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We asked you to tell us who's left you feeling ripped off | 0:00:02 | 0:00:06 | |
and you contacted us in your thousands by post, email, | 0:00:06 | 0:00:11 | |
even stopping us on the street. The message could not be clearer. | 0:00:11 | 0:00:15 | |
It feels to me I'm fighting a battle I can't win. | 0:00:15 | 0:00:19 | |
It costs you a fortune and then you get fobbed off. | 0:00:19 | 0:00:23 | |
With money tighter than ever you need to be sure every pound counts. | 0:00:23 | 0:00:28 | |
We had nowhere to turn. | 0:00:28 | 0:00:32 | |
Whether it's a deliberate rip-off, a simple mistake or a catch in the small print, | 0:00:32 | 0:00:37 | |
we'll find out why you're out of pocket and what you can do about it. | 0:00:37 | 0:00:41 | |
Your stories, your money. This is Rip-Off Britain. | 0:00:41 | 0:00:45 | |
I'm glad you can join us again. | 0:00:46 | 0:00:49 | |
Today we focus on something every one of us will have experienced, probably even in the last few weeks. | 0:00:49 | 0:00:56 | |
It's a topic that is consistently said to be one of the biggest bugbears for UK consumers. | 0:00:56 | 0:01:02 | |
We're talking about cold calling. We really have all been there. | 0:01:02 | 0:01:07 | |
The phone rings and when you answer someone launches into a sales pitch about some deal or other. | 0:01:07 | 0:01:12 | |
It's thought eight out of ten of us will have had that in the last month and not just at home. | 0:01:12 | 0:01:18 | |
It can be on your mobile, too. I had one of those this morning! | 0:01:18 | 0:01:23 | |
You may think the answer is to hang up, but it isn't that simple. | 0:01:23 | 0:01:27 | |
As well as hearing about some of the problems they can cause, we'll look at whether enough is being done | 0:01:27 | 0:01:33 | |
so cold calls only go to people who don't mind them. | 0:01:33 | 0:01:37 | |
And we'll see what's being done to those parts of the industry who break the rules. | 0:01:37 | 0:01:42 | |
On today's programme, how unwanted calls that keep on coming target those that find it hard to say no. | 0:01:42 | 0:01:49 | |
I've had days when I just wanted to cry, my guts turning inside out, frustration, anger. | 0:01:49 | 0:01:56 | |
The three letters most commonly heard in a cold call - PPI. Why is it so hard to get your money back? | 0:01:56 | 0:02:03 | |
We've got to go through a world of battle again. | 0:02:03 | 0:02:07 | |
As stressful as it is, I am willing to challenge them again. | 0:02:07 | 0:02:11 | |
Too many of the stories we investigate start with a cold call | 0:02:14 | 0:02:19 | |
and someone trying to sell you something you don't want. | 0:02:19 | 0:02:23 | |
These calls can be more than just annoying. In some cases, they can cause real distress. | 0:02:23 | 0:02:28 | |
The system to stop you getting them doesn't always work. | 0:02:28 | 0:02:33 | |
While the law says if you've opted out of unsolicited calls, no one should ring you out of the blue, | 0:02:33 | 0:02:39 | |
there's been a rise in the number of companies who simply ignore that and not much can stop them. | 0:02:39 | 0:02:46 | |
They're often referred to as nuisance calls, but for Keith Brown "nuisance" doesn't begin to describe | 0:02:46 | 0:02:53 | |
the emotional impact unwanted calls have had on his family. | 0:02:53 | 0:02:57 | |
Keith's mother is in the early stages of dementia, so she doesn't like dealing with strangers. | 0:02:57 | 0:03:03 | |
Keith says she'll often say yes to whatever they ask, just to make the conversation end, | 0:03:03 | 0:03:09 | |
all of which makes her very easy prey for cold callers. | 0:03:09 | 0:03:13 | |
Keith, what did you find that made you realise your mother had been targeted by cold calling? | 0:03:13 | 0:03:21 | |
There were more and more vitamins and supplements arriving. | 0:03:21 | 0:03:24 | |
Over a couple of weeks, it just grew, just like a mountain that grew. | 0:03:24 | 0:03:29 | |
I spoke to Mum and said, "What's going on here?" and I stopped there and went through them all. | 0:03:29 | 0:03:35 | |
There were 22 different vitamins or supplements. She walked me through into the bedroom, opened the drawers | 0:03:35 | 0:03:42 | |
where she used to have all of her clothing. | 0:03:42 | 0:03:45 | |
All the drawers were full of vitamins. | 0:03:45 | 0:03:49 | |
Keith's mum had bought the vitamins after receiving a cold call from an online vitamin retailer. | 0:03:49 | 0:03:55 | |
She'd seen some friends suffer from arthritis and didn't want it, | 0:03:55 | 0:04:00 | |
so she thought the vitamins would help, but one purchase led to another sales call | 0:04:00 | 0:04:05 | |
and soon the stock grew out of control. | 0:04:05 | 0:04:08 | |
Have you any idea how much your mum has spent? | 0:04:08 | 0:04:13 | |
Over the space of seven months, she's spent just over £2,200 with one company | 0:04:13 | 0:04:18 | |
on vitamins and vitamin supplements. Really what was staggering was the scale. | 0:04:18 | 0:04:25 | |
It wasn't £10 and £50 a time. It was £200 a time, £300 a time. | 0:04:25 | 0:04:30 | |
People were just ringing up, cold calling, knowing that she'd buy, | 0:04:30 | 0:04:34 | |
suggesting multiple orders of multiple things, more and more things, | 0:04:34 | 0:04:40 | |
and she was giving her card details. | 0:04:40 | 0:04:42 | |
So what did you do about it? I immediately rang the company concerned and said, "Please make sure | 0:04:42 | 0:04:48 | |
"that you don't call any more. You cannot justify spending that amount of money for one elderly person." | 0:04:48 | 0:04:56 | |
They agreed they would no longer call her or contact her. Have they upheld that? Well, it's been upheld now. | 0:04:56 | 0:05:03 | |
And then just last week, when I came to see my mother, she said, "I don't understand. This has arrived." | 0:05:03 | 0:05:10 | |
