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I would like to warmly congratulate the newly elected | 0:00:43 | 0:00:46 | |
College of Commissioners, | 0:00:46 | 0:00:49 | |
and, Mr President Barroso, all of you, congratulations. | 0:00:49 | 0:00:53 | |
700,000 people a year die of tobacco. | 0:00:55 | 0:00:58 | |
And I'm responsible for citizens' health. | 0:00:59 | 0:01:01 | |
Following a fraud investigation, EU Commissioner for Health and Consumer | 0:01:10 | 0:01:14 | |
Policy John Dalli has resigned with immediate effect. | 0:01:14 | 0:01:17 | |
Mr Dalli. Michael. | 0:01:41 | 0:01:43 | |
Nobody of us smokes, I think, I hope. | 0:01:49 | 0:01:52 | |
I am using e-cigarettes. | 0:01:52 | 0:01:54 | |
Which are as bad as the others. | 0:01:54 | 0:01:56 | |
Before all this started, I had a meeting with Barroso in his office. | 0:02:51 | 0:02:56 | |
It's the usual meeting that commissioners | 0:02:56 | 0:02:59 | |
have with the president. | 0:02:59 | 0:03:01 | |
And at the end, Barroso said, "Well, you know, this tobacco directive," | 0:03:01 | 0:03:05 | |
he said, "we're having a lot of problems with it." | 0:03:05 | 0:03:08 | |
He said... | 0:03:08 | 0:03:10 | |
He said, "Don't you think we should forget it?" | 0:03:10 | 0:03:13 | |
I said, "Listen, I have a commitment with the... | 0:03:13 | 0:03:16 | |
"with the European citizens. And I will not... | 0:03:16 | 0:03:21 | |
"stop." | 0:03:21 | 0:03:23 | |
Do you remember the moment you are aware | 0:04:38 | 0:04:40 | |
that you are under investigation? | 0:04:40 | 0:04:43 | |
That I am under investigation is on that meeting I had with Kessler. | 0:04:43 | 0:04:46 | |
And he is the head of OLAF. He is the head of OLAF. | 0:04:46 | 0:04:49 | |
He came to my office unannounced. | 0:04:49 | 0:04:51 | |
And what does he ask? | 0:04:51 | 0:04:52 | |
About a meeting I had with a...with a young lawyer, Gayle Kimberley, | 0:04:52 | 0:04:57 | |
here in Malta. | 0:04:57 | 0:04:58 | |
She was asking questions about tobacco, about snus. | 0:05:12 | 0:05:15 | |
She was never registered as a lobbyist. | 0:05:15 | 0:05:17 | |
She was not presented to me as a lobbyist. | 0:05:17 | 0:05:19 | |
How was I to know that she is a lobbyist? OK? | 0:05:19 | 0:05:22 | |
And then he said, "But then you made another appointment | 0:05:25 | 0:05:28 | |
"to meet her on the tenth and you met on the tenth." | 0:05:28 | 0:05:30 | |
I said, "No, didn't meet on the tenth." | 0:05:30 | 0:05:33 | |
This meeting never happened. | 0:05:34 | 0:05:36 | |
RECORDING: If you want to, I can tell you the story. | 0:05:56 | 0:05:58 | |
I know that she wasn't... | 0:05:58 | 0:06:00 | |
I know that she wasn't in the second meeting. | 0:06:00 | 0:06:02 | |
But that I found out when OLAF told me. | 0:06:02 | 0:06:06 | |
We have been told to keep by OLAF that there is an investigation | 0:06:24 | 0:06:28 | |
going on in Malta. So... | 0:06:28 | 0:06:31 | |
So, keep your version. Yeah, yeah, keep... | 0:06:31 | 0:06:33 | |
To tell what you have said to us and what is your version, | 0:06:33 | 0:06:37 | |
because we have done an investigation, | 0:06:37 | 0:06:40 | |
there is Malta's investigations. | 0:06:40 | 0:06:42 | |
It would be preferable that this is not disturbed, | 0:06:42 | 0:06:46 | |
and this will definitely not help certain people if that comes out. | 0:06:46 | 0:06:49 | |
Stick to the story. | 0:06:54 | 0:06:56 | |
As a result of our investigation, | 0:06:56 | 0:06:59 | |
it's turned out that these Maltese interpreters organised over... | 0:06:59 | 0:07:06 | |
last time | 0:07:06 | 0:07:08 | |
two meetings with the Commissioner and representative of the, | 0:07:08 | 0:07:14 | |
let's say, snus companies. | 0:07:14 | 0:07:18 | |
This is Kessler, you understand? | 0:07:23 | 0:07:25 | |
He creates by inventing, | 0:07:25 | 0:07:28 | |
fraudulently, this case. | 0:07:28 | 0:07:31 | |
Silvio Zammit is one of those people. | 0:08:08 | 0:08:10 | |
OK? He was very active in the political party that I come from. | 0:08:10 | 0:08:15 | |
Kessler makes a lot that he is a close friend. | 0:08:15 | 0:08:19 | |
No, I never have any business with him, this guy out... | 0:08:19 | 0:08:22 | |
He's a friend, you know, like many other friends in my... | 0:08:22 | 0:08:24 | |
In your local political network. | 0:08:24 | 0:08:26 | |
Yes, in my local political network. | 0:08:26 | 0:08:28 | |
I am very interested in the meeting with Swedish Match | 0:08:31 | 0:08:34 | |
when they come here. You are interested in that? | 0:08:34 | 0:08:36 | |
Yeah. OK. Can we walk through that meeting as it happens? | 0:08:36 | 0:08:39 | |
Exactly. Of course, of course. | 0:08:39 | 0:08:42 | |
We can. So, Gabrielsson, in the evening he arrives here? | 0:08:42 | 0:08:44 | |
Yes. He sat there. | 0:08:44 | 0:08:46 | |
They sit here. Gabrielsson and Gayle Kimberley? | 0:08:47 | 0:08:50 | |
Uh-huh. And they are talking? | 0:08:50 | 0:08:52 | |
He said to me, | 0:08:52 | 0:08:54 | |
"What is the proposal for this lifting up of the ban?" | 0:08:54 | 0:09:01 | |
And that is the ban on smokeless tobacco? | 0:09:01 | 0:09:03 | |
Yes, yes, yes. But then I said to him, "It's 60 million." | 0:09:03 | 0:09:06 | |
Yeah? You say it here? | 0:09:07 | 0:09:10 | |
Yeah, yeah. But I need to understand, the 60 million euros, | 0:09:10 | 0:09:12 | |
who was getting the 60 million euros? | 0:09:12 | 0:09:15 | |
Was that you or Gayle Kimberley or...? | 0:09:15 | 0:09:17 | |
No, it's for Gayle Kimberley and myself, | 0:09:17 | 0:09:21 | |
so we set up the lobby group. | 0:09:21 | 0:09:23 | |
But I am doing what Gayle is telling me to do. | 0:09:57 | 0:10:00 | |
