Browse content similar to 23/08/2017. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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Really has the United States traditional motto felt less | :00:11. | :00:18. | |
relevant, as rival groups and protesters clashed outside a rally, | :00:19. | :00:26. | |
is the hyper charged policy poisonous? The motto, e pluribus | :00:27. | :00:33. | |
unum. It's difficult to see them finding any kind of common ground. | :00:34. | :00:39. | |
18 men from two of the most notorious gangs in Birmingham are | :00:40. | :00:41. | |
banned from the city centre, our police finally getting to grips with | :00:42. | :00:44. | |
the gang problem, we hear from the mother of one innocent victim. I | :00:45. | :00:51. | |
I felt angry and disgusted to see that 14 years on, the same gangs, | :00:52. | :00:58. | |
the same two names, still terrorise and parts of Birmingham. Not | :00:59. | :01:04. | |
painting but seen by numbers, autistic writer shares his | :01:05. | :01:10. | |
experience with savant syndrome and synaesthesia. In my mind, each | :01:11. | :01:13. | |
number had a shape. -- In my mind, each number had | :01:14. | :01:16. | |
a shape - complete with colour and texture, | :01:17. | :01:19. | |
and occasionally motion, a neurological phenomenon | :01:20. | :01:20. | |
scientists call synaesthesia. The next US election | :01:21. | :01:31. | |
is in on the 3rd November 2020. But, for President Trump | :01:32. | :01:34. | |
the campaigning is well underway. In the early hours of | :01:35. | :01:39. | |
this morning, our time, the President took to the stage | :01:40. | :01:45. | |
for nearly an hour-and-a-half at his "Make America Great Again" | :01:46. | :01:47. | |
rally in Phoenix, Arizona. It was a classic Trump performance, | :01:48. | :01:50. | |
one of promise, defence, Some of his most barbed comments | :01:51. | :01:53. | |
were made about the, as he would put it, | :01:54. | :01:56. | |
"fake news" media, blaming them for giving far right | :01:57. | :01:58. | |
groups "a platform". We'll talk about that in a moment, | :01:59. | :02:03. | |
but first, Gabriel Gatehouse reports from Phoenix, | :02:04. | :02:05. | |
where America's increasingly polarised political debate spilled | :02:06. | :02:07. | |
out onto the streets. VOICEOVER: Bikers for Trump, they | :02:08. | :02:22. | |
came to Phoenix, to show support for their president, and, they said, to | :02:23. | :02:25. | |
stop protest is from harassing those who wanted to attend the rally. | :02:26. | :02:30. | |
Charlottesville is still fresh in the memory. Two radically opposing | :02:31. | :02:36. | |
visions for America clashed, but was built, people died. We don't want to | :02:37. | :02:41. | |
see anybody get hurt. The bikers condemned white supremacists and | :02:42. | :02:46. | |
neo-Nazis, and so, eventually, did Donald Trump, but he was slow and | :02:47. | :02:49. | |
equivocal. Many saw in him a president who emboldened racist. For | :02:50. | :02:56. | |
all of us to protect people from threats of violence by protesters. | :02:57. | :03:01. | |
America is in the grip of a cultural war so polarising, you might wonder | :03:02. | :03:04. | |
whether these two sides lived on the same planet. Basel has emboldened | :03:05. | :03:09. | |
people for the last eight years to come out and be violent because | :03:10. | :03:12. | |
there has been no consequences for any of it, telling people that the | :03:13. | :03:18. | |
only person in the world that can be a racist is a white man. So, yeah, | :03:19. | :03:23. | |
it concerns me that that is the atmosphere in the country. | :03:24. | :03:27. | |
Off-camera, one man told me he hated black people. On camera, others | :03:28. | :03:31. | |
rejected the Ku Klux Klan, more reticent, but no less angry. I think | :03:32. | :03:36. | |
they are trying to start a civil war, to be honest. Who? The | :03:37. | :03:44. | |
government. Why would they do that? I don't know, who knows. I would be | :03:45. | :03:49. | |
the first to take up arms, man, take up arms, for my country. If they | :03:50. | :03:55. | |
come down on our soil, I am ready to defend it, that is the way that I | :03:56. | :04:00. | |
look at it. All these other liberals, goody-goody, they want | :04:01. | :04:04. | |
everybody to... This and that... Nothing ever gets done, all talk, | :04:05. | :04:09. | |
all behind doors. We need to bring more stuff out, get things more | :04:10. | :04:13. | |
done. Do you think Donald Trump is getting things done? Slowly, yes, | :04:14. | :04:17. | |
he's trying, I believe he is really trying, he has to clean up the | :04:18. | :04:21. | |
mess... Clean up the parking lot to make it liveable. Shame on you, | :04:22. | :04:26. | |
shame on you. In downtown Phoenix, protest is gathered throughout the | :04:27. | :04:30. | |
sweltering afternoon as they watched Donald Trump supporters arrive. | :04:31. | :04:37. | |
Shame on you, racist! Neo-Nazi sympathisers! Get out of here! Each | :04:38. | :04:42. | |
side taunted the other, across a police cordoned designed to prevent | :04:43. | :04:47. | |
a repeat of Charlottesville. If you have been shot by a police officer | :04:48. | :04:51. | |
while resisting arrest... You might lead out and die... -- bleed out. It | :04:52. | :05:00. | |
is really extraordinary that the sitting president, with all the | :05:01. | :05:03. | |
