11/05/2014 Sunday Politics North West


11/05/2014

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Morning, folks. Welcome to the Sunday Politics, where we're talking

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about the Europe-wide contest that really matters. No, not Eurovision.

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The European elections. There are local elections across England too

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on May 22nd. The party leaders are campaigning ahead of polling day.

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The results could be a pointer to the Big One, May 2015. We'll be

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speaking to the man in charge of Labour's election battle plan. Has

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the opposition really got its sights set on all-out victory in 2015? Or

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will it just be content with squeaking home? And you can't

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mention elections these days without talking about the impact of this

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man, Nigel Farage. I'll be asking him if UKIP really is fit

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And in the North West. What's the future for AstraZeneca?

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And: Whetting the appetite for the European elections ` we get a

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flavour of what's influencing your vote.

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boroughs. What will make a difference to the way you vote?

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And I'm joined by three journalists guaranteed to bring a touch of

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Eurovision glamour to your Sunday morning. With views more

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controversial than a bearded Austrian drag act and twice the

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dress sense, it's Nick Watt, Helen Lewis and Janan Ganesh. So you might

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have thought you've already heard David Cameron promise an in-out

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referendum on EU membership in 2017 if he's still Prime Minister. Many

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times. Many, many times. Well he obviously doesn't think you've been

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listening, because he's been saying it again today. Here he is speaking

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to the BBC earlier. We will hold a referendum by the end of 2017. It

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will be a referendum on an in-out basis. Do we stay in a reformed

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European Union or do we leave? And I've said very clearly that whatever

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the outcome of the next election, and of course I want an overall

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majority and I'm hoping and believing I can win an overall

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majority, that people should be in no doubt I will not become Prime

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Minister unless I can guarantee that we will hold a referendum. Here's

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saying there that an overall majority there will definitely be a

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referendum. If these are the minority position, he won't form a

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new coalition unless they agree to a referendum, too. The Lib Dems a

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pulmonary agree to that. They probably will because the Prime

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ministers have a strong argument which is I gave you a referendum

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back in 2010 so the least I need is theirs and the Lib Dems are the only

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party who have stood in recent elections on a clear mandate to hold

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a referendum, so it is difficult for them to say no, there was

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interesting the interview he did earlier today. He named everything

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was going to ask for. The most controversial with him, as he said

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in his speech last year, he wants to take Britain out of the commitment

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to make the European Union and ever closer union. That is a very big

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ask, but the point is, he may well get it because the choice for the

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European Union now, France and Germany, is a clear wonderful do

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Britain in or out? Previously, it was can you put up with a British

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prime ministers being annoying? I think you'll find the answer is they

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are willing to pay a price but not any price to keep Britain in. In

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this scenario, Labour would have lost the election again because we

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are talking the slowly happen if Mr Cameron is the largest party or has

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an overall majority. Could you then see Labour deciding we had better go

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along with a referendum, too? I think that's unlikely because as I

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think that's unlikely because there's a huge upside for that for I

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think what's interesting is the idea he would for minority government.

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Would you get confidence and look at other options that might well happen

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with the way the arithmetic is going or is he going to hold out and say

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the only way I will be Prime Minister is in a majority

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Conservative government? No, the implication of his remarks was I

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wouldn't form a coalition government unless my coalition partners would

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also agree to vote for a referendum. He's basically talking about is

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negotiating strategy in those coalition talks. It's a red line and

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a huge opportunity for the Lib Dems, because they know David Cameron

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absolutely has to do, for accidental reasons, as a person who survives as

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Tory leader, to ask for that referendum, so they can ask anything

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they want in return and if I was Nick Clegg, I would work out in the

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next year one absolute colossal negotiating demand for those

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coalition talks. For a party around 10% in the polls, they will do have

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the Prime Minister over a barrel on this one, assuming that coalition

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talks goes well. They could make Michael Gove Tbyte meeting. OK, we

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need to move on. So, the politicians are out and about on what used to be

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called the stump ahead of local and European elections in less than two

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weeks' time. But, without wanting to depress you on a damp Sunday

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morning, the party strategists are already hard at work on their

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campaign plans for the General Election next May. Yes, it's less

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than a year to go. They may have taken their time, but Labour's

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battleplan for 2015 is starting to take shape. As well as take

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promising to freeze your energy bills, and reintroduce the 50p rate

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of tax, Ed Miliband now says he wants to intervene in the housing

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market to keep rents down. There's even talk that the party leadership

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wants to bring more railway lines into public ownership. And Labour is

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gambling that its big push on the cost of living will see it through

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to the general election despite evidence that growth is firmly back.

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Labour's campaign chief Douglas Alexander hopes it all adds up to

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victory next May. But so far, the evidence is hitting home very thin.

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One survey today shows that 56% of people don't think Mr Miliband is up

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to the job of Prime Minister. As we head towards one of the least

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predictable general elections in 70 years, has Labour got a message to

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win seats up and down the country? And Labour's election co-ordinator

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and Shadow Foreign Secretary, Douglas Alexander, joins me now.

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Welcome to Sunday Politics. A lot of these policies announced polar

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pretty well. By popular with the country. When you add them together,

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it's a move to the left and what would be wrong with that? I think is

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your packet suggests, the contours in the coming campaign are becoming

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clear. Our judgement is the defining issue of the year in British

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politics will be the widening gap between the wealth of the country

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and the finances of ordinary families. We believe it will be a

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cost of living election and we have been setting out our thinking in

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relation to energy prices and rent, but you will hear more from Labour

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Party in the coming months because we're now less than one year away

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from a decisive moment. If the leftish think tank suggested any of

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his policies in that Tony Blair years, you would have opposed them.

