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Morning folks - welcome to the Daily Politics.


He's outlawed raising income tax, national insurance or VAT


but is the Chancellor about to raid your pension payments?


The migration crisis brought over a million people to Europe last year


- could changes to EU rules give more of them the right


A quarter of the world used to be painted pink -


is it time for Britain to relinquish the last vestiges of its Empire?


And after Labour and the pollsters made their excuses for getting


we countdown the best political excuses.


I didn't do a great job this morning, I had a brain


What I may need to do is face up to that and then move on.


Brain fade is a regular occurrence on The Daily Politics!


All that in the next 90 minutes and with us for the duration two


politicians whose excuses weren't good enough to miss today's show,


Shadow Work and Pensions Secretary, Owen Smith, and Treasury Minister,


First this morning - are changes about to be made


The Daily Mail splashes this morning with the claim that one and half


million people could lose out on what its calling a "stealth tax


raid to punish prudent savers" in the March Budget.


And the i newspaper warns of a "Pension Pot Raid


to Cut Back Deficit", with claims that the Chancellor


is poised to reduce pension relief for higher rate tax payers


Well - is there any truth in these stories?


Who better to ask than a Treasury Minister?


Should strive as and savers be rewarded rather than punished at the


moment? The position is, as a government, is


that we announced that we were going to review the application of


pensions tax relief, we have made a number of changes over the last


Parliament in terms of focusing it away from the very highest earners.


It but in terms of what is going to be announced at the budget, I'm


always interested to see lots of speculation in the press, but it is


very clear... Is it speculation or briefing?


It is speculation. We announced that we would look in the round at


various radical options in respect of pensions tax relief and we are


continuing to do that but no decisions have been made. If there


is a decision that is made to change that that will be announced at the


budget on March 16. There has not been much more that I can say other


than that. You didn't answer the broad question, should strive as and


savers be rewarded at the moment rather than punished? If you look at


what we are doing at the moment as a government in terms of courage in


saving and in terms of a new savers allowance, taking lots of savers out


of income tax altogether, we've done a lot to help savers at a time when


interest rates are low. That has not been helpful to a lot of savers. We


have taken steps to help. Nobody wants to punish anybody, but it is,


of course, right that we look in a very careful and consultative way at


the way pensions tax relief works. It is a big part of our tax system


and we need to insure that it is effective in terms of encouraging


saving, and it is going in the right place.


So you want to encourage saving, but you have said yourself just now that


you're looking at proposals that perhaps might move away from higher


rate taxpayers. You've had this consultation. Is introducing a flat


rate of tax relief on pensions contributions one of the options on


the table? It is one of the options set out in


the consultation. You are considering it?


That is no news, sorry not to give you and exclusive.


Justice said it on the table. This was one of the options going


back to the July budget in terms of looking at it so it is not a new


thing. Higher rate taxpayers would lose


out, wouldn't they? We are considering various options,


but as I say, in terms of having an understanding of winners and losers


we are looking at the options but it depends.


Should it be on the table, should it even be there to raid the pension


pots of higher income tax payers? I think it is always sensible when


you have a large part of the tax system, and depending on how you


measure it, pensions tax relief results in something like ?34


billion of tax being foregone from the Exchequer.


That is a lot of money, isn't it? To see if that is justified and see


if it is working properly. Most of it goes to higher rate


taxpayers. Yes, that is true and you would here


argue much from the likes of the Institute of fiscal and, they are


quite supportive of the current structure and make the argument that


it should be at the marginal rate because those are the people who pay


more tax -- fiscal studies. Then there is the counterargument that is


made that it should be better targeted and that one should depart


from that principle. Apologies for giving and on the one hand, on the


other hand answer. Sure. These other type of things we are open and


transparent about, but we're looking at them and we will then make a


decision on the basis of the that results.


Can you understand why already there are people on your own side who have


claimed that that would be very unconservative? And they are worried


about it. Even Mark Garnier on the Treasury Select Committee said it


would be bad politics. Are they right?


It depends. In a way it's an argument about an announcement of a


policy that we haven't made. But what you have done...


We have not set out the details, so it is a hypothetical question.


You have two national newspapers who believe it is on the table and add


me to delete they have not been sourced in terms of names, except


for Mark Garnier. They obviously believe there is a strong sense this


could happen and it would give the Treasury an awful lot of money that


could be used to pay down the deficit. So you can understand why


it is something that we are looking at, rightly or wrongly all stop


you've imposed a lifetime allowance on pensions, again, hitting the


aspirational again, you could say and cut the amount you can save each


year into a pension so that would just be the next stage, to have a


flat rate on tax contributions that would hit higher rate taxpayers.


The point I would make is that it is right that this tax relief is


reviewed. There are potentially some quite radical reforms that are out


there. But we're not rushing into any particular decisions. Of course,


we would want to have an understanding as to who would win


and who would lose from that. It may well be that if you invite me back


I'll be back here after the 16th of March.


But then we will all know! What would be the point of that!


To explaining saggy what we've done and why it is fair and right but we


need to take the decision first. You say it is a radical proposal so


to some extent you think it is controversial, or it would be for


your own party and your own aside. At is it also notching, because by


your own party and your own aside. legislating to stop raising income


tax, National Insurance and VAT, you have straitjacketed yourself in the


Treasury and don't have any other options to get money apart from


stealth taxes like this? I don't think that is fair. What are the


options? The OBR set up the fiscal statement


in September. We are on course according to the OBR to have a


budget surplus in 2019-20 of ?10 billion, which gives us a little bit


of a buffer in terms of our target of making sure we have a surplus.


But that is what the OBR is predicting. We are determined to


deliver on that plan. Do you support the idea of a flat


rate, it is redistributed in that sense?


A rare moment of agreement between David and myself, I


A rare moment of agreement between worth looking at. We need to look at


what they are proposing. The stories in the papers are quite different,


the Daily Mail stories about the stealthy way in which they have


adduced the overall pension pots that you can hold, which I think is


broadly a good progressive measure from the government -- they have


reduced. Why is it stealthy? He announced it in the budget.


He did it quietly, you could have ?100 million in the pension pot when


Labour left off all stop it has gone down progressively. They didn't


really trumpet it, so it was stealthy in that respect, it was not


the headline of any budget. Alistair Darling didn't shout from


the rooftops when he cut it. We described it as progressive but


the current government have been a little bit more reticent about it.


They have been open about it. It will affect higher rate taxpayers


and cheese off the Daily Mail as we have seen this morning. We are much


more comfortable with the notion that you do target pension tax


relief for the wealthy in this country. It is only about 50,000 -


60,000 battle the latest change affects. You didn't do injuring 13


years in power. We should have done more.


You still allowed people at the highest rate of tax to deduct that


on their pension payments. I wasn't in parliament than.


Know but it was your party. The bulk of the 34 million it cost the


Exchequer to give this tax relief goes to the wealthier people of this


country. Labour did nothing about that in 30 years.


You are right, it is 70-30, lower basic rate taxpayers get about 30%


of the benefits, and yet they pay around 70% of the relief of the


overall amount and we should have done more to address that.


