28/04/2016 Newsnight


In-depth investigation and analysis of the stories behind the day's headlines with Kirsty Wark. Labour's anti-semitism row erupts - the shadow cabinet responds.

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The Labour leader says it's business as usual.


That was Hitler's policy when he first came into power. I think you


have lost, Mr Livingstone. All of this is toxic.


Bradford is the city in the eye of the Labour storm after MP


Naz Shah was suspended over anti-Semitic tweets.


So what does her community make of the row?


The position she is in, it is disgusting what she said.


Because I don't blame all Israelis and all Jews for what is going


The Energy Minister tells us why she believes a Brexit


The playwright Michael Morpurgo tells us why he's not so sure.


We are not a world power as we once were.


We are a significant country in Europe.


Everyone seems to think that we're not in Europe.


We're in Europe, whether we like it or not.


You cannot move the country towards America.


And a very special performance to mark International Jazz Day.


"Much of the criticism about crisis in the party comes from those


who are nervous of the strength of the Labour Party


Those words were the Labour leader Jeremy Corbyn's considered response


to the row over anti-semitism that led him to suspend his close friend


Ken Livingstone from the party today after he invoked Adolf Hitler


as an early advocate of Zionism - a remark that led to a huge face


to face row with the Labour MP John Mann, who accused him


But Jeremy Corbyn's "crisis, what crisis" suggests that he views


the row over anti-semitism more as an attack on his leadership


Here is John Swinney. All I wanted to do was get on with some


gardening. But it was not to be. Time to apologise? Why are you being


told to apologise? Why have you brought Adolf Hitler into it? Why is


he a vote winner? How on earth did that happen? Earlier on the


breakfast show, when asked about internet posts by the now suspended


Labour MP Naz Shah... She talked about relocating Israel to America,


she talked about what Hitler did being legal and she talked about the


Jews rallying, not using the word is released... That was not


anti-Semitic? It was not, whenever Hitler won the election in 1932, his


policy was that Jews should be moved to Israel, he was supporting


Zionism. That was the breakfast show. By 11 o'clock, who was heading


for the studios at Westminster. On the way, who did he meet but a


Labour comrades. John Mann, MP. You are a Nazi apologist. Rewriting


history... By now, Sadiq Khan, the Labour candidate for his old job,


Mayor of London, had called for his suspension. If you read Mein


Kampf... When was that written? About 1924. That is anti-Semitic.


And outrageous, when he wrote that back then, why bring up this


distinction between him? This is toxic, isn't it? Journalists should


not ask those questions if you do not want me to answer them. All I


wanted to do was some gardening but because a journalist asked me the


question, I answered it... Some Labour MPs would have loved it if


you stayed and did your gardening. Do you think you should stand down


and leave the Labour Party to get on with their election that having this


weird argument about Adolf Hitler being a Zionist? We are above all of


these issues... Almost lost in all of this was another comment by Ken


Livingstone in that interview. He suggested I distinction between


anti-Semitism and racism. I lunchtime was the news that Ken


Livingstone was toast, or at least suspended from the party. Labour


suspensions over accusations of anti-Semitism these days are coming


right London buses. All at once. But Ken Livingstone is not anybody, he


scored the Jeremy Corbyn project going way back. Here he is with Hugo


Chavez in happier times. This afternoon, this from the leader.


Party membership is as big as it has been in my lifetime, 400,000


individual members, 100,000 affiliated supporters, 3 million


affiliated trade union members. It is a very big organisation and I


suspect that much of this criticism that you say about crisis in the


party comes from those who are nervous about the strength of the


Labour Party at a local level. Not everyone is convinced. Mr Corbyn


said crisis, what crisis? And this quote comes from those who are


nervous about the strength of the Labour Party at a local level. This


is about anti-Semitism, the Labour Party has always stood against


discrimination and racism and we are falling short of those principles


and ideals. In seven days, much of Britain goes to the polls. In


London, all addicts is happening in an extraordinary atmosphere. Labour


has descended into a catastrophic rise over anti-Semitism. Meanwhile,


the Conservatives are accused of stigmatising Labour's candidate,


said it can, for being who he is. For the first time in decades, the


politics of religion and identity are at play.


