08/05/2016 Sunday Politics Northern Ireland

This programme contains scenes of Repetitive Flashing Images.

Hello, and welcome to a specially extended Sunday Politics.

Stormont's benches have now all been filled.

The 100 MLAs have been returned.

It's been a great result for the DUP

and its leader Arlene Foster in particular.

Sinn Fein dropped a seat, but remains the second biggest party.

There are some new faces, some very familiar faces,

and there have been a few shocks and surprises as well.

Over the next hour and a quarter,

I'll be asking the main parties where it went right,

or in some cases wrong,

and what it will mean for the next five years.

What departments will they choose in this smaller Executive

or will they prefer to peel away and form an opposition?

I'll be talking to some of the surprises of this election -

People Before Profit's veteran campaigner, Eamonn McCann,

and the leader of the Greens, Steven Agnew,

who has doubled his party's representation at Stormont.

And with their thoughts on all of that and more,

Fionnuala O Connor, Alex Kane,

and our political editor, Mark Devenport.

Well, going into the election, there were 276 candidates.

Over the course of two days of counting,

that was whittled down to the 100 successful MLAs.

The last result came just after 4 o'clock yesterday afternoon,

and in a three-way fight for the fifth and sixth seats,

Sinn Fein's Catherine Seeley and John O'Dowd

pipped the SDLP's Dolores Kelly at the post in Upper Bann.

So how will the new Assembly look?

Well, in many ways,

it won't be very different from 2011.

The DUP remains the biggest party

on 38 seats,

and Arlene Foster will remain

as First Minister.

Sinn Fein dropped one seat

but remains the second largest party on 28,

and will take

the Deputy First Minister's role.

The Ulster Unionists are on the 16

they achieved in 2011,

while the SDLP is down 2 seats at 12.

Alliance held on

to its eight from five years ago.

The Greens saw their numbers double

from one to two,

while People Before Profit

makes its debut at Stormont,

also with two.

Jim Allister is back,

but remains a solo operator for the TUV.

The independent Claire Sugden

also makes a return.

Let's hear from some of the parties who will be bringing new faces

to the green benches at Stormont.

Firstly, not exactly a new face, you might say,

the veteran campaigner Eamonn McCann of People Before Profit

is in our Foyle studio.

The Green Party leader Steven Agnew,

who now has the party's deputy leader Clare Bailey

joining him on the hill.

Welcome to both of you.

Let me just talk to you, first of all, Steven Agnew.

We'd hope we might get a chance to talk to Clare Bailey,

but I think she's done so much talking

over the last couple of days she's got a bit of a bad throat

this morning, so I hope she makes a speedy recovery, because presumably

she'll be wanting to make her voice heard in the Assembly Chamber.

But two is good. Three, of course, would have been better.

You did say to me on this programme a couple of weeks ago

you would be disappointed if you didn't come back with three.

So there's a bit of happiness and a bit of disappointment.

Well, we're absolutely delighted for Clare Bailey.

It's been a tremendous result for the Greens across the board

with the largest increase in vote of any party in this election.

So, overall, the Greens are celebrating.

But, of course, I am disappointed for Ross Brown.

He came seventh in a six-seat constituency. He came very close.

We were right to say that we could get three seats,

because we almost did,

but that's something for us to build on in the future.

But, overall, we've doubled our number of MLAs,

we've increased our vote across Northern Ireland

and, indeed, it was the highest vote we've ever had

across Northern Ireland in terms of vote number.

So, overall, a successful election.

You, you, of course,

came second in terms of first-preference

votes in your constituency of North Down,

which was a personal success from your point of view,

-cos I think you came home with the sixth seat last time.

-That's right.

Clare Bailey in South Belfast, why do you think in a constituency...?

It was quite a diverse constituency, yes, but it is leafy South Belfast,

it's very often how people describe it in shorthand.

How do you think a Green candidate there,

who is clearly left of centre, managed to secure a seat?

Well, while others prevaricated on issues such as equal marriage

and abortion, the Greens, and Clare Bailey in particular,

articulated a very clear vision.

We're pro equal marriage, we're pro abortion reform,

ad that message went down well in South Belfast.

Plus, Clare is a tremendous campaigner.

She's been working in the constituency for many years.

She's had two near-misses in previous elections,

but she's been persistent and kept coming back to the electorate,

kept working hard, and has got the result she deserved.

She didn't have to fight for the final seat.

She took the fourth seat, and I think that's worth noting,

that she came home quite comfortably in the end.

OK, Eamonn McCann, first of all, congratulations to you.

We spoke a couple of days ago and you were confident,

but you hadn't been confirmed.

You've been at this game since 1969 -

I think that was the first time you stood for election.

So, at last, at the age of 73, you're inside the Stormont tent,

which for so many years you've of course been an arch critic of.

Well, I've been an arch critic of the policies

coming out of Stormont and the policies coming out

of an awful lot of other parliamentary institutions

across the water and in an even more wide scale.

I mean, I've argued for that attitude,

and eventually we got a quota.

To be honest, this is just a statement of the obvious, isn't it?

What's going to be your motivation up at Stormont?

What are you hoping you're going to be able to achieve?

You're there and you've got Gerry Carroll for West Belfast,

so there are two of you.

You're not a lone voice, but do you think that you will be able

to have an impact on policy issues?

Do you hope that you'll seriously be able to hold

the Executive to account?

Well, we'll certainly be able to hold the Executive to account,

to the extent that Stormont rules and procedures allow that to happen.

We will bring into Stormont the ideas and the attitudes

of the policies that we have been proclaiming,

that I've been proclaiming for, certainly, a very long time.

I think the most important thing that we bring

and, in our estimation, the most important thing about the election -

People Before Profit candidates -

is that we stood on a clear basis of being neither orange nor green.

We did something the people kept telling us

it was not possible to do -

that in Northern Ireland you either have to be deep green or deep orange

or some muddy mulch in the middle.

We offered a radical political alternative

to the politics of orange versus green.

I think there was, to use a crude term, a market for that attitude.

I think many people were...

And we pulled votes from a much wider range of people than

we ever have before in Derry.

Our vote was certainly the youngest vote that there was

in this constituency, loads of first time voters.

Our election team was the youngest, I would think,

that certainly I've ever been associated with.

So we will bring that sort of youthful energy and a, sort of,

radical anti-Sectarian, "neither orange nor green" attitude

to Stormont. I think that's very important.

Very important to us, anyway.

Eamonn, whenever you were deemed elected,

you just couldn't help yourself.

You revealed one of the talents that you've kept hidden for many years -

your singing voice.

Now, you took a bit of stick when you sang The Internationale

from some of our commentators on our programme yesterday.

Could you just not help yourself?

I'm not aware that I took a bit of stick from anybody.

I take your word for it.