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Let's be clear, when not going for an interest but seeking to secure a

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majority for the only way to do that is not simply to appeal to your

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base, but to the centre ground. I believe we got genuine opportunities

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in the next year. You have the Conservatives in a struggle with

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UKIP on the right of politics. The Lib Dems 9% of trying to find their

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base, and there's a genuine opportunity in the next year for

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Labour to dominate the centre ground of politics and secure the majority

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Labour government we are planning for in the coming year. I notice you

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didn't deny you wouldn't have opposed. You say you have got an

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message for aspirational voters in the South. This is what John Denham

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said. He thinks you're talking too much to your core vote.

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He is right to recognise we took a terrible beating in 2010. 29%. If

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you look at what we've done in the last week, for example, the

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signature policy on rent Ed Miliband announced to launch the campaign,

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there's now more than 9 million people in the country in the private

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rented sector, more than 1 million families. Many of them are in the

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south-east. They are seeing circumstances where, suddenly,

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landlord will increase the rent and they put the pressure involved in

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schooling, health care facing the families, so it is important both in

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terms of policy and in terms of politics that we speak to the whole

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country, not simply to one part of it falls up what is the average rise

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in event last year? I don't know. Can you tell me? 1%. 1% not in real

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terms. I'm not sure what the problem is. It will happen to wages in last

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year, we are facing circumstances where people will be worse off, up

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to ?1600 off worse and frankly, if our opponents want to argue that the

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economy has healed and they deserve a victory lap, good luck to them

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because actually, what we are hearing from the Buddhist public,

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not just in the north and south, is not the cost living crisis is

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continuing and it affects families. There was nothing aspirational about

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your party election broadcast for the European elections. It looked

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like crude class war to money people. That's a bit of it. Bedroom

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tax. Isn't it going to look bad that two thirds of those affected are

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disabled? Who cares? They can't fight back. Shall be lay-offs and

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NHS nurses? The National Health Service? Oh yes. Mr Cameron? Who

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said that? Me. My gosh. The man has shrunk. He's actually shrunk. What

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shall we do with him? Can we hunt him? Nothing about Europe, Labour

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policy. News that the Tories would result in negative campaigning and

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smear. You didn't tell you would be just as bad. Let's start the party

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broadcast. The one thing guaranteed to have most people reaching for the

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remote control these days are the words, there now follows a party but

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the broadcast. I make no apology in the factory to be innovative in how

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we presented. It's factual. It was a policy -based critic of this

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government. And the Lib Dems role within it. So you're claiming it's

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factual to betray the camera and cabinet is not even knowing what the

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NHS is, -- the Cameron Cabinet. They attack the disabled because they

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can't fight back. The Pinellas Tanner severely Prime Minister Sun

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and he was treated during a short life by the NHS. It's a fact many

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disabled people across the country including in my constituency have

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been directly affected by the bedroom tax. And ultimately, this

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Conservative led government, including the Lib Dems, will be held

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accountable by the politicians. You say that, the Prime Minister, who

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had a severely disabled son of. I you not ashamed about? I shadowed

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Iain Duncan Smith of five months also they don't have the excuses of

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seeing that saying nobody told them the consequences of the bedroom tax.

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They went into this with their eyes open. They knew about the hardship

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and difficulty. If they were one-bedroom properties available

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across the country for people to move into, their argument would be

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OK but they knew they were dealing with the most vulnerable people. Did

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you sign off that part of the broadcast? Of course I stand by the

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fact of it. I wish David Cameron and Iain Duncan Smith would apologise to

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the disabled people of the country and the poorest people for the

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effects of the bedroom tax. I hope we get that apology between now and

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election. As someone who thinks integrity is important in politics,

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not ashamed of this kind of thing? It's important we scrutinise the

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policies of this government as well as adding a positive agenda for

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change. You want that you won't promise this is the last time we'll

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see such a negative press campaign? I don't think it is negative or

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personal to scrutinise the government. So we'll get more of

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this? I'm less interested in the background of the cabinet than their

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views. You call the upper-class twits. It's for the British public

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to make a judgement in terms of the British... That's how you depicted

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them. We are held in accountable for the bedroom tax, the NHS, taxation,

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and our record they have to defend. One reason are so fearful in this

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election is actually because they know they have a poor record. Let's

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look at other part of the election campaign. This poster. Particularly

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digitally doing the rounds. On that shopping basket, can you tell us

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which items take the full 20% VAT? It's representative of household

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shopping, which includes items like cleaning products, and we know that

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food is not that trouble. People don't go to the supermarket and say

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this is -- vatable. don't go to the supermarket and say

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your policy. It is the exception rather than the rule to have the

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position we have at the moment. In Northern Ireland we have seen the

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continued rise in terms of the rented sector but there is a

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widespread recognition that for those people in the rented sector,

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change is necessary. Are you coordinating this campaign? It seems

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accident prone. This is a party that has set the agenda more effectively

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than a Conservative party that said when David Cameron was elected he

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wasn't going to bang on about Europe. The day after the election

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we expect the Conservative party to be engulfed in crisis. I'm proud of

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what we talk about and I think there is a clear contrast about a party

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talking about issues people care about, and a Conservative party

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talking about exclusively a referendum. Are you in charge of the

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campaign? I am coordinating the campaign is, yes. The expensive

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election guru you have hired, has he been involved in any of this? We

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have started our discussions with him. You are going to have to brief

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him about British politics because he doesn't know anything about it. I

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make no apology for hiring him. He has a lot of experience in winning

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tight elections and that is what we are expecting. If you are expecting

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us to say, they have passed and we have to hold them accountable, then

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I am sorry but we have a campaign that holds the Government and the

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Conservatives to account for what I think is a very hopeless record in

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government. Thank you. He leads a party with zero MPs but

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his media presence is huge. He's had an expenses scandal, but the public

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didn't seem to mind. He's got a privileged background but he's seen

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as an anti-establishment champion. Nothing seems to stick to him, not

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even eggs. I speak of course of Nigel Farage. We'll talk to him in a

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moment, but first Giles has been out on the campaign trail ahead of

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elections that could make or break the UKIP leader.

