29/10/2015 Politics Scotland

A very warm welcome to the Scottish Parliament at Holyrood. The subject

is the First Minister. It is impossible to predict what will come

from that session of exchanges between the First Minister and

opposition leaders, but we can be sure. They will open with

condolences regarding the tragic events at the Academy. We are

approaching 12 midday, in advance of that, First Minister's questions,

backbench MSP 's are posing questions. Is that business draws to

a close, we will move to the main event of the week Holyrood. Ahead of

the Autumn Conference, the SNP conference, taking place in Perth,

there will also be questions from the leader of the Conservative party

and other members of the Scottish Parliament. The Chamber is filling

up for that session, and the public galleries also almost full. Here is

the presiding officer. Would like to welcome the ambassador of the

Argentine Republic to the United Kingdom. A warm welcome to the

ambassador from Argent Tina. We now move to First Minister's questions.

Question number one. I know that I speak for all sides when I say that

the thoughts and prayers of everyone in this chamber with the family of

Bailey Gwynne, who was stabbed and killed at school yesterday. We offer

our full support to the parents, pupils and staff at this tragic

time. And I asked the First Minister what engagement she has planned for

the rest of the day? May I begin today by expressing my shock and

sadness at the incident which occurred yesterday in Aberdeen. I

also want to convey my deepest sympathy and condolences to the

family and friends of Bailey Gwynne, who tragically died in the

incident. The circumstances of this young man's death are subject to

ongoing and thorough police investigation. I'm sure the whole

chamber will want all those who loved Bailey Gwynne, and all those

who have been affected by this tragedy, to know that our thoughts

are very much with them that this desperately sad time. Later today, I

have engagement is to follow the programme for Scotland. I appreciate

that statement and I know the First Minister will be shocked as anyone

by the incident. I have four questions here and I will use most

of them to hold the government to account in the normal way but I'd

like to use my first question to ask about the death of Bailey Gwynne. We

don't know all the details of the case yet but there are countless

families across the country who will feel this pain and sorrow today. It

is every parent's worst nightmare, sending their child to school in the

morning for them to never return home again. In the First Minister

reassure parents across the country that everything that can be done is

being done to keep our children safe. Yes, indeed, of course I can

and should give that assurance. The Chamber may want to know that I have

this morning spoken to the leader of Aberdeen City Council to offer our

sympathies and condolences but also to convey directly to her that any

support and assistance that the council or the school needs from the

Scottish government in the days, weeks and months ahead will be

forthcoming. Incidents like this are deeply shocking and deeply tragic.

The impact on the lives of those who knew and loved Bailey Gwynne are

impossible for any of us to imagine. Notwithstanding that, of course, it

is also important to remember and to remind ourselves the tragic

incidents like this one are thankfully extremely rare in our

schools. That does not of course take away at all from the tragic

nature of this incident. The Scottish government will in the

fullness of time make sure that any lessons are required to learn from

this incident and learnt. And while I give the assurance that we will

continue to take all steps to ensure as far as any government can the

safety of young people in schools, it is worth also remembering that

violent incidents, incidents of people possessing knives and

dangerous weapons, are on the decline. Now, that is no reason for

complacency because, as the tragic events of the last 24 hours have

reminded us, one incident like this is one too many, and we are united

they in our determination to make sure no young person has to ever

they in our determination to make through this again. Can I thank the

First Minister for that very welcome and fulsome reply. I'd like to turn

out to the question of student finance. Figures published this week

show that under the SNP government the average student bursary or grant

has been cut by almost 30%. It is the poorest students who are

suffering. Students from deprived backgrounds being forced to take on

an even greater debt burden. Students who have the potential to

get on in life and do great things parents don't have a lot of money.

