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falling in the coming months. It is time to bring your HARDtalk. | :00:09. | :00:14. | |
What is a film and what is art? Is a movie about a male sex addict | :00:14. | :00:24. | |
with a scene after seen of him indulging in his addiction art? | :00:24. | :00:29. | |
With me is the award-winning artist and film-maker Steve McQueen. He is | :00:29. | :00:33. | |
considered to be one of the most exciting talents in the film | :00:33. | :00:37. | |
industry. Does he deserve the accolades for her this movie and | :00:37. | :00:47. | |
:00:47. | :01:07. | ||
Steve McQueen, welcome to HARDtalk. Thank you. Why did she want to make | :01:07. | :01:12. | |
a film about a man with a sex addiction? I thought it was | :01:12. | :01:18. | |
important. It is a subject which nobody speaking about. I thought it | :01:18. | :01:24. | |
was worthy of having a background where people can actually have a | :01:24. | :01:28. | |
conversation about the film. Do you really think nobody speaks about it | :01:28. | :01:35. | |
Crows we have had various Hollywood actors talk about sex addictions. | :01:35. | :01:40. | |
People go into sex clinics. People talk about it. But people snigger. | :01:40. | :01:47. | |
They laugh at it. It is not taken seriously. It is not seen might | :01:48. | :01:54. | |
alcohol addiction or drug addiction. What was fascinating about it was | :01:54. | :01:59. | |
that everyone indulges in a one way or another in sex. Everyone drinks | :01:59. | :02:04. | |
-- not everyone drinks or takes drugs. But everyone has a | :02:04. | :02:11. | |
relationship with sex. There is a stigma attached to sex. I wanted to | :02:11. | :02:18. | |
look at it in a serious fashion. you believe sex addiction exists? | :02:18. | :02:24. | |
Expert opinion is divided. One example, in the United States a | :02:24. | :02:28. | |
doctor who works as a psychologist for more than a decade says there | :02:28. | :02:33. | |
is no evidence that sex addiction is a ballad psychiatric disorder. | :02:33. | :02:38. | |
It is not like drug were alcohol addiction. You do not get cravings | :02:38. | :02:43. | |
and withdrawal symptoms. It is more of a compulsion. Addiction is the | :02:43. | :02:49. | |
wrong word. Once upon a time people used to say the world was flat. A | :02:49. | :02:56. | |
lot of people believed it. It is one of those things where there is | :02:56. | :03:04. | |
a stigma attached to it. The stigma is sex. You did a lot of research. | :03:04. | :03:08. | |
People who describe themselves as sex addicts. I do not want to | :03:08. | :03:14. | |
suggest that their opinions are not valid. But consider what the | :03:14. | :03:18. | |
experts said. Are you convinced it exists in the light of your | :03:18. | :03:24. | |
conversations with them? People were diagnosing themselves. Experts | :03:24. | :03:30. | |
in the field to have looked into this just as much as his other | :03:30. | :03:34. | |
expert has. They came to an end conclusion that there is a thing | :03:34. | :03:44. | |
:03:44. | :03:47. | ||
called sex addiction. One could take alcohol and drug addiction out | :03:47. | :03:56. | |
of somebody's life. That is why it is a problem. This rock musician he | :03:56. | :04:02. | |
used to play for her a bend in America says he believes he slept | :04:02. | :04:07. | |
with more than 3,000 women. He said he never considered himself a sex | :04:07. | :04:12. | |
addict. He said it never messed up his ability to function at a higher | :04:12. | :04:22. | |
:04:22. | :04:22. | ||
level. You cannot absorb man who pronounce themselves sex addicts. - | :04:22. | :04:28. | |
- abs older man. You cannot absolve them of their actions. You cannot. | :04:28. | :04:32. | |
There is a difference between being promiscuous and having an addiction. | :04:32. | :04:38. | |
There is a difference. A man who has had sex with more than 3,000 | :04:38. | :04:46. | |
women? I do not know what the average number is. It could be more. | :04:46. | :04:52. | |
There is a situation similar to drug or alcohol addiction. They are | :04:52. | :04:58. | |
craving for the thing and running their lives. Addiction is when | :04:58. | :05:06. | |
everything else becomes secondary. The compulsion is destroying their | :05:07. | :05:15. | |
life. That is what you film says? It is a serious matter. People are | :05:15. | :05:20. | |
laughing about it. But it is serious. People's lives are being | :05:20. | :05:27. | |
ruined. We will show you a cup of your film. You make a distinction | :05:27. | :05:30. | |
between the central character, Brandon, whose inability to be | :05:30. | :05:39. | |
intimate with a woman who he likes. One person for the rest of your | :05:39. | :05:47. | |
