19/07/2017 Daily Politics


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Morning folks - welcome to the Daily Politics.


The divorce bill is the big sticking point as negotiators are locked


in for a third day of Brexit negotiations in Brussels -


might agreement on the final sum only come at the 11th hour?


Tuition fees have caused a lot of anger amongst students,


But the government have given universities the go-ahead to


increase them. Labour want to scrap them


altogether, but would that be a good As MPs pack their bucket and spade,


we'll bring you the final PMQs And it wouldn't be the end of term


without a sports day... Will MPs or journalists win the egg


and spoon race? The shock of the News of the egg and


spoon race! Is Gary Lineker coming on to do this pick? I hope so.


The Defence Secretary, Michael Fallon, called


on his colleagues last night to be more disciplined and loyal,


and to concentrate their fire on a "dangerous enemy within reach


We'll expect nothing less of former soldier, Tobias Ellwood,


now a Defence Minister himself, who is with us for the duration.


And we have a formidable adversary for him -


the Shadow Secretary of Women and Equalities, Sarah Champion.


First, in the last hour or so the BBC has published details


of the salaries of on-screen talent earning more than ?150,000 from


The disclosure was demanded by the Government in the most recent


The BBC didn't really want to do it but the government said they had to.


Only a third of the highest paid reporters and presenters are women -


a situation the director general, Tony Hall, has described


The Chairman of the Common's Culture, Media and Sport Committee,


Damian Collins, welcomed publication of the salary details.


The reason we want a disclosure on salaries is we can see,


do these salaries look competitive or not?


Everyone will expect the top talent, the top on-screen talent,


to be earning high salaries at equivalent levels to people


But what will be interesting to see is other people


within the organisation, maybe at much more middle-ranking


levels, are they on unusually high salaries as well?


And that's why I think it's important that those


When the BBC is funded by the licence fee payer,


and periodically we hear that certain much-loved services


or programmes have to be cut, and there are cutbacks on local


radio, I think it's not unreasonable the licence


fee payers ask the BBC, well, how do you spend


Just some of the reaction to this list today. Sarah Champion, is it a


worthwhile exercise? I don't think so, personally, I know that might be


shocking. I know football players get paid a huge amount and film


stars get paid a huge amount but to be quite honest, if I was reading


the news... I concede market forces are the way they are. Your Tory


colleague says this allows us, his committee and others in public life,


to compare if the BBC are paying market levels or not. Can you do


that when we don't know what the equivalent presenters in Skye, ITV


channel for getting? You illustrate the challenge we face here. Where I


disagree is for competitive football players of film stars, this is


public money. The nation is paying for this. We don't doubt your


talent, but we do want to know... You do. We want to do how much you


are paid. Some of these some side large on the BBC needs to respond to


that. Most importantly, it has highlighted a gender pay gap. I


think that is something Tony Hall must address immediately. He says he


will, we will see. Have you had a look at the list yet, did anything


jump out? Where it is interesting, I'm Brad Tony Hall has said he will


look at the gender pay gap. It's not just about figures but about those


structural blocks that prevents women from reaching their full


potential. That happens in the BBC, we know it happens in journalism and


politics. The figures that come out today, we can now see the scale of


the problem. Exactly, when you are looking like for like, if there are


differences between men and women doing the same job, commanding the


same sort of audience figures, then I think the BBC is right to do


something about it and we are right to know that. However, to be quite


honest, this is another example, the Tories have in for the BBC on this


is another way of having a go at them. Why'd you have it in for the


BBC? I don't agree with that, I am huge supporter, as the party is, for


BBC, nationally and worldwide. It's part of promoting British influence


around the world and respected around the world. To suggest this is


some sort of Tory plot... This is taxpayers money, the nation paying


for this and that is why we have every right to understand. To put


that into context, yes you are in a competitive environment. Let me come


back to the point where we began. You said it's a huge challenge, but


I'm not sure how we resolve it, since we don't know what Adam


Boulton at Sky News is getting all Robert Peston, we don't know what


our equivalents in the other networks are getting. It is not your


intention, I understand, to force them to publish summaries, you


couldn't? They are not taking money from the people. The licence fee


means there needs to be... Comparison. That is a case for


publishing, I understand that argument. But your colleague was


arguing, we can now make comparisons. My point, I will make


for a third time and then shut up, you cannot make comparisons because


you don't have data that allows you to make the comparison. I understand


that. Hopefully we will see some of the private sector coming forward


and being more transparent. There is a fundamental issue, that it's right


the nation sees... You made that .4-macro


times, I haven't contested it. Damian Collins made another point,


regional areas, where is money spent? The balance of national and


local media is important across the BBC. There is no work being done


here today. Everyone is going through these lists! More excitement


in the newsroom than I have seen for a while.


Now, EU and UK negotiators are locked in a room -


several rooms actually - in Brussels for a third


day for this second round of Brexit negotiations.


We won't get an official statement from either side


on progress until tomorrow, but we know a man who's been touring


the Brussels' bars for those off-the-record briefings -


Where are we on the talks? Very good question. We are getting very little


detail about what is happening in those rooms, where they are


grappling with the three big issues, citizens rights for people in the UK


and British people living on the continent, the financial settlement,


the Brexit bill, Northern Ireland and what happens with the border.


Occasional details are coming out when we get a call saying, come and


meet me in the pub and I'll tell you a bit about what's being discussed.


We're waiting for tomorrow lunchtime, when David Davis is


supposed to be back in town with Michel Barnier and we will get an


understanding of what has happened. My understanding is there is


progress on the issue of citizens rights, they are closing on a deal


but not there yet. Northern Ireland, it has turned into an academic


seminar over Anglo relations in recent years, including the Good


Friday Agreement, and the real sticking point when it comes to


money. The UK delegation is really probing the legal basis that the


European Commission is coming up with for the rationales for the UK


paying a big financial lump sum. Could that delay further progress in


the talks? That is what we have heard from Brussels and EU


diplomats, that Michel Barnier may stall those talks, if there is an


agreement in some form on the divorce settlement?


That particular report, which appeared on a rival new service, is


being disputed by both sides. What they don't dispute is there is


frustration on both sides about this financial issue. The EU 's side is a


bit annoyed the UK hasn't been more forthcoming about their view on the


so-called Brexit Bill. The British side is not quite convinced about


the rationales for the bill existing in the first place. It is a crucial


thing, because Michel Barnier has made an agreement on a methodology


for calculating for some, one of the preconditions for the decision he


will make in October about whether sufficient progress has been made in


this set of talks, to move to the second set of talks, which is all


the stuff about the future relationship on trade and things


like that. It is worth remembering, both sides when it comes to the


bill, are talking about a methodology, a way of typing numbers


into their calculators to work out a final number, not a final number


being slid across the table on a post-it note by Michel Barnier. That


will come much greater. Talks about talks about further talks and


calculating that figure some way down the line. Is there a feeling


David Davis and the team haven't been well prepared for these talks?


