism

:16:34.:16:36.

actually cost the NHS? Nick Triggle is our

:16:37.:16:38.

health correspondent. It foreigners come to go Britain or

:16:39.:16:48.

foreigners who already live in Britain or what? It is overseas

:16:49.:16:52.

nationals being treated by the NHS. Now that costs an estimated ?2

:16:53.:16:57.

billion a year, but what the Government is focussing on and what

:16:58.:17:00.

the Government is talking about today is routine hospital care

:17:01.:17:04.

because A care and GP services are provided free. They are focussing on

:17:05.:17:09.

routine hospital stuff, maternity services, scans, knee and hip

:17:10.:17:14.

operations. OK. The Government have set a target for recouping ?500

:17:15.:17:18.

million by next year, but already the NHS is behind schedule so they

:17:19.:17:22.

are looking at new ways to help hospitals identify the status of

:17:23.:17:26.

patients. So, when you say recouping, you mean somebody gives

:17:27.:17:30.

in their passport, you go, you're from South Africa, therefore, we

:17:31.:17:33.

will recoup the money from your Government, is that what it means?

:17:34.:17:37.

Well, so there is three things hospitals are looking for. Of

:17:38.:17:40.

course, firstly, if they are a British national, free treatment. If

:17:41.:17:43.

they are from much of Europe and there are a few other countries

:17:44.:17:47.

where there is an agreement, the hospital then starts a process to

:17:48.:17:51.

charge that patient's Government. However, if they are from outside of

:17:52.:17:56.

Europe, where there aren't the agreements, the patient is charged.

:17:57.:17:59.

There is a third thing they are looking for and that's whether last

:18:00.:18:10.

year, a surcharge was brought on and students were charged ?150 during

:18:11.:18:14.

the visa applications and other people charged ?250 of the that's

:18:15.:18:19.

what hospitals are looking for. If they haven't paid that surcharge

:18:20.:18:26.

when they applied for their visa and they don't get the treatment or

:18:27.:18:32.

what? If they are looking at urgent treatment, the hospital will treat

:18:33.:18:37.

them and then look to recoup it. In Peterborough, either you pay it or

:18:38.:18:39.

you don't get the routine treatment. We can also speak to Meirion Thomas,

:18:40.:18:43.

former consultant surgeon at the Royal Marsden Hospital in

:18:44.:18:45.

London. And Meg Hillier, who chairs the

:18:46.:18:49.

Commons Public Accounts Committee. What do you think about this? I

:18:50.:18:57.

think it is an excellent idea, I suggested this in a letter to the

:18:58.:19:00.

Department of Health in August 2015 and I spoke again to senior members

:19:01.:19:03.

at the Department of Health in January 2016. Why is it an excellent

:19:04.:19:07.

idea? It is an excellent idea because the concept is that the NHS

:19:08.:19:12.

is free at the point of use, but it is, of course, only for eligible

:19:13.:19:17.

patients and I think it is a minimum infringement to people's rights when

:19:18.:19:22.

they attend for their first hospital appointment just to produce their

:19:23.:19:26.

passport or utility bill, driving licence, just to prove that they are

:19:27.:19:31.

eligible for free NHS care. Can I make the point? The whole, this

:19:32.:19:35.

mornings the BBC have been saying this is, health tourism is costing

:19:36.:19:39.

?500 million. That's not right. It is ?2 billion, Nick just said that.

:19:40.:19:43.

It is ?2 billion. The Department of Health are hoping to recover ?500

:19:44.:19:48.

million. Even if they recover that, they are ?1250 million short by next

:19:49.:19:52.

year, that's what the National Audit Office said, even if they recovered

:19:53.:19:58.

that, they are ?1.5 million that the British taxpayer is still funding

:19:59.:20:02.

and subsidising. The Department of Health have really not got to grips

:20:03.:20:08.

with this problem. Meg Hillier, talk to Professor Thomas who thinks it is

:20:09.:20:13.

an excellent idea. It is a minimum infringement just to show your

:20:14.:20:16.

passport. The challenge is how you get a system in place that quite

:20:17.:20:19.

rightly and quite fairly gets people to pay who should be paying. I agre

:20:20.:20:26.

with the professor that people shouldn't be coming here and getting

:20:27.:20:29.

free treatment. If you are saying a passport for everybody, not only

:20:30.:20:34.

everybody has a passport. Only 85% of the population does and a British

:20:35.:20:38.

passport does not prove that you are entitled to healthcare. The

:20:39.:20:41.

Government has set a target for getting some of the money back for

:20:42.:20:45.

the taxpayer, but it set that three years ago and it never set-up a

:20:46.:20:48.

system and because we have a system free at point of delivery, unlike

:20:49.:20:52.

other countries where it is insurance based it is complicated to

:20:53.:20:55.

do that. The Government has got to get a grip... In principle, it

:20:56.:20:58.

sounds like you're saying, this is a good idea? Well, look, it is a good

:20:59.:21:02.

idea to make people who should pay, pay. But I don't think that the

:21:03.:21:07.

proposal of showing a passport really necessarily proves anything.

:21:08.:21:14.

