30/04/2017 Sunday Politics South East

It's Sunday Morning, and this is the Sunday Politics.

Theresa May says she has no plans to increase tax levels,

but refuses to repeat David Cameron's 2015 manifesto

promise ruling out hikes in VAT, national insurance and income tax.

The leaders of the EU's 27 member states unanimously

agree their negotiating strategy for the upcoming Brexit talks, but

And in the last of our series of interviews ahead of Thursday's

In the capital this week: to the leader of Plaid Cymru Leanne

They hit an all-time low after coalition government,

but are the Lib Dems poised to bounce back,

And with me to analyse the week's politics,

Isabel Oakeshott, Steve Richards, Tom Newton-Dunn.

They'll be tweeting using the hashtag #bbcsp.

So when Theresa May was interviewed just over an hour ago

on The Andrew Marr Show, the Prime Minister was asked

to confirm that she would repeat David Cameron's 2015 election

promise not to raise VAT, national insurance and income tax

We have absolutely no plans to increase the level of tax,

but I'm also very clear that I don't want to make specific proposals

on taxes unless I'm absolutely sure that I can deliver on those.

But it is, would be my intention as a Conservative Government

and a Conservative Prime Minister, to reduce the taxes

The Tories like to have a clear tax message in elections, are they

getting into a bit of a mess? That method wasn't clear, but does it

mean, saying they have no plans to increase the level of tax? We are

clear there will not be a rise in VAT, a lot of commentators will get

overexcited about that, but there was no great expectations there

would be a rise in VAT. Tempting as it is, because even one percentage

point on VAT rate is 4.5 billion for the exchequer so it is tempting but

there has been no speculation that would happen. We can see that she

clearly wants to reiterate the language about hard-working families

but I don't think we are that much the wiser. Even if she does not put

up rates, according to projections the overall tax burden, as a

percentage of GDP, is rising, will rise in the years ahead. That is why

it was an odd phrase, I know she is doing it to be evasive but to say

they have no plans to raise the general level of taxation, they do

have. We also know they have specific plans because it was in the

last budget, they had a tax rise which they had to revise, National

Insurance rises, so very wisely in my view they are keeping options

open, the 2015 tax-and-spend debate was a fantasy world, totally

unrelated to the demands that would follow. They now have the

flexibility, one of the arguments you had heard last time was Philip

Hammond saying to her, we have to break away from the 2015 manifesto

commitment and we can only do it this way, that is one of the better

arguments. The Tories like to talk about tax cuts in elections, whether

they do it is another matter, but they are not being allowed to talk

about tax cuts, they are now on the defensive over whether they will

raise taxes. That is not a healthy position for the campaign to be in.

If you look at the numbers, quite frankly, if you will not do this at

this election with eight 20 point lead over Labour, then when will you

take these tough decisions? Reading between the lines of what Theresa

May has said all over different broadcasters this morning, income

tax will go down for low-income families, such as the threshold rise

that microbes that was already factored in. She has had to commit

to it again. VAT will be fat, national insurance contributions

will go up. Do you think they will go up? I think so, she had plenty of

opportunity to rule it out and she didn't. There was a terrible mess

with the budget, it is a good tax argument but not a good electoral

argument that you are eroding the base so heavily with people moving

into self-employment that as you raise national insurance

contributions for everybody but the self-employed, it is something the

Treasury will have to look at. The other triple lock on pensions, we

don't know if they will keep to that either? If they are sensible they

will find a form of words to give them flexibility in that area as

well. I would say there is no question over that, that has gone.

As Mrs May would say, you will have to wait for the manifesto. That is

what all the party leaders tell me! Labour have spent the weekend

pushing their messages Speaking at a camapign rally

in London yesterday, Jeremy Corbyn promised a Labour

government would fix what he called People are fed up, fed up with not

being able to get somewhere to live, fed up waiting for hospital

appointments, fed up with 0-hours contracts, fed up with low pay, fed

up with debt, fed up with not being able to get on in their lives

because we have a system that is rigged against so many.

I've been joined from Newcastle by Labour's elections

and campaigns co-ordinator, Ian Lavery.

Good morning. To deal with this rigged economy, as Mr Corbyn calls

it, the Shadow Chancellor John McDonnell has a 20 point plan for

workers out today. When you add up everything he plans to do to help

workers, how much will it cost? The full costings, one thing I need to

say at the very beginning, the costings of any policy which we have

already ruled out and any policy we will be ruling out in the next few

days and weeks will be fully costed in the manifesto and in addition to

the fact that it will be fully costed, we will see it in the

manifesto how indeed it has been funded, so we are very clear,

anything we have seen already, and there are some exciting policy

releases and there will be more in the future, anything we are going to

do will be fully costed and in the manifesto. You announced a 20 point

plan but cannot tell me what the costs will be this morning so at the

moment it is a menu without prices? It is not a menu without prices, it

is a fantastic opportunity. This 20 point plan is something which will

transform the lives of millions of millions of people in the

workplace... But what is the cost? It will be welcomed by many people

across the UK. The fact the costings have not been released, you will

have to be patient, it will be released very clearly, it will

identify that in the manifesto. Let me come down to one of the points,

the end of the public sector pay freeze. Can you give us any idea how

much that will cost? The end of the public sector pay freeze, so

important to the future of the Labour Party, it is an massive

policy decision. Let me say at this stage, Theresa May, the Prime

Minister, this morning, on The Andrew Marr Show, did not have the

common decency, courtesy all respect to condone the fact that nurses, the

heroes of the NHS, have had a reduction of nearly 14% in their

wages since 2010 and are using food banks to feed themselves! Does that

not say everything that is wrong with today's society? So can you

tell me what it will cost, which is what my question was? What I will

say is everything the Labour Party pledges, everything that we come out

with, what we will roll out between now and the 8th of June, will be

fully costed, people will be very much aware of how much the costings

will be, where the funding will come from, when the manifesto is

published. What about doubling paternity leave, nu minimum wage,

four new bank holidays, any idea what it will

cost? These are exciting new proposals and of course today cost

money but we are the sixth richest economy in the world. It is about

redistribution of the wealth we create. We are seeing growth in the

economy, it is how we utilise the finances in the best way we possibly

can for a fairer society for the many and not the few. You just can't

tell me how much it will cost? That is why I will repeat again that you

need to be very patient. Do you know the cost yourself? You are the head

of the campaign, do you know the cost of these things yourself? I am

very much aware of how much the costings are likely to be, they have

been identified, they will be published in the manifesto. You

really do understand I would not be releasing today, live on your show,

any costings or predictions with regards the manifesto. Why not? You

have released the policy, why not the cost? Because there is a fine

detail and we will identify it to the general public in the manifesto.

