Life After Brexit: A Newsnight Special Newsnight


Life After Brexit: A Newsnight Special

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Day two of Brexit Britain - how are you feeling?

:00:00.:00:08.

We're live in Westminster for a Newsnight Special,

:00:09.:00:11.

as Britain and Europe start working out how exactly this conscious

:00:12.:00:14.

uncoupling will proceed, and what Brexit actually means.

:00:15.:00:20.

When will the British government formally declare its

:00:21.:00:28.

And what sort of relationship does it want with the EU in future?

:00:29.:00:32.

And they are getting increasingly impatient.

:00:33.:00:34.

From the Conservative shires to Labour's Northern heartlands,

:00:35.:00:42.

they voted out but who are the Brexiteers and what do they want?

:00:43.:00:46.

Boston in Lincolnshire voted 80-20 to leave the EU.

:00:47.:00:49.

Lambeth in London voted 80-20 to remain in the EU.

:00:50.:00:52.

How did we get such a divided country and what is going

:00:53.:00:55.

We voted to leave the EU yesterday, so should we get a move on?

:00:56.:01:08.

Or should we take a bit of time to pause and think?

:01:09.:01:11.

The British Commissioner in Brussels, one of the most senior

:01:12.:01:15.

figures there, Lord Hill, he's got a move on by resigning.

:01:16.:01:17.

But British policy is to slow things down.

:01:18.:01:22.

We need a new Prime Minister, for a start.

:01:23.:01:24.

Even the official Leave campaign, so keen to get us out, wants time.

:01:25.:01:31.

But many European counterparts want things to get going,

:01:32.:01:34.

thinking we've voted out, so go now, go, walk out the door...

:01:35.:01:37.

But can they force us to rush things?

:01:38.:01:41.

It all comes back to the magic of Article 50.

:01:42.:01:44.

Our political editor Nick Watt is with me.

:01:45.:01:51.

A little refresher on article 50. That is the formal mechanism in the

:01:52.:01:57.

Lisbon Treaty that allows a member state to leave the European Union.

:01:58.:02:01.

Throughout the referendum, Vote Leave said the initiative lies with

:02:02.:02:05.

the member state to trigger it and David Cameron has said he's not

:02:06.:02:08.

going to do it, he will leave it to his successor as Prime Minister so

:02:09.:02:11.

that means the earliest it could be triggered by the UK will be October.

:02:12.:02:17.

The European Council has issued a statement about which backed that up

:02:18.:02:20.

at one level, saying it is the initiative of the member state to

:02:21.:02:24.

trigger it but it then says, get a move on. You have some intelligence

:02:25.:02:27.

on what some of the member states are telling us about this. It's

:02:28.:02:32.

pretty clear Angela Merkel is sympathetic to the slight pause but

:02:33.:02:34.

what I'm hearing is that member states are saying to Britain, it

:02:35.:02:38.

needs to be triggered by the end of the year and the reason for that is

:02:39.:02:48.

they want the negotiations concluded by the end of 2018 because in 2019,

:02:49.:02:51.

the leadership of all the European institutions changes so they need to

:02:52.:02:54.

turn their mind to that. But there is a second thing and to understand

:02:55.:02:56.

this, perhaps we should look at the wording of article 50. The second

:02:57.:03:03.

sentence of article 50,000:. -- 50 said. The key word is "Shall". Vote

:03:04.:03:13.

Leave says that means we will decide whether to do it but what we are

:03:14.:03:16.

hearing from some member states is that it implies in law and

:03:17.:03:22.

obligation, and obligation to notify and if you don't notify, then

:03:23.:03:27.

perhaps you could be in breach of Article 50 and we might give you a

:03:28.:03:33.

prod. So they might try to invoke or initiated themselves. Why does it

:03:34.:03:36.

matter quite as much as everyone thinks it does that we try to delay

:03:37.:03:42.

or slow down the Article 50 business? The reason why Vote Leave

:03:43.:03:45.

