14/08/2017 Newsnight


14/08/2017

In-depth investigation and analysis of the stories behind the day's headlines. With Emma Barnett.


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But tonight the Government's Brexit position, finally,

:00:00.:00:15.

In something that looks a lot like the Customs Union,

:00:16.:00:18.

but with Britain able to negotiate free trade agreements with the

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We ask whether the proposed transitional arrangement is possible

:00:22.:00:25.

Map and two days after the event. -- and finally two days after the

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event. And those who cause violence

:00:44.:00:44.

in its name are criminals and thugs. Including the KKK, neo-Nazis,

:00:45.:00:48.

white supremacists and other hate groups that are repugnant

:00:49.:00:50.

to everything we hold Trump this evening disavowed the

:00:51.:00:59.

racists but will this be enough to stem the tide of criticism of how he

:01:00.:01:03.

handled events in Charlottesville? Also tonight, after one of the most

:01:04.:01:06.

exciting opening weekends in its 25-year history,

:01:07.:01:09.

we ask one of the Premier League's architects whether it has changed

:01:10.:01:11.

British football for the better. And now, disengaged from the shirt,

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I saw with wonder and surprise... Not the plaything of a boy,

:01:15.:01:18.

nor the weapon of a man, The Prime Minister returns this week

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from her walking holiday in Europe and her government is keen to show

:01:34.:01:40.

it's stealing the march on Brexit. Until now the predominant features

:01:41.:01:44.

of this summer have been Cabinet in-fighting and criticism over

:01:45.:01:47.

the speed at which they're But tonight a picture is starting

:01:48.:01:49.

to emerge of what Britain's negotiators will be pushing

:01:50.:01:55.

for in Brussels. Tomorrow a "future partnership

:01:56.:01:59.

paper" will lay out the government's aspirations for one particularly

:02:00.:02:04.

thorny issue - the customs union, how we trade with our

:02:05.:02:07.

European neighbours. This isn't a formal negotiating

:02:08.:02:11.

position, that is still to come, but the plans suggest that the UK

:02:12.:02:14.

wants to put in place a temporary customs union during a transitional

:02:15.:02:19.

period after we leave the EU This is after the Chancellor

:02:20.:02:21.

and International Trade Secretaries wrote a joint article

:02:22.:02:29.

in the Sunday Telegraph making explicit that they want us out

:02:30.:02:31.

of the customs union the moment We will get full details of the

:02:32.:02:34.

government's proposals tomorrow. editor Helen Thomas has been looking

:02:35.:02:52.

at the government's proposals. It is one of the big questions of

:02:53.:03:04.

Brexit, were Britain step part of the customs union, which allows

:03:05.:03:08.

goods to flow freely tariff free between the countries. Today the

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first glimpse of a real answer from the government. The government wants

:03:12.:03:16.

an interim period where we keep a close association with the customs

:03:17.:03:20.

union. Good news for those fearing a hard cliff edge Brexit. And it's

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meant to provide certainty to businesses. The government has also

:03:25.:03:29.

proposed two possible models for what happens in the future after

:03:30.:03:34.

that. The first is a streamlined customs system that uses technology

:03:35.:03:38.

and other agreements to remove as many barriers to trade as possible.

:03:39.:03:43.

The second is a new customs partnership, a spoke arrangement

:03:44.:03:47.

that enables trade to carry on very much as it does at the moment.

:03:48.:03:52.

Budget abyss spoke arrangement. That's back up. A customs union is

:03:53.:03:56.

where a group of countries band together. In the case of the EU it

:03:57.:04:01.

agrees, no customs duties and borders between states so countries

:04:02.:04:05.

can be traded between those countries free of charge -- so goods

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can be traded free of charge. But if goods coming from other countries

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they are charged. Each in the same way, whether it's going into France,

:04:14.:04:19.

Greece, Italy and any other country in the region. And crucially members

:04:20.:04:24.

are banned by the EU's Common commercial policy. Which means they

:04:25.:04:27.

are not able to strike their own trade deals with other countries.

