How porous is the border between Northern Ireland and the republic? A former Trump adviser discusses the racism row. The tale of a missing investigative journalist in Copenhagen.
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The unseen border on the island of Ireland
is the latest political dividing line in the Brexit battle.
Want to see how soft this border is right now?
That van is in the Republic, now it's in the UK.
The only hint it's gone from one country to another -
the speed-limit signs go from metric to Imperial.
And as the British Government publishes its post-Brexit
vision for the border, we ask Ireland's Foreign Secretary,
A president who seems to side with white supremicists?
Is Donald Trump a racist or just another politician
We ask his former adviser whether he thinks the president
And a story straight out of a Nordic drama.
Last week, a Danish rocket engineer was arrested and is being kept
in custody as police investigate the circumstances around
the disappearance of journalist Kim Wall.
I mean, it's really bizarre, it's really bizarre.
I mean, he's been out there a lot with people,
I've been sailing with him in the submarine.
Obviously, he had girls out with him sailing and all that,
but what happened that particular day, I've absolutely no idea.
Today, the Government published another position
paper in the long-running Brexit negotiation saga.
Buckle up - we with have at least two more years
This briefing, following hot on the heels of proposals
regarding the customs union, concerns the UK's position
on the Irish border and focuses on the need to avoid a hard border.
Northern Ireland is the only part of the UK that will share a land
The Government stresses that there should be
no new physical infrastructure - such as customs posts or CCTV -
at the 300 mile-long border, which has about 200 crossing points.
Critics have labelled the document as vague on detail
and lambasted the plan as a border smugglers' charter.
David Grossman has been crossing the border himself today,
If you want to see the complexity of the Irish border in action,
follow the tourists to the Guinness brewery in Dublin.
Although the famous black liquid is brewed here in Dublin,
Some of it is then transported two hours north to Belfast to be bottled
and canned and then loaded back onto trucks to travel back
It's the sort of interwoven supply chain that's replicated
And for those companies, a hard border would be a disaster.
The Government's position paper, published today,
suggests that lorries like this will, in future,
be tracked using new technology to create a frictionless border.
As we look forward to Brexit, of course, we do want to ensure
that we don't see a return to the borders of the past, we don't
see a return to a hard border, and that we're able to ensure
that the crucial flow of goods and people between Northern Ireland
and the Republic of Ireland is able to continue in the future.
At the 15 main road border points, 118,000 vehicles cross each day -
80 or more smaller crossing points where data isn't collected.
The official estimate is that, in total,
there are 110 million crossings by people each year.
Wants to see how soft this border is right now?
That van is in the Republic, now it's in the UK.
The only hint it's gone from one country to another -
the speed-limit signs go from metric to Imperial.
The UK Government says it should stay as soft as this -
no border guards, no buildings, no barriers.
At the West Belfast office of Sinn Fein, which campaigned
against leaving the EU, they're sceptical that this
frictionless, technology-enabled border can actually work.
They haven't yet indicated how these technical solutions
All the people that we're talking to from the business community,
from government departments, all argue that any technical
solution will still add at least to further bureaucracy and
further barriers to trade, movement of people and citizenship rights
and so on, so we see no evidence that there are technical solutions
which will not create further barriers on the island of Ireland,
which is something we will all be determined to avoid and prevent.
In 2015, ?2.7 billion worth of goods
was sold from Northern Ireland to the Republic.
However, this is dwarfed by the 10.7 billion
that was sold from Northern Ireland to Great Britain.
This is why the UK Government position paper rejects the idea that
some have come up with of moving the border from where it is now
to the Irish Sea, to allow the island of Ireland
The Government has said that the idea of moving the border
is both constitutionally and economically wrong.
That is music to the ears of the DUP, the party which is now,
to support Theresa May's administration.
We will not accept, and the Government has now said
it will not accept, special status for Northern Ireland
which removes Northern Ireland from the rest of the United Kingdom
And don't forget, it's the Irish Government and the EU
negotiators who have said they do not wish to upset the terms
And the terms of the Good Friday agreement make it quite clear
that the constitutional status of Northern Ireland cannot be
changed unless there is a clear majority in Northern Ireland
So the Guinness, and the thousands of other products,
keep flowing across the border unchallenged for now.
Today's position paper is designed to put pressure on both the EU
and the Irish government to help keep it that way.
But what does the Irish government think of the proposals?
I spoke to Simon Coveney, Ireland's Foreign Secretary,
I began by asking whether he welcomed the Government's proposals.
