24/03/2017 Daily Politics

Police say their investigation into the terror attack

on Westminster is focussing on the "motivation, preparation

and associates" of Khalid Masood, and confirm several raids

As the investigation widens, do the police and intelligence

agencies have sufficient resources and legal powers to monitor

all known on radical extremists in the UK?

Ahead of the start of formal Brexit talks, we look at the future

of the car industry, and ask what kind of trade

deal would be best for manufacturing jobs in the UK.

And we take a look back at the other political stories of the week,

including rows at the top of Labour, and pressure on George Osborne

All that in the next hour and with us for the duration

Paul Waugh, the Executive Editor, Politics, at the Huffington Post,

political editor at the Sunday Express.

So, we will be devoting most of today's programme to coverage

and discussion of the terror attack in London.

But before we bring you the latest on the police investigation,

politics is slowly returning to normal business,

and ahead of the triggering of Article 50 next week

the president of the European Commission, Jean Claude Juncker,

has been speaking to the BBC's Europe Editor Katya Adler.

How will you feel on Wednesday when that letter of notification,

that formal letter of notification, arrives here in Brussels?

I will be sad, as I was sad when the vote, the referendum

But does it feel like a failure, President Juncker?

Jean-Claude Juncker there, who has been saying many things about

Britain in recent weeks, most of contradictory. One wiki is nice to

us and the next week, he is threatening punishment. Yes, and he

said the beginning of the week that basically, you know, the UK would

regret its decision and then later on in the week we are told he is not

going to punish us for our decision to go so we don't know where we

stand but broadly, we do know that he's pretty hostile to the UK in

terms of the negotiating position, that it remains to be seen where

things go from there given the fact that, even though we are a long way

off from the 23rd of June, the formal process Brexit only begins on

Wednesday. Indeed. We know how important Jean-Claude Juncker is

going to be in this. Angela Merkel can't stand him. Michel Barnier will

be doing the negotiations for the commission, not Jean-Claude Juncker,

but he has repeated again this figure of an exit bill of ?50

billion, a figure floating around in Brussels. I would suggest to you it

is politically impossible for any British government to the a figure

anywhere near that. I think you're absolutely right which is why

Cabinet ministers had been banging the table, putting their feet down

this week and making absolutely clear ?3 billion would be massive,

never mind 50 billion. Michel Barnier will be sparring constantly

with David Davis and they are both old pros. They are both smart. They

know what they are doing and they will be a negotiation obviously,

give-and-take, and ultimately, it's a question of who will blink first

and we will see who does. Tomorrow, the EU 27, all of them except

Britain, are going to be celebrating the anniversary of the Treaty of

Rome, a historic event in the 1950s that, because Brexit and other

things, why would suggest as well, the election cycle in Europe, still

massive levels of youth unemployment, it's taking place

under something of a cloud? It is, and also if you think about the fact

we're not going to there and Jean-Claude Juncker is very

disappointed by the decision taken on the 23rd of June, it is going to

be difficult to have a celebration falls are all so with a cloud of

this terrorist attack in London, and it's very difficult for them to sort

of talk about punishment beating and being very hard on us when London is

yet again under the cloud of a terrorist attack, which is always

going to colour these kinds of discussions. And when we know the

vital importance of British intelligence and security services,

not just to this country, but to the whole of Europe. That, as the

primers to keep saying, won't change after Brexit. That intelligence

links, sharing, and a former European arrest warrant could

continue after Brexit but we talk about the European Union celebrating

its anniversary but don't forget some of the countries over there and

the leaders think coming out of the eurozone crisis, their economies are

growing. The eurozone is growing. There is a sense of growing

optimism, it is not doom and gloom and they think it's a brand-new

chapter for them as much as us. We shall see.

So far four people have died as a result of Wednesday's

Another 50 are injured - several of them in critical condition.

But after the emergency response comes the analysis

As the hours pass, more information is emerging about the man police

The police have formally identified him as 52-year-old

Adrian Russell Ajao, born in Kent.

The Met Police say he had a number of aliases,

That was the first name we heard after the attack.

Most recently he was living in the West Midlands,

although he is also believed to have lived at certain times

in different towns in Sussex, as well as Luton and east London.

Ajao said he was a "teacher" - although the BBC has been able

to confirm that he never worked as a qualified teacher

He is also reported to have three children.

Ajao had never been convicted of a terrorism offence

but we know that some years ago he was investigated in relation

He also had previous convictions for possession of a knife,

grievous bodily harm and public order offences.

This morning the acting Deputy Commissioner

of the Metropolitan Police described the challenge facing the police,

as they try to establish whether Ajao, or Masood

as he was known, is part of a wider network of violent extremists.

As I've said previously, our investigation focuses

on understanding his motivation, his preparation and his associates.

Whilst there is still no evidence of further threats,

you will understand our determination is to find out

if either he acted totally alone inspired by terrorist propaganda

or if others have encouraged, supported or directed him.

