19/07/2017 Daily Politics

Morning folks - welcome to the Daily Politics.

The divorce bill is the big sticking point as negotiators are locked

in for a third day of Brexit negotiations in Brussels -

might agreement on the final sum only come at the 11th hour?

Tuition fees have caused a lot of anger amongst students,

But the government have given universities the go-ahead to

increase them. Labour want to scrap them

altogether, but would that be a good As MPs pack their bucket and spade,

we'll bring you the final PMQs And it wouldn't be the end of term

without a sports day... Will MPs or journalists win the egg

and spoon race? The shock of the News of the egg and

spoon race! Is Gary Lineker coming on to do this pick? I hope so.

The Defence Secretary, Michael Fallon, called

on his colleagues last night to be more disciplined and loyal,

and to concentrate their fire on a "dangerous enemy within reach

We'll expect nothing less of former soldier, Tobias Ellwood,

now a Defence Minister himself, who is with us for the duration.

And we have a formidable adversary for him -

the Shadow Secretary of Women and Equalities, Sarah Champion.

First, in the last hour or so the BBC has published details

of the salaries of on-screen talent earning more than ?150,000 from

The disclosure was demanded by the Government in the most recent

The BBC didn't really want to do it but the government said they had to.

Only a third of the highest paid reporters and presenters are women -

a situation the director general, Tony Hall, has described

The Chairman of the Common's Culture, Media and Sport Committee,

Damian Collins, welcomed publication of the salary details.

The reason we want a disclosure on salaries is we can see,

do these salaries look competitive or not?

Everyone will expect the top talent, the top on-screen talent,

to be earning high salaries at equivalent levels to people

But what will be interesting to see is other people

within the organisation, maybe at much more middle-ranking

levels, are they on unusually high salaries as well?

And that's why I think it's important that those

When the BBC is funded by the licence fee payer,

and periodically we hear that certain much-loved services

or programmes have to be cut, and there are cutbacks on local

radio, I think it's not unreasonable the licence

fee payers ask the BBC, well, how do you spend

Just some of the reaction to this list today. Sarah Champion, is it a

worthwhile exercise? I don't think so, personally, I know that might be

shocking. I know football players get paid a huge amount and film

stars get paid a huge amount but to be quite honest, if I was reading

the news... I concede market forces are the way they are. Your Tory

colleague says this allows us, his committee and others in public life,

to compare if the BBC are paying market levels or not. Can you do

that when we don't know what the equivalent presenters in Skye, ITV

channel for getting? You illustrate the challenge we face here. Where I

disagree is for competitive football players of film stars, this is

public money. The nation is paying for this. We don't doubt your

talent, but we do want to know... You do. We want to do how much you

are paid. Some of these some side large on the BBC needs to respond to

that. Most importantly, it has highlighted a gender pay gap. I

think that is something Tony Hall must address immediately. He says he

will, we will see. Have you had a look at the list yet, did anything

jump out? Where it is interesting, I'm Brad Tony Hall has said he will

look at the gender pay gap. It's not just about figures but about those

structural blocks that prevents women from reaching their full

potential. That happens in the BBC, we know it happens in journalism and

politics. The figures that come out today, we can now see the scale of

the problem. Exactly, when you are looking like for like, if there are

differences between men and women doing the same job, commanding the

same sort of audience figures, then I think the BBC is right to do

something about it and we are right to know that. However, to be quite

honest, this is another example, the Tories have in for the BBC on this

is another way of having a go at them. Why'd you have it in for the

BBC? I don't agree with that, I am huge supporter, as the party is, for

BBC, nationally and worldwide. It's part of promoting British influence

around the world and respected around the world. To suggest this is

some sort of Tory plot... This is taxpayers money, the nation paying

for this and that is why we have every right to understand. To put

that into context, yes you are in a competitive environment. Let me come

back to the point where we began. You said it's a huge challenge, but

I'm not sure how we resolve it, since we don't know what Adam

Boulton at Sky News is getting all Robert Peston, we don't know what

our equivalents in the other networks are getting. It is not your

intention, I understand, to force them to publish summaries, you

couldn't? They are not taking money from the people. The licence fee

means there needs to be... Comparison. That is a case for

publishing, I understand that argument. But your colleague was

arguing, we can now make comparisons. My point, I will make

for a third time and then shut up, you cannot make comparisons because

you don't have data that allows you to make the comparison. I understand

that. Hopefully we will see some of the private sector coming forward

and being more transparent. There is a fundamental issue, that it's right

the nation sees... You made that .4-macro

times, I haven't contested it. Damian Collins made another point,

regional areas, where is money spent? The balance of national and

local media is important across the BBC. There is no work being done

here today. Everyone is going through these lists! More excitement

in the newsroom than I have seen for a while.

Now, EU and UK negotiators are locked in a room -

several rooms actually - in Brussels for a third

day for this second round of Brexit negotiations.

We won't get an official statement from either side

on progress until tomorrow, but we know a man who's been touring

the Brussels' bars for those off-the-record briefings -

Where are we on the talks? Very good question. We are getting very little

detail about what is happening in those rooms, where they are

grappling with the three big issues, citizens rights for people in the UK

and British people living on the continent, the financial settlement,

the Brexit bill, Northern Ireland and what happens with the border.

Occasional details are coming out when we get a call saying, come and

meet me in the pub and I'll tell you a bit about what's being discussed.

We're waiting for tomorrow lunchtime, when David Davis is

supposed to be back in town with Michel Barnier and we will get an

understanding of what has happened. My understanding is there is

progress on the issue of citizens rights, they are closing on a deal

but not there yet. Northern Ireland, it has turned into an academic

seminar over Anglo relations in recent years, including the Good

Friday Agreement, and the real sticking point when it comes to

money. The UK delegation is really probing the legal basis that the

European Commission is coming up with for the rationales for the UK

paying a big financial lump sum. Could that delay further progress in

the talks? That is what we have heard from Brussels and EU

diplomats, that Michel Barnier may stall those talks, if there is an

agreement in some form on the divorce settlement?

That particular report, which appeared on a rival new service, is

being disputed by both sides. What they don't dispute is there is

frustration on both sides about this financial issue. The EU 's side is a

bit annoyed the UK hasn't been more forthcoming about their view on the

so-called Brexit Bill. The British side is not quite convinced about

the rationales for the bill existing in the first place. It is a crucial

thing, because Michel Barnier has made an agreement on a methodology

for calculating for some, one of the preconditions for the decision he

will make in October about whether sufficient progress has been made in

this set of talks, to move to the second set of talks, which is all

the stuff about the future relationship on trade and things

like that. It is worth remembering, both sides when it comes to the

bill, are talking about a methodology, a way of typing numbers

into their calculators to work out a final number, not a final number

being slid across the table on a post-it note by Michel Barnier. That

will come much greater. Talks about talks about further talks and

calculating that figure some way down the line. Is there a feeling

David Davis and the team haven't been well prepared for these talks?

