05/07/2017 Daily Politics


05/07/2017

Andrew Neil and Jo Coburn look at calls for Grenfell Inquiry judge Sir Martin Moore-Bick to quit, with guests Steve Baker and Jon Ashworth. Plus coverage of PMQs.


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Transcript


LineFromTo

Morning, folks, welcome to the Daily Politics.

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The Grenfell Tower disaster looks set to loom large again today,

:00:42.:00:45.

as we reach the Prime Minister's own deadline for offering

:00:46.:00:47.

But are Labour MPs right to call for the head

:00:48.:00:51.

Theresa May has to umpire the argument in the Conservative

:00:52.:00:58.

Party over public sector pay, but does she have the authority

:00:59.:01:00.

Grenfell and austerity are both subjects likely to come up

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when Theresa May faces Jeremy Corbyn at Prime Minister's Questions,

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we'll have all the extended action live at noon.

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Yes, I wouldn't argue that that is strictly accurate, no doubt

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complimentary and it sounds like a car advert.

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We'll be looking at the Conservative MP who's become an unlikely

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All that in the next 90 minutes of public service broadcasting

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so good you won't even think about turning over

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Is Wimbledon on the other channel? I think so. Very well. Bye, bye.

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We're trusting you to make the right decision.

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And speaking of being second choice, we're joined today

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by Westminster's answer to Henman and Rusedski,

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minister Steve Baker, and shadow health secretary

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So PMQs is just half an hour away, and we're expecting the Prime

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Minister to be asked about the response to the Grenfell

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Today marks the deadline she gave for ensuring all those affected

:02:24.:02:27.

are found a new home, and officials say all survivors

:02:28.:02:29.

of the fire who want to be rehoused have been offered temporary

:02:30.:02:32.

accommodation, although many are still in hotels.

:02:33.:02:44.

The Government has also said it will send in a taskforce to take

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over parts of Kensington and Chelsea Council,

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which has been widely criticised for its response.

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There have also been calls at Westminster for the judge leading

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the inquiry into the fire, he's called Sir Martin

:02:54.:02:55.

Labour MP for Tottenham, David Lammy, said Sir Martin

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Moore-Bick was "a white, upper middle class man who I suspect

:03:00.:03:02.

has never visited a tower block housing estate" and should "never

:03:03.:03:04.

Yesterday Emma Dent Coad, the new Labour MP for Kensington,

:03:05.:03:19.

called the judge "a technocrat" who lacks "credibility" and said

:03:20.:03:21.

he should be replaced by "somebody who can understand human beings."

:03:22.:03:24.

Chris Williamson, Labour's shadow fire services minister

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said he had been shown, in previous court cases to "err

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on the side of the establishment rather than on the side of ordinary

:03:29.:03:31.

people" and should be replaced by "a more appropriate" judge.

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So what do you think? A technocrat, lacks credibility, somebody with a

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human face is needed. What say you? I would say that he should carry on

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with the inquiry. He should be allowed to get on with it. There are

:04:01.:04:04.

clearly concerns from people in the local area and I hope he can move

:04:05.:04:10.

quickly to allay their concerns, involve them. The residents' groups

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have made some suggestions about having a panel to work alongside

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him. I hope those suggestions can be taken on board. The key thing now is

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not to personalise it around him. The key thing is that the inquiry,

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that we get on with it and it is a wider inquiry, looking at all the

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issues. Local MPs, I understand why they would speak out in very

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passionate terms, given what has happened in the area that they

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represent. But I think the key thing now is we let him get on with it.

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Chris Williamson, the shadow fire minister is not a local MP, he is on

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the Labour front bench. What is it with some of your colleagues? Is

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this a class thing? Do they think a judge, wept to Cambridge,

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double-barrelled name, sort of accent that most High Court judges

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in this country have, do they think he just doesn't understand areas and

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the people of Grenfell Tower? I guess that's some of it. I'm from a

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working class background. I don't necessarily have a problem with him.

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The challenge for him is when he does Is inquiry is that he

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demonstrates he knows the concerns of the people of the area and when

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he comes up with proper, meaty conclusions but I think the key

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thing is to let him get on with it and not personalise it around him. I

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don't think that would do justice to anyone. The significance is not that

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although one of your shadow ministers has called for him to go,

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and the local MP, but Mr Corbyn isn't calling for his resignation?

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Jeremy is not. Jeremy quite rightly raised concerns and spoken on behalf

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of the residents and taken up some of their points about having an

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expert panel and wanting greater involvement and for the inquiry to

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be wide enough to look at the broader issues around social

:06:04.:06:06.

housing. You have to be careful not to make it so wide that it is 2025

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before it reports. Quite. You can do inquiries in different ways. You can

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have an initial report that looks at the precivic circumstances of the

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fire and a wider report that looks at the broader issues, which I think

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is the point that Jeremy has been making in recent days.

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It would seem that your front bench, you are almost as dysfunctional as

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the Tories with different views coming out from everywhere.

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Collective Cabinet and Shadow Cabinet collective be responsibility

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is a rare breed? I have read the Foreign Secretary saying one thing

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and the Environment Secretary. You are making my point. You lot are

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doing the same. If I may, I think this is far too important to be used

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as a political football. I welcome what Jonathan has said. I would

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agree with Jonathan that he should be able to get on with it. We are

:07:01.:07:07.

consulting the terms of reference of the inquiry and it is right that he

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should be allowed to get on. I want him to succeed and as quickly as

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possible. Meanwhile the Prime Minister's promise that all those

:07:19.:07:21.

affected should be rehoused has not been met in the spirit of what we

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thought the Prime Minister meant. Some have accepted some

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accommodation and many have been offered homes in towers, which could

:07:28.:07:30.

be frightening or didn't have enough rooms for their families. The Prime

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Minister has already apologised earlier for the response. It doesn't

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seem to be getting much better. Well to see the tower is to understand

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we've had a catastrophe of a kind we could never have foreseen and we

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know people have been through hell. It would be wrong to force them out

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of hotels and into temporary accommodation. I don't think anybody

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is suggesting that. We are suggesting they are offered an

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accommodation that given the terrible ordeal they have been

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through, They would feel comfortable N they would be able to have their

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families with them. Comfortable in. That is what we want to do. We don't

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want people to be forced to move twice when it is not what they want

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to do. There is new housing coming online, including the Barclay homes

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low rise that will become available. If people want to avoid going into

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temporary accommodation and going straight into a permanent home we

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want to work with them at their pace to put them in the right home. The

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money is vale and we're committed to do the right things as we accepted

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the initial response was not good enough. Your Government has put in a

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task force to take over housing, community relations, regeneration

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and various other things, all of which was an implicit criticism of

:08:51.:08:55.

how the council has handled Grenfell Tower. But it hasn't had the guts

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just to put in commissioners and take over from the council. We have

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recognised the initial response was not good enough but we need to

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correct the problems, recognising it is not likely any council could've

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coped with a disaster on this scale, which is why we made the

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announcements we did about civil disaster response in the Queen's

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Speech but we also do need to try and preserve democracy. I think it

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is right we should continue to have a council but given right help...

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Without much power where it matters. It is right they should be helped to

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cope with an extraordinary, devastating disaster of a category

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we never would have expected. Would you put in commissioners? I think we

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need to now. Politicians should not easily come to these decisions

:09:42.:09:44.

overriding local democracy but in these circumstances, the council and

:09:45.:09:47.

council leadership has failed and radical action like that is needed

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now. All right. Thank you both.

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Our Guest of the Day, Steve Baker, is now a minister

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at the Brexit department, and as a backbencher

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He's even been described as one of the five people who made

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Let's have a look at him speaking about the EU at an event in 2010.

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I think the European Union needs to be wholly torn down.

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The thing is, of course, that is actually impractical,

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unless the whole people of Europe can be persuaded to rise up and vote

:10:19.:10:22.

for politicians who are prepared, in a moderate and consistent

:10:23.:10:24.

and principled and gentle way, to say that the European Union

:10:25.:10:27.

project has merely succeeded in raising economic nationalism

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It was to defeat economic nationalism.

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It is therefore a failure in its own terms and if we wish

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to devolve power to the lowest possible level, make it accountable

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and move on into a free society, then it's clearly incompatible.

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Steve Baker that was you in 2010 saying you think the EU should be

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wholly torn down. Do you still think that? What I said in that speech, as

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you heard, that it was a matter for the electors of Europe. It is a

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matter for the electors of Europe. A lot of time have passed in seven

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years and many things have happened. One of the things we have seen which

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I'm grateful for is the electors of Europe have rejected the nationalist

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politicians who are Europe sceptics on the contin and the I'm glad

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they've. They've chosen to solve the problems by further incompetent

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gracing, for example by electing President Macron. Our duty now is to

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negotiate in good faith in our mutual interests to help the

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European Union succeed and have a deep and special partnership in our

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interests. Do you still think the EU should be torn down? What I think we

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need is the European Union to succeed in the interests of all of

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its people. What I said in that speech was I wanted free trade,

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peace, dispersed political power and democracy. I don't think those

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watching this programme will think they are controversial demands. But

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thousand do I they can't happen with the EU as it is, you also said it

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was an obstacle to world peace and incompatible with a free society N

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what Wasilewski or is it an obstacle to world peace? The point I was

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making there is when you recognise that economic nationalism causes

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conflict, for me it is a bad idea to raise that nationalism to a

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continental scale of the the point is we are where we are, the European

:12:30.:12:36.

