03/11/2011 Daily Politics


03/11/2011

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Afternoon folks, welcome to the Daily Politics. Confusion and chaos

:00:29.:00:33.

are the only ways to describe the extraordinary events surrounding

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the G20 summit in the south of France. It's all down to the Greeks.

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As we come on air the Greek cabinet is in another emergency session.

:00:42.:00:45.

Prime Minister Papandreou has already lost his parliamentary

:00:45.:00:50.

majority. Coe be about to lose his job. It looks like he's lost his

:00:50.:00:53.

plan for a referendum and there is a confidence vote to lose tomorrow.

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No wonder the G20 is left scratching its head back in Cannes.

:00:59.:01:04.

World leaders thought the G20 summit would rubber stamp the euro

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don't deal agreed last week. Now there's nothing to endorse, bar the

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growing realisation that if Greece defaults Europe and America are

:01:12.:01:15.

heading back into recession. We will be hearing from our

:01:15.:01:19.

correspondents in Cannes and Athens and talking to two former British

:01:19.:01:22.

Chancellors, Alistair Darling, and Nigel Lawson.

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And how is the crisis changing the landscape of British politics?

:01:27.:01:31.

Should Conservatives who want out of Europe altogether join the UK

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Independence Party? All that coming up. With us for the

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duration former Conservative politician who recently defected to

:01:44.:01:48.

UKIP, Alexander Hesketh, twobg the programme. Events are moving

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quickly this morning as world lieders set out for the -- leaders

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set out for the G20 in Cannes expecting to endorse the Greek

:01:56.:01:59.

bail-out and the rest of the plan that was supposed to save the

:01:59.:02:07.

eurozone. But that plan has unravelled before the ink was dry,

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thanks to various shenanigans emanating from Athens. As things

:02:11.:02:16.

stand, no one in the G20 knows if Greece is staying in or out of the

:02:16.:02:23.

euro. Backs or rejects the bail-out, or even has an operating Government.

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The Greek Prime Minister, George Papandreou, has has just announced

:02:26.:02:31.

that he as offered his resignation to the Greek cabinet. We don't know

:02:31.:02:37.

what the response is yet, but he is clearly hanging on to his job by

:02:37.:02:41.

his fingernails. He has lost his majority, the support of Ministers,

:02:41.:02:46.

including his ambitious deputy, the referendum plan is in tatters. He

:02:46.:02:52.

faces a confidence vote in 24 hours. We will keep I posted -- on all the

:02:53.:03:00.

news as it happens. Th President Obama and the G20 host President

:03:00.:03:04.

Sarkozy made the usual pleasantries this morning and had a joke about

:03:04.:03:07.

the recent birth of the French President's daughter but it was

:03:07.:03:11.

clear neither had a clue about what to do next. We are going to flesh

:03:11.:03:16.

out more details about how the plan will be fully and decisively

:03:16.:03:21.

implemented. We also discussed the situation in Greece and how we can

:03:21.:03:26.

work to help resolve that situation, as well. The United States will

:03:26.:03:30.

continue to be a partner with the Europeans to resolve these

:03:30.:03:37.

challenges. TRANSLATION: We need leadership of Barack Obama,

:03:37.:03:40.

we need the solidarity and support of the United States of America and

:03:40.:03:46.

we need a joint, common analysis as to the way we can put the world

:03:46.:03:50.

back on the path of growth and stability.

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Now, let me go through this breaking news that we are getting.