Well, certainly, I think we welcome the publication
of a detailed written document, and we've been calling now for
quite some time for a detailed paper from the British Government
on what their aspirations are in the context
of Ireland and Northern Ireland, for the Brexit negotiations,
There's a lot of good stuff in it from our perspective,
very strong language in terms of protecting the Good Friday
agreement in full, very strong, supportive language around what's
called the common travel area, which for many, many years,
long before we joined the European Union, has allowed
British people in Ireland and Irish people in Britain to enjoy
There has been suggestions, up until now, coming from
some sources of the UK that, look, we can solve
this problem by technology, by putting cameras on the border,
having numberplate recognition systems.
And I've always been very sceptical of that,
and so that why it is very welcome today that the British Government
is saying clearly that there will be no infrastructure
Let's just say your counterparts in Brussels, the 26 other countries,
do not go for this and we end up with no deal, as Theresa May
has said might be the case, and let's say we are in a situation
where the UK allows chlorinated chicken from America -
will that be a circumstance within which
the Irish government will erect some kind of border?
Well, you know, if Britain decide to take an approach
that clearly applies different food safety standards to Britain,
including Northern Ireland, to the common market
in the European Union, then we have a real problem.
There are two partners in this negotiation.
The other happens to represent 27 other countries,
so what we have today from Britain, which is welcome,
is an approach to the negotiations, much of which is very much supported
by the Irish government, but we will have to thrash
through the issues, find compromises, make sure
that we protect the integrity of the European Union in
these negotiations, as well as try to facilitate British ambition.
The idea that Britain is going to be able to negotiate its own free-trade
agreements with countries all over the world and at the same time
expect barrier-free access into the single market,
I don't think that that in itself is realistic.
But if the final deal on the Irish border came back with,
let's say the other 26 members of the European Union wanting
a harder border solution, would you veto the deal?
Well, I'm not going to talk about what ifs at this stage,
we are part of the other negotiating side,
we are part of the EU negotiating team.
Michel Barnier has been very vocal and very protective
of Irish interests to date, because he has made it very clear
that Irish interests are European interests.
This, in many ways, is a test of the European Union in terms
of how it protects small member states, which is exactly what it
needs to do here in the context of the consequences
In your statement today, you said you would be realistic and fair,
but "We will also be stubborn in relation to defending
If you were in a situation where a hard border was favoured
by your fellow members, I presume you would be stubborn
then in vetoing it, that is what I am testing, your resolve.
I don't think we will be in that place, because the EU has already
shown a willingness to show real flexibility to try to accommodate
what are very real vulnerabilities for Ireland in the context of Brexit
- and Britain also in the context of Northern Ireland.
And so we need to work this out and find the political solution
is that, in my view, effectively allows Northern Ireland
to become an extension of the EU customs union,
to create equivalence north and south of the border that can
allow the free movement not only of people but also of goods.
We also need to find a solution for services.
The British Government talks about the need for a common energy
market north and south, because they are totally
So all of these things are part of the complexity
of Brexit, which of course is a consequence of leaving.
And you know, Ireland is a country that had nothing to do
with the decision for Britain to leave the European Union
but is very much now in the middle of the debate to try and ensure
that we protect ourselves in that context.
And that is what I mean when I say that Ireland
will be fair and realistic, but also stubborn.
If we believe that these negotiations are moving
in the wrong direction, if we believe the British
Government is being unreasonable, we will say so.
I mean, I believe that Ireland is actually Britain's closest
friend here in the context of Brexit, and friends need
I think some of the aspirations that I've heard are not realistic -
in the context of the Brexit negotiations -
and I need to be honest about that, but I think a lot of what we've seen
today in the Irish and Northern Ireland paper coming
from the British Government is really good.
The Irish Foreign Minister, Simon Coveney, who I was speaking
or a racial slur from a politician who should know better?
Earlier today, Sarah Champion - the Shadow Women
and Equalities Minister - resigned from Labour's front bench
after a row erupted about an article she penned for the Sun newspaper.
"British Pakistani men are raping and exploiting white girls,
In the opinion piece, she wrote that "We must accept
for gang-related child sexual exploitation, the convictions
have largely been against British Pakistani men."
She has now apologised for the offence caused
by her "extremely poor choice of words".
But does she have anything to say sorry for?
I'm joined now in the studio by Muhbeen Hussain,
the founder of British Muslim Youth, and from Salford by Amina Lone,
from the Social Action and Research Foundation.
