Browse content similar to 02/12/2013. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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Protest, punch-ups and now the Government of Ukraine says | :00:09. | :00:13. | |
demonstrators are trying to stage a coup. What has happened to a | :00:14. | :00:19. | |
campaign which began as an attempt to embrace European democracy. I met | :00:20. | :00:27. | |
someone and they make me feel so happy, so safe and everything just | :00:28. | :00:36. | |
feels great. A British sporting hero comes out on YouTube. Why do so many | :00:37. | :00:42. | |
sports stars choose to stay in the closet. | :00:43. | :00:46. | |
Have smartphones turned us all into idiots. We talk to Randi Zuckerberg | :00:47. | :00:50. | |
about the state of being together alone, or alone together. | :00:51. | :00:59. | |
Before all that, yet another problem tonight for the Royal Bank of | :01:00. | :01:06. | |
Scotland. This evening it became the bank that likes to say... Sorry we | :01:07. | :01:10. | |
cannot process your transaction. As if it wasn't enough to have played | :01:11. | :01:14. | |
such a role in bankrupting the country and just a week or so to | :01:15. | :01:17. | |
have been accused of running businesses into the ground. Tonight, | :01:18. | :01:22. | |
part of its IT system went into meltdown on what is said to be the | :01:23. | :01:26. | |
busiest internet shopping day of the year, great numbers of customers | :01:27. | :01:31. | |
were unable to use their cards. Our own Andrew Verity is here, along | :01:32. | :01:39. | |
with Paul Lewis, presenter of Radio 4's MoneyBox. What happened? Around | :01:40. | :01:43. | |
of 6. 30 you had reports of transactions being declined. Just at | :01:44. | :01:47. | |
the time when people are looking to buy groceries after work. Then you | :01:48. | :01:50. | |
had a report of a supermarket in Kent where NatWest cards had been | :01:51. | :01:55. | |
declined en masse. Was it an isolated example, have a look at | :01:56. | :01:58. | |
Twitter it turned out not. There were hundreds and hundreds of | :01:59. | :02:01. | |
examples coming in from Twitter of people who had transactions | :02:02. | :02:05. | |
declined. To give you a flavour of those, "there goes my plan to get | :02:06. | :02:11. | |
Christmas shopping bargains tonight, daughter stuck in Leeds with no | :02:12. | :02:14. | |
money for the bus, thanks NatWest your system failure means I can't | :02:15. | :02:21. | |
pay for it". To avoid confusion, NatWest belongs to Lloyd's? We | :02:22. | :02:25. | |
bailed them both out after the crisis yes. The customers of NatWest | :02:26. | :02:29. | |
reporting great difficulties all over. This happened between 6. 30 | :02:30. | :02:35. | |
and 9. 30 and 10.00. It was affecting on-line banking and debit | :02:36. | :02:40. | |
transactions, on-line banking came up about 10.00, and it looked like | :02:41. | :02:45. | |
debit card transactions are back. The chaoses causing, one tweet today | :02:46. | :02:50. | |
my colleague Paul. My autistic son is stressed as card not working in | :02:51. | :02:55. | |
shops or machines, doing my best to help him by phones. You are the | :02:56. | :03:01. | |
Messiah in these circumstances if people start tweeting your account | :03:02. | :03:09. | |
for grumbles. How bad is this? In 18 months in June last year they had a | :03:10. | :03:13. | |
real problem where systems went out for a week in the case of RBS | :03:14. | :03:17. | |
customer, slightly for more NatWest. For Ulster Bank, part of the same | :03:18. | :03:21. | |
group, they were without any access to their bank accounts for a month. | :03:22. | :03:25. | |
And that often meant that their employer couldn't pay them because | :03:26. | :03:28. | |
they couldn't get the money into the bank. It was an absolutely major | :03:29. | :03:34. | |
catastrophe then. What I have been told by RBS tonight is they will | :03:35. | :03:38. | |
compensate people for any losses, if your car is stuck at the carriage | :03:39. | :03:43. | |
full of petrol and you can't pay for it. I have had several tweets along | :03:44. | :03:48. | |
those lines, how do you get home, taxi and hope somebody at home has | :03:49. | :03:53. | |
the money. They will reimburse the expenses. Even last time with the | :03:54. | :03:57. | |
really big problems they had, they didn't pay compensation. There was | :03:58. | :04:01. | |
another minor event that lasted a few hours in March this year. People | :04:02. | :04:04. | |
with that banking group have really suffered from these IT problems. | :04:05. | :04:08. | |
This is not banking group that is in robust good health, is it? Well, no, | :04:09. | :04:13. | |
in many ways it is not. Though I did notice the other day they were | :04:14. | :04:20. | |
discussing making ?500 million worth of bonus payments, whether that will | :04:21. | :04:23. | |
happen we will have to see. Last year Ulster Bank directors didn't | :04:24. | :04:27. | |
take their bonus, I don't know if you recall that. We spent a lot of | :04:28. | :04:31. | |
money bailing Ulster Bank out too. It is part of the same group, they | :04:32. | :04:36. | |
didn't take their bonuses but RBS and NatWest did. There are all sorts | :04:37. | :04:39. | |
of allegations about small businesses and how one bit of the | :04:40. | :04:42. | |
bank has tried to put them out of business so the other bank bit could | :04:43. | :04:45. | |
take their property over. Completely denied, of course. And of course the | :04:46. | :04:50. | |
mis-selling of payment protection insurance, not unique to RBS but | :04:51. | :04:54. | |
affecting a lot of people too. It is the human side too, people | :04:55. | :05:00. | |
humiliated at restaurants and turned down for their cards. A lot of | :05:01. | :05:06. | |
