
Browse content similar to 13/06/2017. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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Hello, it's Tuesday, it's nine o'clock, I'm Victoria Derbyshire, | :00:11. | :00:12. | |
The law no deal, Theresa May will meet the leader of the DUP to broker | :00:13. | :00:24. | |
a will to help her stay on in Number Ten. -- deal or no deal. Theresa May | :00:25. | :00:30. | |
tells the party there will be no backtracking on gay rights, despite | :00:31. | :00:34. | |
the deal with the DUP, but could it signal an end to austerity and a | :00:35. | :00:36. | |
shift on Brexit? With MPs returning | :00:37. | :00:38. | |
to the Commons today, we've gathered together | :00:39. | :00:41. | |
a group of you to tell politicians what you want | :00:42. | :00:43. | |
from them in their job. Integrity, I think integrity is key, | :00:44. | :00:55. | |
we want somebody that will have the same persona in their public life as | :00:56. | :01:04. | |
they do in their private lie. Sir Menzies have an inability to answer | :01:05. | :01:10. | |
questions directly, and it is really simple. -- some MPs. Serving as an | :01:11. | :01:27. | |
MP is a privilege, not a right. Almost a year since Jo Cox was | :01:28. | :01:33. | |
murdered, her parents tell us how much they miss her. We will always | :01:34. | :01:37. | |
be broken, because there is a piece missing. To the outside, while we do | :01:38. | :01:42. | |
appear strong, all of us, there is a lot of days when they are bad, it is | :01:43. | :01:46. | |
bad. We'll talk to Jo Cox's sister | :01:47. | :01:47. | |
and husband before 11. And this programme has learned that | :01:48. | :01:56. | |
another group which represents sexual abuse survivors is pulling | :01:57. | :02:01. | |
out of the Government's sex abuse inquiry, accusing Theresa May of | :02:02. | :02:05. | |
failing to protect survivors. We will hear from them before ten. | :02:06. | :02:14. | |
Hello, welcome to the programme, we're live until 11. | :02:15. | :02:17. | |
the latest breaking news and developing stories. | :02:18. | :02:20. | |
that people trying to bulk up with protein bars and shakes | :02:21. | :02:25. | |
If you use them, get in touch - use #Victorialive. | :02:26. | :02:33. | |
And if you text, you will be charged at the standard network rate. | :02:34. | :02:38. | |
Our top story today, Theresa May will meet Arlene Foster to thrash | :02:39. | :02:48. | |
out the details of a deal to support a minority, government. | :02:49. | :02:52. | |
Opposition parties criticised the talks, Sinn Fein suggesting the deal | :02:53. | :02:58. | |
would undermine the Good Friday peace agreement. With Brexit talks | :02:59. | :03:01. | |
due to begin in less than a week, the EU chief negotiator Michel | :03:02. | :03:05. | |
Barnier has called on Britain not to waste time. A medical correspondent | :03:06. | :03:11. | |
Ben Wright has more. -- political correspondent Ben Wright has more. | :03:12. | :03:14. | |
DUP leader Arlene Foster said it is a tremendous opportunity | :03:15. | :03:16. | |
Theresa May knows a deal with the DUP is her only | :03:17. | :03:20. | |
So an agreement will be reached, probably today, | :03:21. | :03:23. | |
A confidence-and-supply arrangement will provide | :03:24. | :03:29. | |
DUP support to the Tories on major votes | :03:30. | :03:30. | |
like the Budget and the Queen's Speech. | :03:31. | :03:34. | |
The alliance leaves the Government | :03:35. | :03:36. | |
with a vulnerable majority of just six. | :03:37. | :03:40. | |
But Theresa May now looks safer in her job | :03:41. | :03:43. | |
after a meeting with Tory MPs yesterday evening. | :03:44. | :03:45. | |
She apologised for the disastrous campaign, | :03:46. | :03:49. | |
declaring, "I got us into this mess and I will get us out of it." | :03:50. | :03:55. | |
There is a reality that is we have to be pragmatic about what is | :03:56. | :03:58. | |
introduced, we have got to work harder to try to bring people | :03:59. | :04:01. | |
along with us, both inside the Conservative Party and beyond. | :04:02. | :04:08. | |
And while Theresa May tries to rebuild the Government | :04:09. | :04:11. | |
from a hung parliament, a warning from the EU | :04:12. | :04:14. | |
that the UK is wasting valuable time negotiating Brexit. | :04:15. | :04:19. | |
More than two months have passed since Theresa May | :04:20. | :04:23. | |
handed in the UK's notice, but no talks have happened, | :04:24. | :04:27. | |
and there is a two-year deadline to hammer out a Brexit deal. | :04:28. | :04:31. | |
Speaking to the Financial Times, EU chief negotiator Michel Barnier | :04:32. | :04:34. | |
said the UK needed to appoint a negotiated team with a mandate | :04:35. | :04:37. | |
soon because the process would be extraordinarily complex. | :04:38. | :04:44. | |
Theresa May is also facing calls from some Tory MPs and Labour | :04:45. | :04:47. | |
exactly the uncertainty she wanted the election to stop. | :04:48. | :04:51. | |
We can talk to Norman Smith, who is in Downing Street, where politicians | :04:52. | :05:07. | |
are arriving for a Cabinet meeting, but tell us what we can expect from | :05:08. | :05:12. | |
this deal to be brokered between Arlene Foster and Theresa May. Well, | :05:13. | :05:18. | |
the deal is basically Mrs May's political lifeline to survival, | :05:19. | :05:20. | |
because without it she does not have a majority in the Commons, and she | :05:21. | :05:25. | |
cannot govern, so she absolutely has to have this deal. I think it is | :05:26. | :05:30. | |
almost certain she will get it, otherwise Arlene Foster probably | :05:31. | :05:34. | |
would not be coming here. So we can expect they'd heal, and part of it | :05:35. | :05:40. | |
will be a simple transaction, money for votes, Arlene Foster will want | :05:41. | :05:45. | |
cash for investment, schools, hospitals, maybe a few international | :05:46. | :05:49. | |
conferences, maybe government contracts, big sporting events in | :05:50. | :05:52. | |
Northern Ireland, to show that she is getting something for Northern | :05:53. | :05:56. | |
Ireland out of the deal. But the interesting part of the arrangement | :05:57. | :06:00. | |
is what is not going to be spelt out, and that is the implications | :06:01. | :06:07. | |
for austerity and Brexit. On austerity, the DUP have always | :06:08. | :06:10. | |
opposed many of the austerity measures introduced by this and the | :06:11. | :06:14. | |
previous governments. They still oppose things like the bedroom tax, | :06:15. | :06:19. | |
getting rid of the triple lock on pensions, means testing benefits for | :06:20. | :06:23. | |
the elderly, so the expectation is Mrs May will have to drop large | :06:24. | :06:27. | |
chunks of austerity. That is not as difficult as it sounds, because | :06:28. | :06:32. | |
Tories believe that one of the reasons Mr Corbyn did so well is | :06:33. | :06:36. | |
because he kept banging on about austerity. So to some extent she is | :06:37. | :06:41. | |
pushing at an open door. The more complex and difficult area is on | :06:42. | :06:45. | |
Brexit, because those ministers and MPs who want to shift Mrs May away | :06:46. | :06:49. | |
from her approach on Brexit, and instead to focus on the economy and | :06:50. | :06:54. | |
the impact on the economy of Brexit, believe that the DUP will be on | :06:55. | :06:59. | |
board, because of their concerns about what might happen if there is | :07:00. | :07:04. | |
some sort of hard border between northern and southern Ireland. So | :07:05. | :07:09. | |
there is a view that perhaps the DUP could help tilt the argument now | :07:10. | :07:13. | |
raging again over Brexit against Mrs May. Thank you for the moment, | :07:14. | :07:17. | |
Norman Smith, at Downing Street. Joanna has the rest of the morning's | :07:18. | :07:22. | |
news. A brother and sister have been arrested after a man in his 40s was | :07:23. | :07:24. | |
shot dead at a property in Slough. Reuben and Kathleen Gregory are | :07:25. | :07:28. | |
being held on suspicion of murder. The pair are said to have lived in a | :07:29. | :07:36. | |
caravan near woodland in Slough for more than 50 years. | :07:37. | :07:41. | |
A BBC investigation has discovered 22 Facebook accounts belonging | :07:42. | :07:43. | |
They breach the company's rules banning them from the website. | :07:44. | :07:47. | |
Radio 4's File On 4 programme found most of the accounts | :07:48. | :07:49. | |
were taken down within 48 hours of being reported, | :07:50. | :07:51. | |
while six were referred to police to investigate. | :07:52. | :08:02. | |
The European Court of Human Rights and France will rule later whether | :08:03. | :08:07. | |
the live support of a Yale baby boy in London can be switched off. | :08:08. | :08:12. | |
Charlie Gard's parents want to take him to the US for treatment. The UK | :08:13. | :08:16. | |
Supreme Court agreed with specialist doctors that he should instead | :08:17. | :08:17. | |
received palliative care. A group representing abuse survivors | :08:18. | :08:22. | |
has told this programme that it is quitting the government's | :08:23. | :08:24. | |
independent inquiry The White Flowers Campaign has said | :08:25. | :08:27. | |
it blames Theresa May - who set up the inquiry | :08:28. | :08:31. | |
when she was Home Secretary - The group, which represents more | :08:32. | :08:34. | |
than a hundred survivors, said it had lost faith | :08:35. | :08:37. | |
in the inquiry and accused it of not | :08:38. | :08:39. | |
being truly independent. The jury in the trial of the US | :08:40. | :08:43. | |
entertainer Bill Cosby, who's appearing on sex assault | :08:44. | :08:45. | |
charges, will return to court later having failed to reach | :08:46. | :08:48. | |
a verdict last night. The 79-year-old is accused | :08:49. | :08:50. | |
of assaulting a woman at his home The Cosby Show star denies | :08:51. | :08:52. | |
the allegations and says the relationship | :08:53. | :08:55. | |
was consensual. A woman has been charged | :08:56. | :09:01. | |
with murder after a man died following a collision | :09:02. | :09:04. | |
with a tram in Manchester. The 30-year-old man died | :09:05. | :09:06. | |
at the scene at Manchester Victoria | :09:07. | :09:08. | |
station on Sunday evening. 31-year-old Charrissa Loren | :09:09. | :09:11. | |
Brown-Wellington New guidelines are being introduced | :09:12. | :09:26. | |
to ensure that sentences for offences committed against children | :09:27. | :09:29. | |
in England and Wales properly reflect the arm suffered by victims. | :09:30. | :09:33. | |
Those who try to blame others could face tougher punishments. The | :09:34. | :09:40. | |
parents of murdered MP Jo Cox told this programme they will always be | :09:41. | :09:43. | |
broken after their daughter's death. Friday marks a year since the Labour | :09:44. | :09:48. | |
MP was killed outside a constituency surgery. This weekend, her family is | :09:49. | :09:52. | |
encouraging people to join with friends and neighbours for a series | :09:53. | :09:56. | |
of community events being held in her memory. We will talk to her | :09:57. | :10:00. | |
husband Brendan and sister Kim at around half past ten. | :10:01. | :10:08. | |
Bev on Facebook says my heart goes out to Jo's family for their loss | :10:09. | :10:14. | |
and the way she was murdered, but life goes on. She is in a better | :10:15. | :10:22. | |
place, let her rest in peace. On Facebook, a very sad loss, Jason on | :10:23. | :10:26. | |
Facebook says, what a beautiful woman Jo Cox was. Alex, if | :10:27. | :10:30. | |
Parliament was made up of people like Jo Cox, what an amazing society | :10:31. | :10:35. | |
we would be living in. Thank you very much for those. Let me bring | :10:36. | :10:39. | |
you breaking news from Germany, it is being reported by a French news | :10:40. | :10:43. | |
agency, several people have been wounded after shots were fired at a | :10:44. | :10:49. | |
railway station near Munich. One person has been detained, according | :10:50. | :10:53. | |
to police, several people have been injured, a female police officer was | :10:54. | :10:58. | |
badly wounded. Munich police have just tweeted, authorities say a | :10:59. | :11:01. | |
handgun was found during a police operation at a station in Munich, | :11:02. | :11:08. | |
although it is not thought to be terrorist related. Several people | :11:09. | :11:12. | |
injured after shots were fired at a railway station near Munich, one | :11:13. | :11:16. | |
person detained, it is not thought to be terrorism related, we are | :11:17. | :11:19. | |
being told. Clearly, we will bring you more as soon as we have it. 11 | :11:20. | :11:25. | |
minutes past nine, we will talk to voters in the next few minutes about | :11:26. | :11:29. | |
what they want from MPs, who returned to work today, who returned | :11:30. | :11:33. | |
to the Commons after that election. So much as happened in the last few | :11:34. | :11:37. | |
days, hasn't it? But they are going to draw up a sort of manifesto of | :11:38. | :11:40. | |
what they would like from MPs as they come back to work, get in touch | :11:41. | :11:47. | |
with your own views. OK, let's bring you a bit of sport. | :11:48. | :11:50. | |
And British bobsleigh is the latest sport to have its coaches | :11:51. | :11:52. | |
come under scrutiny. What's been going on? | :11:53. | :11:55. | |
Yes, a senior coach working with the country's Olympic bobsleigh | :11:56. | :11:58. | |
And there have been a number of complaints over a "toxic | :11:59. | :12:03. | |
Earlier this year, a host of athletes wrote anonymously | :12:04. | :12:08. | |
to the chief executive of the sport's governing | :12:09. | :12:12. | |
to share concerns over the behaviour of key performance | :12:13. | :12:16. | |
One athlete alleged they had experienced racism several times | :12:17. | :12:20. | |
from a senior coach, and that the coach referred to black | :12:21. | :12:22. | |
people as lazy and had "a blatant dislike towards people of colour". | :12:23. | :12:33. | |
in favour of Caucasian males on the performance programme | :12:34. | :12:36. | |
and a racial stigma against black drivers. | :12:37. | :12:39. | |
Another complainant said, "sexist comments are regular, | :12:40. | :12:42. | |
there have been claims of racist remarks which all get ignored, | :12:43. | :12:45. | |
athletes are literally terrified of putting a foot wrong," | :12:46. | :12:49. | |
and there was "dictatorship within the management". | :12:50. | :12:51. | |
Despite this, just a month later, the people complaining were told no | :12:52. | :12:54. | |
So certainly want to watch in great British bobsleigh. | :12:55. | :13:03. | |
And Theresa May might a chance to go to the football tonight? | :13:04. | :13:07. | |
Yes, Theresa May and Emmanuel Macron will be at the Stade de France in | :13:08. | :13:11. | |
Paris, I imagine they will get time to talk politics, but quite a | :13:12. | :13:15. | |
significant fixture - just a friendly between England and France, | :13:16. | :13:19. | |
but the significance is that French fans have been as to sing God Save | :13:20. | :13:22. | |
The Queen in solidarity with Britain after the terror attacks in | :13:23. | :13:26. | |
Manchester and London. The tribute echoes a couple of years ago when | :13:27. | :13:30. | |
British fans, English fans at Wembley were asked to sing La | :13:31. | :13:34. | |
Marseillaise alongside the French fans, just four days after those | :13:35. | :13:39. | |
atrocities in Paris, so it kind of return fixture, if you like, four | :13:40. | :13:44. | |
French fans at the Stade de France. This were being's last game of the | :13:45. | :13:49. | |
season, just a friendly against France, kick-off is at a de-clutter | :13:50. | :13:52. | |
night. And England's younger football is | :13:53. | :13:56. | |
back with their World Cup. Yes, they flew back late last night | :13:57. | :14:02. | |
from South Korea, the first World Cup win since 1966, this is them | :14:03. | :14:05. | |
arriving back, manager Mark Simpson said it was too soon to claim they | :14:06. | :14:08. | |
are the next generation of golden players. Gareth Southgate has said | :14:09. | :14:15. | |
it is to over the clubs to nurture this young talent, and it will be | :14:16. | :14:18. | |