respect Americans have for this office, could produce this kind of | :05:04. | :05:07. | |
reaction, that the Gulf between this side and that side is so great that | :05:08. | :05:12. | |
it is very hard to see them finding any kind of common ground at all. | :05:13. | :05:24. | |
Both sides in vogue those same three letters, USA, but in Trump's | :05:25. | :05:26. | |
America, they are having trouble on agreeing what USA should actually | :05:27. | :05:30. | |
mean? Do any of you have any understanding about where the people | :05:31. | :05:34. | |
on the other side of the barricades are coming from? You do? Raise your | :05:35. | :05:40. | |
hand, if you do. You have family... Right... Tell me about that. They | :05:41. | :05:49. | |
feel very strongly that what Mr Trump began with the ideas about the | :05:50. | :05:54. | |
economy, meant something, and that he can make change. And they, I | :05:55. | :06:00. | |
don't think, are willing to now say, that is not working, it is | :06:01. | :06:03. | |
backfiring, it is turning into a campaign of hate... And we are | :06:04. | :06:08. | |
having trouble talking to each other. If that is happening in my | :06:09. | :06:13. | |
own family...!... I'm pretty sure that a lot of people over there are | :06:14. | :06:20. | |
having those same kinds of emotions. Arizona has some of the most relaxed | :06:21. | :06:22. | |
gun laws anywhere in the United States, and on both sides, weapons | :06:23. | :06:27. | |
were paraded in plain sight. I'm an American. There were some angry | :06:28. | :06:34. | |
confrontations, but no violence. Between Trump's supporters and his | :06:35. | :06:39. | |
detractors, his presidency may be divisive but it is also invigorating | :06:40. | :06:43. | |
political debate. Trump is getting nothing done, the only thing he has | :06:44. | :06:47. | |
signed his legislation... No, you are wrong. | :06:48. | :06:53. | |
Inside the conference centre, the president was on classic form, | :06:54. | :06:58. | |
untethered from the teller prompt, his routine is a compelling hybrid. | :06:59. | :07:03. | |
He didn't say it fast enough... He didn't do it on time... Why did it | :07:04. | :07:10. | |
take a day... He must be a racist... -- teleprompter. It is part stand-up | :07:11. | :07:17. | |
comedy, part the work of a demagogue. The very dishonest media, | :07:18. | :07:21. | |
those people right up there with all of the cameras... BOOING | :07:22. | :07:26. | |
He quoted selectively from his own response to Charlottesville, | :07:27. | :07:30. | |
accusing the media of doing exactly that as well. This is Donald Trump | :07:31. | :07:35. | |
in his element, with all his contradictions and his audience love | :07:36. | :07:39. | |
him for it. CHANTING By the time it was over, night had | :07:40. | :07:43. | |
fallen, the protesters were still there, the police presence had | :07:44. | :07:45. | |
increased. There were more heated arguments, | :07:46. | :07:54. | |
detailed debate about race, crime, statistics. You are holding the | :07:55. | :08:00. | |
numbers and you are lying. Percentage per capita of the | :08:01. | :08:04. | |
representation of the United States... No... Per capita! But | :08:05. | :08:08. | |
trouble came not between supporters and opponents of the president but | :08:09. | :08:12. | |
it when protesters and the police. You have a responsibility, not to | :08:13. | :08:19. | |
him, but to us! Officers said that the anti-trumped demonstrators threw | :08:20. | :08:22. | |
rocks and bottles, they responded with tear gas, pepper spray and | :08:23. | :08:32. | |
flash bangs. Go, go, go! The police are advancing out, all the people | :08:33. | :08:35. | |
from the rally have been led away, this is now between the police and | :08:36. | :08:42. | |
the anti-Trump protest is. It took several hours to clear the | :08:43. | :08:45. | |
streets... Acrid clouds of tear gas lingered, as the protesters | :08:46. | :08:49. | |
dispersed. It was heavy-handed but they kept the peace, the day ended | :08:50. | :08:55. | |
without serious violence. But with divisions as entrenched as ever. | :08:56. | :08:58. | |
If there's a debate about how voters see Trump, | :08:59. | :09:03. | |
there's no question over how the President sees the press. | :09:04. | :09:06. | |
In his latest attack he said it's time to expose the crooked media | :09:07. | :09:09. | |
deceptions and accused the journalists of fomenting | :09:10. | :09:11. | |
divisions trying to take away America's history and heritage. | :09:12. | :09:13. | |
So, is this bluster or a real threat to the relationship | :09:14. | :09:15. | |
between the press, the white house and the public? | :09:16. | :09:18. | |
And how much blame does a partisan press have to take? | :09:19. | :09:22. | |
Eugene Robinson, is the Chair of the Pulitzer Prize Board and also | :09:23. | :09:25. | |
the Associate Editor of the Washington Post, | :09:26. | :09:26. | |
Initially, then, your reaction to what we heard from the president in | :09:27. | :09:43. | |
Phoenix. It worries me, speaking with my Pulitzer prize hat on, right | :09:44. | :09:47. | |
now, that these kinds of attacks... We are used to politicians running | :09:48. | :09:52. | |
against the media, that is a standard sort of technique, and we | :09:53. | :09:57. | |
have thick skin. If you are a journalist, you ought to have a | :09:58. | :10:01. | |
thick skin, that is fine. As an Trump's rhetoric is something we | :10:02. | :10:05. | |