Are you talking about a certain photograph that emerged on the first


day when David Davis set down in front Michel Barnier? Michel Barnier


and his team had a rich pile of papers in front of them, David Davis


and his team were pretty much empty handed. It gave critics of the


British government a bit more ammunition to say the Brits have


commented these negotiations underprepared. It is the EU that


have made the running by public -- publishing document after document.


They say they have been working on the document for a year ever since


the referendum happen. The rumour is in some bits of the talk, the


British delegation has piles of paper bigger than their European


counterparts and in some areas they feel they are better briefed than


the Europeans. Bright, I can see the level of these talks is getting to


high maturity levels. Thank you. Tobias, without wanting to compare


how big your pilot a breeze compared to mine, is that the perception that


the British side is not as well prepared as Michel Barnier? -- your


pilot of paper is bigger to mind? Information is plucked from various


sources. Your reporter says he's going round Brussels bar is going to


get information, that would be as accurate as going to Westminster


bars here. From recent parties it's proved productive! You get tittle


tattle, the lieutenant speaking about promoting generals on that


happens all the time. The amount of airtime you give these, that is up


to you. The picture itself is another great example. You know if


you walk down number ten Downing St, the last thing you do is show your


papers, because it curious that Oliver will take advantage of that.


Happens all the time. That particular picture shows a starting


point where the media came in. David Davis had a box full of papers. To


make a judgment on this is ridiculous. I think we eventually


got onto it in the report, that each week, each fortnight we are going


through the various issues, the Northern Ireland Borders, the cost


of departing, the EU citizenship, one by one these will be done but


they will be done behind closed doors and an announcement is made.


We need to be patient. How long do you think it will take to get the


divorce Bill part of the negotiations sorted out? We know


from Michel Barnier, he wants to wrap it up before moving to other


things? There is even an absolute determination on both sides to be


constructive about this. Also you had in the report is not just about


a figure being passed across but a formula being devised to make sure


we understand this is fair on both sides. This is part of what


negotiation is all about. I said, when do you think...? We haven't got


much time. Michel Barnier keep saying the clock is ticking. When


would you like to see some sort of announcement on the figure, so that


then things could move on to stuff like the free trade agreement? We


will hear that in detail tomorrow when a press statement is made. We


need to be patient. It is a two-year process and everyone is wanting to


have those answers now. All speculate what they might be when


they are wandering round Brussels bars. Should the EU go whistle, as


Boris Johnson suggested? I think we are sort of trivialising this


against a pipe that is what he said and he is the Foreign Secretary.


Britain has a lot to offer, one of the three big nations in Europe,


financial services, military, defence, intelligence, aerospace,


digital, pharmaceuticals, we lead Europe and the world. Was Boris


Johnson trivialising the debate? I won't comment on those... He said


very clearly they should go and whistle stop to what I'm saying is


we have very much to offer, strong hand to play, Europe knows that as


well. We must allow these talks to develop at their own pace. What is


Labour's Brexit policy? It is quite simple, we want the best deal. The


customs union and the single market, what is Labour's policy? We would


love to negotiate a deal so we can get rid of tariffs and have a strong


trading relationship with them. What we are looking at is how do we get


the best working relationship? How do we get the best deal, and how do


we maintain that in the long term? To get caught up with are we going


for the Common Market or the customs union? I'm less comfortable about


that. What I want is the vision. What I'm not seen for the -- from


the Tories is any vision or endgame. The EU will want specifics. You say


you're not comfortable with the idea of the single market and Customs


union, not comfortable coming out of the single market and Customs union


or staying in? I don't think the question is where I want to be. If


Labour says it wants to end free movement, presumably if you support


that part of the manifesto, you will be outside the single market?


Absolutely. And if you want to do free trade deals, Labour would be


supporting coming out of the customs union or not? At the moment, yes. We


would be. But what we're looking for is rather than getting caught up


with the labels, it's looking at what is the best deal we can get?


What I'm seeing from the Tories is they have got the vision or the game


max. They are going in and blustering. That is not working, on


us internationally. What we're looking to do at the moment is keep


everything on the table, to try and find. Including single market of the


single market and customs union? I don't think it will happen. You


agree with Caroline Flint who said this week we will look like liars,


talking about Labour, if we try and frustrate every government vote on


Brexit? We are not trained to do that at all and we haven't been.


We're trying to get the best of this country. We are in opposition. We


have about 18 months to negotiate something. The fact we're still


haggling about whether or not we are paying the divorce Bill seems crazy


to me. We could have sorted this out before we got to the referendum. The


Great Repeal Bill? At the moment as it stands, no... It transfers


exactly what we see at the moment without a problem, you won't support


that? You are looking at getting more and more delegated powers to


the executive and less and less scrutiny by Parliament. What we're


looking for is to make sure we have some accountability. We have been


elected to scrutinise, to challenge and to get the best for every one of


our electorate. Your bill at the moment is offering that.


The bill simply transfers the powers across so that we have stability.


The next phase beyond that is how you scrutinise the aspects of bad


Bill. But you do accept that there are these powers... And that is


where if you have differences, you could then raise them.


Lets just a sprain briefly to the viewers the reason that these powers


would allow the executive to make changes without going through


Parliament. So you are then going to block... ? At the moment we would


block it. We want a much better deal on the table that we know is going


to enable us to be able to protect workers' rights, to protect


environmental rights, to protect trading. As it stands, we would be


blocking it. And how much would you pay to settle the divorce Bill? I


don't know. Whatever is fair. My region of South Yorkshire has really


benefited over decades of investment. It wasn't a charity that


we were going to. We have a relationship, we are severing that


relationship and we need to do what is fair.


Now, the Government wants to let them rise -


Labour wants to scrap them altogether.


This afternoon MPs will debate university tuition fees.


Labour's relative success in the general election has been


credited in part to its pitch to younger voters,


In April, the Government gave universities the go-ahead


to increase tuition fees in line with inflation


English students starting in September are set


The Labour manifesto promised to scrap tuition fees altogether,


But in an interview with NME magazine, Jeremy Corbyn also


suggested the party would write off all student debt.


He said those who have already graduated shouldn't be


"burdened excessively" and he would "deal with it".


That would cost approximately ?100 billion, roughly equivalent


to the annual cost of day-to-day running of the NHS.


