Browse content similar to The Trial. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
Line | From | To | |
---|---|---|---|
In 2014 there were over 500,000 criminal prosecutions | 0:00:02 | 0:00:04 | |
in England and Wales. | 0:00:04 | 0:00:06 | |
Each one was prosecuted, not by the police, | 0:00:06 | 0:00:08 | |
but by the lawyers of the Crown Prosecution Service. | 0:00:08 | 0:00:12 | |
My job is about applying the law to other people's lives, | 0:00:12 | 0:00:17 | |
and hopefully for the public good. | 0:00:17 | 0:00:19 | |
The defendant is found locked inside the house, | 0:00:20 | 0:00:23 | |
with his mother dead downstairs. | 0:00:23 | 0:00:26 | |
In every serious criminal case, the Crown Prosecution Service | 0:00:26 | 0:00:30 | |
must decide who to charge and what to charge them with. | 0:00:30 | 0:00:34 | |
I think that this will come down to, I suppose, is he bad or is he mad? | 0:00:34 | 0:00:38 | |
Sometimes the difficult decisions are unpopular decisions, | 0:00:38 | 0:00:42 | |
but they are the right decisions. | 0:00:42 | 0:00:44 | |
It's their job to build the case and battle to secure a conviction. | 0:00:44 | 0:00:49 | |
All the defence have to do is just pick at things. | 0:00:49 | 0:00:52 | |
They just have to go like that. | 0:00:52 | 0:00:53 | |
And say "Well, you're not right about that." | 0:00:53 | 0:00:55 | |
Now, for the very first time, the Crown Prosecution Service has let | 0:00:55 | 0:00:59 | |
cameras in to film this unseen world between the police and the courts. | 0:00:59 | 0:01:04 | |
These are real people, they're real people's lives | 0:01:04 | 0:01:07 | |
and real emotions involved. | 0:01:07 | 0:01:08 | |
We may have our suspicions, but if the evidence isn't there, | 0:01:08 | 0:01:10 | |
the evidence isn't there. | 0:01:10 | 0:01:12 | |
For them it's evidence. | 0:01:12 | 0:01:15 | |
It's my life. | 0:01:15 | 0:01:16 | |
This programme contains scenes which some viewers may find upsetting. | 0:01:19 | 0:01:23 | |
For over 21 years no-one has been brought to justice | 0:01:23 | 0:01:26 | |
for one of Britain's most notorious murders. | 0:01:26 | 0:01:29 | |
Now the CPS is preparing for a trial. | 0:01:29 | 0:01:33 | |
On the evening of Monday 18th January 1993, | 0:01:34 | 0:01:38 | |
in an alleyway just off the London Road, in Greenhithe North Kent, | 0:01:38 | 0:01:42 | |
Claire Tiltman, a 16-year-old schoolgirl, | 0:01:42 | 0:01:45 | |
was killed in an apparently motiveless attack. | 0:01:45 | 0:01:49 | |
A massive police investigation followed, but uncovered no suspects. | 0:01:51 | 0:01:55 | |
Claire, the only daughter of Lin and Cliff Tiltman, | 0:01:57 | 0:02:00 | |
had been stabbed no less than nine times. | 0:02:00 | 0:02:03 | |
Cliff, this is obviously a very difficult time for you. | 0:02:03 | 0:02:06 | |
How are you managing to get through it with your wife? | 0:02:06 | 0:02:09 | |
Very, very difficult. | 0:02:11 | 0:02:12 | |
Well, we're not really. Sort of shattered. | 0:02:12 | 0:02:15 | |
Erm... I don't know, a lot of people... | 0:02:15 | 0:02:18 | |
People have asked me how I am... | 0:02:18 | 0:02:21 | |
and all I can say is what I've said to the doctor and everyone else - | 0:02:21 | 0:02:25 | |
do you know anyone that's got a tablet for a broken heart? | 0:02:25 | 0:02:28 | |
If anybody knows anything, you know, if they just phone the police... | 0:02:29 | 0:02:33 | |
-Please. -If anybody's got any idea... | 0:02:33 | 0:02:36 | |
So that they can't do it again to anybody else. | 0:02:36 | 0:02:40 | |
The investigating team believe that Claire's killer did indeed attack again. | 0:02:41 | 0:02:46 | |
And now they want to use the details of that attack | 0:02:46 | 0:02:49 | |
and a recent change in the law to try and prove | 0:02:49 | 0:02:51 | |
Colin Ash-Smith guilty of the murder of Claire Tiltman. | 0:02:51 | 0:02:55 | |
We're here to talk about the murder of Claire Tiltman. | 0:03:02 | 0:03:04 | |
And I know, looking around the room here, there's a fair few | 0:03:04 | 0:03:07 | |
of you that have followed this case for many years, | 0:03:07 | 0:03:10 | |
and probably like I, share a real passion to try and bring | 0:03:10 | 0:03:14 | |
some resolution to the murder of Claire Tiltman, | 0:03:14 | 0:03:18 | |
in such horrific circumstances, back in 1993. | 0:03:18 | 0:03:21 | |
For the past three years Nigel Pilkington has been in charge | 0:03:23 | 0:03:26 | |
of building the case for the prosecution. | 0:03:26 | 0:03:29 | |
Claire Tiltman was walking to her friend's, Victoria Swift. | 0:03:29 | 0:03:33 | |
It's about a mile or so from her house. | 0:03:33 | 0:03:35 | |
They were going to discuss college. | 0:03:35 | 0:03:37 | |
She never made it to her friend's house. | 0:03:37 | 0:03:39 | |
She was stabbed in an alleyway near to where Victoria Swift lives. | 0:03:39 | 0:03:42 | |
Initially, people see her come staggering out | 0:03:42 | 0:03:45 | |
and they think there's been a car accident. | 0:03:45 | 0:03:47 | |
It's very quickly when people go to her aid, | 0:03:47 | 0:03:49 | |
see that she had actually been stabbed a number of times. | 0:03:49 | 0:03:51 | |
And Claire died tragically at the scene. | 0:03:51 | 0:03:54 | |
And what then took place was probably one of the largest | 0:03:54 | 0:03:56 | |
murder investigations that Kent Police have ever run. | 0:03:56 | 0:03:59 | |
However, Claire's attacker was never identified. | 0:03:59 | 0:04:03 | |
Then we have to go forward | 0:04:04 | 0:04:06 | |
about two and three quarter years to the 17th October, 1995. | 0:04:06 | 0:04:11 | |
On that day, literally, round the corner - | 0:04:11 | 0:04:14 | |
we are talking no more than 300 yards - | 0:04:14 | 0:04:16 | |
a woman called Charlotte Barnard is approached by a man. | 0:04:16 | 0:04:20 | |
He grabs her, pulls her across the road, he stabs her about 14 times. | 0:04:20 | 0:04:27 | |
It is literally a miracle that she did not die. | 0:04:27 | 0:04:29 | |
But she did not die. | 0:04:29 | 0:04:30 | |
Now, on that night and on that evening | 0:04:30 | 0:04:33 | |
a very distinctive car was seen just up the road. | 0:04:33 | 0:04:36 | |
And also recognised in the area was Colin Ash-Smith. | 0:04:36 | 0:04:40 | |
He was the attacker for this lady. | 0:04:40 | 0:04:43 | |
He subsequently went on to admit it. | 0:04:43 | 0:04:46 | |
Did you attack Charlotte Barnard on the 17th of October with a knife? | 0:04:46 | 0:04:52 | |
Yes. | 0:04:52 | 0:04:54 | |
Why did you do it? | 0:04:54 | 0:04:57 | |
I don't know. | 0:04:57 | 0:04:58 | |
Is there anything at all that actually triggers off this act in you? | 0:05:00 | 0:05:04 | |
It's like an impulse. I don't know if... | 0:05:04 | 0:05:08 | |
Most of the time I just snap out of it. | 0:05:09 | 0:05:13 | |
The similarities of the two attacks were...well, remarkable. | 0:05:13 | 0:05:17 | |
And so at that stage Colin Ash-Smith's name had been | 0:05:17 | 0:05:22 | |
linked to Claire Tiltman's murder. | 0:05:22 | 0:05:24 | |
I would be lying to you if I said I'm not going to be looking | 0:05:24 | 0:05:27 | |
very closely at you for the death of Claire. | 0:05:27 | 0:05:31 | |
Out of all the interviews I've...been in, | 0:05:33 | 0:05:38 | |
I haven't told one single lie. | 0:05:38 | 0:05:41 | |
Out of every single interview I haven't told one single lie | 0:05:41 | 0:05:45 | |
in any interview at all. | 0:05:45 | 0:05:47 | |
And I can categorically deny I didn't have anything to do with that. | 0:05:47 | 0:05:51 | |
OK. That's a double negative, but I take what you mean. | 0:05:51 | 0:05:54 | |
I didn't have anything to do with that. | 0:05:54 | 0:05:56 | |
You didn't kill... You're telling me you didn't kill Claire Tiltman? | 0:05:56 | 0:06:00 | |
I know I didn't her, kill Claire. | 0:06:00 | 0:06:03 | |
Colin Ash-Smith, born on 3rd of June '68, lived not far away. | 0:06:04 | 0:06:10 | |
And what we also knew was that Colin Ash-Smith actually knew Claire Tiltman - | 0:06:10 | 0:06:14 | |
an association through the British Legion. | 0:06:14 | 0:06:17 | |
Colin Ash-Smith was arrested for Claire's murder and denied it. | 0:06:17 | 0:06:23 | |
At that stage we couldn't link it. | 0:06:23 | 0:06:26 | |
Despite his denials, | 0:06:26 | 0:06:27 | |
the manner of the attacks made Colin Ash-Smith a suspect. | 0:06:27 | 0:06:31 | |
He was put into an identity parade. | 0:06:31 | 0:06:34 | |
OK, I suggest, in consultation with your solicitor, | 0:06:34 | 0:06:37 | |
you select your position in the line-up, please. | 0:06:37 | 0:06:40 | |
Number two to swap, please. | 0:06:40 | 0:06:41 | |
Witnesses who'd seen someone on the London Road | 0:06:43 | 0:06:45 | |
on the night of Claire's murder three years earlier | 0:06:45 | 0:06:48 | |
could not make a positive identification. | 0:06:48 | 0:06:51 | |
And with no forensic evidence Colin Ash-Smith was not charged. | 0:06:51 | 0:06:55 | |
Right, if you'd like to come this way. | 0:06:55 | 0:06:57 | |
He did, however, plead guilty to the attack on Charlotte Barnard | 0:06:57 | 0:07:01 | |
and to an earlier attack on another woman, and was sentenced | 0:07:01 | 0:07:04 | |
to life imprisonment with a minimum of term of 15 years. | 0:07:04 | 0:07:08 | |
