26/10/2016 Daily Politics

The Government says it's sorry to see Zac Goldsmith

resign over Heathrow, but won't be standing

Could this be a chance for a Lib Dem by-election upset?

Heathrow's third runway is unlikely to be up and running before 2025,

but there are still a range of obstacles including legal

challenges, planning laws and concerns over air quality.

Officials are continuing to dismantle the Calais camp

But how many migrants will refuse to give up their attempts to cross the

Channelled to the UK? Theresa May and Jeremy Corbyn

will be facing each other over the despatch box at prime

minister's questions, we'll bring you all the action

live at midday. And when real life at Westminster

gets a bit dull, which fictional politicians do our MPs turn

to for inspiration? All that in the next

hour and a half. And with us for the whole

of the programme today, two politicians who we're pretty

sure aren't a figment Greg Clark is the Business Secretary

although, when Theresa May was appointing her first Cabinet,

she accidentally made him president of the Board of Trade as well -

a job he officially held for four days until officials

realised the mistake. John Healey was Shadow Housing

Minister until Labour's And now he's back in a new, exciting

role, as Shadow Housing Minister. First today, let's talk

about Calais, where French authorities are continuing

to demolish what became known Last night, several

huts were set on fire. There are concerns that many

migrants will not give up their attempts

to cross the Channel to the UK. So far, about 4,000 of some 7,000

migrants have been taken to shelters around France, and workers

have been dismantling It is thought that a large number

of migrants have disappeared, possibly to sleep rough around

Calais until they can Several hundred more young migrants

are expected to arrive in Britain from Calais

in the next few weeks, to join the 200 who

have already arrived. Greg, what will prevent another

migrant settlement developing incarnate? If history is a guide,

that is exactly what will happen again in the UK will continue to be

a magnet. French authorities have thought long and hard about what to

do with the situation all of us could seek if you had a camp of 7000

or 10,000 people, there are big pressures. What it has done in terms

of establishing centres across the country where people can be

processed and put into place those arrangements, that seems to be a

sensible approach for them to take to the problem. Do you think it will

prevent makeshift camps being rebuilt once the bulldozers have

left for those migrants who still want to come to the UK? It is for

the French authorities to act on that. To think it will happen? They

are determined to solve this problem in Calais for is you can understand

the people of Calais being very concerned about the continuation of

this. They are doing everything they can. It seems to me, in a parallel

situation, if we had an encampment of people, of course, both for

welfare reasons for the people concerned, we would want to take

steps to make sure that people are being treated properly. They're in

mind this is an encampment of people, many of whom have been

trafficked and are being trafficked on. The idea you are disrupting and

putting more civilised arrangements in place for people, rather than to

have them in the hands of traffickers... It is a big political

issue in France and will be at the presidential election. It could be

used, couldn't it, in terms of alternatives to border arrangements,

for example? It is a big concern to local French people. The French

authorities and the interior minister have clearly worked with

the local and regional authorities to put into place systems to deal

with the problem. They are going through it. It is clearly a matter

for the French but it is understandable they should want to

act. Two things will happen. The problem of people living in poverty

and misery will get disbursed and be more difficult to deal with. The

pressure points on the UK and on the UK Borders will disbursed as well.

Really the question for the Government now, in light of this,

what is the Government's and for dealing with that? The other thing

that will happen, and we know this happened last time, kids in

particular disappeared into the hands of smugglers and traffickers.

That is the real worry. Let's talk about the children. The Home

Secretary has had to issue an appeal because there are not enough council

places for the Calais children. The Local Government Association has

said the Government only wrote to council leaders on 14th of October.

That is only a week and a half ago. Why was it less so late? There is

constant communication with the local Government Association. David

Simons, believes councillor responsible for that has worked very

closely with the Home Office when I was community secretary, I met with

him and the LGA. The response of local councils across the country to

taking vulnerable people to Syria... This is not enough. We have known

what will happen at the Calais camp. There was a commitment to take

unaccompanied minors. Why were the only written to in the last week or

so? Communication has been constant, going back for years. In particular

over the last year. It is important to recognise the efforts that local

Gottman has made in housing people and giving support to people coming

from Syria. -- local government. They have met with individual

councils across the country. They are made very welcome. They have a

good record. In terms of the money, one of the agreements that was made

with local government was that the costs would be recognised and would

be met. Again, David Simons would tell you that has been a very

constructive relationship. We have left this far too late for Britain

to do its bit, especially for children and teenagers in the camp.

They have not been assessed for that there is no clear plan to bring them

back. It is late in the day, six months after we pass legislation in

Parliament with the Dubs Amendment, about these children who have a

right to be in the UK. Does before that the councils started stepping

up volunteering to places. How concerned are you that the age of

these children is being correctly assessed? I think that is a symptom

of an assessment process that has been rushed and left too late. You

think there should have been more rigorous checks? Assessment should

have been done earlier and plans in place earlier. Places should have

been found for them and prepared for them. All of this should have been

done earlier. It is far too late to do our bit as they are dismantling

the camps. You would be in favour of more rigorous medical assessment so

the British voting public has faith in the system that child refugees

means child refugees? You need to have confidence in the assessment

system that it is hard to do a good job and it is late and rushed like

this. The British public in large and others have wanted to see, and

have been ready to welcome, these children and teenagers who have gone

through the most appalling problems back in their home areas. They do

not have family in the camps. Most of them have family in Britain who

could already be looking after them, instead of this happening late in

the day. It is right to proceed in a carefully planned way. Thank you.

The Government's decision yesterday to go ahead with the expansion

of Heathrow Airport means we could be getting closer to seeing

the construction of the first new runway in the South East

And ministers still face some knotty problems, including the by-election

triggered by anti-Heathrow campaigner Zac Goldsmith,

opposition from local protestors, and the prospect of the whole thing

being ensnared in the courts and the planning process.

You can already hear the lawyers smacking their lips at the prospect

of a dripping roast. Theresa May has made her decision,

but there are a number of clouds on the horizon if plans

for a third runway at Heathrow Zac Goldsmith, the Conservative

MP for Richmond Park, resigned within hours

of the decision yesterday, triggering a by-election,

which he hopes will be a "referendum" on expansion

at the West London airport. Others are already planning

to oppose the third Four Conservative councils have

pledged to mount a legal challenge. Environmental groups,

including Greenpeace, are expected to join them,

over concerns about air quality. The Mayor of London,

Sadiq Khan, another opponent of Heathrow expansion,

has said he is also considering how he can "best be involved"

in a legal challenge. And then there are the divisions

in the Prime Minister's own Cabinet. Boris Johnson has already called

a third runway "undeliverable". Theresa May has had

to suspend collective responsibility to allow him

and Education Secretary Justine It means Mrs May will likely need

Labour support to win a vote But while many Labour MPs

favour Heathrow expansion, both Jeremy Corbyn and Shadow

Chancellor John McDonnell Well, Transport Secretary Chris

Grayling has been talking It's all about what's

right for the country. Everyone benefits

from pursuing this. Albeit, it's difficult for people

who live close by. But if you look at the difference

this will make in terms of creating jobs, creating new opportunities

around the world for British businesses, small, medium and large,

to sell their products, this is right thing

for the whole country. If we want to fund the National

Health Service in future, if we want to do the right

thing by our pensioners, we have to be a nation

that creates wealth, We have to be a country that

works for everyone in it. Well, let's speak

now to Sarah Olney. She's the Lib Dem candidate hoping

to challenge Zac Goldsmith Can you confirm that you will be the

Lib Dem candidate? I am currently the candidate. I was selected by the

local party at the hustings back in the summer. We just need to go

through a further process to confirm who the candidate will be in the

by-election. Do you expect anyone to argue in your constituency or the

wider Lib Democrat party? We need somebody much better known with a

higher profile. Perhaps a 67-year-old male with a knighthood

who used to have a neighbouring constituency. I can't imagine who

you mean. I have heard we will have a discussion about it. There will be

a short list put to the local party and it will be for them to decide.

