21/03/2018 Victoria Derbyshire


21/03/2018

Similar Content

Browse content similar to 21/03/2018. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!

Transcript


LineFromTo

Hello.

Welcome to the programme.

0:00:080:00:15

After years of a 1% pay cap, the

government is expected to announce a

0:00:190:00:25

significant pay increase for NHS

staff in England, apart from

0:00:250:00:27

doctors.

Staff have got to be

addressed, vacancies have to be

0:00:270:00:33

addressed. The issue of using agency

staff has to be addressed. In that

0:00:330:00:37

context it is significant that that

pay award has been made.

0:00:370:00:43

We get reaction from NHS workers.

Plus, there has been a huge rise in

0:00:430:00:48

the number of women using donated

eggs to get pregnant.

You get

0:00:480:00:54

married and then your friends have

kids and it's just not happening to

0:00:540:00:57

you. It suddenly becomes the most

important thing in your life, the

0:00:570:01:01

only thing that you can focus on.

And what next for the future of ant

0:01:010:01:07

and tech? We look at what impact Ant

McPartlin's arrest for drink-driving

0:01:070:01:13

will have on the pair? And how lives

are ruined by addiction to

0:01:130:01:18

painkillers.

Hello and welcome to the programme.

0:01:180:01:28

We're live until 11.

0:01:280:01:29

Throughout the morning we'll bring

you the latest breaking news

0:01:290:01:32

and developing stories and -

as always - really

0:01:320:01:34

keen to hear from you.

0:01:340:01:35

A litle later we'll be talking

to some of you who've

0:01:350:01:38

deleted your Facebook account

in protest at the company's data

0:01:380:01:41

and privacy policies.

0:01:410:01:43

If you've done it, do get in touch.

0:01:430:01:44

If you don't want to message us

on Facebook, you can do

0:01:440:01:47

so a number of other ways.

0:01:470:01:49

Use the hashtag Victoria live.

0:01:490:01:50

And if you text, you will be charged

at the standard network rate.

0:01:500:01:56

Our top story today -

the government is poised to announce

0:01:560:01:59

a significant pay rise for almost

all NHS staff

0:01:590:02:01

in England, apart from doctors.

0:02:010:02:02

It's thought that around a million

health workers will receive

0:02:020:02:05

an average increase of 6% over three

years, in a move which could cost

0:02:050:02:08

the Treasury £4 billion.

0:02:080:02:14

We can speak now to Catherine Burn

's, health correspondent. I know we

0:02:140:02:20

don't have all of the details on

this so far, but what details do we

0:02:200:02:23

have?

It seems to be a six to 6.5%

increase over three years. That is

0:02:230:02:31

the headline. The reality will be

quite different. The average is

0:02:310:02:35

going to be spread out. The biggest

increase will ghost -- increases

0:02:350:02:40

will go to the poorest paid people,

porters, catering staff, cleaners.

0:02:400:02:45

They could have an increase of 29%

over three years. It is quite a big

0:02:450:02:50

deal and quite a decisive end to pay

caps. Since 2010, there have been

0:02:500:02:57

pay freezes and pay cap Macs 1%.

This is a big break.

Porters could

0:02:570:03:03

go from £15,000 to £19,000, a huge

jump?

It is. But the Royal College

0:03:030:03:12

of Nursing is say that if you take

in real terms and count in

0:03:120:03:16

inflation, they have essentially had

a pay cut 14%. Even though people

0:03:160:03:20

will welcome this, they will not

necessarily be jumping for joy.

We

0:03:200:03:24

don't know if it will be accepted?

The unions are meeting today at 11.

0:03:240:03:30

We are expecting them to sign off on

this. There will be a lot of

0:03:300:03:33

last-minute haggling. The

interesting thing to look out for

0:03:330:03:38

will be what sort of strings there

are attached to this.

0:03:380:03:44

are attached to this. NHS workers

lost a day's pay over this. Sickness

0:03:450:03:49

levels in the NHS may be one thing.

There has been talk of increments,

0:03:490:03:54

when NHS workers sort of get

on-the-job pay rises. There has been

0:03:540:03:59

talk of the more -- being more

tightly controlled. It will be

0:03:590:04:03

interesting to see what happens.

Thank you. More on that later in the

0:04:030:04:09

programme. If you do work for the

NHS, get in touch. Would you accept

0:04:090:04:12

this, would you support this?

0:04:120:04:15

Joanna Gosling is in the BBC

Newsroom with a summary

0:04:150:04:17

of the rest of the day's news.

0:04:170:04:19

Good morning.

0:04:190:04:21

Facebook will be questioned

by politicians in Washington today,

0:04:210:04:24

as the company comes under growing

pressure to explain how data

0:04:240:04:26

from 50 million accounts was used

by a British company

0:04:260:04:30

during the US presidential election.

0:04:300:04:32

It's alleged that Cambridge

Analytica used the data to target

0:04:320:04:35

voters and influence

the election outcome.

0:04:350:04:38

That company's chief executive,

Alexander Nix, has been suspended.

0:04:380:04:42

Both firms deny any wrongdoing.

0:04:420:04:43

Simon Jones reports.

0:04:430:04:48

Facebook held a crisis

meeting today...

0:04:480:04:51

An international row about Facebook

data making headlines

0:04:510:04:57

in the States and in London,

home to the consultancy,

0:04:570:05:00

Cambridge Analytica.

0:05:000:05:01

That company is accused

of using the personal data

0:05:010:05:03

of 50 million Facebook users to send

highly targeted messages during

0:05:030:05:06

the 2016 US election campaign.

0:05:060:05:11

Secret filming by Channel 4 News

shows Cambridge Analytica's boss,

0:05:110:05:13

Alexander Nix, boasting

about the role it played

0:05:130:05:15

in Donald Trump's victory.

0:05:150:05:22

The company has denied

the Facebook information

0:05:340:05:36

was used for this purpose.

0:05:360:05:39

It said Mr Nix's comments do to not

represent the values of the firm.

0:05:390:05:42

He has been suspended.

0:05:420:05:43

The Cambridge academic

who created the app

0:05:430:05:49

from which the data

was harvested, has

0:05:490:05:51

been banned from Facebook but says

the only thing he did wrong was not

0:05:510:05:55

to ask enough questions.

0:05:550:05:55

My view is that I have been used

as a scapegoat by Facebook

0:05:550:05:59

and Cambridge Analytica.

0:05:590:06:02

We thought we were acting perfectly

appropriately, we thought we were

0:06:020:06:06

doing something really normal.

0:06:060:06:07

Facebook says it did break rules

by donating data to third parties

0:06:070:06:10

and says it has been deceived

by Cambridge Analytica.

0:06:100:06:18

Facebook denies it has done anything

wrong but there is growing pressure

0:06:190:06:24

from politicians in the US and the

UK for its boss, Mark Zuckerberg, to

0:06:240:06:29

break his silence about how his

customers' information is protected.

0:06:290:06:33

The Royal Air Force has confirmed

that a member of its Red Arrows

0:06:330:06:36

aerobatic team has died in a crash

in North Wales.

0:06:360:06:39

The engineer was killed when a Hawk

jet came down near the RAF Valley

0:06:390:06:42

base on Anglesey yesterday.

0:06:420:06:43

The pilot, who is injured

and receiving medical

0:06:430:06:45

care, managed to eject.

0:06:450:06:46

The jet came down shortly after

taking off on a routine flight.

0:06:460:06:49

There are no details

about the cause of the crash.

0:06:490:06:53

The mother of a two-year-old girl

who died after she was pulled

0:06:530:06:56

from a car found in a river,

has said she will feel guilt

0:06:560:06:59

for the rest of her life.

0:06:590:07:01

Kiara Moore was found

in the River Teifi in Cardigan,

0:07:010:07:05

Ceredigion, after she had been left

in the car while it was parked

0:07:050:07:09

on a slipway on Monday.

0:07:090:07:12

Her father said when the driver

returned, the car was missing

0:07:120:07:15

and initially feared stolen.

0:07:150:07:16

But after a large police search

the car was found in the water.

0:07:160:07:24

A man has been injured

after a parcel bomb exploded

0:07:250:07:27

in the Texan city of Austin -

the latest in a series

0:07:270:07:30

of similar attacks.

0:07:300:07:31

Five devices have detonated

so far this month,

0:07:310:07:33

which have killed two people.

0:07:330:07:34

A sixth parcel bomb was intercepted

before it exploded.

0:07:340:07:37

The FBI now believes the attacks

are the work of a serial bomber.

0:07:370:07:42

President Trump is reported to have

ignored warnings from his national

0:07:420:07:45

security advisers not

to congratulate Vladimir Putin

0:07:450:07:46

on his re-election.

0:07:460:07:47

The Washington Post

is reporting that Mr Trump went

0:07:470:07:50

against his advisers,

and was even given a briefing note

0:07:500:07:52

with the words "Do Not Congratulate"

in capital letters.

0:07:520:08:00

The amount of plastic in the ocean

could trouble within a decade unless

0:08:020:08:06

action is taken. A report from the

UK government says plastics is just

0:08:060:08:13

one issue facing the world's sees

along with rising sea levels. It

0:08:130:08:18

says much more knowledge is needed

about the ocean. The government

0:08:180:08:23

could face an additional bill of

£300 million after on the claim

0:08:230:08:28

benefit claims. The main sickness

and that was predicted to cause the

0:08:280:08:36

government £5 million. The National

Audit Office says the true price

0:08:360:08:40

could be more. Ministers say they

are committed to paying everybody by

0:08:400:08:45

April 20 19. Vulnerable mental

health patients are being let down

0:08:450:08:51

because of serious failings in their

treatment, the Parliamentary and

0:08:510:08:54

health service ombudsman has said.

Issues with some mental health trust

0:08:540:08:58

could lead to some patients

suffering harm. It also found mental

0:08:580:09:03

health care staff can like the

skills and training they need to do

0:09:030:09:07

their job properly. The government

is expanding service provision.

0:09:070:09:12

A group of MPs is warning

of government complacency when it

0:09:120:09:15

comes to security co-operation

with the EU after Brexit.

0:09:150:09:17

The all-party Home Affairs Committee

says the transition period,

0:09:170:09:19

which has recently been agreed,

may need to be extended if public

0:09:190:09:22

safety is not to be compromised.

0:09:220:09:23

They say it's down to the complexity

of issues such as data sharing,

0:09:230:09:27

the European Arrest Warrant

and Europol membership.

0:09:270:09:30

Mark Easton reports.

0:09:300:09:32

Membership of the EU means

the UK enjoys access

0:09:320:09:35

to valuable police data bases,

the European Arrest Warrant scheme

0:09:350:09:37

and the services of Europol.

0:09:370:09:40

The government says it is optimistic

about negotiating just as good

0:09:400:09:43

a deal for when we leave,

but after taking evidence

0:09:430:09:48

from people from the National Crime

Agency and other organisations

0:09:480:09:54

which rely on EU security

corporation, an all-party committee

0:09:540:09:57

of MPs says it does not

share that optimism.

0:09:570:09:59

We are worried that a security

treaty will not be signed

0:09:590:10:02

and implemented in time

for when the transition period ends

0:10:020:10:05

and that could leave us

without proper extradition

0:10:050:10:08

arrangements if people flee justice

and flee from crimes,

0:10:080:10:12

but also without access to criminal

data that the police properly need.

0:10:120:10:19

Access to EU-wide data systems

and the resources of Europol depend

0:10:190:10:21

on legal obligations underpinned

by the European Court of Justice.

0:10:210:10:28

The UK has said being outside

the European courts jurisdiction

0:10:280:10:30

is a red line, but the MPs say

the government should not be too

0:10:300:10:34

rigid on such matters if it

wants to get a good deal.

0:10:340:10:37

And they reckon the complex

technical and legal issues mean both

0:10:370:10:40

sides need to be ready to extend

the two-year transition

0:10:400:10:43

before Brexit kicks in.

0:10:430:10:46

Accusing the government

of complacency, the committee warns

0:10:460:10:48

the UK could be sleepwalking

into a security crisis.

0:10:480:10:50

Mark Easton, BBC News.

0:10:500:10:56

Talk about springing a leak -

these pictures are of a water main

0:10:560:10:59

break in University City

near San Diego yesterday.

0:10:590:11:05

Local reports said a contractor hit

a six-inch diameter blow-off valve

0:11:050:11:09

connected to a water main causing

the leak which saw water shoot up

0:11:090:11:16

above the Californian highway.

0:11:160:11:17

The break shut down the road

for roughly 30 minutes,

0:11:170:11:19

while crews worked to shut off

the water.

0:11:190:11:23

It's been a 25-year wait,

but later today the first polar bear

0:11:230:11:25

cub born in the UK for over two

decades will make his public debut.

0:11:250:11:30

Born in December, the bear

is still to be named as keepers

0:11:300:11:33

try to determine its sex.

0:11:330:11:36

The cub has spent the last four

months with it's mum Victoria

0:11:360:11:40

in the maternity den

at the Highland Wildlife

0:11:400:11:41

Park in Scotland.

0:11:410:11:44

That's a summary of the latest BBC

News - more at 9.30.

0:11:440:11:51

Thank you, joiner. Let me bring you

this news that we are getting in

0:11:510:11:56

from Texas. Reports saying that the

suspect in a series of bombings in

0:11:560:12:01

the state capital of Austin has

died. You can see pictures coming in

0:12:010:12:06

from Austin. Those are live

pictures. We understand a local

0:12:060:12:10

television station is saying the

suspect detonated a device while

0:12:100:12:14

being pursued by police, and was

killed. Earlier the FBI said it

0:12:140:12:20

believed six separate attacks in

Texas were the result of a serial

0:12:200:12:23

bomber. A man being pursued by

police as being killed. We will keep

0:12:230:12:29

you with any news.

0:12:290:12:36

This morning - is there enough

help for people addicted

0:12:360:12:39

to prescription painkillers?

0:12:390:12:42

In the next few minutes we will be

talking to a couple of people about

0:12:420:12:45

the wrong painkiller addiction is.

We will get a sense of what that is

0:12:450:12:48

like. Also people who work at

addiction clinics to talk about the

0:12:480:12:52

sort of people they are treating and

the stories they are hearing. One

0:12:520:12:56

former councillor has told the BBC

the NHS is creating drug addicts. Do

0:12:560:13:00

you agree with that? We want your

experiences this morning if you are

0:13:000:13:04

addicted to these painkillers. To

get in touch. If you text, you will

0:13:040:13:12

be charged at the standard network

rate. Mohsin sport.

0:13:120:13:16

We can speak to John Motson. We need

to talk about the World Cup. Big

0:13:160:13:23

question, who is the England number

one?