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Nigel Farage likes a stage, and at this stage of the Euro and local

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election campaign he is, like his party, in buoyant mood. They feel

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they are on the verge of what they see as causing an earthquake in

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British politics. Today Nigel is filling thousands seat venues and

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bigger. Not that there's much sign of that at this press launch. But

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it's a threat with serious money behind it, that they believe the

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media and the political elite just haven't realised yet, much less

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learned how to counter it. Not that it's all been plain sailing.

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Offensive comments from some candidates has not only seen UKIP

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labelled as racist, but necessitated a rally by the party to visibly and

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verbally challenge that. The offensive idiotic statements made by

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this handful of people have been lifted up and presented to the great

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British public as if they represent the view of this party, which they

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do not. They never have and they never will. APPLAUSE

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I don't care what you call us, but from this moment on, please do not

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call must trust a racist party. We are not a racist party.

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The need to say that is not just about the European and local

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elections even at that campaign launch it's clear UKIP's leader has

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set his sights firmly on the ultimate prize. I come from the

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south of England and I would not want to be seen as an opportunist

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heading to the north, north Norfolk or whatever it will be. I will make

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my mind up and stand in the general election for somewhere in Kent, East

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Sussex, Hampshire, somewhere in my home patch. Back at UKIP HQ they are

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still drilling down how the last fortnight of campaigning should go.

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They aren't taking any chances, and one imagines having offices above

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those of Max Clifford is a reminder how fragile built reputations can be

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of the bubble bursting. They want their reputation to be built on

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votes and they know anything but significant success on May 22nd and

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some seats in Westminster in 2015 isn't going to be good enough. And

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after that, having sold yourselves as the honest outsiders, that stance

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is harder to maintain once your people are on the inside. And subtle

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changes from the past are already noticeable. The ordinary man of the

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people stance is still working. Characteristically outside a pub,

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Nigel Farage is glad handed by a customer. Two weeks to go, let's

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cause an upset. Wouldn't that be great? The only sign that such an

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interaction is different now is the ever presence of bodyguards who

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shadow his every move. Over lunch ahead of Question Time, a radio

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appearance, and then off to Scotland, I ask him if some of those

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minded to vote UKIP who see him as a man they'd be comfortable having a

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drink with are the sort of people he'd be entirely comfortable sitting

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down with. Every political party attracts support from across the

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spectrum and there will be some magnificent people who vote for us

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and some ne'er-do-wells. The one common thing about UKIP voters is

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that they are often not very political. And it's that people's

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army that if UKIP can get to a polling booth might just create that

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earthquake they want. Nigel Farage joins me now. When you

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decided not to stand at the new work by election coming said if you lost

:22:20.:22:22.

it that the bubble would have burst. What did you mean by that? I

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was asked at seven 20p -- at 7:21pm if I would stand, I have decided by

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the next morning that I would not. I didn't know he was going to resign.

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You claim only a handful of UKIP candidates have ever said things

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that are either stupid or offensive, I'm right on that, yes? 0.1%, I'd

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rather it was non-. But why have you chosen a candidate to fight this

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by-election that has said many things most people would regard as

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stupid or offensive? Roger is fighting this for us, someone of 70

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years of age who grew up with a strong Christian Bible background,

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in an age when homosexuality was imprisonable. He had a certain set

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of views which he maintained for many years which he now says he

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accepts the world has moved on and he is relaxed about it. The comments

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about homosexuality are not from the dark ages, they are from two or

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three years ago. From when he was a Conservative, yes, so will you be

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asking David Cameron that question? I have never seen a single comment

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from Roger that would be deemed to be offensive. Do you regard his

:23:59.:24:04.

comments on homosexuality as offensive? When he grew up,

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homosexuality was illegal in this country. But this was in 2012 but he

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said that. Most people have his age still feel uncomfortable about it --

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of his age. In 2012 he said, if two men can be married, why not three,

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why not a commune. Many people in this country are disconcerted by the

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change in the meaning of marriage and in a tolerant society we

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understand that some people have different views. But he has changed

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his views now in only two years? He says he is more relaxed about it.

:24:51.:25:00.

