Episode 2 Nolan Live

Can it be justified when tragedy keeps striking?

We've entertainment you won't believe and a star act

And it's all in front of a live Nolan audience.

The North West 200 has once again been overshadowed by tragedy.

Rising motorbike star Malachi Mitchell-Thomas

lost his life at the weekend at the age of just 20.

And so the debate about road racing starts up again.

Should it be promoted and celebrated?

I don't think it should be promoted or celebrated. I think it's a sad

thing that men want to do this. Many people had dripped it to a --

addicted to be adrenaline buzz I'm going to the edge of what is

possible. That is what they do. They challenge themselves. But you go so

fast and you narrow the margin of error to the point where it doesn't

exist and then you can die and what these men are doing is not

necessary. If they want to do it, they can. But I would say this is

not something to celebrate. This is not something to be happy about,

that there is this culture of fixation on speed. There is also a

measure of preoccupation with mortality in it. When you look at

riders such as Lee Murphy and the poem he wrote before he died which

anticipated the way he would die and when you speak to riders and when

they talk about the acceptance of death as the price to be paid for

the buzz that they get out of it, when they say things like they would

not do it but for the danger, then I think they have crossed the line.

But you are saying this as a man who has never done it, so you do not get

it. I have never taken heroin either. I have never shot anybody.

But I do comment on these things. That is a fatuous point, Stephen.

What do you mean? It is a fatuous point to say that I cant. I'm not

saying you can't comment on it, because we have invited you to

comment on it. What I am saying is you do not understand because you

haven't done it, the dedication, the thrill, the passion, the commitment

that some of these people have two that particular sport. Because you

haven't done it, nor have I. These people have been contacting me all

day and all week and they have been pouring into my Twitter feed and

they are telling me that these men feel that it is almost worthwhile to

die, and that it is better to have died in that way than any other way,

that this is the price to be paid for the thrill that they get. They

are telling me that on the Twitter feed. Look at my twitter feed and

you will see it and you will see the comments from the people who love

these men and who missed them and pine for them and still will say

that he got the death he would have wished for. Well, Philip McCallan,

you wear one of these men. Yes, it was my career, which I loved and

which I was quite successful in. I was the only rider in the world to

win five Northwest 's in one day. Do you take part in any sports? I think

that is an irrelevant question and I have said that to Steven already. I

do appreciate your opinion. You are entitled to it and everyone is, but

I don't think you have ever had that satisfaction of winning and sport

that you get and people who haven't had that. That is not the point. The

point is people are dying. In every way of life, to be honest you, the

amount of people who live their lives raising is very small to the

amount to die on roads, the amount... And I am not here to slack

off any other sport. I am only putting a comparison in. Passport

takes less lives than many other sports. -- passport. What is your

motive behind this? Now, there is a question. I do not think that

anything good can be said about a young man of 20 dying at high speed

on a motorbike for the entertainment of an audience. I cannot find

anything of Merit in that. I can understand that people who look at

him, you love that man, will try to rationalise it in some way, that

there was some good in it, but there is no good in it. But we don't go

out there to entertain you with death. Death is a very, very sad

part of our sport, and an intrinsic part of it. Would you agree that men

would not do it but for the danger? We are not addicted to the danger.

The danger is a very sad part of the sport, so it is, and we do not wish

that to happen anywhere. It is an inevitable part of your sport, isn't

it, that some people will die? It is a possibility. Tell me why people

are dying more now in the last ten years than in any decade since the

1970s. Why is the death toll going up? I can't answer that exactly.

Well, you should be able to. You are a man who knows bikes and who knows

racing and you are quick to lecture me about how little I know, but tell

me now why is that? It could be people training harder or accidents.