Union needs to change, Jean-Claude Juncker has said it is an

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exsitential crisis. He has recently - I think today it was reported - he

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has told the European Parliament it is ridiculous and threatened to

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boycott it. He said that because no-one turned up to hear him speak

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in the European Union Parliament. He was with the Maltese President and

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they are holding the presidency. If you think the EU is an obstacle to

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world peace, were you saying countries like France and Germany

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were object if obstacle to world peace? Well I was saying that they

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have to... You want it to collapse. It is not in the interests of half a

:13:15.:13:19.

billion people who live in the European Union. We need to ensure

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that the mistakes which undoubtedly have been made, with, for example,

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the eurozone, have the opportunity to be corrected, so that all of us

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who share common values in Europe are able it go forward in prosperity

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together. You have tallen into line with what Theresa May has said, she

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wants the EU to be strong and successful and David Davis your boss

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is determined to build a strong and special partnership between

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ourselves and our European Allies, you are now of course a minister and

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agree. Yes, I do. Seven years sore a long time in politics. Well, you

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could transform the EU in seven years if you thought it was an

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obstacle to world peace and it is no longer is, it is a miraculous turn

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around. I have a concern that it causes conflict. I want the European

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Union to be more Liberal, have more power dispersed under democratic

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control to reform, in other words, happily people agree with me because

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you will know that this is a white paper in Europe on European reform

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and people will look at to how it should change and return to nation

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states. I'm sure they are listening and people might say that

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embarrassing that those comments might have been, take your point it

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was seven years ago but could it risk the ability to secure good

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Brexit terms when you have made the comments about nation states as part

:14:46.:14:49.

of the EU? Not at all. I'm fully committed to the position the

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Government has set out to deliver a successful relationship which we

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believe we can achieve and I'm looking forward to doing it in the

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interests of not only the UK. But Europe. And you must be pleased that

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that Emmanuel Macron think it is can be rejuvenated, and anp opportunity

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to be liberated without Britain, to go ahead without the veto constantly

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by the UK. It is an extremely good point and one of the reasons why we

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needed to come out. We were an impediment to them doing what is

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necessary to rescue the economy of the eurozone. I repeat what I said -

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I want free trade, peace, prosperity, dispersed power. We all

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want those. I'm delightful to discover they are not controversial

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comments. We want it make sure the European Union has the best possible

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chance of succeeding for the people within it. We are where we are and

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that will mean a degree of fiscal centralisation to make it work.

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Dominic Cummings said that he thought that the Brexit vote could

:15:56.:16:00.

have been an error? We have not always agreed and I do not agree on

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this occasion. The debate within the Conservative

:16:02.:16:02.

Party over austerity and public sector pay continues,

:16:03.:16:05.

we might well hear more about it at And now former Prime Minister,

:16:06.:16:07.

David Cameron, has weighed in, saying giving up on sound

:16:08.:16:12.

finances is "selfish". So who has said what on this tricky

:16:13.:16:20.

question for the Government? JoCo has the Wimbledon-themed

:16:21.:16:23.

details. I haven't got the racket,

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unfortunately! Yes, the Prime Minister has had

:16:29.:16:31.

a tough job umpiring her party But perhaps she served up the idea

:16:32.:16:34.

of a change of policy at the Queen's speech,

:16:35.:16:38.

when she said the Government would "reflect on the message voters

:16:39.:16:40.

sent" at the election. Her Chancellor Philip Hammond agreed

:16:41.:16:43.

with her saying we are "not deaf" and he could see that the public

:16:44.:16:45.

want an end to the "long Mrs May has then seen

:16:46.:16:49.

a prolonged rally between The Foreign Secretary,

:16:50.:16:53.

Boris Johnson, "strongly believes" that a public sector pay rise can be

:16:54.:16:59.

done in a "responsible way" and The Environment Secretary,

:17:00.:17:02.

Michael Gove, said the Government has "got to listen" to the pay

:17:03.:17:08.

review bodies, and that he did not believe that taxes would have

:17:09.:17:14.

to be increased to pay It's thought that Education

:17:15.:17:17.

Secretary, Justine Greening, and Health Secretary,

:17:18.:17:22.

Jeremy Hunt, have also appealed for more money

:17:23.:17:24.

for teachers and health workers. But there have been some

:17:25.:17:26.

return serves from those Greg Hands, International Trade

:17:27.:17:30.

Minister, said, "There's no change We must live within our means

:17:31.:17:34.

and that is the right thing to do." On Tuesday evening the Chancellor

:17:35.:17:39.

said the Government And keen tennis player

:17:40.:17:41.

and former PM, David Cameron, said yesterday that "giving up

:17:42.:17:49.

on sound finances isn't being generous, it's being selfish,

:17:50.:17:53.

spending money today That's as clear as mud! So, Steve

:17:54.:18:09.

Baker, which of these positions most accurately described the government

:18:10.:18:12.

position on public sector pay? You strongly believe our rights can be

:18:13.:18:17.

given in a responsible way, Boris Johnson, that's something you could

:18:18.:18:20.

have to consider, Michael Fallon, too soon to let borrowing up, David

:18:21.:18:26.

Cameron, it would be a mistake to end the pay cap, Ken Clarke, which

:18:27.:18:31.

is it? The correct position is that the pay review bodies will make

:18:32.:18:36.

their report and be considered. Bearing in mind the balance between

:18:37.:18:39.

the desire to give people a fair pay rise and the need to make sure we

:18:40.:18:42.

continue to have a sound economy. It's not by accident that we have

:18:43.:18:47.

record employment, the economy is growing and we have been recovering

:18:48.:18:53.

from the economic calamity that happened during the crash. Do you

:18:54.:19:00.

believe that arise could be given in a responsible way, as per Boris

:19:01.:19:06.

Johnson? We could see that people have their quality of life rising

:19:07.:19:09.

without it affecting the economy. The pay review bodies... They

:19:10.:19:17.

operate within the guidelines of the government, so they will be

:19:18.:19:20.

influenced by the framework within which they deliberate. Yes, but we

:19:21.:19:24.

need to give them an opportunity to report and consider it, rather than

:19:25.:19:28.

engaging in signalling now. So if the government pay bodies come out

:19:29.:19:33.

and say, we don't think you should take the cap off, the government

:19:34.:19:37.

would go along with it? I don't think I should speculate on what

:19:38.:19:40.

they might say and how people might react. It's a camouflage, isn't it?

:19:41.:19:44.

It's not up to the pay bodies in the end, it up to the government. And

:19:45.:19:49.

there are four different opinions at the moment in the government. The

:19:50.:19:53.

reality is as you well know, we take collective decisions and there will

:19:54.:19:56.

be a discussion within cabinet, some of which has been in topic, and I

:19:57.:20:04.

think it should return to private collective Cabinet decision-making.

:20:05.:20:07.

I want the Cabinet to come to a decision which is responsible and

:20:08.:20:10.

which balances the need for pay rises with the overall need to

:20:11.:20:14.

ensure our economy keeps performing and keeps people in work. So how

:20:15.:20:19.

could you give recent pay rise in the public sector, above the cap,

:20:20.:20:26.

without adding to the deficit? We need economic growth, that's why...

:20:27.:20:32.

It slowing down. So that's why we need to make sure we give businesses

:20:33.:20:35.

the confidence to understand that we are certain where we're going with

:20:36.:20:39.

our Brexit negotiations... The election was a great help with that.

:20:40.:20:44.

That result was disappointing for all of us but we need to continue

:20:45.:20:49.

down the path to deliver the deep and special partnership which will

:20:50.:20:52.

lead to economic growth for us and the economic union and give us the

:20:53.:20:56.

opportunity to pivot outwards to the rest of the world where 90% of the

:20:57.:21:01.

growth will come from by 2020. I think it's important we have a

:21:02.:21:05.

settled position and trajectory. I'm trying to find out what that

:21:06.:21:12.

position might be. Finally, before I come to Jonathan Ashworth, it's not

:21:13.:21:16.

really your decision now, it's a sign of the position the government

:21:17.:21:19.

is in. There are 40 Tory backbenchers who think that in some

:21:20.:21:23.

way, the cap has had its day. And given that you haven't got a

:21:24.:21:28.

majority, the cap has had its day, that's the reality, isn't it?

:21:29.:21:30.

Conservatives are defined by our commitment to a sound economy in the

:21:31.:21:34.

public interest. That's one of the central tenets of being a

:21:35.:21:38.

Conservative. I think conservative MPs will listen to the argument as

:21:39.:21:42.

they are advanced and prioritise a successful economy in the long term

:21:43.:21:46.

because there is no kindness in adopting policies which wrecked

:21:47.:21:51.

people's prospect of employment. Your manifesto talked about 4

:21:52.:21:56.

billion for public sector workers, but that's nowhere near enough. If

:21:57.:22:01.

public sector pay merely kept pace with private sector pay in the next

:22:02.:22:05.

two or three years, and private sector pay is not exactly booming,

:22:06.:22:09.

if it merely kept pace with that, you would need a lot more than 4

:22:10.:22:13.

billion according to the ISS. Where would the money come from? --

:22:14.:22:20.

according to the eye S S. As I understand from the IFS, the way

:22:21.:22:26.

they did their calculation is different, they are not taking into

:22:27.:22:29.

account the national insurance contributions. If you can deal with

:22:30.:22:33.

this public sector pay issue, and that knocks into the wider workforce

:22:34.:22:38.

issues in the NHS, you should be able to bring the agency bill down.

:22:39.:22:45.

I heard you at the weekend making this point, the government has saved

:22:46.:22:49.

600 million on agency fees, it's put a cap on it, that is factored in. We

:22:50.:22:55.

spent 3.7 billion on agency fees, that's not going to change overnight

:22:56.:22:59.

even with a pay rise, given the nursing shortage. You will continue

:23:00.:23:04.

to need to pay to .5 billion in agency fees for the foreseeable

:23:05.:23:08.

future. You need to find 9 billion by 20 one, 20 two. That's for the

:23:09.:23:14.

kind of pay rise in the public sector you are talking about. Where

:23:15.:23:19.

does it come from? Al calculation is art different -- our calculation is

:23:20.:23:23.

different from the IFS. We are saying that the government does not

:23:24.:23:30.

need to go forward with the corporation tax changes. That is 4

:23:31.:23:35.

billion, you need 9 billion. We can test the figure on that. We seek the

:23:36.:23:39.

government can find it by not going ahead with tax changes. What they

:23:40.:23:44.

mustn't do, which is what I suspect might happen, is given the chaos

:23:45.:23:47.

we've got in government, I worry if the government will get rid of the

:23:48.:23:51.

cap but then say to the NHS, you have to find this extra money from

:23:52.:23:55.

the existing budget and that will put huge budget pressure on the

:23:56.:24:01.

wider NHS. What is more important, cabin corporation tax -- cutting

:24:02.:24:07.

corporation tax or giving a pay rise the public sector workers? Both,

:24:08.:24:11.

because cutting corporation tax will increase revenues. But that could be

:24:12.:24:15.

because we are in the seventh year of a recovery and companies have

:24:16.:24:18.

been making more profit. We don't know that it is directly result of

:24:19.:24:23.

cutting corporation tax, you could have got more revenue in if you had

:24:24.:24:29.

not cut it to 19%. Just don't know. It's certainly a matter of dispute

:24:30.:24:33.

amongst economists but the fact is that we have cut corporation tax and

:24:34.:24:36.

revenues have gone up and that is the sort of effect we would go to

:24:37.:24:41.

expect. My point is, at this stage in the business cycle, it could have

:24:42.:24:44.

been at anyway. It's a matter for debate amongst economists. You

:24:45.:24:49.

cannot be sure if you cut it by more, it will continue to generate

:24:50.:24:53.

revenue. We can be sure that if we raise corporation tax, the effect

:24:54.:24:57.

will be felt by Italy's firms, consumers and it will harm

:24:58.:25:01.

economies. We need a shrug it will be felt by employees of firms. There

:25:02.:25:09.

is a lot to pick up there but we need to move on.