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Philip Hammond and Liam Fox this weekend called for a time limited

:04:33.:04:37.

interim period for transition yet stressed they were agreed that

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during this period the UK will be outside the single market and

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outside the customs union. Well, on the latest proposals they will

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indeed be a period of transition. And it will be time limited. But

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what the government seems to be saying is that we would leave the

:04:56.:05:00.

customs union only to move to separate arrangement as similar to

:05:01.:05:03.

it as humanly possible. The big difference would be that the UK

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wants the right to start negotiating its own trade deals, even if it does

:05:09.:05:12.

not sign them what could be contentious. We would be leaving the

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customs union only to stay as close to it as possible. Firstly there is

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a legal problem. As long as you are part of close to the EU customs

:05:23.:05:25.

union the rules don't let strike your own trade agreements. Secondly

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a practical point, other countries like Canada and New Zealand that

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might do deals with the UK don't want to negotiate unless they know

:05:34.:05:39.

what the UK's future relationship with the EU will look like and they

:05:40.:05:42.

will have to wait some time before they know the answer. So what about

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longer-term options. If it is option one which means border checks at

:05:49.:05:51.

least governments and businesses will have had time to prepare. But

:05:52.:05:57.

option two, a new type of customs partnership, could mean no

:05:58.:06:00.

disruptions at the Borders at all. It all comes down to negotiation. Is

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the free flow of German cars and Italian press Dzeko important enough

:06:08.:06:10.

for Michel Barnier wrote to let the UK strike its own trade deals on the

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side? And will the UK be prepared to tell enough rules to make that

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happen? Helen Thomas there. Full details on this proposal will be

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released tomorrow, what we've had is just a preview but there's enough

:06:27.:06:28.

meat in it to discuss. Joining me now is leading Brexiteer

:06:29.:06:32.

and Conservative MP John Redwood. Also with me is the Labour MP

:06:33.:06:34.

Chris Leslie who is a spokesperson for the campaign group Open Britain

:06:35.:06:38.

which is campaigning Good evening to you. John, if I

:06:39.:06:46.

could start with you. It is slightly odd, is not that Liam Fox and the

:06:47.:06:50.

Chancellor got together this weekend, wrote this article in the

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Sunday Telegraph and say they want us to be out of the customs union by

:06:55.:06:59.

March 2019, and then we will have this transitional period where we

:07:00.:07:03.

are in the customs union for we don't know how long. It is a mess. I

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don't think the second part is true. It is good news that

:07:09.:07:22.

the Chancellor and the trade secretary both agree with the

:07:23.:07:25.

government 's policy which has been a stated policy for some time but we

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are leaving the single market and leaving the customs union. That

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isn't just the government's wish. It is the expressed view of Parliament

:07:31.:07:33.

because we had the important vote on this in the recent Parliament and we

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agreed we would leave the single market and the customs union. This

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shows the fudging it because you will be in the position where you

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want the UK and the customs union, all but in name. It is a fudge. The

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document has a couple of options on technical issues about how customs

:07:46.:07:50.

will work once we have left the customs union. Of course we would

:07:51.:07:52.

like something smooth and similar to what we have at the moment, it's

:07:53.:07:56.

easier to replicate things you've already got. But we won't be in the

:07:57.:08:01.

customs union, will be making our own trade agreements. And we have 19

:08:02.:08:06.

months before we are likely to leave the European Union. So instead of

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concentrating on a transitional arrangement afterwards surely we

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should maximise our use of the 19 months. One good thing about this

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paper is that it is getting the media and we hope, the EU, to

:08:19.:08:24.

understand about trade now. You've brought up the EU, it is all very

:08:25.:08:27.

well to say, we are off but we would like all the same perks until we've

:08:28.:08:32.

sorted out our next deals. These are not perks. Some people would say

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they are. Let me ask you, why on earth would Brussels consent to

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this. Because they have much more trade than we do in terms of trade

:08:42.:08:45.

and volume of trade and particularly value of trade that can attract and

:08:46.:08:51.

rules. If we go out with no deal which is feasible for Britain and

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would be fine, there will be big tariffs on agricultural products. I

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don't think everyone agrees it would be fine including Chris. The

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government 's line is that no deal is better than a bad deal. Let me

:09:08.:09:14.

explain. Agricultural products, things that can attract high

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tariffs, they can bring in a massive surplus and we don't want that. You

:09:18.:09:21.

are sure that would be a mess, we are going back to this land of

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wanting to have your cake and eat it. Maybe the penny is beginning to

:09:25.:09:29.

drop somewhere in Whitehall that this idea of leaving the customs

:09:30.:09:33.

union, we can wait for the single market, we'd like to stay in that as

:09:34.:09:38.

well, wouldn't be that good for our economy, society, and prosperity

:09:39.:09:44.

large. The problem is that trying to extricate Britain from what, 57

:09:45.:09:49.

different trade deals that EU have made over the last 40 years leaves

:09:50.:09:54.

Britain and in the cold because of Brexit with all of that, to peace

:09:55.:09:58.

pipe all those jigsaw pieces, how are you going to put those pieces --

:09:59.:10:03.

two piece back all those pieces, how you going to... Do you see it, Chris

:10:04.:10:10.

Leslie, as is often in of the position? We thought we were heading

:10:11.:10:13.

for a so-called hard Brexit and we were leaving the customs union and

:10:14.:10:17.

going for a deal that is almost exactly the same in all but name do

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you know hope this is a softer Brexit. I would hope so and Philip

:10:22.:10:25.