Yeah. | 0:10:00 | 0:10:01 | |
But did they discuss that Mr Dalli would get a... | 0:10:01 | 0:10:05 | |
a cut of the 60 million, was that part of the deal? | 0:10:05 | 0:10:09 | |
No, for sure, not from my side. I don't know nothing about this. | 0:10:10 | 0:10:13 | |
But did you hear them talking about that? | 0:10:13 | 0:10:15 | |
No, no, no, no, no, no. | 0:10:15 | 0:10:17 | |
We never talked about that. | 0:10:17 | 0:10:19 | |
Hello, Miss Kimberley, this is journalist Mads Brugger. | 0:10:19 | 0:10:22 | |
I really need to speak with you. | 0:10:22 | 0:10:23 | |
I also wrote you an e-mail yesterday. | 0:10:23 | 0:10:26 | |
Please give me a ring as soon as possible. | 0:10:26 | 0:10:29 | |
I'm here in Malta. Hope to hear from you soon. Bye-bye. | 0:10:29 | 0:10:31 | |
When she calls me, she said to me... | 0:11:24 | 0:11:27 | |
She didn't say, "Hello, Silvio." | 0:11:27 | 0:11:30 | |
She didn't say, "How are you?" | 0:11:30 | 0:11:32 | |
She basically said, "How much would you charge us to meet Mr Dalli?" | 0:11:32 | 0:11:37 | |
This telephone call was made from the offices of OLAF. | 0:11:37 | 0:11:41 | |
It was recorded on OLAF equipment. | 0:11:44 | 0:11:48 | |
In the presence of OLAF personnel. | 0:11:48 | 0:11:51 | |
It was an entrapment. It was an entrapment and it was illegal. | 0:11:51 | 0:11:54 | |
As a result of our investigation, | 0:12:05 | 0:12:07 | |
it turned out that there is no conclusive evidence of the direct | 0:12:07 | 0:12:12 | |
participation of Commissioner John Dalli | 0:12:12 | 0:12:16 | |
as instigator or mastermind of the operation | 0:12:16 | 0:12:21 | |
of requesting money for changing the decision of the commission. | 0:12:21 | 0:12:27 | |
You know, it was stated in the report that there was no corruption. | 0:12:27 | 0:12:31 | |
Mm. There is no corruption whatsoever. | 0:12:31 | 0:12:35 | |
OK? The report simply states, OK, | 0:12:35 | 0:12:37 | |
that I was not involved in creating this... | 0:12:37 | 0:12:41 | |
..this discussions, OK? | 0:12:43 | 0:12:45 | |
I was not involved in these discussions. | 0:12:45 | 0:12:47 | |
OLAF states this. | 0:12:47 | 0:12:49 | |
But he concludes I must have known. | 0:12:49 | 0:12:52 | |
What is the essence of all of this? | 0:13:13 | 0:13:15 | |
The essence of all of this was that I was kicked out of the picture. | 0:13:15 | 0:13:21 | |
The directive was passed through, but in a diluted form. | 0:13:21 | 0:13:26 | |
So, you feel like you are a victim of a set-up? | 0:13:31 | 0:13:33 | |
I am a victim of a set-up by the tobacco company who wanted me out. | 0:13:33 | 0:13:38 | |
So, the winner of this in a way... | 0:13:38 | 0:13:41 | |
Is tobacco. Tobacco wins. | 0:13:41 | 0:13:43 | |
Tobacco wins. | 0:13:43 | 0:13:44 | |
OLAF, which investigates fraud within the EU institutions, | 0:13:51 | 0:13:54 | |
has been in the spotlight ever since former Health Commissioner | 0:13:54 | 0:13:58 | |
John Dalli had to resign due to bribe accusations in 2012. | 0:13:58 | 0:14:02 | |
Later, though, OLAF itself and its director Giovanni Kessler came under | 0:14:02 | 0:14:07 | |
fire due to the Dalli investigation, | 0:14:07 | 0:14:09 | |
which was said to violate EU regulation. | 0:14:09 | 0:14:11 | |
So, Mr Dalli, it's almost a year since we saw each other last time? | 0:14:57 | 0:15:02 | |
It is. Yeah. Uh-huh. | 0:15:02 | 0:15:04 | |
Time flies. And what has happened since we met? | 0:15:04 | 0:15:08 | |
Well, quite a lot happened since we met. | 0:15:10 | 0:15:13 | |
The most important thing for me is that my wife died. | 0:15:17 | 0:15:20 | |
My condolences. | 0:15:20 | 0:15:22 | |
She died from a massive heart attack. | 0:15:22 | 0:15:24 | |
Again, I believe in God's providence as well. | 0:15:26 | 0:15:28 | |
This became manifest some... | 0:15:31 | 0:15:34 | |
couple of weeks ago. | 0:15:34 | 0:15:36 | |
Out of the blues, I received an e-mail... | 0:15:36 | 0:15:40 | |
..by a person unknown. | 0:15:41 | 0:15:43 | |
Which said, basically, "Listen, I have in my hands... | 0:15:45 | 0:15:49 | |
"..documentation and tapes... | 0:15:50 | 0:15:54 | |
"..that show the corruption... | 0:15:56 | 0:15:59 | |
"..of Barroso and the Commission in your case. | 0:16:00 | 0:16:05 | |
"How they were colluding with the tobacco industry... | 0:16:05 | 0:16:09 | |
"..to take you out of the way." | 0:16:13 | 0:16:15 | |
Yeah. | 0:16:17 | 0:16:20 | |
The first e-mail was received on the fifth of September, and it said, | 0:16:27 | 0:16:34 | |
"Hi, I prefer to remain anonymous, if you will respect this, Sir. | 0:16:34 | 0:16:39 | |
"So, there will be no phone calls, please. | 0:16:39 | 0:16:43 | |
"I have a package of large volume files about Jose Manuel Barroso, | 0:16:43 | 0:16:50 | |
"and representatives of a powerful tobacco lobby | 0:16:50 | 0:16:54 | |
"in the US and continental Europe. | 0:16:54 | 0:16:58 | |
"These documents will shake Europe. | 0:16:58 | 0:17:01 | |
"Massive fraud and espionage." | 0:17:01 | 0:17:03 | |
"These documents will shake Europe"? | 0:17:03 | 0:17:06 | |
"Massive fraud and espionage." | 0:17:07 | 0:17:11 | |
"Will be sent by courier only. | 0:17:11 | 0:17:14 | |
"3,000 euros to my e-mail so, so-and-so." | 0:17:14 | 0:17:19 | |
The person's name on the e-mail is Maria Zamora. | 0:17:19 | 0:17:24 | |
Maria Zamora. | 0:17:24 | 0:17:28 | |
So, too good to be true, in reality. | 0:17:29 | 0:17:33 | |
Then I reply. | 0:17:33 | 0:17:36 | |
"Dear Miss Zamora. | 0:17:36 | 0:17:38 | |
"I would very much like to examine this material, | 0:17:38 | 0:17:42 | |