And this is from the company? Yes. | 0:05:10 | 0:05:13 | |
Offering to sell her more vitamins. | 0:05:13 | 0:05:16 | |
The vitamins were the latest in a long line of cold call offers to which Keith's mum could not say no. | 0:05:16 | 0:05:23 | |
In recent months, she's paid £1,300 to two tradesmen for cleaning her driveway | 0:05:23 | 0:05:29 | |
and she's previously given hundreds to charities in response to appeal letters. | 0:05:29 | 0:05:35 | |
I think in the last couple of years she has lost over £5,000 or £6,000 on various things. | 0:05:35 | 0:05:42 | |
What effect has this had on your mum? | 0:05:42 | 0:05:46 | |
Ironically enough, for people in that stage, the early stages of dementia, | 0:05:46 | 0:05:52 | |
they don't actually know the scale of it. She doesn't really understand the significance of what she's lost. | 0:05:52 | 0:05:59 | |
It's her savings. If push came to shove, I'd sort her out, so she's protected. | 0:05:59 | 0:06:05 | |
But not everybody has a son or a daughter who can move in. And they're in terrible situations. | 0:06:05 | 0:06:12 | |
If you've not got a really strong advocate, a really strong family friend or relative | 0:06:12 | 0:06:18 | |
to stand up and do this for you, and I am here twice a week, every week, | 0:06:18 | 0:06:23 | |
just screening all the mail. | 0:06:23 | 0:06:26 | |
Keith is a professor in healthcare and social work and has worked with vulnerable old people, | 0:06:26 | 0:06:32 | |
but it's so much worse when the issues are closer to home. | 0:06:32 | 0:06:37 | |
When it's suddenly your mum... I've had days when I just, like, wanted to cry, | 0:06:37 | 0:06:43 | |
I've had my guts turning inside out. Frustration, anger. | 0:06:43 | 0:06:47 | |
My mum is a great woman. She's a great mother. I feel slightly emotional talking about it. | 0:06:48 | 0:06:55 | |
And it's, "What is going on?! How can this happen to my mum?" | 0:06:55 | 0:06:59 | |
When we contacted the vitamin company, they told us Keith's mother had bought "in varying amounts" | 0:06:59 | 0:07:05 | |
since 2009, but in 2012, after a request from Keith, | 0:07:05 | 0:07:10 | |
the account was marked "do not call". There was a further short call this year which they say was | 0:07:10 | 0:07:16 | |
a "clear breach" of their policy, due to "an error on account of the sales agent", | 0:07:16 | 0:07:21 | |
but they had no record of a request to no mailings, though they have now updated the account to that effect. | 0:07:21 | 0:07:28 | |
They've also said since 2011 they've made "significant improvements" to their marketing and sales | 0:07:28 | 0:07:34 | |
and introduced new systems allowing them to randomly review orders, | 0:07:34 | 0:07:38 | |
so that they can spot unusually high volume sales. And they stress that all the people called by them | 0:07:38 | 0:07:44 | |
are previous customers rung "at intervals that reflect their purchasing desires". | 0:07:44 | 0:07:50 | |
They insist that "no cold calls are ever made". | 0:07:50 | 0:07:54 | |
But this does highlight a rather uncertain grey area | 0:07:54 | 0:07:58 | |
as to what exactly constitutes consent to repeated calls. | 0:07:58 | 0:08:02 | |
Some businesses consider that an earlier purchase allows them to call again until you ask them to stop. | 0:08:02 | 0:08:08 | |
Critics say each new approach technically constitutes a cold call. | 0:08:08 | 0:08:12 | |
So our pop-up shop telecoms expert David McClelland explains some of the things you can do | 0:08:12 | 0:08:17 | |
to avoid the calls you don't want. | 0:08:17 | 0:08:20 | |
The first thing is to opt out. | 0:08:20 | 0:08:23 | |
The Telephone Preference Service is a register of numbers that legitimate UK marketers cannot dial. | 0:08:23 | 0:08:30 | |
Once you're registered with the Telephone Preference Service, you should get no unwanted calls. | 0:08:31 | 0:08:37 | |
It's against the law for companies to call when you said you don't want them to, | 0:08:37 | 0:08:41 | |
but, unfortunately, it does not stop them all. Keith signed his mum up to the Telephone Preference Service, | 0:08:41 | 0:08:48 | |
but as the company pointed out that does not stop contact from businesses you've dealt with before, | 0:08:48 | 0:08:55 | |
if you gave consent for future contact. In any case, research by consumer group Which this year | 0:08:55 | 0:09:02 | |
found that people registered with the service still receive an average of 10 unsolicited calls a month. | 0:09:02 | 0:09:08 | |
We asked the Telephone Preference Service why that was the case. | 0:09:08 | 0:09:12 | |
They said signing up... | 0:09:12 | 0:09:14 | |
..particularly from "reputable companies that abide by the regulations." | 0:09:17 | 0:09:23 | |
But they also told us... | 0:09:23 | 0:09:25 | |
And the Information Commissioner... | 0:09:27 | 0:09:30 | |
So what should you do if you receive a cold call from a company that keeps on ringing? | 0:09:34 | 0:09:39 | |
Be firm and hang up. Say something along the lines of, "Thank you. I'm not interested. I'm going to hang up. | 0:09:39 | 0:09:46 | |
"Please remove me from your database." Then put it down. Screening calls is important. | 0:09:46 | 0:09:51 | |
A lot of service providers offer caller ID so you can see the number of the person trying to call you. | 0:09:51 | 0:09:57 | |
If you don't recognise it, don't answer the phone. Finally, if you're inundated, | 0:09:57 | 0:10:03 | |
you can change your number. It's a little bit of a last resort. | 0:10:03 | 0:10:07 | |
Ask for a brand-new number that hasn't been recycled from someone else. | 0:10:07 | 0:10:12 | |
Meanwhile, though Keith believes he has done all he possibly can to stop companies cold calling, | 0:10:12 | 0:10:18 | |
he thinks more needs to be done to prevent people being exploited. | 0:10:18 | 0:10:23 | |