But senior figures in the party have appeared to row


back on the pledge, with Shadow Chancellor


John McDonnell saying it was just an "ambition",


But with Labour's success amongst young voters


at the general election, Theresa May's right hand man,


Damian Green, has admitted that there needs to be a "national


And drove. Sarah Champion, when Jeremy Corbyn said a week before the


election, he told voters that he would deal with historic student


debt what did he mean by that? You'll have to ask him. Chance would


be a fine thing! I will ask if you'll come on. I don't think it


will be possible, to be honest. How do you square it with people who


have already paid off their debt, for example? We can't change the


past, and I don't think the Treasury would allow us to roll back on


something. But I think immediately there are things that the Government


can do now, so for example we're looking at the interest rates that


students have to pay going up to 6.1%, which is crazy. If you go to a


high street bank, you can get a better rate than that. Why are we


lumbering students with about ?50,000 now to repay their tuition


fees, more for students from poorer backgrounds because they have had to


take out maintenance grants to survive, and I'm told the average is


?57,000, so the poorer you are, the bigger the amount of debt you have


got on your balance sheet. Why on top of that are you charging 6%


interest? This is why Damian Green has said that we need to have a


debate about this. I think we both agree that we have one of the


largest economies in the world, and to continue that, we need to have


academics and entrepreneurs that are able to go to university is not feel


prohibited because of the finances, said it is important to look at


this, but I'm glad that you should the promise made in the general


election because I think it diminishes British politics as a


whole when these promises are made and then when a Dibon so quickly


after so many students took this is the sole issue, the sole reason they


support Labour. I tell you what also is in British politics, and I see it


first hand almost every day of the week, and that is not answering the


question. My question is why are you charging 6% interest on student


loans? The package of measures depends on what course you are


doing, the length of the course and so on... You pay 6% whatever it is.


I agree that these figures need to be challenged, which is why... You


know what the rich parents are doing? They are taking that debt,


because they can do it, they are borrowing against their homes to


repay that debt at a much lower rate of interest, because they can afford


to do it. Poorer students from council houses or their parents rent


in the private sector, they can't do it. It's another on fairness in the


system. Hence the need for the debate. Let's not forget Labour


introduced tuition fees, the reason for that is when I went to


university, about a fifth of school leavers went to university, the


state could afford to pay that. Now it is 45-50% of school leavers


looking for a degree, and the state simply cannot pay. Labour understood


that before, which is why it is puzzling that they now want to write


it off. It was ?1000 contribution but we still had maintenance grants.


You have now shifted that alone is. I am 48 in a week, and I got a full


maintenance grant and I got all my tuition fees paid for, and I think I


have been a reasonable investment on this country. One of the reasons I


want a service I want to pay that back, I know it to my country. And


if it was a situation now coming from the background I came from, I


just couldn't, my family wouldn't even conceive of getting into that


much debt. The figures show that there are more kids from


working-class backgrounds than ever going to university. It is true,


although the most recent figures show a drop. They don't show that an


background, but what they do show, this is a good question for Tobias


Ellwood. The Government says that despite ?9,000 year fees, university


applications have been rising. But not this year, they are down 5%.


That sense of the accumulated debt seems to be taking its toll. We need


to look in more detail at the numbers. The reason they have


dropped is to do with the uncertainty to do with their


position on... They are down 6% in England where there are fees, but 2%


in Scotland, where there are no fees. 7% in Wales, where there are


fees, so clearly fees, it may not be the whole story, but they are a


part. 18% down for mature students. There is a concern with the number


of overseas students coming here who have been concerned about where


things are with Brexit. This is why Damian Green has called for a debate


on this matter. I want to see this continue... These are British


figures. Let me finish. You can't when you are proceeding on a wrong


premise. These are British figures, not overseas.


I am asking you to interrogate the numbers accurately. Here is the rub,


Sarah Champion. The Labour Party very down on tuition fees, the


Labour government in Wales has just increased tuition fees. What is it


all about? That is their choice. One of the things that we wanted, one of


the things the minister said he would do, was come to the chamber


and have a proper debate about this, but the reason we are having the


emergency debate today is he has refused to do that, and we have


asked him three times. May be the differences you are not in


Government in Westminster but you are in Wales, and clearly the Welsh


Labour government thinks it is a lot more difficult to abolish tuition


fees than you do. And I think voters would rightly think, it could be the


same in Westminster if you wrote in the government. They are increasing


fees. I can't speak for Wales, but we are committed in government to


get rid of fees, because we are seeing the impact that it has had on


people. I guess with devolution, you get different answers to the same


question. The Tories may have MPs called Hugo,


Crispin, Antoinette and... And as we learned yesterday,


they were supping Champagne on the Commons terrace


at their summer party But is Labour the real party


of the affluent classes? Well, a study by Professor Tim Bale


has revealed that 77% of surveyed Labour members are in the highest


ABC1 social groups. Keir Hardie would be turning in his


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until the autumn! It is a big weight off your shoulders.


It is a grey day in old London town. The final Prime Minister's Questions


before the London recess. And that's not all -


John Pienaar is here. I guess both the Prime Minister and


the Leader of the Opposition will want to send their troops away


thinking our person took the part. And to leave an impression on the


country watching Prime Minister's Questions time, that proportion of


the country that does, that needs to be borne in mind. What are you


saying?! We will be watching Theresa May, Jeremy Corbyn, but also the


backbenches will be interesting in this context. On the Tory side, they


will see their job as rattling their spears and cheering louder and more


heartily than we have seen for some time. It will be backing up the


message of various people in the party which is, we are behind you,


Theresa, but also echoing the rebuke to those around the Cabinet table


who have been staring up everything about leadership over austerity,


over Theresa May's austerity, so expect a nice row from the Tories.


On the Labour side, again that changing dynamic will be interesting


to watch. These are the same MPs who sat in sullen silence just weeks


ago, and now they are competing with the other side to rattle their


spears and cheer along. How things change. Nothing succeeds like a bit


of success! We are still waiting for that on this show, but it will come


one day. Any idea what Mr Corbyn will choose is the substance of his


questions? He will choose his own target, but it is generally on the


theme of austerity, so it will be about austerity, and with questions


about public sector pay, we have two more public review bodies in the


pipeline, and being kept there until September or so. You'd be surprised


I guess if he doesn't find time for a little bit of a dig on the public


sector. Lets go over and find out. I'm sure members from all sides will


wish to thank this house for their dedication to our work here in what


has been a particularly challenging year. We saw terrorists attack our


democracy and our way of life, not just in the Westminster attack but


also obviously in the attacks at Manchester, Finsbury Park and London


Bridge. It is thanks to the professionalism and bravery of


people like Elisabeth Byron, an off-duty A nurse who ran to the


Borough Market attack and is with us in the gallery today, that this


shows these attacks will never succeed because we are united in


defending the values that define our nation. This morning I had


ministerial meetings with colleagues and others and I will have further


such meetings later today. Mr Geoffrey Robinson. Thank you. I


wonder, could she find time in Coventry, when I can assure her a


very warm welcome from the three Labour MPs in Coventry who more than


doubled their recent majority. On a serious note, is she aware Coventry


is the National centre designated National Centre for the research and


development of controls the driverless vehicles? Would she not


consider perhaps it might be an appropriate location to relocate her


whole government there, where they can see the driverless vehicles in


practice? I'm grateful to the honourable gentleman. I'm always


happy to visit the West Midlands and I'm particularly pleased to visit


the West Midlands under its new mayor Andy Street. Who doing a very


good job. He mentions the question of automated vehicles. This country


is a leader in automated vehicles. That's part of building a strong


economy and that is what this government is doing.