interesting to see what happens to them next, because a lot of these | :14:19. | :14:23. | |
players you may not have heard of, but they are signed to big clubs, | :14:24. | :14:26. | |
and I think Gareth Southgate means that they all need a regular | :14:27. | :14:30. | |
first-team pitch time with their clubs so that they continue to | :14:31. | :14:34. | |
develop and improve, improve future England squads. And the worry is | :14:35. | :14:38. | |
that, in chasing success, clubs will spend a lot of money on expensive | :14:39. | :14:43. | |
foreign players, and that this home-grown, World Cup winning talent | :14:44. | :14:46. | |
will spend much of next season on the bench. | :14:47. | :14:52. | |
Thank you very much, Katherine, more from her during the morning. It is | :14:53. | :14:55. | |
nearly quarter past nine this Tuesday morning, and the most | :14:56. | :14:58. | |
powerful woman in Britain meet the Prime Minister in Downing Street | :14:59. | :15:03. | |
today. A little bit of laughter from our voters! | :15:04. | :15:05. | |
Arlene Foster of the Democratic Unionist Party, a small political | :15:06. | :15:08. | |
party from Northern Ireland with just ten MPs, | :15:09. | :15:10. | |
arrives to see what Theresa May can offer her in exchange | :15:11. | :15:12. | |
for the DUP's support because Theresa May's Conservatives | :15:13. | :15:15. | |
didn't win a majority in the last week's election, | :15:16. | :15:18. | |
Mrs May needs those ten DUP MPs to stay on in government. | :15:19. | :15:21. | |
Let's speak now to the former Conservative party leader and former | :15:22. | :15:24. | |
Work and Pensions Secretary Iain Duncan Smith. | :15:25. | :15:31. | |
Good morning. Do you feel any kind of affinity with the DUP? Can I say | :15:32. | :15:38. | |
one thing, the football match with France. I was at the England match | :15:39. | :15:47. | |
and I think it is wholly fitting and when I met French people they were | :15:48. | :15:55. | |
very moved that the fans had sung the French anthem. My question was | :15:56. | :15:59. | |
do you feel any kind of affinity with the DUP? Well, in the sense | :16:00. | :16:03. | |
that the Conservative Party is the majority party, but hasn't got a | :16:04. | :16:10. | |
overall majority. The DUP, it seems, appear, and are keen to let the | :16:11. | :16:14. | |
Conservative Party govern and as a result of that Theresa May has to | :16:15. | :16:17. | |
have a discussion with them. I think what you will find it is not about | :16:18. | :16:20. | |
having an affinity, it is about what on balance are the things that they | :16:21. | :16:23. | |
most want, the Conservatives to be in Government for and it's clear | :16:24. | :16:26. | |
that the kind of arrangement I expect we'll end up with will be | :16:27. | :16:30. | |
what they call a supply and confidence. That's to say on votes | :16:31. | :16:32. | |
of confidence they will support us. On things like the Queen's Speech, | :16:33. | :16:36. | |
they'll support us. On things like the Budget they will support us, but | :16:37. | :16:41. | |
they will keep their own counsel on other things and they may not | :16:42. | :16:44. | |
support us on other things, but the key areas where the votes are | :16:45. | :16:48. | |
important, they by and large will back us. But it won't be a | :16:49. | :16:51. | |
coalition, it will be a confidence and supply agreement. As long as | :16:52. | :16:55. | |
they do back you on those big votes, it's OK with you, is it, that some | :16:56. | :17:00. | |
of their MPs are repulsed by gay people, don't believe in same-sex | :17:01. | :17:05. | |
marriage and don't believe in climate change and don't believe | :17:06. | :17:08. | |
women who have been raped should have adorations? A large number of | :17:09. | :17:14. | |
these issues are devolved issues, but it's not going to change | :17:15. | :17:18. | |
anything. Theresa May made it clear on these areas where the | :17:19. | :17:20. | |
Conservative Party is settled and clear, the DUP will have no | :17:21. | :17:24. | |
influence over our views. We'll also anyway on those issues have a much | :17:25. | :17:28. | |
broader consensual cross party arrangement so we wouldn't need the | :17:29. | :17:32. | |
DUP on those issues, you know, I voted for gay marriage. I'm not | :17:33. | :17:36. | |
going toe trenching on that one is nor is the Conservative Party. This | :17:37. | :17:40. | |
will be an agreement, it is not about what their beliefs are, it is | :17:41. | :17:44. | |
about key areas of Government where they believe the Conservative Party | :17:45. | :17:46. | |
needs to deliver to keep the country stable and that's it. Will voters | :17:47. | :17:50. | |
get to see the terms of this deal? I don't think they will be that | :17:51. | :17:53. | |
complex, but I'm sure they will be clear and open. I would certainly | :17:54. | :17:57. | |
want them to be that because it's clear that understand that what we | :17:58. | :18:00. | |
won't have got involved in is any complex arrangement. Now, there is, | :18:01. | :18:04. | |
and going to be issues around investment in Northern Ireland, but | :18:05. | :18:06. | |
those are issues anyway that would have to be tackled as this is an | :18:07. | :18:11. | |
area that is of very high priority to restabilise after the troubles | :18:12. | :18:14. | |
and to make sure that the people there get good work and jobs and | :18:15. | :18:18. | |
getting businesses there. That sort of stuff is just something that was | :18:19. | :18:23. | |
in the plans. It is worth bearing in mind that as I understand Gordon | :18:24. | :18:27. | |
Brown was busy trying to do deal with them in 2010 as well. So these | :18:28. | :18:32. | |
kind of mathematical things are part of Parliament. And it seems that the | :18:33. | :18:37. | |
political price to pay for doing that deal from a Conservative point | :18:38. | :18:42. | |
of view, it will mean an end to austerity which some Conservative | :18:43. | :18:45. | |
backbenchers will welcome because the DUP don't support your measures | :18:46. | :18:49. | |
on austerity and Mrs May's and your vision of Brexit will have to go? | :18:50. | :18:52. | |
Well, let's deal with the austerity thing. Look, there were lots and | :18:53. | :18:56. | |
lots of issues and many of us, remember I resigned over a year ago | :18:57. | :19:01. | |
because I disagreed with George Osborne's direction of tral and I | :19:02. | :19:06. | |
have asked us to re-think whole areas of where we are. The length of | :19:07. | :19:11. | |
time that we are asking public servants and others to put up with | :19:12. | :19:15. | |
reduced flattened salaries has been an issue for me and many other | :19:16. | :19:19. | |
people and we would like to see that revisited. This isn't just an issue | :19:20. | :19:22. | |
to do with the DUP. What the election told us the election was | :19:23. | :19:25. | |
too early and we should have had time to resolve those issues, but, | :19:26. | :19:29. | |
on one side, there is a genuine discussion about that and I think | :19:30. | :19:32. | |
there are key issues around education and stuff that we need to | :19:33. | :19:36. | |
resolve. On the side of the Brexit side, actually the DUP are very | :19:37. | :19:40. | |
clear that they support Theresa May's original position which is no, | :19:41. | :19:44. | |
thet want control of the bofrders, money and laws. There will be no | :19:45. | :19:47. | |
entry into the single market and they're keen not to be in the | :19:48. | :19:54. | |
customs union. But they are opposed to her mantra of no deal is better | :19:55. | :19:58. | |
than a bad deal. They're not actually opposed that. I promise you | :19:59. | :20:06. | |
that this will become clear the DUP supports what her position is at | :20:07. | :20:08. | |
time of the election and the majority of the Conservative Party | :20:09. | :20:11. | |
believes this is a settled issue. So any idea... Well Ruth Davidson | :20:12. | :20:22. | |
doesn't. Not every single MP from Scotland necessarily follows her | :20:23. | :20:25. | |
line. The point is the party overall is settled. What we want, obviously | :20:26. | :20:29. | |
is to engage and discuss these matters with people, but in essence | :20:30. | :20:33. | |
those negotiations are due to start very, very shortly, ie next week and | :20:34. | :20:35. | |
the can Conservative Government needs to get on and make sure that | :20:36. | :20:39. | |
they now start talking to our European allies and friends about | :20:40. | :20:43. | |
how we arrange to have the benefits as the Labour Party stood on the | :20:44. | :20:47. | |
same manifesto, they stood on a manifesto which said no to the | :20:48. | :20:50. | |
single market. No to customs union and control of our borders. So the | :20:51. | :20:54. | |
majority of the British people had in front of them two parties that | :20:55. | :20:58. | |
constituted the majority of the votes that stood on very similar | :20:59. | :21:02. | |
manifestoes on Brexit. But it's not settled, is it? You must acknowledge | :21:03. | :21:08. | |
from the lack of a majority and bass of people like Ruth Davidson, | :21:09. | :21:12. | |
perhaps you think she's flexing her muscles too much, the question of | :21:13. | :21:15. | |
your Brexit vision has been reopened whether you like it or not? I'm not | :21:16. | :21:19. | |
overly bothered about that. The truth is we're going into | :21:20. | :21:25. | |
negotiations and in negotiations different elements will cold out I | :21:26. | :21:28. | |
think that the Conservative Party, people in Cabinet, who may well seem | :21:29. | :21:32. | |
to think that they're going to start reopening this, the answer is I | :21:33. | :21:35. | |
wouldn't try and re-open this before you start the negotiations because | :21:36. | :21:40. | |
all you'll get is what we don't want is another argument and row going on | :21:41. | :21:43. | |
in the governing party. What we need, we had a settled position. We | :21:44. | :21:47. | |
had agreed that position before we went into the last election. The | :21:48. | :21:51. | |
Labour Party to save their votes in those areas where there were strong | :21:52. | :21:56. | |
Leavers who voted Labour in the past they adopted almost exactly the same | :21:57. | :21:59. | |
position, you heard John McDonnell and Jeremy Corbyn saying in terms | :22:00. | :22:03. | |
over the weekend we will not be in the single market. They do not | :22:04. | :22:07. | |
intend to be in the customs union, but they want the benefits of having | :22:08. | :22:10. | |
a good trade deal and good arrangements for access and that's | :22:11. | :22:12. | |
what the Conservative negotiators want. So in a sense, what you've got | :22:13. | :22:18. | |
is a minority of people who just trying to prise this open again, it | :22:19. | :22:22. | |
shouldn't be opened and we should just get on with it and try and get | :22:23. | :22:28. | |
the best deal we can which helps preserve jobs and get good trade | :22:29. | :22:29. | |
deals. Iain Duncan Smith. Iain Duncan Smith will join hundreds | :22:30. | :22:33. | |
of other MPs as they return to Parliament for the first time | :22:34. | :22:36. | |
since the election on Thursday, an election which not only produced | :22:37. | :22:39. | |
a result which virtually no one was expecting, | :22:40. | :22:42. | |
but also showed yet more evidence of a country which is divided, | :22:43. | :22:44. | |
with many who feel let down by traditional politics | :22:45. | :22:47. | |
and politicians, and who aren't happy with the way | :22:48. | :22:49. | |
many conduct themselves. So what lessons can be learned | :22:50. | :22:51. | |
from the campaign, and what does it tell us about how the country | :22:52. | :22:54. | |
wants our politicians to behave? We've brought together a group | :22:55. | :22:56. | |
of voters here in the studio to chew the fat with two new MPs and two | :22:57. | :23:00. | |
with just a little more experience. And we're going to try and draw | :23:01. | :23:03. | |
up our audience manifesto or code of conduct for how | :23:04. | :23:06. | |
they want our politicians Bambos Charalambous | :23:07. | :23:08. | |
is the new Labour MP Christine Jardine, the new Lib Dem | :23:09. | :23:17. | |
MP for Edinburgh West. John Baron, Conservative MP for | :23:18. | :23:25. | |
Basildon and Billericay since 2001. Ben Bradshaw, the Labour MP | :23:26. | :23:28. | |
in Exeter since 1997. I can barely remember that year! | :23:29. | :23:38. | |
Welcome everybody. We've got voters as well. Let me ask, not the | :23:39. | :23:43. | |
politicians, our voters first of all. What word would you use to | :23:44. | :23:50. | |
describe politicians right now? Shady. Disindisingeneralous. | :23:51. | :24:07. | |
Dishonest. I'll come back with one word! | :24:08. | :24:08. | |
LAUGHTER I have more than one word. No, give | :24:09. | :24:16. | |
me a some if you can't contain it to one. In need of one. Yeah, I | :24:17. | :24:20. | |
strongly believe they're divided. You can see that throughout their | :24:21. | :24:23. | |
parties, not just in the Conservative Party, but also in the | :24:24. | :24:26. | |
Labour Party. Too divided. What about you? I would say unavailable. | :24:27. | :24:32. | |
Unavailable definitely. Meaning, what you can't get access to them? | :24:33. | :24:36. | |
They don't come across that way. They come across from a come across | :24:37. | :24:47. | |
as if they're from a completely different world. How do you react to | :24:48. | :24:53. | |
those adjectives? I think it's understandable that people would | :24:54. | :24:55. | |
think that way after some of the things that happened in British | :24:56. | :24:58. | |
politics over the past few years. I'm not at all surprised. I think we | :24:59. | :25:06. | |
have to work to reassure people that we're not all duplicitous or shady | :25:07. | :25:09. | |
and try to be more united in the way that we look at things? I think we | :25:10. | :25:13. | |
need to regain the trust of the public. Easier said than done? It is | :25:14. | :25:18. | |
hard, but you get a and great opportunity as a new MP to build | :25:19. | :25:21. | |
that trust with your electorate. We need to go out there and make sure | :25:22. | :25:25. | |
we are listening to people and that we are truly representing them. Ben | :25:26. | :25:29. | |
Bradshaw, you have been an MP for a long time. You will have heard these | :25:30. | :25:33. | |
adjectives before, is it disheartening that people are still | :25:34. | :25:38. | |
saying this? It is a bit. I won a Tory seat in 1997, I have a 16,000 | :25:39. | :25:42. | |
majority, I haven't achieved that by not being available and your advice | :25:43. | :25:46. | |
to the new MPs and to long-standing MPs was the right one. Make yourself | :25:47. | :25:52. | |
available. Jo Cox was a fantastic role model about what an MP could be | :25:53. | :25:55. | |
like and should be like. She made herself very available and lost her | :25:56. | :25:59. | |
life for doing that and certainly it's a model that good MPs and the | :26:00. | :26:05. | |
vast majority of MPs are in this because they want to serve their | :26:06. | :26:10. | |
constituents and their country. The vast majority of MPs go into | :26:11. | :26:14. | |
politics for the right reason because the concept of public | :26:15. | :26:17. | |
service, they want to serve the public. And I think the vast | :26:18. | :26:22. | |
majority do a decent job at that, but there is this disconnect which | :26:23. | :26:25. | |
we need to try and repair and mend and all I would say is look at your | :26:26. | :26:29. | |
own individual MP because what is interesting in this debate is when | :26:30. | :26:32. | |
you talk to constituents, you get a different view of their local MP | :26:33. | :26:35. | |
than you do of the concept generally. The nature of this | :26:36. | :26:39. | |
conversation, it is broadly generalised, you appreciate that, | :26:40. | :26:42. | |
but Mel, you will have heard politicians say look, we are in it | :26:43. | :26:47. | |
for the right motive, so why do you still have such a bad feeling about | :26:48. | :26:51. | |
them, that their reputation is so poor? Well, I don't have a totally | :26:52. | :26:57. | |
