Browse content similar to 20/10/2011. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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Afternoon, folks. Welcome to the Daily Politics, live from | :00:27. | :00:31. | |
Westminster, where the whiff of rebellion is in the air. The Prime | :00:31. | :00:35. | |
Minister is trying to stave off a rebellion in his own ranks on | :00:35. | :00:37. | |
Monday's vote in the Commons on a referendum about our relationship | :00:37. | :00:41. | |
with Europe. Around 60 Tory backbenchers seem ready to mutiny | :00:41. | :00:48. | |
and vote for such a referendum. Meanwhile, the eurozone crisis | :00:48. | :00:50. | |
heads to its climax, President Sarkozy rushed to Berlin last night, | :00:50. | :00:53. | |
missing the birth of his child, as the chances of France stitching | :00:53. | :00:56. | |
together a comprehensive response to the sovereign debt crisis began | :00:56. | :01:06. | |
:01:06. | :01:08. | ||
to recede. Compared with that, the Commons vote is a sideshow. But, if | :01:09. | :01:15. | |
Europe falters, will the eurosceptics be emboldened? We will | :01:15. | :01:19. | |
be looking at whether or not to get rid of stamp duty. Now the house | :01:19. | :01:23. | |
price boom is over. Has it become a tax that is putting a brake on the | :01:23. | :01:26. | |
British economy? And, we'll find out just how close I managed to get | :01:26. | :01:36. | |
:01:36. | :01:38. | ||
to George Clooney at last night's And joining us for the duration the | :01:38. | :01:44. | |
Director of the Institute of Fiscal Studies - Paul Johnson. So, the big | :01:44. | :01:47. | |
story today is Europe - both the economic crisis abroad and the | :01:47. | :01:51. | |
political rebellion brewing here at home. David Cameron seems | :01:51. | :01:54. | |
determined to make a show of strength over Monday's vote on | :01:54. | :01:59. | |
whether to have a referendum on Europe. There would be three | :01:59. | :02:03. | |
options. Staying in, pulling out or staying in but with a substantial | :02:03. | :02:05. | |
repatriation of powers from Brussels, which I seem to remember | :02:05. | :02:15. | |
:02:15. | :02:16. | ||
was the Tory policy at the last Paul Johnson, how much of our taxes | :02:16. | :02:26. | |
:02:26. | :02:38. | ||
We are spending something like 12 billion a year - gross | :02:38. | :02:43. | |
contributions to the EU. That is going up over the next few years. | :02:43. | :02:48. | |
We get a fair chunk of that back. A few years ago, our net contribution | :02:48. | :02:58. | |
:02:58. | :02:59. | ||
was about 3 billion. That is rising fast over the next few years. | :03:00. | :03:04. | |
our net contribution is beginning to rise. That is the money that is | :03:04. | :03:08. | |
going out of the country in net terms. Is that down to the fact | :03:08. | :03:15. | |
that, unlike France and Italy and Spain, we do not get much out of | :03:15. | :03:19. | |
the Common Agricultural Policy? get a lot less out of it than other | :03:19. | :03:24. | |
countries, given the scale of what we put 10. Early in the 1980s we | :03:24. | :03:32. | |
negotiated that rebate. -- put in. That is because the rebate is going | :03:32. | :03:36. | |
down. �10 million is a lot of money. The EU budget is only 1% of | :03:36. | :03:43. | |
national income. We spend 40%. The EU budget is one 40th the size of | :03:43. | :03:48. | |
an ordinary national budget. Euro-sceptic case is not on the | :03:48. | :03:54. | |
cost of membership. There are other things they are not happy about. | :03:54. | :03:57. | |
There are a whole range of other things that being in Europe is | :03:57. | :04:02. | |
about. There is the cost of membership for the UK. We make | :04:02. | :04:07. | |
contributions to other countries across the EU. It is the other | :04:07. | :04:11. | |
stuff. 4 billion would be a rounding error in national accounts. | :04:11. | :04:16. | |
In terms of money spent, it is relatively small money. This debate | :04:16. | :04:19. | |
on the referendum was going to be next Thursday but the powers-that- | :04:19. | :04:21. | |
be moved it forward so David Cameron and William Hague could | :04:21. | :04:31. | |
