Middle Age of Rock Brian Pern: A Life in Rock


Middle Age of Rock

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This programme contains very strong language.

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Over 40 years, I've been playing music all over the world,

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both as lead singer of Thotch and as a solo artist.

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I invented world music...

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I was the first musician to use plasticine in videos...

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The first musician to record with animals...

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My last album had the lowest bass line ever recorded.

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DISCORDANT BASS TONE

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And long before Bob Geldof and Bono,

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I was staging charity concerts

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and writing songs to raise awareness for the helpless and the homeless.

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# Why no black folk in Jersey?

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# Why no black folk in Sark?

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# Why no black folk in Guernsey?

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# Are they having a lark? #

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This is The Life Of Rock with me, Brian Pern.

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MUSIC: Rock And Roll by Led Zeppelin

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-# People try to put us d-down...

-Talking about my generation

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# Hope I die before I get old. #

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"I hope I die before I get old,"

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sang a 21-year-old Roger Daltrey back in 1965.

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Thankfully for his fans and family, his hope didn't come true.

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He's not dead. But he is old and still singing the same song.

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But Roger's sentiment back there remains just as pertinent

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to rock stars of all g-g-generations

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as r-r-rock music is all about y-y-youth.

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It's all about discovery and adventure.

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Rock will do anything to stay young.

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It's Mr Tom the Jones.

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Tom Jones has been trying to stay young for over 40 years.

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But one thing that doesn't age is his voice.

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# Yeah...! #

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CHEERING

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But not everyone is as lucky as Tommy Jones.

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Yeah!

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The average life expectancy of a rock star is 37,

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which is lower than an Indian peasant or a Glaswegian.

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Drugs and drink contributing factors, of course.

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So, middle age hits you pretty quick if you work in this business.

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However, halfway through the middle age of rock,

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something came along which was to change the face of music forever.

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The machine!

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JAUNTY SYNTH MUSIC

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This was music made by men in white coats.

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The studio, for them, was a laboratory.

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I know this sounds crazy,

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but Moog was an offensive word in those rock'n'roll days back then.

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If anyone uttered the word on Radio One Rock Show

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or The Old Grey Whistle Test, it was, well, it was bleeped.

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It was like saying "cunt", bleep!

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Or "cock fucking cock sucker," bleep!

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You'd get beaten up for saying it out loud on a tour bus or in the street.

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Moogism, I think it was called, was absolutely...

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It was rife.

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I was very resistant to the Moog. I'm a guitarist.

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The Moog is a soulless instrument. "Woo-ee!"

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It's knob twiddling.

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I can make a guitar sound like anything I want.

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I can make it cry, sing, make it sound like a chain saw.

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ORDINARY GUITAR NOTE

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I can make it sound like bagpipes.

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-SAME NOTE

-Or a seagull.

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SAME NOTE AGAIN

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As far as I'm concerned,

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the synthesiser and other such electric devices

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are only good for calling the pigeons home.

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I wrote a piece of music for the synthesiser entitled Bell's End

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which was performed at St Paul's Cathedral

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on 4th February, 1973,

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through to 5th February, 1973.

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It wasn't until much later that the instrument became

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accepted into the mainstream.

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The breakthrough hit was Popcorn.

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After the success of Popcorn,

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it became accepted in certain people,

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like myself and Rick, Yes, ELP, Roxy...

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They all came out of the Moog closet and openly played it.

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It was liberating.

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Tony Pebble, a great player.

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We've got this sort of rivalry because he found out

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that I went to the Royal College of Music and he didn't.

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Secondly, because when he discovered that I started playing at five,

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he got the right hump and started going around telling people

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that he started playing in the womb.

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He claimed that his mum would take the bloody bump along

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to piano lessons and, while the teacher tinkled on the piano,

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Tony would run up and down playing on the lining of her uterus.

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What utter bollocks.

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I was equally outrageous.

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I can remember, on one occasion, I unbuttoned my shirt,

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then I put some shades on.

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Yeah, I think I looked pretty cool.

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# I am your automatic lover... #

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It wasn't long before robots themselves were making music.

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# I am your automatic lover... #

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This song was a huge hit in 1978,

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fusing disco, electronica and robotics.

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What a lot of people don't know is that the person inside the suit

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was the writer and producer, and that person was me.

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-MUFFLED VOICE:

-Hello? I'd like to get out now.

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It's quite hot in here. It's hot in here.

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Very hot.

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Can I get out now, please? Hello?