"and this is why I invite you to spend a weekend break in Malta | 0:17:42 | 0:17:46 | |
"at my expense, so that we can meet confidentially, | 0:17:46 | 0:17:50 | |
"and review the matter." | 0:17:50 | 0:17:52 | |
Answered on the fifth. | 0:17:54 | 0:17:56 | |
"This is to confirm to you that I have no affiliation | 0:17:56 | 0:18:00 | |
"whatsoever with Giovanni." And even this, | 0:18:00 | 0:18:03 | |
she starts calling him Giovanni. | 0:18:03 | 0:18:05 | |
So, she uses the first name of Kessler? | 0:18:05 | 0:18:08 | |
Uses the first name of Kessler. | 0:18:08 | 0:18:09 | |
What does that say? | 0:18:09 | 0:18:11 | |
That says that she has... | 0:18:11 | 0:18:12 | |
Either she knew him well, she worked with him...closely. | 0:18:14 | 0:18:18 | |
Or that she has been going in the hallways of power in Brussels. | 0:18:18 | 0:18:22 | |
That's right. | 0:18:22 | 0:18:24 | |
I also reveal here that this matter has been considered a matter of life | 0:18:24 | 0:18:28 | |
and death by some people. | 0:18:28 | 0:18:31 | |
A matter of life and death. | 0:18:31 | 0:18:32 | |
Yes, it is life and death. If this is true what she is saying, | 0:18:32 | 0:18:36 | |
it is life and death. | 0:18:36 | 0:18:38 | |
No doubt about it. | 0:18:38 | 0:18:41 | |
"I checked the pieces of evidence again, | 0:18:41 | 0:18:45 | |
"and found a recorded conversation | 0:18:45 | 0:18:48 | |
"where your possible elimination was discussed at some point. | 0:18:48 | 0:18:52 | |
"Not too sure what it meant, but the exact wordings are, | 0:18:53 | 0:18:58 | |
" 'We can get him out of the equation.' " | 0:18:58 | 0:19:01 | |
A recording? "We can get him out of the equation." | 0:19:01 | 0:19:05 | |
A recorded conversation. | 0:19:05 | 0:19:07 | |
"We can get him out of the equation." | 0:19:07 | 0:19:11 | |
This was the last e-mail you received? | 0:19:11 | 0:19:13 | |
Yes. And have you written to that person since? | 0:19:13 | 0:19:16 | |
Not yet, not yet. So, this is where we are now? | 0:19:16 | 0:19:20 | |
Exactly. | 0:19:20 | 0:19:22 | |
I'm just saying something in Danish. | 0:19:22 | 0:19:24 | |
Go, go, go, go, go. | 0:19:24 | 0:19:25 | |
I'm saying, Mr Dalli, that if this is true, | 0:19:59 | 0:20:02 | |
we will wire, Michael and I, | 0:20:02 | 0:20:06 | |
3,000 euros to her PayPal account. | 0:20:06 | 0:20:10 | |
OK. But if we know that she really, or he, really has this package, | 0:20:13 | 0:20:19 | |
then things will become easier. | 0:20:19 | 0:20:21 | |
I tell her, "After your last e-mail, | 0:20:21 | 0:20:25 | |
"I have the person... | 0:20:25 | 0:20:30 | |
"..whom I can fully trust to... | 0:20:31 | 0:20:38 | |
"..complete the transaction, OK?" | 0:20:39 | 0:20:44 | |
This is extremely exciting. | 0:20:47 | 0:20:49 | |
What do you think I'm feeling? | 0:20:49 | 0:20:51 | |
I mean, I'm feeling not totally excited, | 0:20:51 | 0:20:54 | |
but this is... I regain my life. | 0:20:54 | 0:20:56 | |
Mm. And the life of my children. | 0:20:56 | 0:20:58 | |
If this is true, this is like a rebirth for me, | 0:20:58 | 0:21:02 | |
because they destroyed our lives, these people. | 0:21:02 | 0:21:05 | |
Hello! Hello. | 0:21:44 | 0:21:46 | |
Good afternoon. Afternoon, nice to see you. | 0:21:46 | 0:21:49 | |
Hi. Hi. | 0:21:49 | 0:21:50 | |
So, you left us yesterday. | 0:21:50 | 0:21:52 | |
I left you yesterday. We were extremely excited. | 0:21:52 | 0:21:55 | |
I'm going to write to the Malta police. | 0:21:55 | 0:21:58 | |
You want to write to the police? Yes, yes, yes. Wait, wait, wait. | 0:21:58 | 0:22:02 | |
Tell them that I receive the e-mail, | 0:22:03 | 0:22:06 | |
the first one I received. | 0:22:06 | 0:22:08 | |
I'm not going to give them any of the other details, OK? | 0:22:08 | 0:22:12 | |
And tell them, "Listen, I'm going to send her the money, | 0:22:12 | 0:22:15 | |
"and I'm writing to you, | 0:22:15 | 0:22:16 | |
"so that there will not be any misunderstanding." | 0:22:16 | 0:22:19 | |
OK? About this action. | 0:22:22 | 0:22:25 | |
And I've decided to send her the money. | 0:22:25 | 0:22:28 | |
And see what happens. The worst case scenario is I will lose 3,000 euros. | 0:22:28 | 0:22:32 | |
You do not prefer that we put forward the money? | 0:22:35 | 0:22:38 | |
No, no. It's better like this, OK. | 0:22:38 | 0:22:41 | |
I tell you what, so I will not involve third parties. | 0:22:41 | 0:22:45 | |
So, we'll see. I'm going to take the plunge, OK. | 0:22:45 | 0:22:49 | |
This is what I decided. | 0:22:49 | 0:22:51 | |
I'm going to take the plunge. | 0:22:51 | 0:22:53 | |
If it's a scam, I lose 3,000 euros. | 0:22:53 | 0:22:57 | |
If it's true, we've won the lottery. | 0:22:57 | 0:22:59 | |
Mm-hm. "You are recognised," she tells me, | 0:22:59 | 0:23:03 | |
"as an influential and respected member of society in Malta, | 0:23:03 | 0:23:06 | |
"and in Europe." Yes. "The documents are deep." | 0:23:06 | 0:23:10 | |
"Deep"? | 0:23:10 | 0:23:11 | |
I think detailed is what she means. | 0:23:11 | 0:23:14 | |
"And we are aware Mr Barroso received tobacco money | 0:23:14 | 0:23:20 | |
"through the DNB Bank of Norway." | 0:23:20 | 0:23:22 | |
That is very detailed. So, this is... | 0:23:24 | 0:23:26 | |
This is quite an interesting detail. | 0:23:26 | 0:23:29 | |
DN...? DNB Bank of Norway. DNB Bank. | 0:23:29 | 0:23:34 | |
Could we write it now? What? | 0:23:36 | 0:23:39 | |
To speed up things. | 0:23:39 | 0:23:41 | |
You know, do it now, | 0:23:41 | 0:23:42 | |
and wait for the answer? | 0:23:42 | 0:23:45 | |
She's answering very fast. | 0:23:45 | 0:23:47 | |
OK. | 0:23:47 | 0:23:49 | |
I'm just thinking, what is actually...happening now, you know. | 0:23:51 | 0:23:57 | |