:04:31. | :04:39. | ||
attend. Leading Tories say there is a panic. If the Commons did vote to | :04:40. | :04:42. | |
have a referendum, and it looks highly unlikely that it will do | :04:43. | :04:46. | |
that, just because of the arithmetic, even if they did, it | :04:46. | :04:50. | |
would not be binding on the Government. It would ramp up the | :04:50. | :04:55. | |
pressure on ministers to become much more Euro-sceptic. Just give | :04:55. | :05:01. | |
us the background. In 1975, but Bay City Rollers were topping the | :05:01. | :05:05. | |
charts. Jim began fixing it, the Tories chose a woman to lead their | :05:05. | :05:09. | |
party and Britain embraced Europe in a referendum. That asked whether | :05:09. | :05:14. | |
we should remain part of the Common Market which we joined a few years | :05:14. | :05:21. | |
earlier. Back then, 67% of Brit said yes. Jump forward to 2006 and | :05:21. | :05:24. | |
the Conservative leadership promised a referendum on the Lisbon | :05:24. | :05:28. | |
Treaty. It change the constitutional framework of the EU. | :05:28. | :05:31. | |
By 2009, the treaty had been ratified across Europe and the | :05:31. | :05:35. | |
Tories dropped the pledge. Thereafter, David Cameron promised | :05:35. | :05:39. | |
a referendum lock - were crying a referendum on any future transfers | :05:39. | :05:48. | |
of power. -- requiring a referendum. The Lib Dems promised an in are out | :05:49. | :05:57. | |
referendum on EU membership. Monday's debate motion calls for a | :05:57. | :06:01. | |
referendum by May, 2013, with three options but the public. Keep the | :06:01. | :06:06. | |
status quo, leaving the EU on reforming the terms of the UK | :06:06. | :06:11. | |
membership of the European Union. Joining us now is James Landale. | :06:11. | :06:16. | |
Support is growing for the summer as Conservative MPs, isn't it? | :06:16. | :06:20. | |
is. The issue of Europe has been pretty quiescent throughout much of | :06:20. | :06:26. | |
the leadership of David Cameron. By and large, by trying to keepers of | :06:26. | :06:30. | |
the front pages and trying to enjoy the fact that many Conservative | :06:30. | :06:34. | |
Euro-sceptic MPs have had different issues. Some are concerned about | :06:34. | :06:41. | |
repatriating powers, others are more concerned with issues such as | :06:41. | :06:43. | |
the Human Rights Act and the European Court of Human Rights. | :06:43. | :06:49. | |
What this court next Monday does is, it allows the coalescence of all | :06:49. | :06:53. | |
the Euro-sceptic concern to come together on one issue and one vote, | :06:53. | :06:57. | |
I think that is why the Government is so concerned about it and that | :06:57. | :07:01. | |
is why they're trying to head it off as much as they can. Is it wise | :07:01. | :07:06. | |
for David Cameron to make it a show of strength? That is what he has | :07:06. | :07:13. | |
been advised not to do. We do not know how hard the Government will | :07:13. | :07:15. | |
order its MPs to back the Government's position on Monday. | :07:15. | :07:21. | |
That is quite fluid. They are saying they expect MPs to back the | :07:22. | :07:25. | |
Government. There is a lot of mainstream Conservative MPs who | :07:25. | :07:29. | |
think that one option for the Government would be to ease off the | :07:29. | :07:33. | |
whipping. It is a backbench issue and it was raised through a | :07:34. | :07:38. | |
backbench procedure. There was a petition asking for a debate. Leave | :07:38. | :07:41. | |
it in that context and say to ministers and others within | :07:41. | :07:45. | |
government, if you are concerned about it, just do not turn up on | :07:45. | :07:51. | |
the day. There is a lot of many of them in -- manoeuvring going on. | :07:51. | :07:56. | |
What a bad arrangements in the other parties? We know the Labour | :07:56. | :08:05. | |
Party will oppose the motion. -- about other arrangements in other | :08:05. | :08:10. | |
parties? There will not be a vote in favour of the whole house of | :08:10. | :08:14. | |
Commons calling for a vote on membership of the European Union. | :08:14. | :08:18. | |
The question is, how many Conservative MPs feel they can | :08:18. | :08:22. | |
