05/01/2017 Victoria Derbyshire


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05/01/2017

Men who murder their families and why they kill their loved ones. Plus remembering the homeless people who lost their lives in the cold and Warwick Davis on Carrie Fisher.


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Hello - it's Thursday, it's 9am, I'm Victoria Derbyshire,

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Our top story today - warnings children are being left

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to "fend for themselves" online - with parents vainly hoping

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I'm the Children's Commissioner and we will be looking at how we give

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children resilience, honest information and the power to

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flourish online. If you identify with that -

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do get in touch. We'll talk to a group

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of schoolchildren Also on the programme -

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the men who massacre We'll hear from some of those

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who survived the attacks. It is really hard. Those are the

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things I have to live with now. Even though it has been 14 years, I have

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bad dreams and all of the things that you have experienced...

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And - could where you live affect your chances of getting dementia?

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Researchers say people who live near major roads may have a greater

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Welcome to the programme, we're live until 11am this morning.

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We will bring you breaking news and developing stories, and we will

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examine the deaths of two rough sleepers in one town in the UK over

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Christmas week. Do get in touch on all the stories

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we're talking about this morning - use #VictoriaLIVE and if you text,

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you will be charged We would really like your input on

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this... The Children's Commissioner

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for England has warned that young people are left to face the dangers

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of bullying and grooming Anne Longfield says children -

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and often their parents - have no idea what they are signing

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up to on social media sites and pupils as young as four should

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be taught about internet Our Education Correspondent Gillian

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Hargreaves has more. Digital technology can

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enrich children's minds, Millions of youngsters have joined

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social media sites to keep in touch with friends,

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but many of those questioned by the commissioner have little idea

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of what they're signing up to. With pages of terms and conditions,

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it seems few realise The Children's Commissioner calls

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for the appointment of a digital ombudsman to mediate

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between children and social media She also recommends there should be

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mandatory digital citizenship courses in schools and new privacy

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laws to protect children's What no-one has done yet is to look

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at how we design and intervene with a digital world in a way that

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can really give children the support they need for the place they spend

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an awful lot of time, but also the information

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and the power to be able to get While Instagram, Facebook

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and Twitter recommend that their services are most

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suitable for children over the age of 13, younger children can

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circumvent the rules As a mum, dad or grandparent, are

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you worried about this with your kids or grandchildren? Let me know,

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how do you police it and make sure that they are safe online? We will

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speak to this group of primary school pupils and secondary school

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pupils and the Children's Commissioner for England. Good

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morning. They are here to give their views and whether it is something

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they worry about Wednesday tick the "I agree" on the terms and

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conditions. -- Wednesday. Annita is in the BBC

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Newsroom with a summary People who live near main roads may

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be at greater risk of dementia, according to a decade-long study

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by scientists in Canada. The medical causes of the brain

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disease have yet to be identified but the research suggests air

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pollution and noisy traffic could be Memories lost, thoughts confused,

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personalities gradually fading. Dementia affects 850,000

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people in the UK. Now there's a claim it

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could be linked to traffic. This study from Canada shows that

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people living close to busy roads had higher chances

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of developing dementia. Researchers in Ontario followed

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more than two million The ones who lived within 50 metres

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of heavy traffic had a 12% higher risk of dementia than those more

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than 200 metres away. So what is it that's actually

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affecting the brain? Ultra-fine particles,

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the very smallest ones, can actually move across the lungs

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into the bloodstream How those particles work,

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a bit speculative, but one hypothesis is fairly nonspecific

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effects on inflammation So we have a potential mechanism

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but it's far from proven. Experts here have cautiously

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welcomed the results They've stressed it shows

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an association, not a cause. They've pointed out dementia

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is also affected by age, But they are encouraging further

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research into the impact The appointment of Sir Tim Barrow

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as the UK's new ambassador to the European Union has

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been welcomed by almost He replaces Sir Ivan Rogers,

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who resigned on Tuesday after complaining of muddle

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and confusion in the The government says the UK's

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new ambassador in Brussels is a "seasoned and tough

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negotiator". Immigrants should be expected

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to learn English before coming to Britain, or attend language

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classes when they arrive. The All Party Parliamentary Group

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on social integration also wants the Government to consider giving

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the UK's nations and regions the power to control

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the number of visas issued. Here's our home affairs

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correspondent, Danny Shaw. Over the past decade,

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the scale of immigration to Britain has been unprecedented,

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sparking debate about whether the numbers should be

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reduced and if so, how? But this report from MPs and peers

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says there should be more focus on what happens

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after immigrants arrive. It says many immigrant communities

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and people already settled here lead parallel lives and it calls

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on the government to address what it The report makes a number

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of recommendations. It says all immigrants should learn

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English before coming to the UK or enrol in classes

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when they're here. It calls for courses to teach

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immigrants about British culture and the report says that government

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should give immigrants guidance on the costs and benefits of UK

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citizenship and consider cutting A lack of integration for newcomers

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leads to them not having access to the same opportunities,

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it can lead to an increase in All the things that make living

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in England and Britain You cannot enjoy what this

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country has to offer Another idea in the report

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is for immigration policy to be devolved to Britain's

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nations and regions. They'd be able to allocate visas

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according to local need. The report says that might instil

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confidence among members of the public that the immigration

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system works for their area. The Home Office says it is not

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planning to introduce local visa arrangements but the department says

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it has made funding available Four people have been arrested

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in the American city of Chicago over a video live-streamed

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on Facebook, in which a bound Police say the man being

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assaulted has special needs. His assailants can be heard making

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derogatory statements The man, who police say

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was acquainted with one of his attackers, has now been

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released from hospital. A record number of new cars

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were bought in the UK in 2016 - according to the Society

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of Motor Manufacturers and Traders. Sales hit 2.69 million -

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that's up more than two per cent However, the industry expects

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to sell fewer new cars this year. Handwritten letters

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from Princess Diana are due to be Written to a steward

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at Buckingham Palace, they reveal that a young

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Prince Harry was routinely In one letter dated 17th October,

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1992, she says how both young princes "are well and enjoying

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boarding school a lot, although The collection will be sold over

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approximately 40 lots - with estimates ranging

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from ?80 to ?900. The auction also includes

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letters from the Queen, written on Windsor Castle headed

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paper. A former Crewe Alexandra coach

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has denied wrongdoing after being suspended

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by the FA's safeguarding panel. Paul McCann worked with young

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players at the club He was working with the then-manager

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Dario Gradi, who is now He also later volunteered as a youth

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coach at non-league club AFC Nearly 5,000 contestants have taken

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part in an annual Japanese The competition requires

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participants to write phrases or poems of increasing complexity

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with a traditional brush and black Those taking part,

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aged from three to 93, were judged on the beauty

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of their strokes and The winners will be announced

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at a separate ceremony in February. That's a summary of the latest BBC

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News - more at 9.30am. Thank you, later in the programme we

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will be talking about final artwork like this... And, oh good, we have

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the human league in there -- vinyl. We will be talking to those hoping

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to make their own masterpieces in 2017.

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Do get in touch with us throughout the morning -

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use the hashtag #VictoriaLive and if you text, you will be charged

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Let's get some sport with John Watson.

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It is really interesting at the top of the Premier League, isn't it?

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Yes, halting up after a huge result potentially in the title race last

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night. Chelsea were hoping to go on a record 14 matches, by winning the

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14 in a row but was stopped last night by Tottenham, they were simply

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superb at White Hart Lane, beating Chelsea 2-0. 20-year-old Dele Alli

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scored two headers so Chelsea were defeated for the first time since

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September. Man of the moment last night, seven goals in four matches

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for Dele Alli, an incredible run of form for Tottenham who have won five

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consecutive matches in a row. Let's hear from the goal-scorer who got

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two last night, Dele Alli himself. There is no need to talk before the

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game, everybody knew how big it was, you could see from the first whistle

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how badly the fans wanted it. It is aways nice to score but more

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important that we got that win today. Yes, that means Tottenham are

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now in third position, not a complete disaster for Chelsea, five

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points clear at the top of the table and their manager Antonio Conte is

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slightly disappointed they did not manage to match that record but he

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knows his team are well placed in the title race at the moment... It

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is a pity, but it is important to know that this can happen. It is

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important to continue to work very hard, and try and improve every day.

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Chelsea's winning run is over but Sir Andy Murray... It is not? He is

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flying at the moment, his winning run is continuing, 26 competitive

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matches in a row for him, and he has managed to continue his run at the

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Qatar Open, he was made to work hard against his competitor, he was

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sweating on the court, taken to a tie-break, but he came through 7-6,

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taking the second set 7-5. This is a big year for him, world number one

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and he would like to preserve that status and he wants to go through

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and win the Australian Open at the end of January. Johanna Konta is

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flying at the moment, she reached the semifinals of the Australian

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open last year, and she is one match away from what would be a third WTA

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final for her, she came through in her match in the quarterfinals of

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the shins and Open in China, world number ten and she wants to go and

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match those achievements of last year. It would be great if she can

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surpass that. And Kadeena Cox has responded to criticism that she is

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taking part in the reality ski show on Channel 4, The Jump, where nearly

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every competitor is injured? Yes, Kadeena Cox was one of the stars of

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the Paralympic games in Rio, winning gold in cycling and athletics but

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after the Paralympic Games she has decided she wants to go on the show

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The Jump, and why not? She would like to build on success from the

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summer, she describes her life as "A ticking time bomb", she says that

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her diagnosis of MS has changed her outlook on life and you would like

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to learn how to ski, why not? For the organisers, UK Sport, she has

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had her funding cut while she competes on the show, but it is

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looking good. She does not have any cycling events this year, she will

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be expected to take part in events in July, but she can compete on the

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show, but fingers crossed you does not get injured. It sounds like she

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would like to say yes to all opportunities, and who can blame

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her? John, thank you. This morning - the men

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who murder their own families. And before you ask -

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in 95% of cases it is men. So what causes them to carry out

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acts of such unspeakable brutality? Leading experts have told this

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programme we should be doing more to spot warning signs and patterns

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of behaviour - things like physical abuse,

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a loss of control and terrifying threats - which should be

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triggering concern and action. But what about the families who this

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advice is too late for? Our reporter James Longman has been

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to meet some of the people whose lives have been destroyed

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by these kind of attacks. They talk openly and honestly

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about what they've been through - you might find some

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of the details upsetting. One of the nightmares I have regular

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is when I'm on a field, and I can and I can see the car,

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and I can hear them calling, mummy, mummy, please help us, mummy,

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and all I can see is a knife, a knife going up and down in the car

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as he is killing the boys. They went and bought two litres

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of petrol and poured it all over the house,

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all over the floor, over the sofas They put him into an induced coma

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at this point to hold his body deal He had wires and tubes

:15:55.:16:12.

and things coming out There is a domestic incident

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in the UK every three days. It's mostly men who

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attacked their families. Why are they so violent,

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and what other warning signs? We've been to meet some

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of the people whose lives and families were destroyed by these

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sorts of attacks, and the author of one of UK's biggest studies

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of domestic homicide, who tries to explain

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why they happen. That particular night,

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I wore a red dress, and just bizarrely Chris de Burgh,

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Lady in Red, was on. He asked me to dance, and I danced,

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he treated me like a princess, Denise Williams met her ex-husband

:17:14.:17:16.

Stephen Wilson when she was 16. Six months in, and he's starting

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to show his true colours, but he knew I had nowhere to go,

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no one to run to. He'd call me all the different

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names under the sun, he'd verbally abuse me,

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mentally abuse me, physically Brett was born in 1993,

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and Bradley the following year. They had dark eyes, beautiful brown

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locks in their hair. How much happiness they brought me,

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even though I was living a horrible life of abuse and putting up

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with drunken outbursts, just having the children

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seemed to make it all OK. Denise took her sons and left

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Stephen several times. She lived for the last

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time in every 2002. She lived for the last

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time in February 2002. She didn't take Brett and Bradley

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with her that time but was planning They all met up at a restaurant

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a few days later. Tell me what happened the last time

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that you tried to leave. As I turned to get out the car,

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he pulled me, he pulled my hair and pulled me into his lap

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in the car, and he started punching So me panicking managed

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to find my horn of the car, and I managed to keep my hand

:18:30.:18:34.

on the horn of the car, and I found the handle on the car door,

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which I pushed open, and he panicked when I was blowing

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the horn on the car, And then he drove off,

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and that was the last I caught the tram back

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to my friend's house, He rang me, and he said I have just

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killed the kids and I'm And at that, you think,

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listen for the boys, listen for the boys in the background,

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can you hear them? And I remember them coming in,

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the Sergeant of the station, and he said, Denise,

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we found the boys, In the corner of this room

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was a big box of toys, and I'm going, go and fetch

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them, go and fetch them so they can play with the toys,

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and he just knelt on the floor, and he said to me,

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Denise, they're dead. and he said to me,

:19:35.:19:38.

"Denise, they're dead". Stephen murdered his two sons

:19:39.:19:40.

by stabbing them in their necks. First he killed their youngest son,

:19:41.:19:43.