life. You come to restaurants and see couple sitting together. They | :05:47. | :05:53. | |
do not have anything to say. They are connected. They do not have to | :05:53. | :06:03. | |
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speak. Or they are just a bore. -- Ford. What is your longest | :06:03. | :06:13. | |
:06:13. | :06:21. | ||
relationship? Exactly? For months. That is the actor who plays the | :06:21. | :06:27. | |
character of Brandon. You said in making this film that you wanted to | :06:27. | :06:34. | |
challenge people's assumptions. But surely it to do that you need to | :06:34. | :06:40. | |
inform them somehow. That is one of the criticism about your film. This | :06:40. | :06:45. | |
character, Brandon, we have no idea what he does for her a living. He | :06:45. | :06:51. | |
comes out of nowhere. You do not empathise or sympathise with him. | :06:51. | :06:55. | |
You do not know a great deal about him. Surely you have to inform | :06:55. | :07:05. | |
:07:05. | :07:14. | ||
them? People are very intelligent. The job that he does is a job in an | :07:14. | :07:22. | |
office environment. It is like any job in an office. It is to do with | :07:22. | :07:29. | |
advertising. The situation of the back story, the criticism has come | :07:29. | :07:39. | |
:07:39. | :07:42. | ||
about where he comes from. I have just met you. Hopefully we can get | :07:42. | :07:51. | |
to know each other. At understand your past three your presence. That | :07:51. | :07:57. | |
is what I want to do through the film. The movie had been going on | :07:57. | :08:03. | |
for a while before all this had come out. There is a moment in | :08:03. | :08:08. | |
Brandon's wife where they can put the pieces of the jigsaw puzzle | :08:08. | :08:12. | |
together through the present. have seen the film. There is a lot | :08:12. | :08:19. | |
of sex. A lot of full frontal nudity. Soft-core pornography | :08:19. | :08:29. | |
:08:29. | :08:33. | ||
masquerading as art? Sex titillate. All people find this -- sex | :08:33. | :08:39. | |
addiction titillating. Are you not saying that sex sells? People can | :08:39. | :08:45. | |
do that more successfully than I could possibly do in this situation. | :08:45. | :08:55. | |
It is not particularly sexy. It is not pornographic or vulgar. This is | :08:55. | :08:59. | |
irresponsible film. It is about a personal problem with their sex | :08:59. | :09:04. | |
life. But people might go because they know it has explicit sex | :09:04. | :09:09. | |
scenes. That is fine. And people go to films where people get their | :09:09. | :09:14. | |
heads chopped off. I cannot dictate what people want. The point I'm | :09:14. | :09:19. | |
trying to make is that this is about someone who has a problem. | :09:19. | :09:28. | |
And finding myself defending sexual addiction quite often. It is | :09:28. | :09:33. | |
similar in the 80s with people who have HIV. There is this massive | :09:33. | :09:43. | |
:09:43. | :09:44. | ||
stigma. Similar to people with sex addiction. It is serious. In terms | :09:44. | :09:52. | |
of the Spelman would you, does it worry you that it got a higher | :09:52. | :09:55. | |
rating? It may not be as much of a commercial success as it might have | :09:55. | :10:02. | |
been. My reason for making this film is to do something responsible. | :10:02. | :10:06. | |
Does it worry you that it may not be as commercially successful with | :10:06. | :10:12. | |
this rating? People will see this film. Children have ways of seeing | :10:13. | :10:17. | |
things which their parents do not want them to see. His commercial | :10:17. | :10:21. | |
success important to you? What is important is that people see the | :10:21. | :10:29. | |
movie. People might be turned off. I am going on to a wider point. | :10:29. | :10:36. | |
People who are intelligent will have the opportunity to realise | :10:36. | :10:41. | |
there is a way around that. Looking at it in a wider perspective. I'll | :10:41. | :10:48. | |
tell you what the Prime Minister has said. He is urging British | :10:48. | :10:52. | |
film-makers are there focus to mainstream movies. This is to | :10:52. | :10:57. | |
bolster the $7 billion British film industry. Calling for more | :10:57. | :11:01. | |
commercially successful pictures to rival Hollywood. Is that something | :11:01. | :11:07. | |
that resonates with you? Making culturally rewarding films as David | :11:07. | :11:12. | |
Cameron has put that may not be commercial successes. I do not even | :11:12. | :11:21. | |
know what that means. Culturally rewarding. Not even Hollywood is | :11:21. | :11:28. | |
accurate at what makes money. Take a look at the King's Speech. Nobody | :11:28. | :11:35. | |
wanted to invest in that movie. is a good example. In the end it | :11:35. | :11:41. | |
