27/07/2017 Newsnight

When is the free movement of people not the free movement of people?

This morning the Home Secretary Amber Rudd

and her Immigration Minister Brandon Lewis seemed to be talking

I'll be speaking to Mr Lewis and, as Labour's got

its own Brexit problems, to the Shadow Home

Also tonight, we report from Caracas, as Venezuala faces

This is a country that has seen many of its youngest people killed,

People like these are commemorating the lives lost in this way,

This is very much an open wound and the consequences

Whose calling who elite, and since when was it a dirty word?

You're coming across to a little bit elitist.

After Emily's extraordionary encounter

with Trump's new man last night, we'll ask what's so bad

We are travelling in this torpedo like objects, deep under the streets

of London. The Home Secretary, safely

on a boat on the west coast of Scotland, broke her year-long

silence on Brexit in an article in the FT to announce

that there will be not be a cliff edge for EU nationals in March 2019,

but rather a transition period, and that she had asked the experts

of the Migration Advisory Council to examine the costs and benefits

of EU migration and report Her Immigration Minister,

Brandon Lewis, then appeared on the Today programme this morning,

taking a different, sharper tone. Free movement will end, he said,

when we leave the EU. Then she talked to him

during the day. I wonder if that

was a rather uncomfortable call? Immigration was a major issue in the

referendum argument. Absolutely no control over huge numbers of people

coming from the EU. Vote Leave and to take back control. Isn't it time

we took back control? Take back control. Control the borders and

control our immigration policies. That's why the government committed

to making an end to free movement a red line in our EU negotiation.

Today the Home Secretary asked the Migration Advisory Committee to

start work on what comes next. We want a newcomer in forms, evidence

-based EU migration policy. We've commissioned the MAC to look into

it, an independent group. The Home Secretary set out a vague timetable,

sort of, that there will be three phases. The first will end on the

specified date, the day we leave the EU, probably March, 2019. EU

citizens who are already here, who have five years residency, will be

able to apply for a settled status and those with fewer than five years

residency will be allowed to stay to clock up those five years. Even the

apparently simple thing about what to do with EU citizens here already,

and to take the big one, the European Union wants its own court

to have some jurisdiction over these people to insure that their rights

are respected, something the government doesn't like at all. The

second phase is a slightly woolly transition phase, where it seems

that EU residents will be able to come here but must register and they

may have weaker rights than earlier writers enjoy. The idea here, the

Home Office is, is to avoid a cliff edge in the Labour market when

Brexit arrives. If we allow EU citizens in during the transition,

will we keep the benefits of the Single Market as well? The

transition proposal makes absolute sense for us in that you can see the

logic in delaying the moment when we leave the Single Market, the customs

union, if we do. The problem is that it may not make sense for the EU

because they are hearing that we will enter free movement and they

may not say that we can do that and keep the economic benefits of the

market. And then the final migration system, after the transition process

ends, but that could be anything from keeping things as they are for

EU citizens or treating EU migrants like other migrants, a more

burdensome and more capricious process. For non-EU Mashup gnaws,

the current -- non-EU nationals, the UK regime is very prescriptive. If

you are coming across as a sponsored worker, you can only come in for a

role that requires degree level education. There are very

prescriptive salary thresholds. If you're being transferred by an

international company, the absolute minimum you can be paid is ?41,500

per annum. Enormous government fees that must be paid by the employer

and employee. ?16,000 in government fees alone if you want to bring a

family of five across for five years. To work out what comes next

we must answer questions about who we want coming here. This Slough

-based employment agency is worried about prioritise in skilled workers.

The majority of the workers that we provide, hundreds on a daily basis,

are working in the elementary sector, they are blue-collar

workers, and I don't think a points-based system is the right

kind of approach to continue to attract that kind of Labour for the

UK market. The points-based system may cater for highly skilled

migrants but it certainly wouldn't recognise, in my experience, the

people with a low skill base that the country so much needs. He isn't

the only businessman lobbying. We've had everything from businessmen

saying that we need banks talking about contingency planning and

possibly moving their headquarters elsewhere. Disputes on this theme

are rumbling along in government. Keeping business happy overall,

while meeting the 100,000 net migration target may prove

impossible. You can't take control of everything.

Well, why has the commissioning of the report by the Migration Advisory

Committee, accompanied by a six-page letter setting out a three-phase

transition period for EU nationals living and working in the UK, caused

If the transition lasts for years, and EU workers are merely

registered as being in the UK, does that constitute the end

of freedom of movement on March 2019 or not?