What do you suggest? This is go Wye the Government has to get to grip

:21:15.:21:19.

with it. What is good practise where trusts are getting the money in with

:21:20.:21:23.

minimal intrusion to the patient. How are they doing that? That's what

:21:24.:21:29.

we got out of yesterday. Very little. Three years ago the target

:21:30.:21:33.

was set and there is no clear system in place, so you have got individual

:21:34.:21:36.

hospitals setting up their system and some working better than others,

:21:37.:21:41.

but no real magic way of making sure that overseas citizens pay and you

:21:42.:21:44.

are not at the same time denying British citizens access and that's

:21:45.:21:49.

the key thing. If you're British, you are entitled, you are resident

:21:50.:21:54.

you may not have a utility bill. What happens to them? You have got

:21:55.:21:58.

to really make sure you think carefully before rushing into a

:21:59.:22:07.

system like this. Professor Thomas? I submitted a 3,000 document to your

:22:08.:22:13.

committee and I did ask if I could appear? Not enough time, professor.

:22:14.:22:20.

It is a minimal infridgement, just because people don't have a passport

:22:21.:22:25.

or driving licence, they will have a utility bill. There are plenty of

:22:26.:22:32.

people who are living abroad who have got foreign passports, but they

:22:33.:22:36.

are resident this this country. Our NHS system is free access to the NHS

:22:37.:22:40.

is dependant on residency, not nationality. A utility bill is what

:22:41.:22:45.

it comes down to or something similar. I can't see why you object

:22:46.:22:49.

to that. Everybody has got a utility bill. I am a constituency MP in

:22:50.:22:54.

Central London. Many of my constituents don't often because

:22:55.:22:57.

they are young and live at home still with their parents or older

:22:58.:23:01.

people, people my age never lived independently because they can't

:23:02.:23:05.

afford to. I don't think we're disagreeing that people who should

:23:06.:23:08.

pay, who are foreign nationals who come here as visitors or whatever

:23:09.:23:11.

and don't qualify should certainly pay and there needs to be a question

:23:12.:23:14.

asked when they are this hospital, there needs to be a mechanism for

:23:15.:23:17.

getting that back. One of the things I would say as well, a lot of

:23:18.:23:20.

hospitals charge people, but getting the money in isn't working. So the

:23:21.:23:24.

Government has got to look at that if they are going to make sure

:23:25.:23:29.

people pay, it is no good sending a bill to someone after they have gone

:23:30.:23:33.

back to their country. Figures show that doesn't turn up. Invoices

:23:34.:23:39.

raised only 16% are honoured. But there is so much at stake. There is

:23:40.:23:43.

?1.5 billion at stake. We are talking about 2% of the NHS budget.

:23:44.:23:50.

So saying that, you're not going to allow people, it is an infringement

:23:51.:23:54.

to ask people to show identification. I think that foreign

:23:55.:23:58.

nationals should pay and there needs to be a system in place, but we need

:23:59.:24:03.

to make sure the system works and it is cost effective at the time of

:24:04.:24:06.

asking for any identification or whatever, but that it doesn't cut

:24:07.:24:10.

out other people. There just needs to be more thought into the process.

:24:11.:24:16.

And just not a free-for-all. I used to be the ID cards minister and

:24:17.:24:20.

passport minister so I have thought about it a lot as well. So there are

:24:21.:24:23.

real challenges about how we prove identity. The definition of a health

:24:24.:24:29.

tourist is someone who comes to this country with a preexisting illness

:24:30.:24:33.

and the purpose of their visit is to access free NHS care. These people

:24:34.:24:38.

have no intention of paying. There is no point in trying to establish

:24:39.:24:43.

the system to make them may for efficiently. What's really clear is

:24:44.:24:47.

when people with the visa and the student precharge, the health charge

:24:48.:24:51.

that's put on when you get a visa, no one asked the question, do you

:24:52.:24:54.

have a preexisting health condition? It would be reasonable to introduce

:24:55.:24:58.

that. But there is no discussion really about that happening at this

:24:59.:25:01.

stage and that would make a lot of sense and pick up the actual real

:25:02.:25:05.

health tourists who come with a condition thinking they're going to

:25:06.:25:08.

get it treated for free right before they arrive and that would be a good

:25:09.:25:12.

important step. This is from Paula. I worked at Lewisham Hospital. I had

:25:13.:25:15.

to get treatment over a period of time and this involved regular x-ray

:25:16.:25:20.

treatments while in the waiting room, at least half of the people

:25:21.:25:25.

were not residents in the UK, they were accompanied by their

:25:26.:25:28.

grandchildren who spoke to the receptionist. While talking to one

:25:29.:25:32.

young lad, he told me he was with his grandparents to came here to get

:25:33.:25:37.

treatment for various ailments. Alan says, "What about those who will

:25:38.:25:41.

never have passports?" You don't want to get obsessed with the

:25:42.:25:44.

passport issue. Thank you both. Thank you very much for coming on

:25:45.:25:46.

the programme. Gaming is a huge, huge

:25:47.:25:54.

industry for the UK. It's estimated to be worth around

:25:55.:25:56.

?4.2 billion and, in fact, Competitive gaming known as e-sports

:25:57.:25:59.

is growing massively in popularity. Thousands of people

:26:00.:26:03.

pack out Wembley Arena So why, at the biggest

:26:04.:26:05.

gaming awards last night, No women were nominated in any

:26:06.:26:08.

of the gaming categories either and now some professional female

:26:09.:26:13.

players are speaking out about what they feel

:26:14.:26:15.

is a culture of sexism. Our reporter Chi Chi Izundu

:26:16.:26:18.

was at the awards. It is one of the highlights of the

:26:19.:26:29.

year in the E sports community, but there was one big thing missing when

:26:30.:26:32.

it came to the nominations and winners of gaming categories. Women.