Bradley, who was seven years old, I remember going and just seeing

:19:44.:19:46.

the children through a glass, like they're in a fish tank,

:19:47.:19:51.

and I identified the bodies. And those are the things that

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I have to live with now, even though it's been 14 years,

:19:56.:20:16.

you still have the things and bad dreams that

:20:17.:20:25.

you've experienced. Stephen Wilson was given two life

:20:26.:20:28.

sentences for their murders. Jane Monkton-Smith is

:20:29.:20:30.

a criminologist at the University She is currently leading one

:20:31.:20:36.

of the biggest studies Over 95% of cases, it will be a man,

:20:37.:20:41.

and it will usually be One of the shocking things

:20:42.:20:48.

about this is that they are nearly always, if not always,

:20:49.:20:52.

planned, and there can be quite and they are usually incredibly

:20:53.:20:57.

violent. Denise's story shows a cycle

:20:58.:21:06.

of abuse ending in tragedy, but what about when the very

:21:07.:21:12.

children targeted David Potts attacked

:21:13.:21:15.

his partner's family, Somebody broke

:21:16.:21:20.

through the back door. But before they did that,

:21:21.:21:29.

they went and bought two litres of petrol,

:21:30.:21:31.

and poured it all over the house, on the floor, over the sofas and up

:21:32.:21:38.

the stairs and everywhere, And then my mum and eldest brother

:21:39.:21:41.

went to try and stop him but he just lit the fuel just in time,

:21:42.:21:56.

and them three there died. Then my sister was calling

:21:57.:22:04.

the police and the fire, I think, and I was still asleep,

:22:05.:22:10.

and by the time they arrived, they charged through,

:22:11.:22:15.

saving me and my sister. Zack was four years old when his

:22:16.:22:24.

mum's new partner broke into the family home

:22:25.:22:27.

and set it on fire. Zack survived, along

:22:28.:22:32.

with his half sister Kay-Lynn, His mum, Tracy, and 15-year-old half

:22:33.:22:34.

brother, Sean, were killed. Zack's dad Rick remembers

:22:35.:22:38.

the night of the fire. All control went, what went

:22:39.:22:45.

through my head was, what's happened, what sort of state

:22:46.:22:56.

is he in, is he going to survive? Same with the others,

:22:57.:22:59.

Kay-Lynn and Sean and Tracy. Zack was taken to a children's

:23:00.:23:01.

hospital for treatment. Heartbreaking,

:23:02.:23:04.

absolutely heartbreaking. He had wires and tubes

:23:05.:23:08.

and things coming out They'd put him into an enduced coma

:23:09.:23:10.

at this point to help his body deal with the shock and the burns

:23:11.:23:19.

as best as possible. About 20% burns, mainly to his arms,

:23:20.:23:26.

up to about T-shirt length. And you've got to cover

:23:27.:23:38.

your arms in this cream? When I found out who died,

:23:39.:23:41.

I was crying, and when I think Zack is now nine and

:23:42.:23:50.

living with his dad. He loves football, especially

:23:51.:23:58.

Manchester United, but the scars Not mean things, but just, like,

:23:59.:24:01.

if somebody's never seen me before, And then I would either describe,

:24:02.:24:14.

or just ignore them. And then, like, two minutes

:24:15.:24:23.

later, they'll say, And then that's what makes me

:24:24.:24:25.

think about it, and then What do we do, when you're

:24:26.:24:39.

feeling emotional about it? I think there was a point

:24:40.:24:47.

she said her phone was taken off her in the evening,

:24:48.:25:16.

you know, he was allowed out, but she wasn't,

:25:17.:25:19.

from what I could gather. Just alarm bells there,

:25:20.:25:22.

you know, controlling. In her research, Jane has

:25:23.:25:27.

found trends linking One of the things is the killer's

:25:28.:25:29.

need to control everything And quite often a personality

:25:30.:25:36.

disorder, so very, very self-focused, sees everything

:25:37.:25:46.

in the world as it applies to them, rather than being sensitive

:25:47.:25:49.

to the needs of others. Very often a lack of remorse,

:25:50.:25:51.

which could be because they have a personality disorder,

:25:52.:25:59.

but it could be a kind of self-protecting denial

:26:00.:26:04.

of what they've done. But in a lot of these cases,

:26:05.:26:07.

men will try to commit suicide. I had a phone call on Mother's Day,

:26:08.:26:12.

and they said to me, "I don't know if it is good news

:26:13.:26:18.

or bad news, Denise, but he has hung himself in prison.

:26:19.:26:39.

He's dead." And very, very angry,

:26:40.:26:42.

the fact that he hadn't got to live with this,

:26:43.:26:45.

and I was the one left behind, having to cope,

:26:46.:26:48.

having to learn to cope, To avenge me, because he lost power

:26:49.:26:50.

over me, he lost the control I think he knew he would lose

:26:51.:26:58.

the boys if they came to me. I think he realised the boys

:26:59.:27:04.

would not go back to him. And so if he couldn't have them,

:27:05.:27:06.

he made sure I couldn't Jane has looked at over 300 cases

:27:07.:27:09.

of domestic homicide and believes There are very complex reasons

:27:10.:27:13.

for this, but sometimes children are deliberately focused on,

:27:14.:27:21.

and sometimes they are And I think that sometimes

:27:22.:27:23.

men are losing a sense of who they're supposed to be now,

:27:24.:27:29.

because society has changed so much for them, and I don't

:27:30.:27:33.

think their roles are necessarily They didn't just snap,

:27:34.:27:36.

these things are more often than not planned,

:27:37.:27:46.

and to say that he just snapped makes it sound like there

:27:47.:27:58.

are not things that can be done to predict this,

:27:59.:28:01.

but there is. I would like think of what it

:28:02.:28:03.

would be like if my mum was around, and what house I would be in,

:28:04.:28:08.

either the same house Yes, you think about

:28:09.:28:11.

the practicalities a lot, don't you? You miss having your

:28:12.:28:16.

mum around, don't you? It would be nice to

:28:17.:28:18.

have mum here as well. Like, somebody to, an extra

:28:19.:28:21.

person to accompany me. So all of this has

:28:22.:28:26.

made you two stronger? Do you think it has

:28:27.:28:28.

made us stronger? Denise has managed to move

:28:29.:28:35.

forward with her life. She is now married

:28:36.:28:47.

and has three children. Going all the way back

:28:48.:28:49.

to the beginning when you met him, in that red dress in the working

:28:50.:28:52.

men's club, do you If I turned back the clock

:28:53.:28:55.

and I didn't meet him, I would not have had the seven

:28:56.:28:59.

and eight years that The children may have died,

:29:00.:29:02.

but their memory is never Thank you for your messages as he

:29:03.:29:23.

watched that. Hannah on Facebook said thank goodness I got away from

:29:24.:29:27.

a violent abuser to protect my son and myself, a decade ago, that could

:29:28.:29:32.

have been us. Sadly others have had a taste of it before and since and

:29:33.:29:35.

agencies meant to help and protect it didn't and still haven't. Let's

:29:36.:29:41.

hope this changes in the future for the better. LJ says these are tragic

:29:42.:29:45.

stories, it's a lot to expose children to. Clarence on Twitter

:29:46.:29:50.

says it is heartbreaking regarding domestic, side, kudos for

:29:51.:29:53.

identifying it as a problem of male violence. Thank you for those. Get

:29:54.:29:56.

in touch if you want to. And to watch that film

:29:57.:29:58.

again and share it - you can head to our programme page

:29:59.:30:00.

bbc.co.uk/victoria. In the next hour we will be speaking

:30:01.:30:02.

to Dr Monckton-Smith, a leading criminologist in domestic

:30:03.:30:05.

homicide, to find out more about why people are driven to commit

:30:06.:30:08.

such horrendous crimes A private memorial service

:30:09.:30:10.

is to take place later today for the American acting icons

:30:11.:30:18.

Carrie Fisher and her mother Debbie Reynolds - that comes ahead

:30:19.:30:20.

of a new documentary We'll have more in

:30:21.:30:23.

the next half hour. A new report says children

:30:24.:30:26.

are being left to 'fend for themselves' online -

:30:27.:30:28.

we'll be speaking to a group of schoolchildren

:30:29.:30:33.

about their own experiences. Here's Annita in the BBC Newsroom

:30:34.:30:40.

with a summary of today's news. A study has warned that children

:30:41.:30:45.

are being left to "fend for themselves" in the digital world

:30:46.:30:48.

- against dangers such The Children's Commissioner

:30:49.:30:50.

for England, Anne Longfield, says many children and parents

:30:51.:30:56.

are often unaware that personal information and content posted

:30:57.:30:58.

on social media sites can be sold Researchers in Canada have found

:30:59.:31:01.

that people living near major roads appear more likely

:31:02.:31:07.

to develop dementia. They tracked more than two million

:31:08.:31:11.

people in Ontario for signs of the brain disease over

:31:12.:31:16.

the course of 11 years. The scientists suggested air

:31:17.:31:19.

pollution or noisy traffic could contribute to the brain's

:31:20.:31:21.

decline. Migrants should be expected to learn

:31:22.:31:26.

English before coming to the UK, or attend language classes

:31:27.:31:29.

when they arrive, according The cross-party group said speaking

:31:30.:31:31.

English was "the key to full participation

:31:32.:31:35.

in our society and economy". They also said ministers

:31:36.:31:40.

should consider letting different parts of the UK

:31:41.:31:42.

set their own immigration policy. The government said it was spending

:31:43.:31:44.

?20 million on English A record number of new cars

:31:45.:31:46.

were bought in the UK in 2016 - according to the Society

:31:47.:31:54.

of Motor Manufacturers and Traders. That's up more than 2%

:31:55.:31:57.

on the previous year. However, there's a warning that

:31:58.:32:09.

with fleet and private sales now falling, the figures are unlikely

:32:10.:32:12.

to be so strong in 2017. This programme has learnt that

:32:13.:32:14.

a former Crewe Alexandra coach has denied wrongdoing

:32:15.:32:17.

after being suspended Paul McCann worked with young

:32:18.:32:18.

players at the club He was working with the then-manager

:32:19.:32:21.

Dario Gradi, who is now He also later volunteered as a youth

:32:22.:32:25.

coach at non-league club AFC Handwritten letters

:32:26.:32:29.

from Princess Diana are due to be Written to a steward

:32:30.:32:37.

at Buckingham Palace, they reveal that a young

:32:38.:32:41.

Prince Harry was routinely In one letter she wrote -

:32:42.:32:43.

"William adores his little brother and spends the entire time swamping

:32:44.:32:56.

Harry with an endless supply of hugs and kisses,

:32:57.:32:58.

hardly letting the parents near!" The collection will be sold over

:32:59.:33:02.

approximately 40 lots - with estimates ranging

:33:03.:33:04.

from ?80 to ?900. The auction also includes letters

:33:05.:33:06.

from the Queen, written That's a summary of the latest BBC

:33:07.:33:08.

News - more at 10.00am. John Watson is here with the sport.

:33:09.:33:17.

Good morning. Tottenham prevented Chelsea from matching the longest

:33:18.:33:20.

consecutive winning run in Premier League history as the blues were

:33:21.:33:24.

beaten 2-0 at White Hart Lane last night to throw open the title race.

:33:25.:33:29.

Dele Alli got both goals with two headers, Chelsea remain five points

:33:30.:33:33.

clear at the top and Tottenham are interred. Andy Murray's winning run

:33:34.:33:41.

continues, extending his consecutive winning run. He is into the

:33:42.:33:46.

quarterfinals after a tough straight sets win over Australian Gerald

:33:47.:33:49.

Melzer as he prepares for the Australian open later this month.

:33:50.:33:54.

The world number one is yet to win one of these titles. Johanna Konta's

:33:55.:33:58.

good run of form continues, one win away from reaching her third WTA

:33:59.:34:02.

final, she beat her competitor Kristyna Pliskova in the finals of

:34:03.:34:07.

the Shenzhen Open in China. That's all of the sport now, more in the

:34:08.:34:08.

next update at ten o'clock. Children are being left

:34:09.:34:16.

by their parents to 'fend for themselves' online according

:34:17.:34:18.

to the Children's In a report today, Anne Longfield

:34:19.:34:20.

says parents 'vainly hope' their kids will benefit

:34:21.:34:23.

from the internet's opportunities She also says it's 'wholly

:34:24.:34:25.

irresponsible' to let children and young teeenagers 'roam

:34:26.:34:28.

in a world for which Last year, 3-4 year olds spent

:34:29.:34:30.

on average eight hours 18 minutes a week online, and 12-15 year

:34:31.:34:39.

olds spend over 20 hours And there's a warning too that

:34:40.:34:42.

youngsters have no idea they often sign away their privacy

:34:43.:34:46.

when they join social media sites - rules in Instagram's terms

:34:47.:34:50.

and conditions for example, allow youngsters' messages amd

:34:51.:34:52.

pictures to be bought and sold by the web companies who can then

:34:53.:34:54.

target them for advertising. The Children's Commissioner

:34:55.:35:02.

is calling for simplified terms and conditions and compulsary

:35:03.:35:04.

digital citizenship Your own experiences are welcome and

:35:05.:35:15.

how you manage to make sure that your job and are safe online, let us

:35:16.:35:16.

know. Anne Longfield is here along

:35:17.:35:17.

with various primary From Whitefield School -

:35:18.:35:19.

Guy is in Year ten, Beth is in Year ten,

:35:20.:35:22.

Zara is in Year nine, Shinia is in Year 11 - they're

:35:23.:35:25.

here with their teacher Darren Also here from Tetherdown Primary

:35:26.:35:28.

