08/03/2014 Plaid Cymru Conference

Spring has sprung, the sun is out and that can only mean one thing.

It's political conference season and its Plaid Cymru today. Stay with us

for coverage from the conference between now and 4:30pm. Good

afternoon. Welcome to the programme. Over the next two hours will be

talking Europe, the pop tracks, childcare and of course where Plaid

would like to go next on the devolution journey. We be heading to

the conference shortly to hear Plaid Cymru's parliamentary leader Elfyn

Llwyd. They are discussing what migration means to Wales. First, we

shall shortly reveal the contents of the whole two. This is our chief

anorak, Vaughan Roderick. Where is Plaid Cymru at the moment?

They are on Newport Road in Cardiff! I think Plaid are in a difficult

spot coming up to an election, a sequence of elections, first of all

the European followed by the general and the assembly election in 2016

and the first of those could well be the trickiest for Plaid Cymru.

That's because of the way the voting system operates. Plaid had two seats

in Europe at one time, and they have had seen since 1999. This time it

looks tricky because of the rise of UKIP and because Labour are in

opposition big -- which means Labour supporters may come out in greater

numbers. There is also a difficulty that they face with what's happening

in Welsh politics more generally wear because David Cameron and

Westminster politicians are playing at Labour's record in Wales. In

essence, Welsh politics is becoming quite British at moment, becoming

quite... Revolving around arguments between Labour and Conservatives,

rather than specifically Welsh arguments. So it's a tricky period.

But they had a good victory in the Anglesey by-election and good cancer

results last year. Organisationally common... The party is looking quite

good. And Leanne Wood has been leading for

two years. How was she doing? I don't sense that anyone in the

pliant -- Plaid Cymru is hatching a challenge of trying to undermine her

leadership. On the other hand, most people within Plaid would privately

tell you that she is so very much a new leader who is on a learning

curve. They are saying that she will be the finished article by the time

of the next assembly elections but she's not the finished article yet.

She wasn't that experienced politician when she was first

elected. And in terms of targets, Europe is

very tricky. Then comes the next general election. What about that?

The Westminster election will be interesting for Plaid because they

currently hold three seats and of those three, when of them only

totally safe and that is to formally honoured. They're going to have to

fight hard to keep Caernarfon and they going to have to fight hard to

keep Caernarfon -- Carmarthen East. But they have a target seat in

Anglesey, and they may have a slim hope in Ceredigion.

Let's go over to the conference hall now at Holland House -- Holland

House in Cardiff. Elfyn Llwyd is on his feet.

The manifesto sets out Scotland's future and has put the yes camp and

the front foot. So far, they have yet to propose a single memorable

policy aside from saying what the Scots won't get if they're tenacious

enough to vote to determine their own future. The incompetence of some

members of the no campaign has made the yes campaign 's case even

stronger. For example, the tremendous comment made by the

leader of Scottish Labour, less than a fortnight ago that the Scots are

not genetically programmed to make political decisions. If that is the

line that Labour takes, it certainly would explain a great deal about the

decision-making of our Labour colleagues in Cardiff Bay. On behalf

of the Westminster group and all of us, I'd like to send our friends in

the yes campaign our heartfelt best wishes for the months ahead.

Obviously obviously, I like everybody in this conference will be

advocating the yes vote but whatever the result and that referendum one

thing is certain, the make-up of this union will never be the same

again. It's no wonder that Labour had such a loss as to what their

strategy is all should be. The Unionist parties can rightly be

accused of putting politics ahead of policy and ahead of the best

interests of the people they purport to serve. The Scottish National

party on the other hand, and the entire yes campaign, have shown that

they are motivated, upbeat and able to back off any cynical attitudes

from London, because they want a better future for Scotland. There is

no reason at all better future for Scotland. There is

should be less ambitious for our future, for the future of our nation

and our people. The changes advocated by the silk reports show

that momentum is finally building amongst the other political parties

to demand more power for the assembly in Cardiff and once again,

Plaid Cymru has paved the way for the debate on what direction

devolution should be taking in Wales. It's certainly gratifying

that the Silk Commission second report has advocated many of

Plaid's policies and whether Silk Commission has demonstrated that

there is a case to transfer responsibilities to the National

Assembly, we must make sure that we push for this transfer to happen at

the earliest possible opportunity. The UK government has indicated that

a Wales Bill will be part of the upcoming Queen 's speech and we in

the Westminster team will be ready to bow to demands on the record.

Recently, my friend and colleague Hywel Williams used his temporary

place on the Welsh temporary affairs select committee to table amendments

of the report on the draft will spill, aimed at removing the

lockstep that would limit the assembly's ability to vary income

tax bands individually from the face of the bill. However a vote on the

amendment on which Welsh Labour MPs and stained, despite their

colleagues in Cardiff saying the lockstep as a Tory trap and that it

should be removed, not for the first time, Labour presents two faces, one

in Cardiff and another in Westminster. They have been sitting

on their hands so long it's a wonder there is any blood left in them at

all but we, at least, won't compromise on our principles and

scrutinising this bill. It's only common sense that the Silk

Commission has recommended adopting a reserved powers model for Wales,

which Plaid has long said would provide greater clarity about the

assembly's unit and allow for more details and more effective scrutiny.

It is frustrating to see that such little progress is being made in

creating a Welsh legal jurisdiction. The assembly 's powers over planning

consents for energy development will be limited to projects generating a

350 megawatts or less. The Silk Commission also failed to recommend

the devolution of control over Crown Estates and broadcasting

capabilities except for S4C. It is courtesy the 12 has been a little

short changed in the short term. Had the Silk Commission recommended to

the devolution of powers over the Crown estate including all of Wales

's natural resources, we would not be facing this exasperating

situation of being an energy rich nation with limited powers to tackle

the farewell poverty which blights thousands of our households. But we

are where we are and our priority now and over the coming months must

be to fight for the implementation of the reports recommendations at

the earliest possibility and we will tolerate no less. But for now at

least, many of the crucial decisions which affect the people of Wales

remain under the control of Westminster and that is why it is so

important that the real act Hywel Williams for

important that the real act Hywel Edwards for Carmarthen East, Liz

Saville Roberts four to formally honoured, and of course, John

Saville Roberts four to formally Rowlands were Ynys Mon, Mike Parker

for Ceredigion in the 2015 general election. Because the need for a

strong voice fighting for Wales is interested in Westminster has never

been more important. Over the past year, our team has worked tirelessly

to keep Wales on the agenda and also to ensure that our constituents and

the people of Wales remain at the centre of debates. In Jonathan

Edwards, we have a politician of conviction who is one of the most

hard-working members of Parliament Wales has or has ever had. Jonathan

has that own policies which would you distribute wealth, tackle

inequality, and strengthen our economy here in Wales. He has called

for an economic failure spells, a bank of Wales, fair funding follows

from HS2 expenditure, and a financial transaction tax. Locally

he has led the campaign to protect fire services and told the Labour

council to account. He fights tirelessly for the people of

Carmarthenshire and we will never -- he will never settle for anything

then the best deal possible for Wales. Hywel Williams has

vociferously oppose the proposed changes to benefits and implement

nation of universal credit and a malicious bedroom tax, as well as

the government 's changes to pensions. Howard has promoted Plaid

's plans for energy woes and has made a case for fear of fairness,

advocating a fuel duty stabiliser to help those in rural areas as well as

early payment of the winter payment -- winter fuel allowance. He has

championed the causes of those most in need of help do to this

government 's pernicious policies. Giving committee stage of the water

bowl, Holocaust vote that would have devolved full control of water

policy to Wales and insured Wales is telling total integrity. Once again

Welsh Labour MPs undermined their Welsh first Minister and failed to

support our amendments. In the second chamber, Dafydd Wigley has

continued to fight winces corner, covering a mammoth amount of

legislation, hosting debates on Wilson 's economy, fighting for the

composition rights of victims of mesothelioma, careless rights, and

securing a legacy for Wales out of the Olympic games. He is as we know

a bit of an Olympian himself, in the form of a multi-event. Proving that

the best retirement for workaholics is no retirement at all but we

couldn't do without him, I tell you that. Myself, I continue to sit on

the Justice committee and have fought against the devastating

changes being proposed to legal aid, the courts, and the prison estate.

