30/09/2014 am.pm

Good afternoon. Welcome to the programme and our weekly coverage of

questions to the First Minister. It is another busy day in the Senedd

with Carwyn Jones' Government unveiling its draft budget for

2025/16 later this afternoon. It is thought there will be plans to

increase spending on health and it will be interest -- interesting to

see if that gets raised in questions today.

Business in the Chamber is already under way, so let's take a look at

today's questions to the First Minister.

The first item is Questions to the First Minister. Question one,

Antoinette Sandbach. Will the First Minister provide an update on what

the Welsh Government is doing to tackle dementia? Yes, together for

Mental Health - our focus is on improving rates of timely diagnosis

and increasing access to information.

PRESIDING OFFICER: They call for a specific Dementia

Strategy with clear lines of accountability. What guarantees can

you provide to those patients and their families who live with

dementia, that the Welsh Government is willing to listen and act upon

the recommendations that have been launched in the report today? Well,

Together for Mental Health provides that framework. I know that there

are many who are aware of that framework. The memo will be aware of

the dementia friendly communities and Dementia Friends campaign which

we have supports a a Government. In January, the Minister launched the

Alzheimer's Society Friends Initiative and that was funded by

the Welsh Government. The Alzheimer's Society provides

invaluable advice to those who are affected by dementia and by

Alzheimer's. PRESIDING OFFICER: Elin Jones?

TRANSLATION: First Minister, over 2,000 people have early dementia

before they are 60 years of age. And services are mainly

before they are 60 years of age. And years of age, 2,000 of them have

different needs, especially if they have residential needs as well?

TRANSLATION: That is correct. It is important and the strategy

identifies the fact that there should be care available to them and

dementia is entirely different in someone who is under 60 years of

age. It progresses more swiftly and we expect the Health Boards, when

they do consider services for people with dementia, to consider the needs

of those under 60 also. PRESIDING OFFICER: Question 2, Jenny

Rathbone. What is the Welsh Government doing to combat the

commercialisation and sexualisation of childhood? We are committed to

commercialisation and sexualisation protecting the rights of children

across all protecting the rights of children

PRESIDING OFFICER: Mohammed Asghar? I'm not aware of any companies that

have fallen into that category, but if the member has any evidence of

that, we will be pleased to consider it.