Well, we're joined now from Leeds by Jon Trickett,


Shadow Local Government Secretary and close friend of Jeremy Corbyn.


Good evening. You have been a member of the party for almost 50 years,


can you remember any time when Bob Dudley anti-Semitic remarks were


made by Labour MPs? Know, and this is not acceptable, I was a victim


myself of an anti-Semitic attack last year and I went to court and


the man involved was found guilty and I was absolutely astonished.


That that happened on the streets of Britain. And it is equally appalling


if anybody expresses any view inside the Labour Party which has a long


record of fighting racism and fighting anti-Semitism and we will


continue to strongly play the argument against any form of racism.


Let us clarify some points. One what is anti-Semitism and what is


anti-Israel. Ken Livingstone today, is it acceptable for him to say that


Hitler was a supporter of Zionism? I did not hear him in that interview


but the truth is, the bits that I have seen caused me to feel very


uncomfortable. The idea that we should somehow be going back to some


period in the life of Hitler when he was working with the Jewish nation


or Jewish race is ludicrous. In 2016, the problems which the nation


is facing right now, and there is a rise of anti-Semitism in the country


and the Labour Party will play a major leading role in fighting bad.


Have no doubt. Let's get another remark, racism is not the same as


anti-Semitism. Do you believe that? Anti-Semitism is racism. It is


racist. Let us be clear about this, racism has no part at all in our


country and in a progressive party like the Labour Party, this must


have a role and Jeremy Corbyn did act within moments, within a couple


of hours, after hearing those comments from Ken Livingstone,


notwithstanding the fact they have worked together for many years. He


was suspended and rightly so. He was slower when it came to Naz Shah. Her


statements... Israel should be removed to the US. Is that


anti-Semitic? It is completely unacceptable. Anti-Semitic? Of


course it is. And let me say, Naz Shah was within three hours of that


statement being brought to our attention, was off the job she was


doing... She was not suspended. Hang on. She stood down within three


hours from the job she had and asked to make an apology to the house and


she did and was then suspended. As soon as the information was


available to the party. Not one case has lasted more than 48 hours from


the moment it was brought to our attention to the point at which


action was taken. Naz Shah also said two other things... The Jews are


rallying and she also compared Zionism to Al-Qaeda. You said she


was removed from her position as PPS to John McDowall but during her


first interview she was not suspended and some time longer to


deal with Naz Shah. It took 36 hours from start to finish, everybody is


untitled two due process. This is a member of the Labour Party who


represents people in Bradford. Action was taken and it was tough,


it was straightforward and it was quick and she will have a chance,


she apologised to the house and she will have a chance to better case to


the committee. -- put her case. This is unacceptable in the modern Labour


Party and we will not tolerate that and as somebody who has been in


court recently as a victim of anti-Semitic action, let me make


this clear to everybody, I was speaking to the leadership and this


is unacceptable behaviour, these views are not part of modern Britain


and the modern Labour Party. Is there a problem on the left of


politics that eight strong anti-Israeli sentiment has crossed


into anti-Semitism is not I do not know that is the case, racism is


normally an attribute of the right-wing, in the titles you drew


attention to the anti-Muslim comments made by the Prime Minister.


You sound rather complacent. Is there a strong... Anti-Semitic


sentiment bleeding into the party? It is acceptable to have a debate


about the actions of any Israeli government, right or wrong, but when


this bleeds into anti-Semitism and racism, it is completely wrong and


that should not happen and will not be tolerated in this party and I


accept the point you are making, some people fail to make the


distinction but in doing so, if you think they are promoting the cause


of the Palestinians by adopting racist language, and attitudes


towards the Israelis, they are not, they are doing damage to the cause.


