04/03/2012 Scottish Liberal Democrats Conference

Good morning and welcome. Later, delegates will hear from all the

leader of the party in a Scotland. This was the scene inside the

conference hall when the party's president will shortly address the

delegates. The latest issue has been the independence referendum. I

am joined in the studio by Professor John Curtis of

Strathclyde University and by our political editor Brian Taylor. Good

morning. Brian, you are in Inverness. Is there a similar that

this year there has there was in Dundee? Morale -- there is a

comparable atmosphere. Both parties are dealing with the fact they had

very poor results in May last year. But they might say that they punch

above their weight. You either go in the corner and cry are you come

back fighting. There will also be some discussion on the independence

referendum. Michael Moore, Secretary of State, his

consultation ends on Friday. He is adamant that further powers and an

issue for down the line. There is a resolution at the top of the motion,

being taken by the conference later, saying that there should be a home

rule, with maximum devolution, an option on the ballot paper. That is

something that attracts a number of Liberal Democrat who are attracted

by the idea of getting some kind of maximum devolution position adopted

by the people but Michael Moore and many others are saying that the

thing is to clarify the independence issue first. That

sounds like a tricky situation for Willie Rennie when he was speaking

in the conference chat yesterday. He was indebted would have to be

the yes or no question on independence but we are hearing

that members would be interested in a second question. I do not think

we should be surprised with this tension. The Liberal Democrats are

staying on the one hand that they want this question on home rule,

and they do not want to call this devotion Max but it does involve

much more powers for the parliament. At the same time they say they do

not want this on the ballot paper and an independence referendum.

That raises the question, if it is not on the ballot paper, how will

you deliver this change at some point in the future? It is not

obvious. What I expect to hear Willie Rennie say is that is

Scotland votes against independence, that he would be willing to work

with the SNP to progress the idea of more powers. There is still the

question of whether that is necessarily the straightest route

to achieving those powers as opposed to putting the question on

the ballot paper? The Liberal Democrats have

traditionally been the party of home rule as an alternative to

independence. They want to see more powers transferred to the Scottish

Parliament. But there is debate over which powers should be

devolved. Made in Scotland from girders.

Willie Rennie would like to forge an alternative to independence. The

Scottish Liberal Democrat leader is in search of a grand design.

He does not know yet what further evolution will look like but he

does know what it would be called - home rule. He has asked some Ming

Campbell, former leader of the Liberal Democrats, to work out

exactly what the Liberal Democrats mean by home rule.

It to party activists and members in Inverness, it means different

things. For home role, we need fiscal

autonomy. That is the basis of home rule. So you do not want an

independent Scotland? No, I do not. I certainly do not. If we are to

Sol for the problem of the United Kingdom and to have a United

Kingdom solution, federalism across the United Kingdom, then we could

be wasting their time talking about all these devolution schemes.

a halfway house to federalism. Tavish Scott is already backing the

Devil is an Plus scheme which would put Holyrood in charge of most

taxes except the VAT and national insurance.

I want to see bought sites responsible for part of the balance

Syed -- balance sheet. devolution plus a blueprint that

Sir Menzies Campbell would snap up? I do not know exactly what people

mean by a these different terms but by the time we have finished, they

will know what home rule for Scotland would mean. For Tavish

Scott has already joined this campaign for devolution Plus, which

would then bowled the substantial transfer of tax powers, is that

something you are signed up to? His predecessor says that the

important thing is to reach an agreed alternative to independence.

We must avoid the perils of an overcrowded pitch. We should learn

from the experience of that baby referendum campaign over 12 months

ago. A single coherent body bringing together the disparate

groups involved. We know the general direction of travel but we

need to flesh out the detail of what a post referendum environment

which has seen independence rejected would axe will look like.

Whatever formula they come up with, it would have to win Treasury

approval. The current Chief Secretary seems sceptical about

devolving some major tax powers. would have to look at any ideas

that came forward if there was a consensus around them. In the case

of the tax, there are the pros and cons. Corporation tax - would we

want tax competition within the UK? That could make all governments

what's what. -- worse off. The one thing they seem to agree on

is that more devilish and does not need a referendum. -- more

devolution. This is not dependent on the ballot

paper. The final proposal will be worked out prior to the referendum.

Yes. So where fewer proposal is on the ballot paper, would you

campaign forward? -- if you're proposal.

I am campaigning for devolution plus. That is the absolute focus. I

do not know what will be on the ballot paper and I will not spend

the next two years second guessing that.

In Inverness this weekend, the official Lib Dem line is that

further demolition on home role can only be delivered to every

independence his first defeated in a straight question referendum. But

if the Lib Dems and other pro-union parties are to persuade a Scottish

voters to reject independence, and to something better, then they will

have to define what something better looks like in time for the

referendum. What is to stop Alex Salmond and the SNP put in their

alternative on the ballot paper, to be tested alongside independence?

The the professor is still with me. A lot to discuss their. It is a

tricky one for Willie Rennie. He has made it clear that he wants to

see only one question. Yes. One aspect of it not be SNP's most

recent proposals but those that were published in 2010, because,

what emerged from that, the SNP said they would ask two questions.

Do you want to increase the powers of the Scottish Parliament? And a

second question, do you want to increase the powers further so that

Scotland becomes an independent country? And from Alex Salmond its

point of view, even is that more than 50% voted for a independence

but 90% had voted for devolution Max, there would still go for the

independence which is something that Willie Rennie was arguing

against. The question that faces the Liberal Democrats is that if it

is not on the ballot paper, how can they say to people? Another

suggestion has been to create consensus between the Conservatives,

Labour and Liberal Democrats about the alternative so that they could

possibly all signed up to this is what they would do in the event of

a No vote. In a sense, the Calman Commission was such a process that

achieved consensus between the T4 parties. But when we compare the

tone of what Nick Clegg said to this conference on Friday, what

Willie Rennie said in terms of devolution, and is what we heard

yesterday, there are some very sceptical dynamics under water here.

Mr Sam and it will be delighted as if that is what happens. -- Alex

Salmond. They must be difficult for the Unionist camp because as

Charlie -- Charles Kennedy was saying, there needs to be a single

coherent body. It looks like he will be reading the Lib Dem

campaign. It is interesting that they are planning for a post

referendum, if there is an old boat. -- a no vote. I think they want to

try to make sure that Scotland does not vote Yes to independence but

also that Scotland does want a more powerful parliament than they have

at the moment with powers for taxes and welfare. Unless they come up

with a clear statement as to how that could be delivered within the

framework of the Union, perhaps people will say that you are not

offering something clear, maybe we should vote for something like

independence. Therefore, coming up with some idea of how the union can

meet the demands of the Scot is Parliament, I think it is essential

that happens this side of the referendum.

Ming Campbell seems proud of his home rule Commission, harking back

to Asquith and Gladstone. What difference would a home rule

Commission make to the devil was in Plus?