:26:33.:26:40.

Effectively you've got the Rory McIlroy, the Cristiano Ronaldo of

:26:41.:26:44.

e-sports in the room tonight and people need to start respecting

:26:45.:26:51.

their ability level. Martin works at G-Finity a company

:26:52.:26:54.

behind a number of tournaments around the world. The tournaments

:26:55.:27:00.

are just one of the ways gamers can make some money, but you won't find

:27:01.:27:04.

many women at the top ones. In fact you are more likely to find them

:27:05.:27:11.

battling at women-only events. Women in e-sports is a very rich subject

:27:12.:27:15.

and it is a very emotive subject and a lot more needs to be done to

:27:16.:27:19.

ensure if not only the perception changes that actually there is more

:27:20.:27:25.

participation opportunities. Women-only teams are a way around

:27:26.:27:29.

the lack of female competitors a the top. Team Secrets became the top

:27:30.:27:36.

female team in the world. There are no physical gownedries or gender

:27:37.:27:39.

boundaries, it is only if you're good enough at the Games. As long as

:27:40.:27:42.

you're good enough, you're good enough. More women should be

:27:43.:27:44.

involved. More women should want to be involved. More girls should talk

:27:45.:27:49.

about e-sports and just get stuck in. So is it as simple as women

:27:50.:27:56.

aren't good enough to be nominated? There were examples of females in

:27:57.:28:03.

e-sports at the top level. There is Scarlett a Starcraft player who

:28:04.:28:08.

earned over 160,000 inside tournament prize winnings. Not

:28:09.:28:13.

wanting to put words into your mouth, women aren't good enough at

:28:14.:28:17.

this particular point in time? If you want to sort of generalise then

:28:18.:28:21.

no. But there are women who are good enough, but there aren't enough of

:28:22.:28:26.

them to choose from. E-sports isn't on the same level as other major

:28:27.:28:31.

league sports, but it is a growing industry. They don't have that many

:28:32.:28:35.

events in their calendar year. Around 40,000 people though have

:28:36.:28:39.

been known to pack out venues just to watch a tournament live with

:28:40.:28:45.

millions tuning in online. Audience wise, it's around 82% men. There are

:28:46.:28:50.

calls though to try and get more girls in the grass-roots of the

:28:51.:28:53.

industry to change that and gamer numbers.

:28:54.:29:02.

We need for visibility given to women who are already in the

:29:03.:29:05.

industry who are doing really good work. People who are working as

:29:06.:29:09.

journalists or streamers or casters or professional players who don't

:29:10.:29:13.

have the same time in the spotlight who aren't given the same financial

:29:14.:29:19.

resources, who aren't offered the same sponsorship deals or platforms

:29:20.:29:25.

to becoming an influential member of the e-sports industry especially as

:29:26.:29:29.

so much of your success is dependant on being embraced by the grass-roots

:29:30.:29:33.

community and a lot of that is facilitated by the amount of

:29:34.:29:37.

visibility that you have on various digital platforms and women don't

:29:38.:29:40.

get those resources in the same amount that men do, unfortunately.

:29:41.:29:44.

Let's talk to Charleyy Hodson, who is a former gamer and now writes

:29:45.:29:49.

about it Josh Nino De Guzman, Director of Dexerto.com,

:29:50.:29:51.

a gaming website Melonie Mac who is a Professional Online Gamer.

:29:52.:29:55.

Welcome all of you. Is this a big deal, sn Yes. I think it can be a

:29:56.:30:03.

very big deal. Women deserve fair representation in everything in the

:30:04.:30:07.

entire world really. I think it's tough from the outside to understand

:30:08.:30:11.

why no women were nominated let alone that they didn't win. In that

:30:12.:30:18.

report Team Secret are one of the top female teams. They won four

:30:19.:30:22.

major tournaments this year, so they're there, but the question is,

:30:23.:30:26.

I don't like the wording, "Where they as good as the men?" There is a

:30:27.:30:31.

question to why the top women's team in the world wasn't classified or

:30:32.:30:33.

mentioned at the awards. Some people think female gamers

:30:34.:30:42.

cannot be as good as men? There is no data to prove that. Any data from

:30:43.:30:50.

the past is perpetuating stereotypes. There is not as much of

:30:51.:30:56.

a crisis as people think. Traditional media are putting a

:30:57.:31:01.

negative spin on it. Including us. One of the judges was involved in

:31:02.:31:09.

the process, the woman, so it is not as though they are a complete

:31:10.:31:13.

anomaly. Fewer females compete, so there is a smaller pool of talent.

:31:14.:31:20.

Men are better represented. The way Jost describes it, is that right,

:31:21.:31:26.

there are fewer female gamers? There are more female gamers playing

:31:27.:31:31.

games. It is 50-50. But this is a splinter of that. What is tougher

:31:32.:31:36.

than a lot of females is that the community can be toxic, and so the

:31:37.:31:43.

accessibility, putting yourself out there, it can be intimidating for a

:31:44.:31:49.

lot of girls. All of the trolls and stuff like that make it difficult.

