24/10/2011 GMT with George Alagiah


24/10/2011

With Zeinab Badawi, as Turkey is rocked by an earthquake that's killed at least 200 people. And are Europe's leaders any closer to solving the Eurozone crisis?


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Or come to GMT with me, Zeinab Badawi. Tensions amongst EU leaders

:00:57.:01:00.

as they struggle to find a way forward on the eurozone crisis.

:01:00.:01:03.

France accuses Britain of unnecessary meddling. And we have a

:01:03.:01:05.

special report from Zambia to look at the impact of its soaring birth

:01:05.:01:15.
:01:15.:01:23.

weight. -- birth rate. In Turkey, rescue

:01:23.:01:26.

teams are desperately searching for survivors after the region was hit

:01:26.:01:29.

by a powerful earthquake on Sunday. As they move through the disaster

:01:29.:01:32.

area, the number of victims keeps going up. It now stands at more

:01:32.:01:35.

than 260 killed and 1,300 injured. There's also concern for the tens

:01:35.:01:37.

of thousands who spent the night outside, in freezing temperatures.

:01:37.:01:40.

With all the very latest, here is our world affairs correspondent,

:01:40.:01:46.

It is a race against time. Rescuers are cutting through layers of

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concrete and steel. At last, they reach this man. Incredibly, still

:01:53.:01:59.

alive, still able to move his arm. They question him and he shakes his

:01:59.:02:05.

head. Gently, they pull him out. One lucky survivor in a sea of

:02:05.:02:15.
:02:15.:02:15.

devastation. Out of the rubble, another man is rushed to hospital.

:02:15.:02:19.

In Ercis, the multi-storey buildings became so deadly.

:02:19.:02:23.

Thousands collapsed like packs of cards. People had to fend for

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themselves for hours before rescue teams reach this remote area --

:02:28.:02:32.

dozens collapsed. We were trapped under debris with my brother. I was

:02:32.:02:36.

pulled out but he is still trapped there. These buildings were no

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match for the force of the earthquake. Two cities and many

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villages are in ruins. Power and water supplies are cut off and many

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residents can do little more than endure the agonising wait.

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situation is really bad, many of our friends and relatives are still

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trapped, we haven't heard from any of them. The Turkish Prime Minister

:02:56.:03:00.

travelled to visit the injured in hospital. This is a Kurdish region

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and Mr Erdogan will be acutely aware of allegations the government

:03:05.:03:10.

has been slow to react. Terror of damaged buildings has driven

:03:10.:03:14.

thousands out into the cold, sleeping where they can. Tents,

:03:14.:03:19.

blankets and he does have at last begun to arrive. Family's -- and

:03:19.:03:23.

heaters. Families who found shelter may have to live like this for

:03:23.:03:28.

months. Funerals have already got under way. There are fears, with so

:03:28.:03:32.

many unaccounted for, the death toll will rise. Eastern Turkey is

:03:32.:03:37.

prone to earthquakes. There will be many questions over why so many new

:03:37.:03:42.

buildings collapsed. For now, the focus is on the people buried here,

:03:42.:03:46.

and trying to get them out. In the middle of so much tragedy, there

:03:46.:03:56.
:03:56.:03:56.

are miracles. Rescue teams find a toddler who is alive.

:03:56.:04:01.

We had to be talking to one of our correspondents in Turkey -- we hope

:04:01.:04:06.

to be talking. In the meantime, let's see some of the other stories

:04:06.:04:16.
:04:16.:04:21.

making headlines. At least 14 people have been wounded in a

:04:21.:04:23.

grenade attack on a nightclub in the Kenyan capital, Nairobi. It

:04:23.:04:27.

comes just a few days after the US embassy in Kenya warned of an

:04:27.:04:29.

imminent threat of terrorist attacks directed at prominent

:04:29.:04:31.

