Attack on Westminster Newsnight

Attack on Westminster

Evan Davis hosts a Newsnight special with the latest on the terror attack outside the Houses of Parliament.

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This programme contains scenes which some viewers


The terrorists chose to strike at the heart of the capital city, where


people of all nationalities, religions and cultures come together


to celebrate the values of liberty, democracy and freedom of speech. The


streets of Westminster, home to the world's oldest Parliament, are


ingrained with the spirit of freedom that echoes in some of the furthest


corners of the globe. There are few places that are a more


obvious target for a terror There are the crowds,


there's symbolism, and today, On Westminster Bridge,


a car was used as a weapon, causing at least three deaths


and multiple injuries, before driving past Big Ben


and crashing into the railings Then an occupant of the vehicle got


out and went on to stab He has just been named as Keith


Palmer, who was 48. There are, as always, questions


about the causes of these attacks, the measures we take to prevent them


and the effectiveness We will be discussing those


through the programme, but nowhere are there more cameras,


more police and passing journalists to witness


an attack than in that zone. Like many, I was in the area


and came out of Westminster station at 2.45pm to hear the sound of three


or four gunshots. A lot of people were running away,


many others were not, carrying on oblivious or perplexed


at what was happening. This was the scene,


then, from my phone. Across the road from the Tube,


a car has rammed the wall, there. An injured person is on the ground


and a cyclist trying to help. At this stage, we had no idea


that there had been deaths Most of us were looking


to see what had happened Very quickly, more police arrived -


from all directions. And the effort was made to clear


the public from the square. As Big Ben chimed 3pm,


there was a strange hush over Parliament Square,


with just the noise of police sirens in the background and a lot


of people just gazing and trying Well, John Sweeney has


been piecing together At around 2.40pm, a car drives on to


Westminster Bridge, mounted the pavement and ploughs into people in


its path. The vehicle crosses the bridge, passes Big Ben and slams


into the railings to the left. The attacker, armed with a knife, runs


around the corner and into the main gates of the Palace of Westminster.


He stabs a police officer. Eyewitnesses say that as he


approached a second officer, clutching his life, he was shot. The


first people to be hit with standing on the south bank of the river, by


this kiosk. This Danish teenager saw the horror. The people were just


lying on the ground. This man, the driver, but at first


the attacker had lost control of his vehicle. The car started speeding


up, the only by that was a light had changed, as he sped up, there was


the shot and he has taken three victims. As I was driving, I was


thinking, he has lost his balance or his brakes and then the second and


the third, I have to stop the new middle-of-the-road to point to the


other cars to stop because there were people in the


middle-of-the-road. People flying like football. I felt sorry for one


of the gentlemen, I do not know what happened but it is not something I


would like to witness everyday. Unconscious in the middle of the


road. Did you get a chance to see the gentleman driving the car? , my


attention was on what was happening, it was so quick, and after 30


seconds I realised. Only one person. That is a crime against humanity.


Our next eyewitness, a former Polish Foreign Minister who filmed this


footage. We heard what sounded like metal on metal and we assumed it was


a collision but then we looked outside and I sold one person died


and another, I took my phone from a journalistic habit and SL five


people in all on the tarmac and on the pavement and then I understood


it must have been deliberate. In the chaos, a woman was reported to have


fallen into the tens. She was pulled out injured but alive. The attacker


then crashed his car into the railings just beyond Big Ben.


