19/10/2016 Victoria Derbyshire

This morning, our exclusive investigation into the debilitating

I want to stop it, but if I do, something else goes.

This man says these symptoms are the result of taking

anti-depressants, others say they've experienced terrible withdrawal

I read the leaflet and I was getting what it said. I was getting seizure

like symptoms. About one in 100 people are thought

to experience side-effects and if that's you, let us know

what those side effects are. We'll bring you an exclusive

report shortly. Also on the programme,

are these refugee recently arrived Also on the programme,

are these refugees recently arrived in the UK from the Calais camp under

18 or over 18? We'll discuss the claims that some

of the child refugees being allowed And after his apology for mocking

Islam, Olympic gymnast Louis Smith visits two mosques

and we were there I wish people who were in a similar

situation to me who are quite ignorant to religion in general to

take a step back and you know give it a chance.

We'll bring you our investigation into anti-depressants

in about ten minutes time - it's a searing insight

into the effects some of the drugs have on people,

and the terrible withdrawal symptoms sometimes experienced by those

Do get in touch if you take them, and let us know

Use the hashtag Victoria Live and if you text, you will be charged

Police have begun a murder inquiry after a prisoner was stabbed

to death at Pentonville jail in north London.

Two other inmates were critically wounded.

Two prisoners have now been arrested.

The Prison Governors Association says there has been an unprecedented

rise in the number of violent incidents and deaths in jails

in England and Wales since cuts in staffing were ordered two

Police and paramedics were called to Pentonville yesterday afternoon

and found the three prisoners with stab wounds.

One of them, a man in his 20s, died at the scene.

The two others, aged 21 and 30, were taken to hospital.

Scotland Yard's Homicide and Major Crime Command began

a murder investigation and arrested two inmates aged 34 and a 26.

Pentonville is a Category B prison, built in Victorian times,

Just days ago in an internal newsletter Pentonville's Governor

Kevin Reilly noted that people had become more and more

anxious about violence here over the past few weeks.

In February last year, prison inspectors ruled the jail

was performing poorly because of staff shortages,

overcrowding and inmates' easy access to drugs.

Levels of violence had almost doubled since the previous

Just last week, the Prison Governors Association called for a public

inquiry into the state of jails in England and Wales and why deaths

It says staff and prisoners are working and living in squalid

and brutal conditions which shouldn't be tolerated.

The Prison Service says it's investigating an incident

at Pentonville and it would be inappropriate to comment further.

We will bring you more on that throughout the programme.

Joanna is in the BBC Newsroom with a summary

Fighters with the terror group Islamic State are accused

of using civilians as human shields in the embattled

Reports say they're not allowing residents to flee Mosul as Iraqi

forces battle to retake control of what's now the last

The Iraqi army advances towards the city of Mosul, the last bastion for

so-called Islamic State in the country. They say they've taken

several villages south of the city. Meanwhile, to the east, their

Kurdish allies, the Peshmerga close in. This soldier raises his arm, a

sign of victory. They say they too have seized areas defended by

pockets of IS fighters. The machine is said to be ahead of schedule with

claims the co-operation between the Iraqi and Kurdish forces has caught

IS off its guard. The speed should be the key element of this

operation. The sooner, the better to prevent, avoid major humanitarian

exodus or complexities that nobody needs.

But while the Iraqi and Kurdish military say they've met little

resistance, this video has been released on social media. It claims

to show Islamic State fighters attacking Kurdish forces.

As the attack gets closer to Mosul, the risks for those inside increase.

There are reports people are not being allowed to leave, used by IS

as human shields. Some have managed to flee to refugee camps, others

take shelter in places they hope are safe like this abandoned school.

This woman walked for three hours with her three children. She had to

leave one of her sons behind. TRANSLATION: I left because I have

diabetes. There is no treatment there. All the medicines have run

out. We were trapped. There was nothing there. I have a disabled

son. I left him. I couldn't carry him. This man described the

dangerous journey out of Mosul. TRANSLATION: We saw dead bodies on

the way here. They were killed by land mines, but thank God we got to

the camp. There are fears up to one million

people could be displaced. The innocent victims caught up in a

battle that aims to liberate them. Dentists have dismissed a call

for migrants arriving from Calais to have their teeth tested to verify

that they're children. Several newspapers have questioned

the age of youths coming to the UK The Tory MP for Monmouth,

David Davies, has suggested that dental examinations

could prove their ages. But the British Dental Association

says it would be unethical to give x-rays which aren't

for medical purposes. 12 more children, from Syria,

Pakistan and Afghanistan, are leaving Calais this morning

for the UK. People who say their lives have

been ruined by commonly prescribed anti-depressants,

known as SSRIs, are due to take their case to

Parliament later today. It's thought about one in 100 people

experience severe side-effects This programme has been speaking

to some people who've experienced President Obama has accused

Donald Trump of "whining" for saying that the election

is being rigged against him. With opinion polls indicating

he's lost further ground to Hillary Clinton, Mr Trump has

stepped up his claims of voter fraud ahead of the third and final

presidential debate tonight. But President Obama

is unsympathetic. If you start whining before

the game is even over, if whenever things are going badly

for you, and you lose, you start blaming somebody else,

then you don't have what it takes Builders' merchant, Travis Perkins,

says it is cutting 600 jobs and closing more than 30 branches

as it warned about The group said the bulk

of the branch closures will come in its heating and plumbing division

after a "disappointing" performance. The company, which employs

28,000 staff group-wide, says it hopes to relocate

some of the affected The Olympic gymnast,

Louis Smith, has visited two Mosques to learn more

about Islam after a video emerged of him and a friend making

fun of Islamic prayers. The four-time Olympic medallist met

Muslims yesterday instead of attending the London parade

to honour the British athletes We'll bring you that

exclusive report shortly. Northamptonshire Police have

released a picture of a man who they wish to trace in connection

with an alleged theft The man entered a branch

of Dunelm Mill and attempted to conceal the blind down one

trouser leg and up the back After failing to pay for it,

he was followed by staff up a nearby canal path,

where he dropped the blind That's a summary of

the latest BBC News. We will look at the side-effects

that people get when they take antidepressants. One viewer says

they destroyed me life. This tweet, "When I was on SSRIs I had such

intense night terrors, I couldn't cope. I came off them a year ago and

I will never go back on them. " Another e-mail, "I was prescribed a

range of different antidepressants over a 30 year periodment their

side-effects were horrendous and affected my ability to function. I

had blurred vision, itchy skin, weight gain and gastro problems and

they robbed me of my motivation and caused serious cognitive decline

which ruined my time at university. I wanted to sleep 24/7. Over the

years I found it impossible to stop taking antidepressants and I often

ended up in hospital whenever I tried."

Tell us your experience. You're texting, you will be charged

at the standard network rate. And first, we've got Leicester

and they are producing last year's Premier League form on the European

stage now aren't they? The manager is not happy. They only

got eight points from eight matches. Go into Europe, the Champions League

and making their debut in the competition they made it three out

of three and they are the best team in the Champions League at the

moment. Last night they beat FC copen haggen. Just the one goal

there. They've already beaten bRution and Porto. Casper

Schmeichel, what a save that was against the Danes to keep them in

that. Spurs have been blowing hot and cold in the Champions League,

but they have their keeper to thank for their point. What about that?

Look at the replay. He kept just the right side of the line. They've won

one and lost one and drawn one. They are second in their group, but they

are the only unbeaten team in the Premier League so it is a flip

situation to Leicester, the way that swap spurs are playing.

Tonight, it's Pep Guardiola's return to Barcelona,

will he get a good reception at his old club?

He will get a fantastic reception. He has been returned to Barcelona

with Bayern Munich a couple of seasons, but going back there

Manchester City. Manchester City played Barcelona a lot in the

Champions League over the past few seasons, but Pep Guardiola he won 14

trophies in four seasons as manager with Barcelona. Also won the

Champions League as player. He has got his own seat at the Nou Camp! It

will be really tough because Man City aren't playing well at moment.

Also in that group, it is tougher for Celtic. They are playing this

evening and Arsenal are playing the Bulgarians.