We have got to stop and have some system, legislative systems, to stop these things happening, | 0:10:23 | 0:10:28 | |
to stop this mass marketing going on. And if it doesn't? We're just going to have it continuing, aren't we? | 0:10:28 | 0:10:35 | |
Next, a cold calling scam that can very quickly leave you hundreds of pounds out of pocket. | 0:10:39 | 0:10:45 | |
And it's remarkably common, so much so that it's estimated | 0:10:45 | 0:10:49 | |
that one in six people in Britain has already received a similar call. | 0:10:49 | 0:10:53 | |
Here's everything you need to know about how to avoid being taken in. | 0:10:53 | 0:10:58 | |
When Hilary Palmer picked up the phone in February, what she was told preyed on every computer user's | 0:10:59 | 0:11:06 | |
worst nightmare. The caller, who claimed to be from computer operating system Windows, | 0:11:06 | 0:11:11 | |
said she was at risk from viruses that could cripple her PC and let criminals access her details. | 0:11:11 | 0:11:19 | |
My reaction when the cold caller said there were loads of viruses | 0:11:19 | 0:11:24 | |
was, "How could this happen? I have got some anti-virus." | 0:11:24 | 0:11:28 | |
This lady was insistent that the viruses were potentially dangerous and need to be sorted. | 0:11:28 | 0:11:35 | |
Convinced that her computer was under threat, Hilary listened and followed technical instructions. | 0:11:35 | 0:11:42 | |
I fired up my computer and she asked me to type in a few letters | 0:11:42 | 0:11:47 | |
and that enabled a screen to come up which showed me | 0:11:47 | 0:11:52 | |
that there were a lot of red warnings on the computer. | 0:11:52 | 0:11:57 | |
The caller told Hilary that these red warnings were the proof that she had viruses on her computer. | 0:11:57 | 0:12:03 | |
In fact, the screen she was seeing was a completely innocuous part of the operating system, | 0:12:03 | 0:12:09 | |
but like most people who get this call, Hilary was not to know these were harmless. | 0:12:09 | 0:12:14 | |
When I saw the red warning signs, I thought, "This is not good! There must be something wrong." | 0:12:14 | 0:12:20 | |
She asked me to count them and said if there were more than 38, it was really dangerous. | 0:12:20 | 0:12:26 | |
And there were many more than 38. | 0:12:26 | 0:12:29 | |
I was worried that there were so many viruses on the computer | 0:12:29 | 0:12:34 | |
and that this would destroy it. | 0:12:34 | 0:12:37 | |
Hilary was told by the caller that she could help her get rid of the viruses, but she'd need access | 0:12:37 | 0:12:45 | |
to Hilary's computer to do so. So Hilary agreed to let the caller take control of her computer | 0:12:45 | 0:12:51 | |
over her internet connection. When she got remote access, | 0:12:51 | 0:12:55 | |
she was able to control the mouse, which was weird. It would whizz around the screen on its own. | 0:12:55 | 0:13:02 | |
And she was able to get rid of them. This took quite a long time. | 0:13:02 | 0:13:07 | |
I was on the phone for an hour and a half. She kept talking me through it | 0:13:07 | 0:13:12 | |
and she'd say, "There's some more." And she'd put up another file and more would come up. | 0:13:12 | 0:13:18 | |
Of course, in reality, there were no viruses on her computer, but by this point Hilary trusted the caller | 0:13:18 | 0:13:25 | |
so when offered the chance to buy extra virus protection, | 0:13:25 | 0:13:30 | |
she was very interested. | 0:13:30 | 0:13:34 | |
She offered me a package of either one, two or three years | 0:13:34 | 0:13:39 | |
and I plumped for the two-year one. | 0:13:39 | 0:13:43 | |
However, I was still a little bit worried about how much it would cost | 0:13:43 | 0:13:47 | |
and she said she could do me a deal for £150. | 0:13:47 | 0:13:52 | |
The caller said it was a huge discount on the price of £600, | 0:13:52 | 0:13:56 | |
so Hilary agreed and the caller emailed over the paperwork. | 0:13:56 | 0:14:01 | |
She sent a form to my computer which I had to fill in with my credit card details | 0:14:01 | 0:14:07 | |
and my security information. The caller was still with me when I was filling out the forms. | 0:14:07 | 0:14:14 | |
She obviously checked the form, said it was all right, | 0:14:14 | 0:14:19 | |
and then that she would phone me in 10 minutes to confirm everything | 0:14:19 | 0:14:24 | |
and then put the phone down. | 0:14:24 | 0:14:27 | |
Hilary had handed all her credit card details over to the caller, including the security code. | 0:14:27 | 0:14:33 | |
10 minutes pass, half an hour, an hour, and I didn't hear anything. | 0:14:33 | 0:14:37 | |
I tried to get her number, | 0:14:37 | 0:14:41 | |
but obviously it was blocked so I was unable to do that. | 0:14:41 | 0:14:46 | |
Hilary checked her emails for any contact details for the caller, but the emails she had been sent | 0:14:46 | 0:14:52 | |
had mysteriously disappeared. | 0:14:52 | 0:14:55 | |
I contacted my son and told him. | 0:14:55 | 0:14:58 | |
He immediately said, "That's a scam." That's when I felt really sick. | 0:14:58 | 0:15:03 | |
Cos I'm not a person who would generally be, I don't think, likely to be scammed. | 0:15:03 | 0:15:11 | |
But through distractions it just took me unawares. | 0:15:11 | 0:15:16 | |
By the time Hilary realised she'd been scammed, | 0:15:16 | 0:15:19 | |
she thought it was too late to call her credit card provider, the Post Office, to check on her account. | 0:15:19 | 0:15:25 | |
When she did check her email the following morning, | 0:15:25 | 0:15:30 | |
the fraudster had already transferred cash out of her account using Western Union. | 0:15:30 | 0:15:37 | |
There was an email from Western Union which said "Pickup Notification". | 0:15:37 | 0:15:42 | |
So I went in to it and it said that £150 had gone out of my account. | 0:15:42 | 0:15:48 | |