is like to delay is because once you have invoked it, you have very few

:03:46.:03:50.

cards to play. Because what would happen when you do that is that the

:03:51.:03:55.

remaining 27 member states amongst themselves, without the UK, would

:03:56.:03:58.

agree what is called a negotiating mandate. They would probably hand

:03:59.:04:01.

that to the European Commission to negotiate with us. That then has to

:04:02.:04:07.

be agreed within two years and you can only extend it if every member

:04:08.:04:12.

state agrees to do so. If it doesn't happen, the guillotine comes down

:04:13.:04:16.

after two years. And you leave on the most neutral terms which may not

:04:17.:04:19.

be the most favourable. Thank you for joining us.

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Well a key requirement of sorting out the separation arrangements

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is that we know what relationship we want instead,

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but also that Europe knows what it wants our relationship to be.

:04:27.:04:29.

On that latter point, our diplomatic editor Mark Urban

:04:30.:04:31.

It's just that many people can't work out in exactly which direction.

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And in a city renowned for its addiction to waffle,

:04:50.:04:53.

even the best minds are grappling with new realities,

:04:54.:04:56.

like how on earth Article 50 will work.

:04:57.:05:00.

is also the expert's guide to Article 50,

:05:01.:05:03.

It is obviously drafted to give the EU a negotiating advantage.

:05:04.:05:10.

If no agreement is made in those two years, then

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It can only be extended by unanimous agreement

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So there is a big disadvantage to the leaving country

:05:23.:05:27.

the resignation of Britain's top EU official today.

:05:28.:05:36.

He felt the referendum result had made his position untenable.

:05:37.:05:40.

as the decision in the British referendum takes place,

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actions have consequences, and I think that it's not possible

:05:47.:05:49.

You have to listen to the will of the British people

:05:50.:05:53.

The process of agreeing a common European response got under way

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with the foreign ministers of the six founding EU states

:06:00.:06:02.

On Monday, Donald Tusk, who chairs the union's Council,

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will go first to Paris for talks with Francois Hollande,

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and then to Berlin to see Chancellor Merkel.

:06:15.:06:17.

He will try to forge a common approach for a European summit

:06:18.:06:20.

in Brussels on Tuesday, where David Cameron will be present

:06:21.:06:22.

to give the British view of the way ahead.

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And then on Wednesday, he'll be left out

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of the discussion as the other 27 seek their way forward.

:06:30.:06:35.

Today's Berlin meeting urged a Brexit as quickly as possible.

:06:36.:06:40.

But the Germans are also saying that there can be some time before

:06:41.:06:44.

the leaving process formally starts, and that the UK does have choices

:06:45.:06:48.

We will deal with all the countries in an equal way.

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It means there should be no revenge, no punishing.

:06:57.:07:02.

And it means with solutions like the Norwegian solution,

:07:03.:07:08.

you have to fulfil the obligation, as everyone else.

:07:09.:07:12.

The question is, how long will it take to negotiate

:07:13.:07:16.

My intuition, for what it's worth, is that it might take much longer

:07:17.:07:28.

than both sides either wish or expect.

:07:29.:07:35.

So to Churchill's bar to consider the new rules,

:07:36.:07:37.

while Wales and Northern Ireland jockeyed for advantage.

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The EU now wants Britain to say what kind of deal it wants,

:07:42.:07:44.

whether it's willing to play by single market regulations

:07:45.:07:49.

and European leaders want the negotiation

:07:50.:07:54.

I'm joined now by the Ukip MP Douglas Carswell.

:07:55.:08:03.

Good evening. Thank you for joining us. Are you in the camp who want to

:08:04.:08:09.

delay a very long time to invoke article 50 or do you think we should

:08:10.:08:14.

get on with it? We want to get this right, act in good faith and do what

:08:15.:08:17.

is right for ourselves and our neighbours and build the new

:08:18.:08:21.

consensus in the country. That means there's absolutely no need to rush

:08:22.:08:25.

into this. There are two or three things we need to get right first.