bad feeling, but I think there is not enough leadership coming from | :26:58. | :27:00. | |
politicians. When we face Brexit, we will need more than political | :27:01. | :27:04. | |
management. We need people who can articulate a political vision and | :27:05. | :27:07. | |
who can answer the question of what sort of nation do we want to be? | :27:08. | :27:11. | |
Instead we get politicians who are concerned or seemingly only with the | :27:12. | :27:14. | |
next five year election cycle, so I think we need to do better on | :27:15. | :27:17. | |
leadership. That's a very, very good point. I think one of the things we | :27:18. | :27:22. | |
need to do more is set out why we want a good deal. The prospect of | :27:23. | :27:29. | |
opportunity that's there and paint reasons for actually negotiating | :27:30. | :27:32. | |
that good deal and being positive and I think that's one thing perhaps | :27:33. | :27:36. | |
we take away as Conservatives from the general election is that we | :27:37. | :27:40. | |
didn't perhaps talk enough about sunnier uplands, the positive | :27:41. | :27:44. | |
reasons for voting and what sort of country we want to live in and there | :27:45. | :27:48. | |
is a lot to be said. David? I don't know, I just get the feeling that | :27:49. | :27:52. | |
Brexit and the recent elections has really exposed politicians to the | :27:53. | :27:56. | |
public about, you know, this is all just grabbing power, you know look | :27:57. | :28:00. | |
at the DUP and people doing deals with each other and it's very dirty. | :28:01. | :28:03. | |
A lot of the time I feel that politicians, I did a lot of | :28:04. | :28:06. | |
campaigning over the years and a lot of time I find that it's difficult | :28:07. | :28:09. | |
to get politicians support for certain things that we know we need | :28:10. | :28:13. | |
to happen in society and I think they need to be working together | :28:14. | :28:17. | |
across parties, especially when it comes to Brexit because both parties | :28:18. | :28:22. | |
are not really obviously... That's going to have to happen now. There | :28:23. | :28:28. | |
is no alternative. Theresa May's destructive hard Brexit is dead. | :28:29. | :28:31. | |
It's over. Everything has changed. We have got to work across party and | :28:32. | :28:37. | |
that's what the public are asking us to do by delivering this election | :28:38. | :28:41. | |
result. I agree and we have ant opportunity to have a much more open | :28:42. | :28:46. | |
approach to Brexit and I was disappointed in what Iain Duncan | :28:47. | :28:48. | |
Smith said because he seemed to take the opposite approach which was the | :28:49. | :28:53. | |
argument is closed. Well, I would argue that the actual election | :28:54. | :28:56. | |
result shows that the argument is not closed. That people rejected | :28:57. | :28:59. | |
Theresa May's very hard Brexit approach and they want a more open | :29:00. | :29:05. | |
approach with as Ben says other ideas coming in, talk across the | :29:06. | :29:09. | |
parties. Gather support from a much broader approach. In Parliamentary | :29:10. | :29:15. | |
practicalities there will have to be Parliamentary consensus because | :29:16. | :29:18. | |
things will get voted down and no progress will be made? Yes, there | :29:19. | :29:23. | |
are discussions going on about how we can rescue our country from this | :29:24. | :29:29. | |
disastrous destructive Brexit which Theresa May set her mind on for no | :29:30. | :29:34. | |
apparent reason. She interpreted the referendum in a particular way which | :29:35. | :29:38. | |
the public rejected. Having been a Remainor herself. Taking it slightly | :29:39. | :29:43. | |
back from Brexit because we could actually be talking Brexit the whole | :29:44. | :29:48. | |
of this time. I said I wanted politicians to recognise that it was | :29:49. | :29:53. | |
a privilege and my comment actually came, it wasn't what I was going to | :29:54. | :29:57. | |
say originally, it came from an interview with the chair of the | :29:58. | :30:01. | |
backbench 1922 committee last night on the news where he said and I'm | :30:02. | :30:06. | |
not quoting verbatim, but he said something on the lines of there are | :30:07. | :30:12. | |
lessons to be learnt the soundbite that has more bite than vibe, one of | :30:13. | :30:16. | |
the things we're going to have to think about is why so many people, | :30:17. | :30:19. | |
some of them must be intelligent, voted Labour! | :30:20. | :30:24. | |
And I just, you know, my hands just went like this. You found that | :30:25. | :30:30. | |
rather patronising. I found that patronising and I found that rude. | :30:31. | :30:35. | |
People, however much integrity you have, you've got to watch your | :30:36. | :30:38. | |
tongues and what you say because we pay your wages. | :30:39. | :30:44. | |
If you could deliver a demand to politicians going back to work | :30:45. | :30:50. | |
today, what do you want from them? I want to feel as the viewer doing the | :30:51. | :30:55. | |
job you are supposed to be doing, representing me, representing my | :30:56. | :30:58. | |
neighbours, and all my friends and all my family and all the people I | :30:59. | :31:03. | |
am ever going to know, you are representing us, so I have to have | :31:04. | :31:08. | |
some affinity with you, and even if we do come from different | :31:09. | :31:11. | |
backgrounds, I have to feel confident that you are representing | :31:12. | :31:16. | |
me - not... I don't want to feel as though you are from a completely | :31:17. | :31:20. | |
different world, I don't get what you are saying, I don't understand | :31:21. | :31:24. | |
what you're saying, how does that affect me, literally, that is what | :31:25. | :31:31. | |
we want to know. The UK referendum is a classic example of the MPs | :31:32. | :31:38. | |
ignoring the population. How do you work that out? Because they try to | :31:39. | :31:41. | |
turn it into a political battle, when in fact it was a vote by the | :31:42. | :31:46. | |
population to decide how they wanted the country to go forward in the | :31:47. | :31:50. | |
future. And what we should be doing now, because the Europeans are our | :31:51. | :31:55. | |
friends, what we should be doing now is forming a commission comprised of | :31:56. | :32:00. | |
both parties, all parties in Parliament, and members of the | :32:01. | :32:05. | |
public, so that they can all go together and negotiate with our | :32:06. | :32:10. | |
friends in Europe. OK. And that way we will see more honest and genuine. | :32:11. | :32:18. | |
One, John. Just briefly, part of the unfortunate thing of just watching | :32:19. | :32:22. | |
PMQs is that there is too much of a risk of seeing politics through the | :32:23. | :32:26. | |
prism of PMQs. What I would like to say is that there is much more | :32:27. | :32:31. | |
co-operation across the parties than is generally realised. For example, | :32:32. | :32:36. | |
I am chair of the all-party Parliamentary group on cancer, which | :32:37. | :32:39. | |
brings politicians from across the political divide together, | :32:40. | :32:42. | |
questioning the Government of the day, whatever their colour. So there | :32:43. | :32:46. | |
is more co-operation than people realise. So why play those | :32:47. | :32:53. | |
particular roles during PMQs? Some of us do not shout... Plenty of your | :32:54. | :32:57. | |
colleagues do. Governments have to be brought to account, and you have | :32:58. | :33:02. | |
to ask difficult questions, and you get direct answers back. But the | :33:03. | :33:05. | |
bottom line is we should remember there is a lot of co-operation, and | :33:06. | :33:08. | |
there needs to be, and I think people are right in the sense that | :33:09. | :33:12. | |
when it comes to Brexit, we are going to have to carry people with | :33:13. | :33:16. | |
us on this issue. I have never understood what the difference was | :33:17. | :33:23. | |
the between hard and soft Brexit, it is a question of getting the best | :33:24. | :33:27. | |
possible deal, and there seems to be an enormous amount of conformity | :33:28. | :33:30. | |
between Labour on the Conservatives with regards to what we want from | :33:31. | :33:36. | |
the EU negotiations. OK. You do see the parties coming together. We are | :33:37. | :33:40. | |
not having the Brexit conversation again! So what are our top three or | :33:41. | :33:47. | |
top five? Put them in order, what do you reckon? Integrity, definitely. | :33:48. | :33:53. | |
So including honesty in that. Transparency, that sort of thing. | :33:54. | :34:06. | |
Passion with respect. Is that number two, is that as high up as it should | :34:07. | :34:12. | |
be? Theresa May sounded like a robot during her campaign... What else, as | :34:13. | :34:17. | |
well as integrity? What else is important? Empathy is a big one, the | :34:18. | :34:22. | |
ability to put yourself in another person's shoes, a boss will tell | :34:23. | :34:32. | |
someone what to do, a leader will show them. MPs need to be leading in | :34:33. | :34:37. | |
compassion, forgiveness, respect, in showing people those values. So how | :34:38. | :34:44. | |
shall we describe that, affinity, empathy? Yeah? Well, I am really | :34:45. | :34:51. | |
interested that is number two, that says a lot, particularly perhaps | :34:52. | :34:55. | |
because of recent weeks. What else are we going for? Clarity. You | :34:56. | :35:01. | |
asking a lot of there, Sharon! Clarity? You mean you don't | :35:02. | :35:05. | |
understand the phrase Brexit means Brexit? I don't understand a word | :35:06. | :35:17. | |
they say! If someone asks me a question, I want the answer, not the | :35:18. | :35:25. | |
same mantra over and over again? Of clarity and directness when they go | :35:26. | :35:38. | |
to press conferences, they know what they are going to say, regardless of | :35:39. | :35:42. | |
the question. We have two experienced politicians and two new | :35:43. | :35:46. | |
politicians, why is it so hard to answer questions directly? If I and | :35:47. | :35:52. | |
so directly, it means a damning headline, is that what is going on? | :35:53. | :35:59. | |
-- if I answer directly. I try to answer directly, I am sure | :36:00. | :36:03. | |
colleagues here do as well, and there is a danger you generalise | :36:04. | :36:08. | |
across all MPs. You have made that point. We decide to do this job as | :36:09. | :36:15. | |
best we can. I have a reputation for speaking my mind, but there is a | :36:16. | :36:19. | |
difference between being in government and in opposition, I am | :36:20. | :36:22. | |
much more free as an opposition backbencher to say whatever I like! | :36:23. | :36:28. | |
Isn't that the problem with party politics? You have to toe the party | :36:29. | :36:32. | |
line, I would love to be in politics, but I could not do that. | :36:33. | :36:36. | |
It is like being in a club, if you come to an agreement in the | :36:37. | :36:39. | |
organisation, you stick to it. If you are going to have a united | :36:40. | :36:43. | |
organisational club, you have to stick to the line. There are ways of | :36:44. | :36:46. | |
answering questions which sounded less evasive than some ministers do | :36:47. | :36:52. | |
it, and you can think of your most and least favourite politicians for | :36:53. | :36:56. | |
and swing questions, but there is a different with collective | :36:57. | :36:59. | |
responsibility and having that freedom. So clarity and directness? | :37:00. | :37:04. | |
Directness and clarity? Any preference? No? Excuse my writing. | :37:05. | :37:10. | |
Clarity and directness... Right, is that it? No, I think four has to be | :37:11. | :37:18. | |
humility, I would put it much higher up. OK, humility. There is such a | :37:19. | :37:24. | |
peeling of we are up here, you are down there, and as you said in your | :37:25. | :37:29. | |
intro, we pay your wages, you are only there because we put an X in | :37:30. | :37:37. | |
the box, so recognised us. Yeah? Are we happy with our top four? What is | :37:38. | :37:44. | |
wrong with passengers I love a bit of passion, believe me! Make its | :37:45. | :37:55. | |
number five! OK, passion! OK... Passion. Sorry! Right, MPs, your | :37:56. | :38:07. | |
reaction? I 100% agree with that, I think humility, the area eyelid in I | :38:08. | :38:12. | |
represent, someone I get the train in the morning, people speak to me. | :38:13. | :38:20. | |
-- the area I live in, I represent. So to be accountable, you have to | :38:21. | :38:23. | |
respect other people, they put their trust in me, I have to respect that. | :38:24. | :38:28. | |
Christian, what about you as a new MP? Formerly a special adviser, you | :38:29. | :38:33. | |
have been around a bit. I don't mean that in the way... You know what I | :38:34. | :38:39. | |
mean, you are experienced! I think those points are all be enough, and | :38:40. | :38:42. | |
one of the problem is that politicians have is that somehow | :38:43. | :38:47. | |
they have managed as a group, not individuals, to portray this image | :38:48. | :38:52. | |
to the public that we don't have personal lives, we don't have | :38:53. | :38:55. | |
families, that we don't actually worry about paying the mortgage | :38:56. | :39:00. | |
ourselves. And I think we need to be more open about the fact that we | :39:01. | :39:05. | |
have lives you are normal people, Shaka! Shark horror! I had personal | :39:06. | :39:20. | |
issues during the campaign, a bereavement, and we got a lot of | :39:21. | :39:25. | |
support. People see you in PMQs, arguing and fighting, and forget | :39:26. | :39:27. | |
that we colleagues and we'll have the same problems. That happened | :39:28. | :39:34. | |
with Jo Cox, to see the whole House come together, they realised she was | :39:35. | :39:39. | |
a really good MP. And beyond that, as the people we represent, I think | :39:40. | :39:45. | |
we are very bad at being open and speaking clearly and honestly about | :39:46. | :39:50. | |
our lives. All right. Are you two happy to sign up to this list? I am | :39:51. | :39:56. | |
sure you already exhibit some of those characteristics! I think, for | :39:57. | :40:01. | |
me, absolutely. One that is missing if I can dare give advice to our new | :40:02. | :40:05. | |
colleagues who have won marginal seats from another party, very hard | :40:06. | :40:09. | |
work - you need to put the hard work in. I agree with all of those, | :40:10. | :40:16. | |
integrity, empathy is very important, we always have to design | :40:17. | :40:19. | |
our policies as best we can to help those more vulnerable at the bottom | :40:20. | :40:24. | |
end of the pay scale and all the rest of it, and employed, one nation | :40:25. | :40:28. | |
politics, if you like, whichever side of the House. But humility is | :40:29. | :40:33. | |
very important. We have, number four. I'm just addressing the list, | :40:34. | :40:39. | |
because it is important that MPs, politics says, we are going to | :40:40. | :40:42. | |
listen, we might have got this wrong, we are going to think about | :40:43. | :40:45. | |
it again. That is carrying people along. I will make a deal with you, | :40:46. | :40:50. | |
Victoria, if we do more of that, the immediate needs to be more tolerant | :40:51. | :40:54. | |
when it comes to accusing us of not knowing where we are going. That is | :40:55. | :41:00. | |
there point, but there are U-turns and there are U-turns! -- a fair | :41:01. | :41:07. | |
point. But you are generalising across the media, as we have been | :41:08. | :41:11. | |
generalising, so right back at you! Very last word. It might sound odd | :41:12. | :41:16. | |
from a Liberal Democrat, but one of the things that had most impact on a | :41:17. | :41:19. | |
generation, helping the Labour Party, the night before he died, | :41:20. | :41:24. | |
John Smith talked about how the Labour Party were asking for the | :41:25. | :41:27. | |
opportunity to serve, and more politicians need to take that sort | :41:28. | :41:32. | |
of approach. It is, as Carol said, about service. Excellent point, I am | :41:33. | :41:37. | |
defending colleagues here - the vast majority, we must member, go for the | :41:38. | :41:41. | |
right reason, and they believe in public service. What message would | :41:42. | :41:44. | |