have not heard, referred to the media as enemies of the American | :10:06. | :10:12. | |
people, he has said, as he did last night, they don't love their | :10:13. | :10:17. | |
country, they don't want to make America Great Again they don't want | :10:18. | :10:21. | |
to make America great... And he has escalated the rhetoric in a way | :10:22. | :10:26. | |
that, frankly, worries me. It could be dangerous. It is very troubling. | :10:27. | :10:34. | |
I think it is something we need to speak out about. Define | :10:35. | :10:39. | |
dangerous...? You perhaps are familiar with the story... | :10:40. | :10:49. | |
Pizzagate... The e-mails of the campaign chairman, John Podesta, | :10:50. | :10:52. | |
were hacked, a lot of them were about ordering pizza, because that | :10:53. | :10:56. | |
is what political campaigns do... They order pizza, working late into | :10:57. | :11:01. | |
the night... And spirited theorists saw these e-mails, and they deduced | :11:02. | :11:05. | |
there must be some kind of code, and somehow lead to the conclusion that | :11:06. | :11:10. | |
Hillary Clinton was running a paedophile ring out of a specific | :11:11. | :11:16. | |
pizza restaurant, here in Washington...! So, one month after | :11:17. | :11:19. | |
the election, a man from North Carolina drove to Washington, went | :11:20. | :11:24. | |
to the restaurant, carrying a loaded military style automatic rifle...! | :11:25. | :11:27. | |
He fired a shot, and he demanded to be taken to the basement of the | :11:28. | :11:32. | |
restaurant, so that he could free the enslaved sex enslaved children! | :11:33. | :11:37. | |
There is no basement, of course there were no children, this is | :11:38. | :11:41. | |
complete fabrication! It is fortunate that the customers and | :11:42. | :11:44. | |
employees were not injured in this incident and the man was arrested. | :11:45. | :11:48. | |
But the potential for disaster was there. A restaurant where parents | :11:49. | :11:54. | |
take children to eat. It is not a leap to worry that such a thing | :11:55. | :12:00. | |
could happen to a newsroom. Let's ask you, we saw in the report from | :12:01. | :12:04. | |
Phoenix tensions running high on both sides, both extremes, the story | :12:05. | :12:08. | |
you have told us about the pizza restaurant, how much is that the | :12:09. | :12:18. | |
real America that we are seeing? My view is that, neither America is | :12:19. | :12:21. | |
more real than the other, no one's America is more real than anyone | :12:22. | :12:27. | |
else's, here is what bothers me... It seems to me... In the piece your | :12:28. | :12:32. | |
correspondent did, at one point, there was an argument on the street | :12:33. | :12:36. | |
over a statistic, over facts, we oughta be able to agree on facts. | :12:37. | :12:40. | |
The Pulitzer Prize has been around for 101 years, all the journalists | :12:41. | :12:46. | |
and playwrights and authors and poets, and composers, who have won | :12:47. | :12:52. | |
Pulitzer Prizes, they share one thing in common, all engaged in a | :12:53. | :12:57. | |
search for the truth. We must believe that there is truth, that | :12:58. | :13:05. | |
truth does exist and that it can be ascertained as near as possible and | :13:06. | :13:08. | |
we can agree on at least what the facts are, and then, let's argue | :13:09. | :13:12. | |
about them, let's agree on what the facts are. And now, sadly, that sort | :13:13. | :13:18. | |
of consensus about literally a chronicle of events, inside the | :13:19. | :13:24. | |
facts, that consensus seems to have broken down. When you look at a | :13:25. | :13:29. | |
Harvard University report which studied the coverage that President | :13:30. | :13:32. | |
Trump got in his first 100 days, in print and on television, it reported | :13:33. | :13:38. | |
the coverage was 80% negative. How fair is it to say that perhaps this | :13:39. | :13:42. | |
is not wholly a one-way street, there is some blame from the media? | :13:43. | :13:49. | |
I suppose it is a matter of degree... I certainly cannot or | :13:50. | :13:54. | |
would not defend every single-storey that has been written, but this is a | :13:55. | :13:59. | |
president who speaks in ways no president has, including a total | :14:00. | :14:06. | |
disregard, at times, for fact. That is the truth. If he does it again | :14:07. | :14:13. | |
and again, four times in a day, which is not uncommon!... Then it | :14:14. | :14:17. | |
will be reported four times in a day, and the fifth story will report | :14:18. | :14:22. | |
that he said something that actually is based in fact, and so, there you | :14:23. | :14:26. | |
have your 80% negative and your 20% positive. It is an unusual | :14:27. | :14:34. | |
situation, granted. But, what are we to do, except report the facts, as | :14:35. | :14:39. | |
we know them. That is what you and your colleagues must do. How much | :14:40. | :14:44. | |
are you in and your colleagues, how much are you victims of a cultural | :14:45. | :14:46. | |
conflict being played out? I don't think we're victims at all. | :14:47. | :14:55. | |
We are certainly privileged to do what we do, I've done it my entire | :14:56. | :15:03. | |
career and I think journalism is an incredible way of seeing the world, | :15:04. | :15:11. | |
and I think it provides a real public service. But yes, there is a | :15:12. | :15:16. | |
