03/06/2014 Newsnight


03/06/2014

Child prostitution at the World Cup. The fight for the top job in Europe. MQM and Pakistan. Violence against women in drama. Tetris at 30. Queen's speech. With Jeremy Paxman.


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Tonight with days to go to the start of the World Cup, we report from

:00:00.:00:11.

Brazil on the grotesque under-side to one of the world's greatest

:00:12.:00:15.

sporting occasions. In the shadows of the football stadiums another

:00:16.:00:19.

side to the competition, the chirp being traffiked for prostitution. Do

:00:20.:00:22.

the police never check? Millions of us tune in for this

:00:23.:00:47.

stuff week after week, why do we love it, why do women seem to like

:00:48.:00:52.

crime drama that features violence against women. The crime writer Anne

:00:53.:00:57.

Cleaves is here to help us with that. And remember this? How a 1980s

:00:58.:01:02.

computer game has lived to the ripe old age of 30 and is still gathering

:01:03.:01:17.

new fans. At 9.00 on Thursday next week the football teams from Brazil

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and Croatia will begin the first match in the 2014 World Cup. Best

:01:21.:01:25.

not to think what the start of that great sporting carnival means for

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untold numbers of children in Brazil. Gangs of pimps are

:01:29.:01:34.

trafficking young girls to ply their trade around the stadiums of host

:01:35.:01:37.

cities there. The country is already facing an epidemic of child

:01:38.:01:41.

prostitution with children as young as nine selling their bodies to

:01:42.:01:45.

escape poverty. Even though they are the victims of sexual exploitation

:01:46.:01:49.

some of the children and their parents were happy for them to be

:01:50.:01:52.

identified on camera. In this country only. We report now from

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Brazil. This is the BR 116, a road that runs

:02:06.:02:11.

almost the entire length of Brazil. The route takes you through towns

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where children try to escape poverty by selling their bodies. This

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highway is nearly 3,000 miles long and a recent police survey

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discovered almost 300 areas where child prostitution was taking place.

:02:34.:02:37.

And that means on average children can be found offering sex nearly

:02:38.:02:45.

every ten miles. We're heading to a remote town 300 miles from the World

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Cup host cities in the northern tronnics. And more than 1,000 miles

:02:52.:03:02.

away from Rio January in the south. Prostitution is legal over 18, yet

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the number of children selling their bodies across the country is said to

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run into the hundreds of thousands. Here I'm told the clients are mainly

:03:12.:03:16.

truck drivers, hiring children as young as 11. We filmed very young

:03:17.:03:19.

girls flirting and working the tables in a bar near a truck park.

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Regular police patrols of truck parks targeting child prostitution

:03:29.:03:31.

are already overwhelmed. But they are facing a new problem, the

:03:32.:03:36.

trafficking of girls to World Cup host cities.

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In the last six months around 100 young girls have been referred to

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the social services. A social worker took me to meet some of them. That's

:03:58.:04:11.

your house? A flower and this is the sky. This girl has just turned 12

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and lives close to the highway. She seems like such a typical child. But

:04:17.:04:21.

social services tell us just how grim her childhood has been.

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Is it not scary being on the streets late at night? Everywhere you turn

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in this small town you see the poverty that is stealing childhood.

:04:57.:05:03.

Angela began selling herself when she was 13, she's now 17 and

:05:04.:05:08.

pregnant for the fifth time. Her first three children were either

:05:09.:05:12.

adopted or aborted, she kept her fourth. Is life tough here? What is

:05:13.:05:19.

tough about it? How is this human misery possible in

:05:20.:05:42.

a country which has the seventh-largest economy in the

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world, just behind the UK. Congresswoman, Lillian Sarh has just

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released the findings of the parliamentary inquiry into child

:05:54.:05:56.

prostitution. Her research took her to all 12 World Cup host cities.

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The parliamentary report highlights the traffics of children from rural

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communities to World Cup host cities. To the prop calm north-east

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the BR 11 six takes you to this stadium, in the shadow of the city's

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World Cup stadium young girls are trading their bodies. We spot two

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girls on the street, right outside a police station. As we get close it

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is clear they are very young. With a charity worker we play the part of

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British tourists, and they immediately offer us a programme,

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the local slang for sex. How old are you? They look much younger. With

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girls look so young, some look younger than others, but none of

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them have any ID whatsoever. And how much would it be for a "programme"?

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That is about ?40 pounds. I have to be afraid. Do the police never

:07:55.:08:02.

check? A police car has just gone by we are talking to a very young boy,

:08:03.:08:14.

didn't take any notice. The police told the BBC that complacency can be

:08:15.:08:18.

an issue and are training their officers to be more proactive.

:08:19.:08:22.

During the World Cup the Government promises more police patrols like

:08:23.:08:27.

these, to spot exploitation and a hot-line to report abuse. Even in

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daylight young girls are selling themselves around stadiums. This

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girl is 14 years old. On the other side of the Atlantic Brazilian

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footballer David Luiz warns England fans of the consequences of hiring

:08:52.:08:57.

child prostitutes. This video is being shown on some flights to the

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World Cup host cities, a campaign funded by British charities and

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backed by British police agencies. It is a penalty! But evidence

:09:07.:09:10.

suggests pimps are determined to cash in on anticipated demand.

