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I'm Ben Brown in the Zimbabwean
capital, Harare, where very shortly, | 0:00:22 | 0:00:29 | |
we're expecting the country's
veteran leader, Robert Mugabe, | 0:00:29 | 0:00:32 | |
to make a live TV address
and announce that he's stepped down | 0:00:32 | 0:00:35 | |
from the presidency. | 0:00:35 | 0:00:45 | |
ZBC have been trailing for the last
few hours that he is making an | 0:00:48 | 0:00:51 | |
address to the nation and there have
been reports that he is going to | 0:00:51 | 0:00:54 | |
resign. Writers have been saying he
has agreed to submit his resignation | 0:00:54 | 0:01:02 | |
as President. -- Reuters. But we're
still waiting to see whether that | 0:01:02 | 0:01:05 | |
happens. This afternoon, he has been
negotiating with generals here in | 0:01:05 | 0:01:12 | |
Zimbabwe. He has been discussing, as
he has done ever since that military | 0:01:12 | 0:01:17 | |
takeover on Wednesday, with them,
whether he should cling to office. | 0:01:17 | 0:01:22 | |
He has been trying to cling to
office. And here we are now, with | 0:01:22 | 0:01:27 | |
pictures from ZBC, a momentous event
now for the whole of Zimbabwe, will | 0:01:27 | 0:01:34 | |
he resign as President after 37
years? Or will he not? We are about | 0:01:34 | 0:01:41 | |
to hear from Robert Mugabe himself
at last. An extraordinary moment for | 0:01:41 | 0:01:49 | |
this country, the whole country
waiting and watching to see what | 0:01:49 | 0:01:56 | |
happens. He has already been deposed
by his own party. Will he go as | 0:01:56 | 0:02:02 | |
President? | 0:02:02 | 0:02:07 | |
C an now from Robert Mugabe. -- let
us hear now. | 0:02:13 | 0:02:19 | |
Fellows about wins. I --
Zimbabweans. I address you tonight | 0:02:42 | 0:02:49 | |
on the back of a meeting I held
today with the nation's security | 0:02:49 | 0:02:55 | |
forces command element. This
meeting, which was facilitated by a | 0:02:55 | 0:03:14 | |
mediating team, followed an
operation mounted by the Sinbad Way | 0:03:14 | 0:03:22 | |
defence forces -- Zimbabwe defence
forces in the week that has gone by, | 0:03:22 | 0:03:28 | |
and which was triggered by concerns
arising from the reading of the | 0:03:28 | 0:03:34 | |
state of affairs in our country and
in the rulings -- the ruling Zanu-PF | 0:03:34 | 0:03:40 | |
party. Whatever the pros and cons,
the way they went about registering | 0:03:40 | 0:03:50 | |
those concerns, I is the President
of Zimbabwe, and as their | 0:03:50 | 0:03:58 | |
Commander-in-Chief, do acknowledge
the issues they have drawn my | 0:03:58 | 0:04:03 | |
attention to. And I do believe that
these were raised in the spirit of | 0:04:03 | 0:04:11 | |
honesty and out of deep
anti-patriotic concern for the | 0:04:11 | 0:04:20 | |
stability of our nation. -- deep and
patriotic concern. As I address you, | 0:04:20 | 0:04:28 | |
I am also aware of a whole range of
concerns which have come from you | 0:04:28 | 0:04:37 | |
all as citizens of our great
country. | 0:04:37 | 0:04:48 | |
Today's meeting with the command
element has underscored the need for | 0:04:50 | 0:04:56 | |
us to collectively start processes
that return our nation to normalcy. | 0:04:56 | 0:05:08 | |
So, all our people can go about
their business unhindered in an | 0:05:08 | 0:05:16 | |
environment of perfect peace and
security, assured that law and order | 0:05:16 | 0:05:24 | |
will prevail as before, and endure
well into the future. If there is | 0:05:24 | 0:05:37 | |
anyone, any one observation we have
made and drawn from events of the | 0:05:37 | 0:05:41 | |
past week, it is the unshakeable
pedestal upon which rests our state | 0:05:41 | 0:05:51 | |
of peace, law and order, amply
indicating that as Zimbabwe ends, we | 0:05:51 | 0:06:03 | |
are generally a peaceably disposed
people, and given to expressing | 0:06:03 | 0:06:13 | |
grievances and resolving our
differences by ourselves, and with | 0:06:13 | 0:06:16 | |
the level of dignity, discipline of
restraint so rare to many other | 0:06:16 | 0:06:23 | |
nations. This is to be admired.
Indeed, such traits must form the | 0:06:23 | 0:06:38 | |
pith of our personality and national
character. A veritable resource we | 0:06:38 | 0:06:44 | |
summon and draw upon in times of
vices are dudes. -- vicissitudes. | 0:06:44 | 0:06:53 | |
The opposition I have alluded to did
not amount to a threat to our well | 0:06:53 | 0:07:00 | |
cherished constitutional order. Nor
was it a challenge to my authority | 0:07:00 | 0:07:06 | |
as head of state and government. Not
even as Commander-in-Chief of the | 0:07:06 | 0:07:14 | |
Zimbabwe defence forces. To the man,
the command element remained | 0:07:14 | 0:07:23 | |
respectful. And comported with the
dictates and moors of | 0:07:23 | 0:07:36 | |
constitutionalism. True, a few
incidents may have occurred here and | 0:07:36 | 0:07:47 | |
there, but these are being
corrected. I'm happy that throughout | 0:07:47 | 0:07:51 | |
the short period, the pillars of
state remained functional. Even | 0:07:51 | 0:08:01 | |
happier for me and arising from
today's meeting in a strong sense, | 0:08:01 | 0:08:10 | |
is a strong sense of collegiality
and comradeship. This should redound | 0:08:10 | 0:08:31 | |
to greater peace and an abiding
sense of security in communities and | 0:08:31 | 0:08:43 | |
in our entire nation. Among the
issues discussed is that relating to | 0:08:43 | 0:08:57 | |
our economy, which as we all know is
going through a difficult patch. Our | 0:08:57 | 0:09:07 | |
great concern... | 0:09:07 | 0:09:18 | |
I beg your pardon. Of greater
concern is spats between | 0:09:32 | 0:09:43 | |
high-ranking officials in the party
and government, exacerbated by | 0:09:43 | 0:09:48 | |
multiple conflicting messages from
both the party and government, major | 0:09:48 | 0:09:55 | |
criticisms levelled against us
inescapable. Amidst all this, | 0:09:55 | 0:10:06 | |
flagship projects already adopted by
government stood stalled, or mired | 0:10:06 | 0:10:12 | |
in needless controversy. All this
now has to stop, as we inaugurate a | 0:10:12 | 0:10:21 | |
new work culture, and pace at which
will show a strong sense of purpose | 0:10:21 | 0:10:29 | |
and commitment to turning around our
economy in terms of our policies. | 0:10:29 | 0:10:43 | |
The government remains committed to
improving the social and material | 0:10:43 | 0:10:51 | |
conditions. Material conditions of
the people. The government will soon | 0:10:51 | 0:11:06 | |
unveil an entrepreneurial skills and
business development programme, | 0:11:06 | 0:11:11 | |
which will empower and unleash
gainful projects at our growth | 0:11:11 | 0:11:19 | |
points and growth areas.
Zimbabweans, we are a nation born | 0:11:19 | 0:11:27 | |
out of a protracted struggle for
national independence. Our rules | 0:11:27 | 0:11:34 | |
like in that struggle whose goals
and ideals must guide our present | 0:11:34 | 0:11:45 | |
and structure our future. The
tradition of resistance is our | 0:11:45 | 0:11:51 | |
collective legacy, whose core tenets
must be subscribed by all across | 0:11:51 | 0:12:03 | |
generations and across times.
Indeed, these two -- this also was a | 0:12:03 | 0:12:11 | |
great concern for our commanders,
who themselves were natives of that | 0:12:11 | 0:12:18 | |
revolution and often Bradbury tender
ages and at great personal peril. We | 0:12:18 | 0:12:23 | |
still have in our various
communities veterans of that funding | 0:12:23 | 0:12:31 | |
struggle. Who might have found that
the prevailing management of | 0:12:31 | 0:12:42 | |
national and party issues quite
alienating. This must be corrected | 0:12:42 | 0:12:47 | |
without delay, including ensuring
that these veterans continue to play | 0:12:47 | 0:12:56 | |
central roles in the lives of our
nation. We must all recognise that | 0:12:56 | 0:13:08 | |
their participation in the war of
liberation exacted lifelong costs. | 0:13:08 | 0:13:19 | |
Which whilst hardly repayable may
still be assuaged and ameliorative. | 0:13:19 | 0:13:32 | |
-- ameliorated. In respect of the
party, and the party issues raised | 0:13:32 | 0:13:39 | |
both by the commanders and by the
general membership of Zanu-PF, there | 0:13:39 | 0:13:43 | |
are also stand acknowledged. They
have to be attended to with a great | 0:13:43 | 0:13:55 | |
sense of urgency. However, I am
aware that as a party of liberation, | 0:13:55 | 0:14:04 | |
Zanu-PF has over the years written
elaborate rules and procedures that | 0:14:04 | 0:14:12 | |
guide the operations of all its
organs and personnel. Indeed, the | 0:14:12 | 0:14:23 | |
current criticism raised, raised
against the command element... | 0:14:23 | 0:14:32 | |
Raised against it by the command
element and some of its members have | 0:14:32 | 0:14:39 | |
a reason from well funding
perception that the party was | 0:14:39 | 0:14:46 | |
stretching or even failing in its
own rules and procedures. -- well | 0:14:46 | 0:14:55 | |
funded perception. The way forward,
thus, cannot be based on swapping, | 0:14:55 | 0:15:07 | |
or riding roughshod over party rules
and procedures. There has to be a | 0:15:07 | 0:15:14 | |
net return to the guiding principles
of our party, as enshrined in its | 0:15:14 | 0:15:22 | |
constitution. Which must apply
fairly and equitably in all | 0:15:22 | 0:15:33 | |
situations and before all members.
The era of victimisation and | 0:15:33 | 0:15:42 | |
arbitrary decisions must be put
behind. As we all embrace a new | 0:15:42 | 0:15:57 | |
ethos, predicated on the supreme
rule of our party, and nourished by | 0:15:57 | 0:16:04 | |
an abiding sense of camaraderie. To
all this must be general recognition | 0:16:04 | 0:16:16 | |
that Zanu-PF is a party of
traditions, and has been served by | 0:16:16 | 0:16:29 | |
successive generations who are bound
together by shared ideals and | 0:16:29 | 0:16:38 | |
values, which must continue to reign
supreme in our nation. | 0:16:38 | 0:16:53 | |
Intergenerational conflict must be
resolved through harmonised melding | 0:16:57 | 0:17:04 | |
of old established players, as they
embrace and welcome new rules, new | 0:17:04 | 0:17:16 | |
ones through a well-defined sense of
hierarchy and succession. Indeed, | 0:17:16 | 0:17:26 | |
all these matters will be discussed
and settled at the forthcoming | 0:17:26 | 0:17:35 | |
congress, within the framework of a
clear road map that seeks to resolve | 0:17:35 | 0:17:42 | |
once and for all any missions or
contradictions -- omissions that | 0:17:42 | 0:17:51 | |
have affected our party negatively.
The Congress is due in a few weeks | 0:17:51 | 0:18:05 | |
from now. I will preside over its
processes, which must not be | 0:18:05 | 0:18:11 | |
pre-possessed by any acts calculated
to undermine it, or to compromise | 0:18:11 | 0:18:21 | |
the outcomes in the eyes of the
public. As I conclude this address, | 0:18:21 | 0:18:28 | |
I am aware that many developments
have occurred in the party, or have | 0:18:28 | 0:18:37 | |
been championed and done by
individuals in the name of the | 0:18:37 | 0:18:44 | |
party. Given the failings of the
past, and the anger this might have | 0:18:44 | 0:18:53 | |
triggered in some quarters, such as
developments... Such developments | 0:18:53 | 0:19:03 | |
are quite understandable. However we
cannot be guided by bitterness or | 0:19:03 | 0:19:13 | |
vengefulness, both of which would
not make us any better party members | 0:19:13 | 0:19:26 | |
or any better Zimbabweans. Our
hallowed policy of re-conciliation | 0:19:26 | 0:19:40 | |
was pronounced in 1980, and through
which we reached out to those who | 0:19:40 | 0:19:45 | |
had occupied and oppressed us for
nearly a century. And those who had | 0:19:45 | 0:19:56 | |
traded fire with in a bitter war.
Surely they cannot be unavailable to | 0:19:56 | 0:20:09 | |
our own, both in the party and in
our nation. We must learn to forgive | 0:20:09 | 0:20:18 | |
and resolve contradictions, real or
perceived, in a comradely, | 0:20:18 | 0:20:31 | |
Zimbabwean spirit. I am confident
that from tonight, our whole nation, | 0:20:31 | 0:20:37 | |
at all levels, gets refocused as we
put shoulder to the wheel amidst the | 0:20:37 | 0:20:48 | |
promising agricultural season
already upon us. Let us all move | 0:20:48 | 0:20:57 | |
forward, reminding ourselves of our
wartime mantra. I think you, and | 0:20:57 | 0:21:13 | |
good night. -- thank U. | 0:21:13 | 0:21:16 | |
It is a long speech.
APPLAUSE | 0:21:30 | 0:21:37 | |
OK, thanks.
Robert Mugabe with an absolutely | 0:21:50 | 0:21:59 | |
extraordinary speech to the nation.
