11/03/2017 Welsh Liberal Democrats Conference

The battle lines are drawn for the council elections in Wales and today

the Welsh Liberal Democrats make the pitch.

Good morning and welcome to the second of spring party political

conference programmes. I'd come with the first out of the blogs this week

and today it's the turn of the Welsh Liberal Democrats are meeting in

Swansea. We will also bring you coverage of Welsh Labour and the

Welsh Conservatives. You can join in the debate on twitter. Joining me

throughout today's programme is Welsh affairs editor. The Welsh Lib

Dems are meeting in each school in Swansea, what conclusions can be

dropped from that? That Swansea is one of their target seats, perhaps.

This is a party that is short of money and short of organisation.

They lost all that assembly seats apart from one and the party

organisation has had to downscale. Very few professional organisers

these days, not really new Welsh Secretary. Basically, the parties

being run by volunteers, but the juicy and opportunity coming in May,

because this is traditionally a party that has built a base from

local government upwards. They've lost in a disastrous set of local

elections five years ago. Our eyes and ears at the conference reserve

reporter. The conference is under way in the hole behind us. They are

discussing the 2017 local government manifesto at the moment, they will

be defending 75 council seats. They had 160 before, the thing we can win

some of them back. The leader of the Welsh Liberal Democrats Mark

Williams will be speaking later, as is one assembly member, the

Education Secretary Kirsty Williams. It is not a full hall at the moment.

We had the former leader of Swansea Council welcomed members to the

confidence earlier. He welcomed them to Wales' premier city, I don't know

how that will go down from people -- with people from Newport and

Cardiff. They will be debating the right to buy. We expect the

government in the next week or so may introduce legislation to scrap

the right to buy. The proposal from the party here today is that the Lib

Dems oppose that, so it will be easy just -- interesting to see how that

will go down later. We will be speaking to cancel candidates and

you will be speaking to Kirsty Williams over the next couple of

hours. We will have plenty from the conference for you. We will be

speaking to Kirsty Williams later. As he mentioned, the conference was

opened by the leader of the Liberal Democrat group on Swansea Council

and he was keen to draw on some sporting inspiration. Good morning

delegates and welcome to the premier city of Wales. I was encouraged by

colleagues from Cardiff, seeing we have a city with a real bed, as a

pause to one that is manufactured. Welcome to Bishop Gore School. This

is a typical example of what Liberal Democrats is about, coming back into

the community and using the community, which is what we should

be doing. Bishop Gore School is a school built in their early 1950s,

and as a result, the architecture is quite stunning. I hope you enjoy the

visit here, and I hope we have a very good confidence. I think one of

the things I would say is that when you come into Swansea, the results

of the coalition I led a very, very clear. The LC was closed under

Labour and we reopened it and made it the most popular paid attraction

in Wales, something and all of us are very proud of. I mentioned

earlier on about us being the premier city of Wales and that is

due largely to the fact of the new stadium, which, again, under the

administration I had the great pleasure to run, finished off that

stadium and made it my into a class venue for first-class football and

rugby. And talking about rugby, what a victory last night. Every pundit

said we were going to lose and what happens? The Welsh came forward.

That's the sort of spirit we need in the Welsh Liberal Democrats. That is

the sort of spirit we need. We did take a beating, let's be blunt about

it, in the assembly and that the general election. But we are coming

back. 85,000 members, doubled our membership. We are coming back. And

that spirit that was shown by that rugby team yesterday is the spirit

that will lead us on again and get back to the numbers of councillors,

the number of AMs and MPs that they enjoyed before. Have a very good

conference, I hope everybody enjoys Swansea and with is a bit of luck,

it would rain. It welcome to Swansea from the leader of the Lib Dem group

on Swansea Council. Let's talk a little bit about the current state

of play, as far as the council elections go. We do the Lib Dems

stand at the moment in Wales? 75 council seats at the moment, it was

72 at the last election and they have picked up a few in by-elections

since then. That's out of a total of 1200, so it's a small base, but is

concentrated in particular areas. It's not impossible for the Lib Dems

to reach a position where they could be leading some councils after me.

None of them they good when I write, but where they could emerge as a

leader of the coalition. The great prize in that is undoubtedly

Cardiff. The parties pretty confident of regaining most if not

all of the council seats in Cardiff Central, their traditional

stronghold. If they did that, then almost certainly Labour would lose

overall control, and because of the dysfunction in the Labour group, is

highly likely the Lib Dems would end up leading cadre. Other areas they

want to make progress is in rural areas, where there are persuading

independent candidates to stand as Lib Dems. And the establishing a

presence on councils where they were wiped out. Before the last

elections, there were very few councils were they didn't have at

least one Lib Dem on them. They lost a lot of those little groups, and

are concentrating on individual wards to get those toll holds on

authorities back. Since the Grexit vote, they have had noticeable gains

and a notable victory in Westminster by-election. Do they see an for

themselves here, as a party which is staunchly Remain? Indeed. We have

two conflicting pieces of data, the UK wide opinion polls which suggest

the party flat-lining at around 9% with it has been since they went

into coalition with David Cameron. But that individual elections, the

party has been doing very well. And what it has been doing is to appeal

to the core Remain vote in the referendum. They don't have the

problem that Labour has, of trying to please to different

constituencies. We think that is round about 25% of the electorate

that not only voted Remain, but still feel very strongly about it.

They want to see a second recommend them. 25% is almost three times what

they are getting in the polls, so that is the rule we are fishing in.

I think you will see them doing well in areas that voted very strongly to

remain and that includes places like Cardiff, but also some of the other

places, more in England and Wales, that have that university vibe,

Bristol, Brighton, Cambridge, Oxford. Those are the sort of places

they are looking to get back. One man looking to "Assembly seat is

current former assembly member Peter Black. We are effectively over the

next two months entering one of the most important paydays for the Welsh

party, after the trauma and ups and downs of the last couple of years.

As you know, we were reduced to one MP in 2015, to one assembly member

in 2016, and in 2012, we've lost a large number of councillors. Going

into these elections on May the force with just over 70 odd

councillors in Wales, looking to build on that, to take advantage of

the fact that first we started to climb back in the polls, secondly as

Chris has already mentioned, our membership has doubled in the UK and

increased substantially in Wales. A lot of new members we have here in

this confidence and also around Wales, who are keen to get out there

and do something to start bringing seats in again and get that Liberal

Democrat message across in local government elections. It is

interesting, in terms of that doubling of membership. 40% of our

members actually joined in the last year, and that's how new we are the

party. We are renewing ourselves as a party and we need to renew

ourselves in local government as well. I am very optimistic as to

what we can do on May the force. That is potential not only to gain

seats, but to get influence on a number of councils around Wales. I

certainly will be trying to focus on that in Swansea and offering what

supporter can elsewhere. But the challenge is in terms of local

government is wider. The Welsh government has just published a

White Paper that I'm putting together a response to. It is very

typical New Labour in a sense that they have copped out of difficult

decisions. We are looking at setting up bodies that are unaccountable.

But also in that White Paper, then this talk about voting at 16, a

policy that has long-standing way been a Welsh Lib Dem policy. And

also a policy of being able to opt into STV. As a party, we should be

pressing for that to happen. We also need to press the Welsh government

to say, you have now conceded the principle of voting, maybe we need

to say that we should be having that proportion across Wales and also

have all councils elected through fair voting. The Welsh assembly now

has control over its own destiny, is able to determine how it selected

and how many members it has got. And a member of a reference group on the

Assembly, which is looking at what legislation is needed for that. We

could potentially in 2021 befriending those Assembly elections

with electing anything between 80 and 100 AMs instead of 60, and using

STV or better fair reporting system than we have at the moment. That

means that not only do we have to change the way we campaign, but that

is an opportunity for us to pull back losses that incurred last year

at the Assembly elections. I think this is an exciting time for

everybody in local government. There are opportunities everywhere for

Liberal Democrats to build on what we have done. If we get out there

and work hard on the doorsteps, get the leaflets out, knock on doors,

top to people and get our act together in campaigning, we can come

out of these elections with clear evidence of the Liberal Democrat

revival in Wales, and I urge you all to go back and do that now. In a

sense, I'm disappointed we haven't got a lot of people who should be

here, but they are getting on with the job in the communities of trying

to get elected. After today, we all need to focus on precision and

intensity to make sure we get those Liberal Democrats elected councils

around Wales. That is my brief introduction, I'm happy to take any

westerns on the opening or anything like that. Our united response to

the White Paper from the Welsh Assembly on the local governance.