Hammond seems to be trying to pull the government in that direction. My

:10:26.:10:29.

worry is that there are so many obstacles that have to be thought

:10:30.:10:33.

through properly. For instance, how is the UK going to get a fresh free

:10:34.:10:39.

trade agreement with the EU through all of those national parliaments

:10:40.:10:44.

across the EU. For instance all of those existing trade deals that we

:10:45.:10:49.

in the UK enjoy, how do we get those grand fathered, basically, readopted

:10:50.:11:01.

the UK. We are facing a problem. The Vote Leave guys promised, in the

:11:02.:11:07.

referendum, John and Vote Leave promised that straight after the

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referendum, from day one, we'd be able to negotiate all these trade

:11:12.:11:16.

deals. But has not happened. Tomorrow's papers are writing this

:11:17.:11:20.

up as a victory for those who support softer Brexit in the

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challenge, a victory for the Chancellor. As an ardent Brexiteer

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do you feel in any way you've been sold down the river? I don't agree

:11:28.:11:32.

with that analysis at all. Government policy is clear that we

:11:33.:11:36.

leave the single market and the customs union. All this trade

:11:37.:11:39.

agreements we have with the EU and the rest of the world will translate

:11:40.:11:44.

to us as well if ourselves in the party wanted, it is nothing to do

:11:45.:11:51.

with the EU, it's about us. If Iraq that is 57 bilateral deals of all

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the countries in the world. When will that happen? It won't be March

:11:55.:12:02.

2019... Muggy give us date. I see no reason why the trade should not

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happen at all. John Redwood, would you prefer Jacob Rhys Mogg to do

:12:10.:12:13.

this deal instead of Theresa May? I'm happy with Theresa May, she is

:12:14.:12:17.

the leader, and Mr Rhys Mogg says he isn't running the leader. We are

:12:18.:12:25.

going to lead in March 20 19. We will leave the single market...

:12:26.:12:31.

Weirdly, John Redwood is happy and Chris Leslie, you are also happy.

:12:32.:12:36.

It's a reversal of the whole of the Brexit process and I think we could

:12:37.:12:40.

still go in that direction. Thank you very much. Brexit back on the

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agenda. Elsewhere, President Trump this

:12:43.:12:46.

evening condemned the neo-Nazis, KKK members and activists from other

:12:47.:12:48.

hate groups who sparked the violence this weekend

:12:49.:12:50.

in Charlottesville, Virginia - one of America's largest

:12:51.:12:52.

recent public gatherings The trouble led to the

:12:53.:12:54.

death of anti-fascist campaigner Heather Heyer

:12:55.:12:58.

and left 19 others injured. Today's remarks were,

:12:59.:13:00.

you might think, a standard presidential statement

:13:01.:13:05.

under the circumstances, yet it took Mr Trump two

:13:06.:13:06.

days to reach a position where he was prepared to speak out

:13:07.:13:11.

against the far-right elements whose support some believe helped him

:13:12.:13:14.

into the White House. How significant is the extreme

:13:15.:13:17.

right in America - and has Trump created the conditions

:13:18.:13:22.

in which the movement might grow? Gabriel Gatehouse has been examining

:13:23.:13:25.

the aftermath of a shocking weekend. This report contains some strong

:13:26.:13:35.

language. They came to Charlottesville

:13:36.:13:38.

prepared for confrontation. The Unite the Right protesters

:13:39.:13:49.

included neo-Nazis and members They brought shields

:13:50.:13:56.

and helmets, clubs and guns. By mid-afternoon, one woman

:13:57.:14:05.

was dead, killed by a speeding car, allegedly driven by a man described

:14:06.:14:09.

as having an interest White supremacists were condemned

:14:10.:14:12.

by nearly everybody We condemn in the strongest possible

:14:13.:14:18.

terms this egregious display of hatred, bigotry and violence,

:14:19.:14:28.

on many sites. -- of hatred, bigotry

:14:29.:14:37.

and violence, on many sides. A neo-Nazi website interpreted this

:14:38.:14:39.

statement as a tacit What might have been a tragic

:14:40.:14:41.

but isolated incident of political violence has become an existential

:14:42.:14:44.

question about where The far right that we're talking

:14:45.:14:46.

about here believes that white people in the United States

:14:47.:14:53.

are being "dispossessed". So when they heard Trump talk

:14:54.:14:56.

about building a wall, when they heard him talk

:14:57.:15:01.

about Mexicans being criminals and rapists, when he retweeted

:15:02.:15:05.

somebody whose account, their Twitter handle

:15:06.:15:10.

was called "White Genocide", these were all things that thrilled

:15:11.:15:14.

them, that energised them, that made them believe that

:15:15.:15:17.