-- devolution plus. We could say that the Liberal Democrats have

been left behind in the race to try to develop an alternative because

reform Scotland's initiatives in terms of devilish and plus... They

have our lawns and a schematics scheme but they have not worked out

a detailed proposal. The Liberal Democrats want to be in the

forefront but they need to get their skates on. Thank you very

much. The party entering government has

been for some Liberal Democrat the peak of their achievement but for

others it has been a despairing lob that has seen their popularity

plunge. Yesterday, Alistair Carmichael endorsed a plan to renew

It is important for us to remember that as important as they are, our

MPs and ministers are an emanation of the party of rather than the

other way around. They all started as rank-and-file members and

achieved their present positions not only from their great efforts

but also as a result of the work done and the money raised by are

the rank and file members. It is not for us to tell our MPs and

ministers what to do. We would not seek to do that and that is how we

are different to the Labour Party. But it makes sense for there to be

a continuing, a two-way dialogue between parliamentarians and the

wider party, and this review is a Collision with the Conservatives

has been likened to a ride on the tiger in the Old Limerick. We have

been here before. On each of the occasions, a party almost ended up

as this man on the face of the tiger. How can we avoid the

disastrous fractures in our party that followed those coalitions? We

believe the best way forward is to involve all parts of the party in

reviewing our strategy in a businesslike way. We want everyone

to come together to evaluate the process and achievements of the

coalition as they affect Scotland. 20th June 12 will be the

appropriate time to start this work. -- June, 2012. This is the right

time for a formal review of where we are.

APPLAUSE The party is notoriously difficult to lead. Party members

have what seems like an unreasonable attachment to

idiosyncratic points of principle. They are sensitive to the fact that

our core programme and deepest instincts are built amongst other

things on a massive contributions to the creation of the NHS and

welfare state. Liberal Democrat support for have a strong

attachment to concepts of the general interest to public service,

to being on the side of the underdog and the dispossessed, and

to equality of opportunity. It can mean a demonstrable a limit on the

ability of the Deputy Prime Minister and his ministerial

colleagues to deliver support for particular policies. Demonstrable

to our coalition partners, and to the country. It can provide us

their views -- it can provide other views. How it can help leadership

to escape the corrosive effect of aspects of Westminster. A political

party is a vehicle for achieving political purposes. High a

political party's influence comes ultimately from its strength at the

ballot box. This party has expended a lot of political capital in the

national interest in joining the coalition. It must be able to renew

its political mandate. That is where the public needs to see we

have been successful, not just in terms of dealing with a crisis, but

in terms of delivering and our values and programme. This party is

our war party, built on the traditions of the past and held in

trust by the present leadership for the future. The political

accountability is to the electric, but there needs to be a robust

structure linking the leadership to the rank-and-file. We have got to

seize the opportunity of this referendum campaign in the context

of the Westminster coalition as an opportunity in which we can

uniquely in Scotland underscore the distinctive, unique identity which

is liberal democracy. One goes hand-in-hand with the other. I just

want to say a few words about the conduct of the forthcoming campaign

itself. First, we must avoid the perils of an overcrowded pitch. My

goodness, we need to learn from the experience of that AV referendum

campaign. It needs a coherent, single body bringing together the

disparate groups involved. We know the general direction of travel,

but we need to flesh out the detail of Forte Post referendum

Environment which has seen Independence rejected would

actually look like -- flesh at the detail of a post referendum

environment. Our task has started here this weekend with the

consultative meeting last night. This debate about the referendum

and the role of Scotland is also a debate about the future of the

United Kingdom. It is a chance for others, in the context of that

coalition, to remake the case for federalism on a UK basis, with

Scotland as a trailblazer. That is the job I will be doing on your

behalf. I will do it with relish. I hope you will enter the campaign

with relish as well. Thank you. APPLAUSE I did not come into

politics to make cuts, and I suspect you did not.

Some of the things we are having to do are very difficult. But it is

necessary that we start to live within a 1 means. That is why the

Government's top priority is to cut the deficit and get our economy

back on track. But this coalition Government is a huge opportunity. I

spent five years as an opposition MP, and it was almost impossible to

get any Liberal Democrat policy through and any piece of

legislation changed to include our priorities. With fewer than one in

10 MPs, that is what we are achieving in the coalition

Government. Nick Clegg's used contract, �1 billion extra to help

hundreds of thousands of young people -- youth contract. I am

jealous of my English colleagues who can say that their schools get

an extra �30,000 a year, and I think that is a policy we should

apply in Scotland. Taking more than a million low paid out of income

tax, and Nick Clegg is right to be pushing towards the �10,000 limit.

I hope you will all have the confidence to get out there. We

need that dialogue, not just for the party, but with the country. I

have been knocking on doors a lot recently. I love it when someone

raises the coalition. It is an opportunity to talk to that

individual and reassure them. There are lots of people who are

uncomfortable about the prospect and the reality of those being in

coalition with the Conservatives. I understand. A lot of MPs Arab

comfortable with it, too. We need to have those discussions to

reassure people we are doing the right thing in the national

interest, and we remain a strong and indeed -- a strong and

distinctive presence. Thank you. Applause there. Let's go back to

the conference hall, where Brian Taylor has been joined by three

activist. Brian. Thank you very much. Three senior members of the

party, Nora Radcliffe,... First, I would like to say I'm glad to be in

a party where ordinary members can put up a major motion like this and

have a debate. The background here is simple. We have a commitment go

back more than 100 years. -- going back. We have a policy that seems

to be very popular with the people of Scotland. I would like to see,

if at all possible, it included in the referendum. As an alternative

to independence? Yes. I would like to see it done in the same way that

we had the referendum in 1997. A second question, do you want to go

further to independence? Eileen McCartin, you think it has flaws?

think the content of a lot of the motion is very, very good. The

principle of having the two vote, I think is wrong, and I think one of

the main reasons is because Alex Salmond wants it. He wants to muddy

the waters. He knows he will lose and he wants to muddied the waters.

I think that is wrong. However, I believe it is very important that

we say exactly where we are going and what we're talking about. I

believe in federalism. The home will contest is extremely important.

Nora Radcliffe, why not take what seems to be the Democratic option?

We are talking about the referendum. Referendums only work if they are

simple, straightforward, one question. If you do not do that, it

is not a referendum. We have delivered home rule, devolution,

that is evolving and has changed enormously since we got it 12 years

ago. Devolution to me is about better Government. It devolves

things to a sensible level. And you do not need to put that to a Test?

We do not. A referendum needs to be a single question. I agree. It is a

good thing that it is debated openly. It does seem that you might

have some opposition. I think so. In an ideal world, we

would have a vote on more powers on home rule now, and we would see how

that went and then have a vote on independence. We do not live in

that world. We have two-and-a-half years. Michael Moore talks about

how a referendum could be delivered in 2013. If the questions have to

be separated out, we could have a referendum on more powers in 2013,

and when that is decided, we could have a referendum on independence

in 2014. Eileen, if you have two options, there is a problem with

that. If one is supported by a large amount and won only narrowly,

who wins? My view is the opposite. I think you have to have the vote

on independence first. Get that out of the way. Then have a very to

after that on status quo or home rule. One of the important things

people need to realise is that the Liberal Democrats are the party who

have driven the whole devolution process certainly for the last 20

years. We were absolutely committed to more powers for Scotland. The

SNP is only committed to more powers to the SNP. The SNP turned

their back on any kind of devolution. They have not been

interested... That is not true, because they campaigned for a Yes,

Yes votes. They did not do it until the very last minute. The hard work

had already been done. They jumped on the bandwagon. We built the

bandwagon and put the wheels on it. The SNP jumped on at the last

minute. They did not do any of the nitty-gritty. Let me ask each of

you about the state of the party. Last May was not wonderful. How do

you fight back? I think people got a shock at the result. I think they

were swept along. There was a knee- jerk reaction to the coalition. I

think people are more rational man. They have seen what it has

delivered. I think they have understood there was not another

option for the Liberal Democrats in the situation they found themselves.

