03/06/2013 Newsnight Scotland

bank of England, you didn't see it, Tonight on Newsnight Scotland.

Meet independence man. He is young, fit and proud to be Scottish. He is

also the bedrock of the campaign to secure a Yes vote in next year's

referendum. But where is independence woman and independence

young person? Tonight we ask, how do the nationalists connect with those

Good evening. Independence man. He is probably a

manual worker and he passionately believes that he and his country

will be better off if we vote Yes next year. How Alex Salmond must

wish others shared his blokish enthusiasm for independence. If they

did, then the gap between Yes and No would be much, much closer. We know,

for example, that women's support for independence has persistently

trailed support among men. And yesterday, perhaps more

surprisingly, the first survey of the voting intention of teenagers

showed weak support for ending the Union. So, how do advocates of

independence reach out to the various groups who so far remain

female, if we become independent next year, the outcome will affect

everyone. And is the yes campaign struggling? They are struggling in

getting towards women and younger voters. They are behind in three

crucial groups. This man says that the independence campaign has a lot

of hard work to do. The first and biggest and most start is the

difference between men and women. Men are from pole to pole more

likely to be in favour of independence than women. The second

difficulty which is quite evident as the age difference. But the most

part, old people. People over the age of 65 seem marginally less

likely to vote for independence. Very much younger people seem much

the same. -- seem to think the differently. The third situation is

people in manual occupations, working-class people, they are more

likely to be for independence than middle-class people in well-paid

occupations. So what about young people? 16 and 17-year-olds will get

a vote in the referendum. After a study taken at the weekend, 60%

thought that Scotland should not be independent. About one fifth said

they would vote yes and a similar proportion said they were undecided.

We met with this group of students at a college in Glasgow. They are

planning for the futures but they do not all necessarily think that

independence is a big issue in their lives. Is it something you think you

might get more engaged with? probably well. I do not take much

about it. I do not watch much news. But once it gets close I probably

will look more into it. I think it is generally due to not knowing both

sides. If you look at both sides and realise what is going on, then we

would make our minds up, but at the moment we're over the majority.

know a lot of 16 and 17-year-olds who can barely feed themselves let

alone make a decision like that point I don't think we should have a

decision. One of the students does support independence, she said the

outcome of the vote would influence what she does after college. I think

like most of the fiscal power is down in Westminster. If we got more

of that control up you be good cut business tax and encourage economic

growth little bit more up your. People like myself and people in

college would have more chance to start up a business and the economy

would grow more appear. That is one female voters convinced, what about

others? Last September of the birth of the Women for Independence

campaign group. Its organisers want to listen to female concerns about

independence and convince them it is best to seek yes. Whilst touring

down the Braveheart rhetoric which is said to that of women voters.

Well, women are discriminated, and particularly in the independence

debate we are a bit fed up of seeing generally male faces discussing the

issues and groaned a very narrow focus. It is not inspiring women to

get involved. -- around a very narrow focus. Not enough arguing

about it. It has been dominated by men. We were concerned that the

voices of women were not being heard. So what does a typical Yes

vote look like? An image of the kid of person most likely would be to

think of the present -- of the present tossing the keeper in the

Highland games, male, young, well built and more than likely to be in

a manual occupation. That gives you an image of the kind of person most

likely to vote for independence. Young, male, fit, active. That is

the archetypal boater. -- voter. interested parties. -- I am joined

in the studio by three interested parties. Do you recognise this

character? Yes and no. There was an excursion into fantasy and fiction

there that was a little implausible. We do not have enough data. There

has always been a gender gap in Scottish politics. It was the same

in the 1979 referendum. Rather huge. So there is something about

politics, a rather narrow preserver of male -- men in Scotland. And a

profound sense of disconnection for women regarding issues they see as

relevant in their lives. They are more cautious and undecided. To what

extent is it the issues featuring in the debate, Natalie? We do lots of

listening exercises. We find that women have the same issues as men,

but it is the way they want to find out and impart information that is

different from the way men do it. We go out into the communities and

speak and engage with women, who are not at the forefront of this debate.