Donald Trump was one of them This has been declared

:15:18.:15:19.

unlawful assembly. The authorities in Charlottesville

:15:20.:15:28.

were taken aback by how fast The governor of Virginia said

:15:29.:15:30.

the right-wing protesters The counterdemonstrators

:15:31.:15:33.

seemed less well armed, but no less angry and,

:15:34.:15:37.

say witnesses on the right, Look out there yourself for footage

:15:38.:15:39.

of these rallies and these marches That doesn't excuse any behaviour,

:15:40.:15:46.

on either side, that's But I'm saying that if we want

:15:47.:16:00.

to have a full and frank conversation about this,

:16:01.:16:04.

we have to realise that these The protest in Charlottesville

:16:05.:16:06.

was sensibly called in defence of a statue

:16:07.:16:10.

to a Confederate general. Their torchlit procession

:16:11.:16:12.

was reminiscent of the Klan America has changed since then,

:16:13.:16:14.

but not, perhaps, as much as eight years of an Obama

:16:15.:16:18.

presidency might suggest. Black quarterbacks on the team

:16:19.:16:22.

of white supremacy hasn't helped us. On the eve of Donald Trump's

:16:23.:16:27.

inauguration I met Silky Slim, a community activist in Baton Rouge,

:16:28.:16:30.

Louisiana. The KKK, he told me then,

:16:31.:16:33.

had never really gone away. Even so, today he's taken

:16:34.:16:35.

aback by the vehemence When we talked to you back then,

:16:36.:16:39.

when you came here, one of the things we really didn't

:16:40.:16:46.

understand, the language where people were asking us,

:16:47.:16:48.

when they came from England, France and other places,

:16:49.:16:51.

do you think this is going to be a race war, we were like no,

:16:52.:16:54.

we're fighting against injustice. But now, we definitely see a race

:16:55.:16:57.

war on the horizon here in America. They aren't even hiding

:16:58.:17:00.

behind their hoods any more. With Trump in office,

:17:01.:17:02.

they think this is something that they can bring to the forefront

:17:03.:17:07.

and America has to accept it. It's a very crazy time right

:17:08.:17:10.

here in America now. Under pressure, Donald Trump today

:17:11.:17:12.

condemned white supremacy more And those who cause violence

:17:13.:17:17.

in its name are criminals and thugs, including the KKK,

:17:18.:17:28.

neo-Nazis, white supremacists and other hate groups that

:17:29.:17:33.

are repugnant to everything But in Charlottesville

:17:34.:17:35.

and elsewhere, there are those who fear his presidency has

:17:36.:17:44.

unleashed forces many thought consigned to history,

:17:45.:17:47.

and opened wounds that the passage Joining me now from New York

:17:48.:17:50.

are the conservative commentator Ann Coulter and Ellis Cose,

:17:51.:17:57.

a fellow of the American Civil Liberties Union and author

:17:58.:18:00.

of multiple books exploring Thank you for joining us. Donald

:18:01.:18:13.

Trump called a press conference today in which he explicitly

:18:14.:18:18.

condemned members of the KKK, neo-Nazis, he knew that he had done

:18:19.:18:22.

something wrong in not explicitly condemning the groups before, didn't

:18:23.:18:27.

he? No, I don't think so. I think that there were different factions

:18:28.:18:33.

that were so heavily... The Republican party in Washington hates

:18:34.:18:37.

Trump and were pushing him to do it, I don't think he should have. To

:18:38.:18:41.

give your view a more accurate description of what happened, the

:18:42.:18:46.

New York Times report, one of the most liberal reporters here, said

:18:47.:18:51.

that the violence was coming from both sides. In fact it was New York

:18:52.:18:55.

militia members doing a better job than the police, who were told to

:18:56.:19:00.

stand down by Democrats. This country has been ruled by left-wing

:19:01.:19:05.

violence for more than a year now. If I can just interrupt, it is a

:19:06.:19:08.

false equivalence to say left-wing violence was the same as fascist

:19:09.:19:14.

white supremacists coming together, walking in jack boots, holding guns,

:19:15.:19:20.

saying that you will not defeat us, dues will not replace us, shouting

:19:21.:19:25.

all sorts of hateful slogans, they started the rally and created the

:19:26.:19:30.

rally and it is the largest group of white supremacist with their faces

:19:31.:19:37.

shown. It isn't the same as antifascist protesters coming

:19:38.:19:41.

together. Absolutely wrong, the "Antifascist", the labels you put on

:19:42.:19:52.

them, those protesters burned down Berkeley twice to prevent me and

:19:53.:19:58.

others from speaking, they shut down a Rose Parade in Portland that has

:19:59.:20:01.

gone on for years because the local Republicans were going to March. No

:20:02.:20:07.