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We need the right people overseeing the process. The old mandarins who

:08:31.:08:33.

got us into this mess can't be trusted, you've got our people like

:08:34.:08:35.

Michael Gove, Chris Grayling and Daniel Hannan overseeing the

:08:36.:08:39.

process. Then we need to informally work out the outline of a deal. But

:08:40.:08:44.

we do that after we invoke Article 50? I mean, we have to get a Prime

:08:45.:08:50.

Minister before we invoke it but you are not suggesting we get the

:08:51.:08:54.

outline of a deal before we invoke it? I think there are important

:08:55.:08:57.

things that need to be discussed before we invoke article 50? What's

:08:58.:09:03.

wrong with invoking it quickly and starting the negotiations? It is a

:09:04.:09:07.

stopwatch and once you press it, you have 24 months. Why rush it? We've

:09:08.:09:12.

waited 40 years to get it right, why give ourselves an artificial

:09:13.:09:17.

deadline? It is a deadline, we were told before the referendum it was

:09:18.:09:20.

going to be dead easy, there's not going to be a problem negotiating

:09:21.:09:25.

because they want to do it. I think it is fairly straightforward and the

:09:26.:09:28.

noises from Angela Merkel were very encouraging but it's important to

:09:29.:09:31.

get this absolutely right. We want to be good friends and neighbours.

:09:32.:09:35.

We should be invoking it by the end of the year. We can't leave them

:09:36.:09:40.

waiting so we can all agree on that? Yes. But the model of what we're

:09:41.:09:44.

going to a mat or what you would like us to a mat, when you think

:09:45.:09:47.

about what that model is, there seems to be some disagreement or

:09:48.:09:52.

differences of opinion amongst the Leave camp over what it should be.

:09:53.:09:56.

Do you think an association agreement, let's call it something

:09:57.:10:01.

half out rather than fully outcome is that acceptable? Leave means

:10:02.:10:07.

leave. No EU institutional court will have jurisdiction. We will

:10:08.:10:10.

decide for ourselves the nature of our relationship but having said

:10:11.:10:14.

that, we are not in the business of closing our borders. For example, we

:10:15.:10:18.

would decide our migration policy. It would be for us to make those

:10:19.:10:23.

decisions. But how we decide it and what those decisions would be for a

:10:24.:10:28.

future government and party. So you would not be one of those who would

:10:29.:10:33.

rule out the single market, for example? Absolutely, we must rule

:10:34.:10:36.

out the single market. We want access to the single market

:10:37.:10:40.

obviously but we must not be part of the single market and subject to the

:10:41.:10:44.

jurisdiction. -- subject to the jurisdiction for a simple reason,

:10:45.:10:47.

there are many businesses you don't sell to the single market so why

:10:48.:10:51.

should they comply with the rules? And free movement, I'm wondering

:10:52.:10:54.

whether you think and interpret the vote of the referendum as a vote

:10:55.:10:59.

that says, free movement absolutely have to go, so anyone who suggested

:11:00.:11:02.

a deal with Europe that maintain free movement... There will be an

:11:03.:11:08.

end to unrestricted free movement. The precise nature of those

:11:09.:11:11.

restrictions is for a future government and future Parliament to

:11:12.:11:15.

decide but it will be weak, Britain who make those decisions. Is there

:11:16.:11:18.

some wriggle room on this because Daniel Hannan was talking about free

:11:19.:11:23.

movement to an extent full stop there will be restrictions on free

:11:24.:11:26.

movement but a future Parliament and British government, like in Austria,

:11:27.:11:30.

will decide the nature of those restrictions. You are a great

:11:31.:11:33.

believer in Parliamentary sovereignty and its imported you.

:11:34.:11:36.