PRESIDING OFFICER: We move to questions from the party leaders and

first this afternoon we have the leader of the Welsh Liberal

Democrats, Kirsty Williams. First Minister, 1 in 200 pregnancies ends

in stillbirth, a figure that has not changed for some 20 years. Indeed,

the most recent figures available show that the rate in Wales is

increasing. What progress has your Government made in implementing the

recommendations of the health and social care committee's inquiry into

this heartbreaking tragedy? The incidents of stillbirths in Wales

has not changed greatly in recent years. Whether it is the case that

there is a level beyond which it cannot go down, that's a matter for

the medics to determine, but certainly we do have one of the

lowest rates in terms of stillbirths in the world. First Minister, I

would state quite clearly it is possible to drive down the number of

stillbirths in Wales. We just need concerted action to do so. The

Government did establish the Welsh Initiative for Stillbirth Reduction

which was charged with implementing the Committee's recommendation. That

came to an end earlier this year. Are you now confident that without

that initiative, measures around reduced foetal movement and growth

assessment programmes are being routinely implemented across all

obstetric units in Wales? Yes, we expect that to continue. The good

work that has been put in place thus far, we would expect to see

continued in the future. One method that seems to have a significant

impact on levels of stillbirth is to make these scans... They have seen

their stillbirth rate drop by 50% in three years. Would you commit to

looking at introducing similar scanning regimes here for all

first-time mothers in Wales? Well, based on the figures na the leader

of the Liberal Democrats has provided, this is something that

needs to be looked at. And I will ask the Minister to examine the

findings of that pilot project to see is whether it can be applied in

Wales. PRESIDING OFFICER: The Leader of the

Opposition. First Minister, the recent cuts in the skills budget of

?7 million along with other measures have realised a cut of ?10.7 million

to the apprenticeship programme. These notices were given to the

providers with only four days' notice of the contract starting on

August 1st. Why was this undertaken in such a shambolic way that has

jeopardised 9,000 apprenticeship places here in Wales? We have of

course more than 12,000 young people who have been helped through Jobs

Growth Wales. He needs to wait for the draft budget announcement in

terms of what the future funding is. But certainly, we believe we have a

very good record in Wales, particularly given the fact we have

had to deal with ?1.5 billion deficit from his party. I note in

the budget announcement today there is talk of additional money for

apprenticeships for up to 5,000 places. This is in-year cuts that

your Government has made to the current programme totalling ?10.7

million, that has threatened 9,000 places. 9,000 apprenticeship places.

Surely that reeks of shambles at the heart of the Government in dealing

with the finances, the providers were expecting the figures to be

delivered by March so that they could plan for the new contracts in

August. Why, with only four days' notice, was this devastation wrought

on this programme? We can't magic - I know he thinks there is a magic

money tree somewhere - but we can't magic up money. The reality is that

our record, when it comes to apprenticeships and providing young

people with opportunities, it is much better than his party has ever

come up with in any level of Government. First Minister, 1.8

million apprenticeships have been generated by the UK Government since

2010. What your Government has done has made in-year cuts. I am unaware

of any substantial in-year cuts given to your Government by the UK

and in fact we have had Barnett consequentials. What the people

seeking those apprenticeships want are some straight answers. Why the

chaos? I do take the point that apprenticeships have been successful

here in Wales. 66% - I'm happy to acknowledge that - 66% of people who

enter the apprenticeship programme find full-time employment at the end

of that programme. 80% of people who go on the programme can finish their

courses. There is a success story there. Sadly, your Government have

taken 10.7 million out of that budget, in mid-year, with four days'

notice. What does that say about the priorities for your Government? It

says that the priorities are all wrong, does it? Well, he is generous

in his praise - and I accept that. He can't say we have done well on

the one hand and on the other we have done badly. There have been

difficult decisions we have had to make. He mentions Barnett. Will he

join me then and other parties in pursuing the need for dealing with

the issue of underfunding in Wales? He keeps on saying - the reality is

that we are underfunded to the tune of ?300 million a year. Some will

say we are holding out the begging bowl. People whose parents and

grandparents worked in coal, steel and tin plate, who contributed to

the prosperity of the UK, is it asking too much that they should

have a fair share of the pot now? I hope he would join me and, in

fairness, other leaders in this chamber in standing up for Wales.

PRESIDING OFFICER: Finally, the leader of Plaid Cymru. Over the

summer, the Chancellor announced generous tax breaks for companies

who were interested in using fracking as a means of extracting

shale gas. There are varying estimates in terms of how much shale

gas could be extracted in Wales. But the UK Government seems intent on

pressing ahead with the granting of licences for drilling. Does the

Welsh Government share the UK's Government enthusiasm for fracking?

No, we take the precautionary approach. The planning issues are

devolved and that precautionary approach has not changed. Among the

many concerns raised by members of the public is the Department of

Energy and Climate Change decision to press ahead with simplifying

underground access for oil and gas developers, giving permission to

companies to drill on private land and private property. 99% of

respondents to the consultation objected to that. Should fracking be

permitted without the consent of the owner? There are real issues with

that. It is difficult to justify that to the public. If she is going

to invite me in her third question to consider whether the licensing

regime should be devolved, that is something I have some sympathy with.

That's good. Fracking remains controversial, as you are aware.

Plaid Cymru has suggested a moratorium on fracking operations

until and unless safety and environmental concerns can be

satisfied. Now, the issue highlights the wider problem that the country

has little competence over its own natural resources and I thank you

for your previous answer on that point. We do, however, currently

have powers and competence over planning. Would Welsh Ministers

support Welsh local authorities who wish to implement a de facto

moratorium using existing planning legislation? A moratorium is

difficult. If you impose a moratorium on fracking, there are

other technologies that would be drawn into it as well. Some will

argue, as I have heard from a moratorium on wind. What is

important - and I don't think we are very far apart - that caution should

be exercised when it comes to considering granting planning

permission for fracking and full consideration has to be given to the

environmental impact as well as the social impact. That much is true.