But if you have got a leader, people like Rachel Reeves, they say is


giving a slow response and we are falling short of principles are the


Labour Party, she says this is a growing problem and Jeremy Corbyn


has not responded, not just in the last couple of days but to this


problem that has been boiling away. I think boiling might be a slight


exaggeration but there is no complicity here, each case has been


dealt with immediately, Jeremy will make a series of announcements


shortly about all of this and we will continue to act in the most


vigorous way. Any sign of racism in this party will not be tolerated and


we will continue to lead the movement against racism in our


country. Jeremy Corbyn, it appeared to me, to not quite deflect the


anti-Semitism ride but talking about the influx of new members to the


party, he said that much of this criticism over anti-Semitism comes


from people who are nervous of the strength of the party at local


level. Do you really agree? I hope that nobody is using the acquisition


of anti-Semitism for factional reasons. I hope nobody is doing that


but let us be clear, whatever... But do you agree with Jeremy Corbyn that


much of this criticism being levelled at Labour over


anti-Semitism is in reality a criticism of the strength of the


party at local level? It sounds like deflection? We're not going to


tolerate any form of racism or anti-Semitism in the party and our


actions in the last few days showed this is the case, a member of the


running seat today has been dealt with and I hope this is the end of


it because people need to know that we will act with great firmness and


we will lead the anti-racist movement, as the Labour Party always


did and always will and in my own case, my grandmother was Jewish. I


remember the anti-Semitism she faced on the streets of Leeds. It looks


like it has seen a resurgence. We will not put up with this. Let's be


finally put this to you that Jeremy Corbyn is suggesting very clearly


that the criticism of the Labour Party over anti-Semitism has got its


roots in problems he says that people have with the strength of the


local Labour Party. On Newsnight last night, a rabbi and Lord Levi


were critical of the party and anti-Semitism. You really do not


think that they are concerned over the strength of Jeremy Corbyn's


Labour Party at local level? It is not something that occurred to me


that they would think and not something I believe either. What I


believe is that racism is unacceptable in our country and the


party and we will deal with it. Thank you.


Joining me in the studio is Labour MP Wes Streeting.