Hilary knew she had to stop the fraudsters taking any more money from her credit card. | 0:15:48 | 0:15:54 | |
I went to the Post Office to cancel the card as quickly as possible. | 0:15:54 | 0:15:59 | |
I was worried that if they had access to my card, they'd take more money. | 0:15:59 | 0:16:05 | |
With the card cancelled, Hilary wrote to the Post Office to ask if there was anything she could do | 0:16:05 | 0:16:11 | |
to get back the money already taken. | 0:16:11 | 0:16:13 | |
Unfortunately, there really wasn't anything the Post Office could do. | 0:16:13 | 0:16:18 | |
As a third party had been used to transfer the lost money, Western Union, | 0:16:18 | 0:16:22 | |
it's not possible to try to reclaim it through the credit card issuer, | 0:16:22 | 0:16:26 | |
not least because although they'd been obtained fraudulently, the details were willingly provided. | 0:16:26 | 0:16:33 | |
So Hilary is left not just £150 out of pocket, but also feeling rather foolish. | 0:16:33 | 0:16:40 | |
I felt a bit...silly, a bit gullible. | 0:16:40 | 0:16:45 | |
They'd left me feeling that how stupid was I that I was scammed. | 0:16:46 | 0:16:52 | |
As in all such successful cold calls, whoever rang Hilary had used a mix of persuasive skills, | 0:16:52 | 0:16:59 | |
lies and trickery to win her over. | 0:16:59 | 0:17:02 | |
I think she gained my trust. She was very clever | 0:17:02 | 0:17:05 | |
in that she talked me through every step of the way and said | 0:17:05 | 0:17:09 | |
the viruses were bad, especially if there was a certain number, | 0:17:09 | 0:17:14 | |
so she got me to count. Getting me to count was making me buy into what she was saying. | 0:17:14 | 0:17:20 | |
When we asked money transfer service Western Union about Hilary's case, | 0:17:20 | 0:17:25 | |
it said it "commits significant resources to combat consumer fraud", | 0:17:25 | 0:17:30 | |
investing in monitoring and detecting systems and working closely with law enforcement. | 0:17:30 | 0:17:36 | |
It added that... | 0:17:36 | 0:17:38 | |
..stressing you should... | 0:17:43 | 0:17:45 | |
That's advice reiterated by Microsoft, the business the callers claimed to be from, | 0:17:50 | 0:17:55 | |
who told us the company... | 0:17:55 | 0:17:58 | |
The company also warns... | 0:18:02 | 0:18:05 | |
But this scam is surprisingly common. When Microsoft investigated, | 0:18:11 | 0:18:16 | |
they discovered one in six of us have received a similar cold call | 0:18:16 | 0:18:20 | |
and almost a quarter are so convinced it's genuine, they follow instructions. | 0:18:20 | 0:18:25 | |
It's perhaps a surprise that in Hilary's case they only took £150 | 0:18:25 | 0:18:30 | |
when it would have been very easy to steal much more. | 0:18:30 | 0:18:34 | |
If I could speak to these people, I would say it is despicable | 0:18:34 | 0:18:38 | |
that they prey on vulnerable people, people who may not have very good computer knowledge, | 0:18:38 | 0:18:46 | |
and were able to get money out of them. | 0:18:46 | 0:18:50 | |
We're on the road again and this year we've brought our pop-up shop to Liverpool! | 0:18:56 | 0:19:02 | |
We have taken over an empty shop, transformed it overnight, packed it full of experts | 0:19:03 | 0:19:10 | |
and they're giving advice absolutely free. | 0:19:10 | 0:19:15 | |
And as well as our shop we've got workshops in the street | 0:19:15 | 0:19:20 | |
so that as many people as possible can take advantage, get advice and stop being ripped off. | 0:19:20 | 0:19:26 | |
But back inside our shop, Joy called in for advice from Trading Standards Officer Sylvia Rook. | 0:19:26 | 0:19:32 | |
She thought she'd been sold a holiday over the phone, but things were not as they first appeared. | 0:19:32 | 0:19:39 | |
I was rang in November and they offered me a holiday in Malta. I was on my laptop at the time. | 0:19:39 | 0:19:46 | |
They seemed to be a bona fide website and everything. | 0:19:46 | 0:19:50 | |
How much were they charging? They wanted 399. | 0:19:50 | 0:19:53 | |
Joy still wasn't convinced, so they tried another tack. | 0:19:53 | 0:19:57 | |
She said, "I tell you what, I'll throw in this loyalty card." | 0:19:57 | 0:20:01 | |
She explained that this was something that you travel a lot, which I do, | 0:20:01 | 0:20:06 | |
"So whenever you wanted a holiday, we would find you a better deal." | 0:20:06 | 0:20:11 | |
Finally convinced by the salesperson, Joy signed up and paid using her credit card. | 0:20:11 | 0:20:17 | |
What came initially was just this. | 0:20:17 | 0:20:21 | |
Right. Saying that you've paid £399.59. | 0:20:21 | 0:20:25 | |
And then after that this came... Which is congratulating you on securing your loyalty card. | 0:20:25 | 0:20:32 | |
I said where is the holiday? I've got the loyalty card. Where's my holiday? | 0:20:32 | 0:20:37 | |
And this is what I got after that. | 0:20:37 | 0:20:40 | |
I recognised that as timeshare holidays. | 0:20:40 | 0:20:43 | |
So it seems what Joy had paid for wasn't the week in Malta she wanted. | 0:20:43 | 0:20:48 | |
Instead she'd bought membership of a holiday club. Feeling ripped off, Joy asked for her money back. | 0:20:48 | 0:20:55 | |
I got a reply saying, "Our MD has said you can't have your money back." On what grounds? | 0:20:55 | 0:21:01 | |
"You've signed a contract." You can make a claim against them. | 0:21:01 | 0:21:05 | |
They will argue that you knew what you were entering into as a contract, but it was over the phone | 0:21:05 | 0:21:12 | |
and you are adamant you were buying a holiday. That should be sufficient to pursue it through the courts. | 0:21:12 | 0:21:18 | |
Under Section 75 of the Consumer Credit Act, if you make a purchase that's more than £100 | 0:21:18 | 0:21:24 | |
and less than £30,000, if there is breach of contract or it is misdescribed | 0:21:24 | 0:21:30 | |
