Browse content similar to 02/06/2013. Check below for episodes and series from the same categories and more!
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county councils bring sweeping weather and decisions in Europe, see | :01:23. | :01:33. | |
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Apology for the loss of subtitles for 2447 seconds | :01:33. | :42:20. | |
of the programme. I'm Etholle George. This week we're down on the | :42:20. | :42:23. | |
farm, where it's less of a rural idyll than an agricultural disaster | :42:23. | :42:26. | |
area. More farmers than ever have been badly affected thanks to the | :42:26. | :42:29. | |
weather this year. Particularly the dairy industry, where many are still | :42:29. | :42:35. | |
getting less for their milk than it costs to produce. It has not been | :42:36. | :42:41. | |
easy. For the work we have to do, there is not enough money in Ed at | :42:41. | :42:47. | |
the moment. For the last couple of years, we have really struggled. | :42:47. | :42:50. | |
And the fallout from the County Council elections continues, with | :42:50. | :42:53. | |
the UK Independence Party taking a higher profile in the East than ever | :42:53. | :42:56. | |
before. It's a rainbow coalition for Norfolk. UKIP are the main | :42:56. | :42:59. | |
opposition, which has given the county its first Labour leader for | :42:59. | :43:05. | |
more than a decade. We speak to him later. But first to our guests. | :43:05. | :43:08. | |
Geoffrey Van Orden, Conservative member of the European Parliament | :43:08. | :43:14. | |
for the East. And Richard Howitt, the East's Labour MEP. And a story | :43:14. | :43:17. | |
this week about the exploitation of thousands of migrant workers who are | :43:17. | :43:21. | |
desperate for somewhere to live. These are the pictures from just one | :43:21. | :43:24. | |
town, Wisbech, where there are more than 1,000 overcrowded and | :43:24. | :43:28. | |
unlicensed properties. Whole families with young children are | :43:28. | :43:35. | |
sharing one room and there are cases of 20 people living in each house. | :43:35. | :43:39. | |
Geoffrey Van Orden, a big problem across the region, so what is to be | :43:39. | :43:45. | |
done? Of course, it is appalling what we are seeing, and we have to | :43:45. | :43:49. | |
properly in force the law as far as these dwellings are concerned and | :43:49. | :43:53. | |
the conditions in which people are living. It points to a wider | :43:53. | :43:58. | |
problem, the number of migrants coming from eastern Europe and | :43:58. | :44:02. | |
elsewhere, but in other region particularly, from eastern Europe, | :44:02. | :44:06. | |
and concentrated in areas such as Wisbech. I was there a couple of | :44:06. | :44:13. | |
weeks ago campaigning and I saw for myself the numbers of people from | :44:13. | :44:22. | |
Latvia, Lithuania and Poland and other places. But... I have to say, | :44:22. | :44:26. | |
we are doing more about this and we need greater opportunities for local | :44:26. | :44:32. | |
people. Richard Howitt, is this is what is meant as freedom of | :44:32. | :44:42. | |
:44:42. | :44:43. | ||
movement? It is good you did this Ed -- did this investigation. I think | :44:43. | :44:48. | |
people's real concern is not just numbers, and numbers game that they | :44:48. | :44:55. | |
can never win, it is about fear for your -- you are less likely to get a | :44:55. | :45:00. | |
job because someone else has taken it. If migrant workers are treated | :45:00. | :45:05. | |
fairly, with proper housing and wages, they will not undercut local | :45:05. | :45:11. | |
Labour. Thank you both very much for the moment. Now to the plight of our | :45:11. | :45:14. | |
farmers. While politicians wrestle with reforms in Europe, farmers are | :45:14. | :45:17. | |
doing battle against the elements. An unprecedented 90% of them are | :45:17. | :45:20. | |
being pushed closer to the breadline. And nowhere is that more | :45:20. | :45:22. | |
true than in the dairy industry. The crisis continues, despite coalition | :45:23. | :45:27. | |
hopes for a voluntary code of practice. | :45:27. | :45:31. | |
The grass still has not grown much on this cold, wet nurse land in | :45:31. | :45:38. | |
South Norfolk. -- marshland. But they had run out of feed, so they | :45:38. | :45:44. | |
had to be put out on the land. is not enough money in it at the | :45:44. | :45:51. | |
moment for the work we have to do. We have struggled. Do you feel like | :45:51. | :45:57. | |
giving up? It has come to that. It has crossed my mind, but hopefully, | :45:57. | :46:01. | |
we have now crossed a low-cost system and we can see a | :46:01. | :46:08. | |