Are you talking about a certain photograph that emerged on the first

day when David Davis set down in front Michel Barnier? Michel Barnier

and his team had a rich pile of papers in front of them, David Davis

and his team were pretty much empty handed. It gave critics of the

British government a bit more ammunition to say the Brits have

commented these negotiations underprepared. It is the EU that

have made the running by public -- publishing document after document.

They say they have been working on the document for a year ever since

the referendum happen. The rumour is in some bits of the talk, the

British delegation has piles of paper bigger than their European

counterparts and in some areas they feel they are better briefed than

the Europeans. Bright, I can see the level of these talks is getting to

high maturity levels. Thank you. Tobias, without wanting to compare

how big your pilot a breeze compared to mine, is that the perception that

the British side is not as well prepared as Michel Barnier? -- your

pilot of paper is bigger to mind? Information is plucked from various

sources. Your reporter says he's going round Brussels bar is going to

get information, that would be as accurate as going to Westminster

bars here. From recent parties it's proved productive! You get tittle

tattle, the lieutenant speaking about promoting generals on that

happens all the time. The amount of airtime you give these, that is up

to you. The picture itself is another great example. You know if

you walk down number ten Downing St, the last thing you do is show your

papers, because it curious that Oliver will take advantage of that.

Happens all the time. That particular picture shows a starting

point where the media came in. David Davis had a box full of papers. To

make a judgment on this is ridiculous. I think we eventually

got onto it in the report, that each week, each fortnight we are going

through the various issues, the Northern Ireland Borders, the cost

of departing, the EU citizenship, one by one these will be done but

they will be done behind closed doors and an announcement is made.

We need to be patient. How long do you think it will take to get the

divorce Bill part of the negotiations sorted out? We know

from Michel Barnier, he wants to wrap it up before moving to other

things? There is even an absolute determination on both sides to be

constructive about this. Also you had in the report is not just about

a figure being passed across but a formula being devised to make sure

we understand this is fair on both sides. This is part of what

negotiation is all about. I said, when do you think...? We haven't got

much time. Michel Barnier keep saying the clock is ticking. When

would you like to see some sort of announcement on the figure, so that

then things could move on to stuff like the free trade agreement? We

will hear that in detail tomorrow when a press statement is made. We

need to be patient. It is a two-year process and everyone is wanting to

have those answers now. All speculate what they might be when

they are wandering round Brussels bars. Should the EU go whistle, as

Boris Johnson suggested? I think we are sort of trivialising this

against a pipe that is what he said and he is the Foreign Secretary.

Britain has a lot to offer, one of the three big nations in Europe,

financial services, military, defence, intelligence, aerospace,

digital, pharmaceuticals, we lead Europe and the world. Was Boris

Johnson trivialising the debate? I won't comment on those... He said

very clearly they should go and whistle stop to what I'm saying is

we have very much to offer, strong hand to play, Europe knows that as

well. We must allow these talks to develop at their own pace. What is

Labour's Brexit policy? It is quite simple, we want the best deal. The

customs union and the single market, what is Labour's policy? We would

love to negotiate a deal so we can get rid of tariffs and have a strong

trading relationship with them. What we are looking at is how do we get

the best working relationship? How do we get the best deal, and how do

we maintain that in the long term? To get caught up with are we going

for the Common Market or the customs union? I'm less comfortable about

that. What I want is the vision. What I'm not seen for the -- from

the Tories is any vision or endgame. The EU will want specifics. You say

you're not comfortable with the idea of the single market and Customs

union, not comfortable coming out of the single market and Customs union

or staying in? I don't think the question is where I want to be. If

Labour says it wants to end free movement, presumably if you support

that part of the manifesto, you will be outside the single market?

Absolutely. And if you want to do free trade deals, Labour would be

supporting coming out of the customs union or not? At the moment, yes. We

would be. But what we're looking for is rather than getting caught up

with the labels, it's looking at what is the best deal we can get?

What I'm seeing from the Tories is they have got the vision or the game

max. They are going in and blustering. That is not working, on

us internationally. What we're looking to do at the moment is keep

everything on the table, to try and find. Including single market of the

single market and customs union? I don't think it will happen. You

agree with Caroline Flint who said this week we will look like liars,

talking about Labour, if we try and frustrate every government vote on

Brexit? We are not trained to do that at all and we haven't been.

We're trying to get the best of this country. We are in opposition. We

have about 18 months to negotiate something. The fact we're still

haggling about whether or not we are paying the divorce Bill seems crazy

to me. We could have sorted this out before we got to the referendum. The

Great Repeal Bill? At the moment as it stands, no... It transfers

exactly what we see at the moment without a problem, you won't support

that? You are looking at getting more and more delegated powers to

the executive and less and less scrutiny by Parliament. What we're

looking for is to make sure we have some accountability. We have been

elected to scrutinise, to challenge and to get the best for every one of

our electorate. Your bill at the moment is offering that.

The bill simply transfers the powers across so that we have stability.

The next phase beyond that is how you scrutinise the aspects of bad

Bill. But you do accept that there are these powers... And that is

where if you have differences, you could then raise them.

Lets just a sprain briefly to the viewers the reason that these powers

would allow the executive to make changes without going through

Parliament. So you are then going to block... ? At the moment we would

block it. We want a much better deal on the table that we know is going

to enable us to be able to protect workers' rights, to protect

environmental rights, to protect trading. As it stands, we would be

blocking it. And how much would you pay to settle the divorce Bill? I

don't know. Whatever is fair. My region of South Yorkshire has really

benefited over decades of investment. It wasn't a charity that

we were going to. We have a relationship, we are severing that

relationship and we need to do what is fair.

Now, the Government wants to let them rise -

Labour wants to scrap them altogether.

This afternoon MPs will debate university tuition fees.

Labour's relative success in the general election has been

credited in part to its pitch to younger voters,

In April, the Government gave universities the go-ahead

to increase tuition fees in line with inflation

English students starting in September are set

The Labour manifesto promised to scrap tuition fees altogether,

But in an interview with NME magazine, Jeremy Corbyn also

suggested the party would write off all student debt.

He said those who have already graduated shouldn't be

"burdened excessively" and he would "deal with it".

That would cost approximately ?100 billion, roughly equivalent

to the annual cost of day-to-day running of the NHS.