Conservative can speak at a college campus because the "anti-fascists"

:20:08.:20:12.

smashed windows and beat people up. The one actual legal difference as

:20:13.:20:16.

opposed to a label that you're going to put on them is that these alleged

:20:17.:20:21.

Nazis, some work, someone not, there were a few Nazis, I'm not one of

:20:22.:20:26.

them, they had a permit to speak and they were not allowed to speak. The

:20:27.:20:30.

anti-fascists disrupted a legal gathering. Donald Trump has clearly

:20:31.:20:38.

condemned the KKK today, perhaps late, you would say, but has he done

:20:39.:20:48.

enough? Has he done enough? He's done all I think. I think it's right

:20:49.:20:56.

to say they had a permit and one reason for that is because the ACLU

:20:57.:21:00.

stood up for them to get a permit. We have to separate the question of

:21:01.:21:04.

freedom of speech from what the speech entailed and what they

:21:05.:21:08.

encouraged and what they created. The problem is that we had a group

:21:09.:21:15.

of white racists who wanted a race riot, basically. There's no way

:21:16.:21:19.

around that. And the fact that the president took two days to speak to

:21:20.:21:26.

it is ridiculous. It's a movement like Witness or anyone who season

:21:27.:21:33.

something, instead of making an immediate statement, speaking two

:21:34.:21:36.

days after being beaten up and finally saying OK, I'll do it...

:21:37.:21:41.

Even when he spoke out he mixed up his message by saying he was

:21:42.:21:47.

thinking of pardoning a sheriff in Arizona who was convicted of racial

:21:48.:21:52.

profiling and slamming the black CEO who resigned, dating to his lack of

:21:53.:21:59.

fortitude in speaking about this before. Clearly Donald Trump has a

:22:00.:22:04.

problem when it comes to associating himself from virulent racism in

:22:05.:22:09.

America, and no president should have that problem that they are such

:22:10.:22:14.

a big part of his face that he must accommodate them -- a big part of

:22:15.:22:19.

his base. A former KKK leader who was at the March said that "We are

:22:20.:22:23.

going to fulfil the promises of Donald Trump. " Why are they doing

:22:24.:22:28.

it in Donald Trump's name and is that the reason he refused to risk

:22:29.:22:32.

this elite condemned them in the immediate aftermath of the Wyatt? --

:22:33.:22:37.

he refused to explicitly condemned them in the aftermath of the riot.

:22:38.:22:44.

If we're talking about how long it takes for a condemnation, the Black

:22:45.:22:48.

Lives Matter activists are responsible for killing ten cops

:22:49.:22:57.

last year. Five in Louisiana. How many black people lost their lives

:22:58.:23:02.

in America last year...? Why wasn't president Obama asked to denounce

:23:03.:23:07.

that. That is a smear, Black Lives Matter did not kill ten cops, that

:23:08.:23:13.

is an incorrect slur, it is a lie. Neither did the clan. The man who

:23:14.:23:18.

drove a car did not... You don't even know if this was... It is a

:23:19.:23:27.

flat out live. It isn't. -- a flat out lie. These are people who are

:23:28.:23:32.

part of Donald Trump's base so he has a lot of trouble associating

:23:33.:23:36.

himself. Hillary had Black Lives Matter speakers at her convention.

:23:37.:23:41.

Donald Trump is not going to have David Duke at his convention. In a

:23:42.:23:45.

freedom of speech and expression you are both speaking at the same time.

:23:46.:23:47.

Thank you for joining us. Saudi Arabia - a key ally

:23:48.:23:48.

of the UK and America - has been ruled as an absolute

:23:49.:23:51.

monarchy since its foundation. Any opposition in the country

:23:52.:23:54.

is often brutally oppressed - even it seems when the dissent comes

:23:55.:23:56.

from within the reigning Al Saud royal family,

:23:57.:24:00.

which has more than 10,000 members. BBC Arabic has been investigating

:24:01.:24:04.

allegations that the Saudi monarchy has operated a system of illegal

:24:05.:24:07.

abduction and capture of dissident Princes who have

:24:08.:24:13.

criticised the government, including evidence of Princes

:24:14.:24:16.

kidnapped in Europe and forced back to Saudi Arabia,

:24:17.:24:23.

where they've not been He's one of the grandsons

:24:24.:24:25.

of King Abdulaziz ibn Saud, He is also a fierce critic

:24:26.:24:34.

of the ruling elite in the kingdom. In January 2016 he was preparing

:24:35.:24:41.

to travel to Cairo on a private jet offered to him by the Saudi

:24:42.:24:50.

consulate in Paris. Two of his staff told us

:24:51.:24:55.

what happened on that flight. Their identities are

:24:56.:24:57.

hidden to protect them. It wasn't until just before

:24:58.:25:03.

we landed that we realised As soon as the Prince realised

:25:04.:25:05.

where we were he got up without his walker and was trying

:25:06.:25:10.

to get towards the door. We looked out the window and we just

:25:11.:25:13.

saw a bunch of people get out with their rifles slung

:25:14.:25:22.

over their chests and The soldiers and cabin crew dragged

:25:23.:25:24.