School are Year 5s Eli, Catrin, Safia and Matteo

:35:29.:35:32.

and his mum Katherine. Thank you for coming onto the

:35:33.:35:41.

programme. A general question, raise your hands, if it is like being at

:35:42.:35:49.

school, I am sorry, who here has Snapchat? How old are you? I am ten.

:35:50.:35:56.

Did you know that you had to be 13 to have it? Yes. That's interesting!

:35:57.:36:05.

Who has Facebook, Instagram? Twitter? Again, you are meant to be

:36:06.:36:13.

13 for Instagram, and twitter... When you go online, are you

:36:14.:36:17.

concerned about anything, or are you just having a great time playing

:36:18.:36:24.

games or speaking to your friends? There is nothing that concerns you

:36:25.:36:32.

in terms of your safety? I keep all of my accounts private, unless I

:36:33.:36:36.

would like somebody to see it, then I keep it private. Mine is Private,

:36:37.:36:43.

I know what I put. Beth, you are the same? Everything is Private? And you

:36:44.:36:52.

only have one account. Not two? They always advertise it looking very

:36:53.:36:56.

safe, and having features of private accounts on Instagram, so it makes

:36:57.:37:02.

it look safe, so yes. Do you think that you are unusual in keeping all

:37:03.:37:10.

of your accounts private? No. A lot of people do it. All of my friends

:37:11.:37:15.

have all of their stuff Private. OK, and what are your worries, Anne, as

:37:16.:37:22.

Children's Commissioner. Firstly, the Internet is a force of good,

:37:23.:37:26.

while we talk about protection it is also about empowering children to

:37:27.:37:30.

get the most out of it. But it was not designed for children and over

:37:31.:37:33.

the last five or six years, it's become a big issue, one third of

:37:34.:37:39.

users are children. And in the clip as you said, children are

:37:40.:37:42.

ill-prepared and do not have knowledge about how the Internet

:37:43.:37:45.

works or the social rules that could be online. Often they do not have

:37:46.:37:50.

the information, especially regarding privacy and terms and

:37:51.:37:55.

conditions will rule that, they are largely unfathomable. They do not

:37:56.:38:01.

have the back-up to do something about if something goes wrong.

:38:02.:38:04.

Really, the balance of power is very much geared away from children on

:38:05.:38:10.

the Internet, and we know that half of children's leisure time, for

:38:11.:38:13.

teenagers, it's online. It is out of sync with their physical world and

:38:14.:38:20.

needs to change in terms of improving their rights. Is there

:38:21.:38:22.

anything that Anne Longfield has said which worries you? I do not get

:38:23.:38:28.

the impression that you are worried at all! I am slowly concerned, we

:38:29.:38:33.

feel so safe in what we are doing online and we know that it is ours

:38:34.:38:38.

but you said, of course, -- slightly concerned. You said that we are

:38:39.:38:42.

almost the underdogs, these big giants have power on us. I think

:38:43.:38:47.

what you do have is an environment which is largely unregulated. And,

:38:48.:38:53.

it is controlled by a feud very powerful companies. So, whether they

:38:54.:38:58.

have set out with intent or not, that is where you are. And it is

:38:59.:39:01.

ruled by terms and conditions which you have probably never read and

:39:02.:39:09.

would not understand if you did. Including adults, have you ever read

:39:10.:39:14.

the terms and conditions? Matty O, did you understand them? Yes. And I

:39:15.:39:20.

got my mum to check, she always checks. And you all clicked that you

:39:21.:39:28.

agree at the end? Yes. And you say that you understand them, what do

:39:29.:39:31.

you understand by the terms and conditions? Say if it is using

:39:32.:39:38.

social media, I understand where the privacy settings are sometimes. And

:39:39.:39:43.

my mum has two check them over. She only knows the password. Are you on

:39:44.:39:51.

Instagram? Do you know that they can buy and sell your information? Yes.

:39:52.:39:59.

I put my account on private. Does that stop a company from buying or

:40:00.:40:03.

selling those images, Jenny Afia? No, they can do what they want and

:40:04.:40:07.

get them to other companies and so one. But it means other people,

:40:08.:40:11.

members of the public, they cannot look at them but companies behind

:40:12.:40:15.

websites know everything about you. What do they know? Explain what they

:40:16.:40:20.

know about primary and secondary school children? Any information

:40:21.:40:24.

that you give them, so how often you go on the website, they are tracking

:40:25.:40:29.

you, even when you are not on it. If it is on your phone, they are

:40:30.:40:33.

monitoring you. They have your name, they have your e-mail address, they

:40:34.:40:37.

know what you like, they have been reading all of your private messages

:40:38.:40:40.

to one another and any concerns expressed privately, any other

:40:41.:40:46.

websites that you have gone too from there, and any products which you

:40:47.:40:50.

have liked, they are keeping records of all of that information. Are you

:40:51.:40:55.

really saying that there is someone at Facebook reading the messages of

:40:56.:41:01.

Sara, when she is working out with her friends what she will be wearing

:41:02.:41:06.

to a party on Friday night? I do not think there is one person there

:41:07.:41:09.

going through your messages but they will be looking at broad patterns to

:41:10.:41:13.

see how they can make money from all of us, and how other people will be

:41:14.:41:18.

interested in what you are doing and they will group information together

:41:19.:41:22.

and get money from it. What do you think of that? That's kind of scary,

:41:23.:41:29.

to be honest. Just the fact that they know what you are saying and

:41:30.:41:33.

what you are doing. It is kind of creepy. What do you think of that? I

:41:34.:41:39.

do not like it. It is basically like they can see what you are doing. As

:41:40.:41:44.

long as you carry your phone with you. And if we click that we agree

:41:45.:41:52.

on terms and conditions, we are giving them permission.

:41:53.:41:55.

As a mum, what are your concerns? As a mother and as a user, I'm deeply

:41:56.:42:04.

shocked that we have reached this point, I think that we have lost our

:42:05.:42:10.

own sense of what we should be passing on to our kids. The fact

:42:11.:42:14.

that we do not realise that privacy does not actually mean that, that is

:42:15.:42:19.

pretty... I'm sure a lot of people are not aware of that. I was not

:42:20.:42:25.

aware. And I see people, friends of mine, on Facebook, posting all kinds

:42:26.:42:29.

of images of their family, images of themselves, and images that, as a

:42:30.:42:37.

parent, and some teachers that you will see, they put images of

:42:38.:42:40.

themselves getting drunk, I don't know, it is not great modelling. It

:42:41.:42:48.

seems like we are giving kids access to something that they perceive as a

:42:49.:42:52.

toy and instead it is a hand grenade... My phone is ringing! I am

:42:53.:43:00.

so sorry. I was meant to put it on silent! I know that you play games

:43:01.:43:06.

online, Matteo, people that you do not know but you have no reason to

:43:07.:43:11.

suspect them, but you had some and kind messages, I think? Because I

:43:12.:43:15.

play games where messaging is not the main part of it, there are other

:43:16.:43:25.

parts to it, umm.. It is like a drawing game, you get a word of

:43:26.:43:29.

something that you have to draw and the other person will get it. I

:43:30.:43:33.

think they could not guess what I drew, and somebody called me a

:43:34.:43:42.

a-hole. I was really upset so I told my mum straightaway. And what could

:43:43.:43:48.

you do? Nothing really. Block the person and I felt extremely guilty

:43:49.:43:53.

that he was exposed to that. I have seen my 13-year-old son who thinks

:43:54.:43:58.

that his peer group are seeing the kind of trouble that others are

:43:59.:44:05.

getting into, they are not aware of their digital footprint. Can I just

:44:06.:44:11.

talk about the other issue that you raised in your report today, Anne?

:44:12.:44:15.

The length of time that people are on average spending online. Between

:44:16.:44:20.

the ages of three and four, on average you spend eight hours 18

:44:21.:44:24.

minutes online, according to Anne's report, and between 12 and 15, it is

:44:25.:44:29.

20 hours on average. Is that not enough? Too much? Are

:44:30.:44:34.

you always drawn to your phone when there is nothing to do? Is that your

:44:35.:44:39.

default position? I think it is too much, to be honest. When you are on

:44:40.:44:44.

social media for too long, you feel bored. I personally feel that there

:44:45.:44:51.

is no point at the end. There is no point in me wasting time on it...

:44:52.:44:58.

When do you reach that feeling, how long are you on it? A couple of

:44:59.:45:06.

hours, to be honest. But it is spread out through the day. And what

:45:07.:45:11.

about your daily habits, Beth? How often a day are you online? A couple

:45:12.:45:18.

of hours. Same as you, but not in one go. If I finish my homework or

:45:19.:45:22.

something, the first thing I think those doing my phone to check if I

:45:23.:45:25.

have any messages... And your parents the same? No, they aren't.

:45:26.:45:32.

Is anybody on for more than three hours per day? Yeah... Darren, as a

:45:33.:45:43.

teacher, where do the schools coming on this? According to Anne's report,

:45:44.:45:48.

parents are being reasonably responsible in the kind of access we

:45:49.:45:52.

give our kids when it comes to being online... We have safety policies

:45:53.:45:57.

for safety agricultural drunk and students, from year seven day are

:45:58.:46:03.

taught in ICT lessons... -- safety policies for students.

:46:04.:46:07.

You need to be careful of what is online and tort of the dangers,

:46:08.:46:11.

teachers are held to safety policies in terms of our accounts. At the

:46:12.:46:17.

same time, some of them may choose to ignore it because they would like

:46:18.:46:19.

more followers. Often you do not think it applies to

:46:20.:46:26.

you because you feel in control of what you are doing online, you think

:46:27.:46:30.

you are kind of invincible. Most of the time that will be true but on

:46:31.:46:36.

the odd occasion you may be subject to bullying, you know, grooming, etc

:46:37.:46:43.

etc. What do you think of Anne Longfield's idea of teaching

:46:44.:46:49.

compulsory citizenship lessons? It is included in the scheme of

:46:50.:46:54.

learning for years seven and we do refresher assemblies throughout the

:46:55.:46:59.

years. From the age of four, you suggest, Anne Longfield. Yes and

:47:00.:47:02.

there is an emphasis on safety and protection which is important, but

:47:03.:47:06.

given this is really now a part ingrained in every part of young

:47:07.:47:11.

people's lives this is about empowering children as well. So how

:47:12.:47:15.

to be a good digital citizen, how to notice if somebody is a real person

:47:16.:47:20.

or a fake person, or how to understand how to react to adverts

:47:21.:47:24.

if they are targeted towards you. And the discussions we've had about

:47:25.:47:27.

terms and conditions, that is something children should all know.

:47:28.:47:32.

You are calling for them to be really simplified. They should be

:47:33.:47:37.

very transparent. That would be incredibly helpful. As a mum, Katie,

:47:38.:47:41.

terms of compulsory lessons from the age of four about how to behave

:47:42.:47:47.

online and manage it, what would you say? Absolutely, and I'm right about

:47:48.:47:50.

parenting and keep banging on about the fact that there is no mandatory

:47:51.:47:56.

sex and relationship education and it has to be seen within that

:47:57.:48:02.

context that it's a relationship you're having with other, often,

:48:03.:48:06.

people you don't know, it's going to be a relationship you are having

:48:07.:48:09.

with human resources who are going through your history to see whether

:48:10.:48:14.

you are a good bet for the company. There is so much that people don't

:48:15.:48:18.

know and we are still as a generation, us lot, incredibly

:48:19.:48:23.

squeamish about the subject and we are failing them. You think we are?

:48:24.:48:30.

Big time. As a privacy law expert, Jenny, would you welcome compulsory

:48:31.:48:33.

lessons from the age of four circuits know what they are doing?

:48:34.:48:38.

Absolutely, we've had a lot of education about safety and the

:48:39.:48:40.

debate about the Internet always gets tied up with safety and that is

:48:41.:48:44.

obviously important, but the debate in the education needs to move on

:48:45.:48:49.

now so that young people in particular understand technology and

:48:50.:48:52.

how it works. For example, knowing that when you are online for three

:48:53.:48:56.

hours a day it's because there is technology built in, they are called

:48:57.:49:00.

sticky sites that are designed just to hook you in and keep you on your

:49:01.:49:04.

phone so that you keep looking at the advertising content and so on. I

:49:05.:49:09.

don't think enough parents and children realise that. That's the

:49:10.:49:12.

point plenty of the audience is making this morning, the fact you

:49:13.:49:15.

all know much more than your periods know. Also raised most kids

:49:16.:49:19.

understand how the Internet works better than adults. Privacy is a

:49:20.:49:23.

generational issue, parents will teach children Web safety. When you

:49:24.:49:28.

became parents you will become savvy in a way that I am not and you are

:49:29.:49:32.

not Katie. Ben says three to four-year-olds, eight hours online,

:49:33.:49:36.

it is disgraceful and shows parents just want quiet out of the way kids.

:49:37.:49:40.

Ed says kids on your programme today holding their own on the online

:49:41.:49:46.

privacy issue. I know that some of your parents monitor your social

:49:47.:49:49.

media sites. Is that part of the deal for you having access to

:49:50.:49:52.

Facebook, Twitter and Instagram? Yes. Are you happy with that? Yes, I

:49:53.:49:59.

don't mind. Would you go further, would you welcome the fact they look

:50:00.:50:03.

at what you are saying to your mates and what other people say to you? I

:50:04.:50:07.

think it is good because then it makes sure you don't do anything

:50:08.:50:13.

bad, your parents are checking your phone and that you are safe. We

:50:14.:50:17.

often walk into situations blindfolded, whereas, for example,

:50:18.:50:21.

