14/02/2012 Stormont Today

Welcome to a love struck Stormont today where it is all hearts and

flowers. If you are sitting up to watch this, maybe you need a little

bit of romance in your life. On the programme tonight, the Road to Love

never run smooth. A �600 million investment in roads and hospitals.

There is something missing. We need to get a hold of the public inquiry

and why the d'Or de Minister would not Minister would not release this,

only he knows. How well people with disabilities be hit by the reforms,

S --? At this stage, it is not accurately assess the impact of the

wide range of proposals on people with disabilities.

With more answers, my guest is disability rights campaigner Monica

Wilson. Big changes are on the way to the

benefits system and no matter how fraught the progress of the welfare

reform bill at Westminster, the government says it is determined it

will become law. How will people with disabilities who receive

benefits be affected? Monica Wilson is from Disability Action. Do you

know? We know a little bit. We know there are thousands of disabled

people in Northern Ireland and families with children with

disabilities that are concerned and worried and the sooner we get the

clarity, the better. We know some things that indicate for us this

might be just about saving money. The discussion around 20% savings

on the disability living allowance doesn't take into account the fact

that in Northern Ireland 21% of people of adults with -- 21% of

adults are living with disabilities. It is different to central London

or England or whatever, and when we get to do our the Reform Bill, we

need to be taking heed of what is happening in Northern Ireland.

finance minister said on another programme there will not be a

reduction in the amount of money being spent on benefits. He was

talking about the whole pool of money. It is a mixed message.

not sure, not that I would dispute the figures yet until I get more

information, but we don't think that sounds like what is going to

happen. We are talking about �4.4 billion that carers save the

economy by unpaid care and many of them will live around poverty

levels when the change comes in. That is one person in five,

unemployed but wanting to work, compared to one person in 15 that

are non-disabled. It is good to see some welfare reform. But what we

want to know is what the impact will be. And how we can mitigate

that. We will come back to that later.

The impact on disabled people on benefit reforms dominated questions

to the Social Development Minister today. We will hear that in a

moment but let's start with regional development and the

upgrade of the rail link to the North West has been playing on many

MLAs minds, especially with those - - especially those with connections

to the area. Given the North West is central to

tourism during upcoming events over the next couple of years, does the

Minister anticipate an increase in passenger numbers and perhaps

additions or amendments to the existing timetable? I thank the

member for a supplementary. I always find those people are the

most difficult to persuade. Translink are planning a new

timetable which will be implemented when new trains are in servers. And,

obviously, this timetable has to be agreed with the Department in

advance, so there will be a period of consultation. Obviously, as part

of that new timetable, Translink will endeavour to deploy new trains,

taking account of the increased numbers. And certainly we would

hope to carry that fall would. minister will be aware that is a

view amongst some people in the North West that the railway line is

up for closure. In order to nail that campaign, bad paranoia that

sometimes exists, will the Minister commit to the long-term, not just

development, but expansion of the line to an early service in the

longer term? I am grateful to the member and, indeed, former Minister

for Regional Development for the East -- for the supplementary

question. I have a strong commitment to the railway system

and I do believe that rail provides an opportunity for moving the

travelling public. Therefore, as minister, I am very supportive. As

an indication of the decision I have taken and the efforts I have

made to ensure that we do not actually close this line and we

continue to improve it, and with that will come the expectation of

greater use, and that will further consolidate the position of rail in

the North West and also in other places in Northern Ireland.

Welfare reform is a major concern for many people, including those

with disabilities, so the social development minister should have

some answers as to the impact it will have, shouldn't he?