I don't think I watched any coverage of anything yesterday.

It wasn't that I just couldn't help myself.

Look, people singing songs on platforms in Northern Ireland,

particularly after winning a seat of some sort in Parliament,

it's not unusual.

I've heard A Nation Once Again sung.

Thinking our God in ages past, or whatever it is in song,

so it's not unusual.

It's probably unusual to hear a song which doesn't

come from either the Nationalist or Unionist tradition

sung on an election platform,

or a results platform in Northern Ireland.

Maybe it was just about time.

Right. Well, I'm glad you didn't see some of the comments that there were

yesterday afternoon, because they weren't all entirely complimentary,

I have to be honest, but I think everybody took it in the spirit in which you obviously intended.

Go back and watch it on iPlayer

and you can decide who's not on your Christmas card list in future.

-Eamonn...

-I don't send Christmas cards incidentally,

-so I don't have a list. Go on.

-Right. OK. Tell me this,

how do you think you're going to work with people like Steven Agnew

in what's now being referred to not as the naughty corner,

but as the noisy corner?

Well, for a start, I don't deal in phrases like naughty corner

and noisy corner. That is to infantilise politics

in Northern Ireland and commentators who use that phrase simply have

nothing better to say.

Certainly I would envisage that we can work well

with Steven and the Greens.

Again, they approached the election saying -

though they couldn't use our phrase, I suppose -

"Neither Orange nor Green,"

but on the same basis as far as that's concerned.

We have also incorporated,

contributing here in the Foyle area on environmental campaigns

and are doing that at the moment in relation to a whole

series of possible potential environmental catastrophes here,

so we disagree on other things, of course,

but I think that there could be a working relationship there.

I hope there will be.

I know Steven a little and I've never had any rows with him,

so I think the people who are...

The main reason why I think that the attitude of neither Orange

nor Green can be brought into the Assembly

and can have a real effect is that there's a hunger for it.

I've knocked on doors and said my opening little mantra,

"I'm from People Before Profit. We are neither Orange nor Green,

"will you vote for us?" The reaction to that was absolutely striking.

People in all areas... I sort of stood back a little bit.

This is a typical reaction.

I stood back a little bit and they said, "Tell me more,"

or words to the effect of, "At last," or, "Are you serious?" Or, "Can you do it?"

Or "Have you any hope of getting elected on this basis?"

Very few people said to us, "Well, actually, we're Nationalists,

"we're Unionists, we can't support you."

I think that this is an idea whose time has come.

The main reason why there are not bigger political formations

based on the type of approach that I'm outlining here is simply

that people have thought, until now, that it just won't work,

that you can't get elected on that basis,

that it's just futile rhetoric to talk like that.

Well, it's not futile rhetoric and hope people in other

constituencies learn the message. You're sitting there wondering

and complaining, or phoning into Mr Nolan or somebody, and say,

"Isn't it terrible that we only have these Nationalists

"and Unionists fighting with one another

"in permanent deadlock seemingly."

OK, you don't have to accept that.

I mean, go out and support candidates who are there

and choose between which non-sectarian anti-Orange,

Green candidates are available to you.

OK, I want to bring Steven in a second,

but very quickly, you just touched on a point about working

relationships with the Greens and so forth. You may have to

develop at short notice a working relationship with Jim Allister

who's another oppositional voice from the TUV.

Do you think you can build some kind of relationship with him, because

there wouldn't be too many common areas on the policy front, I'd have

thought, between People Before Profit

and traditional Unionist voice?

Well, you've just said it yourself.

I mean, there are very few areas of an overlap of policy

and that surely is the key thing.

Certified numbers and procedures at Stormont or anywhere else

don't affect political principles. I think there would be a wide range

-of issues...

-But are you looking forward to working with

Jim Allister? Are you looking forward to having a cup of tea with

him, a conversation next week at Stormont?

I'll be happy to have a cup of tea with almost anybody.

I hope there'd be no personal animosities or anything like that.

I would like to think that I have relatively genial

relationships with people of very different political views.

I've not had a conversation with Mr Allister in my life,

-but I'd talk to anybody.

-OK.

Steven, you have had to develop some kind of relationship

with Jim Allister and again, there wouldn't be terribly many

common areas in terms of policy.

What kind of relationship are you hoping you're going to build with

Eamonn McCann and Gerry Carroll?

I recall an interview with Eamonn on Heart and Minds

when he was asked why, in a European election,

the Greens and, as they were then, the Socialist Environmental Alliance

why we weren't standing together

and he said traditionally the Greens and Reds have marched together,

and we have been in trade union rallies with Eamonn

and I've fought many causes along with Eamonn. As he's pointed out

we've worked closely on some of the environmental issues

in the north west, not least the largest illegal waste dump at Mobuoy,

but the reality are we are separate parties.

We will work together where we share policy and when we disagree,

I will argue with Eamonn as much as anyone else,

because I believe in the policies of the Green Party.

Do you think that that corner, that oppositional corner now in Stormont -

and I don't know if the seating arrangements are going to stay

the same or not, but whatever about it, there are going to be six people

somewhere who are not in the five main parties -

do you think that the make up as it will be from tomorrow has

a serious opportunity, a serious possibility to make a difference

and to actually hold the Executive, whatever it looks like, to account?

I was one Green MLA in the last Assembly and I feel I did make an effective difference.

I called Sinn Fein out

when they said no-one would be worse off on their welfare reform.

I proposed the first-ever motion on marriage equality

and led the way in that issue

when other parties didn't want to talk about it

and, of course, I brought forward my own children's bill

and I've changed the law around children's services,

something that the children's sector campaigned for since 2007.

So that's what we were able to do with one Green MLA.

We've now got two green MLAs and I'm confident that

we can be even more effective in the Assembly and show a distinctive

-voice, an alternative voice to the five traditional parties.

-OK.

Well, we look forward to hearing what you have to say over

the next five years. Eamonn McCann in Derry, thanks very much indeed.

Steven Agnew, thank you very much as well.

Let's hear then from my commentators Fionnuala, Alex and Mark.

Welcome to all of you.

Fionnuala, first of all, looking at the wider picture, do you think that

Sinn Fein in particular has been spooked by the threat from the left?

I feel I should say first in the spirit that Eamonn just

introduced that here I am answering the Green question and

Alex, in a moment, will be answering the Orange question,

but we mustn't upset the running order.

They were, of course, spooked and they've been spooked in advance.

They were managing expectations downward from quite some time ago

and as someone else on air, it was heard on the doorsteps,

"Will you give us your number two preference in West Belfast?"

Because they knew Gerry Carroll was going to get the first one.

The first top in the poll, as other people have pointed out, is

a bit of an illusory victory in one sense.