:31:50.:31:54.

The more that we have accessible female leagues, that makes it easier

:31:55.:32:00.

for a lot of the girls who would be intimidated to jump in, and from

:32:01.:32:03.

there get the confidence to jump into the regularly. Is that systemic

:32:04.:32:09.

sexism, not unique to one particular brands? I don't think this, a lot of

:32:10.:32:21.

people do. I can see that point, but as a whole, I just think that a lot

:32:22.:32:25.

of girls that I talked to who are really good at games and who I would

:32:26.:32:30.

encourage to compete, they are just like, it is intimidating because

:32:31.:32:33.

people are mean, and the environment makes it difficult. What kind of

:32:34.:32:41.

comments are toxic? A lot of general sexist comments, inappropriate

:32:42.:32:47.

comments about showing parts of your body, people suggesting that you do

:32:48.:32:54.

that, all kinds of inappropriate, uncomfortable things. People online

:32:55.:33:01.

are mean to everyone. You would not say it in person. Women are

:33:02.:33:05.

chastised whether they are dressed regularly or whether they are using

:33:06.:33:15.

their assets. As a whole, it is mail bomber noted. -- dominated by men. I

:33:16.:33:23.

stream video games. Almost the entire audience is mail, there is a

:33:24.:33:27.

much smaller fraction of female viewers. I can see how it is

:33:28.:33:32.

intimidating for girls. I deal with the comments, it is fine, I don't

:33:33.:33:37.

let it bring me down, but a lot of girls are not used to that, they

:33:38.:33:41.

have not put themselves in that situation. It would be nice if they

:33:42.:33:46.

had more accessible female leagues that they could join and feel

:33:47.:33:50.

comfortable, and from there get it to the men's. You have to understand

:33:51.:33:57.

the point from some of the guys, especially some of those who protest

:33:58.:34:03.

against misogyny, there is no segregation in tournaments, so the

:34:04.:34:05.

overall prize pool available to women is higher, if they are female

:34:06.:34:13.

only leagues. That is a good point. There is no clear answer, the

:34:14.:34:20.

perfect way. But I feel that in order to get more of a female

:34:21.:34:23.

presence, something like that would help. I do agree. The question comes

:34:24.:34:33.

down to, with the boards or things on how people are registered and

:34:34.:34:38.

find each other, on YouTube, all women being fairly represented as a

:34:39.:34:44.

majority of people, our mail channels being represented, and when

:34:45.:34:49.

it comes to the awards, the report said it is difficult to find female

:34:50.:34:52.

players, but it is not that difficult, because there are women

:34:53.:34:56.

out there. Melanie is there. It is a question of whether they look to

:34:57.:35:08.

find women to go in there. You can find out more on the BBC

:35:09.:35:15.

News website, in the 100 Women series.

:35:16.:35:19.

People with in curable diseases are losing part or all of their benefits

:35:20.:35:24.

after being reassessed. And, Ukip's leader has welcomed

:35:25.:35:29.

Donald Trump's suggestion that he would do a great job as Britain's

:35:30.:35:33.

ambassador to the US, despite their getting no vacancy. We will get the

:35:34.:35:37.

reaction here. Here's the BBC Newsroom

:35:38.:35:40.

with a summary of today's news. The NHS is considering requiring

:35:41.:35:42.

patients in England to produce two forms of identification,

:35:43.:35:45.

including a passport, before they receive some types

:35:46.:35:48.

of non-emergency treatment. It's an attempt to reduce the cost

:35:49.:35:51.

to the service of treating patients from abroad,

:35:52.:35:54.

which currently stands Labour will oppose the move, they

:35:55.:36:10.

say NHS staff not border guards. A spokesman from the BMA says puzzles

:36:11.:36:14.

go far. Nigel Farage has said he is in a

:36:15.:36:21.

good position to help the law -- help after Donald Trump's call for

:36:22.:36:24.

him to be British ambassador to the US. He said many people wanted him

:36:25.:36:30.

to be the UK's senior diplomat in Washington. Downing Street has made

:36:31.:36:34.

clear there is not a vacancy. The amount that the Government has

:36:35.:36:37.

to borrow to plug the gap between its income and spending shrank in

:36:38.:36:42.

October to ?4.8 billion, down by a quarter prepared with the same month

:36:43.:36:47.

a year ago. The figures from the ONS were better than most economists had

:36:48.:36:48.

predicted. According to reports

:36:49.:36:50.

in the US media, Kanye West has been hospitalised,

:36:51.:36:53.

suffering from exhaustion. The news comes after the musician

:36:54.:36:54.

abruptly cancelled the remainder of his live tour following a week

:36:55.:36:56.

of no-shows, curtailed concerts Join me for BBC

:36:57.:37:00.

Newsroom Live at 11am. I have had this e-mail from Keith,

:37:01.:37:21.

it is quite long. I have been fighting the Department for Work and

:37:22.:37:23.