real cultural divide in the United States. I'm not sure we fully | :15:17. | :15:24. | |
understand its dimensions and its potential staying power, but it | :15:25. | :15:32. | |
exists and we report on it and try to understand it, try to help | :15:33. | :15:36. | |
Americans understand it. Is it in any way fuelled by bitterness? The | :15:37. | :15:43. | |
position that the media enjoyed up until this president was pretty | :15:44. | :15:47. | |
strong, but now we have a president who takes to twitter, who goes over | :15:48. | :15:50. | |
the heads of you and your colleagues. How much is that the | :15:51. | :15:55. | |
feeling from the media side? Well certainly we are in a new era when | :15:56. | :16:01. | |
the president, who has umpteen million followers on Twitter, is | :16:02. | :16:04. | |
able to communicate directly with that many people, without the | :16:05. | :16:09. | |
intervention of the media. That is something we all have to get used | :16:10. | :16:18. | |
to. We all -- also have to get used to the fact that on the web the | :16:19. | :16:22. | |
traditional barriers of entry to be a major player in media have fallen. | :16:23. | :16:30. | |
So you don't have two build a printing plant and buy ink by the | :16:31. | :16:35. | |
barrel and paper by the time and higher press men and all of that. In | :16:36. | :16:40. | |
fact, you set up a website and on the web we are all equivalent, | :16:41. | :16:45. | |
basically. And so that's a new environment and we have delivered by | :16:46. | :16:50. | |
our wits, and trust that the cream rises to the top. Briefly, is this | :16:51. | :16:59. | |
sustainable? The relationship between the White House, the | :17:00. | :17:03. | |
president and the media? Well, it will be sustained because there will | :17:04. | :17:06. | |
be the White House and the media, the relationship I hope that yours | :17:07. | :17:20. | |
and call soft some. We will have to because we're not going anywhere. | :17:21. | :17:21. | |
Thank you for your time. How much jurisdiction will European | :17:22. | :17:23. | |
judges have over our laws For the government the answer | :17:24. | :17:25. | |
is simple - none whatsoever. But, as with all things Brexit, | :17:26. | :17:29. | |
it may be more complicated. For Theresa May this is one | :17:30. | :17:31. | |
of her red lines: Having full control over the law | :17:32. | :17:34. | |
is an essential part of the UK So, you'd expect that | :17:35. | :17:37. | |
after we we leave the EU and the transition is | :17:38. | :17:41. | |
done, that's it... Today, the Government set out | :17:42. | :17:43. | |
a discussion document. So, when will we "take | :17:44. | :17:48. | |
back control?" Chris Cook has been taking a look | :17:49. | :17:50. | |
at what ministers want. One of the things we thought we knew | :17:51. | :17:58. | |
about life after we leave EU was that the European Court | :17:59. | :18:03. | |
of Justice wouldn't be part of it. But let me be clear, we are not | :18:04. | :18:07. | |
leaving the European Union today to give up control of immigration | :18:08. | :18:12. | |
again, and we're not leaving only to return to the jurisdiction | :18:13. | :18:16. | |
of the European Court of Justice. So we will take back control | :18:17. | :18:20. | |
of our laws and bring an end to the jurisdiction | :18:21. | :18:23. | |
of the European Court We want to make sure | :18:24. | :18:25. | |
that we are ending, that we are ending the jurisdiction | :18:26. | :18:29. | |
of the European Court of Justice. For some Brexiters it was enormously | :18:30. | :18:34. | |
important that all of our laws should be written by our parliaments | :18:35. | :18:37. | |
and they should be interpreted by our courts, including | :18:38. | :18:40. | |
the supreme courts. That meant ending the role | :18:41. | :18:43. | |
of the European Court of Justice. The ECJ is the body that make sure | :18:44. | :18:47. | |
EU law is evenly applied It's a thing that turns the rights | :18:48. | :18:50. | |
and responsibilities Let's suppose after Brexit | :18:51. | :18:58. | |
that we sign a comprehensive free trade deal that lets European | :18:59. | :19:04. | |
businesses trade freely The Government's plan is that | :19:05. | :19:07. | |
here in Britain our courts should enforce those rights, | :19:08. | :19:12. | |
with no cases sent to the ECJ. The thing is, though, | :19:13. | :19:17. | |
to take a few examples, the EU's agreements with Canada, | :19:18. | :19:20. | |
Singapore and the members of the European Economic | :19:21. | :19:25. | |
Area contain courts. For the same reason our government | :19:26. | :19:27. | |
is proposing a new UK-EU court. We need a sort of enforcement | :19:28. | :19:35. | |
mechanism, that's really Because if we've gone to the bother | :19:36. | :19:37. | |
of agreeing rules in some deep and comprehensive free trade | :19:38. | :19:45. | |
agreement, the people who feel perhaps they're not getting | :19:46. | :19:47. | |
the access they should under that agreement, want some way | :19:48. | :19:50. | |
of getting readdress. So if you've been trying | :19:51. | :19:51. | |
to export to an EU country, you think its rules | :19:52. | :19:54. | |
are discriminating against you, you want some way of appealing | :19:55. | :20:02. | |
to another authority, to say - actually, these people | :20:03. | :20:04. | |
aren't abiding by the rules. I think, overall, this is a really | :20:05. | :20:07. | |