Sinn Fein, of course, were going to manage their vote

and weren't going to throw it all against keeping him

off the top of the poll, but that was a psychological blow

and really it does voice the dissatisfaction

there has been for considerable time in West Belfast.

Where I differ with Eamonn and wonder what will become of them,

I wonder first of all how he will stick it in Stormont and how

boredom will not crush him.

But as Steven pointed out, he was able to achieve a considerable amount.

What I think People Before Profit will do in both West Belfast

and to a lesser extent in Foyle, where Eamonn's voice is more

familiar, is they will do what Bernie Sanders, to an extent,

has done to Hillary Clinton during this campaign.

They will try to keep them honest,

so what Sinn Fein will do now in the negotiations

before, in the next couple of weeks,

is I suspect they will re-write their already written plan for government.

OK. Don't fret there will be plenty of opportunities for you to answer

lots of different questions later in the programme,

so don't worry about that now. No, no, have no fear.

Alex, the Greens had hoped, and Steven's already talked about this point, that they had

hoped to get three home in this election and Ross Brown wasn't successful in East Belfast,

but do you think there is an opportunity for the Green Party to grow in future elections...

-from this base?

-I think there is, partly because they surprised us.

Steven was telling me that, no, they'd be

lucky to get the one, they've proved

and if you look at what happened to South Belfast and also East Belfast,

they're picking up votes from soft unionism as well.

People who you would've thought would have gone to the

Ulster Unionists party, maybe an uncomfortable alliance,

significant numbers of them, in the sense that they made

a difference in pushing candidates over the line, went to the Greens.

That again tells you something. It's part of this ongoing process

of how long it's going to take Northern Ireland to ever get to what we could call normal politics,

but as I've said for some time, there's something happening in the undergrowth. People

are looking and they're thinking, "That's not quite the option for me. I'll give this a go,"

and I think the very fact that you've got two seats, you put your

vote up, next time round people go, "Actually, they did OK last time."

What about relationships?

You heard a little bit there from Eamonn and from Steven about how

different parties, some of the smaller parties might relate to each other.

How do you think Eamonn McCann will get on with Jim Allister, realistically?

You know both of them pretty well?

Eamonn McCann gets on, as he was saying there in the interview,

very well with people across a broad range.

He's a great talker and raconteur and I think that Jim Allister will

at least share with Eamonn McCann a love of plain speaking and rhetoric.

They might have a shared interest in terms of the Stormont

tradecraft, how you work the machine in terms of which

committees you get on in order to have your voice heard, so at

that level... That said,

at the level of principle they couldn't be further apart.

Jim Allister's first act has been to point out that with

the loss of John McCallister

and Basil McCrea that the balance of power has shifted at Stormont

and in relation to the flag over the building, he's saying

Unionists now have the votes to push this through,

so that's a very different kind of first act from anything which

either Steven Agnew or Eamonn McCann or Gerry Carroll would go for.

So there will be a divergence,

but I wouldn't have thought that they'd have

a particularly difficult relationship because, as I say,

Eamonn has the ability to get on with a lot of people

and I think Jim Allister will at least appreciate the fact

that Eamonn can stand up without a note

and I hope that this will be true of many more MLAs in this chamber

and just speak their mind and keep it on point and on message.

Alex, do you want a quick word just before we move on?

The interesting thing, Jim has added... For the past

four, five years, Jim has had it all to himself

in terms in oratorical skill. The man that everyone listens to

because he always says something interesting.

Being challenged now by Eamonn McCann,

having someone there who is as good on his feet, I think

the dynamics between those two in terms of who the media will

hone in on, who they will get the most coverage from...

And it might make Jim up his game,

stop constantly complaining about the DUP

and actually begin to think, "OK, Eamonn's offering something

"slightly different here. I'm back by myself.

"I can't do the same thing for another five years, just whinge.

"I need to do something different."

Just on the dynamic, Steven mentioned it, what

he thought had benefited Clare Bailey and was part of her appeal in

South Belfast and part of the Greens' appeal

and will be part of People Before Profit's contribution, there is

the question of abortion rights, there is

the continuing agony of many women and girls taking pills off the net.

That is not going to go away.

Clare Bailey partly, I think, her vote, nobody would doubt was

due to her honesty and decency on that subject and People

For Profit will be sticking to that, will be pushing that line to

a degree as well, so there will be support for Steven who has

fought the lone fight and that will continue to develop a new

social dynamic inside the Assembly as well.

And that's something we may develop a little later bit later

and obviously other people take a very different perspective on things.

The other issue on which these four will be interesting to watch

will be corporation tax, because all the big parties are signed up

to that, but we're now getting to implementation, which means

cutting a budget in order to allow it to happen and I suspect

that the Greens and People Before Profit will be honing in on that.

We'll develop all of those issues a little bit later in the programme.

For now, thanks very much indeed.

In a moment I'll be talking to representatives from the main

parties, but first our political correspondent Stephen Walker

examines what key questions the election results present

and be warned there is some flash photography in his report.

So the election is over and the counting centres

and the television sets are being dismantled.

We now have the results but we also have a series of questions.

Why is it that the DUP and Sinn Fein are the two largest parties?

Why is it that the SDLP

and the Ulster Unionists failed to make an impact?

And now we know the Stormont arithmetic,

is it time for an official opposition?

The DUP are delighted with their results

and their strategy of effectively making this

a referendum on who should be First Minister clearly paid off.

The DUP is now perhaps being seen as the party of government at Stormont.

Perhaps that's what the average rank and file Unionist is beginning to think.

In other words, the Ulster Unionist Party might continue to do well,

might even become... The protest votes might become Westminster,

which used to be the big election. It might become council elections,

it might become Euro elections.

But the DUP seems perhaps to be

being seen as the party of government in Northern Ireland.

Sinn Fein are the second-largest party but their vote fell and

they lost key figures like Rosie Mccauley in West Belfast,

Maeve McLaughlin in Foyle and Phil Flanagan in Fermanagh South Tyrone.

Questions are now being raised about their tactics.

Rosie Mccauley I know had been tipped, you know,

as a rising star within the party. Maeve McLaughlin, Health Committee,

quite a high profile politician, so that won't play out

well and I think that's quite a disappointment for them,

and what we have seen for a party that is

known for its discipline, known for its strict photo management

is that in a few constituencies, there have been a few upsets,

so Fermanagh South Tyrone's mess of a selection process has come

back to bite them.

They've lost a seat there to the SDLP, that won't play out well.

For the SDLP it's been a painful few days. Dolores Kelly lost

her seat, as did deputy leader Ferghal McKinney.

I think it has been a very poor election result.

They're losing parts of their heartlands,

so, for example, South Belfast, which was always strong for them,

losing their deputy leader there, also Foyle, again which was

the city of the SDLP, it was the John Hume territory.