But senior figures in the party have appeared to row

back on the pledge, with Shadow Chancellor

John McDonnell saying it was just an "ambition",

But with Labour's success amongst young voters

at the general election, Theresa May's right hand man,

Damian Green, has admitted that there needs to be a "national

And drove. Sarah Champion, when Jeremy Corbyn said a week before the

election, he told voters that he would deal with historic student

debt what did he mean by that? You'll have to ask him. Chance would

be a fine thing! I will ask if you'll come on. I don't think it

will be possible, to be honest. How do you square it with people who

have already paid off their debt, for example? We can't change the

past, and I don't think the Treasury would allow us to roll back on

something. But I think immediately there are things that the Government

can do now, so for example we're looking at the interest rates that

students have to pay going up to 6.1%, which is crazy. If you go to a

high street bank, you can get a better rate than that. Why are we

lumbering students with about ?50,000 now to repay their tuition

fees, more for students from poorer backgrounds because they have had to

take out maintenance grants to survive, and I'm told the average is

?57,000, so the poorer you are, the bigger the amount of debt you have

got on your balance sheet. Why on top of that are you charging 6%

interest? This is why Damian Green has said that we need to have a

debate about this. I think we both agree that we have one of the

largest economies in the world, and to continue that, we need to have

academics and entrepreneurs that are able to go to university is not feel

prohibited because of the finances, said it is important to look at

this, but I'm glad that you should the promise made in the general

election because I think it diminishes British politics as a

whole when these promises are made and then when a Dibon so quickly

after so many students took this is the sole issue, the sole reason they

support Labour. I tell you what also is in British politics, and I see it

first hand almost every day of the week, and that is not answering the

question. My question is why are you charging 6% interest on student

loans? The package of measures depends on what course you are

doing, the length of the course and so on... You pay 6% whatever it is.

I agree that these figures need to be challenged, which is why... You

know what the rich parents are doing? They are taking that debt,

because they can do it, they are borrowing against their homes to

repay that debt at a much lower rate of interest, because they can afford

to do it. Poorer students from council houses or their parents rent

in the private sector, they can't do it. It's another on fairness in the

system. Hence the need for the debate. Let's not forget Labour

introduced tuition fees, the reason for that is when I went to

university, about a fifth of school leavers went to university, the

state could afford to pay that. Now it is 45-50% of school leavers

looking for a degree, and the state simply cannot pay. Labour understood

that before, which is why it is puzzling that they now want to write

it off. It was ?1000 contribution but we still had maintenance grants.

You have now shifted that alone is. I am 48 in a week, and I got a full

maintenance grant and I got all my tuition fees paid for, and I think I

have been a reasonable investment on this country. One of the reasons I

want a service I want to pay that back, I know it to my country. And

if it was a situation now coming from the background I came from, I

just couldn't, my family wouldn't even conceive of getting into that

much debt. The figures show that there are more kids from

working-class backgrounds than ever going to university. It is true,

although the most recent figures show a drop. They don't show that an

background, but what they do show, this is a good question for Tobias

Ellwood. The Government says that despite ?9,000 year fees, university

applications have been rising. But not this year, they are down 5%.

That sense of the accumulated debt seems to be taking its toll. We need

to look in more detail at the numbers. The reason they have

dropped is to do with the uncertainty to do with their

position on... They are down 6% in England where there are fees, but 2%

in Scotland, where there are no fees. 7% in Wales, where there are

fees, so clearly fees, it may not be the whole story, but they are a

part. 18% down for mature students. There is a concern with the number

of overseas students coming here who have been concerned about where

things are with Brexit. This is why Damian Green has called for a debate

on this matter. I want to see this continue... These are British

figures. Let me finish. You can't when you are proceeding on a wrong

premise. These are British figures, not overseas.

I am asking you to interrogate the numbers accurately. Here is the rub,

Sarah Champion. The Labour Party very down on tuition fees, the

Labour government in Wales has just increased tuition fees. What is it

all about? That is their choice. One of the things that we wanted, one of

the things the minister said he would do, was come to the chamber

and have a proper debate about this, but the reason we are having the

emergency debate today is he has refused to do that, and we have

asked him three times. May be the differences you are not in

Government in Westminster but you are in Wales, and clearly the Welsh

Labour government thinks it is a lot more difficult to abolish tuition

fees than you do. And I think voters would rightly think, it could be the

same in Westminster if you wrote in the government. They are increasing

fees. I can't speak for Wales, but we are committed in government to

get rid of fees, because we are seeing the impact that it has had on

people. I guess with devolution, you get different answers to the same

question. The Tories may have MPs called Hugo,

Crispin, Antoinette and... And as we learned yesterday,

they were supping Champagne on the Commons terrace

at their summer party But is Labour the real party

of the affluent classes? Well, a study by Professor Tim Bale

has revealed that 77% of surveyed Labour members are in the highest

ABC1 social groups. Keir Hardie would be turning in his

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until the autumn! It is a big weight off your shoulders.

It is a grey day in old London town. The final Prime Minister's Questions

before the London recess. And that's not all -

John Pienaar is here. I guess both the Prime Minister and

the Leader of the Opposition will want to send their troops away

thinking our person took the part. And to leave an impression on the

country watching Prime Minister's Questions time, that proportion of

the country that does, that needs to be borne in mind. What are you

saying?! We will be watching Theresa May, Jeremy Corbyn, but also the

backbenches will be interesting in this context. On the Tory side, they

will see their job as rattling their spears and cheering louder and more

heartily than we have seen for some time. It will be backing up the

message of various people in the party which is, we are behind you,

Theresa, but also echoing the rebuke to those around the Cabinet table

who have been staring up everything about leadership over austerity,

over Theresa May's austerity, so expect a nice row from the Tories.

On the Labour side, again that changing dynamic will be interesting

to watch. These are the same MPs who sat in sullen silence just weeks

ago, and now they are competing with the other side to rattle their

spears and cheer along. How things change. Nothing succeeds like a bit

of success! We are still waiting for that on this show, but it will come

one day. Any idea what Mr Corbyn will choose is the substance of his

questions? He will choose his own target, but it is generally on the

theme of austerity, so it will be about austerity, and with questions

about public sector pay, we have two more public review bodies in the

pipeline, and being kept there until September or so. You'd be surprised

I guess if he doesn't find time for a little bit of a dig on the public

sector. Lets go over and find out. I'm sure members from all sides will

wish to thank this house for their dedication to our work here in what

has been a particularly challenging year. We saw terrorists attack our

democracy and our way of life, not just in the Westminster attack but

also obviously in the attacks at Manchester, Finsbury Park and London

Bridge. It is thanks to the professionalism and bravery of

people like Elisabeth Byron, an off-duty A nurse who ran to the

Borough Market attack and is with us in the gallery today, that this

shows these attacks will never succeed because we are united in

defending the values that define our nation. This morning I had

ministerial meetings with colleagues and others and I will have further

such meetings later today. Mr Geoffrey Robinson. Thank you. I

wonder, could she find time in Coventry, when I can assure her a

very warm welcome from the three Labour MPs in Coventry who more than

doubled their recent majority. On a serious note, is she aware Coventry

is the National centre designated National Centre for the research and

development of controls the driverless vehicles? Would she not

consider perhaps it might be an appropriate location to relocate her

whole government there, where they can see the driverless vehicles in

practice? I'm grateful to the honourable gentleman. I'm always

happy to visit the West Midlands and I'm particularly pleased to visit

the West Midlands under its new mayor Andy Street. Who doing a very

good job. He mentions the question of automated vehicles. This country

is a leader in automated vehicles. That's part of building a strong

economy and that is what this government is doing.