Al parents will be able to take a step back and look at what we are

:50:22.:50:26.

going into, you know? OK. Thank you for coming on, all of you. Thank

:50:27.:50:31.

you, thank you, thank you. That was somebody from Manchester Arena in if

:50:32.:50:36.

you are interested. Your views are welcome, get in touch.

:50:37.:50:44.

Could living near a busy road increase your risk

:50:45.:50:48.

We'll be examining new research which says that could be the case.

:50:49.:50:52.

So little is known about the causes of dementia.

:50:53.:50:55.

Next this morning - this programme has learnt that

:50:56.:50:57.

a former youth coach for Crewe Alexandra football club

:50:58.:50:59.

Paul McCann worked closely with Crewe's then manager and now

:51:00.:51:04.

director of football Dario Gardi who has also been

:51:05.:51:08.

director of football Dario Gradi who has also been

:51:09.:51:10.

Mr McCann says he will co-operate with any investigation.

:51:11.:51:13.

Paul McCann was a coach at Crewe in the 1980s and at one stage she was

:51:14.:51:23.

in charge of the youth team and also in charge of the beating, or reserve

:51:24.:51:27.

team at one point. This was on a voluntary basis, he was never paid

:51:28.:51:31.

for his work at the club, that was a common situation in the 1980s. We

:51:32.:51:37.

have read a book, A History Of Crewe where he is described as a

:51:38.:51:40.

long-standing member of the club, a stalwart and a key member of the

:51:41.:51:44.

youth team and reserve team. He left the club in the 90s, why was that?

:51:45.:51:49.

He left in 1991, he had a job outside football that took abroad to

:51:50.:51:52.

the Netherlands and then Australia. He came back to the UK, the same

:51:53.:51:57.

area, seven or eight years later. He didn't go back to Crewe but

:51:58.:51:59.

maintained an interest in football and was awarded his Uefa a coaching

:52:00.:52:05.

lessons, a serious qualification, allowing you to manage or coach any

:52:06.:52:09.

team up to just underneath premiership level. He never used a

:52:10.:52:13.

qualification to work professionally but in 2014 he was assisted as a

:52:14.:52:20.

youth team manager at AFC badminton on Merseyside which ended after a

:52:21.:52:25.

year in 2015 when the team was disbanded -- AFC Bebington. Back

:52:26.:52:28.

coaching licence has now been suspended? It has been suspended by

:52:29.:52:33.

the Football Association, not by the Cheshire FA but the safeguarding

:52:34.:52:36.

board of the FA in London. It means he may not work in any capacity in

:52:37.:52:40.

football until the suspension was lifted. Officially the FA will not

:52:41.:52:45.

confirm the suspension or tell us what he is suspended, it is

:52:46.:52:50.

confidential information. What did Paul McCann say? He confirmed he has

:52:51.:52:53.

been suspended and we understand he will cooperate with any

:52:54.:52:57.

investigation and we understand he denies any wrongdoing. He told the

:52:58.:52:59.

Guardian newspaper this morning that he thinks he is collateral damage in

:53:00.:53:04.

all of this. He is the second person suspended by the FA that is linked

:53:05.:53:09.

to Crewe Alexandra football club. The current director of football and

:53:10.:53:13.

long-time manager Dario Gradi has also been suspended, this was back

:53:14.:53:16.

in November. The Football Association will not tell us why

:53:17.:53:20.

that was. Dario Gradi has denied any wrongdoing and said he will

:53:21.:53:24.

cooperate fully with any investigation. Thank you, Jim Reed

:53:25.:53:28.

reporting. A private memorial service will take place later today

:53:29.:53:31.

for American acting icons Carrie Fisher and her mum Debbie Reynolds.

:53:32.:53:38.

Family members and close friends will attend.

:53:39.:53:40.

60-year-old Carrie Fisher died last Tuesday after suffering cardiac

:53:41.:53:42.

arrest on a plane travelling from London to Los Angeles.

:53:43.:53:44.

The next day, her mother - Debbie Reynolds - died from a stroke

:53:45.:53:48.

Her son, Carrie's brother, Todd Fisher,

:53:49.:53:53.

says she died of a "broken heart" following her daughter's death.

:53:54.:53:56.

The pair had been taking part in a HBO documentary

:53:57.:53:58.

which airs this weekend - here's an extract from it.

:53:59.:54:03.

That's from when they first invented cellphones.

:54:04.:54:07.

I have to go and start rehearsals for Star Wars seven...

:54:08.:54:17.

I'm concerned because my mother is not feeling well.

:54:18.:54:27.

That's what's good about losing your memory.

:54:28.:54:33.

It's like the old days in a way but I'm like the old days, so...

:54:34.:54:37.

My family in particular can overwhelm

:54:38.:54:39.

It wasn't just my mother that was super famous.

:54:40.:54:42.

They were the couple of America, one heck of a

:54:43.:54:47.

My mother, she'll forget she's not 35.

:54:48.:54:54.

Age is horrible for all of us but she falls from a

:54:55.:54:57.

That was not diagnosed then so nobody kind of knew what was

:54:58.:55:07.

I went too fast, I was too much, I couldn't

:55:08.:55:12.

Turn around this way because your rear end is to the camera.

:55:13.:55:20.

Far more than I ever would want to, I

:55:21.:55:33.

Just do what your mother says, it makes life easier.

:55:34.:55:37.

Here's a reminder of some of their most iconic films.

:55:38.:55:51.

# Singing in the rain # Just singing in the rain.

:55:52.:55:57.

# What the hell are you doing?

:55:58.:56:03.

I recognised your foul stench when I was brought on board.

:56:04.:56:10.

My personal life is always sort of like this, and I think I can, I

:56:11.:56:19.

think I can, and I seem to marry poorly, I have no taste in men.

:56:20.:56:24.

Luckily for me Gareth is good and I have two wonderful children.

:56:25.:56:28.

The Imperial Senate will not stand for this. When they hear...

:56:29.:56:43.

I'm very excited about being back. I've never been happy since I left.

:56:44.:56:54.

She wants to live in England. Swiss Cottage. I keep buying her tickets

:56:55.:57:00.

and she hasn't moved yet. Now I'm going to come.

:57:01.:57:03.

Before 11am we will speak to Warwick Davis who starred with Carrie Fisher

:57:04.:57:06.

in Star Wars and described her as an iconic figure but at the same time a

:57:07.:57:09.

down-to-earth person who just enjoyed living.

:57:10.:57:10.

That is in the next hour. The latest news and sport in a second but first

:57:11.:57:19.

the weather. Wasn't it cold this morning. I have lovely pictures from

:57:20.:57:28.

our weather Watchers. This is in Cheshire, look at the frost on the

:57:29.:57:32.

ground. London, northward, frosty but beautiful start to the day and

:57:33.:57:36.

the temperatures, well, the lowest temperature was in Benson in

:57:37.:57:42.

Oxfordshire, minus 8.1 Celsius, the coldest night in England of the

:57:43.:57:49.

winter so far. In time-honoured state in Scotland, -8, -7, -4, and a

:57:50.:57:54.

bit higher in Belfast and St Mary's because we have a weather front

:57:55.:57:58.

there. For most of us it is a frosty start, in the shade you will hang on

:57:59.:58:02.

to the frost for much of the day but lots of us won't be, we will enjoy

:58:03.:58:05.

wintry sunshine. High-pressure is in charge of the weather, here is the

:58:06.:58:09.

weather front producing cloud in Northern Ireland, the far south-west

:58:10.:58:11.

of Wales and south-west England. Here are the temperatures which have

:58:12.:58:16.

kept up as we have gone through the night. A lot of sunshine. Cold,

:58:17.:58:22.

crisp, winter sunshine with light breezes, along the east coast of

:58:23.:58:25.

England at times you might find a little more cloud which could

:58:26.:58:28.

produce the odd shower but most of us will miss them. More cloud

:58:29.:58:32.

towards the west and with an approaching weather front coming in

:58:33.:58:34.

towards north-west Scotland you will find more cloud building through the

:58:35.:58:39.

afternoon, so in the Northwest the sunshine will be hazy. In Northern

:58:40.:58:42.

Ireland are you are under the influence of weather fronts so

:58:43.:58:46.

mostly cloudy, some sunny spells but for the bulk of England and Wales we

:58:47.:58:51.

are looking at a fine afternoon, cold, mind you, with lots of

:58:52.:58:54.

sunshine. Except in the south-west where you might find the odd splash

:58:55.:58:58.

of rain coming your way. Through the evening and overnight you can see

:58:59.:59:02.

the blue hues on the chart, it means it will be cold and frosty again,

:59:03.:59:05.

but as cloud advances from the north-west some of the frost will

:59:06.:59:09.

lift, not so pushing down into the south-eastern quarter of the UK

:59:10.:59:13.

where it will be frosty, cold obviously, and we will have freezing

:59:14.:59:17.

fog patches. Maybe not just across East Anglia and Southeast, we could

:59:18.:59:22.

see some further west. Meanwhile, the band of rain careers across

:59:23.:59:24.

Scotland and Northern Ireland, getting into north-west England and

:59:25.:59:27.

north-west Wales by the end of the night. Tomorrow the weather fronts

:59:28.:59:32.

will continue their descent south-eastwards bringing rain with

:59:33.:59:36.

them, the cloud building ahead of them. Where you have the freezing

:59:37.:59:41.

fog it will slowly lift, a lot of it into low cloud. Across the far

:59:42.:59:45.

south-east tomorrow it will be quite grey, dank and feel cold. As the

:59:46.:59:51.

rain move south, behind it we see a return to brighter skies, hill fog

:59:52.:59:55.

and some showers. The main thing you will notice is it is going to be

:59:56.:59:59.

mild, except for where we have the low cloud in the south-east.

:00:00.:00:03.

Our top story - The Children's Commissioner for England

:00:04.:00:12.

tells this programme - children are often

:00:13.:00:16.

ill-prepared to deal with potential pitfalls online,

:00:17.:00:18.

amid concerns young people are being left to 'fend for themselves'.

:00:19.:00:20.

You have an environment which is largely unregulated, and it is

:00:21.:00:27.

controlled by a feud very powerful companies. So whether they set out

:00:28.:00:32.

with intent or not, that is where you are -- a few. And it is ruled by

:00:33.:00:38.

terms and conditions that you have probably never read and would

:00:39.:00:43.

probably not understand even if you did. Schoolchildren have told us

:00:44.:00:47.

this morning that some spend about three hours a day online, but were

:00:48.:00:53.

quite happy that parents monitored their activities online. Also

:00:54.:01:00.

today... The men who murdered their families, we speak to those

:01:01.:01:01.

affected. Those are the things

:01:02.:01:03.

I have to live with now. Even though it has

:01:04.:01:06.

been 14 years, I have bad dreams and all of the things

:01:07.:01:08.

that you have experienced... And over Christmas week, two rough

:01:09.:01:23.

sleepers died on the streets in one Kent town.

:01:24.:01:27.

How did that happen in the 21st-century? We have a look.

:01:28.:01:34.

Here's Anita in the BBC Newsroom with a summary of today's news.

:01:35.:01:40.

A study has warned that children are being left to "fend

:01:41.:01:43.

for themselves" in the digital world against dangers such

:01:44.:01:45.

The Children's Commissioner for England, Anne Longfield,

:01:46.:01:48.

says many children and parents are often unaware that personal

:01:49.:01:50.

information and content posted on social media sites can be sold

:01:51.:01:53.

Children are often ill-prepared, they do not have knowledge about how

:01:54.:02:02.

the Internet works or the social rules that could be online. Often

:02:03.:02:08.

they do not have the information, especially regarding privacy, and

:02:09.:02:11.

terms and conditions ruled that, they are largely unfathomable. They

:02:12.:02:15.

do not have the back-up to be able to do something about it, if

:02:16.:02:19.

something goes wrong. Researchers in Canada have found

:02:20.:02:21.

that people living near major roads appear more likely

:02:22.:02:23.

to develop dementia. They tracked more than two million

:02:24.:02:31.

people in Ontario for signs of the brain disease over the course

:02:32.:02:33.

of eleven years. The scientists suggested air

:02:34.:02:36.

pollution or noisy traffic could contribute to the brain's

:02:37.:02:38.

decline. The Turkish government say the man

:02:39.:02:41.

behind the New Year's Day gun attack in Istanbul may have

:02:42.:02:44.

left the country. 39 people were killed in the attack

:02:45.:02:46.

at the Reina nightclub Deputy Prime Minister told

:02:47.:02:48.

a Turkish broadcaster that the killer was of Uighur

:02:49.:02:54.

origin and that the gunman acted alone but may have

:02:55.:02:57.

been helped by others. A record number of new cars

:02:58.:02:59.

were bought in the UK in 2016 - according to the Society

:03:00.:03:03.

of Motor Manufacturers and Traders. Sales hit 2.69 million -

:03:04.:03:05.

that's up more than 2% However, with sales growth now

:03:06.:03:17.

falling, the industry is not expecting such strong figures in

:03:18.:03:18.

2017. This programme has learnt that

:03:19.:03:22.

a former Crewe Alexandra coach has denied wrongdoing

:03:23.:03:25.

after being suspended Paul McCann worked with young

:03:26.:03:26.

players at the club He was working with the then-manager

:03:27.:03:36.

