28/09/2011 Today at Conference

Evening all. Welcome to our round- up from the Labour Party Conference

here in Liverpool. Ed Miliband says the Blair-Brown era is over and

wants to move on, though what he'd replace it with is still far from

certain. The recent past is still haunting him - from why Labour

didn't do then what he wants to do now, to not standing up for Tony

Blair when part of the conference booed the mention of Mr Blair's

name yesterday. There's also those former ministers who think Labour's

record is worth defending, such as Shadow Home Secretary, Yvette

Cooper, who mounted a passionate defence of Labour's record on law

and order. Tony Blair was right, tough on crime, tough on the causes

of crime. Because it worked, crime fell by 40%. The first Government

since records began, where crime went down, not up. Seven million

fewer crimes a year. That's Labour's record and we should be

proud of it. What is David Cameron's answer? 20% front-loaded

cuts to the police. It's shocking. Right across the country 16,000

police officers lost. This is a wreckless risk to take with the

fight against crime. APPLAUSE

Conference, the police do have to make their fair share of the cuts.

We said 12% budget cuts, based on independent advice on what the

police need to protect the front line. That's �1 billion over the

course of the Parliament, but the Government has gone for �2 billion

in cuts, with the steepest cuts in the first two years. We have said

it before, it is too far, too fast and it is communities that are

paying the price. APPLAUSE

How can they turn a blind eye to the evidence from the riots this

summer? For four nights, thousands of people took to the streets to

loot and to rob and burning police cars and looting shops and torching

homes and putting people's lives as well as their livlihoods at risk.

This country must never again tolerate such laurlessness. --

lawlessness. Never again should criminals be allowed to take

control of the streets and they cannot be allowed to get away with

APPLAUSE But, conference, it took 16,000

officers to quell the madness on London's streets. Officers from

Norfolk, South Wales, Hampshire, koum brieia, all joining the Met --

Cumbria, all joining the Met to bring the streets back under

control. That is the same number that David Cameron wants to cut.

How out of touch can you get? Police numbers do matter. You don't

cut crime by cutting the police. Breathless promises this summer to

send in the Army, the troops on the streets of Britain. Prime Minister,

you don't need to bring in the army if you have enough police.

APPLAUSE Now is the time for a serious

vision for the future of policing. A Royal Commission or a heavy-

weight independent review. The Government has refused to do so, so

we will. We are setting up an independent review, to look at the

crime challenges of the 21st century and how policing needs to

adapt and respond. I'm grateful to the much-respected Lord John

Stevens for agreeing to chair this important, independent review.

APPLAUSE Conference, next week, at the Tory

Party conference, we'll hear a lot of tough talk from David Cameron,

about broken Britain, cracking down on crime, and gangs. Tough talk

from a Prime Minister who is still cutting the police, still cutting

their powers and pushing up unemployment and barely mentioned

crime since he started in the job. He says it now, but he hasn't done

it before. Prime Minister, it shouldn't take a riot.

APPLAUSE The taxpayer now has to pay out

hundreds of millions of pounds in compensation to the businesses, the

families hit by riots. Far better to prevent it happening in the

first place, because the Tories claim to be the party of law and

order, but look at the fact - every Tory Government since records began

has seen crime go up, not down. Tories in Government do not cut

crime. If we had said before the 97 election that under Labour crime

would fall by 40%, no-one would have believed it could be done. But

we did it. Tough on crime, tough on the causes of crime. Strong powers,

strong safeguards and prevention and backing the police. Labour is

the party of law and order and that is how we will stay. Thank you.

Yvette Cooper. After, I spoke to her about the summer riots and

suggested that since most of the rioters had grown up under Labour

the party had some responsibility for the disturbances. I think you

should do more and go further to get people out of the life of crime.

It is shocking what happened in the summer. I think you have to

recognise that crime fell by 40% during Labour's period and that

included fewer young people, before the riots and fewer young people

going into the crime. We ended up with people who had grown up, not

all of them, but most of them were in the age group that their

formative experience, their school, their early life, had been under a

Labour Government. They were Labour's children. That's right.

The fact that there have been fewer young offenders I think is an

important progress, but of course it's the case there were a lot of

the young people and a lot of people in their 20s, because some

were older, who we have not managed to stop getting into a life of

crime and that's why you have to always do more. That's why I would

like to see a strong implementation of the work done in Boston and

Hackney that targets the gangs. We have set out ways to fund that. The

Government could start that now, so you don't have a repeat next summer.