Kenyan facilities and areas popular with tourists. Thailand's prime

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minister has warned that flooding, which has hit the country, could

:04:33.:04:35.

last for another six weeks. At least five major industrial zones

:04:35.:04:39.

north of Bangkok have already been swamped. More than 350 people have

:04:39.:04:44.

died across the country so far. 10 days of mourning have been

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announced after the death of Pakistan's former first lady, Begum

:04:49.:04:59.
:04:59.:05:00.

Nusrat Bhutto. She was the widow of Zulfikar Bhutto who founded the

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Pakistan People's Party. European leaders are still

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grappling with efforts to prevent the financial crisis from

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spiralling out of control even more. They say progress have been made

:05:09.:05:13.

but more work is needed before Wednesday, when a definitive plan

:05:13.:05:17.

is expected to be announced. The major issues of how to resolve

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Greece first past the post debt mountain and to determine the size

:05:20.:05:26.

and nature of the bail-out fund is still under debate.

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Late into the night once again, they met. Europe's leaders insist

:05:31.:05:36.

that in three more days, they will have a solution to the debt crisis.

:05:36.:05:40.

Germany's Angela Merkel and France's Nicolas Sarkozy are at the

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centre of the deal being drawn up. They have argued in recent days

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about the way forward. This weekend they publicly presented a united

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front. TRANSLATION: Will battling a problem that has existed for

:05:55.:06:00.

decades. It has nothing to do with the currency crisis but with a debt

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crisis. Wednesday will not be the last step in this matter. There are

:06:07.:06:10.

three big issues that need resolving, if Europe is to stand

:06:10.:06:15.

any chance of emerging from this crisis. Banks hold a lot of dodgy

:06:16.:06:20.

debt and need strengthening. There is agreement on that, at least. But

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there is only some movement on what to do about Greece's debt, and they

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are still considering two options on how to improve Europe's bail-out

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fund. As one source put it, the discussions on that bail-out fund,

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the EFSF, are still a mess. Coming to a workable economic solution is

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difficult enough but arriving at a political compromise that can also

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work is turning out to be nigh on impossible. The big, long term

:06:51.:06:55.

issue is getting Europe's stagnating economy growing again.

:06:55.:06:59.

On that, Europe's leaders believe they have put a workable strategy

:06:59.:07:04.

in place. They also pushed ahead with measures to improve the

:07:04.:07:08.

monitoring of eurozone government budgets. That is designed to ensure

:07:08.:07:13.

our debt levels never get this high again. But staving off the next

:07:13.:07:21.

crisis is one thing -- designed to ensure European debt levels never

:07:21.:07:26.

get this high again. Officials in charge of Tunisia's

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historic free and fair elections say the response from voters

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exceeded all expectations. The turnout amongst the 4 million

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people who registered to vote was more than 90%. Voters are now

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electing a new assembly which will rewrite the country's constitution

:07:42.:07:47.

and appoint an interim President. For the first time in a Tunisian

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election, there has been a sense of suspense. Gone are the transparent

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envelopes and ballot boxes to ensure voters chose the bright red

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cards of President Ben Ali's party. Instead, over 100 political parties

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to choose from. And a lot of emotion about having that choice.

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So, after the first real vote in the country, there was another

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first for Tunisia. A real count. An army of newly trained volunteers,

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working across the country, counting votes in the very rooms in

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which they were cast, in order to avoid an opportunity for fraud as

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they were transported, in trying to get the results out quickly. They

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were armed with the new guidelines. This, after all, is an election

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that has been set up from scratch in just nine months. Later on

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Monday, the Election Commission will announce the official results.

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Then, for the assembly, the real work of writing a constitution, and

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establishing Tunisia's own brand of democracy really begins.