It was expected that he would | 0:21:59 | 0:22:04 | |
announce his resignation, but he has
not done that. It was a lawn and | 0:22:04 | 0:22:09 | |
typically rambling address to the
nation from Robert Mugabe. -- long. | 0:22:09 | 0:22:15 | |
He was flanked by some of the
generals he has been negotiating | 0:22:15 | 0:22:18 | |
with. It had been reported he would
announce his resignation, but he has | 0:22:18 | 0:22:21 | |
not done that. Let us take you
through a few of the things. This | 0:22:21 | 0:22:26 | |
was after a day of extraordinary
pressure on him, in which he was | 0:22:26 | 0:22:31 | |
dismissed by his own party, Zanu-PF,
and they then gave him an ultimatum | 0:22:31 | 0:22:35 | |
that if he didn't resign by midday
tomorrow, he was effectively going | 0:22:35 | 0:22:39 | |
to be forced out of office by an
impeachment process that will now | 0:22:39 | 0:22:43 | |
begin, because he is not going. He
talked about the military takeover | 0:22:43 | 0:22:47 | |
that there has been here, he said he
believed the takeover had been | 0:22:47 | 0:22:56 | |
undertaken out of honesty and
patriotic concern for the stability | 0:22:56 | 0:22:59 | |
of our nation. Slightly incredibly,
he said he did not believe that | 0:22:59 | 0:23:03 | |
military takeover was an attempt to
undermine his authority as head of | 0:23:03 | 0:23:09 | |
state. Not a challenge to my
authority as head of state, he said | 0:23:09 | 0:23:13 | |
that we cannot be guided by
bitterness or vengefulness, we must | 0:23:13 | 0:23:17 | |
learn to forgive and resolve
contradictions. That is move | 0:23:17 | 0:23:23 | |
forward. So, lots of generalities,
frankly a lot of waffle, to be | 0:23:23 | 0:23:28 | |
honest, from President Mugabe, he is
still President of this country for | 0:23:28 | 0:23:33 | |
the time being at least, but maybe
not for very much longer. He has | 0:23:33 | 0:23:37 | |
been deposed as party leader,
deposed as the leader of Zanu-PF, | 0:23:37 | 0:23:44 | |
but he is still technically
President until either he resigns | 0:23:44 | 0:23:49 | |
from office, which he has
steadfastly refused to do, against | 0:23:49 | 0:23:52 | |
all expectations, and despite the
pressure on him from the people with | 0:23:52 | 0:23:58 | |
their demonstration yesterday, with
the Army and from Zanu-PF itself, he | 0:23:58 | 0:24:02 | |
is staying put, it seems. Let us get
some reaction to that speech from | 0:24:02 | 0:24:07 | |
one of the people who demonstrated
yesterday here in Harare. She is an | 0:24:07 | 0:24:14 | |
offer and a neurosurgeon here. --
she is on offer. You might yesterday | 0:24:14 | 0:24:20 | |
demanding he stood done, what did
you think of that speech? It is | 0:24:20 | 0:24:23 | |
interesting, for many of us who are
a little older, Mugabe came onto the | 0:24:23 | 0:24:28 | |
international stage in 1980 with an
incredibly eloquent speech, we will | 0:24:28 | 0:24:31 | |
-- we were very proud and it is
interesting he should go out of the | 0:24:31 | 0:24:36 | |
stage with and also eloquent speech.
But he hasn't gone out of the stage, | 0:24:36 | 0:24:41 | |
he hasn't resign. We are entering a
post McGothigan Europe. Whatever the | 0:24:41 | 0:24:45 | |
speech was tonight, if you saw what
happened on the streets yesterday, | 0:24:45 | 0:24:50 | |
both at the war veterans' mass rally
and on the streets of Zimbabwe, | 0:24:50 | 0:24:56 | |
people were buoyant, we are entering
an area -- an era of inclusivity. We | 0:24:56 | 0:25:00 | |
can never go back. By people were
reporting he would say in this | 0:25:00 | 0:25:05 | |
address on TV, I resign as
President, I resign out head of | 0:25:05 | 0:25:10 | |
state. I think there is a tricky
element here, which is that on the | 0:25:10 | 0:25:14 | |
one hand there must be any
appearance of coercion on the part | 0:25:14 | 0:25:16 | |
of the military. And I think perhaps
flanked by the generals, resignation | 0:25:16 | 0:25:26 | |
may have been perceived by that way.
I think what is happening right now | 0:25:26 | 0:25:30 | |
in Zanu-PF is a political process
and a political solution. We are | 0:25:30 | 0:25:36 | |
entering a post-Mugabe era. I hope
Zimbabweans are not deflated by | 0:25:36 | 0:25:40 | |
this. They must know we have began a
process that will move forward. But | 0:25:40 | 0:25:44 | |
they will be deflated because you
know that the expectation that was | 0:25:44 | 0:25:48 | |
raised with that demonstration here
that you took part in, they demanded | 0:25:48 | 0:25:53 | |
his resignation and they thought
they would get it tonight. Like I | 0:25:53 | 0:26:00 | |
said, I think people will feel
deflated, but the spirit was | 0:26:00 | 0:26:02 | |
incredible, the demands where there,
but Zimbabweans are so patient, this | 0:26:02 | 0:26:05 | |
is our kind of coup, or not coup, it
is our kind of process and I really | 0:26:05 | 0:26:10 | |
don't think there is any doubt that
Mugabe will go. Is he going to be | 0:26:10 | 0:26:16 | |
impeached now? That is what Zanu-PF
have said, if he doesn't go by | 0:26:16 | 0:26:20 | |
midday tomorrow, local time, the
Parliament will start impeaching him | 0:26:20 | 0:26:27 | |
straightaway. I think that political
process has already begun. You have | 0:26:27 | 0:26:31 | |
ten out of ten provinces casting a
no vote, he was removed as head of | 0:26:31 | 0:26:37 | |
the party, it is just a matter of
another final hurdle before he is | 0:26:37 | 0:26:40 | |
impeached. He is pretty stubborn,
all this pressure, and the party and | 0:26:40 | 0:26:44 | |
the army, the people and still he
will not go. 37 years of power, I | 0:26:44 | 0:26:50 | |
don't think it has even sunk in
psychologically, there was not real | 0:26:50 | 0:26:55 | |
cognition that he is no longer in
power. The military intervention, he | 0:26:55 | 0:26:59 | |
said, was not a challenge to his
authority. There is no sense of | 0:26:59 | 0:27:03 | |
that. I think the only way it will
come is through the political | 0:27:03 | 0:27:08 | |
process through Zanu-PF. If I have
heard it said he really believes he | 0:27:08 | 0:27:15 | |
should die in office, die as
President, that is what he has | 0:27:15 | 0:27:17 | |
already assumed. He is just not
prepared to stand down. We have 14 | 0:27:17 | 0:27:25 | |
million people who deserve to have a
fresh voice, they deserve something | 0:27:25 | 0:27:28 | |
better. So it is not about what
Mugabe wants, to die in office, I | 0:27:28 | 0:27:34 | |
think the world would agree that is
a completely unrealistic | 0:27:34 | 0:27:37 | |
expectation. And our country cannot
be held hostage by the dreams of a | 0:27:37 | 0:27:42 | |
single human being. If he doesn't
go, will people march again like | 0:27:42 | 0:27:46 | |
they did yesterday? We saw so many
people on the streets, there was a | 0:27:46 | 0:27:51 | |
euphoric atmosphere. It was a
euphoric atmosphere. But winds have | 0:27:51 | 0:27:55 | |
lost their voice and they found it.
On the streets were blacks and | 0:27:55 | 0:28:02 | |
whites, farmers, maids, gardeners,
people from all stripes. It is not | 0:28:02 | 0:28:06 | |
necessary, I think, for us to march
again, I think the message has been | 0:28:06 | 0:28:09 | |
heard. People heard cars. Mr Mugabe
didn't hear it you, it seems! Is a | 0:28:09 | 0:28:19 | |
-- people heard cars. Good to talk
to you. A demonstrator yesterday and | 0:28:19 | 0:28:30 | |
maybe a demonstrator again. Let's go
to Milton Nkosi. He is in | 0:28:30 | 0:28:35 | |
Johannesburg. I know you have met
Robert Mugabe down the years, you | 0:28:35 | 0:28:39 | |
have followed his career closely.
What do you make of this speech? | 0:28:39 | 0:28:45 | |
Pretty bizarre, wasn't it? Pretty
rambling. Anyone who was hoping he | 0:28:45 | 0:28:49 | |
won't resign, and it is very to say
there were millions who were hoping | 0:28:49 | 0:28:53 | |
that, will be disappointed. Yes
indeed. I hate to say it, but last | 0:28:53 | 0:28:59 | |
time you and I spoke, I said this
guy will fight until the last drop. | 0:28:59 | 0:29:07 | |
They do not come top than this in
life. The writing is on the wall. If | 0:29:07 | 0:29:15 | |
military officers in fatigues
pushing the papers next to him, and | 0:29:15 | 0:29:19 | |
still there is no resignation.
Robert Mugabe will not give in until | 0:29:19 | 0:29:25 | |
he is impeached. There is no other
way now, it is quite clear that he | 0:29:25 | 0:29:29 | |
is holding the line, that he has
been holding all week. So, Milton, | 0:29:29 | 0:29:42 | |
there was so much expectation, I
suppose. How disappointed do you | 0:29:42 | 0:29:47 | |
think ordinary Zimbabweans are going
to be, having heard this address | 0:29:47 | 0:29:52 | |
from President Mugabe after all the
heady atmosphere of a rally | 0:29:52 | 0:29:56 | |
yesterday, the drama of the military
takeover, the drama of Zanu-PF | 0:29:56 | 0:30:01 | |
stripping him of his party
leadership, and all of this in a | 0:30:01 | 0:30:05 | |
sense might be an anti-climax this
evening? | 0:30:05 | 0:30:11 | |
It is a colossal disappointment. I
think across not just Zimbabwe but | 0:30:11 | 0:30:16 | |
the African continent, and indeed
across the world, where people | 0:30:16 | 0:30:18 | |
thought that Robert Mugabe would do
the right thing, he has again stood | 0:30:18 | 0:30:23 | |
his ground and decided that he wants
to die in office. He's only got one | 0:30:23 | 0:30:31 | |
thing in mind. He's going nowhere,
as far as he is concerned. It was | 0:30:31 | 0:30:37 | |
quite interesting, just watching all
the people in the room. There was no | 0:30:37 | 0:30:42 | |
sign of Mrs Grace Mugabe, the person
who actually triggered the sequence | 0:30:42 | 0:30:46 | |
of events we have been following in
the last few days. She was nowhere | 0:30:46 | 0:30:50 | |
to be seen and I wonder where she
was watching this speech from. I | 0:30:50 | 0:30:55 | |
wonder if she had anything to do
with it, given that the president | 0:30:55 | 0:31:00 | |
did not resign, following all the
drama we saw today. Robert Mugabe is | 0:31:00 | 0:31:05 | |
still the president of the Republic
of Zimbabwe. | 0:31:05 | 0:31:09 | |
And what think next now for
Zimbabwe? Inevitable there will be | 0:31:17 | 0:31:24 | |
impeachment. We are hearing from the
war veterans leader, who has been a | 0:31:24 | 0:31:29 | |
leading voice in the campaign to get
rid of Mugabe that the impeachment | 0:31:29 | 0:31:34 | |
process will now begin, as promised
by Zanu-PF, who said if he hadn't | 0:31:34 | 0:31:39 | |
resigned by midday tomorrow,
impeachment would be inevitable. Is | 0:31:39 | 0:31:42 | |
that the way you see it? There are
many options. Robert Mugabe is | 0:31:42 | 0:31:48 | |
hoping he will be presiding, as he
said, over the Congress when it | 0:31:48 | 0:31:54 | |
happens in December. But we know
that Zanu-PF members can't wait for | 0:31:54 | 0:32:01 | |
Tuesday, when Parliament reconvenes,
and that's where they will impeach | 0:32:01 | 0:32:04 | |
him, following their 12 o'clock
deadline on Monday. But also, we saw | 0:32:04 | 0:32:09 | |
that this whole progress was started
by the military. It is now the | 0:32:09 | 0:32:15 | |
chance that the people of Zimbabwe
to lead this process. I think the | 0:32:15 | 0:32:20 | |
military is slightly taking a back
seat here. They are not trying to | 0:32:20 | 0:32:26 | |
put the gun to the head of the
president, because they want this | 0:32:26 | 0:32:31 | |
constitutionally arranged removal
from power. So, if the people pour | 0:32:31 | 0:32:35 | |
out on the streets without being
urged by the military, that will be | 0:32:35 | 0:32:39 | |
a change of approach. But we know
that by midday tomorrow he will have | 0:32:39 | 0:32:45 | |
missed the deadline and impeach --
impeachment proceedings will begin. | 0:32:45 | 0:32:53 | |
In as far as the region is
concerned, they will continue with | 0:32:53 | 0:32:59 | |
their meeting in Rwanda. I think it
is even more important for President | 0:32:59 | 0:33:02 | |
Jacob Zuma to go to Rwanda to talk
about the crisis unfolding in | 0:33:02 | 0:33:09 | |
Zimbabwe. Thank you very much, our
Southern African respondent. We can | 0:33:09 | 0:33:18 | |
now speak to a member of Zanu-PF,
the London representative. | 0:33:18 | 0:33:25 | |
Thank you for being with us. What is
your reaction to the news that he is | 0:33:25 | 0:33:31 | |
refusing to go, against perhaps many
people's expectations and hopes? I | 0:33:31 | 0:33:37 | |
watched the speech with utter
disappointment. President Mugabe has | 0:33:37 | 0:33:41 | |
just rained on Zimbabwe's parade,
really. I think everybody, every one | 0:33:41 | 0:33:47 | |
of my compatriots is downcast,
pretty much heartbroken. I am very | 0:33:47 | 0:33:54 | |
sad, because what will happen from
here now is that humiliation of | 0:33:54 | 0:34:00 | |
President Mugabe, big-time
humiliation, which is something | 0:34:00 | 0:34:03 | |
throughout the week I was saying we
don't need. It is very sad, because | 0:34:03 | 0:34:08 | |
when the evidence of... When the
impeachment evidence comes, it will | 0:34:08 | 0:34:15 | |
be very, very embarrassing and
humiliating and we didn't need to | 0:34:15 | 0:34:18 | |
drag him through this mud but he has
asked for it. As far as he's | 0:34:18 | 0:34:25 | |
concerned, he will preside over
Congress in December. That is | 0:34:25 | 0:34:30 | |
ridiculous! Which Congress? As far
as we are concerned, he is no longer | 0:34:30 | 0:34:34 | |
president of our party. He is done.