welfare reform bill is progressing through Westminster and at this

stage it is not possible to accurately assess the impact of the

wide range of proposals on people with disabilities. My priority is

to insure the needs of the most vulnerable people in society are

protected. And that the reform proposals take into account the

specific circumstances of Northern Ireland. An executive sub-committee

has been set up to consider all of these proposals had to have

developed an executive response to mitigate against any negative

aspects and achieve long-term benefits for the people of Northern

Ireland. In terms of DLA, I remain conscious that we have higher

proportion of our population in receipt of the LA. Under a

different profile particularly in mental health. The assessment

criteria reflects people with disabilities, and those groups that

represent them, and we are consulting on the descriptors and

entitlement thresholds. There is a need for others to be careful that

figures they are quoting in relation to the number of people

that made their is a reduction in benefits are informed and do not

cause undue stress to the honourable people. There is a

danger of being alarmist. Both might officials and I are in

regular and ongoing communication with the Department for Work and

Pensions. The degree around thick pasty for flexibilities within the

proposals to reflect the particular needs and circumstances of the

people of Northern Ireland. In order to assess the impact across

the 75 groupings, my department has deployed a response to the

consultation. I will include another report for that. Tax

credits. My officials are currently working on detailed analysis to

come from the financial impacts for customers and robust information

will be available in the late spring or to the Dunne late summer.

-- or early summer. I thank the Minister for his very informed

answer. Or would it be possible, in the light of the various research

that he is doing and information such as it is to hand to send up

some sort of a contingency plan so that we can limit any negative

impact of the reform and people with distinct needs, particularly

those with learning disabilities? If you are going to have a

contingency plan to deal with contingencies, you need to know

what they are. That is why we are undertaking work to see what the

impact is going to be. The focus up until now has been very much a trip

on engagement with Westminster. But directly with ministers, D W P, but

David frying and Maria Miller. We have been engaged with the

Secretary of State and our officials are in contact with

officials from Westminster. Now the legislation is virtually through

Westminster, and we know where they stand, we can focus on working out,

now we know the product, we will be able to know better what the impact

is going to be, and then we can start to do the work. There are

always the issues authority to keep in mind and financial parity has

therefore limitations on what can be done but operation me what we

can do to make a different is open to us. And we will do everything we

can in that regard for. Are you reassured by the Minister

of's comments? Not really. I would say that Maria

Miller, the Minister for Disabled People has said there is no

unemployment, there is no problem for disabled people seeking jobs.

As I said, we have great unemployment levels with people

with disabilities. The Employment Commission is talking about work

placements and many disabled people find work through work placements.

I think that looking at the benefits given to people that it

under the work and support test, that is very different. For example,

severe disablement premium, given to people who obviously have a need

for that, will not be available for those in the workgroup, but will be

available for those in the support group. The overview of this is that

people are worried. They have said to the department and to the Social

Care Agency they need to make communication plans and if they

don't know what the impact is going to be, that makes me even more

worried. Is there a danger that groups like yourselves are being

alarmist? I don't think so. If you look at the calls we get from

disabled people that are terrified about what is happening, I think

time being realistic. If I knew what the impact was, I would be

better able to respond to it, but nobody knows. That is my worry.

The finance minister has revealed where he is planning to spend

almost �600 million of his Budget with most of the money going on

roads. The controversial a fight upgrade will go ahead but has been

scaled back while the aid to Carrickfergus to Belfast road will

also get improvements, as will the eight eights. In terms of the

construction industry itself, this will create 2,500 jobs, but that is

not the end of the matter. Of course, there is a multiplier

effect so for this. It is reckoned that the �500 million we will be

spending will, in turn, generate additional spending, which, because

of the multiplier effect, will be 2.8 times. That will generate

expenditure of nearly �1.6 billion in the economy over the period.

he and the exec -- are they still committed to the other sections in

the long-term, given that there are problems around funding?

