Browse content similar to 29/06/2011. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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Good afternoon and welcome to Politics Scotland. | :00:18. | :00:21. | |
On today's programme we'll be looking at the latest ideas to | :00:21. | :00:25. | |
streamline public services in tough economic times. | :00:25. | :00:27. | |
And confirmation today that there'll be no fees for Scottish | :00:27. | :00:31. | |
students before or after graduation. But the Education Secretary, Mike | :00:31. | :00:33. | |
Russell, will tell Holyrood there'll be bigger fees for other | :00:33. | :00:40. | |
UK students coming north to study. We'll hear the announcement live. | :00:40. | :00:43. | |
But, first, the Christie Commission, who have said today that public | :00:43. | :00:48. | |
bodies in Scotland need to work together and eliminate waste. The | :00:49. | :00:51. | |
Commission's report for the Scottish Government says that there | :00:51. | :00:54. | |
must be change, otherwise rising demand will "overwhelm" the system. | :00:54. | :00:56. | |
The Commission says the focus should be on earlier prevention of | :00:56. | :01:00. | |
problems to avoid huge costs further down the line. Commission | :01:00. | :01:03. | |
chairman Campbell Christie, once the General Secretary of the STUC, | :01:03. | :01:06. | |
was asked whether Scotland could afford to make the switch to | :01:06. | :01:15. | |
problem prevention. We can't afford not to. For by | :01:15. | :01:18. | |
following through all the recommendations of the report we | :01:18. | :01:22. | |
will be was ceasing - - releasing resources by avoiding duplication. | :01:22. | :01:30. | |
If we can get services working together then we can make savings | :01:30. | :01:34. | |
and that can go into providing prevention. We need to do it | :01:34. | :01:38. | |
because if we don't the demand in public services will be an | :01:38. | :01:43. | |
increasing number of elderly, and we are not so addressing problems | :01:43. | :01:48. | |
that we know we exist with young people. It has to be done. With us | :01:48. | :01:51. | |
today in the studio is the commentator Alf Young, former | :01:51. | :01:59. | |
assistant editor of the Herald newspaper. What do you make of the | :01:59. | :02:04. | |
Christie commission's report? Can you explain about early | :02:04. | :02:10. | |
intervention? There is a number in there that is interesting. 40 % of | :02:10. | :02:13. | |
all the money spent in the public sector at the moment is spent on | :02:13. | :02:17. | |
trying to resolve problems that have arisen because of not | :02:17. | :02:21. | |
intervening early, whether it is in early years education or early | :02:22. | :02:29. | |
stages of illness and so on. There is a kind of magic possibility out | :02:29. | :02:34. | |
there that if you can do the preventative stuff quickly and | :02:34. | :02:37. | |
effectively, then you don't have to spend all the money later on | :02:37. | :02:44. | |
sorting out the problems that arise. The problem is, the think the way | :02:44. | :02:48. | |
to do it is to get all the big services like the health service | :02:48. | :02:52. | |
and local authorities to collaborate and work together. | :02:52. | :02:59. | |
Getting them to do that, the rhetoric has gripped - - is of | :02:59. | :03:05. | |
great, but getting big public bodies to work closely together is | :03:05. | :03:14. | |
incredibly difficult. So some quite high ideals, in a way, but there | :03:14. | :03:19. | |
have been criticisms that it is quite a Willie report. There is a | :03:19. | :03:25. | |
good analysis there. There are big issues in terms of democratic | :03:25. | :03:32. | |
change hands in services. Also the fact that the money will not be | :03:32. | :03:42. | |
:03:42. | :03:44. | ||
there. The Budget will not recover across the public sector until 2026. | :03:44. | :03:49. | |
The EC agenda has always been for politicians to change organisations, | :03:49. | :03:56. | |
to reorganise local government or integrated this or that - - easy | :03:56. | :04:05. | |
agenda. It is easy, but costly. It is much harder to get the | :04:05. | :04:09. | |
integration of activity where people worked intimately together | :04:09. | :04:14. | |
and see themselves as being part of the same delivery with the focus on | :04:14. | :04:24. | |
:04:24. | :04:28. | ||
the customer, on the public. So that it would be a service when you | :04:28. | :04:33. | |
are dealing with the private sector you get what you want, businesses | :04:33. | :04:39. | |
have to serve your needs. In the public sector it is the same. But | :04:39. | :04:44. | |
that is hard to deliver. We are going to hear Mike Russell speak | :04:44. | :04:50. | |
soon. What will he set out? He is looking at the big changes that are | :04:50. | :04:54. | |
coming in England in university education and the impact on that | :04:54. | :04:59. | |
appear. If more and more students want to come here because it is a | :04:59. | :05:03. | |
cheaper option, then the Scottish system has got to deal with that | :05:03. | :05:06. | |
because the gap between what they are prepared to do in terms of not | :05:06. | :05:11. | |
charging fees against what is happening in the South is a | :05:11. | :05:16. | |
headache for him. Let's go over to the main debating | :05:16. | :05:18. | |
chamber at Holyrood and listen to the statement by the Education | :05:18. | :05:28. | |
:05:28. | :05:35. | ||
Secretary, Mike Russell. He is just about to get up on his feet. | :05:35. | :05:39. | |
Today and return to the chamber to set out the next steps, steps that | :05:39. | :05:43. | |
will be taken in the context of a wider ambition on education in | :05:43. | :05:48. | |
Scotland. My vision is of a sector of the plays an important role | :05:48. | :05:51. | |
delivering improved life chances for young people that provides the | :05:51. | :05:55. | |
best outcomes for learners, they take that world class research base | :05:55. | :06:01. | |
of the even greater success and makes them as well possible | :06:01. | :06:04. | |
contribution to getting greater economic growth for Scotland. | :06:04. | :06:09. | |
Scottish universities are highly regarded and will play as a central | :06:09. | :06:14. | |
role in our vision for Scotland. We want to protect and enhance the | :06:14. | :06:17. | |
competitiveness while ensuring that they provide opportunities for all. | :06:17. | :06:22. | |
Before the election I was clear that the debate on higher education | :06:22. | :06:25. | |
were sometimes too narrowly focused on the issue of fees. The green | :06:25. | :06:35. | |
paper opened up a more fundamental discussion. We will not follow | :06:35. | :06:40. | |
England by pitting unmanageable debt burden on our graduates. The | :06:40. | :06:45. | |
average Scottish graduate currently has less than have their debts, | :06:45. | :06:49. | |
almost �11,000 less, than their English counterparts. With the new | :06:49. | :06:55. | |
arrangements in England graduates could walk out with an average of | :06:55. | :07:01. | |
�30,000 debt. We do not think tuition fees are the right solution | :07:01. | :07:07. | |
for us. As Ken Mackintosh said, the Conservatives are side we have | :07:07. | :07:12. | |
solidarity on this issue. This is no longer a live issue for us. | :07:12. | :07:17. | |
