21/11/2011 GMT with George Alagiah


21/11/2011

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A revolution delayed, at least 33 dead as Egypt's activists demand

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for changes more quickly. Back to square one, as they did in the

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February uprising, the protesters Hello. Welcome to GMT. I'm George

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Alagiah. No time for an election honeymoon for the popular People's

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Party. Do they have a solution for the financial crisis?

:00:51.:00:55.

It's only a game, why an invasion of Iran in battlefield three is

:00:56.:01:05.
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It's 12.30pm in London, early morning in Washington and 2.30pm in

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Cairo, where the sound of protest is once again spreading out from

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Tahrir Square. Nine months after the remarkable 18-day uprising that

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ended the rule of Hosni Mubarak, it seems it's back to square one, no

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pun intended. The activists fear the military are trying to enTrench

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their hold over the country. At least 33 people have died in the

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last two days of clashes and Egypt's culture minister has just

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resigned in protest at the government response to

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demonstrations. Emily Buchanan has this report on a revolution re-

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:01:47.:01:48.

The battles on Cairo's streets are ferocious. Police fire tear gas and

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rubber bullets, protesters hold their ground. Their weapons -

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stones, pieces of pavement and grim determination. The future of the

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country is at stake. Tahrir Square, the scene of so much jubilation

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nine months ago, now filled with those desperate to stop their

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revolution unraveling. Activists had believed the army to be their

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ally, but now there's fury that promises by the generals to oversee

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an orderly transfer from dictatorship to democracy have been

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broken the there's -- broken. There's little faith in

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Parliamentary elections. The military will hold power, enjoy

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immunity from prosecution and avoid execute any of budgets.

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TRANSLATION: The military Council said up to six months they would

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hand over power. Nine months have passed and there's no indication

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they are doing that. Vi no faith in these elections at all. The

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interior ministry is supposed to safe guard the elections and

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they're the ones attacking us right now. Near Tahrir Square, a fire in

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a six storey apartment building has become another flash points. People

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are enraged the police wouldn't let firefighters deal with the blaze.

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TRANSLATION: The tear gas landed inside an apartment. The police

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won't allow fire trucks in. Tear gas was not meant to be the

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currency of the Arab Spring. Western governments are urging the

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military rulers to loosen their decades old grip on power. We do

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want to see Egypt a transfer of people. We want to see robust

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guarantees of human rights, including the accountability of

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security forces enshrined in future laws or constitutions As the

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running battles take their toll, make-shift field hospitals have

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been set up. Some of the wounded say they're too afraid to go to the

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city hospitals for fear of being arrested. Elections are supposed to

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be in a week. But with little trust in them and with such a volatile

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atmosphere, it looks unlikely they can take place. The army's

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determined to have the streets clear for polling, but thousands of

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ordinary people are equally determined to risk their lives and

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defy the order to go home. Our correspondent, Yolande Knell,

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joins me live now from Cairo. We were both in Tahrir Square back in

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February. This is a case of day Jew view isn't it? -- de jav? It seems

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this is the worst violence we have seen since the revolution. The

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latest figure suggest that more than 30 people have been killed.

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That's coming from a morgue, close to Tahrir Square. Now we're also

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seeing an encampment in the square, people re-occupying the central

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area, at the symbolic heart of Egypt's revolution. This is all

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something quite new for Egypt in this post-revolutionary period.

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Still the violence continuing. Still a lot of volatility there and

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numbers continuing to swell in Tahrir Square. It's quite a dilemma

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for the ruling military about how to proceed. What effect is this

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likely to have on elections, Parliamentary elections, staggered

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elections, due to start next week.? Exactly one week from now the

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election process is due to start. Elections are due to place here in

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Cairo and other provinces on November 28. Now the ruling

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military was quick to come out and say that it was sticking to that

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time table, but it remains to be seen whether in this security

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environment and the bitter atmosphere that we now see whether

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those elections can take place as planned. Certainly there's been an

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appeal to the new political parties that have been campaigning, they

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have posters up around the city, at the moment, for them to get

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involved and try to help clear Tahrir Square, but the anger of the

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protesters has only been magnified by the brutality that we've seen

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from the police, who are being backed up by the military police.