Is it because the bikes are more powerful, can go faster? The speed,

to be honest, the amount of crashes at 200 mph minimum, the crashes are

happening at much less speed than that. So it is not 200 mph that is

causing that. It is an accident. It is an accident that happens and it

since -- it happens in all sports. I am not here to slack off other

sports but we get thrills in different ways from different

sports. But what price is too much? How many people would it take to die

on our roads during this sport for people to say that is enough? One or

two M deaths in Northern Ireland every other year, is that OK? If it

became ten, would we start to contemplate stopping it? What is too

much? One death is too many anywhere. One death is just not

acceptable anywhere. Well, it is acceptable because the sport

continues. Yes, it continues because people want to do it. The only way

the sport continues its competitors want to compete and people want to

watch it. We have a great heritage in this country of maybe 100 years

of motorcycle racing and motorcycle racing contributes a lots to this

country. Yes, death is a terrible thing, but motorcycle racing, that

programme, the North West 200 goes out to many hundred million homes

worldwide and it contributes approximately ?4.5 million into the

local economy. 800 people take part in the North West 200, starting on

St Patrick's Day. There are a lot of people contributing to the sport and

there is a lot of business benefits. So are you going to take ?4.5

million away? I am not saying stop it, but I would not want our economy

to become dependent on it. Some people work hard to prevent deaths

at these races with the chicanes and whatever. The way to prevent deaths

at these races is to start discouraging young men from it,

instead of encouraging them. That is what we are doing by covering it and

through businesses like yours selling to them and through the

promotion of racing, we are encouraging young men to take this

up. We are having fathers of young men who have done this and died at

it saying that it was a great thing that they did. And there has to be a

counter voice saying this is not a great thing. And there is a father

sitting beside me who lost his son. And all due respect and I hope I am

not upsetting you. Stewart, your son Simon died at the North West 200 in

2014. He was 29. 31. The riders all tell lies. What are your thoughts

around this? I understand both sides of the argument. I can see the

reasons for both of it at. However, it is all about the riders. You

should remember that the North West 200, nobody drags these guys are the

teams they are screaming and howling. The guys are professional

sportsman and they want to perform and they want to perform against

themselves as well as with the machinery. It is in their spirit.

Whether you can take it out of the blood, I don't know, but most of

them really enjoy the racing, and what you were saying earlier about

the people on your Twitter feed and all of that, but that is not my

experience with most of the riders. Most of them trained very hard, they

do a lot of research and they never believe anything is going to happen

to them. Did you try to stop your son doing it? No. He was a grown

man. We talked about it. The only thing we ever said was 11 days

before he went to the North West 200 and died, I sent him and e-mail

saying that we always agreed Wonderwall and if it stopped

becoming fun, you would stop doing it, and he said fine. He said he was

having so much fun and was enjoying himself. He had an accident. Many

people have had accidents and gone back to it. Robert Dunlop, it was

the machine who let him down, so the idea that you can have the skill

that will get you out of these difficulties is a myth as well.

Well, the only thing I would say when that is Simon was that the

Lamont 24-hour and he went off and the break got caught and it threw

him off and he smashed into a while antigrowth -- broke both of his

legs, punctured his long, brokers spying in three places and that was

on the 21st, ruptured both of these eyes, and that was on the 21st of

September. On the 11th of December, he was already and I took into Egypt

and then by the April, he was back again and he was with this company

doing the physio and all he wanted to do was get back on the motorbike

and race. It was his happiest time, racing his motorbike. What is that

all about? What is the thrill? What is the dicing with danger? What of

the appeal of that? I don't think it is just icing with danger, I think

it is all about they take a long time to wear their trying to get two

and they trained very hard and there is no money. They do not make any

money at all. It is just the fact of humanity against the machine. Let me

speak to the audience. Hello. I go to the North West 200 every year and

I also go to the Isle of Man TT every year and it is a fantastic

event. I have always wondered about the local communities, and I can say

that it paints Northern Ireland in the fantastic light. The riders know

the risks but they love the sport. But as a society, we curtail risk,

don't we? And we draw a line in all walks of life, so we are not allowed

to drive down the road without a seat belt on because society decides

you are not doing that, whether you want to or not. We cannot drive on

the roads at 100 mph if we want to because society decides it is too

dangerous for us and others, so this argument I keep hearing that these

guys know the risks and that makes it OK, does it?