So, it is not a slam dunk that he will be the candidate? I don't know.

There will be a process, there will be a short list. I do not know how

long that will be. That is the process. Zac Goldsmith has said he

wants this by-election to be a referendum on Heathrow. Given you

are against Heathrow, any Lib Dem candidate will almost certainly be

against Heathrow, the two front runners are against Heathrow, in

what way can be a referendum on Heathrow? Precisely. It is really

just a bit of a farce. Once again we see the Conservatives finding

themselves having to call an election to decide what really

should be an internal party matter. It is Conservative in fighting

again. We have seen this with the referendum. They cannot resolve

things amongst themselves so they call a referendum. The Lib Dems once

favoured a referendum on in or out. If you are a candidate, will you

make this election... This constituency voted 70% to remain on

June 23. Will you make this as much an election about the referendum,

about the future of Britain in Europe, is about Heathrow? It is a

good opportunity for the voters of Richmond Park to have a say about

what they think about Brexit and the way the Conservative government is

approaching the Brexit negotiations. As you said, we're on the same side

as far as Heathrow is concerned. For the voters to be able to choose

between us, it will be fought on other issues. Brexit will clearly be

the main issue uppermost in the minds of voters. We know the people

of Richmond by and large are against Heathrow expansion, because it is in

their neighbourhood. Window without doubt they wanted to remain in the

European Union, they voted roughly 70% to so do. What we going to find

out that we don't know already? People will be a bit puzzled because

we know all that. Quite. I agree with you. It seems a bit of a farce

we are having this by-election. I'm happy to have the opportunity to put

messages in front of voters. We are keen to get started and up for the

fight. Why would you be a better advocate of opposing the expansion

of Heathrow than Zac Goldsmith, who has a well-known almost national

track record on this issue? I think Zach has failed, to put it

Bruntly. He has had his opportunity and failed to influence the

Government in anyway. The Liberal Democrats have a good track record

of preventing Heathrow eggs spankings. We have had Liberal

Democrat MPs in the past who have fought very hard and very

effectively to prevent Heathrow eggs spankings and when we were in the

coalition we prevented Heathrow expansion. I think I would argue

that the Liberal Democrats have a much better track record in this

area than Zac Goldsmith does and also we are united as a party

against Heathrow which the Conservatives and Labour clearly

aren't. All right, thank you for joining us. Why are the

Conservatives not putting up a candidate against Mr Goldsmith?

Because we admire the work he has done in his constituency. He was

very clear he would resign if this decision was taken. Was it Sarah,

the candidate, Yes. I think she says this is a by-election that shouldn't

happen. I think she would be the first to be outraged if Zac

Goldsmith having said he would resign, hadn't. Yes, I think a lot

of people would think this is a by election which shouldn't happen.

Here is a Conservative MP, who fought the last election being

opposed to Heathrow. Knowing that the Government was likely to go

ahead with Heathrow. The Government has gone ahead with Heathrow. He is

going to fight a by-election being opposed to Heathrow. He hopes to

win. Back to the status quo, ante, nothing will have changed except

it'll have cost the country ?250,000 in money for the by-election. The

fist thing, Andrew, is the decision about Heathrow followed the Davis

commission report, so it wasn't possible for any of to us know what

the recommendations would have been, before the election. It was - we

have discussed it many times on this programme, it was very serious. I

forget, would the Davis commission report before the general election?

Yes. You knew it was the official recommendation. Mr Goldsmith says he

wants this to be a referendum on Heathrow. So if the pro-Heathrow

Government doesn't put up a candidate, how can it be a

referendum on Heathrow? Well, the Prime Minister has said even members

of the Cabinet who have had long-standing constituency

objections to Heathrow are able to continue to express them. I know

that. Who will put the case for Heathrow in the by-election? Well,

the by election is... A referendum on Heathrow The by-election is the

by-election and the candidates will say. And Mr Goldsmith already said

it was a referendum Heathrow. Let me try again, who will put the case on

this by election on Heathrow which you know will get national

attention? This is a by election to elect the next Member of Parliament

for Richmond Park. No, really, wow! The key thing, I think the

Government finally after which, in the 1940s when it was fist put

forward has agreed to ex-spanned airport capacity and taken an

important strategic decision, of course it was controversial, it was

always going to be. None of which has to do with the question I asked.

Never mind. For clarity. The final part of the Davis report came out

after the election. But, you had to be in New Zealand, I think, not to

know which way the wind was going Can I say something on, that the

Davis report was set up with the support of both parties, as John

will acknowledge, to to have a serious consideration of the case

and both main parties committed to... I understand all that. I need

to get on to John. But this must be. I want to stick with the policies

before I come on to it. This Is must be the first time since the 1940s

certainly when you have a Government not prepared to put up a candidate

in the by election. You are ducking the electorate. They want to avoid

the Liberal Democrats winning, it is clear, that's why they are doing t

isn't it? Obviously. Speaking of this... Well, a Member of

Parliament, with respect. Hang on, you have had your say. Ducking,

ducking, ducking, major party. Your colleagues, Clive Lewis, Jonathan

Reynolds, and another have written an article this morning saying

Labour shouldn't stand in Richmond. Do you agree with that? No. Labour

will stand. They will Labour will stand. In a pro-Heathrow stance?

Labour will stand To be honest, I can't see a by-election being simply

a referendum on Heathrow however Zac Goldsmith likes to argue it.

Normally referendums are a judgment, or if you like, at the time on the

Government. That's how we will fight that campaign for the by-election.

So Labour is standing. Yes. Right. Greg Clarke, when do you think the

first plane will take off from the new runway? Well, it clearly needs

to go through the planning process, the middle of the next decade.

2025-26 is the time in which it is... Except that that would only

happen, if everything went right, if the planning process was seamless.

If the legal challenges got nowhere. If people manage not to tie

themselves in front of bulldozers and all the rest of it. If

everything went, you might just make it by 2025. Anything goes wrong, and

these things tend to go wrong, remember Terminal 5, how long that

took t could be much longer than that. The responsibility of the

Government is to do everything meticulously, as we have done,

through the consideration of the report, through the decision of the

sub committee of the Cabinet made, through the parliamentary process.

But it could be a lot longer. The plan and the airports commission

looked at the timetables for each of the proposals, and they validated

the prospects for reach of them. But it is not the quickest one by far.

Not the quickest one. You have said - or your Government - that this is

Britain open for business, but you have actually chosen the most

expensive option and the one that will take the longest to deliver.