Have we looked at attacks since 1990 kind of 5? | 0:07:08 | 0:07:11 | |
-Oh, there's been no attacks. -There haven't? -No. | 0:07:11 | 0:07:13 | |
So they stopped after Colin Ash-Smith | 0:07:13 | 0:07:16 | |
-had been arrested? -Yes. | 0:07:16 | 0:07:18 | |
The similarity of the cases meant Colin Ash-Smith remained | 0:07:18 | 0:07:20 | |
the prime suspect for the murder of Claire Tiltman. | 0:07:20 | 0:07:24 | |
But the details of those cases could not be used as evidence | 0:07:25 | 0:07:28 | |
until a recent change in the law. | 0:07:28 | 0:07:31 | |
The prosecution can now introduce | 0:07:31 | 0:07:33 | |
what's called bad character evidence. | 0:07:33 | 0:07:35 | |
So if there is behaviour which is very similar, | 0:07:35 | 0:07:39 | |
the prosecution could then rely upon it as part of their case. | 0:07:39 | 0:07:42 | |
But there would have to be other evidence, | 0:07:42 | 0:07:44 | |
so it's part of the prosecution case. | 0:07:44 | 0:07:47 | |
The law was changed to allow bad character to be introduced, | 0:07:47 | 0:07:50 | |
not completely, but on certain conditions. | 0:07:50 | 0:07:53 | |
But there's still quite a high hurdle, | 0:07:53 | 0:07:56 | |
and I couldn't run a case if all I had was a bad character. | 0:07:56 | 0:07:58 | |
And people might take the view well, you shouldn't | 0:07:58 | 0:08:00 | |
because it could be a little bit difficult for a defendant | 0:08:00 | 0:08:03 | |
if all the prosecution are saying is that he's a man of bad character. | 0:08:03 | 0:08:06 | |
Before the prosecution will be allowed to introduce any | 0:08:06 | 0:08:09 | |
bad character evidence, they will have to persuade | 0:08:09 | 0:08:11 | |
the judge that it is not the only thing their case is relying upon. | 0:08:11 | 0:08:15 | |
It'll be a difficult case because it's a circumstantial case. | 0:08:15 | 0:08:18 | |
But then there's no point in doing this job | 0:08:18 | 0:08:20 | |
unless you do difficult cases. | 0:08:20 | 0:08:22 | |
Difficult historic crimes often form part of a workload | 0:08:24 | 0:08:27 | |
of the complex casework unit. | 0:08:27 | 0:08:30 | |
Here, lawyers on average spend a year to 18 months on a case. | 0:08:30 | 0:08:35 | |
In Mersey Cheshire, a non-recent sex abuse case is being | 0:08:35 | 0:08:39 | |
prepared for trial in five months' time. | 0:08:39 | 0:08:42 | |
Shall we just start from...base one really. | 0:08:42 | 0:08:46 | |
When's the trial? | 0:08:46 | 0:08:48 | |
The trial is the 27th of October. | 0:08:48 | 0:08:51 | |
We've got one defendant, | 0:08:51 | 0:08:53 | |
and at the moment we've got... | 0:08:53 | 0:08:55 | |
13...complainants. | 0:08:55 | 0:08:59 | |
The defendant, Cavendish-Coulson, was a teacher | 0:08:59 | 0:09:04 | |
in a private school in Cheshire. | 0:09:04 | 0:09:07 | |
It was a boarding school. | 0:09:07 | 0:09:10 | |
And some complainants came forward to say that many years ago they'd | 0:09:10 | 0:09:14 | |
been indecently assaulted by him when they were boys at the school. | 0:09:14 | 0:09:18 | |
So the 13 we've got, | 0:09:47 | 0:09:50 | |
how many are from the school in Chester? | 0:09:50 | 0:09:54 | |
-12. -So we've got 12 from that school, | 0:09:54 | 0:09:57 | |
and the 13th is from where? | 0:09:57 | 0:09:59 | |
-He was privately tutored. -Right. | 0:09:59 | 0:10:02 | |
There's actually a sort of ten year gap between the offences | 0:10:02 | 0:10:06 | |
involving the boys from the Cheshire school and the offence on him. | 0:10:06 | 0:10:11 | |
I think that the fact that something happened some years ago | 0:10:11 | 0:10:14 | |
doesn't mean it didn't happen, | 0:10:14 | 0:10:16 | |
or doesn't mean we shouldn't bother with it. | 0:10:16 | 0:10:18 | |
If they give a credible description of what happened to them | 0:10:18 | 0:10:22 | |
and they're reliable witnesses, | 0:10:22 | 0:10:25 | |
who are we not to prosecute? | 0:10:25 | 0:10:27 | |
We look at the evidence, and if we think there's enough evidence, | 0:10:27 | 0:10:30 | |
then I think it's very much in the public interest | 0:10:30 | 0:10:33 | |
to prosecute sex offenders. | 0:10:33 | 0:10:35 | |
We had our original, very original two, | 0:10:35 | 0:10:38 | |
if you recall, and one of those wasn't wanting to give evidence. | 0:10:38 | 0:10:42 | |
-Is that right? -That's staying the same for his health reasons. | 0:10:42 | 0:10:46 | |
His family don't want him to become involved. | 0:10:46 | 0:10:49 | |
-And that's sad. -Yeah. -Yeah. | 0:10:49 | 0:10:52 | |
-Because it's probably because of this offending... -It may be. | 0:10:52 | 0:10:55 | |
-..that he's not in a fit state to... -It may be, yeah. | 0:10:55 | 0:10:59 | |
We get criticised in the press sometimes as if | 0:10:59 | 0:11:02 | |
we've dredged it up, we've dreamt up cases, we've found victims. | 0:11:02 | 0:11:07 | |
Those victims come to the police and they come to us. | 0:11:07 | 0:11:10 | |
And what offences are we going for on the indictment? | 0:11:35 | 0:11:38 | |
It's all indecent assaults. | 0:11:38 | 0:11:40 | |
Right. Under the old... | 0:11:40 | 0:11:41 | |
-Under the '56 Act, yeah. -Yes. | 0:11:41 | 0:11:43 | |
-And he won't plead? -No. | 0:11:43 | 0:11:45 | |
Just denies it. | 0:11:46 | 0:11:48 | |
Accepts he was at the school, denies committing the offences, | 0:11:48 | 0:11:52 | |
and says they were colluding. | 0:11:52 | 0:11:55 | |
It's been fabricated. | 0:11:55 | 0:11:56 | |
And yet there's no evidence of collusion. | 0:11:56 | 0:11:58 | |
They've come forward separately, from separate lives now. | 0:11:58 | 0:12:01 | |
This was a prep school. | 0:12:01 | 0:12:04 | |
There were only there till they were 13. | 0:12:04 | 0:12:07 | |
So they've had no contact, many of them, for many, many years. | 0:12:07 | 0:12:11 | |
It's like some old school friend of mine | 0:12:11 | 0:12:14 | |
-coming forward at the same time as me and I haven't seen them. -No. | 0:12:14 | 0:12:18 | |
It's the only defence he can come up with though. | 0:12:18 | 0:12:20 | |
If he's still going to plead not guilty, that IS his only defence. | 0:12:20 | 0:12:23 | |
Cos why else would all these people come forward? | 0:12:23 | 0:12:26 | |
So he can only really claim collusion and fabrication, can't he? | 0:12:26 | 0:12:31 | |
Yes, he can. | 0:12:31 | 0:12:32 | |
He's filed a defence case statement now, which confirms that. | 0:12:32 | 0:12:35 | |
-Oh, does it? -Yes. That that's his defence. | 0:12:35 | 0:12:38 | |
-Is that it there? -Yes. -That's it there. | 0:12:38 | 0:12:41 | |
When people say there isn't any evidence, | 0:12:41 | 0:12:43 | |
well, the evidence is the fact that somebody's come forward | 0:12:43 | 0:12:46 | |
and has given a good description of what happened to them. | 0:12:46 | 0:12:49 | |
And if there's no reason to distrust them or disbelieve them, | 0:12:49 | 0:12:54 | |
then we believe them. | 0:12:54 | 0:12:55 | |
And I'm sorry, but if you get a lot of victims in essence saying | 0:12:55 | 0:12:58 | |
more or less the same thing, it does make it more likely to be true. | 0:12:58 | 0:13:03 | |
Difficult though in front of juries, | 0:13:03 | 0:13:05 | |
particularly with non-recent sexual offences. | 0:13:05 | 0:13:08 | |
The main bit, which is paragraph two, isn't it? | 0:13:08 | 0:13:11 | |
"None... None of the assaults took place, and they're all false." | 0:13:11 | 0:13:16 | |
Yes. | 0:13:16 | 0:13:17 | |
And then he has to say... He HAS to, doesn't he? | 0:13:17 | 0:13:19 | |
"The defendant suspects there's been collusion." | 0:13:19 | 0:13:22 | |
-That's because he's got no evidence of collusion. -No. | 0:13:22 | 0:13:25 | |
He's going to suggest possibly that the police in their investigation | 0:13:25 | 0:13:29 | |
gave information away that indicated what they were investigating... | 0:13:29 | 0:13:35 | |
-Oh, I see. -..to come forward. | 0:13:35 | 0:13:38 | |
-So the collusion is sort of via the police. -Yeah. | 0:13:38 | 0:13:41 | |
-As if they've corralled it all. -Yeah. | 0:13:41 | 0:13:44 | |
That kind of makes more sense. | 0:13:44 | 0:13:45 | |
We're satisfied that he is somebody who is a serial sex offender. | 0:13:45 | 0:13:49 | |
So clearly in the public interest to prosecute, as far as I'm concerned. | 0:13:49 | 0:13:53 | |
In North Kent, the prosecution team are on their way to visit | 0:13:56 | 0:13:59 | |
the site of Claire Tiltman's murder. | 0:13:59 | 0:14:01 | |
This offence took place in 1993. | 0:14:02 | 0:14:06 | |
And over 21 years a lot has changed. | 0:14:06 | 0:14:09 | |
Not just the geography of where the offence took place, | 0:14:09 | 0:14:12 | |
but also people's thinking and social habits have changed, | 0:14:12 | 0:14:18 | |
the way people now communicate in terms of telephone evidence, | 0:14:18 | 0:14:22 | |
all impact upon the thinking. | 0:14:22 | 0:14:25 | |
So for us, it's very important that how we present a case to a jury | 0:14:25 | 0:14:29 | |
is how the case would have looked like back in 1993. | 0:14:29 | 0:14:35 | |
Claire lived at Woodward Terrace. | 0:14:38 | 0:14:40 | |
Just this one here. | 0:14:42 | 0:14:43 | |
So she left five to six, I think around then. | 0:14:45 | 0:14:48 | |
She walked along here. | 0:14:48 | 0:14:50 | |