How disturbing is all this to you? This has been a pretty dreadful day


for the Labour Party and the latest in a string of dreadful days


concerning anti-Semitism, whether it is as we have seen in the last


couple of days actions by members of the parliamentary party, but plenty


of examples also of activists and their language, many of whom predate


the leadership of Jeremy Corbyn. When I see are leader on television


effectively saying crisis, what crisis? I think needs to talk to


some of my constituents who are telling me about the struggle they


are having with voting Labour, many who have voted Labour their entire


lives. Deeply hurtful to those who would suffer from anti-Semitism, for


Jeremy Corbyn to say they are just concerned about the strength of the


Labour Party? Absolutely, today we have had people from across the


spectrum of the Labour family speaking out against this. If it is,


as I was just saying, about the flexion, surely that is deeply


insulting? There has been an issue with the flat-footed response of the


Labour Party, that is when the issue was first on our radar as MP's as a


source of serious concern, that we were not acting quickly enough. On


the question of Ken Livingstone, the hierarchy will say he is under


investigation, but in the modern Labour Party, after what has


happened do you think there is a place Ken Livingstone? No, I would


not be sorry if he did not return. In the case of Ken Livingstone he


went out today to defend comments which Naz Shah herself did not


defend. She expressed remorse and a determination to behave differently


and will be judged by how she behaves in the future as well as the


past. But Ken Livingstone went around like a political arsonist


pouring petrol all over serious issues facing the Labour Party and


made matters worse. I don't know what he thought he was achieving and


he is on the ruling NEC, the body that supports to enforce the rule


book. How can have people have confidence the party is combating


anti-Semitism when he is behaving this way? You have said that


activists are making anti-Semitic remarks and I know you have been


looking for a readership on this? Absolutely, let's be clear, the


majority of Labour Party members will be appalled by what has


happened and it all of our responsibility to speak up to create


an environment where Jewish people and all decent minded people are


included. But Jeremy Corbyn has a reach across the left, parts of the


left weather is a problem with anti-Semitism and he is a lifelong


anti-racist so it's not just the responsibility to act, there is a


great opportunity. Jon Trickett would say he has act quickly in the


case of Ken Livingstone and reasonably quickly on Naz Shah, but


what else does he have to do? Labour members of the all-party group


against anti-Semitism offered to meet Jeremy Corbyn because I think


there are practical things we can do in terms of the Labour Party rules


and structures, to make a practical difference. We asked for that


meeting and were told it is going ahead after the elections in May but


still no date has been fixed and it reinforces the idea, and their


comments Jeremy Mincey later in the day have further fanned the flames.


-- the comments Jeremy Mincey later. A big problem for Labour, this is a


damaging issue. Absolutely. We have seen leadership from the city can,


and we should see that from the top -- from Sadiq Khan. Decent minded


conservatives have done the same but we cannot have double standards, we


had to show leadership in our own party and get our own house in


order. Thank you. This row started with


the Bradford West MP Naz Shah's social media posts suggesting Israel


should be moved to America, for which, at first,


Jeremy Corbyn saw no reason to suspend her - a decision


he reversed later yesterday. Naz Shah made a fulsome apology


to the Commons but her actions have opened a Pandora's Box


out of which jumped - as we've discussed - Ken Livingstone


in spectacular fashion. So what is the reaction in her home


town, where she made Secunder Kermani spent the day


in the city of Bradford. The pews in what is now Bradford 's


only synagogue used to be fooled. Now it has a congregation of just


over a dozen. But when it was in danger of closing it was the local


Muslim community who stepped in to save it. There is even an Muslim


only synagogue council. So far as we know... This man who fled Nattie


Germany in the 1930s is the chair of the synagogue. -- Nattie Germany.


Naz Shah has visited twice and he says he is confident she is not


anti-Semitic. Had you seen people being hostile to Jews because of the


row lace -- Air Race and a legend and what is happening in Palestine?


There is some confusion but there should not be, which I have alluded


to before, the two are separate. Sometimes they merge, but they


should not be confused. Do you think Naz Shah was one of those people who


was confusing the issues? Maybe in 2014 when she made these do Robert


Guerrero marks but nowadays she is as entitled to criticise Israel as


anyone else. But she's not anti-Semitic. Bradford West has one


of the largest populations of British Pakistanis of any


parliamentary seat and many people here the Israel Palestine conflict


is a big issue. When George Galloway was MP he even controversially


declared the city and Israel free zone. Some people think the zero


Shah is being and thoroughly criticised and others have said she


should have stood her ground. But these local voters we spoke to


thought she was right to have been suspended. I at 22 at the time would


not have made any comment about needing to be relocated regardless


of how emotional I was so I think it's possible to differentiate and


the anti-Zionist and not anti-Semitic. Boris Johnson said bad


stuff about black people, that's not been noticed or brought up. It has


been brushed aside. Maybe because she is Muslim, maybe because she is


an Asian MP from Bradford. She has not helped calls herself. Do you


think some people here think good for her, she spoke up in favour of


the Palestinians were not many other politicians are? Yes, she spoke up


for them which is all good, I am in favour of everyone who speaks up for


them because they need a voice to be heard but it is the manner of how


you speak up. Like anything in life, it is the manner of doing it, it is


not about blowing it out, whatever comes into your head. We have told


her comments were flagged up to the media by disgruntled local rivals


but they have become part of a very national issue for Labour.


Scotland's Parliamentary elections next week look likely to return


another SNP majority in an electoral system that was designed to prevent


single party government in the Scottish Parliament.


And the latest Ipsos Mori poll for Scottish Television


suggests that Labour, once unassailable, could come third


behind the Conservatives in what would be their worst showing


for more than a century, when the Labour Party


So what are the lessons of political history in Scotland that


explain massive shifts in political popularity?


And if the SNP are the new establishment,


Here's our political editor, David Grossman.


The physical landscape of Scotland is reassuringly familiar.