So, for the next 10, 12, could even be 15 years, you are pretty much

closing the UK for business. We are not going to get this expansion any

time soon? Andrew, I have come from a meeting before I came on your show

with the leaders of the institute of directors, the CBI, the federation

of small business, the British Chambers of Commerce and others,

they were unanimous in welcoming the decision, that a decision has been

made but also the particular decision for this Heathrow option.

But my point is that it will take the longest, won't it? Tell a take

longer than Gatwick. A lot longer. It is one of the considerations that

was made in the decision but the benefits from Heathrow,

establishing, reinforcing this UK's - as one of the world's premier hub

airports, is the right decision. Let me ask you two quick questions

before I come back to John Healy. - was the Government aware that the

plan may now be to build a ramp over the M25? Did you know that when you

took the decision? Yes, part of the ground transport improvements that

are needed to service it, need to be consistent with minimising the

disare up... But the talk was of a tunnel. Did you know that a ramp was

now possible? We knew that there would be changes to the road system

around there Was that in the proposal? Part of the consideration

was the required changes. But was it in the proposal that the Davis

commission considered? The Davis commission made deleer that there

would need to be changes, improvements. It proceeded on the

basis of a tunnel. Around transportation. Let me ask you

another one. David Cameron's advisors warned him last year that

he was "exposed on Heathrow, we don't yet have an answer on air

quality." That's what he was told. What is the answer? The air quality

aspect is one of the questions that was looked at again, which is why

the decision wasn't taken last year. What is the answer? The answer is

that we can meet the air quality requirements that we have by

proceeding with Heathrow. This has been established through the... Why?

Because we can live within our requirements to cap the pollutants,

from the ground level, as well as the airport on the trajectory. They

were stress-tested that the calculations there were robust.

Only assuming there is a massive increase in the use of public

transport and a massive increase in the use of electric cars, correct?

In terms of increasing public transport, this is one of the big

advantages of Heat Heath, and the move towards electric vehicles is -

of Heathrow, and the move towards electric vehicles... So that has to

happen But there are other unanswered questions in the

Transport Secretary's statement yesterday. Air quality, climate

change, that is your Greg's, and how on earth we are going to do that. I

think we've demonstrated that from the questions from the Government.

Can you answer this... It will he a bring benefits from around the UK.

Does Labour support the third runway? I support T Labour supported

the third runway in Government. It made this decision ten years ago.

But you fought. Mr Miliband fought the last election against it. You

have wasted six years. We have done enough on the Tories. Your partying

fought the last election against the runway There are differences within

the Labour Party, like within the Conservatives. I know, you have been

very honest and given us your view - and we know the Tories are divided

on this as well but the majority, it would seem, would be in favour and

as Mr Clarke said, they are proceeding. Is there a collective

view, a collective policy by the Labour Party on this? I think it's

hard to say at this stage. In a way, this is the start of the prose.s the

crunch point will come, as you said earlier, late 2017 or early 18 when

Parliament has to vote on this as part of the national policy

statement. It is at that stage that Labour will have a broader view.

Buts. Do you have a collective view? I would say to you that the majority

of Labour MPs, as things stand, like I do, believe this is the best

option, for much inform needed capacity in the south-east. Is Mr

Corbyn in favour? You will have to ask him? Or the Chancellor.

On-McDonnell is against it. This is a debate that only just started.

Only juster started. Harold Wilson started it in 1968! This is a debate

and process now, triggered by the decision yesterday which has only

just started. OK. We need to move on. Afterall, it's only how many

years, 48? . Keep counting. No, no, you have had

your say. Now how do you think

Greg and John will Well, apparently those are just two

examples of new hand signals for civil servants who want to stop

themselves being shouted down by passionate

ministers at meetings. I learned that in Framery 1. How

much are these consultants getting? Tea.

But for any civil servants watching I've got some news,

you don't need to rely on ludicrous suggestions by consultants

if you want to stop Greg or any one else shouting you down.

Just bring them on here, and I'll do it.

No, you just need to bring one of these to your meeting.

Because the Daily Politics mug is guaranteed to silence

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You ask me that every week, I don't know the answer. Slow counters.

And that can mean only one thing, Yes, Prime Minister's

And that's not all, Laura Kuenssberg is here.

Welcome back. The big storivity week is obviously Heathrow, runway

expansion, provoked a by election, the Government is divided on it,

some big names, so naturally, the Leader of the Opposition will go on

Heathrow, except - that he's just as divided. Well, indeed. Are we

allowed to do hand signals, warming up to Prime Minister's Questions? I

think actually what they may go on, given what has happened since last

week's Prime Minister's Questions, aside from Heathrow, is Theresa May

going to her first EU Council meeting. A really big deal a big

moment for the Prime Minister, to turn newspaper Brussels, to try to

make friends and to try to start - turn up in Brussels, to try to make

friends and start to edging her position which looks like a dynamic

where she will be able to get her way. It was not an easy couple of

days in Brussels at the end of week, at all and especially what went

down, was don't freeze us out, we may be leaving but don't exclude us,

I demand to be in on everything until we leave. It maybe that Jeremy

Corbyn will pick up on that. Do you think he will? Do you have inside

information or are you guessing? I'm always guessing. Last week's guess

turned out to be not bad. We guessed about Simon Stevens. That was true,

that was the health service and Mr Corbyn obviously is very clear. But

we will go straight over now. This morning I had meetings with

ministerial colleagues and others. I shall have further such meetings

later today. In the Black Country in the West Midlands, we are very proud

of our long, industrial heritage. We are also very proud of the recent

revival in the fortunes of the Black Country with new jobs and investment

in the local economy. With the Prime Minister agree with me not one of

the ways to create an economy which works for everyone is to further

devolved powers and funding to the West Midlands to drive investment

and to combine that with the strong leadership and vision that only Andy

Street can provide, the Conservative candidate for West Midlands? Thank

you. Our honourable friend speaks up well for the Black Country. I am

pleased to echo his comments about the economic growth in the West

Midlands. Since 2010 we have seen 220,000 more jobs, 55,000 more new

businesses in the region thought he is right that evolution deal is

important. It is the biggest deal, devolution deal that is being done,

for the West Midlands. Part of that is crucially the election of a

directly elected mayor. Andy Street, with his local knowledge and

business experience, will drive economic growth. Jeremy Corbyn.

Thank you. Could I stop by welcoming the child refugees who have arrived

in Britain in the last few days question that they are obviously

deeply traumatised and we should welcome and love them and support

them in the best way we can. Irrespective party, when members of

this House go through health problems, we reach out a hand of

support. I want to pay tribute to the member for Grantham and Stamford

for the social media message he sent out this morning which shows amazing

humour and bravery and we wish him all the very best and hope he fully

recovers. There are now to be regular sessions of the joint

ministerial Council to discuss Brexit. It seems the Prime

Minister's counterparts are already feeling the same sense of

frustration as members of this House. The First Minister Paul

Wales, Carwyn Jones, said there is a great deal of uncertainty that they

need full and unfettered access to the single market. Can the Prime

Minister help the First Minister of Wales and the other devolved

Administration is by giving them some clarity? First of all can I

commend the Home Office for the work that has been done in ensuring that

it is working carefully to look at the best interests of the child

refugees, so they are provided with the support they need when they come

here to the United Kingdom. Can I also join him in commending my

honourable friend the member for grants and Stamford, for being

willing to be so open about the health problem he has, and we wish

him all the very best for the future and for his place here in this

House. In relation to the issue of clarity on the aim is the Government

has in relation to Brexit, I have been very clear and I will be clear

again. There are those who talk about means

and those who talk about ends. I am talking about ends. What we need to

see is the best possible arrangement for trade with an operation within

the single European market for businesses in goods and services

here in the United Kingdom. I'd thought moment the Prime Minister

was to say Brexit means Brexit again. There are others... I am sure

she will tell us one day what it actually means. The Mayor of London

also added this is causing unnecessary certainty but it is also

very important uncertainty. It would be very helpful if the Prime

Minister could provide some clarity over the Northern Ireland border.

