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-Today, I'm going to tackle a subject -which is an important part... | 0:00:30 | 0:00:35 | |
-..of some people's faith... | 0:00:35 | 0:00:37 | |
-..but which is derided -as superstition by others. | 0:00:37 | 0:00:41 | |
-Saints and their relics -divided our country in the past. | 0:00:41 | 0:00:45 | |
-But I'm starting my journey on the -roadside in Barnes, South London. | 0:00:45 | 0:00:50 | |
-The past is another country, -as someone once said. | 0:00:51 | 0:00:55 | |
-They do things differently there. | 0:00:55 | 0:00:58 | |
-One of the different -aspects of our past... | 0:00:58 | 0:01:01 | |
-..that most of us -might find strange today... | 0:01:02 | 0:01:05 | |
-..is worshipping saints... | 0:01:05 | 0:01:07 | |
-..or going on pilgrimages to places -linked to their life or death. | 0:01:07 | 0:01:12 | |
-We wouldn't do that, would we? | 0:01:13 | 0:01:16 | |
-# Ride A White Swan # -T.Rex | 0:01:16 | 0:01:19 | |
-Marc Bolan, T Rex's singer, -died in this exact spot... | 0:01:19 | 0:01:23 | |
-..in a fatal car accident. | 0:01:23 | 0:01:26 | |
-# Like if you were a bird # | 0:01:26 | 0:01:28 | |
-Ever since, this place has drawn -pilgrims from all over the world. | 0:01:28 | 0:01:35 | |
-Maybe coming here to pay tribute... | 0:01:35 | 0:01:38 | |
-..makes them feel closer to the man. | 0:01:39 | 0:01:41 | |
-Marc Bolan isn't the only person -who evokes this kind of interest. | 0:01:42 | 0:01:47 | |
-Even objects touched -by famous people... | 0:01:48 | 0:01:52 | |
-..can exchange hands -for amazing prices in auctions. | 0:01:52 | 0:01:56 | |
-A lock of John Lennon's hair -sold for 24,000... | 0:01:56 | 0:01:59 | |
-..Elvis Presley's belt for 41,000. | 0:01:59 | 0:02:01 | |
-Even a sandwich -partly eaten by Britney Spears... | 0:02:01 | 0:02:05 | |
-..sold on eBay recently for 280. | 0:02:05 | 0:02:07 | |
-They're ordinary things. | 0:02:08 | 0:02:10 | |
-But an element of mystique -is attached to them... | 0:02:10 | 0:02:13 | |
-..because they belonged -to someone we admire. | 0:02:13 | 0:02:17 | |
-We call them memorabilia today. | 0:02:17 | 0:02:19 | |
-In the Middle Ages, -they would be relics. | 0:02:19 | 0:02:23 | |
-For Christians, a relic is something -that we can link to a saint's life. | 0:02:25 | 0:02:30 | |
-Saints were the rock stars -of the Middle Ages. | 0:02:31 | 0:02:36 | |
-I was raised in the Welsh -Nonconformist tradition... | 0:02:38 | 0:02:42 | |
-..so the idea of praying -at a shrine is very unfamiliar. | 0:02:43 | 0:02:48 | |
-Today, I'm going to try to -understand why saints and relics... | 0:02:49 | 0:02:54 | |
-..have been so important -in our spiritual tradition... | 0:02:54 | 0:02:59 | |
-..and still are for some today. | 0:02:59 | 0:03:01 | |
-I'm going to Scotland to see -how influential one saint was. | 0:03:02 | 0:03:07 | |
-This is the tomb of St Mungo. | 0:03:15 | 0:03:17 | |
-When he first came here -in the 6th century... | 0:03:17 | 0:03:21 | |
-..this whole area was open ground. | 0:03:21 | 0:03:24 | |
-He settled on the riverbank. | 0:03:24 | 0:03:27 | |
-He founded a church. | 0:03:27 | 0:03:29 | |
-In time, he became the bishop. | 0:03:29 | 0:03:31 | |
-He was so well loved -that when he died... | 0:03:31 | 0:03:35 | |
-..his grave became -a place of pilgrimage. | 0:03:36 | 0:03:40 | |
-Over the centuries, so many came -here to worship at Mungo's grave... | 0:03:42 | 0:03:47 | |
-..that the place grew to be -a small village, then a town... | 0:03:48 | 0:03:52 | |
-..then, eventually, a city. | 0:03:52 | 0:03:55 | |
