26/01/2016 Newsnight

Nations apparently ready to trample over treaties in their struggle

And, at the heart of it, Germany divided.

Fingers are being pointed at Greece - again.

I expect from spring on the figures will go up again and we will be

facing two million and I think this is not an option, not even for Mrs

Merkel. Fingers are being pointed

at Greece - again. Could it be kicked out

of the borderless Schengen zone? We'll hear the response

of the Greek Migration Minister. A new worry about the zika virus

that harms the unborn. We'll hear from a researcher

into insect-borne disease who says And, Apple - how can they revive

their plateauing iphone sales? They've started talking about what

he called switch, people came on board with an android phone and

switched over. In one respect Europe can be proud -

it's a continent so pleasant, that a lot of people

want to live in it. 45,000 people have arrived

in Greece this year. What the continent cannot be proud

of is the shambolic response European Interior Ministers met

in Amsterdam yesterday, with proposals that potentially chip

away at the Schengen Treaty, creating a borderless

zone of 26 countries. Now, amazingly, the same two

countries at the centre of the euro crisis last summer,

are at the centre of this one. Greece is blamed for not enforcing

the external EU border. But Germany is doing

some of the blaming, as well as agonising over the wisdom

of its open door policy. Daily, twice an hour,

the police assemble And it is here in the cold

of a Bavarian winter, the multitudes step out

into their promised land. Among those being registered,

the Ahools from Aleppo. Two sisters, their brother,

and five children under eight. They have braved the sea from Greece

and the frozen Balkans. Here the single men also

are separated from groups and hidden This winter was meant to be

a time when the numbers Our area in Rosenheim,

yesterday we had 900 refugees. But we could say the last weeks,

up from 1000, to 2000 per day. Add those reaching other centres

in Bavaria, and officials told us it At that rate, Germany will break

last year's total of 1.1 million A few men were separated,

papers suggested they had already While others went on to refugee

hostels and the unlucky few were taken off for

probable deportation. In the vastness of the Bavarian

mountains certain things are becoming chillingly

clear for Germany. Notably the failure

to reach European solutions and the implications

for this country. In this remote resort,

Wildbad Kreuth, the CSU, the Bavarian branch

of Angela Merkel's party, And they were in a state of revolt

over their leader's So we need a quick solution

and a quick solution means that we have to consider border

controls at national level, that we have to recheck immigrants

that come to Bavaria in a very high And we want to make clear that this

is just not manageable. How long has it got,

do you think, before Germany imposes full border controls and takes

matters into its own hand? I think it is a question of days

or weeks, but not months. A German unilateral solution

with untold consequences In an attempt to staunch more

trouble, Mrs Merkel came to Kreuth. Her emphasis, even now,

is one of joint solutions But the record so far,

and actions of neighbours in taking unilateral steps, suggests Germany

is reaching a moment of decision. Frankly, I do not really see

the signals in Brussels now. Facts are being created

on the ground, we're seeing Austria Potentially then closing

its borders. Because that is what

it implicitly means. So she certainly is seriously

running out of time. Hundreds of miles to the north,

the Bavarian situation is making In an attempt to ease the tensions,

several Berlin museums have signed up to a programme,

using refugees as guides. Educating both the Arab-speaking

new arrivals and German visitors. Salma Jreige came 18

months ago from Syria. She's hoping Chancellor Merkel

doesn't abandon her asylum policy. Even though she has a lot

of opponents right now who don't agree with this precise

policy with refugees, but she's carrying on and at

the same time there are a lot of people who are encouraging her

and the people, the refugees themselves, really appreciate this

because they're sensing that Germany is giving them more opportunities

than other European countries are. So I say carry on and

as in Arabic we say.. But in Berlin, and elsewhere,

the new year's events in Cologne In the district of Landshut

in Bavaria the local mayor has He recently packed a bus full

of refugees off to Berlin because he said there's

no more room here. With dozens more arriving each week,

the mayor says he fears social Mr Dreier directed us to this place,

one of several centres for hundreds So, back in October they ran out

of space in proper hostels and they've just had to open places

like this up one after the other, disused retail warehouses,

a school's being considered in another case and they've had 180

people in here since October. Cooped up here for months,