Hitting, it appears, yet another innocent bystander. My wife and I


came from the Westminster Underground and as they came up


looked across to Parliament and there was a car crashed into the


gate. And the police officers were running with machine guns and there


was a man down beside the car. After is settled in, I thought, I don't


like what is going on and I took my wife and her friend and got behind


concrete. Journalist Quentin Letts heard the car crash and ran to his


office window overlooking Parliament Square. The saw a thickset man in


black clothes coming through the gates were people would normally


drive cars into New Palace Yard, just below Big Ben. Add this man had


something in his hand, it looked like a stick of some sort. He was


challenged by a couple of policemen in yellow jackets and one of the


policemen fell down. And we could see the man in black waving his arm


in a way that suggested he was either stabbing or striking the


yellow jacketed police man. And one of the policemen ran to get help,


which was very quick to come. And then, this. I would say 15 yards,


perhaps. Two plainclothes guys with guns shouted at him, uttered what


sounded like a warning, he ignored that and they shot and two or three


times and he fell. Foreign Office Minister Tobias Ellwood administered


the kiss of life to the dying police officer. The thing London has been


dreading has finally happened, a terror attack, and this one on the


very heart of democracy. Inside the chamber, the Deputy Speaker halted


proceedings. I know how to suspend the city of the house, this house is


a splendid but please wait. These were the scenes in the mother of


Parliaments today. Chaos within. But murder without.


There has been a Scotland Yard briefing. It has confirmed five


dead, including the attacker at this point, 40 with injuries, they think


they know the identity of the assailant, they are not putting out


any name or telling us more about that, they have named the police


officer who was killed, that is Keith Palmer, a husband and father


aged 48. They say there will be extra officers on the streets of the


next few days. An important line is they think the attack was motivated


by international terror. It may not have been a surprise,


but it is still a shock. And the Prime Minister came out


of Number 10 this evening Once again, today, these


exceptional men and women ran towards the danger,


even as they encouraged others On behalf of the whole country,


I want to pay tribute to them. That they have lost one


of their own in today's attack only makes their calmness


and professionalism under pressure After the 7/7 attacks occurred,


Ken Livingstone was Mayor of London. He was in Singapore at the time


of the attack, helping London win the Olympics,


but captured the public mood in the aftermath,


with a well chosen speech. Good evening. I don't know what your


thoughts were when you heard London had been attacked again. Well, we


have known this was going to happen, the difference is back 12 years ago,


when 52 Londoners were killed, that was part of an international group


linked to international terrorists. The problem now is that most of the


recent terrorist attacks in Europe have been individual, angry, young


men, going out with the gun or knife or a lorry on a car killing people.


It is much more difficult to get the data about them to recognise who


they are and prepare for that. That is a problem. The nature of


terrorism in Europe has changed, it is individuals rather than


organisations. Give us some guidance as to what is going on at the


moment. What a Scotland Yard doing? Who was in charge at the moment?


What is the role of politicians at this point or is it delegated to the


police? We did delegate to the police. After the 911 attacks in New


York we started planning for this, we created a counterterrorism


organisation, very large, monitoring the people who could do things like


this, and vast amount of work went into that. Although we have seen


this horror today and the horror back 12 years ago with the attacks


on London, about every year, police stopped three or four attacks in


London. They are able to do that. But there will always be one


individual who can get through and can kill. You raise an interesting


point, is this something that is going to become a normal part of


life in capital are big cities in Europe and the West? Yes but we


cannot allow that to change the way we live. What was remarkable about


the terrorist attacks in 2005, in the weeks that followed, the


Metropolitan police did not come across a single incident where


Londoners had turned around and attacked or abused Muslims.


Londoners recognised what those terrorists wanted to do was to tear


us apart, to unleash a wave of hatred and antagonism and violence


and that is how we must respond to this. The Muslims that live in


London who have become Londoners are not responsible for what has


happened here. And we have to make certain that the terrorist attacks,


whether it is an international organisation or one individual,


angry, young man, cannot divide us. We have to be united. Ken


Livingstone, do you think the police are equipped, ready and able to deal


with the situation that faces them? Up to the job? We put vast amounts


of public money into actually building up the police to do with


this but also I have to say, in the last few days, Sadiq Khan made an


incredible statement, saying he was going to bring back the


neighbourhood patrols that I had when I was the Mayor of London and


they are very good because if people in a community see two or three


police officers that they get to know walking through the area, they


will come up and say, there is something odd going on in that


house... I am worried about this person. An individual is unlikely to


pick up the phone and say, can I talk to the counter terrorism unit.