We not only explain how much it will cost but we will explain where the

funding comes from. Be patient. Will some of the costs be met by

increasing taxes? I would think at this point in time there is not any

indication to increase basic taxes and again the taxes and spending of

the Labour Government with the proposals of the 20 point plan, the

issues we have got, housing, the NHS, crime, education will all be

identified with the costings in the publication. Can you tell us this

morning, we'll tax for most people rise or not to finance this? We in

the Labour Party are looking to a fair tax system which will be

clearly identified in the manifesto. Mr McDonnell also wants to ban all

0-hours contracts. Would that include those who actually like

those contracts? There are nearly 1 million, depending on which figured

you'd use, there are nearly 1 million people on zero-hours

contract and the vast proportion of those want to be able to live a

decent life, a secure life, they want to understand whether they will

be at work the next day, they're included hours... I understand a lot

of people don't like zero-hours contract and your proposal will

address that, but there are those, I saw one survey where 65% of people

on zero-hours contract like the flexibility it gives them. Will you

force them off zero-hours contract or if they like them will they

continue with them? We will discuss it with employee is to make sure

individuals in the workplace have the right to negotiate hours in that

workplace. Guaranteed hours is very, very important. Zero-hour contracts

are an instrument in which employers abuse and exploit mainly young

people, mainly female people in the workplace. We would be banning

zero-hour contract. But there are those, students for example, who

like them, would they be forced off zero-hour contracts in your

proposal? Our proposal would be banning zero-hour contract and

introducing contracts which have set hours in the workplace. You also say

no company will be able to bid for a public contract unless the boss

earns no more than 20 times the lowest paid, or the average wage,

I'm not quite sure which. What would happen if British Aerospace bids to

build more joint strike Fighters and the boss is paid more than 20 times?

I understand the point you raise but we have an obscene situation in this

country, Andrew, in which the bosses at the very top make an absolute

fortune... But what would happen then? Who would build joint strike

Fighters... The difference in wages between the top earners in the

country and the people in the factories, in the workshops,

producing the goods, is vast. I understand that is the reason you

want a ratio. What I am saying is, what happens if the ratio is

greater? Who gets the contract if not British Aerospace? Who else

builds the planes? We are going to introduce a wage rate CEO of one to

20. -- wage ratio. We want to close the gap between the people at the

very top and people who produce the goods. Let me try one more Time, who

would build the joint strike fighter? We would look at the issue

as it came along but the policy is clear... Can you name a single

defence contractor weather boss' salary is less than 20 times average

earnings? We are not reducing, we have rolled that out as part of this

fantastic plan to transform society to get rid of discrimination, to try

and bring together our communities. We will introduce a pay ratio of one

to 20. Fair enough, thank you very much.

It's a month after the triggering of Article 50, and EU leaders -

with the exception of Britain - met in Brussels this weekend

to agree their opening negotiating stance, to get the divorce

It is inside this psychedelic chamber where Britain's 'Grexit'

future will be decided over the next two years, but there is a vast gulf

in rhetoric coming from the UK and the EU. With parallel narratives

emerging for both sides. There is broad agreement that an orderly

withdrawal is in the interests of both sides. But Theresa May's

position is that the terms of our future trade deal should be

negotiated alongside the terms of our divorce. Meanwhile the EU says

the terms of the UK's exit must be decided before any discussion on a

future trade deal can begin. But don't forget that divorce

settlement. Don't remind me. In Brussels, many think written should

pay even more, while in the UK ministers said the divorce bill

should be capped at 3 billion. After you. Thank you.

For are you looking forward to it? Isn't that divorce bill a bit high?

Isn't this about punishing Britain? We are very united, you all seem so

surprised but it's a fact. How soon can we get a deal? We have to wait

for the elections. It was the decision of Mrs May. It took over an

hour for the leaders to make their entrances but once inside it's just

a few minutes to agree the negotiating guidelines. They set out

three main areas. The first phase of talks on the divorce settlement will

deal with the existing financial commitments to the EU, the Northern

Ireland border and the rights of EU citizens in the UK. They said a UK

trade agreement can be discussed when the first phase of talks

reaches significant progress. And that there must be unity in the

negotiations, that individual EU members won't negotiate separately

with the UK. They are quite good here at negotiating because they are

used to it. They set a maximum and then they have to recede a little

bit depending on what the other side is prepared to offer. I think there

is room for manoeuvre in some issues, but I don't think some of

the baseline things will change that much. For example I don't think the

European Union will concede on the rights of citizens who are already

in the UK. It will be very difficult for them to accept that they will

not be any exit bill, and the question of Northern Ireland is very

important as well, the hard order question. The baseline things are

not going to move that much, then you have room for manoeuvring

between. On security, defence and the fight against terrorism, the

guidelines said the EU stands ready to work together. And after lunch,

friendly signs from some EU leaders as they gave individual press

conferences. Paul and said the talks should open doors to new

opportunities and even German Chancellor Angela Merkel, who had

earlier said some in Britain were deluded about Brexit, softened her

tone saying there was no conspiracy against the UK. Unity was the

buzzword at this summit and for once everybody seemed to be sticking to

the script. That unity is not only amongst the 27 states, it's also

among the institutions so many of the divisions we have seen in the

past at European level do not exist. That is very important and it's not

be unity that is directed somehow against the UK because I think we

all want this to be an orderly process and part of that is that the

EU side is unified. So although there are no surprises here, what

took place in this room was a significant step towards the real

Brexit negotiations which will begin soon after the general election in

June, said to be the most complex the UK has faced in our lifetimes.