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In the '70s and '80s,

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many musicians feared that robots would take their jobs.

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And when you see what these guys can do, who can blame them?

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But if robots can be programmed to play instruments like that,

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they can also be programmed to kill, like this.

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So be careful with that screwdriver, Eugene.

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The next step was disco.

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# Another one bites the dust. #

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When Queen were number one in America

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with Another One Bites The Dust,

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anyone hearing them on the radio would think they were black.

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It was the same with Michael Jackson.

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Everybody thought he was black, too.

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So, when Brian suggested he wanted to do a disco album,

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I thought this was an excellent idea

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and I put a deposit down on a vineyard in Malta.

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But there was only one man in the '70s who could give the white man

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the funk - Nile Rodgers from Chic.

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I used to be called Nigel Rogers

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but I dropped the G and swapped the L and the E around,

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made it Nile. You know, Nile.

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They all wanted the Nigel Rodgers touch

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and some get-going disco.

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It all started when I worked with Max Bygraves.

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He was a man who had hands and sang about a homo toothbrush.

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# I'm getting married in the morning

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# Ding dong, the bells are gonna chime! #

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He knocked around the studio for a mad couple of days.

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He was real funny.

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# I'm getting married in the morning... #

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So anyway, I get a call from Brian Pern.

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He had this track called Breakfast

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and he was thinking of turning it into a disco track,

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as he'd never made a disco album.

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Sheesh! Mayonnaise!

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It was a debacle. This was music for drainpipes.

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I got hold of it, put some funk in the trunk.

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-# Disco breakfast

-Ow!

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# When I first met you, your head was in flames... #

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And then Brian made a disco album

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and I remember watching him on Top Of The Pops like this.

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# Inside they were dancing, gasping for air... #

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I thought, what the fuck is he doing?

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It's quite literally Mike Smash here,

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and this week's lowest new entry in the pop chart

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is Brian Pern with Disco Breakfast!

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He'd spent so bloody long working on it,

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by the time it came out in '85, the disco bubble had burst.

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The album crashed. Not even Nile Rodgers could save it.

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Sheesh! Mayonnaise!

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No matter how bad your latest album may be,

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you can still shift a few million units

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with endless early morning TV promotion.

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These cost the best part of a million pounds' worth of injuries to us,

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-the National Health Service.

-I've cut my thumb very badly on one, yes.

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They were rather dangerous and I think something has to be done.

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In order to appeal to the younger market and stay fresh,

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rock stars often have to appear on television that really isn't cool -

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kids' television.

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And for once, they have to be on their best behaviour.

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But sometimes, it's the kids who misbehave.

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When I was doing Swap Shop,

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it was on Saturday mornings and it was live...

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Used to have quite a few pop stars come in

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and maybe sometimes came in with a bit of a hangover.

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They'd have a go at trying to pull Maggie Philbin or Delia Smith,

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or, depending on their persuasions, even have a crack at Craven.

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It wasn't the pop stars that were the issue, to be honest.

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Hopefully, we have a call for you straightaway. It's live on the line,

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if you'd like to pick up the phones there.

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What I recall is that it was the kids.

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We were live, there was no delay.

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We just never knew what they were going to say.

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-Line three.

-'Hello.'

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-Hi, who are you?

-'It's Tracy.'

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Hello, Tracy. What can I do for you?

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'Are you into wife swapping?'

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Ah, that question.

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Uh...

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-I wouldn't say that.

-No, I don't think I am, either.

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When record sales dried up for artistes,

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there was always another avenue they could go down - acting.

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It's invariably an absolutely shocking move.

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I think they shouldn't be allowed to act.

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It should be banned.

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I can think of several instances in which case

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I've nearly died from cultural shock.

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Mick Jagger, however, appearing in his first film since 1970,

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is quite the ineffable twit that he sometimes seems.

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Ringo Starr drifts in and out in a performance which suggests

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that he should run, not walk, to the nearest acting school.

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What opens this week is The Krays, starring Gary and Martin Kemp.

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The acting, I have to tell you, is quite terrible.

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David Essex, I thought, was the first successful musician

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to transfer over to the world of acting.

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I can't remember the name of his film. It was about a funfair.

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That'll Be The Day.

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Whatever.

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Brian had noticed that I'd got a lot of my other acts into

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big TV shows, films...

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Sting in Dune, Bowie in Happy New Year Mr Christmas

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or whatever it was called,

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and Suggs into Rambo: First Blood Part Two.

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So, I got him into one of the biggest soaps of the '80s.