Thank you Mr Speaker. Last week our National Health Service was judged


the best health care system. Best, safest and most affordable, better


than France, Germany, Norway, Switzerland, Australia, New Zealand.


Too often in this house we focus on the negatives and I've heard the


Labour Party attempt to... Well my right honourable friend, and I hope


the Leader of the Opposition when he stands, congratulates NHS staff on


their skills, dedication... CHEERING On their skills, dedication and the


hard work they have put in to achieve these high standards.


Can I thank my honourable friend. I am very happy to stand here and to


congratulate all of those NHS staff who are delivering, delivering such


a fantastic service, and who have made the NHS once again, because


this isn't the first time, once again, the number one health system


in the world. We are determined to continue to enable that high level


of service to be provided, which is why between 2015-2020 we will be


investing over half ?1 trillion in our NHS. Jeremy Corbyn.


Thank you Mr Speaker. I join the Prime Minister in thanking all the


staff of this house for all the work they do all the year-round. They are


fantastic, they are supported, inclusive and great to the public


who come here. I want to thank them for everything they do. I also the


Prime Minister in thanking the emergency services in how they have


coped with all the terrible emergencies we've had in the last


few months, and I have my -- thank my communities, like those in


Finsbury Park, who come together against those who try to divide us.


The emergency services were in action again protecting people from


floods. We always rely on those services. The Chancellor said this


week that some public servants are overpaid. Given the Prime Minister


has had to administer a slap down to her squabbling cabinet, does she


think the Chancellor was talking about her own ministers?


Can I... Can I first of all join the right honourable gentleman, not only


in praising the work of our emergency services but also in


recognising their way in which after the terrible terrorist attacks we've


seen on the Grenfell Tower fire, that appalling tragedy, the way we


have seen communities come together and support those who have been


victims of those terrible incidents that have taken place, and I was


very pleased, as he knows, to visit Finsbury Park after the attack that


took place that and see for myself the work that had been done in that


community and the work he had done over that night, in working among


his constituents to make sure the community came together after that


terrible attack. In terms of public sector pay, I


will simply say this, I recognise, as I said when I stood on the steps


of Downing Street a year ago, that there some people in our country who


are just about managing. They find life a struggle. That actually


covers people working in the public sector and some people working in


the private sector. That is why it is important that the Government is


taking steps, for example to help those on lowest incomes come up with


the national living wage, it's why we have taken millions of people out


of paying income tax altogether, its wide basic rate tax payers have seen


a tax cut the equivalent of ?1000. You only get that with a strong


economy and you only get that with a Conservative government. I thank the


Prime Minister for what she said about my own community, however my


question was about whether the Chancellor had said public service


workers are overpaid or not? The reality in this country is simply


this, a nurse in a medium salary starts on ?23,000. Police officers


?22,800. Job centre car parks on ?15,000. I had a letter from Sarah,


who wrote to me this week about her sister-in-law, who is a nurse. I


quote, she has sacrificed her health for the caring of others. She's had


a pay freeze for the last five years. Only her dedication and


passion for her vocation keeps her going. Why is this happening? What


is the Prime Minister saying to Sarah and those others working in


our NHS? I would say to the right honourable


gentleman, what I would say to Sarah and those working in the national


health service is we recognise the excellent work they are doing. We


recognise the sacrifice they and others have made over the last seven


years. That sacrifice has been made because we had to deal with the


biggest deficit in our peacetime history, left by a Labour


government. And as we look at public sector pay, as we look at that we do


balance being fair to public sector workers, protecting jobs, and being


fair to those who pay for them. The right honourable gentleman seems to


think it is possible to go about promising people more money and


promised that nobody is ever going to have to pay for it. He and I do


both value public sector workers. We both value our public sector


services, the difference is on the side of the House, we know you have


to pay for them. The Prime Minister doesn't seem to


have any problem finding money to pay for the DUP's support. Her


government has been in office, Mr Speaker, the Conservatives have been


in office that 84 months, 52 of those months have seen a real fall


in wages and income in our country. In the last Prime Minister Question


Time before the general election, the Prime Minister, this same Prime


Minister said, and I quote, "Every vote for me is a vote for a strong


economy, with the benefits felt by everyone across the country." Does


the Prime Minister great, you cannot have a strong economy when 6 million


people are earning less than a living wage?


I will tell the right honourable gentleman when you can't have a


strong economy, adopting labour policies, more borrowing, more


spending, more borrowing, high prices, higher taxes and fewer jobs.


The Labour government crashed the economy, the Conservative government


has come in, more people in work, more people in jobs, more


investment. Jeremy Corbyn. Can I buy the Prime Minister to take a chat


with reality on this? -- check on reality with this? Mr Speaker... One


in eight workers in the United Kingdom, that is 3.8 million people


in work are now living in poverty. 55% of people in poverty are in


working households. The Prime Minister's lack of touch with


reality goes like this... Low pay in Britain is holding people back at a


time of rising housing costs, rising food prices and rising transport


costs. It threatens people's living standards and rising debt and


falling savings rate threatens our economic stability. Why doesn't the


Prime Minister understand that low pay is a threat to an already


weakening economy? The best route out of poverty is


through work. What we now see is hundreds to do. Order, order, order!


A question has been asked, the Prime Minister's answer will be heard.


The best route out of poverty is through that is why it is so


important now over the last seven years we are seeing 3 million more


jobs being created in our economy. It is why we now see so many


thousands of people in households with work rather than in workless


households. Many more hundreds of thousands more children being


brought up in a household where there is work, rather than a failure


to have work. That is what is important. What's important for


government as well, is to make sure we do provide support to people.


That is why we created the National living wage. Biggest pay increase


for people on lowest incomes ever. When did the Labour Party ever


introduced the national living wage? Never. That was a Conservative


government. Jeremy Corbyn.


It was labour that first introduced the minimum wage, with opposition


from the Conservative Party. Mr Speaker, wages are lower than they


were ten years ago. The Prime Minister has been in office for just


one year. During that time, disposable income has fallen by 2%.


The economic consequences of false territory are very clear, and so are


the social consequences: life expectancy stalling for the first


time in 100 years. Today the IFA 's forecast income inequality is going


to get worse and that child poverty will rise to 5 million by 2022. Does


that Prime Minister... Order, order, members are shouting


and shouting excessively. They must calm themselves. Jeremy Corbyn.


I will try and help the honourable member, Mr Speaker. Does the Prime


Minister not realised that her talk of a strong economy doesn't remotely


match the reality that millions of people face, with low wages and


poverty at home? The right honourable gentleman is of


course wrong in some of the fact he is putting forward. In fact,


inequality is down, life expectancy is continuing to rise. But what we


know, in terms of a strong economy, is that what will not deliver a


strong economy for this country is Labour's policy of more borrowing,


more spending, higher taxes and fewer jobs. What the right


honourable gentleman wants his country living beyond its means.


That means making future generations pay for his mistakes. That is


Labour's way and the Conservatives will never do that.