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13-year-old Fernada was already selling her body on the B-116

:09:17.:09:21.

highway, she was drugged, kidnapped and forced to work on the streets

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here. She managed to escape. She is back

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home with her mother. But her pimps are still at large.

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She and her mother are reunited, but in a country that is criticised for

:10:12.:10:18.

failing to tackle poverty and child exploitation, there are thousands

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more children that have little hope of escaping Brazil's sex trade. You

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can see more of that report on Panorama tomorrow night on BBC One

:10:28.:10:32.

at 10. 35. Now the bureaucrats at the European

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Commission generously dispensed unwanted advice to the British

:10:39.:10:40.

Government today. They were kind enough to advise on the council tax,

:10:41.:10:44.

house building and London property prices. It is time for our betters

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now to choose a successor to that Prince among men, the current

:10:50.:10:53.

President of the European Commission, Jose Manuel Barroso.

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There are five-and-a-half candidates for the job, a couple of Greens want

:10:57.:11:01.

it as some sort of job SHAFRMENT the front runner is Jean-Claude Junker.

:11:02.:11:13.

In the wake of elections which demonstrated how little enthusiasm

:11:14.:11:21.

people have for the political elite's job, there were rumours that

:11:22.:11:26.

the Germans might be heeding David Cameron's campaign for Junker. Who

:11:27.:11:32.

is the kind of democratic political leader you would love on our shores,

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the one who says they are ready for being insulted for being

:11:37.:11:41.

insufficiently democratic, he is for secret, dark debates, if it is a yes

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they will say on we go and if no they will say they will continue.

:11:49.:11:55.

Some of Jean-Claude Junker's worst hits which means the UK is not keen.

:11:56.:11:59.

It is not hard to see why David Cameron doesn't really want

:12:00.:12:08.

Jean-Claude Junker in the job, there is an obvious appeal to keep them at

:12:09.:12:13.

bay from beyond the water. There is a risk in publicly opposing

:12:14.:12:17.

something that will be decided in private, in a process that the UK

:12:18.:12:24.

can't completely control. Junker does have some fans, but Government

:12:25.:12:29.

sources are adamant you can't make the case for change in Europe with a

:12:30.:12:33.

face from a small country in Europe first a minister in the 1980s. But

:12:34.:12:39.

he is the front runner, and if David Cameron's strategy is to make enough

:12:40.:12:44.

friends behind closed doors fails he will have to deal with the ire of

:12:45.:12:47.

his euro-sceptics. ??FORCEDYELL Euro-sceptics use the word

:12:48.:12:54.

"federalists" too loosely, someone they disagree with. But this is bona

:12:55.:13:00.

fide federalism, he believes in reciprocal voting rights at national

:13:01.:13:03.

election, he wants all the national foreign ministries to be merged into

:13:04.:13:06.

a European one, he wants a European police force and tax system. This is

:13:07.:13:13.

the whole 1950s federalist agenda, undulated. Killing off his bid would

:13:14.:13:21.

be difficult. The most powerful office holder in the EU went through

:13:22.:13:25.

the ordeal along with the audience of live debates. But because Junker

:13:26.:13:32.

is the candidate put forward by the EPP, the biggest block in the

:13:33.:13:35.

European Parliament, and they expect their man to be put in charge. That

:13:36.:13:40.

whole jazzy process could have been a waste of time though. Because

:13:41.:13:43.

there is nothing to stop other names being put forward by this lot,

:13:44.:13:48.

Europe's actual leaders, the council at the last minute. One senior

:13:49.:13:52.

Conservative source told Newsnight the Irish Prime Minister, Enda Kenny

:13:53.:13:57.

is their preferred option, even though publicly he has backed

:13:58.:14:03.

Junker. But is Angela Merkel trying to make life harder for her

:14:04.:14:07.

political naughty fetch few. In the last few days she has hardened her

:14:08.:14:12.

support for Junker, but tonight it appears she might have suggested an

:14:13.:14:19.

elegant way out, suggesting the head of the IMF, Christine Lagarde. It

:14:20.:14:26.

would be a godsend for David Cameron, she is a French candidate

:14:27.:14:34.

with an Anglo-Saxon feel to her, she speaks fluent English, run the IMF,

:14:35.:14:42.

run a big American law firm. She ticks so many boxes at Number Ten,

:14:43.:14:48.

she may be blocked by others precisely because of that. If the

:14:49.:14:51.

appointment doesn't go the UK's way, does it push us nearer leaving the

:14:52.:14:57.

EU all together. That thought may tickle euro-sceptic, but Number Ten

:14:58.:15:03.

officially says no. Mr Junker or whoever is President of the European

:15:04.:15:05.