Isabel, Steve and Tom are still with me.

Isabel, doesn't the British media have to be a bit careful here? We

would never take at face value anything a British politician tells

us. We would question it, put it in context and wonder if they are

bluffing, but we seem to take at face value anything a European

politician says about these negotiations. You only have to look

at the front page of the Sunday Times today to see that. They quoted

at length Juncker, who didn't like the food at the reception and this

and that, and I think the mood is very optimistic. The key thing is

the EU trade Commissioner has said we will get a free trade deal and a

lot of people seem to be wilfully ignoring that incredibly big

concession. That is what will happen in their view. Everything that is

said at the moment needs a slight rerun over. They are all in

negotiating positions, plus we seem to be completely unaware that they

all have their own domestic constituencies as well. Angela

Merkel has an important election coming up in September,

Euroscepticism is quite different from Britain of course, but there's

a different kind of euro scepticism in Germany, she has got to deal with

that. Of course she has, which is why you are right, nothing should be

taken too seriously out of the mouths of British politicians or

European politicians until October this year. We have got to wait for

the French elections, then German elections, and if you look through

this you can see a way forward. There's no trade talks until pay up,

but what was actually written was no trade talks until we make

significant progress on the money. You can define significant progress

in a lot of ways but come December, fireworks over the summer, we all

get very excited about it, in these chairs I'm sure, come December

things will look a lot smoother. The German elections are at the end of

September but I've seen reports in German press, depending how it goes

it could take until Christmas before a new coalition government is put

together. The Brussels long-standing negotiating tactic of nothing is

agreed until everything is agreed, then I guess the British could say

we agree a certain sum of money if that's what it takes but that

depends on them, what good trade deal we get. If we don't get that,

the sum of money is off the table. In that sense, the two are going

parallel. However, I wouldn't entirely dismiss what people are

saying in their pre-election periods to their own electorates because

they have to some extent to deliver subsequently. Of course Angela

Merkel is campaigning and electioneering, who wouldn't, she

has a tough election to fight, but she is measured and thoughtful and

when she says things like some of the British are delusional, that is

unusually strong language for her. What was she referring to? I don't

know, it wasn't specific. Have the cake and eat it perhaps the

sequencing the British don't want. When they thought the British

government was going to effectively demand membership of the single

market, that's not going to happen now. Unless you sign up to the four

pillars, that's the cake and eat it proposition, which they are right in

saying Theresa May has made. But everybody has access, even with no

deal you have access. The other side of it is I think there will be a

united position from them. And so, as somebody pointed out in that

report, they are experienced, tough negotiators, so I don't think it

will be quite as easy as some think. I spoke to one of those who drew up

Article 50 and they said to me they deliberately put this two year

timetable in to make it impossible for anybody to think about leaving.

This is really tight, this negotiation. Easy, it isn't.

This coming Thursday, voters up and down the country

will be going to the polls in this year's local elections.

Over the past few weeks I've interviewed representatives

of the Conservative Party, Labour, the Liberal Democrats,

Today it's the turn of Plaid Cymru and the SNP.

A little earlier I spoke Alex Salmond, who until 2014

I started by asking him why Scots should vote SNP in local elections

when the Scottish Government had just cut central Government funding

It's actually a funding increase going into Scottish councils this

year, and if you look at the funding position for example between

Scottish councils and those in England, which are obviously

directly related through the Barnett formula, the funding in Scotland has

been incomparably better than that in England so there's a whole range

of the -- of reasons... What's happening south of the border

indicates the protection the Scottish Parliament has been able to

put in that helps vital services in Scotland. But there hasn't been a

funding increase, the block grant from Westminster to Edinburgh was

increased by 1.5% in real terms but the grant to councils was cut by

2.6%. It was going to be a cut of 330 million, the Greens got you to

reduce it to 170 million but it is still a cut of 2.6%. Your own

Aberdeenshire Council has had a cut to 391 million. You have cut the

money to councils. Yes, but councils have available to them more

resources this year, and as you say the budget increased that further

which is why we put forward an excellent local government budget in

Aberdeenshire and resisted a Tory attempts to knock ?3 million off...