Earlier I spoke to the Immigration Minister Brandon Lewis.

I asked why the report wasn't commissioned a year and a month ago,

straight after the Brexit vote. We've commissioned today, and the

work with the Migration Advisory Committee will start and we will

have interim reports as well. Later this year I will publish a white

paper. In early 2018 we will bring an immigration bill. The Home

Secretary has made it clear that there is a transition period of up

to three years after March, 2019, went EU nationals can simply turn up

and register to stay. And yet you say that freedom of movement will

end in March, 2019. Which is it? Freedom of movement will end when we

leave the EU, it is one of the four pillars. We get control back of the

immigration system. My understanding is that up to three years

afterwards, workers in the European Union can come and simply register,

which is not controlled, they can register and in the transition

period, up to three years, they can stay. Is that right? We haven't

outlined the detail of what will happen. Amber Rudd did. She didn't.

We've announced that the Migration Advisory Committee will look at the

impact of Labour and the European migration on our Labour market in

the UK and that will inform government policy. Government will

set policy. The framework will be what the immigration system will be

in the immigration bill in 2018. We don't want a cliff edge, we want

business to grow and develop. You say that they will be no free

movement of European workers after March, 2019 but the Home Secretary

says there will be transition arrangements for to three years

where European workers can come here and work. Which is it? They are

compatible, they go together perfectly well. When we leave the

EU, by definition, freedom of movement will end. There will be a

system, after March, 2019, which will be our new system and there

will be a period of that, a transition system including a number

of things, for example EU citizens looking to get settled status in the

UK, who have qualified, after that negotiation. There will be a grace

period of two years for them to deal with it. We will say to people

coming to this country that they will potentially have to register so

we know who is here. That isn't controlling them. If this committee

identifies a need for workers, say, 200,000 of various skills, would you

accept that advice? I won't prejudge what the committee will do, they are

independent, they will give interim reports. They will also be looking

at what industry needs in terms of the proportion of workers. If the

advice is 200,000, are you going to say that isn't acceptable? The

decision on policy is a matter for the government and we will outline

that in the immigration bill next year. There is no mention of keeping

immigration to the tens of thousands, even as an aspiration. It

wasn't mentioned and it is a manifesto commitment. It is a

commitment and we have stuck to that, we are the only party saying

we understand that people in this country want to see us having

control of the borders, reducing migration to sustainable numbers and

we are determined to deliver that but we want to do it in a way that

allows the economy to flourish and we believe you can do both. How do

you know you can do both? The HR directors said that 65% of our

workers are EU nationals. You need low skilled workers. Can they come?

We need to make sure we are developing the skills we need for

the future in this country and attracting the brightest from the EU

and around the world. It is in the brightest and best necessarily, this

isn't to demean people but people want workers in food processing

workers, hotels, baristas, they are the kind of low skilled workers that

we don't have. Are you going to train people to be low skilled

workers? One thing we must ensure we are doing, how we make sure we are

getting the best opportunity. We can reduce the net migration down to the

tens of thousands, while still making sure we have an economy that

is thriving and seeing growth for our country. What kind of economy

are we talking about? Do you believe in a centrally planned economy, you

know what is going to happen, 3000 BMW workers, 500 hairdressers? You

don't know, and you might be short of these people. That's why we have

an immigration policy that has the flexibility to deliver for the

economy. That's why we're talking to different sectors, as I did to the

financial sector today, and we are getting exposed to look at the

economy. I'm not going to prejudge what the immigration policy will be.

That is a matter for the immigration bill in 2018.

Our political editor, Nick Watt is with me.