This situation we have now is infinitely better than it could

have been. I think we're getting credit are. The reason the SNP has

a majority in the Scottish parliament now is because the

Liberal Democrat voters did not come out last year. That was partly

because of what happened the year before. Was the loss of trust

justifiable? I think it was justifiable. People only remember

that now, the tuition fees. They have not realise that there are

positive things that are happening. The tax changes? Yes. Taking

hundreds of thousands of people out of tax altogether, particularly the

poorest, working people in Scotland. That is important to me. What we

are coming up to this year is the elections after the first period of

councils which have run under proportional representation, which

is one of the major achievements of the Liberal Democrats since the

Scottish Parliament came along. I think that has blown up a great

amount of fresh air into local Government. I think local

Government has improved as a result of that. We have to tell people

that is what it is about. Final question. Do you believe you can

work with other parties, Labour and Tories, on the options to

independence, or were you project your own policy on federalism?

work with the SNP on the council all the time, so I am very good at

working with other people and I believe we always will. We will

work with anyone who has the right message to move forward, but it has

to be led properly and the right message. It has to be a positive

message. My impression is that the majority of Scots, like the

Scottish parliament -- the majority of Scots are like the Scottish

parliament. There is a sensible level for that to happen at and I

think we are no sensible party that can lead the way. This sensible

Partick! -- though sensible party! Nick Clegg was in Inverness on

Friday, making his case for the union. He repeated David Cameron's

suggestion of more devolved powers in Scotland in return for a No vote

on independence. Our reporter has been gauging opinion sport in and

outside all. He was undoubtedly the star turn.

This was the Liberal Democrat Prime Minis -- Deputy Prime Minister

after all. But their share of the vote was cut in half at the last

elections. 17 S -- 17 MSPs to just five.

The last time I was here in the Highland capital we were looking

ahead to the Scottish parliamentary elections. They did not quite turn

out the way we hoped. It was a painful experience. As a party, we

lost a lot of excellent people from the Scottish Parliament. So how did

the Scottish party react to their leader's speech?

Nick Clegg got a very warm reception. Remember this is someone

who has had access couple of hard years but he is irrepressible in

political terms. Nick got a positive reaction as you would at X

X. He pressed of the Highlands and Islands buttons. He is a Lib Dem

leader who takes himself and our party seriously. He has proved to

we can actually make a difference in government. He has done a very

good job as Deputy Prime Minister. The young people and our party have

a great regard for him as I do. He comes over very well. He can't help

being English. He is English. Are ringing endorsement. Outside

the conference venue, Inverness has two Liberal MPs and a long history

of liberal voting. How do people on the street and tunic like?

I think the Liberal Democrats were quite popular here but I think

after the coalition, it ruined that. I personally don't like them.

on, have some kind of spine. The difference then between public

perceptions and those of the party. Perhaps there could be more

demonstrable behaviour. Nick Clegg is exuding confidence

before May's council elections. We going to make's elections with

our heads held high, our record of fighting her position in councils

throughout Scotland and a record of delivering real help for Scottish

people in Westminster. Riding high with the party faithful

might produce a warm glow but it might not produce the returns in

local government the Lib Dems hope for in just a few weeks from now.

Professor John Curtice is still with me. Interesting to hear some

of those opinions. One of the delegates said there had been a

justifiable loss of trust over tuition fees. Very hard for the Lib

Dems to overcome that. Indeed. We can compare Willie Rennie's

position with that of Johann Lamont. She at least knows that the

problems she faces was made in Scotland. The Labour Party in

Scotland has gone backwards when the Labour Party south of the

border made as substantial recovery from its defeat in 2010. North of

the border, the party is suffering for its role in the coalition, and

if you look at the timing of the decline, it is centred around that

decision about tuition fees. When you look at the Liberal Democrat

performance in Scotland last year, it was horrendous but it was just

as horrendous as in England and Wales. There is no doubt that

although Tavish Scott tried hard to say, I disagree with Nick Clegg on

to risen fees, he could not escape from that because it is not to say

that people are necessarily against tuition fees because there is

public opinion to say that the principle of having some kind of

tuition fees is accepted, but the fact is the Liberal Democrats said

they would not to them. It was an iconic policy. And then they did

something completely different. They raced to Western fees to a

level where effectively students were peeing all of their tuition

costs. It was such a rise that be public do not trust them any longer.

So far, it is not putting any ice with the public. The Liberal

Democrats have been consistently stuck at about 11 or 12% in opinion

polls ever since that tuition fees decision. In Scotland it is down as

low as a seven or 8%. The party is in deep trouble and its attempts to

differentiate itself from its conservative parties in the

coalition are so far not solving the problem.

Willie Rennie is trying to be an energetic leader but is that

getting across to people? No doubt he has been energetic. He

is clearly very sold confident as a politician. And he has also tried

to suggest his party is not like the other Labour, Conservatives, by

being willing to work with the SNP over budgeting and alcohol pricing.

But however worthy these political manoeuvres, the public are just not

a win and are not listening. 40% people do not think Johann Lamont

is doing a good job but in the case of Willie Rennie, it is 47%. He has

to move from being an effective parliamentarian to demonstrating he

can be an effective campaigner. He must try to get distance between

himself and the coalition, at least in the short term. Nick Clegg is a

deeply unpopular politician not just in Inverness but all the way

down to Cornwall. He must try to distance his party from that.

you very much. The Liberal Democrats have lost another Cabinet

minister in the form of Chris Huhne, the climate and Energy Minister.

His replacement paid tribute to him at conference and pledged to carry

on his green work. To tackle climate tains and protect

our country from volatile international oil and gas prices we

need to change the way we produce electricity. We will actually need

to increase electricity production because we also need to shift from

polluting petrol and diesel transport to cleaner electric

vehicles. We will of course also need to be carbonised Allott has a

two. -- decarbonise electricity. Renewables, like wind, wave, Soler,

and new nuclear. But without public subsidy and with guaranteed

financial provisions for future decommissioning. Thirdly, clean-

coal and clean gas. Delivered by carbon captor and storage. --

carbon capture. In my first month, it is remarkable how many people

seem to think that their low carbon technology is the only one that

matters and the only one that can save us. It is either renewables,

or nuclear, or ccs. For some, onshore wind subsidies are wrong.

For others, Nuclear is not needed because we have so many renewables.

For others, gas is just another polluting fossil fuel when we have

clean nuclear. I have to give you a very dull and boring message. We

need to try a very low carbon technology we can get our hands on.

-- every. The fundamental reason is this. Everyday low carbon

technology has its risks. The future is not certain. The risk of

danger this climate change is just too great. In common parlance, when

you are planning for the future you do not put all your eggs in one

basket. By subsidising renewables, we are seeing the cost of wind and

solar or tumble and I am sure they will go down much more. By being

open to different low carbon technologies, we are creating the

biggest technology race and competition of recent times. That

is what our relativity market reform proposals are all about.