the risk, does it make it OK? People go there for other reasons as well,

they go for the racing and the music aspect. There are so many different

varieties there that attract people both to the North 200 and Isle of

Man TT. So are we saying, over the next few years, some young men will

die, it is part and parcel of the sport, we will just continue

counting them, it might be one the year, maybe one year will be lucky

and it will be two the next, is that tolerable, is that what you are

saying? No death is acceptable. What does that mean, if it is not

acceptable what does it mean? I came across here at six o'clock this

evening and by now we are at 11pm and probably three people have been

killed on the road in the UK and we accept that. I looked at the quarter

figures because I knew it would come into this, in the last quarter of

2015 1780 people were killed on the road. But we tell people to reduce

their speed because speed kills. What would you say to a man have 20

who said that he wanted to get into this, get on a bike and race, would

you say that was a wonderful thing to do? I would say talk to your

parents seriously about it because there are no guarantees you will be

safe doing anything in this life and unfortunately we all lose people we

love. In my village two people were killed just walking down the road

couple of weeks before the North West 200. No matter how we look at

it, my condolences to the family. Malachi's father Kevin paid tribute

to his son after his death. I've lost my best friend, I've lost

my son. He was a fantastic personality, not a bad bone in his

body and no one has a bad word to say about him. I want to thank the

paramedics for trying to save him at the roadside and the organisers for

putting on a fantastic event, the information that came out, the way

they helped me when things went wrong. It was a great event and it

was saddened by his loss. That note said, if I'm going to go

it will be fast and on a bike. My goodness, that is powerful. He

anticipated he would die on a bike and many of them do, and many of

them leave clues in their writing and the things they say. Lee Greg is

the director of research and policy -- Neil Gregg at IAM Road Smart. Is

there an acceptable death toll? There can never be an acceptable

death toll. If you look at Formula 1,

Moto GP, circuit racing, that is the kind of targets, it is rated seed

deaths in these sports, and in history it tends to be the drivers

and riders who have driven that improvement. But in road racing it

seems the riders do understand the risks, that is what they are

therefore, that is the buzz they get, and they are not pressing from

proof months. Formula 1 drivers got together and said no more deaths in

Formula 1 and they designed the cars and circuits to drive down the

deaths. There is a constant effort to upgrade safety and people get

killed. I want to show you this at home.

On the same stretch of road where Malachi Mitchell-Thomas died,

two days beforehand, another racer, Ryan Farquhar, also crashed

Do you know what, I'm actually in two minds

We are talking about how safe this sport is, and whether they should

We are going to show you the footage of Ryan's crash -

just a warning that some of you might find this uncomfortable.