That is central, really, with

0:13:230:13:29

those World Cup places, the battle

for them, Harding up. Particularly

0:13:290:13:34

in goal. Nick Pope worked as a

milkman nine years ago. Now he is

0:13:340:13:40

battling out for the number one spot

in the England squad. It is far from

0:13:400:13:44

nailed down heading into those

friendlies. We are taking him out

0:13:440:13:48

because his story is fantastic.

Having been released at 16, he had

0:13:480:13:52

spells outside the football league

before joining Burnley. He only got

0:13:520:13:56

his chance because of injury to Tom

Heaton. Now he could make his

0:13:560:14:00

international debut in the

forthcoming friendlies with the

0:14:000:14:03

Netherlands and Italy. If you are

questioning if he is the right pick

0:14:030:14:07

for the job, he says he is a safe

pair of hands having never dropped a

0:14:070:14:11

bottle on his milk round.

No, I was Kleenex Mac it was a

0:14:110:14:18

float, electric.

What is the best

thing about England goalkeeper?

Can

0:14:180:14:27

I call myself that if I haven't

played? I think it is just the

0:14:270:14:32

honour, really. Obviously the moment

from Thursday. Getting around people

0:14:320:14:40

and been there from the start,

people have travelled the journey

0:14:400:14:43

with them -- with me. To share that

with them is something I will never

0:14:430:14:47

forget.

It will be a great story of the does

0:14:470:14:51

get selected. Fantastic to hear how

much it means to represent his

0:14:510:14:55

country. From internationals to the

women's Champions League, which

0:14:550:14:59

continues tonight. Manchester City

in Chelsea in action. City are at

0:14:590:15:03

home to their Swedish opponents. In

the WSL this season they are second

0:15:030:15:09

behind Chelsea, who play

Montpellier. If both teams progress,

0:15:090:15:12

it will be the first time in the

competition's history that two

0:15:120:15:16

British clubs have reached the

semifinals.

0:15:160:15:23

We don't our homework on, we know

they are a good team and have

0:15:230:15:28

dominated Swedish football so it

will be a big game with tough

0:15:280:15:31

opponents. Nice to have a home game,

we're been awake for about ten games

0:15:310:15:36

and it has been hard but we have

great support at home and we love

0:15:360:15:41

having them at home. Excited.

One of

several big games coming up in a

0:15:410:15:47

busy end of the week.

And a huge

cricket match in Zimbabwe at the

0:15:470:15:51

moment which could mean Scotland

reached the World Cup?

They are

0:15:510:15:54

playing the West Indies with a place

at the World Cup up for grabs next

0:15:540:15:59

year. The huge match for Scotland.

They make the best start, taking the

0:15:590:16:04

key wicket of Chris Gayle with the

very first ball of the day and he

0:16:040:16:09

then removed Shai Hope to leave the

West Indies at 2-2 but they are now

0:16:090:16:18

99-2 after 24 overs. And we were

talking about England goalkeepers at

0:16:180:16:24

the World Cup, if you're hoping to

be selected you will want to avoid

0:16:240:16:28

something like this happening. This

was a video on social media, some

0:16:280:16:34

street football in Argentina. Superb

skill. A little unfair on the

0:16:340:16:41

goalkeeper! There is no coming back

from that. We know that penalties

0:16:410:16:46

might feature in the World Cup but I

would be very impressed if anybody

0:16:460:16:51

tries that! Amazing!

Thank you,

John.

0:16:510:16:57

This morning - is there enough

help for people addicted

0:16:580:17:01

to prescription painkillers?

0:17:010:17:04

Those who have been addicted to them

have told this programme they have

0:17:040:17:08

been failed at every step.

0:17:080:17:15

Nearly 24 million painkillers,

like Tramadol and morphine,

0:17:190:17:21

were prescribed last year -

that's about 2,700 packs an hour.

0:17:210:17:24

We know that Ant McPartlin is taking

a break from TV to enter

0:17:240:17:27

rehab for a second time.

0:17:270:17:28

Last year he revealed his addiction

to prescription drugs

0:17:280:17:30

following a routine knee operation.

0:17:300:17:32

Later on in the programme,

we'll look at what this could mean

0:17:320:17:35

for the future of Ant and Dec -

two of the biggest names in TV.

0:17:350:17:41

But first, we want to look

at the devastating impact addiction

0:17:410:17:43

to prescription drugs can have

and we want to hear from you too.

0:17:430:17:46

Do get in touch

with your experiences.

0:17:460:17:52

We can talk now to Nicki Hari,

who says her GP made an addict

0:17:520:17:55

of her in prescribing them,

but then had no idea how

0:17:550:17:58

to help her dependency,

which ended up lasting 25 years,

0:17:580:18:02

Antony Corrigan was addicted

to Tramadol, and says he had

0:18:020:18:05

to fight his GP to get off the drug.

0:18:050:18:10

Eytan Alexander, who runs Ukat,

a private addiction centre that has

0:18:100:18:14

referrals from NHS patients in need,

to rehab for painkiller dependency.

0:18:140:18:18

And Cathy Stannard

joins us from Bristol,

0:18:180:18:20

and is a pain consultant.

0:18:200:18:23

She's developing a model

of painkiller support services

0:18:230:18:25

for NHS Gloucestershire.

0:18:250:18:29

Thank you for joining us. I want to

start with you, Nicki. You were very

0:18:290:18:37

young when you put on in strong

painkillers, just 14.

I was 14 I had

0:18:370:18:43

my first operation and I was given

paracetamol and Nurofen also it was

0:18:430:18:48

not until I was 18 that I was put on

very strong painkillers after having

0:18:480:18:54

my appendix out.

What were you put

on?

Codeine, De Goede Mull, tramadol

0:18:540:19:02

and at the time I realised that I

actually really liked the feeling.

0:19:020:19:10

It was like being on a pink fluffy

cloud, all my worries and stresses

0:19:100:19:15

went away. I felt relaxed about

everything. The pain I thought I had

0:19:150:19:22

disappeared. That was when it

started. It did not continue

0:19:220:19:30

solidly...

I was going to ask,

presumably you came off those drugs

0:19:300:19:34

after the operation?

I came off them

out was not until I got into rehab

0:19:340:19:39

and I looked at my journey from

start to finish, well, not finish,

0:19:390:19:47

because I have not finished it yet,

but I realised I could see a pattern

0:19:470:19:50

forming on how I loved having the

feeling of prescription painkillers.

0:19:500:19:59

It was very easy to manipulate the

system. At the time the GPs were

0:19:590:20:04

giving them out quite freely. I

would say that I was in a lot of

0:20:040:20:07

pain and be given a tramadol repeat

prescription for six months so I did

0:20:070:20:14

not even had to go to the GP. It

doesn't take very long to become

0:20:140:20:19

addicted, seven to ten days and

you're hooked.

I can see as you are

0:20:190:20:27

speaking that Anthony is nodding.

Was that your experience as well?

0:20:270:20:31

Very much so, my story is very

similar. I went to the doctor with

0:20:310:20:38

severe pain in my back, I found

myself not able to sit, standing up

0:20:380:20:43

a lot and walking around so I went

to the doctors and pretty much

0:20:430:20:48

immediately they offered me tramadol

and they thought I might have

0:20:480:20:55

sciatica so they offered me another

painkiller that I took. They told me

0:20:550:20:59

to take up to 24 tablets per day,

nothing at all. I came home and took

0:20:590:21:05

the first dose and I was completely

out of it. I was zombified. My

0:21:050:21:12

partner was concerned and did not

want me to continue but I put my

0:21:120:21:16

trust in the doctor that this was

what I needed and it was addressing

0:21:160:21:19

a health need. I did not see it as a

problem.

How long were you on those

0:21:190:21:24

drugs?

In total about two and a half

years. It started gradually, they

0:21:240:21:33

said to take two tramadol every four

hours, eight tablets a day and I was

0:21:330:21:39

also taking gabapentin, that was

four tablets a day. I was not able

0:21:390:21:47

to function well. I was out of it,

it caused me problems at work, I was

0:21:470:21:54

in temporary work at the time so I

was phoning in sick because I could

0:21:540:22:00

not tolerate the pills and I ended

up losing jobs because of it for so

0:22:000:22:04

I felt the doctor was too ready to

give it to me without talking about

0:22:040:22:09

what might happen. He didn't even

offer to send me for tests to see

0:22:090:22:15

what the problem with my back would

be, it was just, take these, these

0:22:150:22:19

can help. I put my trust in my

doctor to help me and I now have

0:22:190:22:24

this feeling of absolute ignorance

that I did not go home and research

0:22:240:22:28

this result but why would I? I'm not

the trained person here.

I want to

0:22:280:22:34

bring in Eytan, you looked surprised

at the second drug he had been

0:22:340:22:41

given?

We see a whole host of drugs.

The mainstream drugs but something

0:22:410:22:48

like gabapentin, sleeping drug, any

form of prescription drug not taken

0:22:480:22:58

as prescribed can have an addictive

process to it was up you form a

0:22:580:23:03

chemical dependence on it. It is the

same thing them if you are a heroine

0:23:030:23:11

user, if you stop taking it, you go

into withdrawal and the same with

0:23:110:23:16

description drugs, you start feeling

unwell and you think you need to

0:23:160:23:20

take more. It is a self fulfilling

prophecy.

0:23:200:23:29

prophecy. Patients are unaware of

what is actually happening, they

0:23:290:23:34

just go and take it themselves.

I

was taking the medication purely as

0:23:340:23:40

prescribed by Mike GP, I was not

abusing the medication or increasing

0:23:400:23:46

the dose is, I was taking what I was

advised to take.

OK.

Again, I

0:23:460:23:54

started off like that and like Eytan

said, the pain went away but I felt

0:23:540:24:02

the GPs were not actually dealing

with the pain.

I agree.

I think

0:24:020:24:07

there should be more pain management

clinics, you should be given options

0:24:070:24:12

of alternative medicines as opposed

to prescribing such addictive

0:24:120:24:16

painkillers to patients.

I want to

bring in Cathy. A lot of accusations

0:24:160:24:23

being made about GPs giving out

these kinds of drugs too readily. Do

0:24:230:24:28

you think it is their criticism?

I

think it is difficult that if you

0:24:280:24:33

are a health care professional with

somebody in front of you who has

0:24:330:24:36

pain, and the accounts of Anthony

and Nicki are really tough, and it

0:24:360:24:46

is tough to not give somebody when

-- give something when somebody is

0:24:460:24:50

in pain is that it is a complex

interaction and the other thing it

0:24:500:24:54

is there to say, what has changed is

our knowledge and understanding of

0:24:540:25:00

how these tablets work. No doubt

that a few years ago we thought they

0:25:000:25:03

were probably the best thing to give

people with severe pain and it is

0:25:030:25:08

only now we are better able to

understand evidence and so on that

0:25:080:25:12

we realise in the long term they are

not the best thing. We all have to

0:25:120:25:17

put up our hands and said we'd

started patients on things that

0:25:170:25:19

maybe now we would not do. I think

two things that came clearly out of

0:25:190:25:25

those stories, one from Nicki was

that very soon she found that the

0:25:250:25:33

medicines helped her with getting

through life, made her feel floaty

0:25:330:25:38

like being on a cloud, that is one

of the things that keeps people

0:25:380:25:43

using them. And both said the

crucial thing to watch out for, when

0:25:430:25:48

you stop taking them you feel worse

so you continue to take them to stop

0:25:480:25:54

feeling worse and that is the marker

of when you have to have a

0:25:540:25:57

conversation with your health care

professional about how to support

0:25:570:26:00

you in coming off.

Let me read you

some of the messages we are getting

0:26:000:26:05

about this. A text from cat saying,

I've been taking large quantities of

0:26:050:26:12

morphine for over 17 years and I'm

dependent on them, taking them for

0:26:120:26:15

chronic pain in the spine after a

hit and run. Ruth says she was

0:26:150:26:21

predicted for years because of

constant headaches and got to the

0:26:210:26:23

point where she could not function

without them. No investigations were

0:26:230:26:28

carried out for 15 years until an

MRI scan for a different issue found

0:26:280:26:32

an aneurysm on the brain. I had to

wean myself off the painkillers

0:26:320:26:36

slowly and they controlled my life.

Did it change the person you were?

0:26:360:26:42

Completely, I did not see it but my

friends and family did. I became

0:26:420:26:46

vacant, absent from situations,

family get-togethers I was not there

0:26:460:26:54

for events at my children's school

force up you literally did not go

0:26:540:26:58

ought you were there and had no

recollection? I didn't go, I had no

0:26:580:27:05

motivation in life. Everything was

just numb. It is hard to describe

0:27:050:27:09

but you're in a cloud, a bubble and

you can't find a way out. When you

0:27:090:27:19

stop taking them, you realise you're

going into severe withdrawal the

0:27:190:27:23

same way a heroin addict would for

submitting cramps, night sweats,

0:27:230:27:30

shakes, your bones are aching and

you don't understand what is

0:27:300:27:32

happening. You think it is because

of the pain you are in, whether it

0:27:320:27:37

is your back or your knee or

whatever but what it is is

0:27:370:27:42

withdrawal from the medication. When

I saw my GP there was no help with

0:27:420:27:48

coming off it. You cannot just stop

taking painkillers, you have to do a

0:27:480:27:53

reduction programme and there is not

that help available.

Did you get

0:27:530:27:58

that support, Anthony?

I don't feel

I did. I went to my GP several times

0:27:580:28:03

and I said I felt I had a dependency

on the tablets. I had managed to

0:28:030:28:09

wean myself to a low dose but when I

tried to not take that last small

0:28:090:28:14

dose I was getting severe withdrawal

and as Nicki said, I was getting hot

0:28:140:28:19

sweats and cold flushes at the same

time, shaking a lot, the insomnia

0:28:190:28:25

was the worst I experienced, I would

fall asleep and immediately jolt

0:28:250:28:29

awake and could not get back to

sleep. I was moody, my partner was

0:28:290:28:33

completely concerned about me. It

was helpful to exercise but because

0:28:330:28:38

I was taking the tablets, up to the

Defour per day, I could not motivate

0:28:380:28:43

myself, I could not move around --

up to 24 per day. I was irritable

0:28:430:28:51

and I relate to what Nicki is

saying. I had to beg the doctor and

0:28:510:28:56

plead and eventually they gave me

zopiclone for one week, sleeping

0:28:560:29:03

medication which I took to get over

the initial period of withdrawal.

0:29:030:29:08

Thankfully, with that, I was able to

come through it. It took about three

0:29:080:29:13

months from that point to not feel

anything, the restless arms and

0:29:130:29:19

legs, and had to have a pair of

pliers in my hand to squeeze all the

0:29:190:29:23

time to take that horrible peeling

away and that was for about three

0:29:230:29:29

months afterwards -- horrible

feeling. I had not taken tramadol

0:29:290:29:31

and gabapentin for a year but I

still have the pain and the

0:29:310:29:37

herniated disc but I would rather

suffer the pain than the addiction

0:29:370:29:42

and the withdrawal, I'm not prepared

to go through that again.