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Reuters reporting he hasn't resigned and doesn't intend to, but

:04:00.:04:04.

also reports that he may at least have offered his resignation to the

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Greek cabinet. When we get clarification of that we will bring

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you up to speed. Alexander Hesketh, this is a remarkable G20, because

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normally these summits are planned in advance, the draft is usually

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written before they get there. It's all falling apart, what do they do

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next? I mean, this has happened before and was totally predictable,

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because the history books are full of examples of where you try and

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have a currency union without having a political union. It's

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doomed from the kick-off. That's why the Germans and French are now

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realising they have to have a fiscal union. They're going to have

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a fiscal union and it's going to cost a great deal of money if

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they're not careful. Will they have a fiscal union that will include

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all 17 of the eurozone members. You would have to bet any fiscal union

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is not going to include Greece now? My bet is that they will

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desperately try and hold the whole thing together with - I mean, July

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21st was a complete fraud. The last meeting was a complete fraud in

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terms of if you actually looked at in the cold light of day and

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outside the Brussels bubble and they'll try and keep it together

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because in a sense France ogt to be the leader of club med and the

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Germans should lead a group if they want to stay in the euro in

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northern Europe. I don't see the French allowing... I agree, which

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is why the whole thing is doomed. Let me bring you up to date, we are

:05:35.:05:38.

getting more clarification of what's happening in Athens. It

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seems the Greek Prime Minister, Mr Papandreou, hasn't just offered his

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resignation to the cabinet, he is actually going to see the Greek

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President to offer his resignation to the President. It's largely an

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honorary title. He is going to do this, he hopes as a prelude to

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forming what's been called a Government of national unity. That

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may sound sensible, the problem is that the opposition, the main

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centre-right opposition in Greece is totally opposed to the bail-out

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that Mr Papandreou is proposing and wanted to have a referendum on. So

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whether there would be much unity in that Government is something

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that we will fine out in the days - - fine out in the days ahead. The

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stakes for today's G20 summit couldn't be higher, at the moment

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they're spectators at the feast watching Greeks not bearing gifts.

:06:29.:06:33.

What can we expect? It's changing all the time.

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President Sarkozy who is hosting today's summit had hoped it would

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be a relaxed and glamorous affair on the French Riviera, where they

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presented the deal thrashed out last week to the rest of the world.

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Instead it's turned into a big fat Greek nightmare. The Greek Prime

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Minister's decision to hold a referendum on the rescue package is

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set to dominate the discussions and now we learn Mr Papandreou will go

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to the Greek President to offer his resignation. This morning he lost

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his majority in parliament, which doesn't bode well for his

:07:04.:07:07.

confidence vote tomorrow. Then there's the referendum itself,

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thought to be held on December 4th. Last night the Greek leader had a

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difficult meeting with President Sarkozy of France and Chancellor

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Merkel of Germany, where they warned him Greece's future in the

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eurozone was at stake. Mr Sarkozy said later:

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The two leaders have said the next bail-out cheque will be withheld.

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President Sarkozy was hoping the meeting would allow him to lobby

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the Chinese President to contribute to the European financial stability

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fund, designed to protect countries in the eurozone from collapsing.

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But they too have indicated they need more clarity on the situation

:07:48.:07:52.

in Greece. So, where does this leave David Cameron? Last night the

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British Government said they're prepared to give more money to the

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IMF, which could, in turn, could could towards helping struggling

:07:59.:08:03.

eurozone countries, something that won't go down too well with his own

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back backbenchers. I am joined by our correspondent Christian Fraser

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at the G20 meeting in Cannes. We have had the spectacle of the Greek

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Prime Minister being summoned by the leaders of France and Germany,

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to explain himself. Now we hear he is off to see the President to

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perhaps offer his resignation. It's chaos, isn't it? There must be

:08:25.:08:27.

total bewilderment among the G20 leaders gathering here. They come

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to talk about the global economy and how to resurge to - to create

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resurgence in the economy and they're focusing on one of the

:08:36.:08:39.

smaller members of the eurozone, Greece. What we are hearing from

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Athens in the last few minutes is that the Prime Minister has in fact

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offered - is going to offer his resignation to the Greek President.