Are people reading this on the doorstep? I went to a meeting on

Monday about it, yes. The first thing you couldn't we would see from

Pembrokeshire is the White Paper doesn't threaten the existence of

Pembrokeshire. You will think that is very important and I can

understand that. The second thing is that in a sense, it's about delivery

of those services, those bigger services. Pembrokeshire is already

part of the larger education Consortium. The White Paper suggests

that will be provided on a more provisional basis in future. I have

concerns about that, because it gloss of controlled by local

councillors and I have concern about how the decisions by bigger

authorities are going to be accountable and how they will be

questions and scrutinised. And overturning decisions, there are

clear dishes about that. I think you should be saying to them that this

is not a liberal document, this is a document that has some good things,

in that Pembrokeshire stays. It also has some bad things, as well, in a

sense that we think there are issues around the accountability and

delivered a baby to be questions we need to be asking the Welsh

government about that. I think there is concerned that once this new

structure comes in, the Welsh government can start dictating more

from the centre, so we need to question where that is going. What

the right way forward is is debatable, because I don't think we

have a consensus on the organisation restructuring, but any structure put

in place has to have proper accountability and scrutiny and if

it hasn't got that, it's not a democratic structure. As Liberal

Democrats, we should be making those points very clearly the people on

the doorstep. Mike Powell. First ball on housing, Peter, currently we

have over 26,000 long-term empty properties in Wales. Would you like

to tell the members present what our policy is to actually start bringing

them back use, please? We have always advocated that there should

be a national strategy on empty properties around Wales, which the

Welsh government has never accepted, and I think that's wrong, because

there's a lot of good practice going on around Wales in terms of bringing

those empty properties back into use. When you have a huge waiting

list for social housing, when you have growing homelessness, it is

absolutely imperative that you make the best use you can the housing

stock you haven't bring as many of those properties back use as

possible. So the first thing we need is a national strategy to deal with

empty properties, which make sure that every local authority is doing

with it to a proper standard. The second thing is to look at the

powers local authorities have, in terms of being able to bring those

properties back into use. Carmarthenshire has a very good

record on this and some local authorities have as well, in working

with owners to bring these properties back. But the empty

dwelling management orders are not very effective. Compulsory purchase

is expensive and bureaucratic, and I think that the Welsh government

needs to do a proper review of what powers local government have to

force owners of long-term properties to make sure of those -- make use of

those assets and let the community use them, because every single empty

property is a blight on the community it isn't with costs that

community money, it cost that community a lot in terms of the

social fabric of that community, and we need to be investing in them.

Certainly, one of the homeless acts in last Assembly gave local

authorities the power to tax those properties up to 200%, and I think

every local authority should be making use of that, because as well

as the carrot of grants being available to orders, that also needs

to be a stick to make sure you take advantage of those bands. That was

Peter Black and he has made his way in double quick time by way of

conference magic to keep Carol Roberts company. Yes, Peter Black,

Swansea council member and former AM. And a councillor in Wrexham here

as well, both of whom were Lib Dem councillors when they are parties

were in charge of their councils. But the case any more. Peter Black,

it is the whole conference for you. Not that long ago, the Lib Dems ran

Swansea Council. It is that likely again this time round? I don't know,

to be honest. We'll do our best, but Swansea is still benefiting from

when the Lib Dems were in charge. We did a lot of work in a city and

invested in schools and we have a good case to go to the people of

Swansea about why they should give us a second chance to run Swansea

again. We can tell you been making up your leaflets listing your

successes. Carroll, Cuba after the Lib Dem group when you run Wrexham

Council. What are your chances, do you think? With fielding a strong

field of candidates. We have a proud record in Wrexham of campaigning on

community issues. We have a strong record of representing our

communities, so that is everything to play for, and I am quietly very

confident. How difficult hasn't been to be a Lib Dem councillor? New

one-year seat again in 2012, but have fewer colleagues lost theirs.

Has it been difficult being a Lib Dem councillor in the last five

years? Politics is always a challenge. I wouldn't say it has

been difficult, because we have a very strong group on Wrexham Council

and we have carried out the role of councillors as we always have, which

is to make their views known, to represent our board members and to

make their voice heard on Wrexham Council. BP is accessible at doing

that and our record goes before us and that sort will be campaigning

on. Peter Black, we've been talking in the studio about the importance

of the Lib Dem grassroots to galvanise the party. With fewer

councillors, has that affected the ability to win our lamented

receipts? We've always been a party that has relied on our members. Our

ownership has doubled in the UK and increase substantially in Wales. We

have a lot of new members who are getting involved in campaigning.

Some are standing as candidates and we are renewing ourselves as a

party. As a councillor, you can make a difference. When I first got

elected in 1984, I was the only Liberal councillor in Swansea. We

have a very effective opposition group in Swansea, so we are very

important to help galvanise the grassroots, but the grassroots also

galvanise themselves. But new blood coming through the party is very

important. From my experience of covering politics, I know the Lib

Dems love campaigning more than any other party, they would tell us.

Mark Williams in his notes says he wants you to campaign like you have

never campaigned before, which is a bit of an ask for a Liberal

Democrat. What more do you do? The bad is in very good heart. You have

a lot of people who are already working hard, and as the elections,

Naylor, we have a lot of new members in North Wales. I think they are

ready to go out and fight back. We have a strong programme to sell, we

have a strong message to work on and I'm confident we will go forward in

good heart. What is different about the Lib Dems compared to five years

ago? Will there be a different message? No, I think the message is

the same. We are very much community politicians, representing the views

of local residents, but we've also got very strong policy statements

around public transport, around schools and education, around

building viable and vibrant town centres. We have always been

traditionally very strong on environmental issues, so I think we

work at both levels, really, we work at policy level and community

politics. We know that Kirsty Williams will be speaking later.

She's a member of the government now. She's the Cabinet secretaries

and education. How has that gone down within the party ranks? That

she's part of a Cabinet made up of exclusively Labour assembly members,

apart from her. Does the party still support? Yes, because she's putting

forward a Lib Dem agenda. The party has always been a party of education

and the environment. Kirsty is putting forward distinctive Liberal

Democrat policies, smaller class sizes, investing in the pupil

premium for the most deprived pupils. And also, distinctly and

around rural and small schools, a distinctly Lib Dem agenda. Not only

do we have a voice in government as liberal Democrats, but we have a

Liberal Democrat taking forward those policies and that's important

to the party. Do you think being a member of the cabinet is to looting

the Lib Dem message? She is part of a Labour Cabinet. Now, I don't think

it's though missing the message, if anything, I think our education

policies are hitting home and people are aware that in Kirsty Williams,

we have a Lib Dem as a secretary for education. Now, I don't think it's

though missing the message, quite the opposite. Thank you very much

for your time this morning. The conference will continue and we will

speak to mark Williams, the party leader in the next hour or so, but

for the moment, we'll hand back to you. You mentioned the qualities of

the Lib Dems when it comes to campaigning. If Philip Hammond is

the spread sheet Chancellor, the Lib Dems must be the spreadsheet party.

Pretend to know where they are locally. The Lib Dems and almost

addicted to campaigning and they are very good at it. They're very good

at targeting wards and figuring out how to win them. The one thing that

unites all the other parties is that they really don't like the Lib Dem

campaigning techniques, because the work. It's squeezing the fort, is in

encouraging people to vote tactically. It's pointing at holes

on the road and overflowing litter bins. They do it because it's

effective. Without doubt, I think, we will see Lib Dem gains in me,

because they will be working towards that they lost last time, trying to

get them back. Without the burden of the coalition with the

Conservatives, it's going to be much easier for them. In one sense, the

fact that Kirsty Williams is now part of a Labour Cabinet is helpful

to them. The sort of Labour voters who used to vote tactically for them

to keep the Conservatives out, this is a clear signal that there still a

party of the centre-left. I think that in a good place going into

local elections, but the bar is quite low. A good result for the Lib

Dems would be to see them going back above 100 seats. I think that's a

realistic, achievable aim for them, but that's still a long way off from

where they were ten years ago. On Kirsty Williams, resounding support

from the guess there, the fact she is now a member of the Labour led

Welsh government. My understanding was that not every Lib Dem was fully

on board with this. Is it a tricky issue for the party? I think there

were concerns about it. Let's look at the opportunities and the dangers

involved. The opportunity is all about profile. In political terms.