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Thank you very much. Let's look at some of the other

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stories making headlines around the world today: All change in Spain,

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the centre-right Popular Party has won a victory in the Parliament'

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election. With all the votes counted, the new Prime Minister is

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assured of a clear majority in the lower house. Mariano Rajoy is

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expected to tackle the country's debts amid slow growth and high

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unemployment. Addressing supporters last night Mr Rajoy said there

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would be no miracle to restore Spain to financial health. Spain is

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the fifth eurozone country embroiled in the financial crisis

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to change its government, after Greece, Italy, Portugal and Ireland

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did the same. Joining me now is an eeconomist from LSC Europe

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institute. He has no honeymoon period. Most election victories,

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especially with this kind of majority, you expect a bit of

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leeway. We will have to perform the reforms as soon as possible.

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There's no way Spain can wait a single minute. He has a mandate

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from the people. The mandate is very clear, absolute majority. It's

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time to reform. You say he's got a mandate from the people, what has

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he got a mandate for? Because with one in five people unemployed, the

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mandate could be make the economy grow, expand things so we have more

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jobs. Actually, what the rest of Europe want him to do is shut

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things down. That's true. In many ways these elections show a protest

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votes primarily against the incumbent. Even if we look at the

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distribution of power in the country, we see the Nationalists

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won in Catalonia. Clearly the mandate is unclear. I would say

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:08:09.:08:09.

that the people in Spain expect the country to move forward, to get out

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from under this, there are serious reforms to be done. You mention

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labour market, what does that mean? The flexibility in the labour

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market, the exit course or protection of employees in Spain is

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far too high. When people say flexible labour market I know what

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workers are going to think, this means the bosses can sack us more

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easily. That's right. That's right, that's what he has to do? It is

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right because that will be the way that new, let's say, jobs will be

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created. Really? Sack more people, you get even more unemployment and

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you're going to create jobs. No of course sacking some people and then

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hiring other people in return. It's not necessarily negative. By

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reducing the excess cost in the labour market you will encourage

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firm owners and business in general to keep on a highering new jobs,

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sorry new people and that essentially means that new jobs

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will be created, new activities put forward. As an economist and

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looking at this through your eyes, what's Mr Rajoy's first big test?

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When is he going to have to show he's got what it takes? I would say

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putting forward the labour market reform will be the main thing. Then

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being able to contain public finance. At the moment public

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expenditure is still contained compared to last year, but it's

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growing far too much as what it should grow. Spain needs

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significant stability at the moment. It's not being attained by the

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previous government. You say this is a protest vote, protest against

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the socialist government. What was wrong with that? They presided over

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a housing boom. That's right. They identified the problem or went

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public with the problem too late. It took a year or more actually for

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Zapatero to recognise that Spain was in a weak position. That was

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very much opportunistic. He wanted to be re-elected in 2008. I think

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that is when Spain started to act too late about one year, one year-

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and-a-half late, that actually shows. Thank you very much.

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US authorities say that they've arrested a man, who they believe

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was plotting to bm a number of targets in New York. Jose Pimentel,

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who is a US citizen, originally from the doe minical republic,

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appeared in court late on Sunday. He's charged with conspiracy,

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possession of a weapon as a ciex terrorism and soliciting support

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for a terrorist act. He was denied bail and remains in custody.

:11:00.:11:04.

Aung San Suu Kyi has confirmed she will stand as a candidate in

:11:04.:11:08.

Parliamentary by-elections later this year. The party decided to

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return to mainstream politics after the new civilian-led administration

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in Burma began a series of reforms. The NLD won a general election in

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1990, but this was overturned by Burma's then military rulers.