informative and pretty useful paper. What came through most strongly | :20:08. | :20:10. | |
for me is the fact that so much attention is being devoted to how | :20:11. | :20:13. | |
to ensure alignment between our legal system and the EU legal | :20:14. | :20:15. | |
system after we've left, means the Government now has one | :20:16. | :20:18. | |
of its priorities to ensure we can keep trading, | :20:19. | :20:21. | |
by making sure our legal system is as closely aligned to that | :20:22. | :20:23. | |
of the EU as possible. But there may be problems, | :20:24. | :20:26. | |
not least with escaping First, a deep relationships | :20:27. | :20:31. | |
with the EU probably means But the more we do that, | :20:32. | :20:36. | |
the more the ECJ will matter. For example, in the field | :20:37. | :20:42. | |
of aviation, outside the EU, if there is an arbitration panel, | :20:43. | :20:49. | |
and these arbitrations wouldn't be at the European Court of Justice, | :20:50. | :20:51. | |
but since all the rules and all the regulations are adopted | :20:52. | :20:56. | |
at EU level, they continue to be interpreted by the European Court | :20:57. | :20:59. | |
of Justice and this arbitration would really be instructed to take | :21:00. | :21:02. | |
all that case law into account. Second, the EU may want | :21:03. | :21:05. | |
a bigger role for the ECJ For me, there are two | :21:06. | :21:08. | |
potential sticking point. The first is to do with | :21:09. | :21:17. | |
the ratification, because, remember, this is about the trade deal | :21:18. | :21:19. | |
and the trade deal has to be approved not just | :21:20. | :21:22. | |
by the European Council, but by the national Parliaments | :21:23. | :21:24. | |
of the member states, and therefore I wonder | :21:25. | :21:26. | |
whether all parliaments will agree to setting up a bespoke | :21:27. | :21:29. | |
new adjudication mechanism. And the big problem is, | :21:30. | :21:32. | |
there are still some areas like the rights | :21:33. | :21:34. | |
of EU citizens in the UK, where the EU is insisting that | :21:35. | :21:37. | |
EU law should apply, and for that you have to have a role | :21:38. | :21:39. | |
for the European Court of Justice. And there's no obvious | :21:40. | :21:43. | |
or easy way round that. Third, you can have enforce your EU | :21:44. | :21:46. | |
rights at a local court, but who will get to take cases | :21:47. | :21:49. | |
to the new EU-UK body? It's not clear to me that these | :21:50. | :21:53. | |
proposals would allow a business which has difficulties exporting | :21:54. | :21:57. | |
to France, for example, to actually access a court directly | :21:58. | :22:01. | |
and make their claims This would all have to be done | :22:02. | :22:04. | |
between the UK Government and the European Union, | :22:05. | :22:09. | |
and so not only business, but if there rights also for people | :22:10. | :22:13. | |
to move, or other rights, they would not be directly | :22:14. | :22:16. | |
enforceable in the same Our government now has a settled | :22:17. | :22:18. | |
view on which court should be supreme, but the ECJ may not go | :22:19. | :22:23. | |
away, and businesses in particular may worry about how | :22:24. | :22:25. | |
they enforce their rights. In 2003, two innocent girls | :22:26. | :22:35. | |
were leaving a party in Birmingham. Charlene Ellis | :22:36. | :22:39. | |
and Letisha Shakespeare were gunned down in a gang related | :22:40. | :22:43. | |
drive by shooting. The feuding gangs were the Johnson | :22:44. | :22:46. | |
Crew and the Burger Bar Boys. 14 years later, West Midlands police | :22:47. | :22:49. | |
is still dealing with gang violence in the city and specifically | :22:50. | :22:53. | |
the same two gangs which killed Today, those gangs were given | :22:54. | :22:56. | |
what police are calling the largest Think of a gang injunction | :22:57. | :23:01. | |
as similar to an ASBO. It requires a lower burden of proof | :23:02. | :23:09. | |
than a criminal conviction and is designed to disrupt | :23:10. | :23:12. | |
and prevent gang related For the next two years, | :23:13. | :23:14. | |
eighteen men, aged between 19-29 are banned from parts of Birmingham | :23:15. | :23:20. | |
and must register phones A little earlier I spoke | :23:21. | :23:23. | |
to Marcia Shakespeare, How she felt when she heard the | :23:24. | :23:34. | |
names of the two gangs who killed her daughter again today. | :23:35. | :23:37. | |
I felt angry and disgusted to know that 14 years on, | :23:38. | :23:42. | |
I'm constantly hearing the same gangs, the same two names | :23:43. | :23:46. | |
are still terrorising parts of Birmingham, | :23:47. | :23:49. | |
and I can't understand why they are not stamped out. | :23:50. | :23:59. | |
I know when I went and did some initial research within New York, | :24:00. | :24:02. | |
when I met some Bloods and Crips over there, | :24:03. | :24:04. | |
and they seemed to be quite faded, so I can't understand | :24:05. | :24:07. | |
why these gangs are continuously happening and continuously | :24:08. | :24:09. | |
So there's been a marked uptick in violence this year, | :24:10. | :24:17. | |
with a number of fatal shootings, not necessarily involving any | :24:18. | :24:21. | |
of the people who are subject to this injunction, but why do | :24:22. | :24:23. | |
Well, I know from speaking to young people who I work with, | :24:24. | :24:31. | |
young boys in particular, they state that the problem | :24:32. | :24:34. | |