People are

0:29:420:29:46

getting in touch echoing what you're

saying. Paul says he has been on

0:29:460:29:50

painkillers for 17 years because of

bladder cancer, my doctor tried to

0:29:500:29:54

cut back but my body will not have

it. My doctor doesn't know the way

0:29:540:29:58

of getting professional help and I'm

still trying. Another text said they

0:29:580:30:03

had an accident that resulted in

taking tramadol, take them for six

0:30:030:30:07

months before the GB stop them,

advanced advice they went cold

0:30:070:30:11

turkey and it was one of the worst

experiences that you could go

0:30:110:30:14

through. A final thought before we

wrap it up, from all of you, we have

0:30:140:30:22

heard Ant McPartlin has got into

rehab again and now we know he had a

0:30:220:30:26

stint in the summer for addiction to

painkillers. Your thoughts on what

0:30:260:30:29

he could be going through now and

from your own experience?

0:30:290:30:37

I was fortunate enough I had private

medical insurance at the time. The

0:30:370:30:42

only way I could get help was going

into a private residential detox.

0:30:420:30:48

And I think that's where,

unfortunately, because there is no

0:30:480:30:51

help on the NHS a lot of people are

contacting helplines were they try

0:30:510:30:59

and help people get into rehab. What

he is probably feeling now is shame,

0:30:590:31:05

guilt, that he has let everybody

down. But having been in rehab, he

0:31:050:31:12

came out and he went straight back

into his old lifestyle, not

0:31:120:31:17

realising, not really dealing with

his Demons. So he needs to kind of

0:31:170:31:23

understand the programme, have a

complete detox. In rehab you are

0:31:230:31:27

broken down. They are there to teach

you, to break you down.

It's easy to

0:31:270:31:38

stop taking drugs through a detox.

It's staying stopped which is the

0:31:380:31:43

issue. Continuing the process of,

what do I do after leaving

0:31:430:31:47

treatment? How do I stay in recovery

instead of going back to my old

0:31:470:31:53

lifestyle and old behaviours? Maybe

I'll just have one. The thought of

0:31:530:31:56

that first one spirals again into

the next process. It's very easy to

0:31:560:32:02

fall back into the trap.

With people

like me who still have the issue,

0:32:020:32:07

the issue has never been resolved. I

have had scans that show the issue.

0:32:070:32:13

I still have that problem. I know

choose not to take the drug. Nicky

0:32:130:32:19

said she had access to that private

facility. Many people like myself, I

0:32:190:32:24

don't have that. I have to put my

trust in my GP. I have two trust

0:32:240:32:29

where they refer me. I don't have

any means to pay for private health

0:32:290:32:34

care or things like that. Touching a

little bit more on Ant McPartlin, I

0:32:340:32:39

should imagine he feels embarrassed

and ashamed that maybe he has failed

0:32:390:32:43

the first time around. This is such

a powerful addiction that it doesn't

0:32:430:32:47

surprise me that is the case. I just

hope he gets the help he needs.

0:32:470:32:53

I think the main message is to talk

about it. One of the things that we

0:32:530:32:57

all hear is that people don't want

to talk about it to the GP. They

0:32:570:33:01

don't want to admit to addiction.

GPs are maybe not looking for it.

0:33:010:33:06

Get the diagnosis. Then I think

there are a number of things.

0:33:060:33:10

Sometimes people will do well with a

gradual reduction. Sometimes you

0:33:100:33:13

have to get help from NHS addiction

services, which are thinly

0:33:130:33:19

stretched. It is about admitting to

a problem first of all. There are

0:33:190:33:23

sources of help out there.

One size does not fit all.

Thank you

0:33:230:33:28

all for coming in. I want to read

this statement from the Department

0:33:280:33:31

of Health. They say it has already

become a big issue another overseas

0:33:310:33:36

countries and we are determined to

make sure it doesn't happen here.

0:33:360:33:38

When we understand the scale of the

problem, we will look at a range of

0:33:380:33:42

policy options to tackle the issue.

Thank you for coming in. After ten

0:33:420:33:48

o'clock, we will ask about the

future of ant and deck. We are keen

0:33:480:33:51

to hear your experience of

painkiller addiction.

0:33:510:33:54

-- Anton deck. Tens of thousands of

people with chronic illnesses are

0:33:540:34:02

disabilities may have been paid too

little in benefits due to an error.

0:34:020:34:07

We hear from people who think they

may have been affected.

0:34:070:34:13

Time for the latest news.

0:34:130:34:14

Here's Joanna.

0:34:140:34:16

More than a million NHS staff

are poised for a pay rise

0:34:160:34:19

with a deal that could be worth

as much as £4 billion

0:34:190:34:22

being announced by lunchtime today.

0:34:220:34:25

The BBC understands that health

bosses and unions have reached

0:34:250:34:29

an agreement that will mark an end

to a seven-year cap and boost

0:34:290:34:34

the salaries of workers including

nurses, porters and paramedics,

0:34:340:34:37

but not doctors.

0:34:370:34:38

Facebook will be questioned

by politicians in Washington today

0:34:380:34:40

as the company comes under growing

pressure to explain how data

0:34:400:34:43

from 50 million users was used

by a British Company

0:34:430:34:46

during the US presidential election.

0:34:460:34:47

It's alleged that Cambridge

Analytica used the data to target

0:34:470:34:50

voters and influence

the election outcome.

0:34:500:34:51

That company's chief executive,

Alexander Nix, has been suspended.

0:34:510:34:53

Both firms deny any wrongdoing.

0:34:530:35:01

Reports from the United States say

the suspect in a series

0:35:020:35:05

of bombings in Texas is dead

after blowing himself up.

0:35:050:35:08

Five devices have detonated so far

this month and killed two people.

0:35:080:35:11

A sixth parcel bomb was intercepted

before it exploded.

0:35:110:35:16

The amount of plastic in the ocean

could treble within a decade,

0:35:160:35:19

unless action is taken to tackle

the problem, a major

0:35:190:35:22

report has warned.

0:35:220:35:23

The Foresight Future

of the Sea Report for the UK

0:35:230:35:26

Government says plastics is just one

issue facing the world's seas,

0:35:260:35:28

along with rising sea

levels and warming oceans.

0:35:280:35:31

It also says much more knowledge

is needed about the ocean.

0:35:310:35:39

That's a summary of

the latest BBC News.

0:35:400:35:44

Thank you. You are still getting in

touch with your experiences of

0:35:440:35:50

painkiller addiction. Robin says he

is so terribly sorry for the

0:35:500:35:54

participants and their valour

experiences. -- valid. He ended up

0:35:540:35:59

at NA any last weekend. He was given

the opportunity without judgment to

0:35:590:36:05

outline his problem. Pain relief was

given without question. "I Was so

0:36:050:36:13

grateful for the common-sense

approach. I didn't have to beg and I

0:36:130:36:16

wasn't treated like an addict.

Thanks to those doctors who make a

0:36:160:36:19

good judgment call. " Share your

experiences with us throughout the

0:36:190:36:25

morning.

0:36:250:36:25

Here's some sport now with John.

0:36:250:36:29

Hello. Scotland are hoping to

qualify for next year's Cricket

0:36:290:36:33

World Cup. Beat the West Indies and

the place is theirs. They dismissed

0:36:330:36:39

Gale for naught. A short while ago

the West Indies were 116-2. England

0:36:390:36:45

captain Joel Ruud says the return of

Ben Stokes to the England team is a

0:36:450:36:49

huge boost. -- Joe Root. From

milkman to the World Cup, Nick Pope

0:36:490:36:56

will hope he can impress Gareth

Southgate in England's friendlies

0:36:560:36:59

with the Netherlands and Italy, nine

years after he was released by

0:36:590:37:05

Ipswich. And two British teams could

reach the semifinals of the

0:37:050:37:12

Champions League for the first time

if Manchester City and Chelsea can

0:37:120:37:17

come through their quarterfinal

ties, the first of which are being

0:37:170:37:20

played tonight. Some big matches to

come later.

0:37:200:37:26

That is all the sport for now.

0:37:260:37:28

Tens of thousands of people

with chronic illnesses

0:37:280:37:32

or disabilities may have been paid

too little in benefits due

0:37:320:37:34

to an error in calculating

the main sickness benefit,

0:37:340:37:37

Employment and Support Allowance.

0:37:370:37:40

Around 70,000 claimants are due

a repayment of up to £20,000

0:37:400:37:43

which could cost the government more

than £800 million.

0:37:430:37:48

Around 2.4 million people claim

Employment and Support Allowance

0:37:480:37:52

because they are unable or have

limited capacity to work.

0:37:520:37:55

We can talk to two people who think

they may have been affected.

0:37:550:37:59

Heidi Niel is on ESA,

and had been on incapacity benefit

0:37:590:38:03

after she had a massive heart

attack at 38.

0:38:030:38:08

Tracey Flynn, who lost her job

after the birth of her second

0:38:080:38:11

child because of her

chronic rheumatoid arthritis.

0:38:110:38:15

Also with us, Labour MP and member

of Parliament's Work

0:38:150:38:17

and Pensions Select Committee Neil

Coyle.

0:38:170:38:25

Thank you all for taking the time

out to speak to us. Heidi, I want to

0:38:250:38:30

start with you. I know that you have

struggled since your benefits have

0:38:300:38:35

changed. Explain in practical terms

and in day-to-day life what that has

0:38:350:38:39

meant to you?

Well, initially I had

no idea about this incapacity DSA. I

0:38:390:38:47

just got a letter to say the name

changed. Until I was notified

0:38:470:38:51

literally yesterday morning there

may be an issue, I literally had no

0:38:510:38:54

idea. They tend to fudge you with

paperwork, which grind you down

0:38:540:39:00

continuously. My benefit was then

stopped in August of this year, when

0:39:000:39:07

it switched over to Universal

Credit. And I'm now going through

0:39:070:39:10

the appeals process to get me back

onto DSA. Now I'm wondering if it

0:39:100:39:17

should be an appeals process to get

me back onto incapacity. It is so

0:39:170:39:22

hard to keep up with where you were

supposed to be. Thank heavens for

0:39:220:39:28

the Citizens Advice Bureau. I'm sure

they have been flooded with these

0:39:280:39:31

problems. Day-to-day living has been

an absolute nightmare. Wondering

0:39:310:39:35

whether I can afford to have heating

on. Basic stuff. Literally basic

0:39:350:39:39

stuff. And being told you can use

the food bank. I mean, where is that

0:39:390:39:45

normal? To me it is not.

You have

also had bailiffs around, I

0:39:450:39:51

understand?

Yes. When your benefit

is stopped, with the

0:39:510:40:00

is stopped, with the incapacity

DSA... They were trying to do it on

0:40:000:40:04

the employment and support allowance

as well. I have had to go back to

0:40:040:40:08

certificates. I had been fully

assessed and was told that I was

0:40:080:40:12

effectively permanently unfit to

work until deemed fit to work. So I

0:40:120:40:18

had to go through that again. That

has been an absolute nightmare.

I

0:40:180:40:24

want to also bring in Tracy to hear

her experiences. I know that you

0:40:240:40:29

have chronic rheumatoid arthritis. I

also know that you have got pretty

0:40:290:40:33

young children who are registered

carers. So juggling all of this must

0:40:330:40:37

be incredibly stressful for you.

It

is. And when you factor in DWP

0:40:370:40:45

involvement, it is never

straightforward. I was moved from

0:40:450:40:48

incapacity benefit to employment and

support allowance in 2011. I was

0:40:480:40:53

actually found that I had a limited

fitness to work. Despite the fact I

0:40:530:41:00

have been retired on ill-health

grounds from a government

0:41:000:41:04

department. That was from a

sedentary position. The amount of

0:41:040:41:08

treatment that I have, and the

amount of intervention by the NHS,

0:41:080:41:13

my GP, my occupational therapist, my

consultant, and the fact that my

0:41:130:41:18

rheumatoid is not particularly well

controlled, I have a suppressed

0:41:180:41:20

immune system, and the amount of

monitoring that goes on, means it's

0:41:200:41:25

very difficult for me to hold down a

job and provide effective and

0:41:250:41:29

efficient services as an employee,

which is the reason that I've lost

0:41:290:41:35

my job in the first place. I just

couldn't manage to get into work and

0:41:350:41:39

do my job.

Neil Coyle, I want to

bring you in. 70,000 claimants here

0:41:390:41:47

could be looking at a huge payment

of Ulster £20,000. The average

0:41:470:41:54

amount we understand will be £5,000.

How on earth are we got in this

0:41:540:41:58

position?

0:41:580:42:03

position?

Sadly, disability UK

described it as a shambolic

0:42:030:42:07

catalogue of errors. The Department

for Work and Pensions, back in 2014,

0:42:070:42:11

when this problem was first

identified, four years ago, it could

0:42:110:42:15

have been dealt with at the time.

But it has been completely

0:42:150:42:20

overstretched and under resourced.

The coalition government axed

0:42:200:42:23

thousands of civil servants and left

those remaining are unable to make

0:42:230:42:26

the decisions properly. We've got an

assessment process the government

0:42:260:42:31

pays millions of pounds to

administer. It is failing disabled

0:42:310:42:36

people routinely. We have had

Universal Credit with its problems,

0:42:360:42:42

Personal Independent Payment is,

whether urban lot of problems. Now

0:42:420:42:46

that we know that employment and

support allowance, which only helps

0:42:460:42:49

disabled people, we now know there

were these 70,000 disabled people

0:42:490:42:53

who are owed at least £2500. The

government really needs to apologise

0:42:530:42:59

and do it very quickly and make

these payments, make these back

0:42:590:43:03

payments as quickly as possible.

The

Department for Work and Pensions say

0:43:030:43:08

they will not comment on individuals

but say they are well under way with

0:43:080:43:12

the plan to identify and repay

people affected. Payments have

0:43:120:43:16

already started. "We Are committed

to making sure people get what they

0:43:160:43:20

are entitled to as quickly as

possible. Everybody who could be

0:43:200:43:23

affected will be contacted directly

by the Department." Heidi, what

0:43:230:43:28

difference would it make if you had

some money that came in, that was an

0:43:280:43:35

average of £5,000? What difference

would that make your life?

Obviously

0:43:350:43:38

in the media didn't help me pay off

the debts that are now spiralling

0:43:380:43:42

out of control. The more the money

is not back in the... Without some

0:43:420:43:51

sort of regular structure, which is

what they had before, yes OK, it

0:43:510:43:55

wasn't a brilliant amount, but I had

worked out budgetary wise. Even if I

0:43:550:44:00

could just get back to that state,

initially, yes it would help me pay

0:44:000:44:04

off some debts. But literally the

whole system needs to be looked at.

