30/04/2017 Sunday Politics North West

It's Sunday Morning, and this is the Sunday Politics.

Theresa May says she has no plans to increase tax levels,

but refuses to repeat David Cameron's 2015 manifesto

promise ruling out hikes in VAT, national insurance and income tax.

The leaders of the EU's 27 member states unanimously

agree their negotiating strategy for the upcoming Brexit talks, but

And in the last of our series of interviews ahead of Thursday's

local elections, I'll be talking to the leader of Plaid Cymru Leanne

No, it's not musical chairs in the North West - we'll

have the candidates for mayor of Liverpool City region

on why they'll be sitting pretty after Thursday.

They hit an all-time low after coalition government,

but are the Lib Dems poised to bounce back,

And with me to analyse the week's politics,

Isabel Oakeshott, Steve Richards, Tom Newton-Dunn.

They'll be tweeting using the hashtag #bbcsp.

So when Theresa May was interviewed just over an hour ago

on The Andrew Marr Show, the Prime Minister was asked

to confirm that she would repeat David Cameron's 2015 election

promise not to raise VAT, national insurance and income tax

We have absolutely no plans to increase the level of tax,

but I'm also very clear that I don't want to make specific proposals

on taxes unless I'm absolutely sure that I can deliver on those.

But it is, would be my intention as a Conservative Government

and a Conservative Prime Minister, to reduce the taxes

The Tories like to have a clear tax message in elections, are they

getting into a bit of a mess? That method wasn't clear, but does it

mean, saying they have no plans to increase the level of tax? We are

clear there will not be a rise in VAT, a lot of commentators will get

overexcited about that, but there was no great expectations there

would be a rise in VAT. Tempting as it is, because even one percentage

point on VAT rate is 4.5 billion for the exchequer so it is tempting but

there has been no speculation that would happen. We can see that she

clearly wants to reiterate the language about hard-working families

but I don't think we are that much the wiser. Even if she does not put

up rates, according to projections the overall tax burden, as a

percentage of GDP, is rising, will rise in the years ahead. That is why

it was an odd phrase, I know she is doing it to be evasive but to say

they have no plans to raise the general level of taxation, they do

have. We also know they have specific plans because it was in the

last budget, they had a tax rise which they had to revise, National

Insurance rises, so very wisely in my view they are keeping options

open, the 2015 tax-and-spend debate was a fantasy world, totally

unrelated to the demands that would follow. They now have the

flexibility, one of the arguments you had heard last time was Philip

Hammond saying to her, we have to break away from the 2015 manifesto

commitment and we can only do it this way, that is one of the better

arguments. The Tories like to talk about tax cuts in elections, whether

they do it is another matter, but they are not being allowed to talk

about tax cuts, they are now on the defensive over whether they will

raise taxes. That is not a healthy position for the campaign to be in.

If you look at the numbers, quite frankly, if you will not do this at

this election with eight 20 point lead over Labour, then when will you

take these tough decisions? Reading between the lines of what Theresa

May has said all over different broadcasters this morning, income

tax will go down for low-income families, such as the threshold rise

that microbes that was already factored in. She has had to commit

to it again. VAT will be fat, national insurance contributions

will go up. Do you think they will go up? I think so, she had plenty of

opportunity to rule it out and she didn't. There was a terrible mess

with the budget, it is a good tax argument but not a good electoral

argument that you are eroding the base so heavily with people moving

into self-employment that as you raise national insurance

contributions for everybody but the self-employed, it is something the

Treasury will have to look at. The other triple lock on pensions, we

don't know if they will keep to that either? If they are sensible they

will find a form of words to give them flexibility in that area as

well. I would say there is no question over that, that has gone.

As Mrs May would say, you will have to wait for the manifesto. That is

what all the party leaders tell me! Labour have spent the weekend

pushing their messages Speaking at a camapign rally

in London yesterday, Jeremy Corbyn promised a Labour

government would fix what he called People are fed up, fed up with not

being able to get somewhere to live, fed up waiting for hospital

appointments, fed up with 0-hours contracts, fed up with low pay, fed

up with debt, fed up with not being able to get on in their lives

because we have a system that is rigged against so many.

I've been joined from Newcastle by Labour's elections

and campaigns co-ordinator, Ian Lavery.

