06/10/2016 Victoria Derbyshire

Hello it's Thursday it's 9 o'clock, I'm Joanna Gosling,

Our top story - Two million people are urged to flee their homes

in America as Hurricane Matthew approaches the Florida coast.

With strong winds battering the Bahamas and more

than ten deaths in Haiti, we'll have the latest

Vicky Balch who lost a leg in the Smiler roller-coaster crash

at Alton Towers tells us there's no point being angry

I don't see the point of being angry, does not necessarily get you

anywhere. Not anyone's file. You have to be angry at something. Not

got anything to be angry about. Things could have turned out worse.

I'm still here, I can get on. And we'll be talking to a woman

whose husband died after a private ambulance crew failed to spot

he was having a heart attack. We will ask if the growing use of

private ambulances could put patients at risk.

We are live until 11 this morning. We will talk to a woman photographer

who complained to the FA after the chairman of a non-league club told

her a woman's place was in the kitchen or bedroom. Kylie Minogue is

delaying marriage until same-sex marriage is legal in Australia. We

will talk to one of her friends. Get in touch using the hashtag. If you

text, you will be charged the standard network rate.

At least 23 people have died after Hurricane Matthew hit

Rescue workers are struggling to reach parts of the country cut

off by the most powerful Caribbean hurricane in nearly a decade.

Hundreds of thousands of people in Florida and South Carolina have

been told to evacuate as Hurricane Matthew moves

The governor of Florida has warned the damage

On the east coast of Cuba they are beginning the long clean-up. It

might not be the same damage as in Haiti, but Harry Kane Matthew has

still been hit. They are waiting in the Bahamas for the destruction. All

air traffic has been stopped, people stocking up on supplies before

heading for higher ground. The fear is, as it goes over the warm waters,

the force of Matthew Coutts strengthen as it heads for the

south-east corner of the United States. The potential damage is

expected to linger for days to come. On the east coast of Florida they

are used to big storms. People are being urged not to underestimate the

scale of what is heading their way. This is a dangerous storm. Never too

early to evacuate. If you live in a low-lying area, on Barry Island, or

areas prone to flooding, get out. Do not wait for an order, get out now.

Further north, in South Carolina, the traffic may be moving slowly,

all going in the same direction. For the first time authorities diverging

all lanes to head west away from Matthew's path. Hundreds of school

buses filled by those without cars. Still to judge to tell how severe

this could be. Authorities want to prepare for the worst while hoping

for the best. The storm is now heading

to the Bahamas where all air and sea Brett Adair is a meteorologist

on the Bahamas, where they've been We are preparing for the worst as it

heads for the Bahamas. You can see the harbour. Some of the boats that

have been crashing up against the docks, as these seas get more

ferocious. As Matthew comes closer to the mainland. Everybody prepared,

having all of their shutters and are boarded up. Everybody hunkering down

for the long haul. We will hear from the Red Cross on the impact, what

they are trying to do to protect the lives and property on the islands.