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Still to come, they lived each other's lives for 12 years. We talk

:09:11.:09:14.

to two Russian girls to have just found out they were swapped at

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birth. Let's get the business news. Ben

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Thompson is here. Markets are reacting to all this eurozone

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crisis, the summit expected on Wednesday again, what have they

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been thinking? It has been a bit of a nervous rider for the markets,

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reacting to any bit of news that comes out of the eurozone. It seems

:09:42.:09:46.

there is confidence that a deal will be done ahead of this crucial

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summit on Wednesday. Some are calling it nervous and also

:09:49.:09:54.

cautious optimism, that it might happen. We have heard of this

:09:54.:09:59.

before. Now suggestions that time is running out. We are also hearing

:09:59.:10:03.

there are concerns about where this money comes from. There are lot of

:10:03.:10:07.

fears about where this money will come from for the stability fund,

:10:07.:10:13.

the EFSF, but also to recapitalise the banks themselves. While the

:10:13.:10:16.

leaders might be deciding they are going to be put in this money in, a

:10:16.:10:20.

lot of concerns about where it will come from, and one place it could

:10:21.:10:25.

come from are the emerging economies. I was told that the

:10:25.:10:30.

fast-growing economies like China have a role to play. Most of these

:10:30.:10:34.

emerging markets have a very decent level of debt, a low level of debt

:10:34.:10:39.

compared to the eurozone. So yes, they have money. But they are also

:10:39.:10:42.

interested by the business environment. Countries like China

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and Brazil, interested in funding a potentially risk free plan for

:10:48.:10:54.

Europe. These countries' export a lot of raw material to the eurozone.

:10:54.:11:00.

A eurozone in good shape is very important. We are hearing that

:11:00.:11:03.

Japan is finally getting back on its feet after what has been a

:11:03.:11:07.

tough ride in the wake of the earthquake and tsunami, that really

:11:08.:11:14.

did affect production. We're hearing that exports are rising

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2.8% to 78 billion. The importance of manufacturing, and everything

:11:18.:11:23.

that goes on in Japan, we see it in the UK. The knock-on effect it had

:11:23.:11:28.

on car-making, for example. One economist told us that the health

:11:28.:11:32.

of the Japanese economy is vital for the health of Asia as a whole.

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Japan is still the third largest economy in the world. We are also a

:11:37.:11:41.

very large purchase or as well as exporter. Our relationship with

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China is very firm, we are complementing each other. It gives

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a good buzz to the Asian area, the core of growth we are seeing

:11:51.:11:55.

throughout the world. The negativity we are seeing is from

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the eurozone and also in the United States. This is what those markets

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are doing. The FTSE 100, pretty flat on the day. France, Germany

:12:06.:12:10.

and Italy, reacting to what they hope will be the end of the euro

:12:10.:12:15.

debt crisis, or hopes that decisions will be made by Wednesday.

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Ongoing fears about where that money may come from. More details

:12:19.:12:29.
:12:29.:12:34.

You are watching GMT from BBC World News. I am Zeinab Badawi, these are

:12:34.:12:38.

the top hat lines. The search for survivors continues

:12:38.:12:42.

in eastern Turkey after an earthquake killed more than 260

:12:42.:12:47.

people, and many more people remain trapped under the rubble. President

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Nicolas Sarkozy of France has angrily accused the British Prime

:12:51.:12:54.

Minister, David Cameron, of interfering in the eurozone crisis.

:12:54.:13:03.

He said he is sick of British Let's talk more about those

:13:03.:13:08.

eurozone discussions. EU leaders are due to meet again on Wednesday,

:13:08.:13:13.

to try to find a way forward on tackling the eurozone's massive

:13:13.:13:18.

debt crisis. Robert Peston has joined us. Let's pick up on Nicolas

:13:19.:13:23.

Sarkozy sounding quite angry with Britain, saying don't interfere,

:13:23.:13:28.

you are not in the eurozone crisis. How credible is that position?

:13:28.:13:32.

think it reflects the stress that all eurozone leaders are currently

:13:32.:13:39.

feeling. Because they are confronting a very serious crisis,

:13:39.:13:44.

in terms of the eurozone's finances, and they haven't got a solution yet.

:13:44.:13:50.

