10/03/2014 Newsnight

With a victim of domestic violence, what are the chances of your

attacker ending up in court. The truth is, it depends where you live.

When I didn't do anything about it, it gave him a green light to come

back the following weekend and the next weekend. The crime prevention

minister faces the shadow Home Secretary? In an age when they say

we are all under surveillance, how can an enormous airliner with 200

people on board simply vanish. The ex-wife of the king of Saudi Arabia,

tells us her daughters are being kept prisoner in the gulf.

To be attacked is one thing, to be attacked within your home is

another. To be attacked, often repeatedly in your own home, by

someone with whom you have been in an intimate relationship is a

special class of crime. The police forces of England and Wales say they

have been making a conscientious effort to improve wait they deal

with these cases, yet some seem to be trying harder than others. It

wasn't home to me. It wasn't a home, to me it was a prison. It was a

place I was being kept, I was being assaulted. Home should be where the

heart is, not the hurt. But for too many women and some men violence

behind closed doors is the norm. Claire Baker was terroristised by

her partner, then she says the police let her down. I locked myself

in the bathroom and called the police and waited for them to turn

up. I was staying in the bathroom and screaming, just come, just

somebody help me. Because he was so bad to me I always had it in my mind

that he was going to go too far and he perhaps was going to kill me. How

did the police help you or not? It was just luck of the draw on the

day. If an officer turned up who knew anything about domestic

violence they were really good to me. Some of the officers were

absolutely brilliant to me. And then other officers they just treated it

really as it was nothing. In Warwickshire, nearby where eventual

conviction rights for domestic violence are high. Only a fraction

of reported incidents get to court in the first place. There are

significant differences, the darker colours where fewer cases are

referred to prosecutors. This is about so much more than

numbers. This is about what happens to women who are brave enough to

come forward when they have been hurt. And what happens next is all

too often dictated by where they live This isn't to do with the

profile of the case but the issue in that local area. Whether the Chief

Constable says it is important, whether all of the Sergeants that

they are responsible for. Whether it is the constables feeling it is

their responsibility to deliver access to justice to women. They

make a difference. How do police forces like Warwickshire, who refer

such a small portion of cases to prosecutors explain themselves. We

have strongly encouraged senior detectives, professional experienced

people, to really look at each individual case, work with the

officer investigating that case. As I said, arrive at the right outcome

for the victim. Doesn't that mean though that crimes are going

unpunished? Not at all. The thing is that a court appearance for a victim

is a painful and traumatic experience. We need to have a

realistic prospect that if we go to court that we are going to have that

criminal justice outcome and the perpetrator does receive justice.

What though can justify you referring 3% of domestic violence

cases and a force like Cheshire referring more than 30%? If a case

is right to take to court, and the CPS support that, we will do that. I

don't want give any impression that we are going soft on people who

commit such horrendous crimes. One insider told me resources at the CPS

are part of the problem. Every agency is suffering, they said, and

cuts mean they have to go after cases where there is a higher chance

of conviction, inevitably that means others get left by the way side. The

Association of Chief Police Officers admits there are variations. They

told us we have substantially improved with investment in

specialist officers... Claire has rebuilt her life now,

with the help of the local Women's Aid. Her ex-partner was eventually

convicted. Me believes she suffered longer than she had to. I felt like

he had come back time after time because when they didn't do anything

about it, it gave him a green light to come back the following weekend,

and the next weekend. With an uneven patchwork of police approaches

around the country, she may not be the only one. We speak to Norman

Baker the Home Office Minister shortly first I'm joined by Yvette

Cooper, the shadow Home Secretary. These figures are based on a lot of

work by the Labour Party. What do you conclude is the reason the

picture is so patchy. I think there is two problems, first is the wide

variation between forces, the second is that the picture has been getting

worse across the country. So you have got a drop in the level of

convictions and the level of referrals, in six out of seven

forces, as well as this wide variation. And I think there is just

not national standards in place for dealing with such a serious crime

and there needs to be. Were there national standards in place when you

were in office? I think we had done a lot of work to make improvements,

for example around introducing specialist domestic violence courts.

I don't think there were national standards in place, that is why this

is the next step we need to have those national standards in place.