It's a dark January night. | 0:14:50 | 0:14:52 | |
She's made an arrangement with Victoria Swift, | 0:14:52 | 0:14:55 | |
who lives over here, to discuss college, because they're 16. | 0:14:55 | 0:14:59 | |
She's only just 16, | 0:14:59 | 0:15:01 | |
she was 16 four days previously, on the 14th January. | 0:15:01 | 0:15:04 | |
So she walked all the way down here. | 0:15:04 | 0:15:06 | |
It's quite a lengthy route. People see her along this road. | 0:15:06 | 0:15:09 | |
Following the 1993 appeal for information, | 0:15:10 | 0:15:13 | |
the police took over a thousand witness statements. | 0:15:13 | 0:15:16 | |
We'll park in here and walk the rest of the way. | 0:15:17 | 0:15:22 | |
At the trial, Nigel wants to try and use five of these witnesses | 0:15:22 | 0:15:26 | |
to piece together the events of that night. | 0:15:26 | 0:15:29 | |
Lee Hooper arrives here at almost certainly six minutes past six. | 0:15:29 | 0:15:32 | |
So Lee Hooper, remind us who he is. | 0:15:32 | 0:15:34 | |
He takes a call from his father, which is on a BT phone bill. | 0:15:34 | 0:15:36 | |
He puts the phone down and leaves the house, | 0:15:36 | 0:15:39 | |
and it takes him 12 minutes to walk here. | 0:15:39 | 0:15:41 | |
And on the south side of the road he sees Claire Tiltman. | 0:15:41 | 0:15:44 | |
Now, that's really important because, if we turn around, | 0:15:44 | 0:15:47 | |
she is going to go to her friend's, Victoria Swift's, | 0:15:47 | 0:15:50 | |
which is in the corner there. | 0:15:50 | 0:15:52 | |
To get to that house, if you were a 16-year-old girl in the dark, | 0:15:52 | 0:15:55 | |
you'd probably walk that way along Station Road and up there, | 0:15:55 | 0:15:59 | |
there's a road up there. | 0:15:59 | 0:16:00 | |
She doesn't do that. | 0:16:00 | 0:16:01 | |
Because she's murdered in the alleyway which is | 0:16:01 | 0:16:04 | |
-just beyond those lights. -OK. | 0:16:04 | 0:16:06 | |
To get from here to that alleyway is going to take us about 90 seconds. | 0:16:06 | 0:16:09 | |
She's here at 18:06, she's murdered 18:20. | 0:16:09 | 0:16:12 | |
-So what happened? -That's 14 minutes later. | 0:16:12 | 0:16:14 | |
So where does she go in 14 minutes? | 0:16:14 | 0:16:16 | |
We say she went up the hill and came down. | 0:16:16 | 0:16:19 | |
And when you do that timing, you arrive at the alleyway about 18:20. | 0:16:19 | 0:16:24 | |
Why did she go up the hill? | 0:16:27 | 0:16:29 | |
We say, almost certainly, | 0:16:29 | 0:16:31 | |
or probably, she went up to go to a shop to buy cigarettes. | 0:16:31 | 0:16:34 | |
Cigarettes were found on her. Ten, but one was missing. | 0:16:34 | 0:16:36 | |
Cigarettes are found on her but we've got no evidence to | 0:16:36 | 0:16:39 | |
say that she bought any cigarettes up at the shop there. | 0:16:39 | 0:16:41 | |
No, we don't. | 0:16:41 | 0:16:42 | |
We then say she came down across the zebra crossing. | 0:16:42 | 0:16:44 | |
We say the zebra crossing's really important in this case. | 0:16:44 | 0:16:47 | |
We say he drives down here. | 0:16:47 | 0:16:48 | |
He sees Claire crossing the zebra crossing. | 0:16:48 | 0:16:51 | |
So he sees her. His plan is hatched in ten seconds. | 0:16:51 | 0:16:55 | |
He's going to get in front of her, he's going to kill her, | 0:16:55 | 0:16:58 | |
he's going to go round, double back and come back to his car. | 0:16:58 | 0:17:00 | |
-It was more opportunist. -It's opportunist. -That's it. | 0:17:00 | 0:17:03 | |
OK. We're going to go back now to the alley. | 0:17:03 | 0:17:05 | |
We've got a number of eye-witnesses, | 0:17:05 | 0:17:08 | |
who see a bit of what happened in the case. | 0:17:08 | 0:17:12 | |
Now, the prosecution role is to ensure we bring all those | 0:17:12 | 0:17:15 | |
pieces together to show that it was Colin Ash-Smith who murdered Claire. | 0:17:15 | 0:17:20 | |
The role of the defence barrister is challenging, undermining, | 0:17:20 | 0:17:24 | |
bringing out the inconsistencies, | 0:17:24 | 0:17:28 | |
trying to show that the story doesn't fit. | 0:17:28 | 0:17:32 | |
Kathleen Still is driving her car up London Road. | 0:17:32 | 0:17:36 | |
And as she drives up the road, she sees something quite unusual. | 0:17:36 | 0:17:38 | |
She sees a man on that side of the road. | 0:17:38 | 0:17:41 | |
You can look at that side of the road. | 0:17:41 | 0:17:42 | |
You can't walk on that side of the road. Look how busy it is now. | 0:17:42 | 0:17:45 | |
She notices this man because it's unusual, | 0:17:45 | 0:17:49 | |
and she gives a description of him. | 0:17:49 | 0:17:51 | |
5 foot 8, 5 foot 10. | 0:17:51 | 0:17:52 | |
20 to 22, fair blonde hair. | 0:17:52 | 0:17:56 | |
Light, fawn beige jacket, dark trousers. That is Colin Ash-Smith. | 0:17:56 | 0:18:00 | |
He's on this side of the road when she's on the other side of the road. | 0:18:00 | 0:18:04 | |
He's determined to get in front of her. | 0:18:04 | 0:18:06 | |
A thing he was to repeat in the attempted murder | 0:18:06 | 0:18:09 | |
of Charlotte Barnard two and a half years later. | 0:18:09 | 0:18:11 | |
That's what he does. | 0:18:11 | 0:18:12 | |
We say that's what we call a very similar fact - that he moves in front of his victim. | 0:18:12 | 0:18:16 | |
Danny French has walked from the station, getting off his train | 0:18:16 | 0:18:19 | |
about 18:07, 18:08, and he's going to get here at about 18:13. | 0:18:19 | 0:18:23 | |
And as he's walking up the road he will see Claire Tiltman coming down. | 0:18:23 | 0:18:28 | |
The other thing he sees, he sees a man in front of Claire. | 0:18:28 | 0:18:31 | |
His description - young man, lightish hair. | 0:18:31 | 0:18:34 | |
He says a light blue denim wash jacket, which is disappointing | 0:18:34 | 0:18:37 | |
cos we don't think Mr Ash-Smith was wearing such a jacket. | 0:18:37 | 0:18:40 | |
But he can't really describe him very well. | 0:18:40 | 0:18:42 | |
And he sees the man in front of Claire, | 0:18:42 | 0:18:44 | |
but he doesn't see anybody behind her. | 0:18:44 | 0:18:47 | |
He walks on. She walks down. | 0:18:47 | 0:18:48 | |
Claire gets to the alleyway. | 0:18:50 | 0:18:53 | |
So here's the alley. | 0:18:53 | 0:18:56 | |
He may know it's her or he may not realise it's her. | 0:18:56 | 0:18:59 | |
But he's in this state that he has to attack. | 0:18:59 | 0:19:02 | |
This is one of his characteristics. | 0:19:02 | 0:19:03 | |
He's says he's got to, you know, when the urge comes upon him he has to attack. | 0:19:03 | 0:19:06 | |
And he stabs her. And it's a ferocious attack, and it's seconds. | 0:19:06 | 0:19:10 | |
Witnesses Harris and Hanson are driving, | 0:19:10 | 0:19:12 | |
and they come up here and they see a girl. | 0:19:12 | 0:19:15 | |
-And she's waving her arms, and clutching her back and looking behind her. -Right. | 0:19:15 | 0:19:19 | |
They see nobody else on the road. | 0:19:19 | 0:19:20 | |
What happened to the suspect? | 0:19:20 | 0:19:22 | |
His car, remember, is up the top of the hill. | 0:19:22 | 0:19:25 | |
He got down, got in front of her. So what does he do? | 0:19:25 | 0:19:27 | |
He needs to get back to his car, but in a circuitous route. | 0:19:27 | 0:19:31 | |
So, in my view, he comes this way. | 0:19:31 | 0:19:33 | |
-Oh, I see. -Yeah, OK. | 0:19:33 | 0:19:36 | |
He gets to the top of the stairs and he runs past this house. | 0:19:36 | 0:19:39 | |
And there's a woman in there and she sees a man. | 0:19:39 | 0:19:41 | |
And she describes that man as having blonde fair hair with a beige jacket. | 0:19:41 | 0:19:46 | |
And he's about 5 foot 10. | 0:19:46 | 0:19:48 | |
She gets the age as 40, which is way out. | 0:19:48 | 0:19:52 | |
But I'm not so concerned about that | 0:19:52 | 0:19:53 | |
because people's misdescription of age is understandable. | 0:19:53 | 0:19:57 | |
People's misdescription of people's clothing is not, or hair colour. | 0:19:57 | 0:20:00 | |
I mean, you'd want to get that right. But you can understand. | 0:20:00 | 0:20:03 | |
And he's limping. | 0:20:03 | 0:20:04 | |
We've checked everybody at the Ivy Bower Surgery, | 0:20:04 | 0:20:07 | |
nobody went in for a limp. | 0:20:07 | 0:20:08 | |
That's not to say that they didn't go in for something else and they had a limp. | 0:20:08 | 0:20:12 | |
But isn't it possible that he fell over running up the stairs? | 0:20:12 | 0:20:14 | |
Well, he would have run away. | 0:20:14 | 0:20:16 | |
He's looking behind him, he seems to be agitated. | 0:20:16 | 0:20:18 | |
He is the description, save for age, which is a description of Colin Ash-Smith. | 0:20:18 | 0:20:22 | |
Once again this evidence is challengeable. There's thousands of statements of people giving | 0:20:22 | 0:20:26 | |
descriptions of different people in different clothing. Why are we picking these people? | 0:20:26 | 0:20:30 | |
Well, of course we're picking them people because they say it fits our case. | 0:20:30 | 0:20:33 | |
But we're also picking them because they give the most proximate times and they give that | 0:20:33 | 0:20:37 | |
-narrative of the clothing and the age and the hair is Ash-Smith. -Yeah. | 0:20:37 | 0:20:41 | |
And he's got to double back and get up to his car. | 0:20:41 | 0:20:44 | |