As well as achieving things we want to achieve, of course. The danger

was that with just one Assembly Member, that the Lib Dems would fall

off the radar into one. You can see that with how many times the pier on

the news or question Time. But someone with his job is going to be

on the radio and television, so it does mean profile. That's the

opportunity. The danger, of course, if you're not in a formal coalition,

you are just one in AM, you look like Labour's little helper. If

Labour is unpopular, that the impact on you and people who might be

unhappy with their Welsh government and who might otherwise have voted

for the Lib Dems, might vote for Plaid Cymru, because they regard the

Lib Dems as being equally guilty with the Welsh government. There are

dangers and opportunities involved. My own opinion is that it was

probably the correct decision, given where the party was when Kirsty

Williams made that decision. Whether it was still the right decision by

the time we come to the next assembly elections, I'm not sure. Is

she on shaky ground when it comes to Brexit? The Lib Dems are more

hardline about it than Labour. Then there's the debate about the right

to buy, the Welsh Lib Dems have a different policy on that to the

Welsh government. This unit difficult position, balancing the

party and our responsibilities as a minister? The danger is of a

confused message. On Brexit, very interestingly, Kirsty Williams did

break the government in a recent Assembly Fort, and Carwyn Jones was

relaxed about that. She is being given a certain amount of wriggle

room, particularly on European issue. The dangers confusion. Let's

take right to buy. If the party is saying we oppose right to buy,

Kirsty Williams is bound by Cabinet responsibility to support it. What

sort of message does that send to the voter? That the party is saying

one thing in its leaflets were doing something else in government. The

truth of the matter is that most voters would be to pay much

attention to any of these things, but it does make the messaging more

difficult. Thanks for the time being. The Lib Dem conference would

be a Lib Dem conference without them discussing PR, and voting reform was

on the agenda today. In an earlier session, a motion was proposed at

the conference on proportional representation.

We have an opportunity to debate one of the Liberal Democrats' favourite

topic - electoral reform. I'm not the only person in this room to be

disappointed by the white paper that came from the Welsh Government.

Local Government reform has been a political hot potato for years. I

have lost count of the different merger proposals that have been and

gone because none of them have managed to get to grips with the

problems. This White Paper has missed an opportunity for more

radical change in many areas within local Government. There was a

glimmer of light in that paper and matter is an opportunity to

implement, albeit on a council basis, to long-standing Liberal

Democrat principles. What the motion before you today does is not only

give us an opportunity to reaffirm our commitment to both, we implement

them where we may find ourselves able to do so. Let me turn to number

16. The principle is tested not just abroad but in Scotland. We know it

leads to a young electorate that is engaged for life. It has been tried

and tested and we have an opportunity to put that in practice

in Wales. I would like us to put that in practice so we can build up

the evidence base to extend that as far as we can in different

elections. Onto the electoral system, STV ensures the result is

far more reflective of the wishes of the electorates themselves. It

provides us with opportunities to make inroads in places where we may

not have been able to under the present system. There is the fact

that in some areas we will lose seats. I am fighting for a four

member ward and a march on all the many years. First past the post

means despite marginality we end up with all four seats going to one

party or the other. I'm hoping all four seeds will come our way but

under STV, winning four seats would be nigh on impossible. If I'm

successful in May, despite the risk it may post my own council seat, I

will walk into Cardiff City Hall and my vote in favour of a fairing voter

system as will my colleagues. That is not what the Lib Dems do. We

don't do the easy thing, we do the right thing. I want you to take the

opportunity to do the right thing. Take this chance to put our

principles into action, to inject fairness into our local Government

system and back this motion. APPLAUSE

Can I call the chair of the policy committee to speak for the motion as

a whole? We haven't had a great number of cards for this motion. If

there are any more, could you hand them in now? I am not speaking

formally for the policy committee but expressing its views in away

from a position of chair. My first reaction was do we really need to

say we are in favour of STV? Of course, we are. Then I thought

clearly this is a key issue for us. A key issue about empowering local

communities. This is an opportunity this consultation has brought to us.

It is a topical issue, an opportunity for us to reemphasise

our commitment to reform of local Government electoral processes. An

opportunity to campaign locally on the fact that the consultation looks

at putting the power to make these changes more in local hands and we

are about to have an election. My conclusion is to say to you clearly

go further motion, support the motion. This is an opportunity for

us to come together and talk to each other and discuss our campaigns at

the local Government election. Talk about it, be prepared for the

campaigning that would be required to make the most of this

opportunity. Thank you for bringing the motion forward and it gives us

work to do and an opportunity. Thank you. Now I have no more cards on

this so I am going to point out that we will have a vote. Can I call Pete

Roberts? He didn't put in a cardboard like to speak on this

motion. Sun-macro the problem is you get asked questions and you miss

planning -- putting in cards that you wish to speak on. Look to

Scotland. It works. We as a party need to stand firm and be proud of

the heritage of fair voting that we have advocated. People say, what

about the rural areas? Rural areas at the moment like my own county of

Powys, we are inundated with an unchallenged, it independent

councillors. Most of whom are ashamed to show the political

colours they sign their membership checks for every year. STV and

multimember constituencies does mean more villages in the same ward. It

does mean a larger area that individual councillors cover but it

means three, four, five councillors covering that area. Giving people

actual choice and doing away with once and for all the job alive type

approach that the rural thief Government and the old, he's a nice

bloke we wouldn't stand against him, that is so prevalent in some of our

rural areas. It is beyond belief. It doesn't lead to good governance. It

leads to lack of direction in local authorities, it leads to alienation

from the electorate and it leads to stagnation in our rural economies.

We as a party should be proud to stand up for our heritage. We should

not fudging our responses and we should actively campaign for STV for

every person and every ward within Wales.

Can we make the motion? Can I call Joseph Carter, please? You have got

five minutes and then we will have a vote. You need to be sitting down

and in the room in order to vote. I am grateful for the opportunity to

Sa made this motion. My view may ask why have this? It does send a

powerful message and bind us together as council candidates and

potential councillors. This is something we wouldn't just talk

about. It is looking at the Weibo stats are playing out there is a

good chance we could be in positions in lots of different authorities.

This is a major opportunity for us to influence change. As has been

said today, we are liberals. This is not about holding power for the sake

of holding power. What message would it send if we did make gains? We

have gained free seats. If we then turn around and say we don't believe

in this, we want to keep our wards as our own, this means we have to

give up some power. We have to give up power to the electorate. I

represent a ward which is currently for the general councillors. I

accept as part of moving towards STV, we would be looking at holding

two of those. That is a sacrifice I will be willing to make as liberals.

It is not about holding power for the... It is about power to the

community. I am conscious of the wards that we lost in 2012. If we

had had STV, we could have kept one out of three councillors and carried

on serving communities. This is important. It is not just about Cos

all looking to become the largest party. It is about being in a

position to influence that county. I pay tribute to Kirsty in this

because if it wasn't for her pushing forward this liberal agenda, being

an influential person being in the Cabinet as Education Secretary. She

is pushing us forward and driving us and is influencing colleagues behind

the scenes and we have to be very grateful to have the best. Whilst it

is optional, it is us being liberal. If we were the Conservatives and

push this through we would make everybody do it. Because we are

liberals, we are saying this is up to local people and councillors to

decide. This is a positive thing for us to do and it keeps true to our

liberal principles. We have had a good debate and I hope going forward

it will make those council gains in order to make this possible up and

down the land. That was a discussion on changing the voting system. There

are some proposals by the Welsh Government to bring it in in local

elections. The last contributor made the point that Kirsty Williams might

be in charge of education but influence on this point within the

Welsh Government is there for everybody to see. It is a big topic

for the Lib Dems, isn't it? Forming the voting system, you are talking

about the two issues that really push the button for the Liberal

Democrats. They feel passionately about it. Ukip support PR as do

Plaid Cymru. It is not just a Lib Dem issue but one they feel

particularly strongly about. What the Government has said is they

would enable local authorities, if they chose, to move to STV. Why is

the Government fudging that? It would have been difficult for them

to say nothing about the voting system because of Kirsty Williams'

presence in the Cabinet. There are many things that Labour control and

they know STV came in, they would be hung councils. You looking at

Caerphilly and so on. There is a lot of resistance to changing the voting

system from Labour councillors. The Labour Party said they are in favour

of it but it wouldn't work in their favour. -- would work. It doesn't

matter what the voting system is, if you don't feel any candidate.