breakthrough. It is no better in the chicken shed, where the price for | :46:08. | :46:18. | |
:46:18. | :46:23. | ||
eggs matches the price of the. one year ago, -- the price of feed. | :46:23. | :46:29. | |
About one year ago, we did not think we could carry on. Why did you carry | :46:29. | :46:32. | |
on? We wanted to see what would happen. | :46:32. | :46:38. | |
They reckon they get 1p per litre for their milk because they have not | :46:38. | :46:44. | |
signed up to the voluntary code of practice, and they are also losing | :46:44. | :46:51. | |
600 �600 per year in environmental subsidies from Europe -- �6,600 per | :46:51. | :47:01. | |
year in environmental subsidies for neuro. -- Europe. We are in the | :47:01. | :47:04. | |
final round of the Common Agricultural Policy's reform | :47:04. | :47:08. | |
negotiations, with hope a deal can be struck in June. The National | :47:08. | :47:15. | |
Farmers' Union wants to make sure any budget cuts are spread across | :47:15. | :47:18. | |
the EU and don't analyse farmers here. Unfortunately, the UK | :47:18. | :47:24. | |
Government does not put farming at the top of its priorities. The | :47:24. | :47:29. | |
French have already done a deal to get an extra 1 billion euros for | :47:29. | :47:34. | |
their farmers. I am worried, as this horse trading goes on for weeks, | :47:34. | :47:40. | |
English farmers in particular, the ones I represent, will be sold down | :47:40. | :47:45. | |
the river. Even this week's Suffolk show could not dodge the bad weather | :47:45. | :47:50. | |
that has caused havoc. We are at least one month late coming into the | :47:50. | :48:00. | |
summer. We had summing -- we are having major problems. We are about | :48:00. | :48:04. | |
three weeks to one month late and that has to relate, especially as we | :48:04. | :48:09. | |
are still called in May, to a later harvest. I am not sure it can catch | :48:09. | :48:14. | |
up. Yet they are managing to bottles hundreds of metres for a growing | :48:14. | :48:20. | |
rapeseed oil market. While the market for milk really breaks even. | :48:20. | :48:25. | |
This farm has been in the family for three generations, but cannot | :48:25. | :48:29. | |
provide a future for two sons. love the animals here and love to | :48:29. | :48:36. | |
see them out. Earlier this week, Andrew Sinclair | :48:36. | :48:39. | |
spoke to Sir James Paice, who is himself a farmer. He was the Farming | :48:39. | :48:42. | |
Minister that introduced the voluntary code of practice for the | :48:42. | :48:44. | |
dairy industry before he was moved from his post. | :48:44. | :48:49. | |
I hope that the rest of those processors will sign up, that the | :48:49. | :48:55. | |
organisation, of which they are all members, will exert more Prince -- | :48:55. | :49:00. | |
pressure, and all the pressure it can, because this was a deal done | :49:00. | :49:04. | |
between both sides of the industry, with government as a catalyst to | :49:04. | :49:11. | |
make it happen. Hopefully, a relationship between producers and | :49:11. | :49:16. | |
processors will carry them into the future. Wouldn't a mandatory scheme | :49:16. | :49:22. | |
be better? It is still there, and it is up to the present ministers to do | :49:22. | :49:28. | |
that to introduce it. Do you think we should? Do not forget, we | :49:28. | :49:33. | |
launched this in September, the day I lost my job as minister, and we | :49:33. | :49:38. | |
knew it would be at least this April before it would be up and running, | :49:38. | :49:43. | |
so it is early days to make a judgement. But the job of | :49:44. | :49:48. | |
legislation is still available, but limited, because it is the EU that | :49:48. | :49:57. | |
can only address certain issues. if that is not enough, there are no | :49:57. | :50:03. | |
worries about CAP reform, and future payments, our farmers right to be | :50:03. | :50:10. | |
worried? I think they are, and I think this reform of CAP was a great | :50:10. | :50:15. | |
opportunity for Europe as a whole to look forward. We put the days of | :50:15. | :50:20. | |
surpluses and butter and milk lakes behind us and we are looking at a | :50:20. | :50:26. | |
period of 30-40 years we have the world could be short of food and we | :50:26. | :50:30. | |
need to refocus the CAP. That opportunity has not been grasped by | :50:30. | :50:36. | |
anyone. What we are seeing now is going to be a mess, not resolved, | :50:36. | :50:40. | |
not satisfactory for anybody in Europe, but I certainly think that | :50:40. | :50:45. | |
is a risk that British farmers, particularly, could lose out from | :50:45. | :50:50. | |