Higher education is based in this country on the ability to learn, | :07:17. | :07:23. | |
not the ability to pay. Our first step must be to address the | :07:23. | :07:29. | |
financial challenges ahead, the challenges created by decisions in | :07:29. | :07:37. | |
England. I have been clear onto issues, we will not charge fees for | :07:37. | :07:42. | |
Scottish students and we will fund the sector so it can retain its | :07:42. | :07:45. | |
competitive position. Alastair Sim from the University of Scotland | :07:45. | :07:48. | |
said that that the situation and England will not be clear until | :07:48. | :07:53. | |
next month. Moreover, universities UK said it will not be fully clear | :07:53. | :07:56. | |
until students start to take their places in university next year. It | :07:56. | :08:01. | |
is possible that yesterday's lunch of the UK white paper may have only | :08:01. | :08:04. | |
added to that uncertainty. But I intend to use the best information | :08:04. | :08:09. | |
we have available over the summer recess to work with the sector | :08:09. | :08:11. | |
through the Spending Review to start to put the funding solution | :08:11. | :08:16. | |
for them into place now. Today am announcing what response will be to | :08:16. | :08:26. | |
:08:26. | :08:26. | ||
hire fees in England and Wales - - higher fees. Scollan welcome | :08:26. | :08:29. | |
students from all over the world and we want them to continue to | :08:29. | :08:34. | |
come here because of the quality of what we offer. But we must be the | :08:34. | :08:39. | |
best option, not the cheapest and we need to move quickly. Or | :08:39. | :08:44. | |
universities are starting to plan recruitment campaigns for 2012 and | :08:44. | :08:49. | |
13. We must provide clarity for potential students from the rest of | :08:49. | :08:53. | |
the UK who want to make the choice to study in Scotland. I am | :08:53. | :08:56. | |
launching a consultation on proposals for secondary legislation | :08:56. | :09:03. | |
to allow Scottish universities to set their own fees from students | :09:03. | :09:08. | |
from the rest of the UK. A plant in Trig - - and introduce primary | :09:08. | :09:16. | |
legislation which will restrict to �9,000 per Adam - - per annum that | :09:16. | :09:21. | |
they can charge to students not from Scotland. This means that we | :09:21. | :09:25. | |
can expect to see a range of potential fees for other UK | :09:25. | :09:29. | |
students from �1,800 to �9,000 giving institutions flexibilities | :09:29. | :09:33. | |
to target their recruitment. I would expect the average fee has | :09:33. | :09:41. | |
gone to be law than an England, possibly about the �6,375 figures. | :09:41. | :09:46. | |
We have no option but to act. If we did nothing students from England | :09:46. | :09:51. | |
in particular with pages of rate in hundred pounds a year to attend a | :09:51. | :09:56. | |
Scottish university, compared to five times the total in their home | :09:56. | :10:00. | |
nation. Action is essential to make sure that Scottish students are not | :10:00. | :10:07. | |
squeezed out by students from elsewhere. Our universities will | :10:07. | :10:10. | |
still be able to offer Scott are students the same number of places | :10:10. | :10:14. | |
next year as they did this year. In fact in time and they allow them to | :10:14. | :10:20. | |
offer more places I will ensure also that the additional revenue is | :10:20. | :10:29. | |
distributed fairly. We will work with the groups to ensure that the | :10:29. | :10:32. | |
additional income generated helps the whole of the sector. The | :10:32. | :10:37. | |
consultation process will run from today until the 2nd September with | :10:37. | :10:42. | |
the relevant secondary legislation to be laid later that month. As | :10:42. | :10:45. | |
well as implementing these new arrangements we will continue to | :10:45. | :10:48. | |
explore the feasibility within the boundaries of European law of a | :10:48. | :10:52. | |
management fee for a European Union students. This is a complex area | :10:52. | :11:00. | |
and we need to take her time to explore what might be possible. I | :11:00. | :11:05. | |
hope to be able to say more about this later in the year. My | :11:05. | :11:10. | |
aspirations for the sector are wider than just financial. They | :11:10. | :11:13. | |
must have mordant and transparent governance arrangements in our | :11:13. | :11:20. | |
universities as a prerequisite. These plans will be shaped by the | :11:20. | :11:30. | |
:11:30. | :11:31. | ||
amounts were they made two years ago. The review will look into | :11:31. | :11:34. | |
whether or not there is the appropriate level of autonomy and | :11:34. | :11:41. | |
transparency. I am publishing the remit of the review today alongside | :11:41. | :11:46. | |
a call for evidence. I expect to have recommendations by the end of | :11:46. | :11:52. | |
this year and to legislate next year. We must go further than that. | :11:52. | :11:56. | |
In September it will bring forward more detailed proposals in the pre- | :11:56. | :11:59. | |
legislative paper covering not just universities but also colleges, | :11:59. | :12:04. | |
skills and training. This will be followed by a period of public | :12:04. | :12:08. | |
debate before legislation covering the reform of all those areas has | :12:08. | :12:12. | |
introduced to the parliament some time in 2012. Meeting the needs of | :12:12. | :12:16. | |
the learner will be at the heart of those proposals. Scotland's ability | :12:16. | :12:19. | |
to flourish is dependent on its people and I'm committed to | :12:19. | :12:22. | |
ensuring all of our people have the opportunities they need to improve | :12:22. | :12:26. | |
their life chances, their attainment and employability. There | :12:26. | :12:30. | |
will be tough choices and we need to be much clearer about the | :12:30. | :12:40. | |
:12:40. | :12:40. | ||
provision on offer. He broadly speaking, my proposals for reform | :12:40. | :12:43. | |
will include more efficient and flexible learner progression with | :12:43. | :12:47. | |
more students capable of moving from school to college to | :12:47. | :12:51. | |
university into jobs. In standardisation of learning | :12:51. | :12:57. | |
provision. Creating structural change across the entire post 16 | :12:57. | :13:03. | |
education landscape so it is more efficient. Guaranteeing wider | :13:03. | :13:08. | |
access including Loring so she'll economic barriers. Maintaining | :13:08. | :13:14. | |
Scotland's World bidding position in university led research. | :13:14. | :13:16. | |
Developing student support arrangements that are fair and | :13:16. | :13:20. | |
affordable. Enjoying governance in universities has greater | :13:20. | :13:26. | |
accountability for public funding. And simplifying the funding | :13:26. | :13:30. | |
structures and flows for both higher and further education. I am | :13:30. | :13:34. | |
pleased to deny to the parliament today that a plan to hold a review | :13:34. | :13:38. | |
of the Government's other - - governance of a further education | :13:38. | :13:42. | |
colleges. This will examine the quality and potential future | :13:42. | :13:46. | |
contribution they can be made by enhanced governance structures for | :13:46. | :13:55. | |
our colleges. The review will be led by Professor Russell great - - | :13:55. | :14:05. | |