Good morning. To deal with this rigged economy, as Mr Corbyn calls

it, the Shadow Chancellor John McDonnell has a 20 point plan for

workers out today. When you add up everything he plans to do to help

workers, how much will it cost? The full costings, one thing I need to

say at the very beginning, the costings of any policy which we have

already ruled out and any policy we will be ruling out in the next few

days and weeks will be fully costed in the manifesto and in addition to

the fact that it will be fully costed, we will see it in the

manifesto how indeed it has been funded, so we are very clear,

anything we have seen already, and there are some exciting policy

releases and there will be more in the future, anything we are going to

do will be fully costed and in the manifesto. You announced a 20 point

plan but cannot tell me what the costs will be this morning so at the

moment it is a menu without prices? It is not a menu without prices, it

is a fantastic opportunity. This 20 point plan is something which will

transform the lives of millions of millions of people in the

workplace... But what is the cost? It will be welcomed by many people

across the UK. The fact the costings have not been released, you will

have to be patient, it will be released very clearly, it will

identify that in the manifesto. Let me come down to one of the points,

the end of the public sector pay freeze. Can you give us any idea how

much that will cost? The end of the public sector pay freeze, so

important to the future of the Labour Party, it is an massive

policy decision. Let me say at this stage, Theresa May, the Prime

Minister, this morning, on The Andrew Marr Show, did not have the

common decency, courtesy all respect to condone the fact that nurses, the

heroes of the NHS, have had a reduction of nearly 14% in their

wages since 2010 and are using food banks to feed themselves! Does that

not say everything that is wrong with today's society? So can you

tell me what it will cost, which is what my question was? What I will

say is everything the Labour Party pledges, everything that we come out

with, what we will roll out between now and the 8th of June, will be

fully costed, people will be very much aware of how much the costings

will be, where the funding will come from, when the manifesto is

published. What about doubling paternity leave, nu minimum wage,

four new bank holidays, any idea what it will

cost? These are exciting new proposals and of course today cost

money but we are the sixth richest economy in the world. It is about

redistribution of the wealth we create. We are seeing growth in the

economy, it is how we utilise the finances in the best way we possibly

can for a fairer society for the many and not the few. You just can't

tell me how much it will cost? That is why I will repeat again that you

need to be very patient. Do you know the cost yourself? You are the head

of the campaign, do you know the cost of these things yourself? I am

very much aware of how much the costings are likely to be, they have

been identified, they will be published in the manifesto. You

really do understand I would not be releasing today, live on your show,

any costings or predictions with regards the manifesto. Why not? You

have released the policy, why not the cost? Because there is a fine

detail and we will identify it to the general public in the manifesto.

We not only explain how much it will cost but we will explain where the

funding comes from. Be patient. Will some of the costs be met by

increasing taxes? I would think at this point in time there is not any

indication to increase basic taxes and again the taxes and spending of

the Labour Government with the proposals of the 20 point plan, the

issues we have got, housing, the NHS, crime, education will all be

identified with the costings in the publication. Can you tell us this

morning, we'll tax for most people rise or not to finance this? We in

the Labour Party are looking to a fair tax system which will be

clearly identified in the manifesto. Mr McDonnell also wants to ban all

0-hours contracts. Would that include those who actually like

those contracts? There are nearly 1 million, depending on which figured

you'd use, there are nearly 1 million people on zero-hours

contract and the vast proportion of those want to be able to live a

decent life, a secure life, they want to understand whether they will

be at work the next day, they're included hours... I understand a lot

of people don't like zero-hours contract and your proposal will

address that, but there are those, I saw one survey where 65% of people

on zero-hours contract like the flexibility it gives them. Will you

force them off zero-hours contract or if they like them will they

continue with them? We will discuss it with employee is to make sure

individuals in the workplace have the right to negotiate hours in that

workplace. Guaranteed hours is very, very important. Zero-hour contracts

are an instrument in which employers abuse and exploit mainly young

people, mainly female people in the workplace. We would be banning

zero-hour contract. But there are those, students for example, who

like them, would they be forced off zero-hour contracts in your

proposal? Our proposal would be banning zero-hour contract and

introducing contracts which have set hours in the workplace. You also say

no company will be able to bid for a public contract unless the boss

earns no more than 20 times the lowest paid, or the average wage,

I'm not quite sure which. What would happen if British Aerospace bids to

build more joint strike Fighters and the boss is paid more than 20 times?

I understand the point you raise but we have an obscene situation in this

country, Andrew, in which the bosses at the very top make an absolute

fortune... But what would happen then? Who would build joint strike

Fighters... The difference in wages between the top earners in the

country and the people in the factories, in the workshops,

producing the goods, is vast. I understand that is the reason you

want a ratio. What I am saying is, what happens if the ratio is

greater? Who gets the contract if not British Aerospace? Who else

builds the planes? We are going to introduce a wage rate CEO of one to

20. -- wage ratio. We want to close the gap between the people at the

very top and people who produce the goods. Let me try one more Time, who

would build the joint strike fighter? We would look at the issue

as it came along but the policy is clear... Can you name a single

defence contractor weather boss' salary is less than 20 times average

earnings? We are not reducing, we have rolled that out as part of this

fantastic plan to transform society to get rid of discrimination, to try

and bring together our communities. We will introduce a pay ratio of one

to 20. Fair enough, thank you very much.

It's a month after the triggering of Article 50, and EU leaders -

with the exception of Britain - met in Brussels this weekend

to agree their opening negotiating stance, to get the divorce

It is inside this psychedelic chamber where Britain's 'Grexit'

future will be decided over the next two years, but there is a vast gulf

in rhetoric coming from the UK and the EU. With parallel narratives

emerging for both sides. There is broad agreement that an orderly

withdrawal is in the interests of both sides. But Theresa May's

position is that the terms of our future trade deal should be

negotiated alongside the terms of our divorce. Meanwhile the EU says

the terms of the UK's exit must be decided before any discussion on a

future trade deal can begin. But don't forget that divorce

settlement. Don't remind me. In Brussels, many think written should

pay even more, while in the UK ministers said the divorce bill

should be capped at 3 billion. After you. Thank you.

For are you looking forward to it? Isn't that divorce bill a bit high?