Stay with us for that. Annita McVeigh is in the BBC

Newsroom with a summary Fracking for shale gas could be

given the go-ahead today. The Communities Secretary,

Sajid Javid, is due to announce a decision about two sites

in the North-west of England. Last year, Lancashire County Council

rejected applications to frack by the energy firm,

Caudrilla. The company appealed,

and the government said it would make the final ruling

because of the importance Our Industry Correspondent John

Moylan reports. These were the scenes in June last

year when plans to explore for shale gas were thrown out

of Lancashire County Council. But the government believes this

decision on fracking Elizabeth and Barry Warren live

near one of the proposed fracking They have been fighting

the plans for over two years. It is very close

to where people live. It will destroy their lives

and the lives of people who use this This is the backyard of Blackpool

and it should be safe. Cuadrilla believes that the rocks

beneath these fields hold vast quantities of gas which will help

secure the energy Britain will need They want to drill

between one and two miles underground and use fracking -

injecting water, sound and chemicals into the rocks at high pressure

to release the gas trapped inside. If fracking is going

to take off then councils are likely to face many

more planning applications The decision the government has

taken today would be setting We will bring you that decision when

we get it, around 9:30 a.m.. People caught carrying knives

illegally should face longer jail terms according

to The Sentencing Council The organisation also wants young

offenders who post films of attacks on social media

to face tougher penalties. It says it wants sentences to better

reflect public concern amid a rise A woman who lost a leg in the Smiler

roller-coaster crash at Alton Towers has told this programme she's not

doesn't "see the point of being Vicky Balch, one of 16 people hurt

on the ride in June last year, told us that things "could have

turned out worse". Last week, Alton Towers' operator

was fined five million pounds over The people working on the ride were

working to the best of their ability. Working as they knew how to

work. I am not angry, not cross. I am more annoyed, there should have

been proper training put in place, like now. You can see that full

interview at 9:15 a.m.. Independent research seen by the BBC

suggests that Heathrow Airport could build a third runway

without breaking European The study - which was led

by Cambridge University - involved placing a network of air

quality sensors in and The government is due to announce

in the coming weeks whether it wants to expand

Heathrow or Gatwick. Here's our Transport

Correspondent Richard Westcott. Pollution is one of the key reasons

people oppose a bigger Heathrow. The air already breaks

EU law in some places. Campaigners think a new runway

would make it worse. This new research funded

by the Independent Natural Environment Research Council suggest

it We expect there to be a marginal

increase in nitrous oxide That will come from

the reduced nitrous dioxide from the general traffic

flow, because of the transition of Critically the study says

it comes down to road The bulk of poisonous

nitrogen oxide gas near the airport comes from cars,

buses and lorries. The study suggests that by 2030,

they will have cleaner They predict that

change will be enough to wipe out any increased pollution

coming from a bigger airport. Opponents think that air quality

is an Achilles heel for Heathrow It could be one of the areas

where it is challenged in the After years of sweeping

the decision under the carpet, ministers will announce

whether to enlarge the frail Whichever scheme they pick will meet

loud, angry resistance. A new study says Mental health

patients are more likely to take their own lives if they're

cared for in the community Research published today

by Manchester University shows there were more than 200 suicides

last year among those receiving psychiatric care at home -

three times higher than for Boys conceived using a common IVF

technique may inherit their father's infertility, according

to new research published today. Tests by the University of Brussels

on the first group of men conceived by the ICSI method -

who are now in their late teens and early twenties - found they too

had low sperm counts. Toad numbers have fallen by more

than two-thirds in 30 years. That's according to a study set up

to help them get across roads. The amphibians are vulnerable

to traffic during their migration In the UK, data collected from 153

sites stretching back to 1985 has Kylie Minogue's British fiance has

said the couple won't get married until same-sex marriage becomes

legal in Australia. The Australian singer

and English actor Joshua Sasse announced their engagement

earlier this year. The couple have been vocal

supporters of the "Say I Do Down The government has proposed holding

a public vote on same-sex We will speak to one Al-Qaeda

minute's friends later about that. We should get a decision

on whether fracking can go ahead We'll being you that

as soon as we get it. Do get in touch with us

throughout the morning - use the hashtag Victoria Live

and If you text, you will be charged It has been a turbulent time for

Tyson Fury. Pulling out of that fight. There are more things for the

world champion to worry about. He admits losing his boxing licence

after admitting taking cocaine. Friends in the sport say he is not

in a good place, he needs help. He has admitted suffering from

depression. The former featherweight world champion Barry McGuigan, he

says that the sport in general must club together to protect athletes

with mental health issues. Maybe time for the sporting governing

bodies to sit down and start thinking about a clinic of some kind

for guys who don't earn a fortune. But still need their help. It only

takes a bit of money to get these things off the ground. The amount of

money in professional sport at the highest level is ridiculous. Bound

to be a portion of that money which can go to a mental health programme

surrounding professional sport. No doubt about it, something is needed,

needs to be done sooner rather than later. We do not want to have a

fatality on our hands. On Monday, you will remember Tyson Fury tweeted

to say he was retiring, before retracting that statement. Maybe

that decision will be enforced on him. The British Boxing Board of

Control will decide whether to withdraw his licence. If they do, he

is likely to lose his world titles. If he has an extended period out of

the sport, prospects of him returning look bleak. Flames

overnight by the world anti-doping agency, data stolen by hackers may

have been changed. If you are not familiar with the Fancy Bears, they

are Russian -based rap group, whose activities seems to mirror the

interests of the Russian government. They recently hacked the world

anti-doping agency, publishing details of athletes' anti-doping

records, and therapeutic exemptions. That prompted replies by Mo Farah

and Sir Bradley Wiggins. Wada says they may have adopted some of the

data, details released to the media did not reflect their own. A pinch

of salt added to the situation. A woman who lost a leg in the Smiler

rollercoaster crash at Alton Towers has told this programme she doesn't

see the point of being angry Vicky Balch, one of 16 people hurt

on the ride in June last year, told us that things could

have turned out worse. Last week, Alton Towers' operator

was fined ?5 million The judge called the crash

a catastrophic failure We last spoke to Vicky

on the programme back It was her first interview

after the accident. Just a few months on from

what happened, she described what she remembered of the moments

after the collision I checked my face, checked my hands,

I realised that they were OK. I've got one scar there, but I

didn't notice that at the time. I was relieved that the top half

of me was OK, but then I had to consider what had

happened to the bottom half I never thought I'd be able

to walk again, with my leg. They were ripped, and there was just

blood pouring out of this knee, and I could see it

dripping the entire time. I could see bodily tissue in front

of me, I don't know whose it was, but it was horrible because I could

see the rip and I could see how far it went into my knee

and it went far. Well, we caught up

with Vicky yesterday. Victoria started by asking her how

she's been since that interview I'm just sort of enjoying, learning

to enjoy how I am now. And you've got a

computerised prosthetic? Tell us what the differences

are with the one you used to wear? The one I used to wear

was just a mechanical leg, so if it wasn't straight and locked,

if I put weight on it, I'd fall over, which happened a lot,

which can be quite upsetting and can This one, I've never tripped up

and if I do trip up, it gives me those extra seconds that

you would have not to fall over. I can walk downstairs

one after another. Upstairs, it's a bit trickier,

but once I've got the hang of it, I will be able to go up one

after another, but because I'm short I can only make little steps,

so the big steps don't work. So practically it's better,

but do you feel more confident? How much more confident do you feel

using that one? I know I can trust the leg,

so even though it's hard and it took me a while,

I learned to trust it. It just gives me a lot more

confidence. any more, and I know if I do trip up

a little, then I can I think you also want to try out

some blades, don't you? Yes, I'd love to

start running again. It just gives me something else

to try and I'm willing I've tried running with this leg,

but it's just landing on something that doesn't have

any bounce, as such. I'm trialling a blade

soon, hopefully. You talked last time about wanting

to get back in a car, It's taken quite a while to sort

of get to that point, because I had to go for an assessment to see

what I'd need, whether it be hand So it's taken a while,

and it's been quite frustrating, but hopefully soon

I'll be back driving. You sat through the recent court

case, where the owners of Alton Towers faced various health

and safety charges. It was surprising and it wasn't nice

to sit through it all, It was quite draining and it wasn't

nice listening to any of it, but I needed

to hear it, I wanted to. Not for closure, I don't think

I'll ever get closure from anything like this,

but I think I'm the kind of person that needs to know

everything about it. Why it happened, how it happened,

and exactly what happened. During the court case you,

along with everyone else in that room, saw footage from the accident

which you had never seen before. It wasn't nice, but I had

built myself up to it. I knew I wouldn't have to watch it,

but I wanted to watch it. I didn't cry, but there was a little

tear, just because I knew what was coming, but I didn't

know what to expect. Obviously there wasn't sound,

but it still wasn't nice and it was just sort of realising it

did happen, it was that bad, We were up there for ages,

so it was just thinking Did you flinch when you first saw it

or were you pretty calm? I was pretty calm, because obviously

there were a lot of people in the room, and I would

have been calm anyway. I just kind of composed myself

and just kept watching, I've watched it a few times since,

and I just sort of get a funny It emerged during the court case

that there were serious issues, that engineers had overridden

the computer system, which would have, should

have alerted them. That there was a carriage stationary

on the ride, and it emerged that the ride shouldn't

have been in use at all, Both those things were

presumably news to you? I didn't know there was a previous

cart before the one we smashed into. I didn't realise that there was one

they had to manually push, so that should have really shown

them that the wind was too strong. There were other rides

nearby that were closed, so it was way over what

it should have been. The people on the ride working on it

were working to the best They were working as they knew

how to work, so I'm not I'm more annoyed because there

should have been proper training put in place,

like there is now. If they'd been following

the procedures they were supposed to follow, it should

never have happened? But they didn't have the procedures

to follow, because they hadn't even read the manual,

apparently, and they hadn't So it's hard to be angry

because it's not their fault. Can you try and explain how

it is that you're not angry? I think at first, the first couple

of weeks after the accident I was more upset, like,

why did happen to me? I asked my mum if I was a horrible

person, things like that. But I just don't see

the point in being angry. It doesn't necessarily get

you anywhere, and it's I think you've got to be angry

at something, and I've not got I know things could have turned out

worse, but it's not, and I'm still here, and I can

still live and get on with it. Is that what you think,

it could have been worse? How do you react to the ?5 million

fine that they were given? For a company that size,

it's not a big fine. Even if it was doubled,

it wouldn't make I think what's more important

is that they've put things It shouldn't happen again,

but if it does happen again, they'll have a

platform to get to us. They have something that will get

them up quicker and they won't wait 20 minutes to ring someone,

like they did with us. I took the anaesthetist who was up

on the ride with us at the time. So I wanted to find out

how he got us down. It was a lot more contained

than I thought it was. I thought I'd feel

something when I got there, and I did get upset,

but then I calmed down and I just It wasn't running, there was no one

there, but I didn't feel anything. I thought I might feel angry or sad,

but I just sat there Was there some kind of perspective

by seeing it, or what? Yeah, I think I had to go back

to see it, again, not for closure, because I don't think that can

happen, but I think it was just I don't know why, but I feel

like it helped. In terms of the future,

what are your plans? I've had a few talks,

I've had a few offers We'll just see what happens

in the future, I think. Maybe in the future,

I'm not sure. Tell us what's

happening this weekend. Team BRIT have asked me to be

a grid girl on Saturday at Oulton Park, which they want me

to start and finish one of the races for the Fun Cup,

so that will be quite fun. They've also offered for me to try

driving one of the race cars, When I spoke to you back then,

I asked you if you had managed to rationalise what had happened

to you, and you said no. And I would like to ask

you the same question now, I think when you wake up every day

and you don't see your leg, I think you've got to

rationalise it at some point. It's getting on with your life,

and I think you can't get on with your life and be happy

with yourself until you... Not necessarily get over

it, but like you said, How do you reflect on what has

happened to you and why? I think I've dealt with it a lot

better than other people could have. I could have gone completely

the opposite way, I could hate how I am now, but I'm trying to make

a difference to other people. Not inspire as such,

because I don't think I've reached that yet,

but I just want to make a difference and make something good out

of a really bad thing. Thank you very much

for talking to us. The says she's gorgeous, and so

strong. You can watch the interview

again on our programme Fracking for shale gas could get

the go-ahead at two sites And a football photographer who

insulted a woman, we talked to her. Now here is all the news.

At least 23 people have died after Hurricane Matthew hit

Rescue workers are struggling to reach parts of the country cut

off by the most powerful Caribbean hurricane in nearly a decade.

Hundreds of thousands of people in Florida and South Carolina have

been told to evacuate as Hurricane Matthew moves

The governor of Florida has warned the damage

Fracking for shale gas could be given the go-ahead today.

The Communities Secretary, Sajid Javid, is due to announce

a decision about two sites in the north-west of England.

Last year, Lancashire County Council rejected applications

to frack by the energy firm Caudrilla.

The company appealed and the government said it

would make the final ruling because of the importance

People caught carrying knives illegally should face longer

jail terms according to the Sentencing Council

The organisation also wants young offenders who post films

of attacks on social media to face tougher penalties.

It says it wants sentences to better reflect public concern amid a rise

A woman who lost a leg in the Smiler roller-coaster crash at Alton Towers

has told this programme she's not doesn't "see the point of being

Vicky Balch, one of 16 people hurt on the ride in June last year,

told us that things "could have turned out worse".