We have been calling for them for several years now. As you know it

was almost impossible to get this sort of information when you were in

office, wasn't it? No, that's not true actually. If you look at

particularly the issues around referrals and convictions, those

were increasing as a result of a lot of hard work that was done between

the police, the CPS, and leadership by a Labour Government introducing

specialist prosecutors, introducing specialist teams and stronger

training. The big problem is it has gone backwards. The problems when

you were in office were more difficult? We have done it with

Freedom of Information requests, and identified this information exactly

because we think there is a serious problem. And the Government is not

doing enough. If you had this level of violence at football matches, and

there would be national outcry, there isn't because it takes place

behind the net curtains. This Government brought in publication of

the rape statistics wasn't it? No, in fact they haven't. The Government

hasn't produced a lot of this information. So look it is important

to have it, and we think you ought to provide more of this information

on a consistent basis because that would help improve standards across

the country. There is a real problem here, as your report said, that

people don't feel they are getting the support they need. Victims are

not getting the support they need in such a horrible crime and it is

getting worse. Since the election you have had an 11 pest increase %

increase in domestic violence cases being reported, and an 11% drop in

the number of convictions for domestic violence. You have

perpetrators of abuse getting away with it. Is it better that police

officers exercise their judgment? Of course police officers have to

exercise judgment every day of the week. But at the moment you are

seeing such wide variations, I think we need national standards in place

about support for victims, about the way in which the police need to

respond, and the Government so far refused to do that. We also think we

should have a national commissioner in place to deal with domestic and

sexual violence because there are similar problems around rape cases.

And you can give a guarantee, can you, that under a Labour Government

there would be no more of the pattern of the closure of Rape

Crisis centres that we saw when Labour was last in power? If you

think about all of the work that the Labour Government did. On both rape

and domestic violence, we had for example a 45% increase in rape

convictions, there was a lot of work that was very good, was it enough?

No of course it wasn't. Because you had serious crimes like this. And

Rape Crisis Centres closed on your woke didn't they? There was a lot of

support for victims, the independent advisers on domestic violence and

rape as well. You want to do more, and in fact the clock has been

turning back instead of going further. You can give that

guarantee? You know I'm not going to set out funding for things in the

next parliament at this stage. At this stage. It is a test of your

commitment? We have said our commitment is to have national

standards for domestic violence, sexual violence, dealing with rape

cases and a national commissioner in place who could make sure that those

standards are enforced. Because I do think that you need national

leadership on this. And Teresa May hasn't done anything to spot this

deterioration in action against such serious crimes, particularly against

women. Although domestic violence includes women as well. Thank you

very much. Now Norman Baker who is the crime prevention minister is

with us. What is your explanation for the fact that picture are so

patchy? They are, and that is one of the reasons why the Home Secretary

and I have asked the Inspector of Constabulary to look at all 43

forces in England and Wales to examine why it is patchy and why the

domestic violence rates are different. That work is on going, it

is completely produced soon with a proper comment from HMRC. You were

unaware of it before today? Of course not. That is why the Home

Secretary and I commissioned the work. We recognised there was an

issue of disparity across the country. There are a number of

possible explanations, it is possible different forces are

looking at it in different ways, and crimes are being recorded under a

different heading, violence and not domestic violence. HMRC is looking

into that and referral process. When did you commission the research?