Commission, will not decide on what happens to a renegotiation which

:15:06.:15:08.

will not even begin until a year from now the President of the

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European Commission is an important person with a lot of influence, but

:15:12.:15:15.

he does not take the decisions. And as our relations with our

:15:16.:15:19.

continental cousins are never straight forward, there is another

:15:20.:15:23.

complication in this torturous process, it is not just about trying

:15:24.:15:27.

to choose the next President, it is also who gets what in the commission

:15:28.:15:34.

and who decides the agenda. Submit to Junker and perhaps the UK gets a

:15:35.:15:40.

juicy deal elsewhere. One senior Conservative suggests what matters

:15:41.:15:45.

is who runs the internal market. With phone calls tonight and a

:15:46.:15:48.

summit in Brussels tomorrow, David Cameron has more chances to win

:15:49.:15:52.

friends across the channel, but he will need them, the machinations are

:15:53.:15:57.

complex and will take time to complete. Jacob Rees-Mogg a

:15:58.:16:05.

euro-sceptic MP is here, the Dutch MEP from the liberal grouping in the

:16:06.:16:09.

European Parliament joins us from the Hague. What do you make of David

:16:10.:16:17.

Cameron's objections to Mr Junker getting the job? What is important

:16:18.:16:27.

is the European Union becomes more democratic and the process of who

:16:28.:16:31.

gets the jobs is more transparent and people have a voice in who this

:16:32.:16:36.

person is. A first step has been taken by the European Parliament

:16:37.:16:40.

putting forward candidates by political groups. The largest group

:16:41.:16:46.

in the European Parliament has put forward Mr Junker. It is up to Mr

:16:47.:16:51.

Cameron to make his case among the council and see what the European

:16:52.:16:54.

Parliament will make of it. I don't think he has much of a chance

:16:55.:16:56.

because the European Parliament has committed to this system before the

:16:57.:17:01.

elections to take a step towards a more democratic and more transparent

:17:02.:17:06.

Europe which I think is very urgently needed. This was agreed

:17:07.:17:11.

that the largest party would endorse a candidate and that candidate would

:17:12.:17:17.

be more or less a shoe-in, before the election? Who was it agreed by?

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It was agreed by the European Parliament? The European Parliament

:17:22.:17:24.

decided amongst itself. It doesn't have the power to appoint, it has

:17:25.:17:28.

the power to approve, which is different. And in the election there

:17:29.:17:33.

is a poll done to see if anybody had heard of the candidates. 6% of

:17:34.:17:39.

voters had never heard of Mr Junker, with a British parliamentary

:17:40.:17:41.

election people know who the candidates are. The idea that

:17:42.:17:45.

democracy comes through the European Parliament within the EU is false.

:17:46.:17:48.

It comes through the Council of Ministers. But this is the mechanism

:17:49.:17:53.

and it was agreed beforehand, why not play a straight bat on it?

:17:54.:17:58.

Because the European Parliament rbitrarily decided this is what it

:17:59.:18:03.

was going to do. This was only one of the institution bus not the most

:18:04.:18:06.

democratic, it must be the Council of Ministers that represent the

:18:07.:18:09.

Governments. Fair enough, they are involved. What is wrong with the

:18:10.:18:13.

principle of the largest party which gathers the largest the largest

:18:14.:18:18.

number of votes being the most effective operator in the

:18:19.:18:21.

endorsement? I think it is a mistake to view the EPP as a single party,

:18:22.:18:25.

that the campaigns in individual parties were run on individual

:18:26.:18:29.

national political grounds, the fact that they picked some obscure

:18:30.:18:34.

Luxembourger to be their candidate that 66% of voters haven't heard of

:18:35.:18:38.

really doesn't give him any credibility. If the price of getting

:18:39.:18:47.

Mr Junker into the position is that a country like Britain decides it

:18:48.:18:51.

has to advance its referendum on whether it stays in the European

:18:52.:18:58.

Union, is that a price worth paying? I'm really sorry I'm having trouble

:18:59.:19:01.

hearing you, what I think is important is that the European

:19:02.:19:06.

Parliament becomes a stronger player, representing European

:19:07.:19:10.

citizens on the EU level, and what we need in Europe is more democracy

:19:11.:19:15.

and more transparency. We do not need back door dealings, back room

:19:16.:19:19.

dealings that the council is known for, so I think it is important, we

:19:20.:19:24.

have put forward as political groups these candidates, and if some groups

:19:25.:19:28.

have buyers remorse to put it that way, that is something they have to

:19:29.:19:32.

deal with, as the liberal group in the European Parliament we have put

:19:33.:19:37.

forward the former Prime Minister of Belgium and the leader of our

:19:38.:19:41.

political group in the European Parliament. There have been debates

:19:42.:19:44.

on television between these candidates to give European citizens

:19:45.:19:49.

a sense of who these people are that are candidates for the President of

:19:50.:19:53.

the European Commission. So this is a first step in what should be many

:19:54.:19:58.

more steps towards a more effective democratic and transparent European

:19:59.:20:02.

Union. I think if there is a problem that we have in Europe, but in

:20:03.:20:06.

politics more broadly in the EU, it is that there are politicians who

:20:07.:20:10.

say one thing, one day and then something else the next day. So we

:20:11.:20:14.

have to stick to what it is we have said we would do, now we must Folau

:20:15.:20:19.

through. Jacob Rees-Mogg you would accept this is an improvement on the

:20:20.:20:22.

previous system would you? Not particularly. You don't think it is

:20:23.:20:26.

more transparent? I don't think it is particularly, nobody has heard of

:20:27.:20:29.

these candidates. Is there any single candidate among them you

:20:30.:20:33.

would support for the job? Perhaps Bill Cash should become a candidate.

