Browse content similar to 11/10/2016. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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This is what a Fresh Start looks like. | 6:06:20 | 6:06:22 | |
The DUP and Sinn Fein are enjoying a new spirit of co-operation. | 6:06:22 | 6:06:27 | |
LAUGHTER | 6:06:27 | 6:06:28 | |
But outside Stormont, an old problem is threatening the new consensus. | 6:06:28 | 6:06:33 | |
What happened on Monday when you spoke to the Secretary of State? | 6:06:33 | 6:06:35 | |
'Over the last few months I've been meeting people who lost relatives | 6:06:35 | 6:06:39 | |
'in some of the Troubles' most controversial killings.' | 6:06:39 | 6:06:42 | |
In any other democratic society we wouldn't be standing here. | 6:06:42 | 6:06:46 | |
We shouldn't have to be standing here | 6:06:46 | 6:06:48 | |
to plead for our inquest to be opened. | 6:06:48 | 6:06:50 | |
They're waiting for inquests - | 6:06:52 | 6:06:54 | |
legal hearings that will determine how their loved ones died | 6:06:54 | 6:06:58 | |
and, in some cases, who is responsible. | 6:06:58 | 6:07:01 | |
But there's a huge backlog. | 6:07:02 | 6:07:04 | |
Northern Ireland's most senior judge has a plan to break that backlog | 6:07:07 | 6:07:13 | |
and clear all the cases within five years. | 6:07:13 | 6:07:16 | |
This opportunity simply must not be squandered. | 6:07:16 | 6:07:20 | |
But the plan has stalled | 6:07:20 | 6:07:22 | |
because there's a row about who will pay for it. | 6:07:22 | 6:07:25 | |
The First Minister has blocked the Executive | 6:07:27 | 6:07:29 | |
from even considering the plan. | 6:07:29 | 6:07:31 | |
I will not allow any process to rewrite the past of | 6:07:31 | 6:07:34 | |
what happened in Northern Ireland. | 6:07:34 | 6:07:36 | |
But it's the government, rather than the DUP, | 6:07:36 | 6:07:39 | |
that Sinn Fein seem to blame for the hold-up. | 6:07:39 | 6:07:42 | |
The responsibility for denying the Lord Chief Justice the funding | 6:07:43 | 6:07:48 | |
lies fairly and squarely at the door of the British government. | 6:07:48 | 6:07:52 | |
So what happens to the families still waiting? | 6:07:52 | 6:07:56 | |
-Hello, how are you? -All right, how are you? | 6:08:22 | 6:08:25 | |
Good, how are you? Did you have a good, safe trip? | 6:08:25 | 6:08:27 | |
'It's been years since Jimmy O'Kane was last back in Northern Ireland.' | 6:08:27 | 6:08:31 | |
Today he's flown back to Belfast. But it's not a happy homecoming. | 6:08:31 | 6:08:36 | |
Last two days, I haven't had much sleep. | 6:08:36 | 6:08:39 | |
It's... | 6:08:39 | 6:08:41 | |
You can't sleep. It's always in your mind. | 6:08:42 | 6:08:45 | |
Jimmy left Northern Ireland in the 1970s. | 6:08:45 | 6:08:48 | |
A few years later, his big sister Rosaleen died | 6:08:48 | 6:08:51 | |
in a suspicious house fire. | 6:08:51 | 6:08:53 | |
Now he wants answers about what happened to the woman | 6:08:55 | 6:08:59 | |
he considered a second mother. | 6:08:59 | 6:09:01 | |
Rosaleen done everything for us. | 6:09:02 | 6:09:04 | |
She was quiet but fun-loving. | 6:09:04 | 6:09:07 | |
Come the weekend, the Saturday night, it had to be the dance. | 6:09:09 | 6:09:13 | |
And Sunday would be her chapel day. | 6:09:13 | 6:09:16 | |
Jimmy takes me to the church in Sailortown, near Belfast docks, | 6:09:16 | 6:09:21 | |
where Rosaleen came to pray. | 6:09:21 | 6:09:23 | |
Can you remember the last time you were here? | 6:09:23 | 6:09:26 | |
Must be at least 20, well over. | 6:09:26 | 6:09:28 | |
Oh, what a shame. | 6:09:29 | 6:09:31 | |
You all right? | 6:09:36 | 6:09:38 | |
HE EXHALES SHAKILY | 6:09:39 | 6:09:41 | |
Do you remember her being in here? | 6:09:46 | 6:09:48 | |
Yes, I do. I used to leave her down sometimes. | 6:09:48 | 6:09:52 | |
She was happy here. | 6:09:55 | 6:09:57 | |
She found her happiness here. | 6:09:58 | 6:10:00 | |
What are you looking for, Jimmy? | 6:10:05 | 6:10:07 | |
I want justice, that's what I want. | 6:10:08 | 6:10:11 | |
-VOICE BREAKING: -I want my sister to rest in peace. | 6:10:11 | 6:10:14 | |
Final peace. | 6:10:14 | 6:10:16 | |
In 1976, Rosaleen was 33 years old, single and working as a waitress. | 6:10:19 | 6:10:25 | |
She was a devout Catholic | 6:10:25 | 6:10:27 | |
but she was the child of a mixed marriage. | 6:10:27 | 6:10:29 | |
Shortly before her death, | 6:10:29 | 6:10:31 | |
she moved to a mainly loyalist part of north Belfast, | 6:10:31 | 6:10:35 | |