There are places where they find real difficulty at the moment.

One-man is going to talk to us now. Mark Williams joins us now. You have

a good chunk of time with them now and you will go through the speech

line by line. The main line that jumped out from the conference guide

is you are going to call on people to campaign like you have never

campaigned before. What will that mean in practice? A vigorous

campaign across the country. There is a necessity there after what we

admit has been pretty bad elections in 2015 and 2016. These elections

are pretty important and critical to the communities in which we are

fighting the critical for the party as well. Fighting to gain more

Liberal Democrat can -- councils across the country. You have won one

Assembly Member. Nine MPs overall. The House of Commons has 650. Why do

you think these council elections will be any different? Why will

people turn to the Lib Dems when they haven't in the previous two

years? They are important elections and it is important they vote. The

West Minster elections -- the Westminster elections were very

painful. As was Kirsty losing her four colleagues. People should vote

because of a renewed clarity of message. When you see the work

Kirsty is undertaking as Education Minister, active work, working with

Labour colleagues, maybe that is a good thing. Working to reduce class

sizes, working to get the progressive system of student

support in the UK. They are important reasons to vote Lib Dem.

What we are saying about social care and house-building in our community

as well. I also think this has to take place against the backdrop of

Brexit and what we are saying about Brexit. How we are standing up

fighting for Wales within these uncertain periods. That is very

important if you represent a farming constituency, and objective one area

where we have had money from Europe. There is clarity from the leader on

these matters and I hope they will be more clarity for me also. The

party's position as a referendum, another referendum. The first

referendum was lost. Respect the decision. I do respect the decision.

Wales voted to withdraw and I understand that will stop I was

gutted by the results as some do that is committed to Europe and I

see the benefits in my constituency. People wanted to leave but people

didn't know the destination of travel and that's why we have

constantly pressed to Reza's may Government -- Theresa May's

Government. That is why we should have an opportunity when the deal

has been concluded and it would be a long way off. There should be an

opportunity for the people of Wales to look at the deal that is offered.

Is it good for the economy of Wales? What if we don't have unfettered

access to the single market? What is the impact that will have on Wales?

Wales' voice needs to be heard. It won't just be a referendum in Wales,

it will be UK wide. It would be a UK wide referendum will stop Theresa

May will carry on ignoring you, won't she? She will press for hard

Brexit. Is she going to be more measured and responsive to the

legitimate concerns that farming unions and businesses are raising? I

will praise the First Minister and the principal opposition party the

coming up with a concrete plan. The Assembly Government, the white paper

they produced. It is imperative that Theresa May listens and acts on what

First Minister and others have been telling her. You mention Brexit.

With people more interested in the councils dealing with dog mass when

it comes to these elections? It is about bigger issues across the UK.

People are constantly raising Brexit at the moment. They are fearful of

what happens next. People use any election as an opportunity to raise

this. People will be reflecting on a whole range of issues, local ones,

electing local champions. The bigger picture as well. The comeback starts

now. You have been in charge in the past. Cardiff, Swansea, Bridgend.

Those days must seem like hundreds of days ago now will stop you are

right. I used her four colleagues in the House of Commons. We are where

we are and the party is determined to move forward, to build up. That

is happening on the ground. Council Danes in Newport, Cardiff. Building

up to our strongest position for weirs. It will take that take time.

Of course it will take time. We came to a great low and it will take

time. No one can doubt the fact that the sincerity of the Lib Dems, we

will build up. It has happened before and it will happen again.

Politicians have a right to project numbers that they might win. You

have defended 75 -- you are defending 75 seats. Do you think you

can get back up there? I will agree. I will not give you a figure. Are

you struggling to find candidates? We're finding candidates in new

areas. I was down in Carmarthenshire where we have not had councillors or

candid as the years. A very active group working hard there. You will

get an answer to that question later down the line but I will be bitterly

disappointed were we not to end election day in May with more

Liberal Democrat councillors. The aspiration should be a high one. It

has to be moving in the direction we were in 2004 when we had a lot of

control across a lot of the country. That is the aspiration and we have

to get to it. You have been an MP for 12 years. It is possibly the

worst time in the party's history. Is this the biggest job you have had

in politics? It is frustrating because you can see the potential

out there. You talk to people and they agree with the course -- cause.

It is about motivating people. I have had higher and lower points in

my career. There is also a question of responsibility to Wales and the

party and that is why I do what I do. Thank you for speaking to us

today. That is Mark Williams and his speech begins at 3:45pm. You will

hear the best bits of that later this evening.

That didn't sound like a leader that has been decimated in recent

elections. He sounds positive. Are they starting from such an open it

-- pace that they are anticipating a relatively good night in May? I

think they will probably get one. It is more than that. This isn't the

first time this party has been in the position it is in now. There

have been two previous occasions where they have been down to one

seat in Wales will stop this is a party that knows how to go into

survival mode. They are back where they were 25 years ago in terms of

organisation, in terms of parliamentary representation, in

terms of local Government. What the older hands will tell you is we have

done it before and we can do it again. There is little doubt in my

mind that they will make some progress in May. It won't take them

back to where they were ten years ago but it may take them back to

where they were 15 years ago. That is the way the Liberal Democrats

think. Something the former Chief Executive said committed membership

as a matter for the Welsh party but I lost count of the times an e-mail

about an English matter was sent to our members despite being entirely

irrelevant. Even in an Assembly election year, I suppose he means

Welsh council elections, our members were targeted with requests that

cash from HQ that undermined our fundraising efforts. What does that

say about the interaction between the party centrally and its

relationship with a party in Wales? There is an awful lot of tension.

Part of the problem is the Lib Dems on paper, unlike the Conservatives

or Labour, are a federal party. The party in Wales is semi --

semi-autonomous. It is largely financed from the centre. If you

talk to people in the party, they will say everything around Liberal

Democrat HQ is aimed at the number of seats sitting on the green

benches in Westminster. Come the general election, there is plenty of

help for us. We have new campaigning techniques but come an Assembly

election, that help isn't there. There is a lot of frustration and

tension. Not just with the party in Wales will stop if you go to the

website, Liberal Democrat voice you will see a huge argument there by

one of their site's editor. Why am I getting all this stuff about England

all the time from the head office? There are tensions between what they

call the state parties, which is the Welsh party, Scottish party and

English party and the Federal party. They have lost quite a bit of

funding and we know a lot of political parties use the status of

the group in an Assembly to fund other activities because it gives

them a profile, it gives them reach. How difficult has it been since

losing those Assembly members? It is difficult. There was no suggestion

that used public money in any way improperly. It is impossible to do

things like employing someone that three days a week to work for the

group but you are giving them a full-time income. You are getting

some help from the party. Nothing illegal, improper, wrong about doing

that. It does mean that now they have had to fall onto their

voluntary work. If the Government announces something, the group would

respond and the group press officer would respond. Now with the

Government announces something, the responses haven't come from outside

the Assembly, particularly if the response is different from what

Kirsty Williams would say. You will see e-mails that would have come

from within, now coming from various places around Wales as they respond

to various activities going on. The Kirsty Williams herself, as the move

into the Welsh Government been a good move? She's saying that they

have won concessions on education. To what extent could they have had

these anyway had they have struck a budget deal with the Welsh

Government? Did she have to be within the Government to have done

the things that she's done? Some of them. She could have achieved some

of them from outside. What would her position be as being a single

Assembly Member on the backbenches? She wouldn't be a recognised group.