To that end, in our continuing investigation and ongoing covert

activity, we have made two further significant arrests overnight.

One in the West Midlands and one in the north-west.

We now have nine people remaining in custody and one woman has

We remain keen to hear from anyone who Khalid Masood,

Anybody who understands who his associates were.

Anyone who can provide information about the places

There might well be people out there who did have concerns

about Masood that weren't sure or didn't feel comfortable

for whatever reasons in passing that information to us.

I now urge anyone with such information to call us.

That of head of counterterrorism at the Metropolitan Police.

And we can speak now to the BBC's Security

Gordon, at the moment in the public domain, all you know is that he

acted alone, at least he was the lone actor on the day. But the

police must think there could be more involved given the number of

arrests they have made. That absolutely rightful soccer crucial

phrase you use there was a lone actor on the day. It's clear he was

the only person involved in carrying out the attack, but that doesn't

necessarily mean they were not other people who supported him or knew

about it or who paps directed and encouraged him to do it. That is the

question police really want to answer at the moment because it

answers whether there is any residual threat from other

individuals out there who might be planning the same. So that is the

reason that they are making these arrests, carrying out these

searches, to try to understand whether those around him, the people

we knew, the contacts he had, were significant and had any

foreknowledge or involvement in the attack. The police will be at

interrogating those they have been arrested Thomas but I'll assume

Gordon, the police will also be trying to collect as much

information as possible, not from people arrested, but just from its

neighbours and people who might have known him and all the rest, which is

where some quite key intelligence could come from I would think?

That's right, they've gone to the hotelier where he stayed at just

before the attack, talking to the people there, and the other crucial

aspect to this is data, and they will look through communication

electronics, travel records, for connections, did he have encrypted

conversations with anyone? What were those are electronic devices he was

using? What was he browsing on the Internet? That could point to

whether others were involved, and was there, for instance, a guided

hand abroad linked to so-called Islamic State? They have said he was

their soldier but that does not necessarily mean they were directly

involved in the attack, so that will also be one of the key lines of

enquiry. In a way, Gordon, you would hope that it wasn't a sophisticated

and highly organised network. He may have had some help, may have had

amateurs in a sense like he was, but you would hope it wasn't

sophisticated and well-organised, because we've always assumed at that

level, our intelligence services will be on it as they have in

previous cases where they have thwarted attacks. That's right,

because the more sophisticated things are, the more people are

involved and the more travel and relocation is involved, the more

chances thereof for the intelligence services to find some entry point

into a plot to spot one of those people and hope they are under

surveillance, to intercept communications, and if it turns out

that there were significant other contacts, if there is a network

operating in the UK or a guiding hand abroad contacting people in the

UK, and the authorities did not know about it, that would be something

that will worry them. He wasn't part of the intelligence picture, the

current picture, only something historic, and so that indicate they

were not aware of people around him or of any contact, so I think they

will be looking to establish that or weather, which so far it looks like,

he was relatively isolated in his activity. Gordon, thank you very

much for that. Let's go now to Birmingham.

And I'm joined now by the MP for Birmingham Ladywood,

Welcome to the programme. We learned quite a lot of police activity of

the last 36 hours has been in part of your constituency, along the

Hagley Road. Tell us a bit about that and what the police have been

doing there. Andrew, as you know could there have been a number of

arrests and police raids on some properties in Hagley Road and the

Winston Green area of my constituency, which is not too far

away. There is obviously community concern about that. Nobody wants to

wake up and find they might have been living next door to a

terrorist, a murderer, or anybody involved in that horrific terrorist

attack and there is some community concern and the police have been

very active and obviously arrests have been made and that sends

reassurance investigation is continuing apace. I assume the

arrests had been made and we've seen the pictures of the police on the

Hagley Road and around the area, but I assume the police and also just be

trying to find out from the locals there what they know, what they can

tell? It may not seem important but in the broader picture of things, it

could be and the police will be doing that in that part of your

constituency? Yes, absolutely, there's been a strong message sent

out to anybody in the area that if they know anything, if they saw

Khalid Masood, they should share that information with the police. We

have seen in the media in the last day or two, some residents in my

area who may have lived next door to him or known him speaking to the

media and also the police, as well, so anybody who knows anything of

course is being encouraged to share that information with the police.

There is a member of Unity community events planned for today and

tomorrow as well and I know that message will go out very strongly

and also Friday prayers across the city, people will send out a very

clear message that anybody who knows anything about Khalid Masood, his

associates, must share that information with the police.