was a massive success. But it was made by independent film-makers and | :11:41. | :11:45. | |
cost $14 million to make, getting back $400 million. It won four | :11:45. | :11:51. | |
Oscars. It shows you can make a film on a small budget that is | :11:51. | :11:54. | |
commercially successful. We do have liked to have made something like | :11:54. | :12:04. | |
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that? If I wanted to make money I would be in a different game. I am | :12:05. | :12:14. | |
an artist. What is art about? It is about experimenting and reflecting | :12:14. | :12:22. | |
with humanity. If it makes money, great. If it does not, so what? | :12:22. | :12:31. | |
you might not get public money. That is what the government says. | :12:31. | :12:35. | |
The government want to get involved in how art is there seemed to and | :12:35. | :12:43. | |
how art is made. -- proceed. If we go down that road we are in a | :12:43. | :12:51. | |
dangerous place. But if you take money from British Film Institute | :12:51. | :12:58. | |
and you say, I have the right to make a film and do artistic work, | :12:58. | :13:03. | |
it is a pity that not everyone likes it, can you justify that? | :13:03. | :13:08. | |
can justify that in that the only quality people can have in terms of | :13:08. | :13:13. | |
making film is that it has some kind of criteria of trying to be | :13:13. | :13:23. | |
:13:23. | :13:28. | ||
excellent. It tries to be excellent. A lot of things have commercial | :13:28. | :13:36. | |
success that a not very good at all. You have had your accolades, in | :13:36. | :13:41. | |
particular for your film Hunger. He won a BAFTA award for it. Best | :13:41. | :13:46. | |
feature film for -- by a director for the first time. It was about | :13:46. | :13:54. | |
the hunger strikes in the early 80s in Belfast. You said at the time, | :13:54. | :13:58. | |
this is one of the most important moments in a recent British history. | :13:58. | :14:06. | |
Why did you say that? Ten men died in a British spy -- prison cell | :14:06. | :14:12. | |
because of starvation. That is important. Ten men died of | :14:12. | :14:17. | |
starvation in a prison cell. That is pretty huge. But wasn't that | :14:17. | :14:22. | |
their choice? It was a choice to make the film in the context of | :14:23. | :14:32. | |
:14:33. | :14:33. | ||
what was going on at the time. did you film lacked balance? One | :14:33. | :14:40. | |
bomb victims said that your film about Bobby Sands glorify as | :14:40. | :14:47. | |
terrorists. I do not think that gentleman actually saw the film. | :14:47. | :14:54. | |
Others made that comment. Even before the cameras started to roll, | :14:54. | :14:59. | |
people were saying that it was glamorising it. I will ask people | :14:59. | :15:08. | |
to go and see it before they judge it. And you obviously do think that. | :15:08. | :15:13. | |
I am just saying that this position a lot of people hold that it lacks | :15:13. | :15:19. | |
balance... It very much emphasised with Bobby Sands. I always try to | :15:19. | :15:29. | |
make a balance. It was always my intention. The actor Stuart Graham | :15:29. | :15:34. | |
who plays a prison warden, we follow him, we see his side of the | :15:34. | :15:44. | |
:15:44. | :15:44. | ||
story. We also seek the hunger striker' side of the story. | :15:45. | :15:51. | |
talk about she mongers de? showed it. We showed what the IRA | :15:51. | :15:56. | |
did in the picture. We see members of the irate shooting a prison | :15:56. | :16:05. | |
officer. -- the IRA. So it you refute the fact that it lacked | :16:05. | :16:11. | |
balance? I do not refuted, go and see the picture. You cannot make a | :16:11. | :16:16. | |
film about this without having some idea of what the other side is | :16:16. | :16:23. | |
feeling. To me, she manatee is more important. -- humanity is more | :16:23. | :16:32. | |
important. Some sort of answer to the situation they Erian. He also | :16:32. | :16:37. | |
said the film has contemporary evidence -- residents. The body is | :16:37. | :16:43. | |
becoming a site of political warfare. Your own body is your last | :16:43. | :16:50. | |
resort for protest. You talk about suicide bombers. Of course. People | :16:50. | :16:57. | |
are taking Daren life in such a way... -- their own that life. It | :16:57. | :17:07. | |
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is warfare. Warfare is something that does interest you. In 2003 you | :17:07. | :17:12. | |
were appointed by the Imperial War Museum as the war artist to Iraq. | :17:12. | :17:18. | |
You spend six days in Iraq. The result was a work called Queen and | :17:19. | :17:26. | |
country. It consists of wooden cabinets filled with facsimile it | :17:26. | :17:33. | |