You didn't do anything. Let me be very clear, I wasn't in


government at the time and I'm in a position now, I can answer if you


want for previous Labour chancellors or I Kantele what I think we should


do. I agree with David it is worth something worth looking at -- I can


tell you. Whether we should use the money to try and have a surplus of


10 billion at the end of the Parliament, I think there are


smarter and more progressive ways they could use that money, they


could use it to write some of the other iniquities in the pension


system, the fact in the 50s are losing out. They could aggressive


more clearly some of the losers out of the single state pension. In


terms of the flat rate I think it is potentially an interesting idea if


they can get properly progressive and if they can guarantee that the


losers will not have a detrimental affect. You will get an announcement


of where we are. It is perfectly possible we will decide not to go


ahead with any significant reform in this area. You will hear an update.


We need to move on. Yesterday the President


of the European Council, Donald Tusk, confirmed that


a proposal on Britain's reformed membership of the EU would be


tabled at next month's But reports this morning


that there are plans to change EU rules on refugees could make life


more difficult for David Cameron as he attempts to make the case


for Britain to stay in Europe. Under current rules -


known as the Dublin Convention - refugees have to claim asylum


in the first European country But the "first country of entry"


principle is under pressure - with southern European countries


such as Greece and Italy accused of failing to register the 1.1


million migrants that have passed through on the way


to northern Europe. European Council president


Donald Tusk has warned that Europe faces "grave consequences" if it


can't agree a new system by March. While Britain is currently signed up


to the Dublin Convention it has an opt-out on justice and home


affairs rule changes. But concerns that huge numbers


of migrants who may have arrived - and are still arriving -


in the EU could end up in Britain won't help David Cameron meet


the Conservatives' manifesto commitment of reducing net migration


to tens of thousands. Net migration currently


stands at 336,000 - so what might any rule changes mean


for the Prime Minister's attempts We're joined now by Kate Hoey


co-Chair of Labour's campaign to Leave the EU - Labour Leave -


which launches today. Labour Leave, it is called. Let me


come to you first, David Gauke. With the government look kindly on


changing the Dublin agreement? The principle behind the Dublin


agreement, in other words that you claim asylum in your first country


that is safe is the right one. You wouldn't change it?


We need to look at the particular details and there are maybe aspects


of the proposal that are... It is not a detail, it is a principal.


What we are told is that the commission is going to propose that


they end that principle that you are automatically have to seek asylum in


the first country you arrive in. What would the Government's


attitudes beta that kind of change? We have to look at the whole


proposal -- attitude towards that kind of change. The principle


behind, you claim asylum in your first safe country, is one that we


think is sensible. It is better than otherwise. They would have to be


something significant that is when the package for us to be enthusiast


it about that. If you don't want to change it and others do do you have


a veto to stop it? My understanding is that we would be able to opt out,


or not opt in to those arrangements but we would have to see what the


proposed the what the precise proposal was. We would not have a


veto? It is important to remember we are not in Schengen, so there may be


a different arrangement for those countries outside Schengen as


opposed to those that are inside Schengen. How many asylum seekers


have been sent back to the European country in which they landed under


the Dublin agreement? I don't have that number. It is quite hard to get


the figures, as is often the case in these matters, it looks like it is


under 1000 year. So it is demeaning is. a fifth a fact. In fact that


there is a principle here which exists. The point being that they


may be people who, if you scrap the principle, and this is one thing we


would need to look at, a rescue could be more people might travel to


the UK on the assumption that they might be able to... But the Dublin


agreement applies to everyone but the Germans are not implementing it.


What we need to have an understanding of is there will be a


behavioural change where people are more likely to come to the UK if


that does not apply. Isn't it unfair given that it clearly government's


policy to campaign to stay the European Union, that for purely


geographical reasons, Greece and Italy have to bear the brunt of the


million arrivals and we do nothing to share the load? Isn't there a


case to change the rules? I think your point about the United Kingdom


does make a big contribution towards for example humanitarian help. That


is in Syria. We don't take many migrants. But the issues are linked.


Our humanitarian contribution in Syria and Turkey for example, is


enabling more people to stay. But it's not. There's never evidence of


that. There's 2000 day arriving. What difference is the Syrian or


Turkish aid meaning? Where not even aware the Turkish money has been


spent. There's no sign of it on ground. There's 2000 arriving. What


difference is it making? If we're not active and provide support in


the region, the risk of there being more refugees coming to Europe is


likely to increase. That is unquantifiable. There was 1 million


last year. But they could be higher. Whatever the number, you're not


taking any. Correct? In terms of fairness, we did take 5000 Syrian


refugees... From Syria. At one of the wealthier members of the EU is


to put more money in than any other member state in terms of that


humanitarian support. We are making a fair contribution. How many Labour


MPs do you think will support this? I won a bet. I thought that would be


your first question. We are in a minority within the PLP. What we


have discovered just from the short time since the launch today, we have


huge support from members of grassroots and Labour supporters,


more importantly. Let me come back to my question. How many Labour MPs?


This referendum will not be one to leave the EU by MPs. I understand


that. Since you correctly guess my question, it means you've had plenty


of time to think about the answer. Roughly how many? We will have the


same number as we had two voted and supported a referendum whether


Labour leadership didn't want it and roundabout 25, 30. That is


irrelevant, because the campaign will be one by ordinary members of


the British public. That but I understand about referendum. It's


not just MPs who get to vote. Even I understand that. You must be pleased


John Mills, your biggest private donor, once Jeremy Corbyn to allow a


free vote on EU. Do you think you'll get one? Of course, the


Conservatives are given free vote and the idea Labour wouldn't would


be nonsense. John Mills led the campaign in 1975 to leave the common


market. He has been long-standing supporter. You think you will get a


free vote? Absolutely. I hope not and I'm committed to staying in


Europe. Therefore, I hope we decide, as a party and I'm confident we


will, our position is clear and therefore we have a weapon vote.


Why, when the Conservatives are in government? Because... MPs know


their constituents and the vast majority, the majority of Labour


supporters, many of whom went on voted for Ukip precisely because of


this issue and we want to win them back, our party is about


reconnecting with voters, the idea we didn't want a referendum and as


soon as we are back in opposition be agreed to one, two days later, now


we would say we were we want a whipped vote is democracy at the


window. The reason the Tories are having a free vote is because they


couldn't possibly whip their party because they are divided on this


issue. The Labour Party is not. We have a handful, less than 10% of the


PLP. At the moment. Therefore we are in a luxurious position of knowing


what our party critical position is and are able to have a position.


It's very interesting... It's mandate we both stood on. I did not.


I want to a fundamental change. What I would say is Jeremy Corbyn, our


leader, is perfectly relaxed about the Labour campaign and he and John


McDonald spent loads of airtime in the same lobby as those of us... I'm


relaxed about it, too. I still think we have a very clear position. Can I


just clarify this. The government position is that there will be a


government policy, almost certainly in favour of staying to remain.