Sultan from the plane. He was screaming at his team

:25:25.:25:30.

to call the US embassy. A Saudi prince and his team

:25:31.:25:35.

of European and American nationals were kidnapped and taken to Saudi

:25:36.:25:47.

Arabia. The foreigners were allowed

:25:48.:25:49.

to leave three days later. Sultan has not been

:25:50.:25:52.

heard from since. Other dissident princes have also

:25:53.:25:56.

gone missing since 2015. Our investigation gathered evidence

:25:57.:26:01.

of the kidnapping and illegal rendition of family members who'd

:26:02.:26:08.

criticised the Saudi rulers. I'm meeting Prince Khalid

:26:09.:26:10.

Bin Farhan al-Saud. His branch of the family fell

:26:11.:26:14.

out of favour long ago, and more recently he began

:26:15.:26:17.

to question the Saudi Eventually he fled to Germany

:26:18.:26:19.

and claimed asylum. According to Prince Khalid,

:26:20.:26:55.

the fate of the dissident princes is decided at the very top

:26:56.:26:59.

of the Saudi government. This is Prince Turki

:27:00.:27:16.

bin Bandar al-Saud. He was once a major in the Saudi

:27:17.:27:22.

police force, with access to highly The bitter inheritance

:27:23.:27:25.

dispute with the family On his release he fled to Paris

:27:26.:27:28.

where he lived in this apartment. In June 2012 he began posting videos

:27:29.:27:34.

on YouTube in which he calls I've spent months tracking down

:27:35.:27:38.

people in Paris who knew Turki. Most are reluctant to speak,

:27:39.:27:56.

saying they fear retribution This man is a blogger and activist

:27:57.:27:59.

who was a friend of Turki's. I searched the international

:28:00.:28:42.

media for news of Turki. I found this article

:28:43.:28:46.

in a Moroccan newspaper. It says Turki was about to leave

:28:47.:28:49.

Morocco for France when he was Then, following a request

:28:50.:28:52.

from the Saudi authorities, he was deported, with the approval

:28:53.:28:59.

of a Moroccan court. If the article is accurate,

:29:00.:29:02.

it looks as if the Moroccan authorities may have colluded

:29:03.:29:05.

with the Saudis in We put these allegations

:29:06.:29:06.

to the government of Morocco. I'd heard about yet another Saudi

:29:07.:29:13.

prince who had disappeared. Saud bin Saif al-Nasr

:29:14.:29:23.

was a relatively minor royal. A playboy with a liking for Europe's

:29:24.:29:25.

casinos and expensive hotels. But in 2014 he began tweeting

:29:26.:29:31.

attacks on the Saudi monarchy. To those who say I'm criticising

:29:32.:29:34.

people from my family, I say it's obligatory

:29:35.:29:37.

to state the truth. In September 2015 an anonymous Suadi

:29:38.:29:55.

price wrote asking for a coup. The letters went online

:29:56.:29:59.

and were read by millions. This was an astonishing

:30:00.:30:01.

display of opposition. Prince Saud was the only royal

:30:02.:30:03.

to endorse the letters. This was tantamount to treason

:30:04.:30:07.

and may have sealed his fate. A few days later, his Twitter

:30:08.:30:10.

account fell silent. This tweet on September

:30:11.:30:17.

10th 2015 was his last. I call for the nation to turn

:30:18.:30:20.

the content of the letters Although there is no definitive

:30:21.:30:23.

proof, Prince Khalid and two other sources believe he may have fallen

:30:24.:30:27.

into an elaborate trap. For one of the Princess, Sultan,

:30:28.:31:12.

2016 was not the first time in 2003 and placed under

:31:13.:31:15.

house arrest in Saudi. After his health deteriorated,

:31:16.:31:25.

he was allowed to leave Saudi in 2014 to seek medical treatment

:31:26.:31:29.

in the United States. He later placed a criminal complaint

:31:30.:31:33.

against his cousin and a Saudi official, accusing them

:31:34.:31:36.

of the 2003 abduction. His lawyer informed the Swiss

:31:37.:31:39.

authorities about the most recent kidnapping, hoping something might

:31:40.:31:42.

be done about the first. In my understanding of Swiss

:31:43.:31:50.

laws, you have 15 years 15 years from that June date in 2003

:31:51.:31:54.

and it is a lengthy process, going So effectively by suspending

:31:55.:31:59.

the prosecution, it's really defeating the ability in a timely

:32:00.:32:08.

manner to pursue the prosecution. According to Swiss law the legal

:32:09.:32:20.

action against Sultan's alleged We tried to contact the three

:32:21.:32:22.