0:44:040:44:12

What is the saying, if it ain't

broke, don't fix it. Everything as

0:44:120:44:15

far as I was concerned was OK. I was

living not comfortably, not a

0:44:150:44:22

luxurious life, but I had it all

under control. They keep changing

0:44:220:44:26

the goal post and it has thrown

everybody into a tailspin,

0:44:260:44:30

depression, suicide. It's just

awful. I wouldn't wish this on my

0:44:300:44:32

worst enemy, literally.

Heidi, thank you for sharing your

0:44:320:44:37

story. Thank you to Tracy and Neil

Coyle first begin to us as well.

0:44:370:44:45

America is good at electing

celebrities into office. Six and the

0:44:480:44:53

city star Cynthia Nixon, who played

Miranda Hobbes in the series, is

0:44:530:44:56

hoping to get in the act. Is

launching a bid to get elected for

0:44:560:45:02

the Democrats.

She held an election rally

0:45:020:45:03

overnight.

0:45:030:45:06

New York is where I was was raised

and where I'm raising my kids.

0:45:230:45:30

And to the thousands

of you standing in this square

0:45:570:45:59

participating in history...

0:45:590:46:02

The Cambridge psychologist who

created an apt to harvest the

0:46:270:46:30

personal data of millions of

Facebook users has insisted he is

0:46:300:46:33

done nothing wrong, it was claimed

the information was used without

0:46:330:46:38

permission to persuade people to

vote for Donald Trump in the US

0:46:380:46:40

elections. Doctor Alexander Kogan

has been speaking to Radio 4.

I am

0:46:400:46:47

stunned by most of this, it has

never been my understanding. The

0:46:470:46:52

events of the past week have been a

total shell shock. My view is that

0:46:520:46:57

I'm being used as a scapegoat by

Facebook and Cambridge Analytica

0:46:570:47:03

when honestly we thought we were

acting perfectly appropriately, we

0:47:030:47:06

thought we were doing something

normal and we were assured by

0:47:060:47:13

Cambridge Analytica that everything

was legal in terms of the terms of

0:47:130:47:16

service.

Cambridge Analytica, the

London based firm that has been

0:47:160:47:22

accused of harvesting Facebook

information for political clients,

0:47:220:47:24

has suspended its chief executive.

It said comments made by Alexander

0:47:240:47:30

Nix to an undercover reporter do not

reflect its values. The undercover

0:47:300:47:33

investigation showed Alexander Nix

boasting he had met Donald Trump

0:47:330:47:39

many times.

0:47:390:47:45

Facebook has been used by political

parties and campaign groups

0:47:530:47:57

for over a decade now to try

and spread their message

0:47:570:47:59

and win over supporters.

0:47:590:48:00

When does legitimate

campaigning become unethical

0:48:000:48:04

and potentially illegal?

0:48:040:48:07

James McGrory is the executive

director of Open Britain, a

0:48:070:48:10

pro-EU campaign group.

0:48:100:48:11

He was the head of press

for the Stronger In campaign group

0:48:110:48:14

during the Brexit referendum

who argued that the UK

0:48:140:48:16

should stay In the EU.

0:48:160:48:24

What are the kinds of conversations

that take place in political parties

0:48:240:48:28

about the use of this kind of data?

First and foremost it had to be

0:48:280:48:33

legal for the big companies like

Facebook and political parties as

0:48:330:48:38

well as businesses and media

organisations hold a lot of data

0:48:380:48:40

about people and that's not a bad

thing necessary as long as it has

0:48:400:48:44

been got hold of correctly and used

correctly. There are legitimate and

0:48:440:48:50

good uses of social media

campaigning amongst political

0:48:500:48:52

parties. People say politics is too

distant, so go where people are, to

0:48:520:48:59

Facebook and Twitter and Instagram.

What you had to be sure about it

0:48:590:49:02

that you are gathering the data

correctly and using it correctly.

0:49:020:49:06

And that people know you have their

data.

When you sign up you are clear

0:49:060:49:11

about what your data will and will

not be used for and while I do not

0:49:110:49:15

know every in and out of what has

gone on, that appears to be the most

0:49:150:49:18

serious allegation, that data has

been so-called scraped without not

0:49:180:49:23

only the consent of the users but

the consent of many friends and

0:49:230:49:27

family. That seems to be an

appalling use of data. However, the

0:49:270:49:33

idea that you go on Facebook and you

say you are interested in the EU as

0:49:330:49:38

an issue or the environment, why

shouldn't political partisan

0:49:380:49:42

campaigns say, we have an advert and

a policy we think you're interested

0:49:420:49:47

in and target that advert.

Is it

ethical?

I don't see why not also if

0:49:470:49:55

you give your details to Facebook

and their clear in that example

0:49:550:49:59

about what your data is and is not

used for, you can get an advert from

0:49:590:50:04

a political party or campaign and

you can click on that, and it will

0:50:040:50:10

take you are seeing this advert

because this group of people want

0:50:100:50:12

you to see it because you are

interested in the environment. If

0:50:120:50:15

you don't want to see any more,

click here. Not every political

0:50:150:50:20

party or campaign or business is

going to be able to get the right at

0:50:200:50:24

that at the right person all the

time but they want to advertise. At

0:50:240:50:27

the same time you should be able to

say, I don't want to see this any

0:50:270:50:30

more. It is about the rules and

transparency with which you operate.

0:50:300:50:34

In my opinion there is nothing wrong

with political campaigns like any

0:50:340:50:38

business or any group of people

wanting to talk to people on social

0:50:380:50:41

media.

I wonder if people on social

media as they did over those

0:50:410:50:46

details, even if it is obvious, who

read the terms and conditions? Is it

0:50:460:50:50

fair when people are giving over

that information that it gets used

0:50:500:50:53

by political parties because they

might not realise it.

There is a big

0:50:530:50:59

distinction to make it is not

necessarily used by political

0:50:590:51:02

parties...

It is used to target.

It

is used to target by Facebook.

You

0:51:020:51:08

have never used it within political

campaigning information you had to

0:51:080:51:13

target particular voters?

You can do

that as well, it is nothing new.

0:51:130:51:17

Political parties even before

Facebook were delivering Leaf books

0:51:170:51:20

to people that were different in one

area to another, people are

0:51:200:51:25

interested in their local

communities. If you have a young

0:51:250:51:28

family you might have interest in

child care or shared parental leave

0:51:280:51:31

and someone who did not a family

might not be interested in that.

0:51:310:51:35

People say that politics is too

distant. There is merit in that also

0:51:350:51:40

we can't say at the same time that

we cannot allow political partisan

0:51:400:51:43

campaigns to talk to people about

the issues that we know matter to

0:51:430:51:47

them. That is part and parcel of

politics whether on the doorstep or

0:51:470:51:52

on an app on your phone. While there

are serious questions to answer in

0:51:520:51:58

this, we have to be careful about

throwing the baby out with the bath

0:51:580:52:02

water and saying that all political

campaigning online, as long as it is

0:52:020:52:09

done appropriately and transparency

and people can unsubscribe from all

0:52:090:52:11

of the things that people should do

and by and large do do, it can be a

0:52:110:52:15

force for good.

Thank you for coming

in.

0:52:150:52:17

The hashtag DeleteFacebook

has been trending

0:52:170:52:19

for the last 24 hours in protest

at the company's data

0:52:190:52:22

and privacy policies.

0:52:220:52:23

Let's speak to two people who have

deleted their accounts.

0:52:230:52:25

James Giblin, who's been on Facebook

for ten years and is

0:52:250:52:28

training to be a teacher.

0:52:280:52:29

And Eva Dull, who's

been on it nine years

0:52:290:52:31

and works in marketing.

0:52:310:52:34

Is it a knee jerk reaction or had

you thinking about getting off it

0:52:370:52:40

for a while?

I have been thinking

about it for a while. This kind of

0:52:400:52:46

thing has been common knowledge

among people for a while, data

0:52:460:52:51

breaches and stuff like that. And on

the back of the Twitter campaign, I

0:52:510:52:57

thought it was something to get

behind to finally push Facebook into

0:52:570:53:01

the past.

What about you, Eva, why

did you decide to the league now?

I

0:53:010:53:07

have been thought about deleting for

two or three years. I think when

0:53:070:53:14

Facebook became a bit frustrating,

not sure if they ran ads before it

0:53:140:53:19

is well, but it was two and a half

years ago when it started

0:53:190:53:24

frustrating the. I started using it

less and less. I have not really

0:53:240:53:29

posted anything in about a year. So

I think this was kind of like what

0:53:290:53:37

pushed me over the edge and I said,

I don't actually get anything out of

0:53:370:53:42

it.

In that sense is it about trust

or saying that I'm done?

I think I

0:53:420:53:55

kind of doubted the trust issue a

while ago because I have been

0:53:550:53:58

expecting some kind of a story like

this to break for some time. I have

0:53:580:54:03

been following Cambridge Analytica

for just over a year. And I think

0:54:030:54:11

this was kind of the final straw but

at the same time I feel...

It looks

0:54:110:54:19

like we have lost the line with Eva.

We can bring in James again. Do you

0:54:190:54:26

think we are a bit naive in what we

share on Facebook? It is free to

0:54:260:54:32

use, they will want something out

the deal, something back, and

0:54:320:54:38

ultimately that is our information.

I understand that but a lot of users

0:54:380:54:44

might be over 50 and not really

familiar with how the internet works

0:54:440:54:49

and how Facebook works as a

platform. Nobody is given a crash

0:54:490:54:54

course in how to use the platform.

They might be naive in the sense

0:54:540:54:58

that they might share personal

information like bank details to the

0:54:580:55:03

partners and they are not aware of

where the data has been stored or

0:55:030:55:08

what it is being used for and things

like that.

Thank you for joining us

0:55:080:55:12

this morning and explaining why you

are deleting Facebook. More on the

0:55:120:55:17

breaking news we brought you

earlier, reports from Texas that a

0:55:170:55:21

suspected serial bomber has died

after being pursued by police. Some

0:55:210:55:27

reports say he blew himself up. It

follows a series of parcel bomb

0:55:270:55:31

attacks in the city of Austin where

to Maccabi blabbing killed and

0:55:310:55:35

several injured. Our correspondent

can tell us more -- where two people

0:55:350:55:41

have been killed.

The breakthrough

happened yesterday where there were

0:55:410:55:46

two devices found at two separate

FedEx facilities, one look up and

0:55:460:55:51

one did not. They were able to get

DNA from that and also CCTV footage

0:55:510:55:57

of a suspect. They released an image

of the suspect in a cap and it

0:55:570:56:02

appears this morning that they were

able to locate the suspect at a

0:56:020:56:07

hotel outside Austin. They blocked

off Interstate 35, a highway, and

0:56:070:56:14

they were pursuing him and it

appears he blew himself up. An

0:56:140:56:20

eyewitness was at home when he heard

police sirens.

They were close to

0:56:200:56:24

the woods and obviously the cops saw

us and they approached us. I don't

0:56:240:56:30

know who it was, they were in

military gear. They asked us to

0:56:300:56:35

leave.

You know that the Austin

bombing suspect is dead?

Is he

0:56:350:56:41

really?

We were able to confirm

that.

We can go live to Texas where

0:56:410:56:47

police are giving a briefing.

About

the level of partnership that has

0:56:470:56:53

taken place with our federal

officials, our local officials and

0:56:530:56:57

police department to bring this to

an end. And through all of this hard

0:56:570:57:04

work, we identified several leads

throughout the course of the week 's

0:57:040:57:11

but beginning within the past 24-36

hours a week started getting

0:57:110:57:16

information on one person of

interest that we continue to work on

0:57:160:57:20

and continued to develop and as we

continued to do our investigations,

0:57:200:57:25

this person of interest ultimately

moved to being a suspect and that is

0:57:250:57:31

what we started focusing on, his

involvement in these crimes. Late

0:57:310:57:35

last night and early this morning we

felt very confident that this was

0:57:350:57:40

the suspect in the bombing incidents

that took place in Austin. We had

0:57:400:57:47

surveillance teams looking for the

suspect and we ultimately located

0:57:470:57:53

the vehicle that this suspect was

known to be driving and witnesses

0:57:530:57:58

told us he was driving and in fact

we found that at a hotel right up

0:57:580:58:02

the road here. We had multiple

officers from both the police

0:58:020:58:08

department and our federal partners

that took up the dishes around the

0:58:080:58:14

hotel awaiting the arrival of our

tactical teams because we wanted to

0:58:140:58:20

have ballistic vehicles here so we

could attempt to take this suspect

0:58:200:58:24

into custody as safely as possible.

While we were waiting for those

0:58:240:58:28

vehicles to get here, much time had

passed and the vehicle started to

0:58:280:58:33

drive away. We began following the

vehicle, again, waiting to get the

0:58:330:58:42

tactical vehicles here so we could

make a stop. However, the vehicle

0:58:420:58:46

ended up stopping in the ditch at

the side of the road behind us. As

0:58:460:58:53

members of the Austin police

Department SWAT team approached the

0:58:530:58:57

vehicle, the suspect detonated a

bomb inside the vehicle, knocking

0:58:570:59:03

one of our SWAT officers back and

one of them fired at the suspect as

0:59:030:59:08

well. The suspect is deceased and

has significant injuries from a

0:59:080:59:15

blast that occurred from detonating

a bomb inside his vehicle. We cannot

0:59:150:59:21

name the suspect at this time

because he has not been positively

0:59:210:59:25

identified yet by the medical

examiner and next of kin have not

0:59:250:59:30

yet been notified.

That is a live

press conference from Austin Texas

0:59:300:59:34

with police giving us an update on

the suspect linked to the parcel

0:59:340:59:42

bomb attacks, giving the status of

his death in the early hours of this

0:59:420:59:46

morning. We will bring you updates

on that in the programme. That get

0:59:460:59:50

the latest weather now.

0:59:500:59:51

It has been a chilly start for many,

some lovely pictures coming in, some

0:59:530:59:58

frost on the ground and sunshine to

start the day as well. The sunshine

0:59:581:00:03

some of us have will turn hazier

through the day and that is because

1:00:031:00:07

we have a weather front which

continues its journey moving

1:00:071:00:11

south-eastward and taking the cloud

with it as it does and some will

1:00:111:00:15

have some patchy rain and drizzle.