You will contact the police. | 0:23:57 | 0:24:00 | |
I've already sent him an e-mail, to tell you the truth. | 0:24:00 | 0:24:03 | |
To the police? To the police, yes. | 0:24:03 | 0:24:05 | |
Unfortunately, I am still a smoker. | 0:24:09 | 0:24:12 | |
And if ever I would be needing a cigarette it is now. | 0:24:12 | 0:24:15 | |
So, I will just go out there and smoke a cigarette. | 0:24:15 | 0:24:18 | |
Go, you can. I'm a non-alcoholic, but I really need a stiff drink. | 0:24:18 | 0:24:22 | |
OK. | 0:24:22 | 0:24:24 | |
You can have a stiff drink. | 0:24:24 | 0:24:26 | |
I'll just have a double whisky. | 0:24:28 | 0:24:30 | |
THEY SPEAK OWN LANGUAGE | 0:24:30 | 0:24:32 | |
Who wants...who wants a whisky? | 0:24:32 | 0:24:34 | |
OK. How good? | 0:24:56 | 0:24:58 | |
I think the storm is coming up, yeah? | 0:24:58 | 0:25:02 | |
This is not the storm yet. | 0:25:02 | 0:25:03 | |
If the storm hits, then it will hit. | 0:25:03 | 0:25:07 | |
Since we met yesterday, | 0:25:07 | 0:25:09 | |
what made you change your mind about you directly paying the source? | 0:25:09 | 0:25:14 | |
No, because I thought of this way to eliminate | 0:25:14 | 0:25:17 | |
the possibility of an entrapment. Yes. | 0:25:17 | 0:25:20 | |
Look, I'll inform the police I'm doing it, | 0:25:20 | 0:25:22 | |
and I'm in the clear. Yes. | 0:25:22 | 0:25:24 | |
So, I scratched that out, that possibility. | 0:25:24 | 0:25:27 | |
And if you have the material, will you have a press conference here? | 0:25:27 | 0:25:31 | |
We'll see. Because then, then, then I will... | 0:25:31 | 0:25:35 | |
THUNDER CLAPS LOUDLY | 0:25:35 | 0:25:36 | |
MR DALLI LAUGHS | 0:25:36 | 0:25:40 | |
It's the thunder, the thunder. | 0:25:40 | 0:25:42 | |
Did you see it! | 0:25:43 | 0:25:45 | |
You want another one?! | 0:25:45 | 0:25:47 | |
MUSIC: Piano Sonata No. 14 in C-sharp minor "Moonlight" by Ludwig Van Beethoven | 0:25:49 | 0:25:55 | |
I said, "I understand your apprehension. | 0:26:11 | 0:26:15 | |
"Rest assured that your safety will be guaranteed." | 0:26:15 | 0:26:18 | |
OK. | 0:26:18 | 0:26:21 | |
"I decided to pay you the expenses, as requested, | 0:26:21 | 0:26:25 | |
"by you, and will arrange to pay into your PayPal account today. | 0:26:25 | 0:26:31 | |
"When will you mail the documents? | 0:26:31 | 0:26:33 | |
"What method will you use? | 0:26:33 | 0:26:36 | |
"I will send you the mailing address... | 0:26:36 | 0:26:40 | |
"..mailing address, once you confirm." | 0:26:42 | 0:26:44 | |
OK? Yes. Sent. You sent it now? | 0:26:48 | 0:26:50 | |
Sent? Sent. OK. | 0:26:50 | 0:26:53 | |
Now we're waiting. Now we're waiting. | 0:26:53 | 0:26:56 | |
For an answer. | 0:26:56 | 0:26:57 | |
I mean, we can wait as long as the music is... | 0:26:59 | 0:27:03 | |
Playing. ..this beautiful and it's raining outside. | 0:27:03 | 0:27:06 | |
We can wait all evening. The rain I love, you know. | 0:27:06 | 0:27:10 | |
I love this atmosphere. Yes. Of raining. | 0:27:10 | 0:27:13 | |
E-MAIL ALERT BLEEPS | 0:27:13 | 0:27:15 | |
So, we have an answer. OK. "Dear, Sir... | 0:27:15 | 0:27:17 | |
"Thank you for your understanding. | 0:27:17 | 0:27:19 | |
"The earliest the package can be shipped will be Friday, | 0:27:19 | 0:27:24 | |
"because we will have to gather all the documents from a safe archive. | 0:27:24 | 0:27:28 | |
"And this might take a couple of days or so. | 0:27:28 | 0:27:32 | |
"Once you confirm, I will ensure the package is promptly sent on Friday. | 0:27:32 | 0:27:36 | |
"Let me have the confirmation on your side. | 0:27:36 | 0:27:39 | |
"We'll keep you informed." This is very straightforward. | 0:27:39 | 0:27:43 | |
Very straightforward. Now we are in action. Now things are happening. | 0:27:43 | 0:27:46 | |
Yes. I mean, this is it. Incredible. We, I mean... | 0:27:46 | 0:27:50 | |
Monday, if this is true, Monday, I should have the information. | 0:27:54 | 0:27:59 | |
Monday, if it's true, | 0:27:59 | 0:28:01 | |
you will have a package of the most explosive political material... | 0:28:01 | 0:28:05 | |
..in the world. ..in the world. Yes. | 0:28:05 | 0:28:09 | |
MUSIC: The Winner Takes It All by ABBA | 0:28:09 | 0:28:12 | |
# The winner takes it all | 0:28:12 | 0:28:15 | |
# The loser's standing small | 0:28:15 | 0:28:19 | |
# Beside the victory | 0:28:19 | 0:28:23 | |
# That's her destiny | 0:28:23 | 0:28:27 | |
# Knowing me knowing you A-ha | 0:28:27 | 0:28:31 | |
# There is nothing we can do | 0:28:31 | 0:28:34 | |
# Knowing me knowing you A-ha | 0:28:34 | 0:28:37 | |
# We just have to face it This time we're through. # | 0:28:37 | 0:28:43 | |
Hi. | 0:29:09 | 0:29:12 | |
Mr Dalli, nice to see you. How are you? Very fine, thank you. | 0:29:12 | 0:29:15 | |
How are you? I am fine. | 0:29:15 | 0:29:17 | |
OK. Great to see you. | 0:29:17 | 0:29:20 | |
So... Yeah. | 0:29:20 | 0:29:22 | |
No package. | 0:29:22 | 0:29:24 | |
So, no package arrived? | 0:29:25 | 0:29:27 | |
No package arrived. | 0:29:27 | 0:29:29 | |
OK. I would have wished a package arrived, but no package arrived. | 0:29:29 | 0:29:34 | |
Yeah, so would we. | 0:29:34 | 0:29:36 | |
Did the source give any explanation to why the package has not arrived? | 0:29:36 | 0:29:41 | |
No, no, no. They didn't give any explanation. | 0:29:41 | 0:29:43 | |
In fact, they turned very, very aggressive. | 0:29:43 | 0:29:46 | |
Aggressive? Aggressive. They were asking for more money, | 0:29:46 | 0:29:51 | |
and practically trying to blackmail, | 0:29:51 | 0:29:54 | |
but, you know, I never gave in to blackmail, | 0:29:54 | 0:29:57 | |
therefore nothing, really. OK. OK. | 0:29:57 | 0:30:00 | |