It is that parents don't have a lot of money.

than before class on Serb but reality is... -- a

lot of gloss on that answer but the reality years, the poorest students

have the highest debt. I ask the very specific question about student

debt. On this occasion, the First Minister did know the answer but she

was too ashamed to say it out loud. Because the value of student debt in

Scotland stands at 2.7 alien pounds -- 2.7 Ilion pounds. Presiding

Officer, the value of student debt in Scotland is more than the

combined cost of the new Forth Road crossing, and the Queen Elizabeth

Hospital in Glasgow. In fact, the value of the accumulated debt of

students in Scotland is now the government's single biggest

financial asset. The student debt monster the SNP wants promised to

dumped is now a debt mountain. Did the First Minister ever have any

intention of keeping that promise? What Kezia Dugdale simply cannot

escape is that average student loan debt in Scotland is significantly

lower than anywhere else in the UK. And Scottish domiciled students and

here I will talk about tuition fees do not have to pay fees of up to

?27,000 charged for tuition elsewhere in the UK. That is a real

saving that doesn't become a debt in Scotland in the way it does in other

parts of the UK and, currently, the least well off students took up the

maximum amount of student loan during the term of their degree. In

the students would commit ?12,000 more than Scottish students. We have

the best student support package in the UK. Average student debt in

Scotland is less than it is in any other part of the UK. We are taking

steps to increase the bursary element of this student support

package and that, stands in sharp conduct contrast to what Kezia

Dugdale is proposing, that they are going to abolish bursaries

altogether and move to loan funding, something the Scottish government

will not do. That is all from a First Minister who told students

their debt would be zero! Judge me on my record, we were told by the

First Minister. So, here it is. The reality is it is easier to be poor

and get to uni in England even under the Tories than it is in Scotland

under the SNP. I heard cries of shameful. Yes, it is shameful! She

promised to abolish student debt. Instead, it has increased. She

promised to expand grants. Instead, they have been cut. Isn't it the

case is that despite all the promises and all the moments of

self-congratulation, the SNP government is letting down

Scotland's poorest students? Firstly, as I just said, and I think

both of my previous answers, we have in this academic year increased the

bursary element of the student support package. Order, order. It

led the NUS to say the Scottish government should be congratulated.

There's been a 50% increase since 2006 in applications to university

from the 20% most deprived areas in our country. Young people are more

likely to participate in higher education by the time they are 30

than was the case in 2006. And on the precise issue of student debt,

let me repeat some of the figures because these are the figures that

matter to people and to students across Scotland. An average student

loan debt in Scotland is 9400 pounds. In England, it is ?21,180.

In Wales, which the last time I looked, was governed by a Labour

administration, average student loan debt was 19,000 ?10. -- ?19,000,

double what it is in Scotland. We live in tough financial times.