It will be mild, the cloud in

1:00:151:00:21

Scotland, Northern Ireland and

England, colder in the South so we

1:00:211:00:26

have the blues and even today later

on and tomorrow, most of us will

1:00:261:00:33

have milder conditions. The bright

sunny skies across England and Wales

1:00:331:00:37

will be replaced by hazier skies,

again some patchy light rain and

1:00:371:00:41

drizzle, mostly across northern

England and Wales. Still some

1:00:411:00:46

showery outbreaks in Scotland behind

the main weather front. We could see

1:00:461:00:53

12 Celsius this afternoon in

Scotland and we have not had that

1:00:531:00:54

for some time. Further south, 7-11d.

This evening and overnight the

1:00:541:01:01

weather front continues to move

south eastwards, taking the rain

1:01:011:01:07

with it, and the showery outbreaks

continue in western Scotland. In

1:01:071:01:11

between with clearer skies, some

patchy mist and fog. Not many

1:01:111:01:16

problems with frost because

temperatures compared to this

1:01:161:01:18

morning are much higher also this

morning it was freezing or below but

1:01:181:01:25

tomorrow it is 5-7d for that if

there is any the likelihood it will

1:01:251:01:29

be part of Wales and south-west

England. Heading through the morning

1:01:291:01:35

tomorrow, we will lose any patchy

mist and fog and it will brighten up

1:01:351:01:41

nicely with sunshine but like today

the cloud will build on the west,

1:01:411:01:45

turning the sunshine in Haiti ahead

of this weather front which will

1:01:451:01:47

bring some more substantial rain and

windier conditions. Temperatures

1:01:471:01:52

still in good shape, 10-12, a bit

cool in Lerwick. This fund will move

1:01:521:02:01

from West to east through the

evening and overnight -- with this

1:02:011:02:05

front. On Friday morning it will

continue, claiming eastern Scotland

1:02:051:02:11

and England but if you follow it

around you can see the other end in

1:02:111:02:15

the north and west of Scotland with

some hill snow possible. This next

1:02:151:02:20

band of rain is coming in from the

south-west. The extent of it is

1:02:201:02:26

questionable but still a bad -- a

good day.

1:02:261:02:32

Hello it's Wednesday,

it's 10 o'clock, I'm Chloe Tilley

1:02:321:02:34

in for Victoria Derbyshire.

1:02:341:02:36

Our top story today -

after years of a 1% pay cap,

1:02:361:02:39

the government is expected

to announce a significant pay

1:02:391:02:41

increase for NHS staff

in England, apart from doctors

1:02:411:02:47

Staffing issues have to be

addressed, vacancies have to be

1:02:471:02:51

addressed. The whole issue of using

agencies sat -- staff on double

1:02:511:02:57

shifts has to be addressed. In that

context it is significant that the

1:02:571:03:01

pay award has been made.

1:03:011:03:02

If you work for the NHS, do get

in touch and tell us your reaction.

1:03:021:03:05

Plus - there's been a huge rise

in the number of women

1:03:051:03:08

using donated eggs to get pregnant.

1:03:081:03:14

You get married and then your

friends have kids and it's just not

1:03:141:03:18

happening to you. It suddenly

becomes the most important thing in

1:03:181:03:21

your life.

The only thing you can focus on.

1:03:211:03:25

We'll be talking live to a woman

who's donated her eggs four times,

1:03:251:03:28

and another women who's had a child

thanks to a donation

1:03:281:03:30

of an egg from her friend.

1:03:301:03:33

And what next for the

future of Ant and Dec?

1:03:331:03:37

We'll look at what impact Ant's

arrest on suspicion of drink-driving

1:03:371:03:40

will have on the pair's many

successful TV programmes.

1:03:401:03:43

Good morning.

1:03:481:03:54

Here's Joanna in the BBC Newsroom

with a summary of today's news.

1:03:541:03:57

Good morning.

1:03:571:03:58

More than a million NHS staff

are poised for a pay rise,

1:03:581:04:01

with a deal that could be worth

as much as £4 billion

1:04:011:04:03

being announced by lunchtime today.

1:04:031:04:05

The BBC understands that health

bosses and unions have

1:04:051:04:07

reached an agreement that will mark

an end to a seven-year cap

1:04:071:04:10

and boost the salaries

of workers including nurses,

1:04:101:04:12

porters and paramedics -

but not doctors.

1:04:121:04:17

Facebook will be questioned by

politicians in Washington today, as

1:04:171:04:20

the company comes under growing

pressure to explain how data was

1:04:201:04:25

used by a British company during the

British general election. It is

1:04:251:04:33

alleged the data was used to

influence the income. Both firms

1:04:331:04:39

deny any wrongdoing.

1:04:391:04:41

Reports from the United States say

the suspect in a series of bombings

1:04:411:04:45

in Texas has died,

after blowing himself up.

1:04:451:04:47

Five devices have detonated

so far this month,

1:04:471:04:48

and killed two people.

1:04:481:04:49

A sixth parcel bomb was intercepted

before it exploded.

1:04:491:04:56

As members of the Austin police

Department SWAT team approached the

1:04:561:05:02

vehicle, the suspect detonated a

bomb inside the vehicle, knocking

1:05:021:05:05

one of our SWAT officers back. One

of our SWAT officers fired at the

1:05:051:05:12

suspect as well. The suspect is

deceased and has significant

1:05:121:05:17

injuries from a blast that occurred

from detonating a bomb inside his

1:05:171:05:20

vehicle.

1:05:201:05:21

Unemployment rose by

24,000 to 1.45 million

1:05:211:05:23

in the three months to January.

1:05:231:05:26

It was the second month in a row

to show an increase.

1:05:261:05:29

However, the rate of

unemployment was down

1:05:291:05:31

slightly, from 4.4% to 4.3%.

1:05:311:05:32

Average earnings including bonuses

rose by 2.8% in the same period.

1:05:321:05:39

That's a summary of the latest BBC

News - more at 10.30.

1:05:391:05:47

Thank you very much. Let me read you

some of the comments people are

1:05:471:05:51

getting in touch with us about

painkillers. We were talking about

1:05:511:05:54

how easily -- two guests were

talking about how easy it was for

1:05:541:06:01

them to become addicted. David has

been taking painkillers for 20

1:06:011:06:04

years. Last month he was rushed into

hospital with his stomach bleeding.

1:06:041:06:09

He had blood transfusions, lost two

stone in weight and is now having

1:06:091:06:13

injections every three months. Simon

has got in touch, saying in a bully

1:06:131:06:18

went to three different doctors in

five days with horrendous back pain

1:06:181:06:20

and was giving increasing amounts of

painkillers. He was paralysed from

1:06:201:06:26

the waist down with the loss of

bladder function due to our bladder

1:06:261:06:32

-- an abscess. Do share your

experiences.

1:06:321:06:34

Do get in touch with us

throughout the morning -

1:06:341:06:36

use the hashtag Victoria live.

1:06:361:06:37

And if you text, you will be charged

at the standard network rate.

1:06:371:06:41

Let me bring you this breaking news

which we are getting from Nigeria.

1:06:411:06:47

Boko Haram militants have released

76 of the 110 schoolgirls were

1:06:471:06:52

abducted from the north-eastern town

of Duchy back in February. Very

1:06:521:06:55

similar to the Chibok girls many

years ago. The government said this

1:06:551:07:02

in a statement this morning. The

information minister said 76 had so

1:07:021:07:08

far been documented and they are

adding details of that throughout

1:07:081:07:12

the morning. As we get more details,

we will bring it to you. Good news

1:07:121:07:18

coming from Nigeria. 76 schoolgirls

abducted in north-eastern Nigeria

1:07:181:07:22

have been released. Now the sport

with John. Good morning. A place at

1:07:221:07:27

the Cricket World Cup hangs in the

balance for Scotland. A victory over

1:07:271:07:30

the West Indies and a place at the

tournament next year in England and

1:07:301:07:34

Wales is theirs. They made the best

possible start. Chris Gale went with

1:07:341:07:41

the first ball of the day. The

Windies 2-2 at that stage. Did

1:07:411:07:47

recover. Lewis made 50 from 63

balls. He went. Then the key wicket

1:07:471:07:55

of Samuels followed. He was caught

in the deep. Scotland have made

1:07:551:08:01

another breakthrough. A short while

ago 135-5, the West Indies. Going

1:08:011:08:08

well in Zimbabwe with the world Cup

spot in Scotland's reach. For

1:08:081:08:13

England, immediate thoughts turn to

their two test series with New

1:08:131:08:19

Zealand. Ben Stokes is set to

return. Captain Joel Ruud says he is

1:08:191:08:23

a 31 player. And that Stokes is

itching to get back. -- Joe Root.

1:08:231:08:35

Coming back into high-intensity

cricket, having spent a lot of time

1:08:351:08:37

out of the game, and managing it

quite shrewdly, has been really

1:08:371:08:45

mature of him, actually. He is

someone who likes to do things at

1:08:451:08:49

150 million mph all the time. You

can see the maturity starting to

1:08:491:08:55

show through a bit more. That is

only a good thing for us moving

1:08:551:08:59

forward.

The football World Cup is

85 days away and the battle for

1:08:591:09:04

places is hotting up for England, in

particular in goal. Nick Pope was

1:09:041:09:09

working as a milkman nine years ago

having been released by Ipswich

1:09:091:09:13

Town. Now he is battling it out for

the number one spot in the England

1:09:131:09:17

squad. His story is pretty

impressive. Having been released at

1:09:171:09:24

16, he had spelt outside before

bully before joining Burnley. He

1:09:241:09:27

only got his chance this is season

because of an injury to Tom Heaton.

1:09:271:09:32

He has been rewarded with an England

call-up and could make his

1:09:321:09:36

international debut in the

forthcoming friendlies with the

1:09:361:09:39

Netherlands and Italy. If you are

questioning a fee is the right pick

1:09:391:09:43

for the World Cup, he says he is a

safe pair of hands having never

1:09:431:09:46

dropped a bottle on Isobel Grant. --

on his milk round.

No, I was clean!

1:09:461:09:55

I were on a float. Electric.

What is

the best thing about being an

1:09:551:10:00

England player?

Can I call myself

that if I have not played? OK! I

1:10:001:10:07

think it's just the honour, really.

Obviously the moment from Thursday,

1:10:071:10:15

being around people who've been

there from the start, people who

1:10:151:10:19

have travelled the journey with me,

to share with them was something I

1:10:191:10:22

will never forget.

We wonder if that story will

1:10:221:10:27

continue, of course. It would be

pretty impressive if he does get

1:10:271:10:32

selected for those friendlies. Lots

of competition. The women's

1:10:321:10:38

Champions League continues tonight.

Manchester City and Chelsea in

1:10:381:10:39

action. City host Linkopings. In the

WS -- WSL they are second behind

1:10:391:10:49

Chelsea, who play Montpellier

tonight. If both teams progress, it

1:10:491:10:52

would be the first time to British

clubs have reached the semifinals of

1:10:521:10:56

the competition.

We have done our homework on them

1:10:561:11:01

and we know they are a really good

team. They have dominated Swedish

1:11:011:11:05

football for a while. It will be a

big game. Tough opponents. It will

1:11:051:11:09

be nice to have a home game. We

played a wafer about ten games in a

1:11:091:11:13

row. It has been hard put to the

home support, we have great

1:11:131:11:18

supporters, great fans, and we love

having them at home.

1:11:181:11:21

Yeah, excited. Just one of two big

games later.

1:11:211:11:24

Now back to you. Let me bring you

this news. Pope Francis is going to

1:11:241:11:32

visit Ireland for six days in

August. That news just reaching us.

1:11:321:11:36

He will head to Ireland for six days

this summer.

1:11:361:11:44

The number

of women using donated eggs to try

1:11:441:11:47

and get pregnant has risen sharply

in the past 10 years,

1:11:471:11:49

latest figures show.

1:11:491:11:50

In 2006, 1,912 women had

IVF using a donor egg

1:11:501:11:53

instead of their own -

by 2016 that had risen 59% to 3,924.

1:11:531:11:58

The Human Fertilisation

and Embryology Authority say

1:11:581:12:00

the rise is down to a greater

awareness of donation

1:12:001:12:06

as an option, more donors,

and more same sex couples,

1:12:061:12:12

single and older women using them -

as well as a rise in the number

1:12:121:12:15

of women donating their eggs.

1:12:151:12:16

BBC Look North reporter

Ali Fortescue has spent time

1:12:161:12:19

with two women who have gone

through both sides

1:12:191:12:22

of the process.

1:12:221:12:25

It is the greatest gift that any

woman can give to another.

1:12:291:12:34

It can be a lifelong commitment,

but really, it's a drop in the ocean

1:12:341:12:38

compared to what the couples have

to go through to make

1:12:381:12:40

their baby possible.

1:12:401:12:44

The road to parenthood

isn't always easy.

1:12:441:12:50

In her late 30s, Amanda was told

she could not have children.

1:12:501:12:53

But six years and four

rounds of IVF later,

1:12:531:12:55

thanks to an egg donor,

Amanda has given birth

1:12:551:12:57

to her son, Max.

1:12:571:13:02

I had him when I was 44

so I was a really late starter.

1:13:021:13:06

Not for want of trying,

because we tried for about five

1:13:061:13:09

years to have a baby naturally,

and it was not until we went down

1:13:091:13:12

the IVF route that we found out

that it was never going to happen

1:13:121:13:15

for us.

1:13:151:13:16

Which, as you can imagine,

was devastating.

1:13:161:13:20

I just think it's something

that people expect.

1:13:201:13:24

It's something you expect

will happen at some point.

1:13:241:13:26

I was never broody but when you get

married and then your friends have

1:13:261:13:31

kids and it's just not happening

to you, it suddenly becomes the most

1:13:311:13:34

important thing in your life.

1:13:341:13:37

The only thing that

you can focus on.

1:13:371:13:39

For somebody to be able to give that

gift to another woman,

1:13:391:13:43

it's such a selfless act.

1:13:431:13:48

It's like the ultimate selfless act

that a woman can do is,

1:13:481:13:51

she's made my family.

1:13:511:13:52

She's made me a family.

1:13:521:13:54

It's amazing.

1:13:541:13:55

It's something that

people take for granted.

1:13:551:13:57

It's something that I've

tried so hard to achieve

1:13:571:14:00

and it is my greatest

achievement, having him.

1:14:001:14:04

But Amanda's story isn't unique.

1:14:041:14:07

The number of women having children

over 40 is at its highest

1:14:071:14:11

level for 70 years.

1:14:111:14:12

And more than half of those over

the age of 45 having

1:14:121:14:16

IVF use donated eggs,

which may explain the rise

1:14:161:14:18

of nearly 60% in the number of women

using donor eggs for IVF since 2011.

1:14:181:14:26

Meet Cathy, another mother,

expecting her third child.

1:14:271:14:30

But before starting a family

of her own, she donated eggs five

1:14:301:14:35

times to families that

she'd never met.