As I said in an answer to an earlier question, the decision on

any road scheme, as far as I am concerned as finance minister, must

be based on, first of all, what are the priorities in the programme for

the government and how does this scheme fit into the priorities

which departments have set for themselves? There must be objective

criteria on which these investments are made. I do not want to give any

commitment today which takes the pressure of the Irish government to

make a contribution. I think he would recognise it would be foolish

to do that. We have got �50 million commitment from them. I think if I

were to signify that we were quite happy to continue with the rest of

the roads, no further money would be forthcoming. It is my job to

maximise the amount of money so that we can maximise them. Can the

Minister confirm the two sections he announced on the road will start

this ought and? Could he give confirmation for the start of the

work on the other road? First of all, the spend on the two

roads will start this year. As far as the hospital is concerned, what

the proposal will do, it will enable them to be because the time

between the enabling works being carried out, which I understand are

being done, and then the hospital been built, because that was going

to be a gap. Again, there will be substantial spend of nearly �10

We need to get hold of the public inquiry into the A five and why the

Minister will not release this, only he knows. And the further need

to remove the plight from the section from Ballygawley until

Aughnacloy because there is a lot of land and farmers and that land

could continue to be blighted if a clear statement of intent isn't

made soon. Let's talk to one of the winners, Danny Kennedy. Going on

that point, what about this public inquiry? The inquiry is an

independent process and the inspector is due to report and he

will report in his own time with his detailed submission. It would

not be proper for me to put pressure on him so we will wait for

the report and when it becomes available we will study it as

quickly as possible and see what the implications are, in respect of

the A5 road and the A eight. this decision taken out of your

hands? I am the Minister for the roads and, therefore, I have

identified priority is in terms and the strategic road network and that

is why we brought forward this balanced series of announcements

today. Long-sought after roads, much campaigned for. And two

sections of the A five. I have announced today almost half a

billion in terms have spent, which is spectacular. Although the A5

road has been scaled back, the local Tories have been critical,

they say that to challenge so much money being spent. Is your party

going back on the manifesto promise? What we're doing is

reigniting the construction industry, giving hope to young

people and creating real benefit in terms of the local economy and

particularly the construction industry. Those are very positive

things and it has been warmly welcomed by the industry and by

road users themselves and I am interested to hear the comments of

others but they are not really at the game when it comes to creating

jobs and developing opportunities all over Northern Ireland.