The Olympic and Paralympic celebrations,

And And Lucy Smith didn't take part? Yes, the Olympic and Paralympic

medallist took part. They had a Palace reception at Buckingham

Palace. They met the Queen and Prince Philip, but Lewis Smith

wasn't there. Choosing to go and accept an invitation to visit the

Muslim community after the video emerged of him seeking to mock the

Islamic faith and I know you've got an exclusive film coming up. But it

was a great day. It has been a great couple of days for the Olympians and

Paralympians, but the parades part within and two are over now, they

have got four years to get ready to do it again in Tokyo.

Cheers, Olly, thank you very much. Pauline e-mailed us

to say, "Dear Victoria. I watch your show every morning

and wondered if you could help. I was on anti-depressants

after pressure at work. It has taken me four years,

yes four years to get off them and now four months into no

tablets, I'm in hell. Will you please do an item

about withdrawing my anti-depressants and the hell people

are going through? It feels like trying to get off

heroin or something. This is a big thing, please,

please do something on it." As a result of that e-mail this

morning we're going to look at their extreme side-effects -

both when it comes to withdrawing from them - and when you're

actually taking them. Later today - people

who say their lives have been ruined by commonly

prescribed antidepressants, known as SSRIs, are taking

their case to Parliament. Some users have told this programme

the tablets have made them suicidal. Whilst for most people the pills

can save their lives. It's thought about one in 100 people

experiences severe side-effects I was semi conscious just having

seizure after scuzure after scuzure. -- seizure after scuzure. I thought

I had some kind of terminal illness. I look and feel like a drug addict.

Some days I can barely function or get out of bed. I was just in a mess

basically. One in 11 British adults takes antidepressants. The number of

pills prescribed have doubled in the last decade. In England last year,

61 million tablets were handed out. They cost the NHS ?780,000 a day.

But they're not helping everyone. Clare believes her life has been

ruined by a variety of antidepressants. She's been left

with constant muscle ache and fatigue and spends most days in bed.

She started taking the tablets 20 years ago whilst caring for her

seriously ill mother and studying for her final exams at Cambridge. I

took them are descended into suicide feelings within days. I was an

absolute mess. I could not read, I could not concentrate on anything, I

was absolutely wanting to take my life continually. She told her

doctor, who put her on a higher dose of different antidepressants. Or God

-- Oh, God. Within two weeks I tried to take my own life twice. What was

scary, when I first started taking them, I read the leaflet and I was

getting exactly what it said, I was getting symptoms were my muscles

were jolting arounds of their own accord and I felt disorientated and

sick and I had the jest of problems and infections, it was really

extreme -- digestive problems. All I can remember is being on the bedroom

floor in a semiconscious state, having a seizure then another

seizure. Claire is not alone in suffering serious side-effects

whilst on the drugs which are designed to affect how the brain

works. It is generally thought depression happens when the level of

the mood enhancing chemicals serotonin falls. The antidepressant

is designed to stop that happening. But David Healy, who has written

several books on antidepressants, thinks the drugs could actually be

dangerous for many more patients than is hinted at in medical

leaflets. They suggest maybe one in 100 could suffer adversely. He

believes the drugs could make a lot of people's problems worse. One in

four people become more anxious rather than less, and they can

become extraordinarily anxious, so that some people will become

agitated and go on to become suicidal. The drugs can become the

problem that they are then used to treat. We asked the drug companies

for interviews but they declined. They say there are plenty of

warnings in the literature that comes with the pills. The problem is

the literature is literally arm's-length and GPs admit it is not

often taken seriously. The companies have to include every side affect

everyone has ever described. Sometimes, people are on tablets,

something goes wrong, they reported, it goes into the leaflet. It might

not be anything to do with the tablet. There is a very long list of

potential side effects and that is one of the reasons we don't give

them out lately. -- lightly. But we must not underestimate the impact

severe depression has. Moderate depression and severe depression

wrecks lives and it costs lives. Do you think they work most of the time

for people? For people with severe depression, you may well need to try

to three before they work but for most people with severe depression

we can find a medicine that will help them and where the benefits

will outweigh the risks. Beer we are, that is what it is doing. This

is what it is doing. Darren doesn't agree. He developed severe muscle

spasms and a stammer when doctors increased the dose of an

antidepressant he'd used for years. I can stop it but if I do, something

else goes. He's allowed us to use this film. He's now trying to come

off drugs altogether. Since I began researching the story

iPad scores of e-mails from all over the world of people suffering not

just side-effects but severe withdrawal symptoms when they stop

taking the drugs. -- I have had scores of e-mails. I could not walk

and was experiencing the most horrendous sensory sensations. My

muscles were burning. It has been 17 months and I'm still recovering.

Every day is a living hell. I'd just get through. Some days I can barely

function. I look and feel like a drug addict. I cannot focus. There

seems to be more women than men who have great difficulty trying to

reduce the dose. Even just trying to reduce, not just getting off. If

they hold the treatment straight from the dose they can become

terribly agitated, suicidal, and when you look at clinical trials,

the taper phase is the riskiest period, when people are most likely

to commit suicide and do other terrible things. I tried about 89

years ago to come off. Professor Healy helps people who have

struggled in the past. What happened? I was in a mess basically,

I reached the point where I could barely function, I was highly

anxious, I was unable to sleep. Gemma, which is not her real name,

came off slowly, but withdrawal symptoms were so bad she is now back

on the tablets. Her words are spoken for her. I fell apart. I was

petrified, I was crying my eyes out. I did not know what was happening to

me. I guess that could be the medication. But I thought I had some

kind of terminal illness, I just did not know what was happening. You

finally decided to go back on the drugs. Why did you do that? The only

way to stop the withdrawal symptoms was to reinstate them. Really,

that's what happened. I was shocked. I reinstated and all the migraines,

the muscle aches, everything just stopped instantly. I'm not for a

second saying nobody gets side-effects, what we need to be and

made is some patients who've taken these have been very vulnerable,

anxious, and it can be very difficult to tell what is anxiety

and what is the tablets. Whilst I absolutely believe that a

significant minority of patients can have side effects for weeks,

possibly months, I would be surprised if all of that effect

related to the tablets in years. They say GPs don't take them

seriously. I take with all side very seriously. But what we need to bear

in mind is that the right patient taking the rates tablets at the rate

dose for the right length time, we can not only transform quality of

life, we can literally keep some patients alive who otherwise would

not be. I think the medical profession puts a Band Aid on mental

health. They are not informing people properly so they think

medication is the answer to everything. Is maybe a minority of

people that have these extreme reactions but they exist. -- it may

be. If you look at the leaflets in the packets, it says, one in 100

people have this symptom, one in 1000, they've got to realise that

one person might be their patients. It does happen.

We have an e-mail, one person says, I was on them for seven years, ...

This person, I was prescribed and when I tried to stop I went into

massive withdrawal like you read heroin users get. I learned how to

taper them slowly. I'm so pleased you are highlighting best. --

highlighting this. One person said they've tried many times to come off

them and suffered debilitating symptoms when I try. Now, due to a

current medical problem I'm needing to take another. This person says

I'm taking antidepressants for severe oppression and they have

saved my life. I'm keen to hear more of your experiences. We will try and

speak to you later in the programme. Karen in Lancashire has been taking

antidepressants for 12 years. How are you? Not so bad. Tell us about

the side-effects. I've been taking them for 12 years and every time

I've tried to come off them I've got down to the lowest dose and as soon

as I try and stop them, I get suicidal thoughts after three days,

I get electric shocks from my head to my toes, feel like I'm walking on

the moon and I feel generally hideous, it is horrible. I've given

up. You've given up trying to come off because it's not worth it? I was

going to say, my GP said the dose I take is negligible so it's better to

stay on them than come off and have the horrendous side-effects. Does

that mean you will be on this low-dose indefinitely? Probably.

Until I can find the guts to come off and go through the horrible side

effects. It is so bad I cannot do it any more. It looks like I will be on

them for however long. Thanks for talking to us. Really appreciate it.

You can get in touch in the usual ways and we will speak to you.