Pensions for nearly two years without any payments, because I

:37:24.:37:28.

cannot get to my health assessment. Even though I have the right

:37:29.:37:32.

letters, the medical certificates, severe problems with my feet, which

:37:33.:37:36.

have left me unable to walk, and I cannot get out of the house, due to

:37:37.:37:41.

mental health problems. I have the MP on the case, but I have had no

:37:42.:37:45.

luck. I don't have family and friends live in other areas, social

:37:46.:37:50.

services have turned me down. I wish I could be sent to Europe so I could

:37:51.:37:54.

be euthanised. You would not treat a dog like I have been treated. I I'm

:37:55.:37:58.

in debt, the council want to evict me because of the arrears, I have a

:37:59.:38:04.

carer, but she has to go home to Canada, because of a family

:38:05.:38:07.

emergency. I had not eaten since Saturday until yesterday. I had wet

:38:08.:38:12.

the bed and been in this state since Saturday. The DWP say I am fit to

:38:13.:38:17.

work. Organisations in South Yorkshire have failed me. I am

:38:18.:38:21.

desperate, I just want to end my life. We will talk to a Conservative

:38:22.:38:25.

MP in the next half an hour about the fact that so many people with

:38:26.:38:31.

deteriorating conditions are being refused the mobility part of their

:38:32.:38:35.

personal independence payment, so stay with us for that.

:38:36.:38:38.

Here's Hugh now with the morning sports headlines.

:38:39.:38:40.

Gareth Southgate is going to have to wait until next Wednesday to see

:38:41.:38:43.

The decision to make his interview yesterday public has

:38:44.:38:46.

But former FA executive Adrian Bevington says it

:38:47.:38:50.

But does Southgate make perfect sense, especially now

:38:51.:38:55.

It's reported he was interviewed in the summer before

:38:56.:39:01.

He's now available, having been sacked by the United States.

:39:02.:39:08.

West Brom are up to ninth in the Premier League table.

:39:09.:39:11.

They beat Burnley 4-0 in the Premier League last night.

:39:12.:39:12.

The International Cricket Council has fined South Africa captain Faf

:39:13.:39:15.

du Plessis 100% of his match fee after being found guilty of ball

:39:16.:39:19.

tampering during the second Test against Australia in Hobart,

:39:20.:39:23.

but is free to play in the third Test.

:39:24.:39:30.

I will be back with more through the day on BBC News.

:39:31.:39:37.

I think it's fair to say that Downing Street are less than pleased

:39:38.:39:41.

with President-elect Donald Trump's suggestion that the current Ukip

:39:42.:39:44.

leader Nigel Farage would do a great job as British ambassador to the US.

:39:45.:39:49.

That is the last thing that number ten want in any circumstances. I

:39:50.:39:56.

suspect their jaws hit the floor when Donald Trump came out with this

:39:57.:40:03.

idea in a random tweet. Here it is. What does he say?

:40:04.:40:20.

You know the moth that was flapping around Theresa May yesterday at the

:40:21.:40:29.

CBI? Nigel Farage is a bit like that. She is trying to get rid of

:40:30.:40:35.

him, but he keeps coming back. This morning, number ten had to think,

:40:36.:40:39.

how do we respond to this? Who do have the president of the knighted

:40:40.:40:44.

States, you don't want to annoy him, because he is trying to build good

:40:45.:40:47.

relations, but you have got to rebuff and killed this idea. If you

:40:48.:40:54.

don't, there will be political uproar, it will cause turmoil in the

:40:55.:40:58.

Tory party, half the diplomatic corps will say, pack my bags, I will

:40:59.:41:03.

not carry on with this if Nigel Farage will get the top job. They

:41:04.:41:07.

had to kill the idea. They said in a very brief statement, there is no

:41:08.:41:15.

vacancy, a line reiterated by the Brexit secretary David Davis, who

:41:16.:41:18.

was over in Strasbourg this morning. Look at the smile on his face as he

:41:19.:41:21.

was asked about the question. Do you think a President-elect

:41:22.:41:23.

in the United States has any role in suggesting who a British

:41:24.:41:26.

ambassador should be? We are believers in free speech,

:41:27.:41:28.

but we have a good ambassador, People can say what they like,

:41:29.:41:32.

the truth is there is no vacancy. The ambassador is very good,

:41:33.:41:41.

as we have seen already, I love the grim smile, they are

:41:42.:41:54.

dreading questions about this. As the Nigel Farage, I spoke to him

:41:55.:42:00.

this morning. He says that when he was in trouble tower the other day,

:42:01.:42:04.

you remember the picture of him and Donald Trump, no mention of this at

:42:05.:42:13.

all. He had a few more observations in an article this morning. He said,

:42:14.:42:21.

nothing could have prepared me. Donald Trump tweeted out I would do

:42:22.:42:25.

a great job of the UK's ambassador to Washington. His view is that

:42:26.:42:31.

everything has changed, with Brexit and more trump's victory, and

:42:32.:42:35.

because he has good relations with Donald Trump, Theresa May ought to

:42:36.:42:39.

take advantage of it. There was support from some of his former

:42:40.:42:44.

colleagues, Steven Woolfe, the former Ukip leadership contender, he

:42:45.:42:48.

expressed his support for the idea. I think Donald Trump has got his own

:42:49.:42:54.

views on how he has a relationship with Britain, he gets on well with

:42:55.:42:59.

Nigel Farage, whether Nigel would make a good ambassador would be up

:43:00.:43:04.

to the Government being able to decide whether he could carry out

:43:05.:43:09.

Government policy. I don't know, things are in a changing world.

:43:10.:43:15.