Everybody knows that. Tough choices always have to be made but we will

continue to make sure we are providing good support from students

so that more of our students from the most deprived parts of our

country can take the opportunity to go to university, so we will

continue to get on with the job, and, as usual, we will leave

Labour, regardless what we do, to moan about it and whinge from the

sidelines. Can I add the condolences of myself and my party to those that

have already been expressed by the First Minister and the whole

parliament to the family and loved ones of Bailey Gwynne. Our thoughts

and prayers are with those who have been affected by the tragedy. But I

also asked the First Minister when she will next meet the prime

Minister. I have no plans in the immediate future. We've just heard a

series of quite serious exchanges regarding funding and access to

university but in none of those exchanges did I hear a credible

alternative plan on how we found bursaries for poorer students and

ensure the wider access we all say we want. So here is one. Under our

plans, we would ask all graduates to pay back a contribution once they'd

got a decent job. That money could then be used to help increase

bursaries for poorer students who, under the current scheme, can't even

get a foot through the door. This plan is sensible, it is moderate,

and it would help those most in need. Can I ask what reason, other

than an ideological one, would this First Minister have for not

considering it? Credit to Ruth Davidson, she is putting forward a

policy, which is to support the introduction of tuition fees, and

she is entitled to put that before the Scottish people at the election

in a few months' time and allow them to cast their verdict on it. We have

an honest disagreement. I believe in free education. I benefited from it

as a young person and I believe I have no right to take it away from

any other young person today so we will have that debate in the months

to come. Students who graduate and to benefit

from a university education payback that through taxation. That is what

I believe should happen, not to have tuition fees or a graduate tax or

whatever terminology Ruth Davidson wants to use. We will continue to

take the steps I outlined to Kezia Dugdale to support students from our

poorest backgrounds to go to university. We have increased the

bursary element of the student support package. I have cited the

figures that showed the lower levels of student loan debt here in

Scotland. Ruth Davidson will also be aware that right now we have a

commission on widening access under way to advise the government of what

additional steps we required to support poorer students into

university. We will continue to do that hard and serious work and have

an honest debate about funding options as we approach the election

next. I would like to thank the First Minister for that answer and

the pointing out it is an ideological point of view. The SNP

has written free education on a tablet of stone. It is bad that --

it is sad that the First Minister is too stubborn to recognise change

because change is needed. You are three and a half more time is likely

to go to university if you are rich. She talks about her situation

growing up. My situation was similar. I had a full grant and that

is what helped me to get there. This SNP government has singularly failed

to close the gap between rich and poor in access to university in more

than eight years of office. Providing Officer, we have a

solution and it works and all we ask is that the First Minister has the

courage to ditch the stone carvings and vanity projects and moved to

practical solutions for our poorest students. Will she? Ruth Davidson

calls it ideological, I call it usable. It will be the people of

Scotland to make up their minds. I will put forward my policy at the

election and I am happy to allow the Scottish people to be the judge of

that. In the meantime we will continue the hard work to make sure

everyone has the chance of going to university. That is why we have

established the widening access commission. Since 2006, there has

been a 50% increase in applications to university from those who are the

poorest. I will take no lectures from a representative of a party who

is right now increasing the taxes for the poorest members of our

community as a result of the working tax credit cuts. Ruth Davidson will

be better advised to wonder what effects those cuts would have to

those in the poorest parts of our community. Is the First Minister

aware of the aquamarine wave energy company going into administration.

Come the First Minister offer a reassurance that the government is

doing everything in its power to ensure an early exit from

administration and will she get involved with discussions with

stakeholders as to how we secure the further success of the Marine

industry? The news that they had entered administration was

saddening. The Scottish Government remains committed to the marine

energy sector, but also to doing everything we can to help secure a

buyer for aquamarine power. It is also important to point out that we

took steps to use don't then our commitment to the sector by

establishing wave Scotland. We did that because we recognise the

challenge the industry faces at the moment, particularly the lack of

Private backers. We will do everything we can to back those who

work in this to collect company at what will be a difficult and

challenging time. I am sure we all appreciate the way the community has

rallied round in Aberdeen following the horrific tragedy. I have just

listened to exchanges between the First Minister, Ruth Davidson and

Kezia Dugdale. For five years I have been lectured on student finance by

the First Minister. All the while, government was breaking its promise

to dump the debt. Order! Order. Let us hear Mr Rennie. I have been

lectured for five years. It has not been dumped, it has been doubled,

but the question I want to ask the First Minister is this. When will

the government publish an estimate of the potential number of refugees

who could be accommodated in Scotland? That estimate will help to

keep up the pressure on the Conservative government to be

compassionate to the plight of refugees by accommodating more here.

When will get that estimate? Firstly, can I thank Willie Rennie

from the very bottom of my heart. He bravely reminds the Scottish

electorate of the Liberal Democrats record on tuition fees. That was

indeed... Order. Order. That was indeed a most charitable thing for

him to have done, but on the very serious and important matter of

refugees, I am very happy for Willie Rennie to be updated on the task

force I established. We want to and are willing to and are preparing to

take a proportionate share of the number of refugees that come to the

United Kingdom. Clearly, the number that are permitted to come to the

United Kingdom is not something within our control, it is determined

by the UK Government. The Prime Minister has said 20,000 over the

life of this Westminster government will be omitted from the camps. We

are arguing for that number to go higher and for it to extend to

refugees who have already made the journey to Europe. The task force is

ensuring that everyone that needs to be involved in this are working

together to make sure we have plans to accommodate refugees. We don't

know yet precisely the numbers of profile of the 20,000 that has been

committed to already. We would expect to see some refugees coming

to Scotland before Christmas and we're working hard to make sure we

can accommodate them and look after them properly. Just for completeness

on student finance... Order. Let us hear Mr Rennie, please. We will take

every opportunity to remind people that this government that it would

dump the debts, but it has double the debt. We will take every

opportunity to remind people, but on refugees... Order. It is all well

and fine for people to laugh about refugees. We need an estimate of how

many Scotland could take, but her minister said to us this week they

have prepared no such estimate after months on the job. The First

Minister has said Scotland will take its on it share of refugees, but

surely we should be more compassionate than a technical

accounting for when lives are at stake? I think the members should

listen... I think, Mr Rennie, you should just get on with it. Winter

is coming, which will leave many refugees vulnerable. We could send a

powerful message to be Conservative government by agreeing to take more.