you give to those who are not following those values? You are | :41:45. | :41:50. | |
saying the right things but the reality is... There is no room for | :41:51. | :41:54. | |
you in politics, and by and large they do get found out on both sides | :41:55. | :41:59. | |
of the House. We are going to ask the MPs to sign up to your code of | :42:00. | :42:03. | |
conduct, if that is right, and if you come across colleagues today, if | :42:04. | :42:07. | |
you wouldn't mind mentioning it, it would be useful. Thank you very much | :42:08. | :42:11. | |
for coming on the programme, we appreciate it. We mentioned Jo Cox a | :42:12. | :42:15. | |
couple of times, one of those politicians that most people think | :42:16. | :42:16. | |
stuck by that code of conduct. On 16th June last year, | :42:17. | :42:22. | |
the Labour MP was murdered outside her constituency | :42:23. | :42:24. | |
in Birstall, Yorkshire. It was a crime that horrified | :42:25. | :42:26. | |
the country but united people In the days, weeks and months | :42:27. | :42:28. | |
that followed, Jo Cox's friends and family pledged | :42:29. | :42:33. | |
to continue her legacy, rather than let it be | :42:34. | :42:35. | |
overshadowed by what happened. In the run-up to the first | :42:36. | :42:38. | |
anniversary of her death, her sister Kim Leadbeater | :42:39. | :42:41. | |
and her family have invited our reporter Catherine Burns | :42:42. | :42:43. | |
to their home for the first time to share their private | :42:44. | :42:46. | |
memories of Jo. We'll never be fully repaired, | :42:47. | :42:55. | |
if you like, because there's always | :42:56. | :42:58. | |
a piece of us missing. I think there must be a difference | :42:59. | :43:04. | |
between denial and disbelief. And Jo's children have got so much | :43:05. | :43:09. | |
of her and Brendan in them. That's a great legacy, | :43:10. | :43:18. | |
I mean, we love that. When I have the darkest | :43:19. | :43:29. | |
and the difficult moments, I just think, right, | :43:30. | :43:33. | |
she would not want you to lose it. to the anger and to | :43:34. | :43:38. | |
the upset and to the hatred. Yes, this is the wonderful | :43:39. | :43:46. | |
town of Batley. She wanted to be at the heart | :43:47. | :43:59. | |
of the constituency, and this is where she decided | :44:00. | :44:02. | |
to base herself. there's still the Jo Cox MP | :44:03. | :44:07. | |
sign on the door. Yes, yes, it's hard | :44:08. | :44:11. | |
to know what to do Is it worse to have it there or | :44:12. | :44:14. | |
better to have it there, you know? I keep saying to myself, | :44:15. | :44:25. | |
if I get through to the end of July with my health | :44:26. | :44:28. | |
and my sanity, I've done well. And then I really don't | :44:29. | :44:32. | |
know what comes after that. because that normal life | :44:33. | :44:34. | |
doesn't exist, you know. Kim Leadbeater | :44:35. | :44:39. | |
has spent this year trying to build a legacy | :44:40. | :44:45. | |
for her sister, Jo Cox. I still miss the sound | :44:46. | :44:49. | |
of her coming down the drive. Her parents have | :44:50. | :44:54. | |
generally avoided the limelight, This is their first interview | :44:55. | :44:57. | |
on national TV. What were you doing | :44:58. | :45:05. | |
when you got that call? We'd just sat down | :45:06. | :45:07. | |
about five minutes, And he just said, "Jo's | :45:08. | :45:09. | |
been shot, I think." And we jumped in the car, | :45:10. | :45:21. | |
I remember I was jumping in the car, I don't know how | :45:22. | :45:31. | |
we managed to get there. People are shot and | :45:32. | :45:39. | |
recover, etc, etc. But you see these things | :45:40. | :45:54. | |
on the television where the doctor, in this | :45:55. | :46:07. | |
case it was a police inspector, comes into the room | :46:08. | :46:11. | |
and he has to tell you. In fact, he doesn't | :46:12. | :46:14. | |
have to tell you. You can see by his | :46:15. | :46:17. | |
expression. And he said, "I'm sorry to say | :46:18. | :46:24. | |
she didn't make it". I think that the difficult | :46:25. | :46:27. | |
thing, it's the That's very, very | :46:28. | :46:29. | |
difficult to understand. And it's about creating a new level | :46:30. | :46:36. | |
of normality for us as a family. One of the things that Kim | :46:37. | :46:39. | |
said afterwards was, "Our family is broken now | :46:40. | :46:43. | |
but we will mend over time". We will always be broken, | :46:44. | :46:45. | |
because there's a piece missing. But, yeah, I think to the outside | :46:46. | :46:50. | |
world we do appear strong. But there's a lot of days | :46:51. | :46:56. | |
when the bad is bad. The long times for us | :46:57. | :47:03. | |
are when we turn the television on and see terrorist acts - | :47:04. | :47:06. | |
Westminster Bridge, Manchester - because that's when it | :47:07. | :47:12. | |
brings everything back. For me, the ambulances, | :47:13. | :47:19. | |
the sirens, I'm back But we still think | :47:20. | :47:21. | |
about the people who have lost loved ones, and we know | :47:22. | :47:30. | |
what they are actually just It must be awful for them. | :47:31. | :47:33. | |
We know what we went through. And unfortunately | :47:34. | :47:38. | |
they don't, as yet. Going forward, build | :47:39. | :47:44. | |
on the children, the grandchildren. Because you're right, | :47:45. | :47:48. | |
it won't go away. And Jo's children have got so much | :47:49. | :47:57. | |
of her and Brendan in them. That's a great legacy | :47:58. | :48:13. | |
and we love that. Jo, she loved them to bits, | :48:14. | :48:15. | |
absolutely loved them. And that's the most | :48:16. | :48:17. | |
upsetting thing, from my It was, for you especially, | :48:18. | :48:19. | |
after Jo was murdered, Lejla and Cuillin came up, and you found it | :48:20. | :48:29. | |
really difficult, didn't you? Obviously this year you've | :48:30. | :48:32. | |
all been part of the But the public face of it | :48:33. | :48:41. | |
has really been Kim. How do you feel about | :48:42. | :48:45. | |
the work she's done? More than one person | :48:46. | :48:49. | |
came up to me after the funeral, and after Kim talked | :48:50. | :48:53. | |
in Birstall marketplace, and said, "You've got not one, | :48:54. | :48:58. | |
but two marvellous daughters. One we saw, Jo, on occasions, | :48:59. | :49:05. | |
on the television And, you know, we're very proud, | :49:06. | :49:08. | |
because I can't separate So this is not what you'd | :49:09. | :49:17. | |
expect your average But this was Jo, just | :49:18. | :49:26. | |
very relaxed, very comfortable, and just embracing | :49:27. | :49:30. | |
the situation she was in. That is absolutely | :49:31. | :49:34. | |
stunning, isn't it? Yeah, that's the birthday | :49:35. | :49:38. | |
karaoke with the Elaine Paige and Barbara Dickson, | :49:39. | :49:43. | |
I Know Him So Well, which was our party piece | :49:44. | :49:46. | |
when we were kids. And it was re-enacted | :49:47. | :49:52. | |
for my birthday last year. # I could have made | :49:53. | :49:58. | |
it differently #. We were really close, | :49:59. | :50:10. | |
like all growing up throughout childhood | :50:11. | :50:14. | |
we were really, really close. There is two years age | :50:15. | :50:16. | |
difference between us, and I am younger, although nobody | :50:17. | :50:18. | |
believed it because Jo looked so We just had a really close | :50:19. | :50:21. | |
relationship, and we never fell out. # But in the end he needs a lit more | :50:22. | :50:26. | |
security. . # It wasn't about Jo Cox | :50:27. | :50:47. | |
MP, it was actually Joanne Leadbeater, | :50:48. | :50:50. | |
who was my sister. Literally sort of within days of Jo | :50:51. | :50:51. | |
been killed, things just started to arrive, and the house | :50:52. | :50:54. | |
was just full of flowers. And that was the classic, | :50:55. | :50:58. | |
line, I never met your sister, but I just had to do | :50:59. | :51:00. | |
something, I just had to say Me and mum and dad when we're out | :51:01. | :51:03. | |
and about and stuff, we go to the supermarket, and we've met | :51:04. | :51:07. | |
people, and they just end Maybe that has detracted | :51:08. | :51:10. | |
from my personal grief, But it has certainly provided | :51:11. | :51:17. | |
comfort and support. At the same time we saw that public | :51:18. | :51:22. | |
outpouring of grief, this was your personal | :51:23. | :51:25. | |
tragedy as well. How did you manage to | :51:26. | :51:26. | |
balance those two things? And, you know, people who knew Jo | :51:27. | :51:28. | |
through politics, people who And initially I found | :51:29. | :51:37. | |
that a bit, hang She's my mum and dad's Jo, | :51:38. | :51:41. | |
and she's Brendan's Jo, really. But then actually you | :51:42. | :51:47. | |
think how lovely it is that so many people | :51:48. | :51:49. | |
wanted her to be their Jo. So you can't possibly | :51:50. | :51:52. | |
be cross about that. Has it hit yet that | :51:53. | :51:54. | |
she isn't coming back? I know exactly | :51:55. | :51:57. | |
what happened. I've got those facts, | :51:58. | :52:01. | |
but I don't think I've got them on a deep emotional level yet, and that | :52:02. | :52:05. | |
worries me, because when that happens it's difficult | :52:06. | :52:08. | |
to know what will happen. I think there must be a difference | :52:09. | :52:11. | |
between denial and disbelief. I've got closer than | :52:12. | :52:17. | |
ever to mum and dad. Which again is heartbreaking | :52:18. | :52:27. | |
at times, when you think, you know, I'm | :52:28. | :52:29. | |
their only child now. And I have guilt associated | :52:30. | :52:34. | |
with that as well, because when the phone rings and it | :52:35. | :52:38. | |
would always be, "oh, it's Like that's, you know, | :52:39. | :52:41. | |
that's gone forever now. It was supposed | :52:42. | :52:45. | |
by Jo's birthday less Her husband, Brendan, | :52:46. | :52:49. | |
spoke in London's We try to remember not how | :52:50. | :52:52. | |
cruelly she has been taken from us, but how unbelievably | :52:53. | :52:59. | |
lucky we were to have her And let me start by saying | :53:00. | :53:02. | |
thank you to everybody My sister would want her murder | :53:03. | :53:09. | |
to mobilise people, To try to make | :53:10. | :53:26. | |
a positive difference. And that's exactly what Kim | :53:27. | :53:35. | |
has spent the last 12 months doing, trying to create | :53:36. | :53:39. | |
something positive from Jo's death. She's worked on causes close | :53:40. | :53:43. | |
to her heart, everything from tackling loneliness to getting | :53:44. | :53:46. | |
communities to But in many ways, she's | :53:47. | :53:47. | |
put her own life on hold. So this is where you | :53:48. | :53:54. | |
had your big speech? Yes, the big tribute to Jo. | :53:55. | :53:58. | |
The big tribute on the 22nd of June. Because I'm a very private person, | :53:59. | :54:03. | |
what I tend to be able to seem to do is just go into this mode | :54:04. | :54:07. | |
of having a job to do and then doing it, and then the fallout | :54:08. | :54:11. | |
for me is often when I get home. So I end up really | :54:12. | :54:15. | |
drained, really tired, and that's when I tend | :54:16. | :54:16. | |
to get more upset. You've spoken a lot today | :54:17. | :54:19. | |
about sort of Jo's legacy, but there's also your life - | :54:20. | :54:21. | |
you, Kim, and what's next for you. I don't know what I'll do, | :54:22. | :54:24. | |
I don't what I'll do. But I think, you know, | :54:25. | :54:27. | |
the platform that we've been given, for the worst possible reasons, | :54:28. | :54:29. | |
my instinct is to try and create something positive | :54:30. | :54:32. | |
out of that by using it in a good way, but I've no idea | :54:33. | :54:36. | |
what shape that takes. We'll be talking to Jo | :54:37. | :54:48. | |
Cox's husband, Brendan, And Kim, Jo's sister. These messages | :54:49. | :54:59. | |
from you. Scott says, "This is a heartbreaking interview with Jo | :55:00. | :55:06. | |
Cox's parents." Kirsty says, "I'm crying over Jo Cox's incredible | :55:07. | :55:12. | |
parents." Kevin Cook tweets to say, "I'm 52 years of age today and I've | :55:13. | :55:20. | |
done a run in memory of Jo Cox and sponsored an AFC Croydon football | :55:21. | :55:25. | |
game in her memory." On our manifesto or code of conduct, | :55:26. | :55:30. | |
whatever you'd like to call the rules that voters came up for | :55:31. | :55:32. | |
politicians as they return to the House of Commons today after the | :55:33. | :55:38. | |
general election, Mel says, "Integrity, honesty, humility. Your | :55:39. | :55:41. | |
panel is spot on today. This is what we want from our politicians." | :55:42. | :55:50. | |
The singer Katy Perry has apologised for "appropriating black and Asian | :55:51. | :55:54. | |
In a recent interview, the singer admitted that she is guilty | :55:55. | :55:58. | |
of cultural appropriation and benefits from what she | :55:59. | :55:59. | |
She's been speaking to promote her latest album, "witness". | :56:00. | :56:04. | |
I've made several mistakes and having a hard conversation with one | :56:05. | :56:10. | |
of my empowered angels about what does it mean? Can can't I wear my | :56:11. | :56:14. | |
hair that way? What is the history behind wearing the hair that way? | :56:15. | :56:20. | |
And she told me about the power in plaque women's hair and how | :56:21. | :56:24. | |
beautiful it is and the struggle. And I listened and I heard and I | :56:25. | :56:29. | |
didn't know and I will never understand some of those things | :56:30. | :56:33. | |
because of who I am. I will never understand. | :56:34. | :56:36. | |
BBC Radio 1 Newsbeat's music reporter Stve | :56:37. | :56:37. | |
Just fill us in a little bit more about what she has been criticised | :56:38. | :56:45. | |
for and why in the past? Katie Perry is a loud pop star. She is full of | :56:46. | :56:49. | |
colour and costumes and that's what has got her into trouble in the | :56:50. | :56:53. | |
past. Two specific occasions. A couple of years ago she sang a song | :56:54. | :57:02. | |
called Unconditionally and she was accused of racism. Secondly, she did | :57:03. | :57:07. | |
a music video called This Is How We Do. She was wearing corn rows and | :57:08. | :57:16. | |
eating watermelon and criticised for appropriating black culture and both | :57:17. | :57:20. | |
times she was criticised and she never really apologised and just | :57:21. | :57:24. | |
said, "I didn't know what I was doing. I'm just a pop star. I I'm | :57:25. | :57:32. | |
just loud." That's how she dealt with any criticism? So the last four | :57:33. | :57:38. | |
days she spent her time in an apartment in America to promote this | :57:39. | :57:42. | |
new album and she has been addressing lots of issues that she | :57:43. | :57:45. | |
has been crit sided for in the past. This cultural appropriation issue is | :57:46. | :57:49. | |
one specifically because in the past she said, "I didn't know I was doing | :57:50. | :57:53. | |
anything wrong. It was up to my friends to tell me this is why you | :57:54. | :57:58. | |
shouldn't be wearing corn rows because you're using black culture | :57:59. | :58:04. | |
for your own gain." There are other issues that she has been dealing | :58:05. | :58:08. | |
with. The feud with Taylor Swift which is the stuff of entertainment | :58:09. | :58:12. | |
journalists, we love it. Sum it up in a line. Tell us why they have | :58:13. | :58:19. | |
been feuding. Taylor Swift, Katie Perry took a couple of Taylor Swift | :58:20. | :58:24. | |
dancers. Took them? From a tour. They were on tour and Katie Perry | :58:25. | :58:30. | |
took them in the middle of Taylor Swift's tourment it is probably what | :58:31. | :58:34. | |
teenage girls fight about and since then they have not spoken o an | :58:35. | :58:40. | |
Friday Katie Perry released her new album and Taylor Swift had taken all | :58:41. | :58:46. | |
of her music off Spotify and decided Taylor Swift that Friday was the | :58:47. | :58:52. | |
best day to put her music on Spotify thereby taking the wind out of Katie | :58:53. | :58:57. | |
Perry's sails and Katie Perry tried to Bury the hatchet with Taylor | :58:58. | :59:03. | |