The Central committee has made a | 0:34:34 | 0:34:39 | |
decision, he's gone. All ten of them
made the decision he has gone. Who | 0:34:39 | 0:34:48 | |
does he represent, or whose
interests, which constitutes does he | 0:34:48 | 0:34:52 | |
represent Christ on the military
says he has gone. At the moment they | 0:34:52 | 0:34:55 | |
are just holding on to the title of
Commander-in-Chief because... He | 0:34:55 | 0:35:01 | |
hasn't stepped down formally. But in
terms of authority, he doesn't hold | 0:35:01 | 0:35:07 | |
authority over anybody. All he has
is an office but absolutely no | 0:35:07 | 0:35:12 | |
authority. I don't know what he's
playing at. As far as Zanu-PF is | 0:35:12 | 0:35:16 | |
concerned, we have a new leader, the
leader appointed today, Emmerson | 0:35:16 | 0:35:23 | |
Mnangagwa. That is it. Come
Congress, Zanu-PF will confirm a new | 0:35:23 | 0:35:29 | |
leader. The nation has to do what it
has to do. Impeachment has to start | 0:35:29 | 0:35:35 | |
on Tuesday. The opposition and
Zanu-PF are agreed on this, the | 0:35:35 | 0:35:44 | |
president has to step down. About
that impeachment... Just tell us, | 0:35:44 | 0:35:52 | |
how quickly do you think that
impeachment process will take? How | 0:35:52 | 0:35:57 | |
long will it take? Could he be gone
within a few days? What is your | 0:35:57 | 0:36:01 | |
estimate? I think by the end of the
week. What has to happen is the | 0:36:01 | 0:36:07 | |
committee has to be set in place to
investigate the allegations, and | 0:36:07 | 0:36:13 | |
that it has to report back and then
people have to vote on it. That is | 0:36:13 | 0:36:16 | |
pretty much the process. It might
not happen overnight, it might take | 0:36:16 | 0:36:21 | |
a few days. It depends on the
cooperation of all the parties, | 0:36:21 | 0:36:24 | |
anyway.
Are you surprised that Robert Mugabe | 0:36:24 | 0:36:32 | |
has refused to resign? People have
always said he is a stubborn man, | 0:36:32 | 0:36:36 | |
he's a fighter, he's not the sort of
man who just gives in to pressure. | 0:36:36 | 0:36:41 | |
So in many ways, perhaps we
shouldn't have been surprised he | 0:36:41 | 0:36:45 | |
refused to resign. In an interview
this afternoon those were my words, | 0:36:45 | 0:36:51 | |
he is a stubborn man, you cannot
second-guess him. When the address | 0:36:51 | 0:36:56 | |
was announced I thought, OK, he has
relented. But I think he is someone | 0:36:56 | 0:37:01 | |
who I think is going to fight to the
death. He can't do it himself. He | 0:37:01 | 0:37:08 | |
will be 94 in three months, 94
years, and you still want to fight | 0:37:08 | 0:37:14 | |
for your term to take it to 99,
100... Come on. You saw how he was | 0:37:14 | 0:37:20 | |
when he was giving that speech, he
was rumbling. We have tried to | 0:37:20 | 0:37:26 | |
respect, but even our African
mentality cannot take it this far. | 0:37:26 | 0:37:31 | |
We respect our elders and seniority,
but this time round I think... It is | 0:37:31 | 0:37:38 | |
testing Zimbabweans' patients,
testing all the patience of the | 0:37:38 | 0:37:45 | |
country. I want to ask you, how
angry do you think Zimbabweans will | 0:37:45 | 0:37:50 | |
be? We saw that extraordinary
demonstration here in Harare | 0:37:50 | 0:37:54 | |
yesterday, so many thousands on the
streets, euphoric celebrations | 0:37:54 | 0:37:57 | |
because they thought a that it
effectively they had toppled him. | 0:37:57 | 0:38:03 | |
Will they be disappointed and also
angry? We're hearing there is a call | 0:38:03 | 0:38:07 | |
from the war veterans leader for
them to take to the streets again on | 0:38:07 | 0:38:10 | |
Wednesday. I will start by talking
about myself. I am extremely angry, | 0:38:10 | 0:38:19 | |
so if my sentiments and my feelings
reflect that of many Zimbabweans, | 0:38:19 | 0:38:23 | |
it's even worse. I am so
disappointed. I represented his | 0:38:23 | 0:38:29 | |
interest here, I have defended him
all the way, and I expected this to | 0:38:29 | 0:38:35 | |
happen in a very dignified way, to
put a closure to what you could call | 0:38:35 | 0:38:43 | |
an illustrious political career. But
no, he's going to be remembered by | 0:38:43 | 0:38:45 | |
how he went, not by what he stood
for. This is the death of his | 0:38:45 | 0:38:53 | |
legacy, and we never hoped that this
day would come. We hoped to remember | 0:38:53 | 0:38:57 | |
him for certain things, look at the
positives and say, OK, he was a | 0:38:57 | 0:39:02 | |
human being, he made mistakes but he
was sincere. Yes, sincerely wrong, | 0:39:02 | 0:39:08 | |
but sincere all the same. Now this,
this idea of taking the whole | 0:39:08 | 0:39:15 | |
country with him to the grave is
wrong, absolutely wrong. There is no | 0:39:15 | 0:39:19 | |
justification for it on no excuse he
gives excuses he is going to | 0:39:19 | 0:39:24 | |
re-form, going to put the country
together, going to bring harmony in | 0:39:24 | 0:39:29 | |
his Cabinet. He can't do it,
because... This conflict within | 0:39:29 | 0:39:35 | |
government has been happening for
the last few years and most of them, | 0:39:35 | 0:39:42 | |
it was suspected that he was the one
engineering it. It's not going to | 0:39:42 | 0:39:46 | |
happen. So he has to go. He is not
the Zanu-PF leader, that's it. When | 0:39:46 | 0:39:56 | |
he talks about the military takeover
that there has been not being a | 0:39:56 | 0:40:03 | |
threat to his authority as head of
state... I have to say, speaking | 0:40:03 | 0:40:09 | |
personally, it seems like he is
living in a parallel universe | 0:40:09 | 0:40:13 | |
because a military takeover was an
absolute threat to his authority as | 0:40:13 | 0:40:16 | |
head of state stop your absolutely.
What the military tried to do was to | 0:40:16 | 0:40:22 | |
say, OK, you have an infrastructure
which sustains your power. We want | 0:40:22 | 0:40:29 | |
to hold that infrastructure so that
people express themselves. So your | 0:40:29 | 0:40:32 | |
body can express itself, as well.
What we saw on Friday was the party | 0:40:32 | 0:40:36 | |
expressing itself through the
provinces in coordinating | 0:40:36 | 0:40:44 | |
committees. What we saw on Saturday
was the people of Zimbabwe | 0:40:44 | 0:40:48 | |
expressing themselves. And what we
saw today was the biggest organ of | 0:40:48 | 0:40:54 | |
the party and the most powerful
organ of the party expressing | 0:40:54 | 0:40:56 | |
itself. And against all that, what
we have seen just a few minutes ago | 0:40:56 | 0:41:05 | |
was President Mugabe remaining
defiant to his people, defiant to | 0:41:05 | 0:41:08 | |
his party, defiant to Zimbabweans
and only studied at defying the | 0:41:08 | 0:41:16 | |
military, his commanders, only
listening to himself. Himself and | 0:41:16 | 0:41:20 | |
the voices in his head, which is
very, very unfortunate. OK, thank | 0:41:20 | 0:41:28 | |
you so much for your time and your
instant reaction to that speech from | 0:41:28 | 0:41:34 | |
Robert Mugabe, who is still
president of Zimbabwe against all | 0:41:34 | 0:41:38 | |
odds and all the expectations. He
has not said that he is resigning. | 0:41:38 | 0:41:42 | |
Let us move forward, he said, and he
didn't believe in his address. He | 0:41:42 | 0:41:48 | |
said the military takeover was in
any sort of threat to his authority. | 0:41:48 | 0:41:52 | |
Well, the calls for his impeachment
now are intensifying. We have | 0:41:52 | 0:41:57 | |
already heard from the War Veterans
Association, who organised the | 0:41:57 | 0:42:03 | |
demonstration here yesterday, that
the impeachment process will begin | 0:42:03 | 0:42:07 | |
pretty much straightaway as a result
of Mr Mugabe refusing to resign. | 0:42:07 | 0:42:11 | |
Let's listen to on X out of that
long, rambling television address. | 0:42:11 | 0:42:18 | |
... Generation conflict must be
resolved through harmonised melding | 0:42:22 | 0:42:33 | |
of old, established players as they
embrace and welcome new rules. New | 0:42:33 | 0:42:44 | |
ones through a well-defined sense of
hierarchy and succession. Indeed, | 0:42:44 | 0:42:55 | |
all these matters will be discussed
and settled at the forthcoming | 0:42:55 | 0:43:04 | |
congress, within the framework of a
clear road map that seeks to resolve | 0:43:04 | 0:43:12 | |
once and for all any omissions or
contradictions which have affected | 0:43:12 | 0:43:22 | |
our party negatively.
The Congress is due in a few weeks | 0:43:22 | 0:43:33 | |
from now. I will preside over the
process which must not be | 0:43:33 | 0:43:42 | |
repossessed by any acts calculated
to undermine it ought to compromise | 0:43:42 | 0:43:49 | |
the outcomes in the eyes of the
public. | 0:43:49 | 0:43:55 | |
That was just an excerpt of
President Mugabe's rather | 0:43:55 | 0:43:58 | |
extraordinary address to the nation
this evening, in what was billed by | 0:43:58 | 0:44:04 | |
some as the resignation speech of
Robert Mugabe, after 37 years in | 0:44:04 | 0:44:07 | |
power. It wasn't that. It was a
rather defiant speech. He is | 0:44:07 | 0:44:13 | |
clinging to office. His opponents,
and there are plenty of them in this | 0:44:13 | 0:44:17 | |
country, are now saying the
impeachment process will begin in | 0:44:17 | 0:44:22 | |
the Zimbabwean parliament, probably
on Tuesday. The two chambers of the | 0:44:22 | 0:44:26 | |
parliament will need a two thirds
majority in each chamber to impeach | 0:44:26 | 0:44:30 | |
him, to effectively kicked him out
of office. That process will begin | 0:44:30 | 0:44:34 | |
in the coming days. Let's get the
analysis now of a Zimbabwean | 0:44:34 | 0:44:40 | |
academic and author. We were talking
to you earlier on and you were | 0:44:40 | 0:44:43 | |
saying you didn't think he would
resign and you were absolutely | 0:44:43 | 0:44:46 | |
right, he hasn't.
Two things... First, people from the | 0:44:46 | 0:44:58 | |
outset insisted it wasn't a coup,
insisted Robert Mugabe was head of | 0:44:58 | 0:45:03 | |
state, throughout. They want him to
go, to resign? Ambivalence has | 0:45:03 | 0:45:08 | |
caught them out, in my view. The
second thing is you have the | 0:45:08 | 0:45:12 | |
individual chairman of the South
African Minister, meeting on Tuesday | 0:45:12 | 0:45:21 | |
in Angola. Yes, I think he is
playing for time. He cannot survive | 0:45:21 | 0:45:26 | |
in office, surely, he is going to be
impeached? I don't think so, I don't | 0:45:26 | 0:45:30 | |
think he will be impeached. I think
given what happened today, and our | 0:45:30 | 0:45:36 | |
suspicion is there where parallel
processes today, the meeting at | 0:45:36 | 0:45:38 | |
State house but also the Zanu-PF
central meeting. What he said today, | 0:45:38 | 0:45:45 | |
the emphasis that these special
congress would determine what | 0:45:45 | 0:45:51 | |
happens in the party means ipso
facto what happened today is null | 0:45:51 | 0:45:54 | |
and void. We saw so many people here
yesterday on the streets, | 0:45:54 | 0:46:01 | |
demonstrating in huge numbers,
celebrating because they thought | 0:46:01 | 0:46:04 | |
they had got rid of Robert Mugabe
but they haven't. They are going to | 0:46:04 | 0:46:07 | |
be furious and they, angry? We will
see. I think he is playing for time, | 0:46:07 | 0:46:14 | |
in my view. He is playing for time,
during which time he can get | 0:46:14 | 0:46:19 | |
guarantees for his safety and that
of his family. He can't stand out | 0:46:19 | 0:46:23 | |
for too long but in the meantime he
is not resigning. I don't think the | 0:46:23 | 0:46:28 | |
Central committee proceedings are
anything to go by. I don't think | 0:46:28 | 0:46:31 | |
even the issue of impeachment will
go ahead, given what he said. It | 0:46:31 | 0:46:35 | |
depends. We have heard from the War
Veterans, the men who fought | 0:46:35 | 0:46:39 | |
alongside him in the war of
Independence. They are saying the | 0:46:39 | 0:46:43 | |
impeachment process will begin now,
because of that speech, because he | 0:46:43 | 0:46:46 | |
didn't resign. That might be an
opinion. We have to ask the | 0:46:46 | 0:46:50 | |
military, the generals themselves.