To lose their third seat there is incredibly difficult

and also the problem for many SDLP candidates is

they're coming in on those final seats,

but of course at the next Assembly election,

there will be less seats to go around, so that does cause

some problems and does put the future of the party into question.

Going down to roughly 11 seats is pretty much alliance of the SDLP.

For the UUP it's been a difficult time.

Their candidate Jenny Palmer took a seat from the DUP in Lagan Valley,

but that was a rare victory.

Mike Nesbitt wrote himself a letter before the election

predicting the outcome and its contents were revealed on the BBC.

I'm going to formally open this now, OK?

And you posted this and then

you put this in your desk, did you? Right.

The Ulster Unionists must now examine why

they failed to win more seats?

I think that we all had wrongly predicted that there would be

a resurgence of votes for the Ulster Unionists and there isn't

and I think there's a very simple reason for that.

Mike Nesbitt's message was quite mixed, it was quite muddled.

In some ways he tried to appeal to the middle ground, in some ways

he tried to play to the hard line. I don't think that quite worked,

whereas the DUP had a very direct message.

It was keep Arlene as First Minister,

it was vote for the union.

The Alliance Party

retained their number of Stormont seats, but their vote fell.

I think they'll be very disappointed,

although they'll be delighted to hold on to those eight seats,

but to a certain extent, it was more by luck than anything else.

They're not as healthy as they were in 2011.

It was a good election for some of the smaller parties with

the Greens and People Before Profit making gains.

New faces like Eamonn McCann, Gerry Carroll and Clare Bailey will add

a new dimension to the Assembly's much-publicised naughty corner.

There's a lot of talk about how Eamonn McCann will slot in.

He's not an establishment figure, let's face it.

He's not one for rules and regulations,

so I think that will make for interesting viewing.

We already had Jim Allister as a one-man opposition.

Now we have his political polar opposite in Eamonn McCann,

but also someone who's likely to make a few waves.

So now that all the results are in, what happens next?

Some observers say the Ulster Unionists

and the SDLP must consider opposition.

There's very little to be gained in a smaller executive for the UUP

and the SDLP to go into it, because at the same time, you're going

to have a bolstered DUP and you're going to have a Sinn Fein that's going to be hunkering down,

so there's going to be very little in it for the DUP and Sinn Fein to

really kick any decent breadcrumbs towards the SDLP or the UUP.

When the official function is there now for opposition, it would

be madness if they didn't take it up.

In the days ahead, talks about a programme for government will

dominate the political agenda. The electorate have made their decision.

Now the class of 2016 have some key decisions of their own to make.

Stephen Walker rounding up the weekend's events for us there.

All of the five main parties saw their share of the vote drop.

We'll hear from them in just a moment.

Let's take a look at that share though.

The DUP is out in front with just over 29%.

Sinn Fein is on 24%. The Ulster Unionists on 12.6.

The SDLP just behind on 12 and Alliance on 7%.

Let's compare that to 2011.

We can see they've all dropped, in fact, some more than others.

With me now to discuss that and other issues

are the Ulster Unionist Party's Christopher Stalford,

Sinn Fein's John O'Dowd,

Naomi Long from the Alliance Party,

the Ulster Unionist Robin Swann

and Nichola Mallon from the SDLP.

So, welcome to all of you,

we've got plenty of time to talk about what happened

over the campaign -

what went right, what went wrong and to look to the future

and how that might shape up.

Christopher Stalford first of all.

The DUP campaign seems to have chimed with a lot of voters,

does that mean, from where you're sitting,

the DUP now speaks for Unionism?

Yes, we do.

I'm delighted with the result party has had.

To have polled over 200,000 votes

is the first time we've been over 200,000 votes

across Northern Ireland since 2007.

I think there are a couple of people who must be thanked for the result,

particularly our director of elections, Nigel Dodds.

He ran an absolutely tight ship,

and I'm delighted with the result the party has achieved

in this election, it's a mandate to endorse the vision

that was outlined by our leader, Arlene Foster...

-It was all about Arlene.

-Well, Arlene was the leader of our party

and was very much front and centre of our campaign,

and I think the result we have got

reflects the huge support there is in the country

for her continuing to be the First Minister of Northern Ireland.

So that's the positive side. But as we said in the introduction,

it is worth noting that all the main parties' votes are down.

The DUP by almost 1%. Second Assembly drop in a row for the DUP.

What does that say about voter disengagement?

We went into this election with 38 seats.

All of the commentators - all - said we would drop seats.

-They said you might.

-Well, we came back with 38 seats.

After ten years in government as the lead party in government,

to come back with the same number of seats that we got five years ago

is a tremendous achievement.

To be over 200,000 votes for the first time since 2007

is also a great achievement.

Let's not be begrudging. We had a good election.

It was a good result and it is a mandate

for Arlene to take forward the vision that she outlined

for the next five years.

OK. John O'Dowd, Would you say it was a good seat for Sinn Fein?

You're down a seat, you're down 2.9%.

Well, we are a party in government, as Christopher said,

most of the parties round the table have been active in government

for ten years and in leadership positions for ten years.

I suspect, if you look across Western Europe,

many parties in government for that length of time

during one of the worst recessions to hit the global economy,

would be delighted to be able to return the vast majority

of their MLAs and hold on, largely, to the percentage of their vote.

Quite frankly, I'm more interested in what happens next.

The election is over.

It's a very important event in any democratic society,

but what we now need to do is knuckle down and get the programme

for government sorted out and start delivering services for society.

Start making the positive changes that are required in our society

and tackle the huge challenges

that are in front of us in the months and years ahead.

But there are lessons that you have to learn.

Gerry Kelly was sitting where you are sitting now, yesterday,

and he said we will have an inquiry

into what went wrong in our campaign,

and ask some serious questions.

Because it didn't all go according to plan - in Foyle, Fermanagh

and South Tyrone, West Belfast,

Upper Bann, you know, you and Cat Seeley squeezed home

and squeezed Dolores Kelly out at the end,

but it looked at one stage like you could not deliver what you hoped.

-Well...

-You could have lost out.

Well, let's start in reverse order.

PR elections are not about topping the poll.

PR elections are about winning seats,

that's what we achieved in Upper Bann.

You use the term, inquiry, review, whatever you wish to use.

Every political party around this table

will review their results and how they fought this election.

I do believe we have to look at what we achieved in Upper Bann

and how we can replicate that in other areas.

It's not about romping home in the first count,

it's not about topping the poll, it's about winning seats.

Yeah. But you didn't win a third seat in Foyle

and you brought your party leader home from Mid Ulster

to take a third seat.

He took a seat. Maeve McLaughlin doesn't have a job tomorrow.

Well...it is a huge loss for the party losing Maeve McLaughlin.

-Phil Flanagan doesn't have a job.