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-Look at that.

-Down, boy.

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I wonder what it's like topsides.

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I think I'll go and find out.

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Oh, I like a man in uniform.

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-Are you a passenger?

-I bought my ticket.

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It's a free country.

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This is a private area here. This is the cruise deck.

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-Officers and crew only.

-Bugger off, I'm having a sleep.

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Brian also auditioned for parts in Long Good Friday...

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I put money in all of your pockets.

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Which one of yous is a grass?

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..Buster...

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I'm Buster Edwards. Which one of yous is a grass?

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..and Labyrinth.

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I'm the goblin king. Which one of yous is a grass?

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Thankfully, for cinemagoers everywhere,

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he didn't get any of them.

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Some rock stars who couldn't act decided to put

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their names and faces to worthy causes.

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Hey, you two! Come here. How old are you?

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-Nine.

-Well, if you want to live to be ten,

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you'd better learn to stop at the curb.

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And I mean stop, right?

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Look at those two! They must be crazy.

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A double-decker bus could have come along

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and made an eggnog out of their noggins.

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Hey, you've got to be careful to look where you're going,

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otherwise the only place you'll be going is heaven or hell,

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or purgatory, depending on which you believe in.

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So look left, look right, be smart, be safe.

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In the early years of rock music, the most popular song writers

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were singing about love or dancing and rocking around clocks.

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Music was for entertaining.

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But others were keen to send a different message

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out to their listeners.

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This was when the protest song was born.

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# How many roads must a man walk down... #

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It was Bob Dylan who kick-started the protest song

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and was an inspiration to us all.

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As you know, I'm a political animal.

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In my solo career, I've drawn attention to certain events

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and situations that would not normally have registered

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to fat, white, middle-class people.

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In 1982, I wrote my own protest song

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when I saw this shocking footage of John Bartlett,

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a man arrested by the police in Australia

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for eating a Chinese meal without chopsticks.

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Gentlemen, this is democracy manifest.

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Have a look at the headlock here. What is the charge?

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Eating a meal, a succulent Chinese meal?

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I was so enraged by the footage,

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I had to act upon it immediately.

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# John Bartlett ate a Chinese meal

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# A succulent Chinese meal... #

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Get your hand off my penis!

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This is the bloke who got me on the penis, people.

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# ...and egg-fried rice

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# Pretty soon he'd have to pay the price

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# The waiter said

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# You must sling your hook

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# Mistaking John for a common crook

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# In a headlock, they compressed his nuts

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# Drove him off With no ifs or buts

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# All John wanted was a Chinese meal

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# Now it's dark and it's cold... #

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The impact of that song was immense.

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I mean, it brought down the Australian government

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and no-one was arrested for eating a Chinese meal ever again,

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which has been a great relief to quite a few of us, let me tell you.

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# This is democracy manifest

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# Get your hands off my penis... #

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The protest song evolved into the charity single.

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And in 1984, one man had the vision to save the starving in Africa

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by making the ultimate charity record of all time.

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That person was me.

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Good evening...

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It was 9:05,

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October 23, 1984.

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I got a call from Brian. He said,

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"Are you watching the Nine O'Clock News?"

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I said, "No, I'm watching Gentle Touch on the other side."

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-SIRENS

-Damn you, damn you, damn you.

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He said, "Switch over." I said, "Don't be daft.

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"Can't do that, it's a good bit."

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What the hell's he doing, eating that pie?

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And what do you think you're doing

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with your collar open and your shirt hanging out?

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Anyway, he told me about the famine in Africa,

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which was horrendous of course.

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And he suggested I call a few people,

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get them down to his Poggle studios

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and get some sort of charity single started.

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So I did. I got straight on the phone

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to some of the biggest acts I had access to at that time.

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People like Big Country, Liza Minnelli,

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Zucchero, Suggs, Mike Batt...

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-# Si-i-i-i-i-i-ide

-# I'm masquerading... #

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About 20% of them were engaged, 10% were out

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and the rest of them were watching The Gentle Touch.

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You're improperly dressed, both of you.

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Your behaviour's disgusting.

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It was the last episode of the series

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and nobody knew if it was going to come back.

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Fortunately it did, in the guise of CATS Eyes with Leslie Ash.

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It wasn't as good.

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The following day, I bumped into Bob Geldof.

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The Boomtowns had gone bust

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and he part-owned a sports shop in Chiswick

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called The Boomtown Racquets.