I would reiterate the point. I have heard what the UK Government has

said but our approach in planning terms remains the same. We moved to

questions on a paper again, question three. With the First Minister make

an announcement of the Welsh government's proposed back route

around the city of Newport, please? Subject to the necessary

investigations that have to take place, such as any potential public

inquiry, our view is that the black fruit would improve access to Wales,

and new junctions are included, and direct a simple Newport itself. It

would create increased connectivity for existing businesses and

employment sites across Newport and there are various stages of

examinations that it would have to go through. Associated British ports

have warned that the proposed black route will damage the economy of

Newport, leading to trade going to Bristol and Liverpool. Another major

Newport employer, I steel has called for an alternative route to be

examined. Will you now agree that a full public consultation and

examination of the suggested blue route needs to take place and that

the current plans for the black route should be put on hold whilst

this is done? With the Glasgow black route there are stages it must go

through. With the blue route, it is not what it appears to be. It would

cost about 800 million, not 300 million. It would be delivered in

the same timescale. I have travelled along the blue route. It has traffic

lights on it and it would need substantial amount of work. It goes

past a housing estate. One of the issues that would need to be looked

at is whether there's a danger in houses would have to be moved and

whether businesses would have to be moved. It is not a pain-free option.

It never was. Nor can it be delivered in a timescale that would

be faster than the black route. That said, I repeat what I said earlier,

there would need to be an environmental study, that much we

understand. They might well be a public inquiry. It is important that

these stages take place so that the can have transparency with regard to

the black route. With the First Minister agree that the M4 in

Newport and other businesses and jobs would benefit greatly from a

more integrated Transport system? And that the Welsh government's

pro-Iraqi should be public Transport including a south wales metro

system. The Metro system is moving forward and that is something that

we will develop. The traffic situation will get worse, it is not

going to improve. It simply is not the case that traffic will suddenly

disappear from that panel. -- panel. It is possible to develop the

Metro proposals. As well as examining the difficulties on the

road network. As indeed was done with the straightening of parts of

the A470. And a full consultation will take place on the black route,

but it is not the case of the development of the AM for having to

take place instead of -- the M4. First Minister, I know that the

announcement on the budget is subject to various votes in this

institution before it is confirmed, but art of the agreement seems to

relate to environmental assessment, another environmental assessment

around the black route for the M4 relief road. Will this work take

place of the budget deal is ratified or must the environmental assessment

weight as well until 2016 when we draw a line on the construction

phase? Another comment on a budget ahead of what the finance minister

may or may not say. It is important to reiterate that the preferred

route has been announced by the Minister. It is subject to various

stages of consultation for it to be as transparent as possible. Will the

First Minister make a statement on the implication of Welsh language

standards? I issued a mission statement on the timetable /which

standards in July and we continue to draft regulations according to that

timetable, and implement in those standards is a matter for the Welsh

language Commissioner. Can you state your intention to complete the three

rounds before the Assembly elections and are you reconsidering the draft

standards in January, when you mentioned a situation whereby it

means to receive services that are contracted out, which would not be

subject to standards? Now, one third of public services in Wales are

contracted out, and therefore, there is a huge gap in the standards. And

can I ask you to reconsider on that basis? I have to say, of course,

that consultation has taken place or is going to take place in terms of

the standards, and the regulations will be before the Assembly in March

so there will be considered -- an opportunity to consider how the

standards can be strengthened, given the situation that the member has

spoken about. First Minister, you will be aware of the comments made

by the SP, that the Welsh language Commissioner should use the

standards and a commensurate way to ensure that standards are called

with the needs of small businesses in Wales. Can you tell us whether

you government supports the comments made by the FSB, and if so, will you

be promoting this in your response to the consultation that you

mentioned a few moments ago? We want to make sure that we listen to the

views of everyone and every organisation that is associated with

this. And we want to ensure that the standards are standards that have a

strong and broad support across Wales, so we look forward to seeing

the comments made by the FSB. Thank you very much. First Minister, the

believe that when these standards are put to the Assembly four years

into the term of this current government, that that demonstrates a

clear commitment and an ability to plan efficiently and effectively in