Following on from the success of our stalking enquiry, which resulted in

changes to the law in 20 to 12. The recently established an all-party

group on stalking and harassment. Last week I presented a ten minute

rule Bill which would strengthen the bill on domestic violence. Today, as

we mark International women's Day, and the impairment nation of Clare

's law, the need to show proper support for victims of these

horrendous crimes has never been more vital. Our group was united in

our opposition to military intervention in Syria and encourage

the government to pursue diplomatic and humanitarian solutions. We have

argued that the UK should grant access to refugees from Syria in

spite of the government 's refusal to join the UNHCR 's resettlement

programme. The team continues to fight to give Wales a platform just

not just in UK politics, but internationally as well. Earlier

this month, I attended a heads of government conference in Athens as

acting chair of the House of Commons Justice select committee

representatives and 28 nations discussed topics such as migration

and tackling violent extremism. In the company of dignitaries from

across the continents, I was very glad to be able to dispel the myth

that not everyone from the few British Isles is anti-European.

Despite the hysteria and indeed scaremongering currently is so --

surrounding the immigration debate in the UK. With the European

elections around the corner, it was a timely reminder to me of the

importance of fostering strong links between Wales and elsewhere on the

continent and highlighting the many benefits brought to Wales by our

membership of the European Union. Our agricultural industry as we

know, forms a vital part of the Welsh economy and is boosted by the

EU policies and projects. Our young people at universities to, receive

vital youth funding and support that insures that Wales 's institutions

are able to offer an excellent standard of education and compete

with the best institutions in the UK and beyond. But membership of the EU

doesn't just help foster progress and ambition. Some of those's cup

poorest communities receive millions of pounds of European funding is

helping to close the gap with more prosperous areas. Which is why it

was so dismaying last year to see Labour MPs from Wales gang up with

some of the Tories most extreme right-wingers to vote in favour of a

cut to the EU budget. This billion pound betrayal serves as a stark

reminder that Labour in Wales will take its orders from Westminster.

But we know that Wales needs a first Minister whose ambitions are

informed by what's best for the Wales news Leanne Wood at the helm.

What says Plaid Cymru is from the other parties and it comes to Europe

is clear and consistent support for Wales as membership of the EU. Our

stance on this debate is driven by principle rather than political

posturing. Our vision and principles find a chord across the continent.

As UKIP makes progress in the polls the London parties and increasingly

willing to dance to the tune for fear of losing support. We know UKIP

will not dictate anything to Plaid Cymru. While I believe the EU is far

from perfect, I am firmly of the view that change from the inside is

better than being stuck on the sidelines with fewer friends and

foes. European Union is good for Wales and I would argue anyone who

cares about nation 's future to turn out to vote in May and make sure we

have the strongest voice possible in Brussels because Wales needs Plaid

Cymru at the European table. The only party that refuses to buckle to

the narrow ideologies of the London parties and the xenophobic attitudes

of the tabloid press. Confidence, over the next six months I would

relationship with two unions will be the subject of great debate. Our job

now is to make certain that we get the best possible deal for Wales in

the speedy implementation of silk 's proposals as a bare minimum and the

pre-election of Jill Evans as the plant -- Plaid Cymru MEP in May.

Thank you. There we go, applause for the

parliamentary leader. The Silk Commission mentioned, the report is

published this week, but Plaid Cymru wanted to go further. The other two

parties have internal tensions regarding the Silk Commission. Part

one is what will be paying regarding the Silk Commission. Part

to over the next few months. regarding the Silk Commission. Part

all about money. I do think we're going to hear an awful lot more

about the Silk Commission part two. It is in the refrigerator. The next

step on that will be to do with the party 's manifesto was come the next

general election. And then whatever happens in terms of possible

coalition talks if it is another hung parliament. It could be on the

back burner. We talk about silk part two, but it lists a lot of things

that might be devolved. There was this thing about reserved powers.

Walk me through that without going into the fridge! It is a model which

says these are the powers that are reserved to Westminster rather than

these other powers devolved to Cardiff. The reason that is

important, that is the Scottish model incidentally, it is much

clearer. We have had a number of court cases where there have been

arguments whether something was devolved or not. For instance, the

agricultural wages board. The Welsh Government wants to establish a

replacement. Is that a question of agriculture which is devolved, or

employment which isn't? This is something the Labour Party in

Westminster and in Cardiff Bay can agree on. If you have a Labour

government in the next election we will be seeing reasonably rapid

moves on that. When it will be seeing reasonably rapid

particular extra will be seeing reasonably rapid

devolved, we saw it this week Ann will be seeing reasonably rapid

Clwyd looking at the Welsh health service, she is reluctant to give

more powers. There are a lot MPs who feel like that. The deserved powers

model is something perhaps that will all could come rapidly after the

general election. We will come back to that. Let's go to the conference

and join our political editor and his guest.

You join me in one of the side rooms to the main auditorium. Elfyn

Llwyd's speech has just finished. Earlier on today we heard from Jill

Evans, the current MEP hoping to be re-elected. The subject of the

European elections is at the forefront of conversation at the

conference. Let's have a chat now with two of those candidates, Steven

Cornelius and Marc Jones. Good afternoon. It is interesting, I

thought, I caught up with Jill Evans and she was comparing this European

election with five years ago. She felt it was much more high profile

on the doorstep because of the involvement, primarily, of UKIP and

the prospect of an in out referendum. People are engaging on

the doorstep. The problem with the Europe election in the past is it

has been a chance for people to vote how they like, it is a freebie. But

this one is much more serious. We are the only party that will stand

up for Wales. The media has given UKIP an easy ride. Now, they are

coming under it more scrutiny. How are you finding things on the

doorstep. We are finding that is a lot more awareness of the European

election. A lot more people adding gauged because it is a high-stakes

election. We have got a lot of work to do. We are determined to make

sure we have Plaid Cymru MEP returned. Was Leanne Wood wise to go

on the attack in the way that she did and UKIP? The reason I frame

that question is I spoke to Lord Elis-Thomas who described the attack

as facile in the way she connected a vote for UKIP are somehow a vote

against national interest of Wales. I think Ian Wood was perfectly

right. You can't ignore UKIP. It would've been facile to ignore UKIP.