What do MPs do, when they see there is about to come out but they

:11:37.:11:40.

believe, and many of them do, I think would be an option which keeps

:11:41.:11:44.

us in the single market and perhaps even keeps free movement if that is

:11:45.:11:47.

the price of being in the single market. Do MPs have to say that it

:11:48.:11:53.

has been voted against or not? Vote Leave was very clear, we want to

:11:54.:11:56.

leave the single market. If we remain part of it, of course we want

:11:57.:12:00.

access to it but if we remain part of it, that is not leaving. If we

:12:01.:12:04.

remain part of the single market... That is staying. So MPs are not

:12:05.:12:09.

entitled in your view to come to their own view about what the

:12:10.:12:13.

referendum means? Leave must mean leave but when we leave, we want to

:12:14.:12:17.

do it in a way that is constructive. We did not ask the public whether

:12:18.:12:20.

what they wanted the Norway option or the Swiss option or the Turkish

:12:21.:12:25.

option. With respect, no one in Vote Leave ever talked about those, you

:12:26.:12:28.

did but we never talked about the Norway, or Swiss model, Weise wanted

:12:29.:12:33.

a British model in the interest of Britain and we can get that. What is

:12:34.:12:38.

to stop MPs saying that Arrington on, which may not be the same yours

:12:39.:12:42.

-- as yours, that in the single market and out of the EU is

:12:43.:12:45.

consistent with what people want? Political elites don't like people

:12:46.:12:49.

deciding these things and there will always be some in the western

:12:50.:12:52.

instability want to do that but the point of the referendum if it gives

:12:53.:12:56.

a democratic mandate to Vote Leave for change. And the Norway option is

:12:57.:12:59.

not consistent with what we've does voted on in your view? With respect,

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Vote Leave has never talked about it. Just a quick... Nigel Farage

:13:04.:13:10.

does not have a place in the committee to Vote Leave getting

:13:11.:13:13.

together to think about some of these issues but should he have?

:13:14.:13:17.

Nigel made a conscious choice not to be part of Vote Leave and I think

:13:18.:13:20.

it's only right and fair we take into account the fact that 48% of

:13:21.:13:24.

people in this country voted to remain. We need to find the right

:13:25.:13:30.

and considerate return. Only 37% of people voted for my party at the

:13:31.:13:34.

last general election. --... Only a certain percentage of people. This

:13:35.:13:42.

will be led by... This will be led by Vote Leave's leadership and we

:13:43.:13:47.

have a dumb right to make this happen. Thank you for joining us.

:13:48.:13:49.

Well, it might matter in all of this what the people of Britain want.

:13:50.:13:52.

We have asked them one question in the referendum, about EU

:13:53.:13:55.

membership, but we didn't drill down into the details about what exactly

:13:56.:13:58.

Would people prefer right out, half out or what?

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We asked Katie Razzall to go and find out.

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Just after 7am, if you are just waking up and joining us, you are

:14:07.:14:13.

waking up to a different country. The UK has voted to leave the EU.

:14:14.:14:19.

It's a new dawn and a time of questions about the people who voted

:14:20.:14:22.

for Brexit and what they actually want. Tremendous news for the

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industry. Marvellous. In North Tyneside yesterday morning, euphoria

:14:31.:14:34.

at the quayside, in a place where a dozen or so fishing boats still

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operate. It's a great day for myself, waking up this morning in

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Great Britain, to see that we have got our independence back. At the

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North Shields Fish market, these traders of course see the EU as the

:14:49.:14:52.

source of the industry's woes but their votes were about far more. The

:14:53.:14:57.

people have spoken, they just wanted a change, out against the

:14:58.:15:01.

government, the bankers, whatever you want to call it, legislation in

:15:02.:15:05.

Brussels and everything, people have just had enough. The north-east

:15:06.:15:09.

think the Brexit message loud and clear, inequality, the threat from

:15:10.:15:12.

globalisation, alienation from Westminster all played their part.

:15:13.:15:18.

They have misunderstood the working classes. It's OK for them to listen

:15:19.:15:22.

to the banker than all the people in London but the governor should have

:15:23.:15:25.

sat up and is in before now, before it got to the stage. How they move

:15:26.:15:29.

forward, I'm really unsure. The ferry between North and South

:15:30.:15:32.