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The German government has agreed to compensate the families of victims

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killed by an alleged Neo-Nazi cell accused of killing ten people over

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a decade. Angela Merkel described the murders as a national disgrace

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and questioned how a group, known to police, could have, as she put

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it, slipped under the radar. Thousands of air passengers are

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facing delays and cancellations because of weather condition as

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cross Europe. Worst affected is Heathrow Airport, where more than

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100 fligts have been grounded. You can see how the advise --

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visibility is there from these pictures. Amsterdam, Brussels and

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Zurich has also been affected. Still to come: Libya insists the

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trial of the country's former intelligence chief, Abdullah Al-

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Senoussi should take place on home soil not The Hague. We'll look at

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how his arrest and that of Saif Al- Islam is a real challenge for new

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Libya. First, let's get all the business

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news. We've been talking,s you just heard,

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talking about debt in Europe, Spain and so on, there is a much bigger

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debt somewhere else, isn't there? If we think the eurozone debt

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crisis is a worry, the US debt crisis could be a monster one,

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could dwarf anything we're looking at in Europe. It's back in the news.

:12:54.:13:03.
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US national debt has ticked past the $15drl. -- $15 trillion. People

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may remember when this was in the news in July, at the 178 hour the

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government agreed to raise the debt -- 11th hour, the Government agreed

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to raise the debt ceiling. They agreed to form a super committee,

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12 panel members who were going to work together on how to cut $1.2

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trillion from the budget over ten years. They haven't agreed to do

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that. We could hear from them today that they are acknowledging defeat.

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It is a very serious situation. we don't do something, I'm afraid

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we're heading down a road that leads to the Greek kind of

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situation, really terrible sovereign debt crisis. It's hard to

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say when that would occur. I don't think we have ten years. It could

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occur next month. There's a worry right there. If they don't agree,

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automatic triggers come into place in 2013 where money will be taken

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from the defence budget and things like welfare budgets. I hate to be

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the first BBC presenter to talk about Christmas, but people are

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thinking about travel and holidays and that kind of thing. There's

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news from Qantas, not resolved their problems. The flying kangaroo

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as we call it at home. There's not a lot of spring in its hop of late.

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Good line. The workers and the airline have, the latest talks have

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failed. The deadline was set today. It means that both sides will have

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to take and abide by a future settlement from an independent

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umpire. Of course, this has been going on, last month the CEO

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grounded the entire fleet. He was fed up with all the strike action

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that's been taking place. This is a bitter row over pay and the airline

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wanting to move jobs to the likes of Indonesia and other places in

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Asia. Let's listen from the CEO what he said about today's

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development. This brings certainty to our customers, employees and

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shareholders. Qantas will be happy to accept the adjudication of the

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umpire. We know the unions are going back to the court to get

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their rights back to strike. If they win that, there could be

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disruption over the Christmas holiday period. Anything on the

:15:18.:15:28.
:15:28.:15:31.

markets? Markets downment -- are Much more on the outcome of the

:15:31.:15:41.
:15:41.:15:41.

Spanish election on the BBC website. And a profile of the new leader.

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This is GMT. I am George Alagiah. Here are the headlines: Egypt's

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health ministry says 22 people have died and 1,800 have been injured as

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protests against the country's military rulers continue in Tahrir

:15:56.:16:04.

Square. Spain's new government, Popular

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Party, has been voted in. Cost of borrowing have risen to nearly 6.5%.

:16:13.:16:16.