Was he your candidate? He is a first-class campaigner who has had

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30 years in industry, he served in the European Parliament, he is a

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good candidate. This morning's papers suggest you are about to

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select Victoria Ayling for Grimsby, but she is on camera saying that, of

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immigrants, I just want to send a lot back. This is all very

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interesting, and we can talk about it, all we could talk about the fact

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that in 12 days we have a European election and every voter across the

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UK can vote on it and it is really interesting. Are you happy to pick a

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candidate that says of immigrants, I just want to send a lot back? I have

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seen the tape, it is a complete misquote and she says it in the

:25:48.:25:53.

context of illegal immigrants. I have seen the full quote and in the

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context it is not about illegal immigrants. Let's come onto the

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European campaign, you have used a company that employs Eastern

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European is to deliver leaflets in London and the Home Counties. Have

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we? I'm told that in Croydon one branch might have done that. Have

:26:14.:26:19.

you found some indigenous Brits to deliver leaflets in Europe? We have

:26:20.:26:24.

thousands joining the party every month and they are not all

:26:25.:26:28.

indigenous because what is interesting is that in today's

:26:29.:26:34.

opinion polls, UKIP is above the Lib Dems and the Conservatives amongst

:26:35.:26:45.

the indigenous voting. We have not agreed a manifesto for

:26:46.:27:00.

the general election, we will do over the course of the summer. This

:27:01.:27:08.

is in your local election. We are having local elections in some part

:27:09.:27:11.

of the country but we are fighting a European election. It is impossible

:27:12.:27:15.

with the British media to have an intelligent debate on the European

:27:16.:27:22.

question. But as I say, we are also fighting the local elections too.

:27:23.:27:26.

You have promised these tax cuts, how much will they cost? I have met

:27:27.:27:32.

-- read the local election manifesto and it doesn't make those promises.

:27:33.:27:37.

We do talk about local services, we do talk about the need to keep

:27:38.:27:42.

council tax down but we don't talk about income tax. Absolutely not. In

:27:43.:27:49.

local election campaigning you say you would restore cuts to policing,

:27:50.:27:56.

double prison places, restore cuts to front line NHS, spend more on

:27:57.:28:03.

roads, how much would that cost? You are obviously reading different

:28:04.:28:07.

documents to me. We are voting for local councillors in district

:28:08.:28:11.

councils who have got little local budgets. Every party in a manifesto

:28:12.:28:18.

puts his aspirations in it. Have you read it? Of course I have, cover to

:28:19.:28:24.

cover, which is why I'm saying you are misquoting it. By the way, on

:28:25.:28:31.

the bubble bursting, you told that to Norman Smith of the BBC. 75% of

:28:32.:28:38.

British laws are now made in the European Union. Now AstraZeneca is

:28:39.:28:43.

potentially going to be taken over by Pfizer. The BBC is refusing to

:28:44.:28:48.

show the public that that decision cannot be taken here but by an

:28:49.:28:52.

elected European commissioner, and we sit and argue about what is in or

:28:53.:29:00.

not in the local election manifesto. It is my job, but let me come on to

:29:01.:29:10.

AstraZeneca. Is it your view that a British government should stop the

:29:11.:29:17.

takeover of AstraZeneca? It cannot. Can we please get this clear. I sat

:29:18.:29:26.

next to Chuka Umunna the other day at question time and he said what

:29:27.:29:32.

could and couldn't be done. He said I am being studiously neutral, and

:29:33.:29:36.

the reason is we don't have this power. That is what the European

:29:37.:29:43.

elections is about. Should France have the takeover of the food

:29:44.:29:55.

company Danan? We seem to do things to the Nth degree and nobody else

:29:56.:30:03.

does, perhaps because we have this culture and we obey it. In your

:30:04.:30:08.

view, you don't think Pfizer should be able to take over AstraZeneca?

:30:09.:30:16.

There is some good science within AstraZeneca which is in danger of

:30:17.:30:21.

being asset stripped and lost. Because it is run by a Swede and a

:30:22.:30:27.

Frenchman and most of its employees are overseas. I understand that but

:30:28.:30:33.

there are still some good science being produced here. What did you

:30:34.:30:36.

think of the Prime Minister saying he would not form a government after

:30:37.:30:42.

the election unless he was able to have a referendum in 2017? I sat

:30:43.:30:50.

here talking to you and you said to me that David Cameron had given a

:30:51.:30:55.

cast-iron guarantee that if David Cameron becomes Prime Minister he

:30:56.:30:57.

will have a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty, but he didn't deliver on

:30:58.:31:03.

that. He knows that people struggle to believe the renegotiation is

:31:04.:31:08.

worth a row of beans. He is saying he will not form a government unless

:31:09.:31:12.

he can go forward with the referendum. I know he is desperately

:31:13.:31:16.

trying to pretend to be Eurosceptic whilst at the same time saying he

:31:17.:31:20.

will campaign for Britain to remain in. In a sense, that is what this

:31:21.:31:25.

election is about. We have three traditional parties, all of whom

:31:26.:31:28.

passionately believe in the continued membership of the European

:31:29.:31:32.

Union and we have UKIP saying we want trade and cooperation but there

:31:33.:31:36.

is a bigger and better world out there. You are now travelling with I

:31:37.:31:44.

think four bodyguards, has this affected you and your family life? I

:31:45.:31:52.

can't stand it. I've always wondered about the place and on my own thing.

:31:53.:31:56.

Sadly we have a couple of organisations out there headed up by

:31:57.:32:00.

senior Labour Party figures who purport to be against fascism and

:32:01.:32:03.

extremism, who received funding from the Department of communities, from

:32:04.:32:08.

the trade unions, who have acted in a violent wait more than once. You

:32:09.:32:12.

are saying the Labour Party is behind the threats? No, I said a

:32:13.:32:18.

taxpayer funded, trade union funded and headed by senior Labour Party

:32:19.:32:21.

figures, and I'm happy for them to come to my meetings and have an

:32:22.:32:25.

itinerant with me, but it's not so much fun when there are banging you

:32:26.:32:29.

over the head. I is still keen to be an MP? Yes, what UKIP will then do

:32:30.:32:34.

is target before the general election next year for the one life

:32:35.:32:39.

be easier if you just went to the Lords? That's the last thing I want

:32:40.:32:45.

to do. There's an awful lot to do. Most of all, I will not rest until

:32:46.:32:50.

we are free from political union and government from Brussels. Nigel

:32:51.:32:52.