:20:34.:20:37.

He is not unfortunately a candidate? He could become one the Council of

:20:38.:20:41.

Ministers could put him forward, it is their choice. This isn't open and

:20:42.:20:44.

transparent because the European Parliament is a closed,

:20:45.:20:48.

inward-looking system, that nobody has paid any attention to the

:20:49.:20:51.

European Parliament's candidates or these debates other than people who

:20:52.:20:57.

are tied into the system. As a member of the organisation there

:20:58.:21:00.

will be somebody who will be President of the Commission? I have

:21:01.:21:05.

more confidence in the pre-Nice system where there was a veto. It is

:21:06.:21:09.

a pity that was given up. National countries represent their countries

:21:10.:21:11.

not the European Parliament, it would be better to do it on that

:21:12.:21:15.

system and whether that is done in private or the near private of the

:21:16.:21:18.

European Parliament, because however much they may have it debates I

:21:19.:21:22.

think they are watched by as many people as watch the Eurovision Song

:21:23.:21:31.

Contest. Or not. But how big a problem is it for David Cameron if

:21:32.:21:36.

he doesn't get his way and Mr Junker is appointed? It is a minor problem.

:21:37.:21:43.

I think back to the appointment of Jack Santer, who took over by the

:21:44.:21:50.

man vetoed by John Major. He courageously vetoed one pro-European

:21:51.:21:53.

federalist, replaced by another, seen as a great victory for British

:21:54.:21:58.

diplomacy. I don't think it would be a great defeat if it went against

:21:59.:22:01.

David Cameron, but equally it won't be a great victory if it goes his

:22:02.:22:10.

way. If there is some sort of compromise, say Christine Lagarde,

:22:11.:22:15.

seems to be popular at present, would that be something that you and

:22:16.:22:17.

your friend could live with, or would it be a subversion of what you

:22:18.:22:22.

see as a process that was agreed upon beforehand? I'm sorry, I can't

:22:23.:22:30.

hear you sufficiently. I heard that the MP of the Conservative Party

:22:31.:22:34.

said that the council should make these decision, but what has been

:22:35.:22:38.

clear is that the system as it has been working with the council and

:22:39.:22:41.

ministers trading different interests is not doing enough for

:22:42.:22:46.

European citizens so it is clear that we should not rely on business

:22:47.:22:49.

as usual, but we have to reform the EU to make it more democratic. I

:22:50.:22:54.

think that is essential. I'm sorry if I cannot hear your question, the

:22:55.:22:58.

satellite connection is not strong enough. I'm terribly sorry you

:22:59.:23:03.

haven't been able to hear properly either. Thank you very much for

:23:04.:23:06.

joining us and thank you Jacob Rees-Mogg too. Regular viewers will

:23:07.:23:11.

perhaps recall a couple of Newsnight reports from Owen Bennett Jones of

:23:12.:23:16.

the activities in Britain of a Pakistani exile who seems to have

:23:17.:23:21.

instilled a rule of fear in the city of Karachi. Finally he was arrested

:23:22.:23:26.

in London and being questioned about alleged money laundering. It set off

:23:27.:23:32.

protests in Karachi where his organisation has terrorised great

:23:33.:23:35.

numbers of people. Such is their reputation that fear of what it

:23:36.:23:39.

might do almost paralysed the city today. Here we are with the latest.

:23:40.:23:57.

IT With little drama Mr Hussein was picked up in a quiet, wealthy

:23:58.:24:03.

suburb. He's Karachi's most important politician w a solid

:24:04.:24:07.

parliamentary block and the ability to deliver formidable street power.

:24:08.:24:12.

He is famous for speeches like this. One of the investigations he faces

:24:13.:24:16.

in the UK is asking whether these kind of remarks amount to incitement

:24:17.:24:24.

to violence. Two Newsnight films revealed the investigations into Mr

:24:25.:24:29.

Hussein and caused a big impact in Pakistan, now he's in custody

:24:30.:24:37.

suspected of money laundering. The party today said it was in shock

:24:38.:24:44.

that he is critically ill and there will now be peaceful protests. But

:24:45.:24:50.

after the arrest, many parts of Karachi emptied as people feared a

:24:51.:24:54.

more violent reaction. Those in the city who passionately support him,

:24:55.:24:57.

and those who fear him, are all waiting to hear the latest news from

:24:58.:25:02.

London. And whether the arrest will be Folaued with charges. I'm joined

:25:03.:25:11.

in the studio now, what is the situation in Karachi tonight? The

:25:12.:25:16.