some discussions. Why are we doing so badly? We hear reports the French | :50:50. | :50:55. | |
have an extra �1 billion. The dead. Why are we getting this wrong | :50:55. | :51:05. | |
:51:05. | :51:06. | ||
mission marked -- they did. When these decisions were taken, such as | :51:06. | :51:14. | |
with France, and switching money, and the different arms of the CAP, | :51:14. | :51:19. | |
those decisions were taken at the behest of the Treasury, rather than | :51:19. | :51:25. | |
in the best interests of British farmers. One criticism I have heard | :51:25. | :51:29. | |
from British farmers is many people in government, particularly the | :51:29. | :51:32. | |
Treasury and civil servants, do not understand farming. Do you think | :51:32. | :51:39. | |
that is true? I think it is true. I have no doubt after two and a half | :51:39. | :51:43. | |
years in government, and a huge section does not understand farming, | :51:43. | :51:47. | |
and not keeping up to speed with changes. Some of the rhetoric is | :51:47. | :51:51. | |
still about those days of and cutting production and farmers being | :51:52. | :51:57. | |
subsidised. They have not caught up. Geoffrey Van Orden, a damning | :51:58. | :52:03. | |
indictment that the Treasury does not understand farming. It is very | :52:03. | :52:07. | |
difficult area and that is no doubt, after the last reform discussions, | :52:07. | :52:14. | |
many of us were disappointed that we were not able to do more for British | :52:14. | :52:20. | |
farmers in the way that they want. Over the years, over decades now, | :52:20. | :52:28. | |
we're British farmers have not got a fair section of the CAP payments. At | :52:28. | :52:35. | |
the moment, something like 50 billion per year is spent on Sun, | :52:35. | :52:41. | |
and British farmers get about 3 billion of that. People watching | :52:41. | :52:44. | |
will be wondering what you as Europe-1-macro are doing, surely it | :52:44. | :52:54. | |
:52:54. | :52:55. | ||
is your job to negotiate on farmers behalf? -- as MEPs. There are some | :52:55. | :52:59. | |
differences. We have heard that this is a government that cares more | :52:59. | :53:06. | |
about cutting the amount going down rather than how it is spent. There | :53:06. | :53:11. | |
was one attack on George Osborne the from a conservative. There are clear | :53:11. | :53:16. | |
dividing lines. The National farmers union once a common policy as | :53:16. | :53:21. | |
possible. It does not want other countries, such as the French, | :53:21. | :53:27. | |
getting money under the table and then missing out. Yet you and your | :53:28. | :53:33. | |
colleagues voted against a more competitive CAP. There are many | :53:33. | :53:37. | |
areas we are, very consciously, we wanted to help local farmers. | :53:37. | :53:47. | |
Sometimes, we find ourselves not voting in the way the government | :53:47. | :53:53. | |
like. Can I just introduce what our position is as UK farming goes? Open | :53:53. | :54:03. | |
:54:03. | :54:10. | ||
Europe have put some figures David Cameron had the chance to | :54:10. | :54:16. | |
challenge that money going to the friends and chose not to do so. One | :54:16. | :54:19. | |
environment, we should have environmental compliance for the | :54:19. | :54:25. | |
money going to farmers. Farmers are stewards of the environment, many | :54:25. | :54:29. | |
supporting this, yet the Conservative MEPs voted against | :54:29. | :54:37. | |
this. We want to see British farmers having higher standards of welfare. | :54:37. | :54:42. | |
Exactly. But conservatives voted against it. We are very strong | :54:42. | :54:49. | |
supporters of animal welfare. We want to see incentives to farmers | :54:49. | :54:55. | |
that are productive and producing sustainable farming. That is what we | :54:55. | :55:01. | |
want to encourage. You say that. You voted differently in March. For Sir | :55:01. | :55:07. | |
James Paice to come on, Cambridge Tory MP, man who abolished the | :55:08. | :55:13. | |
agricultural wages board, meaning some people lose holidays and sick | :55:13. | :55:21. | |
pay, I think... I just want to... are trying to create a more | :55:22. | :55:25. | |
efficient farming industry across the United Kingdom. Of course that | :55:25. | :55:30. | |
is what we want. But those figures revealed a distortion in where the | :55:30. | :55:40. | |
:55:40. | :55:42. | ||
money goes. It was already geared against us, and British farmers, in | :55:42. | :55:47. | |
the European Union. That has been the system for many years. We shall | :55:47. | :55:55. | |
leave that they are for now. Thank you. -- leave that there. A fresh | :55:55. | :55:58. | |