1:14:351:14:39

Somebody in my family had been

struggling with infertility for many

1:14:391:14:42

years, and I'd had a close friend

who had had multiple

1:14:421:14:45

miscarriages, so there was nothing

I could do to help either of those

1:14:451:14:48

friends and family members,

1:14:481:14:49

but it was quite frustrating

watching them go through this

1:14:491:14:52

heartbreaking journey,

and then there was a really kind

1:14:521:14:54

of straightforward way for me

to help other couples

1:14:541:14:56

who were going through fertility

battles of their own.

1:14:561:15:01

What was the actual process

like of donating your eggs?

1:15:011:15:03

It was quite straightforward really.

1:15:031:15:05

I just had some tests

and they all came back fine.

1:15:051:15:08

It was a case of matching my

menstrual cycle with the couple

1:15:081:15:11

I was helping, and then

it was about two weeks of taking

1:15:111:15:14

drugs and having eggs

collected at the end of that.

1:15:141:15:18

A lot of people think that

because you are doing the first half

1:15:181:15:21

of an IVF cycle it's very

gruelling on the body,

1:15:211:15:23

pumping yourself full of hormones,

but I think for a couple

1:15:231:15:26

going through IVF themselves, yes,

it's a gruelling process,

1:15:261:15:29

because hormones can

send you a bit doolally.

1:15:291:15:33

But when you are an egg donor,

you have got a vested interest

1:15:331:15:36

in helping somebody,

and usually it's a couple

1:15:361:15:38

you don't even know.

1:15:381:15:41

But at the end of the day,

if it doesn't work out,

1:15:411:15:44

then you have still tried to help.

1:15:441:15:45

I don't think it's nearly

as hard being an egg donor

1:15:451:15:48

and going through an IVF cycle

as it is being a couple

1:15:481:15:51

and desperately wanting a child.

1:15:511:15:55

Do you ever find it strange that

in a sense, some of your children

1:15:551:15:59

are out there and you don't

really know them?

1:15:591:16:03

I don't see it like that at all.

1:16:031:16:05

I did most of my cycles in my 20s

and 30s when I was mostly single,

1:16:051:16:09

and really for me, each month

I was going to be losing an egg,

1:16:091:16:13

I wasn't going to be doing

anything with that egg

1:16:131:16:15

at so it was going to be a waste.

1:16:151:16:17

It wasn't like I looked down

the toilet I thought,

1:16:171:16:20

that's a potential child

I've flushed away.

1:16:201:16:21

So I think, for me,

what I was giving was something

1:16:211:16:24

I wasn't using in my own life.

1:16:241:16:27

Whereas if you give blood,

if I give a pint of blood,

1:16:271:16:29

then I feel it for a few days

because that is something I do need

1:16:291:16:33

in my body and I will

replicate it again.

1:16:331:16:35

I didn't feel like I was giving

anything away that I was

1:16:351:16:38

going to use for myself.

1:16:381:16:39

So why do women donate their eggs?

1:16:391:16:42

With nothing beyond £750

compensation, it is thought many do

1:16:421:16:44

it as a simple gesture of goodwill.

1:16:441:16:49

People who receive eggs are amazed

that other women want to give them,

1:16:491:16:52

but that is because at the end

of their process they get this

1:16:521:16:55

amazing baby, but for somebody who's

giving eggs, it's...

1:16:551:17:02

I mean, it's an involved process and

it's a commitment, and obviously,

1:17:021:17:05

it can be a lifelong commitment.

1:17:051:17:07

But really, it's a drop

in the ocean compared

1:17:071:17:09

to what the couples have

to go through to make

1:17:091:17:11

their babies possible.

1:17:111:17:12

Donor children are allowed

to contact their biological parent

1:17:121:17:18

at 18, but knowing Max isn't born

from her egg has never

1:17:181:17:20

bothered Amanda.

1:17:201:17:21

It takes more than

genetics to be a mum.

1:17:211:17:24

I carried him, I nurtured him,

I have given birth to him.

1:17:241:17:27

I'm the one who gets up

in the middle of the night.

1:17:271:17:29

He's my son.

1:17:291:17:31

The hope is that more donor eggs

will mean more families like this

1:17:311:17:34

and more men and women given

a chance to become a parent.

1:17:341:17:41

Joining us now, Sapphire Fielding

who has donated her eggs four times.

1:17:461:17:48

She also has four

children of her own.

1:17:481:17:55

As is Maxine, who received an egg

donation from a friend when she

1:17:551:17:58

had problems with conceiving.

1:17:581:17:59

She now has a four-year-old

son called Jake.

1:17:591:18:01

Thank you for speaking to us.

Sapphire, what made you want to

1:18:011:18:06

donate your eggs not just once but

four times?

When I had people in my

1:18:061:18:14

life who have struggled with

infertility, I'm a blood donor and a

1:18:141:18:21

marrow donor and it seemed like I

could help these people who were

1:18:211:18:27

like the people in my life. So I

went looking for a way of going

1:18:271:18:31

about it. And they made such a

magical process. You know it is a

1:18:311:18:40

good thing that you're doing but

hearing stories of people who have

1:18:401:18:44

struggled with infertility that are

not close to you, if you could

1:18:441:18:49

bottle the feeling from egg

donation, it is a magical, warm

1:18:491:18:55

feeling. Knowing you are help

somebody create what I already have

1:18:551:19:02

with Mike four children, I would

wish it for everybody if I could. --

1:19:021:19:07

my four children.

And it was your

chance to have your little boy?

It

1:19:071:19:11

was, I started my IVF treatment just

before I was 40. I had been pregnant

1:19:111:19:20

naturally a couple of times and

unfortunately resulted in

1:19:201:19:25

difficulties. That was the previous,

I had the ectopic pregnancy. I met

1:19:251:19:34

my partner and want to start a

family and nothing was happening so

1:19:341:19:38

we went to the GP and got referred

and I was told I needed donor eggs.

1:19:381:19:45

At the time I was pregnant naturally

but did not know that at the time

1:19:451:19:48

and that resulted in an ectopic

pregnancy again so I had to go down

1:19:481:19:54

the donation route.

And you got a

friend to donate an egg?

I did, a

1:19:541:20:01

close family friend donated for me.

Several people had offered

1:20:011:20:08

previously but change their mind and

that is absolutely fine. It is

1:20:081:20:12

amazing thing for somebody to even

offer to do. We went down the IDF

1:20:121:20:18

process and we just got the one

legged -- IVF. That resulted in my

1:20:181:20:25

little boy, Jake.

He is gorgeous! A

lot of people watching will have a

1:20:251:20:31

million questions to both of you

about the process and going forward

1:20:311:20:35

what it means. You have given an

incredible gift to four people and

1:20:351:20:40

you have your little boy and nobody

would argue with that. Sapphire, do

1:20:401:20:45

you ever think, I have four of my

own children but there are four them

1:20:451:20:49

there and I don't know them, who

they are and where they are?

No

1:20:491:20:57

because I haven't given birth to

that child. The way I look at what I

1:20:571:21:02

have donated, I have given somebody

a seed and that's it. I don't know

1:21:021:21:07

chit, help it grow from feel every

movement inside, I am just giving

1:21:071:21:17

that away. Although biologically we

are kind of connected, that child

1:21:171:21:23

has nothing really to do with me,

that is a mum's job to be the month.

1:21:231:21:28

I don't look at it as I have a child

somewhere else, that is not how it

1:21:281:21:34

feels and how it is. It is somebody

else's child and I helped with the

1:21:341:21:39

DNA also when they

1:21:391:21:40

-- when the child turns 18, do they

have rights to know who you are? You

1:21:441:21:52

can write a letter before you donate

your eggs and give a description

1:21:521:21:57

about yourself and why you wanted to

donate. They are allowed to read

1:21:571:22:00

that at 18. I suppose they could

come and look for you, but the way

1:22:001:22:08

that a child born through egg

donation, they are always brought up

1:22:081:22:12

knowing that this is such a normal

part of them, this is how they were

1:22:121:22:16

made, I can't see them looking for a

part of DNA because that's their

1:22:161:22:23

mum. I'm nothing to do with that, I

am literally just an egg. I did not

1:22:231:22:27

have any part, like in an adoption,

if you adopt a child, there is a

1:22:271:22:34

part of you somewhere else out

there. It's not the same with egg

1:22:341:22:38

donation at all in my opinion.

I can

see you're getting quite emotional,

1:22:381:22:44

Maxine.

I just think it is a totally

overwhelming experience and it is

1:22:441:22:51

the most amazing gift that anybody

could ever receive. It's just such a

1:22:511:22:59

selfless act and to be able to be a

mum to a beautiful little boy is the

1:22:591:23:04

best thing ever. Without the help of

ladies like Sapphire, people like me

1:23:041:23:11

would not be able to be mums.

This

might be a strange question but it

1:23:111:23:16

crossed my mind earlier, the pack

your friend had donated an egg, does

1:23:161:23:21

she ever have any say in the

upbringing? Does she ever go, why

1:23:211:23:26

are you doing that with Jake?

Not at

all. We have a close relationship,

1:23:261:23:32

not in each other's pockets, I am

godmother to her little boy and she

1:23:321:23:38

is godmother to Jake and we are

there were each other if need be.

1:23:381:23:45

there were each other if need be. We

will work around at the time when we

1:23:461:23:48

need to tell them but now we carry

on with our normal lives. We are

1:23:481:23:52

always there for one another. The

lady that did it stays just amazing.

1:23:521:24:00

Thank you for speaking to us this

morning, I'm grateful to you for

1:24:001:24:03

sharing your stories.

1:24:031:24:05

The government is expected

to announce a significant pay rise

1:24:061:24:08

for almost all NHS staff in England,

apart from doctors.

1:24:081:24:11

Norman Smith can tell us more. What

do we know about the deal?

We know

1:24:141:24:20

it is a big deal and likely to cost

around £4 billion and that will mean

1:24:201:24:26

an average increase for NHS staff of

around 6.5% over the next three

1:24:261:24:32

years. The significance is that it

is way above the public sector pay

1:24:321:24:37

cap of 1% per year and seems to mark

the death knell of the public sector

1:24:371:24:43

pay cap which nurses and others in

the public sector have had to endure

1:24:431:24:47

for eight years, two years of the

pay freeze and six years of the cap

1:24:471:24:54

so they have seen their wages

pressed down. Now they get this

1:24:541:24:58

three-year deal, 3% this year, to

present the following year and 1% in

1:24:581:25:04

the final year. The interesting

thing, most of the money will go to

1:25:041:25:10

the lowest paid in the NHS. There

will be rises for those on band one,

1:25:101:25:17

the worst paid, people like cleaners

and porters, some of them will get

1:25:171:25:25

up to 29% over three years, a

whopping rise. There will also be a

1:25:251:25:35

rise in starting salaries for those

coming into the NHS. To give you a

1:25:351:25:39

sense of what it means in real

money, for some porters earning

1:25:391:25:46

around 15,000, their salaries will

go up to nearly 20,000 so a really

1:25:461:25:51

big increase for them. The other

interesting thing is that this is

1:25:511:25:56

money which the NHS is not going to

have to magic up, it is coming from

1:25:561:26:02

the Treasury and why that matters is

because previous increases for the

1:26:021:26:08

public sector, four example for the

police who got 1.7%, they had to pay

1:26:081:26:14

for that largely by finding the

money themselves which caused a lot

1:26:141:26:18

of anger among chief constables.

This is a big cheese moment not just

1:26:181:26:23

in terms of those who work in the

NHS and particular the lowest paid

1:26:231:26:27

but also in terms of austerity and

the public sector pay cap.

And is it

1:26:271:26:33

clear if this is going to be

accepted? It has been a long-running

1:26:331:26:38

dispute.

What was interesting was

that this morning I was talking to

1:26:381:26:42

some of the union people and I

expect them to say, yes, it is

1:26:421:26:49

-- is 6.5% but there is this and

that but not a bit of it. They are

1:26:491:26:55

pretty enthusiastic about what they

have got and I think we'll recommend

1:26:551:27:00

it to their members. They are not

unhappy about the deal they have

1:27:001:27:03

been offered. I suppose the question

that follows is where does the money

1:27:031:27:10

come from all the £4 billion is a

lot of money when we are still

1:27:101:27:14

borrowing a lot of money and when we

have average debt for every

1:27:141:27:18

household I think the Chancellor

said of £65,000 so we borrowing an

1:27:181:27:25

awful lot of money but the

government has 4 billion more to

1:27:251:27:29

give to nurses. Bear in mind that

teachers would be saying that they

1:27:291:27:33

want extra money as well and all of

the public sector will be knocking

1:27:331:27:37

on the door of the Treasury to say,

if you're giving it to the NHS, what

1:27:371:27:41

about us? The extra bill is likely

to be more and that raises questions

1:27:411:27:45

about what is going on in terms of

government thinking. My take is they

1:27:451:27:51

concluded that people feel we can't

go on any longer with this sort of

1:27:511:27:55

austerity, that austerity fatigue

has bedded in and we have reached

1:27:551:28:01

the outer limits with eight years of

pay restraint.

Thank you, Norman.

1:28:011:28:08

Let's talk to John Williams,

who's an A&E Nurse.

1:28:081:28:12

He earns around £30,000.

1:28:121:28:13

We've agreed not to identify

the hospital he works at.

1:28:131:28:15

And Fiona Johnson, who's

from the independent

1:28:151:28:17

health care charity,

the Nuffield Trust.

1:28:171:28:20

Thank you Paul speaking to us. John,

are you happy with what has been put

1:28:201:28:27

on the table?

It is very welcome to

receive this pay rise and that that

1:28:271:28:35

those on the lower end of the scale

are being rewarded. We worked

1:28:351:28:39

incredibly hard on it he paces and

are very much deserving of the rise

1:28:391:28:46

-- on a daily basis.

Do you think it

is a good deal, Fiona?

It is

1:28:461:28:51

important there is a recognition we

could not go on like this. The NHS

1:28:511:28:56

is not the NHS without its staff and

we have a massive problem of

1:28:561:29:00

recruitment and retention with

100,000 vacancies soak a step in the

1:29:001:29:04

right direction to in the eight

years of pay restraint -- so a step.

1:29:041:29:10

Do you think it will be accepted and

moved forward quickly? It has been

1:29:101:29:14

going on for a long time.

I am not

part of the negotiations but one of

1:29:141:29:18

the crucial thing is if there is

additional money coming in. The NHS

1:29:181:29:22

could not afford to shoulder the

extra £4 billion themselves because

1:29:221:29:27

they have massive deficit is already

so the Pledge made by the Chancellor

1:29:271:29:31

seems to be coming through and that

is really important for a

1:29:311:29:36

hard-pressed NHS.