-We're in that city, Glasgow, -Scotland's largest city. | 0:03:59 | 0:04:03 | |
-The M8, thundering past -over there, reminds us... | 0:04:04 | 0:04:08 | |
-..of all the human traffic -drawn here over the ages... | 0:04:08 | 0:04:12 | |
-..to this saint's tomb. | 0:04:12 | 0:04:14 | |
-There would be hardly anything here -if it weren't for St Mungo. | 0:04:14 | 0:04:19 | |
-We don't know much about Mungo. | 0:04:22 | 0:04:25 | |
-He came here in about 540. | 0:04:25 | 0:04:27 | |
-His real name -was Cyndeyrn, Kentigern. | 0:04:27 | 0:04:31 | |
-He spent time in Wales too -and founded a church in St Asaph. | 0:04:31 | 0:04:36 | |
-But his home was here -in the Old North. | 0:04:36 | 0:04:39 | |
-He got the nickname Munghu, -or Mungo, which means "dearest". | 0:04:40 | 0:04:45 | |
-The city where he died was -called "Clas gu", or Glasgow... | 0:04:46 | 0:04:51 | |
-..which means -a dear church community. | 0:04:52 | 0:04:55 | |
-The English poet Philip Larkin said -"What will survive of us is love." | 0:04:58 | 0:05:03 | |
-Nothing shows that -better than this place. | 0:05:03 | 0:05:06 | |
-Whatever we think -of relics and saints... | 0:05:06 | 0:05:09 | |
-..we can't dismiss -Scotland's largest city... | 0:05:09 | 0:05:13 | |
-..a lasting testimony -to people's love for St Mungo. | 0:05:13 | 0:05:17 | |
-Mungo's story is a gentle -introduction to the history... | 0:05:20 | 0:05:24 | |
-..and significance of saints. | 0:05:24 | 0:05:26 | |
-But some stories about saints -are truly terrifying. | 0:05:26 | 0:05:31 | |
-Maybe that's part of their appeal... | 0:05:32 | 0:05:35 | |
-..as we will see -in my next port of call. | 0:05:36 | 0:05:39 | |
-I'm in St Albans, the oldest place -of Christian pilgrimage in Britain. | 0:05:40 | 0:05:45 | |
-It's easy to understand -its historical appeal. | 0:05:46 | 0:05:49 | |
-It was the site -of the Roman town, Verulamium. | 0:05:49 | 0:05:52 | |
-Early in the 4th century, St Alban -was arrested by the Romans... | 0:05:52 | 0:05:57 | |
-..because of his faith. | 0:05:57 | 0:05:59 | |
-He was tried in a court and dragged -to the top of that hill... | 0:05:59 | 0:06:03 | |
-..to be publicly executed. | 0:06:04 | 0:06:06 | |
-To find out more about St Alban... | 0:06:12 | 0:06:14 | |
-..I've come to meet the Dean -of the cathedral, Jeffrey John. | 0:06:15 | 0:06:19 | |
-He lived in a time -of Christian persecution... | 0:06:20 | 0:06:25 | |
-..under the emperor Diocletian. | 0:06:25 | 0:06:28 | |
-He wasn't a Christian... | 0:06:29 | 0:06:31 | |
-..but he met a Christian priest... | 0:06:32 | 0:06:34 | |
-..who was fleeing -from the Roman army. | 0:06:35 | 0:06:38 | |
-Alban sheltered -the priest in his house. | 0:06:39 | 0:06:44 | |
-So he learnt about -Christianity from the priest. | 0:06:44 | 0:06:49 | |
-In time, the soldiers -came after the priest. | 0:06:49 | 0:06:55 | |
-But Alban exchanged -clothes with the priest. | 0:06:55 | 0:06:59 | |
-So the priest escaped -in Alban's cloak. | 0:07:00 | 0:07:05 | |
-But Alban was arrested. | 0:07:05 | 0:07:08 | |
-He was tried and found guilty. | 0:07:08 | 0:07:12 | |
-He was dragged up the hill... | 0:07:13 | 0:07:16 | |
-..where he was decapitated. | 0:07:17 | 0:07:19 | |
-He was buried here, -where the cathedral stands now. | 0:07:19 | 0:07:24 | |
-Over 1,700 years -after St Alban's execution... | 0:07:28 | 0:07:32 | |
-..pilgrims still come here -to worship at his shrine. | 0:07:32 | 0:07:37 | |
-But for many centuries, -this was not possible. | 0:07:37 | 0:07:42 | |