Swift and said we are both strong women in the music industry and she | :59:04. | :59:08. | |
is a great songwriter, it feels clinical and cold. A bit like | :59:09. | :59:14. | |
promoting your new album? Well, exactly. She spent four days talking | :59:15. | :59:19. | |
about something that's getting her headlines. It is nice to her address | :59:20. | :59:23. | |
it. Because in the past she almost stuck her head in the sand with it | :59:24. | :59:27. | |
and finally she hit it head-on. Thank you very much, Steve. Steve, | :59:28. | :59:29. | |
Holden. We have got sunshine. If you're | :59:30. | :59:43. | |
living in the eastern and southern areas, you have got blue skies. That | :59:44. | :59:50. | |
was the scene in Norfolk. For many of us, it is grey skies and a dreary | :59:51. | :59:57. | |
start to the day in Shropshire. More rain towards Northern Ireland and | :59:58. | :00:00. | |
into Scotland. The best of the sunshine is across eastern and | :00:01. | :00:04. | |
southern parts of England and that's where temperatures will get up to 22 | :00:05. | :00:08. | |
or 23 Celsius, but even further north, 17 Celsius to 19 Celsius. A | :00:09. | :00:11. | |
bit more rain will come into Northern Ireland and Scotland | :00:12. | :00:14. | |
overnight, but elsewhere, it will be dry. There could be one or two | :00:15. | :00:17. | |
patches of fog developing in the far southment but for Wednesday, it's | :00:18. | :00:21. | |
going to get warmer for most of us. There will be some rain across | :00:22. | :00:23. | |
Northern Ireland into Scotland as well. But for most of us, hazy | :00:24. | :00:28. | |
sunshine, maximum temperatures 27 Celsius perhaps in the South East. | :00:29. | :00:32. | |
Even in the far north and west despite the cloudier skies and rain, | :00:33. | :00:36. | |
still here temperatures rather pleasant at 17 or 18 Celsius. | :00:37. | :00:43. | |
it's ten o'clock, I'm Victoria Derbyshire. | :00:44. | :00:46. | |
Our top story - will they reach a deal? | :00:47. | :00:48. | |
Theresa May meets the Northern Irish DUP leader today, as they try | :00:49. | :00:51. | |
and broker a deal to help the Prime Minister | :00:52. | :00:53. | |
We will take a look at their anti-abortion stance and speak to | :00:54. | :01:02. | |
those affected by the current legislation. | :01:03. | :01:04. | |
And with Parliament reconvening this afternoon, | :01:05. | :01:06. | |
we've been hearing from members of the public | :01:07. | :01:08. | |
There is not enough leadership from politicians. I have to feel | :01:09. | :01:23. | |
confident you are representing me. You have got to watch what you say, | :01:24. | :01:29. | |
because we pay your wages. This is the code of conduct that you have | :01:30. | :01:35. | |
drawn up, integrity, honesty, empathy, clarity and directness, | :01:36. | :01:43. | |
humility passion! We will be asking all MPs to sign up to it. | :01:44. | :01:47. | |
Also on the programme, almost a year since Labour MP | :01:48. | :01:50. | |
Jo Cox was murdered her family speak about | :01:51. | :01:52. | |
the hole that she's left, and the community reaction | :01:53. | :01:54. | |
That was the classic line, I never met your sister, but I had to do | :01:55. | :02:04. | |
something. My mum and dad, they have met people, they just end up crying, | :02:05. | :02:08. | |
grown men absolutely devastated, and you end up comforting them. Maybe | :02:09. | :02:13. | |
that has attracted from my personal grief, which will come eventually. | :02:14. | :02:18. | |
That is Jo's sister Kim, we will talk to her and Jo's husband before | :02:19. | :02:22. | |
11. Here's Joanna in the BBC newsroom | :02:23. | :02:27. | |
with a summary of today's news. Theresa May will meet with the DUP | :02:28. | :02:30. | |
leader, Arlene Foster, today to thrash out a deal that | :02:31. | :02:32. | |
would see the party prop up With Brexit talks due to begin | :02:33. | :02:35. | |
in less than a week, the EU's chief negotiator, | :02:36. | :02:42. | |
Michel Barnier, has said Britain must not | :02:43. | :02:43. | |
waste time. He's also urged the Government | :02:44. | :02:46. | |
to appoint a negotiating team that is stable, | :02:47. | :02:48. | |
accountable and with a mandate. The new Environment Secretary, | :02:49. | :02:52. | |
Michael Gove, said he wasn't worried | :02:53. | :02:54. | |
about the timetable. We have to make sure we have the | :02:55. | :03:07. | |
right team in place, a Queen's Speech that outlines our sense of | :03:08. | :03:11. | |
direction, and whether a day here there, that doesn't matter to me. | :03:12. | :03:16. | |
What matters is making sure we have the right approach, and the Prime | :03:17. | :03:19. | |
Minister has outlined the right approach. We need to make sure that | :03:20. | :03:22. | |
we arrive at these talks in very good order, and one of the ways we | :03:23. | :03:26. | |
can do so is by having the maximum amount of support for the strategy | :03:27. | :03:30. | |
Theresa May has outlined, which is the right approach. | :03:31. | :03:34. | |
Inflation unexpectedly jumped to its highest level | :03:35. | :03:36. | |
Consumer prices increased by 2.9% compared with a year earlier. | :03:37. | :03:40. | |
It's the biggest increase since June 2013, | :03:41. | :03:41. | |
according to the Office for National Statistics. | :03:42. | :03:46. | |
It said one of the main reasons for the rise was the cost of foreign | :03:47. | :03:51. | |
package holidays for British tourists. | :03:52. | :03:54. | |
In Germany, a policewoman has been seriously wounded | :03:55. | :03:57. | |
after shots were fired at a railway station near Munich. | :03:58. | :03:59. | |
It's understood she was injured when a man grabbed her gun. | :04:00. | :04:02. | |
Police say the man has now been arrested, | :04:03. | :04:05. | |
and that it was not a terrorist incident. | :04:06. | :04:09. | |
has told this programme that it is quitting | :04:10. | :04:12. | |
the Government's Independent Inquiry into Child Sexual Abuse. | :04:13. | :04:16. | |
The WhiteFlowers Campaign has said it blames Theresa May, | :04:17. | :04:18. | |
who set up the inquiry when she was Home Secretary, | :04:19. | :04:21. | |
The group, which represents more than a hundred survivors, | :04:22. | :04:25. | |
said it had lost faith in the inquiry | :04:26. | :04:27. | |
and accused it of not being truly independent. | :04:28. | :04:37. | |
brother and sister have been arrested after a man in his 40s was | :04:38. | :04:45. | |
shot dead at a property in Slough. They are being held on suspicion of | :04:46. | :04:49. | |
murder. They are said to have lived in a caravan in woodland near Slough | :04:50. | :04:55. | |
for more than 50 years. The parents of the murdered MP | :04:56. | :04:58. | |
Jo Cox have told this programme that they "will always be broken" | :04:59. | :05:01. | |
after their daughter's death. Friday will mark a year | :05:02. | :05:03. | |
since the Labour MP was killed outside her constituency surgery | :05:04. | :05:06. | |
in West Yorkshire. This weekend, her family | :05:07. | :05:07. | |
is encouraging people to join with friends and neighbours | :05:08. | :05:10. | |
for the Great Get Together, a series of community events | :05:11. | :05:12. | |
being held in Jo's memory. And we'll be talking to Jo's | :05:13. | :05:14. | |
husband Brendan and sister Kim This tweet from Catherine, | :05:15. | :05:25. | |
incredibly moving film with the family of Jo Cox. Chuck tweets you | :05:26. | :05:31. | |
can see where Jo Cox got her decency, humanity and integrity | :05:32. | :05:37. | |
from, what an amazing family. This e-mail from Bill, how brave of the | :05:38. | :05:40. | |
family to speak, it has brought me to tears, and my beloved wife passed | :05:41. | :05:46. | |
away 14 years ago, you never forget. And this tweet from Toby, a truly | :05:47. | :05:52. | |
moving feature on Jo Cox, I think it should permanently be posted on | :05:53. | :05:55. | |
iPlayer. She gave her life to our democracy. | :05:56. | :05:57. | |
Do get in touch with us throughout the morning, use #Victorialive. | :05:58. | :06:00. | |
If you text, you will be charged at the standard network rate. | :06:01. | :06:04. | |
Right, let's bring you the latest sport with Katherine. | :06:05. | :06:11. | |
The British and Irish Lions are playing their fourth match | :06:12. | :06:16. | |
They're playing the Highlanders in Dunedin, | :06:17. | :06:19. | |
and it's been an entertaining game. | :06:20. | :06:20. | |
Highlanders scored first Waisake Noholo crashing over, | :06:21. | :06:22. | |
injuring Courtney Lawes in the process. | :06:23. | :06:23. | |
But just a few minutes later, the Lions answered | :06:24. | :06:25. | |
with a try of their own, Jonathan Joseph spotting | :06:26. | :06:27. | |
Tommy Seymour ran it all the way in after this interception. | :06:28. | :06:32. | |
Sam Warburton has scored his first of the tour, and there has been | :06:33. | :06:39. | |
another for Highlanders, tries galore in Dunedin, it is 20-22, | :06:40. | :06:43. | |
Lions just leading, 20 minutes left to go there. | :06:44. | :06:47. | |
A senior coach working with the country's Olympic bobsleigh squad | :06:48. | :06:49. | |
has been accused of racism amid multiple complaints over | :06:50. | :06:52. | |
Confidential documents obtained by the BBC show | :06:53. | :06:55. | |
athletes said their concerns were "of the highest order, | :06:56. | :06:57. | |
mentioning bullying, racism, sexism and discrimination." | :06:58. | :07:00. | |
they were told no disciplinary action would be taken. | :07:01. | :07:07. | |
England's footballers play France in a friendly in Paris tonight. | :07:08. | :07:10. | |
with Tom Heaton and Jack Butland sharing goal-keeping duties. | :07:11. | :07:18. | |
French fans have been asked to join in with God Save The Queen | :07:19. | :07:21. | |
as a mark of respect following the terror attacks. | :07:22. | :07:23. | |
Prime Minister Theresa May and President Emmanuel Macron | :07:24. | :07:25. | |
I was at the match at Wembley and, you know, a very special occasion, | :07:26. | :07:40. | |
and we are very grateful to the French for offering this tribute to | :07:41. | :07:45. | |
England as a country, so it is nice that the history between us doesn't | :07:46. | :07:47. | |
come between us at those moments. And England's World Cup winners, | :07:48. | :07:49. | |
the under-20s team, arrived back in Britain | :07:50. | :07:51. | |
late last night. They flew into Birmingham | :07:52. | :07:53. | |
from South Korea, where they lifted their country's first trophy | :07:54. | :07:56. | |
at a world tournament since 1966. England, as a nation of footballers, | :07:57. | :08:09. | |
young players, is changing, so I think, like you say, it is a big | :08:10. | :08:12. | |
thing to have won the tournament, and it shows we are pushing on and | :08:13. | :08:18. | |
chasing to get to the top. For me personally, to save a penalty in a | :08:19. | :08:21. | |
World Cup final, it is what you dream about as a kid. But for the | :08:22. | :08:26. | |
team, and for what we have achieved, for the country, it is amazing. I | :08:27. | :08:32. | |
hope that these players, they take this experience and really go on and | :08:33. | :08:37. | |
benefit themselves and benefit our senior team in years to come, and | :08:38. | :08:41. | |
fingers crossed that will be the case. | :08:42. | :08:43. | |
Britain's six-time Paralympic champion David Weir | :08:44. | :08:45. | |
will compete in a track event for the final time | :08:46. | :08:47. | |
in next month's Anniversary Games in London. | :08:48. | :08:49. | |
He won the London Marathon for the seventh time in April. | :08:50. | :08:52. | |
In January, Weir, who won four gold medals at London 2012 | :08:53. | :08:55. | |
said he would never compete for Britain again | :08:56. | :08:58. | |
And you will be able to hear our interview with David Weir on the BBC | :08:59. | :09:11. | |
News Channel throughout the day, but that is all the sport for now. Back | :09:12. | :09:12. | |
to you, Victoria. Good morning! "I got us into this mess | :09:13. | :09:15. | |
and I'll get us out of it." Theresa May's words to her own | :09:16. | :09:18. | |
MPs yesterday, reportedly showing some of the humility | :09:19. | :09:20. | |
they'd wanted from her. Journalists weren't invited | :09:21. | :09:22. | |
to the meeting. But several MPs have reported | :09:23. | :09:24. | |
the following as taking place. The Prime Minister told her Tory MPs | :09:25. | :09:30. | |
she'll remain leader She pledged that the party | :09:31. | :09:33. | |
would help colleagues who lost their seats, some of whom | :09:34. | :09:40. | |
are in financial difficulties, and when talking about concerns | :09:41. | :09:44. | |
that government policy could be affected | :09:45. | :09:46. | |
by the DUP's views on gay rights, she reportedly said, | :09:47. | :09:49. | |
"LGB...what's the rest of it?" lesbian, gay, bisexual | :09:50. | :09:54. | |
and transgender. the PM needs to to a deal | :09:55. | :09:59. | |
with to stay on in government. Let's talk now to two MPs | :10:00. | :10:07. | |
who were at the meeting, Oliver Letwin, who's the | :10:08. | :10:10. | |
Conservative MP for West Dorset, Geoffrey Clifton-Brown, the | :10:11. | :10:13. | |
Conservative MP for the Cotswolds, and an executive member | :10:14. | :10:15. | |
of the 1922 Committee, which is the group of Conservative | :10:16. | :10:17. | |
MPs Theresa May may with yesterday, and in a moment, we'll speak | :10:18. | :10:20. | |
to Lord Andrew Turnbull, who was a top civil servant under | :10:21. | :10:24. | |
three different Prime Ministers Welcome, all of you, thank you very | :10:25. | :10:38. | |
much for talking to us. Oliver Letwin, how many times did Theresa | :10:39. | :10:41. | |
May apologise to you for throwing away the Conservative majority in | :10:42. | :10:49. | |
that election? Not many! How many? Once, twice? I genuinely have no | :10:50. | :10:53. | |
idea! The meeting was not about that. The meeting was about a pretty | :10:54. | :10:58. | |
unanimous view across the whole room of support for what she was doing, | :10:59. | :11:04. | |
and for the need to carry on, and I thought what was really remarkable | :11:05. | :11:08. | |
was the degree of unanimity. How many times did she apologise? I | :11:09. | :11:14. | |
don't think... I can't honestly remember, but as Oliver said, that | :11:15. | :11:19. | |
is not really the issue. But did she apologise? I am just interested. She | :11:20. | :11:24. | |
apologise to colleagues who lost their seats, she was humble about | :11:25. | :11:28. | |
that. But as Oliver says, there was a remarkable degree of unanimity | :11:29. | :11:33. | |
around the room, as do supporting her. Sure. Issue going to apologise | :11:34. | :11:39. | |
to voters for calling an election that she did not need to that has | :11:40. | :11:45. | |
cost ?130 million? Well, she felt that she needed her own mandate to | :11:46. | :11:49. | |
negotiate these Brexit talks. That was a view at the time. With | :11:50. | :11:54. | |
hindsight, she might have taken a different view. But we are where we | :11:55. | :11:58. | |
are, and we have to go on governing the country with the Parliamentary | :11:59. | :12:03. | |
arithmetic that we have. Oliver Letwin, your Conservative colleague | :12:04. | :12:05. | |
Heidi Elin said she saw a very humble woman in Mrs May. Do you | :12:06. | :12:09. | |
think the rest of the country is going to see her humble side at some | :12:10. | :12:14. | |
point? I would not describe her as humble, as you said, she apologised, | :12:15. | :12:23. | |
she let us in on the feelings that she had about what had happened, but | :12:24. | :12:29. | |
I don't think it is a question of humble or otherwise. I think it is a | :12:30. | :12:34. | |
question of her ability at a time when our country faces significant | :12:35. | :12:39. | |
challenges to manage the economy soundly and come of all of this in a | :12:40. | :12:43. | |
good condition. That is what matters to our fellow citizens, not the | :12:44. | :12:48. | |
political bits and bobs, what happens to the country. I think what | :12:49. | :12:52. | |
cheap is weighed and all of us of is that she is capable of doing that, | :12:53. | :12:56. | |