Dario Gradi, who is now He also later volunteered as a youth

:03:37.:03:39.

coach at non-league club AFC Handwritten letters

:03:40.:03:43.

from Princess Diana are due to be Written to a steward

:03:44.:03:47.

at Buckingham Palace, they reveal that a young

:03:48.:03:49.

Prince Harry was routinely In one letter she described being

:03:50.:03:59.

totally overwhelmed by the number of flowers she received after Prince

:04:00.:04:00.

Harry's birth. The collection will be sold over

:04:01.:04:05.

approximately 40 lots - with estimates ranging

:04:06.:04:07.

from ?80 to ?900. The auction also includes

:04:08.:04:09.

letters from the Queen, written on Windsor Castle headed

:04:10.:04:11.

paper. A five-month-old baby elephant has

:04:12.:04:13.

been taking a dip in a swimming pool in Thailand as part of a lengthy

:04:14.:04:16.

rehabilitation process Baby Fah Jam's front left leg

:04:17.:04:18.

was caught in a trap set by local villagers in November -

:04:19.:04:25.

But although the wound and her health improved significantly,

:04:26.:04:28.

she refused to put any weight The treatment - which is being

:04:29.:04:30.

undertaken so she can avoid having to use a a prosthetic leg -

:04:31.:04:35.

could take up to two months. That's a summary of the latest BBC

:04:36.:04:39.

News - more at 10.30. Do get in touch with us

:04:40.:04:46.

throughout the morning - use the #VictoriaLIVE

:04:47.:04:50.

and if you text, you will be charged Here's some sport now with JOHN,

:04:51.:04:53.

and the Premier League title chase John is here with all of the

:04:54.:04:57.

sport... The Premier League title

:04:58.:05:04.

race is hotting up. Tottenham prevented Chelsea

:05:05.:05:06.

from matching the longest consecutive winning run in PL

:05:07.:05:07.

history which stands at 14 matches. The Blues were beaten 2-0

:05:08.:05:13.

at White Hart Lane last night, both goals coming from midfielder

:05:14.:05:15.

Dele Alli. Before the game his manager

:05:16.:05:17.

Mauricio Pochettino called him the most important player to emerge

:05:18.:05:19.

in English Football in recent years. And Alli responded,

:05:20.:05:22.

helping Tottenham to their fifth straight win

:05:23.:05:23.

So Tottenham are up third, but Chelsea remain five points clear

:05:24.:05:26.

at the top. For the boys, there was no need to

:05:27.:05:30.

talk before the game, everybody knew how big it was for the players and

:05:31.:05:33.

the fans come could see from the first whistle how badly the fans

:05:34.:05:37.

wanted to win as well. It was nice to score but it was more important

:05:38.:05:42.

to get the win today. Tottenham are in third place, Chelsea remain five

:05:43.:05:44.

points clear at the top. And despite seeing his side slip

:05:45.:05:46.

to their first league defeat since September,

:05:47.:05:49.

Chelsea manager Antonio Conte is confident his side can

:05:50.:05:50.

continue their recent good run. It is a pity, but it is important to

:05:51.:06:04.

know that this can happen. It is important now to continue to work

:06:05.:06:06.

very hard, to improve every day. It's now a career best 26

:06:07.:06:10.

competitive matches in a row he's won after beating Gerald Melzer

:06:11.:06:14.

to reach the Quarter Final's The World Number One

:06:15.:06:16.

was made to work hard - he was taken to a tie break

:06:17.:06:21.

in the first set against the Austrian -

:06:22.:06:24.

but took it 7-6 and the second 7-5. As he continues his preparation

:06:25.:06:32.

for the Australian Open later this month, he's reached the final five

:06:33.:06:37.

times in Melbourne, Johanna Konta's good

:06:38.:06:40.

form continues as well. She is one win away from her third

:06:41.:06:43.

WTA Final after victory over Krystina Pliskova in the Semi Finals

:06:44.:06:46.

of the Shenzen Open in China. And Paralympic champion Kadeena Cox,

:06:47.:06:49.

has defended her decision, to take part in the Channel 4

:06:50.:06:57.

reality show, The Jump. UK Sport have suspended her funding

:06:58.:07:02.

while she takes part A number of celebrities have been

:07:03.:07:04.

injured in previous series. On social media, Cox

:07:05.:07:11.

said her diagnosis, of MS, had changed her outlook on life,

:07:12.:07:15.

saying her life is a ticking time bomb, and that she was going to go

:07:16.:07:18.

away and enjoy ski-ing. I'll be back at half

:07:19.:07:24.

past with the latest. People who live near major roads

:07:25.:07:29.

have higher rates of Alzheimers and other forms of dementia,

:07:30.:07:36.

research published in the medical At the moment, very little is known

:07:37.:07:39.

about the causes of dementia. Lets talk to our various guests who

:07:40.:07:50.

we have here... I am waiting for their names!

:07:51.:07:51.

With us in the studio is Dr James Pickett, head

:07:52.:07:53.

of research at Alzheimer's Society, and in our Glasgow newsroom

:07:54.:07:56.

is Professor June Andrews from Stirling University,

:07:57.:07:58.

who's the author of Dementia - The One-Stop Guide.

:07:59.:08:02.

Doctor James, this is not as simple as headlines would suggest, can you

:08:03.:08:12.

and pick this for our audience? Yes, causes of dementia of extreme

:08:13.:08:16.

interest but very complicated. We know there are things we are born

:08:17.:08:19.

with, genetics play a role but there are things which we have control

:08:20.:08:26.

over, like diet and lifestyle. What we are beginning to learn, the new

:08:27.:08:29.

area, is how the environment and where we live plays a role as well.

:08:30.:08:37.

This single study is beginning early research in a big study beginning to

:08:38.:08:43.

unpick that for us. June, does this study mean that if you move near a

:08:44.:08:48.

major road, with traffic noise and air pollution, you are more likely

:08:49.:08:52.

to get dementia? If you move to the countryside you are less likely? It

:08:53.:08:56.

is really important that nobody moves house on the basis of the

:08:57.:09:01.

study. What it does is it reinforces things we've known for quite a long

:09:02.:09:06.

time. Although the origins of dementia are quite complicated, it

:09:07.:09:09.

is quite clear that air quality, where you live, makes a difference

:09:10.:09:14.

to how well you are. That's a quality inside of a care home or a

:09:15.:09:18.

house. It is unsurprising that environmental air quality, the kind

:09:19.:09:23.

of thing an issue near a main road, will make a difference. There is

:09:24.:09:27.

research indicating this but there is no need to move house on the back

:09:28.:09:33.

of this? Why not? There are things that can make more of a difference

:09:34.:09:38.

than the place you live. Exercise makes a difference and what you eat

:09:39.:09:41.

and drink, staying well hydrated and even temperature in your home can

:09:42.:09:46.

make a difference. Moving house is such a huge turmoil for people that

:09:47.:09:50.

if you are already affected by dementia, moving house itself can

:09:51.:09:54.

make things worse. It is important not to overreact to this one piece

:09:55.:09:58.

of research showing there is an association, that is not necessarily

:09:59.:10:04.

causal. That is very important. We are not saying that if you moved by

:10:05.:10:07.

that road, you will get dementia, but what we are saying is that you

:10:08.:10:12.

may be more likely to get dementia, or people who are more likely to get

:10:13.:10:17.

dementia live by busy roads. That's correct. Yes, air pollution could be

:10:18.:10:22.

one factor, disturbance and we know that sleep is important, disturbance

:10:23.:10:29.

in sleep and stress could have a role but there are reasons, as Jean

:10:30.:10:33.

says, you cannot link one thing to the other. The study does not show

:10:34.:10:37.

that moving away from the road reduces risk but the evidence

:10:38.:10:45.

suggests that people who grew up in the country are at higher risk than

:10:46.:10:51.

those who grew up in urban environments. We are learning single

:10:52.:10:55.

pieces of information but we had to take a bigger picture of all of the

:10:56.:10:58.

evidence. There are hundreds of things you do in your life, some of

:10:59.:11:02.

the things you know about, which increase your risk, others which

:11:03.:11:06.

reduce it. It is the whole footprint across your life. I agree with

:11:07.:11:14.

James, one of the things to do is to look at what you can do which will

:11:15.:11:18.

make the biggest difference. Some of the things include rest, which is

:11:19.:11:22.

really hard to get a proper sleep if you are living near a noisy road.

:11:23.:11:26.

There are things that you can do to improve the chances of someone

:11:27.:11:30.

sleeping well when they have dementia, dementia is self is a

:11:31.:11:33.

symptom of the disease. There are a lot of things you can do to make

:11:34.:11:36.

symptoms easy without affecting the underlying disease, which is what we

:11:37.:11:40.

would like to do eventually but at the moment we isn't much -- there

:11:41.:11:44.

isn't much we can do for that. So there has to be more research done,

:11:45.:11:52.

which is being done, why do we know so little about the specific causes?

:11:53.:11:56.

Both if you have talked about a myriad of reasons which can help but

:11:57.:12:01.

why do we know so little about the causes of it? Your brain is a very

:12:02.:12:05.

complicated organ, separated from your body by the blood brain

:12:06.:12:10.

barrier, making research between the two very complicated. We know that

:12:11.:12:15.

the fragile brain can have problems which do not translate into dementia

:12:16.:12:19.

symptoms. That is right there are so many things you can do to keep

:12:20.:12:21.

symptoms down. -- that is why.

:12:22.:12:25.

There are a lot of different causes, vascular disease, outsiders disease,

:12:26.:12:29.

so many and if you found the cause of one of them, you may not get the

:12:30.:12:34.

others. It is very complicated. I'm glad it

:12:35.:12:38.

is being discussed to day, sometimes in it then use it can be

:12:39.:12:42.

oversimplified, which is frustratingly for the families

:12:43.:12:46.

affected. Is it one of the issues of our times? Definitely, we have not

:12:47.:12:49.

invested enough in dementia research for many years. Which is why we know

:12:50.:12:54.

so little about the brain. That is beginning to change, our

:12:55.:13:00.

organisation is creating a new Institute in London to tackle the

:13:01.:13:05.

causes of dementia as well. I'm hopeful for the future that we will

:13:06.:13:09.

begin to invest. We always say that more research is needed and funding

:13:10.:13:13.

as well, we are beginning to address one of the issues of our time. In

:13:14.:13:18.

the meantime, if people know the practical things they can to until

:13:19.:13:22.

this wonderful research comes through, I'm glad that research is

:13:23.:13:25.

being done, knowing what to do in the meantime is vital. You mentioned

:13:26.:13:30.

getting a decent night of sleep, what else? Exercise? That makes a

:13:31.:13:36.

difference, you need fresh air and not near a busy road. Health checks

:13:37.:13:45.

over 40. Eat well, stay hydrated, act on underlying health problems.

:13:46.:13:48.

If you have diabetes or high blood pressure, manage it properly. There

:13:49.:13:53.

are a lot of things you can do and information like that is on the

:13:54.:13:57.

Alzheimer's Society website. What is good for your heart is good for your

:13:58.:13:59.

head. Thank you very much, both of you. The government is being

:14:00.:14:08.

urged to act after two homeless people died in the same town over

:14:09.:14:11.

Christmas, we have been to Chatham in Kent to find out more.

:14:12.:14:16.

This morning we've been talking about the men

:14:17.:14:18.

What causes them to carry out acts of such unspeakable brutality?

:14:19.:14:21.

Leading experts have told this programme we should be doing more

:14:22.:14:24.

to spot warning signs and patterns of behaviour - things

:14:25.:14:27.

like physical abuse, a loss of control and terrifying

:14:28.:14:29.

threats - which should be triggering concern and action.

:14:30.:14:31.

But what about the families who this advice is too late for?

:14:32.:14:36.

Our reporter James Longman has been to meet one woman whose children

:14:37.:14:39.

Denise Williams met her ex-husband Stephen Wilson when she was 16.

:14:40.:14:53.

Brett was born in 1993, and Bradley the following year.

:14:54.:15:00.

life of abuse and putting up with drunken outbursts,

:15:01.:15:04.

just having the children seemed to make it all OK.

:15:05.:15:13.

Denise took her sons and left Stephen several times.

:15:14.:15:16.

She left for the last time in February 2002.

:15:17.:15:19.

She didn't take Brett and Bradley with her that time but was planning

:15:20.:15:22.

He rang me, and he said I have just killed the kids and I'm

:15:23.:15:32.

And at that, you think, listen for the boys, listen

:15:33.:15:38.

for the boys in the background, can you hear them?

:15:39.:15:40.

Stephen murdered his two sons by stabbing them in their necks.

:15:41.:15:46.

First he killed his younger son, Bradley, who was seven years old,

:15:47.:15:49.

I remember going and just seeing the children through a glass,

:15:50.:15:59.

like they're in a fish tank, and I identified the bodies.

:16:00.:16:03.

Stephen Wilson was given two life sentences for their murders.

:16:04.:16:20.

Denise's story shows a cycle of abuse ending in tragedy,

:16:21.:16:30.

but what about when the very children targeted manage to survive?

:16:31.:16:34.

David Potts attacked his partner's family,

:16:35.:16:36.

Somebody broke through the back door.

:16:37.:16:43.

But before they did that, they went and bought -

:16:44.:16:48.

on the floor, over the sofas and up the stairs and everywhere,

:16:49.:16:56.

And then my mum and eldest brother went to try and stop him

:16:57.:17:04.

but he just lit the fuel just in time,

:17:05.:17:10.