Thank you Mr Speaker. Last week our National Health Service was judged

the best health care system. Best, safest and most affordable, better

than France, Germany, Norway, Switzerland, Australia, New Zealand.

Too often in this house we focus on the negatives and I've heard the

Labour Party attempt to... Well my right honourable friend, and I hope

the Leader of the Opposition when he stands, congratulates NHS staff on

their skills, dedication... CHEERING On their skills, dedication and the

hard work they have put in to achieve these high standards.

Can I thank my honourable friend. I am very happy to stand here and to

congratulate all of those NHS staff who are delivering, delivering such

a fantastic service, and who have made the NHS once again, because

this isn't the first time, once again, the number one health system

in the world. We are determined to continue to enable that high level

of service to be provided, which is why between 2015-2020 we will be

investing over half ?1 trillion in our NHS. Jeremy Corbyn.

Thank you Mr Speaker. I join the Prime Minister in thanking all the

staff of this house for all the work they do all the year-round. They are

fantastic, they are supported, inclusive and great to the public

who come here. I want to thank them for everything they do. I also the

Prime Minister in thanking the emergency services in how they have

coped with all the terrible emergencies we've had in the last

few months, and I have my -- thank my communities, like those in

Finsbury Park, who come together against those who try to divide us.

The emergency services were in action again protecting people from

floods. We always rely on those services. The Chancellor said this

week that some public servants are overpaid. Given the Prime Minister

has had to administer a slap down to her squabbling cabinet, does she

think the Chancellor was talking about her own ministers?

Can I... Can I first of all join the right honourable gentleman, not only

in praising the work of our emergency services but also in

recognising their way in which after the terrible terrorist attacks we've

seen on the Grenfell Tower fire, that appalling tragedy, the way we

have seen communities come together and support those who have been

victims of those terrible incidents that have taken place, and I was

very pleased, as he knows, to visit Finsbury Park after the attack that

took place that and see for myself the work that had been done in that

community and the work he had done over that night, in working among

his constituents to make sure the community came together after that

terrible attack. In terms of public sector pay, I

will simply say this, I recognise, as I said when I stood on the steps

of Downing Street a year ago, that there some people in our country who

are just about managing. They find life a struggle. That actually

covers people working in the public sector and some people working in

the private sector. That is why it is important that the Government is

taking steps, for example to help those on lowest incomes come up with

the national living wage, it's why we have taken millions of people out

of paying income tax altogether, its wide basic rate tax payers have seen

a tax cut the equivalent of ?1000. You only get that with a strong

economy and you only get that with a Conservative government. I thank the

Prime Minister for what she said about my own community, however my

question was about whether the Chancellor had said public service

workers are overpaid or not? The reality in this country is simply

this, a nurse in a medium salary starts on ?23,000. Police officers

?22,800. Job centre car parks on ?15,000. I had a letter from Sarah,

who wrote to me this week about her sister-in-law, who is a nurse. I

quote, she has sacrificed her health for the caring of others. She's had

a pay freeze for the last five years. Only her dedication and

passion for her vocation keeps her going. Why is this happening? What

is the Prime Minister saying to Sarah and those others working in

our NHS? I would say to the right honourable

gentleman, what I would say to Sarah and those working in the national

health service is we recognise the excellent work they are doing. We

recognise the sacrifice they and others have made over the last seven

years. That sacrifice has been made because we had to deal with the

biggest deficit in our peacetime history, left by a Labour

government. And as we look at public sector pay, as we look at that we do

balance being fair to public sector workers, protecting jobs, and being

fair to those who pay for them. The right honourable gentleman seems to

think it is possible to go about promising people more money and

promised that nobody is ever going to have to pay for it. He and I do

both value public sector workers. We both value our public sector

services, the difference is on the side of the House, we know you have

to pay for them. The Prime Minister doesn't seem to

have any problem finding money to pay for the DUP's support. Her

government has been in office, Mr Speaker, the Conservatives have been

in office that 84 months, 52 of those months have seen a real fall

in wages and income in our country. In the last Prime Minister Question

Time before the general election, the Prime Minister, this same Prime

Minister said, and I quote, "Every vote for me is a vote for a strong

economy, with the benefits felt by everyone across the country." Does

the Prime Minister great, you cannot have a strong economy when 6 million

people are earning less than a living wage?

I will tell the right honourable gentleman when you can't have a

strong economy, adopting labour policies, more borrowing, more

spending, more borrowing, high prices, higher taxes and fewer jobs.

The Labour government crashed the economy, the Conservative government

has come in, more people in work, more people in jobs, more

investment. Jeremy Corbyn. Can I buy the Prime Minister to take a chat

with reality on this? -- check on reality with this? Mr Speaker... One

in eight workers in the United Kingdom, that is 3.8 million people

in work are now living in poverty. 55% of people in poverty are in

working households. The Prime Minister's lack of touch with

reality goes like this... Low pay in Britain is holding people back at a

time of rising housing costs, rising food prices and rising transport

costs. It threatens people's living standards and rising debt and

falling savings rate threatens our economic stability. Why doesn't the

Prime Minister understand that low pay is a threat to an already

weakening economy? The best route out of poverty is

through work. What we now see is hundreds to do. Order, order, order!

A question has been asked, the Prime Minister's answer will be heard.

The best route out of poverty is through that is why it is so

important now over the last seven years we are seeing 3 million more

jobs being created in our economy. It is why we now see so many

thousands of people in households with work rather than in workless

households. Many more hundreds of thousands more children being

brought up in a household where there is work, rather than a failure

to have work. That is what is important. What's important for

government as well, is to make sure we do provide support to people.

That is why we created the National living wage. Biggest pay increase

for people on lowest incomes ever. When did the Labour Party ever

introduced the national living wage? Never. That was a Conservative

government. Jeremy Corbyn.

It was labour that first introduced the minimum wage, with opposition

from the Conservative Party. Mr Speaker, wages are lower than they

were ten years ago. The Prime Minister has been in office for just

one year. During that time, disposable income has fallen by 2%.

The economic consequences of false territory are very clear, and so are

the social consequences: life expectancy stalling for the first

time in 100 years. Today the IFA 's forecast income inequality is going

to get worse and that child poverty will rise to 5 million by 2022. Does

that Prime Minister... Order, order, members are shouting

and shouting excessively. They must calm themselves. Jeremy Corbyn.

I will try and help the honourable member, Mr Speaker. Does the Prime

Minister not realised that her talk of a strong economy doesn't remotely

match the reality that millions of people face, with low wages and

poverty at home? The right honourable gentleman is of

course wrong in some of the fact he is putting forward. In fact,

inequality is down, life expectancy is continuing to rise. But what we

know, in terms of a strong economy, is that what will not deliver a

strong economy for this country is Labour's policy of more borrowing,

more spending, higher taxes and fewer jobs. What the right

honourable gentleman wants his country living beyond its means.

That means making future generations pay for his mistakes. That is

Labour's way and the Conservatives will never do that.