With whom he agreed on the speech he | 0:46:50 | 0:46:56 | |
made. They were sitting there and
watching him. They went through that | 0:46:56 | 0:46:59 | |
speech together. So would the War
Veterans or anyone else there | 0:46:59 | 0:47:09 | |
overall what was said today? Did
generals cannot be happy. They | 0:47:09 | 0:47:14 | |
launched this military takeover,
they want him gone, they want their | 0:47:14 | 0:47:21 | |
man, Emmerson Mnangagwa, to replace
Robert Mugabe. So far they have | 0:47:21 | 0:47:23 | |
failed in that objective, surely? I
don't think there is a consensus | 0:47:23 | 0:47:28 | |
Emmerson Mnangagwa should come in. I
don't think so. I think in many | 0:47:28 | 0:47:31 | |
respects, the statement by Mugabe
might reflect the broad, a broader | 0:47:31 | 0:47:38 | |
discussion today to stop it might be
also... People have always said he | 0:47:38 | 0:47:47 | |
is a stubborn man. Is this typical
Robert Mugabe? Yes, for sure, for | 0:47:47 | 0:47:53 | |
sure. He will fight to the end,
that's how he is. Even though the | 0:47:53 | 0:47:58 | |
game is over. In my view, the game
is over. For us, most of us, we are | 0:47:58 | 0:48:04 | |
concerned about what happens after.
But I don't think there is much to | 0:48:04 | 0:48:08 | |
go. This is typical Mugabe, you
would say? Yes, typical. Is it sad, | 0:48:08 | 0:48:16 | |
in some ways, to see a man of his
age, 93, refusing to bow out quietly | 0:48:16 | 0:48:21 | |
and maybe with a bit of dignity?
Yes, but also the point is people | 0:48:21 | 0:48:26 | |
are forgetting... The very people
who have been wanting him out, in my | 0:48:26 | 0:48:33 | |
view the coup took place in 2008.
When he lost the election, | 0:48:33 | 0:48:43 | |
Tsvangirai and Emmerson Mnangagwa
reinstalled him. He was playing with | 0:48:43 | 0:48:48 | |
danger anyway. He was never on his
own, ever. The guys who are sitting | 0:48:48 | 0:48:56 | |
there are the ones in charge of this
country, of the estate. From the War | 0:48:56 | 0:49:02 | |
Veterans there has been a call for
more demonstrations on Wednesday, an | 0:49:02 | 0:49:06 | |
attempt to use people power of the
kind we saw yesterday, to try and | 0:49:06 | 0:49:10 | |
force him out of office. You don't
think that will be successful? I'm | 0:49:10 | 0:49:15 | |
rather cynical, because these other
people... Never before. Three or | 0:49:15 | 0:49:22 | |
four days people were rather removed
from the scene, because they fear | 0:49:22 | 0:49:29 | |
the army. It required mobilisation
on Friday night to get them on the | 0:49:29 | 0:49:35 | |
streets. People are nervous. People
know, it's beginning to think now | 0:49:35 | 0:49:42 | |
that really they are dealing with
the same problems that they thought | 0:49:42 | 0:49:45 | |
was over. What is the future for
Zimbabwe now, more generally? People | 0:49:45 | 0:49:50 | |
obviously had great hopes yesterday,
those hopes, have they been | 0:49:50 | 0:49:55 | |
dissipated? I don't think so. On the
positive side, the Mugabe era is | 0:49:55 | 0:50:02 | |
over. That is the positive. It's how
we organise ourselves moving | 0:50:02 | 0:50:05 | |
forward.
Thank you. We are going to talk to | 0:50:05 | 0:50:10 | |
our Africa editor in a moment but
let me read Capcom the news that we | 0:50:10 | 0:50:15 | |
have had. We had that speech from
Robert Mugabe on television, on | 0:50:15 | 0:50:22 | |
Zimbabwean television, said BC,
which according to some reports said | 0:50:22 | 0:50:25 | |
he was going to resign. Reuters news
agency said he had agreed to offer | 0:50:25 | 0:50:30 | |
his resignation, but that turned out
not to be true. He is, as many | 0:50:30 | 0:50:35 | |
people have said for a very long
time, a pretty stubborn man. Our | 0:50:35 | 0:50:40 | |
Africa editor joins me now here live
in Harare. | 0:50:40 | 0:50:48 | |
An extraordinary speech in the end
from Robert Mugabe, and perhaps not | 0:50:48 | 0:50:51 | |
what we were expecting? I don't
think anyone expected it. I think | 0:50:51 | 0:50:56 | |
the only person who didn't believe
Robert Mugabe was going to resign | 0:50:56 | 0:50:59 | |
his Robert Mugabe, and probably his
wife, Grace Mugabe. Having watched | 0:50:59 | 0:51:03 | |
what has happened over the last few
days here, you have had the people | 0:51:03 | 0:51:06 | |
on the streets yesterday in their
tens of thousands, the Central | 0:51:06 | 0:51:10 | |
committee, which he dominated for 37
years, ruling he should be removed | 0:51:10 | 0:51:13 | |
from the presidency of the party,
and setting in train threats to | 0:51:13 | 0:51:18 | |
impeach him by next Monday. And then
tonight, in spite of all of that, he | 0:51:18 | 0:51:23 | |
appears on television and he says, I
will preside over the party Congress | 0:51:23 | 0:51:27 | |
in December, in three weeks' time.
One has to stand back a bit from the | 0:51:27 | 0:51:33 | |
natural sense of deflation that you
get from members of the public, and | 0:51:33 | 0:51:38 | |
not just people who are members of
the opposition. What your previous | 0:51:38 | 0:51:42 | |
guest said, it is the end of the era
of Mugabe but he has managed, | 0:51:42 | 0:51:47 | |
probably by playing an international
card, probably by saying, look, it | 0:51:47 | 0:51:51 | |
is the policy of the African union
and the international community that | 0:51:51 | 0:51:56 | |
leaders are not removed by coups. He
has bought himself some extra time. | 0:51:56 | 0:51:59 | |
But does anyone believe, given the
strength of feeling in the party and | 0:51:59 | 0:52:03 | |
on the streets, that he is going to
end your as president of Zimbabwe | 0:52:03 | 0:52:08 | |
question not know. I'm willing in
terms of analysis to say no, that's | 0:52:08 | 0:52:13 | |
not going to happen. You talked
about frustrated the people will be. | 0:52:13 | 0:52:17 | |
We saw people power on the streets
in Harare. A call from the War | 0:52:17 | 0:52:23 | |
Veterans to come back onto the
streets on Wednesday, but it doesn't | 0:52:23 | 0:52:26 | |
look like Robert Mugabe listens to
the people, certainly not the people | 0:52:26 | 0:52:30 | |
demonstrating yesterday demanding
that he goes. It has never been his | 0:52:30 | 0:52:34 | |
style, Hadzic question not listening
to the people. That is not the kind | 0:52:34 | 0:52:38 | |
of politics... He is a graduate of
the revolutionary politics of the | 0:52:38 | 0:52:42 | |
50s and 60s, trained in Leninist
principles are power. You control | 0:52:42 | 0:52:49 | |
party organs and the military and
the security forces. The key is he | 0:52:49 | 0:52:53 | |
doesn't control any of those animal.
That's why I am saying to you, yes, | 0:52:53 | 0:52:57 | |
tonight is a big anticlimax for many
people who came onto the streets, | 0:52:57 | 0:53:01 | |
but it is not the end of the story
of Robert Mugabe's departure. When | 0:53:01 | 0:53:05 | |
you have the party calling for
people to come out on the streets, | 0:53:05 | 0:53:11 | |
they are potentially worrying
dynamics. All the excitement we saw | 0:53:11 | 0:53:14 | |
yesterday, all of those people who
believe change was imminent, that it | 0:53:14 | 0:53:18 | |
was going to come in a matter of
days, if not hours, when that is | 0:53:18 | 0:53:22 | |
brought onto the streets, it be
problematic. | 0:53:22 | 0:53:25 | |
One more question. Impeachment is
what he has been threatened with by | 0:53:25 | 0:53:31 | |
Zanu-PF. They say if he doesn't
resign by midday tomorrow, which are | 0:53:31 | 0:53:35 | |
clearly won't do, that is when the
impeachment process begins. Will | 0:53:35 | 0:53:39 | |
that get rid of him and how quickly
would it get rid of him? Potentially | 0:53:39 | 0:53:43 | |
possible they might go ahead with
this. The other possibility is you | 0:53:43 | 0:53:47 | |
will get some kind of fudge. There
will be a lot of talking now between | 0:53:47 | 0:53:50 | |
the leaders of the military and the
other branches of the state security | 0:53:50 | 0:53:55 | |
forces. The War Veterans and the
party itself. Remember, the man we | 0:53:55 | 0:53:59 | |
haven't mentioned so far, Emmerson
Mnangagwa. The heir apparent that | 0:53:59 | 0:54:04 | |
the party wants to replace Robert
Mugabe. He is going to have eight he | 0:54:04 | 0:54:08 | |
say in whether that impeachment
process goes ahead or not. It is | 0:54:08 | 0:54:10 | |
still a very top-down party,
Zanu-PF. He is the new top. If he | 0:54:10 | 0:54:16 | |
decides, I can wait another few
weeks for this party Congress to | 0:54:16 | 0:54:21 | |
appoint me, I suspect the party will
fall into line. Whether the people | 0:54:21 | 0:54:24 | |
will is another matter. Thank you
very much indeed. Fergal Keane with | 0:54:24 | 0:54:29 | |
the very latest. It has been another
extraordinary day here in Zimbabwe. | 0:54:29 | 0:54:35 | |
First of all, the day starting with
Zanu-PF's Central committee deposing | 0:54:35 | 0:54:40 | |
Robert Mugabe after 37 years as the
leader of the party. And then | 0:54:40 | 0:54:46 | |
issuing an ultimatum that if he
doesn't resign by midday tomorrow | 0:54:46 | 0:54:49 | |
local time, he would be facing
impeachment proceedings. He made | 0:54:49 | 0:54:54 | |
that TV address on Zimbabwean
television this evening and didn't | 0:54:54 | 0:54:57 | |
say he would resign. He is not going
that will disappoint many millions | 0:54:57 | 0:55:02 | |
of Zimbabweans. That is the latest
from here in Harare with the BBC | 0:55:02 | 0:55:06 | |
special coverage. Back to the
studio. | 0:55:06 | 0:55:09 | |
A good deal of sunshine today but
pictures like this are going to be | 0:55:15 | 0:55:19 | |
few and far between in the week
ahead. The sunshine that many of us | 0:55:19 | 0:55:22 | |
have enjoyed today is about to be
replaced by something cloudier, | 0:55:22 | 0:55:27 | |
milder and wetter. Our weather over
the coming week is going to be | 0:55:27 | 0:55:30 | |
coming in from off the Atlantic.
This is the next frontal system. | 0:55:30 | 0:55:34 | |
Ahead of it, some clear skies this
evening in the eastern side of the | 0:55:34 | 0:55:38 | |
country, meaning an early frost.
Eventually the cloud will build, Al | 0:55:38 | 0:55:42 | |
brings a rain heading into Northern
Ireland, northern England and | 0:55:42 | 0:55:44 | |
Scotland, where we will see some
snow on the mountains and some | 0:55:44 | 0:55:48 | |
outbreaks of rain in Wales and the
Midlands, but quite patchy. Cold in | 0:55:48 | 0:55:52 | |
Northern Ireland and Scotland, 4-5.
Much milder further south, | 0:55:52 | 0:55:58 | |
particular converter Reeson morning.
Quite a wet start the day across | 0:55:58 | 0:56:02 | |
much of northern England, northern
England and Scotland. Further south, | 0:56:02 | 0:56:06 | |
more cloudier and breezy but mainly
dry. A little bit of patchy rain but | 0:56:06 | 0:56:10 | |
look at the temperatures compared to
morning. Some outbreaks of rain in | 0:56:10 | 0:56:16 | |
East Anglia, and it will be slow to
clear here. A cool start the day. | 0:56:16 | 0:56:19 | |
Rain slyly easing from Northern
Ireland. It will take its time to go | 0:56:19 | 0:56:26 | |
from northern Scotland. Snow above
400 metres. The rains slowly clears | 0:56:26 | 0:56:31 | |
eastwards through the day that takes
its time to go from parts of | 0:56:31 | 0:56:35 | |
northern England, the Midlands and
eastern parts of England. The south | 0:56:35 | 0:56:39 | |
and West, some patchy outbreaks of
rain in the afternoon. Once that | 0:56:39 | 0:56:43 | |
rain clears, some brighter skies.