little wonder boredom People told us they didn't feel

safe, that there were frequent fights between different

sectarian groups. Families, meanwhile,

tried to maintain some semblance And here, too, we found even

Syrian refugees urging the German Government

to find a plan B. This is one of hundreds of temporary

refuges across Germany and with 3,000-plus new arrivals

daily, even Merkel loyalists I expect that from spring

on the figures will go up again and then we will be facing two

million and I think this is not Plan B would be much more popular,

which would be really to reject I know also that we are capable

of doing it because the federal police and the army would be capable

to secure the border. And they would just

have to be triggered. The German Government still hopes

to push its neighbours into doing more but in Bavaria a clear

picture is emerging. People are still arriving in numbers

that local authorities It's a situation fraught with risk

for the European project Joining me now from Brussels

is the German MEP Elmar Brok, a firm supporter of Angela Merkel

and the Chairman of the European Parliament Committee

on Foreign Affairs. Evening to you. I don't know if you

listened to that. If the rest of Europe doesn't join Germany in

trying to shoulder the number of people coming in, do you think

Germany can go on receiving this number? Germany does not want to go

on, Mrs Merkel doesn't want to go on. We have to look into

possibilities people stay home, finish the war in Syria and Iraq,

have an agreement with Turkey, have better Turkey border controls, build

hot spots in Greece and Greece should take responsibilities so less

refugees come, people can stay at home or in their camps there, have

to give more European support after the war they can go back and only

people come to Europe that will have the right to come because they're

running away from war. The real asylum seekers must be afraid for

their lives, because of political and religious reasons or whatsoever

and then it's do-able. But we have to become better and the same is for

northern Africa. Are you disappointed with the fact that

European project, Germany, right at the heart of the whole dream of a

united Europe, and a crisis like this comes along and everybody

scurries away and looks after their own backyard and says you can deal

with it, Germany, on your own. You must be utterly distraught at what

it says about the rest of Europe, aren't you? No, we are annoyed with

some countries, not all of them, Sweden took a lot of

responsibilities. They took more per capita than anyone else. We are in

the alone in that sense. Enough is enough, we have to do it in a decent

way and build fences around every European country. I think that is

not a solution. The freedom, the peace in Europe, the chances of the

internal market which can only survive with free movement of

people, and free movement of goods, is so important for our success

story of the last 50, 60 years, we have to deal with that in another

way, to look into the causes, solve that, much more money, much more

interventions and to look in outside borders where we have plans but not

all the countries have implemented it and here you have to put more

pressures. What happens if they don't? I understand your plan A. But

what if the rest of the people players needed to make that work, if

they don't deliver, how long do you think Germany's political stability

will take three or 4,000 people arriving a day?

We have had some progress, in November and December it was 12,000

per day, now 2000, 3000. Because of the weather. But it is still too

much and we have got to work on that. The next step is the European

Council on February the 18th and we have to solve a lot of problems

before March when the Mediterranean can be used more. We should not come

to the situation when more people die in the Mediterranean, that is

inhuman and we need a solution to people in front of the borders, if

you look at the Balkans, I'm afraid that might explode again as it is

done over the last century several times. And we must start to think

about Plan B, as the last chance. Plan A is not successful. Many

critics of Angela Merkel and her open-door policy, how dangerous is

this for Angela Merkel, who is the de facto leader to some extent of

the European Union, how dangerous is it for her? If there is no solution

it is dangerous for every responsible person. 12 million

refugees in Syria and Iraq, 60 million around the world, they look

to Europe because Europe is the most successful part of the world, a

success story. Peace, freedom and prosperity. And we have to do our

job in that way, people need to be helped and they must get our

support, but not the others. And we have to make a better European

solution, it was not possible to provide that before the cost member

states did not follow us to get this European solution because of debates

about national sovereignty. That has got to be changed now. We have the

biggest challenge that Europe has faced for the past 50 or 60 years.