Isn't this about punishing Britain? We are very united, you all seem so

surprised but it's a fact. How soon can we get a deal? We have to wait

for the elections. It was the decision of Mrs May. It took over an

hour for the leaders to make their entrances but once inside it's just

a few minutes to agree the negotiating guidelines. They set out

three main areas. The first phase of talks on the divorce settlement will

deal with the existing financial commitments to the EU, the Northern

Ireland border and the rights of EU citizens in the UK. They said a UK

trade agreement can be discussed when the first phase of talks

reaches significant progress. And that there must be unity in the

negotiations, that individual EU members won't negotiate separately

with the UK. They are quite good here at negotiating because they are

used to it. They set a maximum and then they have to recede a little

bit depending on what the other side is prepared to offer. I think there

is room for manoeuvre in some issues, but I don't think some of

the baseline things will change that much. For example I don't think the

European Union will concede on the rights of citizens who are already

in the UK. It will be very difficult for them to accept that they will

not be any exit bill, and the question of Northern Ireland is very

important as well, the hard order question. The baseline things are

not going to move that much, then you have room for manoeuvring

between. On security, defence and the fight against terrorism, the

guidelines said the EU stands ready to work together. And after lunch,

friendly signs from some EU leaders as they gave individual press

conferences. Paul and said the talks should open doors to new

opportunities and even German Chancellor Angela Merkel, who had

earlier said some in Britain were deluded about Brexit, softened her

tone saying there was no conspiracy against the UK. Unity was the

buzzword at this summit and for once everybody seemed to be sticking to

the script. That unity is not only amongst the 27 states, it's also

among the institutions so many of the divisions we have seen in the

past at European level do not exist. That is very important and it's not

be unity that is directed somehow against the UK because I think we

all want this to be an orderly process and part of that is that the

EU side is unified. So although there are no surprises here, what

took place in this room was a significant step towards the real

Brexit negotiations which will begin soon after the general election in

June, said to be the most complex the UK has faced in our lifetimes.

Isabel, Steve and Tom are still with me.

Isabel, doesn't the British media have to be a bit careful here? We

would never take at face value anything a British politician tells

us. We would question it, put it in context and wonder if they are

bluffing, but we seem to take at face value anything a European

politician says about these negotiations. You only have to look

at the front page of the Sunday Times today to see that. They quoted

at length Juncker, who didn't like the food at the reception and this

and that, and I think the mood is very optimistic. The key thing is

the EU trade Commissioner has said we will get a free trade deal and a

lot of people seem to be wilfully ignoring that incredibly big

concession. That is what will happen in their view. Everything that is

said at the moment needs a slight rerun over. They are all in

negotiating positions, plus we seem to be completely unaware that they

all have their own domestic constituencies as well. Angela

Merkel has an important election coming up in September,

Euroscepticism is quite different from Britain of course, but there's

a different kind of euro scepticism in Germany, she has got to deal with

that. Of course she has, which is why you are right, nothing should be

taken too seriously out of the mouths of British politicians or

European politicians until October this year. We have got to wait for

the French elections, then German elections, and if you look through

this you can see a way forward. There's no trade talks until pay up,

but what was actually written was no trade talks until we make

significant progress on the money. You can define significant progress

in a lot of ways but come December, fireworks over the summer, we all

get very excited about it, in these chairs I'm sure, come December

things will look a lot smoother. The German elections are at the end of

September but I've seen reports in German press, depending how it goes

it could take until Christmas before a new coalition government is put

together. The Brussels long-standing negotiating tactic of nothing is

agreed until everything is agreed, then I guess the British could say

we agree a certain sum of money if that's what it takes but that

depends on them, what good trade deal we get. If we don't get that,

the sum of money is off the table. In that sense, the two are going

parallel. However, I wouldn't entirely dismiss what people are

saying in their pre-election periods to their own electorates because

they have to some extent to deliver subsequently. Of course Angela

Merkel is campaigning and electioneering, who wouldn't, she

has a tough election to fight, but she is measured and thoughtful and

when she says things like some of the British are delusional, that is

unusually strong language for her. What was she referring to? I don't

know, it wasn't specific. Have the cake and eat it perhaps the

sequencing the British don't want. When they thought the British

government was going to effectively demand membership of the single

market, that's not going to happen now. Unless you sign up to the four

pillars, that's the cake and eat it proposition, which they are right in

saying Theresa May has made. But everybody has access, even with no

deal you have access. The other side of it is I think there will be a

united position from them. And so, as somebody pointed out in that

report, they are experienced, tough negotiators, so I don't think it

will be quite as easy as some think. I spoke to one of those who drew up

Article 50 and they said to me they deliberately put this two year

timetable in to make it impossible for anybody to think about leaving.

This is really tight, this negotiation. Easy, it isn't.

This coming Thursday, voters up and down the country

will be going to the polls in this year's local elections.

Over the past few weeks I've interviewed representatives

of the Conservative Party, Labour, the Liberal Democrats,

Today it's the turn of Plaid Cymru and the SNP.

A little earlier I spoke Alex Salmond, who until 2014

I started by asking him why Scots should vote SNP in local elections

when the Scottish Government had just cut central Government funding

It's actually a funding increase going into Scottish councils this

year, and if you look at the funding position for example between

Scottish councils and those in England, which are obviously

directly related through the Barnett formula, the funding in Scotland has

been incomparably better than that in England so there's a whole range

of the -- of reasons... What's happening south of the border

indicates the protection the Scottish Parliament has been able to

put in that helps vital services in Scotland. But there hasn't been a

funding increase, the block grant from Westminster to Edinburgh was

increased by 1.5% in real terms but the grant to councils was cut by

2.6%. It was going to be a cut of 330 million, the Greens got you to

reduce it to 170 million but it is still a cut of 2.6%. Your own

Aberdeenshire Council has had a cut to 391 million. You have cut the

money to councils. Yes, but councils have available to them more

resources this year, and as you say the budget increased that further

which is why we put forward an excellent local government budget in

Aberdeenshire and resisted a Tory attempts to knock ?3 million off...