wind is blowing through some of our county halls following this month's | :55:58. | :56:00. | |
elections. With both Cambridgeshire and Norfolk now in no overall | :56:00. | :56:06. | |
control. Strange bedfellows are being forced to work together. In | :56:06. | :56:09. | |
Norfolk, a rainbow alliance of Labour, the Liberal Democrats, UKIP | :56:09. | :56:11. | |
and the Greens has been formed. While in Cambridgeshire, the | :56:11. | :56:13. | |
Conservatives are being allowed to run a minority administration. And | :56:14. | :56:16. | |
there's another big change coming in. Both authorities have voted to | :56:16. | :56:19. | |
do away with the cabinet system of local government. Instead of a | :56:19. | :56:22. | |
handful of members from the ruling party making all the decisions, | :56:22. | :56:27. | |
committees of councillors will be set up to run things. The key thing | :56:27. | :56:32. | |
about it is bringing back what we see as the democratic deficit lost | :56:32. | :56:35. | |
over years, making decision processes back in the chamber over | :56:35. | :56:41. | |
there, and what it has two B, so that is why we are united together | :56:41. | :56:44. | |
to bring that into existence, a committee system making decisions in | :56:44. | :56:52. | |
the chamber, to all 84 members. And not just our members, including | :56:52. | :56:56. | |
Conservative members as well. advocated the cabinet system, | :56:56. | :57:00. | |
because we need to respond to pressing issues. One of the reasons | :57:00. | :57:05. | |
it was introduced is because decision-making is so very slow and | :57:05. | :57:11. | |
the committee system. Take not the County Council, for example, | :57:11. | :57:15. | |
employing 25,000 people, a very large organisation, and we need to | :57:15. | :57:20. | |
be able to react and plan and do that accordingly and one of the | :57:20. | :57:23. | |
problems with the committee system is everyone works in silos | :57:23. | :57:32. | |
underneath their committee, not enough across the board working. | :57:32. | :57:35. | |
George Nobbs, the Labour leader of Norfolk Council, joins us from | :57:35. | :57:41. | |
Norwich. Why do you prefer the committee system? It is not just me, | :57:41. | :57:47. | |
it is four parties out of five in Norfolk County Council. What the | :57:47. | :57:53. | |
system advocated is decisions like the one about the incinerator of | :57:53. | :57:56. | |
Kings Lynn, dragging on for well over three years, still massive | :57:56. | :58:02. | |
protest, planning applications and enquiries, and that was a decision | :58:02. | :58:08. | |
made by a cabinet of ten people, where the council never had a chance | :58:08. | :58:14. | |
to discuss it. It may sound strange to people outside, but people do not | :58:14. | :58:17. | |
understand that the council does not vote on things at present, it is | :58:17. | :58:23. | |
made by a small group of people, and we are trying to change that. | :58:23. | :58:28. | |
you worried no decisions could be made? What a good decisions, but no | :58:28. | :58:35. | |
decisions. Quite the opposite. -- lots of good discussions, but no | :58:35. | :58:42. | |
decisions. Quite the opposite. It will take as a year to change the | :58:43. | :58:49. | |
system, because that is what the law says. This is not a Labour policy, | :58:49. | :58:52. | |
because other Labour administrations are not doing the same thing, and | :58:52. | :59:00. | |
this could be party political. cannot see how it could be if it was | :59:00. | :59:08. | |
not an across-the-board. Some other councils are adopting it. We must | :59:08. | :59:11. | |
get away from the silly idea that we must have dogma and local | :59:11. | :59:16. | |
government. The Conservatives have done things a certain way for | :59:16. | :59:20. | |
several years, they have had their own way, run roughshod, and assisted | :59:20. | :59:25. | |
them on nobody else. We have tried to do a different approach, with | :59:25. | :59:31. | |
several parties working together. UKIP, Liberal Democrats, Greens and | :59:31. | :59:36. | |
labour are four parties with different views on a huge range of | :59:37. | :59:42. | |
subjects, but coming together on this essential issue, for the people | :59:42. | :59:48. | |
of Norfolk themselves. Stay with us. Geoffrey Van Orden, labour and UKIP | :59:48. | :59:53. | |
coalition, strange bedfellows. All-macro absolutely. This was never | :59:53. | :00:00. | |
part of Labour policy. absolutely. This was never part of | :00:00. | :00:08. | |
the policy. I think what the Conservative leader of Norfolk has | :00:08. | :00:11. | |