Last year. How many years did it take to realise there was a patchy

picture? That is not fair, there is a huge amount of work going on in

the Home Office since 2010. The Home Secretary has been very good on

these issues, I have to say. We have seen the roll out of Claire's Law,

the disclosure orders to protect women from potentially violent

partners and the protection orders to allow the sort of person in your

film to be able to stay in your house and the perpetrator be removed

from it rather than her leaving it. There is an action plan we published

an updated version on Saturdayed, for International Women's Day. Why

does it take the Labour Party or the House of Commons library to go

through a Freedom of Information exercise to find out much of the

information? It doesn't. It has done? No, it will be published hash

on this -- later on this month with a commentary per force, so people

can look at individual forces and see what they are doing, rather than

taking figures, I'm not blaming Yvette and her team. That is patchy,

we want a full proper analysis, and that will be coming forward. What do

you make then of the argument that police forces and the Crown

Prosecution Service are under pressure that wasn't previously

there before you took office? They are under pressure from ministers to

deal with domestic violence properly, they are under pressure

from us to deal with rape properly. That is a pressure I accept. It has

nothing to do with resources? If you are asking about resources, crime

has gone down 10% under this Government. We have seen violent

crime go down as well. That is measured not simply by police

recorded crime but also the official independent crime survey of England

and Wales. And the police have fewer crimes to deal with. There is the

digitalisation of the police force, so less paperwork to do. I don't

think resources is the issue here. The issue is perhaps a culture thing

in each force, which HMRC will get to the bottom of. You are in favour

of policemen exercising judgment aren't you? Of course. When they

exercise judgment you are going to get discrepancies? You will get

differences. But if the difference is significant it is perfectly

proper and right for the Government to ask the proper body n this case

the Inspector of Constabulary to look at the differences and find out

the reason. And whether or not some women and indeed men for that matter

are not being given the support they have been given by the system. The

rescuers searching for the traces of the malaisian airliner which

disappeared are still criss-crossing the sea south of Vietnam, it is now

three days since the aircraft disappeared. Three days since 239

hum beings vanished. In an age we are all subject to surveillance and

personal phones emit GPS signals, how can such a thing happen. It is

not unprecedented but it is highly unusual.

The hours pass and still no sign of Malaysian Airlines flight. Hours of

anger and uncertainty for families with nowhere to go. Couped up in a

Beijing hotel until they and we know what happened to the 239 passengers

and crew. At the moment there are just questions. In many cases what

sounds like heart-breakingly defiant optimisim. TRANSLATION: Our hearts

are hanging in the air. We hope our Government can put some pressure on

them to increase their efforts to save them. Meanwhile the Chinese

Government is sending out increasingly impatient criticism of

the search effort by both Malaysia and Vietnam. How is it possible that

we don't know what happened to this plane? If it exploded in midair US

spy satellites, that notice the smallest flare of a missile launch,

would have expected to see a flash. Sources have confirmed they have

gone back over the images and found nothing. If the aircraft came down

in one piece it should have been visible to radar, and the crew,

should, in theory would have had time to issue a distress call. To

add to the riddle the plane was fitted with the next generation of

satellite tracking systems. Called ADSB, the plane gets its position

from a GPs a GPS satellite, it broadcasts this speed and altitude

and other data to anyone with the right receiver. In time air traffic

control authorities will move from ground-based radar systems to ADSB.

At the moment it is used by flight tracking websites who admit they

don't have enough ground stations in the area to give a complete picture.

We have one receiver close to Malaysia, and we have one receiver

in hoe cheat Ho Chi Min, and in the best conditions we would like to

have a receiver every 50-100kms to get really good coverage. What of

the flight data recorders? If the plane crashed into the sea the boxes

should be sending out sonar pings to guide recovery. But the right

receiver are needed to hear them. It may take days to get vessels on to

the research grid. In the case of the Air France flight that crashed

in the Atlantic on route from Rio to Paris in 2009, the recorders weren't

found for nearly two years, and then only found using mathematical

modelling. We used something bald basing search theory, it was

developed during World War II to search for German submarines. This

pulls together information, each piece of information has

uncertainties and some conflicts in it. And there is a mathematical

theory for a way to account for the uncertainties properly, combine all

this information to get the best estimate for the location of the

wreck. Meanwhile there are just uncertainties, families with nothing

to do but hope and pray. With us now is Professor Grahamrate Braithwaite

from Cranfield University. It is not normal? It is incredibly unusual,

there have been aircraft that have been difficult to find. It will be

found eventually? That is essential. An aircraft like the 777 is used

across the world, a very popular aircraft type and there is no way we

would accept not finding this aircraft. Even if it takes years it

will be done. Could it take years? It is conceivable it could take that

time to recover wreckage, we saw that in the Air France 447 accident

a few years ago. It is unlikely. If it is sound something will be found

relatively quickly. Have you got a theory about how it could suddenly

disappear? There is a few explanations for it. But in my

discipline of accident investigation you have to be very careful about

coming up with theories so early on, because that easily turns into

speculation. So it is essential to keep an open find about what may

have happened here. Clearly it lost contact and clearly it did so in a

way that didn't give many clues as it lost contact. It tells you

something about there are lots of possibilities at this stage. I was

under the impression that modern planes constantly emitted a signal,

is that correct? There is a lot of data leaving an aircraft. Not all of

it is there leaving it the whole time to tell you where it is.

Particularly if you are flying over an ocean where there are not the

ground stations to receive that data. If you multiply that by how

many aircraft flying at any one time, that is a huge amount of data.