Much milder, 12-13, but still in | 0:56:43 | 0:56:48 | |
some colder air across Scotland and
Northern Ireland. There has been a | 0:56:48 | 0:56:51 | |
battle going on between the cold air
to the eastern something milder to | 0:56:51 | 0:56:54 | |
the west. In the coming days, that
milder air will generally win | 0:56:54 | 0:56:58 | |
through. It is quite unsettled.
This is the picture as they go into | 0:56:58 | 0:57:03 | |
Tuesday, another frontal system
pushing its way across, | 0:57:03 | 0:57:05 | |
strengthening the wind and bringing
some outbreaks of rain, mainly to | 0:57:05 | 0:57:09 | |
Scotland, Northern Ireland and
northern England in the morning, | 0:57:09 | 0:57:13 | |
arriving in Wales in south-west
England later. By and large, the | 0:57:13 | 0:57:16 | |
further south unease, holding onto
something drier. 12-14 for most of | 0:57:16 | 0:57:23 | |
us. Through much of us this week 's
wet and windy weather, driest for a | 0:57:23 | 0:57:28 | |
time in the south and east but all
of seeing something a milder. | 0:57:28 | 0:57:32 | |
This is BBC News. | 1:00:18 | 1:00:23 | |
I am Ben Brown reporting live from
Harare and the continuing crisis in | 1:00:23 | 1:00:27 | |
Zimbabwe. The news is that President
Robert Mugabe has made a televised | 1:00:27 | 1:00:35 | |
address in which he has refused to
resign. He vowed to stay on in power | 1:00:35 | 1:00:42 | |
until December, for the special
Congress of the ruling Zanu-PF | 1:00:42 | 1:00:46 | |
party. Against some expectations
that he would step down after huge | 1:00:46 | 1:00:51 | |
pressure and the military takeover
here last Wednesday, he did not say | 1:00:51 | 1:00:54 | |
anything about resigning and he did
not even refer to it. It was a long | 1:00:54 | 1:01:01 | |
and rambling speech. It will
disappoint many people in this | 1:01:01 | 1:01:04 | |
country who had marched against him
yesterday, taking to the streets in | 1:01:04 | 1:01:10 | |
their tens of thousands here in
Harare and also Bulawayo, amid | 1:01:10 | 1:01:17 | |
euphoric and joyful scenes because
protesters believed the Army had | 1:01:17 | 1:01:19 | |
finally toppled Mr Mugabe with his
takeover. But in his address, Mr | 1:01:19 | 1:01:26 | |
Mugabe said that military action in
Harare was not a threat to his | 1:01:26 | 1:01:31 | |
authority as Head of State. This is
what he had to say. | 1:01:31 | 1:01:40 | |
Intergenerational conflict must be
resolved through harmonised melding | 1:01:40 | 1:01:52 | |
of old established players, as they
embrace and welcome new rules. New | 1:01:52 | 1:02:02 | |
ones through a well-defined sense of
hierarchy and succession. Indeed, | 1:02:02 | 1:02:13 | |
all these matters will be discussed
and settled at the forthcoming | 1:02:13 | 1:02:22 | |
Congress, within the framework of a
clear road map that seeks to resolve | 1:02:22 | 1:02:30 | |
once and for all any other missions
or contradictions that have affected | 1:02:30 | 1:02:40 | |
our party negatively. The Congress
is due in a few weeks from now. I | 1:02:40 | 1:02:51 | |
will preside over its processes,
which must not be repossessed by any | 1:02:51 | 1:03:00 | |
axe calculated to undermine it. Or
to compromise the outcomes in the | 1:03:00 | 1:03:13 | |
eyes of the public. | 1:03:13 | 1:03:17 | |
That was Robert Mugabe addressing
the nation. There have been reports | 1:03:17 | 1:03:21 | |
on one news agency that he had
agreed to resign, but those turned | 1:03:21 | 1:03:25 | |
out to be erroneous. He has not and
many people have said for a very | 1:03:25 | 1:03:29 | |
long time he is a stubborn man and
so he has proved to be once again. | 1:03:29 | 1:03:34 | |
In response to that speech tonight
where he has refused to resign, the | 1:03:34 | 1:03:39 | |
leader of the war veterans who
fought alongside Mr Mugabe in the | 1:03:39 | 1:03:42 | |
War of Independence and liberation
has said the impeachment process | 1:03:42 | 1:03:46 | |
against the President must now begin
if he will not resign, and he called | 1:03:46 | 1:03:49 | |
upon people to take to the streets
again as they did yesterday, on | 1:03:49 | 1:03:54 | |
Wednesday, to demand his
resignation. This is his meeting | 1:03:54 | 1:03:59 | |
earlier today with the generals. The
military from the Zimbabwe defence | 1:03:59 | 1:04:06 | |
forces who launched this military
takeover against him last Wednesday. | 1:04:06 | 1:04:10 | |
These are the pictures from inside
Statehouse, the official residence. | 1:04:10 | 1:04:15 | |
The generals again trying to
persuade him to resign with some | 1:04:15 | 1:04:19 | |
dignity of his own free world, to
leave office. But they failed in | 1:04:19 | 1:04:23 | |
those attempts. And the alternative
does now look like impeachment, | 1:04:23 | 1:04:28 | |
which may begin on Tuesday in the
Zimbabwean Parliament. It would | 1:04:28 | 1:04:33 | |
require a two thirds majority vote
in both houses of the Parliament to | 1:04:33 | 1:04:37 | |
impeachment him as nobody knows how
long the process might take. That's | 1:04:37 | 1:04:42 | |
what our Southern Africa
correspondence, a long-time observer | 1:04:42 | 1:04:47 | |
who has met Robert Mugabe down the
years. We use surprised by his | 1:04:47 | 1:04:53 | |
refusal to stand down -- were you
surprised? Well, in a general sense, | 1:04:53 | 1:05:02 | |
I was, but in the true sense, I was
not. Because Robert Mugabe, as we | 1:05:02 | 1:05:08 | |
have always known him, is a very
tough man. He does not give in | 1:05:08 | 1:05:15 | |
easily. There was no way, as far as
his history is concerned, he was | 1:05:15 | 1:05:21 | |
going to just voluntarily resign.
Given the events of the last week, | 1:05:21 | 1:05:28 | |
there was no way that he would
resign, having had meetings with the | 1:05:28 | 1:05:32 | |
Southern African development
community envoys sent by President | 1:05:32 | 1:05:38 | |
Jacob Zuma, two of them, the
Minister of defence, Minister of | 1:05:38 | 1:05:42 | |
intelligence, his own military
chiefs were there, who he has known | 1:05:42 | 1:05:47 | |
for years. He never gave an
instrument those negotiations. And | 1:05:47 | 1:05:51 | |
today, we saw that his party sacked
him as head of Zanu-PF. He still did | 1:05:51 | 1:05:58 | |
not give them. So quite clearly,
Robert Mugabe is still holding the | 1:05:58 | 1:06:04 | |
idea that he has always held before.
He wants to die in office. And we | 1:06:04 | 1:06:10 | |
know that many people, not just in
Zimbabwe, but across the region and | 1:06:10 | 1:06:14 | |
across the continent, are
disappointed by this no resignation | 1:06:14 | 1:06:18 | |
speech.
Yes, he is vowing to stay on at | 1:06:18 | 1:06:26 | |
least for a few weeks. He talked
about presiding over the Zanu-PF | 1:06:26 | 1:06:31 | |
Party Congress in December. Which is
extraordinary really since Zanu-PF | 1:06:31 | 1:06:36 | |
have just sacked or dismissed him as
their party leader today and given | 1:06:36 | 1:06:39 | |
him an ultimatum, where they said,
if you don't resign by midday | 1:06:39 | 1:06:45 | |
tomorrow local time, we are going to
impeach you, or Parliament is. It is | 1:06:45 | 1:06:49 | |
almost as if he is not to anybody.
Yes, and that is exactly the point. | 1:06:49 | 1:06:57 | |
President Robert Mugabe trusts his
own instincts, he trusts his own | 1:06:57 | 1:07:01 | |
thinking. He thinks that he is
correct and the rest of the people | 1:07:01 | 1:07:06 | |
wrong. And that is why he has not
listened to anyone in that room and | 1:07:06 | 1:07:12 | |
that is if they were telling him to
resign, and there has never been any | 1:07:12 | 1:07:17 | |
official confirmation of the
proceedings in those negotiations. | 1:07:17 | 1:07:21 | |
But remember, there is a tank parked
outside his house, he cannot go | 1:07:21 | 1:07:27 | |
anywhere as freely as he would like.
They only allowed to go to the | 1:07:27 | 1:07:31 | |
university for that ceremony. So we
are in a predicament here and that | 1:07:31 | 1:07:36 | |
is why this meeting that President
Zuma is going to attend in Rwanda on | 1:07:36 | 1:07:42 | |
Tuesday, in Angola, is important.
The region is trying to figure out | 1:07:42 | 1:07:48 | |
how to resolve the Zimbabwe crisis.
Everybody had hoped Robert Mugabe | 1:07:48 | 1:07:51 | |
would resign tonight, but that was
to be. | 1:07:51 | 1:07:57 | |
And the fact that it is not to be,
how disappointing will that be for | 1:07:57 | 1:08:04 | |
the people of Zimbabwe, particularly
the people who demonstrated in huge | 1:08:04 | 1:08:09 | |
numbers here yesterday? We saw the
euphoria, that is going to be | 1:08:09 | 1:08:15 | |
replaced now, one representative
Zanu-PF said he was heartbroken. | 1:08:15 | 1:08:18 | |
There is going to be heartbreak and
anger. Yes, very much and that is | 1:08:18 | 1:08:24 | |
correct. For example, in South
Africa, there are millions of | 1:08:24 | 1:08:30 | |
Zimbabweans who are economic
refugees here and they would quite | 1:08:30 | 1:08:32 | |
like to go back home as soon as
things are normal and the economy | 1:08:32 | 1:08:37 | |
can grow again. Because they believe
part of the collapse of the economy | 1:08:37 | 1:08:42 | |
was created by the dictatorship of
Robert Mugabe. But also, remember, | 1:08:42 | 1:08:48 | |
there is this part of that community
that still respects Robert Mugabe | 1:08:48 | 1:08:51 | |
for the role he played in the
liberation struggle against white | 1:08:51 | 1:08:57 | |
minority rule. He was imprisoned for
ten years, he fought his way through | 1:08:57 | 1:09:05 | |
until Zimbabweans gained their own
independence in 1980. So there is a | 1:09:05 | 1:09:11 | |
section of people who still respect
him, it even though they want him to | 1:09:11 | 1:09:15 | |
step down so that their lives can
move on. And that is why we do not | 1:09:15 | 1:09:20 | |
have a Gaddafi moment today.
We don't have a Gaddafi moment and I | 1:09:20 | 1:09:27 | |
suppose maybe we have been writing
Robert Gabby's political obituary | 1:09:27 | 1:09:31 | |
today premature -- Robert Mugabe.
Let's be clear. Robert Mugabe has | 1:09:31 | 1:09:42 | |
reached a cul-de-sac. Whether he did
not resign tonight and he stays on, | 1:09:42 | 1:09:45 | |
it is quite clear that there is very
little room for him to move on now. | 1:09:45 | 1:09:52 | |
He is just showing his deep sense of
commitment to what he believes in. | 1:09:52 | 1:09:57 | |
He wants to stay in power. But there
is no way he can survive this week, | 1:09:57 | 1:10:02 | |
there is no way and Bob way can go
back to where it was last month, for | 1:10:02 | 1:10:07 | |
example. So he is in a difficult
place. I am sure you were wondering, | 1:10:07 | 1:10:13 | |
where was Mrs Grace Mugabe in those
pictures? We saw the military | 1:10:13 | 1:10:18 | |
officers. She triggered the sequence
of events we have been following for | 1:10:18 | 1:10:22 | |
the last few days. It was she who
made the military decide that they | 1:10:22 | 1:10:26 | |
are not going to support her
potential rising to the top job. She | 1:10:26 | 1:10:34 | |
was nowhere to be found today and we
are wondering where she was at this | 1:10:34 | 1:10:38 | |
crucial live TV speech.
Thank you very much for your | 1:10:38 | 1:10:44 | |
analysis. Our Southern Africa
correspondent. It was a long and | 1:10:44 | 1:10:49 | |
slightly strange speech from
President Macron to this evening. | 1:10:49 | 1:10:54 | |
Certainly not what most of the
nation and maybe the world were | 1:10:54 | 1:11:00 | |
expecting -- President Robert
Mugabe. He said the military | 1:11:00 | 1:11:03 | |
takeover was not a threat to his
authority as Head of State and he | 1:11:03 | 1:11:07 | |
talked about being around as head of
country for the Zanu-PF Congress in | 1:11:07 | 1:11:12 | |
December. This is what else he had
to say. The way forward cannot be | 1:11:12 | 1:11:18 | |
based on swapping, vying cliques
that ride roughshod over party rules | 1:11:18 | 1:11:29 | |
and procedures. There has to be a
net return to the guiding principles | 1:11:29 | 1:11:37 | |
of our party. As enshrined in its
constitution. Which must apply early | 1:11:37 | 1:11:47 | |
and equitably in all situations --
fairly and equitably. And before all | 1:11:47 | 1:11:54 | |
members. The era of victimisation
and arbitrary decisions must be put | 1:11:54 | 1:12:04 | |
behind. So as we all embrace a new
ethos predicated on the supreme law | 1:12:04 | 1:12:20 | |
of our party. | 1:12:20 | 1:12:25 | |
That is Robert Mugabe with his
televised address this evening in | 1:12:25 | 1:12:28 | |
Zimbabwe, resisting the pressure on
him to resign that we have seen from | 1:12:28 | 1:12:33 | |
the military, from Zanu-PF, the
ruling party here who have sacked | 1:12:33 | 1:12:36 | |
him today as their party leader, and
from the people who have | 1:12:36 | 1:12:40 | |
demonstrated in the many thousands
out on the streets yesterday, | 1:12:40 | 1:12:44 | |
demanding that he resigned. Let's
talk to Doctor Sue Onslow who has | 1:12:44 | 1:12:48 | |
followed the career of Robert Mugabe
and sheets from the Institute of | 1:12:48 | 1:12:53 | |
Commonwealth studies in London.