I slightly feel that David Cameron, the outburst, was more of a

:13:50.:13:54.

reflection of his general exasperation. The basic point is

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that the UK is not in the eurozone, and boasts how much better of it is

:14:01.:14:05.

not being in the eurozone, so you can understand why a eurozone

:14:05.:14:08.

member might say, this is our problem and unless you have

:14:08.:14:13.

something constructive to say, bolt off, as it were. The other side of

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that, there are three elements to the proposed rescue package. One of

:14:18.:14:22.

those elements is something that affects all European Union members.

:14:22.:14:27.

It is a strengthening of the banks. There will be 108 billion euros and

:14:27.:14:33.

new capital injected into the banks as a result of this rescue package.

:14:33.:14:40.

That element is not just for eurozone banks but banks throughout

:14:40.:14:44.

the European Union. For that reason, David Cameron has a legitimate

:14:44.:14:50.

reason to be at the meeting on Wednesday. But that aside, the real

:14:50.:14:55.

heart of the issue is what France and Germany want to do about

:14:55.:14:59.

tackling the eurozone crisis, and specifically about Greece boss debt,

:14:59.:15:04.

because French banks are very exposed to that -- Greece's debt.

:15:04.:15:08.

We have heard the concern about whether money is coming from for

:15:08.:15:11.

this rescue. In a fundamental sense, we know it is coming from Germany

:15:11.:15:16.

and France, there is nowhere else for it to come from. They are very

:15:16.:15:20.

worried about the scale of liability that would be heaped on

:15:20.:15:24.

their economy from the other really important element of the rescue

:15:24.:15:28.

plan, apart from strengthening the banks, which is expanding the size

:15:29.:15:34.

of this bail-out fund. The bail-out fund does not have enough money

:15:34.:15:38.

right now to deal with a problem that could easily arise if a

:15:38.:15:42.

country like Italy was unable to borrow on markets. Italy could

:15:42.:15:48.

easily be shut out of markets and therefore, to reassure the world's

:15:48.:15:52.

investors that it really wouldn't topple over, this bail-out fund has

:15:52.:15:56.

to have its resources multiplied by four or five times -- that it

:15:56.:16:00.

really wouldn't topple over. They are negotiating the technical

:16:00.:16:04.

details of how to do it, but it is amazingly difficult to come up with

:16:04.:16:08.

a plan that wouldn't be perceived of putting too much of a burden on

:16:08.:16:13.

front. The risk for France is in helping Italy, its own finances

:16:13.:16:17.

will be perceived to be weaker and it could lose its triple-A rating,

:16:17.:16:20.

and that would create a whole new series of headaches for the

:16:20.:16:26.

eurozone. You can see why, coming up with a solution is so difficult,

:16:26.:16:36.
:16:36.:16:37.

because one answer tends to create Thank you very much. The world is

:16:37.:16:40.

watching to see how Libya develops now that Colonel Gaddafi is dead

:16:40.:16:45.

and the country has been declared liberated. The National

:16:45.:16:48.

Transitional Council has begun moving its base from Benghazi to

:16:48.:16:54.

the carpeted, Tripoli and has set itself a deadline of eight Munster

:16:54.:16:59.

hold its first phase of elections. It's still has to announce the fate

:16:59.:17:03.

of Colonel Gaddafi's body and there is growing unease that his corpse

:17:03.:17:13.
:17:13.:17:14.

is still on display in his rata. -- Ms rata. Any word of when Colonel

:17:14.:17:18.

Gaddafi's body may be given up? There have been reports that it

:17:18.:17:24.

might be handed up -- over to his tribe. Absolutely. Those are the

:17:24.:17:28.

reports that if we are hearing as well. But nothing about the exact

:17:28.:17:34.

timings. It is now four days since Colonel Gaddafi died. His body is

:17:34.:17:39.

still lying in that cold storage unit as you say. Libyans continued

:17:39.:17:43.

to queue up to take mobile phone pictures of themselves with their

:17:43.:17:48.

former dictator's body. Many of them are having to hold crossover

:17:48.:17:56.

there Knowles's because of the smell. International concern

:17:56.:18:06.
:18:06.:18:07.