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I was purchasing a punnet of squash balls

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and I relayed what I'd seen on the news

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and told him about my plans to release a charity single that Christmas.

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He sounded keen.

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Unfortunately, I couldn't start work on it right away,

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as I was booked to go skiing with the in-laws

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and Lunn Poly wouldn't give me my deposit back.

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When I arrived home ten days later,

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Do They Know It's Christmas? was number one

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and the rest is history.

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# Feed The world... #

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Yeah, Brian was upset for months.

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Every time he heard that record, he'd break a piece of furniture.

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I was never out of Habitat that Christmas.

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In the end, I suppose the important thing

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was that millions of pounds went to Africa.

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Whoever tied the ribbon on the parcel is irrelevant.

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But I will say one thing,

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when I talked to Bob that day in Boomtown Racquets,

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he said he'd never seen the news.

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He was watching The Gentle Touch on the other side.

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# Snooker loopy Nuts are we

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# We're all snooker loopy... #

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Do They Know It's Christmas Time? inspired countless charity singles,

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including this one by Charlie and David called Snooker Crazy,

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which raised money for snooker players with arthritis.

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# I'll celebrate And buy another eight

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# Hairbrushes for me barnet

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# I always pipe me eyeballs

0:18:320:18:35

# Perhaps I ought to chalk it

0:18:350:18:37

# Cos I wear these goggles... #

0:18:370:18:40

Just Say No by the Grange Hill gang

0:18:420:18:44

climbed to number five in the pop charts,

0:18:440:18:46

where it stayed for one consecutive week.

0:18:460:18:49

# Just say no! #

0:18:490:18:50

I mean, if one of your friends were on drugs, what would you do?

0:18:500:18:53

# Just say no! #

0:18:530:18:54

# Everybody wants to run the world... #

0:18:540:18:58

Everybody Wants To Run The World told people to run the world,

0:18:580:19:01

not rule it.

0:19:010:19:03

It climbed to number 13 in the charts,

0:19:030:19:05

where it stayed for a consecutive week.

0:19:050:19:08

Sport Aid never caught on. They only did it twice.

0:19:080:19:10

I've got a feeling Bob was using it

0:19:100:19:12

just to try and sell a few more of his rackets.

0:19:120:19:16

But the mother of all charity records was Doctor In Distress,

0:19:160:19:19

which outsold all the others by millions.

0:19:190:19:22

# No, no, no, no... #

0:19:220:19:25

In 1985, the controller of BBC One threatened to axe Doctor Who

0:19:250:19:30

so some of the biggest musicians and actors in the world

0:19:300:19:32

got together to try and save it.

0:19:320:19:34

# You tried to exterminate

0:19:340:19:36

# Doctor in distress... #

0:19:360:19:38

The success of Doctor In Distress lead to the next step,

0:19:380:19:41

the global jukebox...

0:19:410:19:42

Live Aid.

0:19:420:19:44

The biggest names in pop music,

0:19:440:19:45

from Elton John to Bob Dylan, from Duran Duran to Wham,

0:19:450:19:48

are to appear in two concerts in London and the United States on July 13.

0:19:480:19:53

Well, of course he was upset. He was never asked.

0:19:530:19:55

Brian, he invented world music. He should have been asked.

0:19:550:19:58

Mind you, I think he dodged a bullet with that one.

0:19:580:20:01

I mean, yeah, everybody remembers Queen, Bowie, U2...

0:20:010:20:04

but the rest of it was a bit patchy, wasn't it?

0:20:040:20:06

# There's more snakes than ladders

0:20:060:20:11

# At this point in time... #

0:20:130:20:17

I mean, you look at some of the other acts who weren't there,

0:20:170:20:20

you'd see that Brian was in very good company.

0:20:200:20:22

Live Aid...

0:20:220:20:24

-Limeade?

-Status Quo...

0:20:250:20:28

-Limeade?

-Queen...

0:20:280:20:30

-Was it a concert?

-Yeah, I don't think we were there!

0:20:320:20:35

In secret documents released for the first time,

0:20:350:20:38

it appears that a more sinister force

0:20:380:20:39

was determined to bring an end to the global jukebox.

0:20:390:20:43

Good afternoon, Wembley. CHEERING

0:20:430:20:46

In a very short time, my duty is to take

0:20:460:20:49

one of the finest ambassadors of the British music industry

0:20:490:20:53

from Wembley to Philadelphia.

0:20:530:20:56

Ladies and gentlemen, Phil Collins! CHEERING

0:20:560:20:59

'Phil Collins was due to fly on Concorde to Philadelphia

0:20:590:21:02

'to play with Led Zeppelin.'