But in politics, it's hard to find a recognisable landmark


The tectonic plates of Scottish politics have shifted.


How long they have shifted for, I think for generations it


George Square, Glasgow, scene of celebration,


rally and protest during the independence


Overseeing it all, the seagull-spattered statue


of a former colossus of Scottish and British politics.


His party once took 85% of the vote in Scotland, although on a very


Today, like Ozymandias, the Empire has weathered to dust.


When Gladstone was Prime Minister and, incidentally, an MP


for a Scottish constituency, you could say without a shadow


of a doubt that the Liberal Party were the political


In the '90s and 2000s, Gordon Brown had rather taken


on the Gladstonian role and Labour was utterly dominant.


Are they the new political establishment in Scotland?


That certainly is how the other parties want to portray them.


There is no doubt that the SNP are the new Scottish establishment.


And what is worse is that they are conservatively cautious with it.


And I think that is depressing for a party that claims to be


Because their only goal, ultimately, is independence,


they are keeping things smooth and safe so they can get that


independence and I think that is not good enough for Scotland.


I want Scotland to be the best again.


They should want that because they say they


So what has caused these huge and, so far, lasting


One theory is that voters gravitate towards whoever is seen to best


express a distinctive Scottish identity.


And that has taken a few forms over the years, but now, of course,


the standard manifestation is that Scots are more left-wing


than those in England, more egalitarian, more caring,


more concerned with social justice and less interested


in lining their own pockets and big business.


And there are elements in truth in all of that but a lot


Nevertheless, the SNP own that view of how the majority of Scots


Labour used to have that and before them it was the Unionist and before


And whoever captures the sense of Scottishness,


that sense of self, tends to do well in political terms.


This shift has had a profound impact on the other parties, too.


The Scottish Conservatives were once led, in turn,


by a privately educated tax lawyer and an elder


In a million years, they would never have tried this.


Or perhaps arranging to meet journalists in a pub at 11am,


but Ruth Davidson is clearly a very different type of


Not to be First Minister but to lead an effective opposition


I think fundamentally they come from quite a similar


ideological space, of course there is the nationalist-unionist


divide, although the Labour Party seems to be going a little bit


softer on the union, they have lost their


But in terms of their ideology, actually it is somewhat similar.


In the time I have been in the Scottish Parliament,


I cannot count the number of bills and legislation that I have seen


being put through and I have seen the Labour Party's attempt


at opposition amount pretty much to grumbling a bit


from the sidelines and then voting for it anyway.


And that is not really asking people, it is not challenging


or having a debate, it is not having scrutiny.


And that is why the SNP have been given a bit of a free ride.


Whilst the Conservatives and Liberal Democrats have


had time to get used to political marginality,


Labour is still showing the signs of a party in shock.


Last May, a forest of 40 Labour MPs was felled, leaving


Iain Murray is the only Labour MP in Scotland.


Is it going to be a quick fix to get Labour back where it was,


I don't think it is a quick fix, the Scottish Labour Party has had


And it is not going to be fixed in one election or in six months,


it is a long-term project, Kezia Dugdale has stated


In fact, our manifesto is a manifesto for the long-term,


it is not just looking at the elections next Thursday,


it is not just looking to 2020, 2021, it is looking to where


What do we need to compete in the world?


Because if we don't analyse what we need to compete


in the world and we don't deal with that and use the powers


of the Scottish Parliament to deliver that, then we will be


left behind and we cannot afford for that to happen.


And where does all this leave the SNP?


Despite their dominance, they still reject the title "establishment".


Where we have separated ourselves out from the


People believe that the establishment in the UK Parliament,


for example, they have a terrible track record when it


came to the expenses scandal, we saw that.


When it has come to the recently released Panama Papers,


we have seen how members of the establishment have been...