HE SIGHS | 0:30:07 | 0:30:09 | |
This is what happened - | 0:30:33 | 0:30:35 | |
I was expecting the package, but I received a phone call | 0:30:35 | 0:30:39 | |
from this man who called himself Dmitri from the Red Brigade, I think | 0:30:39 | 0:30:45 | |
he said. He ordered me to pay 30,000 euros. | 0:30:45 | 0:30:50 | |
I don't know who Dmitri is. | 0:30:50 | 0:30:53 | |
But he sounded very Russian. | 0:30:53 | 0:30:55 | |
"You have one hour to confirm bank transaction or it will be | 0:30:55 | 0:31:00 | |
"Armageddon for you tomorrow." | 0:31:00 | 0:31:02 | |
But, I mean, this is really an aggressive threat towards you. | 0:31:03 | 0:31:09 | |
It is aggressive. This is the aggressiveness. | 0:31:09 | 0:31:11 | |
Very aggressive. | 0:31:11 | 0:31:13 | |
Again, the reason was to try to intimidate me. | 0:31:13 | 0:31:17 | |
How do you feel when your father is threatened? | 0:31:17 | 0:31:20 | |
I am afraid that they might do something to him. | 0:31:20 | 0:31:26 | |
I mean, we are put in a very dangerous... | 0:31:26 | 0:31:32 | |
situation. | 0:31:32 | 0:31:34 | |
I mean... I understand your feelings. Mm. | 0:31:34 | 0:31:37 | |
But I have a proposal that... And I think it should be you doing | 0:31:37 | 0:31:42 | |
it, that you will try once again writing Dmitri and saying... | 0:31:42 | 0:31:47 | |
I prefer to put pressure on the police, OK, | 0:31:47 | 0:31:50 | |
and have them make the contact, not me. | 0:31:50 | 0:31:54 | |
But they are not doing anything. | 0:31:54 | 0:31:55 | |
But if Dmitri still has some kind of evidence... | 0:31:55 | 0:31:59 | |
Some kind of evidence, he is not going to give it. | 0:31:59 | 0:32:03 | |
Dmitri has been playing a game, whoever he is. | 0:32:03 | 0:32:06 | |
And a game which was not intending to do me any good. | 0:32:06 | 0:32:12 | |
One way or the other, | 0:32:12 | 0:32:14 | |
he wanted some result that would put me in a bad light. | 0:32:14 | 0:32:20 | |
But this means then that it is Michael and I | 0:32:20 | 0:32:23 | |
who should be trying to contact Dmitri. | 0:32:23 | 0:32:25 | |
No, no, it is the police, not Michael and you. | 0:32:25 | 0:32:29 | |
You know, you said earlier that you have a little flame of hope. | 0:32:29 | 0:32:34 | |
Do you realise that I am dealing with criminals now? | 0:32:34 | 0:32:37 | |
Yes. | 0:32:37 | 0:32:39 | |
No, I think forget it. I think tomorrow, I will... | 0:32:40 | 0:32:44 | |
It is dangerous. I think tomorrow, I will... | 0:32:44 | 0:32:49 | |
put pressure on the police. | 0:32:49 | 0:32:50 | |
So, then I wrote, | 0:33:22 | 0:33:24 | |
"I am interested in the package you have for sale, please respond." | 0:33:24 | 0:33:29 | |
OK. | 0:33:29 | 0:33:30 | |
Maybe it was a mistake. It was a mistake, but let's carry on. | 0:33:30 | 0:33:34 | |
But it happened. But it was not our agreement when we left here. | 0:33:34 | 0:33:38 | |
But I thought in my twisted logic maybe... OK, go ahead. | 0:33:38 | 0:33:43 | |
You shouldn't have taken initiative, I think, but anyhow. | 0:33:43 | 0:33:46 | |
You are only seeing the story. | 0:33:46 | 0:33:48 | |
But I became very angry about it. | 0:33:48 | 0:33:50 | |
Whatever, I am not pointing fingers. | 0:33:50 | 0:33:53 | |
Because I didn't know. | 0:33:53 | 0:33:55 | |
But anyhow... I didn't know. But carry on. | 0:33:55 | 0:33:58 | |
Carry on, let's see what happened. Yes, yes. | 0:33:58 | 0:34:00 | |
Then Maria Zamora writes back to me, "Not possible, | 0:34:00 | 0:34:04 | |
"Tuesday night in Malta or Denmark," | 0:34:04 | 0:34:07 | |
and that is where we are. | 0:34:07 | 0:34:10 | |
You should have told me you were going to do that. I'm very sorry. | 0:34:10 | 0:34:13 | |
John Dalli was originally quite a respected politician in Malta. | 0:35:31 | 0:35:36 | |
I'm talking as far back as 1987. | 0:35:38 | 0:35:40 | |
He won the respect of a lot of people, | 0:35:40 | 0:35:43 | |
because he took decisive action at a time when Malta's economy, | 0:35:43 | 0:35:49 | |
and Malta generally, was a real mess. | 0:35:49 | 0:35:52 | |
Then, slowly and slowly, there began to be whisperings and conversations, | 0:35:52 | 0:35:59 | |
private conversations, about how corrupt he is. | 0:35:59 | 0:36:04 | |
He was the minister responsible for privatisation of | 0:36:04 | 0:36:08 | |
state entities in Malta including the banks, airport, and there | 0:36:08 | 0:36:13 | |
were these sort of undercurrents about his involvement, | 0:36:13 | 0:36:16 | |
his maybe taking a cut. | 0:36:16 | 0:36:18 | |
The opposition at the time, which is the Labour Party, | 0:36:18 | 0:36:22 | |
used to call him in fact Johnny Cash, | 0:36:22 | 0:36:24 | |
because he had such a reputation for going after money. | 0:36:24 | 0:36:27 | |
But yet, you know, | 0:36:27 | 0:36:30 | |
still really no smoking gun. | 0:36:30 | 0:36:32 | |
No, there is no smoking gun. | 0:36:32 | 0:36:34 | |
Eventually, the Nationalist Prime Minister made what I consider to be, | 0:36:34 | 0:36:40 | |
and many people consider to be, a fatal error. | 0:36:40 | 0:36:43 | |
Which was to nominate him as Malta's European Commissioner. | 0:36:43 | 0:36:49 | |
So, as to get him off... | 0:36:49 | 0:36:51 | |
..off the island. ..off his own back and off the island, | 0:36:51 | 0:36:54 | |
he exported the problem and inflicted it on | 0:36:54 | 0:36:57 | |
a European-wide level, in the European Commission. | 0:36:57 | 0:37:00 | |
Incredible. | 0:37:03 | 0:37:04 | |
He was at an EU Commission meeting in Cyprus, | 0:37:07 | 0:37:12 | |
and he made his excuses and left. | 0:37:12 | 0:37:16 | |
He wasn't present for one of the most important dinners. | 0:37:16 | 0:37:20 | |