Birmingham has gone to a remarkable renaissance in recent years,

particularly in the city centre. We see that in the picture behind you,

which deaths looks wonderful. Is there a concern that fairly or

unfairly, Birmingham is also getting a name for being a terrorist

hotspot? I think of course there's been some recent academic research

on members of terrorist convictions across the country which shows that

Birmingham has the second-largest number of very considerably behind

London. That is what you would expect in terms of the size of our

city and the population here, but I think I would say that it is unfair

to characterise our city in that way. You have to look at those

numbers in context. We are talking about 39 convictions for terrorism

from 1998 onwards in a city that has a Muslim population of 235,000, so

we're talking about very small numbers but it's important we learn

about those 39 and we think about the patterns and pathways towards

radicalisation is that those 39 took so we can learn lessons, not just as

a city but as a country because it never bodies interests and our

desire to find out a way to completely eliminate this problem

which is exactly what we all want to do. The numbers are higher because

you are the second city is well and the population is bigger.

A Are you satisfied that within the many and varied Muslim communities

there are in the Greater Birmingham area, that most do feel comfortable,

feel willing to come forward and give what help, what knowledge, what

information they can to the police and Security Services? I mean

certainly in my own personal spears, I have dealt with constituents who

felt that they might have information that's useful to the

police and they have never felt any compunction about sharing that with

the police. I think there is a wider question around in particular the

Government's Prevent strategy, which, you know, has been in the

press a lot as to whether or not it has lost the confidence of the

Muslim community, not just in Birmingham but across the country

and I think Prevent in my experience has both good and bad aspects. There

is someexaminent work that has taken place in Birmingham which has been

effective. -- some excellent work. Which has prevented young people

from travelling to Syria to take part in the fighting. But there has

been some terrible practice and clangors by front line staff in

terms of referring young children, in inappropriate circumstances, to

various aspects of the Prevent strategy. I think the way to

improve, that build further resilience and confidence in the

community is to have a regular independent assessment of Prevent.

We can learn where it is doing well and mainstream that and also

eliminate bad practice to give communities further confidence that

they are not being spied on and they must feel entirely comfortable

sharing everything they know with the Security Services and police. I

understand. It is very interesting. Let me ask you one final question.

Do the people of Birmingham, their elected representatives like

yourselves, the authorities, is there still much more to do yet on

some problems that Birmingham schools have had with some sort of

extremist atmosphere and environment here, and with extremist preachers?

Are these two issue that is still need work done in the city? I think

there has been some good work after the so-called Trojan Horse scandal,

the issue you are referring to in relation to some Birmingham schools.

That's about reasserting the norms around governance of schools and the

responsibilities of governing bodies and I think the council and local

authority accepted that there were errors they had made in not

asserting the rules around governance properly and I think that

has been dealt with but I would say that there is always work to do

across our communities to build resilience, to make sure that we

stamp out extremist, whether that is preachers or publication or

literature. I think actually, if I was focussing resources, the thing I

would really spend money on is on in the online space and asking tech

companies, Google and others, that they need to do much more work and

take much more responsibility about the sorts of material on their

platforms which I think is accounting for a lot of online

grooming and radicalisation that we are seeing particularly of young

people. That is where we, across this country, have the biggest

problem but I also think it is where we can come up with the best

practical solution, working with the tech companies, making them take

responsibility and getting the material off the online platforms.

You are not the first politician to mention that to me this week, your

fellow Birmingham area MP, Liam Byrne was on this programme talking

about that earlier and making the same powerful points you are.