Last week, Alton Towers' operator was fined ?5 million over

Independent research seen by the BBC suggests that Heathrow Airport

could build a third runway without breaking European

The study by Cambridge University said Lena transport in the area

would balance it out. Kylie Minogue's British fiance has

said the couple won't get married until same-sex marriage becomes

legal in Australia. The Australian singer

and English actor Joshua Sasse announced their engagement

earlier this year. The couple have been vocal

supporters of the "Say I Do Down The government has proposed holding

a public vote on same-sex The UK's only female

giant panda will not give birth to cubs this year,

her keepers at Edinburgh The zoo has been trying to get

Tian Tian to produce a cub since she arrived

from China in 2011. Earlier this year she was

artificially inseminated But, in a statement,

the zoo said her hormone levels had returned to normal and her behaviour

signals the end of her breeding That's all the news. Now the sport.

Wail's footballers are in Vienna to take on Austria in the qualifier

tonight. -- Wales. Both British clubs have suffered heavy first leg

defeat in a women's Champions League last night. Chelsea lost 3-0 to

Wolfsburg, while Hibernian's women were thrashed 6-0 by Bayern Munich.

Johanna Konta has beaten Karolina Pliskova in the China Open. The

British amber one came through in three sets to reach the

quarterfinals. The Olympic champion Justin Rose will miss the final two

months of the season through injury. He has been suffering with a back

problem since May. He won gold at the Rio Games in August. We will be

back with more sport just after ten o'clock. Thank you.

The FA has imposed a two-year ban on the chairman of non-league club

Wellingborough Town after he told a female photographer that

women are only useful in the kitchen and the bedroom.

She is here and we will be talking to her in a minute.

It's not the first time Martin Potton has been in trouble.

Back in March we reported on another incident in which he was was fined

for using derogatory and insulting language

towards a 22-year-old female referee, Mary Harmer.

Lindsay England, who runs the anti-homophobia

campaign Just a Ball Game, was watching the match.

I was watching the game, the team was losing 4-0, then they were 7-0

down. This gentleman decided to say it was the referee's fault, because

she happened to be female. She was not fit to referee in a woman's

game, let alone amen's game. He Jerry Dahl, going on about, I don't

understand what the law is coming to, women seem to be getting

everywhere, you can't go to work from you can't enjoy yourself

without women being there, being in charge. I was shocked to find it was

the chairman of opposition. I did not find out about the comments,

until a few weeks after, contacted by the county FA, asked if I'd heard

the comments. I was refereeing the game, I did not hear them, so

focused on getting decisions right, then hear what players of the Crown

say. Sometimes when you hear those comments, it makes you want to work

harder, prove that women are good referees, sometimes we may be better

than the men. These comments, something part of the past.

Certainly not part of the future. The game is changing, sometimes

people turn their heads, when I warm up and referee again. They turned

their heads, like dominoes. A female referee today. In maybe five years'

time, actually, it is a referee, not a female referee. They are there to

do their job, just and equal, the same as a male referee.

Well the woman who brought the latest complaint

And Vivienne Aiyela who is a member of 'Women in Football' that

What happened between you and that man that they. I was at the football

match, treated myself to a new lens on my camera, not a photographer by

profession. Sitting at the front of the stand, taking some practice

shots. Martin was sitting about two, three rows behind me. Suddenly

starting exclaiming, is this your new profession? I said, I am female,

but I enjoy photography. Why did you take that as a jibe? He's that type

of person. Before he has made not very nice comments towards females.

He ignores them, or ignores me, on a continuous basis. That is what I

recall I said. He suddenly responded, females should be in the

kitchen and the bedroom. I was mortified. There was no reason to be

as nasty, to say something like that. People sitting around, my

husband sitting a couple of rows further away, he heard it.

Spectators to the side. Very few females, men watching that game.

I've felt totally and utterly embarrassed. Did you say anything? I

glared at him, saying, really? I decided to detach myself from that,

not cause further comment from him. Just carried on. When we were

leaving, one of a spectator came past my car, when my husband and I

were leaving, I don't quite believe you said that to you. I said, I find

it awful, somebody, especially the chairman of the club saying

something like that. It is not something I would take lightly, to

report something. I did not want to ask anybody, who I should report

this too. I looked at the FA of the Internet, decided to contact them,

and tell them. You put a complaint forward. He denied the claims, but

the FA ruled in your favour. And for two years, from all football, also

find, he has to go on quality and education course. The right

response? Having heard he recently attended a football match anyway,

not many people will stop him in his attitude. He has resigned, from what

I understand, but in June this year, as chairman of the football club. He

removed himself from that. He has said there will always be sexism in

the game, only time and education will change. He says dinosaurs like

me, I'm an old man, we should have some banter. There are dinosaurs in

the game. I do agree. We are in the 21st century, girls and women play

football. Girls and women go to spectator, to watch their friends,

loved ones play. There is no place for that kind of sexist banter. What

is the best response? Lawro says she did not put in a complaint likely,

but that is what she did? You have to have a complaint commit you have

to have a voice. Sometimes when it happens, you think, is it just me?

Did I hear that correctly? You don't know where to complain. How to

complain. A lot of people in those situations, they take it. They

think, OK, I will leave it, I don't know where to go. Does it happen

much? It happens a lot, I have a friend who is a coach, she gets so

much abuse, she used to sit in her car and cry. Abuse from where? From

the crowd, from the players. I spoke on a panel, women in football, one

of the panel members said it is part of the game. She is a referee. You

get used to it. You should not get used to it. Time it stopped. Have

you witnessed it more widely? I have heard, when I was attending as a

spectator, I have heard ever so often comments like that. I have

heard comments. It prompted me to not support my local team more

often. I don't want to be verbally abused by anybody, least of all a

chairman, or whoever. Why should people look down on women, playing

any sport? Not just football, any sport. Enjoying watching it. Is the

best way to nip it in the bud, for people to take it head-on at the

time? Obviously when you are in a situation, shocked by something, you

don't know how to respond. Would you respond differently? If it happened

again, I would have known hesitation in immediately reporting it. Why not

speak directly to the person present not a very nice person to talk to.

Intimidating in his behaviour. More general, perhaps. From that person,

you would just get verbally abuse. The FAA has dealt with this. The

message coming out of clubs, it seems to be very much that these

things are taken seriously, they want issues reported. Have things

changed? The overall approach changed? Although there will

inevitably be incidents? Things have changed. Last year about 500 cases

people reported. People are getting brave enough to report cases. Things

are changing. People need to not be so scared to report. A lot of people

think I am not going to report, I am going to leave it. If you do, other

people will get it, too. Reporting is essential. Something will get

done, even though you think, I was not report it. I can live with it.