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There will be a Government of national unity that will be given

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powers to negotiate with creditors and they will move, instead of a

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vote of confidence and a referendum, towards elections in the short-term,

:08:57.:09:02.

probably within around four weeks. Now, as Andrew was saying, that

:09:02.:09:06.

does create all sorts of other problems because the opposition,

:09:06.:09:08.

presumably would be included in this Government, has already

:09:08.:09:13.

indicated that it wants to renegotiate the bail-out package

:09:13.:09:18.

that is it - that's been offered to Greece and the German Chancellor

:09:18.:09:24.

has already made it abunantly clear it's not up for renegotiation.

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What's come out of the confirmss over the past 24 hours is something

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new and that's that the spectre of Greece leaving the eurozone is very

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much on the table. And that begs questions in turn, how do you do

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that? What mechanism is there for one of these members to leave the

:09:39.:09:42.

eurozone? Can they be forced to leave? Can Greece go back to the

:09:42.:09:48.

drachma? You can forgive the be-- bewilderment of other leaders here

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who have been invited to try to invest in this new expanded bail-

:09:53.:09:56.

out fund, they must be scratching their heads asking what do you want

:09:56.:10:01.

to us invest in? Greece perhaps leaving the eurozone, the

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Commission has put out a notice saying there is no mechanism for

:10:04.:10:08.

that, if you leave, you have to leave the the European Union, too.

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If you are saying Angela Merkel has anticipated what is going to happen

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and says there is is going to be no further negotiation, do you think

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that threat will stand, bearing in mind that will harm countries like

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Germany if there is a disorderly default or do you think the Germans

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and French could be pushed into perhaps either renegotiating or

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giving the money without the bail- out fund or referendum on it to say

:10:28.:10:34.

yes in Greece? Well, I think it comes down to domestic politics at

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the end of the day. The French have been terrified, not particularly

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about Greece in isolation, but the knock-on effect to the likes of

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Spain and Italy. There are two concerns this raises, first of all,

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the idea of giving the people a referendum, while it might be

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applauded in some quarters as a step towards democracy, on issues

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after all that will affect a generation for perhaps up to ten

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years, it does then open the door to other countries like Italy who

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also have a Government of disunity. We have seen one of the partners of

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Mr Berlusconi's coalition are already digging their heels in,

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what is is to stop them saying how come the Greeks get a decision on

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this and we don't? The second problem is the Germans have

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obviously, and we did see Angela Merkel taking the lead again last

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night, they are obviously saying now that we can't go on like this

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indefinitely. Greece has to make a decision, whether it's in or it's

:11:30.:11:34.

out. Whatever the wording of the referendum is, whatever the wording

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they would have decided for this referendum, it boils down to this:

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Is Greece in or out? That's further than the French would have wanted

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to go but Angela Merkel is pushing it in that direction. Thank you.

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It's unclear what the leaders can do now, there is a nice little

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restaurant to the left of our correspondent's shoulder there.

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They might as well have a walk along there and enjoy themselves.

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The breaking news, the Greek Prime Minister, Mr Papandreou, is

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planning to stand down. He is handing in his resignation to the

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Greek President within the next 30 minutes. It looks like a new

:12:16.:12:19.

coalition, a so-called Government of national unity is going to be

:12:19.:12:29.
:12:29.:12:31.

formed under a former governor of the bank of Greece. At this time a

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week ago we were told that there was a deal to bail out Greece and

:12:34.:12:38.

save the euro. Some of us doubted it, we spoke to two former

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Chancellors about where we went from here. They were pretty sniffy

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about the whole affair. One week on the deal looks near to collapse,

:12:48.:12:54.

their scepticism looks vindicated. We thought we better reassemble the

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team, I speak of messers Darling and Lawson, to discuss again where

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do we go from here? Alistair Darling, are we on the brink of a

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Greek departure from the eurozone? It's very difficult for them to

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stay, I am not an expert on Greek politics pwau Government of

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national aou -- unity does sound odd, it may take some skill to hold

:13:20.:13:25.