and that is where we need to be. -- I think what she persuaded all of us | :12:57. | :13:04. | |
of. So she has two years to see through the negotiations, then she | :13:05. | :13:08. | |
hands over to whoever head of the next general election? It depends on | :13:09. | :13:11. | |
a number of factors, how the relationship with the DUP works out, | :13:12. | :13:15. | |
and I think it depends on the Conservative Party itself. If the | :13:16. | :13:18. | |
Conservative Party itself starts going to war with one another, then | :13:19. | :13:22. | |
the period will be shorter rather than longer. But what you can say is | :13:23. | :13:25. | |
that she's not going to fight the next general election as leader of | :13:26. | :13:30. | |
the Conservative Party? Well, we don't know that yet. I think it is | :13:31. | :13:35. | |
far too soon to say that. You think she could? With that majority? She | :13:36. | :13:41. | |
could, it depends how the thing works out. If the Brexit negotiation | :13:42. | :13:45. | |
went incredibly well and she was crowned as having done an incredibly | :13:46. | :13:49. | |
good deal, I think you might find that the holes and tuition would | :13:50. | :13:55. | |
change. I entirely agree about that, Victoria, you will recognise the | :13:56. | :14:00. | |
slogan that a week is a long time in politics. Two years, 104 weeks, is a | :14:01. | :14:06. | |
very long time in politics, and none of us have the slightest idea what | :14:07. | :14:09. | |
will happen. The important thing is to focus on those years, getting to | :14:10. | :14:13. | |
a successful conclusion on Brexit, and then the whole nation will be in | :14:14. | :14:18. | |
a different position. Do you agree with your colleague that she could | :14:19. | :14:22. | |
be in charge for less than two years, depending on what happens? | :14:23. | :14:26. | |
Prime Ministers are in charge on the basis of delivering for the country, | :14:27. | :14:30. | |
I am confident she will deliver, and I'm confident she will be in charge | :14:31. | :14:34. | |
throughout that period, and I think it is altogether likely she will | :14:35. | :14:38. | |
fight the next election as well. But we take that step-by-step, we have | :14:39. | :14:43. | |
to lock in the DUP, deliver on Brexit and the economy, regain the | :14:44. | :14:48. | |
confidence of electors, many of whom voted for us, many of whom did not, | :14:49. | :14:54. | |
and that is what politics is about. Lord Turnbull, formerly a top civil | :14:55. | :14:58. | |
servant and three Prime Ministers, you have called for Theresa May to | :14:59. | :15:04. | |
stand aside - that would not help Britain's Brexit negotiations. Well, | :15:05. | :15:08. | |
I don't think this coalition can last five years. You haven't even | :15:09. | :15:14. | |
given it a day! I did not say how soon, there is a difference between | :15:15. | :15:17. | |
when she goes and makes it clear that she is going to go, the Ed | :15:18. | :15:22. | |
Miliband time table - I think we will find that this coalition needs | :15:23. | :15:28. | |
to be settled in, get past the Queen's Speech to demonstrate that | :15:29. | :15:32. | |
it can win votes, and then people will look at what it can achieve. | :15:33. | :15:39. | |
Its problem is that it will be, apart from the Brexit negotiators, a | :15:40. | :15:42. | |
near do nothing parliament. It has no strength to take any of the | :15:43. | :15:47. | |
measures that it wants to take, and that will be incredibly frustrating. | :15:48. | :15:50. | |
I don't think she can be the person who fights the next election. The | :15:51. | :15:57. | |
precedents, we have had three elections which were inconclusive, | :15:58. | :16:04. | |
1951, 1964 and 1974, and then another election shortly thereafter. | :16:05. | :16:07. | |
In each case, the election thereafter was won by the side that | :16:08. | :16:10. | |
had the momentum. Although Labour didn't get more | :16:11. | :16:18. | |
seats they definitely had the momentum. So that's the danger. Do | :16:19. | :16:24. | |
the Conservatives want to fight that election with someone who was a very | :16:25. | :16:29. | |
poor cam pamer and handled it so badly or do they want someone new? | :16:30. | :16:34. | |
If they want someone new they have got to get that person in, in time | :16:35. | :16:39. | |
for them to settle in, establish some record and when you start | :16:40. | :16:46. | |
working you find this change needs to be made before two years. There | :16:47. | :16:53. | |
is another precedent here which is in 2010 when as you know I was arbli | :16:54. | :16:59. | |
involved in negotiating an agreement with the Liberal Democrats, but lots | :17:00. | :17:03. | |
of other people told me and people reported in the press that this | :17:04. | :17:06. | |
couldn't possibly last. It lasted the whole course of the Parliament. | :17:07. | :17:09. | |
That Government achieved a great deal and David Cameron went on to | :17:10. | :17:13. | |
win a general election with an outright majority thereafter. So | :17:14. | :17:16. | |
there are conflicting precedents here and actually, I don't think | :17:17. | :17:21. | |
that the Conservative Party or those who are commenting on these matters | :17:22. | :17:25. | |
should be focussing on the question of election victory or otherwise in | :17:26. | :17:32. | |
2022. This nation faces an obsolutely critical juncture in its | :17:33. | :17:35. | |
whole history and who we should be focussing on is getting through that | :17:36. | :17:38. | |
and doing the next two years successfully for all of us and that, | :17:39. | :17:43. | |
I think, that came out of the meeting of the 1922 the Conservative | :17:44. | :17:47. | |
Party in Parliament, wherever else, is focussed on delivering a good | :17:48. | :17:51. | |
Brexit outcome and a sound economy as the background to that in the | :17:52. | :17:54. | |
nation's interests and that's what we should be doing. What you're | :17:55. | :18:00. | |
papering over Oliver is the massive division in view within the | :18:01. | :18:03. | |
Conservative Party. This is where the biggest fault line of politics | :18:04. | :18:11. | |
is. Do they want a hard Brexit which prioritises control over the | :18:12. | :18:16. | |
movement of people or do they want a Brexit which prioritises trade? | :18:17. | :18:19. | |
Until you've settled that, I don't see how you can get to a successful | :18:20. | :18:26. | |
budget negotiation. Whilst you're here briefly, voters have been | :18:27. | :18:29. | |
drawing up on our programme today a code of conduct for MPs as MPs go | :18:30. | :18:32. | |
back to Westminster after the election. The voters have suggested | :18:33. | :18:37. | |
these five points on how they'd like MPs to behave. Number one, | :18:38. | :18:43. | |
integrity, number two, empathy, number three, clarity and directness | :18:44. | :18:46. | |
and four humility, number five passion. Is there any you would | :18:47. | :18:51. | |
disagree. You raised your eyebrows at passion, Jeffrey Clifton-Brown? A | :18:52. | :18:55. | |
politician always has got to have passion and the two really important | :18:56. | :19:01. | |
things is next week we start the complicated Brexit negotiations. The | :19:02. | :19:04. | |
most important event of this country since the Second World War and the | :19:05. | :19:07. | |
Conservative Party will unite around Theresa May because the alternative | :19:08. | :19:12. | |
of Jeremy Corbyn is much worse to every Conservative member of | :19:13. | :19:14. | |
Parliament and that's why they'll unite. Thank you all. Thank you very | :19:15. | :19:18. | |
much. Thank you for coming on the programme. | :19:19. | :19:32. | |
Joims Brokenshire says he's confident a deal between the | :19:33. | :19:35. | |
Conservatives and the DUP will be reached today. He has been speaking | :19:36. | :19:39. | |
to the BBC in the past half an hour. I'm sure that will be a matter of | :19:40. | :19:45. | |
discussion for them and I'm sure we will have more details during the | :19:46. | :19:48. | |
course of the day, but the thing to stress is that the work that I do as | :19:49. | :19:51. | |
Secretary of State for Northern Ireland is separate. That we are | :19:52. | :19:55. | |
very clear on the work that I was doing yesterday afternoon and | :19:56. | :19:59. | |
evening around the devolution settlements and ensuring that we get | :20:00. | :20:03. | |
devolved Government back and that is something that as a Government we | :20:04. | :20:07. | |
hold fast to on ensuring that our duties to serve Northern Ireland | :20:08. | :20:12. | |
well, to adhere to our responsibilities under the Belfast | :20:13. | :20:15. | |
Agreement, absolutely is at the core of what we are as a Government, and | :20:16. | :20:19. | |
will certainly guide our actions into the future. | :20:20. | :20:22. | |
INAUDIBLE Well,ual' confident. I think the | :20:23. | :20:26. | |
discussions thus far have been positive, but the leader of the DUP | :20:27. | :20:29. | |
is seeing the Prime Minister later today for further discussions around | :20:30. | :20:33. | |
the agreement. We want to see conclusions so that we can get on | :20:34. | :20:37. | |
with acting in the best interests of our country and actually getting on | :20:38. | :20:40. | |
with the job. James Brokenshire. | :20:41. | :20:45. | |
The sister and husband of Jo Cox will be | :20:46. | :20:52. | |
joining us to reflect on her life and legacy almost a year | :20:53. | :20:54. | |
Theresa May has failed to protect survivors | :20:55. | :21:06. | |
of historical child sex abuse, that's according to another group | :21:07. | :21:08. | |
which this morning is exclusively announcing on this programme that | :21:09. | :21:11. | |
it's quitting the Government's independent inquiry. | :21:12. | :21:18. | |
The independent inquiry into child sexual abuse | :21:19. | :21:23. | |
in England and Wales was set-up by Theresa May during her | :21:24. | :21:25. | |
It aimed to investigate claims of sexual abuse | :21:26. | :21:28. | |
against local authorities, religious organisations, | :21:29. | :21:29. | |
the Armed Forces and public and private institutions | :21:30. | :21:31. | |
and to "expose failures and learn the lessons" from the past. | :21:32. | :21:36. | |
But it has been dogged by controversy | :21:37. | :21:38. | |
with many key victims groups quitting saying they've lost faith | :21:39. | :21:40. | |
in it and accusing the inquiry of not being truly independent. | :21:41. | :21:44. | |
Now, another group which represents more than 100 survivors, | :21:45. | :21:47. | |
has told this programme that they share the same concerns. | :21:48. | :21:51. | |
Let's talk now to Phil Frampton from the Survivors of Organised | :21:52. | :21:54. | |
and Institutional Abuse, part of the White Flowers Campaign. | :21:55. | :21:58. | |
They have withdrawn from the inquiry. Thank you for talking to | :21:59. | :22:05. | |
us. Good morning, Victoria. Tell us why you're withdrawing? For three | :22:06. | :22:11. | |
years, White Flowers and thousands of survivors have fought for justice | :22:12. | :22:18. | |
on this inquiry and we just don't believe anymore that it's aim is to | :22:19. | :22:22. | |
deliver justice. It's aim is to be investigative, it looks more like a | :22:23. | :22:27. | |
report writing exercise now, but when it was set-up, we stood by this | :22:28. | :22:32. | |
inquiry for three years. We've been critical, but we pointed out at the | :22:33. | :22:36. | |
beginning that it was riddled with conflicts of interest and when | :22:37. | :22:39. | |
you've got conflicts of interest and you're looking at one of the darkest | :22:40. | :22:44. | |
episodes in British history then, people with conflicts of interest | :22:45. | :22:49. | |
will never shine the torch into the dark corners because they're too | :22:50. | :22:51. | |
frightened that they will find themselves or their friends there | :22:52. | :22:55. | |
and that's really what we found. First of all, the Home Office were | :22:56. | :23:01. | |
put in charge. Prior to 1970, the Home Office had responsibility for | :23:02. | :23:05. | |
all of London's children's homes plus the hundreds of children's | :23:06. | :23:09. | |
homes, approved schools and so forth across the country and yet initially | :23:10. | :23:15. | |
they were actually kept out of the abuse before 1970, was kept out. The | :23:16. | :23:18. | |
Home Office is also responsible for the police. It's one of the failing | :23:19. | :23:24. | |
institutions in relation to child abuse so far as many survivors are | :23:25. | :23:27. | |
concerned yet they are at the heart of the inquiry. Their secondments | :23:28. | :23:35. | |
are running the inquiry now. It beggars belief and at the same time, | :23:36. | :23:40. | |
they have put as the Shirley Oaks survivors pointed out, they put an | :23:41. | :23:47. | |
executive social worker in charge of the inquiry, they may have good | :23:48. | :23:50. | |
interests, but also conflicts of interests there in the sense that | :23:51. | :23:53. | |
they are the people who again, many of those social workers, who | :23:54. | :23:57. | |
survivors believe failed them. So you simply don't trust it hence your | :23:58. | :24:03. | |
withdrawal but then how do you find out, how do you get to the bottom of | :24:04. | :24:09. | |
alleged historical abuse in all these institutions? This inquiry is | :24:10. | :24:13. | |
not to get to the bottom of that alleged abuse. That's the issue. We | :24:14. | :24:19. | |
don't feel it's, that its job. It's almost like a paper exercise now, | :24:20. | :24:22. | |
studying reports. So what do you want then? Well, what we want is a | :24:23. | :24:28. | |
truly investigative inquiry. What we needed was a truly investigative | :24:29. | :24:32. | |
inquiry. So are you saying scrap this and start again? No, it can be, | :24:33. | :24:37. | |
it's up to the inquiry to decide, but there are other ways of doing it | :24:38. | :24:42. | |
rather than using this inquiry. This inquiry, many survivors still have | :24:43. | :24:49. | |
some hope in and I, you know, I feel for them really, but it's a question | :24:50. | :24:53. | |
of the inquiry could change itself overnight, if Theresa May wanted, | :24:54. | :24:57. | |
but sadly, I think Theresa May's shown she is more interested in her | :24:58. | :25:01. | |
own personal appearance than she is in how in substance, in real | :25:02. | :25:06. | |
substance. Theresa May said this inquiry would have, that survivors | :25:07. | :25:09. | |
would be at the heart of this inquiry and the truth is survivors | :25:10. | :25:13. | |
are on the very margins of this inquiry. Our representatives went to | :25:14. | :25:19. | |
a seminar, an official seminar of the inquiry and we're told to sit at | :25:20. | :25:24. | |
the back and to keep quiet and handed post-it notes and told if we | :25:25. | :25:27. | |
want to ask a question then we should write them on there and let | :25:28. | :25:31. | |
Professor Jay answer if she has got time. How is that survivors being at | :25:32. | :25:32. | |
the heart of an inquiry? We obviously asked the independent | :25:33. | :25:36. | |
inquiry into child sexual abuse They said no, but in a statement | :25:37. | :25:39. | |
told us, "Whilst we regret the decision by Survivors | :25:40. | :25:45. | |
of Organised Institutional Abuse to withdraw from the inquiry, | :25:46. | :25:47. | |
we acknowledge their decision and would like to reassure | :25:48. | :25:49. | |
all victims and survivors that the important work | :25:50. | :25:51. | |
of the inquiry including the accountability and reparations | :25:52. | :25:56. | |
investigation that SOIA The inquiry would welcome them back | :25:57. | :25:58. | |
should they decide they wish Can I just say a lot of survivors, | :25:59. | :26:15. | |
thousands of survivors have put huge emotional capital into this inquiry | :26:16. | :26:23. | |
over the last three years. The core participants may have to wait three | :26:24. | :26:27. | |
or four years time. Not being able to move on unless they can get | :26:28. | :26:30. | |
support from the inquiry, but the inquiry has said this they will not | :26:31. | :26:37. | |
give that support until those cases go to, are considered and therefore, | :26:38. | :26:42. | |