It is not transmitting location all of the time. Can pilots switch it

off? It is possible to disable some of that information on t aircraft.

Whether you would lose everything that might come down to some very

bad luck or a more determined action. So for example one of the

things if the aircraft had crashed that they might look for is a

locator beacon that should be activated by the crash or entry to

water. That beacon can be damaged by an accident. It could be unlucky

there and lose the signal before it can be picked up. People always talk

in these circumstances about the black box flight recorder as being

the thing that would explain to you, although after the event. We saw in

the piece there that it took a couple of years or something before

they found those off, they are not plaque of course, -- black or

anything, off the France flight? I would anticipate they would be

found. They emit a signal that should last for 30 days, maybe as

long as 90 days. You have to get close to it to pick it up, depending

on the depth, defending on the temperature of the ocean, it might

be an area close to five miles. You need to know where to look before

picking the beacon up. What happens then? Depending on the depth of the

water they are likely to send down a remote low-operated vehicle which

can recover the recorder and pull it out of the wreckage of the aircraft

if it is not separated. Assuming the recorders are working and assuming

nobody tried to disable them, that should tell you about what happened

on the flight. It isn't the panaseer, it doesn't all tell you

the answer. Have you come across cases where they weren't working or

had been disabled? There were cases where some of the perameters weren't

working. Modern flight data recorders could record hundreds if

not thousands of perameters, it is possible some perameters aren't

working. Usually there is enough of a picture to tell you the answer.

There was a previous case involving Silk Air a few years ago, where the

circuit breaker was pulled in flight to disable the flight data recorder

before the aircraft crashed. That told us what was going Onyango the

aircraft. This is kind of modern nightmare, isn't it, that you get on

a plane and you may never be seen again and nobody knows what happened

to you, it is extremely rare isn't it? It is, after the Air France

accident there was an analysis of how likely an event, where the

aircraft that was difficult to find would be, and the demand -- estimate

of that was ten years, and we have another one in two or three years.

Perhaps there won't be another for 15 years? Let's hope that is the

case. It is hardly news to say that Saudi Arabia is one of the most

male-dominated societies in the world. Women aren't even supposed to

drive cars there. King Abdullah has promised women will be allowed a

vote of sorts next year. But his former wife has now claimed that her

daughters are being kept under a form of house arrest there. She told

the Sunday Times that her daughters are under constant surveillance and

appeal for their release. She has agreed to speak us to about the

allegations earlier this evening, but she didn't want her identity to

be revealed. What do you know about the conditions your daughters are

kept in? Very bad conditions, two of them I don't know if you read about

that, they are in a terrible state of health. Hala is completely

destroyed, anorexic, she needs help, she lives alone and in that villa.

The last time she called me a few weeks ago she told me, mummy, I

don't have anyone, I'm hungry. No-one is preparing. She said no,

no, I have food but I don't want to eat. It is like ready food, junk

food or whatever it is. I don't know really what it is. But I know the

situation for a woman nobody is helping, if they don't buy you food,

bring you food, you can never eat even that. They are not able to go

out shopping? I know very well about two of them can go shopping. They

can go shopping, but they are not really imprisoned are they? It

depends how you look at it. If you only allowed this and then going out

so that they will make your trip unbearable so that's it. Basically

even a doctor they cannot have the choice to go to. They can't travel,

they can't move, if they decide that they will do a trip, they can't do

it. Those people who follow them they are not for the safety. And

they are just to make the situation terrible for them. Do you know why

they are being treated like this? Yeah, yeah. As I have told you, you

are owned. For me I was divorced and I didn't go back. Plus he didn't

find, I was always obeying his orders. Don't trouble, I was

divorced. But he still insisted that if he doesn't want me to travel, he

says no, and that means no. Basically I... Have they tried to

leave the country? No, how? I suppose they would ask for

passports? They asked many times to come and see me, they were refused.

The King told them either you marry or die? His other daughters are free

to go wherever they want without escorts I know this, I used to come

here, travel, go anywhere without anyone. Is it true they are actually

imprisoned or held in a palace? Yes. I call it this, when you are locked,

your gate is locked from the outside, that means you are

imprisoned. You will understand it doesn't sound very grim this prison?