That is what the Green Investment Bank will help deliver. And it is

what our competition for carbon captor and storage projects will

help make happen. I would like to say more about ccs. It is too often

disappointment over the decision not to proceed with Long Gannet.

But it did make some real progress. It showed that commercial scale CCS

is technically feasible and for the first time, complete engineering

designs were made freely available for the whole world to see. As we

approached the revised competition, which I hope to announce later this

spring, I hope that Scott is projects like Peter Head will come

forward to compete. We have already invested at Renfrew. This is a huge

investment, even for a large economy like the UK's. In these

difficult times, to put �1 billion into a competition for such a

development shows that we are serious. The UK government has

found the cash and we will proceed. Like our massive investment in

renewables, we believe it is simply irresponsible and reckless to do

otherwise. As Energy Minister, I am also conscious that we are some way

from a low carbon economy. We still depend on unabated coal, oil and

gas and will do so for quite a few years. When we are successful with

carbon captor and storage on a large scale, we will be able to

exploit these resources for many, many more years in the low carbon

future. That means we have to think about, work for, and nurture these

industries as well. On oil and gas, I will be working with George

Osborne and Vince Cable to make sure that our approach strategy

considers their needs as well. From new production, exploration and the

decommissioning industry, it is vital that our Oil and Gas UK

regimes are and are seen to be stable and attractive for

investment. Returning to renewables, where stability has already brought

huge investments and can bring even more in the years ahead, because I

believe renewables are a classic case of how England and Scotland

need to -- need each other. Indeed, how devolution in the UK has worked

and is the best future for us all. Meeting a renewables target of 15%

energy by 2020 for the UK is a tough task already. If England has

to do it for itself, by itself, it will probably be tougher, given

Scotland has relatively more renewable resources. Yes, the

economics of renewables is that Scotland needs English consumers to

help pay for the renewables as the technology develops. The truth is,

Ed Davey death. I am now joined by Liam McArthur. Thank you for

joining me. -- Ed Davey there. Ed Davey was pointing out that this is

the greenest Government. George Osborne says environmental rules

are a burden on British business. think what you saw in Ed Davey's

speech was evidence to back up the claim that this is the most green

Government. I am more interested in terms of the delivery, politicians

are accused of making grand claims, but I think there is evidence the

UK Government is delivering. I think that will accelerate. The

time frames we are operating in an exceptionally tight. It will

require collaboration between Government north and south of the

border. How can the UK Government beat the living and green energy

when it has been reported that the Chancellor's team is encouraging

MPs to write to Downing Street to say that subsidy is to wind farms

are a waste of money, and inefficient? I think onshore wind

is a technology that is already delivering. If we undermine

confidence in terms of the on job - - in terms of the onshore wind

sector, it will disappear if we do not develop hour wind capacity. I

think a number of MPs have not bought into the idea that we need

to be carbonised our economy at all. I am not terribly interest in that

-- terribly interested in that. am sure you were concerned about

fuel poverty. Chris Huhne said consumers had to shop around to

look for the best deal. Ed Miliband was saying on Friday that was not

good enough, to tell people to shop around. He said that people over 75

should get the cheapest tariff by law. Do you support that? I think

there is a very strong case for empowering consumers to seek out

the best deal. To some extent, simply moving from provider to

provider will not necessarily be the best staying long time. We need

to be conscious not just in terms of energy security, not only in

terms of reducing emissions, but the fuel poverty aspect are

critical. They ran many who were not spending enough in terms of

heating their homes. -- there are many who are not spending enough.

Ed Davey was also talking about lowering the carbon emissions.

think if we talk about failing, that undermines the achievements

made. A lot of excellent work has been done in relation to that. The

economics in relation to that case could not be stacked up.

Nevertheless, I think now work will be invaluable in terms of

successive projects that will come forward. Chris Huhne made it clear

that it was the project to beat in terms of CAB -- carbon capture and

storage. To talk of a failure when so much excellent work has gone

into the project, this work will have any value over the next few

years. Scott is Liberal-Democrat have put pressure on the UK

Government to cut fuel duty in and around the islands. That has gone

down by 5p just last week. It turns out that the fuel suppliers are

putting up a duty by 5p. What action is can he Alexander taking

to try to tackle that and make sure people are not paying higher marks

for fuel -- and what action is can he Alexander taking. What we have

seen at allegations about the practices of certain suppliers to

the islands. Any evidence of profiteering will be investigated

and the firms responsible will be held accountable. Ed Davey

mentioned the green investment banker. What pressure IU putting

him to ensure the Green Investment Bank comes to Edinburgh? A I think

Edinburgh has a compelling case. We saw in that debate recently in

Scottish parliament the cross-party support there is for the bank to be

located in Edinburgh. I think now was across industry. In terms of

the skills base we have, not just finance gales but in relation to

Engineering and academia, I think we have a case that is stronger

than any. I hope that will prove successful. No doubt the other

candidates bidding for this believe they have a skills as well. I think

Edinburgh's case is particularly strong. I am interested in how you

were framing the debate when it comes... Are you taking the fight

to the SNP's? They have made a great play of it. I have made no

secret of the fact that the current Government are building a very

strong foundations that were established during the first two

Scottish executives after devolution. I do not hear anybody,

certainly not in Government, all within the energy sector in

Scotland, who believes that segmenting the UK market would be

in anybody's interest. I think the SNP have some issues they need to

deal with. Nevertheless, in terms of direction travelling and areas

focusing on, I have no difficulty but what the Scottish Government

are saying and I have been supportive of it. I think more

collaborative work is happening. Liam McArthur, thank you for

joining us. A red's discuss some of those

issues with Professor John Curtice -- let's discuss. We are waiting

for the speech from Woody Benny. Let us pick up on that final point.

One of Alex Salmond's key arguments is that it's in the Scott term --

in the short term, it would be financially sustainable in the

longer term with a wave and wind- power. The argument that if, indeed,

Scotland's wind and wave power I to be exploited effectively, Scotland

needs to remain within the union. The argument is Scotland must work

with the UK. Scotland would need wider access to the UK markets. I

think it is very interesting the Liberal Democrats are right taking

one of the key SNP arguments -- the Liberal Democrats are taking on one

of the key SNP argument. I suppose it is in the area the party astray

on. Michael Moore has been talking about the uncertainty caused by the

referendum. They Liberal Democrats have long been particularly keen on

the green agenda. Those in the Green Party would add to not enough.

-- those in the Green Party would argue not enough. It provides them

with a potential one of different nation from the Conservatives. --

differentiation. SNP's may not be keen to spend a lot of money on

developing renewables in the short term, nevertheless, they are keen

to pursue this. The trouble with this is that so far, the Liberal

Democrats have not succeeded in turning it into an iconic policy

that people immediately say to themselves, yes, I know what the

Liberal Democrats are doing. There is not an equivalent iconic policy

with which they are associating. The position on taxation, the idea

of reducing tax, that does not sound like the kind of thing that

would require Liberal-Democrats to persuade Conservatives. Is that not

the kind of thing you expect Conservatives to do anyway? It is

not clear that is the kind of policy that would persuade people

the Liberal Democrats have made a difference to a Conservative

Government. Thank you very much. I think we can now go over to

Inverness to the Eden Court Theatre, where will he Rennie is about to

Donald Trump has not met my happy- go-lucky seven-year-old son,

Stephen. Perhaps he should. Puzzled by in recent enquiry from a

journalist about Donald Trump's latest tirade against wind turbines

and the environmental damage he says that they do, Steve and simply

said, no, Dad, they do not do --, they simply turn round and round. -

- no, Dad, they do not do that, they simply turn round and round.