Let me come to you first, Amina, was Sarah champion right to resign from
her post as shadow women and Equalities Minister? No, I don't
think she was, I think she has been punished for a subsequent Collen in
the same paper that referenced her article. And she also said in her
article that the vast majority of convictions are against white men
acting alone. We don't see an outcry from white men. It is understandable
that those crimes are mostly committed by white men in this
country, but she was specific about a certain type of crime from the
community, with cultural differences, and I think she is
being punished and used as a scapegoat because she is an easy
target as a politician. She was very specific about the type of crime she
was talking about, she has been made a scapegoat? The one thing that we
have to be very clear on, it isn't racist to say that Pakistani men are
overrepresented there when it comes to on street grooming, as it is not
racist to say that when you look at the majority of child exploitation,
white men are, in terms of convictions and prosecutions...
Should she have lost their position? I will come to that. She resigned
because she had claimed that she found... She condemned the headline,
she did not agree with it, and what came out from her office manager was
that she was not only accepting of and Budget was thrilled with it.
This is why she resigned. She resigned because of the
contradiction of her own statements. Rather than use saying why she
resigned, I am asking you, should she resign? I think it would have
been a better idea if she apologised... She has apologised.
She apologised six days later. It isn't just about the article, it is
not about stating facts, it is about the language, the rhetoric, the
ramifications of it. One of the ramifications is yes, Trevor
Kavanagh's peas which went on to thank Sarah champion for making it
acceptable to talk about the Muslim problem.
This was a separate piece written by a different writers still employed
by the Sun who quoted Sarah Champion, so you are talking about
the context of that. Which this piece fuelled and we have to
understand language is important and language can fuel. We can understand
that when Sarah Champion was saying that British Pakistanis are raping
white girls, she was not talking about Sajid Javid the Secretary of
State, Sadiq Khan, and she wasn't talking about the vast majority of
Pakistani males. Let me to make this one important point, has anyone
heard about an 81-year-old Yemeni man who was murdered two years ago
and approached by two far-right white extremists and called a
groomer and murdered on the Eve of his second anniversary? Can we stick
with this issue. Can you react to that point that her language fuels
other kinds of hatred and other kinds of prejudice? No, to accuse
Sarah Champion of fuelling racism, it is lazy and it is easy to do. And
if we are going to use, it was clumsy words and she apologised for
those words, but you have to understand that victims of sexual
abuse rarely get heard and believed, they were let down by the system and
the communities. Many faith communities pushed back, the
Catholic Church did when it had its own scandal about sexual
exploitation and understandably, some people in the Muslim community
are doing that. But this is largely men who are very angry about this.
And some of the stuff that I have seen on social media describing the
glee they have got with Sarah Champion resigning is astonishing
and if we are going to talk about language and responsibility, then
that the same argument that people like extremists and Isis use when
they justify what they do from Islamic language so it works both
ways if you use those arguments. One of the issues around many of these
cases to do with gang-related grooming has been, of many, that the
police and authorities involved have been scared to broach the issue
because they are worried about perceived racism. We now in a
situation where we have got an MP who we should say is the MP for
other rum, who has campaigned actively to help those who have been
in these situations and beyond, we in a situation where she has had to
stand down as Meite feel she has the stands down from this post because
she herself cannot talk about this, is that not the problem? That we
make it quite clear, I have supported Sarah Champion and voted
for Sarah Champion. Do you understand that issue? If I can
comment, I voted for her and supported her advocacy work when it
comes to this. But what we have to understand just to say political
correctness is an issue, this is not what the South Yorkshire Police are
saying today. I spoke to the head of South Yorkshire Police and they are
not saying political correctness got in the way and this is why, three
years on, there has not been a single failure from the police or
the social services that has been challenged. Where have the
resignations been, where have the people who have supposedly... Could
you not say this has contributed? Let me finish. We're nearly out of
time. It has contributed to a climate of people being scared to
say what is a real issue? The worst thing about it is that for six days
we talked about critical correctness and race and we have forgotten the
victims that are being brutally abused. And some people would say an
MP is now out of a job, a Shadow Secretary of State, where she had
more power to help. We are not collateral damage. We have not
spoken about Ahmed who was murdered for being called a groomer. We must
stand up for these girls and far right extremists. If that is the
case we must stand up for the girls, the first thing you must do is
believe it... Yes, we have demonstrated against them. You must
create a space within communities where you can talk about it.