terms of the Welsh language? What is extremely important is to ensure

that these standards are supported and are practical, and that means of

course that the commission has to be part of the process, and also, to

consult on the correct manner, and also to bring the regulations back

to the Assembly, in order to get wings right. Things do take a bit of

time. -- things right. Will the First Minister make a statement on

youth unemployment in Wales? We want to make sure that young people get

an opportunity to develop fully in life. We have mentioned jobs growth

Wales and the engagement and progression framework. Does the

First Minister and with me that the drop in youth unemployment in Wales

is an example of the Welsh government leading the way in the UK

with programmes like jobs growth Wales, and that the UK and Scottish

governments could do well to follow them? The member will not be

surprised if I say yes. We have seen substantial drops in unemployment

amongst young people in Wales, particularly those between 16-17

years old where there is a substantial difference to the better

between Wales and the rest of the UK, and that shows that Jobs Growth

Wales is having a significant positive effect on the prospects of

young people. Whilst we welcome youth unemployment being the Jews,

you will know that approximately 20% of young people have been out of

work for more than a year, and 10% of 16-year-olds are not in

education, employment or training. What will you now do to make sure

that this effective programme, which is so vital to the needs of Wales,

continues? We look at the progression framework which

introduced the youth guarantee for Wales. We have been funding

higher-level apprenticeships together with Jobs Growth Wales, and

of course we see success, one example is that the figure for NEETs

dropped in 2011-12, and we want to see that dropping further in future.

Given that more than one in five young people is not employed in

Wales, and that your government programme is being evaluated by

Ipsos MORI to make sure that your spending 73% of the budget on jobs

already in existence, why is the government cutting apprenticeship

programmes such as this when we need more of these programmes in place,

provided by the Welsh government? In terms of Jobs Growth Wales as a

scheme, it has given people the opportunity, young people, the

opportunity to have a job and develop skills. It is important that

they have had a job, but not the job that they have as result of the

scheme. We have to consider the value of the skills that they have

learned. Jobs Growth Wales does not assist young people in long-term

unemployment and is not accessible to many young people because of

double funding issues with UK Government schemes. And it is not

available in many parts of Wales, including the worst hotspot for

NEETs, Bridgend. Will you agree to review provisional support to those

young people in places like Wrexham, Bridgend and the Vale of Glamorgan

where long-term youth unemployment is a real problem, but Jobs Growth

Wales does not help? Jobs Growth Wales is aimed at them in the first

place. One of the first actions of her party in London was to cut the

Future Jobs Fund which was supposed to help so many young people. I do

not see that there is in Whitehall, an equivalent scheme that is

anything like as successful in offering opportunities to young

people as this scheme that we and the people of Wales are very proud

of. First Minister, Jobs Growth Wales has been particularly

successful, creating over 1000 jobs, 90% of them filled, and it is the

most successful area in the whole of Wales. Will you congratulate the

Labour-controlled carefully County Council have run in collaboration

with that scheme the passport programme, and European funded

scheme that has delivered an additional 176 work basements? --

placements. I will offer my congratulations to Caerphilly

Council. It is working well to provide opportunities for young

people. Will the First Minister make a statement on the availability of

cancer treatment in Wales? Cancer waiting times for treatment are

better than in England. First Minister, patience in England are

seven times more likely to gain access to cancer drugs and patience

in Wales. The UK Government spends ?200 million per year on a Cancer

Drugs Fund but as you know, here, we do not have one. There is a petition

winging its way to the Welsh government with tens of thousands of

signatures on it, calling for a cancer treatment fund, here in

Wales. When will the government reconsider the current position and

give cancer sufferers in Wales the treat and that they need and

deserve? There are cancer treatments in Wales that are not available in

England. Can we see a petition organised by his party complaining

about that? I wonder what the petition says. Does it say that it

once cancer treatment to be funded by taking funds away from the

treatment of other drugs, the way that it

treatment of other drugs, the way that the cancer treatment fund does,

is not the way forward for Wales. The message

world leaders, in terms of survival rates. Much of it depends on the

underlying health of the individual, much of it depends on GPs referring

early, which they are doing now. Certainly much more referral by GPs

of suspected cancers, fortunately it turns out that it isn't cancer, but

with lung cancer, early diagnosis is key. The GPs are keen to refer early

to give people a better chance at least of survival beyond one year

and hopefully beyond five. PRESIDING OFFICER: Kirsty Williams?