Shabana Mahmood, we have to leer it there. Thank you for your time. --

leave it there. Do the police and intelligence

services have enough resources In the last parliament,

the Government brought forward That would have given the police

and the security services more powers to access

people's digital communications. But that was dubbed the "Snooper's

Charter" by its opponents. And in 2013, the then-Deputy

Prime Minister, Nick Clegg, said that his Liberal Democrat MPs

would block the bill In 2016, the Conservative

Government brought forward a new piece of legislation -

the Investigatory Powers Act. This gave the authorities more

limited powers than had been Under the terms of the act,

the police are allowed to see which websites

suspects have visited. But they're not allowed to see

the specific web pages In terms of funding,

the Government is planning to spend an extra ?3.4 billion

on counter-terrorism over And ministers say they will hire

an extra 1,900 staff at MI5, However, the Government did cut

police spending in real terms Total spending on the police

in England and Wales fell from ?13.6 billion in 2010-11

to ?11.7 billion in 2014-15. After the election in 2015,

the Government said they would protect the police's

budget in this parliament. The Security Minister, Ben Wallace,

was on this programme yesterday and Jo asked him if the authorities

currently have the Do you think the security services

and GCHQ have enough resources to tackle all the potential suspects

that could perform this sort I meet with them regularly and I ask

and this Government has increased resources to fighting

counter-terrorism across Government and internationally by 30%

over this parliament. We have expanded MI6,

MI5 and GCHQ to meet the threat and we are very alive to asking

those agencies whether they have To discuss this we've been joined by

the Liberal Democrat peer and former Deputy Assistant Commissioner

of the Metropolitan And in our Exeter studio is

the Conservative MP Johnny Mercer. Welcome to the both. Brian Paddick,

you want to move away from blanket surveillance towards more targeted

monitoring. But maybe the only way that you pick up somebody like

Masood is by blanket surveillance. It is interesting, Andrew, I was

briefed by the Security Services. I visited GCHQ during the discussions

around the investigatory powers act. They did not need the blanket web

history information that you referred to before. They say that

they have other means of identifying that information. So, those powers

are eroding people's civil liberties, they are eroding freedom,

which is of course what the extremists want, and Security

Services say that they don't need those powers. The Security Services

wanted the investigatory powers act. I'm not saying we are against that

act as a whole, there are some good elements. But they want it as a

whole? The Security Services said they did not need and did not want

what is called internet connection records which is the web history of

every citizen of this history being held for 12 months. This is the

information about every web page... I see. So this is the actual pages

as opposed to the sites. Exactly. What do you say to that Mr Mercer.

If someone is regularly visiting Islamic State.com, in a way you

really need to know what the actual pages are, they are looking at. The

fact that they are going on to that website, which you can find out,

isn't that enough to put a red flag up? Well, I don't really recognise

what your other guest is saying in terms of what the Security Services

need in terms of powers. I think, you know, this bill has come,

through it's been scrutinised by three committees. It's been changed,

it's had all the attention that it gets going through Parliament and it

has been fed into by professionals and this is what they have asked

for, or required to keep us safe. I don't really think it is for

politicians and others to sort of make political points around civil

liberties. We all understand the points around civil liberties and

how important they are, but, you know, freedom isn't free. We have to

protect our way of life and if those we are going to ask to do that

require extra nous a digital age, which is becoming more complex, I

think we should give it to them. -- require extra powers. But Brian

Paddick's point was on the security servings he says, said they didn't

need to know all the web pages everybody has visited. OK, well, he

said, she said, I can't comment on the specifics of his conversations

in GCHQ. I know that intelligence and Security Services that I have

worked with in the past, you know, we need the tools at our disposal to

be able to do the job and one of those is surveillance, an electronic

surveillance of individuals, to try and identify these attack that is

are really really difficult to identify. Can I clarify this. If the

intelligence services get intelligence that somebody is a

suspected terrorists. We have no problem at all, from that moment

onwards, that person's communications, every website they

visited, that information being accessible. Would they need a

warrant for that? They would not need a warrant to be able to ask the

internet service provider to provide details of the last 12 months of

every web page. They don't need a warrant for under that these powers.

What we are saying if somebody is suspected from that moment on, keep

that information. But not every innocent member of the public in

this country. The other concern that I have, is, yes, there is all this

money going into the Security Service, but the budgets are being

cut for the police. So what we saw on Wednesday was this individual,

nowhere on the radar as far as the Security Services are concerned,

carrying out this attack. But he had been on the radar but didn't seem to

be worthwhile keeping him on it. Not currently on the radar. And there

are not sufficient armed police or community police officers who could

be working with communities around the country, getting the information

that the Security Services need, so they can target their resources more

accurately on the most dangerous people. That community - those

community policing officers are being cutback. There are

insufficient armed officers because the Metropolitan Police, for

example, has had ?1 billion cut from its budget in the last six years.

Let me put to that Jonny Mercer, Conservative MP. Total police

spending in England and Wales was 13.6 billion pounds in 2011, by 2015

it was 11.7. That's in real terms. So in cash terms, of course, much,

much bigger. You can all the sophisticated electronic equipment

in the world but nothing beats a local person coming up to the bobby

and saying -- I'm a bit worried about what is happening in number

24. Absolutely. Look the spend around counter-terrorism, the

visible part of policing that is so important in our communities, is as

important as it has ever been but the digital threat around technology

and so on, as your previous MP from Birmingham was saying - that is

xoencely growing all -- oxpoentiallye spanning all the time.

It is a team effort across government. Sure but you have cut it

in real terms. But it is across Government to try to counter the

threats we saw earlier this week. Not only the police, in other areas

as W it is at times like this we defeat this as a teenagers at

politicians, police, community providers. I don't think it is

really a time for cheap politic about an existential threat. Excuse

What is the cheap political point? The point coming from your, from the

other speaker is that the Government has cut this, that and the other.

They have made challenges decisions in a fiscal environment. But around

armed officers it is an operational policing decision. The Home

Secretary and Government doesn't stipulate how many armed officers

you have. We have a very challenging set of threats that is getting

greater all the time. I think the police is doing a good job and we

should get behind them. You don't think it is legitimate that at a

time when Westminster has just been under attack, to raise the matter

for public debate that the police budget has been cut by ?2 billion in

real terms. It is surely not a cheap political point. It is a perfectly

legitimate matter to raise. Yeah, the police budget that you have been

talking about has been cut, what about all the other spending into

Security Services and the growth around MI5 and MI6 and QCHF. These

are all the measures we bring into the counter-terrorism fight.