Unfortunately, there is still a culture of the blue around sexual
exploitation, Asian girls get bailed systematically by the community
because they get ostracised. So let's talk about it. Do not say, I
supported Sarah Champion... I am sorry, we have to leave that there,
thank you very much. Is Donald Trump a racist,
or just another politician That's what's being asked
across America and around Only 24 hours after the US President
explicitly condemned white supremacists and neo-Nazis
over their violent protest in Charlottesville, Virginia -
having being condemned for not doing so earlier - Donald Trump has
back-pedalled, saying there was "blame on both sides"
and not all marchers Theresa May made her position clear
today, saying it was important to condemn far-right views "wherever
we hear them". So what was Donald Trump
trying to say and why did I asked Sam Nunberg,
former political adviser I think it was unnecessary for the
President yesterday during his press conference to leave it up to
reinterpretation about his initial two statements. If you go over the
choreography of the first two, his initial statement says there is
violence on both sides, I condemn it, I end Tiley condemn it and it is
not excusable -- I entirely. Sam, surely it is a very easy thing
for a President to stand there, just like people on the Republican
side have done, the Bushes... The Bushes have come out now
and said, we need to unilaterally just condemn and reject bigotry
and violence and just say that, in reference to the KKK members
and the white supremacists. The President did,
in his second statement. But he seems to have undone some
of that work with his comments, And what I'm trying to understand
from you, as someone who's worked for him,
is, does he actually hold prejudiced views,
or is he just trying OK, so first of all, he does not
hold any prejudices at all. We can go into it, I can tell
you about it from my own But I also just want to take
the premise of your question, His base is not neo-Nazis,
his base is not the KKK. His base are Republicans
and blue-collar white - predominantly - Democrats
and self-described Independents, and they came out and
they voted for him. If you say Trump holds no racist
or prejudiced views, is one of the reasons why he is kind
of fudging it a bit because he doesn't want to offend
that part of his base? What it is, and this
is where I find it offensive, We feel that the entire base,
that this movement and this organic movement that came out that we have
not seen since the '80s, that got him into office,
where he won states such as Michigan, Wisconsin,
Pennsylvania, that Republicans have not won in over 35 years,
we feel that it is completely delegitimised by parts of the media
when they have incidents like this that you then want to say -
well, they're just a bunch of KKK, they're just a bunch of white
nationalists and they're just Has Donald Trump done
himself a disservice, then, by muddying the waters
and getting defensive? He certainly left it
up to interpretation that his opponents, or others,
or any neutral observers frankly can run with, and he left it up
to an interpretation that his political enemies
can use against him. But by no means is he a racist,
or by no means is he an anti-Semite. I worked for him
from 2011 to mid-2015. I worked for him when people
in my industry would laugh at me when I said, this guy can be elected
President. I worked hundreds of hours
a week for him, nobody would take my phone calls,
we were laughed at, he was called a birther,
he was called a joke. People in the elite
said he had no chance. And subsequently, people leaked
out an eight-year-old Nevertheless, I took responsibility
for it and I was forgiven Yes, Sam, if I may,
just to remind people. You put up this post and you did use
the N word and that was For a racially charged
Facebook post. Even after I was forgiven
by Reverend Sharpton. So, if anything, it shows that
Trump is not a racist, he doesn't want to be
associated with them. And that was after being with me
for five and a half years and knowing that I don't
have a racist bone I mentioned the Bushes have come out
and said there should be no equivocation about the condemnation
of racism, bigotry. And we've also heard only
a few hours ago that Donald Trump has closed down
the Manufacturing Council as well, with regards to the people
around him and the people who are having to sit around him,
because some of them were also very aggrieved by his comments,
or lack of comments, Is he going to be
feeling isolated now? I'm sure he will do an interview,
or he will speak to the American people, and he'll start going back
on the agenda. At the end of the day,
Donald Trump will live or die If the economy is doing well,
the world seems secure, If it is not and he cannot
get an agenda through, he cannot pass tax reform,
he can't fix health care, he will have trouble
getting re-elected. Sam, thank you very much
for talking to us today. It's like a script straight out
of a Nordic thriller. Last week, a Danish rocket
engineer was arrested and is being kept in custody,
as police investigate the circumstances around
the disappearance of the journalist She was interviewing him aboard a
submarine. On Thursday night, off a small dock
to the south of Copenhagen, journalist Kim Wall departed
with celebrity engineer and rocket scientist Peter Madsen
in his self-designed submarine. 17 hours later, Madsen
was rescued by locals after his submarine had sunk,