What she has done is being precisely correct in analysing what UKIP is

all about. They didn't want a Welsh Assembly with any democratic rights

or powers. UKIP is thinking about the south-east of England and it is

ironic we have a party which claims to be run by a public schoolboy. She

takes them more seriously than that? A lot of people in Wales

support UKIP? Is that underestimating them? As you get

close to the election and more light shone on UKIP, but the consequences

of their policies will be, we come shone on UKIP, but the consequences

They don't stand up for Wales in shone on UKIP, but the consequences

Europe. As shone on UKIP, but the consequences

that more and more, I think people will come to see UKIP for the

dangerous agenda that they are. On the border point of Europe and how

people feel towards Europe, Jill Evans said people had lost faith in

the EU. Do you agree with that? How would you turn it around? Our job is

to make sure that Europe works for Wales. That is about changing the

EU. The EU as it is is a nightmare. It spends millions of pounds on

going to Strasborg every month. We need to stop that nonsense. We have

got to be totally honest with people. There are aspects of the EE

which are nonsensical. We have two face up to that and change Europe

from within. We talk about UKIP but they have traction out there with

the public. What arguments are you using to try to get people to

support Plaid Cymru? The choice in this election is clear. Who do you

trust to fight for Wales in Europe? I think when that question is put to

people it is clear it is a Plaid Cymru MEP Winnie. One of the

policies that came out yesterday is to create a private sector led

section which would advise public servants how to spend money. Is it

an acknowledgement we haven't used the EU funds as

an acknowledgement we haven't used have? There has been some success

stories. If you look at the big picture it becomes quite clear that

we haven't done as well as we might have done. GDP across West Wales and

the Valleys has fallen over that period. We need to ask why the Welsh

Labour government hasn't been making a better job of it. It is right that

outcome is looking at that again. -- that Plaid Cymru is looking at that

again. How do we do that? We have frittered it away on smaller

schemes. Sum of those smaller schemes have been useful. We need to

involve grassroots organisations and give them more power about how

things are done. There is a crying need for infrastructure projects and

what have you in Wales. That hasn't really happened with the European

money. Many thanks to you both. From the conference in Cardiff, I have is

the Internet to European candidates, back to you. We will be back there

later. The theme of Europe figured strongly

in yesterday 's speech by Leanne Wood.

Our final national gathering before the Europe in elections in just a

few weeks time. This city, although in Europe's youngest capitals, has

been at the centre stage at key moments in our nation 's history.

It's youthfulness betraying a millennia of the Welsh national

story. It was in this city that the great ifor Bach and body the great

Welsh spirits by scaling the walls of Cardiff Castle to confront the

mighty Norman overlords. Rhun ap Iorwerth may have been small in

height but he was great in determination. In September,

Scotland has the opportunity to step permanent clean and confidently out

of the shadows. And friends, when the people of Wales want it Wales

will follow. Plaid Cymru firmly believes that Wales can and will

shine and will not be left behind. Just like Ifor Bach, we have always

reached those walls in the past from generation to generation. It is the

unlikely story of a country 's triumph against the odds. Over the

decades, we have faced seemingly insurmountable challenges and we

face them together as one. Lastly, last week marked the anniversary

when so many of us thought that Welsh nationhood had been lost. When

so many thought that was one wall too many for Wales to breach. When

our country rejected devolution by a landslide margin of 10-1. We feared

we had voted ourselves out of existence. But within two decades,

that was all undone. Our nationhood has been secured. We proved that we

could bounce back. today we face new opportunities and new challenges. We

will be required to summon the same strength and determination that have

carried our hopes before. The party of Wales is firmly fixed on

transforming this country to enable our people to win for themselves a

better future. We have a restless party, never standing still. We are

driven by our belief that Wales party, never standing still. We are

and will do better, that's the next generation can and will have it

better than the last. It is precisely that Welsh drive that

slides to the unlikely election of the daughter of a the Rhondda bus

driver as the leader of the whale -- party of Wales. Both my parents were

told not to bother sitting there are 11 plus exams. Their future had been

predetermined, a B and placed on their potential. But they did not

play such limits on their children. The 11 plus may now be history but

to children in Wales today face a different kind of barrier, a barrier

in the form of a Labour government that has failed children in all

parts of this country. As Wales itself our children are not allowed

to reach their full potential after 15 years of Labour government for

education authorities are in special measures and we're still slipping

down the pizza lovers. The Prime Minister has said that he has taken

his eye off the ball. He has no strategy. It is quite obvious that

if we carry on to do everything in the same way, we shall get the same

results it's time to believe in something better. And by looking to

the future, Plaid Cymru is determined to ensure a future for

the Welsh language, so that it may grow. This means investing in a

childcare system which secures sufficient to supply of Welsh medium

care for children, to win sure that's the next generation has the

right to begin their lives bilingually. may I take this

opportunity to congratulate Ceredigion council and Plaid

Cymru's leadership there, which has contributed to a excellent Western

reports. We reject an education system which sets school against

School, school against school, teacher against teacher. A system

where banding is more important than results. Plaid Cymru once a new

attitude based on cooperation, not competition. We want to release

teachers to have the time to develop and to teach so that they can

cooperate and share the best practice. Plaid Cymru will work with

teachers, to reduce the bureaucratic burden rather than working from the

top-down. We shall trust teachers and them the freedom to decide how

to do their work. We shall free up teachers so that they can carry on

with the task of teaching. Wales has a first Minister without a plan. He

was also a first Minister without the backing of his own party. And

local government reorganisation, on income tax devolution, on hospital

centralisation, his party is publicly protesting in open defiance

of his leadership. And doesn't it tell us all we need to know about

the state of the Unionist consensus in Wales today that the two main

unionist parties are split and in it has required us to compromise. We

would have preferred to go one further. At last, our country has

the opportunity to gain meaningful powers in a variety of areas. I want

to take this opportunity to thank Doctor Ivor Quill for what he is

achieved through our country through the process of the Silk Commission.

And be in no doubt, Conference, without Plaid Cymru, none of this

would've happened. We have won the argument on the devolution of

taxation, the devolution of policing, and Conference, after

decades long struggle, we won the argument on putting those 's Wales

water in favour's hounds. -- hands. It is vital now that we get on with

implementing the recommendations as soon as possible but the in game

wouldn't response of using -- unionists and minds the whole

process. As the leader of the National party, I want to be clear

with the people of Wales. Do not think that our ambition for our

country is limited. I want to see the people of Wales have control

over all of Westminster's Someone once said Wales has an assembly

because it is a nation but the powers of that assembly are limited

in case Wales acts like a nation. The referendum of 2011, words spoke

and behaved as a nation. Devolution can no longer be a process that has

a pit stop at every juncture. This year, in the context of tectonic

change in these islands, we cannot allow Wales to be a mere spectator.

Winners must be a full participant in the process of changing Britain.

When Scotland has weapons of mass destruction is removed from its

country, words should be able to insist that not one of those

warheads is relocated to our shores. The UK is an unbalanced state,

socially, politically, and economically. The opportunity must

be taken after September to rebalance the British state. I

advocate a new council of ministers for the UK that will comprise of all

the nations. This cancer should be a forum post seeking agreement on

matters, giving of rice to the people through their government is a

recognition of the 70 of the people. But talk alone is cheap. We

must be empowered to. The Tories are keen to talk about UK opt out, from

burdensome EU decisions or decisions deemed to be at odds with the UK's

interests. It may surprise you to hear that I'm not opposed in

principle to opt outs but I'd like to start closer to home with a right

to opt out for Wales from unjust and unacceptable UK policy decisions

that affect us. Real empowerment would mean a Welsh opt out and Welsh

say on big decisions like welfare and warfare. No more bedroom taxes,

forced on Wales. No more young Welshman and women being dragged

into illegal wars against the express will of the people of Wales

and their government. Wales should be able to say no and mean no. A

forum such as this could be an adequate interim measure until our

nation is ready for a more permanent settlement as an independent

country. Plaid Cymru is ambitious for Wales and we trust the people of

Wales with the big decisions. We've seen how project fear in Scotland

has sought to bully instead of presenting at positive case. And how

they roped in others, like the commissionaire who did the cause of

European cooperation in no good at all when he intervened in

Scotland's democratic process. No unelected European Commissioner has

the right to tell the people of a democratic nation that they express

will will be ignored. You won't believe Scotland and you won't

believe Wales either. -- bully. And it's precisely that kind of

intervention that that That's strong voice that Wales has been able to

count on through Jill Evans. Who else will speak for the Welsh

national interest? Who else will advocate and EU for the people, and

EU that is a member, responsive partnership of nations, and EU that

will listen to Wales. We have to be in it to change it. It is the party

of Wales that has inherited the mantle of progressive outfit looking

politics in Wales. We may well be often frustrated at the lack of

agility of the European Union but were fully committed to our

continued membership as an active participant. I know that many people

in Wales who share our vision of a European Wales have agreed Wales,

will feel I urge you today not to let the despondency resolved in

staying away from the polling booths. European elections are

notorious for their low turnout. But if despondent liberal Democrats and

Greens, and sure of what to do at that huge staying at home number it

will only benefit the Europhobia cracked. I -- Europhobic right. This

could very well be our last ever Europe he and election if we do not

make our voices heard and our votes count. -- European election. Don't

forget what is at stake in this election. Do not forget all that

will be put at risk if dangerous right-wing Europhobia is victorious.