into an area known as the "murder triangle". | 6:10:35 | 6:10:38 | |
-NEWSREADER: -Since the beginning of this year, | 6:10:38 | 6:10:40 | |
52 people have died violently. | 6:10:40 | 6:10:42 | |
In a vicious campaign of civilian assassinations, | 6:10:42 | 6:10:45 | |
30 Catholics and 19 Protestants have been killed. | 6:10:45 | 6:10:48 | |
In the early hours of 17 September, a neighbour spotted a fire | 6:10:51 | 6:10:56 | |
in Rosaleen's flat, and raised the alarm. | 6:10:56 | 6:10:59 | |
Rosaleen's body was found inside, naked and badly burned. | 6:11:02 | 6:11:07 | |
Rosaleen had moved house before the fire | 6:11:08 | 6:11:11 | |
due to a petrol bomb attack. | 6:11:11 | 6:11:12 | |
Despite this, the police initially believed | 6:11:15 | 6:11:17 | |
she had deliberately set fire to the flat herself. | 6:11:17 | 6:11:20 | |
At the inquest, police failed to put vital evidence | 6:11:24 | 6:11:27 | |
in front of the coroner | 6:11:27 | 6:11:29 | |
and her death was put down as an unsolved mystery. | 6:11:29 | 6:11:32 | |
Back then, Jimmy didn't know | 6:11:35 | 6:11:37 | |
there were deeper suspicions about Rosaleen's death | 6:11:37 | 6:11:40 | |
and that there were grounds for believing she had been murdered. | 6:11:40 | 6:11:45 | |
-It's all changed. -Oh, completely. | 6:11:46 | 6:11:49 | |
These certainly weren't here at the time. | 6:11:49 | 6:11:53 | |
This is Cliftonpark Avenue. | 6:11:53 | 6:11:55 | |
This is where Rosaleen's house was. | 6:11:56 | 6:11:59 | |
Whereabouts would Rosaleen's house have been? | 6:11:59 | 6:12:02 | |
These are all new now, right, | 6:12:02 | 6:12:04 | |
and we think her house, her flat, was in this location, | 6:12:04 | 6:12:09 | |
somewhere down along this block. | 6:12:09 | 6:12:11 | |
What were you told happened that night, Jimmy? | 6:12:12 | 6:12:15 | |
Well, I was told what happened, originally in 1976, | 6:12:15 | 6:12:20 | |
that Rosaleen had hung clothes up to dry above the stove | 6:12:20 | 6:12:24 | |
and they caught fire. | 6:12:24 | 6:12:26 | |
And... | 6:12:26 | 6:12:28 | |
that was it. She burned to death. | 6:12:28 | 6:12:30 | |
But as Jimmy later discovered from the original inquest papers, | 6:12:30 | 6:12:35 | |
there wasn't just one fire. | 6:12:35 | 6:12:38 | |
From the papers I was learning that there was three fires set - | 6:12:38 | 6:12:41 | |
one under the bed, | 6:12:41 | 6:12:43 | |
one behind a sofa in the sitting room and one under the stove. | 6:12:43 | 6:12:48 | |
Multiple fires had been deliberately started in the flat | 6:12:48 | 6:12:52 | |
and the pathologist who conducted Rosaleen's autopsy | 6:12:52 | 6:12:55 | |
made a startling discovery. | 6:12:55 | 6:12:57 | |
Chris McCann is the O'Kanes' solicitor. | 6:12:57 | 6:13:00 | |
Typically when somebody dies as a result of house fire, | 6:13:00 | 6:13:03 | |
or fire, they will have soot in their airways, | 6:13:03 | 6:13:06 | |
there will be carbon monoxide in their blood. | 6:13:06 | 6:13:10 | |
The autopsy revealed that there were none of those. | 6:13:11 | 6:13:14 | |
So Rosaleen may have been dead before the fires even started. | 6:13:15 | 6:13:19 | |
You won't find Rosaleen's name on any list of victims | 6:13:22 | 6:13:25 | |
of the Troubles. | 6:13:25 | 6:13:27 | |
Her family think she was a victim of a sectarian murder | 6:13:27 | 6:13:30 | |
which was overlooked because | 6:13:30 | 6:13:32 | |
the police didn't present vital evidence to the inquest. | 6:13:32 | 6:13:36 | |
They've applied to the Attorney General to overturn | 6:13:36 | 6:13:39 | |
the original inquest findings and order a new one. | 6:13:39 | 6:13:44 | |
Why do you think a second inquest is required in this case? | 6:13:44 | 6:13:47 | |
The original inquest, we would say the finding is invalid, | 6:13:47 | 6:13:52 | |
because we have since found out that in 1976 a man was interviewed | 6:13:52 | 6:13:56 | |
under caution in respect of Rosaleen O'Kane's death. | 6:13:56 | 6:14:00 | |
He at that stage named three other individuals who may or may not | 6:14:00 | 6:14:05 | |
have been involved in her death. | 6:14:05 | 6:14:08 | |
He gave the names of those individuals to the police. | 6:14:08 | 6:14:11 | |
Certainly that is something that the Coroner should have had sight of | 6:14:11 | 6:14:15 | |
at the time of the inquest in 1977. | 6:14:15 | 6:14:18 | |
In 2002, and again in 2011, | 6:14:18 | 6:14:21 | |