Princes, without success. When we asked the government

:32:23.:32:25.

of Saudi Arabia to respond to the allegations in this film,

:32:26.:32:34.

it declined to comment. Meanwhile, Prince Khalid,

:32:35.:32:38.

still exiled in Germany, fears he also may face

:32:39.:32:45.

the same fate as Sultan. Some have called it the best opening

:32:46.:33:10.

weekend in the 25 years 31 goals have already been

:33:11.:33:17.

scored since the season When the league launched

:33:18.:33:21.

in 1992 it was described as the big bang moment that

:33:22.:33:24.

would transform the game. Since then TV fees, player salaries

:33:25.:33:26.

and ticket prices have soared. Many believe the standard

:33:27.:33:36.

of the football has skyrocketed 25 years on, has the Premier League

:33:37.:33:38.

done what it set out to do, We'll discuss all that in just

:33:39.:33:42.

a moment, but first here are some MUSIC: Alive and Kicking

:33:43.:33:47.

by Simple Minds Fashion and hairstyles aren't

:33:48.:33:57.

the only things to have moved on in the 25 years since English

:33:58.:34:04.

football's First Division broke away Only 13 foreign players appeared

:34:05.:34:07.

in the Premier League's opening Uefa's latest report

:34:08.:34:10.

on European football said the Premier League

:34:11.:34:14.

now had the highest proportion

:34:15.:34:15.

of foreign players of the 75 It also topped the league

:34:16.:34:18.

for foreign coaches, at 75%. Match day attendances are up,

:34:19.:34:26.

but TV has been where the real Sky paid ?191 million to air live

:34:27.:34:30.

matches for five years, At the last auction,

:34:31.:34:38.

Sky and BT paid a combined ?5.1 billion for just three seasons

:34:39.:34:47.

of match rights. That money has then

:34:48.:34:50.

flowed to the clubs. Despite that, tickets have got

:34:51.:34:53.

pricier, with fans taking the hit. One estimate puts the 1992 average

:34:54.:34:56.

ticket price at about ?7.50. Adjusted for inflation,

:34:57.:35:01.

that would be ?14.25 last year. Last season's average

:35:02.:35:07.

ticket price, according So, are spectators getting more bang

:35:08.:35:12.

for their extra buck? Well, on average there were just

:35:13.:35:19.

0.15 more goals per game last year All that money, it seems,

:35:20.:35:22.

doesn't necessarily make Well, one of the people

:35:23.:35:25.

who negotiated the deal that created the Premier League was its first

:35:26.:35:33.

Chief Executive, Rick Parry. Also with us is Henry Winter, the

:35:34.:35:36.

Chief Football Writer at The Times. Rick Parry, good evening, let me

:35:37.:35:51.

come to your first. As one of the architects of the Premier League has

:35:52.:35:57.

it worked out? Unquestionably. It is arguably the most popular

:35:58.:36:00.

professional sporting contest on the planet, watched in more than 200

:36:01.:36:05.

countries. Popular in many respects, it has certainly done what it set

:36:06.:36:10.

out to do. I think there are challenges. Nothing is perfect and I

:36:11.:36:14.

think in particular at the moment it is disappointing that our teams are

:36:15.:36:19.

not doing well in Europe in the five years up to 2009, we were on the top

:36:20.:36:24.

of the pile, the number one ranked nation, now we are number three.

:36:25.:36:27.

There is a chasm between the Premier League and the football league.

:36:28.:36:32.

Wider than ever before, that is an issue. And perennially national team

:36:33.:36:38.

still is not doing what we all hope it would do and steps can be taken

:36:39.:36:44.

there. Will come onto some of those points in a moment. Henry Winter,

:36:45.:36:50.

you speak to a lot of fans and right on behalf of them, many feel price

:36:51.:36:55.

tag. I think one year ago you saw Liverpool fans holding up that

:36:56.:37:00.

banner which said enough is enough, echoing the views of fans all over

:37:01.:37:04.

the country, not simply in the Premier League, some of the prices

:37:05.:37:09.

being asked of fans, it was unconscionable for many in the

:37:10.:37:12.

difficult economic climate. Certainly the more intelligent clubs

:37:13.:37:16.

like Stoke City are addressing the price issue. It's not simply that

:37:17.:37:21.

the cost for home fans, it's a fans as well forget the atmosphere going

:37:22.:37:26.

on many occasions, finally I think now clubs have finally realised that

:37:27.:37:33.

ticket prices have been too much, the football supporters Federation

:37:34.:37:37.

who have led this campaign together with their counterparts at

:37:38.:37:40.