:25:10.:25:11.

Jeremy Hunt wasn't having his best day at the office yesterday.

:25:12.:25:13.

First the Health Secretary appeared close to the bottom

:25:14.:25:16.

of the Conservative Home league table showing the popularity

:25:17.:25:18.

of cabinet ministers among party members,

:25:19.:25:21.

although he was still better liked than the Chancellor

:25:22.:25:26.

He then became the latest victim of the snappers of Downing Street,

:25:27.:25:30.

when he was photographed holding a note

:25:31.:25:32.

which read read "hard Brexit means people fleeing the UK".

:25:33.:25:34.

He later said it referred to a potential criticism

:25:35.:25:38.

that he was expecting from opposition MPs in the Commons.

:25:39.:25:41.

But we thought there might be more to it than that,

:25:42.:25:44.

and when we asked the Daily Politics boffins to have a closer look,

:25:45.:25:47.

Yes, it was a plea from Mr Hunt for what else

:25:48.:25:53.

Well, I'm sorry Jeremy, it probably would put you up

:25:54.:26:04.

there in the popularity stakes with David Davis

:26:05.:26:08.

or Ruth Davidson, but the rules for cabinet ministers are the same

:26:09.:26:12.

You'll need to enter our guess the year competition,

:26:13.:26:19.

MUSIC: Baker Street by Gerry Rafferty.

:26:20.:26:31.

The man stabbed him in the thigh with an umbrella and ran away.

:26:32.:26:43.

As far as I remember, it went like this.

:26:44.:26:46.

# I lost my heart to a starship Trooper

:26:47.:26:55.

The official advice to Britain's housewives was don't panic.

:26:56.:27:08.

# Don't you know I'll be your substitute #

:27:09.:27:12.

# Mr Blue Sky, please tell us why you had to hide away for so long #

:27:13.:27:18.

What do you think about the broadcasting of Parliament?

:27:19.:27:21.

I think it'll give us a chance to see our

:27:22.:27:24.

own members actually speaking up for us.

:27:25.:27:27.

To be in with a chance of winning a Daily Politics mug,

:27:28.:27:49.

send your answer to our special quiz email address,

:27:50.:27:51.

Entries must arrive by 12.30 today, and you can see the full terms

:27:52.:27:57.

and conditions for Guess The Year on our website.

:27:58.:28:09.

There's going to be a statement on public sector pay coming up after

:28:10.:28:18.

Prime Minister's Questions, from Liz Truss, the Chief Secretary of the

:28:19.:28:21.

Treasury. She will make the statement after PMQs. We do not know

:28:22.:28:26.

how long it will last but hopefully we will get it in before supper to

:28:27.:28:32.

night. We like to look at Big Ben, it is glorious summer stay in London

:28:33.:28:38.

town. Primus 's questions in a few -- prime ministers questions in a

:28:39.:28:44.

few minutes. We're expecting a kind of statement by the Prime Minister

:28:45.:28:52.

on rental tower? -- Grenfell Tower? Yes, she has given a lot of updates

:28:53.:28:57.

at the start of prime ministers questions and I imagine she will do

:28:58.:29:02.

that. We have seen this morning how Kensington Council has had a task

:29:03.:29:05.

force sent in on top of other individuals to help them deal with

:29:06.:29:09.

the aftermath of the tragedy, not exactly taking over the council but

:29:10.:29:13.

to help them come to use that phrase, with their housing problems,

:29:14.:29:16.

dealing with those displaced by the fire and the things that surround

:29:17.:29:19.

that. So the government and other local councils have piled in to help

:29:20.:29:24.

out Kensington. I guess people watching will say, why wasn't that

:29:25.:29:30.

done the next day? Why wasn't that done, not for you to answer, but

:29:31.:29:35.

people will think this was such a national tragedy, so visible as

:29:36.:29:38.

well, seeing into the public consciousness, that you would just

:29:39.:29:42.

drop everything and get the resources in to help. A lot of those

:29:43.:29:46.

people are on the ground in Kensington, trying to get together

:29:47.:29:50.

some sort of crisis response after the fire with no help from the local

:29:51.:29:54.

authority. When I was there briefly, people complained about that and

:29:55.:29:58.

since then we've had the Prime Minister talking about the failures

:29:59.:30:01.

on the part of the state, Sajid Javid, the communities minister,

:30:02.:30:05.

saying they had been let down by public policy over decades. There is

:30:06.:30:10.

no shortage of contrition. What do we expect Mr Corbyn to go on? He has

:30:11.:30:17.

rich pickings. He does, but we will see to the target, one of them is

:30:18.:30:23.

Grenfell which transformed itself very quickly into a political

:30:24.:30:27.

argument after the tragedy and then into a party political argument, and

:30:28.:30:34.

Jeremy Corbyn's argument was to blame it on austerity and lay the

:30:35.:30:38.

blame on the Conservative administration. We saw Theresa May

:30:39.:30:44.

pushback on that. Public pay, Theresa May's response will be

:30:45.:30:49.

interesting on that, interesting, in quotes, I suggest. I would suggest a

:30:50.:30:55.

reiteration of Philip Hammond 's line. Maybe Philip Hammond without

:30:56.:31:01.

his fireworks. You sending our audience to sleep? Philip Hammond

:31:02.:31:06.

without the fireworks! We have not had the Prime Minister herself say

:31:07.:31:09.

very much about public sector pay, if she has to say something, I'm

:31:10.:31:13.

sure she will come it will underline her weakness. She is being buffeted

:31:14.:31:18.

around by the pressures inside the Tory party in the country as a

:31:19.:31:23.

whole, and from the Labour opposition. This whole situation

:31:24.:31:26.

flows not just from weakness but political impotence in number ten.

:31:27.:31:33.

The leadership in the government has gone missing. We have seen

:31:34.:31:37.

government ministers ploughing their own furrows at will with no

:31:38.:31:42.

semblance with what we used to consider cabinet discipline. That

:31:43.:31:44.

has been interesting. We don't know how it shakes out, they haven't yet

:31:45.:31:49.

pronounced the public sector pay cap dead but it is a dead policy

:31:50.:31:53.

walking. It seems to be perfectly clear from where I'm sitting that it

:31:54.:31:57.

would be politically impossible to carry on with this policy, even

:31:58.:31:59.

though they might need to do that. Last week saw the 80th anniversary

:32:00.:32:21.

of the 999 service. I know members will want it join plea paying

:32:22.:32:26.

tribute to the men and women who work tirelessly saving lives, day-in

:32:27.:32:31.

and day-out. Mr Speaker, this morning I had meetings with

:32:32.:32:34.

ministerial colleagues and others n addition to my duties in this House,

:32:35.:32:38.

I shall have further such meetings later. Later this week I will attend

:32:39.:32:44.

a meeting of the G20 where I'll discuss the global economy,

:32:45.:32:46.

counter-terrorism and sustainable development with my fellow leaders.

:32:47.:32:49.

THE SPEAKER: Hannah Bardell. Thank you. Her face smashed with an iPad.

:32:50.:32:56.

Her body beaten and forced to abort a baby girl. This is only some of

:32:57.:33:01.

the domestic abuse my constituent, Lola has faced by her estranged

:33:02.:33:07.

husband because she has refused the genital mutilation of her daughter.

:33:08.:33:11.

She's ledgicated, has moot and had a good job with RBS until the Home

:33:12.:33:15.

Office revoked her right to work. I have been writing to the Home Office

:33:16.:33:23.

since March and got nowhere. So will the Prime Minister now intervene to

:33:24.:33:28.

stop this family being deported and the three-year-old girl being

:33:29.:33:30.

subject to female genital mutilation?

:33:31.:33:32.

I say to the honourable lady that the Home Secretary has obviously

:33:33.:33:37.

heard the case she set out here today. The issue of female genital

:33:38.:33:42.

mutilation is one on which I think we are all agreed across this whole

:33:43.:33:47.

House. It is an abhorrent activity T should not be taking place. Great

:33:48.:33:51.

efforts have been made over recent years, in terms of strengthening the

:33:52.:33:56.

law on it but also on getting information out about this issue and

:33:57.:34:02.

also trying to support people in these communities where there is a

:34:03.:34:06.

practice of FGM. The message has to go out from this House today - we

:34:07.:34:13.

will not accept FGM in this country. THE SPEAKER: James Morris. Thank

:34:14.:34:17.

you, Mr Speaker. Until the last few days, Iraqi security forces assisted

:34:18.:34:21.

by coalition air strikes have made significant progress in eradicating

:34:22.:34:24.

Isil fighters from Mosul. This is a significant step forward in the

:34:25.:34:27.

military conflict against Isil in Iraq. But would the Prime Minister

:34:28.:34:31.

agree with me that the UK and the United States and abroad

:34:32.:34:35.

international alliance needs to work with the Iraqi Government to ensure

:34:36.:34:38.

reconstruction in places like Mosul, as well as working with the Iraqi

:34:39.:34:43.

Government to make sure that it is sufficiently strong to withstand the

:34:44.:34:50.

poisonous ideology of the Isil as we seek to defeat it. My honourable

:34:51.:34:56.

friend is right. In order to keep the streets of Britain safe we must

:34:57.:35:03.

continue to I a tack Isil in Iraq and Syria. The RAF has conducted

:35:04.:35:06.

over 1,400 strikes. There are over 500 British soldiers on the ground,

:35:07.:35:12.

providing further assistance but my honourable friend makes the

:35:13.:35:16.

important point that it is not just about the military action that takes

:35:17.:35:22.

place, it is about how we ensure there is sustainable reconstruction

:35:23.:35:24.

and rebuilding afterwards. Our troops have helped train 55,000

:35:25.:35:27.