suggested is perhaps there ought to be a discussion amongst all the | :00:11. | :00:15. | |
parties to work out the best way forward and that is the way to do | :00:15. | :00:22. | |
it. George Nobbs, do you disagree? think you are living in a fantasy | :00:22. | :00:31. | |
world. What was said was what do I have to do to become leader? You are | :00:31. | :00:38. | |
living... Richard Howitt, you are quite keen on this idea of | :00:38. | :00:45. | |
committees. I am keen on democracy, and the electorate spoke in May, | :00:45. | :00:49. | |
kicking the Conservatives out, and I am deeply proud as a Labour leader | :00:49. | :00:54. | |
of Norfolk County Council. On issues that George and labour really cares | :00:54. | :01:00. | |
about, and the Mehdi people of Norfolk, -- and the local people of | :01:00. | :01:06. | |
Norfolk, schools, for example. And they can deal with issues where the | :01:06. | :01:11. | |
Conservatives failed. More people voted conservative than for any | :01:11. | :01:18. | |
other party in Norfolk. More people voted for UKIP than was anticipated. | :01:18. | :01:25. | |
Perhaps, more right thinking voters than previously, but ending up with | :01:25. | :01:34. | |
a left leaning leader. How does that work? George Nobbs? Can I answer | :01:34. | :01:41. | |
some of those bizarre points. Most of the people that voted are | :01:41. | :01:49. | |
represented by the coalition I lead. Your idea is that 32% voted | :01:49. | :01:54. | |
conservative and get 100% of the government. That is going to end. | :01:54. | :02:02. | |
coalition more democratic? UKIP are not in the Cabinet and there are no | :02:02. | :02:07. | |
UKIP policies endorsed by Labour here. I give evidence against the | :02:07. | :02:12. | |
incinerator in Kings Lynn, and feel strongly it is a bad environmental | :02:12. | :02:16. | |
solution. The fact that as a new majority in Norfolk on that issue | :02:16. | :02:21. | |
alone, I celebrate. We shall leave it there. George Nobbs, thank you | :02:21. | :02:26. | |
for your time. We've seen some anniversaries this week. It's a year | :02:26. | :02:30. | |
since Mary Portas set out to revive our high streets and six months | :02:30. | :02:32. | |
since the introduction of Police and Crime Commissioners. Chris Bond | :02:32. | :02:41. | |
rounds it all up in 60 seconds. Tough times on the high street and | :02:41. | :02:46. | |
despite a cash injection from the regional Guru, Mary Portas, some | :02:46. | :02:50. | |
businesses are still in the slow lane. Meanwhile, speeding up heavy | :02:50. | :02:56. | |
traffic the aim of some Essex County Council us, who want a ban on | :02:56. | :03:00. | |
lorries taking over on the A12. Charles Clarke once ran the Home | :03:00. | :03:08. | |
Office, who this week criticised the cost and role of some recently | :03:08. | :03:10. | |
elected Police and Crime Commissioners. After six months, the | :03:10. | :03:13. | |
signs are not good and I see no positive response to the existence | :03:13. | :03:19. | |
of them. And reflecting on the positives and negatives after 20 | :03:19. | :03:25. | |
years in Brussels, one MEP announced he will not stand for re-election. | :03:25. | :03:29. | |
If you go back to where we started, we were a group of people meeting | :03:29. | :03:35. | |
and talking shop, now with the Lisbon Treaty, we have real powers | :03:35. | :03:40. | |
and we can change government's laws. | :03:40. | :03:46. | |
Gentleman, Robert Sturdy, standing down before next year's elections. | :03:46. | :03:53. | |
Any of you planning on that? Not at all. Lots more to be done. Robert is | :03:53. | :04:01. | |
a decent man. It is a sign of the changing nature of the Tory party. | :04:01. | :04:06. | |
What about your plans? My ambition is for Jeffrey to retire when he | :04:06. | :04:14. | |
loses next year, and I am hopeful to carry on. Being an MEP takes up | :04:14. | :04:21. | |
time. What about ambitions beyond politics? One day, I will think | :04:21. | :04:26. | |
about my third career, but I am not ready yet, still a lot to be done in | :04:26. | :04:32. | |
the European Parliament and chairing -- and changing Europe policy. It | :04:32. | :04:37. | |
has been a wrong struggle, -- it has been a long struggle, but we're | :04:37. | :04:45. | |
getting there. I am proud to stay next year. I wish you good luck. | :04:45. | :04:49. | |
They are not stopping being MEPs any time soon. Thank you both very much | :04:49. | :04:53. | |
for joining us. That's all for now. Don't forget Deborah McGurran's blog | :04:53. | :04:56. | |
for all the latest political updates. Join us at 11 o'clock next | :04:56. | :05:00. |