police informed the family these individuals were still alive | 6:14:21 | 6:14:25 | |
but they hadn't been questioned. | 6:14:25 | 6:14:26 | |
The police told us they have a huge number of deaths to review | 6:14:26 | 6:14:30 | |
with finite resources. | 6:14:30 | 6:14:31 | |
Do you think if you got a new inquest it would help you? | 6:14:31 | 6:14:34 | |
Yes, it would. A new inquest would open all the doors. | 6:14:34 | 6:14:38 | |
It's taken families years and years in pain and heartache, | 6:14:38 | 6:14:44 | |
just to get halfway where they're getting. You know? It's... | 6:14:44 | 6:14:49 | |
It's wrong, and as a society and a country, | 6:14:50 | 6:14:53 | |
you can't move on unless you face the past. | 6:14:53 | 6:14:56 | |
Almost 20 years after the Good Friday Agreement, | 6:14:56 | 6:14:59 | |
dealing with the past is still a problem. | 6:14:59 | 6:15:02 | |
For many, police investigations and the Historical Enquiries Team | 6:15:02 | 6:15:07 | |
did not deliver all the answers. | 6:15:07 | 6:15:09 | |
And despite the recent political promise of a Fresh Start, | 6:15:09 | 6:15:13 | |
disagreement over how to deal with the past continues. | 6:15:13 | 6:15:17 | |
Now, some families see the Coroner's Court | 6:15:18 | 6:15:21 | |
as the only place they will get answers. | 6:15:21 | 6:15:23 | |
Recent changes to the way in which inquests work | 6:15:24 | 6:15:27 | |
have offered families a way forward. | 6:15:27 | 6:15:30 | |
Dr Catherine Turner is a law lecturer who has written | 6:15:30 | 6:15:33 | |
about ways to deal with the past. | 6:15:33 | 6:15:36 | |
Since the Human Rights Act has come into effect, | 6:15:36 | 6:15:38 | |
there's a greater emphasis now | 6:15:38 | 6:15:40 | |
on not just how they died, | 6:15:40 | 6:15:42 | |
but also on the circumstances leading to that death | 6:15:42 | 6:15:45 | |
and the attribution of responsibility as well, | 6:15:45 | 6:15:48 | |
who's responsible for the death. | 6:15:48 | 6:15:50 | |
If you imagine the family of somebody who was shot, | 6:15:50 | 6:15:52 | |
for example, or allegedly shot by a British soldier, | 6:15:52 | 6:15:57 | |
a traditional inquest isn't going to provide very much | 6:15:57 | 6:15:59 | |
extra information for them. | 6:15:59 | 6:16:01 | |
Really what they want to know is much more about the circumstances | 6:16:01 | 6:16:05 | |
of who planned the operation, | 6:16:05 | 6:16:07 | |
were all measures taken to protect the life of that person? | 6:16:07 | 6:16:11 | |
Could they have been arrested rather than being shot in the first place? | 6:16:11 | 6:16:14 | |
And these are questions now that the Coroner, | 6:16:14 | 6:16:17 | |
in the course of the inquest, has the power to investigate | 6:16:17 | 6:16:20 | |
where previously he wouldn't have had. | 6:16:20 | 6:16:22 | |
Leading lawyer Michael Mansfield | 6:16:22 | 6:16:24 | |
believes an inquest needs to be opened | 6:16:24 | 6:16:27 | |
into the deaths of ten people shot by the Army in Ballymurphy in 1971. | 6:16:27 | 6:16:32 | |
He says that the changes have placed families | 6:16:33 | 6:16:37 | |
at the heart of the process. | 6:16:37 | 6:16:39 | |
Obviously they want the truth about what happened. | 6:16:39 | 6:16:41 | |
They want it on record and they want accountability. They all want that, | 6:16:41 | 6:16:45 | |
but they also want - | 6:16:45 | 6:16:46 | |
and they're all united in this, whatever their backgrounds - | 6:16:46 | 6:16:50 | |
they want to change the system. They want to ensure that | 6:16:50 | 6:16:53 | |
the system that has allowed these atrocities in the first place | 6:16:53 | 6:16:58 | |
does not occur again. | 6:16:58 | 6:16:59 | |
With blame at stake, | 6:17:05 | 6:17:06 | |
the past in Northern Ireland is very much in the present. | 6:17:06 | 6:17:10 | |
But progress has been slow - | 6:17:16 | 6:17:18 | |
only one or two inquests can be heard a year, | 6:17:18 | 6:17:21 | |
meaning families have had to wait decades. | 6:17:21 | 6:17:24 | |
Controversial killings have turned into extended battles over evidence. | 6:17:26 | 6:17:31 | |
And that means some of the inquest backlog goes back 40 years, | 6:17:31 | 6:17:36 | |
and includes some of the most well-known episodes of the Troubles, | 6:17:36 | 6:17:40 | |
like Ballymurphy, Kingsmills, and Loughgall. | 6:17:40 | 6:17:44 | |
Now, more than 50 cases, involving 98 deaths, | 6:17:47 | 6:17:51 | |
are still waiting to be heard. | 6:17:51 | 6:17:53 | |