is what they're getting is they're walking on the streets, | :24:35. | :24:39. | |
and when they're walking on their own, they're | :24:40. | :24:42. | |
being attacked by people, large groups are trying | :24:43. | :24:44. | |
They're been threatened with knives, and because of this | :24:45. | :24:52. | |
a lot of the young people have decided to join | :24:53. | :24:55. | |
gangs, because they feel safe if they're within a group, | :24:56. | :24:57. | |
So that is another area that also needs to be challenged, | :24:58. | :25:03. | |
about young people joining gangs, because...for protection. | :25:04. | :25:10. | |
It's not just the knives or the weapons, they're actually | :25:11. | :25:12. | |
The West Midlands Police and Crime Commission said | :25:13. | :25:15. | |
in an interview today that what will help back it up | :25:16. | :25:19. | |
is that the eyes and ears of the community will focus on these | :25:20. | :25:25. | |
people and if they see any of these gang members in the wrong area, | :25:26. | :25:29. | |
they will phone the police and therefore the police | :25:30. | :25:31. | |
You'd have to be mighty brave to shop one of these gang | :25:32. | :25:34. | |
Yes, because I know from my case, through the trial, it took a lot | :25:35. | :25:39. | |
And even when they did come forward, there were points when they actually | :25:40. | :25:45. | |
decided they were going to turn around and not give evidence, | :25:46. | :25:48. | |
solely because of the threat level of the gangs trying to control them, | :25:49. | :25:56. | |
and also trying to attack them or family members. | :25:57. | :25:58. | |
So yes, although you've got the gang injunctions and it states it that it | :25:59. | :26:02. | |
will stop gangs going in different areas, I can't see | :26:03. | :26:06. | |
the difference between tagging and gang injunctions. | :26:07. | :26:09. | |
But as I said, I'm open-minded and hope. | :26:10. | :26:12. | |
I appreciate you're not the architect of it, | :26:13. | :26:17. | |
but isn't that where this whole idea could actually fall down? | :26:18. | :26:19. | |
You almost need like a witness protection programme, | :26:20. | :26:21. | |
if I'm going to shop some of these people, | :26:22. | :26:24. | |
I want to know that my family and I are going to be | :26:25. | :26:27. | |
Yes, and that is very hard, and I know through work previously, | :26:28. | :26:35. | |
working with the police in New York and the one thing they did state | :26:36. | :26:40. | |
that a lot of the witness protection, many family | :26:41. | :26:43. | |
members have had to move towns, cities and countries. | :26:44. | :26:47. | |
So, yes, it's a big ask, and that's why I say, | :26:48. | :26:50. | |
even though you have gang injunctions, it cannot | :26:51. | :26:54. | |
There have to be other things in place. | :26:55. | :26:59. | |
Now the only thing that is curious to me is, OK, | :27:00. | :27:04. | |
you have the gang injunctions, but who is monitoring it? | :27:05. | :27:08. | |
Is this a 24-hour watch, where police are within the community, | :27:09. | :27:12. | |
monitoring and seeing these people within the gangs? | :27:13. | :27:17. | |
You've also got social networks where people obtain | :27:18. | :27:20. | |
different sim cards, where they can actually make | :27:21. | :27:23. | |
different phone calls and they can contact people. | :27:24. | :27:25. | |
So I'm very curious to see how this is going to work. | :27:26. | :27:35. | |
Can I put it to you, you're quite close, obviously, | :27:36. | :27:37. | |
Do you think they have the necessary resources? | :27:38. | :27:40. | |
Finally, what sustains you in your work? | :27:41. | :27:44. | |
When you see young people, there are a lot of great young | :27:45. | :27:55. | |
people within Birmingham, however it's about | :27:56. | :27:57. | |
A lot of them, unfortunately, don't have the opportunities | :27:58. | :28:05. | |
and they're not educated, because unfortunately sometimes | :28:06. | :28:09. | |
they're just grouped into one particular group and they give up | :28:10. | :28:12. | |
So when you see hard young people, you know that you've got | :28:13. | :28:20. | |
to keep going to allow some young people to have those opportunities. | :28:21. | :28:23. | |
Marcia Shakespeare, thanks for joining us tonight. | :28:24. | :28:25. | |
Kirk Dawes used to work for the West Midland Police. | :28:26. | :28:30. | |
He founded The Centre for Conflict Transformation, | :28:31. | :28:33. | |
which was credited with reducing gangland violence in the city | :28:34. | :28:36. | |
between 2004 and 2012 - when it was shut. | :28:37. | :28:41. | |
He is in Birmingham tonight. The same question if I can that I put to | :28:42. | :28:48. | |
the campaign and victim's mother, wide Birmingham? I think that | :28:49. | :28:54. | |
between 2004-12, as you say, there was a lot of great work through what | :28:55. | :28:59. | |
was called Birmingham reducing gang violence, that enabled us to reduce | :29:00. | :29:03. | |
the number of firearms offences, knife offences and the like and the | :29:04. | :29:09. | |
number of people in gangs. Wide Birmingham? I think there is a | :29:10. | :29:13. | |
resurgence, in regard to some of the youngsters coming up right now. One | :29:14. | :29:17. | |
of the things I would say is there was a good strategy and that | :29:18. | :29:23. | |