the credit card company is equally liable. | 0:21:30 | 0:21:33 | |
Basic rule of thumb, do not ever purchase anything as a result of a cold call | 0:21:33 | 0:21:39 | |
unless you have made very extensive investigations into that company and even then be very cautious. | 0:21:39 | 0:21:46 | |
You won't go that way again for your holiday, will you? No! | 0:21:46 | 0:21:50 | |
Many visitors stopped off at our complaints corner to let off some consumer steam | 0:21:52 | 0:21:58 | |
and I got some things off my chest. | 0:21:58 | 0:22:00 | |
My biggest gripe is lack of loyalty and service. | 0:22:00 | 0:22:05 | |
And the people of Liverpool weren't backward at coming forward, either. | 0:22:05 | 0:22:09 | |
In this city of our, Liverpool, prices are becoming extortionate. | 0:22:09 | 0:22:14 | |
You don't feel you're getting the best deal or good service. | 0:22:14 | 0:22:18 | |
You're a grown man being talked to like you're 12. | 0:22:18 | 0:22:22 | |
The experts at our shop have put together some free factsheets | 0:22:22 | 0:22:26 | |
with key advice from our pop-up weekend. You can find all of them on our website: | 0:22:26 | 0:22:34 | |
Still to come: two men who took on the cold callers who wouldn't take no for an answer. | 0:22:39 | 0:22:45 | |
I pleaded with them to stop. I'd asked, begged. It didn't work. | 0:22:45 | 0:22:50 | |
I said, "If you call me again, I'll charge you £10 a minute for my time." | 0:22:50 | 0:22:54 | |
If I asked you if there's any type of cold call you've had recently, | 0:22:54 | 0:22:59 | |
the chances are it will have been from someone telling you they want to help you claim hundreds of pounds | 0:22:59 | 0:23:04 | |
in mis-sold PPI payments. | 0:23:04 | 0:23:08 | |
Official figures show that most households typically get seven of these calls every month. | 0:23:08 | 0:23:13 | |
Not only do they make up the biggest share of all unwanted calls that can be identified, | 0:23:13 | 0:23:18 | |
they're also the ones that people say are the most annoying. | 0:23:18 | 0:23:23 | |
Payment Protection Insurance. Three words heard more than any others in the unsolicited calls | 0:23:23 | 0:23:29 | |
to our homes and mobile phones. | 0:23:29 | 0:23:31 | |
Hello? PPI was designed to offer protection if you couldn't make the repayments on any borrowing, | 0:23:31 | 0:23:38 | |
but how it was sold became, for consumers, the biggest banking scandal of recent times. | 0:23:38 | 0:23:44 | |
A whole industry sprang up to help, offering their services to claim back | 0:23:44 | 0:23:49 | |
mis-sold payments on your behalf. | 0:23:49 | 0:23:53 | |
Sammy Morrison from Huddersfield received one of those calls in 2011 | 0:23:53 | 0:23:58 | |
from a company called We Fight Any Claim.com. | 0:23:58 | 0:24:03 | |
They told me they were one of the first and best companies | 0:24:03 | 0:24:08 | |
and had I had PPI? At the time, I didn't have a clue what PPI was. | 0:24:08 | 0:24:13 | |
So they explained it to me, asked me if I had a mortgage, any loans or cards or anything like that. | 0:24:13 | 0:24:20 | |
Sammy was told that in return for a fee they could get her back nearly £2,000 in mis-sold PPI. | 0:24:20 | 0:24:27 | |
They said, "Oh, you've definitely had PPI. We can get you X amount of money, | 0:24:27 | 0:24:34 | |
"but there is an up-front charge." And I was a bit hesitant, | 0:24:34 | 0:24:39 | |
but they guaranteed - not maybe'd - | 0:24:39 | 0:24:43 | |
guaranteed that I would have a good payout within a maximum of 12 weeks. | 0:24:43 | 0:24:49 | |
Convinced by the company's confidence, | 0:24:49 | 0:24:54 | |
Sammy agreed to the £490 up-front fee that We Fight Any Claim.com were asking for. | 0:24:54 | 0:25:01 | |
Satisfied that they would then get on with pursuing the two lots of mis-sold PPI they said she was owed, | 0:25:01 | 0:25:07 | |
Sammy sat back and waited for her cheque to arrive. They were very persuasive | 0:25:07 | 0:25:13 | |
and extremely confident that the two companies I'd had PPI with | 0:25:13 | 0:25:18 | |
were two of the best companies for paying out. They were paying out straight away. | 0:25:18 | 0:25:26 | |
But things didn't move quite as swiftly as Sammy had hoped. | 0:25:26 | 0:25:30 | |
About three months later, after I'd received all the initial paperwork, | 0:25:30 | 0:25:35 | |
I received a form for me to sign and send back. | 0:25:35 | 0:25:40 | |
I rang them up, asked them what this form was. | 0:25:40 | 0:25:44 | |
They said it's for the company. We now give them 40 days legally | 0:25:44 | 0:25:49 | |
to get back to us with a decision. | 0:25:49 | 0:25:52 | |
She had hoped for a cheque, but all she'd got was more paperwork | 0:25:52 | 0:25:56 | |
asking her to sign and give her consent to them pursuing her claim. | 0:25:56 | 0:26:00 | |
Very frustrated, Sammy decided to try to find out more. | 0:26:00 | 0:26:05 | |
I rang the Ministry of Justice and they said at that time it was too soon to do anything, | 0:26:05 | 0:26:11 | |
legally, because it had only been about six months. | 0:26:11 | 0:26:16 | |
It seemed that all Sammy could do was wait and see if the £490 she had paid to We Fight Any Claim.com | 0:26:16 | 0:26:22 | |
would come to anything. But that 12-week wait she'd been promised soon turned into something longer. | 0:26:22 | 0:26:28 | |
The weeks became months and, finally, years. | 0:26:28 | 0:26:33 | |
Two years later of going round and round in circles again and tearing my hair out with them. | 0:26:33 | 0:26:38 | |
In April this year I got back in touch with the Ministry of Justice | 0:26:38 | 0:26:43 | |
and they told me to write to them, saying I'd been in touch with them | 0:26:43 | 0:26:48 | |
and under the Freedom of Information Act ask them for copies of everything they've dealt with on my claims | 0:26:48 | 0:26:56 | |