When you boasted today, as you did in the speech, about the fall in

crime under Labour, that is calf ated by the fact that it ended in

the worst rioting we have seen for a generation. This summer I spoke

to police officers during the few months before the summer and they

said in fact interestingly, that they were worried even before the

summer about public order pressures and the fear of a long, hot summer.

Did they have a sense that something would happen? Senior

police officers had a sense. It's interesting, because for everyone

else it came as a surprise. If you saw it was a long, hot summer, it's

all the more surprising that they left us undefended on the first

night. I don't think the police had anticipated how fast the rioters

would gather. One police officer said to me he had never in 20-year

career seen a crowd gather that fast. That's social media, rolling

news. It does mean that you have to be able to respond. The police, if

criminals can gather quickly, then police need to and it's madness to

make 16,000 police officer cuts. You've set up the commission on the

future of policing, and chosen John Stevens. He's already attacked the

Government's ideas and he was an adviser to Gordon Brown on

international criminal matters. You picked Tim Brain who has criticised

the Government cuts already. It sounds a bit like this sew-called

independent commission is full of people who have already made up

their minds that what the coalition's doing is wrong and what

you'll be doing is right? Well, firstly -- It's not really

independent? He's a cross-bencher in the House of Lords with a long,

independent reputation. He has attacked Government policy? Indeed.

I think all the police were attacking Government policy. As you

well know - It's not just police officers, but experts on crime and

experts on how to bring crime down, all saying it's madness what the

Government is doing. As you'll know, when the public sector gets united

to attack toes trying to reform it, as Mr Blair reminded us, you end up

with scars on your back. I can't find anybody who is supporting what

the Government is doing. Anybody who supports the substantial re-

organisation and chaos that they are proposing in the police force

at the moment, rather than a sensible revision and reform for

the future. You speak to to all police officers and I get a chance

particularly here, I get a sense that there's a crying need of

ordinary police officers for a better quality of leadership and

better way that their leaders are united. There are some excellent

leaders. Of course, in the 21st century what you want is to be able

to draw on the best leadership to promote people fast and have

flexibility, so I'm sure that issues around professionalisation

and the workforce will be things that will be covered as part of

this review. I think there's been a tendency for the Government

ministers to really try to undermine the Middle East in the

way they've handled this and play as being armchair constables.

you think the Government ministers are out to undermine the police?

think some of the things they've been doing that have been doing

that. I think they have no faith in a lot of the police chiefs. During

that period in August when things were really seemed to be tipping

over the edge and we were all scared, that Tuesday when we didn't

know whether the violence would be repeated, at that time we should

all have been backing the police and respect for the police and rule

of law. I think the way they handled that the way they seemed to

be knocking the police and those few very sensitive few days,

actually was undermining the respect for the police at a time

when we needed it most. The big issue at this conference is the

claim by your husband that in another leadership contest he will

stand aside for you. Do you believe him? In fact, what he said was he

said his view was that Ed Miliband was doing a great job and carry on

being a leader for many years to come. He said he didn't want to run

for leadership again should it ever arise and that he would stand aside

for you. Do -- can you take his word on that? Look, that's actually

what he said to me before we had the last leadership. He ran and you

didn't. You see these husbands you can't trust them, can you? You

don't think your husband will run again? No, I don't think so. Been

there and done it, didn't quite get it. Enjoying himself? He's working

very hard and doing a good job. haven't ruled yourself out. People

like me always say that. You do. know the answer already. Thank you

very much for being with us. The conference was also addressed today

by Paul McKeever, the chairman of the Police Federation. It's the

first time anybody in his position has spoken to a Labour conference.

He's really a union official, so he should feel at home here. The

conference certainly liked his message about the coalition. Let's

be absolutely clear here, it wasn't a couple of politicians coming back

to their desks that solved the riots. It was tens of thousands of

police officers - APPLAUSE Pashpash - putting their

lives on the line on behalf of their communities. You know the

public recognised that. The public said thank you. The public were

applauding officers who were out on patrol in the streets, making those

riots abate. They recognised what police officers were doing. They

recognised the worth of police What has been the response of

government? During the riots, we heard from the Prime Minister, the

Home Secretary, that the cuts were going to be going ahead even faster.

That was something that astonished us. It really did take our breath

away. The first duty of any government is the safety of their

citizens and we believe government is playing fast and loose with the

safety of the communities we represent.