Will we continue membership of the customs union will be sea border

checks introduced between Northern Ireland and the Republic? The Leader

of the Opposition tries to poke fun at the phrase, Brexit means Brexit.

The whole point is this. Brexit, it is this government which is

listening to the voice of the British people. Brexit means Brexit

and that means we are coming out of the European Union. What the Right

Honourable gentleman appears to be doing is frustrating the well of the

British people by saying Brexit means something completely different

in relation to the Northern Irish border, a considerable amount of

work was already going on with the Irish government to look at issues

around the Common travel area. That work is continuing. We have been

very clear, the Government of the Republic of Ireland has been very

clear. The Northern Ireland Executive has been very clear. None

of us want to see a return to the borders of the past. I would remind

the right honourable gentleman that the Common travel area has been in

place since 1923. That is well before either of us joined the

European Union. Mr Speaker, on Monday, the Prime Minister said the

customs union was not a binary choice. I can't think of anything

other than a binary choice is whether you have a border or do not

have one. There is not a third way on that one. On Monday, her friend,

the honourable member for Broxtowe, expressed concern of the automotive

and aerospace industries while the British banking Association said its

members are poised, quivering, over the relocate button. Every day the

Prime Minister dithers over the chaotic Brexit, there are rumours

circulating about relocation. This cannot carry on until March of next

year. When will the Prime Minister come up with a plan? I have to say

to the right honourable gentleman, the fact that he seems to confuse a

customs union with a border where they are two different issues, it

shows why it is important that it is this party that is in government and

not his. He talks about the plan. I have been very clear that we want to

trade freely - both trade and operate within the single market. I

want this country to be a global leader in free trade. The Labour

Party is against free trade. I want to introduce control on free

movement so that we have an end to free movement. The Labour Party

wants to continue with free movement. I want to deliver on the

will of the British people. He is trying to frustrate the will of the

British people. Mr Speaker, there was no answer on the border, which

was the question. On Monday, Mr Speaker, the Prime Minister told the

house, and I quote that we have a plan not to set out at every stage

of the negotiation the details. I have been thinking about this white

couple of days, Mr Speaker. I think when you are searching for the real

meaning and importance behind the Prime Minister's statement you have

to consult the great philosophers. The only one I can come up with...

Mr cleverly, calm yourself or you are in peril in your own health. All

I can come up with Mr Speaker is Baldrick, who said, our cunning plan

is to have no plan. Brexit was apparently about taking back control

but devolved governments do not know the plan, businesses do not know the

plan, Parliament does not know the plan. When will the Prime Minister

abandon their shambolic Tory Brexit and develop a plan that delivers for

the whole country? I am interested that the right

honourable gentleman shows to support Baldrick. The actor playing

Baldrick was a member of the Labour Party. I will tell the right

honourable gentleman what we are going to deliver. We are going to

deliver on the vote of the British people, we are going to deliver the

best possible deal for trade in goods and services both with and

operating within the European Union. And we are going to deliver an end

to free movement. That is what the British people want and that is what

this government will deliver for them. Mr Speaker, three years ago

the United Kingdom backed Saudi Arabia former mission of the UN

Human Rights Council. On 28th of October, there are elections again

for the UN human rights Council. A UN panel has warned that the Saudi

Arabian bombing of Yemen has violated international law. Amnesty

International says, executions are on the increase, women are widely

discriminated against, torture is common and human rights

organisations are banned. Will Howard government again be backing

the Saudi dictatorship for membership of that committee? -- her

government. As the right honourable gentleman knows, whether our

legitimate human rights concerns in relation to Saudi Arabia, we raise

them. In relation to the action in the Yemen we have been clear that we

want those incidents which have been referred to to be properly

investigated and we want the Saudi Arabians, if there are lessons to be

learned, to learn lessons. I will reiterate the point I have made in

this House before that our relationship with Saudi Arabia is

important. It particularly important relationship in relation to the

security of this country and counterterrorism and boiling

activities of those who wish to do harm to citizens in the UK. A Yemeni

man living in Liverpool told me this week that Yemen is quickly becoming

the forgotten crisis. If people are not being killed by bombs, it is

hunger that kills them. The UK needs to use its influence to help the

people of Yemen. Bombs exported from Britain are being dropped on Yemeni

children by Saudi pilots trained by Britain. If there are war crimes

being committed, as the UN suggests, they must be investigated. Isn't it

about time this government suspended its arms sales to Saudi Arabia? The

issues are being investigated. I say to the right honourable gentleman.

We have taken action for the P is right to refer to the humanitarian

crisis in the Yemen. -- we have taken action. This country is at the

forefront to ensuring humanitarian aid is provided. I believe this

country are governing can be proud around the world in terms of actions

taken. It is important. There was as the station of hostilities in the

Yemen for a period of 72 hours over the weekend. -- a cessation. I spoke

to the Crown Prince of Abu Dhabi at the weekend. One issue we discussed

was the importance of trying to find a political solution in Yemen and

trying to see if that cessation in hostilities could be continued, but

it has not. The only solution which will work for the Yemen will be to

make sure we have that political solution which will give stability

in the Yemen. Mr Speaker, 20 years ago, a Conservative government

agreed that Christchurch and East Dorset councils could retain their

sovereignty, independence, and control over their own destiny. Will

my right honourable friend assure the House that the Government will

not agree to the abolition of Christchurch or is Dorset councils

against the will of my constituents? My right honourable friend is right

to speak up for his constituents. He is also right that there is not a

single model that will work in every part of the country. That is why we

believe it is important for local people to come together and

determine what is right for them. I know my right honourable friend is

trying to build a consensus and also as to what the right way forward is.

It is right that local people are able to respond on the consultation

and their concerns are listened to. The Scottish Poppy Appeal is

launched today for parliamentarians, so can I take the opportunity it

praise all of the fund raidsers, the volunteers and veterans involved and

I'm sure colleagues in other parts of the House will commend efforts to

raise money for the Poppy Appeal in the rest of the UK as well. Hear,

hear. Mr Speaker, one of the biggest humanitarian catastrophes of our

time is in Syria, specifically in Aleppo, where we expect the

ceasefire to end shortly and an onslaught to begin. Will the Prime

Minister tell us what efforts the UK is currently undertaking to support

a peaceful resolution to the conflict, but also to deal with

those who are exacerbating the situation? Hear, hear. Well, first

of all, may join the right honourable gentleman in commending

and praising the work of all those across the whole of the United

Kingdom who give their time and efforts to raise money for the Poppy

Appeal. It is very important that we never forget those, through many

conflict, who have given of themselves for the safety and

security of us and it is important that we recognise that and give

generously to the Poppy Appeal over the United Kingdom. In relation to

Syria, of course it is important to approach this in a number of tracks.