To address this delay, | 6:17:56 | 6:17:58 | |
the Lord Chief Justice decided to overhaul the inquest system. | 6:17:58 | 6:18:02 | |
There does remain a window of opportunity | 6:18:04 | 6:18:06 | |
to deal with this crucially important issue | 6:18:06 | 6:18:09 | |
and, indeed, to map a way forward | 6:18:09 | 6:18:11 | |
on all aspects of dealing with the past. | 6:18:11 | 6:18:14 | |
This opportunity simply must not be squandered. | 6:18:14 | 6:18:17 | |
Sir Declan Morgan ordered a review into the outstanding legacy cases | 6:18:19 | 6:18:24 | |
and to identify the reasons for delay. | 6:18:24 | 6:18:26 | |
During the course of the review, it became obvious | 6:18:28 | 6:18:30 | |
that there was a common problem across many of the cases - | 6:18:30 | 6:18:34 | |
both the MoD and the police were often slow about releasing evidence. | 6:18:34 | 6:18:38 | |
Daniel Holder is a human rights campaigner. | 6:18:40 | 6:18:42 | |
This has been going on for years. | 6:18:43 | 6:18:46 | |
Numerous excuses and obstacles have been put in the place | 6:18:46 | 6:18:49 | |
of inquests taking place. | 6:18:49 | 6:18:52 | |
Now, largely these relate to the failure of key state agencies, | 6:18:52 | 6:18:56 | |
the military, the police etc, | 6:18:56 | 6:18:58 | |
to disclose documents and records in a timely fashion. | 6:18:58 | 6:19:02 | |
The Ministry of Defence and the police told the review | 6:19:02 | 6:19:06 | |
many of the delays were the result of a lack of resources. | 6:19:06 | 6:19:10 | |
The review was critical of this explanation. | 6:19:10 | 6:19:13 | |
The murder of GAA man Sean Brown | 6:19:20 | 6:19:23 | |
is a case that shows the problems with disclosure. | 6:19:23 | 6:19:27 | |
The chairman of the Bellaghy Football Club was abducted | 6:19:27 | 6:19:29 | |
by the LVF as he locked up the club one night in May 1997. | 6:19:29 | 6:19:34 | |
INAUDIBLE | 6:19:37 | 6:19:39 | |
Poet Seamus Heaney knew Sean Brown. | 6:19:39 | 6:19:42 | |
He said the killing of the sportsman had hurt his soul. | 6:19:42 | 6:19:45 | |
The lustral wash and run of river shallows | 6:19:47 | 6:19:51 | |
That we heard of Sean Brown's murder in the grounds of Bellaghy GAA Club | 6:19:51 | 6:19:56 | |
And imagined hose-water smashing hard back off the asphalt | 6:19:56 | 6:20:01 | |
In the car park where his athlete's blood ran cold. | 6:20:01 | 6:20:05 | |
How hard was it for you coming back down here? | 6:20:11 | 6:20:13 | |
I had been playing football up until that. | 6:20:13 | 6:20:17 | |
I sort of lost heart in it after my father was killed | 6:20:17 | 6:20:20 | |
and now it... | 6:20:20 | 6:20:21 | |
It always brings it back every time you come in the gates, | 6:20:21 | 6:20:24 | |
you see his name above the gate here. | 6:20:24 | 6:20:27 | |
It's always in your head anyway. | 6:20:27 | 6:20:29 | |
Tell me what happened to your father that night. | 6:20:29 | 6:20:32 | |
My father was locking up the gate here at the club | 6:20:32 | 6:20:34 | |
and he was pounced on by I don't know how many men. | 6:20:34 | 6:20:39 | |
They then drove him from here down through Toomebridge | 6:20:39 | 6:20:44 | |
to a slip road just at the end of the motorway at Randalstown, | 6:20:44 | 6:20:46 | |
where he had been... was shot six times. | 6:20:46 | 6:20:49 | |
And his body was left beside his burnt-out car. | 6:20:51 | 6:20:54 | |
No-one has been charged with the murder. | 6:20:54 | 6:20:56 | |
The family feel let down by previous investigations. | 6:20:56 | 6:21:00 | |
So your family have never had an inquest? | 6:21:00 | 6:21:02 | |
No, we never had an inquest. | 6:21:02 | 6:21:04 | |
There has been... | 6:21:04 | 6:21:06 | |
I think it's 26 preliminary hearings. | 6:21:06 | 6:21:09 | |
But after a period of time you say to yourself, | 6:21:09 | 6:21:11 | |
"What is the point in going here | 6:21:11 | 6:21:13 | |
"because we're not hearing anything new." | 6:21:13 | 6:21:15 | |
There's always somebody dragging their feet in some way or another, | 6:21:15 | 6:21:20 | |
and to hold the inquest off for whatever reason. | 6:21:20 | 6:21:23 | |
Whatever reason they see. | 6:21:23 | 6:21:24 | |
In a lot of cases, the PSNI had to release files and documents | 6:21:26 | 6:21:31 | |
and they weren't coming forward with them. | 6:21:31 | 6:21:34 | |
They said they would have them for a certain date and then | 6:21:34 | 6:21:37 | |
that date was pushed back again. | 6:21:37 | 6:21:39 | |