Claims that some of the child refugees brought into the UK are

actually adults. We will speak to the MP who is calling for a dental

examination is to assess the ages of the refugees. Trying to move on and

learn from is the stake. We've got an exclusive report with Louis

Smith, who has visited mosques after a video emerged of him mocking the

call to prayer. Joanna is in the BBC

Newsroom with a summary Police have begun a murder inquiry

after a prisoner was stabbed to death at Pentonville jail

in north London. Two other inmates are in

a critical condition in hospital and two prisoners

have been arrested. The Prison Governors Association has

renewed calls for a public inquiry amid what it calls

an "unprecedented" rise in prison The US has accused the so-called

Islamic State group of using civilians as human shields

in the battle for the American-led air strikes have been

supporting the offensive by the Iraqi army and other ground

forces to retake the city, which is the militant group's last

major stronghold in the country. The military campaign began

on Monday, and there's increasing concern for civilians

trapped by the fighting. People who say their lives have

been ruined by commonly prescribed antidepressants,

known as SSRIs, are due to take their case to

Parliament later today. It's thought about one in 100 people

experience severe side-effects This programme has been speaking

to some people who've experienced I read the leaflet and I was getting

exactly what it said, seizure symptoms. My muscles were jolting

around of their own accord. I felt disorientated and sick and I had

digest of problems -- digestive problems. Really extreme. I don't

know how to begin. All I can remember is being on the bedroom

floor in a semiconscious state having seizures.

The British Dental Association says checking the teeth of child migrants

from Calais in order to make sure they're under eighteen

It comes after the Conservative MP for Monmouth, David Davies,

suggested that dental examinations could prove their ages,

saying some of those arriving don't look like children.

12 more children, from Syria, Pakistan

and Afghanistan, are leaving Calais this morning for the UK.

President Obama has accused Donald Trump of "whining"

for saying that the election is being rigged against him.

Mr Trump has stepped up his claims of voter fraud ahead of the third

and final presidential debate tonight.

But President Obama is unsympathetic.

If you start whining before the game is even over,

if whenever things are going badly for you, and you lose,

you start blaming somebody else, then you don't have what it takes

A rocket has blasted off from the International Space Station. Speed

and lift off. The crew lifted off as scheduled and is set to dock at the

space out post in two days time. The launch was set for September, but it

was postponed because of a technical issue with the spacecraft.

That's a summary of the latest BBC News.

This e-mail, "I wish to remain anonymous. I'm a 34-year-old male.

Ten years on antidepressants and they have ruined my ability to have

a sexual relationship. As a result of this, it has ruined my ability to

have any sort of a relationship. It contributed to the loss of my

partner of eight years. Had I known that antidepressants, I would never

have taken them. I feel suicidal as a result." Christian says, "Before

taking antidepressants my doctor informed me that cold coming off was

harder than coming off horn. I suffered side-effects, the sensation

that somebody was stomping around in my head. Every time I moved my head,

I wanted to lie down to make it stop." Lisa says, "They have got me

through the darkest days of my life including severe postnatal

depression. The one I'm taking has saved my life." Thank you for those.

More to come. I will read as many as I can through the sport.

Leicester made it three wins out of three in the Champions League.

Three more points in the return leg against the Dane ins a fortnight

will see them qualify for the knock-out stage. Tighter in

Tottenham's group. It was goalless. Spurs remain second

in that group. Tonight, Pep Guardiola returns to Barcelona as

Manchester City take on the Spanish champions, Barcelona at the Nou

Camp. Pep Guardiola won 14 trophies there as the manager. Celtic and

Arsenal are playing this evening and rounding off two days of

celebrations in Manchester, and London, Great Britain's Olympic and

Paralympic medallists from the Rio Games met the Queen and other

members of the Royal Family at Buckingham Palace.

That's all for now. I will be back after 10am.

The latest jobless figures have just come out.

Our economics correspondent Andy Verity is here.

For which month and which quarter and what do they say? It is for the

three months to the end of August. Unemployment ticked up in that three

month period. Now, it has been on a downward trend for a while. This is

only a tick up of 10,000 and the statistics are estimates so you

can't even be certain that it has ticked up, but according to the

Office for National Statistics' best estimate had it has risen. On the

other hand there is good news on earnings. We were worried they were

sagging a bit. You have got average earningsks cluing bonuses rising by

2. #3e %. And that too is an estimate, but it is a better

estimate than we had hoped for. OK, possible explanations for if the

10,000 increase is accurate, why? Well, you might speculate that the

labour market is slowing down a little bit. The economy generally is

slowing down. So therefore, it would be logical for recruitment to slow

down. This is, of course, a three month period which includes July and

August so it includes more of the post referendum period than any

previous statistics we've had. And those who didn't want us to leave

the EU will probably say that this is because of a post Brexit

referendum effect that it knocked confidence at least in July, but we

know already that confidence did rebound in August so even if you say

well, maybe post Brexit, unemployment ticked up slightly, you

can't be sure that's a sustained trend. Thank you very much, Andy.

Thank you. Next, Olympic gymnast Louis Smith

has visited two Mosques in an attempt to learn more

about Islam after a video emerged of him and a friend mocking

the Islamic call to prayer. At the time, the four-time Olympic

medallist apologised unreservedly, calling it the lowest point

in his career. Now, in an attempt to learn

and move on from his mistake the 27-year-old has been to meet

members of the Muslim community, and this programme has had

exclusive access to it. Louis Smith has asked us not to show

the video which emerged last week because he doesn't

want to cause further offence. He missed the London parade

yesterday honouring Olympic athletes to visit the mosques

and Athar Ahmad went with him I remember watching Lewis

wine his medal in 2012, so when this video came out

it was disappointing. A lot of people have also been

saying, you know, we forgive you, but we're not going to forget

what you've done. Ultimately I'm a human

being, and I messed up. You've got bags and things, you get

scanned through. You get scanned with your card

when you come through. It is literally like

the Olympic Games. Shoes are fine, up to here,

so if you want to... What do you think about Lewis coming

down today to visit you guys, Islam and the holy Prophet Mohammad,

Sallallahu 'Alaihi wa Sallam, he taught people that Islam

teaches you forgiveness, and if you've made a mistake,

you've made a mistake, And this has opened up

a door for dialogue The whole point is about what is

going on in society today, to bring people together,

and just to create peace It's great that I have only

been here five minutes, and I have learned more in that five

minutes than I have in the last 27 years, because the only thing

you pick up is on TV, That meat is quite spicy -

I'm quite sensitive to spice. On Twitter and stuff,

a lot of Muslims I have seen, you know, they have come out

and said, you have apologised and that's enough, but you've gone

out of your way to come down today. Why did you decide

to follow up on that? Because I am a person of influence

in the public eye and, you know, I have known that for a while,

and what you say can resonate with some people on a personal

level, and what I didn't want is people to see that video

and think it's OK to do what I did or take it one step further,

or two steps further or, you know, have it lead to something

completely outrageous, so me being a person of influence,

if I can take time out of my day and widen my horizon to look

at what Islam is and what it teaches, perhaps other people might

take that time or even just be a bit more relaxed about the situation

and about what Islam preaches. So we are off to another mosque now,

20 minutes from here. Was it awkward meeting those

guys down the mosque? The journey to where I was going -

I mean, you play scenarios over in your head -

is anyone going to be resentful, is anyone going to squeeze your hand

too hard when they shake it? You know, will anyone give

you a smart comment? Things like that, but ultimately I'm

a human being and I messed up, and if I get those reactions

from anyone within the community, What I did was offensive,

but it has been a real eye opener, meeting everyone and seeing

how humble they are, and seeing how peaceful they are,

and I think, you know, I think if people saw what I did,

it would open their eyes as well. No, I'm not doing the parade

this time around. I mean, I don't want

to antagonise situations. I don't want people to feel like,

he has done what he has done, and know he's out having a great

time, he's out partying That must be hard, though,

seeing all the other athletes celebrating their victory

and success, and not being there? It is hard, but at the same time

I'm in this position because of my own actions

and my own behaviour. I can get back into the sport,

I can do competitions and, you know, I have no doubt that I can be one

of the best sportsmen in the world. But I'm not focused on that -

people are slapping all sorts of labels on me

after the video, and... What kind of things have

people been saying? Because it's such a fine

line between offence... You know, people have been

calling me a racist. I think what was seen

in that video is, yes. But in terms of what I stand for,

day-to-day, when I wake up in the morning, when I go to bed

at night, that video is not a representation of what I am

or what I believe in. Have you ever

met an imam before? No, never, or if I have I didn't

know that they were one. Like I said, I tend to just

keep my life sport and the kind If the news comes on,

I switch it off, so I live And this whole situation has

definitely made me realise there is a bigger world out there,

and you need to kind of climb out your little shell and start

to kind of look at the world I remember watching Lewis

win his medal in 2012, and when you have that association

with someone who has represented your country,

so when this video came out it was disappointing

and I thought, oh, should I have But today shows again that, yeah,

it was the right thing to do - we supported you and you are really

good at what you do, and we are proud as Britons

to support you in every way, so... Thank you very much.