:14:05. | :14:07. | ||
Russel Griggs. I believe that the Government's instructor of colleges | :14:07. | :14:11. | |
should a strong regard to democratic accountability. There | :14:11. | :14:15. | |
must be world class leadership and scrutiny in order to support the | :14:15. | :14:19. | |
economic and social role of colleges and what will be a very | :14:19. | :14:24. | |
highly challenging future climate. I'll be asking Professor Griggs to | :14:24. | :14:29. | |
give us recommendations. I'll be asking him to consider what | :14:30. | :14:34. | |
improvements can be made to the democratic accountability of our | :14:34. | :14:37. | |
colleges. What we teach and what we learn has played an important part | :14:37. | :14:41. | |
in developing Scotland's people, economy and society. Education | :14:41. | :14:46. | |
plays a central role in improving life chances, learning in all its | :14:46. | :14:50. | |
forms has a wide reach. At one end of the spectrum it helps those | :14:50. | :14:54. | |
furthest from the labour market to employments, the other gives high- | :14:54. | :15:03. | |
level skills and work - - world leading research. These proposals | :15:03. | :15:06. | |
for reform are ambitious and represent them a significant change | :15:06. | :15:11. | |
since devolution and I believe they will transform for the better the | :15:11. | :15:14. | |
education and training landscape, enhancing the life chances of all | :15:14. | :15:22. | |
Scottish people. The first Earl of Birkenhead was Rector of Aberdeen | :15:22. | :15:26. | |
University and in his address he said Scotland is renowned as the | :15:26. | :15:33. | |
home of the most ambitious race in the worlds. A great compliment. I | :15:33. | :15:36. | |
am ambitious for the people of Scotland and our proposals will | :15:36. | :15:42. | |
ensure that those great ambitions are realised. Education makes | :15:42. | :15:51. | |
The Cabinet secretary will take questions on the issues raced in | :15:51. | :15:55. | |
the statement, I intend to allow round 20 minutes for questions, | :15:55. | :16:01. | |
after which we will move on to next item of business. For those members | :16:01. | :16:05. | |
who wish to ask the Cabinet secretary a question, could you | :16:05. | :16:12. | |
please press your request to speak button now. Can I thank the minute | :16:12. | :16:18. | |
For an advance copy of his statement. Can I broadly welcome | :16:18. | :16:20. | |
the further information he has provided on the review of higher | :16:20. | :16:25. | |
education and the announcement of a review into further education. | :16:25. | :16:28. | |
Labour agree that we wish to see an improvement in accountability in | :16:28. | :16:32. | |
these areas an we look forward to discussing proposals at a later | :16:32. | :16:36. | |
stage. I am slightly taken aback by some of the ministers comment tons | :16:36. | :16:40. | |
issue of fee charges forest of UK students. Which seem to beg more | :16:40. | :16:44. | |
questions than answers. The minister has set the fee cap at | :16:44. | :16:50. | |
�9,000 a year, but can I ask to clarify whether this applies over | :16:50. | :16:55. | |
three years, or over the typical Scottish four year course. Does the | :16:55. | :16:58. | |
Cabinet secretary accept that if it is open to principles, to set a | :16:58. | :17:03. | |
four year charge of �9 thousand a year, the Cabinet secretary is in | :17:03. | :17:07. | |
the ludicrous position of setting higher fierce Scotland than in | :17:07. | :17:10. | |
England. Can I ask the Cabinet secretary will any university | :17:10. | :17:15. | |
introducing the fees have to meet the criteria set by the Office of | :17:15. | :17:20. | |
Fair Access, or are there no widening access obligations | :17:20. | :17:26. | |
attached? On the principles behind his thinking here can I ask the him | :17:26. | :17:31. | |
to clarify whether he see the primary purpose to deter fee | :17:31. | :17:35. | |
refugees or as an income generator? If it is the former, does he plan | :17:35. | :17:39. | |
to set a limit on the number of places available to rest of UK | :17:39. | :17:43. | |
students? The minister began his statement by ruling out a market | :17:43. | :17:47. | |
for higher education for Scottish students, but by allowing course by | :17:47. | :17:50. | |
course and institution by institution flexibility over rest | :17:50. | :17:54. | |
of UK fees, does the minister think it accept to believe create a | :17:54. | :17:58. | |
market for English students? There are widespread fears some | :17:58. | :18:02. | |
institutions tailor their courses according to available funding | :18:02. | :18:06. | |
streams, for example research grants or the number of post grad | :18:06. | :18:10. | |
students. How does he intend to prevent these same institutions for | :18:10. | :18:13. | |
offering courses to fee payers from the rest of the UK which displace | :18:13. | :18:17. | |
the courses that might be available to Scottish students? Finally, on | :18:17. | :18:21. | |
the issue of charging EU students the statement is noticeable for the | :18:21. | :18:25. | |
lack of any detail of how the Scottish Government will proceed, | :18:25. | :18:31. | |
can he at least assure Parliament the plan he has come up with is | :18:31. | :18:37. | |
lawful, as well as feasible within the boundarys of the European Union. | :18:37. | :18:43. | |
If I can deal with that first. I made my statement, it is clear, to | :18:43. | :18:46. | |
use the word within the boun cis of European law we will do our best to | :18:47. | :18:50. | |
make progress on this. It is certainly lawful within Ireland | :18:50. | :18:53. | |
writ occupy, where it operate, and I would have thought what was | :18:53. | :18:57. | |
lawful in Ireland might be lawful here too. I am disappointed in his | :18:57. | :19:02. | |
litany of questions, for vary the o of reason, first I hope he would | :19:02. | :19:06. | |
join with me to say the best solution would be independence for | :19:06. | :19:10. | |
Scotland, because in those circumstances we would be able to | :19:10. | :19:14. | |
treat everybody ebg quit bli. We would have our own money raced and | :19:14. | :19:18. | |
we could choose how to spend it. But we are not in that pofplgs he | :19:18. | :19:21. | |
might reflect that the difficulty that have been created by decision | :19:21. | :19:26. | |
sourt of -- south of the border we were set in train bay Labour | :19:26. | :19:28. | |
Government which commissioned the Brown review and supported the | :19:28. | :19:31. | |
outcomes of it. In those circumstances I think if there are | :19:31. | :19:35. | |
problems, many of them lie at the door of the Labour Party. Well let | :19:35. | :19:40. | |
us dip out of that and go straight to our Aberdeen studio where the | :19:40. | :19:45. | |
new national President of the NUS in Scotland is there for us. Robin | :19:45. | :19:48. | |
Parkerment you have been listening to that statement. What is your | :19:48. | :19:52. | |
reaction to it? Yes, good afternoon. Well I think students are going to | :19:52. | :19:57. | |
find the statement here a mixed bag. There is positives in there, but I | :19:57. | :20:01. | |
am sure the new stories that is going to dominate the news pages | :20:01. | :20:04. | |