You know, it just kept dragging it out and dragging it out, | 6:21:39 | 6:21:43 | |
and we're just no further forward than we were, say, 15 years ago. | 6:21:43 | 6:21:47 | |
The police said they are managing more than 60 legacy cases | 6:21:51 | 6:21:55 | |
and are not dragging their feet. | 6:21:55 | 6:21:57 | |
The Lord Chief Justice was hoping to address delays with his new plan. | 6:21:58 | 6:22:03 | |
He said he could clear the backlog within five years. | 6:22:03 | 6:22:06 | |
Without the plan, it could take until 2040 to hear | 6:22:07 | 6:22:11 | |
all the existing cases. | 6:22:11 | 6:22:13 | |
The families understood that a crucial part of the plan involved | 6:22:13 | 6:22:16 | |
speeding up the disclosure process. | 6:22:16 | 6:22:19 | |
A new unit would take over the handling of documents | 6:22:19 | 6:22:22 | |
from the PSNI and the Ministry of Defence. | 6:22:22 | 6:22:25 | |
The Lord Chief Justice's plan provides a blue print | 6:22:25 | 6:22:28 | |
whereby the backlog of legacy inquests can be taken forward | 6:22:28 | 6:22:32 | |
probably within five years, but there are two important caveats. | 6:22:32 | 6:22:35 | |
Firstly, they need the resources to do it, but secondly also | 6:22:35 | 6:22:38 | |
the pattern of obstruction, the pattern of not co-operating, | 6:22:38 | 6:22:41 | |
of declining to provide documents, either in a timely fashion | 6:22:41 | 6:22:46 | |
or even declining to provide them at all, has to stop. | 6:22:46 | 6:22:49 | |
As well as the co-operation of the PSNI and the MoD, | 6:22:49 | 6:22:53 | |
the Lord Chief Justice also needed money. | 6:22:53 | 6:22:57 | |
It was at this stage that the Lord Chief Justice's plan | 6:22:57 | 6:22:59 | |
moved out of the courthouse and into the political arena. | 6:22:59 | 6:23:03 | |
The Lord Chief Justice took the plan to the | 6:23:04 | 6:23:06 | |
then Justice Minster, David Ford. | 6:23:06 | 6:23:09 | |
In April this year, David Ford submitted a bid for funding | 6:23:10 | 6:23:14 | |
to the First Minister and Deputy First Minister. | 6:23:14 | 6:23:17 | |
It went no further. | 6:23:18 | 6:23:20 | |
Arlene Foster refused to bring the proposal to the full Executive. | 6:23:21 | 6:23:25 | |
And when her veto was leaked, it quickly became an election issue. | 6:23:26 | 6:23:30 | |
We put forward specific proposals of how we could fund those legacy | 6:23:32 | 6:23:35 | |
inquests because of the good work being done by the Lord Chief Justice | 6:23:35 | 6:23:38 | |
and by other judges, and that has been blocked. | 6:23:38 | 6:23:41 | |
I wanted the opportunity to discuss further | 6:23:41 | 6:23:43 | |
with the Lord Chief Justice around the issues of innocent victims | 6:23:43 | 6:23:46 | |
and how we could deal with their issues. | 6:23:46 | 6:23:49 | |
And I make no apology for that whatsoever. | 6:23:49 | 6:23:51 | |
I think the rights of innocent victims are very key in all of this | 6:23:51 | 6:23:54 | |
and I will not allow, I will not allow any process | 6:23:54 | 6:23:58 | |
to rewrite the past of what happened in Northern Ireland. | 6:23:58 | 6:24:00 | |
I'm very fundamental on that and it will not change | 6:24:00 | 6:24:03 | |
either before the election or after the election. | 6:24:03 | 6:24:05 | |
Although the First Minister said she would have further discussions | 6:24:07 | 6:24:10 | |
with the Lord Chief Justice about his proposal, she does not | 6:24:10 | 6:24:14 | |
appear to have done so in the five months since the election. | 6:24:14 | 6:24:18 | |
It became fairly clear during the election campaign that | 6:24:18 | 6:24:21 | |
Arlene Foster was responsible for not allowing that bid to go forward. | 6:24:21 | 6:24:25 | |
But it seemed to be based on the concept that the process | 6:24:25 | 6:24:28 | |
was unbalanced, that if we didn't proceed on all legacy matters | 6:24:28 | 6:24:32 | |
then we shouldn't proceed on any of them. | 6:24:32 | 6:24:35 | |
The reason unionists like Arlene Foster see the process | 6:24:35 | 6:24:38 | |
as potentially unbalanced and in danger of rewriting the past | 6:24:38 | 6:24:43 | |
may be because the vast majority of deaths involved were allegedly | 6:24:43 | 6:24:47 | |
caused by the state. | 6:24:47 | 6:24:49 | |
Ben Lowry is the Deputy Editor of the Newsletter. | 6:24:51 | 6:24:54 | |
He says the First Minister is right. | 6:24:54 | 6:24:57 | |