embarrassing dates and early nights! There was an almost plainive tone to | :05:07. | :05:12. | |
the President of Ukraine today as he appealed to citizens to calm down | :05:13. | :05:17. | |
and not protesting about his Government. The fact that much of | :05:18. | :05:20. | |
his Government couldn't function because of the protest had something | :05:21. | :05:23. | |
to do it. The anger is triggered because he seemed to have decided | :05:24. | :05:26. | |
that the country lies less in a closer relationship with the | :05:27. | :05:30. | |
European Union, than keeping sweet with President Putin. The Russian's | :05:31. | :05:38. | |
ideal leader is a ventriloquist's dummy of course. There are now calls | :05:39. | :05:42. | |
for a general strike to bring down the Government. In the battle for | :05:43. | :05:48. | |
Ukraine, protest is becoming increasingly violent, and the stakes | :05:49. | :05:57. | |
undoubtedly are being raised. What started with demos about the | :05:58. | :06:00. | |
President's rejection of partnership agreement with the EU is turning | :06:01. | :06:05. | |
into a struggle about power and how it is wielded. The police made a | :06:06. | :06:11. | |
mistake when they dispersed the crowd. Lots of people who previously | :06:12. | :06:16. | |
did not support European integration, or were not ready to go | :06:17. | :06:19. | |
on to the streets to show their views, if they supported the | :06:20. | :06:25. | |
European integration, felt angry on Saturday and on Sunday and today, of | :06:26. | :06:30. | |
course, and more and more people have gone out into the streets and | :06:31. | :06:35. | |
some people are becoming very anxious about it. This has become a | :06:36. | :06:39. | |
conflict about Ukraine's true colours. Most Ukrainians say they | :06:40. | :06:47. | |
feel European, but last month pedestrianian put closer ties to | :06:48. | :06:53. | |
Russia ahead of the EU deal. It is a curious mismatch that when the | :06:54. | :06:56. | |
Ukrainians were prepared for integration the rest of Europe was | :06:57. | :07:00. | |
not, when the rest of Europe is offering that integration, the | :07:01. | :07:05. | |
leadership in the Ukraine is incapable of accepting the offer. It | :07:06. | :07:08. | |
is difficult to know what the population itself thinks. But | :07:09. | :07:13. | |
clearly there is a feeling, certainly among intellectuals and | :07:14. | :07:17. | |
almost any professional person in Ukraine that this is going back in | :07:18. | :07:23. | |
history rather than going forward. Today the President, responding to | :07:24. | :07:27. | |
four days of protest insisted they must be carried on peacefully. Other | :07:28. | :07:34. | |
Government figures accuse ultras, professional agitators of hijacking | :07:35. | :07:44. | |
them and trying to mount a coup. Tran People are told to capture all | :07:45. | :07:51. | |
the administrative buildings. To block the functioning of an | :07:52. | :07:58. | |
administrative institution, to put forward ultimatums and this is the | :07:59. | :08:04. | |
way which will lead them nowhere. Now open revolt is spreading in the | :08:05. | :08:10. | |
west of the country, it is traditionally pro-western half. A | :08:11. | :08:14. | |
fragile economy is tottering. There is no-one size fits all easy win | :08:15. | :08:18. | |
outcome here for either side, because I think the current | :08:19. | :08:21. | |
President doesn't particularly want to give in to becoming a province of | :08:22. | :08:26. | |
Russia. And I think the protesters must know there isn't an easy way to | :08:27. | :08:30. | |
become part of the European Union space. The deal the European Union | :08:31. | :08:35. | |
offered was full of, it was a real package of reforms aimed at helping | :08:36. | :08:40. | |
Ukraine slowly but steadily move away from its current state. And | :08:41. | :08:44. | |
some of those reforms will probably end up being adopted, even by the | :08:45. | :08:47. | |
current Government f it stays in power as part of a deal. With | :08:48. | :08:54. | |
opposition loaders uniting to try a no-confidence motion in parliament, | :08:55. | :08:59. | |
President Putin accused them of turning the EU issue to their | :09:00. | :09:02. | |
advantage, jockeying for a presidential election that is | :09:03. | :09:07. | |
planned for three months time. TRANSLATION: In my opinion, all that | :09:08. | :09:11. | |
is happening has no direct connection with the Ukraine-EU | :09:12. | :09:15. | |
relationship, it is a domestic political process, an attempt by the | :09:16. | :09:20. | |
opposition to shake the acting and legitimate, I would like to stress | :09:21. | :09:23. | |
that, authorities. More than that what is happening now shows it is | :09:24. | :09:32. | |
not at all a revolution but well planned actions. Ukraine opinion | :09:33. | :09:37. | |
itself has been divided on the question of EU partnership, and | :09:38. | :09:41. | |
pedestrianian was elected. But the harsher the measures -- the | :09:42. | :09:44. | |
President was elected, but the harsher the measures taken the more | :09:45. | :09:49. | |
he reminds the country of the old Soviet leaders and thus loses | :09:50. | :09:54. | |
support to the opposition. For the past decade Ukraine has been pushed | :09:55. | :09:57. | |
and pulled between east and west. The battle now taking place on | :09:58. | :10:02. | |
Kiev's streets may decide the fate of Prime Minister and President, but | :10:03. | :10:07. | |
that tension between its own people, as much as outsiders, will take far | :10:08. | :10:13. | |
longer to resolve. Just before we came on air I spoke to the Russian | :10:14. | :10:19. | |
activist and husband of one of the Pussy Riot members, I asked him how | :10:20. | :10:24. | |
long these protests were going to continue. It is really hard to see | :10:25. | :10:29. | |