Friends, we have two choices. Two possible futures. We should battle

for Wales, a prosperous Wales, free within the European Union ought to

see our nation be dragged down by London parties. I, and my party,

choose the right shining Path for Wales. Our businesses rely on ?5

billion worth of trade with our EU partners every year. Our country is

benefiting from investment in infrastructure. More than one in ten

jobs is directly dependent on our membership of the EU. That is

150,000 reasons to vote Plaid Cymru in this maze election. -- made's

election. This year marks a significant centenary for Europe.

The autumn of 1914 marked the beginning of a mindless period of

mass death. Of unspeakable butchery and suffering. It is grotesque that

elements of the British state seek to use this centenary to glorify

their worldview. There is no glory in war, least of all the First World

War. One lesson for all of us in this centenary year is the act

despite its many faults and frustrations, the Europe of 2014 is

a far better place for its citizens than the Europe of 100 years ago.

Sowing this ease of division in our country and in this continent has no

place. I say to the purveyors of division today, I say to UKIP today,

your politics has no place in this country. Not now, not ever. Your

values are not the values of Wales. A vote for UKIP is a vote against

Wales, a vote against the Welsh national interest. We cannot and

will not let their ugly politics divide us in May.

I tell them here and now that we are one Wales. Not immigrant versus low

call, one Wales. Not rule versus urban, one Wales. Not Welsh speaking

versus English-speaking, one Wales. Not North, not south. Friends, we

stand together in the face of division as one Wales. More than

ever, our nation needs to pull together, our communities need to

pull together. Four years of Tory enforced austerity, the dismantling

of the welfare state and a cut of ?1.7 billion to the Welsh budget

have plunged families to the breadline. Have put fear into the

work and they seek to divide. Conference, Wales can't rely on

others to champion our national interest. The people of Wales no

that Plaid Cymru can be trusted to put Wales first every time, every

day. I was proud to unveil earlier this year my new shadow cabinet,

Wales 's cabinet in waiting. As a team, we have hit the ground running

and failing policy peoples and proposals that will help to

transform our country. Our plans to recruit a thousand extra doctors to

the welfare -- Welsh health service contrasts to the current

government's managed off-line. We are consulting on a new approach to

tear down barriers between Health and Social Care Act, to put an end

to bed blocking and at last, to put the patient front and centre of

health and social services. We are determined to end the perverse

situation where an energy rich country like ours is burdened with

fuel poverty. We demand control over our natural resources so that the

wealth creators from them and if it's communities and families with

bills kept down, not just for 20 months, but for good. Natural

resources in national hand. We are reaching creativity as well and that

is why we have renewed calls for the devolution of broadcast and so our

creative industries can flourish, boosting our economy and enhancing

our cultures. We have given Wales a voice on matters with a too long we

have been ignored. On migration, it is high time we federalised

decisions so we have a Welsh migration system that works for our

country, our priorities, our needs. Just yesterday I was proud to unveil

our vision for a modern childcare system that will end the postcode

lottery provision aiding parents to get back into the workplace and

giving our children the start in life that these so thoroughly

deserved. Plaid Cymru is not standing still while others pretend

to stand up for Wales. Each and every one of our policy initiatives

is driven by a motivation to release the potential of the country and

match the aspirations of the people. We are getting on with the job of

fighting for the Wales that people are yearning to see. Above all, we

have a laser focus on turning around our country's economic performance

and it will be for the long-term. A durable recovery that will last and

will be universally felt. You see, all this talk of recovery now will

be meaningless if it follows previous patterns. Where the

south-east of England and the bloated London region hoovers the

industry and talent from the rest of the UK. This must not again be a

hollow recovery for Wales. Earlier, I mentioned the need for a political

rebalancing of Britain and there is need as well for the economic

rebalancing of the British state. There is a danger of an upgraded

growth forecast resulting for more than a spreadsheet recovery. Where

the social and economic condition of our country as some have asked and

do not reveal what is, for many, a reality. Zero hours contracts, a

race to the bottom in wages, extortionate bills for essentials

such as public transport and energy. A structural realignment

economically is vital. That is way the party of Wales advocates a

publicly owned energy company so prices are always capped as low as

possible. -- kept. A public rail network that puts people ahead of

the fast buck and is affordable as well as reliable. A business culture

where innovation is encouraged and small and medium-sized enterprises

can flourish. I have spoken often of my desire for Wales to be at the

forefront of a new industrial revolution. To do so, Welsh

businesses must be at the heart of everything we do. A narrative of

putting private sector against the public sector has emerged recently.

A meaningless division in vented to suit no row, party political

interests at Westminster. -- narrow. Many tell you on top and there's

today that Plaid Cymru led Welsh Government will be a business

friendly government. May I tell you enter openness. Over 80,000 Welsh

businesses will benefit and our plans to overhaul the business rates

system with more than 70,000 been removed from paying great

altogether. -- paying rates altogether. There has been a

disconnect between the opportunities provided by European funding and the

long-term economic benefits. Billions of European funds have been

spent in recent years. Billions more will come. But Plaid Cymru once a

change in culture and a strategic shift in how European funds up at to

use. Last week, we were given a chilling reminder of the scale of

the task that faces us. GDP in West Wales and the Valleys has declined

again. From 65% of the EU average to 64%. Our Valleys communities deserve

that than this. I want to maximise the potential of Welsh businesses

and ex-teas and talents for the good of the entire nation. -- and

expertise. We will begin a consultation with as Mrs and others

as to how we can transform our economy by maximising the

possibilities of European funds, especially, private capital

resources from the Welsh and UK Government. The new cycle of

European structural funds is underway and we may never get a same

level of European funding as we will get from this year to 2020. I will

therefore be consulting on establishing a new body outside of

Welsh Government. This new body will be private sector led and will

proactively seek opportunities to invest European funds, other public

funds and private capital for the maximum long-term economic benefit.

It will establish a presence for Wales within the investment sector

2-mac eight -- match ideas. It will transform the mentality of risk

aversion in the current culture of administering rather than driving.

The new body will bring together the best and the brightest, working with

our universities, trade unions and communities. For too long I will

approach to using EU funds especially has been fragmented,

lacking indirection and lacking in focus. Where has it got us) the new

agency I propose will be overarching, nimble and will seek

out opportunities and realise them. It will not sit back and wait for

things to happen. That is Labour 's way, not Plaid Cymru's. The Labour

government may have given up on driving up our GDP but Plaid Cymru

will use every tool in government to add billions in value to our economy

so first we reach the UK average for prosperity and in time we will

exceed it. The party of Wales is the party of designers and innovation.