-This is an Anglican cathedral. | 0:07:43 | 0:07:45 | |
-In the 1530s, -in the Protestant Reformation... | 0:07:45 | 0:07:50 | |
-..shrines like this were demolished. | 0:07:50 | 0:07:53 | |
-The remains of the shrine were -discovered and rebuilt in 1872. | 0:07:53 | 0:07:58 | |
-But it was over -a century later, in 2002... | 0:07:59 | 0:08:03 | |
-..that the relic -was returned to the church. | 0:08:03 | 0:08:07 | |
-Dean Jeffrey John -was here at that time. | 0:08:07 | 0:08:11 | |
-The Archbishop of Cologne -gave us Alban's shoulder bone. | 0:08:11 | 0:08:16 | |
-One of the German -bishops came here... | 0:08:18 | 0:08:22 | |
-..for a very special service. | 0:08:23 | 0:08:25 | |
-It makes a difference. | 0:08:25 | 0:08:28 | |
-A woman who saw the service... | 0:08:28 | 0:08:31 | |
-..when the German -bishop came here... | 0:08:31 | 0:08:36 | |
-...said, "Alban has come home." | 0:08:36 | 0:08:39 | |
-I thought that was very interesting. | 0:08:40 | 0:08:43 | |
-Is it a way for us -to stay linked to the saint? | 0:08:43 | 0:08:47 | |
-I think that's it. | 0:08:47 | 0:08:49 | |
-The relic is a substantial link. | 0:08:49 | 0:08:53 | |
-It's something -to hold on to, literally. | 0:08:54 | 0:09:00 | |
-People keep a memento -of someone who has died... | 0:09:00 | 0:09:07 | |
-..like photographs or things -that belonged to that person... | 0:09:07 | 0:09:12 | |
-..perhaps a lock of hair. | 0:09:12 | 0:09:15 | |
-That's a kind of relic. | 0:09:16 | 0:09:19 | |
-How difficult has it been -to include St Alban's relic... | 0:09:19 | 0:09:24 | |
-..back in the church's life? | 0:09:24 | 0:09:26 | |
-We haven't had much opposition. | 0:09:26 | 0:09:29 | |
-The great majority -of people are very happy... | 0:09:29 | 0:09:35 | |
-..that something of Alban -is back in the cathedral. | 0:09:35 | 0:09:40 | |
-As one of the workers -told me after the service... | 0:09:40 | 0:09:46 | |
-"..I don't know, Dean... | 0:09:46 | 0:09:49 | |
-"..but when the relic, the bone, -returned to the shrine... | 0:09:49 | 0:09:54 | |
-"..it was like the battery -going back into the machine." | 0:09:54 | 0:09:59 | |
-It seems that returning the relic -of St Alban to this church... | 0:10:02 | 0:10:07 | |
-..has had quite an effect on people. | 0:10:07 | 0:10:10 | |
-In the second part, -I try to understand why... | 0:10:10 | 0:10:13 | |
-..by visiting a place -a little nearer home. | 0:10:13 | 0:10:17 | |
-. | 0:10:17 | 0:10:17 | |
-Subtitles | 0:10:22 | 0:10:22 | |
-Subtitles - -Subtitles | 0:10:22 | 0:10:24 | |
-Saints and their relics aren't -part of my spiritual background... | 0:10:28 | 0:10:33 | |
-..as someone raised in a chapel. | 0:10:33 | 0:10:35 | |
-But today, I'm on a journey to try -to understand what their appeal is. | 0:10:36 | 0:10:41 | |
-To do that, I'm on my way -to Wales's most important cathedral. | 0:10:42 | 0:10:48 | |
-I'm following the path -of the thousands of pilgrims... | 0:10:49 | 0:10:53 | |
-..who flocked here over -the centuries to St David's relics. | 0:10:54 | 0:10:58 | |
-David shaped the history -of the church in Wales. | 0:10:58 | 0:11:02 | |
-As our patron saint, he helped -form our national identity. | 0:11:02 | 0:11:07 | |
-In such a Nonconformist, -Protestant country... | 0:11:07 | 0:11:12 | |
-..it's odd that we hold a Catholic -saint so close to our hearts. | 0:11:13 | 0:11:18 | |
-But unlike the other patron -saints of Britain and Ireland... | 0:11:18 | 0:11:23 | |
-..David is the only one -who was born and grew up... | 0:11:23 | 0:11:27 | |
-..in the country -he later came to represent. | 0:11:27 | 0:11:31 | |