You asked me about Aberdeenshire, and Aberdeenshire has put forward a

budget for investment expansion and resisted a Tory attempts to knock ?3

million off the education budget, and I'm very grateful you have given

me the opportunity to make that point. The Government in Edinburgh

has cut the money to Aberdeenshire by ?11 million. It is a cut. But

there is an investment budget in Aberdeenshire that has been made

available by the ability to increase the council tax by 2.5% after a

nine-year freeze in Scotland, and that has brought more resources into

local government and that's why the butchered in Aberdeenshire has been

an investment budget including protection of the education budget

in the face of a Tory and liberal attempt to cut bit. You have to

compare what is happening in Scotland and England, and there's no

doubt Scottish local authorities have been much better funded than

those in England over the last few years and that's been the ability of

the Scottish Government to protect the services at local level. A good

reason for voting SNP. If they have been so well funded, why after a

decade of SNP rule do one in five Scottish pupils leave primary school

functionally illiterate? You have got to take these things... Nicola

Sturgeon has made it a top priority to address these challenges but

let's take another statistic. 93% of Scottish kids are now emerging from

school to positive destinations, that means to further education,

apprenticeships or work. Why are one in five functionally illiterate? You

argue one statistic, I'm arguing Scottish education is putting in

some substantially good performances like the 93% going on to positive

destinations. You can't have a failing education system if you have

got that 93%, and incidentally a record low youth unemployment in

Scotland without the second lowest unemployment rate in Europe. These

pupils are being prepared by the Scottish education system. Let's

take the figures in the round on education. It's so important. Under

your watch, under your government, the Scottish schools in the most

important global comparison have fallen from tenth to 19th in

science, and 11 to 24th in maths, that is a record of decline and

failure. That is by the OECD and first questions about that, but the

OECD has also described Scotland is one of the best educated societies

in the world. That was from the school system in previous years gone

by. For those who are currently in Scottish schools, you have fallen

from 11th to 24th in mathematics. The OECD was commenting on

introduction of the new curriculum for excellence in which they have

given a resounding thumbs up to it, and that's the same source as the

rankings which you are comparing. Nicola Sturgeon has said there are

challenges on Scottish education, particularly the access through the

education system and the attainment gap but don't tell me it's failing

when 55% of our pupils have gone on to higher education. That's one of

the most impressive figures in the world. Why have you cut 4000

teachers? The pupil numbers in Scotland have been falling over

recent years as well and now of course we are increasing the number

of people going through teachers training so we can make sure that

number increases, but listen, the Scottish Government and Scottish

Parliament, as you very well know, are subject to real terms spending

cuts over the last few years and all public services have been under

pressure. The main reason in terms of teacher numbers has been an

attempt on the Scottish Government to protect the teacher pupil ratio,

and that will now be enhanced by a further taker -- intake. You

promised you would reduce primary class sizes to 18 and instead they

are now 23.5 and rising. You broke that promise. You didn't mention

where we started from. We have kept the teacher pupil ratio very solid

in Scotland and that's been against a range of public expenditure cuts

but the new intake of teachers into the new teacher training in Scotland

I think will enhance the system. You have spent in the pasty in

Hollywood 43 hours on Government time debating independence. How many

hours have you debated education on Government time? I don't have that

they get a hand... The answer is zero, you have spent zero-hours

debating education on Government time. Isn't it time the SNP got back

to concentrating on the day job? Andrew, as you very well know Nicola

Sturgeon has identified a key priority, closing the attainment gap

in Scottish education. That is exactly what she has done. Let me

answer the question, it is difficult to be in a remote location, if you

talk before I answer the question then the view was will not be able

to listen. I let you answer that without saying a word. Is this

general election about independence, as you say it is, or not about

independence, as Mrs Sturgeon says it is? No, I have said exactly the

same as Nicola Sturgeon on that. The issue what independence will be

decided in a national referendum of the Scottish people. The mandate for

that referendum was gained in last year's Scottish elections. What this

election is about is backing the right of the Scottish parliament to

exercise that mandate and also providing real opposition to this

Tory Government and allowing the Scottish Parliament to reverse

austerity and some of the public expenditure cutbacks you have been

talking about, that is what this is about, backing our Scottish

Parliament. Alex Salmond, speaking

to me earlier. I'm now joined by the leader

of Plaid Cymru, Leanne Wood. You accuse the Government of wanting

an extreme Brexit, those are your words. What is the difference

between hard Brexit and extreme Brexit? My concern is the way in

which we leave the European Union could be very damaging to Wales if,

for example, there are tariffs introduced then that would have a

real impact in terms of Welsh jobs, and I want to make sure that we have

a Brexit that doesn't cause the damage to Wales that could be

caused. But what is the difference between extreme and hard? Anything

that puts Welsh jobs at risk is either extreme or hard and

unacceptable to Plaid Cymru, and we will do what we can to protect those

jobs. You want Wales to remain a member of the single market even if

the UK isn't, which would mean Wales having to accept the free movement

of people, still being under the jurisdiction of the European Court,

and you also want to stay in the customs union which means you could

not do your own free trade deals. What is the difference between that

and being a member of the European Union? We would be like Norway,

outside the European Union and inside the single market. The key

question is the issue of jobs and the ability to continue to trade.

Wales exports, we are the biggest exporter in the whole of the UK, so

there are many jobs reliant upon those goods being able to be sold to

the single market. Is it central to the UK? Out of the four countries

that make up the UK... Proportionally, yes. If you remain

in the single market, it is hard to see how Wales could stay in the

single market if the UK -- when the rest of the UK was not, you cite

Norway, that has free movement, it has to be said, it effectively have

to accept the jurisdiction of the European Court, it is not in the

customs union so it can do some of its own free trade deals, but the

Welsh people voted to leave. We have to accept the principle of free

movement if there is not going to be a hard border between the north and

south of Ireland. There is going to be free movement within Ireland and

therefore freedom of movement, as we said in the referendum campaign,

would be very, very difficult to rule out. You lost that campaign, as

you know, Wales voted to leave, 17 Council areas voted to leave, only

five voted to remain. Doesn't it explain why your party is going

nowhere? A majority in Wales voted to leave but you effectively want to

support that and de facto remain in the EU? I don't accept that, we

accepted the result but Plaid Cymru now is about defending Wales. There

are so many risks facing our people from the jobs perspective, the

privatisation perspective, the cuts perspective, and from the fact that

the Tories would like to grab power was back from our National Assembly,

so the key point... If you look at the Wales bill that went through

recently, the list of reserved powers there suggests there are some

powers currently within the Welsh Assembly jurisdiction that would be

dragged back. Which power was will Westminster take back? They could

take powers back over the NHS, for example. There is no indication they

want to do that. The Tories have attacked the Welsh NHS. That is my

point! Quite viciously. If they increase their mandate, I wouldn't

put it past them to try to take power was back over the NHS and then

of course we risk our NHS being privatised though this election is

all about defending Wales, protecting Welsh people from further

privatisation and cuts and a power grab from the Tories. Why is there

never a breakthrough for your party, Plaid Cymru? Labour dominated in

Wales for years, the Tories do quite well, Ukip had a surge for a while,

it looks like the Tories will have another surge, never you, always the

bridesmaid, never the bride. Wait until Thursday and I think you will

see that in many parts of Wales we will increase our representation at

a local council level. In the Rhondda, where I am assembly member,

we are looking to increase our representation... You are only 13%

in the polls will stop which is half of even the Tories in Wales! If you

don't breakthrough in the selection, if the real problem is going

nowhere, do you think you will pack it in? Robert Green not, I have a

job to do, a vision of Wales which is about building up our nation and

standing on our own two feet and my job is not done yet. Thank you for

being with us as part of your job, we will see how it goes on Thursday.