Iraqi security force personnel. We are providing over 169.5 million

:35:28.:35:31.

pounds in humanitarian aid and a further ?30 million to help Iraq

:35:32.:35:35.

stabilise these liberated areas. And together we must also work, not just

:35:36.:35:39.

in Iraq but internationally, to ensure that the hateful ideology of

:35:40.:35:44.

extremism is not able to poison the minds of people. THE SPEAKER: Jeremy

:35:45.:35:52.

Corbyn? Thank you, Mr Speaker. Can I start by wishing everyone a happy

:35:53.:35:56.

Pride month and especially those taking part in the Pride maefrp this

:35:57.:36:02.

Saturday. We should be aware - the survey taken by Pride in London

:36:03.:36:06.

found half of LBGT people in London had experienced hate crime in the

:36:07.:36:11.

past 12 months. I join the Prime Minister in wishing the NHS a very

:36:12.:36:17.

happy birthday. I was hoping she was going to say a bit more about NHS

:36:18.:36:21.

staff and their pay during birthday greetings, because after a week of

:36:22.:36:26.

flip flopping and floundering, we thought we got some clarity from

:36:27.:36:30.

Downing Street at last. On Monday the announcement was that the public

:36:31.:36:35.

sector pay cap at 1% remains and a rare moment of agreement between

:36:36.:36:38.

number 10 and 11 was seen but yesterday we had news that

:36:39.:36:42.

firefighters are going to be offered 2% this year and 3% next year. So,

:36:43.:36:47.

account Prime Minister confirm whether the public sector pay cap

:36:48.:36:50.

will remain for all other public servants until 2020? May I join The

:36:51.:36:55.

Right Honourable gentlemen in wishing everybody who is going to

:36:56.:36:59.

take part in Pride London on Saturday an excellent day. I'm sure

:37:00.:37:06.

it will be a very good occasion as it always has been. Can I also say

:37:07.:37:12.

that I and all members of this House value the work that is done,

:37:13.:37:17.

incredibly important work done by our public sector

:37:18.:37:26.

JEERS And I understand the concerns about

:37:27.:37:33.

the pay. But for the information of the House perhaps I can set out the

:37:34.:37:40.

current position. We have had three pay review bodies in the public

:37:41.:37:44.

sector reporting in March. That covered doctors and dentists, NHS

:37:45.:37:46.

staff, including nurses and the Armed Forces and the Government

:37:47.:37:49.

accepted the recommendations in all three of those cases. The

:37:50.:37:53.

firefighters award is not a matter that is determined by Government, it

:37:54.:37:57.

is determined by the employers and it is not subject to a pay review

:37:58.:38:03.

body. There are outstanding pay review body reports. Those cover

:38:04.:38:06.

teachers, prison officers, police officers and senior salaries and the

:38:07.:38:10.

Government will consider those reports very carefully and we'll

:38:11.:38:15.

respond to them. But while we do that, we will always recognise the

:38:16.:38:21.

need to ensure that we take those decisions, against the need to live

:38:22.:38:25.

within our means. The right honourable gentleman and I both

:38:26.:38:28.

value public sector workers and our public services. The difference is,

:38:29.:38:38.

I know we have to pay for them. Mr Speaker, the public sector pay cap

:38:39.:38:43.

causes real shortages in nursing and teaching and many other professions,

:38:44.:38:47.

as well as real hardship. I had a letter last week from a teacher

:38:48.:38:52.

called David. It's all right, he is a teacher, he is doing a good job,

:38:53.:38:59.

all right. Inhe says, and I quote, "I've been teaching for ten years. I

:39:00.:39:05.

have seen my workload increase. I have seen more people leave the

:39:06.:39:10.

profession than start and no form of pay increase in seven years. The

:39:11.:39:14.

only thing holding the education system together is the dedication 20

:39:15.:39:18.

struggle on for their students and staff." And he says, "This

:39:19.:39:22.

dedication is starting to run out." So what we are doing, by this pay

:39:23.:39:30.

cap, I say to the Prime Minister, is recklessly exploiting the goodwill

:39:31.:39:32.

of public servants, like David. They need a pay rise. The Leader of the

:39:33.:39:41.

Opposition refers to the numbers of nurses and teachers we have working

:39:42.:39:45.

in the public sector. Of course we now have more nurses in our

:39:46.:39:49.

hospitals than we had in 2010. More teachers in our schools. But let me

:39:50.:39:52.

remind the right honourable gentleman of why it has been

:39:53.:39:56.

necessary for us to exercise restraint in public spending,

:39:57.:40:01.

including capping public sector pay? It's because we inherited the

:40:02.:40:10.

biggest deficit in our history... Shouts and jeers SHOUTS

:40:11.:40:23.

THE SPEAKER: Order. I noticed earlier Mr Mcmood you seem to be in

:40:24.:40:31.

a hyper condition today. I recommend you take a soothing medicamen, you

:40:32.:40:34.

will probably feel better. We've acted to bring the deficit down. It

:40:35.:40:39.

is now down by three-quarters. At the same time, we have seen the

:40:40.:40:44.

economy grow and we've seen recordlevels of people in

:40:45.:40:48.

employment. Our policy on public sector pay has always recognised

:40:49.:40:53.

that we need to balance the need to be fair to public sector workers, to

:40:54.:40:59.

protect... To protect jobs in the public sector and to be fair to

:41:00.:41:07.

those who pay for it. That is the balance we need to strike and we

:41:08.:41:11.

continue to assess that balance. We've had seven years of tax cuts

:41:12.:41:16.

for the richest and tax breaks for the biggest corporations. And last

:41:17.:41:25.

year, Mr Speaker, there was a net loss of 1,700 nurses and midwives to

:41:26.:41:32.

the NHS, and in the first two months of this year alone, 3,264 have left

:41:33.:41:38.

the profession altogether. Not a great birthday present for the NHS,

:41:39.:41:43.

is it? Last week the Chancellor said "We all value our public services

:41:44.:41:48.

and the people who provide them to us." And went on to laud his own

:41:49.:41:55.

economic record by saying #wed a fundamentally robust economy. Well,

:41:56.:41:58.

the Prime Minister found ?1 billion to keep her own job, why can't she

:41:59.:42:06.

find the same amount of money to keep nurses and teachers in their

:42:07.:42:11.

jobs, who afterall, serve all of us? The right honourable gentleman talks

:42:12.:42:15.

about the number of nurses. In fact I think some of those figures he was

:42:16.:42:21.

talking about was the number of nurses who are registered in the

:42:22.:42:26.

United Kingdom. There are about 600,000 nurses registered in the UK.

:42:27.:42:32.

About half of them, 300,000 work in the NHS in England. And contrary to

:42:33.:42:38.

what he says, we have 13,000 more nurses working in the NHS today than

:42:39.:42:44.

compared to 20 o 10. SHOUTS But ginned stand that it has been

:42:45.:42:48.

hard for people who have been working hard and making sacrifices,

:42:49.:42:53.

over the years, as we have been dealing with Labour's mismanagement

:42:54.:43:03.

of the economy. But let me just... Let me remind the right honourable

:43:04.:43:07.

gentleman of what happens when you don't deal with the deficit? It's

:43:08.:43:13.

not a theoretical issue, let's look at those countries that fail to deal

:43:14.:43:18.

with it? In Greece, where they haven't dealt with the deficit...

:43:19.:43:28.

Yes... SHOUTS AND JEERS What did we see?

:43:29.:43:34.

Spending on the health service cut by 36%. Thatp doesn't help nurses or

:43:35.:43:41.

patients. I hope the Prime Minister's proud of her record of

:43:42.:43:46.

controlling public sector pay to the extent that hard-working nurses have

:43:47.:43:51.

to access food banks in order to survive. And the frozen wages of

:43:52.:44:01.

teaching assistants, par meddies and council workers. But, Mr Speaker, it

:44:02.:44:05.

not -- paramedics. But across the economy wages are

:44:06.:44:10.

rising by 2.1% while inflation is nearly 3%. 6 million workers already

:44:11.:44:17.

earn less than the living wage. What does the Prime Minister think that

:44:18.:44:22.

tells us about seven years of a Conservative Government, and what

:44:23.:44:25.

it's done to the living standards of those people on whom we all rely to

:44:26.:44:30.

get our public services, our health services, delivered to us? I'll tell

:44:31.:44:35.

the right honourable gentleman what has happened over the last seven

:44:36.:44:38.

years, we see record numbers of people in employment. Nearly 3

:44:39.:44:48.

million more people in work. We have seen the introduction of the

:44:49.:44:54.

national living wage - never done by Labour. Done by a Conservative

:44:55.:45:02.

Government. And we've seen 4 million people taken out of paying income

:45:03.:45:08.

tax altogether. And a cut in income tax and a change in the personal

:45:09.:45:14.

allowance which is the equivalent of ?1,000 to basic rate tax payers,

:45:15.:45:18.

including nurses. That's the record of good management of the economy.

:45:19.:45:20.

You only get it with a Conservative. Mr Speaker. Mr Speaker, the Prime

:45:21.:45:36.

Minister simply doesn't get it. SHOUTS AND JEERING.

:45:37.:45:42.

There is, Mr Speaker,... We've got plenty of time, I'm quite happy to

:45:43.:45:55.

go for a lot of time. People should try to calm themselves and give a

:45:56.:45:59.

moments thought as to whether they'd like to be viewed by their

:46:00.:46:03.

constituents shrieking their heads off, it's very down-market. Mr

:46:04.:46:12.

Speaker, there is a low pay at the panic in this country. And it has a

:46:13.:46:17.

terrible -- P epidemic in this country and it has a terrible effect

:46:18.:46:23.

on young people. Those in their 20s will earn less than a generation

:46:24.:46:26.

don't before them. The first generation to be worse off than the

:46:27.:46:31.

last. They are less likely to be able to buy their own home, more

:46:32.:46:35.

likely to be saddled with debt, more likely to be in insecure, low-paid

:46:36.:46:40.

work. Except for more misery, what does the Prime Minister and her

:46:41.:46:43.

government actually offer for the young people of this country?

:46:44.:46:52.