And he's concerned that victims of republican violence | 6:24:57 | 6:25:00 | |
are being ignored. | 6:25:00 | 6:25:01 | |
I have no dispute with the wish of the families | 6:25:01 | 6:25:06 | |
to have scrutiny of their deaths. | 6:25:06 | 6:25:09 | |
I'm saying that it's coming into the context of a very much | 6:25:09 | 6:25:13 | |
larger number of deaths. | 6:25:13 | 6:25:15 | |
We've got readers who are very distressed victims of IRA violence. | 6:25:15 | 6:25:19 | |
A lot of things that have happened, and the fact that they - | 6:25:19 | 6:25:22 | |
although they may not put it in this way - | 6:25:22 | 6:25:25 | |
have no prospect of even really finding out what happened, erm, | 6:25:25 | 6:25:31 | |
when their relatives were killed. | 6:25:31 | 6:25:33 | |
It's this perceived imbalance that may have prompted the First Minister | 6:25:33 | 6:25:37 | |
to talk of an attempt to rewrite history. | 6:25:37 | 6:25:41 | |
It's not a view shared by Martin McGuinness. | 6:25:41 | 6:25:44 | |
I would be concerned that anybody would think | 6:25:44 | 6:25:48 | |
that the Lord Chief Justice is interested in re-writing the past. | 6:25:48 | 6:25:53 | |
I don't think he is. | 6:25:53 | 6:25:54 | |
I am certainly not interested in re-writing the past | 6:25:54 | 6:25:58 | |
because there are many different narratives about the conflict | 6:25:58 | 6:26:01 | |
and the cause of the conflict. | 6:26:01 | 6:26:04 | |
And of course everybody that was part of that conflict | 6:26:04 | 6:26:07 | |
including, you know, many of the unionist parties, | 6:26:07 | 6:26:10 | |
are as much part of that past as anybody else. | 6:26:10 | 6:26:13 | |
But, you know, what we have to do is find ways forward to resolve | 6:26:13 | 6:26:16 | |
these situations. | 6:26:16 | 6:26:17 | |
But Ben Lowry fears a partial view of the Troubles is emerging. | 6:26:17 | 6:26:21 | |
I think the process in recent years has become one-sided. | 6:26:23 | 6:26:27 | |
I don't think that it's a conspiracy or anything. | 6:26:27 | 6:26:30 | |
I think there are of course people who want to pursue the state | 6:26:30 | 6:26:33 | |
vindictively but I don't think that that's what's happening. | 6:26:33 | 6:26:35 | |
I think that the state is more vulnerable in these processes | 6:26:35 | 6:26:40 | |
because it has records. | 6:26:40 | 6:26:41 | |
It has become so one-sided and so distorted, | 6:26:41 | 6:26:46 | |
the way that we're looking at the past, | 6:26:46 | 6:26:49 | |
that it is approaching the level of a crisis. | 6:26:49 | 6:26:53 | |
But for some of the families, it is not a question of rewriting | 6:26:53 | 6:26:57 | |
the past but of correcting errors on the public record. | 6:26:57 | 6:27:01 | |
The killing of Leo Norney happened here at the Shepherd's Path | 6:27:01 | 6:27:05 | |
at Whiterock Road late on Saturday night. | 6:27:05 | 6:27:08 | |
But why it happened has become a matter of very great dispute. | 6:27:08 | 6:27:11 | |
Leo Norney was 17 when he was shot and killed by the Army | 6:27:11 | 6:27:16 | |
in West Belfast. | 6:27:16 | 6:27:18 | |
Soldiers involved in the shooting claimed Leo was a gunman. | 6:27:18 | 6:27:21 | |
But he had been stopped and searched minutes earlier | 6:27:23 | 6:27:26 | |
by another military patrol. | 6:27:26 | 6:27:27 | |
He wasn't carrying a weapon. | 6:27:28 | 6:27:30 | |
His mother never stopped trying to clear his name. | 6:27:31 | 6:27:35 | |
Well, I've wrote to President Carter. | 6:27:35 | 6:27:38 | |
I've wrote to the Queen. | 6:27:38 | 6:27:40 | |
Roy Mason. | 6:27:40 | 6:27:41 | |
Kenneth Newman. | 6:27:41 | 6:27:42 | |
-Well, you've always maintained your son's innocence? -Oh, yes. | 6:27:42 | 6:27:45 | |
And you've always denied the Army claims that he was a gunman? | 6:27:45 | 6:27:48 | |
-That's correct. -How long are you going to keep up your campaign? | 6:27:48 | 6:27:52 | |
Until my two eyes are shut and I'm dead. | 6:27:52 | 6:27:54 | |
And then it'll be finished with. | 6:27:54 | 6:27:56 | |
Annie Norney died in 1997, | 6:27:58 | 6:28:00 | |
and Leo's sister is now fighting for a new inquest. | 6:28:00 | 6:28:04 | |
My parents are dead, | 6:28:06 | 6:28:08 | |
so what I want is an apology, | 6:28:08 | 6:28:11 | |
and I want it made to them, | 6:28:11 | 6:28:13 | |
because their lives were well and truly devastated by Leo's death | 6:28:13 | 6:28:19 | |
and by the attitude of the authorities when my mother | 6:28:19 | 6:28:24 | |