right now since they have basically started for the first time a week | :10:30. | :10:34. | |
ago, and at this scale they have been going on for the last three | :10:35. | :10:39. | |
days and to the maximum point since Sunday, and I think everything will | :10:40. | :10:45. | |
depend on the results of the negotiations between the opposition | :10:46. | :10:47. | |
parliament members and the Government. Because for example for | :10:48. | :10:53. | |
tomorrow morning it is a very important vote scheduled which will | :10:54. | :10:57. | |
give the answer to the question, will the parliaments be able to make | :10:58. | :11:11. | |
pedestrianian to pedestrianian resign. You know -- President | :11:12. | :11:21. | |
Yanukovych resign. People are talking about this like a coup, is | :11:22. | :11:25. | |
that what it looks like? It is not a coup for the Ukrainian people down | :11:26. | :11:31. | |
here, to them it was simply an act of taking to the streets and trying | :11:32. | :11:36. | |
to defend what they think is their rights to live in a civilised | :11:37. | :11:39. | |
country, to be a part of the European community and this is what | :11:40. | :11:44. | |
is what they do. This is democratically elected Government | :11:45. | :11:47. | |
isn't it? At the same time these people really did not, when they | :11:48. | :11:50. | |
elected President Yanukovych they did not sign to the fact that they | :11:51. | :11:55. | |
will be basically dealing with the situation when President Yanukovych | :11:56. | :11:58. | |
will be coming under the influence of President Putin. And making | :11:59. | :12:03. | |
decisions that most Ukrainians definitely do not agree with. This | :12:04. | :12:06. | |
is why there is so many people on the street. This is why the protests | :12:07. | :12:10. | |
have reached a scale they have reached right now. But the protests | :12:11. | :12:16. | |
seem to an outsider hardly to be politically coherent, there are | :12:17. | :12:20. | |
extreme nationalists among the protesters aren't there? I wouldn't | :12:21. | :12:26. | |
say the extreme nationalists were playing an important political role | :12:27. | :12:30. | |
here. Obviously from a purely political side the protests are | :12:31. | :12:37. | |
headed by three members of the three opposition factions inside the | :12:38. | :12:40. | |
parliament and two of those members are not nationalists at all. You | :12:41. | :12:45. | |
really think that President Yanukovych is going to resign, do | :12:46. | :12:49. | |
you? It is hard to see what the Government will choose as their | :12:50. | :12:54. | |
response to the protests right now. But definitely President Yanukovych | :12:55. | :13:01. | |
and his Government will start making very important negotiation offers to | :13:02. | :13:05. | |
the opposition right now, it is clear these protests | :13:06. | :14:45. | |
a Greg Louganis won a medal in the Olympics and came out publicly in | :14:46. | :14:53. | |
the mid-90s he joins us from San Francisco, what did you make of the | :14:54. | :14:56. | |
announcement today? I think it is wonderful that Tom. I have observed | :14:57. | :15:01. | |
him at various competitions and I had the luxury of seeing him at a | :15:02. | :15:05. | |
lot of the competitions and the thing that impressed me most about | :15:06. | :15:10. | |
Tom Daley, it is not so much how talented he is, he is Anne credibly | :15:11. | :15:15. | |
talented diver, but the way in which he treated his friends and his fans | :15:16. | :15:25. | |
and -- he is an incredibly talented diver, it was the way he treated his | :15:26. | :15:29. | |
friends and fans, he always had a smile on his face. We all want to fe | :15:30. | :15:34. | |
loved and safe, and those were the words in his message, I just really | :15:35. | :15:40. | |
wish the best for him. Were you slightly envious of the times we | :15:41. | :15:43. | |
live in now compared to the times when you came out? It is interesting | :15:44. | :15:53. | |
when I look back at career and a lot of the homophobic comments that were | :15:54. | :15:57. | |
made through my career, you know I have been back to a lot of those | :15:58. | :16:01. | |
people, who have actually become friends. It was more jealousy than | :16:02. | :16:10. | |
it was homophobia. Although there was some homophobia around there. We | :16:11. | :16:11. | |
have come to age What strikes me is the honesty, | :16:12. | :16:31. | |
that these young people feel, in order for them to be all that they | :16:32. | :16:35. | |
can be, they have to be honest with themselves and they need to be | :16:36. | :16:41. | |
honest with the public. It is striking, this is a top-level | :16:42. | :16:52. | |
competitor in team sports it is much more unusual? In team sports it is a | :16:53. | :16:56. | |
little different, because That is why it is a team sport. Unless you | :16:57. | :17:03. | |
are a Michael Jordan, and you carry the team, you know, then it is | :17:04. | :17:08. | |
pretty safe. You need to have the safety and security. That is the | :17:09. | :17:14. | |
thing that Tom said, that he feels safe in a team situation, you have | :17:15. | :17:20. | |
to have that support Of the rest of your team. I think that many players | :17:21. | :17:24. | |
might find it very surprising that they actually might have that | :17:25. | :17:29. | |
support, you know. If they were to Be a little bit more open about who | :17:30. | :17:37. | |
they are. It is hard, it is hard to be the first one to be out there. | :17:38. | :17:43. | |
You know we're inundated with these ideals and what's right and what's | :17:44. | :17:49. | |
wrong and you know, I was born this way. I was born gay, I didn't choose | :17:50. | :17:54. | |
to be gay. It is like me asking somebody who is straight, when did | :17:55. | :18:01. | |