What have you learned? Your first question to him was why didn't you

commission it a year ago, it is a tight timetable. I understand Amber

Rudd was keen to get going on the project sometime ago the general

election. That obviously didn't happen and as I understand it Amber

Rudd has found it easier to get approval after the changes that took

place in Downing Street after the general election. Preparatory work

has been going on in the Home Office on this for some time. It's

interesting that Amber Rudd is one of a trio of Cabinet ministers who

have been pushing for a more relaxed position on this to avoid what they

are calling a cliff edge Brexit. No suppliers that Philip Hammond is in

the group but David Davis, the Brexit sev Terry, is in that group

-- Brexit secretary. He got into trouble when they went beyond the

agreed script, that the UK must attract the best and brightest after

Brexit. He said that we need an immigration policy that will avoid

shortages in the Labour market. Not happy in number ten when he said

that. Thank you for joining us. If the government seems to be

at sixes and sevens over Brexit, Jeremy Corbyn and the shadow

Secretary of State for International Trade have put

the clear message out on the airwaves and in print over

the last few days that Labour backs an end to the Single Market and says

no to a Customs Union. But last night the shadow

Chancellor John McDonnell seemed to contradict his leader,

saying that Labour was not ruling out membership

of the Single Market at all. Earlier I met up with

the Shadow Home Secretary, Diane Abbot, and first

asked her for her reaction to today's Government

announcement on immigration. The government's in a mess

about immigration. They were happy to pander

to Ukip voters during the general election,

but, belatedly now, they have realised the very vital role that EU

migrants play in the economy. I'm glad they are going to get

some expert advice. I don't understand that they are

seeking the expert advice a year after we voted to come out

of the European Union. But some facts will be better

than urban myths and some light will be better than the heat

which is sometimes generated Let's look then at Labour's position

because Barry Gardiner, the shadow international trade

secretary, wrote in the Guardian that Labour's position is out

of the Single Market, out of the Customs Union

because you'll be a vassal state and actually what we need

is a bespoke agreement. The Labour Party made it very

clear in its manifesto, that it wants a Brexit which puts

jobs and the economy first and we are not, at this stage,

taking any options off the table. But Barry Gardiner seemed

to suggest that actually, out of the single market,

out of the customs union He may seem to suggest that,

but at this point, we are not taking We believe in looking

at where we want to go and what we want from these

negotiations, were we conducting them, is to have the benefits

of being in the single market We are about looking

at ends, not structures. So in fact, your view

is, we could still be My view is, we shouldn't take

options off the table. This is Britain's future,

this is our children's future. It would be irresponsible to take

options off the table. Jeremy Corbyn said on Sunday,

the benefits of the single market are dependent on membership

of the EU, making it quite clear that he believes we should be out

of the single market. I was with Jeremy Corbyn this

afternoon and he is quite clear, we are not taking options

off the table. There will be no bigger,

or more important negotiation in my political lifetime,

it would be foolish at this stage But he said, we should be

out the single market. He made it perfectly clear,

Andrew Marr pressed him on it What we're saying is that

when we come out of the single market, freedom of movement

will obviously fall. But, we're not taking

options off the table. But what Jeremy Corbyn was saying

is he wants to stop, what do you call it,

unscrupulous agencies Are you sure that Jeremy

Corbyn voted to Remain? It's almost trying to undermine

all the hard work he did and all of us did, to try and get

the right result. But if you have the Labour

leader saying he wants to leave the single market,

that that is the option. If you've got your shadow

international trade secretary saying leave the single market,

leave the customs union, that looks like Labour is actually

supporting a hard Brexit and there is very little evidence

to show that Labour is doing You will see what we're doing

to stop a hard Brexit I can assure you that our vision

for this country going forward, is very different from the view

of Theresa May and Once one of South America's

richest countries, Venezuela, now teeters

on the brink of civil war. Months of protests against

President Maduro's government have Inflation, malnutrition and even

starvation are on the rise in a country with some

of the world's largest oil reserves. The BBC has spoken to activists

who say the government is using torture, and imprisonment

without trial, against those who oppose it, a claim

the government denies. This weekend huge protests

are expected in a showdown ahead of a vote to elect an assembly

to change the constitution. Opposition parties say this

would create a dictatorship. So who are the people hoping

to overthrow the President? Vladimir Hernandez

reports from Caracas. Once the richest jewel

in Latin America, it's now a country drowning in political

and economic chaos. As his people rage, President

Nicolas Maduro's grip on power has It's feared a new constitution

will establish a dictatorship. The BBC has heard disturbing

allegations of state torture I've been to Caracas to meet

the resistance to the Maduro regime and to find out what future lies

in store for this troubled country. By the time Maduro

came to power in 2013, Venezuela's Bolivarian Revolution,

begun by his charismatic predecessor, Hugo

Chavez, was in chaos. Price regulations and the state

control of industry When the oil price fell,