for the past two years. And that was April and I'm still waiting for a response. | 0:26:56 | 0:27:02 | |
To see if we could help bring Sammy's wait to an end, we contacted We Fight Any Claim.com | 0:27:02 | 0:27:09 | |
to find out if they were any closer to getting any of Sammy's PPI back | 0:27:09 | 0:27:13 | |
and, if not, whether they'd be refunding the £490 up-front fee she'd paid them all that time ago. | 0:27:13 | 0:27:20 | |
The company apologised for the fact that she has not received the level of service it would wish to provide | 0:27:20 | 0:27:28 | |
and says "the reasons for the delays are numerous" and due to factors outside its control, | 0:27:28 | 0:27:33 | |
for example, "delaying tactics" by the companies concerned. | 0:27:33 | 0:27:37 | |
While that may make it seem as if nothing is being done, such tactics are all too common | 0:27:37 | 0:27:43 | |
and take time to work through. | 0:27:43 | 0:27:46 | |
But it says the charges were fully explained and agreed to | 0:27:46 | 0:27:51 | |
and up-front fees "were fully allowable by the regulatory bodies at the time," | 0:27:51 | 0:27:56 | |
although the company stopped using them back in January, 2012 | 0:27:56 | 0:28:01 | |
and customers now only pay a fee as and when money is reclaimed. | 0:28:01 | 0:28:05 | |
They also said they have fully refunded Sammy's fee. | 0:28:05 | 0:28:09 | |
10,000 people a week are escalating their complaints to the Financial Ombudsman Service | 0:28:09 | 0:28:15 | |
after trying and failing to get mis-sold PPI payments returned. | 0:28:15 | 0:28:19 | |
Denise Barnaby from London is one. She's banked with the Halifax for 30 years, | 0:28:19 | 0:28:26 | |
but for the last eight months she's fought to get back PPI added without her knowledge to a credit card | 0:28:26 | 0:28:32 | |
that she's had with the bank since 1996. She didn't use a PPI company to help or respond to a cold call. | 0:28:32 | 0:28:38 | |
Denise made the claim herself, which should be straightforward, | 0:28:38 | 0:28:43 | |
but the Halifax denied she was entitled to any money. | 0:28:43 | 0:28:47 | |
When I first got the letter saying I didn't have any PPI added to my credit card, | 0:28:47 | 0:28:53 | |
I was very disappointed. I thought something's not quite right here. I need to investigate and research it. | 0:28:53 | 0:29:01 | |
Determined not to give up, Denise continued to pursue her claim, but the bank refused to back down. | 0:29:01 | 0:29:07 | |
It was like going round in circles, | 0:29:07 | 0:29:10 | |
which was taking an immense amount of time and was quite stressful, to be quite honest, | 0:29:10 | 0:29:15 | |
and sometimes quite depressing. | 0:29:15 | 0:29:17 | |
Denise contacted the Financial Ombudsman Service and the Halifax eventually accepted her claim. | 0:29:17 | 0:29:25 | |
However, Denise's relief was short-lived. | 0:29:25 | 0:29:28 | |
The bank offered her the sum of £1,719.02 - | 0:29:28 | 0:29:32 | |
much less than she felt she was entitled to. When the offer came, | 0:29:32 | 0:29:37 | |
I was absolutely shocked because it wasn't right. | 0:29:37 | 0:29:42 | |
From 1996, that offer just didn't add up. | 0:29:42 | 0:29:47 | |
Denise refused to accept the cheque from the Halifax and continued to chase the bank for her money. | 0:29:47 | 0:29:55 | |
I was very determined that they weren't going to get away with whatever they owed me. | 0:29:55 | 0:30:01 | |
It's my money, so I wasn't going to stop until I got it back. | 0:30:01 | 0:30:05 | |
Denise continued to fight the claim herself and a few weeks later they offered a revised settlement | 0:30:05 | 0:30:11 | |
of £2,598.11. That's over £800 more than their original offer. | 0:30:11 | 0:30:18 | |
And she's keen for other people to follow her example. | 0:30:18 | 0:30:24 | |
My message to everybody would be once you know you're owed PPI | 0:30:24 | 0:30:29 | |
don't give up, be persistent, don't go through any of these PPI companies. You don't need to. | 0:30:29 | 0:30:36 | |
You can do it all yourself. | 0:30:36 | 0:30:39 | |
Keep battling until you do get your money back. | 0:30:39 | 0:30:43 | |
We contacted the Halifax, who told us: | 0:30:43 | 0:30:47 | |
In light of Denise's concerns at the amount of redress, the bank rechecked the calculations | 0:30:52 | 0:30:58 | |
and found "an automation error which resulted in an incorrect amount being calculated." | 0:30:58 | 0:31:04 | |
The bank said it's "very sorry to have made a mistake". | 0:31:04 | 0:31:08 | |
They have offered her £100 for the distress and inconvenience caused. | 0:31:08 | 0:31:12 | |
But Denise's fight isn't over yet. | 0:31:15 | 0:31:17 | |
She's now in the process of claiming back PPI she thinks she was mis-sold on loans from the same bank. | 0:31:17 | 0:31:25 | |
I'm willing to go all the way for my loans PPI and if it means we go through a world of battle again | 0:31:25 | 0:31:31 | |
as stressful as it is, I am willing to challenge them again. | 0:31:31 | 0:31:37 | |
Although slower than expected, Denise did the right thing my making her claim herself. | 0:31:37 | 0:31:42 | |
It's by far the best way to reclaim PPI you think you might be owed. | 0:31:42 | 0:31:48 | |
You can do this absolutely free. | 0:31:48 | 0:31:50 | |
You do not need to use a claims management company. | 0:31:50 | 0:31:54 | |
Go to the Rip-Off Britain website or which.co.uk and you can find | 0:31:54 | 0:31:59 | |
a pool of resources to help make your complaint. First, gather evidence. Pull together your old paperwork, | 0:31:59 | 0:32:07 | |
policy numbers, when you took out the policy and who sold it to you. | 0:32:07 | 0:32:11 | |
Once you gather all your evidence, use some of the template resources on those websites. | 0:32:11 | 0:32:17 | |
You can fill out your details. They'll generate a template letter | 0:32:17 | 0:32:22 | |