No one was prepared for that and we've got to find a solution. To

destroy free movement, the internal market, would be a win for the

terrorists. The enemies of Europe. Because then you destroyed the basis

of our success story which we had for our citizens and we should not

allow that and so we should push, everyone, including Germany, to find

a solution that makes it possible to follow our responsibilities for the

lives of people out at the same time not a burden. If you talk about

Cologne, there were people from Morocco and Algeria, they have no

right to come to the European Union, they're not asylum seekers, not

running away from a war. So we develop instruments, hotspots in

Greece and Italy and other places where these people can be found out

early and sent on. Thank you. Well, Germany is just one country -

but across Europe, the refrain that "this can't go on" is

becoming a familiar one. We woke up this morning to news that

at an Amsterdam meeting yesterday, EU Interior Ministers

were contemplating some kind The key issue for them is Greece,

which is not enforcing Bluntly, Ministers have asked

whether it should be kicked out of Schengen, with the

external border moved in. Some kind of emergency

reintroduction of borders is allowed for two years under

the Schengen Treaty. A little earlier, I spoke

to the Greek Migration Minister, I asked him to respond to those

accusations that Greece was not doing enough to maintain its

borders. Yesterday it was said that the way that Greece has secured the

borders is what we would do in the same situation, so there are several

wise that they're saying. For us, against my country, and I believe it

is not the best way to affirm these big issues. Whatever the rights in

the Bronx, many in Western Europe, Northern Europe, and the solution is

for Greece no longer to be in the borderless Schengen zone. To kick

Greece out of that zone because Greece is not maintaining the

external border as they wanted it to be maintained. What is your response

to the idea that for an emergency period, Greece is out of the

Schengen zone? First of all if someone talks about the history of

immigration, they would not leave it, would not think this is

something that could occur. Yesterday in this ministerial

conference, no one said anything like that. Only the Minister for

Belgium who said that we had to push back. This is illegal. And that

Greece must be a place where there will be a camp for 400,000.

Certainly Belgium has spoken about this idea of having huge camps in

Greece. You refer to that. And also push back. The Belgians said to push

them back into the sea. The Belgians said go against the law. I do not

care if you drown them. I want them pushed back. And probably no one in

the conference of ministers accepted that. Just to be clear, the Belgians

wanted you to push people into the sea as a solution to the problem?

Yes yes. Back to the issue of the camps, there are people who think

that one temporary arrangement would be to have very large camps in

Greece, where refugees are safe and from where they then go home to

Syria after the war, say, is over. Does that have any appeal to you? If

you look at history, you will see the only period of history in which

there were camps for 400,000 prisoners, it was the period of the

Nazis. If you do not see this period there is no other period in history

in which there were camps for 400,000 prisoners. And refugees are

not prisoners. I wonder who you blame for the difficult situation,

that Europe is in customer I do not want to be a part of this lame game.