Paul Waugh has been listening, there is more money for the intelligence

services, and there will be more but in this current envainment cutting

police money will be more difficult. Don't forget he was Home Secretary

when the cats took place. Now maybe the idea that neighbourhood policing

has been cut, that message will be ahead of it louder. Of course, don't

forget, too, for the Prime Minister, she was behind this new

investigatory Powers act, that, at the same time, she's got someone in

her Cabinet, David Davis, who was a big civil libertarian and we didn't

see in her statement yesterday, as powerful as it was, was no

suggestion of extra powers, extra legislation, no repeat of Tony Blair

seven 712 point plan, she was very clear for not to make any promises

in terms of new powers. There was no policy changes, which was

interesting. She didn't go down that road falls of the government would

say these budgets have been cut. That, actually, crime has fallen,

the counterterrorist police have thwarted 13 attempts to attack our

nation, and the police are doing more with less. Yes, that's always

been their argument and also the ointment has been about the changing

nature of crime, the fact we are much more likely, instead of having

our house burgled and robbed on the street, it's defined people

accessing our bank accounts, so the very nature of crime is changed so

community policing is not as valid as it was before when they were

having to physically go to people's houses and interview them about

break-ins etc, so that has been one argument. It is interesting she

didn't say anything yesterday about extra powers and the new review of

terrorism was actually quite clear he thought not only did we have

enough powers but perhaps we had too many powers. It's interesting that

that narrative was coming out before this but I think the attack will

change that a game. As a person who was Home Secretary for six years

beforehand, she found herself in the unusual position, saying, wide and

you get powers when you are Home Secretary? It's interesting having a

Prime Minister who was Home Secretary covering these vital

issues coming to the fore even more after what happened there. Thank you

be joining us this morning. We believe that there. -- we will leave

it there. Yesterday, in the House of Commons,

the Prime Minister paid tribute to the police and the emergency

services for their response Theresa May's statement was followed

by a series of speeches by MPs. Here's just some of

their contributions. Tragically, as the House

will know, 48-year-old PC PC Palmer had devoted his life

to the service of his country. He had been a member

of the Parliamentary and Diplomatic Protection Command for 15

years and a soldier He was a husband and a father,

killed doing a job he loved. He was every inch a hero and his

actions will never be forgotten. We see the police and

security every day. They're our colleagues,

they're fellow workers, they're friends, they're neighbours

and as the Prime Minister said, when dangerous and violent

incidents take place, we all instinctively run away

from them, for our own safety, the police and emergency services

run towards them. We are grateful for the public

service yesterday, today and every day that they pull on their uniforms

to protect us all. No terrorist outrage

is representative of any faith, or of any faith community

and we recommit ourselves to strengthening the bonds

of tolerance and understanding. Those who attack us hate our

freedom, our peaceful democracy, our love of country,

our tolerance, our Now, as we work to unravel how this

unspeakable attack happened, will she agree with me that we must

not, either in our laws or by our actions, curtail these values,

indeed we should have more of them? This was an horrific crime and it

has cost lives and caused injuries but as an act of terror,

it has failed. It has failed because we are here

and we are going to go It's failed because,

despite the trauma that they witnessed outside their windows,

our staff are here and they are It failed because, as the Prime

Minister so rightly said, we are not going to allow this to be

used as a pretext for division, This democracy is strong and this

Parliament is robust. This was an horrific

crime but as an act With your indulgence, Sir,

I would like to turn for a moment to PC Keith Palmer,

who I first met 25 years ago as Gunner Keith Palmer

at Headquarters Battery, He was a strong, professional,

public servant... And it was a delight to meet him

here again only a few months A difficult time there for the

Conservative MP. There were many tributes to PC Palmer in the debate

and a recognition of the carnage that it happened on Westminster

Bridge where the attacker had driven along that bridge knowing people

down, much worse in the end than we thought it was when we first heard

about it and even last night, 75-year-old man died of his

injuries. So for both inside and outside the Houses of Parliament of

Westminster, this was a very, very difficult time for the capital city.

Caroline, one thing they may have changed, in recent years,

Westminster has become almost a term of derision, it has become, for many

who want to attack the political system here, the way Washington is a

term of derision for a lot of American politicians in the

heartlands. I would suggest, after seeing that and after what has

happened, more difficult to make it a term of derision now. Yes, I think

you are right. It changes the narrative around it, and there was

people looking down their noses and actually when you looked at what was

said in the chamber, the words of solidarity with PC Palmer who

basically gave his life to protect thousands of people who work in that

building, it's not just about the MPs and the privileged elite, there

are members of staff cleaners, who work in that building who do that

job day in, day out, knowing it's always going to be a focus of

attention for people that want to disrupt our way of life and inflict

harm on our democratic processes. We always talk about the Westminster

village and the bubble, how cut off we are from the rest of the country.