with all the information to make a valid complaint. | 0:32:22 | 0:32:25 | |
Send it to your lender and after eight weeks you should get told if your claim has been accepted. | 0:32:25 | 0:32:31 | |
An estimated 22% of all cold calls are about PPI claims. | 0:32:31 | 0:32:36 | |
Using a claims management company may seem a tempting option, | 0:32:36 | 0:32:39 | |
but making the claim yourself means you get to keep all of your money | 0:32:39 | 0:32:45 | |
and you can find full details as to how to make your claim on our website: | 0:32:45 | 0:32:53 | |
The thing about the cold calling industry is that those companies involved will claim | 0:32:56 | 0:33:02 | |
that there are actually people who don't mind receiving an offer over the telephone, | 0:33:02 | 0:33:07 | |
but the numbers of those who are not at all happy about unsolicited calls, nuisance calls, | 0:33:07 | 0:33:14 | |
has been steadily rising. So if you've ever felt aggrieved at being called by a company | 0:33:14 | 0:33:21 | |
that you have absolutely no interest in doing business with at all, | 0:33:21 | 0:33:25 | |
you'll be particularly interested in our next story and how some people who are sick of cold calls | 0:33:25 | 0:33:31 | |
have fought back and won. I'm about to meet one of them now and he'll tell you how he did it. | 0:33:31 | 0:33:38 | |
Some people might consider Steve Higgins and Richard Herman consumer heroes. | 0:33:38 | 0:33:43 | |
Both of them successfully took on the cold-calling companies who would not take no for an answer. | 0:33:43 | 0:33:49 | |
Steve was being badgered to reclaim PPI that he knew he could never claim | 0:33:49 | 0:33:54 | |
and Richard was being hounded daily by calls from the same call centre, one that is based overseas, | 0:33:54 | 0:34:00 | |
but working for companies in the UK. | 0:34:00 | 0:34:03 | |
Richard, how did you first become aware of the volume and nuisance value of these unsolicited calls? | 0:34:03 | 0:34:09 | |
An occasional call, one wouldn't matter, but to get two calls a day | 0:34:09 | 0:34:15 | |
and to receive calls with the same characteristics made me realise it was probably the same company | 0:34:15 | 0:34:22 | |
over and over again. I realised I had to stop it. | 0:34:22 | 0:34:26 | |
Richard figured that if he stayed on the phone, they'd eventually put him through to someone in the UK | 0:34:26 | 0:34:33 | |
who, wanting him to sign up, would tell him who they were. | 0:34:33 | 0:34:37 | |
I said, "You need to stop calling me. Take me off the list." I felt that would work, speaking to the UK, | 0:34:37 | 0:34:43 | |
and I said, "If you call me again, I'll charge you £10 a minute for my time." | 0:34:43 | 0:34:48 | |
What reaction did you get then? I don't think they took it on board, but I assumed that was the end of it. | 0:34:48 | 0:34:55 | |
So what happened? About a week later, to my astonishment, they called me again, | 0:34:55 | 0:35:01 | |
but I carried on until I got through to the same company in the UK. | 0:35:01 | 0:35:06 | |
I said, "I've already told you not to call me." | 0:35:06 | 0:35:10 | |
I said I'd be sending an invoice for my time. | 0:35:10 | 0:35:13 | |
It had taken 19 minutes before the call centre put Richard through to the UK company, PPI Claimline. | 0:35:13 | 0:35:20 | |
So, true to his word, Richard sent them an invoice for that time, | 0:35:20 | 0:35:25 | |
asking them to pay him £195. | 0:35:25 | 0:35:27 | |
Their reply was a little surprising. | 0:35:27 | 0:35:30 | |
They wrote back to me to say they'd never ever called me, | 0:35:30 | 0:35:34 | |
but I had recordings of all the calls they had made to me. | 0:35:34 | 0:35:38 | |
But it was true. PPI Claimline had not made any of the calls themselves. They explained | 0:35:38 | 0:35:44 | |
that they pay other companies to generate their leads and find people who might be interested | 0:35:44 | 0:35:50 | |
and then put them through to someone who could seal the deal. | 0:35:50 | 0:35:54 | |
So although it was PPI Claimline who wanted his business, | 0:35:54 | 0:35:58 | |
the company actually making the calls was a marketing firm called AAC, based in Bishop's Stortford. | 0:35:58 | 0:36:05 | |
Determined to prove his point, it was that firm Richard decided should pay for his wasted time. | 0:36:05 | 0:36:11 | |
He started small claims proceedings against them, but before the case was heard, AAC sent him a cheque | 0:36:11 | 0:36:17 | |
for £195 plus £25 to cover his court fees. | 0:36:17 | 0:36:21 | |
I got paid and the cold calls stopped, so it was great. | 0:36:21 | 0:36:25 | |
But then you started getting more. | 0:36:25 | 0:36:28 | |
I had about two months with no cold calls, so about three months later | 0:36:28 | 0:36:33 | |
I started to be cold called again. I played along with it again | 0:36:33 | 0:36:37 | |
and said I'd charge for my time. | 0:36:37 | 0:36:40 | |
And when he was called again by another company generating leads for someone else, | 0:36:40 | 0:36:46 | |
Richard invoiced them, too, this time successfully claiming another £230. | 0:36:46 | 0:36:52 | |
Certainly from my point of view it's changed the number of calls I get completely. | 0:36:52 | 0:36:57 | |
Until recently, I had about four months without any. It's made me feel much better. I felt victimised before | 0:36:57 | 0:37:03 | |
because there's nothing you can do to stop them. Most people who get a nuisance call put the phone down. | 0:37:03 | 0:37:11 | |
You actually, as an individual, stood up against a very large organisation. | 0:37:11 | 0:37:17 | |
That took knowledge, but also time and courage. | 0:37:17 | 0:37:20 | |
I think I had to do it. I was fed up being victimised. | 0:37:20 | 0:37:25 | |
The only way to get my equilibrium back was to do something about it. | 0:37:25 | 0:37:29 | |