It's just gone 11.35, you're watching the Sunday Politics.

We say goodbye to viewers in Scotland who leave us now

First though, the Sunday Politics where you are.

I'm Natalie Graham and this is the Sunday Politics

It's time to pick and choose at County Council elections

on Thursday, but with less money in their pockets to spend

on local services how do the parties tempt the voters?

Joining me in the studio today are Tim Loughton,

Conservative MP for East Worthing and Shoreham and Lord Steve Bassam

First, it's the weekend of picking and choosing general

election candidates for both Labour and the Conservatives.

In Brighton Kemptown some members of the local party are hoping to get

a pro-Jeremy Corbyn candidate in place to beat the Conservatives

in the most marginal seat in the South East.

Steve, would you welcome a hard left Labour MP in Kemptown?

All I am interested in is a labour candidate who will do the job and

campaign against Simon Kirby. It is winnable with only a gap of 600, 700

votes. I am sure we will campaign hard to win that seat. But your

party is very divided in the city, we have covered it over the last

year on this programme, with the rise of momentum in the

constituency. If the local party prioritised winning in Brighton and

Campbeltown rather than holding onto the seat they have held by Peter

Kyle in Hove, that will be damaging? There will be plenty of resources in

both constituencies. Peter has a very well-organised organisation

behind him and we will run a very well organised campaign in Kemptown.

He believes the Conservatives will throw the kitchen sink at him come

he needs all the help he can get to hold onto a small majority? The

Conservatives are out to get in, so you have to make sure they don't. He

doesn't have the backing of his local party a few miles away? In

Brighton Hove Albion there are over 6000 members and those members

will be motivated and mobilised by this general election. Both

campaigns will be equally well resourced. I shall be out there

campaigning in both of them. If we go away from Brighton and have,

there are many marginal seats in the south-east, as you know you used to

hold as a party. It seems many of the candidates who stood two years

ago not standing again. Haven't you got a problem but if you have the

don't have the experience and don't have the experience and

perhaps the local support, you stand less chance of winning them back

this time? Usually the candidates for labour very high and they mount

a very effective campaigns. Sarah was a very effective candidate last

time round. But she is not standing again. She has a new job not

involved in politics. I didn't stand involved in politics. I didn't stand

in 1992. People were happy about that, but I got a house in the House

of Lords. Exactly. Tim, you are looking pretty complacent, Hove, I

put it to you is the 13th target seat for your party in the country.

Yet you only selected your candidate on Friday died. You have given Peter

Kyle a two-week Headstart, if that is not complacent, what is? The

Prime Minister only announced the election the week before. You

weren't ready. Nobody was expecting a general election, it was a secret,

I was out of the country when it happened. We have just selected a

very good candidate, born and bred in Hove and Sussex. She will give

Peter a run for his money. We will Peter a run for his money. We will

will be supporting Simon in Brighton will be supporting Simon in Brighton

and Kemptown. The Labour Party don't know who they will be supporting

a Tory MP then keep a Labour one. a Tory MP then keep a Labour one.

Bearing in mind the Labour Party's difficulties, is the strategy to

attack Jeremy Corbyn or attack Peter Kyle? We're not attacking, this is

about re-electing a strong Conservative government. Peter Kyle

sink at him. You will have two sink at him. You will have two

attack to win? We always fight hard in Hove. My constituency is next

door and we spend as much time as we can in Hove helping out the

Conservative candidate. I am Conservative candidate. I am

supporting Conservative candidates in other parts of Sussex, sitting

MPs and hopefully new MPs like Christie, because we want a strong

and stable government. We have heard and stable government. We have heard

that phrase before, under Theresa May. We will move on. Let's talk

about the electoral pacts which have been done this week.

The Liberal Democrats and Greens have announced they will not fight

each other in the two Brighton seats - to try and beat the Conservatives

in Kemptown and keep the Green MP Caroline Lucas in Brighton Pavilion.

So what do voters make of the decision by some

I can understand why they are doing it, but surely everyone should be

there for people to make their own minds up about and their own choice.

Obviously if you want to vote for a party, they should be

there this should make other parties just you can't.

If it is a party I wanted to vote for, whichever that was wasn't

on, I think I'd feel cheated, actually.

We're joined now from Brighton by Davy Jones, who was the Green

candidate in Brighton Kemptown until he stood down a few days ago.

Thank you for joining us this morning. As we have just heard, many

voters want their party to be on the ballot sheets and you have reduced

their choice and that is anti-democratic? What we would say

to people in Brighton Kemptown is, under the current first past the

post voting system, the old-fashioned voting system we have,

people aren't easily able to vote for what they believe in, because

when they do say, they end up with the opposite of what they believe

in. We believe people have the right to vote for what they

believe in which is why we change the voting system to a fairer voting

system. You are not going to do that in the next six weeks, could you

explain why you are standing down? Is it to help the Labour Party beat

the Conservatives or to help the Liberal Democrats? You are not

right, we haven't got a pact with the two parties. I have no idea what

the Liberal Democrats are doing in Kemptown. Simon Kirby is not very

popular and he has a small majority. We felt there was a real danger that

he would get re-elected if the progressive vote in the city split

between the Labour and greens as it did in 2015. I stood in 2015 and got

around 3200 votes. But lots of the Green voters said, we want to vote

Green, but we feel we have the vote tactically to stop Simon Kirby

getting in. So I have made the choice to stand down to maximise the

chance of defeating Simon. You also got a small share of the vote in

Hove last time round. You have a Remain MP with a small majority, are

you going to stand down there as well? Give me a break. We just had a

big discussion and listened to the voters of Kemptown saying they

wanted us to stand down in Kemptown. It is a brave decision to do so.