Such a wise buy. He is wise beyond Donald Trump's years. I am not

saying that every wind farm application should be approved.

Renewables must be a central part of our energy generation. That is

what Liberal Democrats have said for decades. It has never been more

true today. With fuel bills rocketing and fuel poverty rising,

we cannot expect the burden of protecting our environment for

tomorrow to be borne by the vulnerable today. That is why our

climate change Secretary has promised me that he will redouble

his efforts to tackle fuel poverty. That is why I am pleased he is

driving forward the green deal, so it is not only those with the where

with all that can benefit from warmer homes and lower bills, but

those that do not have the cash. We want to persuade the Scottish

Government in investing in insulating homes. We await to

Scotland, to the environment, to Late last year, I spent a deer -- a

day in Glasgow, with an organisation that helps dog addicts

and give support, addressing of the issues in that the lives of an

adult not just the addiction. Drug misuse is a health problem but the

solutions are not only medical. Addiction is often a symptom of

wider and deeper social problems. Housing, lack of work skills,

victims of child abuse. These can be factors that lead to drug issues.

We need to address the problems and not just the symptoms. Scotland

continues to face about drugs crisis with thousands of homes

blighted by addiction with addicts forced to steal, prostitute their

bodies, and deal in drugs just to get through one day to the next.

Drug dealers I think are parasites. Parasite that feed from the victim

host. On my visit, I met Nadir. She has a six-year-old son who is

catered for by her brother. Mary was in crisis but he still had hope.

Her ambition was to feed her boy breakfast and taken to school. For

most, this is a daily norm. For her, this was a lofty dream. She

deserves an opportunity just like anyone else. She deserves a chance

to recover and I think we know our Too often, model rather than

professional judgments are used. There is no one-size-fits-all

solution. We need a flexible and Patient focused approach. We should

not seek to restrict options for moral reasons but insure that

trained professionals can deliver the service they think is best for

the patient. I am not sure of Alex Salmond has visited turning point

in Glasgow. I do not believe he has met maybe and has certainly not

championed the issue. I am sure he cares, I do not doubt that, but the

time in leader devotes his our reflection of their. He needs to

look at his diary and make time to The First Minister prefers to court

the Ritz and the powerful. Rather than the dispossessed and the

vulnerable. He giggles on the golf course with Donald Trump who denies

climate change. Up the Basque of the bus with Brian Souter, who

denies gay people. And now he has recurred Murdoch on speed dial.

Inviting him around for fireside chats at Bute House. The price for

securing the media tycoon's support was a defence of News International

in the new Sun on Sunday. If you read it, this is where the First

Minister became the only person on the face of the Earth who says that

Levison was not caused by news of the world. Is there anything he

will not do? The pert, Brian and Donald. The would be midwives of an

independent Scotland. It is too much time with billionaires and not

enough time with the dispossessed Being a Liberal Democrat in

Scotland, being a liberal and progressive, is about being

prepared to stand up to powerful vested interests, not cosying up.

It is often David against Goliath. Our Deputy Leader has done it with

the cosmetic industry. The way they market and advertise their products.

So far, she has won four battles against some of the biggest names

in the business. She has led a remarkable campaign that gives

young people more confidence about their body image. It has put the

end it -- the industry on the back foot. And freedom of information is

awkward to those who wield power. They don't like it and they wish it

would go way. At Question Time last month, I asked Alex Salmond to

extend the laws so that people could get more power in their hands.

The First Minister refused. A fortnight later, we find out why.

Freedom of information is so serious. 20 patients died in

Ayrshire and Arran and yet nobody had learned the lessons. One man, a

nurse, to convey powerful players and one. The health boards

dismissed him as vexatious. The Health Department paid no attention

until the Information Commissioner worked out that he was right and

all of these well-paid, powerful people were wrong. My fear is that

their son and Adam is only the tip of the iceberg. -- Air Show and I

am. We need a Scotland wide investigation into the practices

and procedures of every single health boards, every police

authority and every department of governments, so that we can proudly

say that the institutions of our country are honest, open and

Not because this is nice to do but because it really matters. Learning

the lessons from patient deaths, rooting out bad government and

holding the powerful to account might be awkward to those in charge,

but Information and power is safer when the two shared. That is why I

appeal to the First Minister today to commit to extend the laws to

housing associations, PFI companies and other government bodies that

can cut corners and Dods and delay. We deserve to here from them. I

want the First Minister to make Margaret Thatcher recruited me. Not

to the Tories. But to this lot. The actions of her party and of her in

the 80s drove me into politics. I never thought we would be sharing

government with her descendants. But I am so relieved that we are.

Without us, there would be no tax cut for those on low and middle-

income, nor �5 pension rise, no �1 billion a year contract, no

protection for post offices, Norah will fuel discount, no Scotland

Bill with powers for the Scottish Parliament and children would still

The unrestrained, the Tories would govern from the right and I am glad

that we have someone with the steel and vision of Nick Clegg bleeding

our party and doing the right thing in the coalition. -- leading our

party. Let's give neck and applause. He deserves it. I am not ashamed to

say that than pro coalition but I We have always advocated

partnership and now we have it. I am for working together for

fairness, creating jobs, but never for the Tories. While our Liberal

Democrat colleagues in the coalition government have been

working to clear up Labour's economic mess, we in turn have been

serious about protecting Scotland's colleges for the good of our

economy. I have spent every be weeks during the autumn sowing Alex

Salmond and John Swinney where they have new money available that they

could use to reverse the cuts to colleges. Week by week, I made the

case to stop the threat to 9,000 students across Scotland. When

times are tough, I want people to have the opportunity to learn new

skills. Together with Liam MacArthur, I made a serious

constructive case. I was delighted when the Scottish Government

changed its budget to reflect what we had argued. �40 million back in

the budget for colleges. They also committed more money to social

housing and too early intervention, just as we had suggested. Good for

students, good for so -- good for communities and good for Scotland.

We saw but her small group can still bring weight to bear on

government and that our strong force it -- our strong voices in

the liberal cause can be heard. I got this letter from the President

of the National Union of students. He rocks, true to form, the

Scottish Liberal Democrats have been incredibly supportive over

this issue gaining such a win for college students helps those most

in need. Thank you for all of your work on this. In return, I would

like all of us here to congratulate NUS on such a powerful campaign

involving their members and to thank them for the way they reached

out to political parties to win a Are positive, constructive work

comes on top of the work we are doing with the Scottish Government

on minimum pricing for alcohol. We want to address the debilitating

affect that alcohol abuse has on communities, families and health.

We were prepared to change our position. We were prepared to work

with the government and we will challenge the big business and

vested interests who opposed this change. People have a positive

choice. In May. In Inverness, in the Highland Council, where Liberal

Democrats have met the challenge of tough times with a radical new

charitable trust to protect services. Where, by careful work

with any Test Highland, Liberal Democrats have helped elderly

people and children who need better care, where Liberal Democrats in

Inverness have shown themselves to be amazing campaigners and great

champions for local people and where the results of all of the

Saxon and hard work was shown at the Inverness South by-election in

November. A Liberal Democrat gain, a win from Labour and that defeat

Across Scotland, Liberal Democrat councils have been working hard for

the local communities. In Edinburgh, they are building a better future

for the City, cutting crime by 20 % three neighbourhood approach.