It doesn't. For a woman to be not allowed to live normally day and

night, watched, I don't know, what do you mean by that, you can't

travel, you can't go to see your mother. You make it sound as if they

are being held hostage They are. If you return they will be freed? If

that is true I will go now. If you can go with me I will go to it and

get them. What is the physical condition of your daughters? You

mean health wise? Very bad, one is anorexic, complaining from many,

many things. I would like not to air what I know of her situation.

Because I don't want to harm my own daughter. But she is in a bad

health. And the other one is in bad health. The third, the second. And

their mental condition? This is what psychologically they are not well.

They are left out any treament He's the king, he has all the money to

get the best doctors for those two girls. I don't know. We contacted

the Saudi embassy about the allegations you just heard and we

are extending an invitation for someone to appear on the programme

or supply a statement. We were told the embassy doesn't comment on

private matters and this is a private matter. There will be yet

another meeting tomorrow as much of the western world bonders what it

can do about the growing tensions between Russia and Ukraine. There is

to be a referendum this weekend to determine whether the crime ma

Crimea should stay in the Ukraine for go back to Russia. And David

Cameron called it farcical. The Polish Foreign Minister was in the

UK to meet William Hague to discuss their response to rising tensions

today. Afterwards I asked him why Europe refuses to recognise the

referendum? It is under gun point with the presence of foreign troops

on Crimea's soil and without the regular electoral rolls, and without

the supervision of international bodies. And in violation of

Ukraine's constitution. But the definition of nationality is surely

the wishes of the people, isn't it? Yes, but we all have constitutions.

You are going to have a referendum in Scotland, but it is done by

consensus, not by breaking existing law. Wouldn't you allow the

possibility that there comes a point when national borders become

incoherent? Well, that is exactly the principle at stake. I think

after World War ll and the Cold War we have agreed in the international

community that when there are ethnic disputes across national boundaries,

we try to overcome the boundaries and fulfil the rights of citizens

without changing boundaries by force. Which is how the Second World

War started. You have done it in Ulster, it has been done all over

Europe, and it can be done, provided you use institutions that we have

created for those purposes. But it is -- but its international position

has changed since the Second World War, but there is no reason it

should change again? Ukraine has voluntarily given up nuclear

weapons, and received guaranteed from the United States, UK and

Russia of her independence. T viability of her borders and

freedoms from pressures, for example trade boycotts. Think of what signal

would be sent to places like North Korea and Iran of the value of our

guarantees in return for dropping nuclear ambitions if we don't

protect the territorial integrity of Ukraine. If the majority of people

in Crimea say they wish to be part of Russia, who are we to deny that?

If the majority of Crimea have an issue with the Ukrainian Government

there are ways by the Ukrainian constitutions to do that. If they

wanted more autonomy in Ukraine, I think that is something that the

Ukrainian Government would consider. We are not talking about autonomy

within Ukraine, we are talking about the wish to belong to another

country? Well Britain has had those dilemmas before. And you have to be

very careful how to handle it. If the majority of people in the

Falkland Islands, for example, expressed a wish to become begin

Argentinian, we should respect that? The Argentinians invaded and you

sent a task force to take the islands back. Pause there are ways

-- because there are ways of doing it by law and there are completely

unacceptable ways. Because the majority of the people in the

Falkland Islands resisted the invasion? We have no idea what the

majority of the people of Crimea want, they have not been asked and

it is unlikely they will be democratically asked. There is

clearly a demand among some people in Crimea not to be part of Ukraine?

There may be some, but there are ways that you can express that

constitutionally. What better way of judging that than by holding a

referendum? It can be done provided it is legal. Not at the point of a

foreign gun. Supposing this referendum goes ahead, and it gives,

you say it would be unfairly conducted and it gives a result you

don't like. What then? Well, I think Russia will, the European Council

has decided that there will be consequences, and we are all very

reluctant about it. Because we all have commercial relationships with

Russia, but the principle of not changing borders by force is an

important one. And the European Council has decided that just like

the United States Europe will impose a visa ban and asset freezes. Will

they go any further than that? I think if Russia invaded mainland

Ukraine they would go further. You would accept the invasion of Crimea?

No the whole conversation is you trying to accept the invasion of

Crimea. I don't understand why it is any business of our's in this

country? Because you had leaders who said that these are far way

countries of which we know little and we know how it ended. Thank you

very much. Paul Brinkley served as the United States deputy under

secretary of defence under both the Bush and Obama administrations and

is here now. During the time when you were at the Department of

Defence, did you ever envisage this sort of situation? In a way you know

one of the things we are not talking very much about is what motivates

perhaps people in Crimea to seek an alternative governing structure.