You asked me about Aberdeenshire, and Aberdeenshire has put forward a

budget for investment expansion and resisted a Tory attempts to knock ?3

million off the education budget, and I'm very grateful you have given

me the opportunity to make that point. The Government in Edinburgh

has cut the money to Aberdeenshire by ?11 million. It is a cut. But

there is an investment budget in Aberdeenshire that has been made

available by the ability to increase the council tax by 2.5% after a

nine-year freeze in Scotland, and that has brought more resources into

local government and that's why the butchered in Aberdeenshire has been

an investment budget including protection of the education budget

in the face of a Tory and liberal attempt to cut bit. You have to

compare what is happening in Scotland and England, and there's no

doubt Scottish local authorities have been much better funded than

those in England over the last few years and that's been the ability of

the Scottish Government to protect the services at local level. A good

reason for voting SNP. If they have been so well funded, why after a

decade of SNP rule do one in five Scottish pupils leave primary school

functionally illiterate? You have got to take these things... Nicola

Sturgeon has made it a top priority to address these challenges but

let's take another statistic. 93% of Scottish kids are now emerging from

school to positive destinations, that means to further education,

apprenticeships or work. Why are one in five functionally illiterate? You

argue one statistic, I'm arguing Scottish education is putting in

some substantially good performances like the 93% going on to positive

destinations. You can't have a failing education system if you have

got that 93%, and incidentally a record low youth unemployment in

Scotland without the second lowest unemployment rate in Europe. These

pupils are being prepared by the Scottish education system. Let's

take the figures in the round on education. It's so important. Under

your watch, under your government, the Scottish schools in the most

important global comparison have fallen from tenth to 19th in

science, and 11 to 24th in maths, that is a record of decline and

failure. That is by the OECD and first questions about that, but the

OECD has also described Scotland is one of the best educated societies

in the world. That was from the school system in previous years gone

by. For those who are currently in Scottish schools, you have fallen

from 11th to 24th in mathematics. The OECD was commenting on

introduction of the new curriculum for excellence in which they have

given a resounding thumbs up to it, and that's the same source as the

rankings which you are comparing. Nicola Sturgeon has said there are

challenges on Scottish education, particularly the access through the

education system and the attainment gap but don't tell me it's failing

when 55% of our pupils have gone on to higher education. That's one of

the most impressive figures in the world. Why have you cut 4000

teachers? The pupil numbers in Scotland have been falling over

recent years as well and now of course we are increasing the number

of people going through teachers training so we can make sure that

number increases, but listen, the Scottish Government and Scottish

Parliament, as you very well know, are subject to real terms spending

cuts over the last few years and all public services have been under

pressure. The main reason in terms of teacher numbers has been an

attempt on the Scottish Government to protect the teacher pupil ratio,

and that will now be enhanced by a further taker -- intake. You

promised you would reduce primary class sizes to 18 and instead they

are now 23.5 and rising. You broke that promise. You didn't mention

where we started from. We have kept the teacher pupil ratio very solid

in Scotland and that's been against a range of public expenditure cuts

but the new intake of teachers into the new teacher training in Scotland

I think will enhance the system. You have spent in the pasty in

Hollywood 43 hours on Government time debating independence. How many

hours have you debated education on Government time? I don't have that

they get a hand... The answer is zero, you have spent zero-hours

debating education on Government time. Isn't it time the SNP got back

to concentrating on the day job? Andrew, as you very well know Nicola

Sturgeon has identified a key priority, closing the attainment gap

in Scottish education. That is exactly what she has done. Let me

answer the question, it is difficult to be in a remote location, if you

talk before I answer the question then the view was will not be able

to listen. I let you answer that without saying a word. Is this

general election about independence, as you say it is, or not about

independence, as Mrs Sturgeon says it is? No, I have said exactly the

same as Nicola Sturgeon on that. The issue what independence will be

decided in a national referendum of the Scottish people. The mandate for

that referendum was gained in last year's Scottish elections. What this

election is about is backing the right of the Scottish parliament to

exercise that mandate and also providing real opposition to this

Tory Government and allowing the Scottish Parliament to reverse

austerity and some of the public expenditure cutbacks you have been

talking about, that is what this is about, backing our Scottish

Parliament. Alex Salmond, speaking

to me earlier. I'm now joined by the leader

of Plaid Cymru, Leanne Wood. You accuse the Government of wanting

an extreme Brexit, those are your words. What is the difference

between hard Brexit and extreme Brexit? My concern is the way in

which we leave the European Union could be very damaging to Wales if,

for example, there are tariffs introduced then that would have a

real impact in terms of Welsh jobs, and I want to make sure that we have

a Brexit that doesn't cause the damage to Wales that could be

caused. But what is the difference between extreme and hard? Anything

that puts Welsh jobs at risk is either extreme or hard and

unacceptable to Plaid Cymru, and we will do what we can to protect those

jobs. You want Wales to remain a member of the single market even if

the UK isn't, which would mean Wales having to accept the free movement

of people, still being under the jurisdiction of the European Court,

and you also want to stay in the customs union which means you could

not do your own free trade deals. What is the difference between that

and being a member of the European Union? We would be like Norway,

outside the European Union and inside the single market. The key

question is the issue of jobs and the ability to continue to trade.