it could be four years more. Survivors are dropping out of the | :26:43. | :26:47. | |
inquiry at the moment because they can't afford to leave their lives | :26:48. | :26:51. | |
and their emotions on hold. That, for me, is callous and cruel. It's | :26:52. | :26:56. | |
callous, cruel and incompetent if you're running a serious inquiry | :26:57. | :27:01. | |
over such psychological issues. OK, thank you very much, Phil. Thank | :27:02. | :27:05. | |
you, Phil Frampton from the survivors of organised and | :27:06. | :27:06. | |
institutional abuse. The sister | :27:07. | :27:10. | |
and husband of Jo Cox will be joining us to reflect on her life | :27:11. | :27:15. | |
and legacy almost a year With the news, here's Joanna | :27:16. | :27:23. | |
in the BBC Newsroom. Theresa May is meeting with the DUP | :27:24. | :27:35. | |
leader, Arlene Foster, today to thrash out a deal that | :27:36. | :27:37. | |
would see the party prop up With Brexit talks due to begin | :27:38. | :27:40. | |
in less than a week, the EU's chief negotiator, | :27:41. | :27:44. | |
Michel Barnier, has said Britain He's also urged the Government | :27:45. | :27:46. | |
to appoint a negotiating team that is stable, | :27:47. | :27:50. | |
accountable and with a mandate. Inflation unexpectedly jumped | :27:51. | :27:52. | |
to its highest level Consumer prices increased by 2.9% | :27:53. | :27:54. | |
compared with a year earlier, it is the biggest increase since | :27:55. | :28:06. | |
June 2013,according to the Office It said one of the main reasons | :28:07. | :28:08. | |
for the rise was the cost of foreign package holidays | :28:09. | :28:16. | |
for British tourists. The European Court of Human Rights | :28:17. | :28:24. | |
will rule on whether doctors treating Charlie Gard can turn off | :28:25. | :28:28. | |
his life support. Last week the UK's Supreme Court agreed with specialist | :28:29. | :28:31. | |
doctors that he should receive palliative care instead. | :28:32. | :28:35. | |
A woman has been charged with murder, after a man was hit | :28:36. | :28:37. | |
Emergency crews were called to Victoria Station on Sunday | :28:38. | :28:41. | |
evening, but were unable to save him. | :28:42. | :28:44. | |
Charrissa Loren Brown-Wellington, who is 31, will appear | :28:45. | :28:48. | |
That's a summary of the latest news, join me for BBC | :28:49. | :28:52. | |
Highlanders have snatched a win over the British and Irish Lions | :28:53. | :29:03. | |
The Lions gave away a penalty with just six | :29:04. | :29:07. | |
minutes left on the clock and that was enough to put | :29:08. | :29:09. | |
the South Island side just one point ahead, | :29:10. | :29:12. | |
a lead they held onto until the final whistle. | :29:13. | :29:19. | |
A senior coach working with the country's Olympic bobsleigh | :29:20. | :29:22. | |
squad has been accused of racism amid multiple complaints of a "toxic | :29:23. | :29:25. | |
England's footballers play France in a friendly in Paris tonight. | :29:26. | :29:31. | |
French fans are expected to join in with God Save The Queen | :29:32. | :29:33. | |
as a mark of respect following the terror attacks. | :29:34. | :29:36. | |
Prime Minister Theresa May and President Emmanuel | :29:37. | :29:37. | |
Britain's six-time Paralympic champion David Weir will compete | :29:38. | :29:45. | |
in a track event for the final time in next month's | :29:46. | :29:48. | |
He won the London Marathon for the seventh time in April. | :29:49. | :29:54. | |
That's all the sport. Back to you Victoria. Thank you very much. | :29:55. | :30:01. | |
Friday marks the first anniversary of the death of Labour MP Jo Cox, | :30:02. | :30:04. | |
who was killed in Birstall, outside her constituency surgery. | :30:05. | :30:06. | |
Her senseless killing sent shockwaves | :30:07. | :30:07. | |
around the world but united the country in grief. | :30:08. | :30:10. | |
A year on, and her family are determined to continue her legacy. | :30:11. | :30:14. | |
This weekend, on the first anniversary of her death, | :30:15. | :30:16. | |
they're encouraging people to join together with neighbours, | :30:17. | :30:19. | |
friends and their local community at events in her memory. | :30:20. | :30:24. | |
In a moment, we'll speak to Jo's husband Brendan | :30:25. | :30:26. | |
and her sister, Kim Leadbeater, but first let's hear Jo's parents | :30:27. | :30:29. | |
remembering the moment they learnt she'd died. | :30:30. | :30:44. | |
We'd just sat down about five minutes, | :30:45. | :30:45. | |
And he just said, Jo's been shot, I think. | :30:46. | :30:51. | |
And we jumped in the car, I remember I was jumping in the car, | :30:52. | :30:59. | |
I don't know how we managed to get there. | :31:00. | :31:06. | |
People are shot and recover, et cetera, et cetera. | :31:07. | :31:23. | |
So we didn't know at that time. I think we knew. | :31:24. | :31:27. | |
I think I did. I didn't know. | :31:28. | :31:30. | |
But you see these things on the television where the doctor, | :31:31. | :31:34. | |
in this case it was a police inspector, | :31:35. | :31:36. | |
comes into the room and he has to tell you. | :31:37. | :31:38. | |
In fact, he doesn't have to tell you. | :31:39. | :31:41. | |
You can see by his expression. | :31:42. | :31:44. | |
And he said, "I'm sorry to say she didn't make it." | :31:45. | :31:55. | |
because there's a piece missing. | :31:56. | :31:59. | |
The low times for us are when we turn the television | :32:00. | :32:02. | |
on and see terrorist acts - Westminster Bridge, Manchester - | :32:03. | :32:04. | |
because that's when it brings everything back. | :32:05. | :32:07. | |
For me, the ambulances, the sirens, | :32:08. | :32:08. | |
But we also think about the people who have lost loved ones, | :32:09. | :32:20. | |
and we know what they are actually just going through. | :32:21. | :32:25. | |
And unfortunately they don't, as yet. | :32:26. | :32:35. | |
Going forward, build on the children, the grandchildren. | :32:36. | :32:38. | |
Because you're right, it won't go away. | :32:39. | :32:46. | |
# Looking back, I could have played differently... # | :32:47. | :33:15. | |
More than one person came up to me after the funeral, | :33:16. | :33:19. | |
and after Kim talked in Birstall marketplace, | :33:20. | :33:22. | |
and said, "You've got not one but two marvellous daughters." | :33:23. | :33:26. | |
on the television et cetera, making speeches." | :33:27. | :33:35. | |
because I can't separate the two and never would. | :33:36. | :33:54. | |
Talking to us now are Kim Ledbeater and Brendan Cox, Jo's husband. | :33:55. | :34:00. | |
Kim, Jo's sister. Hello. Hi. How are you? I found it very hard to watch | :34:01. | :34:13. | |
that film. Kim, how are you? OK, I think we are tired, extremely busy, | :34:14. | :34:16. | |
but we at to demand that we will get through the next couple of weeks, as | :34:17. | :34:22. | |
Jo would want us two. Not to say it will not be very difficult at times, | :34:23. | :34:27. | |
but we will get there. You talk in the book, Brendan, you talk about | :34:28. | :34:34. | |
the Jo that you knew. I want you both to tell our audience what she | :34:35. | :34:39. | |
was like, because they will not know that much about. Yeah, you can see | :34:40. | :34:46. | |
it in some of that footage, huge energy and enthusiasm, zest for | :34:47. | :34:49. | |
life. She threw herself everything from campaigning to being a mum, to | :34:50. | :34:57. | |
being part of our community, and she just, yeah, as well as that energy, | :34:58. | :35:02. | |
she had an empathy, I know it is on the board! But I talked about it | :35:03. | :35:06. | |
before, and just that sends of ability to feel how people are | :35:07. | :35:11. | |
feeling and empathise with people, whether you were an older person who | :35:12. | :35:16. | |
hadn't seen anybody for a week, who lived in her constituency, or a | :35:17. | :35:20. | |
family from Syria fleeing the conflict there, that supreme ability | :35:21. | :35:25. | |
to empathise and that energy which, for me, which summarises her. Jo was | :35:26. | :35:30. | |
an extremely positive person, she had values that, you know, we can | :35:31. | :35:38. | |
probably all learn from, but if you see my parents speaking, we are glad | :35:39. | :35:41. | |
to have full people. We are not going to be beaten, we always trying | :35:42. | :35:45. | |
to find the positive and good in things. Jo saw the good in | :35:46. | :35:49. | |
everything and everyone, and you will struggle to find anyone who did | :35:50. | :35:54. | |
not like it. You might disagree and debate, fine, but I don't think I've | :35:55. | :35:57. | |
ever met anybody who didn't like. And she was also very annoying! She | :35:58. | :36:05. | |
was not perfect! Everyone is a bit annoying at some point. She was late | :36:06. | :36:10. | |
for everything, forget everybody's birthdays! Unbelievably forgetful. | :36:11. | :36:17. | |
When Jo and I were getting engaged, one of the stories I tell in the | :36:18. | :36:22. | |
book, we went on a cycling holiday, and she forgot her bike. A cycling | :36:23. | :36:27. | |
holiday, how do you forget your bike?! So incredibly annoying, but | :36:28. | :36:32. | |
looking back now, those things are, you know, what made her her. She | :36:33. | :36:37. | |
wasn't a saint, she wasn't perfect, but she was somebody, as we have | :36:38. | :36:41. | |
said, that had this positivity, empathy, a zest for life. Even when | :36:42. | :36:47. | |
she was forgetting her bike, that shone through. Let me read you a | :36:48. | :36:52. | |
couple of messages, so many of these, these are representative of | :36:53. | :36:56. | |
all of them. Kim says, my heartfelt love to Brendan, Kim and all Jo's | :36:57. | :37:02. | |
family, such a heartbreaking loss, what a beautiful legacy Jo left, her | :37:03. | :37:06. | |
passing is not in vain, I have ordered your book, big love to you | :37:07. | :37:11. | |
all. Sophia says, Jo Cox was an inspiration in life and in death, | :37:12. | :37:15. | |
thank you, Jo, despite the dark, horrid early days, your mission | :37:16. | :37:23. | |
lives on, thank you for giving us hope. I don't know if you take | :37:24. | :37:27. | |
comfort in kind words from strangers, do you? Absolutely, it is | :37:28. | :37:30. | |
one of the things that has got us through. For me and mum and dad, the | :37:31. | :37:36. | |
support that has been shown, not just from people we know, but total | :37:37. | :37:40. | |
strangers across the country and across the world, because even if | :37:41. | :37:45. | |
you didn't know Jo, you could see what she stood for, so you might not | :37:46. | :37:49. | |
miss on a personal level in the way we do, but you will see what a loss | :37:50. | :37:56. | |
it is, someone who had those values, so that support has been, yeah, | :37:57. | :38:02. | |
phenomenal. And for often when you go through a loss, you feel very | :38:03. | :38:10. | |
isolated, because everyone else's lives take on as normal. And with | :38:11. | :38:16. | |
this, they could see that other people were feeling the pain that | :38:17. | :38:19. | |
they were feeling, not the same size or scale intensity, but I remember, | :38:20. | :38:29. | |
on the way to the funeral, in the car, Cuillin turned to me, thousands | :38:30. | :38:35. | |
of people and, throwing flowers, and Cuillin said I know that people love | :38:36. | :38:38. | |
money, but I didn't know this many people did. -- loved Mummy. So that | :38:39. | :38:46. | |
compassion, and it is more important, because you can imagine, | :38:47. | :38:51. | |
if this happens at such a formative stage of your life, your view of | :38:52. | :38:56. | |
life and our country could end up being very dark, but they don't have | :38:57. | :39:00. | |
that at all, because of that compassion and kindness, they are | :39:01. | :39:04. | |
only inform six, but they have a very optimistic and enthusiastic | :39:05. | :39:07. | |
view of life. That is testament to you, isn't it? Brendan has been | :39:08. | :39:16. | |
amazing, his priority has been the children since then, the way that | :39:17. | :39:20. | |
they are coping, not just coping, thriving, that is down to how he has | :39:21. | :39:26. | |
done his job. Not just me, Jo and I often talked about how the first | :39:27. | :39:29. | |
three years were critical for kids in terms of the way their brains | :39:30. | :39:32. | |
develop, the way they get their sense of cells, so they have a hell | :39:33. | :39:36. | |
of a lot of Jo in them, and the thing that has got me through is the | :39:37. | :39:41. | |
family, incredibly close family, both on Jo's side and the mine, and | :39:42. | :39:47. | |
then the community. And that is, for us, such a big part of Jo's | :39:48. | :39:53. | |
politics, she wasn't an ideological politician who got her politics from | :39:54. | :39:57. | |
textbooks. She got her politics particularly from her home life in | :39:58. | :40:01. | |
Batley, from her grandad, who was a postman in Batley, and the sense | :40:02. | :40:05. | |
that she got from him of how important it was to know your | :40:06. | :40:09. | |
neighbours, and how much she valued that. So that became a big part of | :40:10. | :40:15. | |
her life and her politics, but now, this morning, I had to get up early | :40:16. | :40:19. | |
to do an interview, and very kindly the neighbours through the tips... | :40:20. | :40:27. | |
They put them on the boat! They are as happy as Larry, and that is | :40:28. | :40:33. | |
hugely valuable. You both mentioned community, but there is the global | :40:34. | :40:37. | |
community, you have had contact from people all over the world, including | :40:38. | :40:44. | |
President Obama. Yeah! And Gordon Brown, who she used to work for, | :40:45. | :40:48. | |
saying, is it all right if President Obama gives you a call? I was | :40:49. | :40:55. | |
speaking to Gordon, and he said, yeah, is it OK if he gets in touch, | :40:56. | :40:58. | |
and I thought he might send a card or something, which I thought was | :40:59. | :41:03. | |
incredible. And my phone rang and it was the weirdest, like out of a bad | :41:04. | :41:09. | |
American film, when they say, can we transfer you to Air Force One? | :41:10. | :41:13. | |
Really? I thought it was maybe taking the make. But it would have | :41:14. | :41:18. | |
been a strange time to do it. He invited us to go over and see him, | :41:19. | :41:23. | |
which was an incredible experience, and amazing for the kids, even | :41:24. | :41:26. | |
though they were then three and five. They got a hell of a lot from | :41:27. | :41:35. | |
it, and Cuillin is obsessed with history, I'd tell you about the | :41:36. | :41:38. | |
Second World War, which I don't know and have about! I had been telling | :41:39. | :41:42. | |
him about the history of America, what little I know about it, and the | :41:43. | :41:46. | |
first thing he said when he got into the room was, I thought the British | :41:47. | :41:50. | |
burned the White House down, the most embarrassing thing you could | :41:51. | :41:53. | |
possibly say! The president said it was much better now that they had | :41:54. | :42:00. | |
rebuilt it. So he was thankful! Tim, you can't bring Jo back, what can | :42:01. | :42:05. | |
you do? I think, for me, accepting that we cannot change what has | :42:06. | :42:11. | |
happened. Whilst it is buried, that is the only way to move forward so | :42:12. | :42:16. | |
three things I want to do. That whilst it is very difficult. I want | :42:17. | :42:20. | |
to scoop the kids up in love, make sure they know how amazing the mum | :42:21. | :42:25. | |
was, how much she loved them, that is the top priority. Second thing | :42:26. | :42:29. | |
is, remember how lucky we were to have Jo, and I was so lucky, we were | :42:30. | :42:39. | |
friends first and foremost, and we will always have those memories. The | :42:40. | :42:42. | |
third thing is to create some kind of legacy, which Brendan is doing | :42:43. | :42:49. | |
amazingly, and I would like to be part of that. I don't now how that | :42:50. | :42:54. | |
would work in the future, but what resonates with me is that Jo should | :42:55. | :42:59. | |
have been alive for at least another 40 years, and the work she would | :43:00. | :43:03. | |