0:21:020:21:04

And the idea was I'd pick him up in my chopper,

0:21:040:21:07

fly him to Concorde, we'd both get on

0:21:070:21:10

and off to America.

0:21:100:21:11

As we were driving down to the helipad,

0:21:120:21:14

we stopped off at BP for, you know,

0:21:140:21:17

a pasty and a Vimto

0:21:170:21:19

and we had no idea we were being monitored by KGB intelligence.

0:21:190:21:23

I'd been seconded to MI6 in 1985 and we'd obtained intelligence

0:21:230:21:27

that the Russians were planning to take down Concorde,

0:21:270:21:29

which contained Mr Phil Collins.

0:21:290:21:31

The Russians were absolutely furious about Live Aid.

0:21:310:21:34

You know, they saw it as another classic example of Western decadence.

0:21:340:21:39

They'd also got wind that at least 34% of the performers

0:21:390:21:42

were homosexual.

0:21:420:21:44

In fact, it was closer to 49%.

0:21:440:21:46

Apparently, the Prime Minister had been informed of the dangers

0:21:460:21:49

but she had promised her son Mark, who's a massive fan of Dire Straits,

0:21:490:21:53

that he could go backstage and meet Mark...the other Mark,

0:21:530:21:56

Mark Knopfler.

0:21:560:21:58

And she knew how disappointed he'd be,

0:21:580:22:01

so she kept quiet about the whole thing,

0:22:010:22:04

which on so many levels is fucking disgusting.

0:22:040:22:08

Welcome to a very special show

0:22:080:22:09

from the flight deck of Concorde Alpha Bravo.

0:22:090:22:12

In a moment, we're going to take you to America.

0:22:120:22:16

A few Russian helicopters set off armed.

0:22:160:22:18

We managed to intercept them in Inkst.

0:22:180:22:20

Inx... Inxk...

0:22:200:22:23

But one did get through and the hardest job we had

0:22:230:22:25

was, in intelligence, keeping it all a secret

0:22:250:22:28

with a billion people watching on television.

0:22:280:22:30

So there we were, Phil and I, sitting together on Concorde

0:22:300:22:33

and we were just finishing off the pasty.

0:22:330:22:35

And we looked out the window

0:22:350:22:37

and there were two Russian helicopters alongside us.

0:22:370:22:40

And we thought, "Oh, hang on,

0:22:400:22:41

"this is like something out of a Rambo film."

0:22:410:22:43

So I immediately ordered a gin and tonic

0:22:430:22:45

and some brown trousers.

0:22:450:22:47

When I got taken into the cockpit, the captain said,

0:22:470:22:50

"You're going to have a word with London now.

0:22:500:22:54

-"So please don't tell anybody."

-And then, the helicopter opened fire.

0:22:540:22:59

The pilot - he flopped on the floor like an old sock

0:22:590:23:02

and I saw Phil going to pieces. He was very worried cos he said,

0:23:020:23:05

"I don't know how to fly a plane!"

0:23:050:23:07

So, it was down to me.

0:23:070:23:08

Well, I managed to land safely at JFK with Phil,

0:23:110:23:13

but I think the whole experience had quite an impact on him, actually.

0:23:130:23:18

And I remember arriving and going into their trailer and saying,

0:23:180:23:22

"Hi, guys. OK, so..."

0:23:220:23:23

And Jimmy Page said,

0:23:230:23:25

"So how does it go, Stairway to Heaven? How does it go?"

0:23:250:23:28

So I said, "Well, you know, I know this is where I come in

0:23:280:23:31

"and I go da-da-da-dum, da-da-la-dum."

0:23:310:23:33

He said, "No!

0:23:330:23:35

"No!"

0:23:350:23:37

STAIRWAY TO HEAVEN INTRO

0:23:370:23:40

IN THE AIR TONIGHT DRUM SOLO INTERRUPTS

0:23:490:23:52

And I thought, "OK..."

0:23:520:23:53

It was like I was being taken apart.

0:23:530:23:56

DRUMMING BEGINS AGAIN

0:24:020:24:04

# ...who's sure All that glitters is gold...

0:24:040:24:08

DRUMMING CUTS IN ONCE AGAIN

0:24:080:24:12

# ..the stairway to heaven... #

0:24:120:24:16

DRUMMING DROWNS SINGING

0:24:160:24:18

After Live Aid, there were all kinds of benefit concerts

0:24:280:24:31

and of course, Live 8,

0:24:310:24:33

not that I was there.