It will spiral. Another person will get the abuse, too. Thank you very

much. Would longer prison

sentences for people caught carrying a knife stop

the rise in knife crime? The Sentencing Council

for England and Wales says yes. We'll find out what victims

and former gang members think. A woman is taking legal action

against an ambulance trust after it sent a private ambulance whose crew

failed to identify that her husband The East of England Ambulance

Service NHS Trust uncovered a series of failures and has apologised

to Kim Page for the death In a serious incident report,

the trust described the team leader of the private crew as complacent

for not heeding the concerns of a more junior colleague

who thought she should Overall the coroner found serious

failings in Gary Page's care. The episode has shone a spotlight

on the greater use of private ambulances in attending

emergency calls. In February Kim Page and her husband

Gary were at home watching TV on the sofa when he began to feel

pain in his chest. By then he was on his hands

and knees, with his elbows A crew from a private

ambulance company contracted to work for the East

of England Ambulance led by emergency medical

technician Lauren de la Haye. Lauren de la Haye sat down

next to Gary and said, She just said to him,

it's definitely not your heart, you're definitely not having

a heart attack. I wish all my my patients

were like you, sitting They decided to take some

ECGs, what did they do That's why he didn't go,

because they didn't say, this could be a heart attack,

you need to go to the hospital. They gave the impression

there wasn't any need for it. Unbeknown to Kim and Gary,

heart traces, or ECGs, taken by the clearly showed

evidence of a heart attack. In the night Gary remained

uncomfortable, and so went to sleep He would wouldn't wake up

so I started to punch him and tried to shake him,

and couldn't wake him, so I got What makes his death even harder

for his family to bear is that Gary Page was just minutes away

from a specialist heart unit here at Basildon University Hospital

when he fell ill. At the inquest, a report

from the East of England Ambulance Service branded Lauren de la Haye

complacent in failing to heed the concerns of a colleague,

and wrongly advising Gary Page and that he was well enough

to stay at home. Her incorrect analysis of his ECG

and presenting signs and symptoms was deemed the root cause

of his death. The coroner, Caroline Beasley

Murray, found serious failings Lauren de la Haye didn't attend

the inquest, but has told the BBC The East of England Ambulance

Service has apologised for providing As a result of the case, the service

has changed its procedures, so that if a crew decides not

to take a patient to hospital, it must first contact

a clinical advice line. NHS spending on private ambulances

for 999 calls in England has trebled Gary Page's case raises

questions about their use. I think the problem with some

private ambulance crews is there's no register,

and it a lottery as to who turns up They may not have the

correct expertise, Kim Page is taking legal action over

the death of her husband, but nothing can compensate her

for his loss. I know people say that, but he was,

and he always will be. And now I've got to find a way

of living without him... Alan Howson is the executive

chairman of the Independent Ambulance Association,

the body which represents Thank you for joining us. Respond to

the claim, one of the issues with private ambulances, no register, a

lottery who will care for your loved one, they may not have the correct

qualification, expertise or experience? Can start by expressing

my sadness over this incident. Very tragic, my thoughts are with Mrs

Page and her loved ones. We fully agree there should be a register for

evidence technicians, accountable for their actions in law. Not

accountable in terms of being struck off if they malpractice. We fully

support a move to introduce a register for technicians. What is

the difference between a technician and a paramedic?

however this skill set of a technician is less than a paramedic.

Their knowledge of the body and how it works is less. They don't have

access to equipment and drugs in order that they can provide a higher

level of treatment. Having said that, it is a good baseline towards

becoming a paramedic. But is it good enough? It certainly is a stepping

stone. And technicians can save lives and do save lives on a daily

basis. A stepping stone, but if a private ambulance with a technician

is responding to an emergency where somebody is having a heart attack,

potentially any life-threatening incident, is a technician enough?

Studies have shown that technicians have a good outcome versus

paramedics. So in terms of whether they perform to the same level,

clearly not, but they do have a good outcome. As I understand it, in that

instance, there were no paramedics available to attend to Mr Paige.

Spell out what you mean by good outcome. Not quite as good as a

paramedic but still OK? Studies show that technicians have a higher

survival rate because their usual method was to recognise and

transport to hospital. Definitive care. Rather than staying and

administering drugs. In this particular instance, the east of

England Ambulance Service apologised and said that in future a clinical

advice line must be contacted if a decision is taken not to take

somebody to hospital. Should that become normal practice? It should.

My understanding was that would normally happen if there was

non-conveyance. There would be a referral back to the ambulance

trust. Can people feel reassured by what the outcome would be if a

private ambulance arrived at their home rather than an NHS ambulance?

Absolutely. Most of the crews in private ambulance companies are

either current NHS ambulance staff working for both the NHS and private

sector, or former NHS staff who have moved across to work for a private

ambulance company. The training standards are the same. Why is it

that there has been such an increase in the use of private ambulances?

That is a reflection of the increase in demand an Ambulance Services per

se. A huge increase over the years, and the number of paramedics is

increasing for a number of reasons. The private service provides

increased capability and capacity at peak moments of demand, while the

Ambulance Service builds up the paramedics and support staff to

croup the vehicles. Thank you very much. Plans to frack for shale gas

in Lancashire could be given the green light today. Sajid Javid is

expected to announce shortly whether work can begin at two sites. Last

year Lancashire County Council rejected applications by the firm

Cuadrilla, who appealed, and the government said it would make the

final ruling because of the importance of the case. Our

correspondent is at one of the proposed sites. Little Plumpton. We

are respecting the announcement and what are you anticipating? We were

expecting the announcement at around 9:30am this morning. Today was the

deadline set by the government to decide whether to overturn the

decision by Lancashire County Council not to allow test fracking

on this site and another one in Lancashire. As yet there has been no

word about what exactly is happening. The site behind me at

Little Plumpton is one of two where Cuadrilla want to carry out test

fracking, including doing horizontal drilling, which is very

controversial and has not been done in the UK before. There are concerns

about the environmental impact of that. The landowners are taking no

chances. If they get the green light to go ahead with this today, they

want to make sure there will be no protest camps today, and it is the

site of a High Court injunction, warning that anybody trespassing on

the site would be in contempt of court. Previously when there have

been attempts to get fracking and test drilling under way in different

parts of the UK, there have been huge protests. In Greater Manchester

a camp was set up for several months trying to stop another company

carrying out test drilling on that site at Barton Moss. This is a very

controversial issue. Frances O'Grady and from the company Cuadrilla who

want to carry out fracking has explained why it is so important as

far as he is concerned. -- Francis Egan. It is safe. It has been

monitored excessively and the monitoring that will go on around

this site is unprecedented. Traffic, noise, air quality, water quality,

so they really can feel assured. I understand that it is like a

construction site but it is temporary and when it has gone away

you won't know anything was there. Yes, but the thing is, you see, a

lot of people don't agree with that. There are concerns about the impact

on the environment, not just the sight of what goes on on this land,

but what is happening underground. Fracking was actually suspended in

this country in 2011 when there was fracking going on not far from here

which caused a number of earth tremors. That was when it was all

suspended. Now the companies are trying to say they have got it all

sorted and it is perfectly safe but there are a lot

of people in Lancashire and beyond with serious concerns about the

environmental impact of fracking. At the same time the government has got

to balance those concerns with the fact that we need energy for the

years to come. The companies say there is a lot of shale gas that

could potentially be exploited beneath our feet and that is one way

of meeting the UK's energy needs. This is a difficult balancing act

for the government and maybe within the next hour we will know what they

have decided to do. We will bring you that when it comes through. Lots

of you getting in touch about sexism in football. This one, it isn't

banter. Using banter as an excuse is redundant. It is 2016. Elvis has

tweeted that sexism has no place in football, and. Elite Probe says I

think the situation is improving. As a person who would like to be in

football, I know I have what it takes and I know what holds me back.

And this tweet, women belong in the kitchen and bedroom, are you

serious? So what if there is a female referee? Leave her to do your

job. And after the interview that Victoria did with Vikki Bunce, a

very brave lady. -- Vicky Balch. Fabulous, inspiring. An inspiration

to young people whatever they are suffering. Her parents must be

proud. I congratulate them all. The worst storm to hit the Caribbean

in a decade, Hurricane Matthew, is moving across the Caribbean and

heading towards the United States. It's already killed at least 23

people in the Dominican People in the central Bahamas

are bracing themselves for the onslaught of the hurricane

as the eye of the category A surge of up to 15 feet

and wind speeds of more than 120 mph

are expected on some southern Earlier I spoke to the Director

General of the Bahamas Red Cross, Caroline Turnquest, and I asked her

how they are preparing before Matthew hits the most populated

areas in the islands. Right now the hurricane has passed

over a number of islands. We're getting initial

reports of some damage, however, as you know,

the teams are going to do a damage In Providence right now, it's sort

of the calm before the storm, because it's expected to come

in full force within What has been done to prepare for it

and to protect people? Persons have been evacuated

from the low-lying areas, those people that live

on the coastline have been In fact, the Prime Minister,

with the help of the Commissioner of Police, has ordered mandatory

evacuation, even though They have been pleading

with persons and the response Having seen the impact

that it's had elsewhere, has that made people more ready

to accept what the potential Well that, coupled with the fact

that we're just coming through a year exactly from another

hurricane, Joachim, that impacted five of our islands,

in really a disaster. What are you predicting the impact

of this hurricane might be? Well, based on predictions,

it's a very, very strong hurricane and it's expected to have storm

surges of up to 15 feet. So we're expecting a lot

of flooding, and we urge persons Has anybody defied warnings

or has everybody listened You're always going to find one

or two persons that don't, but... Families are still, I guess,

still trying to urge them, but a lot of persons,

a record number of persons, Based on previous experience,

how long does it take after a hurricane has hit

to actually assess first of all the impact of it,

and then to deal with it? Well, first of all you have

to have the all clear from the National Emergency

Management Agency - NEMA. Once the all clear is given,

then a team goes out, various teams, but an official team

from the disaster unit goes out to do the assessment,

just to assess where the damage is, On a number of islands, though,

we have been doing some training and we have teams on the ground

and we have, in a few instances, we have pre-positioned supplies,

so persons will have something to work with

until the main team comes in. The Red Cross in the Bahamas. Now

the latest weather update with Carol. What is the latest on

hurricane? It is still category three, which is a major hurricane.