Cooper was looking to pass far quite. It will all come down to the

last lap. Oh, dear, huge one. Ryan Farquhar went down and Ben Cooper

hit the debris, so there will be a stoppage almost certainly. Look at

that human beings spinning along the road. Unfortunately it was an

accident. When you are striving to try to be the best at things and win

races, accidents can happen. He's in his 40s, he gave up motor racing in

2012 and he went back to it. He knew the risks, people keep saying they

know the risks as if this is a positive thing, I say it is an odd

thing that somebody knows these risks. We will all die someday and

some people are better prepared for it than others. I would like to die

at 120. Your wish is not going to come true. Ryan's wish, those boys

wishes was to win races and have a career out of it. Unfortunately it

is sad sometimes, and mistake happens, but we strive different

ways. You want to write the best paragraph, the best paper, the best

thing. You have heard the argument many times, why not stop boxing,

horse racing, rugby, martial arts, UFC, diving, would you ban all those

things, would you try to curtail all those sports? Would you stop people

mountaineering or fishing? I would have problems with people who go man

to nearing in ludicrous conditions, but at the same time, the point

about road racing is different from motorsport in that is about --

different from other sports in that it is about facing deaths. Part of

your commentary is about how the BBC makes this sport exciting. That's

right. Butchered the BBC not be making sport exciting? I think what

we should be doing around this sport is playing it down, discouraging

young people from getting involved in it, recognising that there is

something slightly odd about people wanting to go that fast. It is not

for them to encourage it. This is not like Rory McIlroy in the golf

and a fine young man going out and hitting a ball faster and further

and more accurately than anyone else, this is about a man getting on

a bike and going on speeds way his life will be at stake. Talking about

the BBC, during your commentary, this is what the BBC decides is

unacceptable on air, this is part of your commentary, was it last week?

Yes. It's just unbelievable, the best feeling you've had in the

world, it's better than that. That's you talking about going at 200 mph.

It's just unbelievable, better than the best feeling you've ever had in

the world. Have you ever been in a position where you have in courage

to people to go into biking and they have been injured? I have never

encouraged anyone. What message does that send to kids? That is your

opinion, this is my opinion. But what message does it send to kids

watching the BBC, the best feeling you've had in your life, 200 miles

an hour feels better, is that responsible? If it is in a closed

circuit in control conditions there is no problem. Those crashes are not

at 200 miles an hour. There have been very minimal crashes, in fact

there has never been a crash at 200 miles an hour. That is not causing

the crashes. The crashes are on the bends. I was expressing the feeling

is the way you were -- my feelings. We all have feelings in different

ways, some people get that going up a mountain. RJ is here tonight.

Would you want your children to race? I have been down this street

before, there is no point playing the same record. I am all for road

racing, but you have to remember a public road isn't a controlled

environment. I have a motorcycle and I wouldn't dream of going over 60

miles an hour because the amount of times I have come across mistake saw

sunlight or something on the road, and a closed environment has a

medical team. I am talking about the tan druggie 100, the North West 200

is a big operation. In the paper last year usage you would want your

kids to raise. I wouldn't want to be in this gentleman's position. If my

child chose to race I guide them the way I have guided myself. My father

told me if I ever brought a motorbike home he would destroy it.

When I learned the circuits I built it up and had time to think between

corners and learner circuit. You were talking about Ryan Farquhar,

thankfully he is recovering and he is a very close friend of mine. I

took the notion of doing the Manx Grand Prix in 2013, and I wanted the

best bike available, not the fastest, bikes with brand-new burns

and wheels. I think we should continue this conversation, we have

been talking about it quite a lot, let's continue it on our

different social media channels. I'm sorry what happened to your son.

Thank you very much. Please thank our guests.

APPLAUSE. We have to leave the debate there,

but don't forget you can let Tweet me @stephennolan,

or use our hashtag #BBCNolan. Or you can text us 81771

texts will be charged And as ever, we'll also keep

the conversation going on the Nolan radio show tomorrow morning on Radio

Ulster. The Nolan radio show, Monday to

Friday, nine o'clock. Bringing you the big news of the day. We have to

have a fundamental change in policies with regards to our. The

debate. But. Longer lunch breaks the people who are obese can eat more.

On radio. I am so angry it is just a red mist. On TV and online. The

biggest show in the country, the Nolan Show, from the BBC.

Now our next guests are not for the faint-hearted -

and please don't try any of these stunts at home.

Combining bizarre freak show acts with rock n' roll,

Welcome to the carnival to the greatest show on Earth, welcome to

my freak show. Welcome to the carnival. Welcome to my freak show,

yeah. All right! Step inside, step inside, let the

revelries begin. Step inside. We've got the tallest, the smallest, the

Baptist in the land to feed the curiosities of each and every man.

Welcome to the carnival. Welcome to my freak show, yeah, yeah. Freak, so

chic! Ladies and gentlemen, introducing

the world's greatest sword swallower! We love in very cynical

signs -- times and people do not believe that the sword swallowing is

true. They think the sword retracts into the handle. Of course, it

doesn't. There are sword swallower is all over the world proving

otherwise. We intend to prove that sword swallowing is indeed a genuine

art and we are going to do that because the first sword he is going

to swallow has no handle. It is 18 inches long and attached to a handle

of chains. We will ask him to put the sword into his mouth, into his

throat, passed his lungs, until only the chain is protruding. Here goes.