something together. The real problem which I set out last week

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is that the Greek fix was never going to work. Even if it had

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worked, it was still going to be left with a debt of 120% of its GDP,

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which that doesn't work. So the deal they were being offered and

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asked to implement was never going to work and should never have been

:13:41.:13:45.

on the table last week. Never mind the other two legs of what they did

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last week, the Greek capitalisation of European banks which is now

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urgent, because if you talk about disorderly default there will be

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default in the Greek banks which will come back to other European

:13:56.:14:00.

banks and the rescue fund is not there. As you said at Prime

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Ministers questions yesterday, it's a fund that doesn't exist.

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doesn't exist and the rescue may be needed very, very shortly. I think

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- I hope the G20 is not sitting at the side of the Mediterranean

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waiting for the Greeks to come back. They have to look at what was

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agreed last week, because it won't work and I said it would unravel

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and it has. What they also need to do, which is urgent, is to look at

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policies that will get growth back into the system, because as long as

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we have this lack of growth, these problems are going to get worse and

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worse. It's the lack of policy for growth, the G20 could do that and

:14:37.:14:41.

it should meet with the same urgency and purpose it did two

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years ago. The economy is smaller now. And by the way, without

:14:48.:14:54.

wishing to hog the programme, if Greece does get tipped out of the

:14:54.:14:57.

euro, don't let's kid ourselves that's going to sort the problem

:14:57.:15:00.

out. It's not in our interests to have a country cast adrift with all

:15:00.:15:10.
:15:10.:15:11.

the things that could go wrong, not The fact is, even before Mr

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Papandreou announced he wanted a referendum, the deal that Alastair

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was talking about was already falling apart. The Italians were

:15:18.:15:23.

having to pay much higher yields on their debt because the bond markets

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didn't believe the deal. Let's isolate the three different strands.

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There is first of all the eurozone itself, which is a completely

:15:32.:15:37.

flawed construct, European monetary union, it cannot work. I predicted

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this. I made a big speech at Chatham House when I was Chancellor

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in 1989 predicting precisely this. Plenty of others saw this too.

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Greece is clearly going to fall out of the eurozone... You think it is

:15:51.:15:56.

as clear as that? Yes, I do, quite soon. The others will struggle on

:15:56.:16:00.

for quite some time, but it is fundamentally flawed. So that's

:16:00.:16:07.

that. Alastair is right that growth is important, but there is no quick

:16:07.:16:10.

growth injection you can produce. You have to say, what is the

:16:10.:16:14.

immediate problem. The immediate problem is the threat of a European

:16:14.:16:19.

and to some extent global banking crises as a result of this severely

:16:19.:16:22.

impaired sovereign debt that's around the place. Therefore the

:16:22.:16:29.

banking crisis has to be addressed in two ways. I think Europe as such

:16:29.:16:32.

is not going to be able to play a significant part. There are two

:16:32.:16:36.

levels. First of all, each nation, each member state, just like

:16:36.:16:41.

Britain had to address its own banking problems with when it had

:16:41.:16:46.

banking problems. Which Alistair Darling was involved in. Absolutely.

:16:46.:16:49.

The authorities there are going to have to address the problem of

:16:49.:16:54.

their ropey, dodgy banks, and see what needs to be done and on what

:16:54.:16:57.

terms. Then there's a case for a global approach. I think the

:16:57.:17:01.

British Government is absolutely right to do it through the IMF. A

:17:01.:17:05.

further advantage of doing it through the IMF, I think if China

:17:05.:17:09.

is going to be able to allowed greater voting rights within the

:17:09.:17:12.

IMF which I deserves to have because of the strength of its

:17:12.:17:16.

economy, I think you will get Chinese money only in that way will

:17:16.:17:20.

you get Chinese money and resources devoted to solving the global

:17:20.:17:25.

problem. So I think those are the three strands. That's way ahead.

:17:25.:17:30.