We wrote to the companies Richard invoiced to get their take on this. | 0:37:29 | 0:37:33 | |
Most didn't reply, although PPI Claimline told us... | 0:37:33 | 0:37:38 | |
They accept that the marketing company they used should not have called Richard again | 0:37:44 | 0:37:50 | |
once he requested to be taken off the consent list. They say... | 0:37:50 | 0:37:54 | |
Richard has now set up a website Say No To Cold Calls that offers help and advice | 0:37:56 | 0:38:02 | |
on how to take cold callers to task, | 0:38:02 | 0:38:05 | |
knowledge that he's used to claim back a considerable amount of money. | 0:38:05 | 0:38:09 | |
And, impressive as that is, fellow cold call crusader Steve Higgins | 0:38:09 | 0:38:14 | |
has also had some extraordinary results after getting fed up with unwanted calls in family time. | 0:38:14 | 0:38:21 | |
We were getting around six, seven, eight phone calls a day. | 0:38:21 | 0:38:25 | |
And I work away. When I come home, I like to spend quality time with my wife and kids. | 0:38:25 | 0:38:32 | |
That was often being interrupted having to answer these calls, putting the phone calls down. | 0:38:32 | 0:38:38 | |
It was just ridiculous. | 0:38:38 | 0:38:40 | |
One company in particular kept calling, telling Steve he was entitled to a PPI refund. | 0:38:40 | 0:38:46 | |
Steve knew this was not the case. | 0:38:46 | 0:38:49 | |
I'd claimed PPI in the past, so I was well aware I'd no right to claim PPI despite them telling me I had. | 0:38:49 | 0:38:56 | |
During two months in late 2012, Steve received 94 calls, | 0:38:56 | 0:39:00 | |
of which he thinks the majority were from the same telemarketing company, working for Synergy Leads Ltd. | 0:39:00 | 0:39:07 | |
However much he asked them to stop, they didn't. | 0:39:07 | 0:39:10 | |
I'd pleaded with them to stop, I'd asked, I'd begged. It didn't work. | 0:39:10 | 0:39:15 | |
It was a barrage of calls and I began to log them. That's how I know I had that many calls. | 0:39:15 | 0:39:21 | |
Steve had had enough. He decided to take action. The next time they called, he again asked them to stop | 0:39:21 | 0:39:28 | |
and told them he would invoice them £10 for every subsequent call. | 0:39:28 | 0:39:32 | |
I spoke to their supervisor on the other end. | 0:39:32 | 0:39:36 | |
I told him I'd asked them to stop and he said he couldn't do that. | 0:39:36 | 0:39:40 | |
I then told him I would be charging him £10 for every call that they made. He put the phone down on me. | 0:39:40 | 0:39:46 | |
I hit on a figure of £10 because I looked at how much time I was spending on each phone call | 0:39:46 | 0:39:52 | |
and then I'd look at my line of work and my chargeable tab. | 0:39:52 | 0:39:57 | |
But the threat of invoices did not work. The calls kept coming. | 0:39:57 | 0:40:01 | |
I tried to complain by email, by writing, by phone. No response. | 0:40:01 | 0:40:06 | |
It was then I decided to take this further. | 0:40:06 | 0:40:09 | |
So Steve went to the government website Money Claim Online and filed a claim | 0:40:09 | 0:40:14 | |
with the Small Claims Court. It cost him £60, after which Synergy Leads didn't offer a defence | 0:40:14 | 0:40:20 | |
and the case was found in Steve's favour. The judgment was for £1,000. | 0:40:20 | 0:40:25 | |
It was 94 phone calls at £10 a call, £940. And then I also got £60 court costs, | 0:40:25 | 0:40:32 | |
which the company had to pay. So it was £1,000 in total. | 0:40:32 | 0:40:36 | |
We wrote to Synergy Leads at their registered address and asked them to comment on Steve's case. | 0:40:36 | 0:40:42 | |
They haven't responded. Steve has quite a track record in winning money through Small Claims. | 0:40:42 | 0:40:49 | |
In the past 16 years, he's taken 150 companies through the courts for everything from unfair bank charges | 0:40:49 | 0:40:55 | |
to mis-sold insurance. And he's been awarded a total of around £75,000 in refunds and costs. | 0:40:55 | 0:41:01 | |
Since he wont his case, he hasn't had a single cold call. | 0:41:01 | 0:41:06 | |
If just one person looks at what I did and follows the same path, | 0:41:06 | 0:41:11 | |
because it's cheap and you don't have to see a solicitor, it's very easy. | 0:41:11 | 0:41:16 | |
So if one person does it, I'm really quite pleased. | 0:41:16 | 0:41:20 | |
The more people do it, the less these calls will happen. Companies will sit up and take notice | 0:41:20 | 0:41:26 | |
and decide against phoning people who shouldn't be phoned. | 0:41:26 | 0:41:30 | |
Here at Rip-Off Britain, we're always ready to investigate more of your stories. | 0:41:35 | 0:41:41 | |
You might have a cautionary tale and want to share it with us so others don't do the same thing. | 0:41:41 | 0:41:47 | |
You can write to us at: | 0:41:47 | 0:41:50 | |
Or you can send us an email to: | 0:41:57 | 0:42:00 | |
The Rip-Off team is ready and waiting to investigate your stories. | 0:42:03 | 0:42:08 | |
It really does seem extraordinary that so many cold calls are still made to people who don't want them. | 0:42:09 | 0:42:16 | |
They absolutely shouldn't be approaching you if that's the case. | 0:42:16 | 0:42:21 | |
But remember there are other ways to reduce your unwanted calls. | 0:42:21 | 0:42:26 | |
For example, do not put your number in the phone book and if asked to tick a box opting out | 0:42:26 | 0:42:31 | |
of what they call "Carefully selected offers", don't tick the one opting in! | 0:42:31 | 0:42:37 | |
And there's lots more advice on our website: | 0:42:37 | 0:42:41 | |
That's where we have to leave you, but we will be back again very soon | 0:42:44 | 0:42:48 | |
to look at even more situations that leave you feeling ripped off. | 0:42:48 | 0:42:52 | |
Until then, bye-bye. Bye-bye. Bye. | 0:42:52 | 0:42:55 | |
Subtitles by Red Bee Media Ltd | 0:43:14 | 0:43:17 |