-As an MLA...

Maeve McLaughlin will continue to be a Sinn Fein activist,

campaigner and worker.

-And the same for other candidates who lost out?

-Yes.

-Rosie McCorley... Yes.

-All...

-All...

-I'm sure they'd rather be an MLA?

-Of course they would.

The same as if John O'Dowd had lost his seat yesterday,

we as Sinn Fein activists put ourselves forward

to represent the party

and we take the chances and risks of electoral politics.

Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose.

But what we will still continue to do

is put forward a radical alternative

in terms of our policies and politics.

We will stand by our manifesto commitments.

We fought on the basis that we were going into government.

Others fought on the basis that we might be opposition,

we might go into government, we're not sure what we're going to go.

We are going into government.

Right. Robin Swann, Mike Nesbitt sat here yesterday

and put his hands up and said that this election campaign

from an Ulster Unionist perspective was not a success.

Your share is down -

but critically you did not grow the number of seats.

You had 16 in 2011, you have 16 in 2016.

Well, we had 13 in the last Assembly, we've now 16.

We took back the seats that we lost through defections.

And we had a couple of close misses.

Even he did not try to make that point yesterday,

he conceded the fact that you got 16 in 2011, you got 16 in 2016.

I'm not going to argue, but we had a couple of close misses.

We made mistakes. We will learn from them.

-What were those mistakes?

-There was a number of vote management issues

we'll look at seriously.

You think it's vote management rather than...

explaining to the electorate

precisely what the Ulster Unionist Party stands for?

We heard from a lot of people yesterday

that it was a lack of a simple, straightforward,

clear message that cost the Ulster Unionist Party that growth

and was the reason for the success of the DUP.

We were fighting Project Fear, Arlene or Martin.

That's the message we were continually fighting on the doors.

It was a hard message to fight against.

No matter what detail in policy we put forward,

-it was all about Arlene.

-It was very successful.

-Can I respond?

Listen, we'll come back to you about it in a moment or two.

I know you'll not accept it but it is a bit of a lame excuse.

The others were better than us and they confused people?

It's your job as a politician to get a clear, simple message

out there to inspire the electorate, and you failed to do that.

They don't know what you represent, are you progressive or hardline?

Hard to tell.

We are a progressive party and we put forward progressive policies.

Not progressive when you pulled out of the Executive on

the issue of trusting Sinn Fein and the DUP stayed there.

That was the risk we took

and what we thought was right to do at that stage.

-And on reflection, was it wrong?

-No.

It was the right thing to do at that stage.

We'll enter the discussions for a programme for government

and we'll see if those round the table

are putting forward a progressive programme...

So you are not clear at this moment

whether you will be inside or outside the tent?

We're going into negotiations, Mark. It's made clear by any

opposition person you have questioned including Mike Nesbitt.

We're not going to walk away from the programme

for government discussions.

We'll go in and see if we trust the people around the table

and see if it is a progressive forward-thinking programme

for government for Northern Ireland.

-And we'll make a judgment if we can trust the others.

-OK.

Nichola Mallon, where is the SDLP in all of this?

You can't argue that it was anything other than a disappointing election.

You had a new leader, you promised a great deal

and you go back two seats down on 2011.

It is always painful to lose MLAs.

I personally know Dolores and Gerard and Fearghal.

I'm not going to spin things,

we're very disappointed at losing those seats.

But in saying that, we have increased our vote

in a number of places.

18 of our 24 candidates were brand-new.

We have a new leader in post a couple of months

and we are undergoing significant renewal and change.

Rome wasn't built in a day.

We'll take a hard look at our election results -

but we have a new team and we are energised

and looking forward to being up in the Assembly.

Yeah. It's the worst SDLP result in terms of vote share ever

and in terms of Assembly representation.

As you said, all the main parties

have experienced a decline in their vote.

In North Belfast, in a lower turnout,

I increased the percentage on the actual vote.

We worked hard and we had losses in other areas

but in South Antrim, Roisin Lynch put in a very good fight.

She put the leader of the Alliance Party under pressure.

Connor Duncan in North Antrim put in a good fight too.

We need to build on that.

Where was the Colum Eastwood bounce? You should've done better

and had the wind in your backs with a new leader, should you not?

Certainly in the doors of North Belfast,

people were commenting on Colum Eastwood and recognising

that we are undergoing change,

that we see a significant change in the age of the people

coming into leadership positions in the SDLP.

So I know from speaking to people in North Belfast

that Colum was a factor, and for me it was a positive factor.

Yeah. Just look at where the SDLP has gone since 1998.

Back then, the year of the Good Friday Agreement,

178,000 votes. You topped the league table of all parties

in terms of the popular vote, 178,000 votes in 1998.

2016, 83,000. You have lost nearly 100,000 votes in 18 years.

Yes, and we have to change it, and we are determined to...

You didn't start to change it in this election.

In North Belfast,

we started to change it and in other constituencies.

But as I said, Rome wasn't built in a day,

and as a party undergoing significant change,

we'll need time to do that.

We said that to the voters,

and had honest conversations with voters on the doorstep.

OK. Naomi Long, not a great election

from the Alliance Party's perspective.

You had 8 and you have 8.

Yes, a different eight, which is important,

because we've new people in and we have refreshed the team.

It's always difficult,

when you look at people like Kieran McCarthy, Anna Lo,

who are real characters and big figures in their constituencies

and they are hard to replace.

So we've managed to do that and held our ground.

We did not make some of the gains we would've liked,

but we were runner-up in two constituencies

and within a couple of hundred votes

of gaining seats in others. So in many ways,

the strategy worked, in that we put the effort into those constituencies

where we thought gains were possible.

But we didn't have the luck on those last seats.

That happens. Some elections are lucky.

We squeezed 6 seats out of 3.7% of the vote in 2003.

I think we got all our luck we were ever going to get in that election.

We didn't have any this time around.

That's the way politics is.

But we have got our 8, we have a strengthened team

and I'm looking forward being there on Monday doing the job.

You got 8 this time round, it was a squeeze,

you got 8 more easily five years ago and there has been no growth.

Back in 1998, you had six MLAs.

In 2016, you have gone up two seats.

-Yeah.

-There is no big breakthrough, no groundswell of opinion.

As Northern Ireland has moved on and politics has moved on,

the Alliance Party has been stuck.

No, I don't think you can say we've been stuck,

we've improved in every election.

I agree that this election has not been good in terms of vote share.

You have to look at the micro stuff.

John was talking about PR elections, we weren't out to get easy seats,

we were out to put resources into those seats

where we thought we could make gains.

Those seats did not come through on this occasion,

but the cost of investing that resource in those seats

was, for example, a drop in our vote in Lagan Valley

and a drop in our vote in David Ford's own constituency.