It is heading in the direction of the Bahamas. Outer ring is already

being felt and it has sustained wind speeds widely of 115 mph. We expect

it to intensify to 132 mph in the next 36 hours, taking it back to

category four. This area here is tropical storm Nicole, so something

we are watching is how the two may or may not interact. From Hurricane

Matthew we are likely to see torrential downpours and the Bahamas

is relatively low lying, relatively flat as well, so there is a risk of

flash flooding from that with the devastating impact of the strong

winds as well. And the huge storm surge is likely to cause a lot of

damage. If we look at the track it is expected to take in the next few

days, it crosses the Bahamas and then we have a hurricane warning for

the eastern seaboard of Florida as well. It continues to track

northwards, towards Georgia and the Carolinas. In the northern

hemisphere, hurricane struck in an anticyclonic direction, so it

doesn't take much for it to move further east or west to have a

dramatic difference on the impact likely to be felt by the hurricane.

We will keep you posted. Back at home, it is cloudy and cooler than

yesterday for many. We will see some sunshine, the best of which in the

north and North West of the country. High pressure is anchored over

Scandinavia and it has been blocking weather fronts coming in from the

Atlantic. If you look at the direction the isobars are flowing

in, it is from the east, so an easterly breeze today, which is

quite a cool direction for us. Cloud around this morning and sunshine as

well. Cloud in the east drifting west through the course of the day

into South West England and Wales. Even so it will break up and there

will be sunny spells. The lion's share of the sunshine will be in the

north and North West. In recent days, if you were exposed to the

cloud and breeze, it will feel cooler, and temperatures are down on

recently. There could be showers in the Midlands and East Anglia.

Elsewhere it will be dry with variable amounts of cloud and sunny

intervals and temperatures in Plymouth peaking at 14. For Wales,

the cloud drifts in from the east with the west seeing brighter skies

and sunshine and a fine day in Northern Ireland. 14 is the top

temperature. Again bright spells of sunshine. The lion's share of St

John from the word go across North West Scotland but elsewhere there

will be cloud around. -- lion's share of sunshine. We hold onto the

breeze elsewhere. The showers drift further west into Wales and North

West England and also further north into southern Scotland and Northern

Ireland. They will be hit and miss but it will not be called tonight.

Tomorrow, we will have showers. Still hit and miss. Some in the

South East could merge to give heavier rain at times. Quite a lot

of cloud around. Like today the lion's share of the sunshine will be

in the North West. Temperature wise, the impact of the winds will make it

feel cooler than the temperatures suggest but they will be down on

today. Hello it's Thursday it's 10 o'clock,

I'm Joanna Gosling, Due any minute - a landmark decision

on whether fracking for shale gas can get the go-ahead at two sites

in the north-west of England. One gets the go-ahead, the other put

on hold. With a ten percent rise in knife

crime since last year - would tougher sentences for people

caught carrying We'll be speaking a former gang

member and a mother who's son Kylie Minogue and her fiance

are putting their wedding on hold until same-sex marriage becomes

legal in Australia. We'll speak to one of her friends

here and to one of Australia's The decision to roof on the fracking

scheme in Lancashire. -- is through. One of the projects in Lancashire

granted. The second project, the government has said put on hold for

now, while it takes more time to decide on it. Friends of the Earth

putting that news out, one of the projects will be going ahead, one is

on hold. We're not sure which one gets the go-ahead. A little earlier

and we were at one of the sites in little Plumpton. We need to get

clarity on which one gets the go-ahead. Still nothing official

from the government on this. This is coming through from Friends of the

Earth. We are awaiting the formal announcement from the government.

What is being reported from Cuadrilla and Friends of the Earth,

one of the projects will go through. Let's speak to Cat Smith

who is the Labour MP Still no announcement from the

government, but Cuadrilla and Friends of the Earth are saying

that. I have received my e-mail from the government outlining the

decisions made, to let fracking go ahead at the Preston new road site

and turn down the other. My reaction, I have not read or 603

pages of the decision in the last 60 seconds, but it is one of great

disappointment, local people and local democracy overridden by the

government. This decision was made by Lancashire County Council in a

fairway, for the government to step in it is an affront to democracy.

They should have been decision made by local people. For Sajid Javid to

come in and make it, a of angry in Lancashire. As you say, the County

Council turned down the applications. Officials recommending

the go-ahead for one of the schemes? Can you say that again? Officials

recommended one of the schemes go ahead. In spite of that, the council

said no? No, the council is the body which made a decision festival. I

believe they made the right decision to turn it down. In terms of the

government's energy policy, they are in a complete mess. Given our

obligations under the Paris agreement, we need to move towards

cleaner energy, better ways of sourcing energy. In terms of the

stability of the engine market, a bad decision for government policy

on energy, and in an immediate sense, the anger will be directed to

the gamut from people in Lancashire. We elected local councils to make

planning decisions. To have a government decision, from a person

not living in the area, does not have links air, there will be a lot

of angry people. Since taking over as Prime Minister, Theresa May

launched a consultation meaning homeowners get individual payments

for fracking wells drilled nearby. If those payments were made, would

it soften the blow? I have spoken to local people about the announcement.

There was a feeling there was an attempt to pit neighbour against

neighbour, going down quite badly. Ultimately the impact of fracking in

Lancashire, it may create a handful of jobs, but risking hundreds of

jobs, already here, in things like tourism, who will want to come on

holiday here, if it is a countryside full of fracking wells? She has said

she has had the formal government e-mail on the decision about

fracking in Lancashire, saying the Preston new Road scheme will go

ahead. The Rose Aker would scheme is on hold. We have not seen the

decision, she has seen it. Friends of the Earth saying that is the

verdict put forward by the government, as does Cuadrilla, the

company involved. We will keep you updated as we get more on that.

Let's catch up on more of the news. At least 23 people have died

after Hurricane Matthew hit Rescue workers are struggling

to reach parts of the country cut off by the most powerful Caribbean

hurricane in nearly a decade. Hundreds of thousands of people

in Florida and South Carolina have been told to evacuate

as Hurricane Matthew moves The governor of Florida

has warned the damage People caught carrying knives

illegally should face longer jail terms according

to The Sentencing Council The organisation also wants young

offenders who post films of attacks on social media

to face tougher penalties. It says it wants sentences to better

reflect public concern amid a rise A woman who lost a leg in the Smiler

roller-coaster crash at Alton Towers has told this programme she's not

doesn't see the point of being angry Vicky Balch, one of 16 people hurt

on the ride in June last year, told us that things "could have

turned out worse". Last week, Alton Towers' operator

was fined five million pounds over Independent research seen by the BBC

suggests that Heathrow Airport The people working on the ride were

working to the best of their ability. Working as they knew how to

work. I am not angry, not cross. I am more annoyed, there should have

been proper training put in place, like now.

Independent research seen by the BBC suggests that Heathrow Airport

could build a third runway without breaking European

The study - which was led by Cambridge University -

involved placing a network of air quality sensors in and

The findings are disputed by anti-3rd runway campaigners.

The government is due to announce in the coming weeks

whether it wants to expand Heathrow or Gatwick.

Kylie Minogue's British fiance has said the couple won't get married

until same-sex marriage becomes legal in Australia.

The Australian singer and English actor Joshua Sasse

announced their engagement earlier this year.

The couple have been vocal supporters of the "Say I Do Down

The government has proposed holding a public vote on same-sex

We will speak to one of Kylie Minogue's friends, Cathy let, about

that decision. She can tell us more behind the thinking. -- Kathy Lett.

We will start with the world anti-dating agency, they say hackers

who leaked medical records of some of the world's bigger sports stars

may have doctored data. The so-called Fancy Bears stole

information from wider, saying they wanted to highlight doping in sport.

Mo Farah was targeted, his records showed he had been given a mission

to take a banned substance to treat a medical condition. A wider

spokesman says not all information released reflects their own data.