It is very kind of you to say. How does it make you

feel, hearing that? It backs up my original feelings

of being disappointed in myself and it makes me know that I have

made the right decision coming here and, you know, embracing

what you guys have to offer, and to teach, so I have made

the right decision in terms of accepting their invitation

incoming and I wish people of accepting their invitation

in coming and I wish people who are in a similar situation

to me, who are quite ignorant to religion in general,

to kind of take a step back I was a little bit nervous

about coming down, you know, Feeling a bit of pressure to know

more than what I actually do. It has been a very big eye opener,

and I am very glad that I took the time to come down and meet

the people that I have. Do you think you can now draw a line

under all of this Do you know what, I would

like to carry on getting to know Hopefully this is the start

of something new. There is more on that throughout

the day on BBC Asian Network. The European Space Agency is hoping

to land a probe on the red planet We'll get the insights of a panel

of scientists and stargazers Around 30 child refugees have been

brought to the UK this week from the migrant camp in Calais,

and we've just heard that another 12 The Government says they're

all under 18, but that's been questioned on the basis of photos

which show stubble on their chin A facial recognition programme

is said to estimate one But the Home Office says

its assessments are based on interviews and judgements

about physical appearance The Conservative MP David Davies

is calling for all child migrants to have their teeth tested

to check their ages, but the British Dental Association

says it would be unethical. That's because you can't do x-rays

unless they're for medical reasons We will speak to them in just a

moment. First, our correspondent is that the camp in Calais. How do

officials decide who is allowed to come to the UK? That is being

organised by a group called Safe Passage UK. They said the main

checks on people are either some of the children had passports or they

make contact with the family members in the UK and try to build up as

bigger picture as they can have exactly how vulnerable these

children are and how old they are by speaking to those relatives. These

charities don't do any medical checks over here because they don't

feel that is their job. They have to rely on documentation and speaking

to relatives. I spoke to the sub prefect of some of the officials who

has been overseeing the process of moving them from the channel to the

UK. We've seen 12 more children leave

the jungle, they saw younger -- they were younger than the children we

saw arriving in the UK on Monday, we had 14 on Monday, 13 yesterday, it's

a process continuing and we are told 100 likely to make the journey this

week. One of those expected to arrive is the 13-year-old boy who

featured in our exclusive film with Lily Allen.

The camp is closing in a couple of weeks. What are you going to do?

You've been trying to jump on lorries to get into the UK. That

must be terrifying. If that scary? From what I'm hearing from the

refugee volunteers in the camp, you've got a legal right to be in

the UK. Had he started that process? Have you filled out the forums?

I apologise on behalf of my country. I'm sorry for what we've put you

through. Simon, that 13-year-old's father

lives in Birmingham. You've spoken to the boy today. He was one of the

12 children who were setting off today and being taken across the

Channel. Today, smiling faces, he told me he was looking forward to

being reunited with members of his family. He'd been living in the

jungle for months and said that was no place for a human being, echoing

the thoughts Lily Allen made when she came over. Small thoughts. It is

thought there are around 1000 other unaccompanied children here.

Potentially only 100 will come to the UK. The clock is ticking because

these ramshackle huts will be torn down as early as next Monday. The

key thinker charities is to get the children out of this situation

before that destruction begins. Some newspapers have used this photograph

but charities have told us they believe he is in fact a translator.

In a few moments we hope to speak to the Conservative MP for Monmouth,

David Davies. Before that we will talk to Zoe Gardner, Caroline

Gregory and Judith husband, chair of the British dental Association's

education, ethics and dental team working group. Would it be possible

to take x-rays of some of the refugees Keith to ascertain their

age? This has been suggested many times over the years and there has

been a huge amount of research done. It seems like a cheap solution but

there is a huge range in development of the human body, especially wisdom

teeth, which is what we are talking about. As we know, some people can

have their wisdom teeth when they are 16, 17. Some into their 20s.

Some don't have wisdom teeth at all. It is a very inaccurate way of

trying to ascertain a complex decision because we are always

talking about a definite point in time, the age 18, whether somebody

is younger or older. We can the vine range but to say a specific age is

almost impossible -- defined. Would it be ethical in your view? It is

absolutely not ethical. It involves informed consent. Even though the

risk of radiation is very low there is still a risk and if there is no

benefit for the individual we should not be undertaking it. Whilst we try

and track down David Davies, let's hear a clip of what he said earlier.

When you look at the photographs you can see why there is some doubt some

of these refugees are not under the age of 18. I think the clip you were

talking about there, where charities are saying this photograph being

touted of this as actually being a translator, speaks to this wider

media narrative, this hysteria from people sitting at home thinking that

is not right. Do you think it is hysteria? We are talking about 30

young people who are homeless and have fled some of the most dangerous

countries in the world, coming to be rejoined and sleep in a bed tonight

with their family members. I think it is hysteria. But do you accept

that the public need to have confidence in the system?

Absolutely, but we need to accept that the narrative being put forward

in some of the tabloid press, that has been absolutely shamefully

picked up on by opportunistic MPs, is absolutely false. We have a very

rigorous system of checks for age assessments, they are extremely

harrowing. We work every day with child asylum seekers and we know

what they go through. We know that we see so many cases of people who

turn out to be 14, 15, who have been questioned for hours on their own

with no responsible adult present, no legal representation, to try to

catch them out to ascertain their age. Far more often, we see hundreds

and hundreds of children being paid out of court settlements because

they are detained in detention centres because they are

misdiagnosed as being adults. There are far more cases of young people

falsely claiming than vice versa. We are talking about young people

fleeing war zones. There are two teams in Calais, but we've just had

this in from the Home Office, sources suggest that migrant

children arriving from Calais will be subject to additional checks in

the UK. What those additional checks include, further interviews about

their background and their fingerprints will be cross checked

with other details. We can talk to David Davies in Westminster. Can you

see me? Thank you for talking to us. It is the government who decides

which refugees come to Britain from Calais and there are two Home Office

teams in Calais working out who can come. What is the issue? At the

moment the government guidance is if somebody says they are under the age

of 18 they need to be given the benefit of the doubt. They are not

just asking one simple question, is it? They are asking questions but

they need to give the benefit of the doubt. What I'm saying is that is

probably not quite as stringent as I would like. Particularly given the

appearance of all the people coming over. There is a test which will

determine their age with a fair degree of accuracy and I think where

there are doubts then we ought to be willing to ask people to undergo a

quick dental check or wrist x-rayed. Where would that take place? In a

medical centre. In this country? Ideally in France. Do you think

there are x-ray machines in the jungle? I'm not suggesting that.

You'd obviously have to do it in a proper medical place, I'm not

suggesting that. I know that some people are quite emotional about

this and I just think we don't get carried away. Everyone in Britain

wants to help genuine children. The NGOs were suggesting young children

need help and I want that helped to be to them. There are also going to

be people there who will say or do anything to get into the UK and

we've got to be careful we don't allow people to abuse the

hospitality we want to extend to children. Where somebody has an

appearance that makes them look like they are well into their 20s, we

could be putting at risk people in this country. I dealt with a case

where a woman who was a foster carer was asked to foster what she thought

was a 12 or 13-year-old boy who turned out to be in his 20s, and as

serious offence took place which is still going through the courts.