oppose the Government on this because they feel so strongly about | :08:22. | :08:26. | |
it and constituents feel so strongly about it and they feel it | :08:26. | :08:32. | |
really needs to happen. We are now joined by Emma Reynolds, who speaks | :08:32. | :08:37. | |
for the Labour Party on Europe and Andrew Rossendale he stood up | :08:37. | :08:43. | |
yesterday at Prime Minister's Questions, telling that the British | :08:43. | :08:49. | |
people are crying out for a referendum. About understanding the | :08:49. | :08:54. | |
Labour position, when it comes to this vote, what will Labour do? Is | :08:55. | :08:58. | |
there a three-line whip to vote against? There is a three-line whip | :08:58. | :09:03. | |
to vote against having a referendum on our membership in the European | :09:03. | :09:08. | |
Union. It was not in our manifesto, nor in the manifesto of the | :09:08. | :09:14. | |
Conservative Party. It was a new once promised by the Lib Dems. | :09:14. | :09:19. | |
other kind of Lib Dem promise is there? It is normally sitting on | :09:20. | :09:24. | |
the fence! We think it is a distraction. The economy is that | :09:24. | :09:34. | |
:09:34. | :09:35. | ||
lies in, -- flats lining. People should not be concentrating on | :09:35. | :09:40. | |
theirs. Our front bench will not defy the three-line whip. Some well. | :09:40. | :09:46. | |
You have some rebels. A small minority of Labour MPs, I think, | :09:46. | :09:52. | |
will vote for the nation. Andrew Rosenfeld Kite you have lost pretty | :09:52. | :10:02. | |
:10:02. | :10:03. | ||
heavily. -- the motion. This is a fundamental issue facing our | :10:03. | :10:07. | |
country. It has gone on for years. The British people deserve the | :10:07. | :10:11. | |
right to have their say in a referendum. I do not understand why | :10:11. | :10:17. | |
it keeps whipping politics apart. We should be allowed to had a -- | :10:17. | :10:24. | |
allowed to have a say on this. agree with you but she used -- but | :10:24. | :10:29. | |
you should not be able to determine that. Have the Lib Dems told to how | :10:29. | :10:35. | |
they will vote? I have not spoken to the Lib Dems. What a do know is, | :10:35. | :10:39. | |
however the House of Commons votes, deep people of Britain want to | :10:39. | :10:45. | |
decide the future of this country. -- the people. I believe that David | :10:45. | :10:52. | |
Cameron is doing the right thing for Britain. His heart is the same | :10:52. | :10:58. | |
as the rest of us. He has a three- line whip against you put up his | :10:58. | :11:05. | |
heart is no Rennie yours. If he pledges at some point the British | :11:05. | :11:10. | |
people have the chance to vote, he will satisfy many British people. | :11:10. | :11:15. | |
Is it Labour policy on Europe to repatriate any powers? We have said | :11:15. | :11:24. | |
our membership of the European Union is a vital matter of national | :11:24. | :11:29. | |
interest. We need to make sure we have the strong voice in the | :11:29. | :11:34. | |
European Union to make sure that whatever comes out of this crisis, | :11:34. | :11:39. | |
our businesses and jobs depend on the eurozone. Whatever comes out of | :11:39. | :11:45. | |
it, we still have our vital national interest protected in | :11:45. | :11:49. | |
Europe by further deepening beat single market. Her I understand | :11:49. | :11:55. | |
that. Where do you go after this? - - I understand that. The interest | :11:56. | :12:01. | |
will be the size of the rebellion you can muster. The eurozone is | :12:01. | :12:07. | |
meeting this weekend. Signs do not look good to me for any deal being | :12:08. | :12:10. | |
done. Otherwise Nicolas Sarkozy would stay and watch the birth of | :12:10. | :12:15. | |
his child. Where do you go after this? At what point does the | :12:15. | :12:19. | |
British Parliament allow the British people the right to decide | :12:19. | :12:25. | |
their own destiny. It has gone on for decades and decades. The House | :12:25. | :12:28. | |
of Commons needs to allow the British people to make a decision | :12:28. | :12:32. | |
about our long-term future. It is not just about the crisis at the | :12:32. | :12:37. | |