But the attacker, unwittingly, has also shown that this village has

many fine people in it who have risen to the occasion of what the

atrocities have happened. Very much so. The Foreign Office minister was

very directly involved, Toby Elmore. I had the dubious privilege of

having an office which looked over and seeing him try desperately to

save the peace man's life along with other paramedics and policemen. --

policeman. Maybe this is a tidal change now because is not just

Westminster but Westminster Bridge where it happened and to many, many

people see that as a national symbol of that view across the bridge of

Big Ben, why ceremony people go there, tourists, and that's why one

of those people who died yesterday where there and today we find out we

had a pensioner who has been named as having been killed in his own

city. Yes, from Streatham. Exactly. Westminster is all of us in the

sense it represents all of us, and maybe that is exactly why he made

the wrong move attacking it. Now, as we know, the Prime Minister

will next Wednesday formally inform the European Union of the UK's

intention to leave the EU. Ahead of this key moment

on the journey to Brexit, I've got I can't even say at! It has been a

And it's this: Which member of the EU makes the most cars?

By one measure it's Slovakia, which produces more vehicles

You did not see that coming! The population is not huge.

So do they see Brexit as an opportunity to rev

up their industry at the expense of the UK?

Adam's been to the Slovak capital Bratislava to find out.

A massive garage for a country that makes a lot of cars.

Peugeot, Citroen, they've got a factory here.

There's a few Kias around around here.

There's a Porsche Cayenne over there.

That's made in Slovakia as well and over there is a Land Rover

and in a couple of years they'll be manufactured in Slovakia too.

The three big car manufacturers based here produce more

Along with their suppliers, they account for around a quarter

of a million jobs and 13% of the country's national income.

The Economy Minister has lured them here with tax breaks and government

money and it sounds like more could be on the way.

Many companies want to remove from the UK to European countries

and we offer these companies the possibility to place

Obviously you're discussing with car companies moving

With companies based in the UK, they want to remove their businesses

But, because the UK is also a big market for Slovakia,

he wants the Brexit negotiations to produce a free trade

I support this agreement and I think it is good for business and good

for creating jobs for the both economies, for the European Union

economy and for the UK economy it will be a challenge,

He suggests something along the lines of a trade deal struck

between the EU and Canada, although he also says it would have

to include some form of freedom of movement.

When it comes to the Brexit negotiations, there are another 26

But it does give us an interesting idea what direction

And we've been joined by the chairman of the Commons

Business Select Committee, Iain Wright.

Welcome to the programme. In general terms, how big a risk is the country

like Slovenia, in chunks of our car industry moving there? On the +, the

British car industry is a real success story. We have a great

workforce, it's very productive and efficient and it's not easy to

replicate it. Very high-tech. Exactly, so the degree of innovation

going into our cars, it's a good success story but, having said that,

car manufacturers, multinationals, they want access to the widest

possible customer base and that will mean being part of the single market

and so if you own a car company and you are thinking where do I'd put my

latest investment? You could think this so much uncertainty about

Brexit, I think I will have my new model in wherever. Because then I

know I'm totally inside. There's no tariffs, barriers, and I can bring

labour in and out as well. Did they miss something when economic

minister Dave tax breaks and incentives to go there? I thought

the EU was meant to be a level playing field? I think other

countries use state aid rules for the national economy is better than

we do. It's a frustration. You mean we don't cheat like they do? Cheat

is a strong web that help your comparative strengths. It's a case

of having to protect our national economies, not in a protectionist

sense, but this is a fiercely competitive global race and it's how

do we protect our global manufacturing in Britain? As you

say, our car industry, after having been, I was an industrial

correspondence in the 70s, it was a joke in Europe, and is now a huge

success story. Some of our plants are the most efficient in the world.