0:24:330:24:35

And again, I think he missed a bullet with Live 8 too.

0:24:350:24:38

It was shit.

0:24:380:24:40

So the middle age of rock saw bands

0:24:400:24:42

growing rich and bored and political.

0:24:420:24:44

The outcome of the next age of rock is inevitable.

0:24:440:24:47

Rock has two choices -

0:24:470:24:49

go peacefully in its sleep, or out with a bang.

0:24:490:24:51

Which way will it go?

0:24:510:24:53

Find out next week on The Life Of Rock with me, Brian Pern.

0:24:530:24:57

Yeah, Peter Morgan submitted the first draft

0:25:010:25:03

of the Thotch-Pern biopic.

0:25:030:25:04

Tom Hooper, who did The King's Stutter, he's directing.

0:25:040:25:08

Did you read it?

0:25:080:25:09

No, I couldn't download it.

0:25:090:25:11

It's very good. It's all about the break-up.

0:25:110:25:13

-Well, hopefully they'll get my side of the story across.

-Yeah.

0:25:130:25:17

The rest of the band... they're quite keen.

0:25:170:25:20

They've got Fassbender playing Pat,

0:25:200:25:22

Michael Sheen playing Tony Pebble...

0:25:220:25:25

and Tony Blair.

0:25:250:25:26

-Guess who they've got for you.

-I don't know.

0:25:260:25:29

Idris Elba.

0:25:290:25:31

Idris Elba? Well, who's playing you?

0:25:310:25:33

Judi Dench.

0:25:350:25:37

-Did you ever do the John Peel show?

-No, didn't actually do it.

0:25:370:25:40

We did send things in to John Peel.

0:25:400:25:43

Not records, of course.

0:25:430:25:44

Many fruits and debris from the woodland floor.

0:25:440:25:47

Promotional items for pizzas

0:25:470:25:50

and stuff that had come through our door

0:25:500:25:52

that were of no use to us.

0:25:520:25:54

-OK, Brian, repeat after me, "You remind me of the babe."

-Why?

0:25:540:25:58

Oh, come on, Brian.

0:25:580:26:00

You remind me of the babe.

0:26:000:26:01

-What babe?

-What babe?

0:26:010:26:03

-The babe with the power.

-The babe with the power.

0:26:030:26:05

-The power of the voodoo.

-The power of voodoo.

0:26:050:26:08

-Who do?

-Who do?

-You do.

-You do.

0:26:080:26:10

-Do what?

-Do what?

0:26:100:26:11

-Remind me of the babe.

-Oh, come off it!

0:26:110:26:13

Oh, here are some of the sounds I invented.

0:26:130:26:15

This is perky avocado.

0:26:150:26:18

PERKY AVOCADO BUZZES

0:26:200:26:23

I have the largest collection of guitars in the UK...

0:26:230:26:27

..apart from The Edge.

0:26:290:26:30

But he doesn't count, because technically, he's Irish.

0:26:300:26:34

-TUNEFUL GURGLING

-Jazzy Babies.

0:26:340:26:36

This particular model is worth...

0:26:390:26:42

..I would say probably about £175,

0:26:440:26:47

something like that.

0:26:470:26:49

And then of course, I composed demos,

0:26:490:26:52

you know, the little tunes you get on keyboards.

0:26:520:26:55

This is my personal favourite -

0:26:550:26:57

The Sod.

0:26:570:26:58

CHIRPY DEMO PLAYS

0:26:580:27:02

Oh...

0:27:070:27:09

Just rather hurt my back!

0:27:090:27:10

Could you...

0:27:120:27:14

I've got some co-dydramol and diazepam downstairs.

0:27:140:27:17

Would somebody...? Cos I'm stuck now.

0:27:170:27:20

Help!

0:27:200:27:21

Hello, I'm Pete and this is Martin.

0:27:260:27:28

We live in Worcester and we're both unemployed.

0:27:280:27:31

Up till now, the only things of any interest

0:27:310:27:33

have been rock and pop music and football.

0:27:330:27:35

Now, there's a new group started at our local youth centre in Worcester.

0:27:350:27:39

We'll be finding out how to convince the boss that we're worth employing.

0:27:390:27:42

In other words, how to sell ourselves at interviews.

0:27:420:27:45

It's about the only interesting and new thing

0:27:450:27:48

to do in Worcester during the daytime.

0:27:480:27:50

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