Where does this leave us? It leaves Nigel Farage feeling pretty

:43:16.:43:19.

cock-a-hoop. I suspect it leaves Britain's ambassador in the US

:43:20.:43:24.

feeling a bit awkward, when he now has to deal with Donald Trump. For

:43:25.:43:32.

Downing Street, they will be thinking, when we hear no more of

:43:33.:43:33.

Nigel Farage? One of Donald Trump's biggest

:43:34.:43:37.

supporters, the right-wing journalist Milo Yiannopoulos,

:43:38.:43:39.

has been barred from speaking at his former

:43:40.:43:43.

grammar school in Kent. Simon Langton Grammar School

:43:44.:43:46.

For Boys has cancelled the address to sixth-formers due to take place

:43:47.:43:49.

today after being contacted by the Department for

:43:50.:43:49.

Education's Counter-Extremism Unit. Mr Yiannopoulos is a senior editor

:43:50.:43:53.

for Breitbart, the American Well, now we can talk to three

:43:54.:43:57.

students from Simon Langton Grammar, Joining us from our studio

:43:58.:44:06.

in Tunbridge Wells in Alex Leney, who disagrees with the decision

:44:07.:44:11.

to ban Milo from speaking, and in Canterbury we have

:44:12.:44:14.

Frank Roche, also a student, who thinks it was right that Milo

:44:15.:44:16.

was banned from giving his speech. We also have a student who was due

:44:17.:44:29.

to attend the talk and thinks he should have been given chance to

:44:30.:44:37.

talk. Why were so many people in favour of this? Most people at the

:44:38.:44:43.

school had a general disagreement with him, and were not necessarily

:44:44.:44:48.

just going because they agreed with him, they just wanted to hear his

:44:49.:44:53.

ideas put out there, so they could be challenged and because the school

:44:54.:45:00.

has such a great tradition of bringing guest speakers of all

:45:01.:45:04.

varieties, to challenge students and to be challenged by students. Do you

:45:05.:45:09.

know who contacted the counter extremism unit? I don't. Did you

:45:10.:45:19.

know why? Note. Milo is an extreme figure. His views don't deserve to

:45:20.:45:23.

be given a platform, he should not have been invited in the first

:45:24.:45:27.

place. Whether it was right to cancel it now, I don't know, but he

:45:28.:45:32.

should not have been invited. Why do you say that he should not have been

:45:33.:45:36.

invited because his views are extreme? To give him a platform is

:45:37.:45:42.

to give him legitimacy, it say his views deserve to be debated. He says

:45:43.:45:49.

that transgender people are mentally ill, he equates feminism with

:45:50.:45:52.

cancer, he suggested that Jewish people control the world. These are

:45:53.:45:56.

not opinions, these are vile expressions. They should not be

:45:57.:46:01.

aired anywhere, it is not about the students at this school, it is about

:46:02.:46:05.

society, fascism, and he is a fascist.

:46:06.:46:14.

What do you say to frank? It is ludicrous to start throwing these

:46:15.:46:21.

phrases around like fascism. If I was making my case that he should be

:46:22.:46:25.

allowed to speak because he isn't a fascist, for sure that would be a

:46:26.:46:29.

valid argument, but it isn't because it is irrelevant whether or not he

:46:30.:46:34.

is? What do you say to your fellow student, Frank? Yes, so I think that

:46:35.:46:40.

the important thing is that actually, if it is important that

:46:41.:46:45.

society listen to people who have different opinions and by, you know,

:46:46.:46:49.

giving Milo a platform as people say, I think it means that we also

:46:50.:46:53.

get a platform to be able to challenge his views. Now, I would

:46:54.:46:56.

disagree when it is said that he is a fascist. I think that's pretty

:46:57.:47:01.

much ridiculous, but I think a lot of the people did disagree with his

:47:02.:47:05.

views and it is important that we are able to channel the questions

:47:06.:47:08.

that we had for him, but because of the cancellation of the event

:47:09.:47:11.

unfortunately we won't be able to actually challenge his views.

:47:12.:47:16.

Frank, aren't you in the least bit curious to question him and ask him

:47:17.:47:20.

where his views come from? Oh, certainly. There will always be

:47:21.:47:25.

curiosity and the majority of students who wanted to go to the

:47:26.:47:30.

debate were curious and some wanted to go for entertainment purposes,

:47:31.:47:33.

but the fact that remains that sometimes the denial of freedom to

:47:34.:47:36.

some is the extension of freedom to others. Milo, I have said that Milo

:47:37.:47:42.

has offended transgender people and said they are mentally ill and the

:47:43.:47:47.

suicide rates of transgender people are extremely high. It is a high

:47:48.:47:51.

proportion. Milo is probably not going to kill himself because he

:47:52.:47:55.

can't come and talk at my school, but a transgender person may well

:47:56.:47:59.

take their own life because of what Milo says and what he claims. This

:48:00.:48:03.

is serious. It is quite a middle-class privileged debate.

:48:04.:48:06.

There are people who are being affected right now, here and in

:48:07.:48:10.