Greece wants to be a part of the solution. -- blame game. To act in

Europe in a unilateral way is something, you cannot be a member of

Europe, you cannot participate in a programme for agriculture or you

take money, not participate in an educational programme because you

take money, but when Europe needs you you close the borders. You make

prisoners. You ask to drown people. This is not Europe. I cannot tell

whether you are sad or angry today? I'm not angry. I am a minister and

ministers must not be angry. A minister must keep the door open. We

want to find a solution. But we are tied. We have all these people, all

the refugees. First of all they pass from us. You have to imagine during

the summer, 10,000 per day were passing from an island with 3000

population. You have to imagine that the Adjani in the sea, that everyday

people collect bodies from the coast. -- they are drowning in the

sea. Thank you very much. Ever since the suicide of a young

Tory activist in September, the party has been beset

by allegations that it failed to act over allegations of bullying

in its youth wing - we've reported repeatedly

on the scandal on this programme. The party has tried to draw a line

under the affair by asking law firm Clifford Chance to

conduct an inquiry. But many of those involved remain

unconvinced that the party is really Ten potential witnesses have told

Newsnight they feel reluctant to give evidence to the inquiry

because a former associate of the man at the centre

of the scandal - Mark Clarke - has a role in deciding

the party's response. For four months his parents have

campaigned relentlessly for justice for their son but only now

is Alison Johnson ready to speak on camera about what happened

to Elliott and the family's We live out in the back water

so they probably think, oh well, you know, if we silence

them they'll go away quietly Every day just drifts into another

when you don't know anything. The student vote is

really important... Elliott was found dead on a train

track last September. He left a note saying

he had been bullied. Rather than being treated

as grieving parents, the Johnsons felt like the inquiry

into what happened was putting We also heard they wanted

to interview my husband and myself individually to find out

what our stories were. Well, it's not a story,

it's the facts. Mrs Johnson is not the only one

who doubts the party can get to the bottom of what

happened to her son. He is one of the most senior Tories

you have never heard of. As the leader of Tory

volunteers across the country, he sits on the board that

will consider the official party But for many Semple appears too

close to Mark Clarke, the man at the centre

of the bullying allegations. Here's Clarke endorsing Semple

on a campaign leaflet. Rob understands how

to engage with activists His support was

crucial to delivering both the road trip 2015

and the battle bus 2015 projects. He has the vision, leadership,

competence and credibility to do From everything I have seen Mark

Clark was effectively acting as campaign manager for Rob Semple.

From information I have seen and had sent to me, it would appear that

Mark Clarke was heavily lobbying people to vote for Rob Semple. Party

chairman Lord Feldman has already recused himself from considering the

enquiry and so too has this man, the deputy chairman. But Rob Semple is

going nowhere, despite 15 potential witnesses to the enquiry telling the

programme wanted to step away from it all together. A number said that

his presence makes him when it and to talk to the enquiry. People may

think there is a conflict of interest but the fact they think

they may be shows why Rob Semple should do the honourable thing and

stand down. People think he is a friend or colleague, or that Mark

Clarke helped him get in that position. It might be true, it might

not, the fact that they think that, it shows that this enquiry will be

tainted by his involvement. He should do the decent thing and

realise any enquiry conducted by the Conservative Party in which he takes

part, it has got to be questioned by the general public at large. People

will ask how can a man associated with Mark Clarke be seen to be a

person that is overseeing part of the enquiry. But tonight Rob Semple

told Newsnight he was not in touch with Mark Clarke and he was staying

put. He told us, I'm committed

to ensuring that the highest possible standards of

behaviour are upheld. I will ensure Clifford Chance's

findings will be honoured in full. I urge witnesses to come forward

so that the full facts are known. And the party maintained,

Rob Semple is not being asked to step down from the board

when the report is delivered. Fresh from a general election

victory, and with the Labour Party in disarray, on the face of it the

Conservative Party is in rude health. Not so says one veteran

member of the party. This is a much wider problem the Conservative Party

is got, that there is not accountability for those that run

the party, little transparency, and no democracy. Without those things

you find vested interests have enormous power within the party. And

things happen you could never explain except as a result of vested

interests. Before the crisis you've seen over the years, how do you rank

this? This is the biggest of all, the absolute biggest of all. The

party can no longer treat its members with contempt in the way it

has done in the past. And which it is still doing. That is how the

Johnson feel. Tonight Lord running the enquiry said they were sorry to

learn of the families concerned about the proposed separate

interviews. But they say they're happy to discuss alternatives.

Brazil is taking measures to fight the zika virus and the mosquitoes

The disease has so far caused more than 3,000 cases

of microcephaly in babies - the condition of shrunken heads

But how does the disease affect people as they grow up?

One parent from Manaus in the north of the country,

Viviane Lima, has two teenage daughters who live

Maria Luisa and Ana Vitoria developed it as a result

of a genetic condition - NOT zika, but her story gives some

insight into the little known disease.