strategy effectively stopped in 2012. It's fair, is it not, to | :29:24. | :29:29. | |
question whether West Midlands police have the personnel and | :29:30. | :29:33. | |
resources to implement this? It is fair. The reduction to the police | :29:34. | :29:42. | |
services has taken away their capacity to deal with the upsurge | :29:43. | :29:45. | |
they have now. What we are forgetting is the great work that | :29:46. | :29:49. | |
was done at that time by community groups, specialists in the role of | :29:50. | :29:53. | |
dealing with gangs. In essence, what you got was... If we go back to the | :29:54. | :30:01. | |
gang injunction itself, one big part of the gang injunctions are positive | :30:02. | :30:05. | |
requirements. That's what was utilised, with people from the | :30:06. | :30:08. | |
community, to enable us to actually become involved in moving gangs away | :30:09. | :30:14. | |
from their lifestyle and towards better opportunities. That's why | :30:15. | :30:17. | |
positive requirements are there. What we have seen today, what I've | :30:18. | :30:23. | |
read in the media, is quite simply lots of things around in | :30:24. | :30:26. | |
enforcement, disruption and the like, but I haven't heard anything | :30:27. | :30:32. | |
about positive requirements. What are those requirements? Anything | :30:33. | :30:37. | |
that the public authorities, with partner agencies, consider | :30:38. | :30:41. | |
reasonable. Such as... Discharging a firearm means there is a conflict | :30:42. | :30:46. | |
and with that conflict, just by saying X cannot meet why cannot | :30:47. | :30:49. | |
travel down a certain street will be in a certain part, you'd do not deal | :30:50. | :30:54. | |
with the conflict. A positive requirements was in the past, when | :30:55. | :31:00. | |
it first came out, things like mediation, conflict management, job | :31:01. | :31:05. | |
coaching. You have to give these people are realistic and appealing | :31:06. | :31:08. | |
alternative from the lifestyle they are engaged in. How cost-effective | :31:09. | :31:13. | |
Will this be. You and your colleagues did some research on to | :31:14. | :31:17. | |
the cost of policing prosecuting murders? At the moment the cost of a | :31:18. | :31:23. | |
murder is about ?2 million. Certainly that figure was never the | :31:24. | :31:26. | |
amount in any particular year that was given towards the interventions | :31:27. | :31:30. | |
that were being utilised, that brought the figures right the way | :31:31. | :31:37. | |
down. When we started mediation, for instance, it was never expected to | :31:38. | :31:43. | |
work but it did work we engage these people in the conflict ended up | :31:44. | :31:47. | |
discharging a firearm. Isn't this wishful thinking? Set for two years, | :31:48. | :31:51. | |
you're going to turn some of these men around in two years, pie in the | :31:52. | :31:55. | |
sky? I don't think so. That was set in 2004. Like Marcia sake I went to | :31:56. | :32:02. | |
the United States and spent a lot of time in Northern Ireland. Within two | :32:03. | :32:06. | |
years of gun injunctions coming in and the sort of work the community | :32:07. | :32:10. | |
were bringing in, the numbers fell dramatically. Lastly, the community, | :32:11. | :32:15. | |
the eyes and ears, shopping these gang members, you are on the front | :32:16. | :32:20. | |
line, how likely is that? It is difficult for a lot of people to | :32:21. | :32:24. | |
shop at them, but the challenge is for the community and for the | :32:25. | :32:28. | |
police, but I will always say you've still got to deal with the conflicts | :32:29. | :32:32. | |
themselves. Thank you very much for your time tonight. | :32:33. | :32:46. | |
In the niche world of staggering mathematical feats, the big question | :32:47. | :32:48. | |
is 'Who can recite Pi to the most decimal places?' A record-holder | :32:49. | :32:51. | |
in the field is Daniel Tammett, who managed to recall Pi to more | :32:52. | :32:54. | |
He's been diagnosed as a high-functioning autistic savant, | :32:55. | :32:57. | |
and in his acclaimed books and lectures, he's shown himself | :32:58. | :33:00. | |
to have a rare and eloquent insight into the condition. | :33:01. | :33:02. | |
His new book, Every Word is a Bird we Teach to Sing, | :33:03. | :33:05. | |
published tomorrow, is a collection of essays about languages | :33:06. | :33:07. | |
Daniel Tammett has been speaking to our Culture | :33:08. | :33:13. | |
I kept a list of words, according to their shape and texture. Words round | :33:14. | :33:28. | |
as a three, gobble, covered, cabbage... Pointy as a 4: jacket, | :33:29. | :33:41. | |
wife, quick. Shimmering, as a five. Kingdom... Shoemaker... | :33:42. | :33:42. | |
Surrounded... Numbers felt like my first language | :33:43. | :33:51. | |
in a way that English never did, it felt like a foreign language, being | :33:52. | :33:56. | |
able to the site these numbers like a poem, composed in numbers, or | :33:57. | :34:02. | |
story, was, for me, a way of expressing myself, communicating | :34:03. | :34:05. | |
with other people. -- cite. And realising for the first time that I | :34:06. | :34:09. | |
had a gift for communication, which is paradoxical, because I am also on | :34:10. | :34:12. | |
the autistic spectrum, all with what we call high functioning autism | :34:13. | :34:18. | |
today, and often people on that spectrum find language difficult, | :34:19. | :34:23. | |