continuing over how Colonel Gaddafi died. Was he executed? Was he

:18:07.:18:12.

caught in the crossfire as had been the official explanation? We have

:18:12.:18:18.

heard from a chief pathologist. He would be -- will be revealing the

:18:18.:18:21.

findings as soon as he gets his orders. Everybody is waiting for

:18:21.:18:26.

that. Inside Libya, talking to the Libyans on the streets, they are

:18:26.:18:29.

clearing up after the massive jubilant liberation celebrations

:18:29.:18:36.

yesterday afternoon and last night. They are more focused on the day

:18:36.:18:45.

today workings of the country. are in Tripoli. The National

:18:45.:18:48.

Transitional Council has begun moving towards the capital to fully

:18:48.:18:52.

established themselves as the interim authority. What is their

:18:52.:18:59.

next move? You are right. To fully establish themselves as the

:18:59.:19:04.

transitional authority. But who will be the figurehead? Those at

:19:04.:19:07.

the top of the transitional council up until now always said that after

:19:07.:19:11.

the formal declaration of liberation, they would stand down.

:19:11.:19:15.

And there would be discussions to create the new transitional council.

:19:15.:19:19.

We have heard from the chairman of the best the outgoing chairman

:19:19.:19:26.

today. He has said just now actually before speaking to you

:19:26.:19:29.

that they are expecting an announcement on that in a

:19:29.:19:37.

fortnight's time. And then in eight months' time, the election for a

:19:37.:19:40.

national council which is expected to draw up a constitution for the

:19:40.:19:44.

new Libya and which will be put to a referendum in the country. A long

:19:44.:19:51.

road ahead but Libyans say they are ready for it. Thank you very much.

:19:51.:19:56.

Still awaiting news on what will happen to Colonel Gaddafi's body.

:19:56.:20:00.

Next week, the United Nations will announce that the world's

:20:00.:20:04.

population has reached 7 billion. It is a little more than a decade

:20:04.:20:07.

since the global population stood at 6 billion. The number of people

:20:07.:20:11.

on the planet is rising by around 80 million every year. The United

:20:11.:20:15.

Nations is warning that rapid population growth is threatening

:20:15.:20:23.

many poorer countries, especially in sub-Saharan Africa. This report

:20:23.:20:28.

from Zambia in southern Africa. Its population is projected to triple

:20:28.:20:32.

by 2050. Welcome to the world. Like each and

:20:32.:20:38.

every one of us, these newborns help make up the 7 billion people

:20:38.:20:45.

on a our planet. Catherine has just given birth for the 4th time. She

:20:45.:20:51.

has a daughter. She does not have a name yet. Despite living in poverty,

:20:51.:20:57.

the parents want more children and they are ambitious for their future.

:20:57.:21:01.

Translation macro I want my daughter and my sons to become

:21:01.:21:06.

important people. Then they can help us. But I do not know if there

:21:06.:21:11.

will be enough people for them all to go through school. Big families

:21:11.:21:17.

are the norm. Six children is the average. It is causing a huge

:21:17.:21:22.

increase in numbers. Zambia's population is projected to triple

:21:22.:21:28.

by 2050 and keep rising. protects you against St eyes and

:21:28.:21:37.

best -- HIV. That is despite modern contraception methods. They are

:21:37.:21:42.

available without charge. family planning methods are free

:21:42.:21:47.

but how facilities, people have to travel to attend those services.

:21:47.:21:50.

They do not been learned enough. They would rather use the money not

:21:50.:21:56.

on travelling but to feed the family. This is a youthful country.

:21:56.:22:01.