you choose to be straight? You may be a reticent fellow in this sort of | :18:02. | :18:07. | |
matter, do you but have any advice for anyone who is gay and not yet | :18:08. | :18:12. | |
out who is sports man or women? Each individual has their own personal | :18:13. | :18:20. | |
journey, and that journey is you know you first start with people who | :18:21. | :18:23. | |
you feel safe with, and that is actually usually your family and it | :18:24. | :18:33. | |
opens the doors to those that are open and you see the acceptance and | :18:34. | :18:39. | |
the appreciation of your honesty and how well respected that is, then you | :18:40. | :18:44. | |
realise you know it gives you more confidence to come out to other | :18:45. | :18:53. | |
people. Just to share who you are. People on daily basis, they are | :18:54. | :18:56. | |
taking out pictures of their kids and their weddings and all that. You | :18:57. | :19:01. | |
know what, it was just this year that I was able to legally marry my | :19:02. | :19:09. | |
husband. In the state of California, you know. That privilege, that is | :19:10. | :19:18. | |
denied to many people. It is marriage equality, you know, that | :19:19. | :19:23. | |
love is love. It doesn't matter if it is gay or straight, you know. We | :19:24. | :19:34. | |
just want to be loved and love. The Prime Minister and a hoard of 100 | :19:35. | :19:40. | |
capitist big wigs are in China tonight, enjoying the kind | :19:41. | :19:43. | |
hospitality of the people's Republic. Arguments about human | :19:44. | :19:48. | |
rights, the situation in Tibet and so on have been laid aside in much | :19:49. | :19:53. | |
talk about jam tomorrow in a new commercial relationship between the | :19:54. | :19:57. | |
two countries. Sasauges, bicycle, architect, museums all harked about | :19:58. | :20:12. | |
in order to encourage trade. Last year Britain sent ?9 billion of | :20:13. | :20:17. | |
goods to China and the Chinese sent ?30 billion to this country. Britain | :20:18. | :20:21. | |
wants China to realise its dream and I believe we can help each other | :20:22. | :20:24. | |
succeed in the global race. Some in Europe and elsewhere see the world | :20:25. | :20:29. | |
changing and want to shut China off behind a bamboo curtain of trade | :20:30. | :20:34. | |
barriers. Britain wants to tear those trade barriers down. This trip | :20:35. | :20:39. | |
has been a while in the planning, after Beijing declared itself hurt | :20:40. | :20:43. | |
that David Cameron had met the Dalai Lama last year. This time any | :20:44. | :20:51. | |
protests were soto V oce. The full range of challenges should be in the | :20:52. | :20:56. | |
full range of discussion, including our differences. We should approach | :20:57. | :20:59. | |
with mutual respect and understanding, as we did today. I | :21:00. | :21:02. | |
welcome the agreement to hold the next human rights dialogue early | :21:03. | :21:09. | |
next year. Increasing exports to China is an important part of the | :21:10. | :21:14. | |
Treasury strategy to high to rebuild the UK economy. The trade-off is | :21:15. | :21:19. | |
between moral self-image and self-interest. This promised new | :21:20. | :21:24. | |
relationship with China is based on an urge to get a share of the | :21:25. | :21:28. | |
action. Humam rights activists worry that greed or ambition is elbowing | :21:29. | :21:34. | |
out humanitarian concerns. But how much is China really changing. Our | :21:35. | :21:41. | |
world affairs correspondent has been pondering the subject in some of his | :21:42. | :21:45. | |
favourite haunts in Beijing. Tiananmen Square, the centre piece | :21:46. | :21:51. | |
of modern Beijing. Old stagers like me can never forget the | :21:52. | :21:54. | |
demonstrations here which ended in the massacre of 1989. But like China | :21:55. | :22:00. | |
itself, the square has changed a lot over the years, it is far more | :22:01. | :22:12. | |
people friendly now than it used to be. Over there are the Great Hall, | :22:13. | :22:18. | |
where David Cameron has been having talks with leaders, the visit has | :22:19. | :22:24. | |
been a great success, and unexpected honours has been showered on him. | :22:25. | :22:28. | |
Why? Because China doesn't trust America to be a reliable partner | :22:29. | :22:39. | |
sheet more in -- is parter in -- partner any more. And the British | :22:40. | :22:45. | |
are more than happy to oblige. On the one hand China is closing labour | :22:46. | :22:49. | |
camps and relaxing the one-child rule, on the other it is silencing | :22:50. | :22:53. | |
and looking up its critics with renewed energy. Why? What's going on | :22:54. | :23:02. | |
here? I have really come to love this area. It is called District | :23:03. | :23:10. | |
798. It used to be an entire suburb composed of weapons factories. Then | :23:11. | :23:13. | |
the Government closed it down and handed it over to, of all things, | :23:14. | :23:18. | |
artists, to use as galleries and workshops. For me it is a parable of | :23:19. | :23:23. | |
the way China could become in the future. When you are here, the old | :23:24. | :23:30. | |
Chinese Marxist, Leninist state just seems to evaporate. Being here | :23:31. | :23:35. | |
reminds me forcibly of the artists I used to hang out with in the old | :23:36. | :23:41. | |
Eastern Bloc countries in the 1980s. Czechoslovakia, Hungary, east German | :23:42. | :23:46. | |
and the Soviet Union. For them, the old communist system started to | :23:47. | :23:52. | |
vanish long before the Berlin wall came down. But is the same process | :23:53. | :23:58. | |
happening here? I'm not really sure yet. This is Lydia Jaing, a woman | :23:59. | :24:10. | |
with a remarkable background. In the 1980s she was a worker in an arments | :24:11. | :24:14. | |