moment, it is about the long-term position of the United Kingdom with | :12:37. | :12:41. | |
regard to the European Union. The option of trade and co-operation is | :12:41. | :12:46. | |
what the vast majority of people want. I want trade and co-operation | :12:46. | :12:54. | |
- a sensible relationship that suits Switzerland. As I understand | :12:54. | :12:59. | |
it, the third option is not a Swiss position. Switzerland is not a | :12:59. | :13:04. | |
member of the EU. The third option is, we stay in that have a more | :13:04. | :13:08. | |
arm's-length relationship. Can you clarify that? Be third option has | :13:08. | :13:16. | |
to be discussed as to what bad exactly means. So, the third option | :13:16. | :13:23. | |
is not staying in? We have to change our relationship | :13:23. | :13:28. | |
fundamentally. This is new. I want to get this right. As I had | :13:28. | :13:31. | |
understood it and BBC has been reporting, the options and his | :13:31. | :13:35. | |
referendum would be a vote to come out, vote to stay in on the | :13:35. | :13:42. | |
existing arrangements, Status quo, will vote to stay in or having a | :13:42. | :13:49. | |
substantial repatriation of powers? If we can achieve that, fantastic. | :13:49. | :13:55. | |
There is only one other option. That is the problem. Why have a | :13:55. | :14:00. | |
referendum when you know you cannot deliver? We promised a referendum | :14:00. | :14:10. | |
on the constitutional treaty. We had negotiations, I was working in | :14:10. | :14:14. | |
the Foreign Office at the time... If we have the political will to | :14:14. | :14:20. | |
achieve this, then we can achieve it. We cannot give up before we | :14:20. | :14:26. | |
start. If we leave, we will need to go through an arrangement of trade | :14:26. | :14:30. | |
co-operation. That would be no different you a third option. I | :14:30. | :14:37. | |
want to come back to run important point on Labour policy. -- an | :14:37. | :14:42. | |
important point. It is now conservative coalition policy to | :14:42. | :14:48. | |
urge the eurozone to go full fiscal integration - made to transfer of | :14:48. | :14:55. | |
payments from north to south and fall economic policy to be | :14:55. | :14:59. | |
controlled from the centre. What is the policy of Labour? George | :14:59. | :15:04. | |
Osborne has said for the eurozone to be successful, they need some | :15:05. | :15:09. | |
kind of fiscal integration. That will only be the eurozone 17 | :15:09. | :15:15. | |
members and not the wider European Union. I did not know that but I'm | :15:15. | :15:20. | |
grateful to find out, as you and your government are urging, that | :15:20. | :15:24. | |
changes the whole dynamics of Europe. Britain will be on the | :15:24. | :15:30. | |
wrong side of the block of 17 that will always vote together. That is | :15:30. | :15:35. | |
why, if our membership is being questioned, that weakens our boys | :15:35. | :15:40. | |
in the European Union. I am in favour of us still retaining the | :15:40. | :15:44. | |
relationship we have. You just said you are in favour of the position | :15:44. | :15:52. | |
of Osborne of the deepening fiscal integration. Of the eurozone 17. | :15:52. | :15:56. | |
is a 17 Boat block. There are differences on the single market | :15:56. | :16:06. | |
:16:06. | :16:11. | ||
The crisis is the real news at the moment, there is a real problem | :16:11. | :16:14. | |
going on and that is where the focus of UK and European attention | :16:14. | :16:19. | |
should be. If that is not sorted out... The EU is by far and away | :16:19. | :16:23. | |
our biggest trade June -- trading partner and if they meet real | :16:23. | :16:27. | |
trouble, our economies won't be far behind. | :16:27. | :16:30. | |
You don't think there is going to be a solution by Monday? | :16:30. | :16:37. | |
I think the signs are not good. Mr Sarkozy would not even stay for the | :16:37. | :16:42. | |
birth of his child, which shows you how bad things are. | :16:42. | :16:45. | |
Last night saw the premiere of George Clooney's latest film, The | :16:45. | :16:55. | |
:16:55. | :16:58. | ||