He told his European Commission colleagues that he was flying back | 0:37:20 | 0:37:24 | |
to Malta because he had family problems, | 0:37:24 | 0:37:27 | |
but he didn't go back to Malta at all. | 0:37:27 | 0:37:29 | |
He went to the Bahamas. I know why he went, | 0:37:29 | 0:37:32 | |
because I spoke to the Americans who were in the Bahamas. | 0:37:32 | 0:37:35 | |
They sent me that photo. | 0:37:35 | 0:37:38 | |
So, that is Marie Eloise Corbin. | 0:37:38 | 0:37:41 | |
She was known as Lady Bird. | 0:37:41 | 0:37:44 | |
That is John Dalli. | 0:37:44 | 0:37:45 | |
John Dalli's daughter, Louisa Dalli. | 0:37:45 | 0:37:47 | |
So, this man standing at the back, | 0:37:49 | 0:37:52 | |
he represents the Christian... | 0:37:52 | 0:37:54 | |
The man here in the blue shirt who's standing. | 0:37:54 | 0:37:57 | |
..he represents a Christian organisation. | 0:37:57 | 0:37:59 | |
Yes. I've tried to understand why Lady Bird would have asked this man, | 0:37:59 | 0:38:05 | |
Michael, to fly... | 0:38:05 | 0:38:08 | |
fly to the Bahamas to meet John Dalli, | 0:38:08 | 0:38:11 | |
and afterwards I realised it was to win his confidence, | 0:38:11 | 0:38:14 | |
because she was taking his friend's money - | 0:38:14 | 0:38:17 | |
the money from the other people in the Christian group. | 0:38:17 | 0:38:20 | |
So, you have in a villa in Nassau, you have Lady Bird... | 0:38:20 | 0:38:25 | |
The fraudster. Christians from America... | 0:38:25 | 0:38:29 | |
Yes, mm-hm. Meeting with... And John Dalli, a European Commissioner. | 0:38:29 | 0:38:32 | |
A European Commissioner. That is extraordinary. | 0:38:32 | 0:38:34 | |
Yes, it is extraordinary. | 0:38:34 | 0:38:36 | |
AEROPLANE FLIES OVERHEAD | 0:39:41 | 0:39:43 | |
Good to see you at last. And this is Mads, my colleague. Yes. | 0:40:05 | 0:40:11 | |
The eight Christian Americans that you represent, | 0:40:19 | 0:40:22 | |
who were scammed by Lady Bird and possibly also John Dalli... | 0:40:22 | 0:40:28 | |
The Upstate 8 folks were involved in the gold pool. | 0:40:28 | 0:40:31 | |
In other words, they put their monies together, | 0:40:31 | 0:40:34 | |
in order to create a larger sum of money, in order to get a bigger | 0:40:34 | 0:40:38 | |
investment back. Investment into what? | 0:40:38 | 0:40:42 | |
The gold mines. And these gold mines, where are they? | 0:40:42 | 0:40:46 | |
In Africa. | 0:40:46 | 0:40:48 | |
Is there, in fact, any mining going on? | 0:40:48 | 0:40:51 | |
I couldn't tell you for sure. | 0:40:51 | 0:40:53 | |
And Lady Bird is the architect behind this? Yes. | 0:40:53 | 0:40:57 | |
Seaview Beach. 256. | 0:40:57 | 0:41:00 | |
Is there anybody living in there now? | 0:41:07 | 0:41:09 | |
Downstairs. Ah, you can walk in? | 0:41:09 | 0:41:11 | |
DOG BARKS | 0:41:17 | 0:41:19 | |
Ah. | 0:41:23 | 0:41:25 | |
John stayed on the couch with Louisa. | 0:41:25 | 0:41:27 | |
To me, | 0:41:31 | 0:41:33 | |
Louisa was kind of like a puppet, so to speak. | 0:41:33 | 0:41:36 | |
You know, if her dad said, "Do this," she would do it. | 0:41:36 | 0:41:39 | |
Or if LB said, "Do this," she would do it. | 0:41:39 | 0:41:41 | |
Other than that, she didn't do anything. | 0:41:41 | 0:41:43 | |
So, she was like the servant of Lady Bird and her father? | 0:41:43 | 0:41:46 | |
Yeah. There's the rocking chair that Lady Bird stayed in. | 0:41:46 | 0:41:50 | |
She would come out and go to her chair, | 0:41:50 | 0:41:53 | |
and from there, people fixed her food or drinks, whatever. | 0:41:53 | 0:41:56 | |
In the beginning, | 0:42:00 | 0:42:01 | |
I thought John Dalli was really 100%, you know. | 0:42:01 | 0:42:04 | |
100% what? | 0:42:04 | 0:42:06 | |
For real, you know. | 0:42:06 | 0:42:09 | |
You've got to remember, we were being told that Lady Bird was part | 0:42:09 | 0:42:12 | |
of this gold family. I also picked up the... | 0:42:12 | 0:42:17 | |
This Dragon family's confirmation of identity for you. | 0:42:17 | 0:42:21 | |
Did Lady Bird claim to be, you know... | 0:42:22 | 0:42:25 | |
She was introduced to us as the granddaughter | 0:42:27 | 0:42:32 | |
of the Asian family's patriarch. | 0:42:32 | 0:42:37 | |
And that John Dalli was her right-hand person. | 0:42:38 | 0:42:43 | |
She didn't do anything unless John Dalli said it was OK. Mm. | 0:42:43 | 0:42:47 | |
So, you know, that gave us validity | 0:42:47 | 0:42:50 | |
for John Dalli and for Lady Bird. | 0:42:50 | 0:42:52 | |
Did you discuss these gold families with John Dalli? | 0:42:52 | 0:42:55 | |
Yes. | 0:42:55 | 0:42:56 | |
This thing goes so deep I can't possibly remember | 0:43:02 | 0:43:05 | |
everything to tell you. It keeps coming up, you know. | 0:43:05 | 0:43:08 | |
Her real name is Marie Eloise Corbin. | 0:43:11 | 0:43:14 | |
She's a US citizen. | 0:43:14 | 0:43:16 | |
She changes her identity every so often, | 0:43:16 | 0:43:19 | |
and in fact I received copies of an identity card she uses - | 0:43:19 | 0:43:23 | |
a Filipino passport. | 0:43:23 | 0:43:25 | |
It's ridiculous, because there's her face, | 0:43:25 | 0:43:29 | |
and she's clearly a Western woman with blonde hair, and blue eyes, | 0:43:29 | 0:43:34 | |
and very Western features and with a Filipino name. | 0:43:34 | 0:43:37 | |
Morning. | 0:44:06 | 0:44:09 | |
Morning, Mr Dalli. | 0:44:09 | 0:44:11 | |
Nice to see you. Morning. | 0:44:11 | 0:44:14 | |
Good morning. | 0:44:14 | 0:44:15 | |
What I simply do not understand, we have in the house in the Bahamas | 0:44:19 | 0:44:26 | |
this strange character known as Lady Bird. | 0:44:26 | 0:44:31 | |
For me, she was not strange. | 0:44:31 | 0:44:33 | |