Alistair Darling, you've done a bit of G20ing in your time. You were

:17:30.:17:34.

involved in the big summit in London. If you were there today in

:17:34.:17:39.

Cannes, given the events that are playing out in Athens, what would

:17:39.:17:44.

you do? Well, I think there are two things I would do. Firstly, the G20

:17:44.:17:47.

does need to do everything it can to bring every influence to bear to

:17:47.:17:51.

try to get the eurozone countries to sort out their immediate

:17:51.:17:54.

problems. I agree with Nigel about the recapitalisation. It can only

:17:55.:17:59.

do that nationally. No-one else can do that. That's the first thing. I

:17:59.:18:05.

also agree with him that there isn't a quick fix for growth 2009,

:18:05.:18:09.

when countries agreed to do whatever it took to stop recession

:18:09.:18:14.

becoming depression by putting stimulus into their economies, even

:18:14.:18:18.

a week before it wasn't clear they would agree to that. But because

:18:18.:18:25.

they were scared stiff about the confesss -- about the consequences,

:18:25.:18:29.

they acted. You now have the risk of countries defaulting. You have a

:18:29.:18:33.

risk of that spilling outweigh beyond Europe. So there is every

:18:33.:18:37.

interest in the world here in getting, in making sure that we

:18:37.:18:40.

address some of the big imbalances, the China problem, the American

:18:40.:18:44.

problem, but also that countries act together. On their own, yes

:18:44.:18:49.

they can do some things, but they need to act together, otherwise

:18:49.:18:53.

they'll be dragged along in the wake of events. Nigel Lawson, you

:18:53.:18:57.

said there's a danger to European banks if the national Government

:18:57.:19:02.

have to act. It seems to me the biggest danger is the Italian

:19:02.:19:06.

system, as they buy most of the Italian bonds. And the Italian

:19:06.:19:11.

Government is in no shape to recapitalise Italian banks.

:19:11.:19:14.

Italian Central Bank is still quite a strong institution, even though

:19:14.:19:18.

the Italian Government is very, very rocky. I think that the

:19:18.:19:23.

Italians ought to be able to manage this. We are talking, the Italian

:19:23.:19:29.

political situation will clearly have to be resolved soon. Silvio

:19:29.:19:34.

Berlusconi can't go on like he is. That has got to be resolved. Buying

:19:34.:19:38.

time is an important element in all of these sorts of problems. One of

:19:38.:19:46.

the first problems I was dealing with in 1983 was the Latin America

:19:46.:19:52.

sovereign debt crisis. Hit many similarities to this. -- it had. We

:19:52.:19:56.

solved it satisfactorily through the IMF, buying time. That's what

:19:56.:20:00.

you have to do. And through an Argentinian default as well. Yes.

:20:01.:20:05.

Countries do default and they come back from the grave, as it were.

:20:05.:20:09.

Only Honduras and Ecuador has defaulted more than Greece. Greece

:20:09.:20:16.

has got previous on this. It is not unusual for it to happen. Is UKIP a

:20:17.:20:26.
:20:27.:20:27.

bit like Madame Lafarge as you do your knitting as the tumbrils roll?

:20:27.:20:30.

Every working family in this country is going to be affected by.

:20:30.:20:34.

This we have an interest in trying to avoid this ever happening again?

:20:34.:20:40.

That's why we do not wish to be involved within Europe. Of a way

:20:40.:20:45.

and manner that's conducted way. That's why we have a great interest.

:20:45.:20:49.

Finally, ex-Charles, if the eurozone is going to move towards

:20:49.:20:54.

more fiscal integration, which is the policy of this Government as

:20:54.:20:59.

well as Her Majesty's opposition, and is the policy of Mrs Merkel and

:20:59.:21:02.

Nicolas Sarkozy, will it be an integration of the 17 or even the

:21:02.:21:07.