There is a gap in terms of representation, in terms of the

media. There are not many female senior figures. They do not see the

image reflected in the debate. That is a problem for the whole campaign.

Gerry also mentioned in natural caution. You have written about that

in the past? How would you define it? John Curtis can not but a

caricature of the male voter, but there is a significant minority of

women who want to vote for independence. But the awareness of

the gender gap has become more of a focus recently. The very fact we are

discussing it now is evidence of that. Fiona Mackay at Edinburgh

University has done some very good work around this, challenging common

misconceptions. The idea that women are more emotional and want to

retain a part of the UK, whereas she finds that women are actually more

cautious and Mike Matic and simply want to hear more of the arguments.

-- pragmatic. Figures may change as we go forward and the debate moves

on. Patrick Harvie, how do you analyse the gender gap that is

persistently revealed by Paul on? What the others have mentioned is

quite right. There is an issue with gender equality in politics in

general. It is unfortunate that the SNP have not managed to increase the

proportion of the elected women in Parliament. If we had a parliament,

and particularly pro-independence political parties that more

accurately reflected all parts of Scottish society, perhaps the

dynamics with the different. What if somebody wants to take longer and

make the end up in a different way, we need to connect with people on a

different level. In many respects it is a sensible position. If somebody

is unsure and feels neither nationalist or unionist in the

bones, they may take your time to reach a conclusion and I believe

that is quite rational. What do you think would inspire more people to

get involved? To back the Yes campaign? Is it simply that you have

to demonstrate that there is a potential to be better off in the

event of independence? I have previously argued, and I would

continue to, that we should not pose this debate is about being richer or

poorer. All countries are facing uncertain times in terms of the

economy. I do not think our interest are determined by whether we are

just a wee bit richer or a wee bit more. If people have different

priorities across from sectors of society, which obviously they do,

then the Yes campaign has to articulate the fact that voting yes

does not mean voting for SNP economic policy. In recent months

there has been more talk about policies to improve childcare in the

event of independence. Well that in it for female independence voters?

-- well that do it? No. In a word. Childcare is a societal issue.

People get tired of the notion that women's issues are solely gender

specific. Clearly these things may appeal to women, but women are

interested in the same things as men. Especially the economy. We need

to have a proper debate, where it is not merely talking stick to bring

women into the debate. They make up 52% of the vote. -- where it is not

tokenistic. . There are benefits, opportunities to discuss a different

way of doing things. Is it part of the problem of having a broad-based

campaign for independence that it will therefore be even harder for

anybody in that campaign to define a particular vision? That is true. We

have a Yes campaign and a No campaign but both are rather

narrow, professional, technocratic campaigns. Most Scots do not feel

they are talking to them. The missing Scotland, more important

than John Curtis and his caricatures, is the ruler, younger

Scotland. -- poorer. Absolutely. We need to connect that to the macro

politics. You say, generational, but it seems the youngest generation who

will qualify to take part are not particularly keen on the idea. How

do you explain that? There is a huge way in which this debate is not

proven. All the figures are soft. The onus is on the Yes campaign to

make the proposition for change. They have not yet. But this is still

up for grabs. Do you agree that the Yes campaign have not yet made the

case for change? How would you sum it up? Democracy, fearless,

equality. I believe the Yes campaign are going for with them. --

fairness. How do you make that real? It is about having the powers to

make that possible for the people of Scotland. But don't you have to

specify those powers? A lot of people are more pro-independence

than they even think. When you look at specific issues that people want

power over, for example, wealthier, taxation, which over two thirds want

power over -- wealthier. -- welfare. When you make that connection,

people will move into the debate. you think that advocating votes for

16 and 17 adults have done more harm than good for the campaign? -- have

done more harm. I don't think so. It is a small proportion of voters.

They would need to be wildly out of sync with the rest of the