Ides Of March, a dark thriller It says we are going to help people | :16:58. | :17:02. | |
get an education, create national unity, treat them a trade and get | :17:02. | :17:06. | |
them out of debt for their college loans. Where does that fail? That | :17:06. | :17:10. | |
is exactly right, but if you're going to do it, it do it. Make it | :17:10. | :17:17. | |
mandatory, not voluntary. Mandatory. Everybody who turns 18 or graduates | :17:17. | :17:21. | |
high school gives two years of service to his or her country, and | :17:21. | :17:25. | |
for that your college education is paid for. The beauty of it is that | :17:25. | :17:29. | |
everybody over the age of 18, or pass the age of eligibility will be | :17:29. | :17:38. | |
for it. And all of the others? Can't vote. Too young. For proof | :17:38. | :17:42. | |
policy, there. The man who wrote the film with George Clooney is | :17:42. | :17:48. | |
Beau Willimon, he is in the studio. I saw the film, it was great. It | :17:48. | :17:52. | |
was also really dark, politically, showing what happens behind the | :17:52. | :17:57. | |
scenes. Is it really like that, or was this a more cynical take? | :17:57. | :18:01. | |
really is like that. We are keeping our focus on the darker side of it, | :18:01. | :18:05. | |
but I have worked on a number of campaigns over the years, going | :18:05. | :18:11. | |
back to a Senate race in 1998, Bill Bradley in 2000, Hillary Clinton, | :18:12. | :18:16. | |
Howard Dean. I based my writing of the play and the movie on all of | :18:16. | :18:21. | |
those experiences and things I saw first hand, or variations of first | :18:21. | :18:25. | |
hand. I suppose everybody presumes there is a little bit of dirty | :18:25. | :18:30. | |
tricks that goes on on the campaign trail. That's understandable. This | :18:30. | :18:36. | |
went a stage further. The moral that I took away is that you cannot | :18:36. | :18:40. | |
be a nice guy in politics, only the bad boys won. A lot of people would | :18:40. | :18:45. | |
see that as a cynical attitude but I see it as a realistic one. In | :18:45. | :18:51. | |
America, we want diametrically opposed things from politicians. We | :18:51. | :18:55. | |
want them to be bastions of moral integrity but also looked to be | :18:55. | :19:05. | |
:19:05. | :19:08. | ||
effective -- effective leaders. To be effective leaders, you have do | :19:08. | :19:11. | |
sometimes be abhorrent. When you have someone who is willing to | :19:11. | :19:16. | |
break the rules, or the law, to get something accomplished, and we want | :19:16. | :19:19. | |
to praise them for their ability to get things done, and on the other | :19:19. | :19:23. | |
hand, we want to destroy them, because they have not projected | :19:23. | :19:27. | |
that image of moral integrity on to the wild, we are being hypocrites | :19:27. | :19:31. | |
as an electorate -- onto the world. As much as they are being | :19:31. | :19:34. | |
hypocrites as people. You are saying that leaders have to be | :19:34. | :19:38. | |
flawed, if they are prepared to go and stop at nothing to get the big | :19:38. | :19:44. | |
prize? They are human beings like the rest of us. If you are married | :19:44. | :19:48. | |
and in a long-term relationship, the statistics are that you have | :19:48. | :19:57. | |
cheated, or you will. Those are the odds. When a politician does that, | :19:57. | :20:00. | |
we suddenly find them unfit to lead. One could argue that we should hold | :20:00. | :20:07. | |
them to a higher standard than we told ourselves, -- hold ourselves, | :20:07. | :20:11. | |
but we need to see that we are also because, all contradictory. They | :20:11. | :20:15. | |
have a great deal of power but they are human beings. Those campaigns | :20:15. | :20:19. | |
you work on, were there different levels of taking that to the nth | :20:19. | :20:23. | |
degree? Was some of the guys you worked with worse than others when | :20:23. | :20:28. | |
it became too behaviour in terms of ethical behaviour? -- when it came | :20:28. | :20:34. | |
to behaviour. It focuses on those behind the scenes, and because they | :20:34. | :20:37. | |
are not in the public light, they have more latitude to do things | :20:37. | :20:46. | |