First Minister, these are techniques that we have the clinicians in Wales

who could carry out those interventions. Yet, to date, the

Government has decided not to offer those treatments here in Wales. In

June, I asked you this question. You said you would get the Health

Minister to reply to me. I am still waiting for that response. Could you

give a definitive answer here today about the Welsh Government's

commitment to provide this treatment for Welsh patients in Welsh

hospitals? I will rectify that. The Minister has heard today and I will

make sure the response is provided as soon as possible.

PRESIDING OFFICER: Question 7, Janet Finch-Saunders? Will the First

Minister make a statement on the roll-out of broadband provision in

North Wales? Yes, progress is good. It is being made with the roll-out

of super-fast broadband. Some exchanges have been enabled with the

fast fibre broadband. Thank you. As regards the super-fast broadband

roll-out and the significant investment, constituents and many

constituents are requesting more information than is currently

available as to how, where and when they will be able to receive the

service. Although more properties now access super-fast broadband,

take-up is lower than in England. It appears that little has been done

with regards the marketing and exploitation of the services

forthcoming and available now. And BT maintain they have had no funding

whatsoever for this. What steps is your Government taking to ensure

awareness is raised regarding the availability of this service across

Wales? Have you set a budget aside to do this? It is within BT's

interest to do that themselves. They are not allowed to spend it on that.

They are partners in terms of the roll-out. Nearly 234,000 premises

have been given access to fast fibre broadband. I am not surprised that

people are not using it as they should, probably because they

haven't got access to it yet. I am sure that will change as a result of

the super-fast coming. The market would never have delivered this,

this is a Welsh Government initiative ensuring that many

premises and settlements across Wales are getting access to

super-fast broadband in a way that would otherwise not be possible.

This is an investment in Wales' infrastructure and one that we are

proud of. TRANSLATION: According to a recent

report by the CAB on Anglesey, there is the highest percentage of people

who haven't used the internet at all, that figure is almost 30%.

Whilst I look forward to seeing super-fast broadband available

across the whole of Wales, does the First Minister agree that we need to

prioritise areas such as Anglesey and ensure that everyone has access

to the internet because it's the disadvantaged who lose out most of

not being able to access the service?

TRANSLATION: It is difficult to say that. Every member in this place

would say that their area is the one that should have priority. What is

important is that this happens quickly to ensure, of course, that

people of Anglesey have access to the broadband. If I could just say,

in terms of individuals, there will be details available for them and

also they will receive details whether there is a grant available

for them, of course, or whether they wait for the fibres to arrive in

their areas. But we have to remember that in a year-and-a-half, we will

be in a situation where a high percentage of over 90% of the people

of Wales will have access to broadband.

PRESIDING OFFICER: Question 8, Llyr Gruffydd?

TRANSLATION: Will the First Minister make a statement on community

hospitals in North Wales? TRANSLATION: People across Wales

have equity of access to high quality care, designed to meet their

individual needs as close to home as possible.

TRANSLATION: Thank you for that response. I'm sure you will know on

Thursday the people of Flint will vote in a local referendum for or

against a community hospital. I am sure you will recall the hospital

there closed some 18 months ago. That proved to be very unpopular

locally and, according to many locals, it caused a decline in

services locally. Can I ask you to respect the outcome of that

referendum? If there is a street in favour of a hospital renewal,

encourage the Local Health Board to consider that decision seriously?

TRANSLATION: We can't re-open this. The decision itself has not been

given to Welsh Ministers by the Community Health Council. There is

no role for Welsh Ministers. This was their choice. Can I just say one

thing? I understand that people always find it extremely difficult

when they see something closing, when they have been used to it over

the years - I have seen it in my own constituency. What happens is that

when they see the new resources that are available, nobody wants to go

back to the old system. So, what I would tell the people of Flint is, I

know that there are plans there to ensure that new resources are

available to the people of Flint, resources that would enable people

to remain at home and have care there, instead of going to hospital.