and the broadcast this afternoon is about the charges for the rest of | :20:04. | :20:10. | |
the UK students. I certainly share conis -- concerns this doesn't seem | :20:10. | :20:14. | |
to be fully worked out. I think it is really port this debate remains | :20:14. | :20:18. | |
round how we stop an influx of students for the rest of the UK | :20:18. | :20:21. | |
coming into Scotland and how which protect access for students from | :20:21. | :20:25. | |
Scotland. And we are far from convinced that the only way do that | :20:25. | :20:29. | |
is to increase fees, and we need, we urgently need clarity round | :20:29. | :20:33. | |
whether the plan is to make degrees in Scotland the most expensive | :20:33. | :20:37. | |
degrees in the whole of the UK for students from the rest of the UK to | :20:37. | :20:42. | |
come in and take. Were you surprised at the level of cap there, | :20:42. | :20:48. | |
the 9,000 maximum fee, and of course, on a Scottish four year | :20:48. | :20:53. | |
honours course, �36 thousand. are very concerned this could | :20:53. | :20:55. | |
create the most expensive glees the whole of the UK at �36 thousand, | :20:55. | :20:59. | |
that is, a huge amount of debt for students to be leaving university | :20:59. | :21:04. | |
with, before we even get into the living costs that many student face | :21:04. | :21:08. | |
here in Scotland. So �36 thousand is a huge amount to be paying for a | :21:08. | :21:12. | |
degree, and we need to think through what this is going to mean | :21:12. | :21:16. | |
in terms of access for students from the rest of UK. We are worried | :21:16. | :21:20. | |
about, there is definitely an element of hypocrisy, in some | :21:20. | :21:23. | |
students will be priced out of being able to afford come study in | :21:23. | :21:26. | |
Scotland, through the creation of this market place in education for | :21:26. | :21:33. | |
students from the rest of the UK. But do you not think the SNP | :21:33. | :21:37. | |
Government have created the conditions, we do have to depend on | :21:37. | :21:42. | |
other students coming in to help pay for that? I think it is really | :21:42. | :21:46. | |
important that the debate remains round how we protect access and how | :21:46. | :21:51. | |
we make sure that places are available. And it simply doesn't | :21:51. | :21:55. | |
turn into a debate about how we can make certain groups of students | :21:55. | :21:58. | |
into some form of cash cow or something like that. So I think it | :21:58. | :22:02. | |
is important we stick to, we frame this debate round how we protect | :22:02. | :22:08. | |
access, and maintain places. Now, there was some, a very short bit in | :22:08. | :22:12. | |
the EU, the management fee. How do you think the Scottish Government | :22:12. | :22:18. | |
can get round that? I, I am still far from convinced there is a way | :22:18. | :22:24. | |
to work round the EU law on this. We will have to see how that | :22:24. | :22:28. | |
progresses, but I think the comparison that Mike Russell made | :22:28. | :22:31. | |
to the situation in Ireland is different once you start looking | :22:31. | :22:35. | |
into the detail of it. I just don't think there is a way we will find a | :22:35. | :22:38. | |
situation where you can have one system for Scottish students, and | :22:38. | :22:43. | |
one for students from the rest of the EU. So we will have to wait to | :22:43. | :22:49. | |
see how that plays out really. And wait for more detail really. | :22:49. | :22:53. | |
thank you very much for joining us. Now, more than a third of public | :22:53. | :22:56. | |
money in Scotland is spent on social problem, which could have | :22:56. | :23:00. | |
been prevented in the first place, a new report has warned. The | :23:00. | :23:04. | |
Christie Commission has warned services will buckle without more | :23:04. | :23:08. | |
preventative measures to tackle inequality. Campbell Christie, the | :23:08. | :23:12. | |
report's chairman joins me now. Thank you for joining me. Can you | :23:12. | :23:16. | |
explain your main recommendations in your report? Well, I think it is | :23:16. | :23:20. | |
important to set the scene first, and that is we were asked by the | :23:20. | :23:25. | |
Government, to look at how public sever -- services are delivered in | :23:25. | :23:29. | |
the medium to long-term, taking into account the fact that the | :23:30. | :23:36. | |
fiscal position that we have, the demography increased demand there | :23:36. | :23:40. | |
will be on public services and people live longer and require more | :23:40. | :23:45. | |
support from public service and we were asked to look at that, and, | :23:45. | :23:50. | |
and produce some recommendations, and, in relation to how we can | :23:50. | :23:55. | |
maintain the quality of public service in that environment. We | :23:55. | :24:03. | |
identified a number of key area, where we made recommendations, and | :24:03. | :24:06. | |
there is three particular areas, where we think that we can do a lot | :24:06. | :24:12. | |
better than we are doing currently. One is that it is clear that a lot | :24:12. | :24:19. | |
of, there is a lot of anger round, and concern round, in Scotland, in | :24:19. | :24:23. | |
communities, that public services are very much topped down they | :24:23. | :24:28. | |
deliver what the top thinks we need, and if that doesn't fit, then it is | :24:28. | :24:33. | |
too bad. So there is strong evidence from all the visits we did. | :24:33. | :24:38. | |
All the people we spoke to, that empowering communities, to identify | :24:38. | :24:43. | |
what it is they need, to work with the agencies as to what it is they | :24:43. | :24:48. | |
need, within their own community, would release resources from | :24:48. | :24:52. | |
provision being needed, in care homes and in emergency areas of | :24:52. | :24:57. | |
hospitals and so on. That was one area we thought that with can | :24:57. | :25:02. | |
improve the quality of public services, and it cost less, to | :25:02. | :25:08. | |
provide. You did say in the report the prize is a personal centred | :25:08. | :25:12. | |
system. We have seen a lot of the coverage of the report and there | :25:12. | :25:15. | |
are accusations the report is very woolly and difficult to, there is | :25:15. | :25:19. | |
nothing really definitive in this report. Well, I don't know who is | :25:19. | :25:24. | |
saying that. It is not the reaction we have got, and I don't think it | :25:24. | :25:29. | |
is the reaction that we have had from the agencies that are involved | :25:29. | :25:36. | |
in public service, but let me finish. The second area, is, we | :25:36. | :25:40. | |
have identified from the evidence that we have gather, that there is | :25:40. | :25:44. | |
real concern about the duplication of the provision of service, | :25:44. | :25:50. | |
different services are working in the same ya -- area, it is not | :25:50. | :25:54. | |
clear whether they will pool budgets in order to get the best | :25:54. | :25:59. | |
returns, so we have strongly said that Government should take action, | :25:59. | :26:04. | |
to require people who are agencies, organisations providing public | :26:04. | :26:08. | |
service, to work together with other public service agencies, so | :26:08. | :26:12. | |
that they can deliver good quality services and avoid duplication and | :26:12. | :26:17. | |