It is also worth reflecting as well on the way that government talks

about us, that change, reform, cuts have to be forced through even more

quickly, more radically, whereas when I heard him speaking about the

report on banking, we were told it had to be introduced slowly, over a

number of years... APPLAUSE. So as to avoid unintended

consequences and failure. We feel greatly unloved, I have to say, and

greatly left to our own devices. We believe that the government doesn't

understand us, there is a constant denigration of what it is that we

do and we find that disgraceful. Paul McKeever. This afternoon it

was the turn of Shadow Education Secretary, Andy Burnham, who also

dug out one of those Blairite soundbites. I think you can guess

at -- guess which one it was. In this job, there is one thing you

noticed. How on an almost daily basis, people who did not go to

state schools and don't send their children to them pop up in the

Is there any country in the world which runs down its schools, its

teachers and its young people in the way we seem to do? Well,

conference, at least let us put that right today. We you join me in

thanking our teaches, dinner ladies, support staff, lollipop ladies...

APPLAUSE. We thank them from the bottom of our hearts because it is

their utter devotion to our children that makes England's

schools amongst the best in the world at today young people face

agonising choices. It is not easy to take on the cost of the degree

when you know that you are expected to work for free once you finish it.

But if things weren't hard enough, they just got a whole lot harder.

This government has launched an all-out attack on aspiration, on

the hopes and dreams of ordinary kids, as Daniel Johnson so

eloquently put it before. Before the election, David Cameron

bludgeoned people in the eyes. He said he would keep the education

maintenance allowance. He broke that promise. What kind of man does

that? Leaving thousands of young souls cut adrift? Cameron, the

conman, that is who. APPLAUSE. What kind of man destroys

England's Careers Service with youth unemployment at record levels

and what kind of man chooses this moment, of all moments, to make

young people pay with their life chances? All across England you can

hear the sound of falling aspiration and it is terrifying!

Tony Blair said his priorities were education, education, education and

because of what he did, we can now go further. Aspiration, aspiration,

aspiration. APPLAUSE. Here we are, in Britain,

2011, and we have the spectacle of a Tory Education Secretary

promoting Latin and ancient Greek over engineering, ICT and business

I want as many children as possible to take the subjects in the English

Baccalaureate but they are not right for everyone, as Andrew said

before. And yet the message is clear. Any school or student who

does not succeed and it is second best. And as we have heard today,

there is a growing grassroots rejection of Michael Gove and his

elitist and divisive policies. APPLAUSE. Our task now is to reform

comprehensive education for new times, meeting the aspirations of

every family and our country, and fulfilling Ed Miliband's promise.

Rewarding hard work, stretching the brightest, putting hope in every

heart. Thank you, conference. Burnham. And references to the

Blairite era didn't end there. Labour MP John Mann livened up

proceedings when he said that there were certain Labour members, past

and present, who weren't giving much back to the party. -- enough

back. There is one group of people who are not donating sufficiently

and that is Labour MPs with second jobs, former Labour ministers who

are doing consultancies for private industry...

APPLAUSE. And there is also the book writers, who like to tell us

about their memoirs. What I would like to see is in our report and

maiming of those who have got the bottle to donate money back to the

Labour Party -- they naming. So we can see who they are and we can

thank them for their donations. Some of them will be happy, to name

and shame those people who have made a fortune on the back of the

Labour Party and continue to do so and who are not prepared to give

the money when we need it! John Mann. He later confirmed that

he'd been talking about Messrs Blair, Mandelson and Prescott. As

if we hadn't guessed. Ed Miliband has been trying to explain what he

means by the end of the Blair-Brown Iraq, if he is anti-Blair and what

does he mean by producer and predator countries -- the Blair-

Brown era. He took to the stage this evening to face questions from

party and non-party members. Due to clarify a slightly vague bid in the

way distinguishing between business is doing the right thing and the

wrong thing will be administered -- can I ask you to clarify a slightly

vague bid. It is about the roars that you set. Let me give you an

example. The rules we set for the bank and how they run. Do they

serve small businesses or do they not? Not all banks are predators

but if they are engaging in short- term practices that damage the

economy, it is predatory behaviour. Why should a 17-year-old vote for

Labour? Let me tell you the most important thing of all, and that is

climate change. When I think about my kids, I can honestly say they

will be saying to me in 30 years' time, I hope they won't be talking

about the economic crisis, they will be saying, did you get it on

climate change? Dad, did you really get it? In the 1980s, the then

Dutch government brought in legislation that insured public and

private sector pensions, guaranteeing workers got the same

pension when they were tired that they signed up for. We you give

your word that serious consideration will be given to the

Dutch example? I can't do that and I will tell you why I think I can't.