We've got to be mindful of the fact that if people are lying about their

age they could be putting at risk other people. Particularly if we're

going to put people schools. I'd like to introduce you to Judith

husband. She is the chair of the British dental Association's

education, ethics working group. Could you tell David Davis about the

accuracy of those checks? I want to pick up on the comment of a quick

dental check. It's a very complex set of decisions, even once the

radiograph is taken. An ordinary dentist would not be able to make

that decision, it has been evidenced that the huge range we are looking

at in development within individuals, these are not accurate

on an individual level. Especially when we are talking about deciding

whether someone is 17 or 21. It is inaccurate as well as being

unethical. Can I come back on that? I would first of all say that I

don't think it is unethical at all and you seem to have gone very big

on this question of whether it is ethical. That's a matter of judgment

and we will have to beg to differ. These tests are used in all

countries around the world, they've been used without controversy. We

use them in the UK at the moment. You've come on to say we don't like

them but we've been using them for 20 years. You are absolutely

correct. I was involved ten years ago and 2011 as well. We had an

expert group, we look at all the evidence and complications and it is

not a case of just taking one radiograph or x-ray. It is very

complex, decision process, eating an individual, as has already been

alluded to. -- ageing. The interviews and gathering life

experiences. Just to state that a simple dental radiograph will solve

our problem is simply not true. I was good to introduce you to

Caroline Gregory, a volunteer in the Calais camp. Is it fair to say some

of the refugees will say they were under 18 because they are desperate

to get to Britain? I disagree with that. That has not been our

experience here. These checks have been thorough and these judgments

being made about these children based on their appearance, and yet I

know that Mr Davies says they've got lines around the rise and they look

older than he has but I would suggest they have had far harder

alive than he has had, they've not had the comfort he has had, many of

them have seen their children killed in front of them and experienced

very great trauma and that is why they were older than 18. How do you

respond to that? it If people have had hard lives

they end up looking younger because they won't go through puberty at the

same time as people brought up in a more comfortable lifestyle. Zoe is

smiling at your suggestion that they would end up looking younger? I was

at the camp last year and everywhere I went there were caravans run by

activists and NGOs and all sorts of people offering advice to people on

what to say in order to get into the United Kingdom. So it frankly

beggars belief that somebody who is willing to jump on to a moving lorry

or risk jumping on to a live rail wouldn't be willing to exaggerate

their age if it meant they will be able to get into the UK. It is

naivety to think that and especially as we have been into that camp and

we know there are people there who will tell you what to say. There is

a suggestion from some of the charities that at least one of the

photographs in today's newspaper is of a translator? I don't know that.

There have been various photographs and doubts raised over the age

partly because the NGOs gave us the impression that we would be dealing

with children as young as ten, 11 or 12. It is two Home Office teams

making the decisions in Calais? I have gone through the Government

advice as to what they have to do. They have told to give anyone the

benefit of the doubt if they say they are under the age of 18. I'm

suggesting perhaps that guidance needs to be updated and perhaps we

shouldn't give everyone the benefit of the doubt and we should make the

assumption that just possibly some people will be willing to frankly

tell fibs if it means the difference between getting into the UK or not

getting into the UK. It is obvious that will happen. I have walked

around the camp and I have seen the notices saying, "Come in, we will

tell you what to say in order to get into the UK." I would ask you to ask

the activists to deny that's going on. I have got it on YouTube. If

anyone wants to see it, it is on YouTube.

We will talk to a former refugee about his legal challenge to the

Government over the Calais child migrants.

It is time for the weather. It is looking good across large swathes of

the United Kingdom. It is looking good in the West Midlands and it is

a pretty picture down in the south-west of England. This was

taken in Dorset. However, the further east you go, the skies are

looking threatening out towards Norfolk. There is thicker cloud and

there is a scattering of showers up and down the eastern coast. That's

where we have got a breeze. One or two showers further west into parts

of Wales, but the focus is across the eastern side of England towards

Suffolk. We will see showers coming in on the breeze, but moving away

further inland and most places are fine and dry. Good spells of

sunshine for many. There maybe a shower or to in the north and east

of Scotland. Head further west and it is dry and bright and spells of

sunshine. Not particularly windy. It is 12 or 13 Celsius in Northern

Ireland, patchy cloud and some spells of sunshine. Showers, few and

far between through the afternoon across Wales and the south-west of

England. Some lengthy spells of sunshine, but a shower or two, but

most of the showers will be further east where it is breezy. Top

temperatures around 14 and maybe 15 Celsius if you're lucky. Through

this evening, we keep the showers going on the eastern side of

England. Still breezy. Elsewhere, the winds are lighter, particularly

so across Scotland and Northern Ireland, and it is here where we

will see temperatures dipping away to five or six Celsius in the centre

of Glasgow. Lower than in rural spots. A touch of frost and maybe

some fog patches by dawn. I'm Victoria Derbyshire,

welcome to the programme This morning, our exclusive

investigation into the side-effects I didn't know what on earth

was happening to me. I guessed it could be

the medication. I reinstated and all

the migraines and the muscle aches, everything just

stopped instantly. Many of you are saying those

symptoms are the result of taking antidepressants.

About one in 100 people are thought to experience side-effects.

We'll be talking to some of them shortly.

We have been told there will be extra age checks for child refugees

after they have arrived in the UK. Some observers say they look a lot

older than 18. The narrative that's been put

forward in some of the tabloid press has been shamefully picked up on by

opportunistic MPs is false. We have a very rigorous system of checks for

age assessments and they're harrowing.

It's a question that's been asked for most of our lives and we might

Joanna is in the BBC Newsroom with a summary

Sources the Home Office say it is unlikely that any migrants would be

returned to Calais as they would be able to claim asylum in the UK

regardless of age. Several newspapers have questioned

the age of youths who have been brought here this week. 12 more will

arrive today. Police have begun a murder inquiry

after a prisoner was stabbed to death at Pentonville jail

in north London. Two other inmates were

critically wounded. The Prison Governors Association

says there's been an unprecedented rise in the number of violent

incidents and deaths in jails in England and Wales,

since staffing cuts were ordered two The US has accused the so-called

Islamic State group of using civilians as human shields

in the battle for the American-led airstrikes have been

supporting the offensive by the Iraqi army and other ground

forces to retake the city, which is the militant group's last

major stronghold in the country. The military campaign began

on Monday, and there's increasing concern for civilians

trapped by the fighting. The UK jobless rate held steady a

near 11 year low of 4.9% in the three months to August. The Office

for National Statistics says there are now 1.66 million people out of

work which is an increase of 10,000 people. The organisation says it

shows confidence in the economy. People who say their lives have

been ruined by commonly prescribed antidepressants,

known as SSRIs, are due to take their case to

Parliament later today. It's thought about one in 100 people

experience severe side-effects This programme has been speaking

to some people who've experienced That's a summary of

the latest BBC News. Do get in touch with us

throughout the morning. Use the hashtag Victoria Live

and if you text, you will be charged Leicester City now have more points

in the Champions League than they do They beat the Danish

champions FC Copenhagen 1-0 at the King Power stadium

to make it three wins out Riyadh Mahrez scored

the only goal of the game. Kasper Schmeichel made a terrific

save in the last minute as Leicester No other Champions League side can

boast that record but the manager wishes they could perform just as

well on the home front. It is it is OK. All through my

career this happened. When you play in a big competition you lose

something when you go back into your League. That's normal, but we want

to change this way. Tottenham now have one win and one

defeat and now Spurs say second in their group

a point behind Monaco. There are three clubs playing

in the Champions League tonight. Pep Guardiola returns to the Nou

Camp. The Manchester City manager won 14

trophies as Barca boss He also won the Champions League

with them as a player. City are going through a bit

of sticky patch, without a win in three matches inclduing a 3-3

draw with Celtic in their last Champions league match,

but a return to the Nou Camp It will be special especially when I

see people who I like to see. I like. When you travel around, you

remember the places and the people you met and that's the case. So my

family is here. So that's why I'm always happy.

The Premier League's Executive director Bill Bush has admitted that

several clubs are short of reaching the accessible stadia guidelines

that are supposed to be met by the start of next

He was called before a Government select committee

hearing where Lord Holmes of the Equality and Human Rights

Commission criticsied the League for only satisfying legal

requirements when it comes to disabled access

There isn't a culture of inclusion. There isn't a culture of compliance.

That's the sport for now. I will be back with the headlines in half an

hour. Thank you very much, Olly.

People who say their lives have been ruined by commonly

prescribed anti-depressants, known as SSRIs, are taking

Some users have told this programme the tablets have made them suicidal.

It's estimated about one in 100 people experiences severe

side-effects as a result of taking the tablets.

Though it's worth pointing out that for most people, they do improve

We played you Lesley Ashmall's full report in the last hour.

One in 11 British adults takes anti-depressants.

The number of pills prescribed has doubled in the last decade.

In England last year, 61 million tablets were handed out.