So he's gone round here, he's come up here. | 0:20:44 | 0:20:47 | |
There are three boys here who do see a man whom | 0:20:47 | 0:20:50 | |
-they give a description of, and he's limping. -Right, OK. | 0:20:50 | 0:20:54 | |
Unfortunately the description's not great. | 0:20:54 | 0:20:56 | |
-Are we using them in evidence? -No, we're not using them. | 0:20:56 | 0:20:59 | |
We have to be careful about completely exposing our case. | 0:20:59 | 0:21:02 | |
I mean, what we say about Colin Ash-Smith, this is the evidence. | 0:21:02 | 0:21:05 | |
And these are some of the witnesses who will help us. | 0:21:05 | 0:21:07 | |
But we don't have to prove definitely how he got back to his car. | 0:21:07 | 0:21:10 | |
We don't have to provide a whole story. | 0:21:10 | 0:21:12 | |
-We don't know how he got back to his car. -No. | 0:21:12 | 0:21:14 | |
We suggest that that's a way. | 0:21:14 | 0:21:16 | |
Yeah. That's not... | 0:21:16 | 0:21:18 | |
Sure, the murderer did go somewhere. | 0:21:18 | 0:21:20 | |
It is possible that it is another man who has perpetrated | 0:21:22 | 0:21:26 | |
the attack on Charlotte Barnard two and a half years later, | 0:21:26 | 0:21:28 | |
in exactly the same way, entirely motiveless, with a knife, | 0:21:28 | 0:21:31 | |
having moved in front of the girl he was about to attack, | 0:21:31 | 0:21:35 | |
about 200 yards away. | 0:21:35 | 0:21:36 | |
It's possible that it's another man. | 0:21:36 | 0:21:39 | |
But the more you look at it, and the more you put your case together, | 0:21:39 | 0:21:42 | |
the more we considered, actually, | 0:21:42 | 0:21:44 | |
Colin Ash-Smith did kill Claire Tiltman. | 0:21:44 | 0:21:47 | |
That's the reality. Do we have sufficient evidence? | 0:21:47 | 0:21:49 | |
Well, yes, I think we do. He'll never admit it. | 0:21:49 | 0:21:51 | |
And it'll go to full trial, I've no doubt. | 0:21:51 | 0:21:54 | |
Following press coverage of Keith Cavendish-Coulson being charged | 0:21:58 | 0:22:01 | |
with indecent assault, more pupils from the preparatory school where | 0:22:01 | 0:22:05 | |
he taught French in the 1970s have been to the police to make reports. | 0:22:05 | 0:22:09 | |
The defendant has now been charged with a number of other offences | 0:22:23 | 0:22:27 | |
involving other complainants, and then... | 0:22:27 | 0:22:30 | |
How many more complainants? | 0:22:30 | 0:22:31 | |
-13, I think. -Yeah. | 0:22:31 | 0:22:34 | |
13 more? Because didn't we have... | 0:22:34 | 0:22:36 | |
-presumably coincidentally 13 before? -Yeah. | 0:22:36 | 0:22:39 | |
-So we've now got 26. -Yeah. | 0:22:39 | 0:22:42 | |
Presumably the idea being that we'll link those 13 into the trial, the October trial? | 0:22:42 | 0:22:48 | |
-No. There's going to be two trials. -Yeah. | 0:22:48 | 0:22:51 | |
The victims who have suffered the greatest impact | 0:22:51 | 0:22:55 | |
are in the first indictment, | 0:22:55 | 0:22:57 | |
so they don't have to wait for the second trial to give their evidence. | 0:22:57 | 0:23:00 | |
Right. | 0:23:00 | 0:23:02 | |
The hope is that if trial number one does go for full trial | 0:23:02 | 0:23:06 | |
and he's convicted, the hope is trial two, | 0:23:06 | 0:23:09 | |
he'll just see sense and plead guilty. | 0:23:09 | 0:23:12 | |
So with a bit of luck those complainants will never have to give evidence. | 0:23:12 | 0:23:17 | |
If he's acquitted in trial number one, | 0:23:17 | 0:23:20 | |
we just need to regroup, don't we? | 0:23:20 | 0:23:22 | |
-And consider our position, cos it's the same defence. -Yeah. | 0:23:22 | 0:23:25 | |
But we've got quite a lot of evidence as well as all | 0:23:25 | 0:23:28 | |
-these people saying the same thing. -Yeah. | 0:23:28 | 0:23:31 | |
And what's he going to do? | 0:23:31 | 0:23:32 | |
Sit there for eight weeks and listen to that? | 0:23:32 | 0:23:34 | |
He needs to really be thinking about his position now. | 0:23:34 | 0:23:38 | |
The longer he pleads not guilty and won't plead, | 0:23:38 | 0:23:40 | |
the worse it is for complainants. | 0:23:40 | 0:23:42 | |
-The worse it is for him. -And the longer sentence he gets. | 0:23:42 | 0:23:46 | |
But you imagine that he's got no care for the complainants anyway, | 0:23:46 | 0:23:49 | |
really, wouldn't you? | 0:23:49 | 0:23:51 | |
In that this is just dragging on. | 0:23:51 | 0:23:54 | |
-Anyway... -It's serial offending, isn't it? | 0:23:56 | 0:24:00 | |
Colin Ash-Smith has now served 19 years of his life sentence | 0:24:02 | 0:24:07 | |
and has applied for parole. | 0:24:07 | 0:24:09 | |
That hearing will not take place | 0:24:09 | 0:24:11 | |
until after he goes on trial charged with the murder of Claire Tiltman. | 0:24:11 | 0:24:15 | |
Five and a half weeks before the trial begins, | 0:24:15 | 0:24:18 | |
the prosecution have a conference to make sure they're ready. | 0:24:18 | 0:24:22 | |
Do you want to go through page by page, Brian? | 0:24:22 | 0:24:25 | |
No, because I think that would take us forever to do. | 0:24:25 | 0:24:28 | |
The CPS have instructed Brian Altman QC | 0:24:28 | 0:24:30 | |
to lead the team that will present their case in court. | 0:24:30 | 0:24:34 | |
Brian Altman QC is one of the leading barristers in the country. | 0:24:34 | 0:24:38 | |
I used to brief him as a barrister many kind of years ago | 0:24:38 | 0:24:41 | |
when I used to run the Old Bailey murder unit. | 0:24:41 | 0:24:45 | |
And he's just the type of barrister you would want for a case like this, | 0:24:45 | 0:24:48 | |
as he's able to bring all the circumstantial evidence, | 0:24:48 | 0:24:51 | |
tie it together and present a very compelling case for the prosecution. | 0:24:51 | 0:24:56 | |
We're not talking about the type of killer, | 0:24:56 | 0:24:59 | |
or man who attempts to kill, | 0:24:59 | 0:25:02 | |
who plunges the knife in once, twice, and runs off. | 0:25:02 | 0:25:06 | |
Actually, it's frenzied. | 0:25:06 | 0:25:08 | |
We've got, in Claire's case, front and back. | 0:25:08 | 0:25:11 | |
Charlotte, I think it was front and back as well. | 0:25:11 | 0:25:14 | |
So, you know, there is a similarity there. | 0:25:14 | 0:25:17 | |
It's an unusual, rare event. | 0:25:17 | 0:25:19 | |
Frenzied, quick, rapid, | 0:25:19 | 0:25:21 | |
planned and ostensibly not sexually motivated, | 0:25:21 | 0:25:24 | |
which is actually a fairly exceptional feature, I think. | 0:25:24 | 0:25:28 | |
And of course within a few hundred yards of each other. | 0:25:28 | 0:25:31 | |
And apart from all the other similarities. All right. | 0:25:31 | 0:25:35 | |
It's not just the details of the knife attacks | 0:25:35 | 0:25:37 | |
on Colin Ash-Smith's other victims that the prosecution | 0:25:37 | 0:25:40 | |
want included in their bad character application. | 0:25:40 | 0:25:44 | |
They also want the judge to allow the jury to hear about other similarities. | 0:25:44 | 0:25:48 | |
We say that in four separate occasions when he attacked someone, | 0:25:48 | 0:25:51 | |
he always gives a false alibi. | 0:25:51 | 0:25:55 | |
The morning after Claire was murdered | 0:25:55 | 0:25:57 | |
and the call for witnesses put out, | 0:25:57 | 0:25:58 | |
Colin Ash-Smith rang the police. | 0:25:58 | 0:26:00 | |
So he's setting up his alibi. | 0:26:12 | 0:26:14 | |
And he's doing that because sooner or later somebody might say | 0:26:14 | 0:26:17 | |
"Oh, I saw Ash-Smith up near the newsagent." | 0:26:17 | 0:26:20 | |
It's what he always does, he gets in early. | 0:26:20 | 0:26:22 | |
But he makes a big mistake. | 0:26:22 | 0:26:24 | |
He says 6:30, and that's just not the right time. | 0:26:24 | 0:26:28 | |
Six days later, the police visited Colin Ash-Smith | 0:26:28 | 0:26:32 | |
to record his written witness statement. | 0:26:32 | 0:26:34 | |
6:30 is after the murder. | 0:26:34 | 0:26:36 | |
It's no use talking about what happened after the murder, so he changes it. | 0:26:36 | 0:26:40 | |
Was it a man or was it a woman? | 0:26:46 | 0:26:48 | |
"I don't really know and I can't really give a description." | 0:26:48 | 0:26:51 | |
What's the point of that? | 0:26:51 | 0:26:52 | |
And it's really important for the bad character perspective | 0:26:52 | 0:26:55 | |
to understand the reason that it's so important | 0:26:55 | 0:26:57 | |
is that he keeps doing that. | 0:26:57 | 0:26:59 | |
And if it isn't him, then how extraordinarily coincidental | 0:26:59 | 0:27:03 | |
is that that he keeps doing it? Why does he do it? | 0:27:03 | 0:27:06 | |
And funnily enough, the description that he gives, | 0:27:06 | 0:27:08 | |
if it's a description of anyone it's a description of Claire. Amazingly. | 0:27:08 | 0:27:11 | |
Because he just says, | 0:27:11 | 0:27:13 | |
"Oh, it could have been a female. longish hair down to shoulder. | 0:27:13 | 0:27:15 | |
He's really giving a description of a girl. | 0:27:15 | 0:27:17 | |
It's quite difficult if you're asked to give a description which | 0:27:17 | 0:27:20 | |
you know is going to be false to actually give a false description. | 0:27:20 | 0:27:23 | |
What you would often do is just focus on somebody you know, | 0:27:23 | 0:27:25 | |
not that I'm a master criminal who does that sort of thing, but I think | 0:27:25 | 0:27:28 | |
you would probably focus on somebody you know and give that description. | 0:27:28 | 0:27:31 | |