-David was born -on the Pembrokeshire coast. | 0:11:35 | 0:11:39 | |
-He became an ordinary monk and went -on to be an abbot, then a bishop. | 0:11:39 | 0:11:46 | |
-Before his death in 589... | 0:11:47 | 0:11:49 | |
-..he was appointed -Archbishop Of Wales. | 0:11:49 | 0:11:53 | |
-His importance has -lasted over the centuries. | 0:11:54 | 0:11:58 | |
-Our interest today -in this saint is as strong as ever. | 0:11:58 | 0:12:03 | |
-St David's relics were lost -in the Protestant Reformation. | 0:12:04 | 0:12:08 | |
-But his tomb survived -and was recently restored. | 0:12:08 | 0:12:12 | |
-Some believe that the presence -of a saint can remain... | 0:12:13 | 0:12:18 | |
-..and sanctify an object -simply because of a link with him. | 0:12:18 | 0:12:23 | |
-So the tomb can become a relic. | 0:12:23 | 0:12:25 | |
-It's essentially the same principle -as Britney Spears's sandwich. | 0:12:26 | 0:12:31 | |
-But there's a better -example in the New Testament. | 0:12:31 | 0:12:35 | |
-A sick woman wanted to touch Jesus -as he walked through the crowd. | 0:12:35 | 0:12:40 | |
-She only succeeded -in touching his garment... | 0:12:40 | 0:12:44 | |
-..but that was enough to heal her. | 0:12:45 | 0:12:47 | |
-SAINT DAVID | 0:12:48 | 0:12:50 | |
-When St David's shrine -was restored in 2012... | 0:12:50 | 0:12:54 | |
-..the Bishop said that their hope -was that visitors to St Davids... | 0:12:54 | 0:13:00 | |
-..would be changed -into pilgrims in faith. | 0:13:00 | 0:13:03 | |
-But are these futile hopes? | 0:13:04 | 0:13:06 | |
-It's unlikely that -restoring St David's tomb... | 0:13:08 | 0:13:11 | |
-..will fundamentally change -the way we think of him... | 0:13:11 | 0:13:15 | |
-..in our Protestant Wales. | 0:13:16 | 0:13:18 | |
-David became famous... | 0:13:18 | 0:13:21 | |
-..because his saintliness attracted -pilgrims in the Middle Ages. | 0:13:21 | 0:13:26 | |
-Since then, he has developed -a different significance... | 0:13:26 | 0:13:30 | |
-..a secular, or even political, one. | 0:13:30 | 0:13:33 | |
-When we wear a daffodil on March 1 -and go to St David's Day dinners... | 0:13:34 | 0:13:39 | |
-..that has more to do -with our nationality... | 0:13:39 | 0:13:43 | |
-..than our spiritual lives. | 0:13:43 | 0:13:45 | |
-We're unlikely to see thousands -of pilgrims flocking here again. | 0:13:45 | 0:13:50 | |
-But restoring it -to its former glory... | 0:13:50 | 0:13:55 | |
-..is a very fitting way to honour -and commemorate our patron saint. | 0:13:55 | 0:14:01 | |
-Maybe Protestant churches -aren't the best places... | 0:14:04 | 0:14:09 | |
-..to truly appreciate -the saints' spiritual appeal. | 0:14:09 | 0:14:13 | |
-I'm returning to London... | 0:14:13 | 0:14:15 | |
-..to the Catholic -Cathedral of Westminster. | 0:14:15 | 0:14:19 | |
-Catholics have always revered -saints and their relics. | 0:14:20 | 0:14:25 | |
-I've come to see -one relic in particular... | 0:14:26 | 0:14:30 | |
-..from a comparatively recent time, -about 350 years ago. | 0:14:30 | 0:14:34 | |
-It's a much more striking relic -than anything I've seen so far. | 0:14:34 | 0:14:40 | |
-Unlike many relics, -that can be rather abstract... | 0:14:44 | 0:14:49 | |
-..perhaps a small, ancient bone, -very often out of sight... | 0:14:49 | 0:14:54 | |
-..this is much more direct. | 0:14:55 | 0:14:58 | |
-This is the body of a man who was -executed because of his faith. | 0:14:58 | 0:15:04 | |
-He was hanged, drawn and quartered. | 0:15:05 | 0:15:10 | |
-His body was sewn back together -and hidden for years... | 0:15:10 | 0:15:15 | |