Mr Speaker, what we want is a country where there are not 4

million people living in poverty. Where homelessness does not rise

every year, and I look along that front bench opposite, Mr Speaker,

and I see a Cabinet to grin and backbiting was the economy gets

weaker and people are pushed further into debt. You can try talking to

each other... Mr Speaker... The economy... Order, order! The

honourable gentleman for Stratford-upon-Avon is gesticulating

in a distinctly eccentric manner. Shakespeare's county deserves

better. Jeremy Corbyn. The reality is, wages are falling, the economy

is slowing, the construction sector in recession, trade deficit widening

and reflects crucial Brexit negotiations. Isn't the truth that

this divided government is unable to give this country the leadership it

so desperately needs now, to deal with these issues?

I will tell The right honourable gentleman the reality. The reality

is he is always talking Britain down, and we will lead Britain

forward. Let's look at the record of the Conservatives in government. 3

million more jobs, 4 million more people out of paying income tax

altogether, 30 million people with a cut in income tax, record levels of

the Berlin employment, record numbers of women in work, deficit

cut by three quarters, inequality Dan, record levels of foreign direct

investment. That is a record to be proud of, and you only get it with a

Conservative government. SHOUTING. I don't think the

honourable gentleman knew how popular he was! Will the Prime

Minister join me in again congratulating Gracie Shepherd, who

designed the black flag when she was just 12 years old, reflecting our

industrial heritage, and does she agree that the latest figures

showing the West Midlands as the fastest-growing part of this country

shows once again that the Black Country remains a great place to do

business? As my honourable friend says, he is right. The Black Country

remains a great place to do business, and I would like to

congratulate Gracie on designing that flag at the age of only 12

years, and I have to say I think I'm sure that she and others including

the Express and Star have been surprised at the attitude of the

benches opposite on this. I commend my honourable friend and my other

honourable friends in the Black Country and indeed the Express and

Star for the work they are doing to promote the Black Country is a great

place to do business, to live and to bring up children like Gracie. Does

the Prime Minister believe that her Government has delivered pensions

fairness from women who, like her, were born in 1950s? What the

Government is delivering for women is a better state pension for women

so that women in future will be better off under the state pension

that they have been in the past. We are equalising the state pension age

I think across the whole has everybody will Buckley denies that

is the right thing to do. The Prime Minister has found up to ?35 billion

for Hinkley point C nuclear power station. Up to 200 billion to

replace Trident, and 1 billion for a deal with the DUP just so she could

keep her own job. She seems to be to the magic money tree when she wants

to. Can the Prime Minister now end the injustice for those women who

are missing out on their pensions before she herself thinks about

retiring? I have to say to the honourable gentleman I am a little

surprised given his background that he said what he did about Hinkley

point. It is privately funded. This is not money that is coming from the

Government to developing viewpoint, so I find that a little strange. We

have put ?1 billion extra into this question of the change of the state

pension age to ensure that nobody sees their state pension age

increased by more than 18 months from that which was previously

expected. But I have to also say to the honourable gentleman that the

Scottish Government does also have extra powers in the area of welfare.

And perhaps... Perhaps it is time the Scottish Government got on with

the day job and stop talking about independence. Mr Speaker, businesses

in Stafford and other constituencies need as much certainty as possible

now about what will happen after we leave the EU in March 2019 for

investment decisions they are making in the coming weeks and months. As

the Government works on the cob rents a future relationship with our

European neighbours, would it also negotiate time bound transitional

arrangements which prioritise the jobs of our constituents and the

health of our economy? My honourable friend is absolutely right. As I

have said in this chamber and elsewhere before, we want to avoid a

cliff edge from businesses, because people want to know where they stand

and Tobia Arlt to carry on investing in the UK and creating those jobs

that we have seen being created. -- to be able to carry on investing in

the UK. We want to know what the end state relationship for the UK and

the EU will be in the future, and then we need a period to adjust to

that new end state, practical things will need to be done during that

period, and as part of the negotiations it will be important

for us to agree on that implementation period and what the

arrangements will be during that. Mr Speaker, since Winnie Ewing's maiden

speech 50 years ago this year, MSP is happening arguing for the voting

age to be lowered. In recent elections, young people have proven

themselves to be the most knowledgeable and engage they have

ever been. I believe there is a majority in this House in favour of

lowering the voting age. All the prime Ministers avoid giving the

vote to 16 and 17-year-olds? This is one of those issues on which people

will obviously have different views, my view continues to be that 18 is

the right edge. We expect people to continue in education or training,

and I think that is the right point for the voting age. In Harrow and up

and down the country, young people will be eagerly anticipating their

A-level results to see if they will qualify for a university education.

Could my right honourable friend confirmed the dramatic increase of

people from disadvantaged backgrounds going to universities,

and can she think of anyone that should apologise for misleading the

British public? Well, I think it is a very important as people are

thinking about going to university that they are not misled in any way.

It is the case that more disadvantaged 18-year-olds are now

applying to university than ever before. I believe the Leader of the

Opposition said exactly the opposite, and I think you should

apologise for having said that. But I think the Labour Party should go

further at the election. The Leader of the Opposition vowed to deal with

student debt, Labour were going to abolish it, now there a promise at

all. Students know Labour can't be trusted on student fees. The Prime

Minister will now know what it is like to have a job but lacked job

security. Sometimes it can even bring a tear to the eye. Given her

new-found empathy for millions of workers in insecure work, why is she

now cutting six DWP job centres in Glasgow, and also BRCA office staff

in my constituency where unemployment is twice the national

average? I start by welcoming the honourable gentleman to his new job

in this House. What is happening in relation to job centres in Scotland

is we are ensuring that it is using the estate properly to the best

advantage, and as a result of what is happening, no service is going to

be cut. In fact services to people using job centres will be enhanced

in future. What matters is actually the service that is provided to

people attending those job centres. The brave men and women of our Armed

Forces put themselves in extremely challenging situations in their

efforts to keep us all safe. We owe it to them therefore to do all we

can to support them and their families when they have completed

their service. I warmly welcome the launch of the mental health and

well-being strategy yesterday, but can my right honourable friend tell

the House how we can call Wood and eight this excellent programme with

our international allies, and may I wish her a very well-deserved break

when she finally decides to take recess. The issue Moura boyfriend

has raised is a very important one. Across this House we recognise the

importance of ensuring that we are providing the support -- the issue

my honourable friend has raised is a very important one. I welcome the

new strategy for mental health and well-being in the Armed Forces that

is being produced, and I also like to pay tribute to the tireless work

of my honourable friend from Plymouth, but he raises an important

issue. This isn't just for us in the UK, we need to work internationally

on this, which is why we launched the strategy at an international

conference. The Secretary of State for Defence yesterday launched this

at an international conference with counterparts from the United States,

Australia, Canada and New Zealand. We will all campaign against the

stigmas around mental health so that members of our Armed Forces veterans

can get the help they need. In Liverpool Walton, my constituency,

almost 40% of children are growing up in poverty. With schools closing

this week and local support services cut to the bone, Oster bites and

kids don't get fed. The Prime Minister's mission as she says it is

to make Britain a country that works for everyone. What is she doing now

to stop kids going hungry this summer in Liverpool Walton? I

welcome the honourable gentleman to his place in this House. He is right

that it is important that we look at the provision that is made in school

for children. We look at the issue of households on poverty. But as I

said to his writer or friend the Leader of the Opposition, the best

route out of poverty is for people to get into the workplace and for us

to ensure that there are better paid jobs being provided for people in

the workplace in the future. A young woman in Telford who gave evidence

in an horrific child sexual exploitation case five years ago is

living in fear. The perpetrator, who received a 22 year sentence, is

about to be released early. CSE victims are too often overlooked and

ignored. Does the Prime Minister agree with me that CSE victims

should be properly consulted upon the release of perpetrators, and

that in this case the perpetrator should not be returned to Telford?