factory. Much like this one was before being turned into an art | :24:15. | :24:20. | |
gallery. Nowadays she's a well known social commentator. I used to think | :24:21. | :24:34. | |
a year or so ago that he was the man who tried to open up the system but | :24:35. | :24:39. | |
he couldn't keep control over it, but he's much tougher than that, | :24:40. | :24:44. | |
isn't he? He's much tougher, I don't think many people will see him as | :24:45. | :24:48. | |
China's Gorbachev. He mentioned Russia, I think he's haunted by the | :24:49. | :24:52. | |
collapse of the Soviet Union. He wants to make sure, going out of his | :24:53. | :25:00. | |
way to make sure it doesn't happen to China. How will it happen? I | :25:01. | :25:05. | |
think the authorities will have to let people, the way people, allow | :25:06. | :25:11. | |
people to express their grievances, to express their views, to have a | :25:12. | :25:17. | |
say in how they are governed. Allow them space to shape the future. | :25:18. | :25:23. | |
Otherwise I don't think possibly we can last with this model. Whenever I | :25:24. | :25:30. | |
come to Beijing I like to visit this traditional street, and sample the | :25:31. | :25:41. | |
street food which is on sale. Locusts, actually rather nice! There | :25:42. | :25:52. | |
you go! I recommend them. So, what's really going on in the China that | :25:53. | :25:58. | |
David Cameron has come to visit. My guess, for what it's worth, is that | :25:59. | :26:05. | |
the leader is an instinctive liberaliser, who understands that | :26:06. | :26:08. | |
you can't really open up business and manufacturing here, | :26:09. | :26:12. | |
satisfactorily without giving people much more personal freedom. But, the | :26:13. | :26:18. | |
Chinese leadership as a whole is still obsessed with what happened | :26:19. | :26:22. | |
back in 1989, both at Tiananmen Square, and with the fall of | :26:23. | :26:28. | |
communism in Eastern Europe. Hence the juggling act. There is more | :26:29. | :26:33. | |
personal freedom here, certainly. But people aren't allowed to go as | :26:34. | :26:37. | |
far as many of them would like, can it work? Certainly, but only for a | :26:38. | :26:42. | |
while. The time will come when the old rules will have to be relaxed, | :26:43. | :26:46. | |
and that will be the point of maximum danger for the old Marxist, | :26:47. | :26:56. | |
Leninist system. Just sending an e-mail there, you surely can't be | :26:57. | :27:00. | |
surprised, because this phenomenon of being physically present and | :27:01. | :27:05. | |
mentally absent of virtual conversations rather than actual | :27:06. | :27:08. | |
ones is all around us. Couples who go out for dinner and spend the meal | :27:09. | :27:14. | |
talking to others. Teenagers at home part there part Facebooking. It is | :27:15. | :27:18. | |
not just the rudeness and superficiality, it is that | :27:19. | :27:21. | |
technology has broken down the distinction between public and | :27:22. | :27:25. | |
private. The personal aside that is retweeted across the land, or the | :27:26. | :27:28. | |
personal photo that some how anyone can see. We report. For millennia | :27:29. | :27:37. | |
people have struggled with the question, what does it mean to be | :27:38. | :27:46. | |
human? For the last few years we have been struggling with a | :27:47. | :27:49. | |
variation on that question, what does it mean to be human with all | :27:50. | :27:53. | |
this technology! It is unhealthy, because we have let boundaries go. | :27:54. | :27:58. | |
We are now creatures of this thing that we have created without much | :27:59. | :28:03. | |
control over it. I really do think it is important that we look at the | :28:04. | :28:07. | |
social effects of technology a lot more, not just the glitz, glamour | :28:08. | :28:13. | |
and bling of a new thing. The scene on any street in the modern world, | :28:14. | :28:16. | |
so familiar as to be mundane, and yet to anyone from two decades ago, | :28:17. | :28:22. | |
this would all seem utterly bizarre. How bizarre, look at these famous | :28:23. | :28:26. | |
paintings, reimagined with modern technology, by the Korean artist, | :28:27. | :28:35. | |
Kim DongYU. We have wandered into this world without any idea of how | :28:36. | :28:40. | |
and when it is appropriate to use the technology. The Americans have a | :28:41. | :28:49. | |
phrase FOMO, "fear of missing out". It is this idea that what I'm doing | :28:50. | :28:55. | |
now is not the best thing I could be doing, maybe someone has messaged or | :28:56. | :28:59. | |
Facebooked me and I need to check it all the time. It is a kind of mild | :29:00. | :29:04. | |
paranoia that leaves us dissatisfied and not present here in the now with | :29:05. | :29:08. | |
somebody talking as we are right now. So what to do about all this? | :29:09. | :29:13. | |
Well you could make a game out of it, phone stacking, if you are out | :29:14. | :29:17. | |
for dinner with a group of friends, everyone stacks their phone face | :29:18. | :29:24. | |
down on the table. Whoever touches their's first gets to pay for | :29:25. | :29:27. | |
everybody. Most people don't realise our brains are wired to want that | :29:28. | :29:30. | |
information, to gain more knowledge and to seek out what is going on in | :29:31. | :29:33. | |
the world. We can't be blamed or feel guilty for wanting to pull our | :29:34. | :29:37. | |
phones out every five or ten minutes. We need to become more | :29:38. | :29:40. | |
aware and gain knowledge about why we are doing that. And in turn | :29:41. | :29:44. | |
create better habits and social norms where we aren't expected to | :29:45. | :29:49. | |
always be available. Various writers and bloggers are attempting to | :29:50. | :29:55. | |
evolve a new tech the the question. Including the -- etiquette. | :29:56. | :30:06. | |
