07/03/2014 Newsnight


07/03/2014

The latest on police corruption. The state of the Lib Dems with Tim Farron. Who really founded BitCoin? And the rise of porn for women in Japan.


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Transcript


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Evidence of a possible cover-up within the Met police. A document

:00:09.:00:14.

obtained by the BBC suggests records of a link between an allegedly

:00:15.:00:18.

corrupt officer and another murder investigation. Tonight, we ask if

:00:19.:00:22.

this is a new low for the force. Was this the inventor of Bitcoin?

:00:23.:00:28.

REPORTER: Why did you quit Bitcoin, Sir? No questions right now. He

:00:29.:00:33.

claims he had nothing to do with the cryptocurrency. So why are some

:00:34.:00:39.

still convinced he was behind it? And, a porn business aimed at women.

:00:40.:00:44.

The burgeoning new industry that comes from Japan.

:00:45.:01:01.

Good evening. The BBC has seen evidence of a possible cover-up

:01:02.:01:07.

within The Met Police concerning an allegedly corrupt officer linked to

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the murder case of Stephen Lawrence. Well, today the Met Commissioner

:01:11.:01:14.

insisted he could restore trust in the force, but this evening,

:01:15.:01:18.

documents have emerged suggesting claims the Met police force made

:01:19.:01:23.

just last month could be wrong. Jim Reed has been following the

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developments. There have been other dramatic days

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in the 21 years since Stephen Lawrence was murdered. For The Met

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Police though, the last 48-hours have been some of the most difficult

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in its recent history. This is an awful outcome, a terrible

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day yesterday where obviously the results of Mark Ellison QC's

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inquiry's told us some pretty awful things about the past. So what I've

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got to do obviously is to make sure people are trusting the Met met, the

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Met of today and the Met of the future. I feel for the family, I saw

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yesterday they tried to talk about it. Long ago, historic in the past.

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The Met Police commissioner might like to see this as a problem not of

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his making. The confirmation of his force, the SC squad tried to -- SCS

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squad tried to spy on the Lawrence family. He's simply deflected or

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sought to deflect the criticism that's been laid fairly and squarely

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at his feet elsewhere. It smacks of somebody not trying to go forward

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but looking back and simply looking at it from an emotional point of

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view. And tonight, there are new allegations of a possible police

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cover-up concerning an allegedly corrupt officer limped to the

:02:54.:02:57.

Lawrence investigation. -- linked. There are three major questions as

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things stand, that still loom large for the Met. First up, who knew

:03:03.:03:07.

what? Former SDS officers used to gather here at a safe house on this

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quiet residential street in North London in. 1993, the year that

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Stephen Lawrence was killed, it's claimed Britain's top police officer

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calm to play them a visit. The then Commissioner of The Met row poll tan

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police, Commissioner Condon, is said to have handed over a bottle of

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whisky as a thank you for all their hard work. One former SDS member

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said senior officers at the Met were well aware of the unit's general

:03:37.:03:39.

role. I personally had Lord Condon came

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out to visit us. He's denied meeting me, but his diary probably documents

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it. I asked, is this a special event, the Commissioner coming out

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and I was informed, no, every single Met Commissioner has met the SDS

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since its formation, so surely every single commissioner bares some

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responsibility for this unit that was there. So it's impossible that

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senior management didn't know what was going on? If they are going to

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call me a liar, that's the only definite scenario, but no.

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In a statement today, Lord Condon denied he ever knew about any action

:04:21.:04:24.

by undercover officers in connection to the Lawrence case. Had he done,

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he claims he would have stopped the action immediately. The next

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question - did the actions of undercover officers undermine the

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first public inquiry into the Lawrence case led by Sir William

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Macpherson? Today, this man, the Head of Scotland Yard's Counter

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Terrorism Command, was temporarily moved from his post. The Ellison

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Review, publish yesterday, said Richard Walton was part of the

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police team involved in drafting the final written submissions to the

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Macpherson Inquiry. Ahead of that, he met up with a police spy in the

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Lawrence camp, known as N81, calling it a fascinating and valuable ex

:05:01.:05:04.

change. His account was found to be less than straightforward to

:05:05.:05:08.