get better results. Has this not been tried in the past? You speak | :26:17. | :26:20. | |
of people being in their silo, that has not been in past to get the | :26:20. | :26:24. | |
public sector working together and it has not happened? Well, what we | :26:24. | :26:27. | |
are saying to Government, they should require it to happen. That | :26:27. | :26:32. | |
if services are going to, whether it is local authority, health | :26:32. | :26:35. | |
boards or whoever, police service whoever, if you going to fund them | :26:35. | :26:38. | |
there should be a requirement that the funding they will work with | :26:38. | :26:42. | |
other agencies in order to provide a unified service and a better | :26:42. | :26:46. | |
quality of service. The third area that he we identified as being | :26:46. | :26:52. | |
important, is to, this need to identify and take action early, to | :26:52. | :26:56. | |
prevent the development of particular problems over the years, | :26:56. | :27:03. | |
now if we can do that, then the figure that has been produced about | :27:03. | :27:09. | |
40% of spend in many public service areas arises from the fact that | :27:09. | :27:18. | |
preventative action wasn't taken. That could be how we ensure that | :27:18. | :27:22. | |
elderly people get the vervis -- service they need in their own home, | :27:22. | :27:28. | |
so avoid the need to go into care, to go into care homes or to go into | :27:28. | :27:32. | |
emergency areas in hospital, which is costly. So that is one area. | :27:32. | :27:35. | |
That is a co-point in your report actually, that Americaning of | :27:35. | :27:40. | |
health and Social Services, and you did make that point. That merging. | :27:40. | :27:43. | |
There was another report from NESTA who made the same recommendation | :27:43. | :27:47. | |
but they were putting forward a very strong recommendation that you | :27:47. | :27:51. | |
should take that money out of acute services, to help fund that, but | :27:51. | :27:58. | |
you have not gone that far. acute care is very important, | :27:58. | :28:02. | |
people, people want to have good quality acute care, but what they | :28:02. | :28:07. | |
don't want is to have it clogged up with people who are bed blocking | :28:07. | :28:11. | |
because they can't get out, back into their own community because | :28:11. | :28:14. | |
they are not in there are not the services in their community to care | :28:14. | :28:20. | |
for them, so it is important that we, we don't allow that sort of | :28:20. | :28:25. | |
thing to happen, so it is those areas, but it is earlier than that, | :28:25. | :28:31. | |
for instance I am involved in Stirling, as chair of the urban | :28:32. | :28:37. | |
regeneration company. We are helping young people who are not | :28:37. | :28:40. | |
attending school, bad attender, we are bringing them into work with us | :28:40. | :28:45. | |
as part of a big lot Iry arrangement, it is amazing the | :28:45. | :28:49. | |
transformation of these young people in a work environment. How | :28:49. | :28:54. | |
they blossom, how they go back home to their own areas feeling | :28:54. | :28:59. | |
absolutely, that they have achieved something. If we do that more, we | :28:59. | :29:03. | |
avoid this problem of those people ending up in prison, ending up with | :29:03. | :29:06. | |
alcohol problem, drug problems or whatever, so you know, now, of | :29:06. | :29:09. | |
course everyone will say, preventative care has been on the | :29:09. | :29:13. | |
agenda for a long time. We now have a situation where we have | :29:13. | :29:16. | |
Government power. We have five years to do it they have a majority, | :29:16. | :29:26. | |
:29:26. | :29:34. | ||
Representatives of the six big power companies have been giving | :29:34. | :29:36. | |
evidence to Holyrood's Economy Committee. Earlier this month, | :29:36. | :29:38. | |
Scottish Power announced steep rises in the costs of gas and | :29:38. | :29:41. | |
electricity and there's widespread concern that other companies will | :29:41. | :29:44. | |
follow suit. MSPs began hearing an account of the scale of fuel | :29:44. | :29:50. | |
poverty in Scotland. What percentage are reckoned to be | :29:50. | :30:00. | |
:30:00. | :30:03. | ||
in fuel poverty? A about a third. Be 34 %. That is using government | :30:03. | :30:13. | |
:30:13. | :30:16. | ||
figures. We have asked someone in the Commission for sustainable | :30:16. | :30:22. | |
energy to estimate if every energy company followed the example of | :30:22. | :30:32. | |
:30:32. | :30:33. | ||
Scottish Power. Basically, it would put a hundred and �75 a year on to | :30:33. | :30:41. | |
the average bill. It would increase fuel poverty from 34 % up to the 37 | :30:41. | :30:46. | |
% and take us back to the baseline position that we were in 1999, so | :30:46. | :30:51. | |
all the good work that has begun will be back to square one. Over a | :30:51. | :30:58. | |
five-year period the price for both gas and electricity is the same. | :30:58. | :31:08. | |
Why have the retail cost gone up by so much? I think that it is | :31:08. | :31:12. | |
misleading to take a particular point in time. You can choose | :31:12. | :31:17. | |
different points in time and you will get different relationships | :31:17. | :31:22. | |
because wholesale and retail movements take place at different | :31:22. | :31:28. | |
times, so depending on precisely when you pick you can get a variety | :31:28. | :31:37. | |
of different relationships. As far as Scottish Power is concerned, the | :31:37. | :31:42. | |
accounts but we are filing with the regulator show that after the last | :31:42. | :31:47. | |
two years we have made an average of �10 selling gas and electricity | :31:47. | :31:57. | |
on a typical annual bill of �1,000 for a dual fuel customer. | :31:57. | :32:02. | |
percent is huge in fuel poverty. How much importance to you placing | :32:02. | :32:08. | |
on that? The place enormous importance on it. We spent more | :32:08. | :32:16. | |
relative to our market share than any other supplier. There is a | :32:16. | :32:23. | |
voluntary agreement in existence at the moment. British Gas has spent | :32:23. | :32:30. | |
�227 million on that in the last three years against an obligation | :32:30. | :32:36. | |
of �100 million less. A third of our entire spend for this is going | :32:36. | :32:46. | |
:32:46. | :32:49. | ||
to Scotland and 10 % of all our fund for improving housing stock. | :32:49. | :32:54. | |
As an industry have not done as good a job as we should have done | :32:54. | :32:59. | |
on explaining to her own consumers and the country as a whole the | :32:59. | :33:06. | |
fundamental shifts going on in energy supply. The way this is | :33:06. | :33:11. | |
accelerating a do think that over the next 12 months, the government, | :33:11. | :33:16. | |
consumer bodies, suppliers need to get together and come up with | :33:16. | :33:25. | |
better communications. Tomorrow will see tens of thousands of | :33:25. | :33:28. | |
public service workers go on strike over changes the UK government | :33:28. | :33:31. | |
plans to make to their pensions. While England and Wales are likely | :33:31. | :33:34. | |
to see huge disruption to schools, up to 30,000 Scottish workers in | :33:34. | :33:36. | |
places including jobcentres, tax offices and courts will withdraw | :33:36. | :33:39. | |