The next sword he will swallow is in fact a curved cutlass with 845

degrees curve upon it. To allow Hannibal to swallow this beauty, he

has to have even more body modifications. We will show you some

of those later, but meanwhile, he will take the curved cutlass, place

it inside his mouth, force it down his throat, his whole head, neck,

and body must bend to the curvature of the blade. If he fails to do this

correctly, you will surely appears his oesophagus again. Ladies and

gentlemen, Hannibal! From darkest Africa, the voodoo

warrior! Cheering. You have been watching

Hannibal and Maria and are voodoo warrior.

APPLAUSE I don't know if I want to come

anywhere near you. That is just bizarre. Thank you. Insane. And this

man looks completely and utterly like he needs locked up. And believe

it or not, when he first joined the circus and I first met him, he was a

tax inspector. In his native Germany, where we wear for a month

in Munich to see the show, he fell in love with the show and decided to

leave work in the civil service and become a sword swallower. So George

Osborne, there is hope for him yet. So you are coming to Northern

Ireland. What will be gay be? -- gig. It will be a performance with

musicians and a great amalgamation of rock music and bizarre stuff and

also acts of great beauty. We turn a negative word, horror, into a very

positive word. People really enjoy themselves. People all over the

world. Great to be back here where I started my performing career. At 11

years old, I was... I had not known my dad for a very long because he

had run away from my mum. There is a picture of me as a fire eater. There

is one of me as a baby. My dad deserted us in that very van there

when I was six months old and did not see him for 11 years. My mum

tried to sue him for maintenance and then the courts managed to get them

together. What is he doing with his ribs? He has many body

modifications. He has the teeth and the tongue. Does he speak? Yes, no

problem. I can speak. What did you do with your ribs? They were broken

so that the swords can go down. We got them floating ribs. Show him.

Argh! We are going to see a sword go in. Yes, and you're going help us.

Ask him to take the sword. Once it is deep inside him, he will

bend forward, pushing his internal organs and you are going to pull it

out. New go, Stephen. Argh! I could feel the vibration. I thought it was

plastic or a trick. Unbelievable. We look forward to the show.

APPLAUSE Thank you, thank you.

Before we get into our next debate, let's touch on politics.

The folks on the hill are still in talks about agreeing

a way forward at Stormont and a programme for government.

So we sent Vinny out onto the streets.

We're asking people about Stormont, the new Assembly. What is important

to you? Did strike to get work for young parents with children and more

childcare help facilities. It doesn't meant -- it doesn't benefit

me to work because of childcare. What should they be prioritising?

Gay rights. I think it is high time Northern Ireland came into the 20s

-- 21st century. What do our politicians need to be doing?

Getting their finger out. Welfare system. Just job wise for people and

things like that. Education. It is really important that they focus in

special education. Stop arguing and fighting. I want you to look down at

lens until the politicians what you want them to do for you. I want the

politicians at Stormont to make a better future for my children.

Anything you would like to add? Nothing at all. Wouldn't change

anything. Same old, same old. APPLAUSE

He may be out and about near you for next week.

Abortion is back in the headlines - and on Stormont's agenda.

MLAs from different parties are planning fresh

Official figures this week showed 833 women from Northern Ireland

travelled to Great Britain for a termination last year.

And then you have the big issue of abortion pills available online.

Does that undermine the laws we have?

And should women who buy and use these pills be prosecuted?

Joining me is Marion Woods from Life NI,

Dawn McAvoy from the Evangelical Alliance,

Emma Campbell from Alliance For Choice,

And from a studio in Copenhagen, Dr Rebecca Gomperts

who is a physician and human rights activist.