was trying to get to, you know, to the bottom, to get the truth. | 6:28:24 | 6:28:27 | |
The soldier who killed Leo Norney was sent to jail | 6:28:29 | 6:28:32 | |
soon after Leo's death for planting evidence on a civilian. | 6:28:32 | 6:28:36 | |
But the soldier's conviction was never disclosed | 6:28:37 | 6:28:40 | |
to the original inquest. | 6:28:40 | 6:28:41 | |
Like many relatives in these cases, Anne wants a second inquest, | 6:28:43 | 6:28:48 | |
because new evidence has emerged in the intervening years. | 6:28:48 | 6:28:51 | |
Such as the evidence of this man. | 6:28:52 | 6:28:55 | |
I've his photograph in my phone for the last ten years. | 6:28:55 | 6:28:58 | |
Francis Pyper was 14 when he and three friends | 6:28:58 | 6:29:01 | |
witnessed the killing and aftermath. | 6:29:01 | 6:29:04 | |
But he was not called to the original inquest and he has | 6:29:04 | 6:29:07 | |
not told Anne his story until now. | 6:29:07 | 6:29:10 | |
How far away were you from Leo and those soldiers? | 6:29:10 | 6:29:14 | |
As far as that wall. | 6:29:14 | 6:29:15 | |
The way Leo was shot, he was shot in the back there, right. | 6:29:15 | 6:29:18 | |
Now, how do you know that? | 6:29:18 | 6:29:20 | |
How do you know he was shot in the back? | 6:29:20 | 6:29:22 | |
Because we were walking across the field. | 6:29:22 | 6:29:24 | |
We seen, they shot him, he was trying to get back to | 6:29:24 | 6:29:26 | |
the taxi when the first shot went off. | 6:29:26 | 6:29:29 | |
If you look at the postmortem report, the entry wound went into | 6:29:29 | 6:29:32 | |
his left shoulder and it came out. | 6:29:32 | 6:29:34 | |
It ripped into his heart and out, and fractured his right ribcage. | 6:29:34 | 6:29:37 | |
When you pointed to the left shoulder I was amazed, | 6:29:37 | 6:29:40 | |
because that information isn't in the public domain. | 6:29:40 | 6:29:44 | |
I haven't even discussed this with my family. | 6:29:44 | 6:29:47 | |
But Anne and family are still waiting for the evidence | 6:29:47 | 6:29:50 | |
to be put in front of a new inquest. | 6:29:50 | 6:29:52 | |
They want to prove Leo was killed unlawfully. | 6:29:52 | 6:29:55 | |
What's stopping your inquest at the moment? | 6:29:55 | 6:29:58 | |
Arlene Foster - | 6:29:58 | 6:29:59 | |
she's blocked this important funding. | 6:29:59 | 6:30:03 | |
What right has she to block funding? | 6:30:04 | 6:30:06 | |
My brother... | 6:30:06 | 6:30:07 | |
There is a legal entitlement that he has an inquest. | 6:30:07 | 6:30:12 | |
The Attorney General has ordered this inquest. | 6:30:12 | 6:30:18 | |
It has to be held. | 6:30:18 | 6:30:19 | |
But Miss Foster, she's there to represent everybody. | 6:30:19 | 6:30:23 | |
But she seems to be saying to us and other families, | 6:30:24 | 6:30:28 | |
"I'm not going to do it." | 6:30:28 | 6:30:30 | |
She's saying these lives didn't matter. | 6:30:30 | 6:30:33 | |
We asked to speak to Arlene Foster for this programme but she declined. | 6:30:34 | 6:30:38 | |
Sir Declan Morgan's plan to deal with the backlog of inquests | 6:30:40 | 6:30:43 | |
is still waiting to go in front of the Executive for approval. | 6:30:43 | 6:30:47 | |
The review is proceeding at pace... | 6:30:47 | 6:30:49 | |
The Department of Justice told Spotlight | 6:30:49 | 6:30:51 | |
the proposal is under review, | 6:30:51 | 6:30:54 | |
but the First Minster's objections and her veto seem to remain. | 6:30:54 | 6:30:58 | |
Last month, the Lord Chief Justice spoke publicly about his | 6:31:00 | 6:31:04 | |
frustration at the delay. | 6:31:04 | 6:31:05 | |
It is now almost a year since I assumed the Presidency. | 6:31:07 | 6:31:11 | |
The coroner's courts will not be able to satisfy their legal | 6:31:11 | 6:31:15 | |
obligation to deliver these inquests within a reasonable timeframe | 6:31:15 | 6:31:18 | |
in the absence of the necessary resources. | 6:31:18 | 6:31:22 | |
I do not want us to remain in that position since that would be | 6:31:22 | 6:31:25 | |
yet another devastating blow to the families. | 6:31:25 | 6:31:29 | |
Calls for the British Government to ignore the First Minister's | 6:31:29 | 6:31:32 | |
objections and pay directly for the inquests are supported | 6:31:32 | 6:31:36 | |
by barrister Michael Mansfield. | 6:31:36 | 6:31:39 | |
How do you feel about the fact that the Executive is ignoring | 6:31:39 | 6:31:43 | |
-the top judge in this country? -Well, it's appalling. | 6:31:43 | 6:31:45 | |