Because David was a leader and led from the front.

Instead of knocking doors

in South Antrim where we knew we would hold our seat,

he knocked on doors in North Belfast where we were runners-up.

I think that is how you run an election campaign.

Well, on the issue of leadership which you have raised,

I will take the invitation to discuss it,

when you look at the success of the DUP's campaign,

putting a new leader, Arlene Foster, to the fore

and look at the lack of success

in your campaign, with you sitting in the wings,

maybe - maybe, making it all about Naomi,

we'd be having a very different conversation.

Well, the Alliance Party is not a personality cult,

so let's kill that dead.

-That's not what it's about.

-Maybe it should be?

-No -

it should be about progressive politics, policy.

It's not about one individual. It's about the team that we put forward.

David has done an amazing job as leader. There's no question.

He is one of the most generous people

I know in terms of the time he gives in other constituencies...

Sure, you can say that as deputy leader, but it is what voters think.

Voters maybe don't share that view?

That may or may not be the case,

but I don't this was a referendum on David Ford's leadership.

It was about individual constituencies...

But when you sit down, Naomi, as all the parties will do,

John O'Dowd has already conceded Sinn Fein will do it,

when you sit down as a party,

quietly in a room without any fanfare,

to look at the numbers and look at where the successes were

and where the failures were -

and there were more failures than successes -

are the men in suits going to tap him on the shoulder

and say maybe now the time has come, David?

Nobody is tapping David Ford on the shoulder to ask him to go.

I am sorry this has become such an obsession.

There is a huge amount of admiration

and respect for what David has achieved over his leadership.

He has taken Alliance to places we never thought we would be.

Let's be honest, we used to not be at the table in these debates,

because we were ignored.

We were relegated into the second division.

David has brought us to the table and given us a voice.

Anyone who has not seen what David has achieved

is not looking at the whole picture.

Do you think it is the cult of Arlene, celebrity politics?

Naomi Long says we shouldn't get into that.

-I think that was a sideswipe in your direction.

-No, it wasn't.

I'm just saying that's not what politics is about,

it's about policy.

It is not a popularity contest, and it shouldn't be.

Do you think the DUP turned it into a popularity contest?

I think the DUP had a successful election,

so whether they did or didn't, it worked.

I think that is insulting to the 202,000 people

who voted for our party in this election

and who endorsed the vision outlined by our leader -

to suggest that those people are in some way foolish or sheep,

who were herded into the voting booth is an insult to people.

What do you think they voted for?

-Did they vote for DUP policy?

-You didn't...

-I didn't.

Robin Swann implied it.

So what were people voting for?

-For DUP policy or...

-Yes.

..the DUP's record or Arlene and Arlene's vision,

or were they voting for the candidates

like Christopher Stalford?

What do you think motivated them?

A combination of all of those things

motivated people to vote for our party.

Or the fear factor, as Robin Swann says?

No, the fact of the matter is that in Scotland,

the election campaign there,

Labour wanted Kezia Dugdale to be the FM,

and the SNP said they wanted Nicola Sturgeon.

What sort of party would it be...

I can understand why some parties would want to hide their leader,

but what sort of party wants to hide their leader

from being in the front line of an election campaign?

Well, who hid their leader?

Well, I think some leaders were more prominent than others.

Who are you thinking of?

I didn't see an awful lot of Mike or Colum Eastwood during the election.

-Did you not?

-Not really.

-Where was Mike?

-Mike was visible.

He was around the constituencies.

Coming back to the letter Arlene sent my wife,

"a vote for anyone other than the DUP candidate

"would divide and weaken the pro-Union vote

"and allow Martin McGuinness to become First Minister."

In North Antrim...

The other election broadcast was sent through North Antrim.

Showed the percentage votes of the different parties,

-30% DUP and 26.9% Sinn Fein.

-Is that accurate?

-In North Antrim...

-What's your point?

That was the communication sent to North Antrim.

If the DUP were being open and honest about what they were doing,

that was the Project Fear factor out there...

-The subliminal message...

-The percentages shown on that paper...

-So that's the dog whistling?

-Yes, it is.

You are insulting not only your own constituents...

who voted for the DUP in greater numbers

than they voted for the Ulster Unionists in North Antrim

but you are insulting the 200,000 people

-who elected to support our party in this election...

-Right.

..because they believed in the vision of our party.

So, John O'Dowd, was the reference to Project Fear

an insult to Sinn Fein?

No - well, I didn't take it as an insult.

I don't like the style of politics.

I don't think it's going to work for the DUP in the years ahead.

Because there has been a shift and change in attitudes

across the electorate, I think, and I am thankful that across Upper Bann

I canvassed many areas,

and there was a Unionist voice and a Unionist vote in those areas.

I was pleasantly surprised by the reception I received on the doors.

Often in the past, you would've been chased

or people will have taken great exception

to you going to their door in the past.

Unionist electorate were willing to engage with me on the doorstep.

They put their point of view across as Unionists, but it was being done

in a way which was both amicable that we were able to share ideas

with each other and we could challenge each other,

and I don't think this fear of Sinn Fein

the DUP are promoting will work for them in the future.

People want to see the political parties working together.

Nichola, you within the SDLP

did endeavour to put your new leader forward, front and centre,

but it didn't make any difference.

As I said, round North Belfast, it made a difference.

Colum came to doors with me

and the doors I was at, people were passing comment

on the fact he was a new leader and they were liking what he was saying.

But across all 18 constituencies it didn't make the kind of difference

that you hoped it would make as you were down 2.2%,

you lost two seats in the Assembly.

He's been in post five months or so.

I believe we're starting to get a bounce,

people will see in this next Assembly

the calibre of Colum Eastwood as a leader.

But, Mark, If I could just say,

in relation to the discussion we've just had...

for me it's very simple.

The DUP tried to portray this phoney fight about who'd be top dog

and the truth is that Arlene and Martin

have to sign off on everything together.

So that was a thing I personally found insulting.

I don't know the people I spoke to personally found it insulting,

because it was a phoney fight.

Now, let me bring you in at this point.

Let's plant the past behind us, let's plant the election

and look to the future now because, I think to be fair to our viewers,

they want to hear what happens next. And the results are pretty clear

and we know who's going back to Stormont tomorrow.

The question I have, first of all for Naomi,

are you going to be part of the conversations

on the programme for government?

Because under the new executive, the bar you've got a clear,

as I understand it, to have a position in the executive

as of right, is 11. The Alliance party has eight.

If you've got eight, it may well be that the other four parties

get together in a room tomorrow to start the discussions

about the programme for government and you're outside the room.

It's the first opportunity we've had to seriously discuss this.

-That is a possibility.

-What is the state of play?

That is a possibility.

It depends whether other parties then decide that they want us

to be engaged in this discussion.