stands with portraits of dead bridges soldiers. Looking at Hunger, | :17:33. | :17:40. | |
the subject matter, hunger strikes, fought the irate the British | :17:40. | :17:46. | |
soldier was the ultimate enemy. You were commemorating British soldiers | :17:46. | :17:52. | |
in Iraq. I am not trying to compare the two incidences, but had he | :17:52. | :18:02. | |
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reconcile it? They are humans that died in a tragic way. The ultimate | :18:03. | :18:10. | |
goal was to have an official stamp made. People died in a war honoured | :18:10. | :18:20. | |
with a stab. -- people died in a war, they were honoured by a stamp. | :18:20. | :18:25. | |
Bain officer in a British army could have a stamp. To honour the | :18:25. | :18:35. | |
:18:35. | :18:35. | ||
dead. Unfortunately, we were stopped by the Royal Mail. What do | :18:35. | :18:41. | |
you want to happen to your work? What we and their relatives wanted | :18:41. | :18:47. | |
was that they make official stamps of the dead. That is what you do it. | :18:47. | :18:56. | |
You said it struck me as an intimate but distinguished way as a | :18:56. | :19:04. | |
way of highlighting the efforts of these individuals. But you | :19:04. | :19:11. | |
mentioned national ideals. Did I? HARDtalk never get it wrong. What | :19:11. | :19:16. | |
were you talking about their? not know, I do not remember saying | :19:16. | :19:23. | |
it. I can only interpreted in the weight that what I like about | :19:23. | :19:32. | |
Britain is that we can reflect... On situations that we can reflect | :19:32. | :19:40. | |
on ourselves, reflect on what we have done, who we are. You said | :19:40. | :19:47. | |
that straight after visiting Iraq. You know why I am asking you this? | :19:47. | :19:52. | |
In what way was the Iraq war upholding a national ideals with | :19:52. | :19:58. | |
the UK? We have heard politicians and commentators all saying that it | :19:58. | :20:04. | |
was not a walk. Was it a regime changed? I do not believe I ever | :20:04. | :20:14. | |
said it. You want to have a debate about it. I am just asking you. | :20:14. | :20:21. | |
Personally, I do not agree with the war in Iraq. So why did you except | :20:21. | :20:30. | |
to become the official war artist to Iraq? Requested by the Imperial | :20:30. | :20:40. | |
:20:40. | :20:44. | ||
War Museum. What I was trying to say -- if I did say that, it is all | :20:44. | :20:48. | |
about contradicting the whole notion of what the war artist is. | :20:48. | :20:54. | |
You go there to reflect on what is going on. You criticise it. Were | :20:54. | :21:02. | |
you criticising yet by taking that position? I do not know. Did your | :21:03. | :21:09. | |
friends ask what you were doing? because the post is not about | :21:09. | :21:14. | |
glorifying British nationalism. I am not interested. The post has | :21:15. | :21:20. | |
always been a situation of an artist reflecting on circumstances. | :21:20. | :21:27. | |
But, let me finish... The fact of the manor is... For me, the stamp | :21:27. | :21:32. | |
is for people who oppose the war and also... If you send people out | :21:32. | :21:38. | |
to war and they die in the name of the country, you should honour them. | :21:38. | :21:46. | |
It is a matter of great tragedy that these soldiers did die. But | :21:46. | :21:51. | |
you do not shy away from gritty topics at all, do you, Steve | :21:51. | :21:59. | |
McQueen? You are working on another topic right now about a slave. | :21:59. | :22:08. | |
is black. Wrongly reported again! Sorry. Gritty topics is what you | :22:08. | :22:15. | |
really like. I like things for me which are screaming but are not | :22:15. | :22:22. | |
being held -- being heard. It is very evident to me that these | :22:22. | :22:32. | |
:22:32. | :22:34. | ||
things need subject. Race is an end slavery? Freedom. - races them and | :22:34. | :22:43. | |
slavery? All of my films are about freedom. Twelve Years a Slave is | :22:43. | :22:50. | |
about a middle class black man in the 18th century and he is | :22:50. | :22:57. | |
kidnapped. Final question, you have said, I take my audiences seriously | :22:57. | :23:02. | |
because they take myself seriously. I do not offer them a plate with | :23:02. | :23:08. | |
food already on it. I offer them a buffet. Is that what you like? You | :23:08. | :23:14. | |
do your work and your heart and you let the audience take away what | :23:14. | :23:20. | |
they want from it? I think it is important that once people leave | :23:20. | :23:25. | |
the exhibition or cinema, they can come away and have a conversation | :23:25. | :23:29. | |
about the subject. The artwork should provoke them to have a | :23:29. | :23:37. |