Including the the sister of Mark Zuckerberg. Her blogs are turned | :30:07. | :30:14. | |
into a book. It is about how to turn things all around us rather than | :30:15. | :30:19. | |
getting stuck in a virtual world. Turn off all the beeps that keep us. | :30:20. | :30:27. | |
It is a des to go, turn off cellphones, computers or cameras. | :30:28. | :30:31. | |
Off the grid. You could try digital des to go, like this American | :30:32. | :30:34. | |
retreat that demands phones and computers are handed over. Everyone | :30:35. | :30:38. | |
could benefit from taking, whether a digital des to be retreat, or just a | :30:39. | :30:48. | |
few -- des to go retreat d detox or digital retreat. Some call it a day | :30:49. | :30:54. | |
of digital rest. And I think everyone can benefit from taking, | :30:55. | :30:56. | |
whether it is a few minutes, few hours or days off line. Perhaps | :30:57. | :31:00. | |
though technology will bring us its own solution. The inspiration behind | :31:01. | :31:06. | |
the Google Glass device, currently in development is to get our heads | :31:07. | :31:11. | |
up and hands free, not everyone, it is fair to say that strap ago | :31:12. | :31:15. | |
computer to our head is the answer. One change that may help is the move | :31:16. | :31:20. | |
away from text-based to voice-based computer interaction. In the | :31:21. | :31:25. | |
meantime, are we in danger of becoming robot, the i-diots of this | :31:26. | :31:33. | |
wonderful Spanish animation. Disconnected by the technology we're | :31:34. | :31:37. | |
supposed to have to connect us, always on but never present. Randi | :31:38. | :31:44. | |
Zuckerberg is here, because Facebook has been the subject of a feature | :31:45. | :31:49. | |
film and much hyped public float and endless legal battles it seems. She | :31:50. | :31:52. | |
was responsible for Facebook's public image for six years. She's | :31:53. | :31:56. | |
the sister of the social media site's founder Mark. Now, you seem | :31:57. | :32:02. | |
to be having a bit of a change of mind about whether this is a | :32:03. | :32:05. | |
desirable state of affairs or not. We're all living with it any way? It | :32:06. | :32:12. | |
is definitely a dotcom-plicated world. I think it was having a child | :32:13. | :32:17. | |
of my own that made me revisit my look on technology and become much | :32:18. | :32:21. | |
more aware of just how attached we are to our mobile devices. You have | :32:22. | :32:25. | |
got a sentence in this book about how important it is to acquire a | :32:26. | :32:30. | |
digital identity in the womb! Could you explain that? Well, gosh, our | :32:31. | :32:35. | |
digital identity becomes now even before we're born. I know it sounds | :32:36. | :32:42. | |
crazy but as parents that first time that you post that you are expecting | :32:43. | :32:48. | |
on-line, that first oversharing son know gram photo -- sonogram photo, | :32:49. | :32:55. | |
suddenly you have created a digital footprint for your child on-line. I | :32:56. | :32:58. | |
talked to parents about the really big responsibility we have to our | :32:59. | :33:02. | |
children that way. What is this responsibility. Well you have the | :33:03. | :33:05. | |
responsibility as parents to make sure that if you are sharing | :33:06. | :33:09. | |
information about your children on-line, that you are not doing | :33:10. | :33:12. | |
anything that will damage them in the future. You also have the | :33:13. | :33:17. | |
responsibility, a lot of parents now are turning to Google, to search | :33:18. | :33:21. | |
engines, to make sure that they are carving out the best real estate | :33:22. | :33:26. | |
on-line for their children, they are reserving e-mail address, they are | :33:27. | :33:29. | |
making sure that their child doesn't share a name with someone with very | :33:30. | :33:42. | |
unsavory search results. You are not serious? The first thing anyone will | :33:43. | :33:45. | |
do when they meet your child is search for them on-line. I think it | :33:46. | :33:49. | |
is important for parents to make sure they are putting a child's best | :33:50. | :33:54. | |
foot forward if that is the first thing anyone will do. Do you think | :33:55. | :33:57. | |
there is a distinction any more between private and public? I think | :33:58. | :34:01. | |
it is getting very blurry. Now I think in our real lives we have | :34:02. | :34:05. | |
private, we have public, but most of our lives we live in the personal | :34:06. | :34:10. | |
area inbetween. I share things, I wouldn't really want on the cover of | :34:11. | :34:13. | |
the newspaper, but it wouldn't crush me if it wound up there. | :34:14. | :34:19. | |
Unfortunately on-line don't have that luxury. Everything on-line is | :34:20. | :34:21. | |
very public or private and that's it. Best not to go on-line, wouldn't | :34:22. | :34:28. | |
you say? Well, I would think that a few billion people might disagree | :34:29. | :34:32. | |
with that statement. They choose to do it, they have chosen to succumb | :34:33. | :34:39. | |
to a created need? I think there are amazing benefits to all of these | :34:40. | :34:43. | |
on-line sites, obviously I'm a bit biased I worked for six years on the | :34:44. | :34:47. | |
forefront of one, but I think when you look at a lot of the political | :34:48. | :34:51. | |
events in the world, people now have a voice that used to be voiceless, | :34:52. | :34:56. | |
you look at even the disabled community, people can now | :34:57. | :35:01. | |
communicate in far and away different ways, children now there | :35:02. | :35:04. | |
is so many more tools for education and creativity. Of course you can | :35:05. | :35:07. | |
always look at the dark side of anything. But do you have any sense | :35:08. | :35:13. | |