THE SPEAKER: Prime Minister. Yes, to echo those colleagues, what

:46:53.:46:59.

we offer young people is more jobs, more homes, and opportunity to own

:47:00.:47:06.

their own home. But let me just, let me just tell the Right Honourable

:47:07.:47:11.

gentleman what isn't fair. It isn't fair to refuse to take tough to

:47:12.:47:15.

sessions and to load debts on our children and grandchildren in the

:47:16.:47:23.

future. It isn't, it isn't fair to bankrupt our economy because that

:47:24.:47:26.

leads to people losing their jobs and losing their homes. And it isn't

:47:27.:47:31.

fair to go out and tell people that they can have all the public

:47:32.:47:35.

spending they want without paying for it. Labour's away leads to fewer

:47:36.:47:45.

jobs, higher prices, more taxes and Labour's way means everyone pays the

:47:46.:47:52.

price of labour. Mr Speaker, when Tories talk of tough choices, we

:47:53.:47:57.

know who suffers, it's the poorest and most vulnerable within our

:47:58.:48:05.

society. Young people, Mr Speaker, in Clwyd on zero hours contracts,

:48:06.:48:10.

are more likely to have -- employed on zero hours contracts, are more

:48:11.:48:13.

likely to have worse physical and mental health. University students

:48:14.:48:17.

who have graduated with ?50,000 worth of debt which will stay with

:48:18.:48:24.

them until they retire. Mr Speaker, let me spell it out to the Prime

:48:25.:48:28.

Minister. This is the only country in which wages have not recovered

:48:29.:48:34.

since the global financial crash. More people are using food banks. 4

:48:35.:48:38.

million children living in poverty. Record in work. Poverty. Young

:48:39.:48:47.

people who see no prospect of owning their own home and 6 million earning

:48:48.:48:51.

less than the living way. The low Payet Adamic is a threat to our

:48:52.:48:59.

economic stability. -- the low Payet Adamic. So can she take some tough

:49:00.:49:03.

choices and instead of offering platitudes, offer some real help for

:49:04.:49:09.

those in work, young people who deserve better and deserve to be

:49:10.:49:12.

given more optimism rather than greater inequality? We actually now

:49:13.:49:20.

see the proportion of people in absolute poverty is at record lows.

:49:21.:49:25.

He asks for help for those who low-paid. I'll tell him the help

:49:26.:49:31.

that we have given, we introduced the mandatory national living wage,

:49:32.:49:38.

the lowest earners fastest pay rise in 20 years. We have cut taxes for

:49:39.:49:48.

those on the basic rate. We are doing what is important for this

:49:49.:49:51.

country which is insuring there are jobs and an economy which provides

:49:52.:49:55.

jobs, which is the best route out of poverty, being in work. And I know,

:49:56.:50:02.

I know that the right honourable gentleman has taken to calling

:50:03.:50:08.

himself a government in waiting. Well, we all know what that means.

:50:09.:50:15.

Waiting to put up taxes, waiting to destroy jobs, waiting to bankrupt

:50:16.:50:18.

our country, we will never let it happen.

:50:19.:50:21.

CHEERING I understand the House is excited

:50:22.:50:36.

about hearing the right honourable member, Nicky Morgan.

:50:37.:50:40.

I know that the Prime Minister and her ministers and many other members

:50:41.:50:44.

of the House are committed to better mental health care for everyone. I'm

:50:45.:50:49.

a founder of the Loughborough well-being project and I recently

:50:50.:50:53.

visited an eating disorder service in Leicester. As a result of the

:50:54.:51:03.

Rodman's careful financial management, 1.4 billion more is

:51:04.:51:08.

going into mental health services. How can she insure that this goes

:51:09.:51:13.

into the service is consistently? May I commend her on her work in

:51:14.:51:16.

this project and I'm happy to join her in paying tribute to the work of

:51:17.:51:21.

the eating disorder service in Leicester. As she says, they do

:51:22.:51:25.

incredibly important work and we must do more to transform the mental

:51:26.:51:29.

health services that we provide for young people, but also mental health

:51:30.:51:33.

generally. That's why, as she says, we are putting more money into

:51:34.:51:36.

mental health and it will reach a record 11.6 billion, it reached that

:51:37.:51:44.

last year. That funding, we need to make sure it gets through to the

:51:45.:51:48.

front line, we are working to ensure that people and staff in schools are

:51:49.:51:52.

trained to better identify and deal with mental health problems when

:51:53.:51:55.

they are present with children. I saw that when I visited a school in

:51:56.:52:00.

Bristol last week, excellent work being done, improving the quality of

:52:01.:52:03.

services for young people with mental health. In Blackford. As we

:52:04.:52:11.

meet here today, the funeral is taking place in Dundee for the

:52:12.:52:14.

former leader of the Scottish National Party and member of

:52:15.:52:19.

Parliament for Dundee East from 1974 to 1987, I'm sure the House would

:52:20.:52:22.

like to join with me in commemorating the life and

:52:23.:52:24.

contribution to politics of the late, dearly missed friend and

:52:25.:52:31.

colleague, Gordon Wilson. Mr Speaker, the UK Government has not

:52:32.:52:35.

announced any measures to address rising inflation and slamming wage

:52:36.:52:39.

growth which the eye S S has described as dreadful. -- which the

:52:40.:52:49.

IFS has destroyed as dreadful. As workers endure the worst pay for 70

:52:50.:52:52.

years, does the Prime Minister think she is looking out for the just

:52:53.:52:57.

about managing? Can I first of all say to the honourable gentleman as I

:52:58.:53:00.

did last week, I am sure all members of the House would like to offer our

:53:01.:53:04.

condolences to the friends, families and colleagues of the late Gordon

:53:05.:53:08.

Wilson but also to recognise the role he played in politics in the UK

:53:09.:53:13.

including in this house. And I say to the honourable gentleman, as I

:53:14.:53:17.

have said to the Leader of the Opposition, what is important is

:53:18.:53:21.

that we ensure that we have an economy which is increasing the

:53:22.:53:25.

number of jobs because the best route out of poverty is for people

:53:26.:53:29.

to be in work. That is what we are doing. We've seen nearly 3 million

:53:30.:53:34.

more jobs being created over recent years. That's important for people.

:53:35.:53:39.

We also help people, for example, by cutting taxes, it's what we've done

:53:40.:53:43.

for people who are you lower paid, introducing the national living

:53:44.:53:50.

wage, that is what people need. It is the forecast in the rise in work

:53:51.:53:57.

poverty which should concern us, particularly the increase of young

:53:58.:54:01.

people in poverty. Since the general election in 2010, the FTSE 100 has

:54:02.:54:07.

risen by 39.6%. Monetary policy, not least quantitative easing, has

:54:08.:54:12.

helped drive up financial assets while workers have paid the price

:54:13.:54:18.

for austerity. Workers will earn no more in 2021 than they did in 2008.

:54:19.:54:23.

Will the Prime Minister give workers a pay rise? I would have thought

:54:24.:54:27.

that particularly with his background, he would have recognised

:54:28.:54:31.

the role that the monetary policy including quantitative easing has

:54:32.:54:36.

done in ensuring that we at able to see those jobs in the enquiry --

:54:37.:54:44.

economy which are so important. Can my right honourable friend tell me

:54:45.:54:47.

what steps the government is taking to drive value for money and

:54:48.:54:52.

efficiency in the aid budget to ensure taxpayer money is used to

:54:53.:54:55.

promote global peace and security in the national interest? Can I say to

:54:56.:55:00.

my honourable friend that I am proud that the government is committed to

:55:01.:55:03.

honouring our international commitment on aid, that is important

:55:04.:55:06.

for this country. This money is saving lives, building a more stable

:55:07.:55:11.

and prosperous world, that's firmly in our UK national interest but of

:55:12.:55:14.

course, but he's absolutely right, we need to make sure the money we

:55:15.:55:17.

are spending is being spent utterly and efficiently. The international

:55:18.:55:23.

developer and secretary, I can assure him, is driving value for

:55:24.:55:27.

money and efficiency in the aid budget, focusing on greater

:55:28.:55:30.

transparency, boosting payment by results and driving value for money

:55:31.:55:36.

as well. We set up in 2011 and independent aid watchdog together

:55:37.:55:42.

with stronger controls in DfiD. It's important we are committed to this

:55:43.:55:45.

money but it is also important that it is spelt well. My young

:55:46.:55:50.

constituent paid ?300 house reservation fee to an estate agent

:55:51.:55:59.

their landlord clients -- grow which they will not refund after they

:56:00.:56:03.

refused to honour the contract after the landlord pulled out. When will

:56:04.:56:10.

the Prime Minister act and put an end to these rip-off fees and stop

:56:11.:56:16.

these agents capitalising on young people and others? We have made

:56:17.:56:23.

reference in the Queen's speech to what we're doing in this area, we

:56:24.:56:27.

recognise the issues. He says when, but he will recognise in the House

:56:28.:56:30.

that we need to ensure that anything we bring forward in legislative

:56:31.:56:34.

terms get right, so it's going to work. We recognise the problem and

:56:35.:56:37.

we are going to do something about it. In 2008, I brought forward an

:56:38.:56:43.

amendment to the animal welfare act that would have extended the

:56:44.:56:48.

sentences for cruelty to animals from weeks to years. Will my right

:56:49.:56:51.

honourable friend look and see what can be done to ensure that people

:56:52.:56:55.

who are deliberately and wilfully cruel to animals are punished far

:56:56.:57:00.

more severely? I'm grateful to my honourable friend for raising this

:57:01.:57:07.

issue and we all share a high regard for animal welfare, the importance

:57:08.:57:09.

of having strict laws in place to ensure that we deal with people

:57:10.:57:12.

properly who are not looking after animals. And anyone who is cruel to

:57:13.:57:17.

an animal doesn't provide for welfare needs may be and from --

:57:18.:57:25.

banned from owning animals, given a fine sent to prison. We are in

:57:26.:57:29.

discussion with the Ministry of Justice regularly in remission to

:57:30.:57:35.

the sentencing policy for animal welfare. With this awful service

:57:36.:57:40.

reportedly having to explain in crayon to the -- with the civil

:57:41.:57:46.

service reportedly having to explain in crayon to the Cabinet that there

:57:47.:57:53.

is now know have your cake and eat it option for Brexit, will she

:57:54.:57:57.

admits she is prioritising her own red lines? He will have heard the

:57:58.:58:02.

answer before. We want to negotiate the best possible answer for the

:58:03.:58:08.