But they will talk to the neighbourhood police officer. Sadiq


Khan's policy of bringing back neighbourhood patrols can be crucial


in making Londoners say. This is the first attack we have had under Sadiq


Khan, and Muslim Mayor, does this make this an important time for the


place of the Mayor in London? I watched his response to this and it


sounded so much like how I responded to the attacks 12 years ago. And the


fact that with all of this hysteria about Islamophobia and so on and


Muslim terrorism, the people in London voted for the Mayor who was


Muslim shows we are a great city and will not be divided by a few


embittered and disturbed terrorists. Thank you.


Last month, Max Hill, the barrister who's just


been appointed to be the independent reviewer


of terrorism legislation, warned that that Isis militants


are planning "indiscriminate attacks on innocent civilians".


No-one can say the authorities have not been alert to the possibility.


The threat level has been set at severe for some time.


We should be clear that we still know nothing of the assailant


Our security expert Mark Urban is with me.


Mark, is it important that it is a single say last night or everyone is


assuming that, is that more likely, less likely, Isis or other forms? We


know more because the Assistant Commissioner of special operations


at the Met made a statement as we were going on air, so he has said


that they know who the person is, that it is somebody who they believe


to have been inspired by international terrorism, was the way


he couched it. Although I can't tell you who that person was, who carried


out this act, the people I have been speaking to, tonight, are all


working on the assumption that it was in the words of one of them, a


Lee Rigby type incident. If you look a those individuals, they were both


on the radar, the Lee Rigby ones of the security service and Counter


Terrorism Command, but at the same time, it was a type of act which was


not networked in the way that the 7/72005 attacks were, where you had


people going to Pakistan for training, actually communications


going back-and-forth, things that could have been discovered. Not


enough on the radar to be under constant surveillance. As a result


of 7/7 what was of the security chiefs was saying to me at that


time, he was saying, look, we extended the net wider was the way


he put it. As a result of that, we come across a lot more people, with


radical inclinations and there is concern, among those people who


watch this community, that if this then emerges well, today's at tagger


was somebody who had been in jail or who had been run in by the police,


they then get blamed, because they are casting the net wider, but this


is a new type of thing, that is inspired by. It is not the #340dle


used on 7/7, we have seen that in other European countries with


vehicles being used. It is a different model which frankly,


pretty much anyone could do. Is it, would it be right to look at, to


frame a lot of this less in religion or upon ticks and more in mental


health and to think about these people as being... Insane rather


than thoughtfully inspired by some ideology, just the latest version of


insanity. As you know that gets into the culture war's arguments about


terrorism, the nature of terrorism, with some saying you never refer to


neo-Nazis as terrorists you say they are mentally ill, I mean look, there


is all sorts of fang fors in this, some could say that anyone who goes


to Syria to fight in Egyptian had is not going -- Jihad is not going to


be the same balance of mind as the rest of us. But there is still


ideology, it is all part of the picture. Well let us look at your


report on the issues raised by all of this.


There had been so many rehearsals of scenarios like this in all sorts of


environments. From the Thames, to the streets, to the London


underground. And underlying all the drills, the conviction at whoever


inspired today's attacker the Islamic State group promised to


strike Britain. I think it was only a matter of time before an attack


like this happened, because IS had rallied its supporters round the


world by saying attack where ever, and whenever you can. And what we


saw today was a very low cost attack, it was a vehicle attacking


people on the street, and this is not something that no matter how


many security measures a country can take, could have been fully


prevented. After the Nice attacks in which an say last night used a truck


to mow people down, Islamic State promised again to hit the British.


In the past two years, counter-terrorist chiefs say that 13


plots have been foiled in Britain. Today, though, the Met's Assistant


Commissioner for special operations had to count the cost of one that


had got through. My thoughts are with all those who


have been affected by today's attack. As a service we have lost


one of our own as he acted to protect the public and his


colleague, this is a day we planned for, but we hoped would never


happen. Sadly it is now a reality. We will continue to dual we can, to


protect the people of London. -- do all. Is The Metropolitan Police have


a tight grip on the illegal firearms market in London, and that has given


them a confidence they could prevent a kind of Mumbai or Paris sort of


attack, with multiple gunmen on the streets. But of course, what they


can't stop, is an individual using a car and a kitchen knife.