Venezuela's extravagant The country found itself borrowing

heavily and increasingly reliant In the last quarter years

the economy has shrunk by a third. The IMF estimates that inflation

is running at over 700%. Three out of four Venezuelans lost

an average of 18 lbs Corruption helps the regime

to stay in power. The army are kept onside

by being given charge In March, Maduro's Supreme Court

declared the opposition led National Assembly

to be illegitimate. Demonstrations and violent clashes

with the security forces followed. Over 100 people have

died and thousands more In May, president Maduro called

for a new constitution in an attempt It's hard to get the government

to talk to the media but the minister in charge of food

distribution, a key job in today's Venezuela,

did agree to talk to me. In the Chavista worldview,

there is a familiar bogeyman. The opposition,

unsurprisingly, disagree. Former presidential candidate

Maria Corina Machado thinks there's far more to the resistance

than the violent protest. You don't have to look far to find

who she is talking about. Street kids like these appear

at every demonstration. Their enthusiasm to take

on the security forces, while brave, I saw it for myself

and the very next protest. This is one of the most

controversial aspects Small pockets of demonstrators

at the end of the protest come to places like this,

a military base, In there, there are already

scuffles, with some people telling them, don't do it,

you are valuable, you are a young life, don't lose it, because over

there the National Guard is already This residential block is called

Los Verdes or the Greens. It's been a focal point

of vociferous anti-government Neighbours here set up

barricades on a regular basis and clashes with the police

and National Guard are frequent. One evening, the government

said, enough was enough. When she heard the police

begin their assault, one of the residents,

Camila, went to hide Even though she told

the police she was pregnant, They kept on beating us,

even when they took us They told someone, come on,

I'm going to kill you, Because this is a dictatorship

and they nick whoever they want to, whether you are doing

anything or not. Camila was taken to some of Caracas'

worst prisons before He was arrested at a demonstration,

accused of belonging They grabbed me from behind,

there must be 18, 20 cops While they were kicking

and hitting me, they put me on a bike and took me

to the headquarters Originally designed as a futuristic

shopping centre, today the Helicoide is a place whose name makes even

the hardened shudder. Held in overcrowded cell

for over two months, Simon witnessed prisoners returning

from interrogation with tell-tale One got back, you could

tell he was frightened. He couldn't stand up

straight and you could see And the other guy, you could see his

black eye, it was all bruised, so you could see they have

given him shociks. so you could see they

have given him shocks. Later on, several officers

there told us, we are going to give And we're going to grab

those two and soak them. But intelligence agency officials

ignored a release order and he was only freed a month

and a half later. But far from being intimidated,

the opposition are Whilst we were filming with former

presidential candidate Maria Corina Machado,

we witnessed an extraordinary This is the Attorney

General of Venezuela. She's now playing key

role in this crisis. Many in the opposition,

like Maria Corina Machado, believe that behind the bluster,

the endgame being played out. The president, though,

sees a very different future Whilst their politicians fight it

out, the students of UCV, the largest university in Venezuela,

continue their own Personally, I don't mind giving

up my life out there in the streets, A constitutional assembly

is now set to draw up At least, that is

the government's plan. It's a future that very few

in the country are relishing. And you can see a longer version on

our world at 8:30pm on Saturday night and 9:30pm on Sunday night and

also on the iPlayer. Within the past few hours

the government in Venezuela has banned all protests against this

Sunday's controversial vote on an assembly to draw up

a new constitution... From tomorrow anyone taking part

in a rally or march could be jailed I'm joined live now by the Times

correspondent in Carracas, As a result of that, what is

happening on the streets of Caracas? We have had reaction from our

position that they will be banning hard-core for five days. The

opposition says it plans on Friday in Venezuela to have a massive march

from all over the country, censoring on Caracas, to try and stop what it

says is the last chance it has before there is a complete political

reset if this constituent assembly happens on Sunday. Meanwhile, this

is the second day of a national strike called by the opposition

against the government. It has been pretty effective in Caracas, most

shops are shut, very few cars on the streets. In some ways, a silent

protest, trying to contradict what the government is saying. The

government says it is still leading a popular revolution and the people

are behind it and if the people want to change the constitution, the

opposition, by holding this national strike, they are saying, look at

there, the people are not with you. Thank you very much.

If there's one word which has become nuclear charged in the last decade,

and has dominated the political discourse it is the word "elite".

It's an insult that has been spat out Westminster politicians,

flung at practically everyone in Washington, think Trump's battle

cry "drain the Swamp - and swept away the political

establishment in France.- it has thrown up Donald Trump

and Emmanuel Macron, and almost did for Theresa May,

The Oxford Dictionary definition of Elite is "a select group

that is superior in terms of ability or qualities to the rest

And last night on Newsnight, this is what happened Emily asked

the new White House director Communications Antony Scaramucci -

what part of Donald Trump was not elite?