We mean business. A healthy business environment goes hand-in-hand and

not in contradiction with fake conditions for workers. The

countries with less levels of productivity are those where workers

are respected and treated well. It is a central aim for Plaid Cymru to

end the absurd practice of these eight subsidising poor working

conditions and poor levels of pay. I want to congratulate Plaid Cymru led

Gwynedd Council in increasing the wages of the lowest paid workers

moving towards the living wage. This is very welcome. This is very, very

welcome and indeed it represents Plaid Cymru's drive to increase

wages and boost living standards. I have hope that the rest of this

sector will follow this lad to want to watch. Ten out of 50,000 Welsh

workers currently receive a wage that is currently below a living

wage. Reducing this number will Grant was not just for appropriate

workers but for America as a whole and for the public purse. But a

business in a position of readership and overcoming worlds as low wage

economy in the central plank of Plaid Cymru's business tool. Just as

I return to bridge gaps in standards and pay, so too must bridge gaps

between our communities and between the quality of services across the

country. The headlines that created a web -- winnings from -- report. I

can't think of another example in the world where the government has

been advised by any condition it appointed itself to effectively

rewrite so programme of government. At things as targets would want to

be inconsistent and clear, a reflection of the Welsh Government

and labour. And it is totally unacceptable that a different level

of two when he exists in the transfer of patients times between

one council area and another. But what struck me more than anything

else in that report was the to join the poverty and aspiration that

exists and will ball. It said it reaching the average had That is not

good enough and that is not the the danger posed by global governance

performance. Plus some opinion polls that suggest an increase in

anti-Jewish feelings. Neighbours to performance threatens the very

future of --) performance threatens devolution. But when asked to people

being asked to want to approach Westminster parliament? Wouldn't ask

that, because when you don't get the services you deserve, a children's

education is adequate, the economic are hampered, he wouldn't have

situation of those in charge of institution. -- is an institution,

and of those in charge of the institution. The people of rows in

the final change of direction and Conference, the change of government

and Cardiff Bay will deliver that. Food and culture of. Striving for

excellence buttons and run across all departments and all sectors.

This will always have its day tractors who will tell us that were

too small, too stupid, too weak to reach such levels of excellence. But

once in a generation, enrolment presents itself with the group of

determined people have the opportunity to transfer the cause of

revolution. We're about to enter an electoral cycle is a party that will

begin away -- in a bit of in 2016. When asked to reflect on this

period, let us make sure that it is this moment, here and now, that's

the point to as the moment the course of our country changed for

good. The politics of hope must triumph this very. Wales must

triumph this Very. I began this afternoon by recalling how Ifor Bach

skills and -- skills and apparently impregnable wall in the pursuit of

justice. The rules we face today collectively as a nation of laws

that only exist in our minds and are about and the final lack the

confidence to achieve. So the worlds that stand between Barack and want

to be. There is no role to Ohio to stop the will of the Welsh nation.

The barrier so insurmountable to store all the tide of national

aspiration. This right this together.

Leanne Wood speaking yesterday and will have a word with you shortly.

Pastrana temporarily cut. I'm not sure if the owner so much as

that of the world to go and attack. There are voted on by Solanki, if

you want to do the job out, voted Plaid Cymru. The Plaid Cymru tried

something similar in with the England. But two of the set Cymru

tried something similar in Finn Russell England. Paxton), bandaged

and picking up some votes certain elements of certain elements of

saying what they think about those to clever tactical thinking as well.

Not everybody thinks this attack is clever. This left Lord Elis-Thomas

said something interesting. He describes it as a facile. He is

responding to something that was described as irrational and capable

of Welsh. Lord Elis-Thomas as it is not Plaid Cymru struck to define

what is Welsh and not Welsh. If Welsh voters want to vote pick-up

and that is a valid vote for Welsh voters, it's not arise. Let's as

part of yourself. Can you clarify, because Dafydd

Elis-Thomas is not impressed with the never attacked cab. Isn't an

Welsh to vote in the cup? It's against the Welsh national

interest and that is well I had specialist. There are time of jobs

dependent upon our membership of the European Union, that's 150,000 jobs

in total but at risk if the progressives get their way and what

I've argued is that it simply because interesting ways to back

Plaid Cymru because there because interesting ways to back

real risks associated with not having a Plaid Cymru voice in the

European Parliament. You will remember that there was a vote that

took place in Parliament and the EU budget and it was only Plaid Cymru

MPs who voted in the Welsh national interest not to cut that budget. MPs

from other parties all voted against the Welsh national interest.

Why is it that more people according to the polls, more people in Wales

seem to be backing UKIP ahead of this poll in May than they do Plaid

Cymru? There are plenty of polls which is a

plenty of things. I am looking at the actual -- election results in

Ynys Mon in which we took 60% of the vote and there have been cancelled

by election since... They are heading when the polls in

Europe. And telling the people back then that they are wrong?

There are plenty of people that want to vote for moving out of the EU but

there are also plenty of people who want to remain in the EU and I am

appealing to those people at a black -- back Plaid Cymru this summer

because there is a lot at stake. If there are also plenty of people who

want to remain in the EU and I am appealing to those people at a black

-- back Plaid Cymru this summer because there is a lot at stake. If

the regressive. All those issues will be taken away from the

political agenda. Before the World Cup, just clarify

whether or not Lord Elis-Thomas is wrong to call their attack facile.

Well, Dafydd Elis-Thomas has got fleas on a range of things where we

may not exactly see eye to eye. But we are gathered at the conference,

peoples spirits are very high and the determination from our members

to go out onto the streets to talk to people and explain to them what

is at stake in this election, while it's important to support Plaid

Cymru, that is something we're all focused on and to be honest,

everything else is a sideshow. Let's move on to something else.

You talked about several oxides, that is alike is to opt out from

several policies from a UK government, including on defence.

You said no more Welsh yen and men dragged into illegal wars. How would

that work. If you join the Army and you come from Wales, to go to war or

don't you? There is more than one country that

makes up the United Kingdom. The situation might change in September

depending on the outcome of the vote in Scotland. What is important is

that Wales, being a small company -- country, as a clear say on the

matter is that are non-devolved. War is one of those, Rhydfelen is

another, and there is one of those, Rhydfelen is

if you are in the Army and you are from Wales, to say, look don't go to

war, boys and girls? What I'm saying is if the Welsh

Government took a position that was different to the UK government, that

that position should feature in the decision-making process. I'm a

question like where, there are of people throughout the United Kingdom

who are opposed to going into the Iraq war. There was no ability for

Wales to have an input into that decision and I'm arguing that people

in Wales and know best about what in the interests and should have some

way of having a say about those decisions which affect us deeply.

You said that Plaid is the party of business. And with that, Adam Price,

a former MP, has said he would like taxes for the rich to come down. To

back that? Adam has put forward an argument

that it will accept should be removed, but this should be

considered. We're not going to make any decisions on the tracks at this

stage. From circling over that tax-raising powers, if they do come

to Wales, were to be here until 2021. We know we've got a grave in

our economy now that we've no idea what the situation will be in 2021.

I hope you will have turned around our economic situation by then and

that the economic picture facing woes won't be the same. So not

prepared to outline our taxation policies. At the

prepared to outline our taxation having a healthy debate and ensure

that will continue. No policy has been passed on this

yet and none will be passed on our tax policies until winning a

realistic position to see those policies implemented.