that are wrong, or illegal, or ethically tenuous. Politicians find | :20:46. | :20:52. | |
themselves in that position all the time. Good politics is about Pope | :20:52. | :20:56. | |
compromise -- about compromise at the end of the day. Every time you | :20:56. | :21:03. | |
do that on an ideological landscape, you are redrawing the line in the | :21:03. | :21:08. | |
sand. That sort of behaviour can pleat into your personal life and | :21:08. | :21:12. | |
sense of moral integrity -- bleed into. So that the redrawing of the | :21:12. | :21:16. | |
line becomes a habit. People I have worked for have been great | :21:16. | :21:20. | |
candidates like Howard Dean, Bill Bradley, Hillary Clinton. They are | :21:20. | :21:26. | |
great leaders. Do I have first-hand experience of any of them doing | :21:26. | :21:34. | |
incapacity things, no. I have to interrupt, sorry to do this. We are | :21:34. | :21:38. | |
getting reports from Libya that Colonel Gaddafi has been wounded | :21:38. | :21:47. | |
and captured by the rebel forces in Libya itself. This is coming out of | :21:47. | :21:50. | |
the National Transitional Council. They say they have Colonel Gaddafi | :21:50. | :21:56. | |
in Libya. These reports are unconfirmed. They are being | :21:56. | :22:01. | |
reported by a Reuters. We are getting other reports, we have not | :22:01. | :22:08. | |
yet got it confirmed. We will bring you this as soon as we get it. | :22:08. | :22:14. | |
He is captured and winded in both legs, taken away by ambulance -- | :22:14. | :22:18. | |
and wounded. But it is not confirmed. But it looks like | :22:18. | :22:25. | |
something is happening. Sorry to interrupt with that news. If you | :22:25. | :22:30. | |
were watching, Jo was boasting about how she was going to speak to | :22:30. | :22:34. | |
George Clooney. I was cut off before I finish that | :22:34. | :22:38. | |
sentence! This is how close she got. Look at | :22:38. | :22:42. | |
this. Can't you see me? | :22:42. | :22:51. | |
The closest she got was, George! I am over here! Thank you very much. | :22:51. | :22:56. | |
Thank you so much. Our guest of the day is Paul Johnson from the | :22:56. | :22:59. | |
Institute of Fiscal Studies, which published a report on the number of | :22:59. | :23:04. | |
areas of taxation it thought right for reform. One of them was stamp | :23:04. | :23:09. | |
duty, a relic of the 17th century. A bit like us. It was only meant to | :23:09. | :23:15. | |
be temporary, just like income tax. Damn you, William Pitt. Was it the | :23:15. | :23:21. | |
younger all the elder? Who brought in income tax. A cash-strapped | :23:21. | :23:25. | |
Treasury isn't keen on giving up its big earners. | :23:25. | :23:29. | |
If you are lucky enough to be able to afford one, it is just something | :23:29. | :23:33. | |
you have to pay when you are buying a house. But have you ever thought, | :23:33. | :23:37. | |
what the hell is stamp duty? It is a weird one. Like many taxes, it | :23:37. | :23:43. | |
was brought in to fund the war, in 6094, William and Mary's reign, a | :23:43. | :23:49. | |
war against the French -- 16 at 94. It was only meant to come in for | :23:49. | :23:54. | |
four years. All these years later, it is still there, because like | :23:54. | :23:57. | |
most Chancellors, they think, this is quite nice, we will hang on to | :23:57. | :24:02. | |
this. Best estimates suggest stamp duty land tax let's the Treasury | :24:02. | :24:12. | |
:24:12. | :24:16. | ||
hang on to �6 billion a year. But Raised a lot of politicians out | :24:16. | :24:20. | |
there accept the fact that stamp duty and the way it is levied is | :24:20. | :24:25. | |
well past its sell-by date. Maybe not get rid of it but they need to | :24:25. | :24:32. | |
be substantial reforms. The charge is three form. -- threefold. If you | :24:32. | :24:39. | |
buy a house that is �1 over 250,000, you will pay 3%, not 1%. At �1 | :24:39. | :24:44. | |
could cost you �5,000. That can't be right. What we are saying, there | :24:44. | :24:49. | |
should not be that slapper approach. It is a disincentive. You should be | :24:49. | :24:59. | |
:24:59. | :25:02. | ||