their labour. Those workers are in the PCS union, and their Scottish | :33:39. | :33:44. | |
Secretary Lynn Henderson joins me now. | :33:44. | :33:49. | |
Some of the destruction we might see tomorrow, will be the extent do | :33:49. | :33:55. | |
you think? Places like Jobcentres will be closed, tax offices will be | :33:55. | :34:01. | |
closed, coastguard stations will be affected, the Scottish Parliament | :34:01. | :34:06. | |
staff will be out on strike. A number of government offices around | :34:06. | :34:13. | |
the country will Quine to a halt. you're striking over pensions. The | :34:13. | :34:17. | |
Prime Minister said you can stick your head into the sand when it | :34:17. | :34:22. | |
comes to public sector pension reform. He is pointing at the cost | :34:22. | :34:27. | |
every family in the UK at �1,000 to pay for public sector pensions. Do | :34:27. | :34:36. | |
not pick it is time for reform? That is a flawed analysis. Our | :34:36. | :34:41. | |
strike is not just on pensions, it is on pay and jobs because civil | :34:41. | :34:46. | |
servants are also facing do you pay freezes and 100 seats - - hundreds | :34:47. | :34:52. | |
of thousands of job cuts in the next few years. It is more than | :34:52. | :34:57. | |
just the pensions issue. We maintain the civil service pension | :34:57. | :35:01. | |
scheme has been proven to be affordable, sustainable and will | :35:01. | :35:06. | |
reducing cost. It is not necessary to make these changes at all unless | :35:06. | :35:11. | |
it is an idea - - ideological attack, which are days. With the | :35:11. | :35:14. | |
rise in living standards and people living longer, it is clear that the | :35:14. | :35:18. | |
doors need to be reformed because it seems these penchant or simply | :35:18. | :35:25. | |
an affordable. That is not what Lord Hutton says. But is not what | :35:26. | :35:30. | |
the public affairs committee says and not what the Institute of | :35:30. | :35:36. | |
Fiscal Studies says. It is not just me saying that, these are | :35:36. | :35:40. | |
economists out there that agree that the public sector pensions are | :35:40. | :35:44. | |
affordable and be maintained at this as an attack on us for | :35:44. | :35:54. | |
ideological reasons. The think tank says that a demographic time bomb | :35:54. | :36:01. | |
is ticking. We know that as public servants, who worked to protect | :36:01. | :36:10. | |
people in elderly care. We co- operate with government, they are | :36:10. | :36:20. | |
Our employers and we deliver the services. We have an alternative | :36:20. | :36:25. | |
which is called Pax justice. Looking at the destruction that | :36:25. | :36:30. | |
will take place tomorrow. The destruction of the airport will hit | :36:30. | :36:34. | |
Scottish passengers very badly. The general secretary said there could | :36:34. | :36:39. | |
be a risk to border security and passengers would be protected | :36:39. | :36:43. | |
financially at the end up missing their flights. Why are you letting | :36:43. | :36:49. | |
the people down who pay your salaries? The people who pay our | :36:49. | :36:55. | |
salaries that are our members as well. We have the right to withdraw | :36:55. | :37:00. | |
labour and we have agreed to the public support. Yes, there will be | :37:00. | :37:06. | |
disruption at the airports and we say to the public we are terribly | :37:06. | :37:10. | |
sorry about that but you must make sure that the government changes | :37:10. | :37:16. | |
its mind and properly negotiates. Member sub the public could do end | :37:16. | :37:26. | |
:37:26. | :37:26. | ||
up paying your salaries, people who work and a high streets, lots of | :37:26. | :37:30. | |
people in the High Street are having big changes in their pension. | :37:30. | :37:34. | |
People in the private sector are having to bear that burden. People | :37:34. | :37:44. | |
in the private sector are also depending on... the taxpayer is | :37:44. | :37:50. | |
also funding private pensions. We also represent people in the | :37:50. | :37:57. | |
commercial sector, privatised sectors. We stand together with | :37:57. | :38:01. | |
other unions and workers who want to make sure that the workers of | :38:01. | :38:05. | |
the day and attention at of tomorrow are properly looked after. | :38:05. | :38:09. | |
As summer of disruption has been promised by the unions. What will | :38:09. | :38:17. | |
be your next disruption, do you think? We have not promised at | :38:17. | :38:21. | |
summer of destruction. We have got a 24 hour strike starting at | :38:21. | :38:25. | |
midnight tonight and we will follow that up with a month-long ban on | :38:25. | :38:29. | |
overtime. There will then talk to other unions about getting the | :38:30. | :38:36. | |
government back to the table. If that is not the case we have legal | :38:36. | :38:40. | |
cases out against the changes and are prepared to work together to | :38:40. | :38:44. | |
take industrial action in the autumn. | :38:44. | :38:47. | |
The Finance Secretary, John Swinney, is making a statement to MSPs at | :38:47. | :38:52. | |
Holyrood now. It's on what's called the financial out-turn, which means | :38:52. | :38:58. | |
how much the Government spent compared to their budget. Let's | :38:58. | :39:04. | |
cross again live to the Debating Chamber. | :39:04. | :39:09. | |
An underspend on this Budget cannot be used to buy goods and services. | :39:09. | :39:13. | |
It does not reflect the missed opportunity to spend more on public | :39:13. | :39:22. | |
services. The 2010 and 11 out turn white paper is due to be published | :39:22. | :39:24. | |
in July in which the fiscal underspend for the Scottish | :39:24. | :39:30. | |
government will go on record as �12 million, along with the �86 million | :39:30. | :39:35. | |
non-cash understand. I want to take this opportunity to up to its | :39:35. | :39:39. | |
parliament about other under Spence. The Scottish government has been | :39:39. | :39:47. | |
able to carry forward any unspent Budget to future years. Ensure | :39:47. | :39:53. | |
flexibility was abolished as part of the 2010 UK spending review. The | :39:53. | :39:58. | |
Scottish government had drawn down pretty much all of its balances in | :39:58. | :40:04. | |
the year up to the end of 2010 and 11. Its cash balance at this stage | :40:04. | :40:11. | |
stood at only �22 million, in contrast with Northern Ireland at | :40:11. | :40:15. | |
�295 million and the Welsh government at �164 million. | :40:15. | :40:25. | |
:40:25. | :40:25. | ||
Consequently, wily - - the impact on public expenditure in Scotland | :40:25. | :40:29. | |
is relatively small due to the success of our negotiations with | :40:29. | :40:36. | |
the Treasury. The Budget exchange mechanism has been set out by the | :40:36. | :40:41. | |
Treasury. This would allow some scope to transfer budgets to future | :40:41. | :40:44. | |
years and would have to be declared as part of our spring Budget | :40:44. | :40:48. | |
revision process. The detailed technical rules that the Treasury | :40:48. | :40:55. | |
has imposed great a risk that some avoidable underspent - - | :40:55. | :40:59. | |
unavoidable under his friends would not be available in future. Along | :40:59. | :41:03. | |
with my eight finance ministers from Wales and Northern Ireland I | :41:03. | :41:08. | |