You mentioned in the body you would like to set to control investments

run by the private sector. I'm talking about some kind of WGA was

something instead of Finance Wales? It's not an argument for bringing

back the WDA but there is a case for business to have more of a role in

determining policies and expenditure and business. I think we're missing

a trick by not involving business much male and when we know that last

week we saw the latest figures out from 2011 which showed that in West

Wales and the valleys, GDP has gone down from 65% to 64% of the EU

average, we need to do something different because carrying on as

usual will only get you what you always get so I'm going to be

consulting business and this is to hear from them exactly how they're

going to input into this process and I'm hopeful of a very positive

response. You said an independent Scotland be allowed to automatically

remain in the European Union? The question about Scotland's

membership of the The question about Scotland's

contentious when and it is a Scotland is a successful country, it

is doing well financially and it would be an asset to the European

Union. After the vote has taken place in Scotland next September a

lot of these issues which are then contentious as part of the

referendum debate will not be contentious any more. They will be

more clear-cut. I am confident if Scotland becomes independent

European Union will welcome it with independent arms. Should Wales have

a say whether it should keep the pound? I didn't catch that. Should

Wales have a say whether and not Scotland should keep the pound?

Again, on the question on whether Scotland gets to keep the pound,

that is an issue that will not be contentious after September. It is

in all of our interest for Scotland to remain with the pound. That is

why the yes campaign have advocated that eventuality. It isn't just in

the best interest of the people of Scotland but in the interest of the

whole of the UK. If there is a Yes vote in September, that became clear

that people. Should Wales have a say in its? Wales should have a say on

all aspects after Scotland becomes independent. I have asked for Wales

to have a seat at the negotiating table to make sure our interest

represented and we don't get left behind. Wales should be involved in

on ago she shares after that important vote in Scotland. You have

been at the helm for two years, what we do say your greatest achievement

is so far? The Anglesey by-election was the happiest days since I have

become leader of Plaid Cymru, it was a phenomenal success. The other

parties were trailing well behind. I hope we can replicate that success

not just in those ages where Plaid Cymru is traditionally seen strong

support but in communities across Wales. That is what we are

determined to do as a party. Thank you for joining us.

Scotland, it is looming hugely over this year in terms of the

Constitution. Whatever happens it shifts the whole constitutional

debate. That is why Leanne Wood was kicking

around some of these ideas of Council of government and so on. It

seems unformed. That question you are asking about the Armed Forces,

she didn't really seem to have an answer. She said Wales should have

an input in decisions. Did that mean a veto? Did she mean the Welsh

Government? Over the last ten years of President has been established

where we don't go to vote without -- war without a vote in Parliament.

That seemed to me informed. I do wonder, there was quite a difficult

shift for some of the grassroots of Plaid Cymru in that speech. It was

to move the party into a pro-business movement. It is

traditionally been a party for the Socialist left. I wonder if that was

a little bit of pacifist red meat, if that isn't a contradiction in

terms! There is a long, long tradition of opposing military

action and pacifism within Plaid Cymru. I will if that was thrown in

there for party members because she thought the business thing would be

difficult. She talked about the narrow meaningless division between

the private and public sectors. You could argue they have been part of

that division. It is not a party that is crammed full of businessmen.

Traditionally, Plaid Cymru have talked about cooperatives, user

cooperatives, worker cooperatives. They opposed every single

privatisation there has ever end. To present itself as being a party that

is business friendly and not just friendly to small businesses both

friendlies are big business. Wider shift? Who is playing their? I think

this is the influence of Adam Price who has had the journey himself from

being a man of the left to being someone who, perhaps, has got

different fields. What we might be seeing, it is interesting, Leanne

Wood is the most left-wing leader ever elected by Plaid Cymru. What we

may be saying -- seeing is a shift towards the centre ground or even

the centre-right. towards the centre ground or even

them ground? Who knows? What it would do depending other

mathematics, it'd make the possibility of the rainbow,

something young would says she can't see happening, the coalition

involving Plaid Cymru, Conservatives and the Liberal Democrats. It's a

book that more possible if Plaid Cymru would be more is this

friendly. Now for another speech from yesterday. The North Wales

Assembly Member is the party's natural resources spokesman. He

urged councils to buy locally and praised Gwynedd Council for the way

it sources its school meals. A company that supplies vegetables

to Gwynedd Council told me the contract allows them to apply to

members additional members of staff. Fruit suppliers said they contract

meant six additional staff full stop another six workers able to stay in

the locality to earn a living and raise their families. The variation

between the councils is quite astonishing. It demonstrates what is

possible with a clear policy on procurement in the government. As a

parent, I want to know the food my children are being given in school

is, whenever possible, locally sourced and supplied and adding

value to my local economy. What hope do high half -- I have if the

catering company is based in Newton Abbot of Rochdale? Wales has

catering company is based in Newton food producers. If it's possible for

the county such as Gwynedd to use local suppliers, surely it isn't

beyond the weight of other councils to follow suit. It is a scandal that

food sector jobs are lost in Wales where our run councils are not using

them to the maximum effect. We need a lead from the Welsh, to help local

farmers, food producers and encouraging more food producing

industries. I compare Welsh economy to eight leaking bucket. -- to a

leaking bucket. We need to keep the money circulating in the Welsh

economy. Plaid Cymru is estimating that if we can keep 75% of the value

of public sector contracts winning Wales that will create an additional

46,000 jobs. As with naked huge dent in the jobless figures stop -- that

would make a huge dent in the jobless figures. When anybody tells

you Wales is a work in entry look them in the eye and tell them they

are wrong. We face severe economic challenges and we have a long way to

go but in terms of our Natural Resources Wales in terms of the

natural asset we have, the currency of the future, Wales is stretch.

The party 's lead candidate in this year 's European election is the

current MEP, Jill Evans. She gave her speech this morning. He said the

European Parliament is important but that did not mean things could not

be improved. I steered a new law through

Parliament restricting the use of hazardous chemicals in electronic

goods so they can be recycled safely, so they are not sent to the

poorest countries and burnt and children sifting through the rubbish

looking for metals they can sell. Too much of Parliament is time now

and money is spent on so-called own initiative reports. What does that

mean? It means that MEPs write reports on issues on interest to

them. They go through the committees, the plenary session,

they are voted on, they go through the process but at the end of the

day they are just an opinion. They are not law, they don't change the

law. Last year we dealt with nearly 200 of these reports. Taking up all

of that time. It is time Parliament focused on making laws. Its real

purpose. In A.D. Is whether Disney's international regulation. Like GM

knows and climate change. One example of an issue that that you

deals with which I know matters very much to people in Wales is animal

welfare. As a result of pressure from people in Wales and across

Europe we succeeded in getting a van on cosmetics tested on animals stop

-- eight Ann. -- a ban. The European Commission has now drafted the

comprehensive law on animal welfare Commission has now drafted the

which will cover all kinds of aspects of this issue. It will be

debated aspects of this issue. It will be

months. This issue is so important, I get so many letters and e-mails

from constituents about these issues that I believe it is time we had a

Commissioner with specific responsibility for animal welfare.

It would not only mean that these issues were dealt with prop in the

when we are framing new EU laws, it send a message to the rest of the

world that the EU takes animal welfare very seriously. The bottom

line for Plaid Cymru is that our future lies in Europe but in a new

and better Europe. While the UK Prime Minister votes on Wales's a

half in the European Council. Wales has interests will never be taken

into account. We had a stark example of that recently when Wales was left

completely off the map of key European transport routes. That's

what happened. It was Plaid Cymru that raised that issue that noticed

this had been done. The Welsh Government had not objected. Wales

will always lose out unless we have our own voice and no room vote. It

is no secret that not only does Plaid Cymru wants Wales to stay in

the EU but we want the most radical change of the EU of all, we want

Wales to be an independent member state. We want that voice and that

vote in the council. We want nine state. We want that voice and that

MEPs, not four. We would have older and commissioner, that is the kind

of change we want to see. We work with sister parties across Europe

towards this game. We work, of course, with the Scottish National

Party and the Catalans. We know about the referendum, the momentous

events which are happening later this year. Scotland will join the EU

as an independent member state. Whatever President Barroso says,

Scotland will either. That we there. Wales will chart its own course, our

own unique course like every nation does. But I can assure you that we

will not be left behind in Europe. We, in Plaid Cymru, understand that

the EU project is so much more than money. It is about democracy, it is

about justice, it is about promoting Wales on the international stage, to

work with similar nations and regions across the country, to share

digs agencies and to strengthen and to support each other. -- to share

experiences. We could stage so many exhibitions and meetings to promote

the rest of what we have in Wales. We have done so much of it in the

past 18 months, people are referring to one area of Parliament as the

Welsh corner. But it is also about. This year

marks the centenary of the First World War. 100 years ago a terrible

war was about to start. A war that caused an imaginable death and

destruction. In 2012 the European Union won the repeat -- Nobel Peace

Prize in maintaining peace in Europe. For some, it is a big joke.