Mr Speaker, what we want is a country where there are not 4


million people living in poverty. Where homelessness does not rise


every year, and I look along that front bench opposite, Mr Speaker,


and I see a Cabinet to grin and backbiting was the economy gets


weaker and people are pushed further into debt. You can try talking to


each other... Mr Speaker... The economy... Order, order! The


honourable gentleman for Stratford-upon-Avon is gesticulating


in a distinctly eccentric manner. Shakespeare's county deserves


better. Jeremy Corbyn. The reality is, wages are falling, the economy


is slowing, the construction sector in recession, trade deficit widening


and reflects crucial Brexit negotiations. Isn't the truth that


this divided government is unable to give this country the leadership it


so desperately needs now, to deal with these issues?


I will tell The right honourable gentleman the reality. The reality


is he is always talking Britain down, and we will lead Britain


forward. Let's look at the record of the Conservatives in government. 3


million more jobs, 4 million more people out of paying income tax


altogether, 30 million people with a cut in income tax, record levels of


the Berlin employment, record numbers of women in work, deficit


cut by three quarters, inequality Dan, record levels of foreign direct


investment. That is a record to be proud of, and you only get it with a


Conservative government. SHOUTING. I don't think the


honourable gentleman knew how popular he was! Will the Prime


Minister join me in again congratulating Gracie Shepherd, who


designed the black flag when she was just 12 years old, reflecting our


industrial heritage, and does she agree that the latest figures


showing the West Midlands as the fastest-growing part of this country


shows once again that the Black Country remains a great place to do


business? As my honourable friend says, he is right. The Black Country


remains a great place to do business, and I would like to


congratulate Gracie on designing that flag at the age of only 12


years, and I have to say I think I'm sure that she and others including


the Express and Star have been surprised at the attitude of the


benches opposite on this. I commend my honourable friend and my other


honourable friends in the Black Country and indeed the Express and


Star for the work they are doing to promote the Black Country is a great


place to do business, to live and to bring up children like Gracie. Does


the Prime Minister believe that her Government has delivered pensions


fairness from women who, like her, were born in 1950s? What the


Government is delivering for women is a better state pension for women


so that women in future will be better off under the state pension


that they have been in the past. We are equalising the state pension age


I think across the whole has everybody will Buckley denies that


is the right thing to do. The Prime Minister has found up to ?35 billion


for Hinkley point C nuclear power station. Up to 200 billion to


replace Trident, and 1 billion for a deal with the DUP just so she could


keep her own job. She seems to be to the magic money tree when she wants


to. Can the Prime Minister now end the injustice for those women who


are missing out on their pensions before she herself thinks about


retiring? I have to say to the honourable gentleman I am a little


surprised given his background that he said what he did about Hinkley


point. It is privately funded. This is not money that is coming from the


Government to developing viewpoint, so I find that a little strange. We


have put ?1 billion extra into this question of the change of the state


pension age to ensure that nobody sees their state pension age


increased by more than 18 months from that which was previously


expected. But I have to also say to the honourable gentleman that the


Scottish Government does also have extra powers in the area of welfare.


And perhaps... Perhaps it is time the Scottish Government got on with


the day job and stop talking about independence. Mr Speaker, businesses


in Stafford and other constituencies need as much certainty as possible


now about what will happen after we leave the EU in March 2019 for


investment decisions they are making in the coming weeks and months. As


the Government works on the cob rents a future relationship with our


European neighbours, would it also negotiate time bound transitional


arrangements which prioritise the jobs of our constituents and the


health of our economy? My honourable friend is absolutely right. As I


have said in this chamber and elsewhere before, we want to avoid a


cliff edge from businesses, because people want to know where they stand


and Tobia Arlt to carry on investing in the UK and creating those jobs


that we have seen being created. -- to be able to carry on investing in


the UK. We want to know what the end state relationship for the UK and


the EU will be in the future, and then we need a period to adjust to


that new end state, practical things will need to be done during that


period, and as part of the negotiations it will be important


for us to agree on that implementation period and what the


arrangements will be during that. Mr Speaker, since Winnie Ewing's maiden


speech 50 years ago this year, MSP is happening arguing for the voting


age to be lowered. In recent elections, young people have proven


themselves to be the most knowledgeable and engage they have


ever been. I believe there is a majority in this House in favour of


lowering the voting age. All the prime Ministers avoid giving the


vote to 16 and 17-year-olds? This is one of those issues on which people


will obviously have different views, my view continues to be that 18 is


the right edge. We expect people to continue in education or training,


and I think that is the right point for the voting age. In Harrow and up


and down the country, young people will be eagerly anticipating their


A-level results to see if they will qualify for a university education.


Could my right honourable friend confirmed the dramatic increase of


people from disadvantaged backgrounds going to universities,


and can she think of anyone that should apologise for misleading the


British public? Well, I think it is a very important as people are


thinking about going to university that they are not misled in any way.


It is the case that more disadvantaged 18-year-olds are now


applying to university than ever before. I believe the Leader of the


Opposition said exactly the opposite, and I think you should


apologise for having said that. But I think the Labour Party should go


further at the election. The Leader of the Opposition vowed to deal with


student debt, Labour were going to abolish it, now there a promise at


all. Students know Labour can't be trusted on student fees. The Prime


Minister will now know what it is like to have a job but lacked job


security. Sometimes it can even bring a tear to the eye. Given her


new-found empathy for millions of workers in insecure work, why is she


now cutting six DWP job centres in Glasgow, and also BRCA office staff


in my constituency where unemployment is twice the national


average? I start by welcoming the honourable gentleman to his new job


in this House. What is happening in relation to job centres in Scotland


is we are ensuring that it is using the estate properly to the best


advantage, and as a result of what is happening, no service is going to


be cut. In fact services to people using job centres will be enhanced


in future. What matters is actually the service that is provided to


people attending those job centres. The brave men and women of our Armed


Forces put themselves in extremely challenging situations in their


efforts to keep us all safe. We owe it to them therefore to do all we


can to support them and their families when they have completed


their service. I warmly welcome the launch of the mental health and


well-being strategy yesterday, but can my right honourable friend tell


the House how we can call Wood and eight this excellent programme with


our international allies, and may I wish her a very well-deserved break


when she finally decides to take recess. The issue Moura boyfriend


has raised is a very important one. Across this House we recognise the


importance of ensuring that we are providing the support -- the issue


my honourable friend has raised is a very important one. I welcome the


new strategy for mental health and well-being in the Armed Forces that


is being produced, and I also like to pay tribute to the tireless work


of my honourable friend from Plymouth, but he raises an important


issue. This isn't just for us in the UK, we need to work internationally


on this, which is why we launched the strategy at an international


conference. The Secretary of State for Defence yesterday launched this


at an international conference with counterparts from the United States,


Australia, Canada and New Zealand. We will all campaign against the


stigmas around mental health so that members of our Armed Forces veterans


can get the help they need. In Liverpool Walton, my constituency,


almost 40% of children are growing up in poverty. With schools closing


this week and local support services cut to the bone, Oster bites and


kids don't get fed. The Prime Minister's mission as she says it is


to make Britain a country that works for everyone. What is she doing now


to stop kids going hungry this summer in Liverpool Walton? I


welcome the honourable gentleman to his place in this House. He is right


that it is important that we look at the provision that is made in school


for children. We look at the issue of households on poverty. But as I


said to his writer or friend the Leader of the Opposition, the best


route out of poverty is for people to get into the workplace and for us


to ensure that there are better paid jobs being provided for people in


the workplace in the future. A young woman in Telford who gave evidence


in an horrific child sexual exploitation case five years ago is


living in fear. The perpetrator, who received a 22 year sentence, is


about to be released early. CSE victims are too often overlooked and


ignored. Does the Prime Minister agree with me that CSE victims


should be properly consulted upon the release of perpetrators, and


that in this case the perpetrator should not be returned to Telford?