establish and somewhat troubling. Finally, what of separate

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allegations of police corruption? The claim this man, Detective

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Sergeant John Davidson, was being paid off by the father of one

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Stephen Lawrence's murderers. The BBC's seen evidence tonight that

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Davidson was named in another case involving possible police

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corruption, the murder of private investigator Daniel Morgan. Last

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month, Scotland Yard were saying it had no record of his involvement in

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that investigation. What we need to be reassured about

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is that the culture of policing is fundamentally honest. This sort of

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misconduct and scandal, it cannot take place today and if it does, it

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will be revealed, it will be exposed. I think that's what the

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public need to be reassured about, that things really have changed.

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The Lawrence case might be historic. It might be 21 years old. But it

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will take more than words from The Met Police to convince its critics

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all its problems really are in the past.

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That was Jim Reed and Lord Paddick, the former deputy asssistant

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Commissioner of The Met joins me now from York. Lord Paddick, good

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evening. Let's start with what we have learned then. Evidence that Mr

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Davidson was named nine times in those documents about another murder

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investigation when the Met said it had no record of that last month.

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How do you respond to that? Well, I don't know. Your report says

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that Davidson may have possibly been involved. That's slightly weaker

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than he was definitely involved. I don't know what documents you've

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seen, I don't know what documents the Met base their response on, but

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clearly it doesn't look very good. What we've seen is the documents

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that names him and those are documents that the Met said just

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last month they had no record of him being linked to at all.

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Well, as you say, I don't know on what basis the Met made that

:07:13.:07:15.

statement. I don't know what evidence they had that made them say

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that, compared with the evidence that you now have in your

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possession. It's a very unfair question for me to say, what the

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Met's motivation was, because I don't know what evidence they had at

:07:30.:07:32.

that time. Sure. Let's look at Mr Hogan Howe who, as we heard in that

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report, has been talking about the past and talking about these

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thingses happening a long time ago. Would you feel confident that this

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is all history or would you worry that this was still ongoing?

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What I would be confident of is, if you are a member of the public and

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you are a victim of crime or you dial 999, you can trust 99.9% of the

:08:00.:08:05.

police officers who might turn up when you call for help, not just in

:08:06.:08:10.

London, but across the country. The overwhelming majority of police

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officers are decent, hard-working people who are trying to do the best

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for them. They will be in despair at the revelations that we have seen

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over the last couple of days. So when you say despair, do you think

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we are making too much of the stories that are emerging in these

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days of alleged police corruption? Clearly any police corruption is

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going to affect how the public view the whole of the Police Service.

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What I'm saying is, we need to get these things into perspective.

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There's a world of difference between the special demonstrations

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squad who never believe that they would have to reveal their real

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identity to anybody, therefore they felt they could do whatever they

:08:58.:09:02.

wanted to and they would never be held publicly to account. There is a

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world of difference between that and undercover officers who're working

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against terrorists and other people involved in organised crime who're

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saving people's lives because of the work they are dog and putting their

:09:14.:09:17.

own lives on the line -- the work they are doing. Ordinary officers

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who perform duty every day to try and keep us safe. We have got to get

:09:23.:09:27.

things into perspective. Clearly, if you have got a senior officer at

:09:28.:09:32.

Scotland Yard in charge of Counter-Terrorism who Ellison says

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he has his doubts about, then clearly the commissioner's done the

:09:37.:09:40.

right thing in temporarily moving that officer away from such a very

:09:41.:09:44.

sensitive position. And do you think that the public can

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still have confidence that Bernard Hogan Howe is the right person to

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lead the Met given that the day after he called it the worst

:09:53.:09:58.

revelation, the worst day of his life, worse revelations have come

:09:59.:10:07.

out? Well, your report talks about possible links may have been between

:10:08.:10:11.

the officer of DS Davidson involved in the Lawrence case and him being

:10:12.:10:16.

in some way involved possibly in the Morgan case. Now, that to me at the

:10:17.:10:21.

moment doesn't sound very strong. If it turns out that the Met has misled

:10:22.:10:29.

the public over something in recent days under Bernard Hogan Howe's

:10:30.:10:33.

watch, then clearly that is a far more serious issue. In that case we

:10:34.:10:41.

need to find out what did he know? Did he allow the Met to mislead the

:10:42.:10:46.

public if that's what's happened. If that was the case, that would be

:10:47.:10:50.

fatal for him. Thank you very much indeed.