A new video game depicting an American invasion of Iran in search

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of nuclear warheads has proved to be a great hit. But battlefield 3

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has angered the young of game players in Iran itself and many say

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the plot is insensitive. Our reporter has been playing the game

:16:35.:16:45.
:16:45.:16:50.

and assessing the impact of Shame. You come to our country to

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murder us, get we are the terrorists! The game is set in 2014,

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and following an earthquake, the Iranian government is replaced by a

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radical militia. America's sense in the Marines to find a secure

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weapons of mass destruction and all of this calls for sanctions against

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Iran over its nuclear programme. But do games like this have an

:17:17.:17:22.

impact on public opinion? average player does not think twice

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about the story. They are just looking to run around and have fun

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in the game world. You can appreciate that by the popularity

:17:31.:17:37.

of the multi-player games. Some people play terrorists and some

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people play counter terrorists and there is no more agenda. It is just

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a colourful backdrop. But what if you live in the Middle East? What

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if you are playing the game in your apartment in Tehran? I spoke to a

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game designer from Iran. TRANSLATION: Westerners can never

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understand our situation because they have not seen what I have. But

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I remember playing a game called Generals eight years ago. I played

:18:08.:18:13.

an American soldier attacking Iraq. Six months later, I turned on the

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TV and the stuff I was playing before was now in the news. Our

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neighbouring country was attacked and we could see the impact on our

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own. 5 million copies of Battlefield 3 sold in his first

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week. For enthusiastic buyers, the dual politics in the game were not

:18:36.:18:43.

of relevance. I am not sure of much about the story. I just know it

:18:43.:18:48.

impulse gums and Iraq. I think it is Iraq... I would assume it is

:18:48.:18:54.

somewhere around the Middle East. Not too sure. Battlefield 3 has

:18:54.:18:58.

been condemned in the Iranian press and some Iranian game players have

:18:58.:19:08.
:19:08.:19:09.

launched a petition calling for an apology. Video games are as popular

:19:09.:19:14.

in Iran as anywhere else in the world, but this was just too close

:19:14.:19:24.
:19:24.:19:25.

to home for comfort. The British Foreign Secretary,

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William Hague, has insisted that Colonel Gaddafi's son must be

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prosecuted and international standards even if his trial takes

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place in Libya and not in the International Criminal Court. Saif

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Al-Islam was captured on Saturday, while Abdullah Al-Senussi was

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captured on Sunday. Both are wanted by The Hague but Libya will seek to

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try them at home, we think. To talk about the latest developments in

:19:54.:19:59.

the country, I am joined by it John Oakes, author of Libya: The History

:19:59.:20:01.

Of Gaddafi's Pariah State. It is a book that includes the most recent

:20:02.:20:05.

developments in the country's history. Thank you for being with

:20:05.:20:11.

us. I found it interesting that you talk about Gaddafi's Bedouin troops

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and say that this somehow shape of 40 years that followed? I did. He

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was born in a tent somewhere south of Sirte. This is what I call it.

:20:25.:20:31.

For 10 years of his life, he lived in a Bedouin tent. They were

:20:31.:20:36.

completely isolated and if you drive around Sirte, you find how

:20:36.:20:42.

very isolated it is, and without communication from the outside.

:20:42.:20:46.

lots of leaders in Africa that high North started in very humble

:20:46.:20:52.

beginnings in small villages. And often -- Nelson Mandela himself did.

:20:52.:20:58.

That does not mean they end up being what Colonel Gaddafi was?

:20:58.:21:05.

You have to resume that he is particularly involved in his

:21:05.:21:11.

revolution from the age of about 14. And if you look at his history, you

:21:11.:21:20.

see that he left Sirte when he was in primary school and went on to a

:21:20.:21:29.

very interesting place because the capture of Abdullah Al-Senussi took

:21:29.:21:34.

place there. He went there way started his revolution at about the

:21:34.:21:40.

age of 14. What do you think the chances are, as I just mentioned,

:21:40.:21:45.

of both sides of a Islam and Abdullah Al-Senussi that they will

:21:45.:21:50.

get a trial and not end up like Colonel Gaddafi? -- of psi leaf al

:21:50.:22:00.
:22:00.:22:01.

Islam? Well, his son was caught by a Zintan Brigade, and they were the

:22:01.:22:06.

rebels at the back of Tripoli, and for a long time they had been anti-

:22:06.:22:10.