You think I can. The reason I think I can't is because look at what is

happening to longevity. It is great that people are living longer, far

more than we expected. I am sorry you don't agree with me... The

truth about it is that unless we take seriously the cost challenge

of pensions, I don't think we are going to succeed. He clearly didn't

agree with me! I am going to say something which is quite rude. We

have the Germans sniffing around at the moment... I can't remember the

name, it was in the national papers. Please do not let the Germans take

their National Health like they have taken the trains. When we were

in government, we deduce the private sector -- we deduce the

private sector. I think we were right. That made a big difference

to cataracts, hip operations and other things. But I really think

that the idea that an NHS hospital, if it is badly managed, let it be

taken over by other management but I am not in favour of sending it

out to the private sector. I don't think that reflects the values of

the NHS. Don't you think it is time to bring David out of Siberia and

all of the rumours about backbiting? This party will not win

if people focus on that and that is what the media is focusing on.

Death is a massive asset to our party and politics -- David is a

massive asset. I want to have him back. In the end he has got to

decide whether he wants to play a role in the shadow Cabinet or not.

The Labour leader has talked about wealth "built on sand" as example

of bad companies. So when I spoke to Shadow Business Secretary John

Denham I asked him if the tax revenues which poured into the

Labour government coffers during the financial boom years under

Labour was wealth built on sand. That approach to the economy was

and one that was sustainable in the long term and that is why Ed

Miliband was talking about the rules when you were taking all that

money, billions of pounds from financial services, you did know

and you certainly did not say it was built on sand.

After losing an election, we should say, do we understand what needs to

be done in the future. We have a record as a government that I am

very proud of but there were things that happened and things we did not

get right that we need to change in the future.

My point is that all of us, we do not know when wealth is built on

sand and when it isn't. Who would have thought that there will Bank

of Scotland turned out to be wealth built on sand? -- Royal Bank of

Scotland. If we have as many companies as possible which invest

long term, which trained their staff, which take the environment

seriously, which want their customers to be with them in 15

years' time, not just 15 minutes, those companies are the ones that

are most likely to bring success to the country. We have always known

that. But we don't have an environment that fosters that so it

has been possible to make more money by doing short-term things

than by building a long-term business so what government has got

to do is create the environment for those good companies to go. You

won't get good companies without good government. But you penalise

companies that don't follow you? You can't come in after a company

has done something and say we will punish you, you have to get the

incentives right in the first place. This is not about morality. It is

recognising that if the walls of the game say you can get more by

speculating, people will. So let's make it so that companies who built

their wealth for the long-term growth. This country is full of

companies that invest for the long term. Isn't it? There are not

enough of them for the size of our country to pay our way in the world.

We have brilliant companies but we also have ones with short-term

business models. I will not name them. Why? Because no company fits

entirely... If you cannot name companies, it is impossible to have

a proper debate. No. It is about looking at the features in

companies that you want to encourage. How many ministers in

the shadow Cabinet have first-hand business experience? I don't know.

For who has? I set up the social enterprise very successfully myself

30 years ago. Do you have many business folk in their Cabinet?

have lots of business people around the party. If I go through them, I

don't think any come to mind that have made their main careers in

business of and yet you think, although your Shadow Cabinet has no

business experience, you think you can judge when wealth is not based

on sand, when it would be good or bad to sell accompany on in five

years' time, whether venture capital lays down the right

business. You have no qualifications for any of that!

What was said yesterday has not come out of thin air. If you talk

to business, this is a discussion they are having. It is the conflict

they often find between long-term wealth creation and short-term

decisions, the dilemmas faced by small companies that want to grow.

John Denham. And that's it for today, on a day when the Labour

leader came under some pressure to put flesh on the bones of

yesterday's speech and to tell us more about exactly how he planned

to part company with the recent past. I suspect he'll be doing that

for some time to come. Tomorrow is the last day of conference.

Appearing on stage will be the Shadow Communities Minister,

Caroline Flint, the Shadow Leader of the House, Hilary Benn, and

Harriet Harman, who'll give the traditional Deputy Leader's