Otherwise you could be caught out later on in a police interview, | 0:27:31 | 0:27:34 | |
if you can't remember what description you've given. | 0:27:34 | 0:27:37 | |
So I think what happens is that he gives a description of somebody | 0:27:37 | 0:27:40 | |
and only person's whose description he's given if it's of anyone, | 0:27:40 | 0:27:43 | |
is of Claire. | 0:27:43 | 0:27:44 | |
The CPS' handling of non-recent sex abuse cases | 0:27:46 | 0:27:49 | |
is often highly controversial. | 0:27:49 | 0:27:52 | |
The month before Keith Cavendish-Coulson goes on trial, | 0:27:52 | 0:27:55 | |
Claire and Janet have come to London for a meeting with | 0:27:55 | 0:27:58 | |
the Director of Public Prosecutions. | 0:27:58 | 0:28:00 | |
I'm ultimately responsible for all cases that go through the CPS. | 0:28:00 | 0:28:04 | |
But when we have case management panels | 0:28:04 | 0:28:07 | |
we have criteria which will say, "Are they very serious cases? | 0:28:07 | 0:28:10 | |
"Are the trials going to last a long time? | 0:28:10 | 0:28:12 | |
"Are there particularly vulnerable, sensitive victims and witnesses? | 0:28:12 | 0:28:16 | |
"Is there going to be lots of press interest in it?" For example. | 0:28:16 | 0:28:20 | |
And those are the cases that will come in for a case management panel. | 0:28:20 | 0:28:23 | |
So it's really around making sure that these cases are dealt with properly. | 0:28:23 | 0:28:27 | |
Sorry, we're almost late. | 0:28:27 | 0:28:29 | |
No, no, no. You ARE late. | 0:28:29 | 0:28:30 | |
-You're not almost. You are. -THEY LAUGH | 0:28:30 | 0:28:33 | |
A problem with the trains, I gather. So... | 0:28:33 | 0:28:36 | |
Do you want to just give us | 0:28:36 | 0:28:37 | |
a very quick sort of run through of the brief facts? | 0:28:37 | 0:28:41 | |
It is a number of complaints, | 0:28:41 | 0:28:45 | |
non-recent complaints of indecent assault against the defendant, | 0:28:45 | 0:28:48 | |
who was formerly a teacher at a private preparatory school in Cheshire. | 0:28:48 | 0:28:54 | |
A boarding school for boys under the age of 13. | 0:28:54 | 0:28:57 | |
-OK. So total number of complainants now is about 20... -26. -26. | 0:28:57 | 0:29:03 | |
Because they took place so long ago, quite often evidence that you | 0:29:03 | 0:29:07 | |
would have had, had you been able to get to the | 0:29:07 | 0:29:10 | |
scene of the offending earlier, of course that's no longer there. | 0:29:10 | 0:29:13 | |
People's memories, if it's 20 years ago as opposed to two weeks ago, | 0:29:13 | 0:29:18 | |
will be very different, but we will also go back and look | 0:29:18 | 0:29:21 | |
at things like, are there other witnesses we can get who saw people | 0:29:21 | 0:29:24 | |
at particular times that can support the victim and their allegations? | 0:29:24 | 0:29:30 | |
-So the size of the case served evidence is quite substantial? -Yes. | 0:29:30 | 0:29:35 | |
And I presume you've got some school records stuff because certainly | 0:29:35 | 0:29:38 | |
some of the parents made complaints to the school, didn't they? | 0:29:38 | 0:29:41 | |
-Yes, and we've got... -He was eventually dismissed or...? -He was. | 0:29:41 | 0:29:44 | |
Well, arrangements were made for him to be let go, | 0:29:44 | 0:29:46 | |
if you like, yes, by the headmaster of the school. | 0:29:46 | 0:29:49 | |
So we've got evidence from that headmaster, | 0:29:49 | 0:29:52 | |
and we've got evidence from parents at the school. | 0:29:52 | 0:29:54 | |
Excellent. That's good. | 0:29:54 | 0:29:55 | |
And I presume his defence case statement was no more than, | 0:29:55 | 0:29:58 | |
"Never happened." | 0:29:58 | 0:30:00 | |
No. Fairly standard, isn't it, really? | 0:30:00 | 0:30:02 | |
And there's been nothing from them in relation to sort of medical | 0:30:02 | 0:30:05 | |
or anything like that or | 0:30:05 | 0:30:06 | |
bearing in mind as well his age, that sort of thing? No? | 0:30:06 | 0:30:10 | |
-No, cos how old is he now? Is he 70? -71. | 0:30:10 | 0:30:13 | |
No, seems to be completely compos mentis, doesn't he? | 0:30:13 | 0:30:18 | |
Age in itself isn't a bar to prosecution. | 0:30:18 | 0:30:21 | |
It's more around do they have any mental issues, | 0:30:21 | 0:30:24 | |
will they understand what's happening? | 0:30:24 | 0:30:26 | |
And sometimes they may be so ill that we do have to make | 0:30:26 | 0:30:29 | |
a judgment about whether it's in the public interest to prosecute. | 0:30:29 | 0:30:32 | |
And whether they'll be able to stand trial, | 0:30:32 | 0:30:34 | |
whether they'll understand the whole process. | 0:30:34 | 0:30:36 | |
Is there anything in relation to any of the individuals that might | 0:30:36 | 0:30:39 | |
lead to a specific attack on them? | 0:30:39 | 0:30:41 | |
The character of the victims? | 0:30:41 | 0:30:43 | |
-No. -They're all professional people, living all over the country. | 0:30:43 | 0:30:46 | |
None of them have any previous convictions or health issues | 0:30:46 | 0:30:50 | |
that would give rise to a concern about vulnerability | 0:30:50 | 0:30:54 | |
and an attack on that basis. | 0:30:54 | 0:30:56 | |
And certainly the defence haven't raised any issue so far. | 0:30:56 | 0:30:59 | |
Although I accept that that's | 0:30:59 | 0:31:01 | |
very often something that waits until the trial. | 0:31:01 | 0:31:03 | |
In the years following Claire Tiltman's murder, | 0:31:06 | 0:31:09 | |
the case was never closed. | 0:31:09 | 0:31:11 | |
After her mother died in 2008, her father kept campaigning. | 0:31:12 | 0:31:17 | |
Never given up hope. | 0:31:17 | 0:31:18 | |
Never. Never have done, never will do. | 0:31:18 | 0:31:22 | |
But she would have been 30 now, so. | 0:31:22 | 0:31:24 | |
Yeah it's... Yeah, she was a good kid, really was. | 0:31:25 | 0:31:29 | |
I miss her to bits. | 0:31:29 | 0:31:30 | |
He died in 2012 before Colin Ash-Smith was charged | 0:31:32 | 0:31:36 | |
and the campaign to keep the case in the public eye | 0:31:36 | 0:31:39 | |
was taken over by a group of Claire's school friends. | 0:31:39 | 0:31:42 | |
Tilt was just someone really, really fun, | 0:31:42 | 0:31:46 | |
galvanised people together, had lots of different friends. | 0:31:46 | 0:31:49 | |
I always remember afterwards that she was portrayed as this | 0:31:49 | 0:31:52 | |
very goody-goody, two-shoes grammar school girl. | 0:31:52 | 0:31:55 | |
She was so far away from that. | 0:31:55 | 0:31:57 | |
She was nothing like that at all. | 0:31:57 | 0:31:59 | |
She was real good fun and just someone that always, | 0:31:59 | 0:32:02 | |
always made you laugh, that's what I always remember. | 0:32:02 | 0:32:04 | |
-Had a really good laugh. -Superb sense of humour. | 0:32:04 | 0:32:07 | |
She definitely got her sense of humour from Cliff | 0:32:07 | 0:32:10 | |
and Cliff totally doted on her. | 0:32:10 | 0:32:12 | |
As a 15, 16-year-old, your parents aren't always the people that | 0:32:12 | 0:32:16 | |
you're closest to at that time, by far. | 0:32:16 | 0:32:18 | |
-They were all just best friends. -Yeah. | 0:32:18 | 0:32:21 | |
Very, very close unit, had a lot of respect and thought | 0:32:21 | 0:32:24 | |
so much of her parents. | 0:32:24 | 0:32:26 | |
Now, almost 22 years after Claire's death, the prosecution | 0:32:26 | 0:32:30 | |
are going to try and prove Colin Ash-Smith is guilty of her murder. | 0:32:30 | 0:32:34 | |
Some people look at this case | 0:32:34 | 0:32:35 | |
and say, "I don't know what you're doing, Nigel. | 0:32:35 | 0:32:38 | |
"You haven't got a case here." Because it's a circumstantial case. | 0:32:38 | 0:32:41 | |
There's no direct evidence in the case to say that Colin Ash-Smith | 0:32:41 | 0:32:43 | |
was responsible but yet the case is overwhelming, in our view. | 0:32:43 | 0:32:47 | |
It doesn't quite take a leap of faith cos that's not | 0:32:47 | 0:32:50 | |
part of the Code for Crown Prosecutors. | 0:32:50 | 0:32:52 | |
But you have to take a view that, if we look at all the case | 0:32:52 | 0:32:54 | |
together, do we have a case that could succeed? | 0:32:54 | 0:32:57 | |
The problem with that is that many people would disagree. | 0:32:57 | 0:33:00 | |
So you put 10 lawyers in a room and some agree with me | 0:33:00 | 0:33:02 | |
and some would not. | 0:33:02 | 0:33:04 | |
But at the end of the day, it's just about judgment. | 0:33:04 | 0:33:08 | |
For two days, the judge considers | 0:33:10 | 0:33:12 | |
whether to allow the prosecution to use details | 0:33:12 | 0:33:14 | |
of Colin Ash-Smith's other offences as evidence of bad character. | 0:33:14 | 0:33:18 | |
He decides in the prosecution's favour and the trial can now begin. | 0:33:20 | 0:33:24 | |
It's taken an awful lot of hard work from a lot of people from all the | 0:33:26 | 0:33:29 | |
organisations to get this to where it is, unrelenting over the years, | 0:33:29 | 0:33:33 | |
try, try, try again, try something different, try something new. | 0:33:33 | 0:33:36 | |
Do you know I think it does mean a lot to the officers working on it. | 0:33:38 | 0:33:42 | |
And the additional tragedies of her parents that are now both | 0:33:42 | 0:33:45 | |
deceased, who aren't here hopefully to see justice. | 0:33:45 | 0:33:48 | |