Wales' footballers are in the energy take on Austria in their second

World Cup qualifier. The Austrian coach suggested Wales were lucky to

get as far as the semifinals in Euro 2016. Despite stoking the fire, he

thinks Wales will be high on self-confidence. Here is Chris

Coleman's response. That semifinal achievement, you can get lucky over

the space of 90 minutes. You don't achieve that by being lucky, that is

for sure. We had a bit of luck here or there, we had bad luck, like

everything else. The reason for our achievements, because we are a good

team. The new women's Super League champions, Manchester City will play

in the last 32 of the women's Champions League later. Two British

clubs suffering heavy first leg defeat. Chelsea losing to Wolfsburg

heavenly. Burnley thrashed 6-0 by Bayern Munich. Joanna Conser through

to the quarterfinals in Beijing. -- Johanna Konta. She had never beaten

her opponent before. The second set when 6-3 to force a deciding one. It

went all the way to a tie-break. She took it 7-2 to earn her sixth win

over the top-10 player this year. She will face Simona Halep or Zhang

in the semifinal. Justin Rose will miss the last months of the golf

season with a back injury. His last appearance came in the European

Ryder Cup defeat at the weekend. Britain most decorated Paralympian,

Dame Sarah Storey, and Laura Kenny had claimed there is inequality

between men and women's Road cycling. A minimum wage exists in

men's Road cycling, but not women. Sarah Storey say she and her

husband, Barney, have had to bear a lack of finance. I'm not sure

whether we are headed that way, but we have to attract sponsorship,

proving the events and the quality of the teams, allowing riders to

take a wage. Ultimately allowing staff to take a wage. So many

women's teams rely on volunteers. Barney and I went without payment

for three years. Even those winning things, we have been seen as a

successful team, even we do not have the revenue to pay ourselves, let

alone pay the riders. Dame Sarah Storey. Back with a brief update

just after 10:30 a.m.. The government has approved one of

two sites in the north-west of England for fracking for shale gas.

The second site has been delayed. Navy official statement from the

government. David Cox is the director of London Energy Promoting.

It is some progress, most people in the energy industry hoping we see

some real fracking going on, to see whether we can produce this gas

economically in the UK. Helping our security of supply, providing money

for the government coffers. At least we have movement and one. Presumably

the other one will be proved quite shortly. I'm expecting them to

improve both. No long on -- no word on the second one. It is not

popular, local people do not want this. That is a problem, quite a

successful campaign by the environmental lobby, against

producing our own natural resources. This has brought this country's

strengthen the past. The environmental concerns are

overblown. We will produce this gas safely, in an environmentally safe

way. We had to get on and see whether we can produce economically.

On the reassurances. How can you give people complete reassurances.

There are concerns about potentially the impact on the water,

contamination, noise, traffic pollution. There were two minor

earthquakes in Lancashire previously, prompting a temporary

ban. The earthquakes are slightly exaggerating the problem. The

geological Society told me it was more akin to a heavy lorry going

past your house. Hardly an earthquake. Nothing is completely

safe. Any industrial process, any process, has risks. The

environmental standards put in place to make sure it is done safely, I

would have no problem living next to this type of facility. There are

facilities around the UK, onshore oil and gas production feels people

do not know are there. Reducing gas and oil safely for many years. We

have to get on and see whether we can do it. Rather than pushing the

problem abroad. Produce it in Nigeria, the Middle East, the US.

Not our problem. We can use it to keep our houses warm, the

environmental concerns with the leave to you. We should produce it

ourselves, in an environmentally safe way, making money for the

national coffers. I am hearing you say you would be happy to live next

to a site producing shale gas. People living in the area may say

that is easy to say when you don't? I am an environmental scientist by

training. One of his first jobs I had when working for British Gas,

environmental monitoring on an oil-producing field, which exists

down in Dorset, in an area of outstanding natural beauty. I would

go down there, monitor the site, nobody locally knew the site was

there. A lot of fear is being got up by the environmental lobby. I don't

respect. You have to deal with the facts, not simply scare people all

the time about earthquakes, flames coming out of the, the line they

have taken so far. They sit on evidence, look at what we can do in

environmentally safe way. And we can produce this gas, if we can produce

economically, we can produce it safely, in a way that keeps our

houses warm for the next 20 or 30 years.

Thank you for joining us. We can talk now to a commodity strategist,

Christopher Ecclestone. Thank you for joining us. What is your

perspective on this? I think it is a necessary step. Frankly in a

post-Brexit environment, the UK has an energy deficit, an enormous

deficit, and it will need to deal with its energy shortages that are

imminent. The only real way that energy is available is through

exploring the fracking option. What has happened is actually just the

first step in this whole process. One cannot overdramatised it because

it is just exploration. They may not find anything. They may not find

enough. They may not find whatever would be economical to extract.

There are a number of steps to consider before reduction even came

into play. And what about the safety concerns? People are concerned. In

recent years, particularly in the US where shale gas extraction has

happened, there have been talks about earthquakes and it is obvious

that earthquakes have increased in places like Oklahoma because of

fracking. The question is whether the geology is the same as

Lancashire. I doubt it. Ultimately down the track we will have to see

how this plays out. In the US, fracking and extraction has been

very aggressive. I would think even if something is discovered in

Lancashire, the government will be very cautious about the extent and

the rate of extraction, and how it is done. There are still a lot of

decisions to be made about whether this is going to be something that

is allowed to go ahead full throttle or whether there will be lots of

restrictions placed upon it. Thank you very much. A wide range of views

on the decision on fracking. It is not popular locally. Our

correspondents David Guest is at one of the sites. What will the reaction

be there? There will be a mixed reaction. As you say, this has been

a controversial matter. I am in Little Plumpton and the site behind

me has been approved and it runs alongside Preston New Road. This has

been a contentious issue in Lancashire. This County Council

rejected the application after a very heated debate. There were lots

of protests from people in Lancashire. On the other side there

are business groups who have been arguing for the economic benefits of

fracking today, saying there is a big resource under the ground and we

should be exploiting it. On the other hand, I spoke to a protest a

short time ago who said it is a blow to democracy. Lancashire County

Council turned it down and the government

have jumped in and overturned it. The government made no secret of the

fact they were in favour of moving ahead with shale gas exploration as

a method of meeting energy needs in the UK in the coming years. Thank

you. "If people carry knives,

there is always the risk that they will be used,

and with tragic consequences" - the words of the Sentencing Council

which, along with families and friends of victims of knife

crime, is calling for people who carry knives to face

tougher prison sentences. The group, which produces guidelines

on sentencing for judges, says they need to do more to reflect

public concern about the problem. The draft guidelines also recommend

stiffer sentences for anyone who posts violent material on social

media bragging about their exploits. It comes as official figures show

that the number of people carrying a knife have gone up 13% in the last

year. Police recorded 27,000 offences involving a knife in 2015

and of those 188 resulted in death. We can talk now to Caroline

Shearer whose son Jay was stabbed and killed in 2012,

Mahamed Hashi, a youth worker from South London who admits

he once carried a weapon, and Sheldon Thomas, a former gang

member who now advises Caroline, your son was stabbed to

death when he was 17. Tell us what happened. Yes, Jay was a A-level

student at it went to a private party and it was gate-crashed.

Somebody approached his friend and Jay tried to protect his friend

saying he didn't want any trouble, and they stabbed him. It was

gate-crashed by a gang, a wannabe gang, if you like. You have had a

horrific personal experience of knife crime. What do you think when

you hear the sentencing council talking about longer sentences? For

the past four years I have been working with an array of knife crime

victims. Many of them are high profile and many of them are low

profile and we all stand together on this. The actual sentencing that

they have already got isn't working. This is a knee jerk reaction from

the government. It is a total... Just something to shut us up. Most

of these will never seek prison themselves. It is all done on

culpability. One of the questions is reasonable excuses. Can somebody

define reasonable excuse? Anything can be a reasonable excuse. Our

children are not born with knives in their hands. A reasonable excuse for

carrying a weapon? Exactly. Our children are not born with weapons

in their hands. It is down to training and education. If the

traders do not have the experience to train the children and the youth

of today, unfortunately we don't stand a chance. There has got to be

a deterrent, and the deterrent is not community work. We are talking

about people, youngsters and some older people, walking around with

weapons in their pockets. These are weapons that kill. Talking about

explaining why people would carry knives, you were attacked by

somebody with a knife, and you decided to carry something around

with you for protection, a screwdriver. Tell us about your

experience. That is right. I was stabbed in an attempted robbery on a

bus and I decided to fight back and I was overpowered. I was

subsequently stabbed. For me what that did was really upset me. The

police decided not to pursue the group of boys because it was a large

group. I thought if they can't protect me, who will? I work with a

lot of young people who have been victims of knife crime. Changing the

sentencing, as Caroline says, will make no difference. The issue is and

should be looking at what is driving Safir. For me this is an example by

the sentencing committee that they are disconnected from the problems.