United Kingdom which ensures we have a comprehensive free trade

:58:09.:58:11.

agreement, we can trade with our partners, we have a deep and special

:58:12.:58:14.

partnership with the European Union, that we ensure that we are growing

:58:15.:58:19.

our economy but it's not just about our relationship with the European

:58:20.:58:22.

Union, it's about trade deals that we will do with countries around the

:58:23.:58:26.

rest of the world. And it's about ensuring sound management

:58:27.:58:33.

conservative government. Commissioners have highlighted to me

:58:34.:58:37.

the valuable contribution that retired police Sergeant and now

:58:38.:58:42.

special constable Ross Hall has made to maritime policing. Does my right

:58:43.:58:45.

honourable friend believe that joined up working with other

:58:46.:58:49.

agencies is essential and can make a positive contribution to beating

:58:50.:58:54.

crime in our small harbours? And helps protect our borders? Can I

:58:55.:59:00.

join my honourable friend in recognising the contribution that

:59:01.:59:04.

special contribution Ross Hall has made in her constituency, and she

:59:05.:59:10.

makes an important point. When I was Home Secretary, I brought various

:59:11.:59:13.

agencies together to look at just this issue of how we deal with

:59:14.:59:18.

protecting our borders. That joined up working can make a real and

:59:19.:59:23.

positive contribution. As she will know, of course, what matters is not

:59:24.:59:26.

just how we do that but ensuring that we're having an impact but as

:59:27.:59:31.

she will know, crime has fallen by a third since 20 ten to eight record

:59:32.:59:39.

low. -- 2010 to a record low. Thank you for advising me on my blood

:59:40.:59:44.

pressure, when I go to my consultant on Monday, he will give me the same

:59:45.:59:50.

advice. My blood pressure rises because when I go and see those

:59:51.:59:54.

nurses in those hospitals, overstretched, overworked and

:59:55.:59:57.

underpaid and having to use food banks, she pays lip service and does

:59:58.:00:04.

not look at the pace sector gap and does not reduce it. Listen to the

:00:05.:00:07.

plea of those nurses and do something about the pace sector cap.

:00:08.:00:14.

I have set out the position to the Leader of the sop significance when

:00:15.:00:25.

he spoke earlier. -- Leader of the Opposition. And for nurses there is

:00:26.:00:30.

the overall public sector pay increase but also many nurses

:00:31.:00:33.

receive increments or progression pay. And for a typical band 5 nurse,

:00:34.:00:37.

they'll be receiving 3.8% over and above the 1%. It is a strong economy

:00:38.:00:47.

that power this is Government's investment in the NHS and it is a

:00:48.:00:53.

strong economy that is allowing this Government to create 1,500 new

:00:54.:00:57.

medical school places and new medical schools. Does the Prime

:00:58.:01:04.

Minister agree with me that Lincolnshire makes a new case for a

:01:05.:01:10.

new medical school in this great county? My honourable friend makes

:01:11.:01:18.

an important point. We can only pay for public services with a strong

:01:19.:01:25.

economy. And as he said we are going to train 1,500 more doctors every

:01:26.:01:30.

year to ensure the NHS has enough doctors to continue providing a

:01:31.:01:33.

safe, compassionate care we all want to see. We are looking at the

:01:34.:01:37.

question of how to allocate the places and will publish their

:01:38.:01:39.

consultation response. They are also looking at the possibility of new

:01:40.:01:42.

and aspiring medical schools bidding for these places and I'm sure that

:01:43.:01:48.

as my honourable friend has always been a champion for his constituents

:01:49.:01:52.

and constituency, he will continue to make an excellent case for Lynne

:01:53.:01:56.

coreshire. On Saturday the Shadow Chancellor and I joined staff from

:01:57.:01:59.

picture house cinemas outside the Ritzy in Brixton who are striking

:02:00.:02:02.

because their employer reus foos to pay the London living wage and has

:02:03.:02:07.

outrageously stacked their trade union representatives. Will the

:02:08.:02:11.

Prime Minister join me on calling of Picture House cinema who made a

:02:12.:02:15.

profit last year of ?18 million to pay their staff the London living

:02:16.:02:21.

wage and to rein-Tait their local res madly -- reinstate. It is about

:02:22.:02:26.

a relationship between employers and their employees. What I say to her

:02:27.:02:30.

overall is the importance of Government taking the right

:02:31.:02:34.

decisions to ensure we can - excuse me - taking right decisions to

:02:35.:02:44.

ensure that growing the economy and providing those jobs for people in

:02:45.:02:50.

the first place. Tait THE SPEAKER: Andrew Bowie. Thank you Mr Speaker,

:02:51.:02:55.

I would to thank the Prime Minister for taking time during the general

:02:56.:03:01.

election to come up to campaign in my constituency where I think we did

:03:02.:03:08.

rather well. I would like to ask if she agrees with me that it is

:03:09.:03:13.

utterly shameful that the Scottish Government have for the second year

:03:14.:03:17.

in a reh to go pleading to the European Commission for an extension

:03:18.:03:21.

to the farm payment deadline, and is this not proof, if further proof

:03:22.:03:27.

were needed that the SNP are failing rural Scotland? THE SPEAKER: Order.

:03:28.:03:29.

We're fascinated to hear the answer, I should just say although I'm

:03:30.:03:33.

interested to hear the answer and we will, the Prime Minister is not

:03:34.:03:36.

responsible for the Scottish Government. Prime Minister. Can I

:03:37.:03:42.

first of all welcome my honourable friend to his place in this House

:03:43.:03:49.

and I very much enjoyed my visit to his constituency during the election

:03:50.:03:53.

campaign. But what he says is absolutely right because time and

:03:54.:03:57.

again, in this Chamber, Mr Speaker, we hear the Scottish Nationalists

:03:58.:04:02.

demanding more powers for Scotland. Yet what do we see? They are failing

:04:03.:04:08.

to deliver for the Scottish people on the powers they already have. Yet

:04:09.:04:14.

again Scottish schools are now outperformed in every category by

:04:15.:04:18.

schools in England, Northern Ireland, Estonia and Poland. Powers

:04:19.:04:22.

are kept in Edinburgh rather than being devolved to local people and

:04:23.:04:27.

as my honourable friend says, yet again we see farmers waiting months

:04:28.:04:31.

for their subsidy payments. The simple fact is that the SNP's

:04:32.:04:35.

qualities are not in the best interests of the people of Scotland.

:04:36.:04:39.

THE SPEAKER: Order. I say to the honourable gentleman the member for

:04:40.:04:42.

Glasgow South who persists in gesticulating in an eccentric

:04:43.:04:45.

matter, he seems discome bob lighted from the world he inhabits. It is an

:04:46.:04:52.

unhappy state of affairs. The southern rail dispute is causing

:04:53.:04:58.

real damage to the economy of Eastbourne and South East. My

:04:59.:05:01.

constituents have had a shocking time with the services provide the

:05:02.:05:05.

or not for the last 1 months. This shrimp cannot go on. With the Prime

:05:06.:05:11.

Minister enlighten me, my constituents and the House, why the

:05:12.:05:15.

Department for Transport and the train operator will not meet with

:05:16.:05:21.

the unions at the same time in the same room, together, to negotiate a

:05:22.:05:25.

deal? I recognise the problems that have been experienced by passengers

:05:26.:05:28.

on southern rail, this is a matter that has been raised by a number of

:05:29.:05:35.

my colleagues in the House, including my honourable friend the

:05:36.:05:38.

member for Lewes who raised it last weevenlingt I'm very disappointed

:05:39.:05:41.

that they have called more industrial action. It is completely

:05:42.:05:44.

unnecessary. All it will do is cause more disruption and frustration for

:05:45.:05:49.

passengers. The recent independent report says the main cause of

:05:50.:05:53.

widespread disruption on Southern has been union action. So, I would

:05:54.:05:58.

urge the unions to call off these strikes, work with the operators and

:05:59.:06:01.

deliver the services the passengers need. THE SPEAKER: Alex Burghart.

:06:02.:06:11.

Businesses across my constituency will be cock ahoop to hear that

:06:12.:06:17.

their calls for better broadband are being answer bid the digital

:06:18.:06:20.

infrastructure investment fund. Which is going to unlock about ?1

:06:21.:06:24.

billion for full fibre service. It is going to help them create jobs,

:06:25.:06:27.

particularly in rural areas. Will the Prime Minister agree with me

:06:28.:06:31.

that this is exactly the sort of infrastructure spend we need to get

:06:32.:06:36.

our country Brexit-ready? My honourable friend makes a very

:06:37.:06:41.

important point. And wear already a digital world leader and we're

:06:42.:06:44.

committed to making sure this unremains so. We already see 93% of

:06:45.:06:50.

the UK accessing superfast broadband and we are on track to reach 95% by

:06:51.:06:58.

the end of the year but we do want to see more commercial investment in

:06:59.:07:01.

the gold standard connectivity full fibre provides and this is' why

:07:02.:07:04.

we've launched this digital infrastructure investment fund

:07:05.:07:05.

accompanies aaround the UK will be able to apply for match funding for

:07:06.:07:11.

projects which would see fibre delivered right to the doorstep.

:07:12.:07:14.

Yesterday we also announced 100% business rate relief for businesses

:07:15.:07:18.

rolling out new fibre. This is important. We want to continue to be

:07:19.:07:22.

woorld leader and these are the actions Government are taking in

:07:23.:07:27.

making sure we will be. Police officer numbers in Wales have

:07:28.:07:31.

dropped by 10% since her party came to power. The policing is devolved

:07:32.:07:35.

in Northern Ireland and Scotland and have xrap funding worth ?25 million

:07:36.:07:40.

at their disposal. This would more than replace those lost officers.

:07:41.:07:46.

What justification is there for refusing to want to devolve

:07:47.:07:50.

policing? We have been around this discussion before but can I address

:07:51.:07:55.

the central issue of what the honourable lady is talking about,

:07:56.:07:59.

police budgets and the number of police officers. We are currently

:08:00.:08:03.

protecting police budgets. We have been doing that since 2015. That I

:08:04.:08:07.

believe is acknowledged across the House. And we have we are not

:08:08.:08:12.

protecting the police budgets but ensuring the police need the cape

:08:13.:08:18.

acts they need to deal with new types of crime, creating the

:08:19.:08:22.

national cybercrime unit and national police agency and this is

:08:23.:08:27.

why what we are doing to cut crime and crime is at a record low. THE

:08:28.:08:35.