MQM have their people out on the streets in the city, they say they

:25:17.:25:19.

will be doing a peaceful protest until's out of custody, that could

:25:20.:25:23.

be as long as 36 hours, that is happening. I mean it has been more

:25:24.:25:27.

peaceful than many people thought, some buses were set alight. These

:25:28.:25:31.

guys in the screen are his supporters in Karachi? So he has a

:25:32.:25:35.

very passionate support base, very loyal support, but also many people

:25:36.:25:39.

in the city who fear him. The city is divided by him. But those people

:25:40.:25:43.

who support him are always, he has huge street power, he can deploy

:25:44.:25:47.

them whenever he wants. It is extraordinary that one man can have

:25:48.:25:50.

that much sway? Particularly when he has lived in London for 23 years.

:25:51.:25:55.

This is all done down a phone line. He has complete control of his party

:25:56.:26:00.

and now he is gone one of the problems the party has got is they

:26:01.:26:03.

don't know what to do because he's not there to tell them. How can he

:26:04.:26:07.

control a party thousands of miles away living in London? The party

:26:08.:26:11.

critics would say it is by the use of violence, by the use of force

:26:12.:26:15.

that many of his party officials are afraid of him, and that it is being

:26:16.:26:18.

done in that way. His supporters would say he's a charismatic and

:26:19.:26:22.

brilliant politician able to pull it off. Now the last episode of the

:26:23.:26:31.

gritty television crime series Happy Valley ended half an hour or so ago,

:26:32.:26:37.

it has been great success, with the central character, Sergeant

:26:38.:26:41.

Katherine Corn hugely popular. It is widely recognised that the most

:26:42.:26:44.

eager consumers of this sort of television are women. The question

:26:45.:26:48.

is why? Why should entertainment that so often features violence

:26:49.:26:52.

against women appeal to women? In a moment we will talk to two crime

:26:53.:26:55.

writers about the attraction of events we all fervently pray will

:26:56.:27:01.

never occur for real. They have this, in the meantime, as you would

:27:02.:27:05.

expect it contains some scenes of violence you might find distressing.

:27:06.:27:13.

Is it a realistic depicks of the kind of violence women can suffer in

:27:14.:27:18.

real life, or gratuitous titillation to win ratings. The cameras also

:27:19.:27:24.

focus on women, abused, battered, raped or dead, but has it gone too

:27:25.:27:28.

far. I find it increasingly rare to come across a drama where there

:27:29.:27:33.

isn't a woman being terrorised at the least, having her throat cut,

:27:34.:27:37.

tied up somewhere, menaced or murdered or scared out of her wits.

:27:38.:27:42.

It seems to have become a norm, without anybody noticing really. It

:27:43.:27:46.

seems to have crept in particularly over the past, I would say two or

:27:47.:27:50.

three years, and it has become quite intense now. Happy Valley, which

:27:51.:27:56.

ended tonight has been pretty gruelling viewing at times, but six

:27:57.:28:00.

million people have tuned in and only 15 complained, its female

:28:01.:28:05.

writer defended the violence as necessary and says in the end she

:28:06.:28:09.

has created uplifting television with strong female characters at its

:28:10.:28:16.

heart. The Fall was dubbed the most repulsive drama ever shown which one

:28:17.:28:27.

writer, it was a serial killer attacking attractive young women. It

:28:28.:28:31.

is all about context, set in the 1950s Bletchley Circle saw four code

:28:32.:28:37.

breakers becoming investigators, it didn't shy away from female death,

:28:38.:28:43.

but it wasn't gratuitous, and it showed the female leads reacting to

:28:44.:28:46.

it. Why did we have to come here and see her if we couldn't help her,

:28:47.:28:51.

what was the point of it. But criticism of too much female-based

:28:52.:28:55.

violence on TV is changing behaviour. I have been developing a

:28:56.:28:59.

show where the female writer which involves murders, all of the people

:29:00.:29:02.

who are dying are men. That doesn't mean it is a better or worse show,

:29:03.:29:06.

or we don't think about violence towards men. But certainly she did

:29:07.:29:10.

say when she started to write it that she would be damned if the

:29:11.:29:15.

first person to die on the TV show would be a woman. I think it

:29:16.:29:19.

self-regulates, people are aware, it has become an issue and it will

:29:20.:29:23.

affect how violence is depicted and violence against women. That shift

:29:24.:29:29.

can't come soon enough for those who trace violence against women on

:29:30.:29:32.

television back to our love affair with Nordic noir, The Killing with

:29:33.:29:38.

frightening scenes from the start spawned too many a British crime

:29:39.:29:46.

drama with brutality at its heart. Ripper Street, set in East London

:29:47.:29:52.

six months after backthe ripper's killings was simply attacked for the

:29:53.:29:57.

period back drop and the portrayal of violence. Do charities that

:29:58.:30:01.

campaign against real world violence worry about the TV versions.

:30:02.:30:06.

Violence against women is a reality, and it is really important to

:30:07.:30:09.

recognise how much of it there is. So in one sense no I don't have

:30:10.:30:15.

concerns. What does concern me though is when TV dramas perpetuate

:30:16.:30:21.

some of the many myths that exist around violence against women.

:30:22.:30:25.

Violence of course can be used to powerful effect, in the past even

:30:26.:30:30.

Women's Aid itself hasn't shied away from pretty graphic story telling

:30:31.:30:35.

that wouldn't look out of place of a TV drama and curtesy of Keira

:30:36.:30:38.