They cost the NHS ?780,000 a day, but they are not helping everyone.

And that's when I was put on to 100mg of those.

Claire says the drugs have left her virtually bedridden.

She started taking them 20 years ago whilst caring for her sick

mother and studying for her exams at Cambridge.

I took them and descended into suicidality within days.

I couldn't read. I couldn't concentrate on anything.

I was absolutely wanting to take my life continually.

She's not alone, suffering side-effects whilst on the drugs

which are, after all, designed to affect how the brain works.

It's generally thought depression happens when the level of the mood

The anti-depressant is designed to stop that happening.

But David Healy, who has written books about the subject,

thinks the drugs could make some people's symptoms worse.

One in four people become more anxious rather than less

and they can become extraordinarily anxious so some people become very

agitated and some go on from that to become suicidal.

The drugs can become the problem that they are then used to treat.

We asked the drug companies for interviews but they declined.

They say there are plenty of warnings in the literature

The problem is, the literature is literally arm's length.

And GPs admit it is not often taken seriously.

What the companies have to do is they have to include every

side-effect that anyone has ever described.

It might actually not be anything to do with the tablet.

The answer is yes, there is a very long list of potential side-effects

for anti-depressants but we also must not

underestimate the impact that severe depression has.

Moderate depression, severe depression wrecks lives.

But Darren, which isn't his real name, wishes

He developed severe muscle spasms and a stammer.

I could stop it, but if I do, something else goes.

It may be a minority of people that have these extreme reactions

They have got to realise that that one person might be their patient.

Had is a text from Kate, "Without antidepressants, I would not be able

to function and may not be here now. Please remind people there is a

balance and to seek support from their GP." This texter, who doesn't

leave their name says, "Antidepressants should not be a

long-term fix. They should be used to enable people to face their

issues for a short period of time. Doctors prescribe and forget and

repeat prescriptions are handed out, no counselling and support and no

assessment as to which medication is best for the individuals." That

story came from one of our viewers. We can talk now to two

people who've experienced problems with the drugs -

Katinka Blackford Newman, who had severe side effects

and James Moore who suffered terrible withdrawal symptoms

when he tried to come off them. Professor Linda Gask is a retired

psychiatrist who believes without antidepressants

she wouldn't be alive. And, Professor David Healy

is a Psychiatrist with the University of Bangor,

who believes these drugs You suffered hallucinations and many

other side-effects. Tell us what you experienced. I took them for

insomnia and literally within hours I went into trancelike state and

toxic to helium when I was hallucinating, I thought I had

killed my children. I took a kitchen knife and I attacked myself. I don't

even remember that. I was highly psychotic. I ended up in a hospital,

they did not realise it was caused by antidepressants and they gave me

more anti-psychotics, I suffered side-effects to the point where I

could not leave the house or hold a conversation, could not feel love

for my children, and I was ready to end my life, it was not worth

living. I went to hospital they took me off all the drugs. It was clear

that I was suffering severe side effects from these drugs. When you

tried to come off antidepressants, how was it? It chimed with the

experiences you've had on the show so far. Nobody gives you any warning

when you try to stop these drugs how difficult it is going to be. People

with mental health already have plenty to deal with and to give them

even more feels really unfair. It was extremely unpleasant trying to

reduce. Every time I tried, I with anxiety, with the shakes, -- I

suffered with anxiety. It was deeply unpleasant. I went to see my doctor

and he said it was the return of my original symptoms. That wasn't the

case. I really wasn't prepared for how difficult it was going to be.

You've said you would not be alive without antidepressants. It is

certainly a theme from our viewers. They've sent things with similar

thoughts. How have they helped you? They've helped me keep going when

I've been very depressed, I've not been able to function, not been able

to think clearly. Sometimes not been able to get out of bed. Lost weight,

felt I was worthless, considered ending my life. On the occasions

when I've gone on to antidepressants, they've helped a

great deal and got me back to the point where I could work and

contribute again. I would not be here now if I'd not been able to

take them. I've been on them for a long time because I had three

episodes in three years. At that point the decision was I should stay

on them. I've had psychotherapy as well because for severe depression

you should have a combination of the two. Professor David Healy. Around

one in 100 will experience side effects. The majority of people find

using antidepressants very helpful. You accept that? I don't. We know

that roughly half the people who go on stop within a month and this is

largely because they don't like the effects. They make them feel

extraordinarily bad. About a quarter of people can become more anxious on

these drugs rather than less. There is an order group of drugs that can

be tremendous for people who are severely depressed. -- older group

of drugs. They also cause problems but they are worth trading off. The

later group of drugs, the SSRIs, haven't been shown to work in people

who are severely depressed but come with tremendous problems. It is not

always clear that the severity of the condition is worth taking the

risk of. What should GPs do? A large number of problems I think that will

resolve of their own accord, different to the counter problems.

These are things that will resolve in 12-16 weeks. They say, we have

bills, they may be useful if your condition is not clearing up. But

you can get through this with some support from the and some

problem-solving, you will be more resilient in the future. At the time

you had anxiety, worrying about losing the home, would you have gone

away reassured? Whether I would have gone away reassured or not is

irrelevant. Actually, when we look at the scientific literature, these

pills have been shown to be no more effective than placebo in treating

mild to a depression. -- mild tomb at depression. It would have saved

the year of my life. If you had known these would sort themselves

out would you have left reassured? It takes a brave GP to tell someone

to go away for a few weeks or try some therapy but the fact is, an

interesting point, she was prescribed these for insomnia. They

are prescribed off label for a whole range of conditions like IBS, people

take them and then they find they cannot come off. It doesn't seem

right. I appreciate doctors are in a difficult position but if the focus

is on the start of treatment that is fine but what happens at the end of

treatment? You talked about the literature earlier. There is a list

of side effect as long as your arm. There's nothing about how to safely

stop taking the drugs. Did you have a conversation about side-effects

and getting off these eventually? I did. As I was a psychiatrist I

already knew about the side-effects and I've experienced them. I'd like

to come back on a point of David Healy. I took the older

antidepressants as well and one of the reasons SSRIs were a step

forward was because the side-effects from those ones were pretty

horrible. Dry mouth, when I stood up in the morning I would feel like I

would fall over. Very dozy and dopey. SSRIs were a step forward at

that point. I don't doubt in any way that some people have severe and

serious side-effects but I think they do help a lot of people and...

Thank you very much. Really appreciated. Do let us know your own

experience. Still to come before 11. Claimed that Islamic State fighters

are using civilians as human shields in the battle for Mosul.

It's a question that's been asked for most of our lives -

and Mars - our nearest neighbour has long been considered the most likely

place to host a form of life in our solar system.

The European Space Agency is hoping to make history later,

by landing a small probe on the surface of Mars.

If the mission is successful, the Agency will use the same

techniques to land a rover - which will drill deep

into the surface of the planet to help prove whether or not

Let's talk to Andrew Coates and Anne Wellbrock who are working

on the project, alongside veteran stargazer Robin Scagell.

And from mission control, we have another British scientist,

Thank you for coming on the programme. We're going to speak to

Manish in a second. In the meantime, what are we waiting for today? There

are two spacecraft getting to Mars, one is the orbiter which will look

for signs of methane. There is also the lander, which will land on the

surface. It's a complicated mission involving both of those elements but

both of those things are happening this afternoon. Really exciting day.

Looking from methane on Mars is important because it can tell us

about life on Mars. In what way? Just explain that. Methane should be

very short lived in the Martian environment. What we are seeing is a

trace gas, but nevertheless it is there. The fact it is there is

interesting because it should break up in the sunlight. It means there

is a source, which could be either geothermal activity or potentially

life. We will follow up on these this afternoon. It is going to drill

underneath the surface and look for signs of life. These are exciting.

If that happens successfully then the European Space Agency joins this

exclusive club. Only the Americans have landed up probe on Mars. Yes.