Doctor Gompertz, you sell these pills. Is that correct? No, we do

not sell pills. It is a service that is giving information to women that

contact us and for the women who need to be told that they can go to

England and get medicines locally and if they have no other options,

we can refer them to our doctors who prescribe the pills and then we ask

for a donation. The women who cannot afford the donation, they can take

it. We are working together with a pharmacy in India who provides the

medicine. So you facilitate people getting them? Why are you doing

that? You just want to flout the law, do you? Well, no. It is a very

well-known way to increase access to health services where they are not

available. At the moment, in the US and Australia there are also these

kind of abortions. But they are not available because people in a local

area have a democracy and the politicians who create legislation,

given a mandate by the citizens in that country, decide that they

should not be lawful. What you do is undermine that. So this law of

Northern Ireland is from 1870. Since then, there have been a lot of human

rights convention signed and all of these human rights conventions say

that women's rights are being violated when abortion is being

criminalised. These conventions overrule all of the local laws. I am

complying with international human rights laws. Right, so you are

overruling our laws here in Northern Ireland from Copenhagen. You know a

lot about Northern Ireland? What happens is that women in Northern

Ireland have urgent medical needs. They need safe abortions. They don't

have any other option. How much, Rebecca, do you know about these

women before you facilitate them getting these pills? Do you ever

meet them? Well, it is about medical care on a distance so it has been

proven to be extremely safe. What we do is we ask exactly the same

questions as a face-to-face doctor consultation would do. That is

enough and has been proven by research, by the World Health

Organisation, to find safe abortion services. Dawn, what is your

reaction? The 1861 act, the fact that it dates from them is

irrelevant. It is not the date of the law, it is the content that

matters. There is no human right to abort because both lives matter and

there are two lives involved here. We reject completely the charge that

human rights should be used to end human life. There is no human right

to abortion. The law here defends, recognises both laws, recognises the

humanity of the on-board and so we defend the law as it stands. But you

can have all of the laws that you want, but if these pills are freely

available online, the law is undermined. It is more than an

individual woman's right to choose we would encourage the judicial

system and the police to consider how best to deal with illegal

abortion bills. Abortion isn't health care. It is not necessary for

women. The last year still values human life, that it sits under

criminal law. We're not talking about a handbag that should be under

civil law, it is not property. The unborn child is not the property of

the mother, it added value. -- it has value. Well, life Northern

Ireland believes in the intrinsic value of life from conception and

what we strive to do is to support women who find themselves in these

difficult situations and as a caring charity, we have every sympathy for

any woman who finds themselves in a situation where they think that they

have no other option but to turn to an abortion pill. But we would

remind them, especially whenever they are purchasing pills online,

they do not know what they are getting. They cannot guarantee that

what they receive in the post is what they actually have asked for.

Not only that, they are risking their own health and obviously they

are terminating the life of the unborn child. We know that women in

Northern Ireland turn to services like women on the web, simply

because the access to the very safe health care is not available under

the law in Northern Ireland. The current law, as it stands, is happy

for women to go to England and need the Netherlands and further afield

to access abortion. The MLAs are only interested in criminalising

women who have abortions here using very safe medicine. They are happy

for women in Northern Ireland to have abortions as long as they do

not have them in Northern Ireland. I think that is a nonsense. I am

sorry. It is not a matter of... How would you stop women? Do you suggest

that we don't let women leave? The law is valid here in Northern

Ireland because the MLAs have chosen to be pro life in their stands. I

honestly do not believe that the majority of women believe that they

need an abortion in order to flourish, and a society that tells

us that we need abortion in order to flourish is not a society that I

think we should be living in. You can't talk about women as a whole.

You can't talk about what women think because different women think

differently. differently. I was going to say, yes, different women

will think differently. But what you can say is no matter what the

situation, since humans have started to reproduce, is the development of

the unborn child in the womb, and that's what we would ask people to

think carefully about and educate themselves. Go-ahead. It was clear

from the statistics this week and women buying abortion pills online

that the Lord Rennard island are not stopping women having Washington's,

it stops them having safely. -- having abortions. I think it's time

we trusted women to make decisions relating to their own bodies. As I

said, I think the law is showing that it is protecting unborn lives

because for four live births across the water there is one abortion. For

Northern Ireland figures there are 25 live births for one abortion.