SPEAKER: Scott Mann. Can I thank the Prime Minister for introducing the

:08:36.:08:38.

trade and fishery Brexit bill in the Queen's Speech. It'll be welcome in

:08:39.:08:42.

the West Country however we are facing significant challenges with

:08:43.:08:45.

rural Post Office network and the trands flings some branches from

:08:46.:08:49.

community branches to community village stores and community

:08:50.:08:52.

buildings. Some of those moves have been smooth and some haven't. Can I

:08:53.:08:59.

ask her to take a look at this and see if there is anything more the

:09:00.:09:04.

Government can do to help my constituents? My honourable friend

:09:05.:09:07.

again raises an important point and it is right we should recognise the

:09:08.:09:11.

role played in communities by rural Post Offices and rural Post Offices

:09:12.:09:16.

in places like Campbell Ford and in his constituency but in the

:09:17.:09:19.

constituencies of other honourable members. We've invested in the

:09:20.:09:24.

network up to 2018. It is at its most stable for decades but he is

:09:25.:09:29.

right, I would urge the Post Office to help to make it as easy as

:09:30.:09:35.

possible for shops who want it take over postal services to be able to

:09:36.:09:40.

do so. . THE SPEAKER: Diana Johnston. Mrnchts speaker, 2,400

:09:41.:09:44.

people have died as a result of the NHS contaminated blood scandal. More

:09:45.:09:47.

than Hillsborough and all the other disasters over the previous few

:09:48.:09:50.

decades put together. With the excel effort that the former right

:09:51.:09:54.

honourable member for Leigh presented to Parliament on April

:09:55.:09:58.

25th of a criminal cover-up of an industrial scale, will the Prime

:09:59.:10:02.

Minister now do the right thing and order a public inquiry for the whole

:10:03.:10:08.

of the United Kingdom? The honourable lady raises an important

:10:09.:10:11.

issue. I know the thoughts of members of the House will be with

:10:12.:10:18.

all of those who've been affected by this terrible tragedy in relation to

:10:19.:10:21.

contaminated blood. Serious allegations have been made and I

:10:22.:10:24.

would say obviously information that has been brought forward to the

:10:25.:10:29.

House will be looked at bhinsteres at the Department of Health but if

:10:30.:10:33.

any honourable member has further information or evidence they believe

:10:34.:10:36.

would be important that should go to ministers, so they can properly

:10:37.:10:39.

investigate T we are providing more compensation than any previous

:10:40.:10:42.

Government and committed ?125 million of extra funding for those

:10:43.:10:48.

affected for the contaminated blood tragedy last July. But the

:10:49.:10:52.

Department of Health will look at any new evidence that is brought

:10:53.:10:58.

forward. Mr Speaker, rather than celebrating the NHS, the party

:10:59.:11:02.

opposite rather shamelessly have tried to weaponise the NHS with the

:11:03.:11:09.

political campaigning tools. Will the Prime Minister assure me that

:11:10.:11:15.

services like the 999 service will be decided upon, based on clinical

:11:16.:11:19.

decision, not those of politicians that are trying to weaponise our

:11:20.:11:22.

public services? My honourable friend is absolutely right. In

:11:23.:11:26.

relation to the services that are provided by the NHS, it is so

:11:27.:11:30.

important that decisions are taken on a clinical basis by those who

:11:31.:11:34.

understand the needs and requirements of people and in

:11:35.:11:40.

different areas. And that's why we have set up NHS England which has a

:11:41.:11:46.

plan for developing services in the NHS, over a five-year period. It's

:11:47.:11:51.

important that politicians allow clinicians and others in the NHS to

:11:52.:11:57.

make the decisions they need to. I'm thinking of my constituents Konnie

:11:58.:12:01.

and Chris Guard and Charlie at this difficult time. It's clear that if

:12:02.:12:09.

Charlie remains in the UK there is no further treatment available and

:12:10.:12:12.

that life support will be switched off. There are differing views about

:12:13.:12:17.

the charges of the by pass therapy that other children, albeit with

:12:18.:12:20.

less swear forms of Charlie's condition have benefited from. I

:12:21.:12:23.

understand the chances of improvement for Charlie are low but

:12:24.:12:26.

that doctors would be able to say within three months whether Charlie

:12:27.:12:32.

is responding and whether the change is clinically beneficial. If there

:12:33.:12:36.

is any room for discretion within the court ruling for Great Ormond

:12:37.:12:42.

Street to allow Charlie to leave and to transfer his care to doctors at

:12:43.:12:47.

Columbia University and he is sufficiently stable to receive

:12:48.:12:49.

treatment, would the Prime Minister do all she can to bring the

:12:50.:12:52.

appropriate people together to try to make this happen? Can I first of

:12:53.:12:59.

all say to the honourable lady she is right to raise the concerns of

:13:00.:13:03.

her constituents in this matter and I'm sure the thoughts of all members

:13:04.:13:08.

of the House are with the familiar lane Charlie at this exceptionally

:13:09.:13:13.

difficult time. It's an unimaginable position for anybody to be in and I

:13:14.:13:18.

fully understand and appreciate that any parent in these circumstances

:13:19.:13:21.

would want to do everything possible and explore every option for their

:13:22.:13:25.

seriously illchild but I also know that no doctor ever wants to be

:13:26.:13:32.

placed in the terrible position where they have to make such

:13:33.:13:35.

heart-breaking decisions. The honourable lady referred to the fact

:13:36.:13:38.

that we have the court process here. I'm confident Great Ormond Street

:13:39.:13:41.

hospital have and always will consider any offers or new

:13:42.:13:44.

information that has come forward with the consideration of the

:13:45.:13:47.

well-being of a desperately ill child. Mr Speaker, when the Prime

:13:48.:13:51.

Minister and I left our comprehensive schools to go to

:13:52.:13:54.

university, we entered into a privileged elite. Can my right

:13:55.:13:57.

honourable friend confirm that as a result of a tuition fee, introduced

:13:58.:14:01.

by Labour, improved by the coalition, there are now more young

:14:02.:14:09.

people from working class and poor backgrounds staying at university

:14:10.:14:13.

than ever before, because come people say it is fewer. Are they

:14:14.:14:21.

right or are they wrong? I'm very happy to join my honourable friend

:14:22.:14:28.

in relation to this issue. Issue in recognising she and I went to

:14:29.:14:30.

comprehensive schools and universities at a time when the

:14:31.:14:33.

number of people going to university was significantly lower than it is

:14:34.:14:41.

today. And I'm also grateful to her for reminding the House that

:14:42.:14:46.

actually it was the Labour Party that says they would not introduce

:14:47.:14:50.

tuition fees and when they got into Government introduce tuition fees.

:14:51.:14:54.

But what we are seeing - what we are seeing under the current... What we

:14:55.:15:00.

are seeing under the current system is more young people than ever going

:15:01.:15:05.

to university, and crucially, to address the point she raised,

:15:06.:15:08.

disadvantaged 18-year-olds are 40% o % more line e likely to go to

:15:09.:15:14.

university now than they were in 2009.

:15:15.:15:20.

The Prime Minister herself commissioned ship Jones to the port

:15:21.:15:28.

on the Hillsborough families. Even -- given what is before us that the

:15:29.:15:32.

state still does not know how to deal with the victims of tragedy,

:15:33.:15:39.

will she give me the date on when this report will be published? I

:15:40.:15:43.

have not seen the report yet and I cannot give her a date, but she

:15:44.:15:48.

raises an important point. The reason why I asked Bishop James

:15:49.:15:50.

Chester undertake this work was because I was concerned about the

:15:51.:15:55.

ways the bereaved families at Hillsborough had been treated over

:15:56.:15:58.

far too many years and we have seen the result of the CPS decisions last

:15:59.:16:05.

week. This is why we have committed, in the Queen's speech, to

:16:06.:16:08.

introducing an independent and public advocate who will be able to

:16:09.:16:12.

act on the behalf of bereaved families in cases of public

:16:13.:16:15.

disaster, because I think it is important that they are able to have

:16:16.:16:19.

that support alongside them. Too many families just have too, as we

:16:20.:16:23.

have seen in Hillsborough, have two over many years fight to get justice

:16:24.:16:27.

will stop I want to ensure they have help and support in doing that.

:16:28.:16:34.

Given the government's record in freezing fuel duty, will she resist

:16:35.:16:41.

recent calls to raise the duty because it hurts the lowest paid the

:16:42.:16:44.

most? Will she do every thing possible to make sure that when the

:16:45.:16:48.

international oil price falls, this is reflected properly at the pumps

:16:49.:16:51.

so that we can have a Britain that works for every motorist? Can I

:16:52.:16:57.

first of all commend my honourable friend who has been championing this

:16:58.:17:00.

issue for all the years that he has been in the House. And the work that

:17:01.:17:05.

he has done as a great campaigner on this and other issues has been

:17:06.:17:10.

recognised in changes the government has made. I'm pleased that we have

:17:11.:17:15.

been able to do what we've done in relation to holding down the issue

:17:16.:17:19.

on fuel duty, he struggled to tempt me down a path which I will not go

:17:20.:17:23.

down because he knows decisions at these matters are time of fiscal

:17:24.:17:27.

events. It comes to an end after 47 minutes,

:17:28.:17:38.

last week was not an aberration, if you thought it was, you have been

:17:39.:17:44.

proved wrong. It looks like the speaker is planning to run the PMQs

:17:45.:17:48.

for 45 minutes. The exchanges between the front benches, it was

:17:49.:17:53.

like the campaign had not ended. Mr Corbyn making much of the themes he

:17:54.:17:56.

used in their campaign, public sector pay, the need to pay teachers

:17:57.:18:01.

and nurses more and so on. The Prime Minister fighting back saying she is

:18:02.:18:06.

followed three pay review bodies, she's for more to come in, we need

:18:07.:18:12.

to live within our means. It did not get so far but it was an echo of the

:18:13.:18:17.

campaign. One difference, Theresa May made quite a spirited defence of

:18:18.:18:23.

the government's economic record since 2010, which is something she

:18:24.:18:26.

didn't do during the election campaign. That was interesting. We

:18:27.:18:31.

will see where we are in a moment with our panel. But what did the

:18:32.:18:35.

viewers say? Still the same untruths from the Tories on pay in economy, a

:18:36.:18:44.

rise is needed now. But this one, Theresa May seemed to be on form

:18:45.:18:48.

today, her backbenchers hacking her all the way, Mr Corbyn cannot think

:18:49.:18:54.

on his feet and catch the Prime Minister on God. This one, Corbyn is

:18:55.:19:02.

back to his letter from able routine, it doesn't work, the brain

:19:03.:19:07.

is back and Theresa May is still shrill when rattled. And this tweet,

:19:08.:19:13.

has Theresa May ever defended the economic record of the Tories as

:19:14.:19:21.

vigorously as this? Might get her a positive editorial in the standard.