Thank you very much. Are you | 1:12:53 | 1:12:57 | |
surprised that he has refused to bow
to all that pressure and he is | 1:12:57 | 1:13:01 | |
staying in the job, for now at
least, technically still President | 1:13:01 | 1:13:04 | |
of Zimbabwe? I must admit, I
listened to his address with growing | 1:13:04 | 1:13:11 | |
disbelief, but thinking, he has done
it again. I was thinking at | 1:13:11 | 1:13:15 | |
lunchtime, this is going to be a
very difficult President to oust | 1:13:15 | 1:13:19 | |
from office and he has proved me
right yet again, I suppose, in that | 1:13:19 | 1:13:25 | |
particular respect. I thought it was
very interesting reading the press | 1:13:25 | 1:13:29 | |
statement by the Central committee,
the decision this morning, that he | 1:13:29 | 1:13:35 | |
has been dismissed as their leader,
but not expelled from the party. He | 1:13:35 | 1:13:42 | |
has raised the stakes yet again in
saying that he wants to go in his | 1:13:42 | 1:13:46 | |
own time and saying he will preside
over the special Congress which will | 1:13:46 | 1:13:49 | |
be held on the 12th of December. I
am going to be very interested | 1:13:49 | 1:13:55 | |
tomorrow to see whether they will
initiate proceedings which raises | 1:13:55 | 1:14:00 | |
the stakes yet again. But your other
point made reference to Grace | 1:14:00 | 1:14:05 | |
Mugabe. She has been expelled from
the party along with 19 other | 1:14:05 | 1:14:10 | |
members of the group. She has been
picked out as leader of the women's | 1:14:10 | 1:14:16 | |
league. In other words, she has been
removed from the equation, | 1:14:16 | 1:14:20 | |
completely and utterly. And going
through that long and rambling | 1:14:20 | 1:14:24 | |
speech, he was making gestures of
being penitent. And emphasising | 1:14:24 | 1:14:33 | |
constitutionalism, the party was
paramount. Unity was paramount, | 1:14:33 | 1:14:37 | |
learning from previous mistakes and
arbitrary decisions that might have | 1:14:37 | 1:14:40 | |
crept in here and there, he used
that phrase. So this is a man | 1:14:40 | 1:14:45 | |
listening to his own counsel and who
is a long-standing taskmaster of | 1:14:45 | 1:14:53 | |
political manipulation and
determined that he will go, if you | 1:14:53 | 1:14:56 | |
can, at a point of his own choosing.
Now, that is of course increasingly | 1:14:56 | 1:15:00 | |
constrained around him. Emmerson
Mnangagwa, having replaced Robert | 1:15:00 | 1:15:07 | |
Mugabe as President, first secretary
of the party, is he going to choose | 1:15:07 | 1:15:13 | |
this? He will go for the long game I
think and say, if we can wait | 1:15:13 | 1:15:17 | |
another couple of weeks, I would
think he is encouraging a | 1:15:17 | 1:15:24 | |
constitutional and rule-bound
procedure precisely because this is | 1:15:24 | 1:15:29 | |
within African union structures and
approaches. They may want to abide | 1:15:29 | 1:15:38 | |
by the rules but the people out on
the streets demonstrating here in | 1:15:38 | 1:15:44 | |
Harare yesterday, they are going to
be hugely disappointed and angry. | 1:15:44 | 1:15:49 | |
There has been a call for another
big demonstration on Wednesday. You | 1:15:49 | 1:15:53 | |
just wonder how the anger is going
to be channelled after tonight. | 1:15:53 | 1:15:59 | |
That was my other thought
immediately, I listened to the | 1:15:59 | 1:16:02 | |
speech and I was in touch with my
co-author and I said, I think this | 1:16:02 | 1:16:06 | |
could get ugly. And that really
troubles me. Because as your | 1:16:06 | 1:16:11 | |
previous commentators said, the
hope, the euphoria, there was an | 1:16:11 | 1:16:20 | |
amalgam of euphoria and hope and
expectation, in that massive | 1:16:20 | 1:16:25 | |
demonstration and demonstrations
elsewhere. In London as well. | 1:16:25 | 1:16:29 | |
People's hopes riding high that
there would be a symbolic shift in | 1:16:29 | 1:16:33 | |
Robert Mugabe's departure and now
there is a sense among some quarters | 1:16:33 | 1:16:38 | |
of being cheated. Some say, yes, the
party is back United and moving | 1:16:38 | 1:16:43 | |
forward, I would say it is a very
complex surge of emotion is going on | 1:16:43 | 1:16:49 | |
in Harare right now.
Yes, and what about the impeachment | 1:16:49 | 1:16:57 | |
process? That is what is being
threatened by Zanu-PF, the party | 1:16:57 | 1:17:01 | |
that has dumped him as party leader.
They have said he will be impeached | 1:17:01 | 1:17:06 | |
because he will not resign. Do you
think Parliament will do that and | 1:17:06 | 1:17:10 | |
can do that and if they can, how
quickly can they do that? | 1:17:10 | 1:17:14 | |
Well, that was the message coming
through should he not resign, that | 1:17:14 | 1:17:21 | |
the Chief Whip Zanu-PF would
institute proceedings in Parliament. | 1:17:21 | 1:17:24 | |
And not only was there a decision to
purge the G-force Tielemans, but the | 1:17:24 | 1:17:36 | |
G-force T provincial party
structures of the state have been | 1:17:36 | 1:17:43 | |
removed and the team have been
reinstated, so there has been a | 1:17:43 | 1:17:47 | |
reconfiguration in Parliament. A
strong message sent by the party. | 1:17:47 | 1:17:50 | |
What I don't know whether they would
indeed decide to go for impeachment | 1:17:50 | 1:17:55 | |
or whether one of the key deals find
the scenes has been, OK, we will | 1:17:55 | 1:18:01 | |
allow YouTube reside over the
special Congress in December, which | 1:18:01 | 1:18:06 | |
will lead to the formal succession
choice, decided by the party, | 1:18:06 | 1:18:10 | |
because Robert Mugabe has always
said he personally could not | 1:18:10 | 1:18:14 | |
designate his successor. So it would
always be a party decision. And it | 1:18:14 | 1:18:17 | |
would seem to me that the
configuration of power in the Army, | 1:18:17 | 1:18:26 | |
also with Emmerson Mnangagwa in
conversation also with South Africa, | 1:18:26 | 1:18:31 | |
has been to play a slightly longer
game. But back to my earlier point. | 1:18:31 | 1:18:40 | |
The need is for speed of political
transition, the need for a stable | 1:18:40 | 1:18:45 | |
decision, and environment, so they
can start to address the economic | 1:18:45 | 1:18:50 | |
problems confronting Zimbabwe.
Thank you very much indeed. Doctor | 1:18:50 | 1:18:59 | |
Sue Onslow, from the Institute of
Commonwealth studies. Let's just | 1:18:59 | 1:19:04 | |
recap where we are on this
extraordinary day in Zimbabwe. After | 1:19:04 | 1:19:09 | |
those demonstrations we were talking
about on the streets yesterday, when | 1:19:09 | 1:19:12 | |
there was a mood of great euphoria
and a sense that people power had | 1:19:12 | 1:19:17 | |
managed to topple Robert Mugabe.
That was the thought of the | 1:19:17 | 1:19:21 | |
thousands of demonstrators who took
to the streets. Well, they have been | 1:19:21 | 1:19:25 | |
frustrated and disappointed. And
today, we had the Zanu-PF Central | 1:19:25 | 1:19:35 | |
committee, we had the extraordinary
news that they were dumping him as | 1:19:35 | 1:19:42 | |
party leader. And there was an
expectation when he made his speech | 1:19:42 | 1:19:46 | |
this morning on television, on ZBC,
that he would announce his | 1:19:46 | 1:19:52 | |
resignation. That was not to be and
he said he is staying until the | 1:19:52 | 1:19:56 | |
Party Congress next month. So at
least for EP weeks. Let's bring in | 1:19:56 | 1:20:01 | |
our Southern Africa correspondent in
Harare. You listened to that | 1:20:01 | 1:20:08 | |
extraordinary speech, rather
rambling at times from Robert | 1:20:08 | 1:20:12 | |
Mugabe. We use surprised he has
decided not to resign and he is | 1:20:12 | 1:20:18 | |
staying put, this is classic,
stubborn Robert Mugabe? It was | 1:20:18 | 1:20:23 | |
baffling. Everybody expected one
thing and yet it is the choreography | 1:20:23 | 1:20:26 | |
now we're looking at. Why did he not
go then? His sense of himself, his | 1:20:26 | 1:20:34 | |
dignity, is clearly fundamental to
all of this. This is a 93-year-old | 1:20:34 | 1:20:37 | |
who could have gone longer know --
long ago and organised a succession, | 1:20:37 | 1:20:44 | |
how does he dig himself out of this
hole? We know that Zanu-PF, the | 1:20:44 | 1:20:49 | |
party, has already abandoned him
coming he knows that. Though the | 1:20:49 | 1:20:53 | |
night, perhaps it was about giving
the general is the all clear. He was | 1:20:53 | 1:20:57 | |
very explicit and he said at no
point had his own sense of himself | 1:20:57 | 1:21:02 | |
as the President been challenged.
That there was no breaking the | 1:21:02 | 1:21:06 | |
constitutional order. So he has
given them the all clear. We all | 1:21:06 | 1:21:11 | |
thought that was the moment he would
say, and so, after today's | 1:21:11 | 1:21:16 | |
extraordinary events and yesterday's
public marches, I will go. But | 1:21:16 | 1:21:20 | |
perhaps we are being too hasty.
Perhaps we need to see this either | 1:21:20 | 1:21:25 | |
as a staged event where perhaps in
the next day or two he will resign, | 1:21:25 | 1:21:29 | |
or maybe he will simply, stubbornly
push Zanu-PF to do what it has now | 1:21:29 | 1:21:35 | |
said it will do tomorrow. Tuesday in
particular. To start impeachment | 1:21:35 | 1:21:42 | |
proceedings. The thing about
impeachment proceedings, one | 1:21:42 | 1:21:45 | |
imagines a quick vote in Parliament
and he is out, but it will take a | 1:21:45 | 1:21:49 | |
bit longer and it could drag out for
days, if not longer. So he can buy | 1:21:49 | 1:21:56 | |
himself time. And he was very
specific tonight about wanting to | 1:21:56 | 1:22:00 | |
get to that Party Congress in
December. And saying, I will | 1:22:00 | 1:22:05 | |
preside. There was a little madness
almost because clearly, the reality, | 1:22:05 | 1:22:10 | |
the world has changed. In his bubble
which is also clearly, this bubble | 1:22:10 | 1:22:15 | |
of self-importance, of a man who has
never been challenged. In this | 1:22:15 | 1:22:20 | |
context, 437 years. Now he has got
to find way to explain to himself | 1:22:20 | 1:22:26 | |
that he has no power, at least in
the party left. Thank you very much | 1:22:26 | 1:22:30 | |
indeed. Andrew Harding, our Southern
African correspondent. It seemed at | 1:22:30 | 1:22:38 | |
times that Robert Mugabe is living
in a parallel universe, especially | 1:22:38 | 1:22:41 | |
when he said the military takeover
was not a threat to his authority as | 1:22:41 | 1:22:44 | |
Head of State. But let's bring in
the representative in the UK | 1:22:44 | 1:22:52 | |
Zanu-PF, the party that has
dismissed Mr Mugabe as party leader. | 1:22:52 | 1:22:57 | |
What was your reaction when you
heard that speech, Mr Mnangagwa, and | 1:22:57 | 1:23:02 | |
you heard he is not going to resign?