We're waiting to see the response of other parties. We have seen the

response of the Lib Dems and the women's equality party. If I was

Peter Kyle with his slim majority and a strong Tory lead in the

opinion polls, I think I would want to sit down and discuss with the

other Progressive parties, so if you are watching, we're waiting.

The problem with these deals or packs, it is suggested Labour cannot

win on their own, seats like Kemptown, you need the help of the

other parties? The Green party is a recent phenomena in our country.

They took a small share of the vote, enough to prevent Labour winning the

Kemptown seat last time round. I hope they don't put a candidate up

against Peter in Hove because he is a very progressive candidate and he

is popular. He is well liked locally and it is good the other smaller

parties are thinking about that because we don't want a political

monoculture in the south. Beyond Brighton and her, would you

encourage voters in Eastbourne to vote Lib Dem to stop the

Conservatives winning fair? It would be the obvious thing to do? Looking

at it in mathematical terms, it would be. We have always put

candidates up there. That arguably, put the Conservatives in position in

Lewes. The last election, the truth of the matter is, the Liberal vote

imploded and disappear. To Labour, so they need those votes back? The

Lib Dem vote collapsed because they lost support. Tim, Ukip is saying

they will not put candidates in seats with a good Brexiteer, you

could be called a good Brexiteer, are you hoping they will stand down

against you? I will take on all comers. There will be a Conservative

candidate in every seat in the whole of Great Britain. That is the way it

should be. Davy Jones said, give us a break, you should give the

electorate a break. Someone said in your clip, it is cheating the voters

and it is taking them for fools. Voters are smart enough to know if

they vote tactically, they can. They don't need to have a lack of choice

because of party has done a dodgy deal and that party won't be

standing. I would take on all comers and these sorts of deals undermined

democracy. Your opponents arguably, Ukip, did very well in your part of

Sussex. They came third in the general election. Locally, they did

well, has the threat gone away? I am not complacent, I will be running a

positive campaign. Ukip came a poor third behind Labour having

people are saying, what is the point people are saying, what is the point

of voting Ukip, the job has been done on Ukip, people were not

convinced it was going to happen but the Conservative government

are coming out of Europe. So why are coming out of Europe. So why

would you vote Ukip? We're not taking this for granted. I want

everybody to give the voters a chance and if you do these dodgy

deals, it is gerrymandering the system and it is taking the

electorate for fools. It's not just the General

Election politicians All the seats in the County

Councils of Kent, Surrey and East and West Sussex,

are up for election on Thursday. Sara Neville has been getting

a flavour of the debate. If you love the maelstrom

of elections, you must be feeling Two in five weeks, with the first,

the local County Council In Kent, it's a pick and mix

of nearly 400 candidates Each one eyeing up the mouthwatering

prospect of a seat on the council. This is the first election

since the Brexit vote last year, so it could give us a flavour

of what voters are thinking ahead But how will the parties

tempt the electorate? Kent's currently Conservative

controlled and has The budget has shrunk by some 35%,

real terms loss of half a billion. Council tax is up and there

is unprecedented pressure If you'd asked me five years ago

whether we could go on improving services at the front with 35% less

money, I would have But we have achieved

that through a constant Unlike other authorities,

we haven't closed libraries, we haven't closed children's

centres, we've built and improve services, in my view,

over the last four years. They certainly did in 2013, coming

from nowhere to take 17 seats, bumping Labour into third to become

the official opposition. Thanet is a Ukip stronghold,

but with a no vote secured on the EU, and no Nigel,

has Ukip's bubble burst? The point of voting Ukip really

is whether or not you trust the Conservative Party

to the deliver what I think there's enough evidence

in the frame to show the Conservative Party can't be

trusted on this. The biggest issue locally

is connected to social care. Huge issues with the social

care budget and the way Kent County Council

handles that budget. Labour want to bag 23 seats this

time round and improve on the 13 They say the standard

of services has dropped in the last four years,

which, they say, could turn Since 2010 the Conservatives

at Kent County Council have cut Therefore, all of our front line

services have been diminished I think if the Tories get

in this time, and there are indications they will,

then of course, those services, some May be the Lib Dems will be

the party feeling the sugar rush? With seven seats, it

seems the centre ground With seven seats, it seems

the centre ground wasn't But, four years on it's a very

different political landscape. We think we have a completely

chaotic planning system, which is leading the government

imposed high housing figures, resulting in a lot of large houses

on greenfield sites, when what are we really need

is low-cost housing on Brownfield Polling suggests that Labour vote

is collapsing and the Ukip vote is also suffering,

particularly in East Kent and we hope the votes

will therefore come our way, as the major opposition party

to the Conservatives. Choices about how your local

services, schools, housing, roads and social care

will all be managed. A taste test in Kent. In East and

West Sussex county have responded to cuts in their budgets by making

savings. Let's go back to Brighton and speak to our political reporter.

The parties in Sussex are arguing over how best to save that money?

Indeed, in East Sussex the Tories say they have a plan to boost the

county's economy while making savings where they need to. Labour

and the Greens dispute whether the cuts need to be made, particularly

in adult social care. Ukip, for their part say they would like to

cut costs by relying less on more expensive agency care workers. In

West Sussex, it is different, it is about who has the safest pair of

hands. The Tories say they have proven they can manage the council's

finances sensibly. The opposition disagree, pointing, for example, to

a scrapping of unpopular council DIY waste charges after the government

indicated it may ban them anyway. And the council was told in 2013, it

may have spent more than ?1 million of bills twice, but only started

taking reaction to recover the cash Lacen last year. The opposition say

they took too long to take the issue seriously. What effect has the

unexpected general election had on the local campaigns? Some tell me it

has tempted more people out on to the doorsteps, but it has turned

next Thursday's poll into an important bellwether for junior

eight. If the Lib Dems are to have their fightback, they will be

looking to increase our county, maybe winning new seats. We know the

Tories have been campaigning hard in Labour seats and 12 seeds somewhere

like Hastings would set them on their way to regain their overall

majority in East Sussex. In Crawley, a good performance would set Henry

Smith's mind at ease. The Greens are wanting to win their first seats at

both county councils, but in terms of the general election, we will be

watching Ukip closely. They are the official opposition in West Sussex

and on most of their seats in 2013 when they were riding high. But some

suspect they may not return very many councillors on Friday morning.