:19:22.:19:28.

To which George Osborne treated, a smiley face. Is that good? Does it

:19:29.:19:36.

apply Kim? I can't tell. -- does it look like him? And we had the first

:19:37.:19:45.

MP not wearing a tie and asking a question, a pink shirt and a nice

:19:46.:19:49.

fitted collar, that started a trend. I am not sure that this will buy to

:19:50.:19:55.

reset may credit with George Osborne's Usher could Theresa May's

:19:56.:20:00.

credit with George Osborne's standard, but she looked more

:20:01.:20:03.

relaxed and comfortable as she has been since her decline. The reasons

:20:04.:20:11.

are discoverable, maybe the pressure is off now that she has fallen as

:20:12.:20:15.

far as she has. It makes it easier to be yourself. In question Time, we

:20:16.:20:22.

saw her try her best to hold the line on public sector pay,

:20:23.:20:26.

reiterating the policy. In the course of doing that, she expressed

:20:27.:20:29.

that the public pay review bodies will be read carefully and their

:20:30.:20:33.

recommendations would be studied and acted upon, or not, as the case

:20:34.:20:37.

would be. The sponsoring ministers of the pay review bodies have given

:20:38.:20:41.

a green light to those bodies to go ahead and bust the 1% pay cut if

:20:42.:20:45.

they want to do it. It would be quite difficult not to do that now.

:20:46.:20:49.

We know that is their natural inclination because they have been

:20:50.:20:53.

building up to this for a couple of years. We're we are to begin with,

:20:54.:21:02.

in my view, a political impossibility of hanging onto a

:21:03.:21:04.

public sector pay cap when sponsoring ministers and others say,

:21:05.:21:10.

it is the time to breach the cat. When the government says they have

:21:11.:21:14.

listen to the electorate, how do you then say, we have decided to ignore

:21:15.:21:18.

that message that we said we were listening to carefully? And when

:21:19.:21:21.

you've got enough MPs and more on the Tory side to stage a big enough

:21:22.:21:26.

rebellion to bring it down, even the government would be minded to dig

:21:27.:21:31.

its heels in. The deficit was just under 50 billion in the last

:21:32.:21:34.

financial year, it's rising this year for some technical reasons, it

:21:35.:21:38.

will be over 50 billion. Does it no longer matter? The deficit does

:21:39.:21:43.

matter which is why all our policies in the general election campaign

:21:44.:21:46.

were accosted. You may disagree with them. No one agreed with them. No

:21:47.:21:56.

experts no expert body agreed with your tax revenue projections. We put

:21:57.:22:05.

forward I costed manifesto. You say that but by constituents didn't

:22:06.:22:10.

believe it. The key thing is it is up for ministers to set the rebid

:22:11.:22:18.

for these bodies for public pay, you say he's given them the green light,

:22:19.:22:21.

it is he in the instruction he's given them, actually going to say,

:22:22.:22:25.

do not impose a cap? That's the question that the government has not

:22:26.:22:30.

answered. How could he do that? He could not. He could say, take into

:22:31.:22:37.

account the new inflation levels. That's what's made the pay cut such

:22:38.:22:43.

an important issue. When the cap was introduced, inflation was close to

:22:44.:22:47.

zero. If you've only got 1%, not much but in real terms, you get a

:22:48.:22:51.

little rise. You would hardly notice it but you get a little rise. Now

:22:52.:23:00.

with a 1% pay cap, you get it cut in real terms. It's difficult to

:23:01.:23:04.

sustain the claim that the inflation target is symmetrical which is what

:23:05.:23:07.

the governor of the Bank of England was insisted on when inflation was

:23:08.:23:12.

near zero. The reality is that positive inflation creates these

:23:13.:23:15.

pressures. We need to keep inflation under control. We will see a one off

:23:16.:23:19.

through the referendum change in the currency level will wash through,

:23:20.:23:24.

and I think we will see inflation stabilise after that. A pay rise in

:23:25.:23:29.

the public sector of 2.5% wouldn't be inflationary, would it? 2% sounds

:23:30.:23:35.

like a small number but when you run to the figures, it would be very

:23:36.:23:41.

expensive. Why did the Prime Minister use grease as an example of

:23:42.:23:45.

a country who had not tackled its deficit? But Greece has been in

:23:46.:23:52.

notorious difficulties. What is its deficit, and why would she raise it

:23:53.:23:56.

if she used it as an example? We seen that in Greece, where taxes

:23:57.:24:01.

haven't been paid and where the government has lived beyond its

:24:02.:24:04.

means, the consequence of running up too much debt has been profound. She

:24:05.:24:08.

wasn't talking about debt, she was talking about the deficit, a

:24:09.:24:12.

different thing, Greece doesn't have address it, it ran a budget surplus

:24:13.:24:18.

last year. What are our deficit as a percentage of GDP? It is just 3%. It

:24:19.:24:27.

is just under, we are just under 3% and Greece is running a surplus, why

:24:28.:24:31.

would you raise that? Greece is an example of where excess in debt is

:24:32.:24:37.

leading to public service is being in trouble. That's not what the

:24:38.:24:40.

Prime Minister was talking about, she was saying it had not got on top

:24:41.:24:45.

of its deficit and that is not what the figures say. The political thing

:24:46.:24:48.

which was interesting is that the Prime Minister 's got a lot of

:24:49.:24:55.

support from the backbenches, and that is I suggest because they know

:24:56.:24:58.

she is living on borrowed time but she'll go at a time of their

:24:59.:25:02.

choosing. So for the moment, they're going to rally behind her until they

:25:03.:25:06.

choose that she doesn't stay there any more. I think that's precisely

:25:07.:25:11.

right. The Conservative backbench at question time now are like spear

:25:12.:25:20.

carriers in this experience drummer, they say nothing until the queue

:25:21.:25:24.

comes to cheer. -- in a Shakespearean drama. The job for now

:25:25.:25:29.

is to stay there and she will achieve that until the recess. We

:25:30.:25:33.

have to exit now. A Shakespearean exit from the stage.

:25:34.:25:36.

We've talked before about Corbynmania and the huge

:25:37.:25:38.

support for the Labour leader on social media.

:25:39.:25:40.

He's not the first politician to get an online following.

:25:41.:25:42.

You might remember the somewhat smaller Milifandom that

:25:43.:25:45.

sprang up around former Labour leader Ed Miliband.

:25:46.:25:48.

But this week it's been suggested that there's a new unlikely

:25:49.:25:51.

What greater pleasure can there be for a true born Englishman

:25:52.:26:00.

or true born Englishwoman, to listen to our own

:26:01.:26:04.

Mr Speaker, or my right honourable friend the member for Buckingham,

:26:05.:26:09.

as he now is, has a reputation for being a moderniser.

:26:10.:26:12.

This is the word I use with some caution.

:26:13.:26:20.

Can we indulge in the floxinoxinihilipilification

:26:21.:26:23.

There are times when a nation needs a hero.

:26:24.:26:27.

Now might not be one of those times, but there seems to be loads

:26:28.:26:36.

of people at the moment who just really love Jacob Rees-Mogg.

:26:37.:26:41.

Maybe it's because he himself posts to social media.

:26:42.:26:44.

Maybe because he's had such a strong and youthful

:26:45.:26:49.

And maybe it's because he seems to have cross-party support.

:26:50.:26:56.

Whatever it is, The Rees-Mogg has inspired a generation

:26:57.:27:00.

of Photoshoppers and meme creaters on the Internet.

:27:01.:27:02.

So much so that someone even interviewed him about what he thinks

:27:03.:27:10.

of these memes and that's been really popular.

:27:11.:27:12.

I always think it's important to sit comfortably in the chamber,

:27:13.:27:14.

particularly when you're in there for a long time.

:27:15.:27:17.

There's even a campaign to make him PM.

:27:18.:27:22.

What is it about Rees-Mogg that you love so much?

:27:23.:27:25.

I think it's because he's a little bit eccentric.

:27:26.:27:29.

He doesn't take themselves so seriously.

:27:30.:27:31.

So how many people have signed up for the campaign?

:27:32.:27:34.

So we have just over 12,000 signatures so far.

:27:35.:27:37.

Yeah, it is, I've got to say I'm actually surprised that we've got

:27:38.:27:46.

this big in such a short period of time.

:27:47.:27:51.

His support isn't just the grassroots of his power base

:27:52.:27:54.

But as his local paper once said, he's got Mogg-mentum.

:27:55.:28:08.

So, is their love for him in the studio? Absolutely massive love for

:28:09.:28:17.

Jake, we are all fans. As leader? Who knows what happens with due

:28:18.:28:26.

course. We need to guess the year, it is 1978. So, Minister, hit that

:28:27.:28:30.

red buzzer. Brexit negotiations are over! Here is the winner.

:28:31.:28:42.

Congratulations, it is 1978. One o'clock News is starting on BBC One,

:28:43.:28:46.

I will be back at the earlier time of 11am tomorrow because of

:28:47.:28:50.

Wimbledon, on BBC Two. Hope to see you then.

:28:51.:28:52.

Andrew Neil and Jo Coburn are joined by Brexit minister Steve Baker and shadow health secretary Jon Ashworth. They look at calls for Sir Martin Moore-Bick, the judge appointed to lead the Grenfell Inquiry, to quit and the growing pressure on the government from its own ministers and backbenchers to increase spending.

There is full coverage and analysis of PMQs as well as a look at how Conservative MP Jacob Rees-Mogg has become an online sensation.


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