of a guilty conscience, because you marketed Facebook? No, definitely | :35:14. | :35:17. | |
not. I definitely believe that the glass is very half full when it | :35:18. | :35:22. | |
comes to using Facebook. But what I do think is that especially as a | :35:23. | :35:27. | |
mom, it is easy when you are in Silicon Valley to have your head | :35:28. | :35:31. | |
down and think about what you are innovating right now, it was not | :35:32. | :35:35. | |
until I left and started speaking to other moms, other people around the | :35:36. | :35:38. | |
world that I realised for every opportunity we have created with | :35:39. | :35:42. | |
social media we have also created challenges in people's lives that | :35:43. | :35:46. | |
definitely need to be addressed. Interesting you used the word | :35:47. | :35:54. | |
"challenges" as opposed to problems? Problem infers that there is not an | :35:55. | :35:58. | |
easy solution, I think they are challenges because it is a website. | :35:59. | :36:01. | |
It is a phone, it is just a tool. The website isn't bad, the phone | :36:02. | :36:05. | |
isn't bad it is how we use it. Overall people are niave though? | :36:06. | :36:10. | |
People are, no, I don't think people are niave, in fact young people | :36:11. | :36:14. | |
today when you talk to them they are much more savvy about anything | :36:15. | :36:18. | |
on-line than you would even guess or imagine. They are very savvy about | :36:19. | :36:23. | |
their privacy settings, they are savvy about what they share. I don't | :36:24. | :36:26. | |
think people are niave at all, it is a human desire to connect. I think | :36:27. | :36:30. | |
we have taken it a bit too far. Thank you very much. In case you | :36:31. | :36:36. | |
missed it this weekend saw people from 30 countries gather in Croydon, | :36:37. | :36:41. | |
of all place, to take part in the World Memory Championships, today | :36:42. | :36:45. | |
the winner was crowned. Jonas Von Essen triumphed in a series of | :36:46. | :36:50. | |
tasks, including memorising playing cards and historic dates. Tonight we | :36:51. | :36:53. | |
thought we would give him another challenge. You have seven minutes to | :36:54. | :36:59. | |
commit our end credits to memory, starting now. By the age of 77, most | :37:00. | :37:04. | |
people would expect to be able to put their feet up, but the actor | :37:05. | :37:10. | |
Robert Redford is still at it in JC Khanneder's new movie All Is Lost. | :37:11. | :37:18. | |
He plays a man alone fighting the elements when his boat is struck by | :37:19. | :37:23. | |
a cargo container. He's the ship's only speaking role and not that much | :37:24. | :37:29. | |
at all. He met the film critics while he was here. This is the | :37:30. | :37:39. | |
Virginia Jane, SOS call, over. You are sitting at home and the script | :37:40. | :37:44. | |
comes through the door, it is 31 pages long, your character doesn't | :37:45. | :37:47. | |
get a name and barely any dialogue, why do you take the part? I guess | :37:48. | :37:50. | |
you could say that this was evidence of pure cinema. There are no | :37:51. | :37:54. | |
barriers of dialogue, there are no barriers of too much information. It | :37:55. | :38:00. | |
was pretty much existential in that you just had to be there and it | :38:01. | :38:04. | |
would give the viewer a chance to come closer to you as a character. | :38:05. | :38:09. | |
For all those reasons it could easily have gone so wrong, did you | :38:10. | :38:13. | |
and the director ever look at each other and say what are we doing? I | :38:14. | :38:20. | |
used to say that to him! Yeah, I think probably there is always that, | :38:21. | :38:25. | |
there is always that shadow around the film, what are we doing here? | :38:26. | :38:30. | |
This is the Virginia Jane, an SOS call, over. Did you find it a | :38:31. | :38:40. | |
challenge acting without a costar to act opposite? Well I love co--star, | :38:41. | :38:46. | |
I love the interaction between you and another person, I like the | :38:47. | :38:49. | |
dynamic and exchange. But on the other hand I felt totally | :38:50. | :38:55. | |
comfortable with this character. His co-star was the water and the boat. | :38:56. | :39:00. | |
And I had to be comfortable with that and I was. Until it got really | :39:01. | :39:08. | |
stormy. Is that what reminded you of Jeramiah Johnson, which you have | :39:09. | :39:12. | |
compared it to, he's acting opposite the land, here it is the sea, there | :39:13. | :39:15. | |
the American west? It did. But only after. I was too busy getting | :39:16. | :39:23. | |
through it. I was too occupied with the character and what we were going | :39:24. | :39:26. | |
through because it was so intense. But after the film was over and I | :39:27. | :39:29. | |
could think back on it, I realised it had a common theme in the sense | :39:30. | :39:34. | |
that Jeramiah Johnson, in 1970, that was a man going through incredible | :39:35. | :39:39. | |
obstacles that seemed impossible to overcome, but he just kept going. | :39:40. | :39:42. | |
And that was on land. This same thing happens here. And I realise | :39:43. | :39:47. | |
that there was something thematic about that point when things seemed | :39:48. | :39:52. | |
so impossible when all seems to be lost. You are 77 now and obviously | :39:53. | :39:56. | |
in great shape, were you prepared for all that he put you through in | :39:57. | :40:00. | |
the course of the films? I was offered doubles, when we talked | :40:01. | :40:04. | |
originally I said it is pretty intense stuff here physically. When | :40:05. | :40:14. | |
we get down there I will see I will do what I can and we will see where | :40:15. | :40:18. | |
that goes. And one thing led to another, and as I got more into it I | :40:19. | :40:21. | |
got more into it. Do you still find it uncomfortable | :40:22. | :40:40. | |