Herbert would be important. -- her vote. There was a personal element

here. She has been in the Assembly since the beginning, since 1999. The

opportunity for a politician, an ambitious politician, to be in

Government and in the Cabinet table dealing with an issue like health

and education, I don't see how on a personal level she could have turned

that opportunity down. Is there a danger she should be the

first one to go? I think she is probably the safest member of the

Cabinet, given the mathematics. They are not as desperate for her

support. Thomas is not the reliable of votes if you talk to people. They

don't know which way he is going to vote on any particular issue in

advance. I think Kirsty Williams is fairly safe. I think she will be

there in that job. Certainly while Carwyn Jones is First Minister. If

Carwyn Jones stands down in the year or so before the election, that will

give Kirsty Williams a chance to reconsider and whoever the First

Minister, whether she wants to go into an election in Cabinet or

whether she should step back so she can differentiate between the

Liberal Democrats and Labour. One of Kirsty Williams' legs in Cardiff Bay

is keeping company to Carl. I am joined by William Powell.

Deputy leader of the Liberal Democrats on Powys council. Good

morning. You will be speaking later on in the conference. What is your

main message is going to be? The Lib Dems are back in business. Are they

really? If you look at the three council election wins we have had in

recent times at local Government level, also across the UK. We have

surged to 85,000 members. We are the party that given people a sense of

hope and the rebuilding of trust that is all too lacking in some of

the other parties. The single biggest engine for that is our

commitment to making the best deal of the Brexit situation which we

find ourselves. Brexit is going to have some impact. Who knows if it

will be positive or negative? It will have an impact in Wales. We

need to make sure the maximum number of environment options and the

maximum level of support is still in place for our rural communities. The

landscape which we have, one of our great assets, is not there by

accident. It is the result of the wider economy, the intervention of

farming over time and we need to ensure we are there standing up

strongly with farming union representatives and other key

representatives of our rural heartlands because there is no doubt

that there is a real danger that Brexit represents a major threat to

the survival of our economies. We need to be there for them and we

need to make sure we make the best of the situation in which we find

ourselves. I imagine you will be campaigning. Is Brexit coming up? It

is coming up and it is increasing and I have noticed a shift where

people are opening up and talking about it and talking not so much

about their sense of optimism, but their concerns and they want that

reassurance. Particularly members of the farming community that feel they

have been sold short by the promises that have been made that are

evaporating. Can the Lib Dems position on Brexit

attract voters? It's clearly attracting members, because we've

picked up thousands of members. It is a main engine for us, because

people can identify clearly what our position is and that ultimately we

are committed to there being a second thought and a vote on the

terms of the referendum. But given there was no clarity on destination,

we are there to provide that second opportunity, so that people can

endorse the terms on the bench or otherwise. Few would introduced as a

former Assembly colleague of Kirsty Williams. She sits in the Cabinet

now. Few are a member of the Liberal Democrats in Brecon. I would be

interested in your views, but also people who are members of the

constituency party about Kirsty's position or the party to back Kirsty

to go into government. Is it a popular one? I must say it is,

because people continue to judge Kirsty by what she has achieved at a

local level but also nationally. It is a wonderful opportunity that we

now have, even in challenging circumstances, to deliver their

priorities, such as commitments on class sizes for the first time ever.

Dedicated and customised rural schools policy. And the upcoming

leadership academies, so that we have quality leadership across

schools and colleges in Wales, and a whole host of other areas. These are

not in areas where we are standing on the sidelines making noises, we

had in there, shaping things in government. We are intervening by

people to advance them and put them in a better place for their quality

of life and their futures. Don't you think it dilutes or is the minimal

Liberal Democrat presence in the Assembly, then? No, I think to the

contrary. The fact is we were elected with a single member. I am

sure viewers will understand that if you have a single Assembly Member,

you have no group structure, you have very little opportunities to

contribute as a single freestanding member. Being able to be at the

heart of the governments at the Cabinet table, shaping things, and

not only within the education portfolio, but across the piece in

policy terms. And crucially, from my perspective, advancing the cause and

understanding of rural communities and the importance that their voices

heard loud and clear that the of government. Thank you for your time.

William Powell will be speaking to the conference later. Back to the

studio. Earlier this morning, Bob Griffin,

the party's economic spokesman, addressed the conference. Our stance

on staying in the European market is clear. As a public sort out fact and

fiction in the discussion on Brexit, the real life impact on their jobs,

on the industries and on their areas and communities will be apparent,

and our view becomes more and more credible. I've also got to see that

we have a whole debate on this later on in confidence, so we can all

voice our concerns and our opinions on that at a later time this

weekend. In terms of statistics, in Wales, it's nice to see our

unemployment is falling and wages are rising faster than in England.

But the above statistics, we start from a low base. We have a lot of

catching up to do. One in three people in Wales is paid out of the

public purse. This percentage is incredibly high and is unsustainable

in the long-term, as we look for greater devolution in Wales, we have

to change this balance, so that there are more people earning in the

private sector in wealth generation and less dependent on the public

purse. So we need to promote the growth in our private sector, the

wealth generators, start-ups helping expanding businesses and innovators.

BC from time to time the Welsh government condemned for making bad

decisions, but we have to accept that if we are investing in the

private sector, some are just not going to work. And if more than half

work, perhaps we can set a benchmark on that, then that is fine. But

would also going to get failures or was with grant aid to the private

sector. But the fear of getting it wrong has meant that our process of

giving grant aid and other support to the private sector has got more

complex, more bureaucratic, to the point where I have been talking to a

fairly major food processor, who has been waiting 16 months Wednesday

decision as to whether he can proceed or not without grant that

would generate over 30 jobs. This is hopeless. In those 16 months, we've

voted to leave the EU, his whole world has changed, his export market

is now in danger, the cost of its raw materials has gone up. The world

has changed in the time he put that in. This is replicated many times

over, so that we need to see that our grant aid, help for businesses,

is simple, is fast and is consistent, which it isn't now. We,

in Wales, have places like Swansea, like Cardiff, where economic growth

is good, and there are places like where I come from, from Merthyr

Tydfil, where economic growth is very slow, and despite a lot of

projects, hasn't really taken off. We have another problem with the

heads of the valleys areas, in that many people live in social housing.

This might seem a long way from economic growth, but the truth is,

if you do social housing, it's very difficult to move. If work is

available outside of the commute area, you don't do it, you cannot

move easily, if you're in social housing. So part of my brief to do

with infrastructure is also looking at ways in which we can help people

in economic blackspots, like the heads of the valleys area, be able

to get themselves to places like Cardiff and Swansea, to be able to

work. The projects would like to see include the electrification of the

valleys lines, proper integrated transport structures, a whole host

of things we want to see in terms of infrastructure. And things that will

inspire and pick Wales on the map, in terms of our very local Swansea

Bay generation scheme. And there is a great range of economic growth

structures that we could do. Any minute now, the former leader of the

Welsh Liberal Democrats, Kirsty Williams, will be addressing

conference. We've topped about it already. I suspect she will be

talking about her work as a government minister, especially in

terms of the concessions she has had from the Labour government and some

education policies. Yes, and she's in the fortunate position at the

moment as someone who is still in the first year in the job, of not

having to defend what she has inherited from the previous

government. The poor at Pisa figures happened on her watch, but she can

say, I'm already changing things, you will see the fruits of my work

in a few years' time. In terms of her record on education, I do the

tour have any problem. She can pledge that it will delivered on

time. But she does face a difficult problem. She is by far and away the

best public six speaker -- the best public speaker the Lib Dems cracks

of court. Tim Fallon 's not here because it's his wife's birthday.

She has to do more than just talk about her time in government. There

are also the Donaldson reforms. She could be out of office before the

fruits of our Labour become evident. That's a problem for everyone.