We are involved - my right honourable friend the Foreign

Secretary, has been involved in discussions with the United States

of America, Secretary of State, Kerry about looking for a way

forward. I raised the issue of Russian actions in Syria,

particularly the bombing of Aleppo at the European Union at the end of

this week, it was only the agenda because the UK had raised T as a

result of that discussion, the EU agreed that should the atrocities

continue, then we will look at all available options for taking action

to put pressure on Russia to stop their indiscriminate bombing of

innocent civilians. I commend the Prime Minister for those endeavours,

but it is widely expected that the onslaught on Aleppo will be unleash

bid Russian airpower, which is currently steaming across the

Mediterranean Bonn a battle group of ships. And in recent years 60

Russian vessels have refuelled and resupplied in Spanish ports. So will

the Prime Minister join me and EU and NATO Allies in unequivocally

calling on Spain to refuse the refuelling? The right honourable

gentleman refers to the passage of Russian naval ships and of course on

the high seas they are able to travel as they wish, although, of

course, when they went through the English Channel they were

accompanied by royal naval vessels, as they went through. But, what we

have seen, sadly s that the Russians are already able to unleash attacks

on innocent civilians on Syria. What happens is that we put pressure on

Russia to do what everybody agrees is the only way that we are going to

resolve this issue, which is to ensure that we have a political

transition in Syria, and that's where we should focus our attention.

THE SPEAKER: Wendy Morton. Mr Speaker, my constituency of

Aldridge Brownhills forms parts of the UN West Midlands Combined can

Authority. So there will be new powers being devolved to the

authority and the mayor. Account Prime Minister tell me how these new

powers will help my constituents, and local businesses, in sectors

such as manufacturing, the automotive industry and bricks ander

is a ammics? I can confirm - and ceranics. I confirm the deal will

provide the West Midlands with ?1 billion over years for local

projects to drive economic growth. This is why it is so important to

have a mayor who understands the local area, but also has business

expertise, Andy Street to ensure the economic projects are being

developed with the interests of the locality in the prime focus for

them. I believe that the deal will deliver more jobs on economic

prosperity across the West Midlands. It is good for the West Midlands and

her condition constituencies and good for the rest of the country as

well. The independent inquiry on child sexual abuse was established

to deliver long-awaited justice for victims and survivors and to do so

it must have their could have, dethe Shirley Observation survivors

association represents more than 600 survivors of abuse that took place

in Lambeth Council children's homes and has raised concerns about

changes to the inquiry. Will the Prime Minister meet with me and the

how many from street that and survivors to ensure action so their

confidence can be restored. The whole purpose of the itch Quiry was

to provide justice for those whose voices have not been heard for too

long and who felt that people in positions of power and institutions

of the state and other organisations had not heard, their voice, they had

not been prepared tolies u listen to them and investigate properly what

happened. It is important that victims have confidence in the

inquiry. The inquiry is an independent inquiry and it is up to

the inquiry chairman to work with irsour viefrs and victims, which I

know the inquiry chairman has been doing, but I will certainly ensure

that the Home Secretary has heard the representations that the

honourable lady has made and we will take what she has said to us today

away and consider very carefully what she said. We all want this

inquiry to work properly and to work in the interests of survivors and

victims. THE SPEAKER: Trevelyan Trev.

The Prime Minister will be aware that our nation's commitment to our

present and former Armed Forces personnel and families by way of the

Armed Forces could have nanted is a work in progress and whilst we have

made important moves there is much more to do. Will she take this

opportunity to I a sure this house of her personal commitments of the

values and promises set out in the covenant and pledge to lend her

support to efforts to continue the good work begun, to ensure personnel

veterans and their families face no disadvantage for the service and

sacrifice they have all made for our country? My honourable friend is

absolutely right. I know she has championed the Armed Forces covenant

and is a great proponent of our veterans and Armed Forces. It is

right everybody in this House owes a great debt of gratitude to our

veterans and those serving today in our Armed Forces for what they do to

keep us safe and secure. And this is' why it is so important that the

covenant isn't just a responsibility for the Government, it is actually a

national responsibility. We should all be working to ensure that those

who served us and served us well, do not face disadvantage. It is why we

have been doing things like putting money into a forces help-to-buy

scheme to help them with house, I think the figure is ?200 million. We

must continue to do this. I absolutely commit to ensuring this

is a Government that continues to support our set rans and the members

of our Armed Forces. - our veterans. Mr Speaker, last year, my

25-year-old nephew committed suicide after a very short period of

depression. His GP had referred him for talking therapy counselling but

warned him it would be at least six months before he got an appointment.

Mr Speaker, these treatments in the NHS are very often a waiting game

and a dangerous waiting game and a postcode lottery. What is the Prime

Minister doing to sort this crisis out? Hear, hear.

Can I first of all recognise and commend the honourable gentleman for

raising the personal experience that he has of the terrible tragedy that

can occur when mental health problems are not properly dealt

with. He raises a very serious issue and it is a serious issue for

everybody in this House on how the NHS treats mental health. It is why

we have established this concept of parity of esteem forp mental health

and physical health in the National Health Service. It is why we are

seeing record levels of funding but the question of talking therapies,

which are therapies which are very effective and we have been

introducing waiting time standards for this area but I accept there is

more to do in this area to ensure that those with mental health

problems are properly treated, and are given the care and attention

they need. It is an issue not just for the them but for the whole of

our society. My right honourable friend became Prime Minister in

dramatic and extraordinary circumstances and in my judgment,

she has proved more than capable of rising to the many challenges... ...

Hear hear. It was not my right honourable friend's fault that the

Chilcot report took seven years or more than ?10 million in terms of

cost. Now that we know that Parliament was misled, would my

right honourable friend we assure me that she has a cunning plan to

ensure that action is taken. Well, I thank my honourable friend for his

comments. Obviously what the Chilcot report did was an important task but

although it did look at - and criticise - the way in which

information had been handled in a number of aspects, it did not say

that people had set out deliberately to mislead. I think it is important

that we recognise that. But it is important, also, that we learn the

lessons from the Chilcot report and this is' why the national security

advisor is leading a piece of work, an exercise to do precisely that.