It'll be interesting. Tim Loughton, council tax has gone up, but we know

things will get worse. How are your Conservative council candidates

propose to defend the huge cuts your government is making the councils

when they are on the doorstep this week. I agree it will get worse. We

know it is because funding is coming down for councils. We are

repatriated in business rates to local authorities, so we are

devolving power. That is going to be a turbulent time until that comes

in. A council like West Sussex, froze council tax for five years

solid. We managed finances well and with the challenging problems and

issues around an elderly population, I think we have done better than

many in making sure we don't cut those front line services. But it

will be a challenge. The Local Government Association says there is

a funding gap of ?6 billion over the next five years. You mentioned adult

social care, it is the looming crisis and the Prime Minister

alluded to something in the manifesto. In this part of the

world, care homes are either closing down or on the brink. People cannot

care in their homes, the NHS is feeling the pressure. People will

blame your government for that, whatever you come up with in the

manifesto. Adult social care is the biggest challenge facing every local

government. This is going to be a big issue, we have got to dust down

the do not report and the work that has been done over many years. Would

you like a death tax in the manifesto? I am looking at new ways

in how we fund long-term adult social care so elderly sisters Billy

Mac as the standard of care they need and deserve. In an ageing

population, we need to make sure we're not piling costs onto the NHS

because we have people who could come out of expensive hospital bed

but they can't because the social care is in there. We need to

streamline social care before we work out how we have a sustainable

way of paying for our older citizens, quite rightly, in the

future. In Kent, the Conservatives have cut budgets and improve front

line services without reducing library hours or closing children's

sentence, as they have done in parts of Sussex, so it can be done? I am

sure there are other services under pressure. Kent does have a good

reputation for some of its service areas, but you cannot keep taking

the money away and expect the services to improve. I think Tim has

put his finger on the point, the problem that will occur in the next

Parliament. We need to have a better settlement for local government,

particularly with adult social care and children's services because they

are under pressure and under strain. Whilst I accept the rebalancing with

business rates will have some benefits, it is not the whole story

and we need a bigger pot. OK. Remember you can follow both

the local and general election campaigns over the coming weeks,

and find out more about all the candidates and the smaller

parties, on your BBC local And now it's time for some

of the other news you may have missed in 60 Seconds with Yetunde

Yusuf. The Conservative MP Craig McKinley

has been reselected to fight his Also this week, it was revealed that

Kent Police submitted a file to the Crown Prosecution Service

as part of an enquiry relating to his expenses

in the 2015 general election. Mr McKinley says there was no reason

why the investigation would overshadow his campaign,

that he had acted properly and honestly throughout

and had done nothing wrong. The Sussex Police and Crime

Commissioner says officers need to do more to recognise

the crime of stalking. Last year, more than 200 people

reported the offence, with a sharp I think it's very difficult

for police officers to understand in the first instance,

the severity of the Because often incidents

are reported in isolation. And it's been one year

since the start of strike action The long-running dispute

is over the introduction The disruption is estimated

to have cost the south-east I would really like to ask both my

guest about the year long strike on Southern trains but that is all the

time we've got time for this week. Remember you can keep up today

with all the election news and you can find details of who's

standing where, on the BBC News Website and on your

local BBC radio station. we will take the mandate that we

want. To all three of you, thank you. Andrew, back to you.

So, how will Thursday's local election results affect

Who's winning the election ground war?

And as he celebrates 100 days in the White House,

We have the local elections, Metro elections in Liverpool, greater

Birmingham, West Midlands, how will they play into the general election?

Significantly, it is very unusual. People keep comparing this with the

election in 83, not! Margaret Thatcher was nervous and to wait

until after the local elections to call the election to see the result.