Zac was four years old when his mum's new partner broke

:17:11.:17:20.

into the family home and set it on fire.

:17:21.:17:24.

Zac survived, along with his half sister Kay-Lynn,

:17:25.:17:25.

His mum, Tracy, and 15-year-old half brother, Sean, were killed.

:17:26.:17:34.

Zac was taken to a children's hospital for treatment.

:17:35.:17:36.

When I found out who died, I was crying, and when I think

:17:37.:17:46.

Zac is now nine and living with his dad.

:17:47.:18:03.

I would like think of what it would be like if my mum was around,

:18:04.:18:06.

and what house I would be in, either the same house

:18:07.:18:09.

Yes, you think about the practicalities a lot, don't you?

:18:10.:18:12.

You miss having your mum around, don't you?

:18:13.:18:14.

It would be nice to have mum here as well.

:18:15.:18:18.

Like, somebody to, an extra person to accompany me.

:18:19.:18:30.

Let's talk now to Dr Jane Monckton-Smith -

:18:31.:18:32.

a Criminologist at the University of Gloucestershire.

:18:33.:18:34.

She's currently leading one of the biggest studies

:18:35.:18:36.

Hello to you. Good morning. This text from Simon goes to the heart of

:18:37.:18:48.

it. My heart bleeds for them and what horrific things they had to

:18:49.:18:52.

endure. Why do these situations arise and what could lead to these

:18:53.:18:55.

men killing their own children and partners? We have to try and stop

:18:56.:18:59.

this before it happens. The poor boy having to watch that happen to his

:19:00.:19:02.

mum and brother and surviving to live his life without them makes me

:19:03.:19:08.

cry. What leads some men to do this? Well, I think we need to look at the

:19:09.:19:13.

dynamics of domestic abuse and especially coercive control. Is

:19:14.:19:17.

there always a link? I would say always a link. Perhaps we could put

:19:18.:19:22.

it at 98%, but really, even though most of these cases don't come to

:19:23.:19:25.

the notice of the police or there is no arrest record before these things

:19:26.:19:29.

happen, families, friends, communities can very often spot some

:19:30.:19:33.

of the danger signs, especially if they know what they are. The

:19:34.:19:37.

families that I've worked with always say if only we'd known what

:19:38.:19:46.

to look for. When you say something we can look for, sometimes there is

:19:47.:19:51.

physical evidence when somebody beats up a partner, relatives will

:19:52.:19:54.

know if somebody is not allowed out of the house, or not allowed to call

:19:55.:20:00.

them or text them, won't they? But you never actually think, do you, he

:20:01.:20:05.

might kill them? You just don't think that. Nobody thinks murder

:20:06.:20:09.

will come into their lives, do they? It is our worst nightmare. But from

:20:10.:20:14.

all the research that's been done internationally and certainly from

:20:15.:20:18.

the study I'm doing, there are some inconsistencies in the way that this

:20:19.:20:21.

certain group of men behave, and it is mainly men, over 95% of cases it

:20:22.:20:29.

is men. The consistency is spread across domestic abuse. These are

:20:30.:20:35.

domestic homicides that have extended out a little bit. Is there

:20:36.:20:40.

always a pattern rather than somebody out of the blue suddenly

:20:41.:20:44.

murdering their partner or children? I can say with some confidence, and

:20:45.:20:49.

other researchers have said with confidence, that these are always

:20:50.:20:52.

planned. They are never spontaneous and I think that's where we get

:20:53.:20:58.

misled. That means somebody can't snap, in inverted commas, if it is

:20:59.:21:04.

premeditated? He just snapped, is very often the reason we put forward

:21:05.:21:07.

for these things happening but that is not helping us stop it because it

:21:08.:21:11.

is to misinterpret what has happened. It looks sometimes as if

:21:12.:21:16.

they've just snapped because we don't recognise the antecedents, the

:21:17.:21:23.

stalking, the escalation and things like that. In most cases there is no

:21:24.:21:29.

obvious violence. What do you expect other people to do then? There is no

:21:30.:21:33.

obvious violence. You think you know, he won't let her out, what are

:21:34.:21:38.

you going to do? Ring the police and say I think my brother-in-law won't

:21:39.:21:43.

let my sister out? They will not be able to do much. It would be

:21:44.:21:47.

difficult on that information to do much but you must remember we have

:21:48.:21:52.

two new course of conduct defences, coercive control and stalking. So

:21:53.:21:58.

the police have more powers to act earlier in the situations. What I am

:21:59.:22:01.

saying to you if you are a relative or friend and you think there is an

:22:02.:22:05.

issue, is it your job to collect some evidence and present it to the

:22:06.:22:08.

police in order to get them to act, or is it enough to say, I think

:22:09.:22:20.

there is an issue here, please help? The best thing is to speak to the

:22:21.:22:22.

person involved. You have to speak in a varied nonjudgemental way

:22:23.:22:25.

because it is very difficult to leave. In fact, leaving is the

:22:26.:22:27.

biggest trigger for this kind of behaviour, this kind of family

:22:28.:22:29.

annihilation, so it has to be done carefully. What I would suggest is

:22:30.:22:32.

anybody in this kind of situation and any families who are concerned,

:22:33.:22:37.

and they are usually concerned, can phone domestic violence helpline is,

:22:38.:22:41.

stalking helplines, to get some more information and perhaps get referred

:22:42.:22:47.

to a safety plan. And that might involve what? What might a safety

:22:48.:22:53.

plan involve? As we know, mums will say don't do anything because that's

:22:54.:22:57.

going to make him worse. Yes they do, absolutely. A generalised

:22:58.:23:02.

comment but we all recognise it. That is what happens most of the

:23:03.:23:05.

time because that is an absolutely valid comment to make because one of

:23:06.:23:09.

the biggest trigger is, as I've just said, is when there is a separation.

:23:10.:23:14.

A lot of these men have separation anxiety. So it does make it very

:23:15.:23:20.

difficult. That does not mean there cannot be a safety plan around that

:23:21.:23:24.

family and that woman. OK, so people should not feel that it is futile if

:23:25.:23:29.

they ring one of the helplines and support groups? Not at all. Steph on

:23:30.:23:34.

Facebook says I got out of an ABC relationship in 2015 and it was

:23:35.:23:38.

difficult because I had nowhere to live -- abusive relationship. I wish

:23:39.:23:41.

I could have left years before but it wasn't easy but I'm glad I did.

:23:42.:23:46.

Me and my daughter are putting our lives back together again and I'm

:23:47.:23:50.

awaiting counselling and I'm happier than I ever have been.

:23:51.:23:56.

Mark says the stabbings, the arson attacks, they are awful. I lost my

:23:57.:24:00.

partner to cancer in 2011, that in itself is hard to cope with and I

:24:01.:24:04.

cannot begin to imagine how one copes with such awful events. My

:24:05.:24:08.

love to the victims. This text, Denise and the poor boy are so

:24:09.:24:12.

strong in what they have had to deal with, people can only imagine what

:24:13.:24:15.

they have had to go through and I hope they find peace in the future.

:24:16.:24:22.

Why do people need to be so cruel? Are these cases finally on the rise?

:24:23.:24:27.

There is some evidence to suggest, especially in the United States,

:24:28.:24:32.

where there was a very sharp rise after 1990. The figures went up to

:24:33.:24:37.

about 2007. We are seeing a rise in this kind of murder. But that may be

:24:38.:24:46.

just because there is more visibility of it. But the domestic

:24:47.:24:50.

homicides themselves are not rising. So it's arising within that group.

:24:51.:24:55.

Thank you for coming on the programme.

:24:56.:24:57.

If you want to read more about this you can find an article on the BBC

:24:58.:25:01.

news site and if you want to see the film it is on our programme page.

:25:02.:25:11.

ABC .co .uk/ Victoria. -- bbc.co.uk/ Victoria.

:25:12.:25:13.

The deaths of two rough sleepers in the same town

:25:14.:25:16.

over christmas week, has prompted calls for

:25:17.:25:17.

government legislation on homelessness in the winter.

:25:18.:25:19.

The two men died within a few streets of each other

:25:20.:25:22.

in Chatham in Kent - it's feared they may

:25:23.:25:24.

Currently there's no legal obligation for local

:25:25.:25:26.

authorities to provide help, but some say that should change.

:25:27.:25:29.

Lesley Ashmall spent the evening in Chatham.

:25:30.:25:33.

Hi, Leslie. Yes, Christmas Eve, busy shopping centre, one man found dead,

:25:34.:25:42.

and then just a few days later another man died just round the

:25:43.:25:46.

corner. Last night I went out with a local charity checking all the

:25:47.:25:50.

people, plenty of them still sleeping on the streets last night

:25:51.:25:53.

in the bitter cold. They went out checking they're OK.

:25:54.:26:01.

The high Street was mobbed, Christmas Eve, people doing

:26:02.:26:05.

shopping. It was 11:30am when somebody realised he had passed

:26:06.:26:08.

away. If you look at the flowers left over the last week, pictures,

:26:09.:26:14.

he left all of his stuff and this is where Michael stayed. Michael

:26:15.:26:17.

McCloskey was in his 40s, a father and grandfather. A run of bad luck

:26:18.:26:23.

left him on the streets. Michael was always in top spirits, a great guy,

:26:24.:26:27.

West Ham supporter, so we always talked a lot about football. He was

:26:28.:26:31.

a nice guy, you can see from the amount of flowers left and reading

:26:32.:26:35.

some of the cards. And then just a few days later a few streets away

:26:36.:26:40.

another person died. Sadly great past as well. It is two too many,

:26:41.:26:45.

the council needs to do something. Why are these guys left out here?

:26:46.:26:49.

Why aren't we looking after them? There are still people on the street

:26:50.:26:55.

as you can see. When are the council going to say this is enough. This is

:26:56.:26:58.

a very big problem. It's not known how either man died

:26:59.:27:07.

but their friends think the weather could have been to blame. Definitely

:27:08.:27:15.

the cold. It's got to be the cold because they had no blankets on,

:27:16.:27:19.

definitely the cold. How do you survive? We popped into McDonald's

:27:20.:27:25.

now and again, we have a place up the road, try and find anything warm

:27:26.:27:30.

in the shops. I have three or four coats on, three or four trousers,

:27:31.:27:35.

three pairs of socks, two sleeping bags and still freezing in the

:27:36.:27:38.

morning. What should the government do? The government needs to come

:27:39.:27:43.

down and see the homeless people who are actually homeless and give them

:27:44.:27:48.

a place to stay, do you know what I mean? We are all suffering, we are

:27:49.:27:54.

not all bad people. There is not enough places for people to go.

:27:55.:27:58.

There are more homes in Chatham than people think. I'm a victim of

:27:59.:28:02.

circumstances, I had my Mrs and that and I was working but I'm down on my

:28:03.:28:10.

look -- luck. I'm struggling on the streets. I have two or three fits a

:28:11.:28:15.

day and if it weren't for my friend Shane being around me I would be

:28:16.:28:22.

dead myself. Medved has said it follows national guidelines and

:28:23.:28:27.

offers accommodation when the weather falls below freezing for

:28:28.:28:35.

three consecutive nights. But, for Shane and Barry, those guidelines

:28:36.:28:36.

aren't enough. We asked Medway Council

:28:37.:28:38.

for an interview. It is very sad to see people

:28:39.:28:40.

sleeping on the streets and to hear We would urge anyone sleeping rough

:28:41.:28:45.

to visit our contact point in Gillingham,

:28:46.:28:48.

so we can provide advice We can speak now to Balbir Chatrik

:28:49.:28:50.

from the homelessness charity Centrepoint,

:28:51.:29:03.

Andrew Faris who was homeless and sleeping rough for five years,

:29:04.:29:12.

and Rick Henderson who is the chief Let me ask all of you -

:29:13.:29:16.

how is it possible that people can be left to potentially freeze

:29:17.:29:20.

to death on the streets We are already into 2017 now and we

:29:21.:29:31.

find even now, last night, for example, people are suffering, there

:29:32.:29:36.

is severe weather, nobody has any obligation to check on them. There

:29:37.:29:41.

is no figures on how many people die every night or every year published,

:29:42.:29:46.

as homeless people, they are regarded as homeless people. Yes,

:29:47.:29:50.

they are missing. It is really sad to know people are dying because of

:29:51.:29:54.

the cold weather. Rick, you are local to the area. This is sort of

:29:55.:30:04.

beyond belief, isn't it? I wish it was, these two cases local to where

:30:05.:30:07.

I live are tragic because it happened within a few days of each

:30:08.:30:12.

other. The fact is these are not isolated incidents. There is an

:30:13.:30:15.

annual roll call of deaths of people on the streets, often as a direct

:30:16.:30:19.

result of the cold weather but for all kinds of reasons. This is

:30:20.:30:21.

happening because, although there are some guidelines, some practice

:30:22.:30:26.

around this area, we call it the severe weather emergency protocol,

:30:27.:30:33.