16, or will it be a smaller eurozone that does that? My guess

:21:07.:21:13.

is that a lot of uncertainty that it will be a smaller unit. There is

:21:13.:21:17.

such a disparity between Germany on the one side and if you assume

:21:17.:21:22.

Greece is out of it. One point that Nigel made, an important one, what

:21:22.:21:27.

is desperately needed is time. You can't reorder the eurozone within

:21:27.:21:31.

days but they won't get that time unless they deal with the problems

:21:31.:21:38.

that were there last week. On a smaller eurozone? They may try that,

:21:38.:21:43.

but I don't think the people s even of the smaller part, the inner core,

:21:43.:21:46.

I don't think they really want a full political union. So the thing

:21:46.:21:51.

is not going to make sense even at that level. Gentlemen, we'll leave

:21:51.:21:57.

it there, but don't go too far away. We may need to make a block booking

:21:57.:22:01.

for you. Remember Harold Wilson said a week is a long time in

:22:01.:22:04.

politics? It is certainly a long time in eurozone politics! An hour

:22:04.:22:09.

is a long time in Greek politics! Gentlemen, former Charles, thank

:22:09.:22:15.

you. -- Chancellors, thank you.

:22:15.:22:18.

Now, the Greek Prime Minister isn't the only European leader with his

:22:18.:22:21.

own domestic political problems. There's no prospect of him losing

:22:21.:22:24.

his job, of course, but you'll remember last week that 81 of David

:22:24.:22:27.

Cameron's MPs defied him and voted in favour of a referendum on

:22:27.:22:30.

Britain's relationship with Europe. We decided to take a look back

:22:30.:22:33.

through the archives and began to wonder - can you guess what these

:22:33.:22:43.
:22:43.:22:43.

Apology for the loss of subtitles for 41 seconds

:22:43.:23:24.

Yes, they were all former Conservative Party members who have

:23:24.:23:28.

now joined UKIP. One of them was a young Lord Hesketh, our guest of

:23:28.:23:31.

the day here, who joined UKIP last month. Well, we're joined now by

:23:31.:23:35.

Andrea Leadsom, a Conservative MP and one of the 81 rebels who defied

:23:35.:23:41.

the party leadership last week. Thank you for joining us. Lord

:23:41.:23:45.

Heskey, you have made this radical switch after a long history with

:23:45.:23:48.

the Conservative Party. What's wrong with the Tory Party? I think

:23:48.:23:54.

that all political parties over the European issue have become

:23:54.:23:57.

completely controlled by the Civil Service. That's a combination of

:23:57.:24:02.

the Civil Service in this country and the Civil Service in Brussels.

:24:02.:24:05.

And the establishment that goes with that. It is not just the civil

:24:05.:24:10.

servants. But Europe is hard-wired into the system. But if you've got

:24:10.:24:14.

a Prime Minister like David Cameron, who reputedly was very Euro-sceptic,

:24:14.:24:19.

surely it is down to the leadership of the party? I think the actions

:24:19.:24:23.

of Andrea and 81 people in the House of Commons last week shows

:24:23.:24:27.

that there's a distinct sense of unease about whether or not whoever

:24:27.:24:31.

is running the House of Commons is actually able to deliver. This is

:24:31.:24:36.

the real problem. This is the actuallity of it, which is for

:24:36.:24:40.

instance I saw one Tory MP once weekend, wisely, in my opinion,

:24:40.:24:43.

suggesting that we should immediately get rid of the UK

:24:43.:24:50.

ambassador in Brussels, who goes under the winning name of Akreb.

:24:50.:24:55.

Unusual to say the least! actually I would put a politician

:24:55.:25:05.
:25:05.:25:07.

in there. This is about politics, not about the grand project which

:25:07.:25:13.

Giscard d'Estaing would have called it. But your main aim is to have a

:25:13.:25:19.

referendum isn't it? And surely the best and only likely way of making

:25:19.:25:23.

it that happen is to work through the Conservative Party isn't it?