Those are reported figures. Even if it were doubled that... Many women

don't give a Northern Irishman postcode. We also know our figures

are similar to the Republic of Ireland, and last year 1300 packages

of abortion pills were seized. What do you think of these pills? The

World Heath Organisation says they are safer than Viagra and aspirin

and they have saved hundreds of women's lives. You have helped women

get them here. I have worked with Rebecca on many occasions. So you

have aided women to get these pills which is against the law? It is none

of my business why a woman wants to continue with a pregnancy or not and

it is safer that she has access to these pills from a reputable source.

It is against the law although the law has been shown to contravene

many human rights standards. So you decide you are going to break the

law, and by the way it is also against medical advice, isn't it? It

is not. I can read to you from Murray Stopes who ran campaigns in

favour of abortion services. "We Do not recommend taking medical

abortion pills without the supervision of a trained family

planning professional". Which is what the women consult online.

Someone on the other side of the world? We are forcing women to

travel to England to get help because the MLAs had too frightened

to change the law. Do not purchase them online, says Murray Stopes

comic you may be risking your-. Not from Women Help Women. They

interview women to make sure they have no contraindications. Despite

you knowing it is against the law, when a woman wants these pills you

help get them, do you deliver them? It used to be against the law in

Northern Ireland to have gay sex and people still did it because it is a

human rights now recognised. Do you deliver them? I will not tell you

what I do. I help women who need it. I also volunteer at Murray Stopes

and help women in. Have the police questioned you? They have questioned

me to do with my escort in women to marry Stopes. Have they questioned

you about breaking the law in terms of these pills or arrested or

cautioned you? They haven't. Why not, Chief Constable? We have a

statement from the police we can read. Let's have a look at this.

Is it for the police to get involved in emotion? I thought they just

followed the law, why are they saying it is a most if -- it is

emotive? Police would remind the public not

to tape and prescribed prescription jugs as it is potentially harmful

without appropriate medical supervision -- prescription drugs.

That is the police statement. Is it not an extraordinary situation that

someone in the studio tonight is saying she breaks the law and the

police don't go near it. It is not for me to say if you should be

prosecuted, that is for the CPS, but they don't question you. Can I ask

you something? Yes. We are talking about real women in real lives and

not just about an abstract law. We have so

many e-mail correspondence, there are many women in Northern Ireland

who are extremely poor, who don't have the money to travel to England.

This is a matter of social justice. Women are poor who are entitled to

the same health care. Said the answer to poverty is the ending of

the human life? Breeder Hughes from the Royal College of midwives. I

think the Royal College of midwives is very clear that abortion is in

fact a health-care issue, not a moral issue, it is a health-care

issue. But across the world women died because they cannot access

safe, legal abortions. Not in Northern Ireland. With women having

access to pills on the web, which are as Emma has said perfectly safe

if taken possibly... How do you know what's in them? They are the kosher

substance, they are safe. The Royal College of midwives this week also

called for complete decriminalisation without asking

their midwives or consulting them and would say abortion throughout

the UK... Can I go back to what I said before I was interrupted? These

drugs are safe if taken as directed and if the women are counselled. Can

that happen online? Lots of people have telephone conversations and

medicines prescribed with their doctors. What happens in Northern

Ireland if a woman buys these pills because she doesn't have the money

to go to Britain, she suffers a adverse effect and she is afraid to

seek medical help because she fears she

will be prosecuted. I think until now there has been complacency,

people saying, they will never prosecute a woman for this. They

have, and there was another case adjourned today, and at least two

more from the justice system. We think the police service should

prosecute these women, -- I den think it is the in -- in the

interest of health and Society. We are out of time but there is clearly

more discussions to have on this tonight. Thank you to our guests,

give them a round of applause. APPLAUSE.