SWEP, which means the local authority should trigger the

:30:34.:30:38.

provision of emergency accommodation. This is optional, it

:30:39.:30:41.

is not a statutory legal requirement, but we'd like to think

:30:42.:30:45.

it should be. There is also no legal requirement to investigate in any

:30:46.:30:48.

significant way to the deaths of people on the street. There are no

:30:49.:30:52.

serious case reviews, for example. Something we would like to see. It

:30:53.:30:57.

is a bad situation but not an isolated situation. This happens all

:30:58.:31:01.

of the time. It is absolutely disgraceful in the 21st-century,

:31:02.:31:05.

having people dying on the streets, it is unacceptable. We need to work

:31:06.:31:08.

together to change that. But it's not just about people on the

:31:09.:31:12.

streets, we know young people in particular are sleeping on night

:31:13.:31:16.

buses, they are sleeping in stairwells, because it's not safe

:31:17.:31:19.

for them to be on the streets because young people in particular

:31:20.:31:25.

as our research has shown, they don't want to be on the streets, so

:31:26.:31:29.

a quarter would go home with a stranger just for a place to stay.

:31:30.:31:34.

About 10% will actually emit a crime. So you've got a police cell

:31:35.:31:40.

for the night. Another 10% will actually do something to get

:31:41.:31:44.

themselves admitted to A just to be off the streets. Why don't local

:31:45.:31:48.

authorities have an obligation to look after people like Michael

:31:49.:31:51.

McCloskey and Greg. Sadly we only know his first name.

:31:52.:31:55.

I don't know, we have questioned the councils... Were they not vulnerable

:31:56.:32:04.

enough? That is true, in that case it is right. We have found that the

:32:05.:32:12.

people who are sleeping rough, of our friends who are sleeping rough,

:32:13.:32:19.

often you find people on the streets in London, if they are stood up,

:32:20.:32:23.

they are not regarded as homeless but if they are sitting down they

:32:24.:32:28.

are not regarded as homeless, if they are laying down for six days in

:32:29.:32:30.

a row, somebody may come along to see if they can

:32:31.:32:39.

get them help. Where is the priority to see a human being on the street

:32:40.:32:44.

and say, I need to do something... I have to read you this e-mail from

:32:45.:32:51.

Sue. In 2002 I befriended a rough sleeper in Bath, he suffered from

:32:52.:32:55.

mental illness, physically abused at home he was an alcoholic. He was

:32:56.:32:58.

physically strong but vulnerable and was known to local police because he

:32:59.:33:03.

was prone to violence. He himself was subjected to frequent violent

:33:04.:33:07.

attacks why drunks and other rough sleepers. He died on New Year's Eve

:33:08.:33:13.

in 2004 having been stabbed more than 12 times, the perpetrator is

:33:14.:33:18.

still free despite up to 20 people witnessing the attack. Every witness

:33:19.:33:20.

was threatened by the attacker, known to many of them, with their

:33:21.:33:25.

lives. Should they have dared give evidence? If I were to sum up the

:33:26.:33:30.

lives of rough sleepers, it is petrifying, turbulent and isolating,

:33:31.:33:35.

and without hope. The fact is, the law is not strong enough when it

:33:36.:33:43.

comes to individuals. They test Bumrah Bella Tabor titters

:33:44.:33:48.

arbitrary. Royalty need, if you -- they test vulnerability. But by and

:33:49.:33:56.

large if you are a single person without dependents, the only thing

:33:57.:34:00.

you are legally entitled to is advice and assistance.

:34:01.:34:03.

Clearly that is not enough, we need a system allowing people to get off

:34:04.:34:07.

the streets, and get people into accommodation. We need to prevent

:34:08.:34:09.

people from a riding on the streets in the first

:34:10.:34:19.

place, people are being evicted from private tenancies and cannot solve

:34:20.:34:23.

issues before they are evicted. We know the relationship breakdowns

:34:24.:34:26.

causes people to wind up on the street and you cannot stop people

:34:27.:34:30.

arriving on the streets completely but if you have the resources and

:34:31.:34:33.

will to do it, you can make sure that people do not live on the

:34:34.:34:36.

streets because when they do that, chances are they will die on the

:34:37.:34:42.

streets. Is that fair? Absolutely, but we need to know the scale and

:34:43.:34:46.

nature of the problem. If you look at figures, they underestimate how

:34:47.:34:52.

many rough sleepers there are. In London, there are about 8000 people

:34:53.:34:56.

sleeping rough last year, about 10% of young people. We know that it is

:34:57.:35:02.

an underestimate. We need to know the scale of the problem so we can

:35:03.:35:05.

do about the right solutions, without that we cannot develop them.

:35:06.:35:10.

Are they being developed by anyone with power, even without knowing the

:35:11.:35:14.

scale of the problem? I think the government is doing some work, this

:35:15.:35:18.

reduction Bill is going through Parliament and will prevent

:35:19.:35:23.

homelessness. Rick is right, if young people are on the streets, we

:35:24.:35:28.

pick them up. How did it happen to you? My thing was that I was in

:35:29.:35:34.

commercial business, is state, and I found myself homeless and was Auden

:35:35.:35:43.

the streets for 5.5 years -- estate. How did that happen? It happens very

:35:44.:35:50.

quickly, it happens within three months of you losing your property,

:35:51.:35:55.

and onto the streets. It is so quick, repossession takes place very

:35:56.:36:01.

quickly. You owned a house? A very large house, with cars, business,

:36:02.:36:05.

offices... And your business went down the drain? In one go. They did

:36:06.:36:11.

not care, they could have given me another 60 days to swap everything,

:36:12.:36:15.

you plead with them, let me solve it in 30 or 60 days... But in two or

:36:16.:36:19.

three months, that's it, you are out. Give us the keys. Then people

:36:20.:36:24.

think you must have friends who you could cap on their sofa, or a

:36:25.:36:30.

relative? It does not happen that easily. Because you do not want to

:36:31.:36:35.

impose yourself? Not only that, it is not just pride but when you think

:36:36.:36:40.

you have those friends, they are not around. They disappear suddenly

:36:41.:36:42.

because you need money and accommodation, you will be a burden

:36:43.:36:46.

on their family and with how they operate. What I have found myself,

:36:47.:36:52.

it is such a hard way of getting out of homelessness. Why did the last

:36:53.:36:56.

five and a half years... I could have done it in one or two years,

:36:57.:37:00.

don't drink or smoke, do this or do that... But the system itself takes

:37:01.:37:04.

you along that path where you have to go through hoops, one after the

:37:05.:37:11.

next. There is no counsel that I could go to and say, I need help

:37:12.:37:17.

from you. Can you help me? I'm a single person, I just need one room

:37:18.:37:20.

and I need to get my life together. Why do you need to be out of there

:37:21.:37:25.

for so many years? That's the problem. Councils need have an

:37:26.:37:28.

obligation and if they want to come with our charity every night, and

:37:29.:37:32.

see the homeless guys in central London, if you want to do a walk

:37:33.:37:38.

around, I can introduce you to 50-100 people every night on the

:37:39.:37:40.

streets of central London. Some are very young, and some are

:37:41.:37:47.

very old. Angela, she is in her 50s. David is in his 60s. These guys are

:37:48.:37:54.

vulnerable. Let me read a couple more messages from people watching

:37:55.:37:58.

you talk about this. Anthony on Facebook says that the UK is a

:37:59.:38:02.

shameful place for homeless people with woeful care. Another says it is

:38:03.:38:07.

heartbreaking, due to a relationship breakdowns they nearly found

:38:08.:38:10.

themselves rough sleeping before Christmas, they ran Al Gore boot

:38:11.:38:13.

camp so they knew how cold it could be, let alone sleeping outside --

:38:14.:38:22.

outdoor boot camps. Thank you for talking about this

:38:23.:38:26.

with us this morning. Thank you for coming on the programme.

:38:27.:38:28.

Still to come, we'll talk to the Star Wars actor Warwick Davis

:38:29.:38:31.

about his friend the American actress Carrie Fisher.

:38:32.:38:33.

A memorial service takes place for Carrie and her mother

:38:34.:38:38.

Debbie Reynolds, who died within 24 hours of each other over Christmas.

:38:39.:38:41.

The winner of the Best Art Vinyl award will be announced tonight -

:38:42.:38:44.

but what makes a vinyl album cover iconic?

:38:45.:38:46.

We'll be discussing with some experts shortly.

:38:47.:38:52.

And some of the nominees for the award tonight.

:38:53.:38:57.

Slightly later than normal... All of the news.

:38:58.:39:06.

A study has warned that children are being left to "fend

:39:07.:39:09.

for themselves" in the digital world - against dangers such

:39:10.:39:11.

The Children's Commissioner for England, Anne Longfield,

:39:12.:39:14.

says many children and parents are often unaware that personal

:39:15.:39:16.

information and content posted on social media sites can be sold

:39:17.:39:19.

Just the fact that they know what you're saying and you're doing, it

:39:20.:39:26.

Researchers in Canada have found that people living near major

:39:27.:39:33.

roads appear more likely to develop dementia.

:39:34.:39:36.

They tracked more than two million people in Ontario for signs

:39:37.:39:41.

of the brain disease over the course of 11 years.

:39:42.:39:45.

The scientists suggested air pollution or noisy traffic

:39:46.:39:47.

could contribute to the brain's decline.

:39:48.:39:50.

A record number of new cars were bought in the UK in 2016 -

:39:51.:39:54.

according to the Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders.

:39:55.:39:57.

Sales hit 2.69 million - that's up more than 2%

:39:58.:39:59.

However, with sales growth now falling the industry isn't expecting

:40:00.:40:06.

Migrants should be expected to learn English before coming to the UK,

:40:07.:40:15.

or attend language classes when they arrive, according

:40:16.:40:16.

The cross-party group said speaking English was "the key

:40:17.:40:21.

to full participation in our society and economy".

:40:22.:40:24.

They also said ministers should consider letting

:40:25.:40:26.

different parts of the UK set their own immigration policy.

:40:27.:40:29.

The government said it was spending ?20 million on English

:40:30.:40:31.

This programme has learnt that a former Crewe Alexandra coach

:40:32.:40:38.

has denied wrongdoing after being suspended

:40:39.:40:39.

Paul McCann worked with young players at the club

:40:40.:40:46.

He was working with the then-manager Dario Gradi, who is now

:40:47.:40:50.

He also later volunteered as a youth coach at non-league club AFC

:40:51.:40:55.

Handwritten letters from Princess Diana are due to be

:40:56.:41:01.

Written to a steward at Buckingham Palace,

:41:02.:41:06.

they reveal that a young Prince Harry was routinely

:41:07.:41:08.

In one letter dated 17th October, 1992, she says how both young

:41:09.:41:14.

princes "are well and enjoying boarding school a lot, although

:41:15.:41:16.

The collection will be sold over approximately 40 lots -

:41:17.:41:23.

with estimates ranging from ?80 to ?900.

:41:24.:41:26.

The auction also includes letters from the Queen,

:41:27.:41:28.

written on Windsor Castle-headed paper.

:41:29.:41:35.

Tottenham prevented Chelsea from matching the longest

:41:36.:41:47.

consecutive winning run in PL history as the Blues were beaten 2-0

:41:48.:41:51.

at White Hart Lane last night, to throw open the title race.

:41:52.:41:54.

Dele Alli got both goals with two headers.

:41:55.:41:56.

Chelsea remain five points clear at the top,

:41:57.:41:58.

Andy Murray's winning run continues, he's extended his to a career best

:41:59.:42:02.

26 consecutive matches following his victory over

:42:03.:42:04.

He's into the Quarter Finals after a tough straight sets win over

:42:05.:42:08.

the Austrian as he prepares for his assault on the Australian

:42:09.:42:11.

Open later this month, one of two major titles the world

:42:12.:42:14.

And Johanna Konta's good run of form continues as well.

:42:15.:42:17.

She is one win away from reaching her third WTA Final.

:42:18.:42:20.

She beat Krystina Pliskova, to reach the Semi Finals

:42:21.:42:22.

And that's all the sport for now, I'll have more on the BBC

:42:23.:42:29.

A private memorial service will take place later today for American

:42:30.:42:37.

acting icons Carrie Fisher and her mother Debbie Reynolds.

:42:38.:42:39.

Family members and close friends will attend.

:42:40.:42:40.

60-year-old Carrie Fisher died last Tuesday after suffering cardiac

:42:41.:42:43.

arrest on a plane travelling from London to Los Angeles.

:42:44.:42:48.

The next day, her mother - Debbie Reynolds - died from a stroke

:42:49.:42:51.

Her son, Carrie's brother, Todd Fisher,

:42:52.:42:54.

says she died of a "broken heart" following her daughters death.

:42:55.:42:57.

The pair had been taking part in a HBO documentary

:42:58.:42:59.

which airs this weekend - here's an extract from it.

:43:00.:43:05.

That's from when they first invented cellphones.

:43:06.:43:11.

I have to go and start rehearsals for Star Wars seven...

:43:12.:43:21.

I'm concerned because my mother is not feeling well.

:43:22.:43:29.

That's what's good about losing your memory.

:43:30.:43:33.

It's like the old days in a way but I'm like the old days, so...

:43:34.:43:39.

My family in particular can overwhelm

:43:40.:43:41.

It wasn't just my mother that was super famous.

:43:42.:43:45.

They were the couple of America, one heck of a

:43:46.:43:50.

My mother, she'll forget she's not 35.

:43:51.:43:57.

Age is horrible for all of us but she falls from a

:43:58.:44:00.

That was not diagnosed then so nobody kind of knew what was

:44:01.:44:10.

I went too fast, I was too much, I couldn't

:44:11.:44:14.

Turn around this way because your rear end is to the camera.

:44:15.:44:24.

Far more than I ever would want to, I

:44:25.:44:34.