-- what is driving the fear? Do you see this about fear and not bravado

and wanting to be aggressive? Definitely. I am not advocating

carrying weapons but we have got to understand the lives of some of

these young people. When you go on these estates and you see mass

unemployment, absent fathers, mothers with children from two or

three different men in some circumstances, not in all cases,

these young men are growing up where they don't want to be part of gangs.

We have got to understand that there are more young people not involved

in gangs than involved in gangs. These young people feel nobody is

keeping them safe. Remember that the youth service was disbanded many

years ago and that was one of the things that went out engaging people

on these particular estates. We don't have a safer neighbourhood

police force any more because that has been disbanded. Caroline is

shaking her head. I don't agree with that. I do not agree with because of

absence fathers and the way they have grown up. Before Jay was

murdered I was a foster carer for adolescent teenage boys who had had

horrendous lives. But they didn't go out of my home and start carrying a

weapon. There is no excuse. The only excuse they are using at the moment

is mandatory. I don't care where they come from and I don't care what

lies behind it. Yes, some of them have got but a brilliant and some of

them haven't got a father, but they are out there and they want money.

The reason they want money is for a Rolex, their shoes, and they can't

get money anywhere else. The employment isn't there for some of

these youngsters. I understand Caroline's paint and I haven't lost

a son, so I understand where she is coming from. One of the things that

I think Caroline needs to understand is it is easy for us to sit in

judgment of a young person and their life. But she is talking about

somebody carrying knives to rob someone and not in self defence.

Most of the young people carrying weapons are not out there to rob

people. I am sorry! Can I just finished? A lot of young people who

are caught our first time offenders. Secondly a lot of the people who...

But what we are talking about here with the sentencing guidelines is

repeat offenders and it is about sending out a message to stop people

using them where it does result in deaths. But you can't arrest and

lock your way out of this system. Remember this. What would stop

someone? We need to look at the psychological factors that cause

these young people to want to pick up a knife. Now specifically on

that? Training and education. Five years after I was stabbed I was

diagnosed with post traumatic stress and so many of these young people

are walking around with that. In London we have the highest

incidences of youth violence and mental health issues. Until we

address the underlying issues about why young people have this fear and

what is affecting the psychological well-being in terms of making the

right decisions, we will not get to the bottom of this. Locking somebody

up does not get to the bottom of the psychological factors and white

young children do not feel safe in their neighbourhood. -- why young

children. We need to address the root causes, which is what the

government doesn't want to do. They think by locking somebody up, it is

excess but it is a failure. We have young people going into prison,

mixing with criminals who are much more violent than they are, and they

come at worse than when they went in and that is why they repeat

offender. There is no real limitation in the prison system. We

are locking people up and making the situation worse. We have got to

understand that we have got to get to the root causes and the drivers.

If these tools and were educated at a young age before they meet their

peers. We are teaching sex education at the age of eight and we are

training young people in weapons and the dangers and the consequences and

PTSD. Which I also suffer from. I deal with hundreds of victims. My

charity isn't just about my son. On the point of the training you are

talking about, you are talking about it coming from outside the home

because they are not getting it at home. We have trained over 50,000

children so far. We have a 100% track record. We have teamed up with

Close To Home. We are in Hackney, in Barnet, the Home Office is coming

down and they need to see the training we are doing but we are

also training the trainers. The training she is talking about is

fantastic but this is what people are failing to understand. Those

children have still got to go home to broken homes, to estates. We are

in a situation where we have not accepted that society has changed

dramatically in terms of broken families, in terms of deprivation.

Caroline is making the point that not everyone from a bad background

picks up a knife. The people that will be found and arrested are

normally the ones coming from particular backgrounds. For me, I

understand both points and I do agree, but to me it is fair. -- it

is fear. You cannot train your way out of fear and talks abut it out of

it. You have got to make young people feel safe and if they don't

feel safe, they will make themselves feel safe. I didn't carry a knife,

carried a screwdriver because I was too afraid to carry a knife. Two

days into carrying that, my mum caught me and I had to face that. I

was in fear. I was six feet at 16 and I felt comfortable defending

myself but I couldn't defend myself against the larger numbers of people

armed with knives. For me the issue is when you look at prison, 95% of

the young people suffer from mental health, and you never see the

government addressing these issues in terms of the trauma they have

suffered. This is the point. I totally accept what Caroline has

said but I am in total agreement with him because we have got to

address the fear factor of children on these estates and look at the

psychological factors, which the government doesn't want to go down,

because there are costs involved. We need to look at all of that. I am

scared of guns that I don't carry one. Thank you to you all for

talking to us. Kylie Minogue and her fiance

put their wedding on hold until same-sex marriage becomes

legal in Australia. We'll speak to one of her friends,

best-selling author Kathy Lette. For the first time in 100 years why

British Vogue is featuring real women on its pages rather than

models. With the news here's Annita

in the BBC Newsroom. The government has given Cuadrilla

approval to drill for gas on one of its sites. Last year the local

council rejected the application, it appealed, the government intervened

to make the final ruling because it claimed it was so important.

At least 23 people have died after Hurricane Matthew hit

Rescue workers are struggling to reach parts of the country cut

off by the region's most powerful hurricane in nearly a decade.

Hundreds of thousands of people in Florida and South Carolina have

been told to evacuate as Hurricane Matthew moves

The governor of Florida has warned the damage there

People caught carrying knives illegally should face longer

jail terms according to the Sentencing Council

The organisation also wants young offenders who post films

of attacks on social media to face tougher penalties.

It says it wants sentences to better reflect public concern amid a rise

Independent research seen by the BBC suggests that Heathrow airport

could build a third runway without breaking

The study - which was led by Cambridge University -

found that new laws requiring cleaner engines in lorries,

buses and cars will cancel out any extra pollution

However, the findings are disputed by the pressure group,

The government is due to announce in the coming weeks whether it wants

A woman who lost a leg in the Smiler rollercoaster crash at Alton Towers

has told this programme she's not doesn't see the point of being angry

Vicky Balch, one of 16 people hurt on the ride in June last year,

told us that things could have turned out worse.

Last week, Alton Towers' operator was fined ?5 million

Join me for BBC Newsroom Live at 11 o'clock.

Time for the sport. Wales are in Vienna to take on Austria in their

second World Cup qualifier today. The Austrian coach suggesting Wales

were lucky to get as far as the semifinals in Euro 2016. Unfortunate

Austria were knocked out in the group stages. Both British clubs

suffered heavy defeats in the last 32 of the Women's Champions League.

Chelsea losing 3-0 to last year's beaten semifinalists will spur,

Hibernian thrashed 6-0 by Bayern Munich. Johanna Konta through in

three sets to reach the quarterfinals at the Chinese Open.

BBC Sports understand England have suffered another injury blow ahead

of the autumn internationals. The Bath winger Anthony Watson suffering

a broken jaw at training camp. The second led to the injured after Sam

Jones broke his leg. That is it for me, more sports news throughout the

day. Kylie Minogue won't be

marrying her fiance, Joshua Sasse, until same-sex marriage

becomes legal in Australia. Miss Minogue has previously

described Australia as backward on marriage equality,

saying the Earth didn't cave in in other countries where it is legal

and that love is love. A public vote on the issue will be

held in the country next February. Joining us now is Kathy Lette,

the Australian writer and author, And in Western Australia

is Stephen Dawson. He's an MP in the country

and was one of the first same sex couples to get married

there in 2013. Have you spoken to her about this?

They rang me, saying they had started the campaign. A brilliant

idea, embarrassing we don't have same-sex marriage. When I turn on

the television in Australia, I expect it to be black-and-white,

because we have gone back in time. They are saying you can have a

plebiscite. We don't need, 70% agree. A huge waste of money.

Malcolm Turnbull doing that to placate the right wing of the party.

They could pass the law, making us look like an advanced country. At

the moment we're just backwards. When Kylie says she will not get

married until it is legal. She has one eye on the referendum. It is

planned for February, complete waste of money. Why is it something she

feels so strongly about. Kylie is a gay icon. She is author free love,

people being able to express their love and affection to whoever they

feel drawn to. As it should be. A great spokeswoman, great advocate.