have done in that 40 years, what you would have achieved to do things, | :43:04. | :43:10. | |
and I feel a bit of a moral duty to do something positive and help | :43:11. | :43:15. | |
people, like Jo would have done. Thank you both very much, thank you | :43:16. | :43:18. | |
for talking to us. The book is out today, it is called Jo Cox: More In | :43:19. | :43:26. | |
Common. All the profits are going to the foundation which is taking | :43:27. | :43:30. | |
forward her work. This weekend is the Great Get Together, which we | :43:31. | :43:33. | |
have been putting together for what feels like a long time now excited | :43:34. | :43:37. | |
is a simple idea, asking people to get together with their neighbours, | :43:38. | :43:41. | |
share food, celebrate all the things we have in common. Jo talked about | :43:42. | :43:45. | |
that a lot, the killing was designed to divide us, and we think the best | :43:46. | :43:49. | |
possible response is a weekend to bring the country back together | :43:50. | :43:53. | |
again, which we do need. And you have got your address at the ready! | :43:54. | :43:57. | |
Get together and have a good weekend. Thank you both, thank you. | :43:58. | :44:01. | |
A court ruling is due this month in Northern Ireland | :44:02. | :44:03. | |
over the strict abortion laws there. | :44:04. | :44:05. | |
Campaigners say the result has been made all the more significant | :44:06. | :44:07. | |
Unlike the rest of the UK, abortion is illegal | :44:08. | :44:11. | |
in almost all circumstances in Northern Ireland. | :44:12. | :44:14. | |
Campaigners hope the ruling will be a step towards changing the law | :44:15. | :44:17. | |
in cases of rape, incest or fatal foetal abnormality. | :44:18. | :44:24. | |
Hi. I'm Sarah. Nice to meet you. Come on in. Thank you. This is my | :44:25. | :44:50. | |
mum, Jane. Hi Jane. Nice to meet you. It was just a few weeks after | :44:51. | :44:58. | |
Sarah Yeates' wedding that she found out she was pregnant. It was all | :44:59. | :45:02. | |
planned and she was delighted. Everyone talked about the 3D scan | :45:03. | :45:07. | |
and we wanted to see the baby in 3D. It was private. It wasn't at our | :45:08. | :45:12. | |
hospital. They put the baby on the scroon. Feet, legs, oh you're having | :45:13. | :45:20. | |
a wee girl the when she got to the baby's head, there was nothing from | :45:21. | :45:24. | |
above the baby's eyes basically. There was no skull or brain | :45:25. | :45:30. | |
formation. Sarah's baby had a condition which occurs in six in | :45:31. | :45:33. | |
every 10,000 births. There is no treatment. And babies with it die | :45:34. | :45:38. | |
before they're born or shortly after birth. This is your scan that you | :45:39. | :45:43. | |
got? Yes, the skull wasn't formed. There was nothing above that. It | :45:44. | :45:46. | |
should be round and it's not. So the baby wasn't going to be able to | :45:47. | :45:52. | |
survive as soon as the baby was cut from me, when the umbilical cord was | :45:53. | :45:56. | |
cut that's when the baby would have passed away. When I realised what, | :45:57. | :46:05. | |
the baby wasn't going to survive and how bad the condition was, I thought | :46:06. | :46:10. | |
that I couldn't continue on for nine months and people asking me when you | :46:11. | :46:14. | |
were due, was your nursery set-up? Did you know what you were having? I | :46:15. | :46:19. | |
just did not have the baby at the end of it, I just felt like I | :46:20. | :46:26. | |
couldn't go through with that. We said we wanted a medical termination | :46:27. | :46:30. | |
and that's what it is. And they said sorry, we can't help you and we were | :46:31. | :46:34. | |
absolutely shocked. We were like, what do you mean you can't help? | :46:35. | :46:38. | |
They said, sorry, but with the law here, we can't help you. You would | :46:39. | :46:45. | |
have to go across the water. Unlike the rest of the UK, abortion is | :46:46. | :46:50. | |
illegal here in Northern Ireland in almost all circumstances. That meant | :46:51. | :46:55. | |
that at 21 weeks pregnant Sarah had to travel to London to have her | :46:56. | :46:58. | |
abortion. It is that experience that means she is involved in this court | :46:59. | :47:03. | |
case. Halfs the experience like? Making that journey, going all that | :47:04. | :47:07. | |
way? Awful. I should have been at home with my family round me, my | :47:08. | :47:13. | |
friends supporting me. Sarah started her fight in court with the judicial | :47:14. | :47:19. | |
review two years ago. In 2015, the Northern Ireland Human Rights | :47:20. | :47:22. | |
Commission brought the case to extend the grounds for abortion. The | :47:23. | :47:26. | |
judge in the case ruled that women, who were victims of rape or incest, | :47:27. | :47:34. | |
and in cases of foetal abnormality should be allowed abortions, but the | :47:35. | :47:40. | |
ruling was appealed and campaigners are awaiting for a decision from the | :47:41. | :47:45. | |
Appeal Court. Sarah is being backed by Amnesty International. Well nrm's | :47:46. | :47:51. | |
laws date back to 1861 and unlike in the rest of the UK the 1967 Act | :47:52. | :47:56. | |
doesn't apply in Northern Ireland. So it means that with the exception | :47:57. | :48:01. | |
of where a woman's life and her long-term physical and mental health | :48:02. | :48:05. | |
are at risk, abortion is illegal in every other circumstance. So, our | :48:06. | :48:10. | |
laws force women who have been ramd, they force girls who are victims of | :48:11. | :48:15. | |
incest to travel to access abortion services. Amnesty say the likely | :48:16. | :48:21. | |
Conservative DUP deal makes this case even more important. They say | :48:22. | :48:25. | |
that Northern Ireland's politicians, particularly the DUP, have failed to | :48:26. | :48:29. | |
deliver abortion reform and that's why they have to take the fight to | :48:30. | :48:33. | |
court. What's the result you're looking for from this court case? | :48:34. | :48:37. | |
With this case specifically we want the court to find that our laws, not | :48:38. | :48:45. | |
only breach a woman's right to privacy, but our laws aamount to | :48:46. | :48:50. | |
cruel and degrading treatment and are discriminatory against women in | :48:51. | :48:53. | |
this part of the UK because if Sarah and women in those circumstances | :48:54. | :48:56. | |
lived in another part of the UK, they would have been able to access | :48:57. | :49:01. | |
abortion lawfully, but here, our law treats women like Sarah as a | :49:02. | :49:03. | |
criminal. We shouldn't have been in that | :49:04. | :49:06. | |
situation. We should have been at home with our medicals and in our | :49:07. | :49:10. | |
hospital. Nobody knows when this is going to happen. It could happen | :49:11. | :49:16. | |
again. I have a sister and female cousins, girls, women, constantly | :49:17. | :49:20. | |
contacting us... Abortion is such a sensitive issue here and there are | :49:21. | :49:24. | |
many opponents to Amnesty to Sarah. Those who don't want to see any | :49:25. | :49:28. | |
extension to the circumstances in which abortion is legal. And so have | :49:29. | :49:31. | |
involved themselves in this court case. I'm off to see antiabortion | :49:32. | :49:44. | |
group. They're called Precious Life. They are set-up outside the | :49:45. | :49:48. | |
university here. Hi, nice to meet you. You too. Is this your team? | :49:49. | :50:02. | |
This Lucy is the chair of the Queen's Pro Life Society. She | :50:03. | :50:06. | |
organises the outreach here every week. You get a really good | :50:07. | :50:12. | |
reception. I believe that every life deserves to be protected, you know, | :50:13. | :50:17. | |
both women and children and I don't think you can sort of rank the value | :50:18. | :50:21. | |
of a human life based on anything. If someone has a disability or based | :50:22. | :50:26. | |
on the circumstances of conception I think you have to protect everybody. | :50:27. | :50:29. | |
This case in the court is about women who have been raped. Or have | :50:30. | :50:37. | |
been subject to incest or where the baby will never live outside of | :50:38. | :50:41. | |
pregnancy or will die as soon as it's born. We would argue as a third | :50:42. | :50:46. | |
party intervener in that particular case that every child should be | :50:47. | :50:49. | |
protected in law, policy and practise and that the law here | :50:50. | :50:54. | |
should not be changed. While a child in the womb, that child alive and | :50:55. | :50:58. | |
kicking. That child is a human being and that child deserves to be | :50:59. | :51:02. | |
protected. So you think even if the mother doesn't want to carry it, she | :51:03. | :51:06. | |
should have to? To murder a child in the womb is always wrong and that's | :51:07. | :51:11. | |
what happens through an abortion. They know you're there, that's | :51:12. | :51:20. | |
probably why. So do you have any sympathy with the pro-lifers? | :51:21. | :51:25. | |
They're unbelievably passionate about this and they, through their | :51:26. | :51:29. | |
eyes, that baby, that unborn baby is just the same as you or I? I | :51:30. | :51:34. | |
appreciate that this is an issue that people have strong feelings on, | :51:35. | :51:38. | |
but where I draw the line is when people force that opinion on other | :51:39. | :51:43. | |
women. You know, this is an issue for each individual woman and her | :51:44. | :51:47. | |
doctor. It's no one else's business. It's a private matter. What is it | :51:48. | :51:50. | |
like for you, listening to the stories of the women that come to | :51:51. | :51:56. | |
you? It's enormously difficult. I'm obviously speaking to these women in | :51:57. | :52:00. | |
my Amnesty capacity, but as a woman myself I can't imagine what it's | :52:01. | :52:03. | |
like for these women in these circumstances to be told that your | :52:04. | :52:07. | |
pregnancy isn't viable or to be a victim of rape, to be a child who is | :52:08. | :52:15. | |
a victim of incest, and to be told by doctors here, we can't help you. | :52:16. | :52:18. | |
I mean abortion is not only a healthcare and Human Rights issue, | :52:19. | :52:24. | |
but there is an economic dimension, women who have money will be able to | :52:25. | :52:28. | |
circum haven't the law here because they can travelment women who live | :52:29. | :52:32. | |
in poverty, don't In 2015 the BBC polled the Northern Irish public on | :52:33. | :52:38. | |
this issue. 84% of people asked said abortion should be available in | :52:39. | :52:45. | |
cases of rape. 67% said it should be in cases of abnormality. Precious | :52:46. | :52:51. | |
Life dispute the findings. 84% of people in Northern Ireland said in | :52:52. | :52:54. | |
cases of rape... Has everybody in Northern Ireland been asked? No. | :52:55. | :52:58. | |
When you do polls, you don't ask everyone. While we are looking at | :52:59. | :53:02. | |
the results, a member of the public starts ripping up their leaflets. | :53:03. | :53:06. | |
She is just doing that for attention. I think you're spreading | :53:07. | :53:12. | |
these. It's upsetting my son seeing these images. Do you think that you | :53:13. | :53:16. | |
have the right to do this to other people walking past? Do you think it | :53:17. | :53:20. | |
is a woman's right to make this decision and not you and your | :53:21. | :53:24. | |
(BLEEP) absurd religious ideas? Don't you think a woman has the | :53:25. | :53:28. | |
right to choose? Well, I think you've answered our question and | :53:29. | :53:34. | |
you're in favour of abortion. (BLEEP) God bless that wee child. | :53:35. | :53:38. | |
There is plenty of anger directed at the stall, but some also want to | :53:39. | :53:43. | |
hear their arguments. Circumstances and it is necessary. In what | :53:44. | :53:48. | |
circumstances? If the girl was raped or sexually abused or what do you | :53:49. | :53:52. | |
call it, incest? Is it the child's fault? No, it's not the child's | :53:53. | :53:58. | |
fault... Right, OK. It's not the girl's fault either. Why should we | :53:59. | :54:02. | |
punish the child? I know what you're saying. I haven't thought about it | :54:03. | :54:15. | |
that way. There you gallon. Yeah. Do you usually have people who are more | :54:16. | :54:19. | |
in favour of your message? Well, a variety of different views and view | :54:20. | :54:23. | |
points, but I mean that's basically for your eyes only that set-up | :54:24. | :54:27. | |
there. We don't have the problem at all with... You have different | :54:28. | :54:38. | |
opinions. It is a very emotional issue, isn't it? It's not really. | :54:39. | :54:42. | |
It's quite black and white. What I'm saying, it's wrong. For a lot of | :54:43. | :54:46. | |
people, it's not wrong, you know? You know that might be their opinion | :54:47. | :54:50. | |
in this day and abling, but they're blind to it and it's important that | :54:51. | :54:53. | |
they are informed and that's what we're here to do. How old is he? | :54:54. | :55:03. | |
Two-and-a-half. Sarah now has two children. Jacob and ten week old | :55:04. | :55:12. | |
Aoife. You've got a good play area here. | :55:13. | :55:18. | |
How did what affect your pregnancies with these two? Well, I was, well, | :55:19. | :55:26. | |
we were so nervous of it happening again. We were told if we had one, | :55:27. | :55:29. | |
we would have a higher chance of having another. Have you had any | :55:30. | :55:35. | |
abuse personally? Yes. Not only attacking me for what I'm trying to | :55:36. | :55:39. | |
do, but they have seen pictures on Facebook of my son and then they | :55:40. | :55:43. | |
were starting to say about ugly redheads and all this sort of stuff. | :55:44. | :55:51. | |
It's just ridiculous. It's so awful. What do you want to see from this | :55:52. | :55:59. | |
court case? Well, politicians failed to help us and women like me so | :56:00. | :56:04. | |
we're hoping that we'll get the help through the court. If they ruled in | :56:05. | :56:09. | |
your favour, would that feel like something of a victory like a step, | :56:10. | :56:17. | |
some sort of change? It's bitter sweet. That's the best way of | :56:18. | :56:25. | |
putting it. It would be a relief, but as I say, it would be mixed. | :56:26. | :56:33. | |
Very mixed. Because... Well, as a family, we would have been against | :56:34. | :56:37. | |
termination and abortion because like many people, we're very naive | :56:38. | :56:42. | |
and very ill informed quite frankly and we had never ever thought that a | :56:43. | :56:46. | |
termination would have been needed on medical grounds and one thing | :56:47. | :56:50. | |
we've learnt from this journey is we don't judge anyone until you walk in | :56:51. | :56:54. | |
their shoes because you just don't know how you'd react. Sarah and her | :56:55. | :56:59. | |
mum want abortion to be legal in cases like her's, cases of foetal | :57:00. | :57:09. | |
arnormality. Amnesty is looking for complete discriminalisation. There | :57:10. | :57:14. | |
is any amount of families who there have who have been confronted with | :57:15. | :57:18. | |
the reality of our law. It is illegal in almost every | :57:19. | :57:21. | |
circumstance. Even if you get a victory in this case, it is likely | :57:22. | :57:25. | |
to be challenged again. It's 2017. Our laws date back to 1861. It's | :57:26. | :57:31. | |
unacceptable that our politicians have not grappled with this issue | :57:32. | :57:35. | |
and legislated for change. Change is long overdue and it is coming. | :57:36. | :57:45. | |
We will continue to follow developments in the case on this | :57:46. | :57:49. | |
programme. Thank you for your help compiling | :57:50. | :57:55. | |
the MPs charter. We asked you how you would like them to behave. There | :57:56. | :58:06. | |
is your list. Number one, integrity. Two, empathy, three clarity and | :58:07. | :58:10. | |
directness, four, humility. Five, passion. We're going to send it to | :58:11. | :58:16. | |
all the new MPs over the coming days and weeks. | :58:17. | :58:21. | |
On the programme tomorrow - snooker legend Ronnie O'Sullivan. | :58:22. | :58:25. | |
Thank you for your company today. Have a good day. Bye-bye. | :58:26. | :58:28. |