Just do what your mother says, it makes life easier.

:44:35.:44:39.

Here's a reminder of some of their most iconic films.

:44:40.:44:54.

# Just singing in the rain.#

:44:55.:44:57.

I recognised your foul stench when I was brought on board.

:44:58.:45:11.

My personal life is always sort of like this, and I think I can, I

:45:12.:45:15.

think I can, and I seem to marry poorly, I have no taste in men.

:45:16.:45:22.

Luckily for me Gareth is good and I have two wonderful children.

:45:23.:45:29.

The Imperial Senate will not stand for this.

:45:30.:45:32.

Don't act so surprised, your Highness.

:45:33.:45:45.

I keep buying her tickets and she hasn't moved yet.

:45:46.:45:59.

Let's speak to the actor Warwick Davis - he played an Ewok

:46:00.:46:09.

in the third Star Wars film, Return of the Jedi aged 11.

:46:10.:46:15.

He was also a friend of Carrie Fisher. Thank you for joining us. At

:46:16.:46:22.

age 11 what are your memories of her then? I remember Carrie as Princess

:46:23.:46:28.

Leia, being a huge star Wars fan at the time. On first meeting her

:46:29.:46:34.

that's really who I saw her as being, this iconic character from my

:46:35.:46:39.

favourite films. But as I got to know her during the filming I

:46:40.:46:45.

realised she was a really funny, fun person to be around and was very

:46:46.:46:48.

caring as well towards me having to work in the hot Ewok costume as we

:46:49.:46:55.

did, and we had the seem to play together, the scene where I found

:46:56.:47:00.

her crashed on her speeder bike and take her back to the Ewok village. I

:47:01.:47:05.

was fortunate to get to know her at that young age and we have kept in

:47:06.:47:10.

touch ever since. How did you become friends? How come there was a

:47:11.:47:14.

connection? I think it's just because I was the youngest member of

:47:15.:47:17.

the cast and I would often just hang around, even when I wasn't filming I

:47:18.:47:22.

would be around the set being a fan of the films anyway. And also over

:47:23.:47:25.

the years you do keep in touch because we would often see each

:47:26.:47:30.

other at press junkets and DVD launches and Star Wars celebration

:47:31.:47:33.

events and I got to interview carried live on stage several times

:47:34.:47:38.

and she was always one of my favourite guests to interview --

:47:39.:47:42.

Carrie. The fans adored her as well and it was a really easy show to do,

:47:43.:47:48.

the ones with Carrie. She was a very open person, she was open about her

:47:49.:47:53.

addiction and mental health issues, which she said she thought were

:47:54.:48:00.

caused in part by her life in show business. What would you say about

:48:01.:48:04.

that? This business is quite stressful. But it has its upsides

:48:05.:48:10.

and it has its downsides. Carrie seemed to where the famed quite

:48:11.:48:15.

well. She wasn't somebody who played celebrity particularly. She was very

:48:16.:48:18.

down-to-earth and kind of very in touch with the fans and with

:48:19.:48:24.

reality. But obviously it did take its toll on her. But I can fully

:48:25.:48:31.

appreciate that as well. She always had a lot of time for people. That's

:48:32.:48:38.

quite something when you're one of the most recognised people on the

:48:39.:48:41.

planet having been in some of the most iconic films in existence. But

:48:42.:48:50.

she remained who she was. It didn't change her in anyway. You last saw

:48:51.:48:53.

her in July, did you say? How was she? She was great. I was

:48:54.:48:58.

interviewing her live on stage in front of 4000 people. She was as

:48:59.:49:05.

sharp witted and as funny as I remember her always being. You just

:49:06.:49:10.

never know what you're going to get. She was there with her wonderful dog

:49:11.:49:14.

Gary, of course, they went everywhere with her. They were

:49:15.:49:19.

inseparable, be it on a red carpet or on a stage, Gary would be there

:49:20.:49:25.

with her and he attacked me at that last meeting on the stage in front

:49:26.:49:28.

of everyone, which was funny, not as bad as it seems. She was

:49:29.:49:33.

fantastically funny. I remember Carrie with a smile on my face, very

:49:34.:49:37.

fondly, she was always very funny and would make you laugh. Thank you

:49:38.:49:42.

for joining us. Warwick, we appreciate your time. Warwick Davis

:49:43.:49:43.

on Carrie Fisher. As music lovers re-discover vinyl -

:49:44.:49:44.

we ask what it takes to make We'll be talking to some people

:49:45.:49:51.

who were behind some of the most Four people have been arrested

:49:52.:49:55.

in the US city of Chicago over a video live-streamed

:49:56.:49:59.

on Facebook, in which a bound We are going to play a clip and you

:50:00.:50:08.

might find some of the images we are about to show distressing.

:50:09.:50:10.

Police say the man being attacked has special needs.

:50:11.:50:17.

His assailants can be heard making derogatory statements against white

:50:18.:50:20.

people and President-elect Donald Trump.

:50:21.:50:21.

In one part of the video the attackers used a knife to remove

:50:22.:50:24.

Speaking at a news conference, Superintendent Eddie Johnson

:50:25.:50:31.

of the Chicago Police Department expressed his disgust.

:50:32.:50:35.

It's sickening. You know, it makes you wonder, what would make

:50:36.:50:40.

individuals treat somebody like that. I've been a cop for 28 years

:50:41.:50:44.

and I've seen things you shouldn't see in a lifetime but it still

:50:45.:50:48.

amazes me how you still see things that you just shouldn't. You looked

:50:49.:50:53.

at that video, they were just, stupidity.

:50:54.:50:55.

Chicago police say an adult man with learning difficulties

:50:56.:50:57.

He was found walking around the city's West Side area

:50:58.:51:01.

during the early hours in a disorientated state.

:51:02.:51:06.

He was traumatised fairly good. Like I said, it took most of the night

:51:07.:51:15.

for him to calm down enough for him to be able to talk to us.

:51:16.:51:18.

Detectives say careful consideration will be given to watch charges, if

:51:19.:51:24.

any, followed their investigation of the four suspects now in custody.

:51:25.:51:27.

Although they are adults they are 18. Kits make stupid mistakes. They

:51:28.:51:38.

are young adults and they make stupid decisions. That certainly

:51:39.:51:42.

will be part of whether or not we seek a hate crime to determine

:51:43.:51:47.

whether or not this is sincere or just stupid ranting and raving. Much

:51:48.:51:51.

more on that story throughout the day on BBC News. It has just gone

:51:52.:51:55.

10:50am. Good morning. We know that in an age of live

:51:56.:51:57.

streaming more and more of us are actually buying vinyl albums -

:51:58.:52:00.

while it still only accounts for around 2.5% of the

:52:01.:52:04.

overall music market, Which means artists are spending

:52:05.:52:06.

more time trying to create iconic album covers -

:52:07.:52:10.

in a hope of emulating Look at these. You will probably

:52:11.:52:21.

recognise all of them and you will all have your favourites and no

:52:22.:52:22.

doubt on some of these. Tonight the winner of the 2016

:52:23.:52:23.

Best Art Vinyl award will be announced -

:52:24.:52:26.

so how does a record sleeve become iconic and what were the best

:52:27.:52:28.

works of art in 2016? Let's speak now to musician

:52:29.:52:31.

Kate Jackson - she designed Road Movies herself -

:52:32.:52:35.

and she's one of the nominees Pete Fowler's famous and celebrated

:52:36.:52:38.

for his record sleeve art - he designed most of the albums

:52:39.:52:44.

for Welsh band the Andrew Heeps is from Art Vinyl

:52:45.:52:47.

which holds the awards every year. Rob O'Connor's been involved

:52:48.:52:52.

with creating iconic album covers such as Parklife by Blur -

:52:53.:52:57.

his company Stylorouge is also nominated for tonight's

:52:58.:53:02.

Best Art Vinyl award - creating the sleeve

:53:03.:53:04.

for Kula Shaker's new album Welcome all of you. We have some

:53:05.:53:16.

amazing examples here. As you are behind the awards tonight what are

:53:17.:53:19.

you going to pick out was my cake is up for an award, David Pallett's

:53:20.:53:25.

Black Star, describe why that is iconic. -- David Bowie. Time will

:53:26.:53:33.

tell. We've gone through a very difficult year. I will hold it up.

:53:34.:53:38.

It has been a difficult year with what has gone on but what can be

:53:39.:53:42.

removed is this which is a great record which has influenced people's

:53:43.:53:46.

decisions about being great design as well. To create something like

:53:47.:53:49.

this which has so much intrigue, the album cover its self, months after

:53:50.:53:55.

its release, people were discovering things, if you shone it in the

:53:56.:53:59.

light. Kate, would you mind putting the record on? Year. That is Black

:54:00.:54:09.

star down there. Using my DJ skills, it is Black star. People's influence

:54:10.:54:17.

on to which record sleeve they particularly like this often come

:54:18.:54:21.

from the music as well. A lot of the time it is up to these guys we are

:54:22.:54:25.

with today to take the concept of that music and turn it into a visual

:54:26.:54:30.

thing that we can all enjoy. How do you do that? Take the music and turn

:54:31.:54:39.

it into it? Yes. It is different with every job, we have done several

:54:40.:54:43.

over the years as a company and what is difficult is making it specific

:54:44.:54:48.

for each artist, each artist has a specific requirement. Give me an

:54:49.:54:53.

example. Hold that one up. That is Jake's cover. He has had some which

:54:54.:55:00.

have relied heavily on his image and he wanted some part for this one and

:55:01.:55:06.

we sourced the correct artist for him for that project. Whether it is

:55:07.:55:09.

described as iconic or not is neither here nor there. Kate, in

:55:10.:55:14.

terms of you designing this, why did you do it? Hold it up so everyone

:55:15.:55:20.

can see it. The camera will find it. I am in an unusual position of being

:55:21.:55:25.

the musical artist and visual artist, so when I was writing the

:55:26.:55:29.

music I suppose I had a kind of idea of what I wanted the sleeve to look

:55:30.:55:35.

like. I don't know if that's true for all musical artists. I don't

:55:36.:55:40.

know whether, say, for example, musicians come to you and described

:55:41.:55:42.

to you what they want or whether you take the music and then interpret

:55:43.:55:47.

that. We do take the music and interpret it and if we don't like

:55:48.:55:52.

the music that gives you a quandary. Pete spoke about this. Pete does

:55:53.:55:56.

what we do and listens to something else we do like to inspire us. It's

:55:57.:56:00.

interesting that you do design your own covers because we always try and

:56:01.:56:04.

make our designs look like they have come from the artist. For me that is

:56:05.:56:08.

paramount because we don't want people to think that is some design

:56:09.:56:13.

agency. Absolutely, who is making money out of this. That doesn't seem

:56:14.:56:19.

to be very creative although it clearly is. Let's talk about some of

:56:20.:56:25.

these. What inspires you? Talking about the inspiration for it, I've

:56:26.:56:28.

been working with the Super Furry Animals since 96, I think. Coming up

:56:29.:56:33.

with something new every time. The first record I designed for them was

:56:34.:56:38.

their second album Radiator, and I was given a list of working titles

:56:39.:56:43.

for the songs, and also some recordings and demos and finished

:56:44.:56:47.

tracks and was told by the band if you can get inspiration from these

:56:48.:56:50.

that would be great, if not, do what you like, which is quite scary. Have

:56:51.:56:57.

you got it? No. What was the cover of Radiator. It was a bear walking

:56:58.:57:03.

down the street scene the evil reflection of itself in the mirror.

:57:04.:57:10.

They went on tour in Japan and a generalist explained to them what

:57:11.:57:14.

the album was about it was about Shinto religion and they were like,

:57:15.:57:19.

OK. Everyone has their own interpretation in our world. That is

:57:20.:57:24.

the beauty of it. When you look at one of your favourite album covers

:57:25.:57:27.

it arouses different emotions. I look at Dare and I could cry because

:57:28.:57:33.

I was so happy at the time. It is not particularly iconic, it just

:57:34.:57:36.

means so much to me. The winner announced tonight? It will be

:57:37.:57:42.

announced tonight in London. Put us out of our misery. It will stay

:57:43.:57:47.

secret until about nine o'clock tonight. It is a celebration of what

:57:48.:57:52.

we do, and we do a montage of the 15 nominees. Obviously there is

:57:53.:57:58.

ultimately a winner -- 50 nominees. It is a celebration of record cover

:57:59.:58:02.

art. What is lovely is I'm talking about the Best Art Vinyl awards and

:58:03.:58:07.

I'm surrounded by people whose work I have bought without knowing,

:58:08.:58:14.

realising it. I think that's what it's about. These guys are sometimes

:58:15.:58:19.

the unsung heroes behind creating these lovely images. The artwork is

:58:20.:58:25.

the magic portal into the music itself. It's the thing that you have

:58:26.:58:29.

in your bedroom. You can even put it up on your bedroom wall if you want

:58:30.:58:33.

to. That's the difference to me between holding a beautiful piece.

:58:34.:58:37.

I'm going to stop there because it's the end of the programme but good

:58:38.:58:41.

luck. We are back tomorrow at 9am. Thank you

:58:42.:58:43.

MUSIC: Mad World by Gary Jules

:58:44.:58:45.

Men who murder their families - why the perpetrators kill those closest to them. Plus remembering the homeless people who lost their lives in the cold and Warwick Davis shares his memories of acting with the late Carrie Fisher.