without Kim Wall. What happened in those 17 hours
has been the subject Madsen's account of the night's
events given to the police has been This is the rather gloomy looking
dock that Peter Madsen claims to have dropped off Kim Wall
at about 10:30pm on Thursday. Now, it's 10:30pm tonight and,
as you can probably see, But helpfully for the police,
a local bar owner here claims to have the whole area covered
with CCTV, and we're Right, so, there's loads
of CCTV here, clearly. And it's all looking out over this
dock, where Peter Madsen claims So you have this information,
but you're not going to even try No, what I'm saying is that
I have bits and pieces I don't in any way think
I can comment on what On Thursday night, workers around
the south of the dock were helping You were here on Thursday
night until when? So, Peter Madsen claimed that he had
brought the submarine back... We saw the submarine over here like,
the days before, but not... Excuse me, madam,
we're from the BBC. We were wondering, I wanted
to quickly ask you, do Yeah, actually, I was here,
but I didn't see anything. Kim Wall grew up in the small
Swedish town of Trelleborg and is a talented journalist,
writing in the New York Times We knew her since she was
a small kid, Kim Wall, There are lots of people knowing
the family, and so...and also her. Peter Madsen's submarine
sank in Koge Bay, 30 miles from Copenhagen -
he says because of One of the first people to locate
Peter Madsen's submarine was and he told me that as he approached
the submarine, it began to sink. Police now think he may have
scuttled his own sub. Peter Madsen is well-known
here in Denmark. He calls himself
an invent-repreneur, with a goal of putting
people into space. His submarine is said to be one
of the biggest of its kind in the world, and it's something
he was deeply proud of. I mean, he's been out
there a lot with people. I've been sailing with him
on that submarine. Obviously, he had girls
out with him sailing and all that, but what happened
that particular day? I mean, obviously, it's strange
that he sank his U-boat. That's what the police said,
he sunk it on purpose, It's like, he...
He, er... It was such a huge effort
to build this boat. And it was such a big part
of him and his life, so... Some of Peter Madsen's story raises
more questions than answers and, as a result, the focus automatically
shifts to Kim Wall. What was she doing in
Peter Madsen's submarine? Was she investigating him,
or did something just go One of the possibilities
is that this is murder, and, obviously, then you need
to look for a motive. Are there journalists that sort of
do investigations on Peter Madsen? Has that been done before?
No, not in this kind of way. I've never seen an
investigation into that. And I must say that I think
that I'm the journalist that by far has written the most about him,
so I would know that. I see him as a very nice and loving
person, with very sound core values. He was obviously a man that had
fights with a lot of people. I mean, he has a whole water
of people behind him that he has been in fights with,
er, and I have been in arguments with him myself, but I've never
experienced an unstable man - in the sense that
I am afraid of him. Madsen denies the charges
against him and says he's innocent, As the days draw out, hope
of finding her alive diminishes. It starts with -
something has happened, but we hope that there
will be some end of it. So we know how this, yeah, sad thing
- or good thing - will end up. That was James Clayton,
with filmmaker Jamie Bowles. Now, you know the difference
between the two statistics the Government uses to measure
inflation - the RPI and the CPI. But just in case -
both the retail price index and the consumer price index look
at how much prices are increasing. But they are calculated
in different ways, and that means
the RPI is generally higher. Well, rail fares are going up 3.6%
in January, and the interest rate
on student loans has risen to 6.1%. These are both linked
to the higher RPI rate of inflation, and some believe it's
a way for the Government to rip off you, the
consumer - but is it? It was created in 1947,
when rationing was in But to many economists,
the retail prices index and to most consumers
it's just a few letters. Replace the R with C, and it becomes
the consumer prices index. Both track the rise in prices
of a basket of goods and services, but there's good reason
to take an interest Commuters should care -
the Government links rises in regulated rail fares to RPI,
which, in July, was 3.6%. Students should care too - interest
on their loans is linked to RPI. is that RPI is widely seen
as a flawed measure. The RPI lost its status
as a national statistic in 2013, and there were a number
of weaknesses identified that means that RPI tends to be higher
than other measures of inflation. So overall we do not see the RPI
as a good measure of inflation, and we strongly discourage people
from using it. This line shows the difference
between RPI and CPI. In the financial crisis,
as interest rates were slashed, But otherwise RPI has
consistently been higher, and that could leave the nation's
commuters and students There may only be one letter in it,
but actually there are three big The first is how
they measure housing costs. RPI, for example, includes
mortgage interest payments, RPI exclude some of the highest
earners and some of the poorest households, whereas CPI