This is a very important issue that my honourable friend has raised, and


we all know that child sexual exportation is a horrific crime


takes place, and it is right that if victims are going to come forward to


report this abuse, they need to know that they will have the support and


the confidence that they can do that, and be confident in their


future security and safety as well. The victim contact scheme is


supposed to treat victims properly, and it is supposed to ensure that


consideration is given to victim related conditions when they are


looking at the offender's license, and somebody being released. If she


would like to write tomorrow but friend the Justice Secretary, he


will look at it carefully. The interim Prime Minister has


repeatedly refused to answer the question from my right honourable


friend the Leader of the Opposition. It was reported at the weekend that


the temporary Chancellor said that some public sector workers were


overpaid. So can she tell the House and the country and those public


sector workers which ones she thinks are overpaid, which ones she thinks


are underpaid and what she is going to do about it? As I said earlier, I


recognise that there will be be born working in the public sector who do


find life a struggle, who are just about managing. There will be people


working in the private sector in the same place as well. I also say to


the honourable gentleman that some people working in the public sector


are very well paid, as we have seen in the figures released today. What


I also say is that we need to ensure that when we look at public sector


pay that we balance being fair to workers, protecting jobs and being


fair to those who pay for the public sector, and that also we give


support to people to ensure that they can keep more of the money that


they earn. That's why we believe it cutting taxes.


Mr Speaker, the Government is under predictable pressure on public


sector pay and spending, which we would all like to respond to, if it


was actually sensible to respond to some of these demands. But does my


right honourable friend agree that the only way in which a responsible


government can actually increase public sector pay is if we restore


to this country strong economic growth and a sensible government


fiscal balance sheet? And that the biggest threats to our achieving


either of those over the next two years are a bad Brexit deal putting


barriers to our trade and investment, or the return of a hard


left old-fashioned socialist government?


My right honourable friend is absolutely right. As a very


successful former Chancellor of the Exchequer with expertise on this


particular issue, he is right that we need to get a good Brexit deal,


but he's also right that the policies of the Leader of the


Opposition and the Shadow Chancellor, where they ever to get


the opportunity of putting them into practice, would not lead to more


money for nurses or for our National Health or more money for the health


sector. It would lead through its higher borrowing, higher spending,


higher taxes, we would see jobs going, we would see higher prices,


higher taxes for people, and we would see less money available for


our health service and our nurses. Does the Prime Minister know how


universal processes failing my constituents? Vulnerable Blackpool


people are juggling a month's money without help, a six-week wait for


money coming, causing more stress on a phone helpline which Citizens


Advice says can cost claimant 's 55p a minute. Couldn't she start by


getting a free phone number? I think the importance of the


Universal Credit scheme is it is ensuring that being in work always


pays. What we see from the Universal Credit scheme is we are seeing more


people getting into the workplace. The DWP is constantly looking at the


scheme and how it is operating around the country, to ensure any


problems that are being raised by people are being addressed.


Mr Speaker, thousands of my constituents are millions of


consumers in this country have to pay surcharges when they use their


credit or debit card, a highly unfair practice. Good my right


honourable friend outlined the impact of lifting of surcharges on


consumers in this country? My honourable friend is absolutely


right and I think it is very important this issue is being


addressed. We believe rip-off charges have no place in modern


Britain and that is why card charging abuse is going to come to


an end. This is about fairness and transparency. We don't want people


to be surprised when they come to pay for something, that they see an


extra surcharge suddenly being added because they have used a particular


card. We estimate the charges can add up and the total value of these


fees in 2010 was estimated at ?473 million. That money is going to be


put back in the hands of shoppers across the country, so they have


more cash to spend on the things that matter to them.


In her Lancaster House speech, the Prime Minister said the UK would be


leaving the single market. Can she tell the House whether that red line


on the single market also applies to any transition agreement or


implementation period that might be agreed for the period after March,


2019? We said we would no longer be


members of the single market because we will no longer be members of the


European Union. The four pillars of the European union are indivisible,


and therefore the other issues that we wish also to not be subject, like


the European Court of Justice and freedom of movement requirements,


mean we would no longer be members of the single market, at the end


point, at the end of the two years, when we have negotiated the deal,


there will be an end-stage agreement for that deal. We are clear, at the


point at which we reach the end of those negotiations, we will be out


of the EU. Can I welcome the report from the


IFS this week on income inequality in the UK. Contrary to Labour


propaganda, often repeated during the general election, the income gap


between rich and poor in our country has reduced every year since 2010.


Does my right honourable friend agree with me that this clearly


shows that those with a broader shoulders are bearing the heaviest


burden of dealing with the debt inherited from the last Labour


government? No, my honourable friend is


absolutely right. The IFS report very clearly shows what he has said


today. As we know, the top 1% of taxpayers are bearing 27% of the tax


burden. That is a higher burden than in any year under the Labour


government. NHS England commissioned child and


adult mental health beds in my constituency recently received a


damning si QC report. It was found on safe because they found a young


woman with MRSA with open wounds on a ward. Does the Prime Minister


share my concern that a shortage of mental health beds risks the NHS


placing very young and vulnerable people in unsafe environments? Will


she consider giving NHS England the responsibility and resources to


investigate the quality of care before the commission?


I think the honourable lady has raised a very significant point.


First of all, mental health we are boosting the funding going into


mental health and the national health service. We are taking a


number, and across the picture, across government in terms of


dealing with mental health, and taking a number of steps to improve


mental health. She has raised a very particular case, which I'm sure


everybody around this house will have been concerned here I will


ensure the Secretary of State looks into the case she has raised.


Daesh's atrocities have failed to deliver a caliphate. Does my right


honourable friend our international partners must commit resources to


bring prosecutions against Daesh fighters and those who join with


them? Making sure where ever a death cult had terrorist hides, we will


find them and hold them accountable? My honourable friend is absolutely


right about this. It is important that those who have committed these


horrific crimes are brought to justice. We have done good work as


the United Kingdom, in helping those in those theatres to see how they


can collect evidence which can be used in prosecutions. We want to do


this work internationally through the United Nations and is an issue


that yesterday I was speaking to the Prime Minister of Iraq about and we


want to work with them and others, to make sure we send a clear message


that my friend identified. Does the Prime Minister agrees a


huge increase in knife crime has tragic consequences for families in


constituencies like mine? What with the Prime Minister do to work with


me and other MPs across this house, to find solutions to this blight on


young lives, including looking again at the budget for policing?