This was a long time coming, it was a serious report. There is much in

it, we need to ensure that we do learn the lessons from it. THE

SPEAKER: Dr Alasdair McDonnell. Question 6, please. THE SPEAKER: Get

in there, man, let's hear it. The Prime Minister will be aware that

much of the foundation and many of the elements of the 1988 settlement,

the peace agreement in Northern Ireland was referenced and rooted in

EU approaches and processes of laws and that leaving the EU will

significantly destabilise the foundations of that settlement, has

the Prime Minister given any consideration to the extent of the

potential damage the EU withdrawal, from the European Union, could do to

do Good Friday Belfast agreement under the 1998 political settlement

and does she at this stage have any plan to protect that settlement? Can

I say to the honourable gentleman, I don't believe there is any reason to

believe that the outcome of the referendum will do anything to

undermine the absolute rock solid commitment of this Government and

the people of Northern Ireland, to the settlement that was set out in

the Belfast agreement. And there is and remains strong support for the

entirely peaceful future for Northern Ireland. That has been

determined by democracy and consent. We remain committed to that and we

remain committed to work with others to ensure that entirely peaceful

future. THE SPEAKER: Jeremy Lefroy General

Electrihas shown its confidence in the UK economy and my constituents

by starting construction of the second of its two new world class

research and manufacturing facilities on Staffordshire County

Council's redhill business park, would the Prime Minister meet with

General Electric and other West Midland manufacturers who hear how

important that may have chains and markets, free of tariffs and

bureaucracy are of them and their hundreds of thousands of staff. I'm

delighted to hear of the commitment made to Stafford but it is more than

a commitment to Stafford. It is a commitment to the UK and to the

future of our economy here in the UK. I understand my right honourable

friend, the international Trade Secretary, has already met with GE,

to discuss with them, their interests in trade and what we can

be doing to promote free trade. As I have said earlier, I want the UK to

be a global leader in free trade and we are listening to businesses

around the country, in the importance that they place on free

trade, as we look at the negotiations for exiting the EU.

Speak Jim Dowd. Is the Prime Minister aware of the recent reports

showing the continuing and alarming increase in average alcohol

consumption in the UK, and particularly, amongst women? Given

the numerous health risks associated with excessive alcohol consumption,

will her Government, together with the drinks industry, reexamine the

case for mandatory health warnings on all alcoholic products? Hear

hear. Well, I recognise what the honourable gentleman raises in terms

of the figures that have been shown recently, and particularly the

figures in relation to women and the use of alcohol. Of course, I was

part, as Home Secretary, part of the development of the alcohol strategy

that the Government produced a few years ago. I'm pleased to say that

at that time we were working well with industry to encourage them to

ensure that they could take steps to have an impact on the drinking

habits of the nation. THE SPEAKER: Maggie Troup. Thank you

Mr Speaker. With the final decision on the eastern route of HS2

imminent, it is important for the infrastructure, and additional

traffic this will bring to the areas around the station hubs, with this

in mind will my honourable friend back my campaign for a new phase of

the M1 to ensure that Erewash residents don't get stuck in a jam?

I seem to recall I first met my honourable friend when she was

campaigning on an issue in relation to motorways and she's absolutely

right, in order to support the rail infrastructure, we need to ensure

that the right roads infrastructure is there. And that's why we are

investing ?15 billion in the road investment strategy. That's about

boasting local economies and boasting growth and seeing further

economic growth. I understand highways England ark looking at the

issues in the eefted Midlands and looking at Brigging forward

significant new road enhancements around the site of the East Midlands

HS2 station and going forward, they are looking at an audit of roads in

the area. I trust my honourable friend will make her voice heard on

this issue and that of her constituents as she has done in the

past Can I return the Prime Minister to the answer she gave to my friend

for Hull. Because the Conservative manifesto promised shorter NHS

waiting times for those who need help with their mental health. But

as prescriptions for antidepressants still rise, my constituents in

Wirral, who need talking therapies, have to wait a month for referral,

and well over four months for treatment. So was that Tory

manifesto just words, or will the Prime Minister ever deliver?

Hear, hear. I gave a serious answer to her

honourable friend, which is that we have been looking at the whole issue

of talking therapies and the availability of talking they are

pains the waiting times that relate to talking therapies. And we do want

to improve the options that people have for having access to talking

therapies, precisely because they have been shown to be so successful

in so many cases. So this is something that the Government is

working on. We will continue to work on it to provide, as we have said,

that parity of esteem between mental health and physical health in the

National Health Service. As a former Wimbledonian my right

honourable friend will understand the significant of transport for

south-west London and in particular for Wimbledon. Could my right

honourable friend assure me the Government still supports CrossRail

2 and will she ask the Secretary of State it set out the timetable for

the delayed consultation? Well, I can absolutely give the commitment

that we continue to support CrossRail 2. We are waiting to see a

probust business case and a proper funding proposal in relation to

CrossRail 2. My right honourable friend, the Transport Secretary will

he be setting out what the timetable in relation to this is, but I can

assure my honourable friend, as a former Wimbledon, we are well aware

of his interest in the Wimbledon to Waterloo aspect of this and the

needs of the local area are being taken into account.

THE SPEAKER: Yash minute Qureshi. Mr Speaker, in the Indian-occupied

Kashmir, over the last three months, 150 people have died, 600 blinded by

the deliberate use of pellet guns, over 16,000 injured, many critical,

you unexplained disappearances, food and medicine shortages. Would the

Prime Minister meet with me and cross-party colleagues to discuss

the human rights abuses and the issue of self-determination for

Kashmiri people, as set out in the resolution of the UN in 1958 and can

she raise this matter with the Indian Prime Minister? THE SPEAKER:

Extremely grateful to the honourable lady. The Prime Minister? Well the

honourable lady sets out her case and the issues she has identified in

relation to this. I take the same view this Government has, since it

came into power and indeed previously, which is that the issue

of Kashmir is a matter for India and Pakistan to deal with and sort out

but the Foreign Secretary has heard her representations and I'm sure

will be interested in taking those issues up with her.

Thank you, Mr Speaker. Several months ago, I raised the issue of

enhanced medical assistance for the Kurdish Peshmerga with the former

Prime Minister at his last PMGs and wrote it the new Prime Minister. But

now with a campaign to liberate Mosul ongoing, will my honourable

friend agree it meet with me and representatives of Kurdish regional

Government to discuss if we can provide specialist medical

facilities here in the UK, for instance, ten beds for seriously

wounded Peshmerga and ensure the forces on the ground are getting all

the support they need, I understand they are sort of heavy weapons and

basic infantry equipment like helmets anded abouty armour. My

honourable friend is right and I recognise this is an issue he has

raised before. I would first say, obviously, what we have seen is the

that the coalition activity that is taking place is actually having some

impact and is having an impact, as we wish it to, in relation to Daesh.

There aren't plans, at the moment, either to undertake, or do what we

he has suggested in hi question or to provide a field hospital, and

field medical capabilities from the United Kingdom but we do continually

review what we are doing in terms of support of the coalition and of

course we are also, as part of the training that we are providing for

the Peshmerga, that does include training and the provision of

medical facilities. Mr Speakerer I am esure we all recognise that the

removal of the camp attical clay is not a long of it term Will term

solution to the humanitarian crisis but account Prime Minister tell us

what the Government is going to do to learn from the experiences in

Calais and speed up acceptance of vulnerable individuals as committed

to under the Lord Dubb scheme? Individuals are already being

brought to the United Kingdom under the amendment, in addition to the

resettlement scheme for vulnerable Syrians we have, the 20,000 that

will be brought to the UK over the course of this Parliament. And in

addition to the 3,000 vulnerable people, children and others, who we

will be bringing from the Middle East and North Africa, working with

UNHCR and all of these to make sure that it is right for the individuals

to come here to the UK and they have the support when they get here but I

would remind the honourable gentleman that it is this country

who is the second biggest by lateral donor in relation to humanitarian

aid in the region and we are able to provide and support more people in

region and that's the right thing to do. Around Heathrow legal air

quality limb Ritz being breached. Over Twickenham, noise pollution has

increased, according to Heathrow data. Account Prime Minister explain

how a third runway can be delivered and comply with pollution legal

requirements? Does she agree, environmentally, Heathrow is not

good enough, and cannot possibly be both bigger and better? The

Government looked very closely at this issue of air quality and

environmental impact of all three schemes that were proposed by the

airports commission. We took extra time to look at those, that was the

decision to take increased airport capacity in the south-east. We

wanted to look more particularly at the air quality issues. The evidence

shows that air quality standards can be met, as required by all three of

the schemes, including the north-west runway at Heathrow. But

my honourable friend raises an issue that is actually about more than

airports, because the question of air quality is also about road

transport and that's why we are looking to do more in relation to

what we are doing for air quality. It is y for example, I'm pleased to

see we are such a leading edge in the provision of electric vehicles.