Those Cabinet ministers who don't agree with that can go their own way


for the duration of the referendum. Will Shadow Cabinet members be


allowed to do that if they don't agree with the party line? I'm not


in charge of that, am I? My view is we should have a whipped vote. A


settled Labour Party policy, pro-European, and I think we should


have a clear position, unlike the Conservatives. So if shadow


ministers disagree with the party line should not be allowed? That is


my view. We did a clear pro-European position and deflect responsibility


and stick together and vote for Europe. I kind of stitch up but in


the establishment and Labour? Unfortunately, it'll be the public


to decide and the last thing they want the moment is a stitch up


between politicians cosy at Westminster out in the country the


mood very very different. Kate, you about a moment ago when his people


in the country would decide the referendum. Self-evidently right. It


is our job, I think, to provide leadership. You are trying to do


that by making a case for us leaving Europe and I'm being clear, the


Labour Party which you're a member of come in a minority, is going to


make a case to the country and say we should stay. And we are finding,


across the country now, Parliamentary parties are wanting to


have that debate, inviting people. We need to have that debate. We have


never had that debate in the party really, since the end of the Neil


Kinnock error. Is it your view, as I understand it, you had 200,000 new


members since Jeremy Corbyn became leader, not since you lost the


election but a lot after that, so are there any indications of what


the attitudes towards Europe? We are finding genuinely that new people


coming in at a very different attitude to this idea that the EU


was all about workers rights. Social Europe is finished. The EU project


is on its way out. What are you game planning for the timing of the


referendum? We are still game planning for a July but it's more


likely to be September. The Prime Minister wants a piece of white


paper to be put through as quickly as possible. I think tuna. June


would be too near. All right. -- I think tuna. We will see a lot


between now and then. Any cabinet members which might come over to


your side? One or two. Which ones? It's not my place to decide. Current


Cabinet ministers would like to be able to campaign? Yes. We will think


about that. You have to go and ask them.


Now - the bookies now have Donald Trump as their firm favourite


to win the Republican nomination and last night he got another boost


- the endorsement of the former governor of Alaska


and vice-presidential candidate - Sarah Palin.


Are you ready for a Commander-in-Chief...


You ready for a Commander-in-Chief


who will let our warriors do their job and go kick ISIS' ass?


Ready for someone who will secure our borders


to secure our jobs and to secure our homes?


I'm here to support the next President of the United States,


Now - despite a petition with over half a million signatures calling


for Donald Trump to be banned from the UK -


and a parliamentary debate in which he was branded


"an attention seeker", a "fool", a "buffoon",


a "demagogue" and a "wazzock" - Mr Trump will still be free to come


That caused the new York times a few problems and NBC and CBS.


But he won't be able to get hold of one of these.


That's right, because if you look at the small print on our website


carefully, you have to be a UK resident to qualify and be able


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But you have to be resident in Britain. You do. I can feel a


challenge coming on. It's coming up to midday here -


just take a look at Big Ben - It's a glorious cold bright winter


's day here. Prime Minister's Questions are a few moments away.


Laura is with us. We can't work out what Jeremy Corbyn is going to go on


today? Today there were protests in Westminster and Jeremy Corbyn is no


stranger to that and what many young people were protesting about today


where the abolition of grants to loans,, the conversion which George


Osborne brought in in the summer and it's likely Jeremy Corbyn will raise


theirs. There was an opposition they debate in the house yesterday I


believe we're Labour MPs raised the issue and, in a sense, it pushes


lots and lots of buttons for him, and speaks to many of his concerns


about generational fairness, it's something he has found, currency


with young people in terms of a future for them and it's quite a


difficult sell for the government, the sort of trick is for want of a


better word, student at the bottom of the end of the income threshold


and their family will get bigger loans. But they are already getting


loans for their fees. I think the Scottish Government reined back on


grants, as well. The problem there was the poorer students, though they


got fees, that's a future payment they may, doesn't stop them going to


university, but they need something to live on and it was the grant


which allowed them to live. Indeed, it was one of the very carefully


controversial packages of the coalition raising fees, but raising


the amount of support people at the bottom got and the coalition would


always trumpet what they see as a success as they raised fees but


poorer students did not stay away from university. The concern now is


those poor students who are still entitled to grants lose them all


together, and we would inevitably see a gradual change where poor


students started to stay away from university. It may well be Jeremy


Corbyn is hard to predict, last week I said it would be incredible if you


didn't raise the junior doctors strike and he didn't. He can hardly


raise this week since there's been an abeyance while negotiations are


going on. Indeed. I think it is watching you may pick up your


advice. It brings a lot of bells for Mr Corbyn and gives the government


some problems. If the Shadow Cabinet reshuffle over? I thought that was


until yesterday, yet another name popped into my inbox. On days 16. Do


you want to check your phone while we're chatting? What are they been


saying the last 25 minutes before I sat down in the studio. Would you


like to consider your position? Not yet. What name came in? Now you're


asking me. The names are now completed with somebody who will not


be the Shadow Cabinet, and additional appointment to the front


bench. There you go, even the Tories know. The Prime Minister will... You


are 50% right. The Prime Minister, whatever he is asked, will somehow I


suggest work in the latest unemployment figures. It would be


surprised if he didn't and which Prime Minister would not want to


trumpet what our record employment figures and, in a sense, not only is


it a record label want to boast about, but also something very


difficult for the Labour Party. We know from yesterday's report about


what went wrong into the election, one of the things Ed Miliband did


not do was win back voters trust on the economy. These figures suggest,


under this government, the economy is improving therefore making it


harder for Labour to pull back its power and resonance on that issue.


It's interesting, as the labour market tightens, average earnings


are not showing much sign of life. It's going up by about 2%. It is OK,


when inflation is effectively zero, but it's not huge, is it? Remember,


when one of the gambles the government is taking is the private


sector will pick up the slack in terms of wages. Let's see what's


coming up and go straight to the Commons.


I shall have further such meetings later today. Gareth Thomas. If you


have worked hard for a company and helped it succeed, surely you should


be allowed to benefit a little from the profits that that company makes.


Does the Prime Minister think it is time for companies like Sports


Direct to follow the example of the best businesses and give share a


small percentage of the profits? We have encouraged companies to have


profit-sharing arrangements and we took action in previous budgets to


do that, but we are going further than that to make sure there is for


the first time in our country a national minimum wage, which will


come in in April this year. That means, for the lowest paid people in


this country on the minimum wage it will be a 7.5% pay rise in April


under a Conservative government. Mr Speaker, with mounting global


economic uncertainty, it was comforting to see this morning's


figures showing record UK employment. In this new age of kind.


Consensual politics does my Right Honourable friend agree that every


member of this house should welcome the news that from North Yorkshire


to North London Britain is back in work?


My honourable friend is absolutely right. Over the last year, we've


actually seen more people in work in every region in our country. That is


something that is welcome. The unemployment figures this morning,


which the House might not have had time to see, are very welcome. The


unemployment rate is now the lowest rate in nearly a decade at 5.1%. The


unemployment rate is now lower than it was at the start of the


recession. The latest figures show unemployment falling by another


99,000. And we have today in our country the record number of people


in work ever in our history and a record number of women in work.