People will sensibly our education system is going. People deal with

the education system on a daily basis, so they have a perception of

how their children's schools are doing and I think people will be

able to judge her effectiveness, even if we haven't yet reached the

next Pisa results. We can sense the direction things moving in. The Lib

Dems were hammered for going into coalition with the Conservatives in

Manchester. This is not a formal coalition in Wales. How is it

different? Many ways, her hand was forced on this, because if she

wanted a profile, there was no one else convertible. That's the first

point, but the other point is, I would query the assertion that they

were hammered for going into coalition. I do think that's

necessarily the case. I think what they were hammered for was for

abandoning some key commitments wasted on. It was the sort of

coalition they went into which appeared far, far too friendly, far

too close with the Conservatives, that they were punished for. If they

had taken a more pragmatic, defending seated stands, had

insisted more on questions around student finance, for instance, we

know David Cameron would have given them or if they had asked for more,

then they might not have been hammered in the same way. In public,

we haven't seen any tension between Kirsty Williams and the Welsh

government on the policy front. We did see one, on the Brexit vote. She

was allowed to vote that way. But it did raise eyebrows. Carwyn Jones, at

the start of this agreement, said Kirsty Williams would have to accept

Cabinet collective responsibility. There haven't really been issues

that have arisen yet that would cause an embarrassment, apart from

that Brexit one, and on that, she was given a pass. There will be

issues. I have no doubt, where she finds herself in a difficult

position, where she has to support government positions that are

opposed to her own opinions and official party policy. People talk

about the influence she has in government. That might be apparent

with the Welsh government getting ?200 million extra as Barnett

consequential. To what extent she can persuade the Welsh government to

spend that in her area. We will see where that money goes. What we could

see is the personal relationship between Carwyn Jones and Kirsty

Williams is good. I think that because the personal relationship is

good, she actually has slightly more influence than you might expect,

just from being one single member of the Cabinet. But when it comes to

everyone pushing for more money, we know there will be pushing for more

spending on social care, for instance, she will face a difficult

fight, because it's not really that much money. I think they are giving

her the big wide but the moment. Let's cross over to the conference

floor. Issues, Kirsty Williams herself, waiting their turn. Let's

tune into what is being said. Welcome, Kirsty, and we look forward

to hearing from you. APPLAUSE

Thank you to everybody for your warm welcome. It's great to be back here

in Swansea. Peter Black always used to tell me that I grew up on the

wrong side, but actually, I have very strong family roots here in

Swansea. That ugly, lovely town, crawling, sprawling by the side of

the long and splendid curving shore. The sea town was Dylan Thomas's

worlds, and it was mine. My mother was born on Gorse Avenue and as a

family, we wouldn't Swansea every weekend. I learned to ride my two

wheeler bike in the park around the corner, I ate my ice cream at

Joel's, and when I was a little bit older, I might occasionally have

ventured along the Mumbles My old. Of course, political parties are a

lot like families. The Addams family, in the case of Ukip. The

Welsh Liberal Democrats are also a family. In fact, here in Swansea, it

is very much a family affair. So much so that my uncle Phil, his

son-in-law John and my little brother Ben, a role Welsh Liberal

Democrat candidates this month of May, regularly Swansea. APPLAUSE

So yes, maybe we do take being like a family just a little bit too

seriously at times. Conference, it has been said that nothing remains

the same, and that has never been truer. Since last spring conference,

our world has completely changed. In Wales, we have seen you can spread

the toxic division to the National Assembly. In London, we have a

government refusing to say that EU nationals have a right to stay and

call our country home. And in America, we have seen a man

unapologetic in his sexism and racism take the most powerful office

in the world. These are worrying times. But worrying times when

movements are built. Boiling times when people realise that there are

things they hold dear that we must all fight for. Leonard Cohen sang,

or at least he spoke deeply, that there are cracks in everything, and

that is how the light gets in. The grey clouds of division continued to

lead all the rows, and I don't know about you, but I can see the rays of

light shining through. People across Britain have found something not

just a fight against, but to fight for. To fight for tolerance,

community and fairness. The people of Britain need an opposition party

that both fight with these values, and that party is ours, the Liberal

Democrats, and our party will take the lead. APPLAUSE

And let us be clear, that fightback has begun. We have more members than

at any time in our party's yesterday. We are winning council

by-elections across the country, and then I see it, even the polls are

beginning to look up a bit. People are feeling ignored, marginalised,

forgotten. But we are listening. And we now that it is dealing with the

present and shining a light into the future, rejecting a false, nostalgic

nationalism, it is that that will make a real difference to people's

lives. Conference, it has been tough for us since last spring, but now is

the time to stand up, now is the time to lead and now is the time to

promote the Welsh Liberal Democrats. APPLAUSE

We know that division and fear always rise up when people feel

helpless. To fight this, we as liberals, believe that education is

the key to empowering people. Education, as Carol said, is at the

heart of what we stand for. In the last Assembly, which party

prioritised education in negotiations with the Welsh

government? Was it Plaid Cymru? In those five years, did the Tories do

it? Not once. It was only the Welsh Liberal Democrats every single year.

Because of this determination, we secured over ?300 million additional

funding for our schools. Not bad for a party of just 5ams. And now in

government, we, and mean me, still prioritise education every single

day. Conference, we are still achieving more than the other

parties put together and we're still very much the party of education.

Raising standards, reducing the attainment gap in delivering an

education service that is a source of national pride and national

confidence. International mission. Our mission. Conference, we will

show the way as Liberal Democrats. But we also know that it is not

going to be easy. The Pisa results show was that there is much to do,

and hard work ahead. Wales needs strong leaders, eight national

mission needs strong leaders. You will know that I recently invited

international experts to provide progress on how we are doing. The

report was positive. The live a long way to go, but the reforms we have

put in place have their backing. However, they share my strong view

that Wales has not done enough to support and develop our leaders. The

Welsh Liberal Democrats made this point time and time again in the

last Assembly, and that is why we promised in our manifesto the

establishment of a leadership Academy, something I have

prioritised since being in government. I can issue you that

leadership development will be a prime driver of our reforms. No more

than ever, wales needs strong leaders who adopt that the

challenge, and our academy will focus on the needs of the next

generation of teachers. It will develop career routes for those who

want to be headteachers it will make sure that our leaders are

well-prepared for the job we ask of them. Wales needs strong leadership.

Conference, Wales has been crying out for an Academy like this for

decades. So you can be proud that it is because of us that we are making

it a reality here in Wales. APPLAUSE I spoke earlier of the need to

listen to what people tell us. Since becoming Cabinet Secretary, it

has been a privilege to visit schools, meeting teachers, pupils

and parents right across the country. They are all spell out a

clear message to me. We must reduce class sizes. While the Welsh Lib

Dems have listened to that message. The Tories and Plaid Cymru continue

to fight back. Briefing parents and teachers are wrong and that class

sizes don't matter, and that we should sit back and accept growing

numbers in our classrooms year on year. Well, we want. We have listen

to concerns that that the international evidence. Just down

the road at the last primary School, I announced ?56 million investment

to reduce infant class sizes. Evidence shows that this investment,

links to our other reforms, book improve attainment and to have a

significant impact on blood of pupils and will support teachers to

be more eminent of all stop -- will support teachers to be more

innovative. Conference, we have elections coming up. Tell everyone

about this policy on the doorstep. Tell everyone we have listened and

tell them we're delivering it in government. The Welsh Lib Dems are

raising standards for all. APPLAUSE A year ago, in the Assembly in

opposition, I hosted a debate in the chamber in title, The Importance Of

Rural Schools, How Schools Are The Lifeblood Of The Rural Community.

Not the catchiest of titles, I know, but based on a simple truth. Without

schools, how can communities flourish? Young families need

schools near them or they will move away. Communities will simply

decline. Never did I imagine that so soon after that debate, I would

actually be able to do something about it. Too often we hear about

how people across Wales feel left behind and that devolution has

become a Project limited to Cardiff. That is why was proud earlier this

month when the government unveiled plans for the North Wales metro, are

planned that will be transformative. I was proud to introduce Wales's

first ever rural and small schools strategy. For the first time, Wales

will have a definition of the rural school. We will also introduce rules

presuming against the closure of rural schools. It's not simply about

keeping schools open, it's also about making sure all schools get a

fair hearing when their future is considered. This is about the Welsh

Lib Dems raising standards in all of our schools, no matter where they

are based. You may ask, what about the funding? I have guaranteed ?10

million additional investment to support this policy, because I know

that warm words are simply not enough. We recognise that children

in small and rural schools deserve the same opportunities as children

across Wales. The Welsh Lib Dems will always be on the side of our

rural communities. APPLAUSE But

let us think. Let us reflect. Is there anything

more heartbreaking than knowing that the pool family, the less likely it

is that the child will be able to reach their full potential?