Knightly to get the own message across. With us is Anne Cleaves

:30:39.:30:45.

whose novels have been done both for the BBC and ITV, and the crime

:30:46.:30:53.

fiction critic Jake Kerridge. Let's look at the question of the appeal

:30:54.:30:56.

to women. It is clear that very large numbers of women form the core

:30:57.:31:01.

of the audience and many of these programme, yet these programmes do

:31:02.:31:04.

feature a lot of violence against women? Not all of them do of course.

:31:05.:31:11.

I agree. What women watch crime drama for is the strands of the

:31:12.:31:15.

story, quite often it is domestic, it is about family and the clips you

:31:16.:31:21.

didn't show from Happy Valley are about a close family. Sometimes

:31:22.:31:27.

dysfuntional. I think the writing was brilliant about that, and that

:31:28.:31:31.

is why women are watching it. What is your theory? I think we have to

:31:32.:31:35.

wonder why when two-thirds of the people who read and buy crime

:31:36.:31:39.

fiction are women why these interesting and ingenious ways of

:31:40.:31:43.

slaughtering so many women are so popular, apart from some kind of

:31:44.:31:48.

prevalent misogyny among women, I don't think it can be that. And

:31:49.:31:52.

factually we know that most murders are perpetrated against men,

:31:53.:31:57.

specifically young men? It may be to do with sexual violence as well. The

:31:58.:32:03.

crime writer Val McDermott that women are incull culcated by a fear

:32:04.:32:12.

of violence that men are not, so they read something to get a thrill

:32:13.:32:16.

that preys on their very deepest fears. What do you make of that

:32:17.:32:20.

idea? I don't agree with that. I think there is a tendency to put on

:32:21.:32:26.

what you think is going to be popular. We were talking about The

:32:27.:32:33.

Killing, the start of that came from the Dragon Tattoo, where it started

:32:34.:32:38.

with quite playful, quite domestic and the violence got stronger and

:32:39.:32:42.

stronger and less appropriate, I think. And because the male central

:32:43.:32:47.

character was very sympathetic, he was a great supporter of women, some

:32:48.:32:53.

how that was fine. That made the violence against the central woman

:32:54.:32:58.

character some how all right. Is there something also in drama that

:32:59.:33:07.

has a strong female lead, some how often feels it is OK if you have

:33:08.:33:11.

that to have violence against women in the same thing too. Have you

:33:12.:33:15.

noticed that? I think that is a cop-out too. But you have noticed it

:33:16.:33:21.

I bet? I'm not sure that I have, I suppose The Killing, but I know more

:33:22.:33:27.

about crime fiction in books. Prime Suspect, The Killing, The Bridge,

:33:28.:33:34.

all these things? It is true. Go on? It is true, why do women watch it,

:33:35.:33:40.

I'm not convinced that they watch it because they like seeing women

:33:41.:33:44.

raped, tortured and mutilated. I think it is sad if that is what we

:33:45.:33:48.

think, and if that is why people watch television for those things.

:33:49.:33:53.

Do you have a further view on why it has this appeal? In the days of

:33:54.:34:00.

Agatha Christie crime writers got a lot of criticism for not taking

:34:01.:34:04.

murder seriously making it into a parlour game, when you have the

:34:05.:34:12.

books, the original Swedish title of The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo was

:34:13.:34:21.

first called Why do men hate women. It was prevalent amongst the

:34:22.:34:24.

establishment and in society, he thought to justify write beg it he

:34:25.:34:28.

had to write about it in some detail and he had to have rape scenes in

:34:29.:34:33.

the books. I don't think they are gratuitous, I think he sets enough

:34:34.:34:36.

details going in the readers mind that they know what is going on. He

:34:37.:34:40.

doesn't linger. The problem is when the books are adopted into films, as

:34:41.:34:47.

The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo was in Swedish and American, that the

:34:48.:34:50.

viewer is just hit over the head with the rape scenes. You read a lot

:34:51.:34:55.

of this stuff, is it getting more violent? I think so. I do worry

:34:56.:35:02.

about the normalisation of sexual violence towards women and I find it

:35:03.:35:05.

very boring, because I get a flood of book which on the first page some

:35:06.:35:11.

poor woman, usually a young pretty woman has something quite nasty done

:35:12.:35:16.

to her. Do you come under pressure from publishers or television

:35:17.:35:22.

producers? Not at all. But I have too been sent books to blurb, and

:35:23.:35:27.

one sent by a publicist saying this is a really thrilling story about a

:35:28.:35:33.

serial rapist terrorising the town and leaving behind him a trail of

:35:34.:35:38.

tortured and mutilated women. We know you will love this book. No,

:35:39.:35:44.

really, I won't love this book. I worry I suppose that new writers

:35:45.:35:49.

feel that's what's going to sell. And young women writers write it too

:35:50.:35:54.

because they think that's what a best-selling crime novel is going to

:35:55.:35:59.

be like. I think we know that Hitchcock knew that people wanted to

:36:00.:36:03.

see a blonde get stabbed in the shower not a man. But at the same

:36:04.:36:09.

time when you watch the shower scene in Psycho, you don't see the knife

:36:10.:36:15.