Their friends and themselves have been involved in evading tax


Up here in Scotland, if you take the Scottish Parliament


as an example, and the Scottish government and the SNP,


we were not embroiled in the scandal, the Panama accounts


have not shown any connections because there aren't connections


Nevertheless, since the General Election,


two SNP MPs have lost the party whip while allegations of financial


If the polls are even within a Royal mile of being accurate,


the SNP looks set to continue its amazing dominance


In the EU referendum arguments on the economy,


the voices shouting loudest so far have been warning about the adverse


impact of a Brexit - the latest being the Chancellor's


insistence that leaving the EU would slow growth and do permanent


But today a group of economists have produced a report -


a sort of Eight Horsemen against the Apocalypse -


The eight economists claim that in, in fact, the UK economy


would be boosted by 4% if we were outside the EU.


Their report argues we wouldn't even need a new trade agreement


because 70% of our exports are traded under World Trade


The eight economists say the report is designed to dispel


the exaggerated claims and threats whipped up by Project Fear.


They argue that the benefits of the EU single market have been


greatly oversold and the downside of belonging is that you must apply


all its rules and conditions throughout the whole economy.


So although only 12% of our GDP is directly accounted


for by exports to the EU, the 88% that is not must obey


A Brexit, they say, would lead to a 2% improvement in output


The economists claim that consumer prices would fall by about 8%.


Their argument being that the EU is a customs union and as such it


artificially inflates the prices of agricultural


and manufacturing goods, which hurts UK households.


They forecast that if the UK remains in the EU, GDP growth


By comparison, a post-Brexit reality, they predict,


The economists concede short-term uncertainty but insist that this


would be outweighed by the long-term benefits of becoming


Joining me now is Andrea Leadsom, who is the Minister of State


at the Department of Energy and Climate Change.


She didn't write today's report, but she firmly believes the UK


Given all of the following wind for staying inside, presumably this is


music to your ears? It is great to see an alternative view and as I


have said, it is very difficult to gaze into the crystal ball even to


next month, 15 years, as economists are trying, but it is important to


show there is another side to this argument. We will go on to whether


or not the figures mean anything but when it comes to the arguments for


staying within the EU or leaving, the document suggests that no flight


of global situations, but if you look at HSBC, Standard Chartered,


none of them at all will give any fall for leaving. HSBC have just on


their periodic review of where they should face their business and have


decided to stay in London. Looking at merging with the London Stock


Exchange, they know there is a referendum coming up so you have to


follow the money and not just look at the rhetoric. Let us look at some


figures, the document is full of productions that we would be better


off if we left. He would be more competitive, GDP would grow, we


would be more productive and so forth. That is one set of figures,


and yet leave EU were very keen to rubbish the Chancellor when he said


that if we left the EU, we would be ?4300 per head worse off. What do


you think? Well, that figure, the Treasury figure, assumes that the


UK, if we leave the EU, pulls up the drawbridge, does no more trade and


gets a very basic trade agreement with the EU and as a result, of our


failure to do any International Trade, productivity will decline and


that is where you get that number from. It just does not stack up.