Shields is a regular commute but these are not regular times. To help

:15:33.:15:36.

this great country succeed, thank you very much. The Prime Minister

:15:37.:15:44.

has resigned. From people who voted in, and there were some, fear about

:15:45.:15:48.

what the future holds. People like me are very scared. It's a huge

:15:49.:15:52.

gamble. You don't know what out there. We need concrete facts, which

:15:53.:15:56.

we are not going to get. But here, even those who voted out did not

:15:57.:16:00.

have clear ideas about the next steps. For England to be England

:16:01.:16:04.

again, to do our own thing, to control our own money. I don't know

:16:05.:16:10.

exactly what was going to happen if we voted out or in. So you decided

:16:11.:16:15.

to take the risk? I thought it was better than sitting there and

:16:16.:16:18.

wishing things would change. At least you are doing something about

:16:19.:16:23.

it. Change is perhaps a big ask in a deprived region which are set so

:16:24.:16:27.

much store by this vote. Remain as Slate central pledges made by Brexit

:16:28.:16:30.

politicians during the campaign are now being rolled back from. On NHS

:16:31.:16:33.

spending and getting immigration down. This former city trader

:16:34.:16:38.

invests in north-east charities. I do feel that there wasn't element of

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a conflict in this way, that if I'm crude, generally, some rich, white

:16:46.:16:48.

men got sections of the population to go with them on a journey that

:16:49.:16:53.

would not benefit the population, that would benefit the careers of

:16:54.:16:59.

the rich, white men. I think that time will bear me out. So much of

:17:00.:17:04.

England voted out, from the once proud industrial heartlands and

:17:05.:17:09.

places like South Shields, all the way to the Conservative shires. This

:17:10.:17:13.

was a union of voters that has changed the face of Britain. Hello!

:17:14.:17:22.

Welcome to a new era. That is how you are feeling? Positive? Yes, very

:17:23.:17:28.

positive. Feeling happy? I really am, actually. Nice that someone

:17:29.:17:32.

wants to talk to us because our grandchildren don't. They are not

:17:33.:17:37.

happy with you? 250 miles from North Shields, Miles and Juliet McNair are

:17:38.:17:41.

unlikely bedfellows with the Tyneside Brexiteers. Now we are

:17:42.:17:45.

going out, what was it you voted for, what did you want? Above all,

:17:46.:17:54.

to regain our own sovereignty. That was the absolute main and prime

:17:55.:17:59.

reason. Independence, really. What do you want them to negotiate? What

:18:00.:18:04.

are your lines in the sand? Sovereignty as in running our own

:18:05.:18:09.

laws? Absolutely. Control of our borders and immigration? Yes... In a

:18:10.:18:16.

modified form. You might accept the Norwegian model, freedom of movement

:18:17.:18:22.

with an emergency brake? Yes... A basic British sense of tolerance

:18:23.:18:28.

should apply, here. In their Warwickshire constituency, the

:18:29.:18:31.

majority voted out. If they don't bring down immigration, will that be

:18:32.:18:35.

a problem for you as someone who voted out? I think it will because

:18:36.:18:41.

there is that option as well. We are full. It's not a racist thing. We

:18:42.:18:47.

are full. I did not actually vote for immigration, to be honest. That

:18:48.:18:51.

was not my first motivation to vote. I know everyone talks about it but

:18:52.:18:53.

that was not the real reason. As well as dealing with the EU,

:18:54.:19:05.

politics at home is heating up. In the Tory leadership race,

:19:06.:19:10.

the forces are lining up for and against the bookies'

:19:11.:19:13.

favourite, Boris Johnson. For the moment, Boris Johnson

:19:14.:19:26.

appears to have the Conservative Party in his hands. He is no doubt

:19:27.:19:32.

hoping the gods, who have a way of reminding me mortals who is in

:19:33.:19:42.

charge, will be on his side. Amid the continuing fallout from the

:19:43.:19:46.