Since I've become Prime Minister 2.3 million more people in work, and I'm


sure that is something the whole house can welcome. Jeremy Corbyn.


Thank you, Mr Speaker, it's nice to get such a warm welcome.


HECKERLING. If you will allow me for one moment.


Can the Prime Minister tell the House where in his election


manifesto he put his plan to abolish maintenance grants for students?


First of all, people will recognise no welcome for the thousands of


people who found work in our country, what a depressing


spectacle. In our manifesto we said we would cut the deficit and we


would uncap student numbers, and we've done both.


Jeremy Corbyn. There is not such joy in Port


Tolbert and other places that have lost steel jobs and they want their


government is their industries. The Prime Minister has form in terms of


student maintenance grants because the Conservative manifesto there was


no mention either... Are you done? Let me very gently say to the


dedicated Prime Minister's parliamentary private secretary...


Compose yourself, man. Being a statesman does not include


chuntering. Jeremy Corbyn. Thank you, Mr Speaker forced up as I was


saying, the Prime Minister has form here because there was no mention of


tax credit cuts in the manifesto either. This proposal will affect


500,000 students, not in his manifesto. I have a question from a


student by the name of Liam, who says: I'm training to be a


mathematics teacher and will now come out at the end of my course to


debts in excess of ?50,000, which is roughly twice as much as what his


annual income would be. Why is Liam being put into such debt?


What I would say to Liam is he is now in a country where the


university system has more people going to university than ever


before, and more people from low-income backgrounds going to


university than ever before. In addition, what I'd say to me, and I


wish him well, is he will not pay back a penny of his loan until he's


earning ?21,000. He will not start paying back in full until he's


earning ?35,000. And our policy is actually going to put more money in


the hands of students likely, which is why we are doing it. By contrast,


the Labour policy, which is to scrap the loans and scrap the fees, which


would cost ?10 billion, would mean going back to a situation where


people went out, worked hard, pay their taxes for the elite to go to


university. We are on capping aspiration and he wants to put a cap


on it. Jeremy Corbyn.


I'm pleased to say Liam is trying to be a maths teacher which might be


able to help the Prime Minister because he did say he was earning


?25,000, which is more than ?21,000, if that is a help. In 2010 his


government, in 2010, Mr Speaker, the Prime Minister's government troubled


tuition fees to ?9,000, defending it by saying they would be increasing


maintenance grants for students from less well-off backgrounds. They are


now scrapping those very same grants they used to boast about being


increased. Where is the sense in doing this? Why are they abolishing


those maintenance grants? The sense in doing this is we want


to uncap university places, so as many young people in our country who


want to go to university can go to university. And that's what we are


doing. Before too much shouting from the party opposite, when they were


in government it was Labour that introduced the fees and loans


system. Given this is the week we are meant to be learning the lessons


of the last election, let me read a lesson from someone, frankly, I


rather miss, Mr Ed Balls, who wrote this this week in the Times higher


education supplement. He said this: we clearly didn't find a sustainable


way forward for the financing of higher education. If the electorate


think they have the answers for the future they will support you --


think you have the answers. When they were in government they


supported fees and loans, when we were in opposition we made the


mistake that they did. If you want to be on the side of aspiration, if


you want to be on the side of more university students and help people


make the most of their lives, the system we've got is one that is


working and the numbers prove it. Jeremy Corbyn.


Mr Speaker, that is from the very same Prime Minister who is taking


away the grants that are designed to help the poorest with our society


and give them access to higher education. I want to ask him about


one particular group that are being targeted by this government, student


nurses, not mentioned in the manifesto, the repayments that


student nurses will have to pay when they qualify amount to an effective


pay cut of ?900 for each nurse. Why is he punishing them when we need


these nurses within the NHS? First of all there are 6700 more nurses


than when I became Prime Minister, but the facts are these: the Labour


Party does not want to base up to difficult decisions but let me give


him this one statistic. Today, two out of three people who want to


become a nurse can't become a nurse because of the bursary system. So,


by introducing the loans nurses will get more money, we will train more


nurses and bring in fewer from overseas. It's good for nurses, it's


good for the NHS and good for our country, and it's only a Labour


Party that is so short-sighted and anti-aspirational that it can't see


it. Jeremy Corbyn!


The Prime Minister and I would probably agree that we need to be


spending more and directing more resources in dealing with the mental


health crisis in this country. I've got a question from somebody who


wants to help us get through this crisis by becoming a mental health


nurse. It's a woman called Vicky from York, and she has a very real


problem. I wouldn't have been able to or chosen to study to be a mental


health nurse without a bursary for the following reasons: I'm a single


month I need support for childcare costs and have debts from a previous


degree, I'm a mature student of 33 and wouldn't take on further debts


which would be impossible for me to pay back and be fair on my daughter.


She is somebody who we need in our NHS. We need her as a mental health


nurse. We are losing her skill, her dedication, her aspiration to help


the Anne Tyler community. Two out of three Vickys who turn up


who want to be nurses are turned away by the current system, so we


are bringing people in from Bulgaria or Romania, or the other side of the


world, to do nursing jobs we should be training British people to do.


The British people want to train as nurses, the NHS wants those nurses,


this Government will fund those nurses, so help let's them train and


improve our health service. Jeremy Corbyn!


The problem is, you are expecting Vicky and others like her to fund


themselves by paying back a debt, or paying back from their wages in the


future. I don't think she has been very reassured by the Prime


Minister's answers today, unconvincing to her. However, he


wasn't very good at convincing the honourable member for Lewes, nurse


herself, I would have struggled to undertake my training given the


changes to the bursary scheme. Nine out of ten hospitals currently have


a nurse shortage. Isn't what he is proposing for the nurse bursary


scheme going to exacerbate the crisis make it worse for everybody


and our NHS less effective than more effective? What is his answer to


that point? I will give him a direct answer, which is we're going to see


10,000 extra nurse degree places because of this policy. Because we


are effectively on capping the numbers that can go into nursing. I


have to say, Mr Speaker, this week has all been of a piece, a retreat


of the Labour Party into the past. We've seen it with wanting to bring


back secondary picketing, wanting to bring back flying pickets, we've


seen it with the idea of wanting to stop businesses paying dividends and


with the absurd idea that nucleus of rings should go to sea without their


missiles. Anyone watching this Labour Party, and is not the leader,


it's the whole party, they are a risk to national security, a risk to


economic security, a risk to our health service and to the security


of every family in our country. CHEERING


SPEAKER: Edward Aga. Yelena Gloucestershire and the East


Midlands continue to be a powerhouse of jobs and growth attracting


investment from the UK and beyond and we are rightly proud of the


success of our local businesses in Charnwood. Does the continued


ability to attract foreign investment help -- be helped or


hindered if secondary picketing were reintroduced? The East Midlands is a


powerhouse of our economy and we've seen employment in the East Midlands


go up by 17,000. When businesses look at whether to invest in


Britain, whether their overseas businesses, or indeed British


businesses, they want to know we are going to have good labour relations


and not a return to the 1970s of secondary strikes and flying


pickets. It is extraordinary for a party that spent so long trying to


cast off that image of being in favour of these appalling industrial


practices has now elected a leader and is backing a leader who would


take us right back to the 1970s will stop


SPEAKER: Angus Robertson. Thank you very much, Mr Speaker.