am so continuing to discuss with the Treasury to ensure that we have | :41:08. | :41:12. | |
the right to spend the budgets allocated to us in the UK spending | :41:12. | :41:17. | |
review and they are not lost so Scottish public services. This is | :41:17. | :41:20. | |
especially important at that time when the UK government is already | :41:20. | :41:25. | |
reducing the total resources available to us. This issue | :41:25. | :41:27. | |
underlines the problems of the current fiscal arrangements whereby | :41:27. | :41:31. | |
we have to wait for the UK to decide how Scotland should best | :41:31. | :41:36. | |
manage its own Budget and are subject to a Treasury rules and | :41:36. | :41:41. | |
changes to these rules and which we are not consulted. Given this | :41:41. | :41:43. | |
uncertainty about future arrangements am pleased to be able | :41:43. | :41:51. | |
to announce today such a low underspend of �12 million. I | :41:51. | :41:54. | |
commend these outturn figures to the chamber. They demonstrate the | :41:54. | :41:59. | |
firm, - - demonstrate the firm grip that this government has some | :41:59. | :42:06. | |
public finances. We have been faced with ever increasing challenges | :42:06. | :42:11. | |
over public finances. Our response has required competence and a | :42:11. | :42:15. | |
commitment to building effective partnerships across this Parliament | :42:15. | :42:19. | |
and across the public sector in Scotland. We will not alter from | :42:19. | :42:24. | |
this course as a litter the future. The outcome of the UK spending | :42:24. | :42:31. | |
review places severe pressures on future Scottish budgets. But 2014 | :42:31. | :42:37. | |
the Scottish at Dell will be 12 % below its 2010 level in real terms. | :42:37. | :42:43. | |
Within that our capital Dell will fall by 35 % over this period. We | :42:43. | :42:48. | |
will continue to make your argued that the UK government has cutting | :42:48. | :42:52. | |
public expenditure too far and too fast. It is against this background | :42:52. | :42:55. | |
we have already published a Budget for this financial year that | :42:55. | :43:00. | |
addresses the cuts imposed upon us, cuts of �1 billion, while delivered | :43:00. | :43:05. | |
on key priorities in the economy, the environment and public services | :43:05. | :43:10. | |
and building parliamentary support for our approach. Alf Young is | :43:10. | :43:18. | |
still with us. What do you make of that so far, Alf? It is 12 million | :43:18. | :43:24. | |
underspent and a Budget of 28 billion. To miss your Budget by 12 | :43:24. | :43:32. | |
million out of such a massive number is pretty good going. That | :43:32. | :43:36. | |
argument brewing is that in past years if you did underspend you | :43:36. | :43:40. | |
could roll it over and use it the following year. He is saying with | :43:40. | :43:44. | |
budgets being squeezed going forwards it would be quite nice to | :43:44. | :43:48. | |
take that 12 million and use it going forward but the Treasury has | :43:48. | :43:58. | |
:43:58. | :43:58. | ||
changed the arrangements Anne's the other devolved ministers are trying | :43:58. | :44:02. | |
to say to the Treasury, look this is not in the spirit of things that | :44:02. | :44:05. | |
you are not going to let us have that because we didn't quite manage | :44:06. | :44:10. | |
to spend precisely the amount that we were allocated. It is a fair | :44:10. | :44:14. | |
point because the rules apparently were changed on a unilateral basis | :44:15. | :44:20. | |
with the discussion. Maybe it is part of George Osborne turning the | :44:20. | :44:24. | |
screw. It does not help to lose that 12 million, although it is | :44:24. | :44:32. | |
tiny in relation to the amount So, are you thinking that Mr | :44:32. | :44:38. | |
Swinney has managed to do well in getting it down �12 million? Given | :44:38. | :44:43. | |
how complex a budget leek that is and how many areas it gets spent on | :44:43. | :44:50. | |
to, get it wrong, to underspend it by �12 million out of 28 and a bit | :44:50. | :44:55. | |
billion is pretty good going. you can see more of John Swinney's | :44:55. | :44:59. | |
statement on our website. But first of all back to the story about | :44:59. | :45:08. | |
funding for higher education, in Edinburgh we have Alastair Sim. | :45:08. | :45:12. | |
Good afternoon. Thank you for joining me. First, what was your | :45:12. | :45:18. | |
reaction to Mr Russell's statement there, about the �9 million cap fee | :45:18. | :45:21. | |
four students coming from England? Think he is doing the right thing | :45:21. | :45:25. | |
at the right time. We have been saying urgent action need to be | :45:25. | :45:30. | |
taken so we have a managable cross border flow, so we are able to | :45:30. | :45:33. | |
welcome people from the rest of UK but not to become the cheap option | :45:34. | :45:37. | |
and become swamped. I think he has done the right thing and he has | :45:37. | :45:41. | |
done the timely thing so universities can get on with making | :45:41. | :45:46. | |
fee setting decisions, to give learners certainty to what is going | :45:46. | :45:51. | |
to apply to them. We are not the cheap option, we are probably the | :45:51. | :45:56. | |
expensive option. With the set cap of �9,000 peran nem numb it could | :45:56. | :46:02. | |
mean students from London could be paying �36,000 to study at Glasgow. | :46:02. | :46:05. | |
In fact Scotland could become one of the most expensive places to | :46:05. | :46:09. | |
study on a four year course? have only had this announcement | :46:09. | :46:14. | |
today so we don't know what decision institutions are going to | :46:14. | :46:19. | |
make, those decision will be affected by the fact our | :46:19. | :46:22. | |
universities want to attract good students from across the UK. They | :46:23. | :46:27. | |
will need to be able to settifies that enable them to continue to do | :46:27. | :46:30. | |
so I don't think we will necessarily see the sort of rush to | :46:30. | :46:35. | |
the top that there has been in England, but it does give | :46:35. | :46:38. | |
flexibility. Medical degrees, typically the same length in | :46:38. | :46:42. | |
Scotland as in England. It allows you potentially to set a fee that | :46:42. | :46:46. | |
puts you exactly on par with what is happening in the rest of the UK. | :46:46. | :46:50. | |
Makes it is a fair choice. But as you pointed out, we did see a | :46:50. | :46:54. | |
troush the top in England, why do you think that won't be the case in | :46:54. | :46:59. | |
Scotland? And could it be very obvious then, if we have some | :46:59. | :47:05. | |
universities charging maybe, 3 or 4,000 and some charging 9,000. It | :47:05. | :47:09. | |
gives a variable look at universities in Scotland doesn't it. | :47:09. | :47:12. | |
I don't know what decision they are going to make. We have only had | :47:12. | :47:16. | |
this announcement today, but I think the decisions they make will | :47:16. | :47:21. | |
be conditioned by what has happened down sou. I mean, there is no point | :47:21. | :47:25. | |
in Scottish universities generally setting their fees for students in | :47:25. | :47:30. | |
the rest of the UK, at a level that makes them uncompetitive choice for | :47:30. | :47:33. | |
the able people from all sorts of backgrounds we want to continue to | :47:33. | :47:39. | |