If some parties don't take their seats,

it might well fall to Alliance at some point

that we would have an entitlement.

So if other parties don't want us to be part of those negotiations,

that will be a decision they have to make.

We'll find out whether people want us

to be part of those negotiations, but no, we won't be there of right.

Which is a disappointment because we'd want to be there,

being able to influence what happens in the room.

But it depends, as I say, whether other parties will want us

to be there and be involved.

Christopher, do you have any knowledge?

Will the Alliance party be invited to those conversations or not?

With all due respect, Mark,

48 hours ago I was a councillor in Belfast City Council.

I'm now one of the most junior backbench assembly members.

-Your party has asked you to come on.

-Of course.

So I imagine you've had a conversation with the powers that be

and you know what the line is.

I'm sure that the view will be that as many parties as possible

should be involved in the discussions

around the programme of government,

and I'm sure that'll be the case.

So, you think that even though the Alliance party

is not entitled to be there,

the DUP would be magnanimous in the Alliance party's "defeat",

and invite it along to the table?

Let's not overstate it. It wasn't a defeat.

You're getting carried away with yourself, Mark, if I may say so.

Defeat to get 11 seats, Naomi, you know what I mean.

-Hang on, you know what I mean.

-We didn't cross the bar.

-Exactly.

It was not a defeat.

You didn't clear the bar, so you're not there as right.

You said that yourself. But you're going to be magnanimous.

It's not for me to dole out munificence to Naomi Long

or anyone else, but I do think...

I'm clarifying what you said

a minute ago, which seemed to suggest...

They are presently an executive party, so I would imagine

they'd be part of any discussions around the programme for government.

At very least, I'd imagine the party would want people like Steven

and David in the room to discuss the work programme that is left

from the departments which they exited at the election.

So I would imagine, at the very least,

they would want them engaged at that level.

OK, John O'Dowd, can you shed any light on this

from Sinn Fein's perspective?

Do you imagine that Alliance will be in those

programme for government discussions?

I think Naomi has summed it up there.

There's experience for both David and Steven

in relation to those departments they've left.

And they do have experience which is useful

for the rest of the political parties to be involved

in elements of the programme for government.

Perhaps the entirely around the programme for government.

But we want to see moving forward an assembly which is fully functional

and working and people are buying into a programme

of delivery and change for this session.

Right, Robin Swann, you said you want to be part of those

conversations and you're entitled to be part of those conversations.

But still you seriously want to be

part of a propping-up Project Fear in the executive?

We don't want to be part of what the last executive delivered.

We don't want to be part of more of the same,

we don't want to be part of 400,000 people on the waiting list.

So, what you what need to hear to persuade you that you want

Mike Nesbitt to be Minister for Education?

We want to hear what's in the discussions.

We want to hear what the other parties are putting on the table

for the programme for government.

Each party's set out a manifesto of different commitments and pledges.

We want to see what makes up the final programme for government.

And the see of the other parties are genuinely committed.

But your hunch is that you'd want to be in the executive

rather than in opposition?

We want to be part of the talks around programme for government.

That doesn't answer my question.

Is your hunch that you want to be in the executive or the opposition?

We want to be part of the talks around the programme for government.

You've asked every Ulster Unionist politician that has come on

and they've given you the same questions.

You're consistent on that, if nothing else. Right, Nichola.

What's your hunch about whether the SDLP should be in or out,

as far as the executive is concerned?

My hunch is the SDLP's position has been made very clear

and we have been consistently making clear.

We fought this election, we had a manifesto,

we have key policy pledges, we'll be going in tomorrow morning

to the Assembly, we'll be talking to the other parties.

But we want to see what the content of the programme for government is.

And if the content is strong, if it delivers on some of our key

policy pledges, then yes, we will be government.

If it doesn't, then we'll need to reflect upon that

and consider our position.

Or, of course, you could try to change it.

It's interesting that both yourself and Robin Swann talked about

what the other parties have in their draft programme for government.

Forgive me for saying, but it's almost as if the DUP and Sinn Fein

will hand or circulate some sort of document

-that you either agree with or disagree with.

-No, no.

Should you not be part of influencing

-the creation of that document?

-Absolutely.

Neither of you articulated it in quite that way though.

Perhaps if I say it like this.

We had a manifesto.

Clearly the policy pledges were costed.

Very clearly that was what we were standing in this election for.

And that will form the basis of our negotiation on the content

of the programme for government.

And as part of that negotiation, we will be listening and inputting.

And the truth is, we've already seen the bare bones

of a draft programme for government

in your two manifestos, Christopher.

-Yes, but...

-Yes.

-But it's not a two-party government.

But you're conceding we have seen the bare bones

of a draft programme for government?

No, you've seen us outlining our policies

and the positions we will take in terms of any negotiations

regarding a programme for government.

And they're remarkably similar to Sinn Fein's.

Well, what I would say is, if other parties have other ideas,

they should bring those forward, we'll have the discussions.

We should try and put together a programme for government

that can command the support of as many in the house as possible.

But you don't need their support.

-Well...

-What's the motivation for the DUP and Sinn Fein

to have the other parties involved?

The two of you can carve it up between you, and if they like it,

they can support you and join the executive.

If they don't like, they can lump it and go into opposition.

So why would you be generous to them? I don't understand.

Well, I don't think, to be fair, the SDLP in particular

ran on a platform saying vote for us to be the opposition.

I think they ran on a position of wanting to be

in the government of Northern Ireland.

The only way you can influence events in Northern Ireland

in terms of delivering for your constituency is to be at the table.

I understand that. I'm asking you why you would be

so generous all of a sudden to your political opponents?

It's not a case of me being generous, they've been mandated

by the people who voted for them to be there in government.

And if the people who voted for them mandated them

to be there in government, then I think

they should serve people who voted for them by being present.

So you make it clear

you'd rather they were in government than in opposition.

It's entirely a matter for the Ulster Unionist Party and the SDLP.

But from my perspective, I don't think the electorate

voted for either of those parties to not fulfil their obligations.

The people voted for them to be in the Assembly,

not necessarily to be in the executive.

I don't think people voted for an opposition,

they voted for those parties to be present in government.

John O'Dowd, would you like to have a two-party executive,

just yourselves and the DUP?

Would that be handier, cosier, easier?

I believe in the principles of the Good Friday Agreement.

And the Good Friday Agreement says

we shall have a power sharing executive,

and that's a power sharing executive including

all those parties you have a mandate to be in government.

But if you're in government, you're in government.

And what we witnessed from the Ulster Unionist Party and the SDLP

over this last five years was an opposition platform in government

which destabilised the executive,

which I think caused greater negativity in society

and caused suspicion of politics. So I hope the SDLP

and the Ulster Unionist Party go into government,

but I hope they go into government to govern, not to be an opposition

because if they're going to be an opposition,

go outside the executive

be an opposition cos there's nothing either of the two parties...