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There've probably been better starts to a spring can everyones than this

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one. In the early hours the Liberal Democrats were beaten into last

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place at a council by election by their Bus Pass Elvis party whose key

:11:07.:11:09.

pledge is to legalise brothels with a discount for OAPs. Caught in a

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trap? We are not going to dwell on one result in Clifton North

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Nottingham. The party has suffered consistency

:11:19.:11:25.

in the polls. The Lib Dems will set out an in or out choice on Europe

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for as they take on UKIP. We'll talk to Tim Farron in a moment after a

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reminder of how they are faring. We thought we'd give the Liberal

:11:37.:11:39.

Democrats a health check. Since June 2010, the percentage of people

:11:40.:11:45.

intending to vote Lib Dem has fallen from 21 to 9%. The Tory vote 29 to

:11:46.:11:52.

34% while Labour's risen from 32 to 38%. UKIP has had a big leap from

:11:53.:11:56.

22010%. Voters don't seem that happy with

:11:57.:12:01.

Nick Clegg. He scores the lowest on satisfaction ratings as party leader

:12:02.:12:06.

with just 25% compared with 31% for both Ed Miliband and Nigel Farage

:12:07.:12:13.

and 37% for David Cameron. Nick Clegg's diminished stature has

:12:14.:12:16.

been reflected in the numbers willing to pay to join. Party

:12:17.:12:21.

membership's fallen from 65,000 in 2010 to 43,000, although they had a

:12:22.:12:26.

slight increase last year. That's not just a Lib Dem problem though.

:12:27.:12:32.

Labour membership fell from 193,000 to 188,000, Tory from 177,000 to

:12:33.:12:38.

134,000, only UKIP were the big winners with a rise from 15,000 to

:12:39.:12:45.

32,000. Partly as a result of this, the

:12:46.:12:48.

party's finances are somewhat underweight. The Lib Dems spent ?6.4

:12:49.:12:54.

million but the income was just ?6.2 million, leaving them badly

:12:55.:12:58.

out-of-pocket. What ideas of the party's brains come up with for the

:12:59.:13:02.

2015 manifesto? Among the front runners with a mansion tax on homes

:13:03.:13:07.

worth over ?2 million, a raid on pensions limiting tax free savings

:13:08.:13:11.

to ?1 million and an increase in the personal tax allowance to an

:13:12.:13:17.

expected ?10,500 or more. Will this be enough to ensure Nick Clegg is

:13:18.:13:18.

fit for the fight? We'll see. We are going to be talking to Tim

:13:19.:13:29.

Farron, the Lib Dem President in a moment, but first, let's bring you

:13:30.:13:34.

our next report. Pornography, let's be frank, belongs more often to a

:13:35.:13:37.

man's world. In Japan, the industry's moving in the opposite

:13:38.:13:42.

direction. They are increasingly directly make porn films aimed at a

:13:43.:13:46.

female audience with male porn stars treated like rock stars. Here is

:13:47.:13:49.

Rupert Wingfield-Hayes. In Tokyo, empty apartments double as

:13:50.:14:09.

film sets. Young people aspire to be film stars. This vast city is now

:14:10.:14:16.

the porn capital of the world. This woman is one of thousands of young

:14:17.:14:20.

Japanese women who every year flock to join its ranks.

:14:21.:14:46.

As many as 20,000 adult movies are made in Tokyo every year.

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Traditionally, Japanese porn has had its fair share of the extreme and

:14:55.:15:01.

the bizarre. But this new generation, film makers is aiming at

:15:02.:15:07.

a new market. Women. Ellie is 30 and went to film school. She says

:15:08.:15:12.

women's appetite for porn is being driven by frustration with men.

:15:13.:15:34.

Shoko and her co star film all morning.

:15:35.:15:39.

Women viewers are increasingly seen as a vast untapped market. One

:15:40.:15:46.

recent survey suggests one in five Japanese women regularly watch porn.

:15:47.:15:55.

They want to see sex, but also I want thatcy.