Farage, thank you for being with us. It's just gone 11.30am. You're

:32:53.:32:55.

watching the Sunday Politics. We say goodbye to viewers in Scotland, who

:32:56.:32:58.

leave us now for Sunday Politics Scotland. Coming up here in 20

:32:59.:33:01.

minutes, our panel talks about the big stories of the week. First

:33:02.:33:02.

though, the I'm Arif Ansari. Coming up in the

:33:03.:33:13.

North West. How hungry are you for the European

:33:14.:33:17.

elections? We sample the appetite in this region.

:33:18.:33:21.

Nobody in our house is voting. Not me, not my wife, not my children,

:33:22.:33:24.

nobody. A complete and utter waste of time and energy.

:33:25.:33:30.

I'm joined by three candidates who are a bit more excited. Last week we

:33:31.:33:33.

had Labour, the Conservatives and the Greens, this week Louise Bours

:33:34.:33:37.

for the UK Independence Party and two sitting MEPs ` Nick Griffin of

:33:38.:33:40.

the BNP and the Liberal Democrat Chris Davies. Welcome to you all.

:33:41.:33:48.

And we start with U.S. Drug giant Pfizer's possible hostile takeover

:33:49.:33:50.

of AstraZeneca, which employs around 2,000 people in Cheshire. The

:33:51.:33:55.

American company says all options are open after its ?63 billion bid

:33:56.:34:06.

was rejected. Mr Griffin, what would you do? There has almost been a

:34:07.:34:14.

takeover of a British company and there has been promises made. They

:34:15.:34:18.

are usually broken and it is bad news for Britain. It should be kept

:34:19.:34:22.

within British ownership and I think attention should focus on the real

:34:23.:34:26.

scandal, that when you have the takeover bids, who is a PR man, a

:34:27.:34:34.

personal friend of the Prime Minister, you see these connections

:34:35.:34:40.

between the people ripping off Britain and the corrupt elite.

:34:41.:34:51.

Louise. It is the government's job to protect the British people and

:34:52.:34:54.

they need to protect their jobs. They have a duty to protect their

:34:55.:35:00.

jobs. I think they have to look at that first. That has to be paramount

:35:01.:35:09.

in their mind. Chris Davies? AstraZeneca is losing 2500 jobs in

:35:10.:35:14.

the North West of England. It is a Swedish company. 90% of its 50,000

:35:15.:35:19.

employees don't work in Britain. This is part of the global system

:35:20.:35:26.

and what is made of stronger is inviting foreign

:35:27.:35:34.

done well out of it. Vince Cable has a difficult decision to make

:35:35.:37:14.

are written on. Are they? The company exports 2% of all UK goods,

:37:15.:37:16.

and if this takeover does happen it will be the largest acquisition of a

:37:17.:37:19.

British company by a foreign business. Pfizer has already run

:37:20.:37:24.

down three of the companies it has bought. Pfizer had been acting in my

:37:25.:37:31.

language like a praying mantis. They have been sucking the lifeblood out

:37:32.:37:34.

of those three units in order to sustain themselves. The Business

:37:35.:37:38.

Secretary is keeping a careful watch on events. In conclusion, I say I

:37:39.:37:47.

want to assure the house we are alive to the national interest

:37:48.:37:50.

considerations here. We see the future of the UK as a knowledge

:37:51.:37:54.

economy, not a tax haven. The bosses of both firms are to be questioned

:37:55.:37:57.

by the Business Select Committee. A get`together which will be carefully

:37:58.:38:04.

watched by MPs from all parties. So Chris Davies, you've talked about

:38:05.:38:11.

the free market, but you also said Vince Cable has a difficult decision

:38:12.:38:17.

to make. He has to weigh up whether this is in the British interest and

:38:18.:38:23.

we don't know. There are American state governors where Pfizer is

:38:24.:38:29.

situated at the moment. They think they will lose jobs in America to

:38:30.:38:33.

Britain and of course at their headquarters is moved here the tax

:38:34.:38:37.

reasons, that does change the orientation. It may not all be bad.

:38:38.:38:46.

Vince Cable talked about serious EU legal constraints. What did he mean

:38:47.:38:51.

by that? The constraints are the ones we have encouraged the EU to

:38:52.:38:56.

adopt, which is to try to break down the barriers to take overs in order

:38:57.:39:02.

to encourage free flow in investment. You are not so keen on

:39:03.:39:08.

the free market? It has been a disaster for British workers. I was

:39:09.:39:14.

in St Helens yesterday and accompany you soon employ 20,000 people, and

:39:15.:39:20.

now it has reduced. To have closed down and the other is going. It is a

:39:21.:39:25.

disaster for British workers. We need a government which invests in

:39:26.:39:33.

companies. The tragedy is that it is no longer in British ownership. It

:39:34.:39:37.

was badly managed under British management because the same

:39:38.:39:43.

workers... Now it is under foreign management? That is a great shame.

:39:44.:39:51.

It is not a great shame in the company is still going. It is better

:39:52.:39:56.

that it is going than closing down. Instead of throwing billions of

:39:57.:39:59.

pounds to corrupt banks the British government should have invested that

:40:00.:40:03.

money in British industry and British workers, so we had those for

:40:04.:40:09.

those workers under our control. You said it was all about protecting

:40:10.:40:16.