referendum, business at Westminster has all but ground to a halt. Behind

:19:47.:19:51.

the scenes, Tory MPs are calculating whether Boris is unbeatable in the

:19:52.:19:54.

leadership contest which will be under way within a week. The

:19:55.:20:01.

remainder is, as the pro-European Tories call themselves, of meeting

:20:02.:20:07.

to discuss their tactics. Newsnight has realised there is a realisation

:20:08.:20:11.

in the George Osborne camp that he will struggle to gain traction

:20:12.:20:15.

because he is so closely associated with a failed Prime Minister. Shares

:20:16.:20:18.

in the energy and time change Secretary Amber Rudd are one of the

:20:19.:20:23.

few things that are performing well at the moment, but her allies know

:20:24.:20:27.

it will be a tall order to beat Johnson, who is campaigning was seen

:20:28.:20:30.

to have added 2% to Brexit numbers in the referendum. It was not

:20:31.:20:37.

difficult to detect the weary mood in the Remain camp, as the Prime

:20:38.:20:40.

Minister discharged his duties on Armed Forces Day. Some on his side

:20:41.:20:48.

who lament the political forces which ejected him from office say

:20:49.:20:54.

the next leader must be a healer. In my view, a great Prime Minister

:20:55.:20:59.

leading a great and reforming administration, mainstream,

:21:00.:21:00.

conservative one-nation reform has been taken out at the knees by the

:21:01.:21:05.

savagery of this bill is a good earthquake. And in choosing a

:21:06.:21:08.

replacement for David Cameron, we have to pick not just a person, but

:21:09.:21:12.

I think we need to develop a programme that brings the party

:21:13.:21:16.

together but more importantly brings the country together, that speaks

:21:17.:21:20.

not just to the 52 voted to leave the European Union, but the 48

:21:21.:21:23.

wanted to be part of a forward-looking and global Britain.

:21:24.:21:28.

It is your fault, Jeremy! When are you resigning? It is your fault!

:21:29.:21:35.

Labour is facing its own bout of soul-searching after Jeremy Corbyn's

:21:36.:21:39.

underpowered performance in the referendum campaign. A rather

:21:40.:21:43.

different reception awaited Labour's most senior elected official at the

:21:44.:21:46.

Pride rally, as he said London should fight hard to maintain core

:21:47.:21:50.

aspects of Britain's EU relationship. What is clear from the

:21:51.:21:55.

results on Thursday was that London was the only region in England to

:21:56.:21:59.

vote too Remain in the EU, overwhelmingly so. It is also clear

:22:00.:22:03.

to me that London is a powerhouse for our country. The idea that

:22:04.:22:06.

London would not be around the table is ridiculous. The current and

:22:07.:22:11.

future Prime Minister needs to make sure we have a seat around the

:22:12.:22:15.

table. We have to make sure we are inside the room when it comes to

:22:16.:22:17.

doing a deal with the European Union. The Prime Minister was a

:22:18.:22:21.

spectator today as the Red Arrows marked ardent forces day -- Armed

:22:22.:22:30.

Forces day. He will be an onlooker again shortly.

:22:31.:22:33.

I'm now joined by Conservative MP Robert Halfon.

:22:34.:22:40.

You are sometimes called the minister for blue-collar Tories. How

:22:41.:22:45.

is your party going to reconnect with those blue-collar Tories?

:22:46.:22:48.

Nobody seems to be connecting with them well at the moment. I think we

:22:49.:22:52.

have a major challenge. We need to reconnect with the millions of

:22:53.:22:55.

working class voters who have left the Labour Party, which is a huge

:22:56.:22:59.

challenge for them as well. We need to reconnect with the people who

:23:00.:23:03.

have voted to Remain, the 48%. And we need to reunify the party. In

:23:04.:23:07.

terms of working people, we have started on the road with the

:23:08.:23:10.

national living wage, with apprentices and creating jobs, but

:23:11.:23:13.

we need to do more. We need to deal with poverty, compassionate

:23:14.:23:17.

conservatism at the heart of conservatism. That is a huge

:23:18.:23:22.

challenge. Obviously, this is going to be a debate in the leadership

:23:23.:23:28.

election, but one would have to wonder whether going from one white

:23:29.:23:33.

it to another white Italian is going to cut it. No one has ever said to

:23:34.:23:37.

me how terrible it is that the Prime Minister comes from a poor school.