-..before it was possible -to return it here to Westminster. | 0:15:15 | 0:15:20 | |
-Although the silver mask -on his face and hands... | 0:15:20 | 0:15:25 | |
-..make him look peaceful... | 0:15:25 | 0:15:28 | |
-..there is something rather -discomfiting about this relic... | 0:15:28 | 0:15:33 | |
-..and rather horrifying. | 0:15:33 | 0:15:35 | |
-Here, we can touch our past... | 0:15:36 | 0:15:39 | |
-..a barbaric time in our past. | 0:15:39 | 0:15:42 | |
-It's easy to see how this man's -bravery can bolster people's faith. | 0:15:43 | 0:15:49 | |
-St John Southworth -was a Catholic priest. | 0:15:54 | 0:15:58 | |
-He had done charitable work amongst -the poor of London for some time... | 0:15:59 | 0:16:04 | |
-..when he was arrested in 1654. | 0:16:04 | 0:16:08 | |
-Being a Catholic priest -was completely illegal at the time. | 0:16:10 | 0:16:15 | |
-He was condemned to a cruel death. | 0:16:15 | 0:16:18 | |
-It's a powerful story. The relic -itself is a powerful symbol too. | 0:16:20 | 0:16:25 | |
-But I want to learn more... | 0:16:26 | 0:16:28 | |
-..about why exactly saints are such -a vital part of the Catholic faith. | 0:16:29 | 0:16:34 | |
-I'm going to talk to the Head of -the Church in England and Wales... | 0:16:34 | 0:16:39 | |
-..Archbishop Vincent Nichols. | 0:16:39 | 0:16:41 | |
-The Catholic understanding of saints -is that they're alive in Heaven... | 0:16:44 | 0:16:48 | |
-..and they are attentive -to our efforts here... | 0:16:49 | 0:16:52 | |
-..and help us with their prayers. | 0:16:52 | 0:16:55 | |
-So there's not just -a memory relationship... | 0:16:55 | 0:16:57 | |
-..but a living relationship -with saints. | 0:16:58 | 0:17:00 | |
-I think it is a misunderstanding -that we worship saints. We don't. | 0:17:00 | 0:17:06 | |
-We offer them our love -and we ask for their prayers. | 0:17:06 | 0:17:10 | |
-We draw strength -from their example... | 0:17:10 | 0:17:12 | |
-..and their continuing presence -as part of the living church. | 0:17:12 | 0:17:16 | |
-I remember vividly... | 0:17:16 | 0:17:18 | |
-..the cortege carrying -the body of Princess Diana... | 0:17:18 | 0:17:23 | |
-..coming up the Edgware Road. | 0:17:23 | 0:17:25 | |
-The Edgware Road -was crowded with people. | 0:17:26 | 0:17:28 | |
-They were throwing flowers... | 0:17:28 | 0:17:30 | |
-..to catch them -on the hearse as it went by. | 0:17:31 | 0:17:34 | |
-And somebody said to me... | 0:17:34 | 0:17:36 | |
-"..Each of those flowers -is a prayer for Diana." | 0:17:37 | 0:17:40 | |
-The same man went on to say... | 0:17:40 | 0:17:42 | |
-"..I think this moment marks the end -of the Reformation in England." | 0:17:43 | 0:17:46 | |
-English people are discovering again -their voice at the point of death. | 0:17:47 | 0:17:52 | |
-We do pray for those who have died. | 0:17:52 | 0:17:55 | |
-And they're discovering -their vision of a future... | 0:17:55 | 0:17:59 | |
-..which is so vividly expressed -in the lives of the saints. | 0:17:59 | 0:18:04 | |
-I don't know about the end -of the Protestant Reformation... | 0:18:04 | 0:18:09 | |
-..but death does affect us all. | 0:18:10 | 0:18:13 | |
-Most of us at some time have visited -the grave of someone dear to us. | 0:18:14 | 0:18:19 | |
-Maybe coming to pray to a saint's -relics isn't all that different. | 0:18:19 | 0:18:25 | |
-Whatever our religious background... | 0:18:28 | 0:18:31 | |
-..we can all be inspired by stories -about our predecessors in faith. | 0:18:31 | 0:18:36 | |
-What I see here -is that relics can be a step... | 0:18:36 | 0:18:41 | |