:15:56.:16:00.

-- intimacy. Another big change is the promotion of male stars. The

:16:01.:16:15.

real star of this shoot is Itetsu. It's him the female viewers want to

:16:16.:16:21.

see and it's him the photographer lingers on. This 35-year-old is the

:16:22.:16:24.

first male porn actor in Europe Japan to become a really big star.

:16:25.:16:48.

Ultimately, this isn't just about changing tastes. All over the world,

:16:49.:16:55.

people are watching porn for free on the Internet, the old business model

:16:56.:17:00.

is broken. Anni has been a porn actress for

:17:01.:17:04.

three years. She says it's getting harder and harder for anyone to make

:17:05.:17:10.

money. Many people watch porn for free, so actresses have to work

:17:11.:17:15.

harder. They have to shoot longer so it's very, very hard. The fee is

:17:16.:17:22.

getting less. It's a completely different thing to 20 years ago.

:17:23.:17:28.

Right now, Anni is a big star. Her videos sell thousands of copies.

:17:29.:17:32.

She's constantly on the road promoting her films. She's opening

:17:33.:17:36.

up new markets in China where she has a million followers on its

:17:37.:17:40.

version of Twitter. Even in China, 40% of her fans are women.

:17:41.:17:48.

Many, many promoting events all the time and they need to keep the

:17:49.:17:52.

relationship with the fans. We have to have this blog, Twitter and

:17:53.:17:56.

everything. I think they are looking for another way to sell the videos

:17:57.:18:03.

these days. For Ittetsu, that means doing a lot of this.

:18:04.:18:12.

Building the brand. For Japan's biggest male porn star, taking your

:18:13.:18:21.

clothes off in front of the fans' cameras is a big part of the job

:18:22.:18:25.

too. It's called "added value" but the

:18:26.:18:29.

goal is just the same, to get the fans to part with their money.

:18:30.:19:02.

The industry's betting with up with are much more willing to pay for

:19:03.:19:09.

porn than men. These fans are lining up to meet four of their favourite

:19:10.:19:16.

male stars. They are paying for a 30-second chat, hand shake and

:19:17.:19:19.

signed DVD and it really is 30-seconds.

:19:20.:19:25.

Ten years ago, this scene would have been unthinkable. But Japanese women

:19:26.:19:31.

appear more open than ever about exploring their sexual fantasies.

:19:32.:19:42.

I think the future is in females because more and more women are more

:19:43.:19:47.

confident to talk about intimate life and they are more curious. I

:19:48.:19:49.

think the future is women. If the porn industry has a future,

:19:50.:20:04.

then it has to find customers who're willing to pay for its products.

:20:05.:20:12.

That used to be men alone in their bedrooms. But in Tokyo, it looks

:20:13.:20:18.

like the future of porn will be increasingly female.

:20:19.:20:26.

Now, Tim Farron has just popped up from the Lib Dems Spring Conference.

:20:27.:20:34.

I'm not going to ask you about Japanese porn, you will be relieved

:20:35.:20:38.

to hear. I know tomorrow you kick off with a shuningt of an in-out

:20:39.:20:44.

referendum on Europe in the May elections? Yes, the European

:20:45.:20:51.

elections are on May 22nd and offer people a genuine choice. Politics is

:20:52.:20:56.

stage and managerial and who you vote for can often be very blurred

:20:57.:21:00.

on messages. Two parties have a clear message - if you want to leave

:21:01.:21:03.

the European Union, risk those three million jobs and peace and security

:21:04.:21:07.

and our ability to catch criminals across borders, you should vote

:21:08.:21:11.

UKIP, they are the clear party. If you think Britain's future is best

:21:12.:21:14.

within the European Union, fighting for those jobs and for the recovery

:21:15.:21:18.

of our economy with it, alongside our neighbours in Europe, then you

:21:19.:21:22.

vote Liberal Democrat. Labour or Tory, that would be a wasted vote.

:21:23.:21:27.

I'm thinking that ten years ago, your ambition was to Jeffers take

:21:28.:21:30.

the Tories, now it seems you are battling with UKIP, that's a bit of

:21:31.:21:47.

a comedown -- was to -- overtake the Tories. It's very right that Nick

:21:48.:21:52.