We should act now. Does she not agree? I don't want to overstate

this, but I think Willie Rennie should be mildly ashamed of himself

over the tone of this question. Willie Rennie sat around a table at

the summit I convened the Wii 's ago. We agreed the degree of

consensus that we would take. It is an appropriate starting point to say

that we will take the relevant share of refugees. I am also saying I

would like to see the Prime Minister go further than that in two ways.

Firstly in terms of the number and secondly in terms of the reach of

the programme. That is the appropriate way to behave to argue

for a more expansive approach from the UK Government, but to do the

hard work to make sure we have the practical preparations in place to

take that proportionate share. We will get on with that work and I

really do hope, and this is a genuine invitation to Willie Rennie,

that he will come back into the consensus rather than trying to make

cheap political points out of an issue that is so important. To as

the First Minister what correspondence the Scottish

Government has had with the UK Government on its discredited plans

to cut tax credits by 2016. The Deputy First Minister read to the

Chancellor in early live to set out Scotland's nes and is about cutting

tax credits. On July 20th, along with others, we voted against it. I

would take this opportunity again to urge the Chancellor to think again

and to abandon a misguided policy that will penalise hard working

families across Scotland and the UK. Can I take this opportunity to

remind members that you should keep to the words that are actually on

the order sheet and not add additional words to it. John

McAlpine. Can the First Minister offer any advice as to how the

Chancellor would proceed with his plans regarding tax credits? I think

he should abandon them. I'd then think they are right or necessary.

George Osborne has said that he is in listening mode, but if he is

serious about listening, he will admit he has made a serious mistake

and reverse these damaging proposals. The impact on Scotland's

means -- on Scotland means that a quarter of a million people could be

affected. These changes will be unconscionable and I hope the

Chancellor uses his Autumn Statement to show he is not proceeding with

them. For a reduction in the number of training places for nurses and

matrons increase the use of agency nurses? There has been an increase

of 5% we have historically high levels of nurses and midwives in the

NHS. Regarding agency nurses, we have reduced significantly the

number of agency nurses working in the NHS.

The First Minister says we should judge the SNP on their record.

Order, order! Audit Scotland pass judgment on her record last week.

The First Minister herself took the decision to cut training places when

she was Health Secretary. Scotland's nurses have told us the

consequences could quadruple agencies spent from 3.9 million to

?16 million. This mismanagement led her to the damning report card she

was given last week. After eight years in government, and her failure

to address previous warnings, does the First Minister now agree with

audit Scotland that we need fundamental change in how we staff

are health service? Of course, it is this government coming forward with

those change proposals from the transformation in primary care

those change proposals from the through to the expansion of elective

treatment centres, this is a government that

treatment centres, this is a the job. Let me just turn to

vacancy rates are broadly the same. There was 3.6% when we took office,

3.7% now. Agencies spend is lower than when we took office. She cites

the figure of ?16 million. It is worth pointing out to the Chamber

that is 13% lower than the ?18 million it was when we inherited the

position from the last Labour government so, presiding officer,

our NHS today, government so, presiding officer,

the same emphasis on job quality. Isn't it time to start putting as

much emphasis on job quality when we decide on the eligibility for

government support services and grants paid for by the taxpayer? I

think that is a fair point and through the fair work convention and

the approach we've taken we will continue to consider issues like

that. I also think for people across the country, job numbers matter, but

he's right to say that the quality of work matters as well. We want to

see more full-time work for people who want it rather people being in

jobs where they are working fewer hours than they want to work. And we

want to make sure people in jobs are being paid a decent living wage,

they have good living conditions and they are well rewarded. That is the

whole focus of the business Pledge and the fair work convention.

Crucially, this gets to the heart of why we are seeking a partnership

with business. They should do these things because it is good for

business as long as society. I think we are making headway on that

argument in Scotland and I hope we have the support of the Chamber to

push further ahead on it. That ends First Minister 's questions.

Condolences expressed by all the political leaders, Nicola Sturgeon

going further saying she would attempt in as much as was possible

to learn some lessons from the tragic events in Aberdeen. I hand

you over to the daily politics. is dealing with the Foreign Office,

all they want to talk about is China. . After Mr Mhodi's visit,

that will change. The Office for National Statistics

have this morning released new