Regardless of their talent, regardless of that ability,

regardless of their intellect. Too often in our society, poverty means

it shall's life chances are stolen away from them. This injustice is

what drives all of us, each and every one of us in this room. And

that is why I am so proud that we established the Welsh pupil premium

in the last Assembly. Together, we secured this extra funding for our

schools. And in government, I took the decision to double this

investment again for our youngest pupils. As we all know, it is the

early years that really matter the most. One-to-one tuition, extra

staff, outreach programmes, all supporting our most disadvantaged

pupils. This is meant over ?25 million extra investment in

Swansea's schools alone. Conference, being in no doubt, that the decision

to back the Welsh government's budget to support our poorest pupils

was the right one. And it is making a difference. You know my proudest

moment as Cabinet Secretary was welcoming this year's GCSE results,

that showed that the attainment gap closed between the Buddhist pupils

and their peers, and that is in large thanks to our pupil premium.

Conference, I can guarantee to you here today that this investment will

continue, it will continue until once and for all, a child's life

chances are based on their ability and never, ever on their background.

Of course, our national mission reaches further than schools. No one

can accuse us of having a quiet year in government. Reforms have been

wide-ranging and will lead a long-lasting, progressive legacy

that we can be proud of. I have announced that we will establish a

new strategic authority to oversee skills and higher education and

further education. It is clear to me at the various sectors are regulated

and funded in different ways by different bodies, and that has

resulted in counter productive competition, as well as gaps and

confusion for learners. My focus is on making sure there are high

quality options and outcomes for all other citizens. In our working

lives, they are no longer the dues rapidly. We need a system that makes

it easier for people to learn and acquire skills throughout their

careers. Across-the-board in England, they think the answer is

more marketisation and privatisation, and I reject this.

Drawing on international best practice, we will go forward with a

sector that is coordinated, coherent and places learners at its heart.

This is a radical, radical change, but one that is truly necessary. The

Welsh Liberal Democrats, we take difficult decisions, but also the

right ones. Topping of difficult decisions, I have also announced

changes to higher education and student finance. But the truth is,

we're the party had already taken this difficult decision. We've

learned the lessons from the past, and this time, we went into the

election with the clear but achievable policy. Beware the first

party in Wales show leadership on this. Heading into the election, we

were the only parted to be brave enough to be upfront and revealer

hand. We knew and we said so, that the current system was

unsustainable. What importantly, we were the only party that recognised

it was living costs, not fees, that deterred poorer people from going to

university in the first place. That in government, we're putting our

principles into practice, securing stable and sustainable funding for

higher education in Wales, and I the fact that NUS in Wales have

supported these proposals. Because of the Welsh Lib Dems, students will

receive the equivalent of the national living wage while they

study. Because of the Welsh Democrats, we are introducing a

system that is fair and consistent, for full-time, for part-time and for

postgraduate students. Because of the Welsh Lib Dems, Wales will have

the most generous and progressive system anywhere in the UK and

indeed, it will be unique in Europe. Tough decisions, yes, but

conference, decisions that we can be proud of. APPLAUSE

My experience over the last ten months, alongside international

evidence, has told me that effective leadership is the key that unlocks a

better future for any education system.

But now one leader can raise standards, transform lives and build

better communities on the lawn. No single teacher, headteacher or

school, not even a single cabinet secretary. But if we had a party, as

candidates, as councillors, if we commit to listening and leading,

then we will deliver a Wales that is open, tolerant and United. So,

conference, let's be leaders in our communities and in our councils

across our country. Let's have the courage and the confidence to make

the case that tomorrow can and will be better. The Welsh Liberal

Democrats meeting in all parts of Wales, leading for all people in

Wales. Kirsty Williams with more than one reference in her speech to

listening to the electorate. Quite a bit about her record since she

joined the Welsh government. Yes, it was interesting that she

concentrated so much on education. Almost as if she felt she had to

justify that decision to go into government, saying that the Liberal

Democrats have always been a party of education. Maybe under the

surface there is a little bit more disquiet than we are picking up on.

The fact that Kirsty Williams had to really put a strong defence of

adorable in government. Is there a danger they could be seen

as a one topic party? That is a danger but what else can you do? You

can't be a minister that everything. Education isn't a bad subject to be

associated with. More difficult if she had accepted the health

portfolio. Health is an issue where there are always problems. However

much money you have, there will always be difficult is somewhere

within the health service. Education throws up less curveballs in terms

of unexpected surprises, unexpected bad news. I think she would be on a

sticky wicket if she had taken the health process. She was referring to

listening to people and made a reference to people on Brexit. To

what extent are the party listening to the majority of people in Wales

who voted to leave the -- leave the European Union? The truth is they

are not. They believe in the European Union. To be fair to them,

will we have expected Ukip members to become supporters of Europe at

the vote on the other way? Why should a party which has

pro-Europeanism as part of its foundational values abandon that? It

is more of a calculation. Plaid Cymru didn't give up after the 1979

devolution referendum. They carried on pushing and another referendum

came along. The party is saying they respect the result and the verdict

of the people that that doesn't mean our values or our commitment to

Europe has changed. That is a perfect standpoint to take. What you

get into more difficulties as people sense you are trying to prevent the

will of the people from being fulfilled. It is a difficult balance

and people would respect them for sticking to their values but would

resent them if they thought they were using Parliamentary tactics to

draw out the process or prevent the process. We will hopefully hear from

Kirsty Williams who hopefully will be joining me live in no time at

all. In the meantime, let's hear from a former member. We have heard

from a few of them already on the programme. Lynette Parrott has been

talking and taking apart -- taking part in localism. We pride ourselves

on our long term commitment to localism. Some of my earliest

members are running away from dogs on housing estates with focus

leaflets in my hand or folding them in front of the file with my family.

At the core of today's motion is the reason why that is crucial in

today's politics more than ever before. The conference notes section

talks about the disconnect we have between communities and Government

at all levels here in this country. The dangers of that should be

obvious to all of us. We have seen a frightening slide towards the right

in our country over the last few years and people who are desperately

searching for ancestor the problem is that they feel and the

disconnection may feel from decision-making have been throwing

themselves into the arms of people who may offer those easy ounces but

they offer no solutions and they won't attack the needs of those

communities in the long term. We must be an alternative that is

credible and viable. We must be that bridge between our communities and

Government at all levels. Whether we are in a local community council

serving our local commutes or whether we are in the House of

Lords. That connection is crucial. We must be so careful to ensure that

our iteration of localism is consistent with our values, our

aspirations and a recognition of what strategic priorities should be.

Localism must never sink to -- into parochialism. We have to do what is

right for everyone. We can recognise the need for housing, how's our

young families and the homeless. And oppose every planning application.

We have to make brave choices that are consistent with the long-term

needs we have. We must be brave enough and honest enough to

sometimes say no to the community. That is honest localism and it will

protect our values and needs for the future as a party but part of our

local communities to. We need to be brave to reject those campaigns that

may seem expedient now that undermine our belief in fairness and

opportunity for everybody in the long-term. Who else would be that

honest and that brave? Who could fill that gap. If there was no Lib

Dem party, there would be a need to invent because there is nobody else

who will be honest enough to do so. Don't just vote for this motion, go

back and live this motion. Now it is needed more than it ever was. People

need somebody to turn to. Go and give them a reason for it to be you.

Applause macro -- APPLAUSE .

Tim Farron is missing from this conference. He has some family

commitments. It is his wife's birthday, apparently. It is not a

snub. We don't always see the Prime Minister at a Welsh Conservative

conference. I do think Tim Farron is the asset to the party that Nick

Clegg was. Nick Clegg had a very good relationship. He was a very

prominent public figure. Back in the days, the Lib Dems used to get a lot

of their time. The leader of the Lib Dems was someone that people knew. I

am not many -- I am not sure how many people know Tim Farron. He's

having to fight to establish his profile at the moment. He isn't yet

a major asset that the party can deploy because an awful lot of

people have no idea who he is. He's not going to be the one who will be

winning votes for the Lib Dems in May? Not at this stage. It would be

the focus leaflets. Winning elections is what the Liberal

Democrats are good at in terms of targeting of rewards in terms of

campaigning tactics and that is what they will be depending on. We are

joined life by Kirsty Williams, the sole Welsh Liberal Democrat. Good

afternoon. Good afternoon. 75 councillors down from 115. One Welsh

MPs, no MEP's. Is it a back to basics campaign? It has been a tough

time for the party but what we have seen in recent months is a huge

swelling of our membership figures and a new-found sense of

self-confidence to get out there and campaign. We have seen electoral

successes in council by-elections across the UK. A fabulous

Westminster constituency one and we share that sense of optimism and the

need to get out there, working communities and be the community

champions and fight those local elections with optimism, enthusiasm

and a sense of determination. This is your first Welsh conference since

becoming part of the Welsh Government. Have you had any

conversations with anyone within your party who was unhappy about

that move? The party endorsed my move to be part of the Government.