So that moment when you know the trial is just about to start, | 0:33:48 | 0:33:51 | |
it's quite an emotional thing. | 0:33:51 | 0:33:53 | |
The opening in my estimation is probably the most important | 0:33:55 | 0:33:59 | |
thing that any prosecuting counsel can do. | 0:33:59 | 0:34:01 | |
It's the old thing, isn't it? | 0:34:03 | 0:34:04 | |
You tell them what you're going to tell them, | 0:34:04 | 0:34:06 | |
you tell them it and then you tell them what you've told them. | 0:34:06 | 0:34:09 | |
And you give them a sound bite, | 0:34:09 | 0:34:11 | |
something that they're going to remember about the case - | 0:34:11 | 0:34:15 | |
senseless slaughter, motiveless, remorseless, savage, brutal. | 0:34:15 | 0:34:19 | |
I'm afraid they're all adjectives and adverbs | 0:34:19 | 0:34:21 | |
which we have used down the ages, but it grabs people. | 0:34:21 | 0:34:25 | |
And I use my mannerisms | 0:34:25 | 0:34:26 | |
and I use my gestures in such a way that they will understand this is an | 0:34:26 | 0:34:31 | |
important, really important point. Perhaps that's not so important. | 0:34:31 | 0:34:35 | |
And at times you'll see that I deliberately drop my voice. | 0:34:35 | 0:34:38 | |
That's cos I want them to strain to listen to what I'm about to say. | 0:34:38 | 0:34:41 | |
And other times, I'll really raise my voice. | 0:34:41 | 0:34:43 | |
And all of that, I'm afraid, is entirely deliberate. | 0:34:43 | 0:34:46 | |
Not because I'm playing a game. Far from it. | 0:34:46 | 0:34:49 | |
And not because I'm trying to embark on an Oscar-winning performance, | 0:34:49 | 0:34:52 | |
I'm not. | 0:34:52 | 0:34:54 | |
It's because I have a job to do. | 0:34:54 | 0:34:56 | |
And my job as an advocate is to persuade. | 0:34:56 | 0:34:58 | |
And if I can't persuade them on the basis of this opening, | 0:34:58 | 0:35:02 | |
then I'm not doing my job. | 0:35:02 | 0:35:04 | |
The position is that we're not being contradicted, nobody's objecting | 0:35:32 | 0:35:35 | |
to anything we're saying so it's our best chance to put our case forward. | 0:35:35 | 0:35:38 | |
But hereafter, our case will come under scrutiny, because the | 0:35:38 | 0:35:42 | |
defence will be cross-examining our witnesses and putting their case. | 0:35:42 | 0:35:46 | |
They haven't put anything of their case yet. | 0:35:46 | 0:35:48 | |
All that's happened so far is that he's said he's not guilty. | 0:35:48 | 0:35:50 | |
Over seven days, 19 witnesses will be presented by the prosecution | 0:35:52 | 0:35:56 | |
and then cross-examined. | 0:35:56 | 0:35:58 | |
The evidence of a further 88 people, some now deceased, | 0:35:58 | 0:36:02 | |
will also be read to the jury. | 0:36:02 | 0:36:03 | |
One of the key witnesses is part of the prosecution's new evidence. | 0:36:05 | 0:36:08 | |
He's a friend Colin Ash-Smith made in prison. | 0:36:08 | 0:36:11 | |
Monday we have a man to whom we say Ash-Smith confessed | 0:36:13 | 0:36:18 | |
aspects of what he had done in prison, 10 or so years ago, | 0:36:18 | 0:36:23 | |
which will be interesting. | 0:36:23 | 0:36:25 | |
Of course Dubois assumed he was talking about the offence | 0:36:40 | 0:36:43 | |
that Colin Ash-Smith was in prison for. | 0:36:43 | 0:36:45 | |
But when you know the case and you know the detail of the case, | 0:36:45 | 0:36:48 | |
there wasn't a zebra crossing in that case at all. | 0:36:48 | 0:36:51 | |
It didn't feature. | 0:36:51 | 0:36:52 | |
But when you know the Claire Tiltman murder case, it is | 0:36:52 | 0:36:55 | |
really quite relevant because Colin Ash-Smith had phoned in | 0:36:55 | 0:36:58 | |
on the day after, mentioned a zebra crossing, seeing somebody on there. | 0:36:58 | 0:37:02 | |
The story, as we believe it, was that actually | 0:37:02 | 0:37:04 | |
he has seen Claire Tiltman in that area, in that location where he was. | 0:37:04 | 0:37:09 | |
So that piece of evidence is really, really powerful | 0:37:09 | 0:37:12 | |
because it isn't a straight confession. | 0:37:12 | 0:37:14 | |
It isn't "I did it", and you can make comment on that, that maybe | 0:37:14 | 0:37:18 | |
that could be bravado about something. | 0:37:18 | 0:37:20 | |
It's something that didn't mean an awful lot. | 0:37:20 | 0:37:22 | |
It didn't mean anything to Dubois. | 0:37:22 | 0:37:24 | |
And the other dynamic is that he's still friends with | 0:37:24 | 0:37:26 | |
Colin Ash-Smith, and when the prosecution case is served, | 0:37:26 | 0:37:30 | |
Colin Ash-Smith gets a copy of Dubois' statement. | 0:37:30 | 0:37:32 | |
He then makes a phone call from prison into Dubois | 0:37:32 | 0:37:36 | |
and then introduces this whole business of the zebra | 0:37:36 | 0:37:39 | |
crossing in that phone call. | 0:37:39 | 0:37:41 | |
I've seen the evidence they think they have | 0:37:41 | 0:37:44 | |
and I'm wondering why I'm still here actually, to be honest. | 0:37:44 | 0:37:46 | |
-Right. -I even saw your statement actually. There's nothing in there. | 0:37:46 | 0:37:49 | |
You knew me in prison. So what? | 0:37:49 | 0:37:51 | |
Yeah. I knew you in prison. We talked about a couple of things. | 0:37:51 | 0:37:54 | |
I can't remember if they were related to any offence or not. | 0:37:54 | 0:37:56 | |
Well, the thing is, | 0:37:56 | 0:37:57 | |
they said you'd mentioned like a pedestrian crossing. | 0:37:57 | 0:38:01 | |
That day when I was arrested, I went probably about through 50 of them. | 0:38:01 | 0:38:05 | |
-A-ha! -You know what I mean? | 0:38:06 | 0:38:08 | |
They're trying to link it to the one, this thing, you know. | 0:38:08 | 0:38:11 | |
Yeah, yeah, yeah. The 20-year-old case, yeah. | 0:38:11 | 0:38:14 | |
You know, she said I got upset at a pedestrian crossing probably. | 0:38:14 | 0:38:19 | |
I got upset at a lot of things back then. | 0:38:19 | 0:38:21 | |
You know, it's quite comical when I look at it. | 0:38:21 | 0:38:23 | |
It's not... It's a serious thing but I've sort looked through | 0:38:23 | 0:38:26 | |
the statements and their evidence and stuff and think, "is that it?" | 0:38:26 | 0:38:30 | |
-You know... -There's nothing there. | 0:38:30 | 0:38:33 | |
There's nothing there that relates to this offence. There's nothing. | 0:38:33 | 0:38:36 | |
Well, why's he picking out that particular bit of information? | 0:38:36 | 0:38:39 | |
Well, the reason is | 0:38:39 | 0:38:41 | |
because it's extremely relevant to what happened on that day. | 0:38:41 | 0:38:45 | |
And we would say he was talking about Claire Tiltman on that day. | 0:38:45 | 0:38:48 | |
That's exactly what happened. | 0:38:48 | 0:38:49 | |
That fits into exactly what the whole case is | 0:38:49 | 0:38:52 | |
and that's what makes it so powerful. | 0:38:52 | 0:38:54 | |
Keith Cavendish-Coulson is facing 42 counts of indecent | 0:39:08 | 0:39:12 | |
assault on boys he taught during the 1970s and '80s. | 0:39:12 | 0:39:15 | |
Today he is expected to appear in Chester Crown Court | 0:39:16 | 0:39:19 | |
for a plea and case management hearing. | 0:39:19 | 0:39:22 | |
It's not an easy thing for people to come forward | 0:39:22 | 0:39:25 | |
and make these complaints. | 0:39:25 | 0:39:27 | |
And part of the reason that they make complaints to the police | 0:39:27 | 0:39:30 | |
is they want to see justice done. | 0:39:30 | 0:39:32 | |
But it won't be an easy process. They will have to give evidence. | 0:39:32 | 0:39:35 | |
They will have to be cross-examined about the allegations. | 0:39:35 | 0:39:38 | |
The defendant's version of events will be put to them | 0:39:38 | 0:39:42 | |
quite robustly by those representing him. | 0:39:42 | 0:39:45 | |
And it is a high burden of proof. | 0:39:45 | 0:39:47 | |
And so, very often there are cases where they may think, well, | 0:39:47 | 0:39:51 | |
some of that's right and some of what the defendant says is right | 0:39:51 | 0:39:54 | |
and the truth probably lies somewhere in the middle, | 0:39:54 | 0:39:57 | |
so we can't be sure. | 0:39:57 | 0:39:58 | |
So we've got to find the defendant not guilty. | 0:39:58 | 0:40:01 | |
And it doesn't necessarily mean the complainant must have been lying | 0:40:01 | 0:40:05 | |
and what the defendant says is completely true, | 0:40:05 | 0:40:08 | |
which I think sometimes is the public perception. | 0:40:08 | 0:40:11 | |
Due to earlier cases in the day over-running, Cavendish-Coulson | 0:40:11 | 0:40:15 | |
hasn't actually had the charges read to him in court. | 0:40:15 | 0:40:18 | |
But there is a development. | 0:40:18 | 0:40:19 | |
-PHONE RINGS -'Hello?' | 0:40:19 | 0:40:22 | |
Hi, Claire, it's Janet. The defendant's appeared. | 0:40:22 | 0:40:26 | |
He's not actually been arraigned. Although... | 0:40:26 | 0:40:29 | |
-'Oh, no.' -I know. | 0:40:29 | 0:40:31 | |
Although the defence have indicated that he's going to plead guilty. | 0:40:31 | 0:40:35 | |
'Did he indicate that in open court?' | 0:40:35 | 0:40:37 | |
Yes, he's indicated it in open court. | 0:40:37 | 0:40:40 | |
His counsel has confirmed that he's got signed instructions | 0:40:40 | 0:40:44 | |
to that effect, | 0:40:44 | 0:40:45 | |
and that there is no dispute with any of the prosecution evidence | 0:40:45 | 0:40:51 | |
and there is no basis of plea. | 0:40:51 | 0:40:53 | |