effectively covers everyone. But the third one is
the big one - the formula. The two are just worked
out differently. To produce the price index,
the Government has to collect, I think, about 250,000
prices every month. The method that they use for some
parts of the retail price index is known to create an upward bias,
things go up by more than they come down, and for that reason
the International Labour Office, which offers international
guidelines on how to compile price indices, has been saying for decades
that this measure shouldn't be used. Despite this, the Government says it
has no plans to change its policies. But why not, given that the
Government itself also gets stung? It pays interest on hundreds
of billions of pounds' worth Those interest payments
are also linked to RPI. Meanwhile,
the Office of National Statistics We are required by law
to publish the retail prices index, but we also know that there are
a number of long-term contracts, many signed a long time ago,
that use the retail prices index, so stopping it would simply
not be practical. Our approach has been instead
to develop other measures that that people can use
instead of the RPI. My sense is that if anything,
the problems with the retail prices index are going to get worse,
rather than better, as shopping habits change,
and I think it would be much better for the Government to address
and resolve the problem than for the Government,
the British Government, to carry on publishing a statistic
which is known to be flawed. Rail companies, bond investors,
the student loans market while the taxpayer
could stand to benefit. Perhaps it's time
to consign RPI to history. an economist
from the Royal Statistical Society, and Ben Southwood from
the Adam Smith Institute. If I could come due first, Ben,
consumers are going to be laid end in our pocket if they are being hit
by rail price increases, are they being ripped off by the Government?
In a sense, they are. As was adequately shown there, RPI is a bad
measure of true inflation, although true inflation is an abstract
concept and all we have measures. Because RPI comes in slightly high,
it has allowed the Government to achieve a couple of political goals,
shifting the burden of rail onto those who use it, and not the
general taxpayer, lightening the burden on the general taxpayer,
going up from 50% of a ticket paid by the person who uses the train to
65%. And students? Students pay about 55% of their loans, and the
Government pays about 45%. Now, if we charged them less, the Government
would pick up more of the cost of the education. There is a reasonable
case for that, but a student who benefits from a degree, there is a
reasonable case for them paying for that. Is it time for the Government
to retire RPI? It can't retire RPI for a number of reasons, because it
is used in many contracts, private and public. It is not always as bad
as it is painted. There are advantage is to it. For example, it
was designed to measure inflation as experienced by households, whereas
CPI was designed for macroeconomic purposes. So CPI is very good, for
example, as the target rate for the Bank of England, but not so good if
you want to actually measure the impact of inflation on households.
But at the end of the day, people don't care about how things are
indexed, they care about the bottom line in their bank balance, and if
they hear about the benefit of paying off debts, people paying
those bills are actually using those services, if you agree with that,
the idea that they are being ripped off does not make people happy. That
is absolutely right, and I think the Government is fairly shameless in
the way it uses RPI and CPI, because it tends to use CPI when it is
paying out money, for example on some benefits, public sector
pensions, and it off when users RPI when people are paying out money, as
with rail fares, student loans and a number of other things. How can you
feel OK with that? I think if I was at home, I would be shaking my best
at the television. I don't think it makes much of a difference. If you
had student loans set as RPI plus some number, if it always comes in
at 0.5% above CPI, to make the same bank balance for the Government, the
same balance between taxpayers and users of the service, added the 0.5%
onto the arbiter in number, it doesn't really matter which one you
use. The decision is a political one of who bears the burden. I think it
is dishonest. The other thing is that it is inefficient, because the
difference between RPI and CPI, as your graph showed, is not constant,
and at times RPI has been lower than CPI. But in future we cannot change
it? The others for national statistics as to keep on publishing
RPI. -- the office for national statistics. For legal reasons, it is
difficult to correct the overestimation, although it would be
possible technically, so we are in a bit of a bind, which is one reason
that the ONS is creating a new index, yet another. That is the
household costs index. We will talk about that another time. That is all
we have time for this evening. Good night.
We have got rain moving eastwards at the moment, there will still be some
to clear away in the morning from southern and eastern England, it
shouldn't last long, cloud will take longer to break up before there is
sunshine and showers further north. I think we will catch showers in
Northern Ireland, on and off, heavier ones towards the north, and
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