going into the body, it is the editing and cutting, it doesn't

:36:16.:36:20.

linger on the face. Now Happy Valley, excellent series, but if you

:36:21.:36:26.

want to get value you have to see the young police woman getting run

:36:27.:36:30.

over four or five times to make an impact. You wonder how far people

:36:31.:36:34.

will be able to go in the future next time they want to make an

:36:35.:36:37.

impact. Do you not think the pendulum will swing back too, I get

:36:38.:36:40.

that feeling with fiction and novels. I think so, in your books a

:36:41.:36:45.

lot of the violence happens offstage and done very subtly. I think people

:36:46.:36:50.

will try to become more ingenious in their use of violence and they won't

:36:51.:36:55.

just have all guts strewn everywhere. I think the lovely crime

:36:56.:37:01.

writer Bob Barnard said more than one murder in a novel was rather

:37:02.:37:05.

vulgar. At the time trees, the -- Tetris,

:37:06.:37:12.

the game familiar to everyone under the age of 60, if you are over 60,

:37:13.:37:16.

you might learn something. It is a game developed in Russia and

:37:17.:37:21.

celebrating its 30th anniversary this week. That is the equivalent of

:37:22.:37:25.

two entire geological eras in the world of computing. Yet the game is

:37:26.:37:30.

still available and hugely popular on mobile phones and other devices.

:37:31.:37:35.

Even David Grossman hasn't been cool that long, he hasn't been off his

:37:36.:37:41.

chopper bike that long. He has this report. It has been rep Tate cathed

:37:42.:37:54.

on keyboards. On guitars. -- replicated on key boards, and

:37:55.:37:58.

whatever this is. But the original eight bit Tetris version is the

:37:59.:38:06.

Madingley catchy -- Madingley catchy like the game. I have been playing

:38:07.:38:11.

for 25 years and I love it still, I feel really relaxed when I play it.

:38:12.:38:18.

I'm passionate about it, it is a fantastic experience for me. So much

:38:19.:38:23.

has changed since this game was brought out, not just the computer

:38:24.:38:27.

graphics or the hardware, geopolitics too. Back then Russia

:38:28.:38:31.

was considered a dangerous and expipingsist state. Oh, hang on...

:38:32.:38:40.

The game was invented in the secret computer labs in the Moscow academy

:38:41.:38:46.

of science, an adaptation of an old Russian shape puzzle. I played a lot

:38:47.:38:51.

with this strange proto-type, and I can stop it myself and other people

:38:52.:38:58.

in my room were asking what are you doing here. And then I let people

:38:59.:39:04.

play and I realised it is not myself who is cuckoo and has something

:39:05.:39:09.

wrong in the brain, because everybody who touched this game

:39:10.:39:16.

couldn't stop playing either. Tetris spread via pirated floppies reaching

:39:17.:39:21.

the US. Everyone who played it realised this was something

:39:22.:39:24.

different, up until then video games were a scripted progression through

:39:25.:39:29.

a fine night number of -- finite number of levels, and boring. Tetris

:39:30.:39:34.

was different from the start because every time you played it was more

:39:35.:39:39.

difficult, it was different and it was impossible to win. That is

:39:40.:39:44.

probably the reason why Tetris has this enduring appeal. It is because

:39:45.:39:49.

however hard you try you can't win. In the late 80s the superpowers of

:39:50.:39:56.

the gaming world started a Cold War-style battle for the rights to

:39:57.:40:02.

Tetris. They descended on Moscow, Atari versus Nintendo. Nintendo made

:40:03.:40:08.

a video of the trip to Moscow in search of the elusive rights. Take a

:40:09.:40:14.

look outside, this is Moscow. Watching a video of Hawaii, because

:40:15.:40:21.

the TV doesn't work. The radio doesn't work. I have read everything

:40:22.:40:25.

I could read. He was negotiating with the Soviet Ministry of

:40:26.:40:30.

Software, who, he says, were pretty much clueless, he walked away with

:40:31.:40:34.

the hand held and console rights. To them it was more money than they had

:40:35.:40:38.

ever seen. For me it was more money than I had ever seen, we were happy

:40:39.:40:44.

campers. Could you put a figure on how much it was worth to you? At the

:40:45.:40:51.

end of the day, gosh, I would have to calculate, 35 million copies, it

:40:52.:40:56.

would have been multiple millions of dollars. And the game still appeals,

:40:57.:41:03.

now shrink wrapped in the smooth cellophane of nostalgia. There is

:41:04.:41:07.

demand for the original versions on the originalens machines. It is the

:41:08.:41:12.

impolicity, that modern games are very absorbing and time-consuming,

:41:13.:41:17.

but something like Tetris you can pick up and play for ten minutes or

:41:18.:41:23.

hours, it is an addictive game. In Tetris the World Service you up all

:41:24.:41:28.

this random chaos and it is your job to put it in order and make sense of

:41:29.:41:33.

it and make it neat. But time, there isn't enough time. Your successes

:41:34.:41:40.

are brief, they soon disappear, all that's left is a big pile of failure

:41:41.:41:47.

of dashed intentions of incomplete dreams until... You die. The Tetris

:41:48.:41:56.

world is pretty bleak. There are 337 days left to the date

:41:57.:42:01.

of the next election. Tomorrow we shall discover what the Government

:42:02.:42:06.

plans to spend them doing. Famously much of the time with Government is

:42:07.:42:09.

spent dealing with events they didn't foresee but the Queen's

:42:10.:42:12.