World attention on the conflict in the Middle East is focused on Syria


and Iraq, and much less so on the catastrophe in Yemen causing


thousands of people to lose their lives and millions of people to lose


their homes. Can the prime Minster tell the House what the UK


Government is doing to support peace in Yemen?


We can with all the people taking part in this conflict to encourage


them to get round a negotiating table, as they have done recently in


order to bring about what business is Aryan Yemen, a government that


can represent all of the people. You've got to make sure that both


Sunni and Shia are properly represented in their country and


that's the only way we can meet our national interest to back a


government in Yemen that will drive the terrorists, including Al-Qaeda


meet Arabian Peninsular, AQAP, out of Yemen, because they have been and


they are a direct threat to the British citizens of Britain.


Angus Robertson. Thousands of civilians have been killed in Yemen


including a large number by the Saudi air force using British built


planes with pilots trained by British instructors dropping British


made bombs and co-ordinated by the Saudis in the presence of British


military advisers. Isn't it time for the Prime Minister to admit that


Britain is effectively taking part in a war in Yemen that is costing


thousands of civilian lives, and he has not sought Parliamentary


approval to do this? I think the right honourable


gentleman started in a serious place but then seriously wandered off. It


is in our interests that we back the legitimate Government of Yemen and


it's right to do that. We have some of the most stringent arms measures


controlled in the country anywhere in the world but to be absolutely


clear, we are not a member of the Saudi led coalition. Additional two


personnel are not directly involved in the coalition operations,


personnel are not carrying out strikes, directing or conducting


operations in Yemen or selecting targets and not involved in the


Saudi targeting decision making process but, yes, do we provide


training and advice and help in order to make sure countries do obey


the dorms of humanitarian law? Yes, we do. Thank you. The recent floods


in the North of England have caused untold misery to people,


householders, farmers, livestock and also what we need is a long-term


strategy for floods, and I know the Prime Minister has done a lot of


work across the country, some rivers need to be dredged, some need to be


slowed down and we need to manage the floodwaters in a better way.


Along with our long-term economic plan, can have a long-term plan on


floods? We absolutely can do and that's exactly what the environment


and agriculture secretary is doing. We have an unprecedented six-year


commitment of ?2.3 billion but as important as the money, is making


sure we have a joined up approach to dredging in some places, building


flood barriers in others, managing the water in landscapes, including


farming practices in a holistic way to use all the resources we had to


reduce the likelihood of floods. There is concern on all sides about


the recent rather patchwork approach to constitutional reform. We need a


new act of union, one which sets out the rules and responsibilities so


that the process of devolution by consent will be both fairer and more


comprehensive. Really meet with me and other members of the


constitutional reform group to discuss the new union? We come from


all the parties including experts such as Lord Lisvane, the former


clerk Robert Rogers. I'm very happy to meet with the honourable lady.


She has great expertise in this area. What I believe, I think there


would be common interest in what we're trying to do with the


Government is find a devolution settlement that works for all of the


devolved nations of the UK. Including importantly for England as


well. I think we've made some very good progress with a further


devolution measures we've had in Scotland and in Wales, the


maintenance of a devolved assembly in Northern Ireland, if a further


mother measures we can take I'm happy to see them. I don't believe


simply writing things down in one place will solve the problem but I'm


happy to meet with her. Does he agree with me that our nuclear


deterrent only works against our nation 's enemies if our nuclear


submarines are equipped with nuclear missiles? And those who do not


believe that have a defence policy inspired by the Beatles's yellow


submarine and while they may twist and shout, their current leader


certainly needs help. I congratulate my honourable friend on his


ingenious question. There is a comic element to sending submarines to see


without missiles in but it is absolutely serious because the


deterrent has been on a cross-party basis, a key part of our defence and


making sure we have got the ultimate insurance policy which we support on


this side and should vote on in this House and all I can say, when it


comes to the Beatles, I suspect the Leader of the Opposition prefers


back in the USSR. CHEERING


. Thank you, Mr Speaker. Just under two weeks ago, a 16-year-old boy was


murdered in a knife attack in my constituency. I'm sure the whole


House will want to join me in sending our deepest condolences to


Charlie 's friends and families. Given that knife crime in London


rose last year and the number of teenage deaths peaked to its highest


level in seven years, what action will be taken to make sure we don't


return to the days when knife crime in London are affecting young people


is merely a fact of life? He speaks for the whole House and I'm sure the


whole House will want to be with in spirit, the family and friends of


Charlie who lost his life in this attack for that there's nothing


anyone can say that will give them the comfort that they seek. What I


would say is we have toughened the law in terms of knife crime offences


and the level of custodial sentences people are getting for those crimes.


The police have done a huge amount to try and crack down on knife crime


and that's why it has fallen by 17% since 2010 but there's still more in


terms of educating children and young people about the dangers of


carrying a knife. The carrier of this crime ends up the victim of the


attack often so we also need better education. Does the Prime Minister


agree with me that encoding people in this country to learn the English


language has a unifying effect? It AIDS integration and helps to create


national identity and social cohesion and therefore should be


promoted. He is absolutely right. I think the most important thing in


our country is to make sure that everybody can take advantages of the


opportunities in our country to work, get training, go to


university. This is an opportunity country but there's no opportunity


for people if you don't speak the language. That's why we are


targeting money at those people very often women who have been stuck at


home sometimes by the men in the House and make sure they can get


their English language skills they need. Let me make one other point


because this is so important. When I sat in a mosque in Leeds this week,


a young person said how important it is that in mammas speak English


speakers if you have young people, sometimes it's big English


themselves but not Arabic, they need someone to guide them away from ices


and their poisonous rhetoric so speaking English is important for


Avril and, in mammas included. Young people in Southampton have seen


themselves frozen out of the living wage and housing benefits and face


the downgrading or closure of the colleges and sixth form colleges


many of them get their qualification from and now we see the ending of


maintenance grants for those young people who want a good university.