For me, she was somebody very buoyant... | 0:44:33 | 0:44:37 | |
Did you know that she was using multiple identities? | 0:44:37 | 0:44:40 | |
No, I don't know. | 0:44:40 | 0:44:43 | |
I didn't know. | 0:44:43 | 0:44:44 | |
Because she has names like Mary Swan, Eloise Corbin... | 0:44:44 | 0:44:48 | |
I never called her by any of those names. | 0:44:48 | 0:44:51 | |
What did you call her? | 0:44:51 | 0:44:53 | |
She was called Lady Bird. | 0:44:53 | 0:44:56 | |
Lady Bird was her nickname and we knew her as Lady Bird. | 0:44:56 | 0:44:59 | |
You had no idea that she was a fraudster? | 0:45:02 | 0:45:04 | |
No idea. Do you believe her to be a fraudster today? | 0:45:04 | 0:45:09 | |
I have no proof that she is a fraudster today. | 0:45:09 | 0:45:12 | |
They must have known she was a fraudster, | 0:45:12 | 0:45:15 | |
because she came to Malta out of a prison in Thailand, | 0:45:15 | 0:45:18 | |
and her documents did not show her real name. | 0:45:18 | 0:45:22 | |
There is no way they could have not found out she was a fraudster. | 0:45:22 | 0:45:25 | |
What about her being in prison in Thailand? | 0:45:25 | 0:45:28 | |
I knew about that and that was a question of | 0:45:31 | 0:45:35 | |
problems with her passport. | 0:45:35 | 0:45:37 | |
Because of her fake identities? | 0:45:37 | 0:45:39 | |
No, I don't know about fake identities. | 0:45:39 | 0:45:42 | |
She was posing as a Filipino, using a Filipino passport? | 0:45:42 | 0:45:44 | |
I don't know the details, | 0:45:44 | 0:45:46 | |
but I knew that it was something to do with her passport. | 0:45:46 | 0:45:48 | |
What is this document showing? | 0:45:54 | 0:45:56 | |
This was an annual audit, so at the end of December the 31st, | 0:45:56 | 0:46:03 | |
OK, Janie, she shows that she has $55,583.32 | 0:46:03 | 0:46:09 | |
transferred to Claire Gauci Borda, | 0:46:09 | 0:46:13 | |
John Dalli's daughter. | 0:46:13 | 0:46:14 | |
And this is signed by John Dalli's daughter? Correct. | 0:46:14 | 0:46:19 | |
OK. One American is writing, "My name is Janie B Moore..." Uh-huh. | 0:46:19 | 0:46:23 | |
"..and I wish to report a scam that I have been taken into | 0:46:23 | 0:46:28 | |
"by a group in Malta." Yes. | 0:46:28 | 0:46:30 | |
That's through Daphne Caruana Galizia. | 0:46:30 | 0:46:32 | |
She has been contacted by Daphne Caruana Galizia, | 0:46:32 | 0:46:35 | |
and brainwashed by her. Completely. | 0:46:35 | 0:46:38 | |
"The ones..." Continue. | 0:46:38 | 0:46:41 | |
"The ones I am aware of are Mary Swann, known as Lady Bird..." | 0:46:41 | 0:46:45 | |
Mm-hm. | 0:46:45 | 0:46:47 | |
"And Claire Gauci Borda and Louisa Dalli." | 0:46:47 | 0:46:52 | |
Mm-hm. That must be you? | 0:46:52 | 0:46:54 | |
Mm-hm. Yes, yes, yes, yes. Uh-huh. | 0:46:54 | 0:46:57 | |
"I have sent 11 wire transfers to the HSBC in Malta..." | 0:46:58 | 0:47:04 | |
Uh-huh. | 0:47:04 | 0:47:05 | |
"..for a total amount of $409,000." | 0:47:05 | 0:47:11 | |
Mm-hm. That's her life pension. | 0:47:11 | 0:47:13 | |
"We were told we were investing in gold and other precious metals, | 0:47:15 | 0:47:19 | |
"and we would receive 10% interest and a bonus at the end of the year." | 0:47:19 | 0:47:25 | |
Did they receive any interest? | 0:47:26 | 0:47:29 | |
No. | 0:47:29 | 0:47:30 | |
"All the earnings were rolled over until I received a letter saying | 0:47:33 | 0:47:38 | |
"that Lady Bird was a fraudster and I had been taken in by a scam." | 0:47:38 | 0:47:45 | |
This is all, OK. | 0:47:45 | 0:47:46 | |
The set up again | 0:47:46 | 0:47:50 | |
by Kessler and Daphne Caruana Galizia, OK. | 0:47:50 | 0:47:53 | |
These people were simply brainwashed. | 0:47:53 | 0:47:56 | |
They lost their money. | 0:47:56 | 0:47:58 | |
I... Well... So many people lose their money. | 0:47:58 | 0:48:01 | |
I mean, what the hell are you talking about? | 0:48:01 | 0:48:04 | |
"I have proof of all wire transfers, our payments to Malta, | 0:48:04 | 0:48:07 | |
"correspondence with... | 0:48:07 | 0:48:11 | |
"..Louisa Dalli." You never had any correspondence with them? | 0:48:12 | 0:48:16 | |
That is not true. | 0:48:16 | 0:48:18 | |
I never corresponded with her. | 0:48:18 | 0:48:22 | |
Your daughters were involved in the management? So what? | 0:48:22 | 0:48:26 | |
Were they...? My daughters... Listen, listen. | 0:48:26 | 0:48:29 | |
My daughters have their own company and their own business - so what? | 0:48:29 | 0:48:33 | |
But, please... And Kessler is trying to make the point that, | 0:48:33 | 0:48:36 | |
because they used that address, that I'm involved, | 0:48:36 | 0:48:39 | |
which is completely stupid. | 0:48:39 | 0:48:40 | |
Now my question is, these people... | 0:48:41 | 0:48:47 | |
never met my father. | 0:48:47 | 0:48:51 | |
What interest do these people have to... | 0:48:51 | 0:48:56 | |
..do harm to my father? | 0:48:57 | 0:49:00 | |
Let's stay on the question your daughter asked. | 0:49:00 | 0:49:04 | |
Why do these Christian American pensioners, | 0:49:04 | 0:49:08 | |
why do they want to hurt you? | 0:49:08 | 0:49:12 | |
Because...because they were roped in by Kessler, | 0:49:12 | 0:49:15 | |
and Daphne Caruana Galizia, who is one of my arch enemies in Malta. | 0:49:15 | 0:49:21 | |
I mean, this is all another... | 0:49:21 | 0:49:24 | |
another Kessler...Kessler... | 0:49:24 | 0:49:27 | |
sting. | 0:49:27 | 0:49:28 | |
Something you also have to explain to me is this strange nexus between | 0:49:30 | 0:49:35 | |
John Dalli, Silvio Zammit and this lawyer named Gayle Kimberley. | 0:49:35 | 0:49:41 | |
So, Gayle Kimberley and Iosif Galea both worked for the lotteries and | 0:49:41 | 0:49:46 | |