Worries over the zika virus and its potential impact this

There is concern that it could be transmitted sexually.

The evidence of sexual transmission is anecdotal but there are two cases

- going back some years - that raise that prospect.

Professor Brian Foy who is himself a researcher on insect-borne

disease at Colorado State University.

And joining me in the studio is Jeremy Farrar, professor

of infectious diseases and director of the Wellcome Trust.

Brian Foy, you were in Sennegal, you contracted something and went back

to Colorado, give us the brief story. Well, this is a story that we

published in a periodic journal, my colleagues and I back in 2011 and it

documented anonymously a report of two scientists in Senegal brought

back viral diseases - one of them transmitted to his wife. A clever

science group reporter from Science Magazine read our article and

basically, we were doing research in southern Sennegal on malaria and we

were getting bitten by a lot of mosquitos, we came down and when we

got home with symptoms of diseases and so we got our blood tested. We

thought that was it. We September our blood to the CDC and I kept some

in my laboratory but soon after my wife came down with the same

symptoms of rash and we included that, we took her blood, as well,

and sent it to the CDC and it took a long at that time to figure out what

was going on, this happened back in tweet-9. Eventually we found out it

was the zika virus and we pshed this report and in a lot of the evidence

suggests that it was direct transmission, probably sexual

transmission. You have got children, I think, correct? They didn't seem

to get it? They did not. Are there any other ways, any other theorys,

obviously sexual transmission is one. But lots of things, lots of

intimate contact you could have had with your wife, maybe she got it

from sweat, all sorts of things one could imagine, no? Of course. That's

why it's circumstancesal evidence but it's strongly - it suggests

sexual transmission. There was other things, there was - none of my

children got it and I was wrestling and playing with them as soon as I

got home, as well. We deduced from all the lines of reasoning it was

probably sexual transmission. That sat Father a long time, in the

outbreak before the current outbreak in the South Pacific it looks like

another person, another man, they actually isolated the virus from his

semen after he became sick with zika. At least two data points

suggesting the virus could be transmitted sexually. I did want to

ask about that. I think I read in the New York Times that one of your

infection symptoms was you had blood in the semen. I am wondering, don't

want to get too personal, but whether we can be sure it was semen

or blood that was the bodily fluid that was carrying the virus? That's

true. Of course, no isolations were done. The only isolation was done

with this other man. It is circumstancesal evidence, there is

no doubt about it. We do have two data points now and it suggests a

likelihood it could happen, the real question is how probable it happens.

Certainly in this current large outbreak there is no doubt that

mosquitos are primarily transmitting it to most people. You wouldn't have

discovered it if you didn't happen to be in a person interested in

insect-borne diseases and infection? Ironically, yes. Thank you very

much. Jeremy Farrar, do you buy the sexual transmission theory? In

Brian's case, absolutely. He's done an amazing job to highlight that

potential root of transmission. It wouldn't have happened if he had not

been a biologist with an expert in that space. Whether it's in the

semen or in the blood that happened, I think the fact that it was

sexually transmitted is pretty declare. Do we know much about this

blasted thing? It feels like we are still - this is 2008, so it's been

around a while. It's been around a long time. We seem ignorant of it.