Wales exports, we are the biggest exporter in the whole of the UK, so

there are many jobs reliant upon those goods being able to be sold to

the single market. Is it central to the UK? Out of the four countries

that make up the UK... Proportionally, yes. If you remain

in the single market, it is hard to see how Wales could stay in the

single market if the UK -- when the rest of the UK was not, you cite

Norway, that has free movement, it has to be said, it effectively have

to accept the jurisdiction of the European Court, it is not in the

customs union so it can do some of its own free trade deals, but the

Welsh people voted to leave. We have to accept the principle of free

movement if there is not going to be a hard border between the north and

south of Ireland. There is going to be free movement within Ireland and

therefore freedom of movement, as we said in the referendum campaign,

would be very, very difficult to rule out. You lost that campaign, as

you know, Wales voted to leave, 17 Council areas voted to leave, only

five voted to remain. Doesn't it explain why your party is going

nowhere? A majority in Wales voted to leave but you effectively want to

support that and de facto remain in the EU? I don't accept that, we

accepted the result but Plaid Cymru now is about defending Wales. There

are so many risks facing our people from the jobs perspective, the

privatisation perspective, the cuts perspective, and from the fact that

the Tories would like to grab power was back from our National Assembly,

so the key point... If you look at the Wales bill that went through

recently, the list of reserved powers there suggests there are some

powers currently within the Welsh Assembly jurisdiction that would be

dragged back. Which power was will Westminster take back? They could

take powers back over the NHS, for example. There is no indication they

want to do that. The Tories have attacked the Welsh NHS. That is my

point! Quite viciously. If they increase their mandate, I wouldn't

put it past them to try to take power was back over the NHS and then

of course we risk our NHS being privatised though this election is

all about defending Wales, protecting Welsh people from further

privatisation and cuts and a power grab from the Tories. Why is there

never a breakthrough for your party, Plaid Cymru? Labour dominated in

Wales for years, the Tories do quite well, Ukip had a surge for a while,

it looks like the Tories will have another surge, never you, always the

bridesmaid, never the bride. Wait until Thursday and I think you will

see that in many parts of Wales we will increase our representation at

a local council level. In the Rhondda, where I am assembly member,

we are looking to increase our representation... You are only 13%

in the polls will stop which is half of even the Tories in Wales! If you

don't breakthrough in the selection, if the real problem is going

nowhere, do you think you will pack it in? Robert Green not, I have a

job to do, a vision of Wales which is about building up our nation and

standing on our own two feet and my job is not done yet. Thank you for

being with us as part of your job, we will see how it goes on Thursday.

It's just gone 11.35, you're watching the Sunday Politics.

We say goodbye to viewers in Scotland who leave us now

Coming up here in 20 minutes, the Week Ahead.

Coming up in the North West: six of the candidates standing to be

Roger Bannister from the Trade Unionist and

Socialist Coalition, Tabitha Morton from

the Women's Equality Party, Tom Crone is the Green Party

candidate, Carl Cashman is standing for the Liberal Democrats,

Tony Caldeira for the Conservatives and Paula Walters for UKIP.

The Labour candidate Steve Rotheram declined to take part because he's

out campaigning ahead of the general election.

Paul Breen from Get The Coppers Off The Jury isn't here either.

More information on them and all the candidates on the BBC website.

But before we hear from them, let's just remind ourselves

This election is in the newly created Liverpool City Region.

In fact, it is the five Merseyside councils -

that's Sefton, Liverpool, Knowsley, St Helens and Wirral,

plus Halton in Cheshire - a total population of 1.5 million.

So, what powers will the new mayor have?

Well, not as many as his or her counterpart in greater Manchester.

For example, there is no control over the police, fire and rescue,

But the mayor will be in charge of transport,

with the potential to sort out bus routes and ticketing.

Housing is another area, as is money to invest

Their powers will be fairly limited, actually.

They will mostly be in things like transport, and in planning -

planning for housing development, skills and so on.

There will be more over time, we know that.

But this is a change, it is a significant change,

because for a long time there has been nobody, or no elected

individual, who has really spoken for this full city region.

What are the issues voters want the new mayor to tackle?

Transport is one of the things that affects me.

Like, housing and that has affected people I know,

Because I am fairly young, myself, so that will be important to me.

I want to get a job more than anything.

Definitely, to make sure that housing isn't

I would like more creative industry opportunities

We've told you what it is and where it is.

It'll be up to you to decide who becomes the mayor

So, we build drill down to your specific policies and areas like

transport shortly, but I wanted to start with Brexit. It is a big

talking point of the moment. There is nothing you can do to reverse a

decision, but you will have to do as mayor is deal with the Follett of

Britain leaving the European Union. We know it has been enormously

influential in Liverpool. Things like the airport, restorations, what

balance and that? I think the point balance and that? I think the point

about Brexit for Liverpool and the Liverpool City Region is common to

the north of England. I would certainly look to work with other

local authority leaders, other metro mayor is, to make sure the voice of

the north is held within the Brexit negotiations. We have been a period

of industrial decline, we have certain benefits from the EU. I

because I don't think it is helpful because I don't think it is helpful

to ordinary working class people. If you look at certain villains, you

can see that the EU exist to undermine the rights... While we be

better off if believe the European Union? I think it is very dangerous.

The Women's Equality Party is one of the only parties retracted reverse

Article 50, because workers I could roll back very easily when we're out

of the EU, and also many women slate as well. I think we have to fight

for those lights and to make sure they are protected. Also that people

have led their many years, and who have added to our economy, feel safe

and secure and realise the Liverpool City Region is for them. New

campaign to leave the European Union. Are you not concerned about

workers' rights? And we will lose ?190 million by one. What do we do

without massive in the budget? This guide and following. Every time I

see this, I gets shouted down. But it is not their money, it is their

more of it. Liverpool to get more more of it. Liverpool to get more

than its pretend, pound for pound. Particular care back to Liverpool

City Region, you look at the Fisherman, if you look at the

deprivation... There is no guarantee that outside the EU things will be

better. There is no guarantee. There are other areas that have got

absolutely nothing. Like I say, this guy hasn't falling and. Why can that

money be used elsewhere? I think a lot of working-class people and the

city might believe this guy has actually follow and, because what

policies is dreadful. When we had managed decline and 80s, we had

objective one status from the European Union. They didn't give up

on us, and we shouldn't give up on YouTube now. What can you do. We

need to make sure powers are repatriated to the region and not

Westminster. As near, what would you do to make that happen? I would

speak to Theresa May. I would make sure we have a voice as an

internationalist city region. I want to work with the men of greater

Manchester and with the Northern Ireland December to create an

assembly that make sure we come together as a real northern

powerhouse and take our case to Theresa May and take a case to

Europe as well. Tony, when George Ward Osborne was -- when George

Osborne was Chancellor, he was knocking on the door. As Theresa May

as committed? She is fully committed. The people of the UK

decided to leave the European Union and we have got to get on with it

both as a meeting, as a city region, and as a Government as well. In

terms of the Liverpool City Region, we have lots and lots of

opportunities. We have a brand-new Superport so they exported to

countries around the world. We must take advantage of the natural

opportunities we have. With the law exchange rate, our business and

economy is huge for Liverpool City Region and that will bring more

business. Pascal have a point that we should try and retain the rights

we have under the European union? CEU has guaranteed certain rights

for workers which tapping very important. It is also guaranteed

environmental protection that we wouldn't have had outside the EU.