gaming authority in Malta, and they no longer do. | 0:49:46 | 0:49:48 | |
They had an affair. | 0:49:48 | 0:49:50 | |
Iosif Galea was very close to Silvio Zammit, | 0:49:50 | 0:49:54 | |
and also very close to John Dalli. | 0:49:54 | 0:49:56 | |
In fact, I have a photo, which I published, | 0:49:56 | 0:49:58 | |
of them travelling in Italy together. | 0:49:58 | 0:50:00 | |
Iosif Galea, Silvio Zammit and John Dalli. | 0:50:00 | 0:50:02 | |
Gayle Kimberley's involvement was tangential. | 0:50:02 | 0:50:05 | |
She became involved simply because she was having an affair | 0:50:05 | 0:50:09 | |
with Iosif Galea, and then later was subject to blackmail - | 0:50:09 | 0:50:12 | |
she couldn't... But she was the one | 0:50:12 | 0:50:14 | |
who was in contact with the Swedish Match? | 0:50:14 | 0:50:16 | |
Yes, yes. She got in touch with Swedish Match | 0:50:16 | 0:50:19 | |
as an independent consultant. They would not... | 0:50:19 | 0:50:22 | |
They wouldn't have known that she was sleeping with Iosif Galea, | 0:50:22 | 0:50:25 | |
who is part of a whole cabal with John Dalli and Silvio Zammit. | 0:50:25 | 0:50:30 | |
I had a very brief conversation with Gayle Kimberley. | 0:50:35 | 0:50:38 | |
Uh-huh. On the phone. Uh-huh. | 0:50:38 | 0:50:40 | |
And she did not want to meet with us, | 0:50:40 | 0:50:44 | |
talk to us, and I said, "But why?" | 0:50:44 | 0:50:47 | |
you know, and then she said... | 0:50:47 | 0:50:50 | |
"No, because they are powerful people," she said. | 0:50:50 | 0:50:54 | |
Something in that line. | 0:50:54 | 0:50:57 | |
When you mentioned Zammit and Iosif... | 0:50:57 | 0:51:01 | |
Iosif Galea. She sounds...afraid. | 0:51:01 | 0:51:05 | |
But you wouldn't have said Zammit was powerful - | 0:51:09 | 0:51:12 | |
Zammit is not powerful here. | 0:51:12 | 0:51:14 | |
You met Zammit. Yeah, yeah. We met him. | 0:51:14 | 0:51:17 | |
What is that? | 0:51:20 | 0:51:21 | |
You're not going to... Do not... | 0:51:21 | 0:51:24 | |
It's a naked woman. | 0:51:24 | 0:51:26 | |
It's she. It's Gayle Kimberley? | 0:51:26 | 0:51:29 | |
Don't say nothing in front of the cameras. | 0:51:35 | 0:51:38 | |
Because it's illegal. | 0:51:38 | 0:51:40 | |
Those are to show you... | 0:51:41 | 0:51:44 | |
to show my evidence for the court. Mm-hm. | 0:51:44 | 0:51:46 | |
Because I have all the evidence, you know. | 0:51:46 | 0:51:48 | |
PHONE RINGS | 0:51:48 | 0:51:52 | |
Hello? This is journalist Mads Brugger, | 0:51:52 | 0:51:55 | |
calling for Gayle Kimberley. | 0:51:55 | 0:51:58 | |
Yes, this is Gayle. I have been to Malta several times, | 0:51:58 | 0:52:02 | |
speaking with Silvio Zammit. He has... | 0:52:02 | 0:52:05 | |
He walks around with this folder | 0:52:05 | 0:52:08 | |
with everything, that according to him... | 0:52:08 | 0:52:12 | |
Who, Silvio Zammit? | 0:52:12 | 0:52:14 | |
Silvio Zammit walks around with this folder, this file, | 0:52:14 | 0:52:17 | |
which contains everything that, according to him, | 0:52:17 | 0:52:20 | |
proves how innocent he is, | 0:52:20 | 0:52:22 | |
and inside that file is a picture of you in your underwear. | 0:52:22 | 0:52:25 | |
Oh, my God. Seriously? When did they take pictures of me in my underwear? | 0:52:27 | 0:52:31 | |
No, I was not aware. Erm... You see, it is making me very anxious. | 0:52:31 | 0:52:36 | |
I'm sorry, but I don't want to discuss this any more. | 0:52:36 | 0:52:40 | |
I had no idea they fabricated e-mails... | 0:52:40 | 0:52:43 | |
Can I ask you, was he blackmailing you? Ah, I cannot... | 0:52:43 | 0:52:47 | |
Can I ask you...? This is just to get the facts straight. | 0:52:47 | 0:52:51 | |
Erm, I really need to go, I can't... | 0:52:51 | 0:52:54 | |
Anyway, I am coming back... No, thank you for your work. | 0:52:54 | 0:52:58 | |
It's from a holiday or...? | 0:53:01 | 0:53:04 | |
In Italy? I mean, that's a picture, OK? | 0:53:04 | 0:53:06 | |
That I take. I have thousands of pictures with people. | 0:53:06 | 0:53:10 | |
Yeah. People have to come to me, we're in parties, | 0:53:10 | 0:53:12 | |
and things like that, and I will... No, they take pictures. | 0:53:12 | 0:53:16 | |
That's it. But there is no closeness. | 0:53:16 | 0:53:19 | |
I don't have any business dealings with Zammit. | 0:53:19 | 0:53:22 | |
I mean, I don't have any... | 0:53:22 | 0:53:24 | |
Nothing. Understand? | 0:53:24 | 0:53:26 | |
And Zammit never represented me in anything, never. | 0:53:27 | 0:53:31 | |
"Remember, you are dealing with a real businessman now. | 0:53:47 | 0:53:50 | |
"Not a fool. | 0:53:50 | 0:53:52 | |
First you send me a small sample of..." | 0:53:52 | 0:53:54 | |
"A real businessman now. | 0:53:55 | 0:53:58 | |
"Not a fool." | 0:53:58 | 0:54:00 | |
"No funny, | 0:54:02 | 0:54:05 | |
"no money." | 0:54:05 | 0:54:07 | |
"Send me a sample of material..." | 0:54:09 | 0:54:12 | |
"I thank you for the opportunity to talk about the Bahamas, | 0:54:17 | 0:54:21 | |
"and crush the insinuations and defamation that were being bandied | 0:54:21 | 0:54:25 | |
"about by Kessler, Daphne Caruana Galizia and their cohorts." | 0:54:25 | 0:54:30 | |
"Please allow me to call when I reach Europe. | 0:55:25 | 0:55:28 | |
"I am positive we shall be friends forever after this." Yes. | 0:55:28 | 0:55:32 | |
"Looking forward to being best | 0:55:38 | 0:55:42 | |
"friends with you." | 0:55:42 | 0:55:46 | |
Best friends forever. | 0:55:46 | 0:55:49 | |
PHONE RINGS | 0:56:00 | 0:56:03 | |
SECOND VOICE DISTORTED | 0:56:07 | 0:56:10 | |
MUSIC: Piano Sonata No. 14 in C-sharp minor "Moonlight" by Ludwig Van Beethoven | 0:57:06 | 0:57:13 | |
Star Wars, Harry Potter, | 0:58:38 | 0:58:40 |