Half the population is aged 16 or under. And more and more families

:22:01.:22:08.

are leaving the countryside to live in the capital. Population growth

:22:08.:22:13.

can be good for the economy. A young workforce are relatively few

:22:13.:22:18.

elderly. But the increase is so rapid the fear is it could

:22:18.:22:23.

perpetuate poverty. Zambia is barely able to feed 30 million

:22:23.:22:29.

people now so how will it cope with 100 million or more by the end of

:22:29.:22:31.

the century? And how do you encourage the young

:22:32.:22:37.

to have fewer children than their parents? Aid agencies say it is

:22:37.:22:42.

going to start with more rights for women. If you are married to a man

:22:42.:22:46.

and he wants 10 children, you have no say. Even when you know that

:22:46.:22:50.

they will not be looked after properly. We need to empower all

:22:50.:22:53.

men are so that they can make decisions about their lives. --

:22:53.:23:00.

Women. What things can the new government do for you? And that

:23:00.:23:05.

begins in the classroom. Attitudes are changing. These teenagers want

:23:05.:23:15.
:23:15.:23:17.

Korea's first and motherhood second. I want to children. I want two

:23:17.:23:20.

children to reduce the population. Zambia is a big country. Three

:23:20.:23:27.

times the size of Britain. There is plenty of room. But the expanding

:23:27.:23:32.

population needs more schools, jobs, hospitals and homes if it is to be

:23:32.:23:42.

lifted from poverty to prosperity. You can follow our special series,

:23:42.:23:47.

7 billion and counting on the website. Over the next seven days,

:23:47.:23:51.

we will be travelling to seven different countries looking at the

:23:51.:24:01.

emerging issues as our global population reaches seven billion.

:24:01.:24:05.

Now a poignant story about two young girls and their families.

:24:05.:24:09.

Police in Russia are investigating after it emerged that two babies

:24:09.:24:13.

have been mixed up at birth 12 years ago. The two families

:24:13.:24:21.

involved have already lodged a civil case against the hospital.

:24:21.:24:26.

Family photos normally bring back hammy -- happy memories, but for

:24:26.:24:30.

this family, the past has turned into a nightmare. They have

:24:30.:24:34.

discovered that her 12-year-old daughter, the clerk -- the deal she

:24:34.:24:43.

thought she had given birth to, is not her child. My ex-husband

:24:43.:24:48.

refused to pay maintenance. I took him to court. But with the DNA

:24:48.:24:58.
:24:58.:24:59.

tests, the results were a total surprise. Police believe that 12

:24:59.:25:03.

years ago, there had been a terrible mix-up at the local

:25:03.:25:06.

maternity hospital. That two babies had been given the wrong name tags

:25:06.:25:13.

and the wrong parents. At first, I thought it was a joke, then I could

:25:13.:25:21.

not stop crying. My whole world had turned upside down. If she had been

:25:21.:25:26.

given the wrong baby, then where was her real daughter? She was

:25:26.:25:29.

desperate to find out so she went to the police and they began to

:25:29.:25:32.

search for her biological child. Within weeks, they had found her,

:25:32.:25:38.

living just a few miles away, in this house. She had been brought up

:25:38.:25:44.

a devout Muslim. She thought her father was this man. When the

:25:44.:25:48.

priest told him about the mistake at the maternity hospital, he did

:25:48.:25:56.

not want to believe it. detectives showed me a photograph

:25:56.:26:01.

of the other girl. The one they said was my real daughter. When I

:26:01.:26:06.

saw her face, it was like seeing myself. The two families are

:26:06.:26:10.

getting to know each other but after a lifetime apart, it is not

:26:10.:26:17.

easy. I have tried to show motherly love but she does not accept it.

:26:17.:26:25.

When your own daughter looks at you like a stranger, that is so painful.

:26:25.:26:29.

The girls say they did not want to stop parents, they are just happy

:26:29.:26:37.

to have found each other. -- swapper. We were a bit shy at first

:26:37.:26:43.

but now we are the best of friends. They were born 15 minutes apart.

:26:43.:26:45.

With Zeinab Badawi. Turkey is rocked by an earthquake that's killed at least 200 people. We have the latest. Are Europe's leaders any closer to solving the Eurozone crisis after agreeing on the outline of a rescue deal?

And we're live in Libya to discuss the country's democratic future - as well as the unease that Colonel Gaddafi has still not been buried.


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