What difference

will this money make to staff

1:29:361:29:38

working in the fund line and

particularly the people like the

1:29:381:29:44

porters and the lower paid staff? Is

it likely more people will stay in

1:29:441:29:49

the NHS instead of the droves

leaving that we have seen?

I would

1:29:491:29:53

certainly hope that was true. It is

very welcoming for the lower paid to

1:29:531:29:59

have this large increase. I do worry

about the staff who have been

1:29:591:30:05

serving for a long time, from what I

gather there will not be a huge

1:30:051:30:08

increase in their wages. To be

realistic, this pay rise over three

1:30:081:30:12

years is not in line with inflation

so it is still not a huge pay rise

1:30:121:30:17

and in real terms it is perceived as

a pay cut again.

I guess many people

1:30:171:30:23

are watching this in the private

sector would say that their pay is

1:30:231:30:26

not going up in line with inflation

as well, it is tricky for everybody.

1:30:261:30:30

It is, and it is worth remembering

that the NHS has been cutting costs

1:30:301:30:36

every year and probably around £2.5

billion of what it has managed to

1:30:361:30:40

save recently is accounted for by

staff before going salary increases.

1:30:401:30:45

NHS staff have had to do their bit

to keep costs down. And times are

1:30:451:30:50

tough for everybody.

Thank you for

coming in.

1:30:501:30:59

Still to come...

1:30:591:31:00

Tens of thousands of grandparents

looking after their grandchildren

1:31:001:31:02

are missing out on a little known

tax perk which can boost

1:31:021:31:05

their State Pension

by hundreds of pounds a year.

1:31:051:31:11

And after Ant McPartlin's arrest on

suspicion of drink-driving, what

1:31:111:31:17

next for Ant and Dec's TV

partnership?

1:31:171:31:22

Time for the latest

news - here's Joanna.

1:31:221:31:24

More than a million NHS staff

are poised for a pay rise,

1:31:241:31:27

with a deal that could be worth

as much as £4 billion

1:31:271:31:30

being announced by lunchtime today.

1:31:301:31:31

The BBC understands that health

bosses and unions have

1:31:311:31:33

reached an agreement that will mark

an end to a seven-year cap

1:31:331:31:36

and boost the salaries

of workers including nurses,

1:31:361:31:38

porters and paramedics,

but not doctors.

1:31:381:31:44

Facebook will be

questioned by politicians

1:31:441:31:46

in Washington today,

as the company comes under growing

1:31:461:31:49

pressure to explain how data

from 50 million users was used

1:31:491:31:52

by a British company during the US

presidential election.

1:31:521:31:55

It's alleged that Cambridge

Analytica used the data

1:31:551:31:58

to target voters and influence

the election outcome.

1:31:581:32:00

That company's chief executive,

Alexander Nix, has been suspended.

1:32:001:32:03

Both firms deny any wrongdoing.

1:32:031:32:08

Police in the United

States say the suspect

1:32:081:32:11

in a series of bombings in Texas

has died after blowing himself up.

1:32:111:32:14

Five devices have detonated

so far this month

1:32:141:32:16

and killed two people.

1:32:161:32:17

A sixth parcel bomb was intercepted

before it exploded.

1:32:171:32:24

As members of the Austin police

Department SWAT team

1:32:241:32:26

approached the vehicle,

the suspect detonated

1:32:261:32:32

a bomb inside the vehicle, knocking

one of our SWAT officers back.

1:32:321:32:35

One of our SWAT officers fired

at the suspect as well.

1:32:351:32:40

The suspect is deceased

and has significant

1:32:401:32:42

injuries from a blast that occurred

from detonating a bomb inside

1:32:421:32:44

his vehicle.

1:32:441:32:51

Unemployment rose by

24,000 to 1.45 million

1:32:511:32:53

in the three months to January.

1:32:531:32:55

It was the second month in a row

to show an increase.

1:32:551:32:58

However, the rate of

unemployment was down

1:32:581:33:00

slightly, from 4.4% to 4.3%.

1:33:001:33:04

Average earnings including bonuses

rose by 2.8% in the same period.

1:33:041:33:10

Reports from Nigeria say that

Boko Haram militants have

1:33:101:33:13

returned 76 schoolgirls

abducted from Dapchi

1:33:131:33:15

in the northeast of

the country over a month ago.

1:33:151:33:21

110 schoolgirls were abducted

from their secondary school

1:33:211:33:22

in February.

1:33:221:33:23

It's feared at least

five students may have died.

1:33:231:33:25

Eyewitnesses said a convoy

of vehicles dropped the students off

1:33:251:33:27

before driving away immediately.

1:33:271:33:33

That's a summary of

the latest BBC News.

1:33:331:33:40

Thank you. Let me read you this

message which is come into us. We

1:33:401:33:44

were talking about painkiller

addiction earlier. A couple of

1:33:441:33:49

people sharing their experiences.

They were critical of GPs and how

1:33:491:33:52

easily they were handing it out. One

guest said it was as easy as handing

1:33:521:33:57

out sweets. This text is quite long.

"I'm A practising GP of 17 years and

1:33:571:34:03

I'm sure there is a massive problem

with dependency to prescribe drugs.

1:34:031:34:08

However, this GP bashing agenda is

quite frankly scandalous. Patients

1:34:081:34:13

need to take some responsibility for

their actions. Falsely claiming to

1:34:131:34:16

be in pain when they are not is a

conscious decision the patient has

1:34:161:34:20

made in an attempt to falsely

obtained medications. I would

1:34:201:34:26

welcome a ban on prescribing many of

these drugs if GPs are not

1:34:261:34:29

competent. I would direct these

patients to specialist painkillers.

1:34:291:34:36

However, the patients currently wait

several months to be seen. How is

1:34:361:34:39

this additional demand going to be

met? Who will deal with the patient

1:34:391:34:43

while they're waiting months, not

the incompetent GP, surely? The

1:34:431:34:48

general public have no real

understanding of the pressures of

1:34:481:34:50

the NHS, and your is simply

attributing responsibility for the

1:34:501:34:55

failings of society to GPs, were

quite frankly getting setup as

1:34:551:35:02

reflected in the massive problems

with recruitment." Your experiences

1:35:021:35:07

welcome. Whether you are a GP, you

work in the health service or you

1:35:071:35:11

have an addiction to painkillers

yourself.

1:35:111:35:12

Share your stories with us.

1:35:121:35:13

Here's some sport now with John.

1:35:131:35:18

Good morning again. Scotland are

eyeing a place at next year's

1:35:181:35:22

Cricket World Cup. If they beat West

Indies in Zimbabwe this morning, a

1:35:221:35:26

place is theirs. They restricted

West Indies to 117-6 this morning.

1:35:261:35:32

Jason Holder was the last wicket to

fall for just 12 runs. For England,

1:35:321:35:38

with the test series against New

Zealand starting on Thursday,

1:35:381:35:41

Captain Joe Root says the return of

Ben Stokes is a huge boost. He will

1:35:411:35:46

play his first Redbook rigger for

six months. Nick Pope will hope that

1:35:461:35:52

he can impress England manager

Gareth Southgate in forthcoming

1:35:521:35:54

friendlies with the Netherlands and

Italy. Nine years after he was

1:35:541:36:00

released by Ipswich, he took place

in a milk round. Places in the men's

1:36:001:36:08

squad are up for grabs. Two English

teams could reach the semifinals of

1:36:081:36:14

the women's champions Victor An

Manchester City and Chelsea can come

1:36:141:36:18

through their quarterfinal ties. The

first legs play tonight. City play

1:36:181:36:23

Linkopings and Chelsea face

Montpellier. That is all this board

1:36:231:36:29

for now.

Back to you. Thank you.

1:36:291:36:31

Tens of thousands of

grandparents who look

1:36:311:36:32

after their grandchildren

are missing out on a little

1:36:321:36:34

known tax perk which can

boost their state pension

1:36:341:36:37

by hundreds of pounds a year.

1:36:371:36:38

The number of families claiming

the credit has increased

1:36:381:36:41

from about 1,000 to 9,000 over

the past year but up

1:36:411:36:45

to 90,000 are eligible.

1:36:451:36:48

We can talk now to Caren

Satter in North London

1:36:481:36:50

who looks after her grandchildren

on Wednesdays so her

1:36:501:36:52

daughter is able to work.

1:36:521:36:58

And Mandy Phillips,

who looks after her two young

1:36:581:37:00

grandchildren part-time

as both her daughters-in-law work.

1:37:001:37:08

How old are the grandchildren you

look after, Karen? How difficult is

1:37:091:37:12

it?

My grandson is five and a half

and he is at school now. And my

1:37:121:37:20

grand daughter, Megan, is too.

Recently she has gone to nursery. As

1:37:201:37:25

soon as I have finished with you, I

will be picking her up, then I will

1:37:251:37:30

bring her home and look after her

for the rest of the afternoon until

1:37:301:37:34

her mum comes home. How difficult is

it? It is not difficult at all. It

1:37:341:37:38

is wonderful. It is my pleasure. I

love it. I couldn't wait for them to

1:37:381:37:43

be old enough to be left with me.

I'm excited to hear there might be a

1:37:431:37:47

little bit of money that I can

recycle, so I will probably go and

1:37:471:37:52

buy some presents with it. It is a

never-ending story. You bring of

1:37:521:37:59

yours, you still -- you bring up

there's.

Mandy, are you at

1:37:591:38:07

hairdressers?

I am. I'm working as I

speak.

Tell me about your

1:38:071:38:14

grandchildren. You look after them

on a regular basis?

Yes, every week.

1:38:141:38:19

One of them is at school until

three. I pick her up at three. The

1:38:191:38:24

other one is a nursery until three

but I pick her up at 2:30pm so I can

1:38:241:38:30

get the other 143 o'clock.

And you

work. That has to be exhausting?

No.

1:38:301:38:37

I am a hairdresser. I take them both

from, I feed them and I bathe them.

1:38:371:38:42

One of my daughter-in-law is comes

and she takes her home at about six

1:38:421:38:50

o'clock. The other one stays with me

overnight. I then have all day

1:38:501:38:53

Tuesday because I don't work

Tuesday. Her mum comes at six

1:38:531:38:57

o'clock the following night. It is

really Monday and Tuesday.

I wonder

1:38:571:39:01

if you think it is fair that you are

effectively bringing up your

1:39:011:39:05

grandchildren? I don't mean totally

bringing them up. My generation of

1:39:051:39:10

working mums, a lot of people rely

on support of parents, don't they?

1:39:101:39:17

They do. I have got friends whose

children, many girls, who have

1:39:171:39:25

virtually got full-time jobs. They

are professional girls. They are

1:39:251:39:29

working four to five days a week.

I've got a friend with four

1:39:291:39:35

grandchildren. She is in her 70s.

She does more now as more

1:39:351:39:39

grandchildren have been born, I

won't say more than she did with her

1:39:391:39:43

own children, would she is certainly

under a lot of pressure. And she is

1:39:431:39:47

actually a widow. She is under a lot

of pressure. It is quite exhausting.

1:39:471:39:51

I think she loves it but by the end

of the week she is tired because she

1:39:511:39:54

is doing her childcare job. We are

not the age we should be bringing up

1:39:541:40:01

children. You are supposed to be in

your 30s, 40s. It will be

1:40:011:40:06

interesting with your donation

ladies, who are having Leyds

1:40:061:40:11

donations, they may not have

somebody grandparents to help them

1:40:111:40:13

because we may not be there.

I'm in

my 40s. I'm an exhausted working

1:40:131:40:19

mum. I know how tired I get looking

after my kids. That is why I asked

1:40:191:40:24

the question. It is demanding, isn't

it, Mandy?

It is demanding. But when

1:40:241:40:31

you are tired and raising your own

children and working, it's a

1:40:311:40:36

different kind of tiredness. I'm

tired whilst I'm looking after them.

1:40:361:40:44

Having two together helps. They play

with each other. I just organise.

1:40:441:40:48

Then choose to have got the other

one. She's a good child, so it's not

1:40:481:40:52

a problem. You enjoy doing it so

much. On Tuesday they are gone.

1:40:521:40:58

Although I do see them other times

in the week, maybe Sunday, whatever,

1:40:581:41:03

it is not continual. You do know it

is finite. With your own children

1:41:031:41:08

you are tired because it is

relentless. This isn't. There is a

1:41:081:41:12

reason why you have a special

relationship with your

1:41:121:41:15

grandchildren, and it is because it

is not continuous. If I couldn't do

1:41:151:41:20

it, I wouldn't.

Does this news that

you could be getting extra tax

1:41:201:41:25

breaks that will amount to several

hundred pounds a year, make a

1:41:251:41:29

difference? Or do you do it for the

love of it. I'm guessing by your

1:41:291:41:34

face that you think no right us I

can't believe we are getting a tax

1:41:341:41:41

break.

Money would be wonderful who

would not like more money. If I

1:41:411:41:48

wasn't working and there was no tax

break, I would still do it. They are

1:41:481:41:52

your grandkids. It's what you do.

Thank you both for speaking to us.

1:41:521:41:57

Don't work too hard at your

hairdressers!

Thank you.

1:41:571:42:03

What next for Ant and Dec?

1:42:031:42:04

It's almost impossible to imagine

one without the other.

1:42:041:42:06

The pair have been inseparable

for years both professionally,

1:42:061:42:08

as Britain's best-known presenting

duo, and personally, through their

1:42:081:42:10

longstanding friendship.

1:42:101:42:11

There you are, that's it,

Toff is our winner.

1:42:111:42:15

I hope you've all enjoyed the past

three weeks as much as we have.

1:42:151:42:18

All that is left for us to say

now though is, Toff,

1:42:181:42:21

you are a celebrity and you're Queen

of the Jungle.

1:42:211:42:24

Get yourself out of here!

1:42:241:42:25

Well done, Toff.

1:42:251:42:27

CHEERING.

1:42:271:42:35

A massive fan of yours, George.

1:42:371:42:38

So excited you're

on the show tonight.

1:42:381:42:40

Not as excited as I am.

1:42:401:42:43

I grew up watching this show,

it's amazing, thank you very much.

1:42:431:42:46

You grew up watching the show?

1:42:461:42:47

LAUGHTER.

1:42:471:42:49

I'll be honest, I'm

starting to go off him.

1:42:491:42:51

He's a little bit chatty, isn't he?

1:42:511:42:53

Stick to the singing, son.

1:42:531:42:55

He'll be back later

for the end of the show.

1:42:551:42:57

George Ezra, everybody.

1:42:571:43:00

OK then, here we go.

1:43:011:43:04

The winner of Britain's

Got Talent 2017 is...

1:43:041:43:12

Tokio Myers!

1:43:161:43:23

Well done, Tokio!