-..to getting that inspiration. | 0:18:41 | 0:18:43 | |
-I'm going to finish -my journey back in Wales... | 0:18:51 | 0:18:54 | |
-..by visiting -a remote little church... | 0:18:55 | 0:18:58 | |
-..that nevertheless -attracts hundreds of pilgrims. | 0:18:58 | 0:19:02 | |
-This is Pennant Melangell, -near the Berwyn Mountains... | 0:19:02 | 0:19:07 | |
-..the home of a saint who made -this place a nature reserve... | 0:19:07 | 0:19:12 | |
-..as well as a reserve for faith. | 0:19:12 | 0:19:15 | |
-Melangell was a princess -in the 7th century... | 0:19:16 | 0:19:20 | |
-..who had decided to become -a hermit to avoid having to marry. | 0:19:20 | 0:19:25 | |
-So she came to this valley -to live a life of prayer... | 0:19:25 | 0:19:30 | |
-..in harmony with -the wild animals around her. | 0:19:30 | 0:19:34 | |
-But one day, King Brochwel -and his men came here to hunt hares. | 0:19:35 | 0:19:41 | |
-One terrified hare ran to hide under -Melangell's cloak as she prayed. | 0:19:41 | 0:19:49 | |
-She used her saintliness -to protect it. | 0:19:49 | 0:19:53 | |
-The king's chief -hunter stepped forward. | 0:19:53 | 0:19:56 | |
-He lifted his horn to his lips, -to set the dogs on the hare. | 0:19:57 | 0:20:01 | |
-But no sound came from it. | 0:20:02 | 0:20:04 | |
-This greatly impressed -King Brochwel. | 0:20:04 | 0:20:08 | |
-So he gave the valley -and all its animals... | 0:20:08 | 0:20:12 | |
-..to the care -of Melangell, for ever. | 0:20:12 | 0:20:16 | |
-Even today, local people -refer to hares... | 0:20:16 | 0:20:20 | |
-..as Melangell's Little Lambs. | 0:20:20 | 0:20:23 | |
-The story of Melangell -is a simple one. | 0:20:26 | 0:20:29 | |
-She didn't establish a city or -sacrifice her life for her faith... | 0:20:30 | 0:20:35 | |
-..but her story has lasted. | 0:20:35 | 0:20:39 | |
-She lived here over 1,400 years ago. | 0:20:42 | 0:20:46 | |
-But people still remember her -and come here to pray... | 0:20:46 | 0:20:51 | |
-..at her shrine. | 0:20:51 | 0:20:53 | |
-These are all prayer cards... | 0:21:14 | 0:21:18 | |
-..asking for the saint's help. | 0:21:18 | 0:21:21 | |
-"Thinking of you -today Grandad. Much love." | 0:21:22 | 0:21:27 | |
-"We pray for everyone -in our family." | 0:21:27 | 0:21:31 | |
-"Help us to prosper and grow." | 0:21:33 | 0:21:36 | |
-It's impossible not to sense... | 0:21:41 | 0:21:44 | |
-..the pain and anxiety... | 0:21:47 | 0:21:49 | |
-..that is expressed -on many of the cards. | 0:21:50 | 0:21:54 | |
-People ask for the saint's help. | 0:21:54 | 0:21:58 | |
-But I suppose -one also senses their hope. | 0:21:58 | 0:22:03 | |
-There's something in that... | 0:22:04 | 0:22:06 | |
-..that really touches you. | 0:22:06 | 0:22:08 | |
-It's difficult to explain exactly -what the appeal of the place is... | 0:22:28 | 0:22:33 | |
-..and St Melangell's -relics in the church. | 0:22:33 | 0:22:37 | |
-Is it the simple -story of Melangell? | 0:22:37 | 0:22:41 | |
-Or the fact that people still flock -here to pray for help from her? | 0:22:41 | 0:22:47 | |
-Or is it the appeal -of the place itself? | 0:22:47 | 0:22:52 | |
-It's probably -a combination of all these... | 0:22:53 | 0:22:56 | |
-..that is responsible -for the fact that this place... | 0:22:56 | 0:23:01 | |
-..has really touched me. | 0:23:01 | 0:23:03 | |
-People have described this place -as Britain's holiest place. | 0:23:03 | 0:23:07 | |
-And I must say, on the whole, -I tend to agree with them. | 0:23:08 | 0:23:13 | |
-S4C Subtitles by Gwead | 0:23:36 | 0:23:38 | |
-. | 0:23:38 | 0:23:38 |