What many of these attacks do have in common, and this happened with


the murder of Lee Rigby, is that the attackers are already well-known to


security agencies. It isn't yet clear whether that was the case in


London today, but with hundreds involved in militant Islam, the


problem remains one of resources, and calculated risks. The UK has one


of the best security services in Europe, if not the world, and I know


that the security services in the UK have foiled a number of plots, that


the public do not necessarily know about, and as I said, the problem is


you can't fully immunise a country against someone driving a vehicle


and attacking people that way, but the more complex plots certainly the


UK intelligence services is and security services have done a very


good job of protecting British citizens from those kinds of


incidents. There are a great many investigative


avenues ahead for the police and MI5 now. Mapping the attacker's


contacts, asking themselves about whether any warnings were missed,


that gave an indication that he had decided to mount the crimes we saw


today. Well before we move on the Met


police has released this image of Keith Palmer, the policeman who was


killed today. Husband and father aged 48.


Grant Shapps, the Tory MP and former party chairman,


was caught up in today's events, and he's in Westminster now.


You were in old palace yard. Yes, New Palace Yard, and as we were


walking through, to go to that vote, walking, chatting as we went, there


is a lot of commotion, I looked round, police had their guns raised,


pointing in the direction of, of the attacker, and we heard three shots,


I think, perhaps four, ring out, and immediately, you know you are in a


situation which is not just, you know a protestors has climbed over


the fence, a police officer appeared immediately, dropped to the ground,


get to the ground, get to the ground, get back, find a secure


path, and we on our hands and knees, worked our way back to a place where


we could go further into the Commons itself. And at that point I realised


that the vote was still ongoing but now colleagues were stopped in their


tracks from getting to the Commons chamber, and I went straight to the


chamber and spoke to the Deputy Speaker, to tell him that he needed


to stop the vote, probably suspend the House because there was a


serious attack outside. What did you think was happening, did you, I mean


did you think this was a full scale attack on the Palace of Westminster,


while you were lying on the ground, total to get down, what were you


thinking? Well, you know, as with all these things when you are in the


moment, you are trying to work out what is going on, how serious it is,


tries to, you know get out the way as fast as possible. As it happens


as a minister I went to Mogadishu and I had security training for that


event. Never used it in Mogadishu, it was fine while I was there, I


never thought I would first get to experience and you know use that in


Westminster, but it did give me a sense of what you want to do is get


out the way as fast as possible. You have no idea whether there is going


to be a follow up or other people involved or what have you, that I


have to say, the one thing there was no panic, there was no great


commotion, people moved calmly, got into the chamber, other groups were


held elsewhere, I was with a whole bunch in the chamber, probably 400


of us for about five here hours after that, and it was the Commons


at its best with people trying to help each other out. I want to say


this police officer, Keith Palmer, who we all knew from the entrance


gate, and will have said good morning to or whatever, thoughts go


out to him and to the three other members of the public, who were


murdered in this pointless totally pointless attack today. And after


those attack, there were attempts, to resuscitate Bowe the attacker and


-- both the attacker and Keith Palmer. And it was your colleague


making the efforts to resuscitate Keith Palmer. He was a fellow


Foreign Office minister of mine and somebody who has experienced


terrorism in his family, before with his brother, killed in an attack. He


went straight to the scene, and as the pictures showed, tried to bring