Giving your chances for young people, through their Edinburgh

guarantee that gives apprenticeships and work experience.

And asking every council in Scotland to match the excellent

work Edinburgh are doing. In five, they have recycling up to 50 % --

Ffife. In Perth, where they have met the 2012 homelessness targets

ahead of schedule, and are building new council homes for the first

time for a generation. In Aberdeenshire, where they are

building new schools and where they have won awards for quality. In

Aberdeen, with the council was turned back from the brink and they

have held -- they have been held up by audit Scotland as an example to

follow. And across Scotland, brilliant liberal Democrat

councillors working hard for communities. In Glasgow, helping

that city make some big changes. David May, leading on the economy

in Angus. Being comparable Graham Reid -- the incomparable Graeme

Reid. I want more of this. I do want more of this in every corner

of Scotland. Too many to mention. Thank you took all of you hard-

working Liberal Democrat councillors. We are delivering in

office. I think it is positive politics. This accepts you have to

work with other people. It is a generous approach. It recognises

people may have different views and ideas. It poses a massive challenge

to part of the SNP. The people who attack personally anyone who

disagrees with them. It is ugly politics. They will hunt down one

by one everyone on the internet who stands in their way, faking letters

from academics, telling cross-party groups they cannot criticise the

Government, telling airlines to downgrade Jim Wallace. They talked

down Scotland's place in Britain and caused... If they are not

careful, they will cause Scotland to become a divided country,

setting Scott again stopped for a generation. My message to the SNP

is simple. Please do not question my loyalty to my nation just

because I do not agree with your It is not all those in the

nationalist camp. There are many sincere, generous, liberal-minded

people in the SNP. But it is there behind the scenes abusers who need

to be tackled. The SNP leadership needs to rein them in, to tackle

the abuse, to overcome the division creators. Their leaders need to act,

and act now. Although I guess their leaders are tied up with their own

problems. They cannot even get a story straight and what

independence means for Scotland. Take just one issue. They started

saying it would be a monetary union with the euro. Then they turned on

the TV and did not like that. Then it would be a monetary and fiscal

union with the rest of the UK, underpinned by the Bank of England.

Then they worked out that is what we have got now. So then they were

tempted by another monetary union, the one when Czechoslovakia

separated. Do you know how long that monetary union lasted for? Six

weeks. It started to collapse after three weeks. It fell apart in well

over a fortnight -- it fell apart in a fortnight. They had to put...

The central bank locked fought tons of Slovakia and gold in their

vaults because of a billion pounds dispute even as they fell apart.

Now, Scotland is not 1990s Slovakia. But we should not believe that

nothing like this could happen to us. It did on Black Wednesday, when

the UK interest rates went up to 15%, as the speculators tried to

wreck currency after currency in the exchange rate mechanism. That's

the power of international forces. Play with them at your peril. That

is the rest, and that is the reality that the SNP deny. I think

the strategy should be simple. We should set up the potential for

Scotland, a powerful force with the United Kingdom, with domestic

control. That is a good reason to reject independence. When Scotland

vote snow to the SNP plans, we Liberal-Democrats will have an

important job to do, taking the country forward. It may be that

after the no vote, the SNP can survive the ending of their dream.

We and they could well be able to work together afterwards to shape a

new Scotland. Does welcome noises we have heard recently from Labour

and Conservative leaders will meet to be nurtured as well. Alastair

Darling, Douglas Alexander and David Cameron said they are

prepared to move to our agenda of more powers for Scotland and home

rule, when they say that, we need to welcome that and work with them.

Be in no doubt, those other parties might say they want home rule, but

there are only taking their first hesitant in front steps. Week will

lead to be the ones who bring people together and bring people

ALVA. We will be the guarantors of change. Liberal Democrats have

wanted home rule for 100 years. The Bill was passed in 1913 to create a

Scottish parliament, but the First World War stopped it becoming law.

Russell Johnson too oblique commission back in 19 seventies

that a federal system would serve every system in the UK well,

sharing the risks and sharing the wings. David Steel, Jim Wallace,

Malcolm Bruce, they worked hard on the constitutional convention to

create the Scottish parliament. We made sure proposals, to transfer

Now with Ming Campbell -- now with Menzies Campbell, every step of the

way, Liberal Democrats have led the way. We are the guarantors of

change. It is our job to convince people a liberal country will mean

that Scotland can be modern, outward-looking, positive and

confident. Scotland, with the powers to win our home affairs, but

proud to share wins and risk. We welcome it be it -- we welcome the

growing clamour for change across Britain. More and more people are

saying that federal ideas made more sense now than ever before. From

the voice of Welsh Conservatives to the editorial pages of the

Financial Times, converts to our cause. We have broken down barriers

between people and parties are to build agreement on the way ahead,

so on the future of Scotland, we can be proud to say that when

history Chimes, it will be the Liberal Democrats and Liberal

Democrat ideas that shape our We are the guarantors of change. To

make our case and lead the campaign, we need a special voice. I am

delighted that Charles Kennedy has agreed to lead the Liberal Democrat

efforts in the forthcoming referendum. Who better to lead our

And it is all of our jobs to sure people how much they agree with us.

Whether it is home rule, a strong Scotland within the United Kingdom,

people agree with us. Whether it is standing up against the cuts to

colleges so that thousands of extra people get the chance to be all

they can play, people agree with us. Whether it is about local councils

that build new houses, putting recycling on the agenda. Put

schools first. People agree with us. Constructive when we can be,

awkward when we have to be. On the side of ordinary people, punching

above our weight. Strong liberal voices, but living for Scotland. --

The will he Rennie, receiving a standing ovation -- Willie Rennie.

He hit out at SNP cuts and set out his post referendum strategy a if

there was a no vote, and confirmed that Charles Kennedy would lead the

efforts in the no campaign. There is the scene at Eden Court Theatre.

The delegates taking their seats as he has walked off stage. I am still

joined by Professor John Curtice. It was interesting to hear him set

out his position. Yes, it was. He indicated the Liberal Democrats are

strongly in favour of much more in a way of devolution. What was

interesting was it was not entirely clear as to how he would ensure it

would be delivered. He did not repeat the remarks he has made on a

number of occasions, but it is nothing the issue should be on the

ballot paper. So maybe a little bit of room for manoeuvre. The

interesting thing was the way in which they were framed more widely.

This was a speech in which he was trying to deal with his basic

problem, which says he is leading a party that people do not trust.

People are not quite sure what it is relevant to any more. A very

important passage in which he trumpeted than degree to which he

had tried to get more cuts for -- he had tried to reduce the cuts to

further education colleges. Here is a man trying to rebuild bridges

between his party and the students, those bridges that were broken down

by the coalition. Beyond that, he was trying to say to people, we

have made a difference to the UK He seemed to also say, by the way,

given we do these things, we are effective and we have a long term

plan for home rule. His implication was that if you believe in home

rule and more Paras for as the Scottish Parliament, you have to

vote for the Liberal Democrats. He was trying to give people good

reasons to vote for his party in May. He mentioned by all of the

councils where there are quite a lot of Liberal Democrat councillors

and where we anticipate a lot of them might lose their seats. He was

harking back to more than 100 years of home rule. A I think there were

two aspects. Trying to say to people, if this is what you want,

you have to vote for us. Trying to get electoral advantage out of it.