This is a very important issue that my honourable friend has raised, and

we all know that child sexual exportation is a horrific crime

takes place, and it is right that if victims are going to come forward to

report this abuse, they need to know that they will have the support and

the confidence that they can do that, and be confident in their

future security and safety as well. The victim contact scheme is

supposed to treat victims properly, and it is supposed to ensure that

consideration is given to victim related conditions when they are

looking at the offender's license, and somebody being released. If she

would like to write tomorrow but friend the Justice Secretary, he

will look at it carefully. The interim Prime Minister has

repeatedly refused to answer the question from my right honourable

friend the Leader of the Opposition. It was reported at the weekend that

the temporary Chancellor said that some public sector workers were

overpaid. So can she tell the House and the country and those public

sector workers which ones she thinks are overpaid, which ones she thinks

are underpaid and what she is going to do about it? As I said earlier, I

recognise that there will be be born working in the public sector who do

find life a struggle, who are just about managing. There will be people

working in the private sector in the same place as well. I also say to

the honourable gentleman that some people working in the public sector

are very well paid, as we have seen in the figures released today. What

I also say is that we need to ensure that when we look at public sector

pay that we balance being fair to workers, protecting jobs and being

fair to those who pay for the public sector, and that also we give

support to people to ensure that they can keep more of the money that

they earn. That's why we believe it cutting taxes.

Mr Speaker, the Government is under predictable pressure on public

sector pay and spending, which we would all like to respond to, if it

was actually sensible to respond to some of these demands. But does my

right honourable friend agree that the only way in which a responsible

government can actually increase public sector pay is if we restore

to this country strong economic growth and a sensible government

fiscal balance sheet? And that the biggest threats to our achieving

either of those over the next two years are a bad Brexit deal putting

barriers to our trade and investment, or the return of a hard

left old-fashioned socialist government?

My right honourable friend is absolutely right. As a very

successful former Chancellor of the Exchequer with expertise on this

particular issue, he is right that we need to get a good Brexit deal,

but he's also right that the policies of the Leader of the

Opposition and the Shadow Chancellor, where they ever to get

the opportunity of putting them into practice, would not lead to more

money for nurses or for our National Health or more money for the health

sector. It would lead through its higher borrowing, higher spending,

higher taxes, we would see jobs going, we would see higher prices,

higher taxes for people, and we would see less money available for

our health service and our nurses. Does the Prime Minister know how

universal processes failing my constituents? Vulnerable Blackpool

people are juggling a month's money without help, a six-week wait for

money coming, causing more stress on a phone helpline which Citizens

Advice says can cost claimant 's 55p a minute. Couldn't she start by

getting a free phone number? I think the importance of the

Universal Credit scheme is it is ensuring that being in work always

pays. What we see from the Universal Credit scheme is we are seeing more

people getting into the workplace. The DWP is constantly looking at the

scheme and how it is operating around the country, to ensure any

problems that are being raised by people are being addressed.

Mr Speaker, thousands of my constituents are millions of

consumers in this country have to pay surcharges when they use their

credit or debit card, a highly unfair practice. Good my right

honourable friend outlined the impact of lifting of surcharges on

consumers in this country? My honourable friend is absolutely

right and I think it is very important this issue is being

addressed. We believe rip-off charges have no place in modern

Britain and that is why card charging abuse is going to come to

an end. This is about fairness and transparency. We don't want people

to be surprised when they come to pay for something, that they see an

extra surcharge suddenly being added because they have used a particular

card. We estimate the charges can add up and the total value of these

fees in 2010 was estimated at ?473 million. That money is going to be

put back in the hands of shoppers across the country, so they have

more cash to spend on the things that matter to them.

In her Lancaster House speech, the Prime Minister said the UK would be

leaving the single market. Can she tell the House whether that red line

on the single market also applies to any transition agreement or

implementation period that might be agreed for the period after March,

2019? We said we would no longer be

members of the single market because we will no longer be members of the

European Union. The four pillars of the European union are indivisible,

and therefore the other issues that we wish also to not be subject, like

the European Court of Justice and freedom of movement requirements,

mean we would no longer be members of the single market, at the end

point, at the end of the two years, when we have negotiated the deal,

there will be an end-stage agreement for that deal. We are clear, at the

point at which we reach the end of those negotiations, we will be out

of the EU. Can I welcome the report from the

IFS this week on income inequality in the UK. Contrary to Labour

propaganda, often repeated during the general election, the income gap

between rich and poor in our country has reduced every year since 2010.

Does my right honourable friend agree with me that this clearly

shows that those with a broader shoulders are bearing the heaviest

burden of dealing with the debt inherited from the last Labour

government? No, my honourable friend is

absolutely right. The IFS report very clearly shows what he has said

today. As we know, the top 1% of taxpayers are bearing 27% of the tax

burden. That is a higher burden than in any year under the Labour

government. NHS England commissioned child and

adult mental health beds in my constituency recently received a

damning si QC report. It was found on safe because they found a young

woman with MRSA with open wounds on a ward. Does the Prime Minister

share my concern that a shortage of mental health beds risks the NHS

placing very young and vulnerable people in unsafe environments? Will

she consider giving NHS England the responsibility and resources to

investigate the quality of care before the commission?

I think the honourable lady has raised a very significant point.

First of all, mental health we are boosting the funding going into

mental health and the national health service. We are taking a

number, and across the picture, across government in terms of

dealing with mental health, and taking a number of steps to improve

mental health. She has raised a very particular case, which I'm sure

everybody around this house will have been concerned here I will

ensure the Secretary of State looks into the case she has raised.

Daesh's atrocities have failed to deliver a caliphate. Does my right

honourable friend our international partners must commit resources to

bring prosecutions against Daesh fighters and those who join with

them? Making sure where ever a death cult had terrorist hides, we will

find them and hold them accountable? My honourable friend is absolutely

right about this. It is important that those who have committed these

horrific crimes are brought to justice. We have done good work as

the United Kingdom, in helping those in those theatres to see how they

can collect evidence which can be used in prosecutions. We want to do

this work internationally through the United Nations and is an issue

that yesterday I was speaking to the Prime Minister of Iraq about and we

want to work with them and others, to make sure we send a clear message

that my friend identified. Does the Prime Minister agrees a

huge increase in knife crime has tragic consequences for families in

constituencies like mine? What with the Prime Minister do to work with

me and other MPs across this house, to find solutions to this blight on

young lives, including looking again at the budget for policing?