British jobs. How will they do it? We have been here before. We've had

:40:17.:40:20.

promises from companies that they will protect jobs. That didn't

:40:21.:40:26.

happen. I live in Cheshire. I know how worried and concerned people

:40:27.:40:29.

were when AstraZeneca move to Cambridgeshire. I've seen what

:40:30.:40:35.

effect that has had on local businesses. The government should

:40:36.:40:38.

look at theirs. They should seek assurances. If this goes ahead,

:40:39.:40:44.

assurances must be given that binding that British workers would

:40:45.:40:49.

lose their jobs. I do not trust Pfizer. I think it is obvious they

:40:50.:40:54.

are a takeover giant and it has to be paramount. British workers.

:40:55.:41:08.

British jobs for British workers. I didn't say that. At the end of the

:41:09.:41:12.

day it affect the local economy. It is not just about the company, it is

:41:13.:41:19.

about everything which surrounds it. Let's move on. Well, the main

:41:20.:41:26.

business for my guests this month is persuading us that we should send

:41:27.:41:30.

them to Brussels. A quick reminder that in North West England we'll be

:41:31.:41:34.

electing eight of the UK's 73 MEPs on May 22nd. We currently have three

:41:35.:41:37.

Conservatives, two from Labour, Chris Davies and Nick Griffin here

:41:38.:41:40.

for the Lib dems and the British National Party, and one for UKIP.

:41:41.:41:44.

But are any of them whetting the appetite of the voters? Elaine

:41:45.:41:50.

Dunkley's been to find out. Here at Bury Market there is plenty

:41:51.:41:54.

of European flavour but is there an appetite for the European politics?

:41:55.:41:59.

Nobody in our house is voting. Not me, not my wife, not my children,

:42:00.:42:03.

nobody. A complete and utter waste of time and energy. Talk of Brussels

:42:04.:42:07.

isn't high on the list but border control and British jobs are. In

:42:08.:42:13.

Britain at this particular time we're not looking after ourselves.

:42:14.:42:22.

It's quite ludicrous in my opinion, the way numbers are flowing in. It's

:42:23.:42:30.

crazy. All people are the same. It doesn't matter where they come from.

:42:31.:42:34.

As long as they can speak English it doesn't really matter. Yannis came

:42:35.:42:37.

to Bury to start a new life after the economic collapse in Greece. He

:42:38.:42:40.

believes the issue of immigration has been high jacked for political

:42:41.:42:44.

gain. I think it's right you can go from one country to the another to

:42:45.:42:48.

start a new life, to learn new things. That's why I cam here. Most

:42:49.:42:52.

of the people that come from other countries are working really hard.

:42:53.:42:55.

We have people here from Poland, Greece and Cyprus and they are very

:42:56.:43:01.

good workers. Over in Burnley, it's Guttentag to good times. Veka, a

:43:02.:43:05.

German company, employs 340 people making PVC frames. Business is

:43:06.:43:12.

booming, links with Europe have created a window of opportunity.

:43:13.:43:17.

Without the backing of our German mother company and the German banks

:43:18.:43:21.

to help us with our finances, we probably wouldn't be here today with

:43:22.:43:24.

what we've got, in terms of a facility which has gone from ?24

:43:25.:43:28.

million to near a ?68 million turnover. But not everyone agrees

:43:29.:43:32.

that Europe is working in the interest of British business. In

:43:33.:43:36.

Accrington the Cardboard Box company provides packaging for leading UK

:43:37.:43:42.

brands. Owner Peter Street is a member of UKIP. He feels boxed`in by

:43:43.:43:47.

European Policy and wants out. Rules, regulations. The fishing

:43:48.:43:51.

industry has been devastated. Most industries have been hurt by it.

:43:52.:43:56.

Fortunately this one isn't. I had a chemical industry back in the 1980s.

:43:57.:44:00.

I couldn't start that company now with all the rules and regulations.

:44:01.:44:04.

I wouldn't be allowed to. This is a new national centre for Graphene in

:44:05.:44:07.

Manchester, built with ?23 million of European funding, but are we

:44:08.:44:10.

getting out of Europe what were putting in? Of course Manchester

:44:11.:44:16.

will be definitely the centre of this innovative material. It is

:44:17.:44:23.

something which will influence the industry all around Europe and

:44:24.:44:26.

therefore we have to calculate in terms of business opportunities. The

:44:27.:44:30.

European election is one of the largest democratic events in the

:44:31.:44:37.

world. We don't believe in a country called Europe and we won't be part

:44:38.:44:41.

of it. How much we invest in Europe and how much Europe invests in the

:44:42.:44:45.

North West is a key issue. Our membership of the EU gives Britain

:44:46.:44:49.

access to market with 21 million companies. Who are you? We can't

:44:50.:44:53.

have an immigration policy as a member of the European Union because

:44:54.:44:56.

we have an open door to 485 million people. Is it going to get personal?

:44:57.:45:00.

In an uncertain world it is strength in numbers. Now it's the voters who

:45:01.:45:10.

will get their say. Louise Bours, can I get this right?

:45:11.:45:15.

You hate the European Union so much you're desperate to become a

:45:16.:45:22.

European MP. If we didn't have UKIP MPs, a lot of the auger questions

:45:23.:45:25.

and the things at the centre of political debate would not be

:45:26.:45:30.

there. We have made you didn't issue a central issue and if our UKIP MPs

:45:31.:45:37.

went there, that wouldn't have been brought to the British public's

:45:38.:45:43.

attention. I can't think of time it hasn't been to their attention. When

:45:44.:45:54.

you asked people about Europe people don't have a interest in the

:45:55.:46:01.

elections. I think we have inflamed that. Why do you want to be a

:46:02.:46:07.