Wildlife is better protected, our beaches are cleaner as a result of

being an EU. I worried that a Conservative Government will be

willing to take this legislation that protects workers and the

environment. It is a desperate race to the bottom to try to attract

business to the country after Brexit. I will be campaigning very

hard to maintain as many of these as possible, because it is very

important. It is essential that the funding we have been getting from

the EU is replaced by central Government, and that is extremely

important. How do you make that happen? There is no guarantees about

funding from central Government. No more has been put on paper. What do

you say to central Government about investment? As I said earlier, we

have to make the case and make it stronger. We have to look for allies

in similar positions, and that is what I believed then also divide is

an issue for those, because of the period of industrial decline. I

don't accept that we had managed decline, it was chaotic. Big

business, manufacturers who pulled out absolutely hammered the

industrial base of Liverpool City Region and left does as a rust belt.

There was nothing managed about that. It was an absolute disgrace.

And yet the introduced in investment. They workers' rights

thing is overplayed. We had better workers' rights than many of the

minimum rights and the European Union. It is a matter of recognising

what the EU was far. It was media to help Merseyside, it was there to

enable the rights in the European Union to get even richer. I have no

problem with immigration, but the idea that the labour force of the EU

has now been gradually changed so that you recruit in one country and

ship them over for a crucial period of time, the writer undermined, it

does damage that family life. Is that point, Tabitha? This is an

opportunity to be better than the EU. I think we have to be very

careful about that. I don't see any leadership in the current Government

offering that. I think the Metronet has an opportunity here. -- the

Metro Mayor has an opportunity. Governments have to be held

responsible. We need to do particle things. I launch my policy to have

university childcare for all, and that really can take advantage of

the ?23 billion we are losing and the north-west because of the

productivity gap, so we can get families back into work again. So

women, and Dads can actually have a choice of how they go to work. There

is this balance constantly between drawing the economy and having

should be either. We can do both. should be either. We can do both.

Let me ask all of you, because I'm sure you all say yes, I will be

asking the Prime Minister for more money, I will be lobbying for more

powers. As it stands, this is a disappointing deal. As mayor, what

can you actually do? I do agree there is not enough money in the

deal and the powers that have been devolved don't make it real

demolition. This has been agreed behind closed doors without the

involvement of local people. It is a half-hearted deal. We have to fight

from. Speaking to central Government is a key part of that, making the

case for a region and demanding more money and powers is part of it. I

resilient local economies I will be resilient local economies I will be

businesses, and encouraging businesses,

cooperative models, and also tried cooperative models, and also tried

Revolution here and Liverpool City Revolution here and Liverpool City

Region. There are a lot of things we can do locally as well. On top of

all those things, we should be asking for more freedom for how we

raise revenue. We are very raise revenue. We are very

constrained at the moment. I would like to bring in the land value tax

which would raise money without having to take any more money from

talking about the fact that the talking about the fact that the

behind closed doors. Should there be behind closed doors. Should there be

a referendum in the Liverpool City Region about whether this mayor

position should even exist? I think there should be. The very nature of

devolution as to get people local and dispersed power. Isn't it a

normal waste of time and resources? Not at all. The people and this

region shouldn't be treated as second-class. This shouldn't be

giving a third rate deal. This should be as whether they wanted

this and post. We do want devolution, we want to make your own

decisions on community. We don't want the power centralised without

having a say. Fair enough, if the people say yes they

mayor, that is fine. But let's have mayor, that is fine. But let's have

the people decide. A referendum once your mirror? I actually agree. The

only reason I am standing there is that I believe there will be a lot

of vanity project that Liverpool city... Why would people vote for

you if you don't think there should be a mayor? Because I would stop

this happening. All the money would be used century. It would be used on

big vanity project. I will give unit is ample. The spec high-speed train.

We have been told that that project will cost our region ?2 billion.

Editors and the Liverpool Echo that mayors have said that how we raise

this money is to get a loan. And a bundle then be paid for by local

taxes and by future tunnel feels. Don't go for this project if you

don't have the money. Is that a fair point that Merseyside

in Liverpool city region have to invest more than they get out of

what Pollock was vanity projects? Or do we have to speculate to

accumulate? That is a common misconception. A lot of investment

has gone into the Liverpool city region recently and you have the

Mersey Gateway Bridge and education of the railways. You have two new

hospitals and 12 new schools. That is a lot of money going to the city

region and as a result of that our economy has grown by 3.6% and we

have record employment. As mayor of the Liverpool city region I will be

banging on about the positives and the good things that can be done.