Liverpool, they want and ?20 fall away tickets, this 20 is bloody

:37:41.:37:45.

campaign. As Rick said the huge amounts of money flowing into the

:37:46.:37:49.

games and clubs through sponsorship and revenue, they have to start

:37:50.:37:52.

bringing down their prices even more. Sharing the wealth, should

:37:53.:38:00.

more money go from the Premier League to invest in the grassroots

:38:01.:38:04.

of football, it's only 100 million that has been pledged, when you

:38:05.:38:12.

think of the figures involved. ?100 million in terms of the Premier

:38:13.:38:17.

League is a significant sum, in terms of grassroots, of course more

:38:18.:38:23.

can always be done... That's two players from Manchester City, in

:38:24.:38:27.

compared to the cost of the TV rights. Or less than half a player

:38:28.:38:38.

in the case of PSG. The Premier League for its greatness has not let

:38:39.:38:41.

the cash flow around in the right way and has denied its fans access.

:38:42.:38:47.

Unquestionably there are some issues that needs to be addressed, it's

:38:48.:38:52.

been a success on many, many levels but I think there are some

:38:53.:38:56.

challenges ahead, and neglecting fans, that is huge mistake because

:38:57.:39:00.

at the end of the day it is atmosphere that is of paramount

:39:01.:39:05.

importance. Fans absolutely part of the event, and without traditional

:39:06.:39:14.

fans, the spectacle is not what it should be. Many fans of an older

:39:15.:39:23.

profile, due to their age, Henry, only 13 foreign players in the

:39:24.:39:26.

Premier League started, your entire career has been about covering the

:39:27.:39:33.

Premier League. The now - know the majority of foreign players, how

:39:34.:39:37.

much of an issue has this been for England's national team. My career

:39:38.:39:41.

has almost been learning new languages with the welter of foreign

:39:42.:39:46.

players coming in! It's a huge issue for the team, your statistic of 67%

:39:47.:39:52.

of foreign players impinges on the opportunities, the pathway of these

:39:53.:39:55.

good kids but we've got being developed at the academies, they are

:39:56.:39:59.

not able to force their way into first team squad is because coaches,

:40:00.:40:05.

many of whom are foreign and don't necessarily have any affiliation to

:40:06.:40:08.

the England team, because of the pressure on them to win trophies,

:40:09.:40:13.

they are not going to risk it with young kids. There are exceptions,

:40:14.:40:16.

Mauricio Pochettino at Spurs does give kids a chance as we saw at the

:40:17.:40:21.

weekend. There are some managers who are enlightened on this. But too

:40:22.:40:27.

Fisher. It's huge for the national team because we saw this summer the

:40:28.:40:32.

England age group teams are doing well, the under 19 groups, the under

:40:33.:40:36.

20s, what has happened to the senior teams, they are struggling to get of

:40:37.:40:39.

the group stage of tournaments because too few of these players are

:40:40.:40:43.

getting opportunities. A big challenge. In 25 years maybe we will

:40:44.:40:52.

be talking about 50 years of the Premier League. Rick Parry, Henry

:40:53.:40:53.

Winter, thank you. That's all we've got

:40:54.:40:55.

time for tonight. But before we go, it emerged over

:40:56.:40:57.

the weekend that the 18th century erotic classic,

:40:58.:41:02.

Fanny Hill, had been removed from a university reading

:41:03.:41:04.

list for being too racy. We didn't want any students who'd

:41:05.:41:06.

hoped to read it to feel So here's the editor of The Amorist,

:41:07.:41:09.

Rowan Pelling, with a passage. And now, disengaged from the shirt,

:41:10.:41:23.

I saw with wonder and surprise... Not the plaything of a boy,

:41:24.:41:27.

nor the weapon of a man, but a maypole of so enormous

:41:28.:41:31.

a standard that, had proportions been observed,

:41:32.:41:34.

it must have belonged Its prodigious size made me shrink

:41:35.:41:36.

again, yet it could not, without pleasure, behold,

:41:37.:41:42.

and even venture to feel such a length and breadth of animated

:41:43.:41:45.

ivory, perfectly well The proud stiffness

:41:46.:41:50.

of which distended its skin, whose smooth polish and velvet

:41:51.:42:04.

softness might vie with that of the most delicate of our sex,

:42:05.:42:07.

and whose exquisite whiteness

:42:08.:42:11.

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