European MP? We want to get out and the way to get out is to put our

:46:08.:46:11.

message out in the north`west, so people can see what kind of

:46:12.:46:15.

organisation nurses. They can work here in the North West, break the

:46:16.:46:21.

stories and issues that have been shown to be ludicrous and damaging.

:46:22.:46:28.

Nick Griffin, why vote BNP when you can vote UKIP? People are voting

:46:29.:46:37.

overwhelmingly on the image of `` issue of immigration. When 300,000

:46:38.:46:49.

British people emigrate each year, they would replace them with

:46:50.:46:56.

Africans. If you want 50,000 Asians come in, both Nigel Farage. If you

:46:57.:47:05.

want to shut the door, vote us. What utter nonsense. Our policies are

:47:06.:47:09.

moderate. It is a policy of common sense. You want to pull the

:47:10.:47:14.

drawbridge. We don't. We say if you have the skills, you are welcome.

:47:15.:47:21.

The whole thing is just basically referring the debate on

:47:22.:47:24.

immigration. We want people to come if they can contribute to this

:47:25.:47:32.

economy. What we don't want is uncontrolled mass immigration. The

:47:33.:47:37.

borders need to be controlled. Chris Davies, you describe yourself as the

:47:38.:47:45.

party of in, in what? Ensuring Britain is a key part of the EU.

:47:46.:47:49.

That is for the sake of our jobs and the union. For the promotion of

:47:50.:47:54.

values, like liberty and equality which lie in the heart of the

:47:55.:47:58.

European Union. 28 countries working together in peace, promoting a

:47:59.:48:03.

British agenda. You do accept you on the wrong side of public opinion? I

:48:04.:48:12.

don't agree with that. These two parties are competing for the

:48:13.:48:14.

anti`immigration vote. They are welcome to it. I've heard that man

:48:15.:48:24.

from Greece. I welcome... I welcome, not only my party is

:48:25.:48:28.

standing up for the pro`Europeans but also the pad so many young

:48:29.:48:33.

people from across Europe come to this country. These are part of our

:48:34.:48:39.

future. They're one of the reasons this country... Why aren't you

:48:40.:48:45.

winning the argument? You tell me how many local newspapers have

:48:46.:48:49.

covered this issue other than perhaps scandals about UKIP. Five

:48:50.:48:56.

years ago... That is nothing to do with it. I am looking forward to

:48:57.:49:03.

have an in`out referendum but one of the strongest argument I hear is,

:49:04.:49:10.

how can we have a referendum when all the newspapers are stacked on

:49:11.:49:14.

one side. They're putting oddments over which undermined the

:49:15.:49:17.

credibility of the EU and don't tell the truth. Mr Griffin, have you

:49:18.:49:24.

achieved anything as a European MP? I stop this country Dragon this war

:49:25.:49:29.

in Syria which had nothing to do with us. I was able to go to

:49:30.:49:38.

Damascus. It swayed the boat of another Tory MPs against war to keep

:49:39.:49:42.

us out of that monstrous war. I think that is an achievement. Are

:49:43.:49:49.

you being serious? I yam. People can go on a website and see that. You

:49:50.:49:55.

think they were swayed on the issue of Syria because of you? According

:49:56.:50:00.

to the BBC, they are talked to a number of people, and that the

:50:01.:50:05.

people who were thinking of voting did so in the end because they had a

:50:06.:50:11.

letter from the Syrian parliament expressing their position in terms,

:50:12.:50:18.

which English politicians could understand. Again, utter nonsense.

:50:19.:50:29.

Of course we have policies. They are highlighted in the manifesto. When

:50:30.:50:32.

it comes out of the 20 15th, you will see. Nigel Farage has rubbished

:50:33.:50:46.

your manifesto. That was in 2010. The one the 12015 is in development.

:50:47.:50:51.

We are on the side of public opinion. `` though one for 2015.

:50:52.:51:09.

Time for the rest of the week's news now. Here's Ian Haslam with 60

:51:10.:51:14.

Seconds. An investigation by BBC North West

:51:15.:51:17.

Tonight found that some people with serious health conditions are

:51:18.:51:20.

waiting up to seven months for their new disability benefits. The cancer

:51:21.:51:23.

charity MacMillan is helping the government reduce delays.

:51:24.:51:26.

A House of Lords report called on the government to speed up

:51:27.:51:28.

production of shale gas. Meanwhile, American scientists found a rise in

:51:29.:51:31.

the number of earthquakes in Oklahoma after fracking began.

:51:32.:51:36.

It was another difficult week for the Co`Op. The former City Minister

:51:37.:51:39.

Lord Myners warned the 160`year`old organisation founded in Rochdale

:51:40.:51:41.

won't survive unless it focuses more on profit.

:51:42.:51:46.

The new Anglican Bishop of Liverpool says he won't shy away from

:51:47.:51:49.

challenging politicians over the impact their policies have on

:51:50.:51:58.

ordinary people. I won't run away from that. I will tell people, have

:51:59.:52:04.

you noticed what is happening on the ground.

:52:05.:52:07.

And work's begun on access roads for the new Runcorn Bridge. The

:52:08.:52:10.

government says the toll crossing will boost the local economy by ?61

:52:11.:52:16.

million a year. That's almost it from us. Before we

:52:17.:52:20.

go, a reminder that there are a total of 11 parties fielding

:52:21.:52:23.

candidates in the North West. Also fielding a full list of candidates

:52:24.:52:26.

are: An Independence from Europe, the English Democrats, No2EU and the

:52:27.:52:33.