:23:38.:23:41.

Many would love to send their kids to a posh school if they could

:23:42.:23:44.

afford it. That is not the issue, the issue is whether we are seen as

:23:45.:23:48.

being on the side of working people. And the millions who voted Leave,

:23:49.:23:54.

that we speak for them. A lot of people have said there is an out of

:23:55.:23:58.

touch elite, that is one of the things that has been a refrain of

:23:59.:24:01.

the referendum campaign. You can't honestly say that Boris Johnson will

:24:02.:24:08.

break through that as an Etonian, will he? He is just another one of

:24:09.:24:13.

the same. I wonder whether there should be a fresh face, something

:24:14.:24:17.

different. I accept that there is an anger against the elite. That was

:24:18.:24:22.

behind many of the people who voted to Leave last week, and we have to

:24:23.:24:26.

respond to that as a party. I believe we have started down that

:24:27.:24:31.

road. We have a long way to go. I genuinely don't believe it is back

:24:32.:24:34.

about whether people are posh or what background they come from, it

:24:35.:24:37.

is about how we present ourselves. Are we going to be the party for

:24:38.:24:45.

workers? Is someone struggling to earn a living go to feel we are on

:24:46.:24:49.

their site? That has to be the raison d'etre of the next Tory

:24:50.:24:54.

leader. Why don't you stand? Not in a million years. You would connect

:24:55.:24:58.

with the blue-collar workers. In my deputy chairman job, I have gone

:24:59.:25:00.

around the country, talking about this. I don't want us to have a

:25:01.:25:06.

majority of ten, I want a big majority, and the only way to do

:25:07.:25:10.

that is to reach out to the millions of voters that Labour have lost who

:25:11.:25:13.

voted Leave. Do you think if a new leader comes in with a different

:25:14.:25:19.

programme, a different approach, do you think they need to go to the

:25:20.:25:24.

country to seek a mandate at some point before long? And other fixed

:25:25.:25:27.

term rule, it is difficult now to call an election. But you could make

:25:28.:25:31.

it happen. It is difficult. It would be up to the leader to decide. We

:25:32.:25:37.

have to cross one bridge at a time. We have to organise the

:25:38.:25:39.

renegotiations. There has to be an election of a new leader and there

:25:40.:25:43.

has to be a programme to get the Conservatives back with a proper

:25:44.:25:46.

majority by speaking forward to people. Can I ask you whether you

:25:47.:25:50.

think the leadership election needs to take the 14 weeks that seems to

:25:51.:25:54.

be allowed for? Margaret Thatcher retook the Falklands in half that.

:25:55.:25:59.

When Margaret Thatcher was deposed, that was on a Thursday and there was

:26:00.:26:03.

a new Prime Minister by the Tuesday. We are now at an important time in

:26:04.:26:08.

the country's history and we are other less. We can't wait 14 weeks

:26:09.:26:12.

for you guys to decide between Boris and Theresa May. This is an

:26:13.:26:16.

incredibly important question, who is going to be the next Prime

:26:17.:26:20.

Minister? Who will carry on the work that David Cameron started? And

:26:21.:26:24.

don't forget, when Margaret Thatcher was standing, it was only MPs who

:26:25.:26:30.

had the election. We have to go around the country and speak to

:26:31.:26:33.

members, and they will make the final decision. Thank you very much.

:26:34.:26:36.

Now, to finish, the most fraught issue of all -

:26:37.:26:39.

the gulf between inners and outers, the new national divide.

:26:40.:26:41.

It's about class, region, education and outlook.

:26:42.:26:43.