What's happening right now, which I love, is that the elites

and the media establishment that want to hit the president

on Russia everyday, they recognise there is nothing

What part of Donald Trump is not elite?

The business side or the politics side, or the inheritance side?

What part of Donald Trump, many people in the UK

There's so many things about the president.

He's a celebrity, he's a billionaire.

How about the cheeseburgers, how about the pizza that we eat.

Everyone eats cheeseburgers and pizza, what are you talking about?

You are coming across a little bit elitist,

so let me just say something to you, OK.

I grew up in a middle-class family, OK.

We had virtually a tight budget and little to no money.

I spent 30 years of my life trying to get into the global

elites so I could stand here and serve the president.

Do you know why I missed the movement?

As I tunnelled myself into elites, we had this circular conversation

about what was going on, which was completely wrong.

Donald Trump is not elite then, he's not an elite?

He knows how to operate in an elitist world and he has

unbelievable empathy for the common struggle that's going

on with the middle-class people and the lower middle-class people.

So, eating cheeseburgers and pizza is the latest

I'm joined by the former executive editor of The Times,

Roger Alton, and Dr Faiza Shahenn, the Director of the Centre

Good evening to you both. Roger, is membership of an elite a useful

distinction or simply a kind of insult? Trump uses it as an

all-purpose swearword about the media because he has a problem with

the media and of course, vice versa, I sort of sympathise because the

media spends all its time attacking him, and he them, so he uses an

all-purpose swearword to say you are an elite. But there is a serious

issue about a bunch of people who set themselves up, I think that's

what the Sophy was referring to, sometimes also overhear, setting

themselves up as the custodians of the opinions that matter and if you

don't share their views on Europe, then you are out of the window --

that's what the Mooch was referring to. If you don't share those

opinions, then you are part of the elite. Is that a problem? You aren't

necessarily saying that elites are a problem? I think the self appointed

elite is a problem. I'm a fan of excellence, a sporting team,

England, excellent, that is simple to understand. Is there a catch all

that elites, cultural, political, the law, naturally look after

themselves, it is an attitude, but is it a negative thing? I agree that

what we saw there, the use of the term elite to shut down

conversation, that the word is being used to manipulate people. But there

is real anger behind that. Why have Trump and others used the word?

Because people are getting rightly angry about the small group of

people who have huge power and influence in our society, the

judiciary, the media, whether it is the way in which they are gaming the

system to make sure they day at the top. It is quite a dirty reality. Is

that a modern version of it? Perhaps in the past, elites have been

incredibly influential and powerful, for instance I don't think without

an elite you wouldn't have had such a big women's suffrage movement.

There are many examples of working-class struggles. It was a

mixed struggle actually. There are a number of things. Change doesn't

always come from the elite, there were many examples. The weekends we

have didn't come from the elite, it is making the elite change. What we

are seeing now politically is a movement of people who are very

angry, who have very little trust. The Grenfell survivors, when they

hear about the town leader not having been to a tower block, they

feel that they do not share their struggle. Isn't that a cheap jibe in

a way? You can say that it is a cheap jibe that works, from somebody

like Trump, but what constitutes an elite? Of course he is an elite but

he has managed to corral the word to himself. He has a connection, his

support has barely moved, a lot of people still like him and they don't

like that kind of liberal American press which thinks it can run

everything and to a certain extent in this country as well. It says

what of ridiculous word, it is good to have excellence, but not to have

self appointed elites. Why is having an elite synonymous with being

excellent? I don't understand. We make that confusion. They are there

by lottery of birth. Bayard. Presumably you could have an elite

that forces change through its acumen of knowledge and excellence.

-- they aren't. What happens is that, the elite are not

necessarily... If we think about what the elite means, they generally

come from wealth, went to private school, went to elite is the tuition

is, so they may have had a privileged life. -- elite

universities. When they are writing our policies, our laws, writing our

screenplays, they are really skewing our idea, across the board, but I

really skewing... Screenplays? Something we see in many areas,

dominated by certain people from certain backgrounds. Is it

necessarily harmful to have elites? It isn't, you need elites, you don't

want self appointed elites, you need people who are excellent. You want

people who are very good running things. I think we are defining

elites differently. Thank you for joining us.

How was your journey home this evening?