-- Imams. Whatever primers they got it into young people trying to make


their way in life? We have record numbers going to university, record


numbers taking on apprenticeships, record numbers in work for that


today the unemployment figures show a record low in the unemployment


rate amongst those people who have left school and I would say one of


the reasons why a Labour MP in this south of England is as rare as hen


's teeth as big as they talked down our country and opportunity in it. I


would like to thank the Prime Minister for launching the delivery


board on Monday evening at number ten, men and women experts in their


sectors coming together to deliver the 3 million apprenticeships by


2020. Does the Prime Minister agree with me that it will be a great


thing if, when students across our country log onto the website, they


are informed about the opportunities of degrees as well as the more


traditional agrees? That's Mac degrees. One reason is if you become


an apprentice, that is not locking out a chance of doing a degree later


in your career. The opportunities for learning and learning are


getting great. The second reason it's so important, in schools,


teachers are very well equipped to tell people about degree


opportunities because that's the route that they've taken, A-levels


and suchlike. But we need to improve the information in schools so people


can see the opportunities for apprenticeships, in some cases, then


leading onto degrees. My 24-year-old constituents Loria is in need of


stem cell donor. The campaign is attracting global support and on


Saturday, the O2 Centre in Manchester will run a drive to get


as many people as possible on the bone marrow register. When the Prime


Minister join me at this event on Saturday and send a message of


support to those working to keep her alive? I certainly will join the


honourable lady in supporting this campaign. It had meetings with the


bone marrow organisations in number ten Downing St to support the


matching campaign and I'm sure, by her raising it in this way, many


others will want to come to this event and support it in the way she


suggests. The Prime Minister is aware that a number of colleagues


and I await his response to our request made in November for a


meeting regarding his Ewood negotiations to discuss the


importance of this Parliament being able to stop any unwanted taxes


regulations or directives which goes to the core of the issue like the


Borders control, business regulation. Will he meet with us


prior to the next meeting? I'm having a range of meetings with


colleagues about the European issue. I'm sure that I will be covering of


many in our Parliamentary party as possible. I've always felt he has


slightly made up his mind already and wants to leave the EU whatever


the result. I don't want to take up any more of this time than is


necessary. LAUGHTER


Mr Jonathan Edwards. The UK Government is a cheerleader for


China to be awarded market economy status because it wants the City of


London to become a major trading centre for the Chinese currency. It


would be nigh on impossible to impose tariffs on Chinese deals


despite their strategy. If there's not a classic case of once again the


Westminster Government putting the bankers of London before


manufacturing workers in Wales and the rest of the UK? I think the


honourable gentleman is wrong both on content and approach. The two


issues are separate. There are market economies that Europe still


puts dumping tariffs on, we did that recently with America and we've done


in the past with Russia, so we should take these issues separately


and continued to pursue robust action against China, exactly what


we are doing, based on the merits but in terms of a close ablation


ship, trading relationship with China, I want to help the Welsh


businesses including companies like air bus to break into Chinese


markets and make sure we get the best of British jobs, manufacturing,


exports. That's what we want in our relationship with China. Speaking of


Airbus, the Mersey region which straddles the England Wales border,


is one of the most dynamic industrial areas of the country.


Will my right honourable friend welcomed the establishment of the


all-party Mersey group which has been formed to promote the economic


success of the region and really urge his ministerial colleagues and


the Welsh Government to cooperate with the group and its work? First


of all, let me join my honourable friend in welcoming this new group.


I think is important, when you look at the development of the Welsh


economy, to think about how the North Wales can benefit from growth


in the north-west of our country and the links between the North West and


Wales, which this group will examine. HS2 and what happens crew


will be of vital part of that process but I'm happy to talk


further with him. Will the Prime Minister operate and speak for the


whole of the House, the unconditional unequivocal support of


the British people for the people of the Falklands Islands to their


rights, their British right, to self-determination and that will not


be undermined in any way by some kind of accommodation or


negotiations in which the people of the Falkland Islands may have an


enormous say and have no veto. They should have a right to determine


their own future. CHEERING


The honourable gentleman has put better than I could. The people of


the Falkland Islands have spoken in-out referendum and will maintain


the status quo and as long as they want that, they have a guarantee


from me and I find it quite extraordinary that the Labour Party


now want to look at trying to change the status and giveaway something


people absolutely considered to be their right and that will never


happen as long as I'm in Downing Street. Thank you. As a former Cub


Scout leader, I'm pleased to say that Scouting is thriving in Harrow.


This year marks the centenary of the formation and founding of Cub


Scouting across the UK. Will my right honourable friend join me in


congratulating the 150,000 young people who participate in Cub


Scouting every week in the UK, congratulate and thank the leaders


who give up their time voluntarily to enable young people to have


adventures in a safe environment and call on more people to volunteer as


leaders as part of the big society movement? I absolutely agree with my


honourable friend, the Scouts are a great part of the big society and we


provided them and other uniformed youth groups with over ?10 million


of funding since I've been Prime Minister to help them do the


excellent work they do. I had a letter recently from their grills,


the chief scout himself, looking at what we can do the welcome has


centenary and give this fantastic organisation a big centenary boost.


-- Bear Grylls. The Prime Minister should be aware that Sheffield


Masters announced this morning and last of 100 jobs in this crisis hit


industry. Many of those jobs will be in my constituency. We have had lots


of words, hand wringing and crocodile tears from the Prime


Minister and the ministers in this chamber. About the job losses across


the steel industry. Can you tell me when he's actually going to do


something to support world-class companies like Sheffield 40 Masters?


First of all, we have taken action including the action on energy bills


which will save these industries ?400 million in this Parliament. The


honourable gentleman chose to inject a bit of politics into this, let me


inject some back. When the Labour Party were in power, what happened


to employment in the steel industry? It was cut by 34,000, cut in half.


Where were the carve outs from the energy bills them? Where were these


special arrangements for taking votes in Europe we put in place?


Where were the rules for making sure that we buy which steel here when it


comes to public procurement as we will for HS2, the carrier programme


and also if he is interested in Sheffield 40 Masters, he might want


to have a word with his leader about something called a Trident


submarine. CHEERING


Mr Speaker. We don't yet know who will headline Glastonbury the summer


but we do know that, as things stand, they will not have anywhere


to do their banking as this world-famous town is to lose all


three of its remaining banks within 12 weeks of each other. Will he join


me in encouraging those banks to think again and otherwise to make


sure that they need their responsibilities under the banking


protocols? I will certainly make sure that happens and arrange a


meeting with the Treasury minister to discuss this issue. We have huge


challenges because of the growth of Internet banking but important in


towns, market towns I represent, we have a physical presence on the high


Street. The Prime Minister may be aware about Julie Pearson, young


Scottish woman who died in November and was allegedly beaten and raped


before her death. I've met the family recently and I hope the House


will offer condolences. They are struggling to get authorities to get


the autopsy report. Will he look at this case to put pressure on the


Israeli Government and authorities and the family than can move on and


get justice for Julie? I'm not aware directly of this case, but I will


certainly take it up on her behalf with the Israeli authorities because


important our constituents get answers on this matter. Perhaps I


could have a meeting with Foreign Office minister so they can discuss


it but we have good relations with Israel and use them to make sure


when people need answers, they get them. Order.


It is 12:36pm, Prime Minister's Questions over run as a usually does


these days. It has come to an end. Jeremy Corbyn, as Laura accurately


predicted, went first of all on student grants, the change of


student grants into loans, we will talk about that in a minute, and


moved onto bursaries for nurses, both issues are linked and used all


six questions on these two issues. I will come back to that and get


reaction from our panel when we have heard what you thought of it.