even at the highest end, but it is something I have learned how to | :34:24. | :34:27. | |
master. VOICEOVER: He may have started with numbers but Daniel also | :34:28. | :34:31. | |
has an intense relationship with words. He speaks several languages, | :34:32. | :34:37. | |
his new book is part travelogue, part meditation, on the subject of | :34:38. | :34:42. | |
how we communicate in all its variety. One of my favourite word is | :34:43. | :34:51. | |
Icelandic, it means midwife, but it literally means light mother, and | :34:52. | :34:59. | |
this is the first ten, 12 digits of pi, the number is -- the word is | :35:00. | :35:07. | |
Ljosmoour. How Mick Lacy did you manage to get to with this? 22,000 | :35:08. | :35:16. | |
514. -- how many bases. How did you do that? -- how many places. When | :35:17. | :35:21. | |
somebody sees calligraphy, squiggles on a page, Chinese ideograms, to | :35:22. | :35:26. | |
have them memorise it would be impossible, but numbers, for me, | :35:27. | :35:30. | |
they are not squiggles on a page, they have shaped and colours and | :35:31. | :35:34. | |
textures and meanings. -- 22,514. These meanings are intuitive, but... | :35:35. | :35:41. | |
They are so full of poetry. In my mind, each number had a shape. | :35:42. | :35:47. | |
Complete with colour and texture and occasionally motion. A neurological | :35:48. | :35:53. | |
phenomenon which scientists call synaesthesia, each shape a meaning. | :35:54. | :35:59. | |
The meaning could be pictographic. 89 was dark blue, the colour of the | :36:00. | :36:10. | |
sky. Threatening storm. You are looking at, reaching some tentative | :36:11. | :36:13. | |
conclusions, about the changing relationship between the written and | :36:14. | :36:17. | |
the spoken word. In this age of digital communication. Yes. Can you | :36:18. | :36:24. | |
tell us about that? What is fascinating is that language is | :36:25. | :36:27. | |
merging in a way that linguists had not expected, 50, even 30 years ago. | :36:28. | :36:32. | |
We are seeing with computers now and people writing more and more online | :36:33. | :36:36. | |
that they are using essentially spoken language but in a way that is | :36:37. | :36:41. | |
written. Using the same abbreviations, the same slang. The | :36:42. | :36:46. | |
same expressions that we would not have seen written in the past. And | :36:47. | :36:49. | |
it is changing our relationship with language. There are people who say, | :36:50. | :36:55. | |
it is a form of dumbing down. Standards dropping... I am more | :36:56. | :37:02. | |
optimistic. Talking about autism, what would you say to parents, young | :37:03. | :37:07. | |
people, who are faced with this condition and are perplexed about | :37:08. | :37:14. | |
it, concerned about it. It brings benefit, there have been wonderful | :37:15. | :37:17. | |
poets, autism does bring benefit, and many writers in the past, maybe | :37:18. | :37:23. | |
that in Nabokov, Lewis Carroll, they may have been on the spectrum. We | :37:24. | :37:28. | |
know that there is this fantastic potential. What the barrier is in | :37:29. | :37:35. | |
part is society, society up until very recently did not realise that | :37:36. | :37:39. | |
people on the autistic spectrum had creativity and could create, they | :37:40. | :37:43. | |
assumed that people could memorise, that they could be like machines, in | :37:44. | :37:50. | |
a way, robots, calculators, but not writers, not artists, sculptures. -- | :37:51. | :37:52. | |
sculptors. One day, intent on my reading, I | :37:53. | :38:03. | |
happened upon lollipop, and a shock of joy coursed through me. I read it | :38:04. | :38:14. | |
as, 1,011, and I thought it was the most beautiful thing I had yet read. | :38:15. | :38:18. | |
Half number, half word. What does pound sign | :38:19. | :38:31. | |
barcamp mean to you? Not a lot I expect, but it's | :38:32. | :38:35. | |
historic because it was the first time a hashtag, | :38:36. | :38:38. | |
as it's now of course known, appeared on twitter, | :38:39. | :38:40. | |
and that was ten years ago today. Here's the man who came up | :38:41. | :38:43. | |
with the idea, Chris Messina, telling #newsnight | :38:44. | :38:46. | |
about how it happened. Ten years ago today I was one | :38:47. | :38:48. | |
of the first users of social media, and I saw the great potential | :38:49. | :38:51. | |
of this platform to The problem with early Twitter, | :38:52. | :38:53. | |
early platforms, especially in the early days of the iPhone, | :38:54. | :38:56. | |
was that it was just a mess. We needed a way of actually | :38:57. | :39:00. | |
organising conversations I thought the hashtag would be | :39:01. | :39:01. | |
a great way to do that, and I wrote up my ideas, | :39:02. | :39:09. | |
I shared it on the web, I spent the next several years | :39:10. | :39:12. | |
actually promoting this idea Ten years later, I'm super thrilled | :39:13. | :39:14. | |
with how much it's grown, how much it's expanded and how | :39:15. | :39:18. | |
people are actually using it to find people who they want to connect | :39:19. | :39:21. | |
with, have conversations with and use to understand | :39:22. | :39:23. | |
the world around them. That's nearly all for tonight, | :39:24. | :39:40. | |
but in tribute to Chris Messina's invention we thought we'd leave | :39:41. | :39:42. | |
you with some hashtag highlights. | :39:43. | :39:46. |