We're in a situation where this document is stuffed full of figures


saying we would be better to go and those wanting to remain give just as


much. You are rubbishing the Chancellor? It is very difficult for


economists to look at next month let alone in 15 years and all I would


say about this, this is not a document, they are eight different


essays on an aspect of leaving the EU, incredibly eminent economists


with a very valid view and they think there would be a benefit


economically to leaving the European Union. I am not just justify their


opinion but we have to look at the big picture, how could the UK


survive outside? Remain say they have the OECD, the US Treasury, the


CBI, Barack Obama, stacked up against them? Well, there is a very


big visitation of gaining up against the poor British voter but if you


look at life from the point of view of the British voter, the British


voter actually is in a situation where if you are trying to get a


good school plays or a doctor 's appointment or onto housing ladder,


there is an overwhelming and uncontrollable goblin of too many


people which is a direct result of being in the EU. This is about


immigration as well? It is about a number of factors but I am talking


about the fact that international institutions and other politicians


do not have skin in this game, those who do are the British public, who


will be voting. In terms of productivity and GDP growth, what


these economists say is that if we were outside the EU, we would not


have the free movement of EU citizens and we could cherry pick


the cream of the immigrants who wanted to come. The same number of


immigrants, but it would give us a broader range of abilities. Do you


agree? I think immigration is a good thing up to a point but the problem


we have is when it is uncontrolled and puts enormous pressure on UK


public services then it is a problem. The other impact, is to put


wages down for British workers and therein lies the problem, a certain


amount of immigration is good but those immigrants need to be people


who can contribute to this economy. By and large, the immigration within


the European Union has been good for the country because they come and


want to work very hard. The report from the Bank of England last year


said that the wave of new people coming into the country has put down


wages for the lower paid. Do you think that Britain should come out


of the single market? I certainly think that Britain has the most


amazing future ahead of us if we leave. We're not a tiny country, by


the world's fifth biggest economy with the best contract law in the


world, part of the Commonwealth of 2.5 billion consumers and we have


the least corrupt judicial system in the world and some of the best


universities... Should become the single market? Almost certainly that


would be the case. Not like Norway and Switzerland? Norway has a


publishing of 6 million people and is largely goods traded and Iceland,


they have a proposition of 300,000, very good than Northampton. We would


operate on WTO rules? We would have a UK solution and there will be


something that is discussed once we get to the other side. Barack Obama


says we would be at the end of the queue for any kind of trade deal


were not having to deal with 500 million? Even the day after,


officials from the US Department had said there is no such thing as any


queue for international trade deals and anyway, the US does not have


many of them on the go and let us not forget that we have been in the


EU for 43 years, we are the biggest foreign direct investor for the US


and restore free trade agreement with the USA Today and there is no


reason to think if we did not keep one would not be perfectly in line


with countries like a man. If you do not leave that we need to operate


under WTO rules, you don't actually have any blueprint in how we could


deal with International Trade? We would have a British option, we


would immediately go from being a member of the EU to being the


biggest trading partner, it would be absolutely in their interests and


our own interests and we have been aligning our rules with their heirs


for 43 years, it would be very easy to negotiate, offensive free-trade.


Thank you very much indeed. In the run-up to the EU referendum,


Newsnight is inviting a number of public figures in the UK to tell


us their thoughts on the EU, whether they are passionate


advocates for Remain Tonight, the author and playwright,


and the man who wrote I think what we are in the process


of doing is finding a new place for ourselves in the world


and we have not quite found it. Europe has been, if you like,


our resting place for some time now But we are, I think, as a people,


uncomfortable being one We are not a world


power as we once were. We are a significant


country in Europe. Everyone seems to think that


we're not in Europe. There is the Channel between us


but we are in Europe, We cannot move the country towards


America. But in a way, we are,


to some extent, going back I think it has been


disappointing, the re-negotiation. Not necessarily because of


what David Cameron has or has not But because of the kind


of threat that it came with. It seems to me that when you go


into discussions with friends, you don't begin it by saying,


if I don't get what I want out of this discussion, I am leaving,


and I'll through my toys out We don't need to talk


to our friends that way. The creation of fear


and the uncertainty of it is being whipped up by one side


and by the other. And it seems to me that they're


missing the point I tend to be the kind of person


who listens to one side of it And then I hear the other side


and I think that's right. But they don't know any more


than I do. And I do know my history,


I do know we have been at peace for all these years and that has


something to do with the EU. This is not a club that I think


we should leave without thinking That's just about


all from us tonight. But we've just enough time for some


music in celebration The all-star Human Revolution


Orchestra will be performing An Ode to the Human Spirit


at London's Shaw Theatre on Saturday The acclaimed jazz guitarist


Hugh Burns is here to give us We are days away from the start of


me but this spring weather will continue. Low pressure bringing


further outbreaks of rain, sleet and hill snow to the northern half of


the country in particular and Northern Ireland getting


In-depth investigation and analysis of the stories behind the day's headlines with Kirsty Wark. Labour's anti-semitism row erupts - the shadow cabinet responds. Would Brexit hit the UK economy? Plus author Michael Morpurgo and live jazz.

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