There are many American probes on Mars and it's great to see the

Europeans joining them. Search for life on Mars is potentially

ground-breaking in terms of the effect. It will be like landing man

on the moon, in terms of the way people view what we've done. This is

an important mission. Why is this a particularly interesting time to be

looking for a life on Mars? In the past we've learned Mars is a lot

more active than we first bought. Initially, a few years ago we

thought it was a very dead and dry planet. But we now know it was once

wet and active. It may still be active now. It will be really

interesting to look for life using these missions, especially looking

for methane and trace gases of methane. Looking to see if it might

be a biological source. We also know that on the surface of Mars the

radiation is quite harsh because the atmosphere is not very thick. Under

the surface there might be microbial life. This is what we're going to do

with the Mars rover. We will drill down into the surface. It is a good

time because we know that Mars might have been more active than we

previously thought. We know a lot more about Mars than we did a few

years ago, even, because there's been a lot of missions. Explain what

this is. This is a model of our camera system which we are leaving

for the 2020 Rover which will launch in 2020 and in 2021 it will land on

the surface. You are very confident. It has got to work today for it to

happen. All of this is very important and the build-up to what

we really want to do in 2020. This is a model of the camera system, it

is sitting the same height as a person above the surface. It has

wide-angle cameras to get 3-D models. It has very good geology

filters to get a good context of geology on the surface. There is a

high-resolution camera. With that we get the context for where we are

going to drill. The really historic and exciting thing is it will be

drilling underneath the surface two metres to look for signs of life

because previously they've only been able to do five centimetres

underneath the surface. This is 40 times better. Are you confident this

probe is going to get through the atmosphere and land successfully?

Who can be certain? If we knew we would be a different business.

Obviously there's always a chance. A lot of probes have failed but once

you get that far, one hopes there will be success.

The United States says so-called Islamic State militants

are using innocent civilians as human shields.

It comes as Iraqi and Kurdish forces continue

their offensive to try and capture the group's stronghold

Around 700,000 people are thought to remain in the city including up

Tarik Kadir is leading the Mosul response

He joins me now from the nearly city of Irbil.

What can you tell us from Irbil? We can say that we are starting to see

which is a change from yesterday a lot of people displaced from the

areas of fighting and now in areas where we can access them. OK. And in

terms of preparations for what may happen over the coming days and

weeks, what are you doing? Well, at the moment we're organising truck

loads of core relief items for families as well as water, simply

water because the areas that people are being displaced to, often there

has been no arrangement put in place to provide basic food and water. Can

anyone here help? Yes, certainly. I think the attention to the situation

and at last we are seeing this area what's been isolated for the past

two years is coming under access from the outside world. I think the

donations of a lot of people have been very helpful in order for us to

put in place our teams to respond to the beneficiary needs especially

those of children. I mean, in terms of people trying to get out of

Mosul, whether that's even possible or not, would that be the wisest

thing for them to do? That's a very good question to which I can't

really give a constructive answer because it all depends on how the

military advance goes. In some cases, we're hearing stories that

people were asked to stay within their homes and others that they are

being asked to leave which they might not always be free to do. In

any case we are calling on all actors to ensure safe passage for

civilians to not be a part of the combat.

Thank you very much for talking to us Tarik, thank you.

Home Office sources say migrant children arriving from Calais

will be subject to additional age checks in the UK.

A French official has said they don't under go any checks in France.

Pictures have emerged showing those arriving could potentially be a lot

But charities have told us that at least one of those photographed

could actually be a translator. So far 14 child refugees have

arrived under something called the Dublin Agreement which says

unaccompanied minors have the right Another agreement known as the Dubs

Amendment pledges support for vulnerable children who don't

have any family in the UK, separate registration process

will take place for vulnerable children who do not

have family in the UK. Lord Dubs and a charity called

Citizens UK are now accusing the Government of dragging

their feet over the issue and say they'll begin legal proceedings

in the next 48-hours if the Home Office doesn't

begin to act. Lord Dubs, who was himself a child

refugee, visited Calais Well, I'm a refugee and I came

to England at the age of six. He's complaining it has been eight

months now and he's very upset that no one has, like,

bothered or ask us how Yes, you are, and that's why we're

here, to ask you how you are. Lord Dubs is here now,

along with the leader of Ealing Council, Julien Bell,

who wants to take in some of these children and we can speak

to Laura Griffiths from Citizens UK Welcome both of you and we'll talk

to Laura in a second. Lord Dubs let me ask you about the issue of the

ages of some of these refugees. Some Conservative MPs, some British

newspapers are questioning legitimately the ages of those who

have been brought over this week so far, what do you say? A lot of

trouble has been gone to by the French authorities and the Home

Office to check the background of these young people, but could I say?

The majority, I've met them in Calais on two occasions, the

majority are young. They're vulnerable and there are further

ones we want to get here who are even younger and girls among them,

you know, there is a dire wages and we shouldn't be diverted from what

is a good news story, at last some of these children are coming. We can

hear from one of the boys who is currently in Calais, but is due to

arrive in the UK later today. I was asking why does

he want to go to England? TRANSLATION: He has got his

family back home. He has got his brothers

and he wants to go to school And how long has he been

in Calais? And what's life been

like in Calais? TRANSLATION: He says the jungle

isn't even fit for animals He was the child that Lily Allen

apologied to when she visited So you've been trying to jump on

lorries to get over into the UK. Has that, that must be terrifying? Is

that scary? What are your hopes for the future?

I apologise on behalf of my country. I'm sorry for what we've put you

through. Sorry...

Earlier the Home Office turned down our request for an interview,

but told us, "The process to transfer as many eligible

children as possible from Calais to the UK before the start

So far not a single child has been taken in under your amendment ie

children who don't have relatives here in Britain, why do you think

that is? Well, I think the Home Office have been very slowmed we had

hoped something would start way back in May or June when Parliament

passed the amendment. Look, they're beginning to move. They're beginning

to do the right things, but they should have got on with this a long

time ago. Are you confident that unaccompanied children, who don't

have relatives here, will be in Britain, what in the next seven

days? I'm not sure about seven days, you but talked to the Home Office

Minister and Home Office officials and I'm assured they are trying to

get on with it. Some of the children with no family here will be stuck

without safety and I understand there are urgent discussions going

on between the British authorities and the French authorities that

there should be safety for all the children including those with no

family here, before any demolishing takes place. There are a number of

British taxpayers who say we should be looking after British children

who are in need before we take in unaccompanied children without

relatives here from the Calais camp? Well, we're a rich country. I think

we can do both. We're not going to get into an argument today about

Government cuts, but they have been pretty severe and the refugees and

our children here in Britain should not suffer because of the Government

cuts. It is a different argument. We're talking about not launch

numbers, we are talking about a strong humanitarian need to give

people a decent life in this country, to give them a chance, they

are vulnerable children who have been deeply shocked by their

experiences and there is some brilliant British NGOs Help

Herselfries and others who are working with them and who are doing

the right thing. That's a sign that Britain has strong humanitarian

instincts. Why can't they claim asylum in France and stay in France?

Well, some might. My amendment didn't say we should take them. The

argument for my amendment is we should take our share of the

unaccompanied child refugees in Europe. There are more in Greece

than in Calais. We should take our share and other countries should

take their share. Ealing and other councils said they're happy to take

some children in. Tell our audience about the numbers you're willing to

take in? We'res a council prepared to take ten children. Our

neighbours, Hammersmith and Fulham will take 15. Hounslow will take

five. So that's 30 right there. I know other Labour council leaders in

London and others are saying they will take some too. So, there is a

willingness on behalf of councils to take these children this. I think we

just need the Government to get on with it. They have foot dragged for

too long and actually children have paid with their lives with the

delays. So there cannot be anymore delay. There will be some council

taxpayers in Ealing do don't want their council tax to be spent

looking after children? We will get Government funding for this. It

won't cover all the costs, but the vast majority of my residents and

the British people are compassionate and they can see that, you know,

this is just a terrible situation for children to be left in. I

visited the camp in August and saw the conditions that these children

are in and it is just one of those things that you cannot walk by on

the other side and not do anything about it and so, I'm sure my

residents will be fully supportive of this. Laura Griffiths, you're out

in Calais from Citizens UK. What do you make first of all about this

conversation that is going on amongst some people in Britain about

whether the refugees that have arrived so far this week from Calais

are actually under 18? Well, think those that arrived under Dublin 3

have gone through checks through the Home Office and other agencies to

verify their ages and the family link. OK. I want to introduce you to

Janet who got in touch this morning. She fostered an Afghan refugee. She

was told was 14. This was back in 2000, but she believes he was

actually 21 or 22. Hi Janet. Tell our audience more? Yeah, he turned

up at our house with severe stubble and needed a razor straightaway. I

did start caring for him and I had to take him to the dentist and the

dentist queried his age. He said, "How old did you say he was?" I said

and he just shook his head and said he's 21, 22 at least. Did you have

to get something verifiable than the dentist's opinion to prove the age?