Apparently he's having everything. No basis of plea. | 0:40:53 | 0:40:58 | |
No issue with any complainant. So it's a full hands up. | 0:40:58 | 0:41:02 | |
Is that a likely custodial sentence? | 0:41:02 | 0:41:04 | |
I think so. Coming his way. | 0:41:04 | 0:41:06 | |
I know. | 0:41:06 | 0:41:07 | |
-How old is he? -Erm, I think he's 70, 71. | 0:41:07 | 0:41:12 | |
Finish his last days in prison maybe. Oh, dear. | 0:41:13 | 0:41:18 | |
Yeah, probably. | 0:41:18 | 0:41:20 | |
-That's a fantastic result for us. -I know. I'm really pleased. | 0:41:20 | 0:41:22 | |
Absolutely fantastic. | 0:41:22 | 0:41:24 | |
It's been a year's work actually. So really good. | 0:41:24 | 0:41:27 | |
Keith Cavendish-Coulson finally does appear in court | 0:41:29 | 0:41:32 | |
to enter his plea to the charges against him. | 0:41:32 | 0:41:35 | |
Everyone's done so much work on the case, I thought I'd go in and | 0:41:47 | 0:41:49 | |
listen to the words "guilty" 42 times, | 0:41:49 | 0:41:52 | |
as it happened in this scenario. | 0:41:52 | 0:41:55 | |
He, erm, queried one of them. | 0:41:55 | 0:41:59 | |
Said he didn't know the person and then seemed to change his mind, | 0:41:59 | 0:42:02 | |
so a great feeling of relief, to be honest. | 0:42:02 | 0:42:05 | |
And then two of the victims | 0:42:06 | 0:42:08 | |
of course gave Victim Personal Statements, | 0:42:08 | 0:42:11 | |
which means they are reading out to the court | 0:42:11 | 0:42:14 | |
how the offences have affected them. | 0:42:14 | 0:42:17 | |
And gosh! It was upsetting, to be honest. | 0:42:17 | 0:42:21 | |
The one victim who read his statement out particularly | 0:42:54 | 0:42:57 | |
seemed almost that this was a cathartic exercise for him, I think. | 0:42:57 | 0:43:02 | |
Because over... I know it was the '70s, | 0:43:03 | 0:43:06 | |
but different authorities had let them down, sort of, | 0:43:06 | 0:43:11 | |
teaching professionals and the like, | 0:43:11 | 0:43:13 | |
and here was the criminal justice system | 0:43:13 | 0:43:16 | |
actually listening to what he had to say. | 0:43:16 | 0:43:19 | |
So, I think he felt that was quite cathartic, to be honest. | 0:43:19 | 0:43:23 | |
The judge has retired to consider the sentence he will impose. | 0:43:24 | 0:43:27 | |
At Inner London Crown Court, | 0:43:30 | 0:43:32 | |
the prosecution has finished presenting their case. | 0:43:32 | 0:43:35 | |
It's been all us so far. | 0:43:37 | 0:43:39 | |
Everybody in that court seemed convinced. | 0:43:39 | 0:43:41 | |
But as I've said to you, you've only heard our side of the story. | 0:43:41 | 0:43:43 | |
Now you will hear the defence's side of the story | 0:43:43 | 0:43:45 | |
and that might change the position. | 0:43:45 | 0:43:47 | |
Part of the defence case is to pin their colours to two other | 0:43:49 | 0:43:53 | |
individuals, one of whom, erm, is... | 0:43:53 | 0:43:58 | |
is and was a serial killer. | 0:43:58 | 0:44:00 | |
And another individual who killed his mother, a year or | 0:44:18 | 0:44:23 | |
so after Claire was killed, | 0:44:23 | 0:44:25 | |
in the local area, | 0:44:25 | 0:44:28 | |
leaving behind, erm, a note. | 0:44:28 | 0:44:31 | |
Course the one difference between us | 0:44:55 | 0:44:57 | |
is I have to prove it was his client. | 0:44:57 | 0:44:59 | |
He doesn't have to prove it was either of the other two. | 0:44:59 | 0:45:01 | |
He just has to put before the jury evidence, which if | 0:45:01 | 0:45:06 | |
they are unsure about it, means that they wouldn't convict this one. | 0:45:06 | 0:45:10 | |
Peter Rivers, if you look at the picture of Peter Rivers, | 0:45:10 | 0:45:13 | |
he's a middle aged man, quite large. | 0:45:13 | 0:45:15 | |
No description of that person is given anywhere near this. | 0:45:15 | 0:45:17 | |
He could have got to that place at 6:20 on the train. | 0:45:17 | 0:45:23 | |
But you know, the fact that we can't alibi him out causes us a problem. | 0:45:23 | 0:45:26 | |
But there's no DNA of him at the scene. | 0:45:26 | 0:45:29 | |
So there's nothing to suggest him apart from that note. | 0:45:29 | 0:45:31 | |
And myself and counsel have come to the view that we're quite | 0:45:31 | 0:45:34 | |
sure that that isn't a line that's going to go anywhere. | 0:45:34 | 0:45:37 | |
But it remains a highly unusual feature of the case that you | 0:45:37 | 0:45:40 | |
seem to have someone admitting it. | 0:45:40 | 0:45:41 | |
Of course, he committed suicide and that was a year later. | 0:45:41 | 0:45:44 | |
They're using it just to sow a little seed of doubt | 0:45:44 | 0:45:47 | |
but, er, we'll see. | 0:45:47 | 0:45:49 | |
Not the first time that defence counsel do that in cases like this. | 0:45:49 | 0:45:53 | |
The trial is now entering day 15. | 0:45:55 | 0:45:58 | |
It's been communicated to us today by the defence that they | 0:45:58 | 0:46:02 | |
have chosen to call their client, which is | 0:46:02 | 0:46:04 | |
the single biggest tactical decision they need to make. | 0:46:04 | 0:46:09 | |
The danger to them is that as soon as their client | 0:46:09 | 0:46:11 | |
goes into the witness box, they lose control. | 0:46:11 | 0:46:15 | |
At the moment, if there's a break, | 0:46:15 | 0:46:16 | |
they can have a discussion with their client. | 0:46:16 | 0:46:19 | |
As soon as he goes into that witness box, | 0:46:19 | 0:46:21 | |
he cannot say one word to his lawyers. | 0:46:21 | 0:46:24 | |
So, for the first time in this case, Colin Ash-Smith will be alone. | 0:46:24 | 0:46:28 | |
-Very much alone. -And at his most vulnerable. | 0:46:28 | 0:46:31 | |
He'll be very, very alone. | 0:46:31 | 0:46:33 | |
In interview when we asked him those questions all those years ago, | 0:46:33 | 0:46:37 | |
he chose not to answer any questions. | 0:46:37 | 0:46:40 | |
But now he's going to have to answer the questions | 0:46:40 | 0:46:42 | |
because he's not in a position to refuse to answer. | 0:46:42 | 0:46:45 | |
And I think we've got some very good questions to put to him. | 0:46:45 | 0:46:49 | |
There is a possibility I will be cross-examining him | 0:46:49 | 0:46:52 | |
for about two days. | 0:46:52 | 0:46:54 | |
But the most exceptional feature from his point of view is because | 0:46:54 | 0:46:58 | |
he pleaded guilty to both of those offences in 1996, he wasn't tried. | 0:46:58 | 0:47:02 | |
So, for him, stepping into the witness box will be a completely | 0:47:02 | 0:47:05 | |
novel experience. And sometimes, I think quite naively, | 0:47:05 | 0:47:08 | |
they think all they have to do is give their account | 0:47:08 | 0:47:10 | |
and everybody will believe them, that'll be the end of it. | 0:47:10 | 0:47:13 | |
That's not how it works. | 0:47:13 | 0:47:14 | |
So it will be a bit of a shock to him, I suspect, once I start on him. | 0:47:14 | 0:47:18 | |
The cross-examination of Colin Ash-Smith | 0:47:19 | 0:47:22 | |
begins on day 16 of the trial. | 0:47:22 | 0:47:24 | |
His house was searched on his arrest | 0:47:55 | 0:47:58 | |
and he wrote four plans. | 0:47:58 | 0:48:01 | |
"Number three, at an old people's home, | 0:48:01 | 0:48:04 | |
"total abysmal failure rather not talk about it." | 0:48:04 | 0:48:07 | |
I'm just coming out of court, not long. | 0:48:09 | 0:48:12 | |
I still don't actually know what to think. | 0:48:12 | 0:48:14 | |
Cos it's a very, very strange set of circumstances, this. | 0:48:14 | 0:48:18 | |
You've got somebody in the witness box, admitting | 0:48:18 | 0:48:22 | |
and talking about the most horrific things. | 0:48:22 | 0:48:24 | |
Even for hardened police officers that are here at the moment, | 0:48:31 | 0:48:34 | |
it's quite shocking the things that are coming out. | 0:48:34 | 0:48:37 | |
The writings that he put about a care home in Swanscombe. | 0:48:37 | 0:48:40 | |
It was complete disaster, as he wrote it, with no detail on it. | 0:48:40 | 0:48:44 | |
And you could have heard almost like an audible gasp in the court | 0:48:44 | 0:48:48 | |
when talking about breaking in, "Why were you doing it?" | 0:48:48 | 0:48:50 | |
"Oh, just to go in because I hadn't done it before." | 0:48:50 | 0:48:54 | |
"Did you have a knife with you?" "No, I didn't." | 0:48:54 | 0:48:56 | |
And he said, "but I had a crossbow". | 0:48:56 | 0:48:59 | |
And when he's talked about going out at night, undoubtedly | 0:49:01 | 0:49:04 | |
looking for victims, armed with knives, walking the streets | 0:49:04 | 0:49:07 | |
of that area, once, twice a week after his parents went to sleep. | 0:49:07 | 0:49:11 | |
This is a very, very dangerous man. | 0:49:11 | 0:49:13 | |
I think it's gone all right but it's for others to judge. | 0:49:13 | 0:49:16 | |
I'm actually coming to the important stuff. First thing tomorrow, Nigel. | 0:49:16 | 0:49:20 | |
Claire's old school friends have been in court throughout | 0:50:12 | 0:50:15 | |
the proceedings. | 0:50:15 | 0:50:16 | |
There's a beautiful thread through the whole thing, | 0:50:16 | 0:50:18 | |
it's all about that zebra crossing. | 0:50:18 | 0:50:20 | |
All roads lead to it. | 0:50:20 | 0:50:21 | |
And if I didn't get that across, I didn't do a good job. | 0:50:21 | 0:50:24 | |
We did want to give you a standing ovation actually. | 0:50:24 | 0:50:26 | |