I waited with bated breath, hoping | 1:23:02 | 1:23:08 | |
at some point the speech would take
a turn and I would think, OK, we are | 1:23:08 | 1:23:14 | |
getting there now. But as I
continued to listen, he was | 1:23:14 | 1:23:21 | |
basically saying, we have learned
lessons. Hello! You have learned | 1:23:21 | 1:23:25 | |
lessons for how long? After how
long? And to do what? Within what | 1:23:25 | 1:23:32 | |
time you have? And at what age? It
did not make sense. And also, the | 1:23:32 | 1:23:37 | |
fact that he completely ignored
today's events, ignored them or he | 1:23:37 | 1:23:43 | |
did not even know that he is no
longer the Zanu-PF leader. He is no | 1:23:43 | 1:23:49 | |
longer the first secretary and
President, somebody else has been | 1:23:49 | 1:23:52 | |
put in place of him. He is not aware
that over 200 members of his own | 1:23:52 | 1:23:57 | |
Central Committee, out of 300,
dismissed him. And he believed that | 1:23:57 | 1:24:03 | |
he could just walk into that
Congress and chair it and steer it | 1:24:03 | 1:24:11 | |
his way as he normally does. It was
like he is lacking awareness of | 1:24:11 | 1:24:20 | |
where he was and who was surrounding
him. Because totally, the pressure | 1:24:20 | 1:24:24 | |
from the commanders seemed to not
have brought any end results. | 1:24:24 | 1:24:33 | |
Nothing. So I don't know. But the
point still remains. It does not | 1:24:33 | 1:24:41 | |
change that President Robert Mugabe,
is he still is, is no longer the | 1:24:41 | 1:24:47 | |
President Zanu-PF, no longer the
first secretary of Zanu-PF. He will | 1:24:47 | 1:24:50 | |
not preside over the Congress that
is coming. And he was trying to | 1:24:50 | 1:24:54 | |
articulate his own agenda for that
Congress. He is not going to | 1:24:54 | 1:24:58 | |
articulate an agenda for that
Congress is the agenda has been set | 1:24:58 | 1:25:02 | |
by the Central Committee today,
which has nothing to do with the | 1:25:02 | 1:25:05 | |
issues he is raising. The issues
that are coming to the Zanu-PF | 1:25:05 | 1:25:11 | |
constitution, they have been set
today by the right Central | 1:25:11 | 1:25:14 | |
Committee. And we no longer have
that power he is trying to use to | 1:25:14 | 1:25:24 | |
impose well.
We're running out of time, but thank | 1:25:24 | 1:25:28 | |
you very much for your analysis.
From Zanu-PF, the Zanu-PF | 1:25:28 | 1:25:34 | |
representative in London. With his
analysis of what has been an | 1:25:34 | 1:25:38 | |
extraordinary speech from President
Robert Mugabe, and he is still | 1:25:38 | 1:25:45 | |
President Robert Mugabe, the oldest
Head of State still at the age of | 1:25:45 | 1:25:48 | |
93. He has refused to bow to
pressure from the people, from the | 1:25:48 | 1:25:53 | |
party, from the Army, for him to
resign. He is staying in office. | 1:25:53 | 1:25:58 | |
Stubbornly, some would say. But that
is the very latest from Harare. You | 1:25:58 | 1:26:01 | |
are watching BBC News. | 1:26:01 | 1:26:03 | |
It may have been a cold weekend, but
it ended on a final note for many | 1:26:07 | 1:26:11 | |
today, a lot of dry weather around
and sunshine as we can see from | 1:26:11 | 1:26:15 | |
these pictures from the Isle of
Wight to Orkney. A lot of cloud | 1:26:15 | 1:26:19 | |
moved into Western part of the UK so
that is going to wind out over | 1:26:19 | 1:26:23 | |
night. After a chilly start across
eastern parts, temperatures rise | 1:26:23 | 1:26:29 | |
tonight with the cloud moving in and
rein in Northern Ireland, Scotland, | 1:26:29 | 1:26:33 | |
Northern England, Wales and the
Midlands and East Anglia. Light and | 1:26:33 | 1:26:36 | |
patchy in Southern England. Still
some cold air in place in Scotland. | 1:26:36 | 1:26:42 | |
As the wet weather moves in, we will
see some snow. The hills, North of | 1:26:42 | 1:26:48 | |
the Central Belt, Bob 400 m and a
messy start to Monday across | 1:26:48 | 1:26:51 | |
Scotland with rain and heavy rain in
places. The higher you go, North of | 1:26:51 | 1:26:57 | |
the central bolt. Outbreaks of rain
in Northern Ireland, Northern | 1:26:57 | 1:27:01 | |
England and eastern England. For
much of Southern England, the | 1:27:01 | 1:27:04 | |
Midlands and Wales, the overnight
rain is light and patchy. But plenty | 1:27:04 | 1:27:09 | |
of cloud. Look how mild it is to
start the day! So different from how | 1:27:09 | 1:27:13 | |
Sunday started. On Monday, after a
wet start for some, gradually | 1:27:13 | 1:27:19 | |
turning drier. It takes a while to
get rid of the rein in Northern | 1:27:19 | 1:27:22 | |
England but it improves in the
afternoon, brighter breaks to the | 1:27:22 | 1:27:26 | |
East of high ground in the UK
possible. A lot of cloud through the | 1:27:26 | 1:27:30 | |
day. Patchy light rain and drizzle
into the afternoon in some spots. | 1:27:30 | 1:27:34 | |
Most of us will be milder but still
single figure temperatures in | 1:27:34 | 1:27:38 | |
Scotland. This is Monday evening, a
lot of cloud -- a lot of cloud, | 1:27:38 | 1:27:42 | |
patchy rain. The cloud moves through
Northern England and in the Scotland | 1:27:42 | 1:27:47 | |
through the night and into Tuesday.
Milder air eventually reaching | 1:27:47 | 1:27:51 | |
Scotland means any snow turning the
rain across most of the hills during | 1:27:51 | 1:27:55 | |
Tuesday. The wind is picking up
across the board and more rain | 1:27:55 | 1:28:00 | |
working South East across England
and Wales through Tuesday. | 1:28:00 | 1:28:04 | |
Temperatures higher even in
Scotland. But elsewhere, 12-14d. The | 1:28:04 | 1:28:08 | |
big picture Tuesday and Wednesday,
dominated by low pressure. The wind | 1:28:08 | 1:28:13 | |
is getting stronger. The second half
of the week quite turbulent. Low | 1:28:13 | 1:28:17 | |
pressure giving wet and windy
conditions at at times. This week, | 1:28:17 | 1:28:21 | |
it is turning milder with quite a
bit of wet weather around and | 1:28:21 | 1:28:24 | |
midweek, wet and windy. | 1:28:24 | 1:28:26 | |
Hello. | 1:29:37 | 1:29:38 | |
This is BBC News. | 1:29:38 | 1:29:43 | |
The President of Zimbabwe,
Robert Mugabe, clings | 1:29:43 | 1:29:45 | |
on to power after failing
to announce his resignation in | 1:29:45 | 1:29:51 | |
Flanked by military chiefs,
he said he intended to chair | 1:29:51 | 1:29:53 | |
the congress of the ruling Zanu-PF
party next month. | 1:29:53 | 1:29:56 | |
In doing so, he defied an ultimatum
by the party to resign by tomorrow. | 1:29:56 | 1:30:02 | |
The leader of Zimbabwe's war
veterans says plans to impeach | 1:30:02 | 1:30:05 | |
the 93-year-old will go ahead,
with demonstrations expected | 1:30:05 | 1:30:07 | |
on the streets of the capital
Harare on Wednesday. | 1:30:07 | 1:30:12 | |
In other news, police say
a postmortem examination carried out | 1:30:12 | 1:30:17 | |
on the body of the teenager,
Gaia Pope, hasn't identified any | 1:30:17 | 1:30:21 | |
injuries to suggest another person
was involved in her death. | 1:30:21 | 1:30:31 | |
More now on our top story,
in an extraordinary day in Zimbabwe, | 1:30:31 | 1:30:35 | |
President Robert Mugabe has NOT
resigned from power | 1:30:35 | 1:30:39 | |
despite pressure on him to do
so from within his own party. | 1:30:39 | 1:30:49 | |
At just after 7 O'Clock London time,
President Mugabe made | 1:30:49 | 1:30:52 | |
a televised address from his state
residence, flanked by military men. | 1:30:52 | 1:30:59 | |
And despite the widespread
speculation he was about to stand | 1:30:59 | 1:31:07 | |
down, he disappointed many by not
resigning and instead | 1:31:07 | 1:31:09 | |
said he intended to lead
next month's congress | 1:31:09 | 1:31:11 | |
of the ruling party, ZANU-PF. | 1:31:11 | 1:31:12 | |
Let's listen to that
speech in full now | 1:31:12 | 1:31:14 | |
. Hello Zimbabweans. I address you
tonight on the back of a meeting I | 1:31:14 | 1:31:20 | |
held today with the nation's
security forces command element. | 1:31:20 | 1:31:31 | |
This meeting, which was facilitated
by a mediating team, from the | 1:31:31 | 1:31:44 | |
Catholic Church followed an
operation mounted by the Zimbabwe | 1:31:44 | 1:31:49 | |
Defence Forces in the week that has
gone by. And which was triggered by | 1:31:49 | 1:31:58 | |
concerns arising from their reading
of the state of affairs in our | 1:31:58 | 1:32:06 | |
country and in the ruling ZANU-PF
party. Whatever the pros and cons, | 1:32:06 | 1:32:16 | |
the way they went about registering
those concerns, I, as the President | 1:32:16 | 1:32:24 | |
of Zimbabwe and as their
Commander-in-Chief, do acknowledge | 1:32:24 | 1:32:29 | |
the issues they have drawn my
attention to. And do believe that | 1:32:29 | 1:32:35 | |
these were raised in the spirit of
honesty and out of deep and | 1:32:35 | 1:32:44 | |
patriotic concerns for the stability
of our nation. And for the welfare | 1:32:44 | 1:32:53 | |
of our people. As I address you, I
am also aware of a whole range of | 1:32:53 | 1:33:02 | |
concerns which has come from you all
as citizens of our great country. | 1:33:02 | 1:33:16 | |
Today's meeting with the command
element has underscored the need for | 1:33:18 | 1:33:29 | |
us to collectively start processes
that return our nation to normalcy. | 1:33:29 | 1:33:38 | |
So all our people can go about their
business unhindered in an | 1:33:38 | 1:33:45 | |
environment of perfect peace and
security, assured that law and order | 1:33:45 | 1:33:55 | |
is obtained and prevail as before
and endure well into the future. If | 1:33:55 | 1:34:05 | |
there is any one observation we have
made and drawn from events of the | 1:34:05 | 1:34:12 | |
past week, it is the unshakeable
pedestal upon which rests our state | 1:34:12 | 1:34:21 | |
of peace, law and order amply
indicating that as Zimbabweans, we | 1:34:21 | 1:34:34 | |
are generally a peacefully disposed
people and can express our | 1:34:34 | 1:34:44 | |
differences and exprus our
differences with ourselves and with | 1:34:44 | 1:34:46 | |
a level of dignity, discipline and
restraint so rare to many other | 1:34:46 | 1:34:51 | |
nations. This is to be admired.
Indeed, such traits must form the | 1:34:51 | 1:35:03 | |
peace of our national character and
personality. Yes, a veritable | 1:35:03 | 1:35:14 | |
resource we summon and draw upon in
troubled times. The operation I have | 1:35:14 | 1:35:23 | |
alluded to did not amount to a
threat to our well-cherished | 1:35:23 | 1:35:29 | |
constitutional order. Nor did it
challenge to my authority as head of | 1:35:29 | 1:35:35 | |
state and government. Not even as
Commander-in-Chief of the Zimbabwe | 1:35:35 | 1:35:48 | |
Defence Forces. To a man, the
command element rebhaned respectful | 1:35:48 | 1:36:02 | |
and comported with the dictates of
constitutionalism. True, a few | 1:36:02 | 1:36:09 | |
incidences may have occurred here
and there but these have been | 1:36:09 | 1:36:17 | |
corrected. I am happy that
throughout the short period, the | 1:36:17 | 1:36:25 | |
pillars of state remain functional.
On lappier for me and arising - even | 1:36:25 | 1:36:38 | |
happier for me and arising out of
today's meeting is a strong sense of | 1:36:38 | 1:36:50 | |
collegiate and now the in the
various arms of our security | 1:36:50 | 1:36:53 | |
establishment. This should bring
greater peace and also an abiding | 1:36:53 | 1:37:06 | |
sense of security in communities and
in our entire nation. Among the | 1:37:06 | 1:37:21 | |
issues discussed, is that relating
to our economy, which, as we all | 1:37:21 | 1:37:29 | |
know is going through a difficult
patch. | 1:37:29 | 1:37:40 | |
Of great concern (inaudible)
operations of all importance. | 1:37:43 | 1:37:57 | |
(Inaudible) | 1:37:58 | 1:38:06 | |
... Between high rapging officials
in the party and in Government, | 1:38:07 | 1:38:17 | |
exacerbated by multiple conflicting
messages from both the party and | 1:38:17 | 1:38:23 | |
Government - high ranking officials,
made the criticisms levelled against | 1:38:23 | 1:38:27 | |
us inescapable. Amidst all this,
projects already adopted by | 1:38:27 | 1:38:43 | |
government stood stalled, needless
controversies. All this now has to | 1:38:43 | 1:38:47 | |
stopped as we inaugurate a new work
culture and pace which will show a | 1:38:47 | 1:38:56 | |
strong sense of purpose and
commitment to turning around our | 1:38:56 | 1:39:07 | |
economy in terms of our policies.
The Government remains committed to | 1:39:07 | 1:39:24 | |
improving the social and material
conditions of the people. Government | 1:39:24 | 1:39:38 | |
will soon unveil an entrepreneurial
skills and business development | 1:39:38 | 1:39:42 | |
programme which will empower and
unleash gainful projects at our | 1:39:42 | 1:39:48 | |
growth points and rural areas. Tell
all Zimbabweans we are a nation born | 1:39:48 | 1:39:58 | |
out of a protracted struggle for
national independence. Our rules lie | 1:39:58 | 1:40:08 | |
in that struggle, with goals and
ideals and present and construct our | 1:40:08 | 1:40:20 | |
future. | 1:40:20 | 1:40:24 | |
Core tennants must be subscribed by
all across generations and across | 1:40:29 | 1:40:32 | |
times. Indeed, these too was a great
concern of our commanders who | 1:40:32 | 1:40:43 | |
themselves were makers of that
revolution and often at very tender | 1:40:43 | 1:40:49 | |
ages and at great personal terror.