The divisions here are so deep, that there will be people wanting | 6:31:45 | 6:31:48 | |
to block it until kingdom come and you won't get the truth. | 6:31:48 | 6:31:51 | |
Should the Secretary of State not step in, then? | 6:31:51 | 6:31:53 | |
Yes, I think the Secretary of State should step in, | 6:31:53 | 6:31:56 | |
so that's why I'm saying, actually, | 6:31:56 | 6:31:57 | |
the Secretary of State in England should be stepping in, | 6:31:57 | 6:32:00 | |
never mind the Secretary of State here. | 6:32:00 | 6:32:02 | |
So in other words, the Home Secretary should be taking | 6:32:02 | 6:32:04 | |
some responsibility, but more particularly the Prime Minister. | 6:32:04 | 6:32:08 | |
The Secretary of State for Northern Ireland told us that | 6:32:08 | 6:32:11 | |
because justice is devolved, it is up to the Executive | 6:32:11 | 6:32:15 | |
to resolve the issue. | 6:32:15 | 6:32:16 | |
Nevertheless, the Deputy First Minister insists | 6:32:19 | 6:32:22 | |
it's the UK Government - and not the DUP - | 6:32:22 | 6:32:25 | |
that's the main obstruction. | 6:32:25 | 6:32:28 | |
He told Spotlight he wrote to Prime Minister Theresa May last week | 6:32:28 | 6:32:32 | |
to start new talks on resolving the legacy issues like inquests. | 6:32:32 | 6:32:36 | |
I would love the DUP to agree that we would make a joint request | 6:32:36 | 6:32:40 | |
to the British Government to release that money | 6:32:40 | 6:32:43 | |
for the Lord Chief Justice. | 6:32:43 | 6:32:45 | |
But in the absence of that, the responsibility for denying | 6:32:45 | 6:32:50 | |
the Lord Chief Justice the funding to complete his programme | 6:32:50 | 6:32:53 | |
over the course of five years lies fairly and squarely at the door | 6:32:53 | 6:32:57 | |
of the British government. | 6:32:57 | 6:32:59 | |
But David Ford feels the responsibility to solve this | 6:33:00 | 6:33:03 | |
stalemate lies with Sinn Fein and the DUP. | 6:33:03 | 6:33:06 | |
I think it illustrates the real problems of the so-called | 6:33:06 | 6:33:10 | |
"Fresh Start", that it wasn't actually a fresh start for victims. | 6:33:10 | 6:33:14 | |
It was anything but a fresh start for victims, and yet the government | 6:33:14 | 6:33:17 | |
did the deal with the two biggest parties to the detriment of those | 6:33:17 | 6:33:21 | |
who are wanting to see a full outcome dealing | 6:33:21 | 6:33:23 | |
with all the legacy issues. | 6:33:23 | 6:33:25 | |
You are placing the responsibility for this at the foot | 6:33:25 | 6:33:27 | |
of the British Government. | 6:33:27 | 6:33:29 | |
Is this an attempt to paper over the cracks | 6:33:29 | 6:33:31 | |
between Sinn Fein and the DUP? | 6:33:31 | 6:33:33 | |
No, I never paper over the cracks. | 6:33:34 | 6:33:37 | |
There are differences of opinion between us and the DUP | 6:33:37 | 6:33:40 | |
on a range of issues. | 6:33:40 | 6:33:41 | |
Er... | 6:33:41 | 6:33:43 | |
It's also true that we agree about more things than we disagree about, | 6:33:43 | 6:33:47 | |
so we should always keep this in perspective. | 6:33:47 | 6:33:50 | |
We're not agreed on academic selection, | 6:33:51 | 6:33:54 | |
we're certainly not agreed on the issue of the request by | 6:33:54 | 6:33:57 | |
the Lord Chief Justice, and I do think the British Government | 6:33:57 | 6:34:00 | |
could quite easily, even against the backdrop of | 6:34:00 | 6:34:03 | |
no agreement within the Executive Office, | 6:34:03 | 6:34:06 | |
release those funds to the Lord Chief Justice. | 6:34:06 | 6:34:08 | |
And I think questions need to be asked as to why they are not | 6:34:08 | 6:34:11 | |
prepared to do that. | 6:34:11 | 6:34:12 | |
With different views on how to deal with the past, | 6:34:12 | 6:34:15 | |
the problem is finding common ground on how to go forward. | 6:34:15 | 6:34:19 | |
Rosaleen is just one of many. | 6:34:20 | 6:34:22 | |
Nobody's speaking. Nobody's doing nothing. | 6:34:24 | 6:34:27 | |
And it's wrong. It's bad. | 6:34:27 | 6:34:29 | |
You know, it's not just the killers and the murderers | 6:34:32 | 6:34:35 | |
that do the damage. | 6:34:35 | 6:34:37 | |
It is also authorities, | 6:34:38 | 6:34:42 | |
by their lack of support and help, | 6:34:42 | 6:34:47 | |
and they could finish it so quick, | 6:34:47 | 6:34:49 | |
but they just choose not to. | 6:34:49 | 6:34:51 | |
But while the issue remains unresolved, | 6:34:56 | 6:34:59 | |
the pain of the past never goes away. | 6:34:59 | 6:35:02 |