seeing yourself on the screen when you watch yourself? Yeah. I can't | :40:41. | :40:44. | |
explain it, I just never really liked it much. I have only seen this | :40:45. | :40:48. | |
film once. I didn't see Dailies, I didn't go to the monitor like | :40:49. | :40:55. | |
happens quite a bit now. I'm not a fan of the monitor either as a | :40:56. | :41:01. | |
director or actor. It has become de rigueur for actors and directors to | :41:02. | :41:07. | |
hover around the monitor. Not for me. When I'm in the role I'm in the | :41:08. | :41:12. | |
role I don't want to be distracted by critically looking at myself. | :41:13. | :41:16. | |
Aside from the fact I have never enjoyed seeing myself. To me it is a | :41:17. | :41:20. | |
distraction. You came into the industry first written about as a | :41:21. | :41:23. | |
sex symbol, that must have been a distracting thing, did you find it | :41:24. | :41:27. | |
difficult to pivot out of that to the more politically engaged films | :41:28. | :41:32. | |
you wanted to make? I did, I was surprised when it came and then I | :41:33. | :41:35. | |
was flattered. I enjoyed it for a while. Then I realised that I | :41:36. | :41:39. | |
couldn't slide out of it, that it was being attached to me in a way | :41:40. | :41:43. | |
that began to feel uncomfortable, because I felt it became a very | :41:44. | :41:49. | |
strikes in terms of the performances I would give it would be how I | :41:50. | :41:56. | |
looked rather than the subtle things within the character. I realised it | :41:57. | :42:00. | |
was a bit of a cage and it was really hard to get out of. You have | :42:01. | :42:06. | |
been very passionately engaged with America throughout your career, one | :42:07. | :42:11. | |
thinks of films from You will The President's Men through to Quiz | :42:12. | :42:17. | |
Show, she's your most constant co-star, how has America changed in | :42:18. | :42:22. | |
your lifetime? Nothing has changed from my interests. I felt early on | :42:23. | :42:26. | |
when I had the chance to tell my story as an acting producer and then | :42:27. | :42:30. | |
director, what fascinated me was my own country, but not the country | :42:31. | :42:36. | |
that was propagandaised. Not the country that was overpromoted like | :42:37. | :42:40. | |
it was at the end of the Second World War when I was a kid growing | :42:41. | :42:44. | |
up. I remember hearing all the slogans about "doing your bit", | :42:45. | :42:51. | |
happiness and doing your best", and "it doesn't matter how you play the | :42:52. | :42:55. | |
game as long as you do your best". I realised that was a lie in my 20s, | :42:56. | :43:01. | |
there was a grey zone inbetween. I got interested in that, that was | :43:02. | :43:06. | |
were things were more complex. I didn't see it as black and white, | :43:07. | :43:09. | |
because of my own live ex-peerences I saw a different America. Still an | :43:10. | :43:13. | |
America I loved. There were stories I wanted to tell about the grey part | :43:14. | :43:17. | |
where things were more complex and not so easily determined. And then | :43:18. | :43:21. | |
so that led me to be more interested in making a film where you end it by | :43:22. | :43:26. | |
asking a question. And let the audience play a role in | :43:27. | :43:30. | |
interpretation. It is one of many films this fall with the theme of | :43:31. | :43:34. | |
survival at the centre. I wondered if this speaks to anything in | :43:35. | :43:38. | |
America at the moment, these films that focus on a sort of life or | :43:39. | :43:42. | |
death existential struggle and all is lost as one of those. Does that | :43:43. | :43:48. | |
connect with anything going on? Since we made this film I didn't | :43:49. | :43:52. | |
think you could draw a parallel with where the country is, and now you | :43:53. | :43:58. | |
can. You can. Is all lost? We certainly need to be and seem to be | :43:59. | :44:01. | |
teetering on the edge. It is embarrassing for me as a person who | :44:02. | :44:05. | |
loves my country to see the leaders of my country behaving so | :44:06. | :44:12. | |
ridiculously. So stupidly. In such a narrow-minded way. And seeing how we | :44:13. | :44:17. | |
must be perceived by other countries like yours. What must you think of | :44:18. | :44:23. | |
us? So we had pretty poor representation right now with the | :44:24. | :44:26. | |
breakdown. Particularly you think the motivation on the one side is | :44:27. | :44:30. | |
just one thing, and that is to go against the President. What a rotten | :44:31. | :44:39. | |
situation. Robert Redford talking to us. Alongside me is the world memory | :44:40. | :44:44. | |
champion, Jonas Von Essen, still putting the final names into his | :44:45. | :44:49. | |
head. He's going to recite them all from memory in a moment or two. In | :44:50. | :44:52. | |
the meantime the front I will take that now, right Jonas, | :44:53. | :45:24. | |
nice trophy. I think you can play us out by telling us what the credits | :45:25. | :45:34. | |
were tonight. Yes, the presenter is of course Jeremy emPaxman. The | :45:35. | :45:46. | |
production team consists of it's, em, in order it is... I will give | :45:47. | :46:01. | |
awe clue clue, the first one is James Fray. Gemma Parks, and then | :46:02. | :46:09. | |
Jake Morris, and then it is let's see now. Max? It is Max... Davidson. | :46:10. | :46:22. | |
And then Hannah Razak, and then we have also Sam Ha CLSHGS k. Correct, | :46:23. | :46:26. | |
do you remember any more after that? I think so. We will be here all | :46:27. | :46:39. | |
night. We also have Lorraine Iganis. And Toby Keely. Shall we cut to the | :46:40. | :46:45. | |
chase the editor, the editor at the end? The editor that is of course as | :46:46. | :46:54. | |
usual Ian Katz. | :46:55. | :46:56. |