I would say you have to consider what else will be available and

experience shows that when there is something new available, and there

was a very strong campaign against closing a local hospital in one

area, there is a brand-new centre that is popular in the community.

What I would say to these people is, give these plans a chance. In terms

of what Welsh Ministers can do, the system, the Community Health

Council, of course, hasn't given this to Welsh Ministers to

reconsider. PRESIDING OFFICER: Antoinette

Sandbach? The figures that your Government published last week

highlighted the problem of bed-blocking in the Welsh NHS. That

is a direct consequence as a result of the closure of community

hospitals. The Welsh average saw 63% of patients waiting to leave

hospital, delayed by three weeks. When we are seeing delays like this,

and getting people out of hospital, and particularly out into community

hospitals, so they are not causing problems in the District General

Hospitals. Surely, you should pay attention to referendums like that

happening in relation to the Flint community hospital. Otherwise, how

do you plan to deal with those delayed releases of care? First of

all, the member gives the impression that delays have increased, they

have not, they have gone down. The number of delays in July of this

year is 10% lower than the figure in August of last year. So, her entire

argument goes out of the window... 73% last time. I don't want people

to be discharged from General Hospitals into other hospitals. I

want people to go home, that is the whole point. I want to make sure

there are opportunities for people to get the enhanced care they need

to go home and not sit in hospitals for weeks upon weeks. Three weeks on

average. I don't accept her premise that what we should do is to move

people out of a DGH and into a community hospital and forget about

them. I'm not prepared to do that. The Minister is not prepared to do

that either. I want to see people back at home. That is exactly what

we will do as a Government. First Minister, the problem you have is a

lack of trust as far as North Wales' residents are concerned. Time after

time, those new facilities have not been opened. We have lost 50

community beds over the last 18 months. We have also lost 370 beds

during the last four years from our District General Hospitals. So, the

real issue is, not only are we faced with no new facilities being opened

to replace the beds that are being taken out of the system, there is

also a situation where care provision within the sector is also

being blocked by local authorities due to the cuts in local authority

social services' budgets. Can I say in relation to Flint, our there are

proposals for a joint health and housing scheme, a new primary care

resource centre in the town. I cannot see why people would be

against that. I gave an example in my own constituency of a care home

that closed. People were up in arms about it. It was an elderly

building. People were sharing rooms, sharing bathrooms. But people were

very attached to the building. We accepted that. Now, there is an

extra care facility there and nobody wants to go back to the old system.

So, the point I would make is, where you have new facilities, people who

are very much against a change in provision, when they see the new

provision and the new resources, they will often change their mind.

My message would be to people - I understand people are very attached

to hospitals, particularly hospitals that have been there for many years,

but there comes a time when we have to move to a system which is better

for patients and enables more people to be looked after at home, which is

what we all want to see. PRESIDING OFFICER: Question 9,

Rhodri Glyn Thomas? TRANSLATION: Will the First Minister

make a statement on local government reform?

TRANSLATION: The Minister made a statement on this last week.

TRANSLATION: I am sure the First Minister would agree that if we are

going to have a sustainable answer to how to provide public services in

Wales, that we have to look at the public services as a whole. Why,

therefore, did you prevent the Williams Commission from looking at

the Health Service and other public services in Wales in the report that

was prepared for you as a Government?

TRANSLATION: That was not the case. What I told the Williams Commission

is we don't want to reconsider the boundaries of the Health Boards as

they were. Therefore, we didn't want to look at it again a few years

after having done it. On everything else, the Williams Commission had

the opportunity to consider and we must bear in mind that the Williams

Commission itself considered all parts of the public sector, not just

local government, although... STUDIO: We leave First Minister's

Questions there. You can see more coverage of the National Assembly

online. That is it for today. We will be

back with more First Minister's Questions next week. Don't forget,

for all the latest political news, watch Wales Today later today at

6.30pm on BBC One Wales. As for am.pm, from all of us on the

programme, goodbye. Well, of all the people

that I've met,