Many scoffed at it. But I believe that in this special year we have an

opportunity for the EU to build on that, to establish a new role for

itself will stop instead of moving towards setting up a European army

which is what some are trying to do, let's establish a European civilian

Peace Corps. Not sold is that, lawyers, all those peoples with

skills that can work in areas of potential conflict, to prevent

violence and increased tolerance. Plaid Cymru is the only party that

protects their Welsh national interest and promotes that interest

in the European Parliament. That means we are the only party that

Those is a job to do after this election and we mean business.

Myself and the team of candidates in the election. I want to thank all of

the people who are already working hard campaigning and to urge anyone

who would like to help, who would like to join us in this crucial

campaign, to get in touch. I'm proud to be a member of a party that

outward looking and forward thinking. We go into these elections

with confidence. We know that We put Wales first always.

Jill Evans speaking this moment -- morning. Simon Thomas said teachers

were tied up with fresh tape and he attacked the government on education

and said Plaid Cymru government would be unstoppable.

Recognising that many schools have excellent teaching, I want to free

up successful teachers and leaders excellent teaching, I want to free

to teach and cuts down on red tape. This government blames teachers and

Micro manages them. I trust teachers and I trust professional teachers

and support staff. In government we will move with the trades unions and

the We will focus on outcomes and achievement. The quid pro quo is

that we're teaching is Paul made mediocre, we will intervene to

improve things. Again the best people to improve teachers are

professional teachers themselves so continual professional development

will be at the heart of what we do. Millions professional managers in

schools to free up head teachers to get back who do want to devolve

teachers pay and conditions. These are things we want to do in

government so how do we get here? Get these policies in chase so

that's the people of Wales have what they deserve and it starts here

today. It means putting Wales first in the European elections. Imagine a

European Parliament without a Plaid Cymru MEP, nobody to stop Labour.

Nobody to speak out for farmers and environment. Learn to advocate for

higher education institutions. Because unlike other MEPs, our MEP

does not take orders from outside Wales especially as your captors.

I'm not happy with everything the EU does. But I don't protect 150,000

jobs and trade by pulling out of a massive single market that has

opened doors and protected workers. He gathered by having a voice in

Europe that speaks for Wales only and put Wales first. If you rejoice

in diversity, if you want to see climate change taken seriously, if

you want a strong and proud of her rise that challenges the system and

doesn't just go down the pub and challenge the system, if he wants to

tackle poverty, and have a thriving economy than we need to make sure

that Jill Evans is re-elected MEP in ten weeks time. The route to a Plaid

Cymru government starts with his European elections. The day we

remove Labour, is the day Wales rediscovers its ambition and its

soul. Simon Thomas. Yesterday, a Pinellas

discussed Labour 's proposal to increase tax for high earners. -- a

Pinellas -- a panel discussed. I'm in a minority because I think

that if we had hired the Silk powers without the lockstep, which would

have allowed as to forget the top higher rate, but the existing higher

rates, I would have been in favour of cutting the higher rate in Wales

because that's an arm of your inward investment policy. If I'm trying to

get global entrepreneurs to come to Wales because it's a fantastic

country to be successful in, which it is, we have the skills go space

here than I am also able to say, by the way, you'll pay less tax than

you will over the border in Bristol, and I want that a lever and I'm

sorry, but you know, my own view is that we have a casualty of

capitalism as it has played out in this country. There are other models

that are different, but we can't afford to not allow ourselves that

flexibility and freedom where we are now. That doesn't mean that we give

up on our values of social justice, but we need to be very much focused

on the real issue which is unless we have entrepreneurs creating jobs in

Wales, then all the other great things we wanted to do to create a

Scandinavian style decent society, we won't be able to do it unless we

have that economic base. So we may be in agreement more than you

expected but there is a debate to be had and I understand the reasons

people would take a different theory but in the rails of 2014, where we

are at the moment, then actually I would like to say to that rest of

the world, we are open for business, it's a great place to come and grow

a successful business and yes, what's the difference between giving

and entrepreneur attacks kept and giving him a grant. The difference

is the grant is a run-off. They take the money and they run. Give them a

lower tax rate and they wanted the next year and the next year and in

ten years and in 20 years and they will stay.

You know what, I never thought I would be at a Plaid Cymru conference

where the audience clapped. I don't suppose in Wales we've got many in

that band and I suppose what I suppose what Adam is saying is that

if ours was different from the English tax rates, we'd get more of

them in so the tax take would go The additional rate is now 45%. In

the case of Wales, if you remove that so it's reverted to 40%, it

would cost us in gross terms ?20 million a year, that's all. You

would hope that you would get more people coming in but also by the

way, I must watch what I say, but when you have high marginal rates of

tax, a lot of people take legal approaches to avoid that attacks. It

is probably in the area when Alastair Darling puts the top rate

up to 50% I started getting lots of letters from various accounting

firms saying we can help you avoid that 50% rate. It makes it

worthwhile to spend money to save on tax. There is a moral case for

taxation, and Plaid Cymru are clear on that, but nevertheless, if you

put the marginal rates up high, that encourages people to take legal

avoidance steps. But maybe, Jocelyn, we should finish on this note.

I was wondering whether we would have richer people moving to Wales

and having second homes in Bucks! What about lower taxes for the

rich? Leanne Wood made it clear that it is not party policy, but an

interesting debate. Fascinating. There is a name for

Adam Price's argument, trickle-down economics. There are only created

jobs at the bottom was to cut taxes at the top. I'm sure Adam Price

would say he was talking about a specific situation in Wales, that

Rose has a shortage of entrepreneurs but that's what it is. We see it

being exercised in America to this day. Cut taxes at the top, create

jobs at the bottom and most economies on the left would say it

doesn't work that. On that stage, you so the shifts developing.

Jocelyn on the left, adamant moving to the right. It's a fascinating

dynamic and it does tie in with some of the things we heard in buying --

Leanne Wood's speech. That suggests that there is

something in the economic field workers a tectonic shift going on

amongst the leading thinkers and Plaid Cymru.

We'll have more from you shortly, but now were going back to the

conference hall. No, they're not ready. Forum, in terms of the

economy and dedication, we felt about Europe, and may the 22nd, what

will the big teams be? To an extent they vote on Europe in

that it's a low turnout election, so those who turnout are quite well

politically informed full stop there aren't many low information voters

so the question of Europe to motivate Plaid Cymru voters who

traditionally turn out very well in European elections and the issue of

Europe to motivate UKIP voters. When it comes to the Labour Party, the

key is can Labour get more of the people out than last results in the

rock-solid Labour constituencies, only about 4000 people voted Labour.

If Labour can get their vote out, then that's what really puts Jill

Evans's seat in peril. What will drive Labour voters? A desire to

give a kick to the Westminster government. So really, Europe is a

driving part pass force for some parties.