Well, nothing was ever really done about it. At that time there was so

many coming into the country that needed homes and he left us a month

later. So I didn't really pursue it after that. Right, you were

expecting a young teenager and clearly it wasn't? Yeah. I mean I

have children on my own and I did question him about his age and he

pretended not to understand. He said the Afghanistan calendar was

different to ours, so he couldn't work out what his age was. He

pleaded ignorance. Are you glad you did what you did or not? I am

because I had a number of boy from Afghanistan and Albania and a lot of

them have gone on to have good jobs here and work hard. In his case, the

placement ended badly. He tried to attack me and he had to be removed

from the house that day. And when I look back on it, I had young

children in my house at the time of my own, you know, they might have

been at risk. Janet, thank you very much. Thank

you for coming on the programme. In terms of this warning to the

Government, you're saying now the Government has 48 hours to start the

process of resettling before you will take legal action before

Citizens UK will take legal action. What does the process of resettling

mean Lord Dubs? It means identifying in Calais the ones that are eligible

to come here. Bringing them here and finding foster parents. Foster

parents with local authorities like Ealing, Hammersmith and others so

they can have a safe environment. Of course, it is difficult. There is a

lot of pressure on local authorities, but local authorities

are stepping up to the mark and that's a good thing.

Are you not reassured by a statement that we have today from the

Immigration Minister saying it is up to the Government who is admitted to

the UK, the Home Office sent a team of officials to work alongside

French officials in Calais to assist with speeding up the Dublin process

for people, unaccompanied children who have relatives here. Secondly, a

second Home Office team sent to France to work with the French

authorities to identify and prioritise the children we drought

to the UK under the terms of the Dubs agreement?

That is good news, at long last the Home Office is stepping up to the

mark and doing what we want them to do. We should congratulate them. I

don't think I normally do that. Are you calling on other local councils

to promise to take in more children? Absolutely. The numbers are not that

large and if every council took in five or ten then we'd more than deal

with the problem. There are 1000 unaccompanied refugee children in

the camps. Talk of 300 is probably not sufficient. If all councils

stepped up to the mark with be able to look after them. Thank you.

Police have begun a murder inquiry after a prisoner was stabbed

to death at Pentonville jail in north London.

Two other inmates were critically wounded.

Two prisoners have now been arrested.

Association says there has been an unprecedented rise in violence

in jails in England and Wales since cuts in staffing were ordered

Joining me now is the Director of the Prison Reform

How do you react to what appears to have happened? It's a terrible

tragedy for everyone involved, for the families of the man who was

killed and those injured. It is also a very frightening day for those

living and working in Pentonville and it will take a lot of courage

and skill to get through the next few days safely. When Mac the have

any accurate details about how this happened? I've got no details about

the offence. This used to be incredibly unusual and still is,

though they are much less rear than they used to be. How do you stop it

happening? Is it a one-off? It is not inevitable. The key thing in

prison is the resources don't match what is needed. There are too many

prisoners for the number of staff. The government has a clear choice.

They can either invest more in prisons at a time when all our

public services are under pressure, or reduce the way that we use

prison. We have said for a long time that is the answer. Use prison less

and make sure the conditions are better. Depending on the Justice

Secretary, policy changes. Ken Clarke up two years ago, wanted a

rehabilitation revolution, which some people thought was going soft

on those who have committed crimes. Then we had Chris Grayling, at the

opposite end of the spectrum, he wanted to be tougher. This is not a

hard or soft question. The prison population has grown every single

year under every single government. This is an issue for Parliament

about how we want to use prison, about the length of sentences, how

long we stay in there. All governments want people to be

rehabilitated. At the moment we don't have a prison system that is

fit for what the country should expect. So an immediate call to

employ more staff? It is very difficult in London. It is not a

good wage anymore, it is difficult to retain people in prisons like

Pentonville. These will put people off applying. At the moment we say

Pentonville could accommodate 1300. That means almost everybody can

expect to share a cell which the Victorians thought was fit for one

person. So we need fewer people in prison and that is the quickest

thing the government could do to reduce pressure. A proportion of the

British public might think we don't need fewer people in prison. If you

committed a crime you need to face punishment in jail. I understand

that, but actually most people who commit a crime do not go to prison.

What we know about prison is it always punishes, it is always a

miserable experience. But we also know it is worse at rehabilitating

people than when you can be punished in the community. Plenty of people

will need to go to prison and we need to think hard about how long we

sent them there for. But plenty of people in prison could be punished

in the community but also rebuild their lives. What sort of punishment

would be receiving the community? The sort of thing that works best is

when people put something back into their communities. They work in the

community doing jobs we don't pay people to do that do need doing like

removing graffiti, restoring places that have become rundown. People

have to turn up, they have to pay the price that the court says. But

it restores self-esteem, it allows them to restore their relationships.

So they put something back into the community without destroying the

things that give them a future. Thank you very much.

This morning - are anti-depressants a curse or cure?

People who say their lives have been ruined by commonly prescribed

antidepressants, known as SSRIs, are taking their case

Some users have told this programme the tablets have made them suicidal.

Claire Hanley begun taking them while caring for her seriously ill

mother and studying for her final exams at Cambridge University,

but suffered severe side-effects after her GP prescribed

I was an absolute mess. I couldn't read. I couldn't concentrate on

anything. I was absolutely wanting to take my life continually. She

told her doctor, who put her on a higher dose of different

antidepressants. God. Within two weeks I tried to take my only twice.

Almost immediately. -- own life. What was scary, I read the leaflet

and I was getting exactly what it said, I was getting seizure like

symptoms were my muscles were jolting around their own accord. And

I felt disorientated and sick and I had digestive problems, it is really

extreme. I don't know where to begin. All I can remember as being

on the bedroom floor, semiconscious, having seizure after massive

seizure. You can read more on the BBC news site. Thank you to all of

you who got in touch about this. So many of you have. Catherine on

e-mail said, soon after taking SSRIs I lost my appetite, a massive amount

of weight, and found myself collapsed at work. I was not happy

or sad, I just felt nothing. However, without them I would not

have been able to get out of the place where I was. I believe the

benefits outweigh the negative side effects. Another e-mail, 34-year-old

male, they have completely ruined my ability to have a relationship. I

have zero libido and that began after the first three months. It has

ruined my ability to have any sort of relationship. Let's speak to

Gemma who has been taking antidepressants since she was 13.

How old are you now? 30. How has it been having almost two decades on

antidepressants? Horrific. Many times, I've tried to come off them,

and I've been OK for a while. The withdrawals have been quite but

eventually my mental health issues would return again and I'll have to

go on the medication. They keep trying me on different medication

and the side-effects will be pretty horrific. Some of them will work for

a while but my body will become tolerant of them saw the half to try

something different. What kind of side effects? Yellow mac severe

weight gain. For anyone suffering with problems that is not a nice

thing to go through. I've had other problems like I would wake up in the

morning and pass out. Complete loss of six drive. All sorts of things.

It has been absolutely horrible. What does your GP say when you say

these tablets are having a detrimental effect on my life? They

put me on another medication. You know? They try a different one. What

would be a better solution? If there was an ideal scenario. -- for anyone

who presents their problems to a GP the first thing that GPs should do

is ask about therapy. Not everybody has depression because of chemical

imbalance. A lot of people go through trauma. The only real

solution is therapy. Unfortunately, because of the NHS, there is

extremely long waiting lists. I think more money should be put into

therapy rather than handing out medication. Did you have

conversations about side effects and the potential difficulties of

withdrawing from tablets when you wanted to come off them? Absolutely.

I've had many conversations with GPs about the side-effects. They say,

you do need to take them. I felt pressured in a way to take these

medication. When you look back on the 20 years of taking it, do you

wish you'd never bothered? I think in my young teenage years I needed

therapy. I did not actually speak to the doctor, my mother was speaking

on their behalf. If I had been an therapy in the beginning I would not

be where I am now. I'm very grateful for you to talk to us on national

TV. I wish you all the best. You can watch the full film on our page. It