Clear division, Andrew. Mark Bradley says yet again the Prime Minister


didn't answer Jeremy Corbyn's questions but because of the lack of


leadership and teeth from Jeremy Corbyn the prime Minster walked over


the Labour leader. Richard Stanley said, finally a week where Jeremy


Corbyn has scored some good blows against David Cameron. Bigging the


Prime Minister into a hole on details around student fees and NHS


nurses worked well, and let the Prime Minister struggling with


prescriptive dancers. David Kidd said Jeremy Corbyn stumbles over his


questions and is no match for David Cameron when it comes to debating on


his feet -- scripted answers. Totally and ineffective. Katherine


Jenkins says the prime and is the's declarations appear callous even


when trying to appeal to normal people, while Jeremy Corbyn appears


ever more confident appearing the strongest and fairest leader


challenging the government and speaking up for the public.


Thank you. Is to Corbynista still using his crowdfunding technique.


Today was Lee and Vicky, he's not using it all the time, he's got rid


of the idea of going through all of Prime Minister's Questions with


questions source from the public but it is clearly a useful device and


humanises the issues. It is useful he is using it. Today we saw these


are good strong issues for Jeremy Corbyn and have cut through with


lots of people around the country, changes happening to people's lives,


no question. Is one of the e-mails suggested, the Prime Minister was


not really put under very much pressure by Mr Corbyn and the manner


in which he asked the questions. Again something we have discussed


before, he's not really very much into the follow-up, the art of the


follow-up. The AdLib follow-up. There was a


good question, why wasn't this in the manifesto, the Government wants


to make a change affecting thousands of students and it wasn't in the


manifesto but he sort of let it go in a sense. One final thought,


interestingly, we are seeing the Tories coalescing and sticking to


and carving out this attack line we are going to hear again and again


and again, different to how they approached Jeremy Corbyn before


Christmas about the idea of going back to the past, Labour not just


looking inside itself but looking back to the bad old days of the 70s


and 80s, and you heard it with planted questions on nuclear weapons


and secondary picketing, and Nigel Dodds from the DUP raising the issue


of the Falklands. Indeed. David Gauke, the Prime


Minister said in 2010 we must always look after poorer students. That's


why we are keeping bursaries. What has changed? The position is that we


think that in order to ensure we can properly fund record numbers of


people going into higher education, that the best value for money


approach of doing this is moving towards a loan system that we think


this still ensures that people have got access to the funds they need


whilst going through university, and in terms of the balance between the


taxpayer and the student, or more to the point, someone who has had the


benefit of higher education, we are clear that there needs to be that


shift. When did you change your mind?


Well, this is an issue we have always looked at.


You have always been in favour of bursaries, and indeed you justified,


by you I mean your party and ministers at the time, justified the


trebling in tuition fees by an increase in student grants to help


poorer students live through their time at university. So, what's


changed and when did you change it? We were clear when we fought the


last General Election that we needed to find further savings in public


spending. You didn't mention this one.


We are looking at the budget for the Department for business, innovation


and skills, this is a substantial part of that budget.


Why didn't you put it in the manifesto? Once we had won the


General Election we looked at all of the areas of public spending to see


where we felt there were as savings and here we felt there was a


significant saving that could be made that enables us still to do


something very important, which is take the cap on the number of


students away. Let's get this right, we went into


the selection with all previous statements from Conservative


ministers extolling the virtues of bursaries and saying how important


it was, even with rising fees, that bursaries help put students to go to


university. In that election campaign you never mentioned that


you were thinking of going from bursaries to loans, it wasn't in the


manifesto, so how were we to know this is what you would do?


We were very clear about the principles behind it. ...


You were not very clear. We were very clear we would find


savings in public expenditure. We gave those numbers and we talked


about departmental spending, that we were going to find ?13 billion from


that. You didn't tell us beforehand, did


you? We didn't make that decision until


subsequently. If it is such a good idea why


haven't you put it through a committee? This is a big change for


lots of poorer students. Why haven't you even had a debate in the House


of Commons about it? It's perfectly reasonable to do this


through a statutory instrument. It absolutely isn't. You have been


doing it repeatedly with issue after issue. Tax credits. The power that


we used to take this through on a statutory instrument was a power


given to the Government in an act of Parliament passed by a Labour


government in 1998. This is a complete red herring, we never used


it as widely as you have done to bring through major changes.


Can I just make the point, David Gauke, that it wasn't in the


manifesto, you gave no inkling that this was a potential change, that if


you were elected you would do. And yet you still wouldn't debate it in


the House of Commons. It is surely worth more than a statutory


instrument that you can show through in a committee.


There was a vote in the House of Commons on this, as we can have an


opposition Day debate. Only thanks to us. The idea that somehow this is


concealed... I come back to the point. The very power that we were


using, it was announced in the budget, there is no concealment


here. The power to take this through by a statutory instrument is a power


that a Labour act of Parliament gave us. Why does that make it right? I'm


making the point that if Owen is going to criticise that it's


outrageous that we used a statutory instrument for this Labour gave us


the powerful stop we didn't use this for financial measures like this,


that's the truth, we didn't use it for anything as substantial. We are


talking about a bit of process now and I'd like to get back to the


substance. This is a big policy change that will affect lots of


people's lives when they go into higher education in the years to


come and it's interesting and worth knowing that this plan was on the


shelf and discussed and considered by Vince Cable and David Willis


under the coalition and they shied away from doing it at that time. I


understand Nick Clegg was nervous about going that far because of


everything around tuition fees. In a sense it was something that was on


the shelf that the Conservatives knew about, that when they got back


in everybody was scaring about savings and they could take this


back of the shelf and get savings pretty much that were easily


deliverable monopoly Dibley easy, but easily deliverable. Even so just


after the election there was a tussle in the business department


about whether this was the right way to go but it did make its way into


the budget. -- but not politically easy. I want to talk about the issue


we have been discussing. I don't, because we've already done it and


David Gauke has had a number of difficult questions. I don't think


anyone can say we have not grilled him. It would be nice to comment on


big Government's policies. You have been and I'm asking about Labour's


policies. The policy was cutting tuition fees from 9000 down to 6000


and the policy in Wales is we believe in lower tuition fees, we


have a 3000 feet in Wales and we have maintained it under the Welsh


government educational grants including the Educational


Maintenance Allowance for 16-19 new role is. The crucial issue we have


got to address is the fact that 500,000 students, the poorest ones


who benefit presently from ?3500 grants each year, are going to be


not ?40,000 in debt at the end of their university but ?53,000 and the


Government is going to save money on the back of the poorest. Their own


impact assessment concedes, Andrew, that it is going to diminish female


participation in higher education, diminish what is a patient from


black and ethnic minorities and diminish participation by the


disabled, that is his Government's assessment.