Even if it means getting into more debt as a public body in the short

term? We need to get a proper case together and use the mayor funding

that we have to make sure that we can go to government and make sure

that we see this stacks up and this is responsible government and what

we want to do. When you have local councils losing ?40 million per year

in the funding, ?30 million per year in the whole city within is not

enough. -- region. It is not anything new what we need. We don't

have the same powers as Manchester and we need more funding. The need

to make sure people have a real say. That's where address this narrow

that we don't want to be mayor because we have a referendum. It is

giving people a real state. You can say I don't think we should have

this city mayor but it needs more powers. You've got to decide whether

you will give it a good first if you won the election or if you're going

to campaign to get rid of it. I don't think you can write those two

bikes together. I think we need to stop playing politics with people's

lives. As with the rape crisis Centre during the week whose clients

have doubled during the year but had half the funding cut and have half

the staff. Playing politics is wrong. We need to make sure that

metro mayor make sure the funding is to end violence against women and

girls across the region because we have the highest rate of domestic

violence and the whole of the UK and no strategy across the region. This

week I announced our strategy to do that and some of my colleagues on

the panel today signed up for that. Unfortunately the conservative and

Ukip candidates did not sign up for that. I will make sure that whatever

happens in the 4th of May we have that strategy because people do not

stop suffering because that is not enough money. Often those cuts

because of national policy. He talked about regional council cuts

but one area where you will have more control as mayor is transport.

We know that the tunnels generate ?37 million of revenue annually.

Some of you want to get rid of the tunnel tolls because you feel it is

too much about burden on families and live there. Tom, do we keep

them? We do keep them. I'm looking at variable pricing. Rather than

increasing or decreasing them, we increase at rush hours to discourage

people from driving on a daily basis into town centres. We could maybe

make them cheaper in the middle of the day there for productive

business trips a day to take place between the wobble and Liverpool are

not hampered by it. -- well. -- Wirral. Air pollution causes 1000

every deaths a year across Liverpool region. That is like a good idea. If

you travel at peak time. It will discourage people. People working

from 9-to-5 paying enough. They are paying the car tax. This shouldn't

be paying. -- they should not be paying. We have rightly paid ?1

billion for our tunnels. -- already paid. The money is being siphoned

off elsewhere. Why should the people not pay for it to use it? Because

people live in Liverpool and they work in The Wirral and vice versa.

It is eternal and does not take much upkeep. So 37 million will be met by

everyone in the region? No, it will not. The funding will come from a

room tax. This is all over the world. You can seat in Las Vegas and

seat in Singapore and works. It means that people coming into the

night pay a room tax which is the night pay a room tax which is the

cost of a pint of beer or a glass of wine and that would immensely go

towards funding the tunnels. Is that a good idea? I think our visitor

economy is one that is one of our unique selling point across in

Liverpool city region and we need to attract more of just. Will it be

noticed? I think it will. I know it happens in Brussels. It is more

inconvenient and another stint. I want people to come to a region and

across the whole city region is well and enjoy the state and think what a

fantastic place to be an visit and work and I am going to compete

again. But the benefits of those collective powers I'd it? Would an

extra couple of quid put people off? I think we need to be a low tax

economy as much as we can. You do support the tunnel types? I think at

this point in time we have no choice because of funding structure. I do

not like the funding tunnel tolls. We have to see how we can do it

without affecting some of the services. I don't think they feel at

all. I think how we should be free and funded. The ad we have now is

that the new bridge will have a tool on it. And then because there

personal toll on the existing Runcorn Bridge nobody will use the

new bridge. Then there was talk about introducing a toll on the

existing Runcorn Bridge. Highway should be paid out of public

expenditure. Let's hear from Tabatha. We need fear tolls so

people in The Wirral can travel between the cities. It is often

women and young people who are penalised so we want to get people

into training and people into employment and the other people who

need public transport. I think we should use that money to fund

affordable access. Is that how it should be this beauty? Across public

transport? How do you mean? Tabatha was seeing money should be

reinvested from the tours across public transport. This should not be

a toll. For their intended to do with the new bridge is not have a

toll on site. People are intended to go online and book your toll. In

other areas people are being fined so there are cases where mistaken

identity in the car. There are lots of false in the system. Should we

get rid of the tolls? I don't you going to get rid of the tours and

increase for attacks because we simply haven't got power over that.

I think we need to look at it in the longer term and we need to expand

our vision on this. What I want do is enhance the walrus car making

sure we can get through the tunnels with that. You will be head of

strategic planning as mayor and will have compulsory purchase powers and

call in planning applications you don't agree with. When you think

about the fact that the average price of a house across Liverpool

city region is five times the average salary would we start? Tom,

what would you do to make that easier and fearful? -- fear? -- more

fair. At the moment tax on the green belt on the benefits a few people. I

would prioritise building a brown field sites more than green belt

size but I would recognise that a brown belt sites, some of them are

ecological importance. To take pressure off green space for housing

developments I would have a policy focusing on high-quality, density

urban developments in town centres modelled on some of the best

European cities. That is a lot of concern that all of the attention

will be our Ben and that the banner of Liverpool itself will garner all

the attention and budget. What would you say to Holton and Mosley? I

would make sure that everybody has the built-up areas and all of -- a

lot of these areas need reinvigorating. If we use good urban

design it will really bring these places back to life and make much

more sustainable committees were people of course the and live close

to schools and close to the shops so they don't have to get a car. Is it

a good idea to invest equally in all six banners to develop the urban

Central parts of them which is oversubscribed? Orders that create

chaos? I think it makes sense to build what I would say is a city

region the box for everybody. I want to see opportunity and different

projects and funds spread across the whole city region. Do you buy that

intersect? It is not that simple. The plan is to build 25,000 new

homes by 2020. As part of the government strive to build a million

new homes. Without encroaching on green belt? Exactly. What we need to

do now is protect those green spaces at all costs. Expansion all suckers

only -- exceptional circumstances only. St Helens has an issue with

development and there are some industrial sites it could be used.

25,000 new homes are smart the area has 2% of the country's population.

Is it realistically economically, Roger? Is it desirable? I think it

is desirable and is a great need for affordable housing. Even when there

are thousands of homes sat with nobody in across Merseyside? They

have been left into decline and they need investment. Do you start

building new ones? I don't think it's an either or. We need to start

building new homes. We need to make sure they are affordable and

Alderman Brownfield sites. Perhaps the one benefit of being in an era

of industrial decline is that there is plenty of Brownfield sites about.