Mr Speaker, the Prime Minister's real plan for Brexit seems to be to

pick winners, to cut a special deal for the City of London, to get the

bankers avoid the dire consequences of leaving their economic unions.

Wales has an exporting economy with a ?5 billion trade surplus last year

and 200,000 jobs dependent on trade with the European Union. A soft

Brexit for her friends in the City, a hard Brexit for everyone else.

Will she cut a similar deal for Wales?

I will be cutting the best deal for the United Kingdom, all parts. THE

SPEAKER: George Freeman Referry year hunces of people are diagnosed or

die prematurely from rare diseases like cystic fibrosis or rare cancers

for which there is no treatment or drugs are prohibitively expensive.

This week there has been a very view to get quicker access to other med

sip, will the Prime Minister welcome that and encourage NICE and NHS

England to implement it speedily? I certainly join my honourable friend

in welcoming the publication of the review, this in terms of patients

being able it get quicker access to drugs and treatments. It is, I

think, the United Kingdom has established a leading role in

relation it the life sciences, I would pay tribute to my honourable

friend for the role he has played in developing life sciences here in the

UK. I know the Department of health will be looking closely at the

specific recommendations from that report but will be doing so in the

light of recognising that if we can take opportunities to, through the

National Health Service, to be encouraging the development of the

new drugs, for the benefits of patients we should do so.

Thank you, Mr Speaker, Mr Speaker, the Prime Minister just told us that

there are record lefls of spending go into our mental health services.

Her Health Secretary stood at that despatch box on 9th December and

told us the proportion of funding go noop mental health from every one of

our CCGs should be increasing Y is it, then that 57% of CCGs in our

country are reducing the proportion of spend in mental health? Yet

another broken promise. When will we have real equality for mental health

in our country? The fact that I set out that we are spending record

levels in the NHS on mental health is absolutely right but I have said

in response to a number of people who have questioned on this, that we

recognise that there is more for us to do in mental health. I would have

thought we should have cross-party support on doing just that.

Thank you, Mr speaker, outside Downing Street on the day she became

Prime Minister, my right honourable friend said - if you suffer from

mental health problems there is not enough help to hand. Can I welcome

my right honourable friend's commitment to mental health,

expressed on that day... Hear hear...

And in her responses today and can I ask her what steps she has taken to

make sure the Boldewijn ambitions of the Government's five-year plan for

mental health are reachieved? Well I'm pleased to say, that what we

see, far far from the impression given by some of the comments

opposite since 2009-15 around 750,000 more people are accesses

talking therapies and 1,400 more people are accessing mental health

services every day, compared to 2010. So that's up by 40%. But my

honourable friend, who I know has a particular interest in this issue,

and a particular expertise in this area, is right that we need to do

more and that's why we are continuing to invest in mental

health services and continuing to increase the standards we provide.

Final poly, Mr Greg Mulholland. Just 20 children are diagnosed with

uninoperable brain tumours as a result of a disease every year, and

NHS England turned that down for funding, despite being affordable.

Will she meet with me and the families affected by this particular

issue, to discuss how the families can get the treatment these children

need? I'm happy to look at the issue the honourable gentleman has raised

and look in detail about what can be done to take that forward.

Prime Minister's Questions has come to an end. A bit earlier than last

week. Mr Corbyn devoted his first questions about Brexit, asking the

Prime Minister to clarify and clear up the uncertainty. We did not get

very far on other people asking questions. The Prime Minister said

something significant and we will come back to that in a moment. We

moved on after bringing Baldrick into the questions. We moved on to

Saudi Arabia and the Yemen with the human rights commission. Many people

wondered why they were on the human rights commission. Mr Corbyn moved

on to Yemen and again we did not really get very clear questions from

the Prime Minister. Angus Robertson, the leader of the Scottish

Nationalists in the House of Commons asked about Aleppo. He brought up

the issue of the Spanish refuelling this Russian task force that sailed

through the English Channel and is now in the Mediterranean. Whether we

should press the Spanish not to do it. Again the Prime Minister did not

really answer the question. We see on the BBC website that the Spanish

government is reconsidering it. Probably too late for this convoy.

They are being refuelled on the northern coast of Africa and juts

into Morocco. It is really Spain's Gibraltar was that they own this

sliver of land in the Moroccan area. That is where the refuelling has

been done. The biggest story of the week has been Heathrow. Not a single

mention, which frankly baffles me, on the Prime Minister Pozner speech

during the referendum to Goldman Sachs and no mention either I don't

think of the upcoming by-election Mr Goldsmith has triggered. You could

not say PMQ has its fingers on the national news pulse. Viewers

followed the line of the debate at the dispatch box. Brexit is an

unfortunate chain of questions. The primers to have often said she will

give a running commentary. -- the Prime Minister. The we ever know the

long-term economic and trade plan for Brexit? I agree with Baldrick,

the Government shows no signs of having a plan.

While right to raise issues around the bombing in Yemen, interesting Mr

Corbyn makes no reference to the evil being delivered on the people

of Aleppo Cracknell offer any useful advice on the matter. This from

Peter. Disgraceful that the Prime Minister could not answer the

question about the refuelling of Russian warships by Spanish

authorities. They are on their way to bomb the last remaining citizens

of Aleppo. The Prime Minister is not putting any pressure on Spain to

stop this action. They say they are reviewing it. They are under some

pressure from Nato but probably too late for the refuelling of that

particular Russian flotilla. Let's hope if they did refuel it hit would

be cleaner fuel than what it was using going through the English

Channel. New pictures are coming in from the

Calais so-called Jungle camp. It is quite dramatic, the pictures. The

fires have now taken. Some report suggest it was a group of anarchists

that set the fire is going. We have no evidence it was the refugees or

asylum seekers. What has happened but as you can see, it actually

looks like a scene from the Middle East with burning oil wells. These

are the camp is going up in flames. It seems there was a lot of gas

canister cooking facilities around. The refugees had to cook for

themselves and make their own meals. The fire has hit that, causing a

number of explosions. Some reports are saying the fires are now out of

control. Dramatic pictures from the Calais camp. Laura, what did we

learn during Prime Minister's Questions? Not very much. Jeremy

Corbyn is better in PMQs when he was back he is not laser-like in his

focus will start he does not or is picked on the hottest political

issues of the day. We are starting to learn that Theresa May is a class

act and not answering the question. Some people might have noticed there

was a small story about an academic at York who has studied this.