welcome to Scotland. Mr Ruthle was vague about the EU management fee, | :47:39. | :47:43. | |
the fee for students coming from the European Union. How do you | :47:43. | :47:47. | |
think he will get round that legally? That is for him and his | :47:47. | :47:50. | |
legal team to look at. We are supportive of him looking at it. I | :47:50. | :47:56. | |
mean we think it is only fair, that you know, given that students in | :47:56. | :47:59. | |
France, Netherlands, rierbld, wherever, are generally having to | :47:59. | :48:04. | |
make a contribution to the costs of their own -- university education. | :48:04. | :48:07. | |
We think it is fair enough they should be able to make some | :48:07. | :48:11. | |
contribution to the cost of the university education in Scotland. | :48:11. | :48:15. | |
So, we are fully supportive of the Scottish Government looking at this, | :48:15. | :48:19. | |
but it really is going to take them, I think at Mike Russell indicated | :48:19. | :48:24. | |
some effort with their lawyers to find way doffing this, that is | :48:24. | :48:30. | |
going to be robust. Finally, Mr Russell was saying he was going to | :48:30. | :48:35. | |
look at university governance, there is that review group who is | :48:35. | :48:39. | |
going to examine university, do you feel that Mr Russell is gunning for | :48:39. | :48:44. | |
universities at the moment? Gunning for the top tyre in universities? | :48:44. | :48:49. | |
Do you think Gunning for the management? I don't think so. I | :48:49. | :48:54. | |
draw great confidence from the fact he has appointed one of my members | :48:54. | :48:59. | |
to lead this review, now I don't think we have anything to be | :48:59. | :49:02. | |
worried about from the university perspective. Look at the | :49:02. | :49:06. | |
competition over governing bodies at the moment. On average, 40% are | :49:06. | :49:10. | |
drawn from the staff and communities we really are visible | :49:10. | :49:16. | |
and accountable in our governance. Yes, by all means let us look at it, | :49:16. | :49:20. | |
but I don't think a review is going to find there is a fundamental | :49:20. | :49:24. | |
problem, I think the review is going the find out we have robust | :49:24. | :49:26. | |
governance that enables universities to make the decisions | :49:26. | :49:32. | |
that need to be made, in tough times, and that brings in a wide | :49:32. | :49:38. | |
range of ability, and perspective from staff, students in the wider | :49:38. | :49:41. | |
community. I think we have a strong foundation we are buildinging on | :49:41. | :49:45. | |
and of course we are open to looking at how that might be | :49:45. | :49:50. | |
improved. -- building. Thank you very much for joining us. Now, the | :49:50. | :49:55. | |
new leadership of Aberdeen City Council has been agreed. The SNP's | :49:55. | :50:00. | |
Callum McCaig becomes one of the youngest council leaders at only 26. | :50:00. | :50:07. | |
A business plan to save 120 million overify years is also expected to | :50:07. | :50:12. | |
be rubber-stamped. Our reporter is in our Aberdeen studio. Good | :50:12. | :50:15. | |
afternoon Colin. So Callum McCaig has been confirmed in post? Yes, | :50:15. | :50:19. | |
good news for him. He is the youngest council leader as you say | :50:19. | :50:24. | |
in Britain, not in the UK, in Britain it is 29-year-old gentleman | :50:24. | :50:29. | |
in York, and the mayor of Belfast is 25. But he has been confirmed in | :50:30. | :50:35. | |
post, he is 26 years old, very young, some would say inexperience | :50:35. | :50:40. | |
but has been a kouns lo for four years and was convener of the | :50:40. | :50:43. | |
Education Committee so he is not wet behind the ear, eand he has a | :50:43. | :50:47. | |
lot of respect from colleagues and his party. That is the thing. A lot | :50:47. | :50:53. | |
has been made about his age but he seems determined he can do a good | :50:53. | :50:58. | |
job for the city. He says age should be no barrier, he says what | :50:58. | :51:04. | |
age should a councillor be. There is evidence, I am sure we can give | :51:04. | :51:08. | |
example, probably older and wiser heads have made mistakes for | :51:08. | :51:12. | |
council. Callum McCaig comes to this job with an open mind, he says | :51:12. | :51:16. | |
that he will be looking at it, taking advice from his elders and | :51:16. | :51:21. | |
people with more experience, but he wants to take Aberdeen Council for | :51:21. | :51:25. | |
ward. He has had the experience, as I say, he came in when he was | :51:25. | :51:30. | |
elected in 2007, along with three other very young SNP councillors, | :51:30. | :51:38. | |
he is one of that young batch, an of course this isn't unprecedented. | :51:38. | :51:43. | |
Euan Dough was head of Tayside council in 1994 and he was only 22. | :51:43. | :51:48. | |
They have got some very urgent business to attend to, that massive | :51:48. | :51:52. | |
savings plan they have to agree to Absolutely. The five year plan. | :51:52. | :51:57. | |
This is his biggest headache. It is still being considered. It has not | :51:57. | :52:01. | |
been rumer stamped ath as yet. The council has made hundreds of | :52:01. | :52:04. | |
millions of pounds worth of cuts over the last three or four year, | :52:04. | :52:09. | |
over the next five years they are having to rationalise services, | :52:09. | :52:12. | |
they are making �120 million, that is, what they are facing over five | :52:12. | :52:17. | |
year, the unions won't be happy, some are saying that if it goes | :52:17. | :52:20. | |
ahead it will be like a declaration of war. So we can expect some | :52:20. | :52:24. | |
troubled times ahead for Callum McCaig, there are there were | :52:25. | :52:27. | |
protestors outside the meeting to give him a taste of that. That | :52:27. | :52:30. | |
wasn't about the Fife year plan that, was about the controversial | :52:31. | :52:35. | |
plans for the redevelopment of union terrace gardens in the centre | :52:35. | :52:38. | |
of Aberdeen that. Is another of the many headaches this young man will | :52:38. | :52:43. | |
have to face over the coming five years. Lots going on in Aberdeen. | :52:43. | :52:47. | |
Thank you for joining us. It has been a busy day in Scottish | :52:47. | :52:52. | |
politics. Alf Young is still here. Let us go back to the higher | :52:52. | :52:55. | |
education statement from Mike Russell. Were you surprised at this | :52:55. | :53:01. | |
level of a �9,000 capped variable fee? I was surprised on two count, | :53:01. | :53:05. | |
that he went as high as a figure south of the border, but he is | :53:05. | :53:09. | |
leaving it open to the university to decide how much they charge, and | :53:09. | :53:13. | |
you would have thought that for universities like Edinburgh or St | :53:13. | :53:15. | |
Andrews which have large numbers of students from south of the border | :53:15. | :53:19. | |
coming to them at the moment, they would probably be pitching at the | :53:19. | :53:23. | |
high end. And the other thing that surprised me about it, was that he | :53:23. | :53:28. | |
said there has to be some kind of analysis done of how the money gets | :53:28. | :53:31. | |
spread to the other universities, that is an interesting point. | :53:31. | :53:36. | |
you very much for joining us. And that is it from us, today and for | :53:36. | :53:42. |