America because of Donald Trump and his regime that's about to come and

:48:11.:48:15.

take power because of these opinions, these are not acceptable

:48:16.:48:18.

opinions. Thank you, all of you, thank you

:48:19.:48:19.

very much. Thousands of people living

:48:20.:48:24.

with degenerative conditions - like dementia, Parkinson's

:48:25.:48:26.

and multiple sclerosis - are losing part or all

:48:27.:48:28.

of their disability benefits after being reassessed

:48:29.:48:30.

and told their health is improving. This programme has learnt that

:48:31.:48:32.

many of those with incurable conditions applying

:48:33.:48:35.

for the mobility element of Personal Independence Payment

:48:36.:48:36.

are having their awards reduced - something that charities and patient

:48:37.:48:38.

groups have told us The Government says that assessments

:48:39.:48:41.

are carried out by qualified health professionals and overall more

:48:42.:48:50.

people are getting the highest We bought you Jim Red's full report

:48:51.:48:52.

earlier in the programme - It's like having a really bad dose

:48:53.:48:56.

of the flu and you can't move Eight years ago she was diagnosed

:48:57.:49:05.

with Parkinson's disease. Diane has difficulty

:49:06.:49:15.

walking, but when she's on the right medication,

:49:16.:49:16.

she can drive short distances. I did mention to my family that

:49:17.:49:19.

I was a bit worried, because I'd learned of people losing

:49:20.:49:21.

the mobility part of their All my family said, "That

:49:22.:49:24.

won't happen to you, because you've got a debilitating disease

:49:25.:49:28.

that is not going to get any better. And I was absolutely gobsmacked

:49:29.:49:31.

when the letter came. There's a lot of paperwork

:49:32.:49:34.

in those! For seven years, Diane received

:49:35.:49:36.

Disability Living Allowance, but DLA is slowly being phased out,

:49:37.:49:41.

replaced by the Personal Diane was told her needs had changed

:49:42.:49:45.

and the amount she received for getting around fell from ?57

:49:46.:49:58.

a week to zero. Without the disability allowance,

:49:59.:50:00.

I couldn't have a car, because I haven't

:50:01.:50:02.

got any extra money. It took my independence

:50:03.:50:04.

away, totally. Diane received a new car. He was

:50:05.:50:32.

relieved for me. I think I was just relieved it was over really. Faced

:50:33.:50:37.

with a growing bill for disability payments the Government has been

:50:38.:50:41.

tightening the rules. Under the old DLA scheme 82% of people with

:50:42.:50:45.

Parkinson's were receiving the full mobility payment. Under PIP that's

:50:46.:50:49.

dropped to 40%. It is the same basic pattern with other diseases like

:50:50.:50:56.

multiple sclerosis and rheumatoid arthritis. The Government says more

:50:57.:51:00.

people receive the highest rate of support under PIP and more people

:51:01.:51:07.

with MS and osteoarthritis and parkens are receiving the highest

:51:08.:51:10.

daily rate that, wouldn't include the mobility allowance. We first met

:51:11.:51:15.

Withinedy Mitchell last year when she appeared in a film about early

:51:16.:51:21.

onset dementia. I'd forget the most silly of words and that was when

:51:22.:51:28.

something hit me that t wasn't quite right. My life has changed simply

:51:29.:51:46.

from the fact that I probably was able simply to talk about anything

:51:47.:51:53.

and everything, but now I have lots of notes. Wendy never received DLA.

:51:54.:51:58.

She was one of the first to be moved straight on to PIP. Under the

:51:59.:52:04.

current system, she still has to be reassessed every 18 months.

:52:05.:52:08.

When her latest decision came through, she was told her needs had

:52:09.:52:13.

changed and her entire benefit to be cut from ?7 # a week to nothing. I

:52:14.:52:21.

got the shocking letter that told me that I was no longer going to get

:52:22.:52:27.

any payment whatsoever and a list of all the things that I was apparently

:52:28.:52:35.

better at than I was 18 months previously which was ridiculous. I

:52:36.:52:39.

wish I was better. Who wouldn't when they've got dementia?

:52:40.:52:45.

A group of charities is now calling for ministers to scrap unnecessary

:52:46.:52:49.

repeated reassessments for people living with diseases like

:52:50.:52:52.

Parkinson's and dementia. The Government says the PIP system is

:52:53.:52:56.

better than the one it replaced and overall, it is spending more on

:52:57.:52:59.

disability benefits each year. Let's speak now to Laura Wetherly,

:53:00.:53:03.

who is from the MS Society. Richard Graham, Conservative MP

:53:04.:53:06.

and member of the Work John Stillitz, who has MS

:53:07.:53:08.

and severe difficulty walking. He is appealing against cuts

:53:09.:53:12.

to his mobility benefits. Welcome all of you. Richard, can you

:53:13.:53:19.

tell me how it is possible for someone with a progressive

:53:20.:53:22.

condition, ie, one that's getting worse, like MS, or dementia, to

:53:23.:53:29.

apparently get better? I think the general idea behind moving from DLA

:53:30.:53:34.

to PIP was to try and focus getting the money on the people who need it

:53:35.:53:41.

had the most. I'm asking you how a degenerative condition can get

:53:42.:53:45.

better? I agree. Sometimes tb stabilise so it should stay the

:53:46.:53:50.

same, but where it is deteriorating what should happen under PIP is

:53:51.:53:54.

people should get more money as it gets worse, but there are cases

:53:55.:53:57.

where, you know, this doesn't happen well. The process falls down and

:53:58.:54:01.

that's why the appeal system is there.

:54:02.:54:08.