I don't fear them being an opposition,

I don't fear them being in government,

but I do have serious concerns that the agenda of "in, out,

"we're not sure if we're in government,

"we're not sure if we're an opposition,"

it's damaging the political institution.

But I think, and they can speak for themselves,

the criticism of the three smaller parties in the executive last time

around was the fact that their voice wasn't sufficiently

well heard by the two main parties, and that's why they were annoyed.

Hang on. The electorate have just spoken.

The only reason why Christopher and I represent the two largest parties

is because the electorate went out on Thursday

and made us the two largest parties.

As you refer to the smaller parties,

the electorate decided in numbers to vote

and put them into positions they're in. That's democracy.

-Naomi.

-I think that that overstates how it was in the executive.

I have to say, our minister has achieved a lot despite being there.

Yeah, but they're frustrated as well.

We've heard from David Ford and Stephen Farry

-about how frustrating it was.

-Of course,

and we were clear about that.

But to be fair, I think if you ask any minister in the last executive

they'll point to issues where they were frustrated,

where they couldn't deliver.

The issue is whether or not you work constructively

with the other people around the table.

And we endeavoured to do that - but what I want to say is this.

There was a difference

in terms of how we dealt with the justice ministry

and that we got that after negotiations on the programme

for government, and David Ford has been very clear in paying tribute.

And to both the DUP and Sinn Fein

that when they got the deal for justice

around what the programme would be

they stuck to their word and allowed him to deliver within that remit.

Now if that happens,

that didn't happen around the wider executive last time.

If that happens around the executive this time

and people continue to stick to their word on those issues,

I don't think that any party that has something to offer

has anything to fear from being part of it.

I don't think I overstated it as far as the Ulster Unionist's

position is concerned.

Danny Kennedy at DRD was absolutely raging at the way

he was treated by the two bigger parties.

He was, and he was continually financially hamstrung by DUP

through monitoring rounds and through a decrease in budget.

As was Michael McGimpsey before him as health minister.

But all the ministers were.

You'd be willing to guarantee this round,

you'd want to guarantee this time...

He left a £20 million shortfall in his own budget.

It was the £20 million that was meant to come out...

They expected the executive to take the money out of health

and education and other places to fill the £20 million hole

he deliberately left in DRD.

That's £20 million that should have been in his budget.

OK, let's not fight that old battle again.

But the point is you would want to be sure that that scenario

wasn't going to replay in the next mandate

if you're going to go into the executive.

Is that the point?

And that's why we put that forward before 2011.

And that's why it's taking part now,

that we do the programme for government before we run the hunt.

In fairness, that has been our position since 1998.

And we actually made it work around justice

by engaging with people. And to be fair,

to hide behind things like cuts in your budget to say that was

the only reason you didn't deliver,

it's also by the calibre of your minister

and how they manage the budget.

Quick final thought, Nichola, on this, before I take one final issue.

Just to say the SDLP was very frustrated

by the culture within the executive.

But under the ministers that we had,

we think we can stand on a strong track record.

When the SDLP hold ministries they get things done.

I want to ask you about one issue

which has blown up on social media today,

and I am going put it first to Christopher.

I want to get a reaction from John.

There's a lot of Twitter reaction to a post that Gregory Campbell

put on Facebook. I don't know if you've seen it,

Christopher Stalford. He says, "Excellent election results.

"Sinn Fein long term plan just got an awful lot longer

"and breaking the habit of a lifetime to send best wishes

"to Raymond McCartney, Shinner MLA in Foyle - why, you may ask?

"Because he's a bit more successful at electioneering

"than he was at hunger striking."

How's that appropriate?

Well, I think those that are reacting to comments

that were made on social media, a lot of contrived anger around this.

I think it was a throwaway joke remark...

-Was it?

-..by Gregory.

And I think a lot of those who are expressing fury and outrage

were a lot less slow in expressing their fury and outrage

at some of the Twitter comments that have been made recently

by the eccentric president of Sinn Fein.

So you think it was perfectly reasonable for him to put that up?

Well, look, I think if the worst that Gregory Campbell does

to a Sinn Fein representative is insult him,

there are people who have from a republican background

who have done a lot worse to Gregory Campbell down through the years,

and that includes attmepts to murder him and his family.

John, other Sinn Fein representatives

have been pretty unhappy

and have demanded that those remarks be withdrawn.

What's your view?

I think in this era they should be withdrawn.

And we're talking about going in to discuss a programme

for government, and have mutual respect,

mutual trust, mutual understanding within that.

But Gregory Campbell's a fool,

and he's away now to Westminster to retire.

I wish him well, staying over there.

And does that kind of spat, as we bring this conversation to an end,

really augur well for the future?

No, cos I don't think Gregory Campbell

represents the vast majority within the DUP.

I think the man is a loose cannon with the DUP.

I believe, and it's my experience over this last five years,

and last number of weeks,

-the unionist community want to work with republican...

-OK.

-And the republican community wants to work with unionist.

-Christopher.

I think Gregory Campbell's a valued member of our party,

a very strong constituency Member of Parliament in East Londonderry.

Not a fool? He's gone to Westminster to retire.

No, he's not. And were he, he would not have been elected so many times

by the people of the East Londonderry constituency.

And I know the circumstances around Gregory's family

and himself have been targeted many times by republicans for murder.

-Yeah, you said that.

-But let's keep these things in perspective.

You said it, we haven't got time to say it again.

And the president of Sinn Fein...

You've said that as well. Naomi, you're shaking your head.

I genuinely think that it is time

that Gregory stops trying to be funny,

because it falls flat on every occasion.

It's insulting to the electorate,

it's insulting to the people that he attacks.

It isn't amusing, it's childish and pathetic,

and frankly somebody should take over his social media account.

And I would give the same advice to a lot of other politicians,

including Gerry Adams over the last while.

Somebody needs to manage their accounts,

because when they go on these outbursts

they do politics no service.

We need to leave it there, folks. Thank you all very much.

No doubt we will hear a lot more from you weeks and months ahead.

Now, while Arlene Foster may be basking

in a job well done this weekend,

some party leaders might have other thoughts.

We'll hear more on that in a moment,

but first here's the Sinn Fein president Gerry Adams

who was at the Belfast count.

Tara Mills asked him if there was any disappointment on his part

that People Before Profit had topped the poll in his old constituency.

Ranting at something or shouting at something about something

or protesting about something is all very well. It isn't a policy.

What we're actively doing, and it's there, the proof is there,

is tackling the issue of poverty,

tackling the issue of disadvantage, deprivation, housing, homelessness

all of those issues, bringing jobs in,

pressing ahead with equality, working towards Irish unity,