Did you perhaps fantasise about a private train,

travelling effortlessly, on time, and invisible to sweating,

cursing commuters thronging the streets a few feet from you?

The Mail Rail was an underground railway which moved letters

and parcels across London for 80 years, avoiding the crowded

One of London's hidden wonders, it's been mothballed

for more than a decade, but it's being brought

back to life as visitor attraction from September.

We have this exclusive preview from Stephen Smith, which contains

It's one of London's best kept secrets.

An underground railway that almost nobody has travelled on, until now.

For almost 80 years, trains ran clear across the capital,

six miles from east to west, with never a problem

This is the forgotten labyrinth of the mail rail.

It's a wonderfully intimate experience.

Possibly a bit cramped for some, but we are travelling in this kind

of torpedo-like object deep under the streets of London.

Unbeknownst to the thousands of commuters up above.

Riding alongside Newsnight on this maiden-ish voyage

30 years clocked up on the mail rail, but this is his first

This is a luxury, riding around in this train, it's smooth,

and it's much more roomy than the wagon I was

That was built in 1927 and you feel every lump and bump

I know there's a sort of graveyard for old trains down here,

do you see a lot of ghosts as you go around yourself, your

Here is loaded with echoes for me, the memories of people I've known

working here and every event linked to a place somewhere on the railway.

ARCHIVE: Once aboard, parcels and letters travel over

Miniature engines, running on a two foot track give the whole thing

the Alice in Wonderland fascination of model trains and

It was 1927 when the first wagons of letters and parcels rolled

through the narrow tunnels of the Post Office railway,

The idea was to keep the all-important mail free

The Mail Rail employed hundreds of staff and moved

They made their own entertainment in this twilight world,

They worked out they'd have enough time for a throw each,

And they couldn't leave their station, they couldn't walk off,

so while they were standing there they had a game of darts.

But according to Royal Mail, the railway became more expensive

than moving post by road, so in 2003, the last postie turned

I remember 2011, the first time I got to come down to the Mail Rail,

to see whether there was the chance of opening it up.

It was much like the Mary Celeste situation, the last rota

from the last week of operation was still on the notice board.

There was sort of unfinished cups of coffee, bits of chocolate bars,

there were people's belongings left in the lockers, their

And that really was part of the appeal.

And when we have brought our friends and those who might come to ride

here in the intervening years, they've always said, try and leave

The platform you are about to see looks much as it did on the day

But now the railway is reopening as a visitor attraction with two

battery-powered trains specially made in the UK, getting

He's writing to the famous poet WH Auden at the GPO film unit.

This is the night mail crossing the border, bringing the cheque

Ah, yes, WH Auden and his celebrated poem to the post, the night mail.

What is it about railways and the postal service that we seem

It is a perfect storm for nerds, a railway,

But for the rest of us, assuming we're not nerds,

which is a big assumption, can enjoy it too, perhaps?

Also because it looks like the log flume at Blackpool Pleasure Beach,

presumably it goes quite fast, so you've got the basic

You can feel when it's going down or up, which is

And no disrespect, I like the unvarnished quality of it.

You can see the stalagtites, or is it stalagmites,

You can see the cladding, the rings that are put

We are occasionally asked whether, like so many London Underground

terminals, you might find a mouse or a rat down here.

Because there were no people riding the trains and because there were no

passengers on the platforms, there was no food for such things,

so unusually for underground London, it was a relatively rodent free

We've left Stephen Smith down there! The front page of The Times

tomorrow, the Irish want a sea border with the UK after Brexit,

Theresa May suffering a new setback in the negotiations of the Dublin

have said that the proposed Irish border was unworkable. It will

antagonise the DUP because it will object to any implication that

Northern Ireland should not be treated as part of the UK.

Before we go, 50 years ago today, the law in England

and Wales changed - homosexuality was no longer illegal.

One of those who spoke in favour of the law was the Earl of Arran.

Here's an excerpt of his speech in 1966 -

voiced for Radio 4 by the actor Alan Cumming -

Because of the bill now to be enacted, perhaps a million human

beings will be able to live in greater peace.

I find this an awesome and marvellous thing.

The late Oscar Wilde, on his release from Reading jail,

wrote to a friend, "Yes, we shall win in the end but the road

will be long and red with monstrous martyrdoms."

My Lords, Mr Wilde was right, the road has been long

and the martyrdoms many, monstrous and bloody.

Today, please God, sees the end of that road.

It isn't really the kind of whether we'd be hoping for at this time of

year but in