You have been bitten what needs to be done to the car industry, what

the government needs to do to remain a success post Brexit. What have you

found? There are two things. The long-term view, you don't just start

a car manufacturing plant tomorrow. It takes time to be able to turn

things around and so having that long-term view as part of an

industrial strategy, which favoured areas of competitive strength, that,

in the short to medium term with regards to Brexit, we've got to

provide certainty as much as possible and replicate the nature of

the single market in order to provide confidence for those car

manufacturers. I heard him saying Slovenia would be happy with the

free trade deal for Great Britain along the lines of the Canadian EU

free trade deal. Would that be as good, if we are not members of the

single market, which we won't be, is a free trade deal as good as it gets

and would that be pretty good? It's better than no deal. The Prime

Minister said no deal is better than no deal. Than a bad deal. Sorry,

yes, that's true but that's a concern because of tariffs, the

rules which slapped 10% on car exports for us, that would make is

very uncompetitive. I have been saying Slovenia but Slovakia we are

talking about here. A deal was done with it Nissan cars

which seemed to keep Nissan happy but one of the problems is we don't

really know what that deal s if it was a deal in the sense of an

actually written down deal as opposed to ministers saying - don't

worry everything would be fine. Would it not be helpful if there was

more transparency and other car manufacturers can see what is on

offer from the British Government? I do think that's fair, Nissan in my

part of the world, and it is important for the north-east economy

but the likes of Toyota and Honda will be saying, if Nissan gets

something, what about us but it is not a done deal, Nissan have gone on

the record saying they are reevaluating their investment in the

light of what might happen with the Brexit negotiations. So this is

going to come to the fore, this is all the stuff we'll have to to get

across once Article 50 is industriered. That is he a right. It

seems like a long time coming we are finally at this point where the

negotiations will start finally and trade will be a very big aspect of

that. I can tell you now, we have Liam Fox writing for us in the

Sunday Express this week where hopefully he will answer some of the

ideas about what the processes are going to look at in terms of our

trade... I bet he doesn't. Do you think that's going to be pulled

then? I hope not. One of the interesting thing about cars, I have

a friend who works in t and he points out it is a low margin

industry and if there are tariffs it makes a difference and that's why

someone like Liam Fox has to sort out is a long-term or transitional

deal. The whole tariff business is a two-way stream, if they put tariffs

in our cars that makes us less competitive, although we have been

much less competitive with the fall in the pound. But we, I assume put

tariffs in their car, that may not be overall a sensible thing o to do.

That would mean people would be more inclined to buy a Jaguar than

Mercedes, more inclined to buy a car made here than in France, for

example. It is difficult to see what is in the wash in the end? I think

you demonstrate it is in all of our interests that we get a good deal.

We don't know either of these things. But having said, that the

likes of France and Spain may be saying - hang on, we could aFrank

these car manufacturing plants and provide employment that's currently

in the UK, on to the continent. So we have to be important. One final

thing on, that the Peugeot-Citroen take over the Vauxhall, the remnant

part of General Motors in Europe, the fact that the French Government

has a combhing in that, that must be a little bit worrying? Of course it

is. It is the year of the French presidential election, any candidate

will be saying - what can we offer you, what sort of sweet heart deal

can we do? There is a considerable undercapacity in European car plants

and so they could move production. So it is a concern and the British

Government does need to provide clarity and certainty on that. We

will keep across all of this as the Article 50 talks get under way and

Ian Wright I hope you come back and continue to brief us on this. Thank

you. The terrorist attack on Wednesday

has rightly commanded the attention of politicians,

the public and the media. But while politics-as-normal has

been suspended for 48 hours, politics this week has been

as lively as ever. Labour's deputy lead accused union

boss, Len McCluskey, of plotting a hard-left takeover

of the party. Sometimes spirits in

the Labour Party can run high. George Osborne was the subject

of an urgent question in the Commons When I heard that this urgent

question had been granted, I thought it was important to be

here, although unfortunately we've missed deadline

for the Evening Standard. At Prime Minister's Questions,

Theresa May and Jeremy Corbyn clashed on school funding

and grammars but the PM was defiant. Typical Labour, take the advantage

and pull up the ladder behind you. Two reports suggest millions

of people may have to work longer to qualify for a state pension -

possibly until the age of 70. And Martin McGuinness, the IRA

commander-turned peace maker, So things did go on as normal even

as we were focussing on the terrorist attack here at Westminster

this week. The Labour Party leadership - can I suggest that this

battle for the leadership of night night has become a proxy war for the

liedership of the Labour Party. -- of Unite. You have pro-Corbyn in

McCluskey and anti-Corbyn in the challenger I think that's what Tom

Watson was trying to do, in effect say - if you vote for Len McCluskey,

you vote for death of the Labour Party. Whereas if you vote for the

other candidate, you stop the hold that the har left have on T I think

there is this notion that they are going to fund Momentum candidates

rather than moderate Labour candidates and we have seen it going

on in Birmingham with the mayoral context up there. You can frame it

within that argument, I think. I don't get the - am I right in

thinking Mr McCluskey is still pretty much the favourite to be

re-elected? Yes, most people I talk to, it is not measured just by the

nominations that he gets but he is 80% ahead in terms of the

nominations but more importantly in terms of the impact on the Labour

Party, I was outside the Parliamentary Labour Party meeting

on Monday night, one of my duties I do every week on a Monday. You did a

great report. Have you got a tumbler up against the wall? A good mobile

phone. I I didn't need the tumbler because the shouts was so loud,

people shouting at Jeremy Corbyn. That's why he put out that video

trying to reassure people. There was' genuine anger about the

briefing going on over Tom Watson. That's why because there was a truce

for a while but it boiled over this week because of the Unite election.