Can I also welcome the honourable lady to the House, to her place in


the House. Her presence here, of course, has enabled me to have a


very good chief of staff appointed into my office at number ten. She


raises this issue... This... This issue is, the issue of knife crime,


she has raised a very serious issue of macro. The Government has been


taking a tougher stance on knife crime. We do think this is an issue.


We have done this in a whole variety of ways, so that now a a knife in


public you are much more likely to go to prison. We do recognise there


is more to do in this area. That is why yesterday the Home Secretary did


announce plans to consult on new offences to toughen up knife crime


laws, including restricting the online sale of knives. We have done


some of that already, and banning possession of dangerous or offensive


weapons on private property. The honourable lady has raised an issue,


the Government is addressing this, we recognise we need to do more and


that is what the Home Secretary is doing.


Before the election, the Government committed to removing the faith


-based cap for free schools and even included this promising a la


election manifesto. Catholic dioceses up and down the country are


anxious to open free schools and some of purchase sites. Will the


Prime Minister, her government to honouring a solemn pledge in our own


manifesto? My honourable friend will recognise


that the reason we put that in our manifesto and the reason it was in


the school's green paper that we published before the election was we


do believe it is important to enable faith schools, more faith schools to


be set up a more faith schools to expand. This is an issue my right


honourable friend the Secretary of State for Education is considering


and she will be publishing further details on our overall view, in


terms of improving school diversity and encouraging more good school


places to be created in the near future.


Last week the Prime Minister refused to make public a report on the


foreign funding of extremists in the UK, despite pressure from all sides


of this house and beyond. With survivors of 9/11 urging her to make


the report available, would she explain if this refusal is because


the contents of the report will embarrass the Government's trends in


Saudi Arabia or because they came about arms sales to Riyadh more than


public safety? It is absolutely nothing to do that.


Are certain elements of, and confidential elements in the report


that could not be made available. Mr Speaker, for signs of the strong


economy that Prime Minister has so eloquently been outlining this


morning, you need look no further than Taunton Deane. It is a


microcosm of the national picture, with record house-building, record


employment and record government investment in road schemes, like the


A358. Would the Prime Minister agree with me, to further fuel the


economic success this government is everything, these key road projects


should not just speed up traffic and ease congestion but more jobs,


further food and in productivity? I am very happy to recognise Taunton


Deane is a microcosm of the excellent economy we see across the


country. My honourable friend has made an important point and it is a


point the Government readily understands and accepts, the


importance of investing in infrastructure to boost our economy.


That's like the ordinance statement latte the Chancellor of the


Exchequer announced the investment fund, considerable proportion of


which will be going to infrastructure and we fully


recognise the importance not just of large-scale transport projects like


Crossrail and HS2 and the expansion of Heathrow, but also of investment


in projects at a more local level if we're going to unlock further


economic growth in areas like Taunton Deane.


Without legal powers, funds, criteria is all schools or


Parliament open, this in Keleher TriStar consulting on the closure of


the hospital and the building of a new ?400 million hospital in


Belmont. After five consultations over 18 years, wasting ?40 million


of tax payers money, isn't it time for the Prime Minister to step in


and put a stop to it and allow this important hospital to get on with


the day job? I would say to the honourable lady


that I understand Jepson Anson Keleher trust are seeking views on


specialist -- Epsom and St Helier. No final decisions have been made


and any decisions for further change will be subject to consultation.


Not only has the Institute for Fiscal Studies said we have the


lowest income gaps for a decade but the Office for National Statistics


has also said Britain has some of the lowest levels of persistent


poverty in all of Europe. Does my right honourable friend agree that


it is right that this country is governed by the true facts and not


the fake news? And that this government is committed to building


a strong economy for all? Can I start by welcoming my


honourable friend to her place in this chamber. Can I say she is


absolutely right. We owe it to our constituents and the public that we


actually ensure when we debate these issues, we debate on the basis of


the facts are not the basis of the sort of fake news we hear too often


being put forward in chamber. Mr Speaker, Lakeside children's


Centre is a lifeline for often struggling kids and their parents in


one of the poorest wards in Britain, giving them the best possible start


in life. Yet Lakeside and 26 children's Centre now face closure


in Birmingham. Does the Prime Minister understand that the


consequences of her actions, ?700 million of cuts to the City


Council's budget, is having a devastating impact on the provision


of children centres and Wilshire act properly to fund and reverse the


tidal wave of closures that will otherwise have a devastating impact


on the life chances of a whole generation of children?