Anybody with MS, dementia or Parkinson's, whether they're

:54:09.:54:10.

stabilised or not, it is just going to get worse. I mean, don't you

:54:11.:54:14.

think you're on the wrong side of the moral argument here? I think

:54:15.:54:20.

every situation is genuinely different. Individuals are

:54:21.:54:23.

different. I have been through this myself because my mother had

:54:24.:54:27.

dementia for a long time and eventually died of it and that's why

:54:28.:54:30.

you've got to have some form of assessment by people who are

:54:31.:54:35.

knowledgeable, who understand... Are you sure they're knowledgeable?

:54:36.:54:41.

Because they keep making mistakes? 65% of people are getting their

:54:42.:54:44.

original decision overturned on appeal? Well, the DWP tell me that

:54:45.:54:51.

6% of people eligible for PIP appeal and about 3% of them are successful.

:54:52.:54:57.

Every individual, like John, who is appealing, is one too many, but at

:54:58.:55:00.

least there is a system there and the numbers are not that high in

:55:01.:55:05.

overall percentage terms. It is just no consolation to say at least you

:55:06.:55:10.

can appeal. Wendy Mitchell, who you saw in our film, is so demoralised

:55:11.:55:14.

by the whole process, she is clearly getting worse. She appeared on our

:55:15.:55:20.

programme 18 months ago, we are not health professionals and we can see

:55:21.:55:24.

she is deteriorating and she says, "I am so demoralised, I can't go

:55:25.:55:28.

through this appeal. I can't do it." Look, in that situation I would

:55:29.:55:32.

strongly advice her to go to her MP for help. Why should she have to?

:55:33.:55:38.

She has got dementia. She is getting worse. Yes. Sure. But, listen,

:55:39.:55:43.

politicians aren't responsible for the assessments, you've got to have

:55:44.:55:47.

a system... They're responsible for employing the assessors and putting

:55:48.:55:50.

the criteria in place. Indeed. So you've got to have a system where

:55:51.:55:55.

somebody decides whose case is the most serious and who deserves the

:55:56.:56:00.

most money? No system is going to be perfect, but if it not working as

:56:01.:56:04.

clearly as it should do, we've got to make it better. There are some

:56:05.:56:07.

things that could be improved, you have different assessments for PIP

:56:08.:56:10.

and for the work capability assessment. I don't see any reason

:56:11.:56:16.

why those can't be merged so that you only have one assessment that

:56:17.:56:19.

would reduce the amount of stress for individuals concerned. There is

:56:20.:56:25.

another aspect about mobility. If the assessors decide that you're not

:56:26.:56:29.

eligible for the maximum mobility allowance and therefore, your car

:56:30.:56:35.

will be taken away, you're given seven weeks before that car is taken

:56:36.:56:41.

away. OK. It doesn't give you enough time to have an appeal and maybe

:56:42.:56:44.

keep your car and I think that's maybe something that the Government

:56:45.:56:48.

should look at. It happened to you John, you have had your mobility car

:56:49.:56:52.

removed, how does that impact on you? To correct, I was in touch with

:56:53.:57:00.

the motability people. They were really helpful. I told them I was

:57:01.:57:05.

going through the appeal process and they said, "Keep us informed. Best

:57:06.:57:10.

of luck basically." We are obliged to send out the standard letter from

:57:11.:57:17.

the computer to say we will, we are terminating the agreement. You're a

:57:18.:57:21.

proud man. How does it make you feel to go through this? To say it is hue

:57:22.:57:27.

millnating. I understand there is the need to have a system, but my

:57:28.:57:33.

condition is progressively going to get worse and I know that if I have

:57:34.:57:38.

the opportunity for another car, it would probably be one that I need to

:57:39.:57:43.

ramp so I can put a scooter into so I can keep my mobility wherever I

:57:44.:57:47.

go. It is frustrating. It is embarrassing because you are pouring

:57:48.:57:51.

your heart out almost, you know, to some stranger who comes in and then

:57:52.:58:01.

does not record things accurately so that I do feel extremely frustrated

:58:02.:58:07.

and you highlighted cases. Laura, I've hardly left you any time. How

:58:08.:58:11.

big a problem is this? It is a really big problem. MS affects over

:58:12.:58:16.

100,000 people in the UK and causes symptoms that affect how people,

:58:17.:58:21.

see, think and feel. Over 1,000 people with MS have had their

:58:22.:58:25.

mobility support downgraded since the introduction of PIP and that's

:58:26.:58:28.

down to a number of things that aren't making sense. First of all

:58:29.:58:33.

the criteria changed from DLA to Personal Independence Payment and we

:58:34.:58:38.

are calling on the Government to reflect those barriers.

:58:39.:58:47.

Decisions are made following consideration of all the information

:58:48.:58:49.

provided by the claimant, including supporting evidence

:58:50.:58:51.

from their GP or medical specialist."

:58:52.:58:53.

Sorry for not giving you more time. Thank you for your time as well.

:58:54.:58:59.

We're back tomorrow at 9am. Have a good afternoon.

:59:00.:59:03.

The most daunting of cookery challenges is back.

:59:04.:59:06.

It's not as simple as it first appears, is it?

:59:07.:59:09.

The programme hears from people who have been stripped of their mobility benefits - despite having a degenerative condition.

The BBC's John Simpson talks about life as a foreign correspondent and his 10 near-death experiences.

And we ask why so few women were nominated at the world's biggest gaming awards.