We are getting these result in the middle of an election campaign so it

will be important, whoever does badly will suffer a dent in

confidence in terms of how they approach the election and we are

also going to have mayoral figures as a reminder of another big

difference with the 80s that however big, say, the Conservatives win in

Westminster, there are now sectors of power in other parts of the

United Kingdom which were not there in the 80s. One of the reasons

niches that are rated in 83 was memories were still alive in

political circles of 1970, Wilson saw the local election results and

thought, I can win, he was told he would win by the Economist magazine,

who had done the analysis, and of course he lost, so that is why she

waited, Mrs May does not need to wait for that at all now, and on the

Metro elections, the one she will be looking at is the West Midlands,

that is the one that is a competition. I think she can really

lose on Thursday in the local elections, governing parties are

supposed to take effect again, losing lots of council seats. She is

projected to put on 100 or so seats, Labour projected to lose around 200,

the first time the main opposition party has shed seats since something

like 83 so clearly the local elections give Mrs May great

momentum going into the general election campaign but there is a

downside in that, which is what we have already heard fighting about

this morning, if it looks like it is going too well for the Tories, it

says to voters, why bother turning up? Sushi comes up with totally

unbelievable sound bites this morning that this is the most

important general election in her lifetime. Really?! For her it is! It

always is until the next one! I wonder if voter turnout is a

problem? Tory voters are more likely to vote than Labour voters. If there

is a sense that it is all over bar the shouting, the overall turnout

will be low that Tory voters are still likely to turn out more than

Labour voters so she would still win some. I don't think she needs to be

too worried, I think there will be a significantly low turnout, even I am

finding it hard to be that excited about this general election. Really,

the policies, we have spent a lot of time talking about them today and we

have to examine them, but all this is about is, do you want Theresa May

or Jeremy Corbyn in Number Ten? Those are the only question is,

apart from possibly how strong do you feel about Brexit, that will be

on the voters' minds. You may say that but I will not be put off from

going through a list of policies that we have already had in the last

24 hours. On the Conservatives, more powers to stop company bosses under

pensions, of course Philip Green was in mind there. Labour has come up

with quite a few policies, actually, give all work of equal rights,

whether part-time or full-time, temporary or permanent. Ukip, scrap

VAT or takeaway -- on takeaway food and end the BBC licence fee. The

Liberal Democrats have come out posed to the runway at Heathrow. I

thought I knew that already? Will any of these policies make a

difference? They are all nice handy things that people quite liked but

probably not, is the answer. They are an awful way away from polling

day now for people to remember and latch onto. I don't think you make

your mind up on small issues like Heathrow, unless you live in

Richmond-upon-Thames, maybe, but the problem Labour have got with

unfailing a lot of these retail type policies which, in themselves, are

very popular, is no one will listen to them until they get over the

leadership credibility issue. Jeremy Corbyn could the world on a stick,

but if no one believes he can deliver it then he will not be

listened to and he has not done much apart from a speech yesterday in

which is claim to fame was getting arrested, I don't see how that would

work for him getting to Number Ten. They are not making progress on it.

Labour has rolled out a number of policies which, taken individually,

would have certain traction in normal times, quite interesting

ideas, this sense of unfairness, a feeling that ordinary workers have

not done well out of the recovery, those who caused the crash have, 20

points, I went through some of them earlier, putting aside they are not

costed, we are assured they will be. The problem I suggest is not the

costing but the cut through? Every election has a context which is

determined by opinion polls, however sceptical we are these days, and if

one party is way ahead it is difficult for the other party to

appear relevant, because if people assume they are not going to win,

even some of its own MPs are saying, we are not going to win this, so you

can vote for us, it is very hard to get attention and relevance. Where I

think all the parties are bad with their current leaders is framing

arguments, so those policies you have highlighted makes sense. The

best leaders are brilliant framers of an argument and neither Theresa

Maynor Jeremy Corbyn R. They have been campaigning, their manifestos

are not out yet, both sides have been telling us we have to wait for

costings, but it has not stopped them campaigning. Let's remind you

of where they have been and what they have been doing so far.

Let's start with Jeremy Corbyn, his first official visit was in the

ultra-marginal Conservative seat of Croydon Central where the MP Gavin

Barwell has a lead of just 165. That is not the only Conservative seat he

has visited, along the way he popped in on Bristol North West, a

Conservative majority of nearly 5000. The Tory seat of Cardiff

North, a lead of just over 2000, Warrington South, just over 2700,

and Crewe and Nantwich, Tory majority of three and a half

thousand. Yesterday he visited Bethnal greed and Bob, a Labour lead

of 20 4000. Theresa May kicked off her campaign in Bolton, Labour

majority of over 4000. On her way round the UK she had a comfy stop in

her own maidenhead seat, where she is defending a majority of nearly

30,000, before travelling to other Labour marginals including Dudley

North, a Labour lead of 4000. Bridgend, a lead of just under 2004

Labour, before becoming ambitious and visiting shadow minister Richard

Bergen's Leeds East seat, which he won by over 12,500 votes. Yesterday

she went north of the border to Aberdeenshire, where amongst other

places she visited the SNP seat of West Aberdeenshire and Kincardine,

where the Tories would have to gain over 7000 votes to unseat the NP.

What do you make of it all so far? It is remarkable she is doing these

visits in Scotland. Past but even five years and the idea of a Tory

Prime Minister going round Scotland would be utterly counter-productive,

and actually they are ambitious for Scotland now under with Davidson, a

prospect of multiple seats, and that would be a real genuine shift in

Scottish politics, the likes of which we have not seen for 15 or 20

years. If she gets that, that helps towards 100 seats, because if she

wins ten in Scotland, it is effectively 20, the SNP lose ten,

she gains ten, she wants to do that in the Midlands with Labour, and the

North. To get the 100 majority, other than Scotland, she has to win

Labour seats, that is all that is there. And clearly she has been

told, it is obvious, that she has a chance of doing so, otherwise you

don't go to these parts of the country in the first few days of the

campaign. All logic points to her being able to pull it off as well.

The opinion polls, the state of the Labour Party. The only qualification

I have in this is that politics is so wild and free Braille at the

moment, it doesn't feel like landslide to rain. That is true, it

doesn't. It is early days, we haven't yet had the manifestos, the

campaign is yet to gather momentum. It doesn't feel like landslide

territory. I disagree, look at every single poll, the Tory lead is 10% in

Wales, you can see her picking up 20 seat there. Put this together, I am

told by the way she is going into traditional Labour heartland again

tomorrow, the key is the Ukip vote. That will implode... Crumble towards

Tories? If she can hoover that up and retain the Tory vote, she will

have a majority of 150. I cannot let you go without

reminding you that it is Donald Trump's 100 days. He's not making a

lot of it now, this is what he said last night.

We are just beginning in our fight to make America great again.

Now, before we talk about my first 100 days, which has been very

exciting and very productive, let's rate the media's 100 days.

Because, as you know, they are a disgrace.

There you go, still bashing the media, that was at a rally in

Virginia, the 100 days was last night. He seems happier campaigning

than running the country. You each have 20 seconds to give me your

board on the first 100 days. Remarkable, he will not stop

slagging off the media but America first has not meant America first in

terms of national policy, he has reneges on what he said about Nato

being obsolete. He is moving from the old right to the centre because

that is where you get things done, he is a pragmatist, also is about's

friend Nigel Parrott is no longer welcome, we read this morning!

Allegedly! He loves campaigning but finds governing much more difficult.

Who would have thought being president of the United States was a

difficult job?! He loves rallies but being president and politics is a

very difficult thing indeed. Thank you, there we go, Mr Trump's 100

days, we will see what the next 100 brings.

The Daily Politics is back on BBC Two after the bank holiday

on Tuesday at midday, with all the latest

And I'll be back here on BBC One next Sunday

Remember - if it's Sunday, it's the Sunday Politics.