If George Osborne had been in Parliament on Wednesday afternoon he

would have been part of the lock-out, he couldn't have got out,

only a mobile phone, battery running out adds many people found and the

city of which he is now editor of the biggest local newspaper, would

be producing its second edition, or a special edition because the city

was under attack. But he couldn't, as editor have done anything about

that at all. Is he going to survive as an MP and an editor? That's the

question lots and lots of MPs are asking and indeed virtually all the

bodies that oversee the sort of standards and conduct of MPs are

also looking into this as an issue. The idea that you would consider an

MP's job as being a full-time job, and you would really consider being

an editor of a newspaper, even a smaller regional newspaper... It is

a time-and-a-half job, let me tell you More than full time and that's

along with what, he has five or four other jobs on top of that. Don't

forget there was due to be a 1922 Committee meeting where he was going

to be hauled over the coals by some Tory MPs for this Standard job. As

it happened during the urgent question you saw there, a lot of

Tory MPs rallied around George Osborne, they didn't like it that

Labour was going on the attack so aggressively. So he had respite but

Caroline is right, a lot of Tory MPs are still upset. An influential

report came out, perhaps of a sign of things to come, the Cridlyn

report, the former Director-General of the CBI. All the headlines #3r

about, if you are 29, you have to work until you are 96 before you get

to retirement, quite rightly it got in the headlines but interesting

within it was to end the Tory flagship, actually Labour supported

the too, the triple lock on PEPses after 2020, that is going to rise,

it is a tough one for politicians, but they do need the money. They do,

and the likes of Ros Altman have been calling for the triple lock to

be ended for sometime. A couple of months ago she insisted it had been

on the table and had been discussed but it is also a kind of - it is one

of those issues, it is almost untouchable. It is the grey vote...

And they all vote Exactly. It is the centre-piece of what David Cameron,

particularly made as his kind of centre-piece, the protection of the

pension. But if you look at the economics, if you look at the

figures, and nobody is actually guaranteed it beyond 2020, it does

start to not make economic sense. Politician lbs pleased by that, it

gives them political cover, figures, ammo. But Labour is in a position

now to objecting to any cuts to this triple lock and we might have the

Tories who abeen done it. That would be a strange set of affairs. It

makes it moer difficult for the Tories, if Labour is going to hold

on to it. Article 50, triggered Wednesday, negotiations will begin

sometime thereafter. It's an historic moment, is it not It is and

what the Prime Minister said to the Cabinet this week. She said this is

an historic record. I suspect because of that, she is going to put

a lot of effort into the phraseology, the crafting, the

wording of this lemplt it is not going to be a two paragraph, you

know, bye-bye, it'll have real significance and she'll work on this

this record. An historic moment in our nation's history? Yes, it is

going to be an historic moment and also what is going to happen next in

terms of the union. That's the other question mark, what happens with

Scotland? They'll resume their talks about a second independence

referendum on Tuesday, so it'll have lots of ramifications in lots of

quarters. It will indeed. It gives us plenty to talk about.

Let's return to the terorrist attack in London and speak

to our political correspondent, Eleanor Garnier, who's outside

the gates to Parliament where Khalid Masood murdered PC

The gates are just right behind her. Eleanor, the saisant Met

Commissioner talked this morning about the chaining tone of security

outside Parliament. Is there any sign of that yet? Well there are

definitely more police officers wandering around Westminster but I

think that's happening across London and the rest of the country, too.

There is, of course going to be a review of security here at

Westminster and that's to be expected after an attack like this

One minister hog got caught up in the attack said in temples access to

-- one minister who got caught up in the attack said in terms of access

to Parliament things would needs to change and I think there are issues

about whether or not there are enough armed officers and military

on the state but the message has been clear from police chief, the

way the security set-up st allowed to design access of Parliament to

the heart of democracy, with security measures that are

proportionate and also not too intrusive as well. So, yes, there

are people who are questioning what is going on and maybe have some

concerns but MPs over the last day or so are saying they don't want

this area turned into some sort of for the rows with armed guards on

every single entrain exit. Does that mean, then, Eleanor as you stland

this morning, the guards on the gate, the Carriage Gate into the

yard where all the terrible action took place on Wednesday, are the

police there still unarmed, the ones on the gate. We know there are armed

ones behind them, further n the perimeter defence system, but are

they still unarmed in the gate? I have seen armed officers walking

past the gates here, not just at this entrance but down the other end

too, but more the visitors' entrance and the entrance that journalists

can use and MPs and peers. I was here for a couple of hours this

morning and I saw quite a few armed officers walking past Carriage Gate.

As you say there are officers on the inside as well but also officers hop

aren't armed as well. You were covering these events this week, I

see behind you, the traffic and tourists and some of them on the

green but, there on Parliament Square. It looks like we are getting

back to normal here now, is that fair? That's definitely fair,

Andrew. Remember, this attack happened not just two days ago, this

area I'm standing in was a crime scene 24 hours ago, there were

forensics crawling over the cobbles behind me. You almost wouldn't know

what had happened on Wednesday, were it not for flags flying at half-mast

and flowers that are now being laid in spots around wrems. I've walked

through the Palace and the police and the staff that you pass, I think

that eye contact, the smile is being held a second longer. Eleanor thank

you very much for everything this week.

The One O'Clock news is starting over on BBC One now.

I'll be back on Sunday with the Sunday Politics, do join me then.