What motivates people in the Ukraine who recently underwent these events

in Kiev to seek an alternati governing structure. What I was

personally involved with during those two administrations had to do

with the economic underpinnings that lead to conditions that because

these rifts to form in the first place. It is interesting if you look

at Ukraine's economy, since the fall of the Iron Curtain, it has lagged

every other post-Soviet era economy. 06% of the G -- 60% of the

neighbouring countries per capita compared to other countries. And if

you look at Crimea in the Ukraine you have the same statistical

phenomenon. The average cry mean has relative income, 60% of the citizens

of the Ukraine. It is interesting to me how the economic disparity in an

age of information, when people see neighbouring countries and

prosperity emerging in neighbouring countries, it creates a level of

frustration that leads n my opinion, to these rifts. The rifts can be

sectarian, as we see in the Middle East and central Asia, they can be

ethnic, as we are seeing emerge in a place like Ukraine. At the root of

them is an absence of economic development, and an access to

opportunity, that a population feel seems fair relative to what its

neighbours, or its international partners are experiencing. When you

look at how the west is struggling to make sense of this and to

determine how to respond and you look at the way in which President

Obama was wrong-footed over Syria, then sites he has had here about

what to d about Ukraine, what do you conclude about American power? I

don't know that you conclude anything about American power, but I

do think we are going through a period that I think will get more

intense in the next few years. We spent a trillion dollars on the

effort in Iraq, and the blood of thousands of our young men and

women, and thousands and hundreds of British young men and women. A $700

billion exercise in Afghanistan, not ending as well as we thought it

would be. For us to be intropective on how we engage in foreign policy

conflicts perhaps is not to be unexpected of our country. I think

it is rational. And I think you also have to look at how we positioned

ourselves as "the west", not just the United States but Europeans. In

terms of strategic levers the Russians have significant strategic

levers that are at play here. Whether they are energy plies

supplies to Europe, and -- energy supplies to Europe and financial

integration that has taken place and risks to both western and Russian

economy that make it much, much more complex to react in the way we might

have in years past. You raise Iraq and Afghanistan, what went wrong

there? I think for us in Afghanistan, and we are seeing this

play out. We have lost sight of something very important in the

west. We believed that if we created democratic institutions that all

good things would follow. I find this a loss of understanding of our

own history in the rest. Democratic institutions were built on economic

foundations, they created middle-class prosperity and gave

citizenry a stake in those institutions. Afghan GDP today is

minimal. The institutions we have worked so hard to establish are

almost completely dependant on foreign aid today. I'm very

concerned that as we draw down our presence in Afghanistan, and the

international community disengaged, we have created a house of cards in

Afghanistan because we have lost sight of the economic foundations

that are so important. If we believe democratic institutions are

desirable, we need to be equally as passionate about creating economic

opportunity and a basis for the institutions to rest upon. I wonder

what conclusion you draw about the par be a spring and American support

for that? I think there is significant American support, but it

is also struggling for all the reasons we have said, if you look at

Egypt today. The number one problem is economic. You hear it across the

piece. It is 80 million people, half very young, frustrated, no

opportunity. What do you have that when you have that mix? You have

unrest, you have civil discord, and democratic institutions are not

sustainable in those circumstances. Those are complicated problems to

solve and we struggle to solve them because they are not easy and they

are country-specific. Every country has a set of human assets and

natural resources that have to be assessed. To approach the problem as

we have from the last deck taped, strictly militarily and in terms of

the US engagments in the region, the jury is in. We can look at the

results and see that adjustment to our foreign policy is overdue.

Litarily and in terms of the US engagments in the region, the jury

is in. We can look at the results and see that adjustment to our

foreign policy is overdue. Do you think the foreign policy you were

involved in was wrong? The roles replayed, businessmen who worked in

Iraq, Pakistan, to begin to create economic opportunity. That was a

very difficult slog, because within my Government institutionally those

economic development activities are viewed as emerging from structural

implementation of rule of law, democratic institutions. I think

that's upside down. And I think we have learned painful lessons from

this. Thank you. It is a serious and embarrassing condition which could

affect any woman who gives birth. You may not have heard of it,

because in a healthy country like our's, it can be avoided or treated

quickly and effectively. Yet in the developing world an estimated two

million people suffer from T it is called obstetric fistula, it leaves

women constantly leaking urine or worse. The BBC's global health

correspondent has been to central Uganda. You won't be surprised to

learn that her report contains graphic images and details.