The world's developed -- the Welsh Democrats have a clear mechanism. I

couldn't have done it unless they Welsh Democrats had endorsed that.

They did that last May and we have been able to demonstrate the value

of having a Welsh Liberal Democrat in the Government. In terms of

education, something that the party is traditionally campaigning on a

main previous assemblies it was our priority that prioritised spending

and education. I have a national mission to raise standards, close

the attainment grabbed and ensure our education system is a source of

national pride and conference. Our influence goes beyond education. We

will increase the number of nurses working in that community, sport our

rural communities. We have ensured a better deal for local Government. We

will build more affordable homes. It is not just education. It allows us

to make a real difference in our communities. It sounds like you are

enjoying life with Labour. Hardly a day goes by when we don't see

another expose on Wales' public services. Wales has become the

weakest link. If that still your view? The differences I recognise

there is a job of work to do to improve public services in Wales. My

Cabinet colleagues would say the same. I haven't changed my tune. I

believe it now as Cabinet Secretary. The crucial difference is I now have

the opportunity and the powers to do something about it. Talk is one

thing. Criticism is one thing. The ability to hold the Government to

account is another. I have an opportunity to change our education

system, put in place the investment and leadership in class sizes,

teacher's professional learning that will make a difference for our

children and the teaching profession. You might change your on

public services but have you changed your view on labour who you have

described as Wales' weakest link? Is that still your view? No one Lib Dem

Cabinet member can single-handedly reverse any decline in public

services, surely? What the cabinet can do is work with politicians in

other parties to make a difference. With the best will in the world,

having been good at Prime Minister's Questions, it was a valuable thing

to do but it didn't make a difference. Working with the

Government by agreeing a budget deal that saw additional resources

invested, to support the education of our poorest children, we saw the

gap at GCSE levels between our poorest children and their richer

counterparts close. I got into politics to do things and I am

willing to do it because what is important to me is the policy of

public services. It is important to the Government as a whole. I am to

bring ideas, commitment enthusiast and to make a difference to

communities. You mentioned a people premium. This is what an independent

report said about the people premium. There is some ambiguity

about how the pupil death probation --... It predates his introduction.

This is your flagship policy which has a lot of questions around it. I

was recently in a school in one of our most challenging communities.

The chairman of governors, the headteacher, they are using that

money to invest in additional staff to give the children the additional

help and attention they need. Last year we saw they closing of our GCSE

results. We are seeing at the end of primary school that our primary

schools are able to use that resource to ensure their poorer

children are going into secondary School on the same basis as they're

better off counterparts. If you listen to teachers, school

governors, the parents of that that -- those children, the pupil premium

is giving opportunities to children that would not be there without it.

The message I get is please keep on spending this money, keep on

investing and keep on closing the attainment gap. Can we rattle

through some of the topics. You said you are listening. How are you

listening to the majority of the Welsh people on Brexit to fated

believe -- voted to leave? My party has accepted the fact that the Welsh

party and the UK have made a decision to leave the European

Union. That doesn't mean we should abandon our beliefs. It is about

working to go other and we will move our country forward. My party is

saying that they hope and aspiration for a number of people wanting to

stay in the European Union. They need to be listen to. From a Welsh

context, we need to ensure the Tory Government in Westminster to do news

to negotiate a deal that gives us unfettered access to the single

market. Not to do that, to have a hard Brexit which is where the

Tories seem to be willing to take us, will be disastrous for the Welsh

economy and disastrous for the economy will mean bad news for our

public services because you won't have the wealth to win best. One of

the first speakers was Peter Black. He says it is disappointing haven't

got people here who should be here. Did he have Tim Farron in mind? Tim

has a family engagement this weekend. Politicians are people also

and there been times in the past when leaders haven't been able to

come to conferences for a whole variety of reasons. I Welsh leader,

Mark Williams, it is that commitment to his community that saw him return

so successfully. He is here and our counsel candidates are here. We are

determined to use the opportunity of this we can to share ideas, share

good practice and let communities now that it would be this party that

is willing to listen to them and willing to be their community

Champion in County halls across the country. On a similar conference

programme, we discussed your project. Project 32 or project 35. I

am kindly said it was now Project 3.2. Wheel in a school Assembly Hall

today. Would you conceive that is probably the only Assembly hall that

you are likely to dominate the quite a while? We know as a small party we

always punch above our weight in the National Assembly and in Westminster

we are the only party come despite our small size, that is holding the

Tory Government to account for the disastrous policies it is pursuing.

It has been a difficult time for this party. Membership is up,

council candidates are up. We are determined to be the community

champions the Welsh people need. Thank you very much for your time.

What did you make of that? The Liberal Democrats are keen that

recycling. Kirsty Williams was sure-footed as ever. The party has

no option but put his hands up and say it is in a bad place. They have

to start rebuilding somewhere if they are not going to disappear

entirely. I think Kirsty Williams' job is to hold the fort and hope it

goes well. One thing that is interesting is there was hardly any

apology from Kirsty Williams on the stance on Brexit. Quite obvious

which side of the argument they are now representing. They don't have

the problem Labour has of having two distinct constituencies and they

leave constituency. The SNP showed you can turn a minority in a

referendum into a majority of first past the post election. If the Lib

Dems could get off the Remainers, half the people who voted to remain,

they will be doing three times better than they are now. That is

what they are aiming for. Would a good night in May give them a

springboard, put the foundations in place looking had to the next Welsh

Assembly elections? They have always had a decent amount of Assembly

members. If you look at it, the correlation between how people lived

in local elections and Assembly elections is closer than it is

between local elections and Assembly elections. If you do well in a

sufficient number in a region, it should deliver you a regional seat.

It is a long time. It is four years away to the next Assembly election.

These local elections will have been forgotten. What it does is

councillors give you organisation. It gives you feet on the ground,

leaflets to doorsteps and that is rarely what equips you to get those

regional seats in. On her record since she took office, quite a

robust defence around the things she has been doing, deprived pupils so

one. You would expect that sort of defence. Time will tell on some of

these issues. She said in her speech that there was evidence that

reducing class sizes was beneficial for pupils. The OECD say not. They

say there are more important things than you can do class sizes. We will

know whether she succeeds or not. We can pop over quickly for some more

reaction from the conference. We will get some reaction on Christine

Humphreys. Former President of the Welsh Liberal Democrats. Kirsty

Williams has spoken. What did you make of what she had to say? It was

a marvellous speech and I like the fact she started with the fact that

we're a family. When you come to Welsh Lib Dem conferences, it is

like meeting of the family again and we thoroughly enjoyed ourselves as

well as getting involved in policy. All the things that Kirsty has

delivered as the Cabinet Secretary fair education, they are really

putting Lib Dem policies into action and that makes us proud that she has

been able to do the things that we have decided in conferences in the

past. For Lib Dems, it is the conferences that set policies. She

has been enacting what we want to do. There is no tension with the

fact that she is in the Cabinet? We would like her to have a team around

her again but no tensions at all. Thank you for joining us. It is

lunchtime here and everyone has gone off for their lunch. I will do the

same. 75 councillors, 168 back in 2008.

How much of that can be bridged? The first key is how many candidates

they managed to find. We will find that out pretty soon. Realistically

they need to get back into three figures. Over 100. They will get

back up to 160. If you are drawing a target, I would guess they would be

hoping for somewhere around 120 seats. Thank you very much. We'll

back at S4 C at 2:30pm. Thanks for watching and goodbye.