Can I also welcome the honourable lady to the House, to her place in

the House. Her presence here, of course, has enabled me to have a

very good chief of staff appointed into my office at number ten. She

raises this issue... This... This issue is, the issue of knife crime,

she has raised a very serious issue of macro. The Government has been

taking a tougher stance on knife crime. We do think this is an issue.

We have done this in a whole variety of ways, so that now a a knife in

public you are much more likely to go to prison. We do recognise there

is more to do in this area. That is why yesterday the Home Secretary did

announce plans to consult on new offences to toughen up knife crime

laws, including restricting the online sale of knives. We have done

some of that already, and banning possession of dangerous or offensive

weapons on private property. The honourable lady has raised an issue,

the Government is addressing this, we recognise we need to do more and

that is what the Home Secretary is doing.

Before the election, the Government committed to removing the faith

-based cap for free schools and even included this promising a la

election manifesto. Catholic dioceses up and down the country are

anxious to open free schools and some of purchase sites. Will the

Prime Minister, her government to honouring a solemn pledge in our own

manifesto? My honourable friend will recognise

that the reason we put that in our manifesto and the reason it was in

the school's green paper that we published before the election was we

do believe it is important to enable faith schools, more faith schools to

be set up a more faith schools to expand. This is an issue my right

honourable friend the Secretary of State for Education is considering

and she will be publishing further details on our overall view, in

terms of improving school diversity and encouraging more good school

places to be created in the near future.

Last week the Prime Minister refused to make public a report on the

foreign funding of extremists in the UK, despite pressure from all sides

of this house and beyond. With survivors of 9/11 urging her to make

the report available, would she explain if this refusal is because

the contents of the report will embarrass the Government's trends in

Saudi Arabia or because they came about arms sales to Riyadh more than

public safety? It is absolutely nothing to do that.

Are certain elements of, and confidential elements in the report

that could not be made available. Mr Speaker, for signs of the strong

economy that Prime Minister has so eloquently been outlining this

morning, you need look no further than Taunton Deane. It is a

microcosm of the national picture, with record house-building, record

employment and record government investment in road schemes, like the

A358. Would the Prime Minister agree with me, to further fuel the

economic success this government is everything, these key road projects

should not just speed up traffic and ease congestion but more jobs,

further food and in productivity? I am very happy to recognise Taunton

Deane is a microcosm of the excellent economy we see across the

country. My honourable friend has made an important point and it is a

point the Government readily understands and accepts, the

importance of investing in infrastructure to boost our economy.

That's like the ordinance statement latte the Chancellor of the

Exchequer announced the investment fund, considerable proportion of

which will be going to infrastructure and we fully

recognise the importance not just of large-scale transport projects like

Crossrail and HS2 and the expansion of Heathrow, but also of investment

in projects at a more local level if we're going to unlock further

economic growth in areas like Taunton Deane.

Without legal powers, funds, criteria is all schools or

Parliament open, this in Keleher TriStar consulting on the closure of

the hospital and the building of a new ?400 million hospital in

Belmont. After five consultations over 18 years, wasting ?40 million

of tax payers money, isn't it time for the Prime Minister to step in

and put a stop to it and allow this important hospital to get on with

the day job? I would say to the honourable lady

that I understand Jepson Anson Keleher trust are seeking views on

specialist -- Epsom and St Helier. No final decisions have been made

and any decisions for further change will be subject to consultation.

Not only has the Institute for Fiscal Studies said we have the

lowest income gaps for a decade but the Office for National Statistics

has also said Britain has some of the lowest levels of persistent

poverty in all of Europe. Does my right honourable friend agree that

it is right that this country is governed by the true facts and not

the fake news? And that this government is committed to building

a strong economy for all? Can I start by welcoming my

honourable friend to her place in this chamber. Can I say she is

absolutely right. We owe it to our constituents and the public that we

actually ensure when we debate these issues, we debate on the basis of

the facts are not the basis of the sort of fake news we hear too often

being put forward in chamber. Mr Speaker, Lakeside children's

Centre is a lifeline for often struggling kids and their parents in

one of the poorest wards in Britain, giving them the best possible start

in life. Yet Lakeside and 26 children's Centre now face closure

in Birmingham. Does the Prime Minister understand that the

consequences of her actions, ?700 million of cuts to the City

Council's budget, is having a devastating impact on the provision

of children centres and Wilshire act properly to fund and reverse the

tidal wave of closures that will otherwise have a devastating impact

on the life chances of a whole generation of children?