The second thing he was saying to his party was that, we are no party

of partnership, which sometimes means compromises and difficult

decisions. But he was also trying to say there was a consensus with

Labour, the Conservatives and themselves coming to some agreement

for some understanding after the referendum if there was a no vote.

That is an aspiration but how would you get people there? What type of

promises the Maitre delight to read to say that if you vote for the

Liberal Democrats this is what we will do. Thank you very much. We

cross back to Inverness now or where Brian Taylor is standing by

with some delegates from the hall. Thank you very much. I was just

watching Willie Rennie's speech. I am joined by three of his

colleagues. Thank you all for coming. Straight to that speech and

the core message at the end about being the guarantors of change. How

can you guarantee something when you will be working with other

parties? I think the point he made is that we have a history of about

100 years of standing up and fighting for home rule and working

with other parties as we have seen when the Scottish Parliament came

into being. With the Calman Commission. We can do that again.

We have shown that we are delivering government working with

the Tories, we have worked with the Labour Party before and we could

work with the SNP after the referendum. We have the expertise

and the skills and the ability to bring other parties together with

us. I think that is what he was seeing.

He said that there was a potential for Scotland as a power will -- a

powerful force in the United Kingdom. But can you define what

home rule is? It is simply defined in the 1930 Act of Parliament. It

means you control your own revenues for the things you do domestically

and to share with others be things you do together. Independence could

be the most confused and uncertain future we could possibly have.

how can you campaigned jointly with for example the Labour Party? Ed

Miliband and Johann Lamont are saying no to the substantial

transfer of tax powers. They can say what they like but they know

perfectly well they are then that dynamic situation. There will be a

need for change. We have to resolve whether Scotland is in or out of

the United Kingdom. The Liberal Democrats are saying, stay end but

we will work with others to bring more powers but also focus on the

positive benefits of being British and part of the United Kingdom. We

will make sure people understand what they stand to lose as well as

what they stand to gain. There was also top of putting a

home rule option on the ballot paper but you are not in favour of

that? I think you are confusing two

issues. We have to decide if we are staying in the United Kingdom are

not first. Then we can bring the other parties together to deliver

what we hope will be significant change to bring Scotland more

powers. It is about bringing all of the parties including the parties

of the wider United Kingdom into that. This would affect all parts

of the UK. So, first decide whether we are in the United Kingdom. Then,

move forward to work with other parties to bring home rule.

Alex Salmond talent is your party in particular to draw up a scheme

of maximum home rule and to bat on the ballot paper alongside

independence. Why not? It would be good if he could first

define what independence was. We have caused a lot of questions to

Reichs salmon do not have answers. This is a party that has walked out

of everyday cross-party attempt to bring best. The only thing they are

interested in his independence and nothing less. They will do anything

to confuse the electorate. A clear question and a clear choice, that

is what their mandate is for. And once that is exercised, it is

either independence or not. If it is not, you speculate you could

work with the SNP? If it was rejected, independence,

we all agree there should be more powers so if that is part, then we

can work together with them on that. How can you bring the Tories and

the Labour Party to your position when they are notably sceptical

about transferring his tax powers? Nobody believed we could get the

Scottish Parliament we have so we have done it before, we can do it

again. How can you bring those two parties

to the table? You can see that we can negotiate

and work with different parties. We are willing to work with anyone to

make sure that Scotland has a better system. We would love to be

fully federal but we will work with people that we get the home rule

that Scottish people consistently so in opinion polls that they want.

We have worked with other parties before and they recognise that.

There is the issue, will them barely -- Willie Rennie talks about

punching above your weight. But this is not the most well-attended

conference I have seen. Are you perhaps facing at rock -- a

backlash from those poor results last May?

We have had a tough year and Willie has been open about that but you

should remember that we are in the run-up to cancel elections and I

have not on doors and people are willing to talk to us. There is not

the ferocity we had a year ago. That has died down? I think it is

less. The evidence of what we have been doing in local councils, a lot

of people are working so hard day in and day out to win those council

elections, so they have to keep going on that all the time. When

you have a setback, it does have an effect on the electorate. People do

recognise that I in the coalition that the UK level, Liberal

Democrats are making a difference. I think we are getting a grudging

respect. And we have continued a lot to the Scottish debate. Willie

Rennie's speech was not just about home rule it was about alcohol

abuse, drug abuse, schools and training. We should not ignore the

whole range of essential issues that need to be confronted. We are

doing that as a party. Willie Rennie has demonstrated that from a

point of severe crisis for the party after last May, we have

stabilised the ship and we are moving forward, starting to rebuild

and starting to win at by-elections, south of the border and here in

Inverness a few weeks ago. It has been a challenging time but Willie

is taking us forward and we are punching above our weight at

Holyrood and in the coalition. People are recognising that.

Let us talk about federalism. Is that still their aim? That was

clear, that is the ambition. what do you federate? Scotland,

England, the regions of England? That is a question. How does

England contributing to this because to date they have rejected

any part -- any powers being taken from the centre but I think they

are wrong to do that. There is recognition in England that there

should be an identity for England within the United Kingdom. People

are resentful of the Scottish Parliament and Scottish devolution,

and the way to get around that is to have an English parliament and

some sort of English legislator, that is logical. When you ask, what

do you federate? The federation is England, Wales, Scotland and

Northern Ireland. Any further federation is a different tear.

Unequal federations do exist but as long as the powers are guaranteed

and they are clear, as long as the finances are shared fairly, it can

be done. We also have to remember that when there has been talk about

the resentment of Scots getting a free ride and things like that, as

we bring more fiscal powers to Scotland, as we hope to progress to

more physical ability to raise taxes that we are spending, it will

be seen that we are taking that responsibility. That is how the

home rule can work and that is how of federalism can work.

What is your best? We have debate about the date of a referendum and

whether that is one question or more. What is Europe opinion?

Salmond is having some difficulty with having a to buy a five year of

debate. He has to face up to some of the damage to business this can

do. We have made it clear that there is a mandate for just one

question and that is the question that should be important without I

confusing diversion. It will be hard to justify waiting 2.5 years

for this question. He is adamant. Most Scots side for two want to get

this decision overland done with. They wanted clear cut and the last

thing they want is for this to end up in the courts. Sorting out a

muddled result is the last thing Scotland needs.

Thank you very much. Back to the studio.

Thank you very much. Professor John Curtice is still with me. Willie

Rennie is hoping to work with Labour than the Conservatives if

there is a no vote in the referendum. Could that come off?

The question one might want to raise is looking at the history of

past collaborations, one might want to argue that the reason for

example that Labour was involved in the constitutional convention was

that it lost the last government by-election, back in the 1980s. It

became afraid about the consequences. The reason that the

Calman Commission was created was because of Alex Salmond's initial

success in 2007. If that analysis is correct, then we have Scotland

were to vote No to the independents, with the threat of independence

gone, with Labour than the Conservatives continue to feel the

need to do something about home rule for Scotland or might they

feel that the storm has passed and they could have about to their

Unionist preferences? That is one question to be sorted out. How will

they ensured that indeed something does happen that Scotland vote no-

one there is nothing on that ballot paper about home rule at the same

time. Thank you very much. I am now joined from Inverness by the leader

of the Scottish Liberal Democrat Willie Rennie. Good afternoon.