Clegg's decided to put the challenge down to Nigel Farage which he has

:21:53.:21:57.

accepted and I will say that so far as I am concerned, UKIP's position

:21:58.:22:01.

is utterly wrong and against Britain's interests but it's at

:22:02.:22:05.

least clear and you know what you are getting if you vote for them and

:22:06.:22:09.

also Liberal Democrat, are you in or are you out. That's the choice

:22:10.:22:14.

people need to make in May. You said it doesn't matter where you come in

:22:15.:22:21.

the elections. One pollster could see you losing all 12 seats. Would

:22:22.:22:25.

you say that didn't matter? Of course it does. It matters that we

:22:26.:22:29.

do as well as we possibly can and for the future of Britain's

:22:30.:22:33.

relationship with our friends and neighbours in Europe with the

:22:34.:22:36.

protection of the three million jobs and our ability to catch criminals

:22:37.:22:40.

and for sustaining peace and security within our continent, it's

:22:41.:22:42.

really important to stay in the European Union. What is the message

:22:43.:22:47.

that would come out of the European elections on 22nd May. If UKIP have

:22:48.:22:51.

done well, the message will be to businesses in this country and

:22:52.:22:55.

outside, you'd better leave Britain. There is no future because you are

:22:56.:22:59.

no longer going to be part of that important market. If the Liberal

:23:00.:23:01.

Democrats do well in May, the message will be the opposite. I want

:23:02.:23:05.

to look further afield because the Liberal Democrats have had a rocky

:23:06.:23:09.

few months. The Lord Rennard scandal, was that badly handled? If

:23:10.:23:16.

he turned up in York, would he be welcome? I don't think it's been

:23:17.:23:21.

badly handled in the last few months. It was badly handled over

:23:22.:23:25.

the last decade. The reality is that I think the party in not dealing

:23:26.:23:32.

with the issue years ago when it appeared to a few people did not do

:23:33.:23:41.

a service either to Lord Rennard or to the people who complained. Since

:23:42.:23:47.

it's come to our attention broadly a year ago, it's clear that we have

:23:48.:23:53.

dealt with it during. Would he be welcome if he turned up there today?

:23:54.:23:56.

He's not a party member at the moment, his membership is currently

:23:57.:23:59.

suspended as the investigation continues.

:24:00.:24:04.

How did the Tories handle the Patrick Rock allegations? Do you

:24:05.:24:08.

think their fared better? I mean, I think these are all grubby things

:24:09.:24:12.

for us to comment on as media stories. The fact is, the issue has

:24:13.:24:19.

been a far more serious one and more appalling one and it's important

:24:20.:24:25.

that those things that are potentially involved there and all

:24:26.:24:28.

these things are important to be underlined by saying people are

:24:29.:24:33.

innocent unless proven proven guilty that, it's wrong for us to be trying

:24:34.:24:36.

to score any political points one way or another, just as I thought it

:24:37.:24:40.

was grubby ov the Harriet Harman situation a few weeks ago. You use

:24:41.:24:45.

the word "grubby" and one of the problems I guess the Liberal

:24:46.:24:48.

Democrats have with the voters is the whole manifesto question that

:24:49.:24:51.

whatever you say after the tuition fees looks like an empty pledge.

:24:52.:24:55.

Does that mean there'll be nothing really in your manifesto going

:24:56.:24:58.

forward or that you have to make sure you stuck to your promises? I

:24:59.:25:04.

do accept that the fees issue's always about trust because a new

:25:05.:25:08.

policy is far better than the Labour one it replaced in terms of being

:25:09.:25:12.

fairer to students from better off backgrounds. This whole issue of

:25:13.:25:17.

trust is important. But let's not overdo it. We got 9% of the seats in

:25:18.:25:21.

Parliament, 23% of the votes in the election and got 65% of our

:25:22.:25:26.

manifesto promises such as the tax cut for 24 million lowest paid

:25:27.:25:30.

people in this country. If a party with 9% of the MPs and 23% of the

:25:31.:25:35.

the vote had got 1010% of the manifesto through which is what you

:25:36.:25:38.

are suggesting we should have done, that would be a matter for the

:25:39.:25:41.