Speech to parliament tomorrow will tell us what the coalition

:42:13.:42:16.

Government would like to be doing with whatever time they have left in

:42:17.:42:20.

Government. The newspapers have had plenty of suggestions, some of them

:42:21.:42:26.

dressed up as impecably authoritative leaks. We have some

:42:27.:42:29.

ideas about what might really happen. What will happen? The first

:42:30.:42:33.

thing is it will be short, ten minutes, it will alling over by 11.

:42:34.:42:42.

45, as one observer put it unless Her Majesty does a Jean Carlos on us

:42:43.:42:46.

it will be forgotten by six. It is 11 bills, technical ways of

:42:47.:42:50.

implementing what we have heard. The pensions reform, we have heard a lot

:42:51.:42:54.

about the Dutch-style collective and the fund for that. We know there

:42:55.:43:00.

will be help for landlords, that rather excruciating scene between

:43:01.:43:03.

Clegg and Cable today setting out that. We know there will be an end

:43:04.:43:10.

to resolving day pay-offs, where senior civil servants get a

:43:11.:43:16.

redundancy pay off and come back in. And companies won't be allowed to

:43:17.:43:20.

drill without asking owners' permission, this is the fracking

:43:21.:43:24.

stuff. In terms of the mood it is difficult to set out all the

:43:25.:43:27.

legislation so quickly after what you call mid-terms, the European

:43:28.:43:31.

elections and the local elections, my reading of this is there will not

:43:32.:43:38.

be a lot of red meat thrown to the Tory backbenchers, there won't be an

:43:39.:43:44.

EU referendum bill or big moves on immigration curbs, or an Immigration

:43:45.:43:47.

Bill, and perhaps a way of saying the Government is confident with the

:43:48.:43:51.

results they have just seen. Is there likely to be anything really

:43:52.:43:56.

contentious? The most controversial thing is the recall bill, a measure

:43:57.:44:00.

by which constituents have the power to throw out their MP if there has

:44:01.:44:04.

been serious wrongdoing. Now there was a lot of toing and freeing on

:44:05.:44:12.

this, after the expenses scandal people wanted to put this mechanism

:44:13.:44:17.

in. People got cold feet in the first draft the Government thought

:44:18.:44:21.

they would end up with a lot of Newarks on their hands, they tried

:44:22.:44:26.

to remove it, now it is back in and in, in a very loose woolly way, the

:44:27.:44:31.

wording will be "my Government is committed to continue the programme

:44:32.:44:36.

of reform with legislation for the recall of MPs... " there are many

:44:37.:44:40.

who fear the bill in the current form won't have any teeth. I know

:44:41.:44:45.

Zach Goldsmith behind this from the start will be looking very closely

:44:46.:44:49.

at what is said and what is not said about recall. If all that ends up

:44:50.:44:55.

being is a system whereby it goes to another part of parliament, the

:44:56.:44:58.

Standards Committee for example, to decide on when there should be a

:44:59.:45:02.

by-election or when somebody should be removed from office then he will

:45:03.:45:06.

table an early day motion and take it to the Labour benches and say we

:45:07.:45:10.

need help because the Conservatives and Liberal Democrats have failed to

:45:11.:45:14.

get it through. Thank you. Tomorrow morning's front pages or some of

:45:15.:45:16.

them: That's it for today. We say good

:45:17.:46:01.

night with pictures from a town in Argentina that was flooded beneath

:46:02.:46:07.

10ms of salt warter in 1985 but then reappeared 25 years later. The

:46:08.:46:16.

director has made a film about Danny McAskall's cycle through the ruinsa

:46:17.:46:32.

film about Danny McAskall's cycle through the ruins.

:46:33.:46:59.

Good evening, warm and humid weather heading our way for the end of the

:47:00.:47:08.

week, breaking down into thundery showers. No warmth around, spreading

:47:09.:47:13.

into central and eastern Scotland through the afternoon. But Northern

:47:14.:47:17.

Ireland is escaping most of the rain, largely dry here. The western

:47:18.:47:21.

fringes of Scotland doing OK, but central and eastern Scotland, the

:47:22.:47:24.

rain sets in through the afternoon. Here temperatures of only 12 degrees

:47:25.:47:28.

moving down into northern England through the Midlands and the

:47:29.:47:31.

persistence of the rain means the temperatures could struggle in

:47:32.:47:34.

Birmingham and Oxford to get any higher than 11 degrees. That will

:47:35.:47:38.

feel like we have slipped back a couple of months. The rain on and

:47:39.:47:42.

off for much of the day here. Heading further west Devon and

:47:43.:47:45.

Cornwall getting dryer and brighter through the afternoon. I think

:47:46.:47:48.

across western parts of Wales the rain will begin to ease off, perhaps

:47:49.:47:51.

some

:47:52.:47:53.