We resisted the urge to stand up and clap. | 0:50:26 | 0:50:28 | |
We were expecting the jury to do it actually. | 0:50:28 | 0:50:31 | |
Can I just mention something about this afternoon? | 0:50:31 | 0:50:33 | |
You've all been very, very good but there will be a defence speech. | 0:50:33 | 0:50:36 | |
No rolling the eyes. | 0:50:36 | 0:50:39 | |
No tutting. Nothing like that. | 0:50:39 | 0:50:41 | |
It's just undignified. | 0:50:41 | 0:50:43 | |
The last thing I want is anybody excluded. | 0:50:43 | 0:50:46 | |
And you've all been great. | 0:50:46 | 0:50:48 | |
It's good to have the odd reminder because it's... | 0:50:48 | 0:50:50 | |
It does get hard, doesn't it? | 0:50:50 | 0:50:52 | |
It's automatic to do those things. | 0:50:52 | 0:50:54 | |
It's quite hard sitting there and not having... | 0:50:54 | 0:50:56 | |
You know, you have an emotional stake in the whole thing, | 0:50:56 | 0:50:59 | |
understandably. | 0:50:59 | 0:51:01 | |
But in so far as one can ever read a jury, I think it's gone all right. | 0:51:01 | 0:51:05 | |
I hope history doesn't say I'm wrong. | 0:51:05 | 0:51:07 | |
At Chester Crown Court, | 0:51:09 | 0:51:11 | |
the judge is due to sentence Keith Cavendish-Coulson, after | 0:51:11 | 0:51:14 | |
he pleaded guilty to 42 counts of indecent assault | 0:51:14 | 0:51:17 | |
in the '70s and '80s. | 0:51:17 | 0:51:19 | |
If you were sentencing today for offences today, | 0:51:20 | 0:51:24 | |
it would be 14 years. | 0:51:24 | 0:51:26 | |
But, although we're sentencing in modern times, | 0:51:26 | 0:51:31 | |
we've to sentence in relation to the regime that was in place | 0:51:31 | 0:51:35 | |
at the time, but not as a judge in that time would have sentenced. | 0:51:35 | 0:51:42 | |
So you've to apply the maximum sentence here, which is 10 years, | 0:51:42 | 0:51:46 | |
under the 1956 Act but then try and sentence it as best you can | 0:51:46 | 0:51:51 | |
within that regime, as a modern judge would sentence. | 0:51:51 | 0:51:55 | |
Not as a judge would have sentenced then. It's quite tricky actually. | 0:51:55 | 0:52:00 | |
Before sentencing, the judge describes the case as a shocking | 0:52:02 | 0:52:05 | |
episode of criminal sexual behaviour and comments that the sheer scale | 0:52:05 | 0:52:10 | |
of the offending with the number of offences and victims is truly awful. | 0:52:10 | 0:52:14 | |
Here he's just said, "I've read the pre-sentence report | 0:52:14 | 0:52:17 | |
"and the defendant, beyond his guilty plea, | 0:52:17 | 0:52:20 | |
"any other remorse is minimal. | 0:52:20 | 0:52:22 | |
"He attempts to justify his behaviour, | 0:52:23 | 0:52:25 | |
"saying it's what the boys wanted." | 0:52:25 | 0:52:27 | |
And that it's just a media storm. | 0:52:33 | 0:52:36 | |
That otherwise these victims would have forgotten | 0:52:36 | 0:52:39 | |
what had happened to them. | 0:52:39 | 0:52:40 | |
And the judge says, "For an intelligent man, | 0:52:40 | 0:52:43 | |
"this is an extraordinary statement and a highly revealing statement." | 0:52:43 | 0:52:47 | |
I think it is, actually. | 0:52:47 | 0:52:49 | |
He didn't seem to think that it would have had | 0:52:49 | 0:52:52 | |
an effect on his victims. | 0:52:52 | 0:52:55 | |
Maybe that just shows his psyche though, really, rather than | 0:52:55 | 0:52:57 | |
a lack of remorse, it's a lack of understanding or something. | 0:52:57 | 0:53:00 | |
Yes, it's a complete lack of empathy, isn't it. | 0:53:00 | 0:53:03 | |
He thought they should just have... | 0:53:03 | 0:53:05 | |
Got on with it. | 0:53:05 | 0:53:06 | |
..shut up and got on with it, which is quite remarkable really. | 0:53:06 | 0:53:11 | |
But clearly shows a lack of understanding | 0:53:11 | 0:53:14 | |
of why he's been prosecuted, even. | 0:53:14 | 0:53:17 | |
And then he's said, "Stand up Keith Cavendish-Coulson. | 0:53:19 | 0:53:22 | |
"I sentence you for a catalogue of shocking sexual abuse | 0:53:25 | 0:53:28 | |
"on a large scale, involving boys who should have been able to look | 0:53:28 | 0:53:31 | |
"to you to be treated with respect, rather than wholesale sexual abuse." | 0:53:31 | 0:53:37 | |
And then he said, | 0:53:38 | 0:53:39 | |
"All sentences will run concurrently making the total of six years | 0:53:39 | 0:53:43 | |
"and nine months, which in my judgment is the correct custodial | 0:53:43 | 0:53:47 | |
"sentence for the criminality revealed in this quite exceptional case." | 0:53:47 | 0:53:51 | |
That's it. Six years and nine months. | 0:53:53 | 0:53:55 | |
Sentences are a matter for the judge. | 0:53:56 | 0:54:00 | |
It's not really for us to, erm, | 0:54:00 | 0:54:03 | |
pass comment on it, erm... | 0:54:03 | 0:54:05 | |
to the public. | 0:54:05 | 0:54:08 | |
Our role is to prosecute, it's not to sentence. | 0:54:08 | 0:54:11 | |
At Inner London Crown Court on the 22nd day of the trial, | 0:54:14 | 0:54:17 | |
Colin Ash-Smith's defence team finish their closing speech. | 0:54:17 | 0:54:21 | |
The jury has now retired to consider their verdict. | 0:54:46 | 0:54:50 | |
You just don't know what word they're going to utter. | 0:54:50 | 0:54:53 | |
There's only one defendant and there's one count of murder | 0:54:53 | 0:54:56 | |
so it'll be over very, very quickly when the word is uttered. | 0:54:56 | 0:55:00 | |
And that'll mark a turning point in 21-plus years, | 0:55:02 | 0:55:06 | |
uttered in one word in a few seconds within a courtroom. | 0:55:06 | 0:55:09 | |
And when you're waiting for that, that does get you a bit. | 0:55:09 | 0:55:11 | |
Well, I hope it's one word, by the way. | 0:55:11 | 0:55:13 | |
And not two words! | 0:55:13 | 0:55:16 | |
HE LAUGHS | 0:55:16 | 0:55:17 | |
It'll be one word. One word. | 0:55:17 | 0:55:20 | |
It's very difficult because, you know, for us it's...it's a job. | 0:55:22 | 0:55:27 | |
We take a professional approach, we hope. | 0:55:27 | 0:55:29 | |
But we have invested time and to some extent emotion | 0:55:29 | 0:55:33 | |
into a case like this and so | 0:55:33 | 0:55:35 | |
inevitably you want it to go your way. | 0:55:35 | 0:55:39 | |
But in the meantime, we have other work to do. | 0:55:39 | 0:55:42 | |
That's what we do, as best we can. | 0:55:42 | 0:55:43 | |
Sometimes it's very difficult to focus | 0:55:43 | 0:55:46 | |
but you just fill in the time and you wait. | 0:55:46 | 0:55:48 | |
It takes the jury just over a day to come to a unanimous verdict. | 0:55:56 | 0:56:00 | |
They find Colin Ash-Smith guilty of the murder of Claire Tiltman. | 0:56:01 | 0:56:05 | |
The prosecution enjoys no victories and suffers no defeats, Mr Withers. | 0:56:08 | 0:56:13 | |
Justice has been done. | 0:56:13 | 0:56:15 | |
Yes. But it was a nice win on this occasion. | 0:56:15 | 0:56:20 | |
No, I'm absolutely delighted. | 0:56:21 | 0:56:24 | |
We're all delighted, I mean just to see their faces, | 0:56:24 | 0:56:27 | |
it makes it all worthwhile. | 0:56:27 | 0:56:29 | |
The last bit, it was critical, when you turned round | 0:56:29 | 0:56:31 | |
and they're all hugging each other and in tears. | 0:56:31 | 0:56:34 | |
Yeah, absolutely makes it all worthwhile. | 0:56:34 | 0:56:36 | |
It's incredibly emotional, especially in a case like this | 0:56:36 | 0:56:39 | |
where, you know, it's 22 years, and so much time passed | 0:56:39 | 0:56:43 | |
and so many people have invested so much time and effort in it. | 0:56:43 | 0:56:46 | |
And the family and the friends. | 0:56:46 | 0:56:47 | |
So, it's amazing when that happens and makes it all worth it. | 0:56:47 | 0:56:51 | |
The judge describes it as a brutal pre-meditated murder | 0:56:53 | 0:56:57 | |
of a much-loved child, | 0:56:57 | 0:56:59 | |
carried out for a feeling of power, and sentences | 0:56:59 | 0:57:02 | |
Colin Ash-Smith to life imprisonment with a minimum term of 21 years. | 0:57:02 | 0:57:07 | |
It's nearly 22 years since Claire was cruelly taken from us. | 0:57:11 | 0:57:15 | |
Today we finally know who murdered her | 0:57:15 | 0:57:18 | |
but we will never understand why. | 0:57:18 | 0:57:21 | |
But we should not be out here speaking with you today. | 0:57:21 | 0:57:24 | |
It should be Claire's parents, | 0:57:24 | 0:57:26 | |
Lin and Cliff, who both tragically died too soon, after trying to deal | 0:57:26 | 0:57:30 | |
with the devastating loss of their only child. | 0:57:30 | 0:57:33 | |
We will never get our friend back and we'll never forget her. | 0:57:39 | 0:57:43 | |
But now Claire and her beloved parents, Lin and Cliff, | 0:57:45 | 0:57:49 | |
can rest in peace, knowing that her murderer | 0:57:49 | 0:57:52 | |
has finally received his justice. | 0:57:52 | 0:57:55 | |
Thank you. | 0:57:55 | 0:57:56 | |
Anyway, there it is. That's it. That's the end of the case. | 0:58:03 | 0:58:07 | |
-Successful. -On to the next one. | 0:58:07 | 0:58:09 | |
On to the next one. | 0:58:09 | 0:58:10 | |
If you are interested in finding out more about the justice system | 0:58:15 | 0:58:18 | |
you can join in a simulated court case | 0:58:18 | 0:58:20 | |
from The Open University and reach your own verdict. | 0:58:20 | 0:58:23 | |
Go to bbc.co.uk/prosecutors | 0:58:24 | 0:58:27 | |
and follow the links to The Open University. | 0:58:27 | 0:58:30 |