that police officer back. But, I mean it is an extraordinary day in


Parliament. I think the key is, as the Prime Minister said, tomorrow,


we will sit again, and the pointlessness of attack like this, I


think will be crystal clear, it doesn't change, this thousand year


old mother of all Parliaments behind us, to have another attack, it has


happened before, I guess nearly 40 years ago now, with Airey Neave,


almost in the same location, just underneath that location, in the car


park on that occasion, it won't change our desire to have a


Parliament that the public can access, that our constituents can


see us in and represents the best of the world's democracy. Grant Shapps,


thank you very much. We asked the Government


and the Mayor of London to come The Shadow Home Secretary,


Dianne Abbott, joins us. Your reaction to the events? I was


in lockdown in the chamber, for five hours. MPs stayed calm but it was


frightening. We didn't know whether it was part of a series of attacks


round Westminster or London, when we heard about the deaths, five in all,


including the say last night, particularly the death of the


policeman, that we saw, you know, every day, coming in, people were


very moved. Security of Parliament. Do you look at what happened today,


as the security works, or do you see this as now needing a view of what


the security is? I mean the bloke runs in, but he, he is stopped by a


policeman. He didn't get in the bidding, he didn't get very far, we


have to get the facts about what actually happened, we need to review


it, I think it is very important to have a balance between keeping


people safe and remember, 2000 people work on the Parliamentary


estate but keeping Parliament open and accessible to the public.


Security in Parliament is higher than I have ever known it I would


hate to have a Parliament that was cut off from the public. Even more,


and the communications within Westminster, I think Mary Creagh was


saying it was confused, these things will be confused because Nonos what


is happening, did you feel you knew what was going on as fast as you


would have liked? I was confident, 400 MPs in the chamber in lockdown,


that we were getting information as soon as it could be verified. It


was, it was frightening, but MPs stayed calm. How do we stop this?


Now, you are not a fan of the prevent scheme which is the big


expensive Government programme, that has been running, to, talk people


out of radicalism and prevent it, how do you think, how do we stop it?


I don't think the prevent scheme has been effective. That is my issue


with it. It has maybe worked with some people but overall it is not


effective in its own terms. The House of Commons is on the footprint


of a medieval Palace, 2,000 people in and out every day, very hard to


make it completely secure unless you are... It is not just about the


House of Commons, Westminster Bridge is where the true horror was, most


of the deaths were occur, and you are not going to be able to provide


security on every bridge in every part of the country, that won't be a


solution, how do you prevent, this is I suppose the nub of the problem,


you don't think prevent is, who, you said it demonises communities, what


do you do to guide people away from that course? We have to look where


it has worked and where it has failed. Deem needing communities


will not make us safer. But there is some work it has done that has


worked. It is demonising communities to say there is an issue we a number


of people who are persuaded to, tempted by mad radicalism. The truth


is, when I go into universities and talk to young people, when I talk to


communities some feel demonised, that is not helpful. There is


practical work that can be done to show people, to reassure people that


have a stake in society. Thank you very much indeed.


A man armed with a motor car and knife causes death


We can't stop people acquiring access to cars or to knives,


This has become a real headache, since the Nice attack


on Bastille Day last July, when a lorry was used


Suddenly, that realisation, that individuals can wield great


harm without explosives, was a game changer.


Well, you would think the only way is to stop the people


But if there are too many of them, that's not easy.