I have to say, there are urban professsionals who voted to Remain

:26:44.:26:47.

who are dealing with Brexit through the five stages grief -

:26:48.:26:50.

denial, anger, bargaining, depression and acceptance.

:26:51.:26:54.

As of a moment ago, a petition calling for a rerun

:26:55.:27:04.

of the referendum had received 2.3 million signatures.

:27:05.:27:06.

Can the divided British peoples cohabit comfortably?

:27:07.:27:08.

Emily has been out, trying to make sure we all learn to get on.

:27:09.:27:14.

If there's one thing we learned from the vote on Thursday,

:27:15.:27:17.

it's just how divided the country is.

:27:18.:27:19.

Boston in Lincolnshire voted 80-20 in favour of Leave,

:27:20.:27:23.

So we've brought citizens from each place together.

:27:24.:27:29.

Angie and Nina come from a farming community.

:27:30.:27:31.

James and Gurjinder, the Lambeth boys, are a lawyer

:27:32.:27:36.

and do they understand the choices they each made?

:27:37.:27:43.

When you voted Leave, was it about the EU,

:27:44.:27:47.

was it about kicking the Government, was it about change of any kind,

:27:48.:27:52.

or was it about something I haven't mentioned?

:27:53.:27:54.

We tried to tell everybody what was happening in Boston.

:27:55.:28:00.

People say we're the most segregated town in the country.

:28:01.:28:10.

What happens is, you get your neighbours,

:28:11.:28:13.

and it is full of EU migrant workers.

:28:14.:28:19.

They come over here, they live in houses of multiple occupation.

:28:20.:28:23.

Some of them have been here for five years and can't even

:28:24.:28:30.

I don't doubt in any way that these things are true

:28:31.:28:34.

and that there are these problems in these towns.

:28:35.:28:36.

What I worry about is that the EU has been blamed inaccurately.

:28:37.:28:47.

I think these problems are there, but it isn'y the EU's fault.

:28:48.:28:50.

Why do you think people have misunderstood?

:28:51.:28:53.

I think there has been a lot of either deliberate

:28:54.:28:55.

miscommunication or a very difficult conversation in the UK

:28:56.:28:57.

they just seemed to be shouting at each other or believing their own

:28:58.:29:03.

or believing their own side's truth, and sometimes both sides' truths

:29:04.:29:06.

I for one didn't think it was correct to have

:29:07.:29:09.

350 million to go to the NHS on the back of the battle bus,

:29:10.:29:14.

and since then Nigel Farage has said that was ill-advised

:29:15.:29:16.

But do you think people who voted Leave

:29:17.:29:23.

But do you think people who voted Leave are thick?

:29:24.:29:25.

Do you think that that is how the other side think?

:29:26.:29:31.

Definitely, especially with the barrage of things that have

:29:32.:29:33.

We know 350 million was not going to go directly to the NHS.

:29:34.:29:38.

But where you get your savings is, the doctor who lives near me,

:29:39.:29:41.

he told me they employ three interpreters at 40 quid an hour.

:29:42.:29:44.

We would not have to be paying that through the NHS if we didn't have

:29:45.:29:47.

I think we need to have a national conversation on how to build

:29:48.:29:57.

a fairer Britain, which everyone feels works for them.

:29:58.:30:00.

I just hope it goes straightforward and it sorts itself out.

:30:01.:30:08.

For the younger generation like kiddies, they've been brought

:30:09.:30:12.

up in this environment, so to speak, due to vandalism,

:30:13.:30:15.

I don't want my children seeing all that,

:30:16.:30:20.

Wherever you go right now, people agree on one thing:

:30:21.:30:30.

we are in the midst of a quite exceptional

:30:31.:30:32.

Life carries on - Glastonbury today, Wales winning football games,

:30:33.:30:36.

Pride, Armed Forces Day, but Brexit is always

:30:37.:30:38.

Which is why we've been here on a Saturday night.

:30:39.:31:01.

Rolls-Royce Corniche - one of the best of the very best.

:31:02.:31:05.

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