Gaddafi because of his suppression of their system that was very

:22:10.:22:16.

powerful. They wanted to get into power so they have got his son, and

:22:16.:22:23.

with whom they can negotiate a place in power. The other capture

:22:23.:22:29.

of Abdullah Al-Senussi is from another group, and they, too, want

:22:29.:22:34.

a place in power. So you are suggesting that far from justice

:22:34.:22:39.

being of a key motive, this could be part of a power play? Yes, and

:22:39.:22:44.

it seems very likely that is the case. If you look at the people of

:22:44.:22:47.

Misrata, and you will remember how they fought like crazy to become

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free, they, too, one to have a place on the board somewhere.

:22:53.:22:57.

interesting that you say in your book, I cannot remember where, that

:22:57.:23:01.

the problem for Libya is that it does not have a reconciliatory

:23:01.:23:10.

chief or a Mandela or a Desmond Tutu? Yes, and it needs them.

:23:10.:23:16.

Benghazi has always been a separate entity. I lived there for four

:23:16.:23:20.

years and being separate is very important to Benghazi. It used to

:23:20.:23:25.

be the capital of a place that had Greig background. I am so sorry to

:23:25.:23:30.

interrupt you. We have run out of time. Thank you.

:23:30.:23:34.

A Hollywood director Joe Wright is best known for films like Pride and

:23:34.:23:38.

Prejudice and Atonement, but his latest project is a little more

:23:38.:23:43.

modest in scale and has swapped film stars or puppets. Joe has gone

:23:43.:23:47.

back to his roots in London to puppet theatre, where you watched

:23:48.:23:57.
:23:58.:24:03.

his parents pulling the strings. The expressions don't change, the

:24:03.:24:08.

acting is perhaps a little bored and. But there is something here

:24:08.:24:18.
:24:18.:24:19.

that is spellbinding. -- a little wooden. It is a very magical place

:24:19.:24:25.

and it is a place where anything is possible. A very optimistic place.

:24:25.:24:30.

And on the front row of his opening night, a film director, Joe Wright,

:24:30.:24:37.

who is today... I am not sure what my credit is for this show. Is it

:24:37.:24:42.

producer? Story boarding. There you go! How long is it since you have

:24:42.:24:51.

worked on a puppet show? About 25 years. Twenty-five years! You see,

:24:51.:24:58.

Joe grew up here. Here he is with his parents, John and Lyndie, who

:24:58.:25:03.

created the Little Angel Puppet Theatre. It is an extraordinarily

:25:03.:25:08.

magical experience here backstage, with all these creatures who seem

:25:08.:25:12.

to have lives of their own. They are now all celebrating their 50th

:25:12.:25:19.

birthday. Stand outside and it has barely changed since it began in

:25:19.:25:29.

1961. The building had been a derelict hall. Got you! My bird! My

:25:29.:25:33.

lovely bird! But building the audience for puppet shows was not

:25:33.:25:41.

easy. You shot it! There have been rocky moments. When we first opened,

:25:41.:25:45.

there would be three people to a show and very often, they would end

:25:45.:25:51.

up having supper with us at the end. But they did build an audience,

:25:51.:25:56.

brought here by the stories and all we can see in those wooden faces.

:25:56.:26:00.

think it is the audience's ability to project emotions onto an

:26:00.:26:07.

inanimate object that is uncanny. particularly like this guy. He is

:26:07.:26:15.

looking at a map. Where am I? What is going on? Happy, sad, uplifting,

:26:15.:26:23.

uncanny. We can see it all in little box of a chiselled wood.

:26:23.:26:27.

-- little blocks. I just want to show you some

:26:27.:26:33.

pictures of the US, where heavy rain has caused a street to

:26:33.:26:37.

collapse. This is in the San Pedro area of Los Angeles and the Street

:26:37.:26:43.

slipped into the ocean on Sunday. The road had already been closed

:26:43.:26:46.

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