I'm joined by Richard Barrett, who has held positions in MI5,


served as director of global counter terrorism operations


for the Secret Intelligence Service, and is now director


And Sara Khan, CEO of the anti-Islamist charity Inspire,


which supports and works alongside the government's counter-extremism


Can we start on Prevent, we heard Diane Abbott's not new views on


Prevent. How well isn't working? The government has said that there have


been successes, 50 people have been stopped from travelling to Syria,


including a number of children, there is work taking place around


challenging far right extremism and providing support to vulnerable


young people who are expressing extreme views so we know there is


successful work happening. It is not perfect but we need to continue


positive work but that burqas critical and it is important to


realise that Prevent operates in a space where people are vulnerable to


radicalisation but may not have necessarily committed a criminal act


so it is preventing that by providing early intervention. The


key development since 7-7, 12 years ago, this idea that these


individuals are not networks, they are inspired by rather than joined


up with forces like Isis, is Prevent good for those people wasn't aimed


and devise an Europe with networks? Prevent was designed to be flexible


to the nature of the threat and to the evolving threat, whether that is


a lone wolf or dealing with different types of extremism and it


is important to recognise that after the merger of Lee Rigby, the


intelligence and security community made it clear that out of contest,


the counterterrorism strategy, one of the most important strands is


investing in Prevent, investing in early intervention and prevention is


the most cost effective. Are you a supporter of Prevent? I am a


supporter of Prevent in so far as it engages the community, the public,


and Prevent is quite innovative with the UK as the first country to try


this policy and it has had to be reinvented from time to time but


nonetheless it has been worth trying and we must remember that Prevent is


about radicalisation to extremism in any direction and we think back to


the last attack, the last murder in the UK, Jo Cox, that was from a


different form of extremist. Let us talk about the security and how we


stop this time of thing. A car and a knife, ordinary objects, you cannot


take those away, we can design roads so pedestrians are separated from


motor vehicles. What is the response to what has happened? The correct


response as a Prime Minister said and the Mayor of London, we carry


on. This sort of thing cannot be prevented completely, it is bound to


happen and the main way to reduce terrorism is to reduce the impact of


terrorism, if terrorists did not have much impact they would not do


it, they would find something else. That is unrealistic because if you


launch an attack on Westminster Bridge you will have worldwide


coverage, guaranteed. That is something to do with the choosing of


this location. Have we reached an era where the bombs are not


necessarily any more? You do not need explosives or to learn about


explosives, has become easier to become a terrorist that can make a


global impact? It is clear we are living in an era of extremism, we


witnessed the murder of Jo Cox last year by far right extremists and BC


the global rise of extremism and the reality is this type of terrorism is


not going to go away any time soon and so we must continue with


resolution to try to champion our values and counter extremism and


radicalisation and invest and support police and security agencies


to empower communities and to work with young people, at multipronged


level defeat extremism. As bomb-making come less valuable as a


skill? We saw the government yesterday and the American


government taking action against carrying laptops onto planes from


certain places and that was about explosives, the fear that computers


or something like that could contain exposes so I think bomb-making is a


real concern to the authorities but with the availability of a kitchen


knife and a car, terrorism is available to anybody. If you look at


today, did you think that this really could have been a great deal


worse? Or did you think this was as bad as it could get? In a way, the


security at the Palace of Westminster stopped getting in, he


did not far. Tragically, taking a life in the process. But in a sense,


I don't know if we should feel this way but this was quite a limited


attack? You are absolutely right, terrible death of Keith Palmer but


nonetheless he did not get very far before he was tackled and brought


down, there was a huge police response, as we saw on the news.


That is something to bear in mind. The protection is there. The other


thing is this sort of thing is incredibly rare and the risk to any


particular member of the public, that they might be in the wrong


place at the wrong time, is so small as to not affect our way of life. We


are beginning to lose count of how many smaller incidents are occurring


here and in other countries every now and again, some other deranged


individual doing something like this, normally not with the impact


of today. Is it becoming more normal? It depends what you define


as normal, is a commonplace? I do not think it is, in respect of the


UK, we have been rather fortunate compare to other European countries


and in the Middle East so we have to deal with this threat and continue


to challenge extremism and fight those who promote terrorist ideas


and beliefs and prepare and protect the country from terrorism. Thank


you both very much indeed. Let us hope we're not talking about this


again too soon. Richard Watson has some information on the attack?


There has been speculation on wrong information on the internet but I


have been speaking to the international centre for the study


of radicalisation at Kings College and they have interesting research


that is quite persuasive. They are telling me that they have evidence


that the car used in this attack was hired from enterprise rentals at


Birmingham on the 16th of March, just six days ago, that is


information, we cannot confirm it but is interesting. The 16th of


March, enterprise cars in Birmingham. Do we know if that was a


continual rental? I do not know that. There are many different


scenarios we would have to think about, wasn't stolen? Thank you very


much. One of the strange


things about these days is the normality of them -


so much busy city It's not that people


are not moved or affected, or wanting to talk about it,


they just might as well be That sentiment came through in


the Prime Minister's words Tomorrow morning, Parliament


will meet as normal. And Londoners and others from around


the world who have come here to visit this great city


will get up and go People will board their trains,


they will leave their hotels, And we will all move


forward together. Joining me now is former editor


of the Evening Standard And director of the think tank,


Centre for London, Ben Rogers. Do you see this as an attack on city


's? The city is such a tempting target. Big cities, Paris and


Berlin? His recent attacks have been aimed at crowds and cities are all


about crimes and it is easier, you are more vulnerable inner-city,


every time you get on the Tube, I am vulnerable to attack but also in a


way, cities where people help each other and some of the worst stories


about child abuse and so on, they take place in closed institutions


like orphanages and boarding schools. If you are walking down a


country lane and a killer comes towards you, that is worse, walking


down a city street... Exactly. Cities have a certain resilience.