United Nations, a travel else the I of democracy. We got two thirds of

:25:42.:25:45.

what we promised the electorate done, despite less than a quarter

:25:46.:25:50.

voting for us. Tim Farron, thank you very much indeed. Despite our best

:25:51.:25:54.

efforts, for a second night we are unable to speak to the journalist

:25:55.:25:58.

who broke the Bitcoin story. The Sochi Paralympics opening ceremony

:25:59.:26:02.

was full of the usual pomp but it may be remembered for who didn't

:26:03.:26:06.

turn up. Prince Edward pulled out. The British Government refused the

:26:07.:26:10.

invitation and, when the countries paraded their flags around the

:26:11.:26:14.

arena, the Ukrainian Paralympic team chose to sit it out, leaving the

:26:15.:26:19.

flag bearer on his own. The team said they want to compete to remind

:26:20.:26:23.

the world what is happening in their country under the presence of

:26:24.:26:29.

Russian troops. Earlier, I spoke to Bogdana Matsotska, an Al pyre

:26:30.:26:32.

Skinner who boycotted the games on Friday 21th February after 30

:26:33.:26:43.

protesters were shot dead in Kiev. -- Alpine skier. Tell us why you

:26:44.:26:50.

chose to pull out of the Olympics, Bogdana Matsotska? I'm training a

:26:51.:26:54.

lot, four years for this Paralympics and it was a really hard decision

:26:55.:26:57.

for me and my dad because he's my coach. But after we saw just on TV

:26:58.:27:02.

and received the messages what's going on in Ukraine and then we have

:27:03.:27:12.

all out war, it was so... The feelings were that we could not do

:27:13.:27:15.

it another way. It was the right decision at that moment I think. I

:27:16.:27:20.

feel the thing that I did, we did, was the right decision. What was the

:27:21.:27:23.

reaction from your team-mates, the rest of the Ukraine team when you

:27:24.:27:28.

told them? They were surprised actually, like "oh, what, come on,

:27:29.:27:34.

we are competing and training a lot and you just want to recognise all

:27:35.:27:40.

your job what you have done before", but, you know, everybody have their

:27:41.:27:45.

own minds and I cannot tell them to do something and they cannot tell me

:27:46.:27:48.

what I need to do. Did it have the ever fact you were

:27:49.:27:58.

hoping it would have? I was surprised when the newspapers or the

:27:59.:28:02.

channels started to call on me and to offer me. I was just thinking

:28:03.:28:12.

that, you know, I'm... I cannot do things another way. When it started

:28:13.:28:18.

all around the world, it was the chance to tell the all of the world

:28:19.:28:22.

what is going on in Ukraine. Do you think the Ukrainian team should be

:28:23.:28:27.

at the Paralympics now? Come on, guys. Now the Crimea, they

:28:28.:28:35.

want to take Crimea to part of Ukraine and they just put the

:28:36.:28:42.

soldiers in my country and after this you want to compete in this

:28:43.:28:48.

country, it's insane, but they have their own minds. I cannot tell them.

:28:49.:28:52.

Have you said that to them? Have you made those views felt? No. No. They

:28:53.:29:01.

have on the shoulder there, so they can do what they want and what they

:29:02.:29:04.

think is right. What did you make of the ceremony

:29:05.:29:10.

today when the Ukrainian flag carrier was the only one

:29:11.:29:18.

representing Ukraine? From one side I'm really happy that

:29:19.:29:23.

the people understand and it's also the message to all the world because

:29:24.:29:29.

we need help, you know, Russia is big country and now it's difficult

:29:30.:29:38.

situation. I don't know, I have lots of feeling, I cannot explain it all,

:29:39.:29:43.

you know, it's really hard to tell it, but I hope that all this things

:29:44.:29:51.

what's going on now just end and finally we'll get a new government

:29:52.:29:57.

with the Ukrainian Ukraine, you know. Bogdana Matsotska speaking to

:29:58.:30:01.

me earlier from Ukraine and sadly, that's all we have time for, but

:30:02.:30:05.

from all of us here, good night, have a good weekend.

:30:06.:30:32.

Hello. It's going to be a grey start to

:30:33.:30:33.

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