Crowds are gathering to see local celebrities coming to town. These

radio DJs broadcasting throughout the region are just the warm-up act

though. The headliners are missionaries from the hospital, here

to talk about a condition called obstetric fistula, it is where often

younger, smaller mothers develop a hole in their bladder caused by

their baby getting stuck in the birth canal during delivery. The

woman is left leaking urine constantly. If they gave birth in a

hospital rather than at home these problems could be avoided. Most

women can't afford to. This community is being told there is a

solution for a lucky few who have the condition. For the next two

weeks doctors from the UK are offering free fistula repair

surgery. Selina and her mum heard the radio show and have arrived at

the hospital. She's 17 and in constant discomfort, her underwear

stuffed with rags to avoid urine dripping down her legs. Whenever she

leaves the house she takes plastic sheets with her. Her story is a

particular one. She fell pregnant last year. TRANSLATION: I was at

school when I met my boyfriend. He would come and buy me chicken and

chips, I didn't know he wanted to get me pregnant. I loved him. She

was in labour at home for three days before going to hospital, Sheehy

vently delivered a baby girl, who died soon afterwards. TRANSLATION: I

didn't even get to hold my baby or Herrera before she died. When I see

other women carrying their babies I feel so sad. Her boyfriend left her

after the birth, leaving her facing a bleak futureeir babies I feel so

sad. Her boyfriend left her after the birth, leaving her facing a

bleak future. Before her operation she wanted to show me where she

lives. We made the 60km journey. When she arrived there was an

unwelcome surprise. She thinks she has seen the man who got her

pregnant. She's not sure if she wants to speak to him. I think she's

feeling a bit shy. She's not sure what his reaction to her will be.

Let's follow her and see what happens. Is he there. Are you

feeling shy? Do you want to see him? That's him? Is that him in the white

shirt? OK. Reluctantly her sheepish looking ex-boyfriend is dragged out

of the house by one of the missionaries. She was very young

wasn't she when you got her pregnant? Because you are 23, you

are a lot older than her? TRANSLATION: He wasn't aware she was

so young. You didn't know she was 16? John said he did his duty by

paying for her hospital bills but the relationship is over. He's now

one of the lads again. Selena is offered support by some of her

neighbours, but she tells me later it is all a show for the cameras,

and some of these girls actually usually torment her over her

condition. She says her friends treat her so badly, when they see

her they tell her she stinks, she's like rubbish to them, mostly she

says at home. Back at her home, watching all of this unfold is

Selena's mother and she's livid. TRANSLATION: She was so healthy. She

would dress so smartly and whenever she walked in the village she was

the envy of everyone. Now when I see her in this condition, and the man

who did this to her is stood right there. Not even asking for my

forgiveness, I feel so sad and angry. It is the first day of the

free fistula repair camp at the hospital. An anxious Selena is first

on the list. Here it is important to find creative ways of getting the

job done. Like using a surgical glove as a town the question.

Tourniquet. This is complex surgeries but they have found the

problem here quickly. It is just at the edge, it is about a 4cm hole,

you can actually see right into the bladder there. Can you see that.

Shane Duffy and his team from Chelsea and Westminster hospital in

London are training Ugandan doctors here so they can eventually take

over. It is important to have it tension-free. The surgery has been a

success, her mother hopes she will go back to school and get her life

back. Selena is looking forward to hanging out with her friends again

and one day having another baby. But there are 200,000 other women living

in Uganda with this condition, with only a fraction lucky enough to get

treatment. These women are hoping they will be seen by the UK team

before they have to leave. But there are too many to treat everyone. Many

more will be left waiting, facing a lifetime of rejection, shame and

humiliation. That's all for tonight. The decision of the Globe Theatre to

perform Hamlet in North Korea hasn't been greeted with universal approval

by human rights campaigners today. Not that the vast majority of the

population will be able to see it, let alone understand western actors

performing in English. We have an actor here to show us how Korean

Hamlet should be done. With act two, seen two. (She speaks in Korean) #6

Our weather has taken a turner dryer. A touch of frost, patchy fog