Simon, we have to choose on these occasions between minimising or


maximising the response and this is a dilemma because you don't want to


say this is nothing, 40 people injured and four innocent people


tragically killed. On the other hand, you do not want to give them


the publicity and sense of event that they want to create. That is


what you have just done! There is a choice and the BBC has made the


choice and they have opted with the terrorist. You cannot ignore it.


Nobody is suggesting that, this is why I protest about the coverage you


give to these incidents, you have a choice of prominence and the


prominence given right now is aiding and abetting terrorism. I really


feel that way, choose to treat this as a crime, under the IRA and PLO


terrorists, they were treated as crimes, in this case, probably some


crazy man who has gone gone mad has done something stupid and is dead,


that is a crime. All of London people are doing crazy things with


knives and guns and dying, this has taken place but said Parliament and


people have died. This should be publicised but it is different from


describing it with this culture of politics and Islam and religion and


it is quite wrong and this is a new phenomenon, not on the part of the


terrorists, this is a method of getting publicity and we give them


the publicity. Do you agree? I do, partly. I was struck by how much


coverage this has got. In London, we have a good story to tell about how


although we have seen high levels of migration in recent years, we have


managed very well and there are other migrant cities in the world,


like New York, but what London has done is we invented ourselves as a


migrant city and without any real pain. I think Simon would have put


this on the front of his paper and the first seven or eight pages. I


would have tried not to. First page, of course. The BBC led on the Nice


attack for one week. What did the -- what Isis want them to do? That. The


thing that. This getting as much attention is that it is happening


more often and we do not want that. The IRA was interesting because it


was directed at London and because of the crowds and quite


deliberately, as I recall, it was downplayed, it was not ignored but


downplayed and treated as a crime and the political significance of


this was in a sense, it was Ireland and we understood it whereas we


don't really understand Islam but there is this relentlessness of


threat, menace, this publicity from the BBC, there was a drama a few


weeks ago, publicity for terrorists. It is not the way to handle it.


Always on these occasions, people come out, we heard the Prime


Minister, this will not change us, we will not give in, it is almost a


cliche. I do not know how we could let this change is? What would we


do? It is very hard to do anything about that. It is extraordinary, the


trend of these things, people do at once and others follow and it is-


the security services to guess what is happening next. I think what


Sadiq Khan and others are doing is talking the story up, this is a good


story. This would have cost London millions in tourism and the more


publicity, the more money it will cost. Thank you.


Well, that's all we have time for tonight.


But it is an interesting observation that while the news that someone


is hell bent on killing as many ordinary people as possible could be


seen as a sign of a country that is hateful or dysfunctional,


there is a paradox that in aftermath of such on atrocity,


you find everybody more harmonious than ever and united


You heard the Prime Minister say the Commons and the Lords


are scheduled to be back at work tomorrow.


The tone will reflect unity rather than division.


I'll be back with more tomorrow, but in the meantime - goodnight.


It looks like there is some rain on the way tomorrow morning.


Not for everybody but I think central and south western areas,


including Wales, will have some rain first thing and the far south-west


of the country will stay cloudy with spots of rain


But the vast majority of the UK is in for a sunny day.


The lion's share of the sunshine will be across the northern two


Certainly Northern Ireland, Scotland and the North of England,


right across the Pennines - a very different story tomorrow


Look at all that clear weather from Yorkshire,


The south-east, also a better day, no downpours


But then the closer we get to the south coast, the thicker


the cloud is and from the Isle of Wight, down through the West


Country to the tip of Cornwall, I think there is a chance


of encountering some rain at any time from morning


Wales is not looking bad at all, apart from this southern tip


so maybe Cardiff catching a few spots but for the bulk of


Thursday into Friday, it looks like we're going to keep


the dry weather through Friday and Saturday and Sunday looks


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