Allister later this afternoon was not very happy with this proposal,

and said, where is the business case? Has it been sent to the

Department of Finance? The fact is, the business case was only

completed upon receipt of the inspectors' report and that will

detail any necessary changes and they will be costed and then the

business case will be finalised to the satisfaction of everyone. That

is the nature of the contracts we have entered into. Thank you for

joining us tonight. It may seem like a dim and distant memory, but

when the budget was agreed in March last year, the SDLP voted against

it. But as Mark Devenport told me earlier, that view may be softening,

thanks to today's spending announcement. It would appear that

the SDLP reacted to the good news for Labour around Stormont by

trying not to be painted into the corner of being nay-sayers and they

always quoted against the budget in the past, even ministers have voted

against it, they continue to do so, like in June. Yesterday, during

heated exchanges, Alasdair McDonnell again said, we are minded

to oppose this, but in the light of this capital spending, the SDLP

finance spokesperson said they were ready to be more generous and

signalled a shift. Good news on that front but some bearing bad

news today? This is about the release in written form of report

from inside the finance department and the First and Deputy First

Minister's offers by units within those offices. It was not

particularly wonderful in the sense that this report found that 67% up

the executive goals under the old Programme for Government had been

met but there has giving things to say about health. It found that

less than one-third of the previous goals had been met. Some people say,

this maybe should have been spelt out on the chamber floor and maybe

this is bearing bad news. Since it appears to be bad news mainly about

health and of course help was run by the Ulster Unionists, would the

DUP and Sinn Fein really have thought about burying this? They

could have used this as an opportunity to bash the Ulster

Unionist Party? They spent a long time and the last administration

having a go at Michael McGimpsey. The kind of goals that were not met

were about ending the rise in obesity, reducing the suicide rate

by 15%. They said some strong targets for themselves. They did

not manage to achieve these. The question is, get targets that you

can meet! Then you welcome up trumps when people look at it

afterwards and say, did you achieve those goals? The Alliance Party

thinks it is a case of burying bad news and Stewart Dickson joins me

now. You think that this unlikely put this out on the same day that

they announced lots of money for road improvement and hospital

improvement? I am convinced. It was a good news story in terms of my

constituency in East Antrim and in relation to the roads and hospitals

but sitting on a table outside was a written statement from OFM-DFM

telling us basically had they failed to meet their targets. Not

even prepared to come to the chamber and answer questions on

this or make any oral statement. I think that has shovelling bad news

out when most of the media has been covering the good news about the

investment. They did reach 67%? That includes green and amber

warning lights so even that is over a bit. Realistically, we are

looking at nearly 50% of key targets must and many of those are

very important, hospital waiting times, in relation to the rate of

suicide, one of the most important issues that challenges our

community. Important indicators. This is a period of 2008 - 11 but

much of the failures have been since 2010. So might argue that it

was a targets that were unrealistic. To reduce suicide by 15%, given the

upward trend over the past years, was pretty unrealistic in the first

place? You need to set challenging targets, no matter what. I do

appreciate this is a very sensitive area but it does in investment and

perhaps more time. But OFM-DFM paid for a great deal of professional

and buys in setting as targets. They are set as realistically as

possible and they might be challenging and sometimes ministers

tell us that targets are stretching targets. Eradicating child poverty

by 2020? Why set that as a target. There have been good things, things

have been achieved. They are unrealistic, like that., but also

failures in there. Trolley wait times. That simply as a failure.

There are difficult issues for people with disabilities, one of

the targets they did not breach was at 13 week waiting list for people

waiting for new wheelchairs. They did not meet that. What is the

waiting time? It can be as long as 26 weeks. It depends on the type of

wheelchair and the complexity of the individual need but if you do

need something that enable you to move outside your room or your

house and you had to wait 13 weeks, would you not be feeling that you

are not part of society? And not being given the respect and dignity

that you deserve? That was on target that was not realistic

enough? I absolutely, there are as a general acceptance that you wait

for equipment. I do not think you should wait unless it is a very

complex issue. When you need something that is either brought in

or something that has to be purpose-built. But the railway

targets, respite care packages, the number of packages did not meet

targets. That is vitally important for people, for families who need

respite. It is only a couple of weeks and people need that. If

they're under the pressure of depression or under pressure as

families. And too much is expected of people in care and not enough

divot -- dignity is given to disabled people. Should we not be

shutting us from the rooftops? These targets have not been

reached? We are and my colleague raised this as a point of order

with the Speaker today. He is a vice-chair of the OFM-DFM committee

and he will raise those issues and they do expect Peter Robinson to

come to the chamber and explained to the members why are these

targets were set out why many of them simply have failed us. It

isn't just important health issues, there are a range of targets and we

simply have not planting of trees, for example. That was not

unrealistic. There are things that I accept that the economy has

overtaken in relation to tourism. But all these things need to be met

and we need to have a collective -- explanations given to us. Can MLAs

multitask? Should they be working on tablet devices and phones in the

chamber? An eagle-eyed Sinn Fein MLA and viewer of this programme

last night noticed MLAs using technological devices during

proceedings. I asked him if he was for or against it. I observed a

number of MLAs using their iPhone and computers in the chamber. That

isn't officially allowed but it does indicate that members want to

use these devices in the chamber and want to get on with working in

the chamber and as a modern assembly we need to allow that and

we need to facilitate that. Are you aware of the rules and regulations

in other places? Westminster and the Dail, for instance? In Wales,

that is a very good example. Laptops and computers are used

within the chamber and actually, it does increase the number of elected

members to stay in the chamber. What you find is that members have

an increasing workload which is electronic, through e-mail, and the

need to be able to deal with that rather than leaving the chamber I'm

going to other officers to do this work. If we can work in the chamber,

we can also listen to debates and multi- task and all the rest of

that. In a modern assembly, people expect us to do work and that work

should be facilitated. She people not listen to other members? You

talk about multi-tasking but if you're concentrating on e-mails or

looking at other business, is at the time and place to be doing

that? Should you not engage in the debates? You can tipple. Computers

can actually help with the betting because if you listen and here and

relevant point, you can research that. Using your computer. It will

inform members and will prove to be a oven assistance rather than

hundreds. When you go to this bigger or the Commission? I have

raced this on a number of occasions with the Assembly commission and

they informed me that this will be raised on 27th February at a

meeting. A number of members want to facilitate this request and on

television, you can see members of every party already doing this, so

there is no reason why it could not be part of the mainstream.

final thought? What happens with the Welfare Reform Bill? Do you sit

on the sidelines? We are actively lobbying at ministerial level but

we need to lobby to make sure that this bill for Northern Ireland does

not go through in an accelerated passage way. We need to look at the

various clauses and the regulations, because often it is the practice

that is important. The key very much for being with us tonight. --