Can I say to the honourable gentleman that obviously decisions


on this issue are being taken by the Birmingham Local Authority. It ill


behoves any member of the Labour Party to stand up and complain about


the issues we have had to address with public spending because they


are the direct result of a failure of a Labour government to manage our


economy. Order. And there we have it, another 45


minute session from Prime Minister's Questions, that is becoming the norm


under Speaker Bercow. On the 6th of September, they will be back,


briefly before they go off again for conference season. Jeremy Corbyn


going strongly on the need to increase public sector pay,


particularly at the lower end, teasing the Chancellor with the


reports, or teasing the Prime Minister with the reports that said


that public sector workers were overpaid. Broadening out his attack


into general low pay and inequality. The Prime Minister giving the


standard response that we need a strong economy to be able to tackle


all of these things, and that is what she is trying to provide and


wouldn't happen under Mr Corbyn. So, nothing we haven't heard before, but


it has been the theme of the past several weeks and months of this


battle between the two sides. We would just like to apologise to Keir


Hardie who I said would turn in his grave at how posh the Labour Party


has become. Somebody kindly treated to remind me that he was actually


cremated and his ashes scattered, so turning over in his grave would be a


physical impossibility. In fact, even if he had been buried, it would


be a physical impossibility! In the finest traditions of accuracy. No


fake news. On the issue of pay, more wind is


said that praising emergency services was keeping payload is an


insult, it is astounding that the Prime Minister cannot see it. Joe


Stuart said he doesn't think on his feet enough, Jeremy Corbyn, he


missed an open goal regarding the NHS. Ian White Lee says, Jeremy


Corbyn going on the economy was never going to go well as Mrs May


just batted him on his policies. She seems to have a spring in Hurst --


her step, and it appears these jobs are so poorly paid, these new


created jobs, that they don't pay income tax. And I would like to draw


everyone's attention to this, showing an SNP MP wearing a football


shirt. Hannah Ba Dell says, is that unparliamentary to show up in the


house wearing a football shirt? I believe it is unparliamentary, this


is coming from a woman who was told I have unparliamentary hair. I'm not


sure she wants to wear that as a badge of honour or shame. I don't


know this for a fact, but there has been a sports day event between MPs


and journalists, and she may have come straight from that, but will


she be told off? I think there will be a quiet word, yes. And you are


not in unparliamentary attire now, but still not wearing a tie. Is this


opening the floodgates? I'm not making a statement, it is just warm


in here! What did we see today? We saw the Chancellor giving a very


clear indication of what is going to happen to the public sector pay cap


in the long term. He has dug his heels in on the 1% cap from what we


hear, and we hear just about everything that goes on in Cabinet


now. It's like we are there! And the Prime Minister is standing behind


him for a good reason, the Cabinet, the Government, the Prime Minister


and the Chancellor see an obvious need to retake the high ground of


the economic argument, to reassert the case for fiscal competence,


because that ground was slipping. It slipped during the election, they


didn't expect that to happen, and before they move on the question of


the pay cap, there is an eminent possibility of that. They want to do


it from the position of strength and not weakness, and not allow Jeremy


Corbyn to claim all of the credit. We will see what happens in the


budget, because our vision only extends as far as the budget when


the Chancellor has to make fresh calculation is an way up the


politics. On the question Time session overall, Theresa May and


Jeremy Corbyn, we thought they would give some wellie, and they both did.


On her side, you could argue that that is perhaps low expectation, her


side are lining up behind her and propping her up, she can't be seen


to be stronger now than she was after the election, but she is more


stable, and that is a lot because the party as a whole are sticking


with her as strong as they possibly can. Survival equals stability in


their mind at the moment, and that means keeping her where she is for


the immediate future. Jeremy Corbyn was in campaign mode, and he will be


heading off to do that over the summer holidays, 70 something


constituents. Sarah is looking forward to it! That's my holiday!


You need to get out more. The Prime Minister claimed that work


is the route out of poverty, so why do 55% of poor families have


somebody in work? The essence of what she was saying is that every


week, a thousand people are coming in to work, 3 million people have


been employed since 2010, our economy has grown since 2010 by 15%.


That is the importance we need to focus on. Why are so many people in


work still poor? There won't be the money for any breach of the 1% pay


freeze if the economy doesn't grow. Let's come back to what I ask for


other than generalise about the economy. If work is the route out of


poverty, why are so many people in work in poverty? One in five workers


are in poverty. I'm not sure whether is figures are coming from. The


office of the National statistics. People have been taken out of paying


tax altogether, we have increased the national minimum wage, and we


need a working economy, going back to that point... You don't think


there is a problem in this country now with low paid, with low pay,


that people are working hard, following the Government's advice,


they are told the work is the route out of poverty, get a job, welfare


has been reconfigured to change the balance in favour of work and


against welfare, and you think that after doing all that, there are


still so many people on such low pay. There are 6 million people on


less than the living wage. This is unfinished business, we need to keep


working forward. But the alternative, which is to borrow


more, tax more, we'll see unemployment rise, it will see


interest rates rise as well, it will see inflation rise, too, and that


would mean that the debt will rise as well. Tobias, the alternative...


The alternative could be to invest in our workers, to skill them up and


try to get a high-income generating economy, because then we all benefit


from it, whereas we seem to be going to the lowest nominator. We are


doing that with apprentice schemes... We could be doing that


across-the-board. 3 million more British it introduced in 2010. They


are not apprenticeships as the Germans would recognise them. Both


parties have been pretty useless at this. They have never managed to


introduce a German or Austrian type apprenticeship. But I have a


question for you. The Leader of the Opposition said using an e-mail or


something he had had from a nurse, claiming in effect that nurses have


not had a pay rise for many years. That's not true, is it? It's not


technically true. It is not accurately true. They would be


getting their increase to the top of their banding, they have been


getting 1%... No, the 1% is separate. A nurse starting in


London, Tate London for an example, on ?26,500. Over seven years gets 4%


per year of increments, progression, on top of whatever the 1% or 2% or


0% may be. So after seven years, the salary is ?34,500. If they become a


senior nurse. These are not huge salaries, I understand that, but it


is not right to say that nurses' pay has been frozen, is it? Yes and no.


What is happening with those nurses as they are getting more experience,


more skills, moving up their pay grade, so they are getting more


remuneration for that. What they are not getting was you would get a cost


of living increase year-on-year. On top of that, but the pay hasn't been


frozen, it may still not be enough and we have a shortage of nurses,


which is a labour markets go to say it may not be enough, but I just


wanted to establish that it hasn't been frozen. We need to move on, but


John, she has made it to the summer recess. The Prime Minister. But they


will all come back in September, fully refreshed, and she is straight


into the Tory party conference. That's right. There is a common


understanding that they can't afford a break-up crisis, a collapse in the


party, which means the entire party, at this stage of the game. So they


go into the summer recess very grateful that they have got as far


as Thursday without anything blowing up. They might have a build-up to


the party conference, we have seen that before in past years. There


will be a great build-up of headlines and speculation and


punditry that says this conference will be a car crash, a beauty


contest for potential successors. It will be make or break the Theresa


May. She will get a massive cheer, and everyone will walk away again,


and the day after conference, it all begins again. It all begins again.


John, thank you for that. We need to move on.


Now, whilst we've been on air, MPs and journalists have been competing


In a moment we'll find out who won the egg-and-spoon,


three-legged and sack races, but we didn't want our studio


guests to miss out - we know they are both very


competitive - so Sarah and Tobias will be competing in that epic


You don't have to jump over anything all run around the studio.


Whilst you're doing that here's the Daily Politics'


sports correspondent, Jenny Kumah.


Journalists are used to chasing stories. MPs familiar with


overcoming parliamentary hurdles. But who will come out the winner of


this political sports day? We have named ourselves the Sporty Spices,


Damian hasn't decided which one he is! We will do our best. The


journalist who was fittest was the one who has all the long lunches!


First up, the egg and spoon race. Won by times journalist Matt


Chorley. I am elated. I was so pleased my egg didn't drop off! Vela


cross-party team of the sports minister and her shadow member in


the three legged race. But they're in initial joy turned sour after


they were disqualified. The video clearly shows that you were not in


fact three legged it. Pushing the Telegraph team into first place. So,


can the MPs pull it back to win the tug-of-war?


But had the politicians done enough to triumph over the media? In last


place, MPs, if you would like to come and collect...


This wasn't just all about winning or losing. The money raised from


today's charity event will go to the Met police benevolent fund. Clearly


they cheated. We played honourably. Damian Welch run an inquiry and


unsubscribe to all of the newsletters. We can build on this. I


am over the moon, my dreams have come true.


I have been umpiring this fearsome game of tiddlywinks, and they are


both doing reasonably well! Useless! I have given up.


Guess the year was 1990, the poll tax riots gave it the clue. Tobias,


could you press the button? And Andy from Birmingham, you got the answer


right. The One O'Clock News is starting


over on BBC One now. I will be here at noon tomorrow


with all the big political The BBC Proms celebrates


the extraordinary film music


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