looking at it in the same way. -- Regional differences mean half the | :25:02. | :25:06. | |
stamp duty revenue comes from a quarter of transactions that in -- | :25:06. | :25:09. | |
are in the south-east. And it is an extra financial burden on first- | :25:09. | :25:14. | |
time buyers, which taken altogether, suggests leading stamp duty as it | :25:14. | :25:17. | |
is is bad for the housing market. Trouble is, with a cash-strapped | :25:17. | :25:21. | |
government, it seems now is not the time to cut such a big source of | :25:21. | :25:25. | |
revenue. The Treasury is raising the tax is and we need those to pay | :25:25. | :25:28. | |
for public services. If we were looking at anything, it would be | :25:28. | :25:31. | |
help for small businesses, those parts of the economy that will | :25:32. | :25:36. | |
create growth. The Treasury's position is that any and every tax | :25:36. | :25:40. | |
cannot always be under review. And all of them could be up for reform. | :25:40. | :25:44. | |
In the current economic climate, having spoken to officials and a | :25:44. | :25:48. | |
Treasury Minister, it is fair to say, stamp duty reform is not, at | :25:48. | :25:55. | |
the moment, top of their agenda. We are joined by the Tory MP | :25:55. | :26:03. | |
Is it realistic to get rid of stamp duty in any way, given it has | :26:03. | :26:08. | |
become a huge money-spinner for the Treasury? No but two reforms are | :26:09. | :26:13. | |
possible. I have been pushing to see stamp duty paid by people | :26:13. | :26:20. | |
selling the very expensive houses. If a company is not carrying on | :26:20. | :26:23. | |
business, if it consists of a single property, when it is sold, | :26:23. | :26:29. | |
it should be taxed as... That is a London problem. Yes, but it would | :26:29. | :26:34. | |
bring in a lot of money, and we need to extend capital gains tax to | :26:34. | :26:37. | |
non-residents. That would make people at the top pay a fair share. | :26:37. | :26:43. | |
The other issue is the one that you said in your clip, above 250,000. | :26:43. | :26:48. | |
In my constituency of Rochester and Strood, many family detached homes | :26:48. | :26:53. | |
are worth 250, 300,000, and it is very difficult to sell those. Many | :26:53. | :27:00. | |
people have to take a prize at 249995, because of this economic | :27:00. | :27:04. | |
cliff -- a price at. Do you get the indication that the Treasury is | :27:04. | :27:07. | |
interested in any of that? Potential it. I think the Treasury | :27:07. | :27:12. | |
would want to do that in a revenue neutral way, charging a bit about | :27:12. | :27:19. | |
1% on those immediately below 250,000. I also think the Treasury | :27:19. | :27:22. | |
appreciates these taxes tend to reduce transactions. When Labour | :27:22. | :27:25. | |
put in the big increases, the property market was booming. Given | :27:25. | :27:29. | |
the difficulty of transactions in the property market, if you cut | :27:29. | :27:34. | |
rates temporarily, it could lead to more transactions and revenue, and | :27:34. | :27:40. | |
house sales feed into the wider economy. It is a very damaging tax, | :27:40. | :27:45. | |
it reduces the number of transactions, it increases rather | :27:45. | :27:49. | |
than reduces volatility in prices. The approach is absurd because it | :27:49. | :27:53. | |
makes it very difficult to sell. There was a report earlier this | :27:53. | :27:57. | |
week worrying that too many people occupied houses too big for them. | :27:57. | :28:02. | |
One reason, it was so expensive to sell the house. The whole housing | :28:02. | :28:07. | |
tax system needs reforming. It is unfair and regressive and the way | :28:07. | :28:12. | |
it impacts on people. I don't see tax reform being high up the | :28:12. | :28:16. | |
Government's agenda, but I live to be surprised. We have depict the | :28:16. | :28:22. | |
guess the year when a bomb yesterday. -- we have to pick. From | :28:22. | :28:32. | |
:28:32. | :28:33. | ||
Roger Langley from Ipswich, the mud is yours. That is it, thanks to all | :28:33. | :28:39. | |
of our guests -- the mark is yours. Thanks to Paul Johnson. I will be | :28:39. | :28:46. |