1:43:231:43:24

But following Ant McPartlin's arrest

on suspicion of drink driving,

1:43:241:43:34

his much publicised painkiller

and alcohol addiction and his split

1:43:341:43:36

from his wife, there are now

fears for their future.

1:43:361:43:38

We know Ant won't be returning

to this year's series

1:43:381:43:42

of Saturday Night Takeaway on ITV,

and Dec Donnelly is now

1:43:421:43:45

working out what to do

with the rest of the series.

1:43:451:43:48

So what could happen

next for the pair?

1:43:481:43:50

Someone who knows Ant well

is Colman Hutchinson.

1:43:501:43:52

He's a former executive producer

of ITV's Who Wants To Be

1:43:521:43:54

A Millionaire and Blind Date.

1:43:541:43:57

With me is Sam Wolfson,

editor of Vice UK.

1:43:571:44:00

He's written extensively about

the pair's on-screen friendship.

1:44:001:44:03

In Stoke-on-Trent is

Emma Jackson-Bowers who is a huge

1:44:031:44:05

fan of their Saturday Night Takeaway

programme.

1:44:051:44:07

Her husband got a tattoo

of both Ant and Dec.

1:44:071:44:15

Emma, I have to start with you. Why

has your husband got a tattoo of ant

1:44:171:44:22

and deck?

We want to enter the

competition to try and win the kids

1:44:221:44:27

a place on the plane. The trigger

competition was published just after

1:44:271:44:33

the show on Saturday night. It was

the best thing we could think of to

1:44:331:44:37

try and win a place.

That his

commitment to the cause. That is on

1:44:371:44:41

his arm, is it?

Is on his calf.

What

you make of what has happened to the

1:44:411:44:50

partnership over the last few

months, and the challenges that Ant

1:44:501:44:55

McPartlin has been feeling? Do you

feel sympathy?

I do feel sympathy.

1:44:551:45:01

He is going through a rough patch.

Everybody goes through rough

1:45:011:45:06

patches. With his addiction, the

divorce from his wife, he is in a

1:45:061:45:11

really bad place at the moment. As

for ant and deck as a duo, I feel

1:45:111:45:21

for Declan as well. This is through

no fault of his own that it could

1:45:211:45:25

possibly affect his career as well.

I want to bring you in, Coleman. I

1:45:251:45:31

know you know Ant McPartlin quite

well. I'm interested in some of the

1:45:311:45:35

comments made by celebrities on TV

in recent days. Phillip Schofield

1:45:351:45:40

has been supportive yet critical

about obviously drink-driving. And

1:45:401:45:44

also Piers Morgan saying this Ant

McPartlin is not the guy he knows.

1:45:441:45:49

Is he the guy you know?

1:45:491:45:54

First of all I had to say don't know

him well, I have only met him at

1:45:541:45:59

functions and had a meeting so I

don't know him personally so I

1:45:591:46:02

wouldn't be able to say what I feel

personally because I'm not a friend

1:46:021:46:07

of his and I don't know him on a

personal level, I have met him a few

1:46:071:46:12

times.

With regards to his future

and you looking at this from an

1:46:121:46:17

executive point of view, his future

and the future for Ant and Dec is a

1:46:171:46:22

huge brand for ITV?

Absolutely, it

is massive. I think the brand has

1:46:221:46:28

been so perfect, they are loved by

the nation, everybody thinks they

1:46:281:46:33

are perfect and wonderful and

suddenly there is a chink in the

1:46:331:46:37

armour over the last 12 months. And

I figured it is frightening. These

1:46:371:46:42

things can come to an end very

quickly. You look at Michael

1:46:421:46:48

Barrymore, he was huge in his day

and could do no wrong and everybody

1:46:481:46:51

adored him and it was wonderful and

suddenly a few things go wrong and

1:46:511:46:55

it is all over. It is terribly

worrying for them I think.

1:46:551:47:01

Particularly, I feel for both of

them but particularly for Dec. He

1:47:011:47:06

has not been involved in any of

this, it is not down to him, and his

1:47:061:47:13

career is under threat because of

the actions of Ant, which is

1:47:131:47:18

difficult.

Talk about that

friendship, you have written a lot

1:47:181:47:21

about how strong it is, they lived

near each other, it is quite an

1:47:211:47:26

incestuous relationship!

They are

very close, they go to each other's

1:47:261:47:29

houses and have dinner and go on

holiday together and have always

1:47:291:47:32

said that if the key to the success

that they are friends first and the

1:47:321:47:36

career has come from that. That is

why I think it is so difficult now

1:47:361:47:40

because they have said in the past

that they would not go on TV which

1:47:401:47:43

out the other -- without the other.

If Ant is out of this series of

1:47:431:47:51

Saturday Night Takeaway and

Britain's Got Talent, presumably

1:47:511:47:55

that means Dec is out as well. It

can quite quickly fall apart because

1:47:551:48:00

they have never really had a hiatus

from TV. Since Pop Idol in 2001 they

1:48:001:48:07

have been on Saturday night prime

time three shows a year pretty much

1:48:071:48:11

constantly. I think it will be

particularly challenging for them to

1:48:111:48:16

talk about this in a way that can

kind of work within their act and

1:48:161:48:22

who they are.

They handled it

brilliantly on I'm A Celebrity

1:48:221:48:25

because when Ant came back they make

jokes about it and because they drew

1:48:251:48:31

attention to it, it worked well also

slightly different if you look at

1:48:311:48:38

addiction to painkillers against

potentially a drink-driving offence.

1:48:381:48:43

They have tried it this time, a

couple of jokes and move on and

1:48:431:48:46

clearly that has not worked because

there has been another incident. I

1:48:461:48:51

don't want to speculate on whether

it is a relapse or whatever but it

1:48:511:48:56

is a serious incident and at this

point I think for the first time

1:48:561:49:00

ever they might have do drop the act

and talk seriously about what has

1:49:001:49:05

happened to regain that trust with

viewers. And also to be good

1:49:051:49:10

spokespeople for depression and

mental health issues.

How much of

1:49:101:49:14

this decision will be down to them

and how much will be taken out of

1:49:141:49:18

their hands by ITV and by the

advertisers?

I think the decision

1:49:181:49:22

will be taken out of their hands,

because I feel that ITV, their sense

1:49:221:49:29

would be that we cannot have him on

television at the moment when he is

1:49:291:49:32

under suspicion of this

drink-driving. It is a family show,

1:49:321:49:38

they are looked up to and admired.

They are role models for young

1:49:381:49:43

people. I think it would be very

difficult even if he wanted to

1:49:431:49:48

continue for him to continue at the

moment while this hangs over him. As

1:49:481:49:53

I said, they are role models and

that is what they are seen as an

1:49:531:49:57

they will have to overcome this

somehow. I think it is too early to

1:49:571:50:00

do that at the moment.

As a fan,

what is your take on this? Do you

1:50:001:50:07

think it would be appropriate to

seek Ant back on TV or do you think

1:50:071:50:12

it is too serious an allegation

which he is facing and therefore he

1:50:121:50:15

has to step back?

I would love to

see Ant back on TV but I think for

1:50:151:50:22

the moment he has made the right

decision by stepping away from his

1:50:221:50:27

work commitments and he needs to get

himself sorted and take some time

1:50:271:50:31

out to heal himself and get in a

better place but I would like to see

1:50:311:50:35

him back on TV. He is a big role

model for most of the kids.

I would

1:50:351:50:42

like you to have a look at this if

you can, because since we have been

1:50:421:50:47

on air, a viewer who want is that

Weight Ant and Dec has said Abbot

1:50:471:50:53

Point impact it had on their young

son -- who watches Ant and Dec.

Why

1:50:531:50:57

are you crying?

Because Ant and Dec

is not on any more.

Whose fault is

1:50:571:51:03

that?

Ant's fault.

It certainly is.

Come on now, stop crying.

I can't!

1:51:031:51:13

It's hard to watch. That is the

problem, they had to connect with

1:51:151:51:20

their audience and if their audience

is cross...

I think so come they

1:51:201:51:26

have a broad audience, it is not

little kids, it is mums and grandads

1:51:261:51:31

and everything and there is a lot of

the audience who will have dealt

1:51:311:51:35

with similar things that Ant is

going through and it is about

1:51:351:51:38

connecting with that group and be

able to talk openly about these

1:51:381:51:41

things. Obviously the priority has

to be his health and the safety of

1:51:411:51:46

others, drink-driving is a serious

crime. I am sorry for that kid, it

1:51:461:51:51

is upsetting, sad that we will miss

Saturday Night Takeaway as lobber

1:51:511:51:57

they have given it a go trying to

prioritise being on TV -- as well.

1:51:571:52:02

There was some talk on Twitter about

whether Scarlett Moffatt from goggle

1:52:021:52:10

boxed, she was on Saturday Night

Takeaway on Saturday, if she should

1:52:101:52:13

have sent -- on goggle box also

would ITV entertain the thought of

1:52:131:52:21

him presenting with somebody else?

I

think it would be a huge ask for her

1:52:211:52:30

to co-host with Dec, it is not an

easy job, they are hugely talented

1:52:301:52:34

and skilled at what they do and have

honed their skills over many years.

1:52:341:52:37

I think it would be virtually

impossible to get somebody like

1:52:371:52:42

Scarlett Moffatt, talented though

she is, she does not have that

1:52:421:52:44

quality is because she does not have

the experience. I cannot imagine

1:52:441:52:48

being in a position to be able to

co-host the show with Dec. I am sure

1:52:481:52:54

there are others who would be

capable, whether they would have the

1:52:541:52:57

same chemistry...

They could get

Tapili back.

1:52:571:53:06

Tapili back. -- Cat Deely. Thank you

all for coming back.

1:53:081:53:14

This morning we've been

asking if there's enough

1:53:141:53:16

help for people addicted

to prescription painkillers?

1:53:161:53:18

Nicki Hari told us her GP made

an addict of her in prescribing

1:53:181:53:21

them, but then had no idea how

to help her dependency, which ended

1:53:211:53:24

up lasting 25 years.

1:53:241:53:25

It wasn't until I was 18 that

I was put on very strong painkillers

1:53:251:53:29

after having my appendix out.

1:53:291:53:32

What were you put on?

1:53:321:53:34

On codeine, Co-codamol,

I was given tramadol and at the time

1:53:341:53:36

I realised that I actually

really liked that feeling.

1:53:361:53:43

It was like being on a pink

fluffy cloud, all of

1:53:431:53:46

my worries and stresses

went away and I just

1:53:461:53:52

my worries and stresses went away

and I just felt really

1:53:521:53:54

relaxed about everything.

1:53:541:53:56

The pain that I thought I had had

disappeared so that's when

1:53:561:53:58

it started.

1:53:581:54:02

Obviously it didn't continue

solidly until much later.

1:54:021:54:07

Presumably you came off those drugs

after you had the operation?

1:54:071:54:15

Yes, I came off them and it wasn't

until I got into rehab and I looked

1:54:161:54:18

at my journey from start to finish,

well, not finish because I haven't

1:54:181:54:22

finished my journey yet,

but I realised I could see a pattern

1:54:221:54:24

forming on how I loved

having the feeling of

1:54:241:54:32

prescription painkillers.

1:54:331:54:35

And it was very easy

to manipulate the system.

1:54:351:54:37

At the time the GPs were giving

them out quite freely.

1:54:371:54:41

I would go to my GP,

say I'm in a lot of pain in and be

1:54:411:54:44

given a tramadol repeat prescription

for six months so I didn't even have

1:54:441:54:48

to go to the GP and it doesn't take

very long to become addicted,

1:54:481:54:51

seven to ten days and you're hooked.

1:54:511:54:59

We can speak now to some

of our viewers who've got

1:55:021:55:04

in touch this morning.

1:55:041:55:05

Agnes is in Manchester -

she's addicted to painkillers

1:55:051:55:07

but says they're the only option

to address her pain.

1:55:071:55:11

Bob, who's in Doncaster -

his twin brother was

1:55:111:55:13

addicted to painkillers.

1:55:131:55:16

And Jo is in Glastonbury -

she says she tried to take her

1:55:161:55:19

own life after being

addicted to painkillers.

1:55:191:55:23

Thank you for talking to us. Tell me

about your situation and how you got

1:55:231:55:27

there.

I started when I was pregnant

with my now 12-year-old daughter. I

1:55:271:55:36

had slipped discs and I was given

Co-codamol at first but had a bad

1:55:361:55:43

reaction to it and two years after I

was given tramadol. A few years ago

1:55:431:55:48

in 2013 I became ill with CFS,

chronic fatigue syndrome, and I

1:55:481:55:57

experienced a lot of muscle pain and

this was basically the only thing

1:55:571:56:02

that helped me. I have been referred

to pain clinic, fried gabapentin,

1:56:021:56:08

this is the only thing apart from

coming off which might GB has

1:56:081:56:14

suggested to come off and just bear

the pain but it is not easy to live

1:56:141:56:18

with this type of pain.

I want to

bring in Bob. It was your twin

1:56:181:56:26

brother who was addicted to

painkillers?

That's right.

Tell us

1:56:261:56:30

what happened.

He was knocked off

his bicycle cycling to work one

1:56:301:56:36

morning, he taught maths in high

school, and subsequently had an

1:56:361:56:43

operation on his back which do not

go well and he was left in a lot of

1:56:431:56:48

pain. He was prescribed numerous

drugs over quite a period of time

1:56:481:56:53

but each time he was given a

different description he was not

1:56:531:56:57

allowed to come down off the

previous drug properly -- different

1:56:571:57:01

prescription. These basically just

fried his brain I think any tried on

1:57:011:57:07

a number of occasions to commit

suicide and in the end he managed to

1:57:071:57:11

do it.

It is desperately sad and I

am so sorry to hear that. I wanted

1:57:111:57:17

to bring in Jo, tell me your

experiences.

I'm approaching 50. I

1:57:171:57:28

was

1:57:281:57:35

was put on, tranquillisers, in my

20s. The dose was going up because I

1:57:351:57:42

was getting used to them and the

doctor was giving me more. What I

1:57:421:57:46

did not realise was one of the

side-effects was depression and that

1:57:461:57:49

led to me trying to take my own life

when I was about 21. A couple of

1:57:491:57:56

years later I was diagnosed with

various pain issues and put on very

1:57:561:58:06

strong opiate medication. This is an

exact TV stories we have had

1:58:061:58:10

throughout the programme.

Thank you

all very much for sharing your

1:58:101:58:14

experiences this morning. Thank you

for your company and all of the

1:58:141:58:20

messages you have been sending to

us, we do read them all. Have a

1:58:201:58:24

lovely day. Thank you for your

company.

1:58:241:58:32

Download Subtitles

SRT

ASS