:25:23.:25:27.

disagreement I don't think you spend 50 years with the Tory Party

:25:27.:25:33.

and make the jump that I made unless you've come to the collusion

:25:33.:25:39.

that -- conclusion that all political parties, for want of a

:25:39.:25:45.

better word, set-up, are incapable of dealing wit. You might as well

:25:45.:25:51.

jump ship and join UKIP? Not at all. I think the Government are doing an

:25:51.:25:56.

excellent job. At what? For example ensuring Britain doesn't remain a

:25:56.:26:01.

part of the bail-out mechanism after 2013. Looking after British

:26:01.:26:04.

interests. David Cameron, William Hague and George Osborne have

:26:04.:26:07.

spoken strongly about the need to renegotiate powers in Britain's

:26:07.:26:11.

best interests. I'm certainly working with a wide range of

:26:11.:26:15.

colleagues across the party to look at ways that we can renegotiate

:26:15.:26:19.

powers. But then, as Lord Hesketh said, he spent all this time in the

:26:19.:26:22.

Conservative Party, but none of these things have come to fruition.

:26:22.:26:27.

There is no reliable evidence to say any of those power would be

:26:27.:26:30.

repatriated, and you won't get that referendum. But things have changed

:26:30.:26:35.

in the last week, they've certainly changed in the last couple of years.

:26:35.:26:38.

And I remain incredibly hopefully and positive that this Government

:26:38.:26:43.

is going to make that difference. In terms of having a referendum?

:26:43.:26:47.

They've already ruled that out and your colleagues have argued this is

:26:47.:26:50.

the best opportune time to have a referendum to renegotiate Britain's

:26:50.:26:53.

relationship with Europe. Very a slightly different take on it. The

:26:53.:26:57.

point about the vote last week, for me at least. The key thing is that

:26:58.:27:01.

the British people should have their say at some point. This

:27:01.:27:05.

wasn't about a lack of confidence in the Government. This was a point

:27:05.:27:08.

about democracy, that people have waited since 1975 to have a further

:27:08.:27:14.

say on the EU. It is that alone that made me decide to vote for a

:27:14.:27:18.

referendum. That is not to say that I think the Government is doing the

:27:18.:27:22.

right thing in moving towards a situation that looks after

:27:22.:27:26.

Britain's interests in the EU. you worried that any of your

:27:26.:27:34.

colleagues will leave the party and join UKIP? Not at all. There are a

:27:34.:27:37.

group of people in the Conservative Party who believe Britain would be

:27:37.:27:45.

better outside of the EU. My straw poll of the 20 is 10 intake, we are

:27:45.:27:51.

a Euro-sceptic bunch but we don't favour getting out altogether.

:27:51.:27:54.

Doesn't that represent the majority view, regoegs yes, but not pulling

:27:54.:28:00.

out of the EU altogether? I think what Andrea said was interesting.

:28:00.:28:03.

She is talking about the parliamentary party. I don't expect

:28:03.:28:08.

to see many people coming out of the parliamentary party, if any.

:28:08.:28:13.

Peter Oborne in today's Telegraph, he says we are going as a political

:28:13.:28:17.

party. We are not just a single- issue party. We had a manifesto at

:28:17.:28:21.

the last election and the reality is that more and more people are

:28:21.:28:26.

coming to us. Can I give you two examples. Briefly. One is the Tobin

:28:26.:28:31.

tax. The response we've had from the City in the last two weeks is

:28:31.:28:35.

simply breathtaking. Now, just time to put you out of

:28:35.:28:38.

your misery and give you the answer to yesterday's Guess The Year

:28:38.:28:41.

competition. 1960 was the year. Alexander, pick a winner. J reg

:28:41.:28:50.

began from Peterborough. -- J Regan.

:28:50.:28:53.

I'm back here tonight on This Week with Alastair Campbell and Michael

:28:53.:28:56.

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