Been around since 1947 I think off the top of my head. It's caused

outbreaks in the Pacific Ocean, in Africa, in Asia and of course in

south America now. But what's changed is the scale of this

outbreak. We have seen an outbreak in Brazil, we think probably 1. 5 to

2 million people infected. We have seen it spreading through south

America to central America. This is - the virus is carried by mosquitos

and the particular mosquito that's carried it is beautifully adapted to

the 21st century and it will spread further. If it is sexually

transmitted as well, that's awful, isn't it? That's going to

particularly affect the group who are most vulnerable and need to

protect themselves most, which are women of child-bearing age or are

likely to be pregnant. The critical point is how common is the sexually

transmission? We have billions of mosquitos beautifully able to

transmit this infection and I think that is where the focus has got to

be. But as we learn more about this infection and we learn that sexual

transmission is potential then we should be humble and accept that we

don't know that much about zika and it's critical that research is done

so we learn how it's transmitted and how it causes this microcephaly in

children. The word vaccine comes in, this is a viral disease, is it

something they're going to be able to knock up in a year? Or have they

been looking at it for years and said this is a real tough nut to

crack? No, we are a long way behind F you compare, let's compare, for

instance Ebola, we were fortunate with that, there was a vaccine that

was in a freezer at the national institute of health in the United

States which many of us could work on and we got a vaccine. Within 12

months or so. That's unprecedented. We are not at that stage with zika.

We don't have a vaccine, a potential vaccine in somebody's laboratory

We don't have a vaccine, a potential freezer or in a company that we

could take it through in a year. We are not going to have a vaccine for

this in 12 months sdmrchlt we are having to start from scratch

basically? Yeah, and we have to think, this is part of a continued

pattern of the emergence of new infections for which we have no

treatment, we have no vaccine, and we are not able to fully control it.

We have to - our research agenda has got to get stronger around this.

Thank you both very much. For a long time - since before

the death of Steve Jobs - have people predicted that best days

of Apple are behind it. After such a run of good form,

a fall in fortunes is surely due. This evening, we got the latest

results of the company, which showed Apple reporting

lower-than-expected iPhone sales It's a struggle to grow

at the old pace, once And other companies can

make them just as well. Joining me from New York

is the Journalism professor and technology

commentator, Jeff Jarvis. Any clue in these

that Apple's best days are behind it? One never wants to predict that

but since the death of Steve Jobs we haven't seen any great surprise and

the sales of iPhones are now flat. There are a total of one billion

Apple devices in the world and 1. 4 billion android devices in the

world. I don't know where Apple goes next is the problem. I love my

smartphone too and I do buy them regularly but there hasn't been a

great surprise in the entire industry lately. We are not going to

have two or three each, clearly that does limit that market. Let's talk

about some of the other products around. Do you have an opinion on

the watch? Clearly the watch hasn't been a breakthrough like the tablet

and the iPad and iPhone? I have a Google watch and it's nice to have

and I enjoy it. Is it a life-changer? Absolutely not. Is it

a necessity? No. That's not going to be it. What about the car? Google

obviously are more public about what they're doing on the car. Apple

famously are secretive on it but are clearly working on a car, everyone

assumes they are. Is that going to be at some point the great new

thing? The car industry is hard, just ask the entire nation of

America how we have fared lately. There's going to be plenty of

competition. The German auto industry is hot on to this, the

Japanese auto industry will be, as well. Google has made hints. I think

the technology is going to be trying to reinvent the operating system of

the car. It's now a six-year design cycle. Apple could make a difference

there. Is that an easy business, no. Is it quick, no. Who knows. There is

a phrase that says if you are supersuccessful, ultimately, you

tend to gravitate back to average again. You have seen all these

fantastic companies in the world that have been unassailable and they

find themselves looking pretty normal. At some point Apple maybe

our expectations have to be that Apple will drift down. It will just

have to effectively become more normal as a company as time passes?

Well, you are right, it is that horrible issue of capitalism always

expecting more and more and more, like a greedy parent wanting the kid

to do better in school. So, January al's performance is amazing and

historic profit -- Apple. It cannot keep up with that level of growth

and can in the keep up without diversity. Google is now into many

areas. Apple is, I mean, Amazon rather is huge, not only in the

sales but also in the cloud. But Apple is pretty much a one-note

wonder right now which is phones and devices, it hasn't been big on

social, in the cloud, it hasn't been big on entertainment, even though

it's a huge distributor, compare to to Amazon or Netflix. They can't use

their huge cash flow to buy things. I am in the sure what I would do if

I were Cook. Thank you very much indeed.

Plenty more wind and rain in the forecast I am afraid. A messy start

to the day with strong winds across parts of England and Wales and that

will linger all day across southern counties. Improving