Studied how good politicians are at trying to dodge questions

effectively. Theresa May scores incredibly highly, elegantly and

evasively, saying nothing whatsoever. It was not a good

session. Some people are reading it, I do not know the fact words. People

are doing detailed textual analysis of what she says. There was an

implication she had not ruled out not staying in the single market. I

did not quite get that. People pounce on every nuance, misspoken

word, at the moment. That is because we have so little information. The

same happened at her press conference at the end of the

Brussels summit last week. Had she tweaked the formulation that she

wants to operate in the single market? That phrase was first used

at the party conference. Essentially, when you talk to people

about this privately, you talk to ministers who are involved, people

in Number 10. They insist that nothing is ruled in or ruled out. If

you look at what Theresa May has said in public, particularly the

suggestion that she is firm and we will leave the restriction of the

European Court of human justice, the application is it would be

impossible for us to stay in the single market. The vote leaves

campaign, whatever people campaigning against the hard Brexit

now say, they were explicit in the campaign that it would mean leaving

the single market. However, behind-the-scenes, again and again,

I have been told nothing is ruled in and nothing has been ruled out. The

most interesting reason is Cabinet ministers cannot yet agree what it

should look like. As you and I discussed before, because the cast

of characters around a table in Europe will change the match before

our negotiations get anywhere with the French and German elections in

other countries, there is a limit to how much point there is with the UK

Government is putting forward what they want to do before they know

what they might get. Briefly, there is an interesting echo. This time

last year the same thing was happening with David Cameron's

renegotiation of the European Union. People were saying, Britain has to

tell us what we want. There came no answer and the pressure built and we

ended up with a letter to Donald Tusk and everything else. There is

not a totally blank page. I once had a tutor University who did thesis on

why some Soviet candidates got 99.98% of the vote instead of 99

point 97 of the vote. That is the kind of thing that is going on at

the moment. Why would you not, even just for fun, mention the Prime

Minister's speech to Goldman Sachs? No great surprise that someone who

was a remainer gave that style of speech but as a supporter of

ordinary working class people, what was she doing speaking to Goldman

Sachs? I think because he may not pick up what the Westminster world

regards as the hottest topics of the day but he is picking up the biggest

topics beyond Westminster. He was right to talk about Brexit and the

card questions. It is exposing the Prime Minister for having no answer

on the customs union nor the Northern Ireland potential border,

nor access to the single market. I think he came out 1-0 ahead. Is

Labour in favour of staying in the customs union? Yes. If you want the

full access to the single market, the customs union is intrinsically

linked with that. As an ex-customs minister, I know what it is like

when you have to face customs borders. I understand that. It makes

business and trade more difficult. It is a prize we need to go for. By

definition, Britain out of the EU, on your formulation about would not

be able to do its own free trade deals? My formulation, one of the

aims I would go into these negotiations with. One of the ways

of getting around this constant textual analysis of what the Prime

Minister has said is for the Government. It is in the Court of

the Government to negotiate the best deal for Britain, to spell out its

negotiating aims. If I were doing that, one of my aims would be

remaining in the customs union. That means he would not be able to do our

own free trade deals. This is... That is the situation. The clue is

in the words, customs union. They do their own customs. If you're in

that, you cannot do your own free trade deal. I believe we are moving

in... The Brexit arrangements and Brexit negotiations herald a new era

in international trade arrangements. That is a different matter. It may

be the case now but not necessarily the case as we come to try to do our

own deals. We can do our own deals if we stay in the customs union. I

would doubt as I think we will see in two years' time, some of the

arrangements, some of the terms of trade deals with other countries,

trading. -- changing. I do not see that as a show stopper. That

situation is clear as night follows day at the moment. That is not even

a matter of argument, that you cannot do your own free trade deals

if you're in the customs union. That is why the leaders said they wanted

to leave the customs union. Let me move on for that this is a

government policy we should leave the customs union. The Prime

Minister said, there is no point analysing different words. She would

not give a running commentary. I am not asking for a running commentary,

actually a rather basic question. Since Liam Fox is running around

asking about all the great trade deals he will do with Australia,

Canada, even the United States, New Zealand. It therefore must be

governed policy that you are leaving the customs union. Theresa May has

been very clear. We have not taken decisions on what is our negotiating

brief yet. At the time we do, that will all be set out. No, no forced

on you answer these questions. These are important issues for people who

depend on export trade and imports. Neither of you can give any answers.

You can send a mounting frustration. They can sense mine. If we stay in

the customs union, we cannot do our own free trade deals. The European

Union will do them on our behalf. One thing that Theresa May has

said... You tell me! The arrangement we may be able to negotiate may not

conform to a stock arrangement that is currently bears. One of the

reasons she said she will not give a running commentary... Even a walking

commentary would be fine. A stumbling commentary I would settle

for. If we stay in the customs union, Brussels does our own free

trade deals. We cannot do a free trade deal with America if the

customs union is already negotiating a free trade deal. What it don't I

understand? What the Prime Minister has said, and I will repeat. The

Prime Minister has been clear about this. We're not going to specify

what our negotiating mandate is until we have decided in every

respect and it will be set out. Thanks for coming here. I think I

gave a running commentary. You could be in trouble. I am not going to

give a running commentary on the next item.

Now if you ever feel let down by our real leaders at PMQs,

perhaps instead you find yourself turning to the simpler world

But which political characters in literature and television

Well, in answer to this, surely one of the great unanswered

questions of our time, one academic has conducted a survey.

Of the 49 MPs who responded, the rest of them were perhaps too

The clear winner picked by 22% of those MPs is Jed Bartlett,

the US President in Aaron Sorkins' long-running and rather soppy TV

Perhaps unsurprisingly as President Bartlett is a Democrat,

he was the overwhelming favourite of Labour MPs.

In second place, with 18%, the authors have combined the votes

for Francis Urquhart and Francis Underwood.

Both are the scheming anti-hero of House of Cards,

first as a British book and TV series and later a huge

And coming in tied for third with 6% - which is a whopping

couple of mentions each - is everyone's dream ticket

of Yes Minister's Jim Hacker and Borgen's Birgitte Nyborg.

Well, to discuss this, we're joined by Professor Steven Fielding

He's written a book looking at the changing way politicians have

been reflected in fiction since the Victorian period.

Welcome to the programme. Were you surprised that Jed Bartlett came top

of the survey? No, not really. He obviously... We asked MPs to say why

they chose him. He expresses their ideal. He combines idealism with

pragmatism. He is witty, he is learning. As one MP ended, if only

they could all be like that, or their own leaders could be like

that. That was the thing. What is interesting, only Labour MPs picked

Jed Bartlett. Only Labour MPs! Right. Oh, right. Not a hero for the

Conservatives. One Conservative did pick a West Wing character but not

Jed Bartlett. It was called the left wing by critics. Nevertheless I was

surprised not a single Conservative MP did it. Maybe we need to know if

more Conservative MPs contributed to the survey. What made me laugh was

Alan starred was picked by one Tory MP and Mayor Jo Quimby from the

Simpsons was picked. Thank you very much.

There's just time to put you out of your misery and give

Press the red buzzer and we will find out the winner. It is Baldrick!

Jo Fisher in Birkenhead. The one o'clock news is starting

over on BBC One now. I'll be back here at noon tomorrow

with all the big political stories They have something on me

that I can actually remember. The final chapter between

Gibson and Spector.