That is why David Gauke was asked some tough questions, can I get


clarification from you now you have had your say, is it Labour policy to


abolish tuition fees and if not what level would you set them at? Jeremy


Corbyn has said it is his omission to abolish tuition fees and we are


considering how to do that and when we put forward the manifesto for the


next election that will be a consideration for stop didn't you


tell me you were not abolishing tuition fees and you kept them in


Wales? My previous answer was that at the last election Labour's posy


was to cut from 9000 down to 6000 and the leader says he wants to open


access to higher education and he believes that means Labour needs to


look at tuition fees and abolish tuition fees, and we've got to


consider seriously how we move towards making higher education


accessible to more young people, in particular from the lowest income


households. I'm afraid we are away over... We are going to stop. We


have other things to do, that's it, stop! Start! The bell has rung. Very


brave, Andrew! Go! Christine Ariza, the MP for Neath, after my appalling


memory lapse earlier summer minister for legal aid, cease and desist.


Thanks very much! Now - we used to boast an Empire


on which the sun never set - now just a few "overseas


territories" remain. But is it time to relinquish


control of these? Journalist Richard Norton-Taylor


thinks that the Union flag should be lowered on the Falkland


Islands and Gibraltar - Approaching the planet for the first


time, aliens may wonder what on earth the Union Jack


is doing flying on an island 3,000 miles away from Britain,


and also on a large limestone rock Successive British governments have


claimed sovereignty over the Falkland Islands


but the claims are far from solid. And shortly before the invasion


of the Falklands by the Argentinians in 1982, the Thatcher government


offered an arrangement whereby Argentina would get sovereignty over


the islands and Britain would lease And the islanders would be promised


uninterrupted enjoyment And then, even after the invasion


in 1982, the Thatcher government was prepared to do a deal,


negotiate over the islands. In strict treaty terms,


Britain's claims to Gibraltar, the Rock of Gibraltar,


are stronger because the 1713 Treaty of Utrecht ceded the rock


to Britain in perpetuity, Even so, despite this,


the British governments in the past have been prepared to discuss


sovereignty arrangements, joint sovereignty,


for example, with Spain. It cannot be beyond the wit


and imagination of democratic governments to abandon


an anachronistic notion of false The Rock of Gibraltar


and the Falkland Islands have no It is time, indeed it is well


beyond time, to negotiate in the name of territorial


integrity and common sense. And Richard Norton


Taylor joins us now. Welcome. You agree with Jeremy


Corbyn in terms of discussions on both of those? He said something for


the first time last Sunday I've been talking about this quite a long


time. Do you agree with him the Falkland Islands have a right to


self-determination? Yes. On the basis of that, the one to stay as


is. Self-determination is not same as giving up the British colonial


status. It happened in many other countries. Minorities who have


self-government, certainly, and it guarantees they can preserve their


way of life which has been suggested in the Gibraltar context too,


actually. Part of any agreement, one should have, talks first with


Argentina and the Spanish government over Gibraltar, is to have some


agreement whereby the Argentina 's would have to look after their own


indigenous population not on the mainland, not just the islanders.


That can be part of a deal in the interests of the minorities in


Argentina and indeed Spain, as well as in Gibraltar and the folder. Is


it time we negotiated with Argentina the Falklands? No, it's very clear


that there is an established printable self-determination. I


think this is a peripheral issues and... Jeremy Corbyn talked about


it. He was asked a question about it and did not raise it. Universal


Credit, cuts to bursaries, all of those are much more important


subjects for the country. I think, our opinion as Labour about the


Falklands, it is self-determination, it's for the people of the Falklands


to stay part of Britain and if they want to, they should do. They should


be reasonable accommodation with Argentina, Jeremy Corbyn said. Is he


right? I think our position is clear. It should remain part of


Britain. What does he mean by reasonable accommodation? He was


simply saying at the Falklands is raised once more by the Argentinian


government, we should reasonably engage in discussions with them and


of course that's right, however, our principal position has to be it for


the people of the Falklands to determine whether they want to be


part of or Argentina or independent. Their view is clear they want a part


of the UK and therefore they should remain part of the UK. He was asked


about it counted as a veto and he wasn't clear about that. In fact,


today Nigel Dodds wanted clarification. I think they should


have a veto. It's for them to determine whether they want to


remain part of the UK but I genuinely do think, and I know why


the Tories want to talk about this, going back to the past, the 1970s


etc, but it is peripheral. Jeremy answered the question honestly,


however, it's not the main topic of conversation. It's a peripheral


issue? It's not as urgent as other issues like the economy or Trident


or whatever but it's an important issue and there will be negotiations


on time. Maybe when I'm past retirement, even more past


retirement age, but it's going to happen sooner. Should David Cameron


we willing to negotiate? No, I agree with what Owen has said in terms of


respecting the self-determination of the islanders, but where it is


important is it does reveal something about Jeremy Corbyn. Owen


Smith is normally done that for you. The big dispute between the UK and


any other part of the world, Jeremy Corbyn seems to be on the side of


the other part of the world. He was asked the question did not bring it


up, though. Thank very much. So yesterday they


made their excuses. The Labour Party tried to explain


why it lost the General Election and Pollsters tried to explain why


they were predicting might Ed Miliband might


become Prime Minister. But how do those compare


with the great political excuses At five, it's Natalie Bennett


with her mental brain fade. Er, we're looking at a total


spend of 2.7 billion... Having a brain fade is arguably


the most honest excuse of today's top five and she did


have a massive cold. In at number four, it's the UKIP


front man Nigel Farage with a novel excuse for being late


to a meeting in Wales. More creative than to blame


the traffic, he had an excuse It took me six hours and 15


minutes to get here. What it does have to do


with is a country with a population going through the roof chiefly


because of open door immigration and the fact the A4 is not


as navigatable as it used to be. Down to three, it's Gordon Brown


with that 2010 classic. JEREMY VINE: Someone


has handed me the tape. Let's play it and see


if we can hear it. GORDON BROWN: 'She's


just a bigoted woman'. He said sorry and had


an excuse up his sleeve. This was me being helpful


to the broadcasters with my microphone on, rushing into the car,


because I had to get At two, it's Aston Villa's number


one fan David Cameron. He said, well, he forgot which team


he supports which may well be true because a few months later he also


forgot his daughter after Sunday He remembered to take


the President Xi, though. And at number one, the then


Environment Secretary Owen Paterson with the irrefutable excuse


as to why the badger cull targets The badgers have


moved the goalposts. Those pesky little badgers always


interfering with the goalposts. What's the most embarrassing excuse


you've had to make? I've never had to make an embarrassing excuse. You


haven't? I once left an event because I wanted to go and watch


England play football and I said I had to look at Stirling matters


because Raheem Sterling was a star player at the time. Can you do


better than that, please? Similar to David Cameron, my mother once left


knee in a pram outside the butchers and got on the bus and went home


before she realised. How could you do that, say that about your own


mother? What is your excuse for Labour spending ?600 on chicken


suits during the election campaign? Money well spent. We should have


spent more. What was the year? Guess which year it was. It was... 1979.


The winner is Nick from Hertfordshire. Well done. On the


Falklands, Michael Foot was very robust. Yes, he was. In that famous


speech, he did better than Margaret Thatcher. On a Saturday morning. No


time to talk about Gibraltar properly. Sorry about that.


The One O'Clock News is starting over on BBC One now.


We'll be here at noon tomorrow with all the big political stories


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