The party is also gearing up for next year 's Westminster election.

Our political editor is joined by two people who are hoping to win

seats next year. Thank you. Let's fast forward to

this time next year when were going to be talking about the general

election. I've got to parliamentary candidates would meet Liz Simon

Roberts and Mike Barker, the candidate for Ceredigion. I'm

electioneering at this I am interested in that the local economy

will only have the lowest salaries in Britain and will need full

employment. Mike, you're approaching

Ceredigion. What angrily taking in terms of the way you're describing

the economy and the challenges facing that earlier? I have been

conducting a survey of constituents about the cost of living.

We hear so much about recovery. Two people in Ceredigion, this is not

apparent. People are on zero hours contracts and peoples wages are

stagnating. The cost of living is serving so the tourney, Lib Dem,

were all having a recovery, has not yet reached wrestlers and it's not

going to Leanne Wood talked of a spreadsheets

recovery yesterday. But the GDP figures, the unemployment rate is

lower in Wales. But on the ground people are having a tough time of

it. We have a so-called recovery which has been linked A.D. Age old

dream of lighting the blue touch paper of property prices. It causes

immense damage. It is a one trick pony, this government. The people I

talk to, thousands of them, they are not feeling it. They are feeling the

opposite. They feel that the hidden costs of people who work in, we do

have respectable rate of employment, but the costs associated with it,

the cost of petrol, the cost of fuel, those are the issues affecting

people from day to day. Yes, you can look at it in terms of the recession

is gradually receding in London but we're not seeing any difference in

north-west Wales. The general election will be the Conservative,

Labour battle ground. How do you make sure that Plaid Cymru doesn't

get marginalised within that debate? Locally, we have an

effective mechanism which of the big British parties have, we have

Facebook and Twitter and we have people on the ground. We can talk to

people. You are in a safe Plaid Cymru seat. You are in a Liberal

Democrat seat. How do you try to deal with that challenge? Ceredigion

is a strange old seat. It is between two parties that don't feature in

the narrative. I am finding a lots of people are fed up with the

government in London. The Lib Dems are centre stage in that. Our MP is

trying to duck the bullet. He can't duck the bullet. He has caused

immense suffering. -- his government has caused immense suffering. Why do

you think the impact on the Scottish referendum will be? It will raise

our word expectations. It is a game changer. It be very close. I was in

Scotland last week and I detect a great deal more enthusiasm for the

Yes and the don't know camps. It will be a game changer whether it is

a Yes Henri Noma. Thanks very much. From two parliamentary candidates,

back to you. Looking at those parliamentary

elections, we have got the EULA elections coming up and then the

Assembly elections. How do they stagger their many? -- we have got

the EULA elections coming up. For UKIP, we have the elections where

they hope to develop a permanent base. For the Conservatives, Labour

and Liberal Democrats, it is the general election. That election is

important for Plaid Cymru. They have only got one safe seat. They have

two defend to. They have two try and take their number one target. They

have got to be shepherding their resources very carefully. Quotes to

their advantage, Labour is it against things. One thing to their

advantage. We could have a few by-elections

thrown in. Let's go to the conference hall now and speak to

their new Assembly Member, Rhun ap Iorwerth. Let me at the start of

this cycle of elections over the next three years, it is vitally

important for all of us in Wales that Plaid Cymru strengthens its

presence at all levels. It is lovely to be back here in Cardiff. As 4pm

on Thursday, after three days in the Assembly, I left Cardiff for

Anglesey. At nine o'clock Friday morning, I left Anglesey to come

back to Cardiff. It is a tribute to my wife's cooking that I was willing

to travel 400 miles to have one night at home. It is important that

I spend as much time as I can at home. It isn't easy. But everyone

here knows that we have to work hard for the future of Wales. It is

something that pushes us to go that extra mile. The challenge we face as

the party is to prove that dedication to the people of Wales.

We have to understand the challenges that face Wales. We are trying to

transform the nation. Rhun ap Iorwerth addressing the conference.

Let's rejoin our political editor. Let's get a bit more reaction to

Leanne Wood's speech yesterday. I am tried by Lord Elis-Thomas. The

former presiding officer at the Assembly. We were talking earlier in

relation to that strong attack from Leanne Wood against UKIP and the

attack is a rose for UKIP is a vote against Wales. You felt that was a

facile criticism. What did you mean? We add in danger of trying to

define what is for against Wales. The positive effect that European

policies have especially on the environment, agriculture and

fisheries and all those at the environment, agriculture and

fisheries and all those pages. It is important first not to try to define

a party which is a party fighting elections is Wales is somehow an

Welsh. I and a study argument she said. -- I understand. What is also

of interest to me, the Conservatives in the UK seem to be overreacting to

UKIP in the same way. It must be because UKIP are registering in the

polls. Early on I was speaking to some candidates for the European

elections and I put this to them. They agreed with it wholeheartedly.

They feel it is their view UKIP policies are against the interests

of Wales. As a result, Leanne Wood was perfectly justified to launch

the attack in the way she did. I think it is a mistake for parties to

use value all airtime or speech time in attacking the parties. They

should put forward a positive message about how we would do things

differently. My experience in the European Parliament during the

present Parliament in promoting aspects of the common agricultural

policy on behalf of my own committee, I have positive supports

from all the Welsh MEPs. That is how we should operate. We should

represent Wales positively rather than falling into this trap that

that is a big hike about withdrawal, as if that wasn't not shown. A

speech about hard edged electioneering, very strong attack

against the Labour Welsh Government. She said they were threatening the

future of evolution. What do you make of that? I don't understand

that argument. The target for me is not the Welsh Government but the

target is the UK Government. The people threatening devolution are

those who would give us more of it. The people of Wales, all the polls

indicate, want is to have an effective Welsh Government and the

National Assembly to call that governments to account. That means

changing the way in which powers are set out to that the UK Government

rather than holding and giving powers, the -- the feigning powers,

and then they should allow us to do the rest. On that point, back to you

in the studio. But have our final word with Vaughan

Roderick. Why did you make of that? What is he playing at? I don't think

he is playing at anything. Dafydd Elis-Thomas is at a stage in his

career where he feels he is free to speak his mind. That embarrasses, at

a time, his leaders and other people within the party that he feels he is

saying things the party needs to year. There is no secrets in the

fact that Dafydd Elis-Thomas has a warm relationship with some of the

Labour figures in the Assembly, he has an supportive of the Welsh

Labour government on a number of occasions where his party have felt

colder towards them. In a sense, what he is trying to do is keep open

the lines of communication because what Dafydd Elis-Thomas wants to see

is a coalition between Labour and Plaid Cymru. To come full circle,

comebacks of the European elections, will they get a fourth seed? The

mathematics here is pretty insert and? The mathematics is fascinating.

Then a four seat. If Labour can get a double the votes of either the

Conservatives or UKIP or Plaid Cymru, Labour will get two seats. If

that happens, one of the other three is going to fall off the bottom of

the list. Whoever comes first or second in those three will get

seat. The maths can go a number of ways. A sickly, the questions

revolve around the turnout of Labour supporters. -- basically. That MEP

position is crucial for Plaid Cymru. It brings in a lot of cash.

It's brings in a lot of cash because Jill Evans is a senior V. -- senior

MEP. It will be a big blow words you to lose the seat. Will they win it?

My own view is the moment is polling suggests they would lose it. Because

it is a low turnout election they could hang on. Thank you. Final

public will be back tomorrow on Radio Wales at eight o'clock. That

is it from us. Don't forget, until tomorrow, you can follow the

conference online and in our bulletins. From all others on the

programme, for your company, goodbye.