Everywhere I have been people are concerned about holding onto the

green belt and I think we need to keep the green spaces that we've

got. Everyone will see less prioritise Brownfield and try to

protect the green belt. What will you try to do that is different?

Tony's government of those who want is to build houses on the green belt

in collusion with Labour councils. I will bring in Brownfield development

cooperative to bring in the Brownfield sites and build a home is

at the need for the future and build them in the right place. To make

sure that the affordable as well. Far too often we have these

high-priced luxury and affordable homes built in the leafy suburbs. We

need to make sure we have the houses for the future built on the right

places. Tabatha you will have to work with the leaders of the council

labour representatives. You manage those personalities when they have

the plans for housing in the right places. Tabatha you will have to

work with the leaders of the council Labour representatives. How do you

manage those personalities when they have the plans for housing and you

have to get the boat through the authority? It is the very reason I

am standing. When I saw the devolution deal signed by the nine

middle-aged white men. That does not reflect our region. I think the

region deserves fresh ideas and with asking the same old parties, the

same old ideas. I think talking about housing, there is a shocking

housing shortage but we need to create homes not houses. I grew up

in a council estate in Netherton and there were 700 families living there

was a raw seven shops and a tiny recreation area. That is housing

that they are not homes. We need to create committees were people can

work and play and gather together so that will require careful planning.

What other nuts and bolts of that? It means making sure we're not

throwing up roses for housing sake. It needs to be right houses and make

sure that I transport links. So that people are not travelling halfway

across the region to work. It is also training and skills for people.

Paul, is that key to building a community not just a house? --

parlour. -- Paula. Who is paying for that interest? It is interest-free

but once the workers varnished we get it back. -- work is finished. We

will get the money and it will already be there. It will come out

the pot of cash of the mayor. We will end up with a concrete jungle

if we do that. Give interest-free loans to local builders.

You will have as many a lot of influence of education for 16 to

18-year-old. You will have the power to redesign apprenticeships. Let's

talk about Knowsley. A lot of adults leave school without any

qualifications whatsoever. Twice the national average. How do you improve

this? It is important because my business is in Knowsley. I

understand the committee very well, and it doesn't have that sex from

college. That is not acceptable in 2017. -- ASICs form college. I think

we can improve the education by learning from skills and sharing

best practice from across the region. For example in Wirral we

have selective grammar schools, and if they had that in Knowsley, you

would find their attainment would go up, and we would end up with better

outcomes. More grammar schools? They bring up the average. Is that fair?

Totally disagree. I have worked in Knowsley for 40 years. Grammar

skills aren't the answer. I can be slightly dispassionate about this

because I went to a grammar school that turned into a comprehensive

part way through. One thing we have seen with the expansion of

comprehensive education is it is massively increase the number of

young people going to urge universities. No one can take that

away. But we have a problem with children and young people who don't

want to go and that direction. I don't think the offer an education

system that is good for them. All these problems are compounded with

academisation. What will you do as much mayor? I would make sure there

is adequate funding for post school Mac education. Why do you do with

it. You put it into the school Mac 's to make sure you get over the

problem of Knowsley having no sex from education whatsoever. -- six

form education. How do you make sure everyone across a liveable city

region has an opportunity. I want to bring about a low carbon Industrial

Revolution to Liverpool City Region. I want to see it zero carbon by

2030. That is a huge challenge. That was what lots of new job

opportunities and attract new industries. If you are 16 and you

want past one JC 's Admiral GCSE, how will that help you? People will

see that there is a real, exciting industry to go into. I want to focus

on that, but I want to... Does that mean we should look at more

vocational training? Should be give everyone an apprenticeship? No. I am

all for grammar schools. I think all children are different. Some

children need to go to grammar schools. It is what they need for

their career. Other people don't. I don't think we should lump everyone

together in a comprehensive system. We should keep the comprehensives,

we should also have the grammars, and we should also have colleges. I

think you're been shouted down because it is absolutely disgusting

to judge someone on the educational abilities analyse chances based on a

test when there are 11 years old. That is completely wrong. We want to

bring back secondary moderns. It is not bringing back secondary moderns.

We do it in Wirral. We have comprehensive, grammar skills, all

they need extra as... Grammar skills is not the answer. What is the

answer? I am from Knowsley so I was and that education system that was

bottom of the education tables for the country. I want is to be a

global, while beating system. How, though? We can't be that Raimi are

bottom of the league table. I want to make sure people don't feel

pushed down a certain path, that they don't have to go down a

university education power. I want to bring in degree level

apprenticeships to match degrees. Is that realistic, Tabitha? I

understand this completely because Alaska with no qualifications, and

if I didn't do an apprenticeship, I wouldn't be here today. It is a real

passion of mine, but we have to make sure we are giving our young people

options. Nationally, 96% of UK apprenticeships are taking up by

young women. 4% of the engineering apprenticeships are taking up by

young men. Young women, sorry. That does not reflect what young people

want to do. Talking to companies across the region, they are crying

out for employees. We are not supplying them. We have the jobs, so

as mayor, I would incentivise training to recruit women. We will

have to leave it there, I'm afraid, because we're out of time. Voters in

the Liverpool City Region ahead to the on Thursday.

More on all the candidates on the BBC website.

A reminder that elections are also taking place for the mayor

of Greater Manchester and Lancashire, Cumbria

We'll have the results, reaction and what it could mean

for the general election on next week's programme.

The East End girl who became the nation's favourite.

We don't know what it is, but she definitely has... Something.

From stage to screen and into our hearts.

Ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha-ha! Ooh, in't she wonderful?

If you're not careful, you'll end up playing this sexy little blonde