Socialist Equality Party. And for more information on the parties and

:52:34.:52:36.

who's standing for them, you can go to the BBC Website. That's at

:52:37.:52:44.

bbc.co.uk/news/events/vote2014. Next week we'll be focusing on the

:52:45.:52:48.

local elections, which also take place on May 22nd. Just time to

:52:49.:52:53.

thank my guests ` Louise Bours, Nick Griffin and Chris Davies. Now, I'll

:52:54.:52:59.

hand you back to Andrew Neil in London.

:53:00.:53:05.

the website now. Now it is back to you, Andrew.

:53:06.:53:17.

Welcome back, let's go straight to our panel. What did you make of Mr

:53:18.:53:25.

Alexander's defence of the Labour party election broadcast? It is

:53:26.:53:28.

difficult for them because they started by saying they were not

:53:29.:53:32.

going to do negative campaigning and they have thrown that away for an

:53:33.:53:38.

advert which is funny but crude in the class war sense. He didn't look

:53:39.:53:45.

thrilled to be defending it. There is a page in Tony Blair's memoirs

:53:46.:53:51.

talking about negative campaigning, and he says that anything too

:53:52.:53:54.

extreme turns off the average voter so his line of attack on Hague was

:53:55.:54:06.

funny jokes but... I think this failed the Blair test, it was too

:54:07.:54:11.

vicious. If your strategy is to shore up your car vote, that advert

:54:12.:54:18.

was genius. If your strategy is to reach out to a broader number of

:54:19.:54:25.

voters, Middle Britain, then that advert was a complete disaster. It

:54:26.:54:28.

looks like there is a lot of negativity and smears all round in

:54:29.:54:33.

the next year. That definitely looks the way we are going. They will be

:54:34.:54:51.

essentially trying to re-run by -- the American election. I am slightly

:54:52.:55:03.

puzzled why we cannot have our own election gurus who live here and

:55:04.:55:08.

understand the country. I should point out that the ?450 extra VAT

:55:09.:55:15.

that was claimed in that Labour poster, both Ed Balls and the Labour

:55:16.:55:20.

Treasury team have said that is ?450 per year. Nonsense the VAT rise, one

:55:21.:55:27.

year. I should also point out that Nigel Farage said to Norman Smith,

:55:28.:55:31.

the BBC is always reliable Norman Smith that if you run in Newark and

:55:32.:55:38.

lost the bubble would burst. I should also point out that although

:55:39.:55:43.

a number of the tax rises I mentioned on council tax, minimum

:55:44.:55:47.

wage tax and some other things that UKIP wants to cuts, a couple of

:55:48.:55:53.

these are in the local manifesto but several are not. They are on the

:55:54.:55:56.

UKIP website, which is still several are not. They are on the

:55:57.:56:03.

and dated 2014. We like to make sure we are absolutely right. Let's talk

:56:04.:56:08.

about Nick Clegg and Michael Gove and the latest spat. Let me show you

:56:09.:56:13.

this headline in the Observer this morning. From both the Independent,

:56:14.:56:22.

he called him a zealot, lunatic is of -- another word. Do we take this

:56:23.:56:33.

seriously? It hinges on this question of what counts as an area

:56:34.:56:36.

of need in education. question of what counts as an area

:56:37.:56:41.

there are not enough school question of what counts as an area

:56:42.:58:20.

politics of the playground. I read in the Mail on Sunday this morning

:58:21.:58:31.

that some Tory insiders are accusing Lib Dems of spreading rumours about

:58:32.:58:35.

the camera in marriage. The rebuttals of education story is that

:58:36.:58:43.

the free school meals is sucking money away. I always thought they

:58:44.:58:52.

would work together without fuss and yet it has been more the source of

:58:53.:58:58.

disagreement then I would have expected a couple of years ago. Is

:58:59.:59:04.

it serious? It is serious obviously, using that language, but is it fatal

:59:05.:59:11.

for the Coalition? I think it is a road bump because I don't think

:59:12.:59:13.

anybody wants to dissolve the Coalition. It is a challenge for

:59:14.:59:18.

Labour because where do they stand on the free schools? They invented

:59:19.:59:22.

the Academy programme so it is difficult for them to take a

:59:23.:59:26.

hands-off approach at this stage. There was a danger for Michael Gove

:59:27.:59:30.

that he looks ideological but the danger for the Liberal Democrats is

:59:31.:59:33.

that they are breaking the rules for the Coalition they said that they

:59:34.:59:37.

wouldn't break which is that they looked like opposition in

:59:38.:59:43.

government. Is Michael Gove's position safe? Very safe. If he

:59:44.:59:50.

moves in a reshuffle that will be to a a job. That's all for today. The

:59:51.:59:56.

Daily Politics will be back on BBC Two at lunchtime from Tuesday

:59:57.:59:59.

onwards. I'll be back here on BBC One at 11am next week. Remember if

:00:00.:00:02.

it's Sunday, it's the Sunday Politics.

:00:03.:00:50.

What if the person that killed her...

:00:51.:00:52.

I found out she'd been taking drugs. Just let me explain.

:00:53.:00:55.

You wasn't at that party all night. Yeah, I was.

:00:56.:00:59.

What was she even doing there? Oi, you keep your mouth shut.

:01:00.:01:01.

She was exchanging a significant number of texts and calls

:01:02.:01:04.

with someone in the weeks leading up to her death.

:01:05.:01:07.

It's like we didn't really know her at all.

:01:08.:01:10.

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