Before we end the show tonight, let's talk to a local couple

who have won the hearts of the nation, or at

Ladies and gentlemen, it's Ian and Ann Marshall!

Ladies and gentlemen, it's Ian and Ann Marshall!

CHEERING AND APPLAUSE. Hello, have a seat! Well, they recognise you from

the big show, don't they, unbelievable. What was it like on

the stage? Fabulous, fantastic. You are a bit of a nutter, I saw that

straightaway, this woman is completely eccentric. Just like you!

APPLAUSE. That's what I said to Simon, you didn't see this in the

clip, I said to Simon Cowell, she's just like you, she's a subtle as a

brick behind the year. How long have you been married? 44 years. When did

you start singing together? A year ago. I am looking at the crowd here

because I don't fancy you... LAUGHTER Not until you've tried it,

big lad! You see those wooden dolls on that screen, that was taken in

Hong Kong, we are like little china dolls, like one of those

old-fashioned picture things. But when we went on the show we had a

fantastic time, there was a lot you didn't see on the actual show. White

and there's so much I am finding out about U2, but there are lots of back

stories, for example one of you has lost a lot of weight, who was that?

Do you think it was me? Do I look like I needed to lose weight? It was

you? He was as big as you last November! And sure you're glad he's

not as big as me now. I thought he was going to cut a few pounds of

you, the man with the sword. I could give you a few tips but whether you

take them and I don't know. The other back story I heard, it you

lived on the streets. I was a runaway 14, my father was a bare

knuckle fighter and an alcoholic, my mother was sanatorium, no wonder

with around, and I ran away because he beat me for not making sure the

House was clear enough. And basically I lived on the street from

14, and I wanted to tell you this, I didn't steal a thing, I went hungry,

I had nothing, I didn't take, I ate rotten food from garbage cans or

anything, had my shoes stolen. The thing is, you see, I'm not living on

this story. This is a positive. I know, because the big smile on your

face and the joy you to clearly have in your marriage... I am a master

chef today. The joy he had was meeting a Northern Irishman.

APPLAUSE. Will you take us out of the show 's singing. We will bring

the show out with you tonight. Go ahead. Give me a kiss first.

That's almost it for another action-packed Nolan Live.

Wou can continue the conversation with me after the show

But singing us out tonight with their fun version

of Beyonce's Crazy In Love, it's Ian Ann!

of Beyonce's Crazy In Love, it's Ian Anne!

# I look and stare so deep in your eyes,

# I touch on you more and more every time,

# When you leave I'm begging you not to go,

# Call your name two or three times in a row,

# Such a funny thing for me to try to explain,

# How I'm feeling and my pride is the one to blame.

# But I just don't understand How your love can do

# Got me looking so crazy right now, your love's

# Got me looking so crazy right now in love

# Got me looking so crazy right now, your touch

# Got me hoping you'll page me right now, your kiss

# Got me hoping you'll save me right now

# Looking so crazy in love's got me looking, got me

# Got me looking so crazy right now, your love's

# Got me looking so crazy right now in love

# Got me looking so crazy right now, your touch

# Got me hoping you'll page me right now, your kiss

# Got me hoping you'll save me right now

# Looking so crazy in love's got me looking, got me

# Oh yeah, doo-ba-doo-ba-ba-ba-boom-boom

# Got me looking, so crazy, my baby I'm foolish,

# Got me looking, so crazy, my baby I'm foolish,

# Got me looking so crazy right now, your touch

# Got me hoping you'll page me right now, your kiss

# Got me hoping you'll save me right now

# Looking so crazy in love's got me looking, got me

# Got me looking so crazy right now, your love's

# Got me looking so crazy right now in love

# Got me looking so crazy right now, your touch

# Got me hoping you'll page me right now, your kiss

# Got me hoping you'll save me right now

# Looking so crazy in love's got me looking, got me