Can I say to the honourable gentleman that obviously decisions

on this issue are being taken by the Birmingham Local Authority. It ill

behoves any member of the Labour Party to stand up and complain about

the issues we have had to address with public spending because they

are the direct result of a failure of a Labour government to manage our

economy. Order. And there we have it, another 45

minute session from Prime Minister's Questions, that is becoming the norm

under Speaker Bercow. On the 6th of September, they will be back,

briefly before they go off again for conference season. Jeremy Corbyn

going strongly on the need to increase public sector pay,

particularly at the lower end, teasing the Chancellor with the

reports, or teasing the Prime Minister with the reports that said

that public sector workers were overpaid. Broadening out his attack

into general low pay and inequality. The Prime Minister giving the

standard response that we need a strong economy to be able to tackle

all of these things, and that is what she is trying to provide and

wouldn't happen under Mr Corbyn. So, nothing we haven't heard before, but

it has been the theme of the past several weeks and months of this

battle between the two sides. We would just like to apologise to Keir

Hardie who I said would turn in his grave at how posh the Labour Party

has become. Somebody kindly treated to remind me that he was actually

cremated and his ashes scattered, so turning over in his grave would be a

physical impossibility. In fact, even if he had been buried, it would

be a physical impossibility! In the finest traditions of accuracy. No

fake news. On the issue of pay, more wind is

said that praising emergency services was keeping payload is an

insult, it is astounding that the Prime Minister cannot see it. Joe

Stuart said he doesn't think on his feet enough, Jeremy Corbyn, he

missed an open goal regarding the NHS. Ian White Lee says, Jeremy

Corbyn going on the economy was never going to go well as Mrs May

just batted him on his policies. She seems to have a spring in Hurst --

her step, and it appears these jobs are so poorly paid, these new

created jobs, that they don't pay income tax. And I would like to draw

everyone's attention to this, showing an SNP MP wearing a football

shirt. Hannah Ba Dell says, is that unparliamentary to show up in the

house wearing a football shirt? I believe it is unparliamentary, this

is coming from a woman who was told I have unparliamentary hair. I'm not

sure she wants to wear that as a badge of honour or shame. I don't

know this for a fact, but there has been a sports day event between MPs

and journalists, and she may have come straight from that, but will

she be told off? I think there will be a quiet word, yes. And you are

not in unparliamentary attire now, but still not wearing a tie. Is this

opening the floodgates? I'm not making a statement, it is just warm

in here! What did we see today? We saw the Chancellor giving a very

clear indication of what is going to happen to the public sector pay cap

in the long term. He has dug his heels in on the 1% cap from what we

hear, and we hear just about everything that goes on in Cabinet

now. It's like we are there! And the Prime Minister is standing behind

him for a good reason, the Cabinet, the Government, the Prime Minister

and the Chancellor see an obvious need to retake the high ground of

the economic argument, to reassert the case for fiscal competence,

because that ground was slipping. It slipped during the election, they

didn't expect that to happen, and before they move on the question of

the pay cap, there is an eminent possibility of that. They want to do

it from the position of strength and not weakness, and not allow Jeremy

Corbyn to claim all of the credit. We will see what happens in the

budget, because our vision only extends as far as the budget when

the Chancellor has to make fresh calculation is an way up the

politics. On the question Time session overall, Theresa May and

Jeremy Corbyn, we thought they would give some wellie, and they both did.

On her side, you could argue that that is perhaps low expectation, her

side are lining up behind her and propping her up, she can't be seen

to be stronger now than she was after the election, but she is more

stable, and that is a lot because the party as a whole are sticking

with her as strong as they possibly can. Survival equals stability in

their mind at the moment, and that means keeping her where she is for

the immediate future. Jeremy Corbyn was in campaign mode, and he will be

heading off to do that over the summer holidays, 70 something

constituents. Sarah is looking forward to it! That's my holiday!

You need to get out more. The Prime Minister claimed that work

is the route out of poverty, so why do 55% of poor families have

somebody in work? The essence of what she was saying is that every

week, a thousand people are coming in to work, 3 million people have

been employed since 2010, our economy has grown since 2010 by 15%.

That is the importance we need to focus on. Why are so many people in

work still poor? There won't be the money for any breach of the 1% pay

freeze if the economy doesn't grow. Let's come back to what I ask for

other than generalise about the economy. If work is the route out of

poverty, why are so many people in work in poverty? One in five workers

are in poverty. I'm not sure whether is figures are coming from. The

office of the National statistics. People have been taken out of paying

tax altogether, we have increased the national minimum wage, and we

need a working economy, going back to that point... You don't think

there is a problem in this country now with low paid, with low pay,

that people are working hard, following the Government's advice,

they are told the work is the route out of poverty, get a job, welfare

has been reconfigured to change the balance in favour of work and

against welfare, and you think that after doing all that, there are

still so many people on such low pay. There are 6 million people on

less than the living wage. This is unfinished business, we need to keep

working forward. But the alternative, which is to borrow

more, tax more, we'll see unemployment rise, it will see

interest rates rise as well, it will see inflation rise, too, and that

would mean that the debt will rise as well. Tobias, the alternative...

The alternative could be to invest in our workers, to skill them up and

try to get a high-income generating economy, because then we all benefit

from it, whereas we seem to be going to the lowest nominator. We are

doing that with apprentice schemes... We could be doing that

across-the-board. 3 million more British it introduced in 2010. They

are not apprenticeships as the Germans would recognise them. Both

parties have been pretty useless at this. They have never managed to

introduce a German or Austrian type apprenticeship. But I have a

question for you. The Leader of the Opposition said using an e-mail or

something he had had from a nurse, claiming in effect that nurses have

not had a pay rise for many years. That's not true, is it? It's not

technically true. It is not accurately true. They would be

getting their increase to the top of their banding, they have been

getting 1%... No, the 1% is separate. A nurse starting in

London, Tate London for an example, on ?26,500. Over seven years gets 4%

per year of increments, progression, on top of whatever the 1% or 2% or

0% may be. So after seven years, the salary is ?34,500. If they become a

senior nurse. These are not huge salaries, I understand that, but it

is not right to say that nurses' pay has been frozen, is it? Yes and no.

What is happening with those nurses as they are getting more experience,

more skills, moving up their pay grade, so they are getting more

remuneration for that. What they are not getting was you would get a cost

of living increase year-on-year. On top of that, but the pay hasn't been

frozen, it may still not be enough and we have a shortage of nurses,

which is a labour markets go to say it may not be enough, but I just

wanted to establish that it hasn't been frozen. We need to move on, but

John, she has made it to the summer recess. The Prime Minister. But they

will all come back in September, fully refreshed, and she is straight

into the Tory party conference. That's right. There is a common

understanding that they can't afford a break-up crisis, a collapse in the

party, which means the entire party, at this stage of the game. So they

go into the summer recess very grateful that they have got as far

as Thursday without anything blowing up. They might have a build-up to

the party conference, we have seen that before in past years. There

will be a great build-up of headlines and speculation and

punditry that says this conference will be a car crash, a beauty

contest for potential successors. It will be make or break the Theresa

May. She will get a massive cheer, and everyone will walk away again,

and the day after conference, it all begins again. It all begins again.

John, thank you for that. We need to move on.

Now, whilst we've been on air, MPs and journalists have been competing

In a moment we'll find out who won the egg-and-spoon,

three-legged and sack races, but we didn't want our studio

guests to miss out - we know they are both very

competitive - so Sarah and Tobias will be competing in that epic

You don't have to jump over anything all run around the studio.

Whilst you're doing that here's the Daily Politics'

sports correspondent, Jenny Kumah.

Journalists are used to chasing stories. MPs familiar with

overcoming parliamentary hurdles. But who will come out the winner of

this political sports day? We have named ourselves the Sporty Spices,

Damian hasn't decided which one he is! We will do our best. The

journalist who was fittest was the one who has all the long lunches!

First up, the egg and spoon race. Won by times journalist Matt

Chorley. I am elated. I was so pleased my egg didn't drop off! Vela

cross-party team of the sports minister and her shadow member in

the three legged race. But they're in initial joy turned sour after

they were disqualified. The video clearly shows that you were not in

fact three legged it. Pushing the Telegraph team into first place. So,

can the MPs pull it back to win the tug-of-war?

But had the politicians done enough to triumph over the media? In last

place, MPs, if you would like to come and collect...

This wasn't just all about winning or losing. The money raised from

today's charity event will go to the Met police benevolent fund. Clearly

they cheated. We played honourably. Damian Welch run an inquiry and

unsubscribe to all of the newsletters. We can build on this. I

am over the moon, my dreams have come true.

I have been umpiring this fearsome game of tiddlywinks, and they are

both doing reasonably well! Useless! I have given up.

Guess the year was 1990, the poll tax riots gave it the clue. Tobias,

could you press the button? And Andy from Birmingham, you got the answer

right. The One O'Clock News is starting

over on BBC One now. I will be here at noon tomorrow

with all the big political The BBC Proms celebrates

the extraordinary film music