Thank you for joining me. Good morning. Before we get on to a

referendum and constitutional issue, let's focus on the coalition. Do

you think you should apologise for the Liberal Democrat being part of

the coalition such as their role would be tuition fees?

Nor, I am glad we are part of the tourism -- the coalition. You would

not have the pension freeze or the post of this protection, Dungavel,

all of these things would not have happened if we run up there.

Nothing to apologise for. One delegate said there was a

justifiable loss of trust in the Liberal Democrat because of the

tuition fees. How can you regain that trust? I saw you were trying

to almost build bridges with the NUS when you revealed that a letter

thanking you for your support. take a simple approach to politics.

You have to listen and find out what people are concerned about, do

something about it, and make sure that you continue to work hard and

communicate and tell people what you are doing on their behalf. That

is the simple approach to politics. Central to that is listening and

that is what we have tried to do since I became leader, working with

the NUS and students on things like colleges, making sure we get more

funding into colleges to reverse the cuts the SNP wanted to impose.

Doing things like that is important I think people have wrecking last

year as a fairly energetic leader, but do you think you are making

your mark -- people have recognised youth. Alison McKay Mischa and

Tavish Scott, they have been very active -- Alison McInnes. Liam

McArthur and Jim Hume as well. There is a great team. It is for

others to judge whether we are a good team. I think we're a great

team. Let's turn to the constitutional issue. It was very

clear you are trying to emphasise your home rule Heritage, you're the

guarantors of change and they tried to place yourself in a pose

referendum Scotland if there is a no vote. Speaking to Professor John

Curtice, he was saying that the threat of independence is lifted,

perhaps Labour and the Conservatives would not want to

push for any more change and you will be left high and dry.

evidence is to the contrary. You have got David Cameron for the

first time talking about more powers for Scotland. Alastair

Darling's intervention was very good and engaging. The evidence is

to the contrary. There are more people coming to our position. Even

Alex Salmond seems more keen on May -- even Alex Salmond seemed to be

changing his view slightly. We have worked for the Conservatives at

Westminster. We have worked with the Labour Party a previously. We

have a track record for working with other people. I am confident

we can continue to do that, working with others constructively and

deliver home rule for Scotland. am not sure the evidence is to the

contrary. Someone was complaining yesterday about corporation tax.

You might have a problem persuading some people about more powers for

Scotland. Why has she said to pay commission? -- why has she set up a

commission? You need to look at the individual issues. I will come Ben

Thompson -- I welcomed Ben Thomson's stuff on Beaver plus. --

devo plus. I am not sure I understand your question. Evolution

at the moment, you're trying to play shots off as this guarantor of

change. Maybe the support is not a round. By think it is about. There

is evidence from David Cameron, Douglas Alexander, Alastair Darling,

ferry senior figures. They have talked about more powers for

Scotland. People from the Labour Party I have talked to want to look

at more powers for Scotland. I think it is what most people in

Scotland want. We are or where most people are. OK. Thank you very much

for joining the. With me once again is Professor John Curtice. He threw

back what you were saying there. would argue that the cases he cited

were evidence to my case. I think you could argue that Conservatives

and the Labour Party and in the wake of the threat of the fact that

they accept there has to be a referendum, showing signs they are

willing to move, and to that extent, quoting evidence of parties moving

in that way next the boy that the crucial question is, what would

happen if independence were to be defeated? Would be a move? They may

move so far that it is difficult for them to come back. I think it

will -- I think it is the threat. We have focused a lot on substance

in a speech. Let's look at style. He started with the words, Donald

Trump. How do you think this speech words in terms of delivery? In it

took us quite a while to try to work out what he was trying to do.

I think we wondered what point he was making. Suddenly, he moved on

to drugs. It's not usually the most popular issue. Eventually, we got

the point that he would try to make. It took us five minutes be far we

got the point. It was a bit disjointed. In terms of style, the

interesting thing I think was in that interview with Yale, he was

relaxed and conversational. I think he came across as less effective as

a platform speaker. He did not have the degree of presence that Joanne

had yesterday. It is not clear he has quite the gravitas and presence

to command the attention of the audience in a big platform speech.

I think we were wondering where the applause lines were at times. I

think he has some work to do in terms of plot from speaking.

Let's head back to Inverness and back to Brian Taylor. Hello. Hello.

I mentioned earlier that topical motion of having a second question

on the ballot paper. I listened to some of the speeches before or, and

it was looking fairly critical. Somebody described the prospect as

silly. What do you make of that speech? He was good. The theme of

been the guarantors of change, that makes a lot of sense. He knows he

has this albatross round his neck of them being in coalition with the

Tories in London. He got round that by saying he was pro coalition, but

would never be pro-Tory. Exactly. I do not think the voters are buying

that. Even just looking at the numbers, they have a long way to

fight back. He said yesterday in introducing Nick Clegg that his

mother told him to smile through adversity and pain. Even looking at

the numbers in their just now, this party is down. They say they are

campaigning for the local elections. You think it is more than that?

you talk to the people who are fighting the elections, they know

the Lib Dems are being squeezed. Let's talk about their approach to

the Home Rule question. They made the pot that the danger is there

had been dreading to negativity. -- dragged into negativity. They do

have a point when they say they have he Stokeley been a party of

home rule. -- historically been a party of home rule. Do you think

the three parties other than the SNP, can they find common ground on

which to campaign as to further powers, or is that maybe not the

objective? I think they will have to have some set of ideas,

something positive to say, vote to know and you will get this. There

has to be something tangible. If it is simply, vote down independence

and we will give you something, but not define that something, that

will be a problem. What can the common ground they? The Liberal

Democrats want federalism. The Tories are sceptical. The ideas

that have been garnered under the label developers could in theory

from a plan. It is a big problem. Thank you very much for joining

those with your analysis. From Eden Court, back to the studio. Brian,

thank you very much. Let's get some final thoughts from Professor John

Curtice. There was an interesting point he was making about the SNP's

attempt to make a monetary union. One of argument is the realisation

that the SNP wants the -- once an independent Scotland to keep the

pound. One of the lessons of the eurozone crisis is it is very

difficult to hear monetary union without a degree of so-called

fiscal co-ordination. There has to be a fiscal discipline. This has

begun to be acknowledged. The First Minister said he accepts an

independent Scotland might have to accept something like the

Maastricht criteria, whereby in any you should not run into a fiscal

deficits below a certain level. That is a great intellectual debate.

The interesting thing many tried to do is see whether they could find a

way of raising this issue in such a way that perhaps the rest of the

public might buy into it. He was trying to raise,... I am not sure

economists would argue that the analogy was good. It might be aware

of trying to dramatise issues. I think we can expect this debate to

continue. John, thank you very much, and thanks for your company here

this morning in the studio. That brings our live television

coverage of the conference to a close. Thanks to Professor John

Curtice for his company. I will be back with Politics Scotland on

Wednesday. Keeping touch with all the news from the Conference on our