We still have in our various | 1:40:49 | 1:40:58 | |
communities veterans of that
founding struggle. We might have | 1:40:58 | 1:41:06 | |
founded the prevailing management of
national and issues quite | 1:41:06 | 1:41:13 | |
alienating. This must be corrected
without delay, including ensuring | 1:41:13 | 1:41:22 | |
that these veterans continue to play
central roles in the lives of our | 1:41:22 | 1:41:28 | |
nation. | 1:41:28 | 1:41:38 | |
We must all recognise that our
participation in the war of | 1:41:39 | 1:41:46 | |
liberation exacted life-Long costs,
which whilst hardly repayable, may | 1:41:46 | 1:41:55 | |
still be assuaged and
Amelliouraited. In respect of the | 1:41:55 | 1:42:05 | |
party, and the party issues raised
by both of the commanders and by the | 1:42:05 | 1:42:11 | |
general membership of ZANU-PF this
too stands acknowledged. They have | 1:42:11 | 1:42:20 | |
to be attended to with a great sense
of urgency. However, I am aware that | 1:42:20 | 1:42:31 | |
as a party of liberation, ZANU-PF
has, over the years, written | 1:42:31 | 1:42:38 | |
elaborate rules and procedures that
guide the operations of all its | 1:42:38 | 1:42:47 | |
organs and its personnel. Indeed,
the current criticism raised against | 1:42:47 | 1:42:59 | |
the command element - raised against
it by the command element and some | 1:42:59 | 1:43:04 | |
of its members. Have arisen from a
well-founded perception that the | 1:43:04 | 1:43:14 | |
party was stretching or even failing
in its own rules and procedures. The | 1:43:14 | 1:43:25 | |
way forward, that cannot be based on
swapping (inaudible) that ride | 1:43:25 | 1:43:38 | |
roughshod over party rules and
procedures. There has to be a net | 1:43:38 | 1:43:45 | |
return to the guiding principles of
our party, as enshrined in its | 1:43:45 | 1:43:53 | |
constitution, which must apply
fairly and equitably in all | 1:43:53 | 1:44:00 | |
situations and before all members.
The area of victimisation and | 1:44:00 | 1:44:15 | |
arbitrary decisions must be put
behind so as we all embrace a new | 1:44:15 | 1:44:26 | |
ethos, predicated on the supreme law
of our party and nourished by an | 1:44:26 | 1:44:37 | |
abiding sense of comrade Iry. --
comradery. To all there, there must | 1:44:37 | 1:44:49 | |
be general recognition that ZANU-PF
is a party of traditions. And has | 1:44:49 | 1:45:01 | |
been served by successive
generations who are bound to the by | 1:45:01 | 1:45:06 | |
shared ideals and values which must
continue to reign supreme in our | 1:45:06 | 1:45:12 | |
nation. | 1:45:12 | 1:45:22 | |
Intergenerational conflict must be | 1:45:23 | 1:45:36 | |
resolved through harmonised melding
of old established players as they | 1:45:37 | 1:45:42 | |
embrace and welcome new rules, new
ones through a well-defined sense of | 1:45:42 | 1:45:50 | |
hierarchy and succession. Indeed,
all these matters will be discussed | 1:45:50 | 1:46:01 | |
by settled at the forthcoming
conference within the framework of a | 1:46:01 | 1:46:08 | |
clear road map that seeks to resolve
once and for all any omissions or | 1:46:08 | 1:46:19 | |
contradictions that have affected
our party neglectively. | 1:46:19 | 1:46:28 | |
In a few weeks from now, I will
preside over the processes which | 1:46:32 | 1:46:39 | |
must not be prepossessed by any acts
acts calculated to undermine it or | 1:46:39 | 1:46:49 | |
to compromise the outcomes in the
eyes of the public. I conclude this | 1:46:49 | 1:46:58 | |
address and I am aware that many
developments have occurred in the | 1:46:58 | 1:47:05 | |
party or have been championed and
done by individuals in the name of | 1:47:05 | 1:47:12 | |
the party. Given the failings of the
past and the anger this might have | 1:47:12 | 1:47:25 | |
triggered in some quarters, such as
developments - such developments are | 1:47:25 | 1:47:34 | |
quite understandable. However we
cannot be guided by bitterness or | 1:47:34 | 1:47:43 | |
vengefulness, both of which would
not make us any better party members | 1:47:43 | 1:47:56 | |
or any better Zimbabweans. Our
policy of reconciliation, which we | 1:47:56 | 1:48:08 | |
pronounced in 1980, and which
through we reached out to those who | 1:48:08 | 1:48:16 | |
had occupied and oppressed us for
nearly a century and those we had | 1:48:16 | 1:48:28 | |
traded fire with in a bitter war,
surely cannot be unavailable to our | 1:48:28 | 1:48:38 | |
own, both in the party and in our
nation. We must learn to forgive and | 1:48:38 | 1:48:50 | |
resolve contradictions, real or
perceived in a comradery Zimbabwean | 1:48:50 | 1:49:01 | |
spirit. I am confident that from
tonight our whole nation, all of us, | 1:49:01 | 1:49:10 | |
gets reforecast as we put shoulder
to the wheel amidst the promising | 1:49:10 | 1:49:18 | |
agricultural season already upon us.
Let us all move forward, reminding | 1:49:18 | 1:49:35 | |
ourselves of our war-time mantra. I
thank you and good night. | 1:49:35 | 1:49:49 | |
Sorry, one or two places I went
wrong. I hope we can correct that. | 1:49:52 | 1:49:59 | |
There we are, Robert Mugabe
essentially defying all expectation | 1:49:59 | 1:50:02 | |
in that speech earlier this evening.
So many people expecting a speech of | 1:50:02 | 1:50:06 | |
resignation but actually as you saw
there something quite different. | 1:50:06 | 1:50:09 | |
What might be described as a rather
rambling speech, some confusion tend | 1:50:09 | 1:50:14 | |
that he was even on live television,
as he apologised under his breath to | 1:50:14 | 1:50:19 | |
those around him for having stumbled
here and there and Morgan Tsvangirai | 1:50:19 | 1:50:36 | |
saying he was "baffled by his
decision not to resign." Well Ben | 1:50:36 | 1:50:42 | |
Brown spoke to the Africa editor,
Fergal Keane who gave his reaction | 1:50:42 | 1:50:46 | |
to Mugabe's speech It is the end of
the era of Mugabe but he has managed | 1:50:46 | 1:50:51 | |
probably by playing an international
card, probably by saying it is the | 1:50:51 | 1:50:56 | |
policy of the African Union, or
international community that leaders | 1:50:56 | 1:50:59 | |
are not moved by coups, he has
managed to gain himself extra time. | 1:50:59 | 1:51:04 | |
But does anybody really believe?
Given the strength of feeling in the | 1:51:04 | 1:51:07 | |
party and on the streets that he is
going to endure as President of | 1:51:07 | 1:51:11 | |
Zimbabwe? I'm willing, in terms of
the narrative to say, no that's not | 1:51:11 | 1:51:17 | |
going to happen. You talked about
how frustrated the people will be, | 1:51:17 | 1:51:20 | |
we saw that people power on the
streets down behind us in Harare and | 1:51:20 | 1:51:25 | |
the call we gather from the war
veterans for them to come back out | 1:51:25 | 1:51:27 | |
on to the streets on Wednesday but
it doesn't look like Robert Mugabe | 1:51:27 | 1:51:31 | |
listens to the people, certainly not
to be people who were demonstrating | 1:51:31 | 1:51:36 | |
yesterday, demanding he goes. It has
never been his story, listen | 1:51:36 | 1:51:39 | |
together people. That's not the time
of politics he came up W he is a | 1:51:39 | 1:51:44 | |
graduate of the revolutionary
politics of the 40s, 50s, 60s, | 1:51:44 | 1:51:51 | |
trained in Leninist positions of
power, you control party organs, and | 1:51:51 | 1:51:56 | |
the military and security force. The
key thing is he doesn't control them | 1:51:56 | 1:52:00 | |
anybody. Tonight, yes, a big
anticlimax for many who come out on | 1:52:00 | 1:52:04 | |
to the streets but it is not the end
of the story of Robert Mugabe's | 1:52:04 | 1:52:08 | |
departure. That is going to happen.
Now, when you have the party calling | 1:52:08 | 1:52:11 | |
for people to come on to the
streets, they are potentially | 1:52:11 | 1:52:15 | |
worrying dynamics. All of that
excitement that we saw yesterday, | 1:52:15 | 1:52:18 | |
all of those people who believe that
change is imminent. That it is going | 1:52:18 | 1:52:21 | |
to come in a matter of die days, if
not hours, when it is brought on to | 1:52:21 | 1:52:27 | |
the streets, it could be
problematic. . One more question, | 1:52:27 | 1:52:32 | |
you know, impeachment is what he is
being threatened with by ZANU-PF of | 1:52:32 | 1:52:37 | |
they have said if he doesn't resign
by midday tomorrow, which he clearly | 1:52:37 | 1:52:41 | |
isn't going to do, that's when the
impeachment begins. Will that get | 1:52:41 | 1:52:45 | |
rid of him? How quickly? It is
potentially possibly they might go | 1:52:45 | 1:52:49 | |
ahead with this. The other
possibility is you will get some | 1:52:49 | 1:52:52 | |
kind of fudge. There will be a lot
of talking now between the leaders | 1:52:52 | 1:52:57 | |
of the military and other branches
of the state security forces, the | 1:52:57 | 1:53:01 | |
war veterans and party and something
we have not mentioned so far in this | 1:53:01 | 1:53:08 | |
conversation, the kind of heir that
the party wants to replace Robert | 1:53:08 | 1:53:11 | |
Mugabe. He will have a key say in
whether that impeachment process | 1:53:11 | 1:53:15 | |
goes ahead. It is still a very
topdown party. He is the new top. If | 1:53:15 | 1:53:20 | |
he decides - I can wait another few
weeks fear the congress to anoint | 1:53:20 | 1:53:25 | |
me, I suspect the party will fall
into line. Whether the people will, | 1:53:25 | 1:53:28 | |
is another party. The BBC's Fergal
Keane speaking to Ben Brown in | 1:53:28 | 1:53:33 | |
Harare. And earlier Ben also speak
to the representative for ZANU-PF in | 1:53:33 | 1:53:39 | |
the UK he said he was disappointed
by Robert Mugabe's speech Robert | 1:53:39 | 1:53:47 | |
Mugabe has just rained on Zimbabwe's
par I had a, really. I think | 1:53:47 | 1:53:53 | |
everybody, every one of my
compatriots is downcast, pretty much | 1:53:53 | 1:53:56 | |
heart broken. I'm very sad because
what is going to happen from here | 1:53:56 | 1:54:01 | |
now is the humiliation of Robert
Mugabe. Big time humiliation, which | 1:54:01 | 1:54:08 | |
is something that throughout the
week I was saying we don't need and | 1:54:08 | 1:54:14 | |
it is very sad, because when the
evidence - I mean when the | 1:54:14 | 1:54:18 | |
impeachment evidence comes, it will
be very, very embarrassing and | 1:54:18 | 1:54:22 | |
humiliating. We didn't need to drag
him through this mud but he has | 1:54:22 | 1:54:27 | |
asked for T and as far as he is
concerned, he is going to preside | 1:54:27 | 1:54:32 | |
over Congress in December. That's
ridiculous. Which Congress? As far | 1:54:32 | 1:54:37 | |
as we are concerned he is not longer
President of our party. He is done. | 1:54:37 | 1:54:42 | |
At the central committee, the
highest board inside ZANU-PF, | 1:54:42 | 1:54:46 | |
outside Congress has made a
decision, he is gone. All ten of | 1:54:46 | 1:54:51 | |
them on Friday made the decision he
is gone, so whose interests is he | 1:54:51 | 1:54:58 | |
representing? Which constituents
does he represent? The military says | 1:54:58 | 1:55:01 | |
he is gone. At the moment he goes
under the title of Commander of | 1:55:01 | 1:55:08 | |
chief, because he hasn't stood down
formally but in terms of authority, | 1:55:08 | 1:55:12 | |
he is not comaerned of anybody. All
he has is an office but absolutelily | 1:55:12 | 1:55:17 | |
no authority. So, I don't know what
he is playing at. | 1:55:17 | 1:55:30 | |
As far ZANU-PF is concerned we have
a new leader. The nation will do | 1:55:36 | 1:55:39 | |
what it has to do. Impeach element
have to start on Tuesday. Let it | 1:55:39 | 1:55:44 | |
play. Both the opposition and
ZANU-PF are agreed on this, the | 1:55:44 | 1:55:49 | |
President has to step down. He is
three months away. BEN BROWN: How | 1:55:49 | 1:56:01 | |
quickly do you think that
impeachment progress will take? How | 1:56:01 | 1:56:04 | |
long will it take? Could he be gone
within a few days? What is your | 1:56:04 | 1:56:10 | |
estimate? I think by the end of the
week. The committee has to be set in | 1:56:10 | 1:56:15 | |
place to investigate the allegations
against him. And then it has to | 1:56:15 | 1:56:19 | |
report back and then people have to
work on T that's pretty much the | 1:56:19 | 1:56:23 | |
process. So it might not happen
overnight. It might take a few days. | 1:56:23 | 1:56:29 | |
It depends on the cooperation of all
the parties anyway. | 1:56:29 | 1:56:37 | |
The representative there from
ZANU-PF | 1:56:37 | 1:56:39 |