Hughes Ian loved everybody else is madly in love, they should be able

to celebrate the union in the same way. Proud for her to stand up this

way. When they come out on this issue people listen. Gets a lot of

attention. Australia has been innovative country. One of the first

countries to give women the inventing the secret ballot. First

country to have a Labour government, albeit in Queens land. We are built

on a egalitarianism and equality. The fact we are not treating people

equally in this area, perplexing embarrassing. We need to change the

law to morrow. Let's bring in Stephen Dawson, a gay MP. What do

you think about Kylie 's stepping in this way? We're very proud of her.

-- Kylie stepping in this way. Obviously the couple are very much

in love, to put on hold their marriage to assist the rest of us to

get married, makes us very proud. Will it make a difference? Look, I

hope so. Over 70% of Australians support marriage equality. The

politicians in Parliament could legislate today or tomorrow if they

wanted to. Really they need to get on with the job we pay them for. To

vote on the legislation. The referendum will go ahead in

February. What do you anticipate happening? At this stage, not clear

whether it will go ahead. A number of the vertical parties have said

they were not supported. The Green Party saying they will support it,

independence will support it. The Labour Party will eventually come

out and say they don't support it. If that is a case, there will be no

plebiscite in February. Spending upwards of $200 million on a vote

that does not count. Hopefully the plebiscite gets knocked on the head.

The politicians can make a decision we voted them in do. In countries

where gay marriage is legal, perfectly normal, they may well be

surprised to hear it is not the case in Australia? Absolutely. I am from

Ireland originally. In Catholic Ireland, people voted to allow

same-sex marriage. Really this is an issue that makes us look backwards

in Australia. We are very innovative, mostly a progressive

country, as Kathy pointed out. I hope we move on it quickly. The

other bad thing about a plebiscite, it stirs up vitriol and hatred

towards gay people. As we saw with Brexit. Look at the tragedy,

involving Jo Cox. Is that happening? , there

is concern about vitriol, attacks. There are high instances of

attempted suicide in the LG BT community. A campaign may have a

terrible impact, particularly young LG BT people in Australia. Real

concern. We should all put on our hot pants, feather bowlers, shimmy

around, refuse to do anything else until we get same-sex rights for

people in Australia. Tiara time. I'm assuming Kylie does not expect she

will never be able to get married. She said she will not get married in

Australia, they may get married somewhere else. She wants to get

married there, that is where her family and friends are. She wants to

get married here, but not until they have same-sex marriage. Is there a

final date? My lips are big, but sealed. I want to be the major

dishonour! I was seen at the party Steve. We won Kylie to get married.

-- I will see you at the party. We have work to do, to change the laws,

so Kylie and Joshua can have their nuptials here. Willie dust off the

frock? -- will you dust off. It will be frock fantastic. The gas company

Cuadrilla has won the right to fractional gas in Lancashire. A

second site has been delayed. What is fracking, David Shipman discusses

how it works. The first part of the operation

involves drilling straight down and then turning the drill horizontally

to run for miles underground. The ability to do

this is improving all The aim is to reach the tiny

fissures in the shale rock Some are less than one

millimetre across. That's where the molecules of gas

are locked away, trapped inside. Now what's called

slick water is then This forces the cracks

in the rock to Tiny grains known as propents,

a bit like sand, are The technology of this

keeps advancing. Well, with the rock

broken up, the gas is released and flushed

all the Gina Dowding is a Green councillor

for Lancashire County Council and she's also part of the group

Frack Free Lancashire. Thanks for joining us. I assume you

are disappointed with the government's move? Absolutely

devastated, as will many thousands, millions of people across the

country. Many people will be pleased, saying it is good for

business and future energy security? The business community is saying

that, the reality is, a tragedy on two France. Firstly for democracy. A

long extensive process examining the implications in the planning

application. Lancashire said no to fracking. Interesting Theresa May

said Brexit means Brexit, as far as we are concerned in Lancashire we

said no to fracking. She has overturned a democratically make

decision at a local level. It has been the government's decision to

back fracking, David Cameron was clear, in government, the government

would be going all out for shale to boost the economy, jobs and energy

security. That still does not negate the democratic process. Things have

to be examined locally. A democratically elected government.

The local council have looked at the implications for Lancashire. We have

had the expertise and examination in the county. OK for the government to

want to do something. We still are a democracy, we still need to listen

to local people. What we need from government, democratically elected

government is clear leadership on climate change. At the moment we

have Theresa May saying one thing, doing another. The fossil fuel,

shale gas industry, it is not going to help combating climate change.

What we need is a thoughtful, quick investment in and support for

renewable energy industries. On the local Democratic issues you are

talking about. There was a decision locally it would not go ahead, what

was that based on? Environmental concerns? The whole thing, in terms

of planning applications, there were material considerations taken into

account. There was an environmental health impact assessment. A public

report from the director of health, saying given the risks, given we

don't know what the health implications are, we should not go

ahead with fracking until there has been baseline monitoring. A whole

range of issues look at, water, availability of water. This industry

consumes loads of water. The fallback needs to be dealt with.

This was all looked at in detail by local people. We are right at a

time. Fracking has been happening elsewhere, that has been experienced

elsewhere? We have seen more and more the evidence coming to light,

contamination of water. New York State banning it, France banning it.

Not plain sailing for the fracking industry, not the way forward. It is

an industry of the past, we need investment and security for the

renewable energy industry. Some breaking news now. The nurse

Pauline Cafferkey, who was infected with the Ebola virus, has been taken

to hospital in Glasgow under police escort. We don't know much more

about it but she has suffered other health issues following contracting

the Ebola virus. She has been in hospital several times since

returning to Glasgow, having successfully been treated for the

Ebola virus after she contracted it in 2014. We don't know what the

latest issue is but she has been taken to hospital in Glasgow under

police escort. That is being quoted by the Press Association and we will

bring you more as we get it. Just checking if there is anything more.

Nothing more at the moment but we will stay across it and update you

if we get anything more. Lots of you getting in touch following our

conversation on knives. Let me just get some of your comments to bring

to you. We have had an email from Fiona. I am the mother of a

23-year-old son caught carrying a knife earlier this year. He got 200

hours community service and I was outraged at the leniency of his

so-called sentence. No mother wants to see her child go to prison but

where this behaviour is concerned, I do believe the law needs to send a

stronger message. I am ashamed of his behaviour but even more ashamed

that he bounced out of court laughing. Stuart has emailed. When

will UK law wake up to the real world? Unless you have an extremely

harsh deterrent sentence, criminals are laughing at the pathetic system.

We should protect law-abiding members of society and not

criminals. Isis fighters have captured large areas of Iraq and

Syria. Much of the area seized was part of the Kurdish autonomous area,

and recapturing it fell to the Kurdish forces. They have had some

success stopping Isis advances, but as winter draws in, they face

challenges. Earlier I spoke to the head of the Kurdish intelligence

agency and I asked them about the difficulty of fighting Isis in

Kurdistan and Syria and I asked him which territories he is focusing on.

Mainly in Iraq but sometimes we have got to go across the board. Isis did

a good job of taking away the borders. We focus on Syria and Iraq.

How much territory does Isis control? Only in the Kurdish region

of Iraq we have 950 kilometres of border with us. You can imagine the

scale of the territory they control, Isis. Describe how they operate. How

do they compare to a conventional enemy or any other enemy? An enemy I

have never seen anything like before. Different techniques,

different tactics all the time, very dynamic. They change their way of

operation. It takes a while to get used to. Fighting, their style of

fighting. More gorilla warfare. The techniques they have to defend

themselves, mining, trenches, they are very good at them. It has been

quite successful in slowing down the Iraqi forces and the Kurdish forces

on the ground pushing against them. For example we saw them coming up

with a new tactic which was using the civilians as human shields, and

that really slowed down the process of liberating the area, an operation

which was supposed to take two weeks. It took three months for this

reason. The 10,000 civilians remained in the area and they were

used as human shields, which made it very difficult for the coalition

forces to do air strikes. So what tactics are the Kurdish forces

deploying against them and what have you found to be successful? Look,

they change their tactics and we have got to adapt to the way they

fight. It was a difficult fight two years ago. When they came in they

were a lot stronger and with better weapons and better armoured

vehicles. It took a long time for our brave fighters to get used to

the style of fighting but since two years ago we have come a long way